Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Thank you. Um, welcome. This is the September 17th meeting of the Sandowski Landmark Commission. Um, Quinn, will you please call the role? Ellie Dyer here. Daniel Frederick here. John Felter here. Alan Griffith here. Jeff CrarAel here. Lewis Schultz. All right. Thank you. Okay. Commissioner Schultz cannot be here. Can I have a motion to excuse him, please? So moved. Second. Second. All in favor say I. I. Any opposed?

Okay. Thank you. First of all, I'd like to say welcome to um Dan Frederick to the commission. We appreciate you coming joining us and bringing your expertise which we've been slightly light on from as most of the rest of us are enthusiastic amateurs. Um but uh welcome and thank you. Thank you. All right. Uh the Can I have a Are there any questions on the minutes? Not. Can I have a motion to approve the minutes? So move. Second. Second. Any discussion on the minutes? If not, all in favor say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. I should probably abstain. Wasn't here.

There we go. Okay. Um, all right. We'll move on. I think we have just one order of business. So, Adam, if you'd like to go ahead.

Yep. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh so our application today is for 233 Jackson Street for alterations on the existing first floor facade and a second story addition um for a non-contributing building at 233 Jackson Street. Uh this application was submitted by Fe Architecture on behalf of the owner GMA Asset Management Group LLC. So here's where the property is situated relative to Jackson Street um outlined in red. And then next on the lefthand side you can see a bird's eye view of where this is located in our historic district the southwestern corner. And then on the right hand side you'll see it labeled as the old uh correct me if my pronunciation is wrong company buildingstein. And uh so like I mentioned it's a non-contributing building. Moving on on the left hand side of this slide is an existing condition elevation of Jackson Street. You can see the uh the blue columns support beams. Then moving on to the right hand side of the slide is the southern elevation and northern elevation from the sidewalk respectively. Uh last two elevations here. Top is a zoomed out version and bottom is zoomed in. And the zoomed in version you can you'll note a what looks like a garage building. said that's the last we'll talk of it today because it's not part of the scope of work, but it is on the property just for reference of its um scale from the street level. All right. Uh before we get into talking about the proposed work for each elevation, just some three general notes for all of the elevation plans. Uh one is siding. You'll see dark and light red colors or shades of red. Um to our knowledge that's been exaggerated a bit to just show the distinction between existing and proposed structures. Uh that sighting material that will be used is

is the color called Cabernet red which is the Everlast brand sighting which is an inorganic product designed to mimic the look of wooden batten board sighting. uh windows. Um we will talk about how many existing window and door openings on the first floor will be altered and that it should be noted that the proposed windows for both floors will have a consistent visual theme in terms of size, style, and material. And then all downspouts and gutters will be replaced with new white Jialter boundarized aluminum gutters. All right. First is the one we can see from the street, the existing Adam, could I just Yes, absolutely. Um, just given the amount of information here, I think if anybody has a question as we're going along, feel free to jump in and ask rather than

Sure. save them all to the end if that's okay with you. Uh, totally fine. Okay. All right.

Yeah, just interrupt me. No problem. Um, so for the eastern or front elevation from Jackson Street, we have a before on the right hand side, existing, and a proposed after on the left hand side. I'll show that again before we're through with this. Um, this has a lot of work to describe. Uh, first on the we're going to go first floor to second floor for each elevation. Uh, first floor involves repainting the underside of that canopy the color bisque and the blue steel support beam in the middle to be black. Second is replacing the existing multicolored mosaic tile finish with a Bridgeport blend color brick veneer from the Belden brick company. Moving on, uh, applicant also proposes altering the existing window and door openings by replacing them with a new commercial door with a clear anodized finish and steel replica windows from Graham. And they propose adding an ADA ramp and small staircase to the front entrance as well as the addition of a bike rack. You can see on the right hand side that the railing material is proposed to be metal and the color uh is black circled. So there is another uh before on the right after on the left on the second floor of this elevation. Applicant proposes setting the building addition um I believe even with uh the existing parapet walls. It might be just behind, but at any rate, the new facade will provide one window aligned with the proposed door on the first floor below. That window will allow sunlight to enter into the hallway of the apartment complex on the second floor. As part of this project is um transient rental units, four of them on the first floor and six apartment units on the sec second floor edition. Okay, any questions before I move on to the next elevation? Okay. The western elevation or the rear side of the building is pictured on the

first floor. Uh the applicant proposes covering two existing window openings and one existing overhead door opening with uh drywall and composite siding. And as a a note, anytime I say covering or partial covering, it's just presumed that it's whatever the appropriate wall assembly is for, you know, building code. But our understanding just for reference is drywall with the siding over it. Um the overhead door opening will also have a new window placed in it to allow light to enter the new transit rental unit behind it. Uh second floor on this elevation. Uh you can see the darker right and left sides of that image are the back of two residential units. Uh the existing central part of the building um will contain an elevator and a staircase um to help residents move throughout the building. Any questions? Okay. The north side of the building uh this elevation and the next one, the south, which I'll let's go to the north first, uh are pretty similar. Uh so on the north side on the first floor, the applicant proposes filling two existing window openings with custom windows with the metal frame and creating one new door opening with a concrete stairway which you can see on the bottom right of that image. The applicant also proposes covering part of the five existing window openings, one existing loading bay opening, and the complete covering of one existing window opening. on the second floor. Uh we will see that seven of the windows match the size of the smaller windows on the first floor and that um six of those seven windows are aligned with each other horizontally creating a consistent rhythm. Uh the rightmost window is partly elevated because it's the building staircase. So moving on. Oh, sorry. Any questions

on that elevation? Okay, southside elevation first floor. Um again it's similar applicants proposing covering part of seven existing window openings with two existing doorways and completely covering four existing window openings on the second floor. The south side of the building edition is visible uh here and this is going to mirror the north side window placements with six windows at two per unit um all being aligned in the same size. And a quick note, if we look at this slide, the red rectangle um and then just to the right of that is a zoomed in uh of the existing roof line and cornice. It's important to note that the seconds story windows will overlap with the existing cornice and rough line so that it sits on both planes of the new and existing walls. Um, but the applicant expressed to us that they're going to do their absolute best to preserve the parts of the cornice and rough line that don't need to be touched

to help keep that um, you know, any remaining historic integrity past the facade intact. Any questions on that elevation? Okay. Uh just for reference, this was a lot more legible and provided in your packets, but here's the first floor plan where we see the four transient rental units and the staircase on the left side of the image or the rear of the building. And then here's the second floor plan, six residential units with two windows per unit. Just one question on that. Yes.

Going back the extreme left at the rear, that lower roof, is that is the intention to make that into an outdoor living like a deck or something. We I I believe yes, that's the long-term intention, but for this particular scope, yeah, it's not part of this project. Yeah, this submission.

All right. Uh staff analysis is in two sections. We've we've talked about some of this. Um so, we can go to number three, which is that the guidelines state that new uses should adapt to existing window or door openings, not the other way around. and that filling should be avoided. However, those guidelines do also state that if those existing openings are filled or altered, they should be as reversible as possible so that the opening may be used again in the future with minimal work. And four, simply put, staff believes that um by doing a combination of drywall and composite siding, that is much more reversible than filling it completely with brick. um which uh more complies with our guidelines. Uh five, all proposed alterations will make the texture of the building more consistent and by extension harmonious with the character of the historic district. So that's first floor. Second, uh again it's for new residential apartments. Addition will have a flat roof and the exterior will be visually distinct compared to the existing structure with our which are both um guideline requirements. Uh, bullet point three, the new windows, as we discussed, will overlap with the existing first floor cornice and rough line, which will be preserved to the extent possible. Four, the new windows will match the style and rhythm and symmetry of the new windows on the first floor. Uh, five, proposed siding design to mimic uh wood, which is common in the district for other non-contributing buildings. This commission just fielded a case for that with Ephus EFS finish for stone. Um and six uh these elements will create a design that reflects elements typical of other residential properties in the district and will comply with the design guidelines. Um second to last slide. Thank you. I know this is dense. Other

department's comments um which were already forwarded to the applicant. uh one's from engineering staff which they just gave a heads up to the owner said that if the plan and that's an if it's ever to stop using the existing turnaround at the east or front elevation on Jackson Street city would be interested in reclaiming public on street parking spots in front of the building staff had two comments um both pretty standard or the first is standard one is all contractors must be licensed with the state of Ohio as may be applicable and must be registered with the city of Sunduski prior to starting work. Two, a chief building official noted that due to the pre building's previous use as a laundromat, it is likely that environmental cleanup will be required as part of the change of use process. However, a phase one environmental review will be necessary to determine this. Again, outside of this board's um scope, but just for the sake of thoroughess for for the applicant mostly. Okay. So staff recommends granting a certificate of appropriateness for the proposed work at this location with the following conditions. One, all applicable permits are obtained through the building department, engineering department, planning division, and any other applicable agency prior to construction. Thank you.

I have a few comments if you're not sorry from staff yet. Adam, do you mind putting the southside facade on the screen? I appreciate it. So I think in this image, it's really obvious to see what u Mr. Panis was mentioning with the exaggerated detail and color. So that lighter red is existing and the darker red is the proposed sighting. It'll match a lot better in reality obviously. I just want to make sure that was clear. Uh I also want to mention when they first their first draft of this proposal had smaller windows that would certainly be more economical and more convenient for them and with staff's comments on what the guidelines are asking for that that the windows be more designed um according to the warehousing look and feel of the original construction and that they take up more of the original openings. They brought back this proposal with much larger windows. So we really appreciated that they uh did that and that helped us get comfortable with supporting the project. So, I want to mention those two and then if you wouldn't mind showing the front facade.

Sure.

They also um were amanable to keeping the tile that's there now. Um and we discussed that the existing elevation this building has been significantly altered from its original condition and the facade that is there today is not considered historic according to the time frame in which our our uh historic district was created. So its significance is not relevant to our historic district. It could be argued that the facade as is with the blue and the tile is has some historic integrity if you wanted to take that view of it. Um but we took the perspective of of helping drive the process of fitting more within the guidelines of the historic time frame of our downtown which is why they went with the brick veneer instead of the existing mosaic tile. They also had a pitch roof on the first um draft which we um asked to to shift to a flat roof because that would be more appropriate for a warehouse style building within the time frame of the historic district in Sunduski. So just want to add those. Thank you.

Okay. Are there any questions or comments from commissioners? I've got a couple questions. That's all right. Um the just to clarify the the big chimney on the back on the on the second floor plan it says it's going to be removed and reused the brick but on the elevations is still staying. Is that chimney staying or going?

It's going to stay. Okay, which I think is good. I mean it's obviously an architectural feature. And then the other I guess comment I had was the um on the south elevation I guess and the and the rear elevation. That little window down on the lower right is that not to have the industrial mutton bars and uh all the windows didn't match.

Okay. So that one should have the little mutton bars in it then that match the other industrial windows. Okay. And then the um on that same elevation, there's a big window at the end of that second floor hallway. Is that correct? And it's just not shown in the elevation. I think it doesn't show there because it's it's actually on the other side. Oh, the side. This one. Okay. Are you referring to the roof access? I see what you mean, Dan. Oh, it's uh I I think you're Yeah, I think you're right. I think there's a door or some sort of window that provides roof access on the internal. If you look at the internal Okay. Right. On the internal there's a window in that stairwell.

I just don't I just don't see it on the back elevation. But that' be nice to have a window there. Obviously that long hallway would be nice to have here. I can flip. John, you want to clarify or you welcome to come up here and clarify if you wish. Ken, we'll just need your name and address for the purposes of the application, please.

Uh John Fe, 224 East Water Street, um the architect for the project. Um and we had uh proposed a I guess our initial thoughts were the easy way out and then um with Adam's help and Aaron we met on site and they beat us up pretty good and so uh we agreed to make uh some really fundamental changes to to get where we are. Um, as far as the elevations go, there may be in when we made a change over, we may have missed a window or two, but uh, it was probably cuz we had gone from a small Anderson style windows to something more commercial industrial looking. Um, so it was if there's if there's a window in the floor plan, it'll be in the elevation. So, and and they will match the sizes of said we went to a universal size big window and a universal size small window. So, everything's very similar. Oh, I I will just real quick history of the building was built in 1914. The original front part of the building was two stories. Uh then it was one story in between and the back was two stories again.

Uh and it was originally Bstein Cleaner. Um they there for a long time and when they vacated um they had done the remodeling and put that really gorgeous looking canopy on the front. Um it was an architectural style of the time. I think it was in the late 50s. Yeah.

I don't have a good date on it. Um but they want to keep it because as the transient people come they'll they'll come to the front door unload and then they'll go in the back and park. So, um, the siding that we picked, it's an it's called an Everlast. It's a vinyl siding, but it's actually not vinyl. It's a composite. Uh, Dan's probably familiar with it. It's it's a real heavy siding. Um, it doesn't oil can. Um, it's got a lifetime guarantee on the color for not fading. Um, it's product we use on a lot of the houses that we do over in Lakeside. The Lakeside Design Review has accepted it. um where they do not allow vinyl sighting. This is one sighting they do. So, uh it's a product we really like. So,

thank you. comments. I just for really my education, um I know the guidelines sort of say not to fill it in with brick, but in a case like this where this building is certainly not going to go back to its original use or is unlikely to. Um where would we be on if the you know if if the owner wanted to put brick in there? I'd take the perspective that it's better to be able to leave it able for somebody else to fill that whole opening with a window in the future again. Um, but I I'm just one interpreter of the guidelines. Was there any desire

on the part of your client? I looked I personally looked at it originally, but uh, you know, brick are hard to match that are that old. Um, and the the difference in colors down that side, it's like, which one do you match? Um, you know, I can get a red brick that matches some of the red, but then there's some really light color brick there that I can't. So, I'd be buying boatloads of brick just trying to fill them in and make it look right just to fill a couple window openings in, and it just didn't seem practical. Yeah, that makes sense. Okay. Would it be Can I ask question? Would it be comparable to do like the brick veneer that you're doing on the front as the siding instead of the siding or that be a big cost difference?

Be quite a big cost difference. The signing is not cheap but um um the brick is more. Okay. Anything else from commissioners? No. Great. Um I don't know. Mimi, do you want to say anything? You're not required to. You can if you would like to turn up to you. Okay. Perfect. Thank you, Mr. Frank. Appreciate it. Okay. Any other questions or comments? If not, I'll entertain a motion on this particular recommendation. Just to note, staff are proposing a uh acceptance or a issuing of the um

granting of the certificate appropriation appropriateness for the proposed work with the usual conditions. I hear a motion. Mot motion to approve with staff's recommendation. Second. Am I Am I allowed to second? This one you remember. Okay, we have a motion on the table. Is there any further discussion? If not, um clerk, will you Quinn, will you please call the role? Jeff Crarael, yes. Elliot Dyer, yes. Daniel Frederick, yes. Alan Griffith, yes.

John Felter, yes. Okay, motion is approved. Thank you very much and congratulations. Looking forward to seeing this project come to come to be. Very exciting. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. Uh let's see here. Do we have any other business? If not, can I have a motion to adjourn, please? So moved. Second. You're returned. Thank you very much. Crochet.