Historic Preservation Commission - Regular Meeting

I called the November 18 historic preservation commission meeting to order at 06:03PM. Kirsten, could you please call the roll?

Okay. Commissioner Conrad? Here. Commissioner Allen? Here. Commissioner Simmons? Here. Commissioner Peterson?

Here.

And Commissioner Wolf? Vice Chair Whitaker?

Here.

And Chair Parson? Here.

Commissioners and attendees, please join me in our pledges of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of

The United States Of America

and to the republic

for which it stands, nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Honor the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to the Texas, one state under God, one indivisible. Citizen communication. Any citizen wishing to address the Commission regarding a topic on or off the agenda may do so for up to three minutes after completing a registration card. Commissioners may not respond to or discuss any topic that is not on the posted agenda.

I don't think we have any. Item e, approval of the minutes. Commissioners, are there any amendments or revisions to the meeting, the minutes of the meeting as read? If none, then I will entertain a motion to accept the minutes.

I'll make a motion to accept the minutes.

Do I hear a second?

Second.

I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Kristen? Okay. Could you pull the commission? Sure. Commissioner Conrad?

Yes. Commissioner Ellum? Yes. Commissioner Simmons? Yes. Commissioner Peterson? Yes. Vice Chair Whitaker?

I abstain, I wasn't here.

Chairperson. Yes.

Item f certificates of appropriateness. Consider a presentation and action regarding a certificate of appropriateness for 103 East Main Street, HB 20 Five-twenty 6.

Good evening commissioners. So this is concerning a structure at 103 East Main Street, Williams Grocery, aka Miller's Exchange Bank. It was built 1876. It was built at the same time as 101 And 105 East Main. There were three of them that were built right when the train station opened, and they all looked similar and had three arches.

The facade of 103 collapsed in the early twentieth century, and the current facade dates to 1973. The request concerns the rear cooler and service counter addition that was put on in 2013. The tenant after that had, used it as a barbecue pit area, and the current tenant has turned it back into a customer area. To recap from the October HPC meeting, there was a request the request was to approve a retroactive certificate of appropriateness for having painted the brick blue. The painting painting previously unpainted masonry is something that's discouraged very strongly in the guidelines and so partly because it's really difficult to undo.

So this was sorry. They denied the request and then required that it be the commission required that it be repainted in a color that's normal to bricks, so at least it didn't it didn't, stand out as being painted brick. Also, he had the applicant had said that he would prefer to put, put a siding or something over it, and the HBC said that if he applied in time for the November meeting, they considered an alternative even if it hadn't been repainted yet. Which brings us to the current request, which is to cover the painted brick with stained wood siding similar to the partition on the the left of the photo, which is constructed of southern pine with Minwax dark walnut stain, installed horizontally with a gap between planks and then screwed, attached to furring strips that are attached only onto the mortar. Which brought up the other point, which that the partition hadn't been approved yet either.

So, we thought it would be better to consider all the things, all the parts of moving in changes together. It's like the partition, the wall sconce, and the back door, and while we're at it, the color of the brick paint. So with the secretary standards, this is regarding an addition in the back. So what the secretary standards say regarding new construction is numbers nine and ten. Nine, new additions, exterior alterations or related new construction will not destroy historic materials, features and spatial relationships that characterize the property.

New work will be differentiated from the old and will be compatible with the historic materials, features, size, scales, proportion and massing to protect the integrity of the property and its environment. And then point 10 is new additions and adjacent or related new construction will be undertaken in such a manner that if removed in the future, the essential form and integrity of property and its environment would be unimpaired. So, taking the siding and the partition together as they're both the same, would thing wood construction. They're both southern yellow pine with Minwax dark walnut stain installed horizontally with a gap, between the planks and over the furry. And in the siding case, it would be installed, on furring strips over was screwed to the mortar.

Could note that installation with gaps isn't typical for, sidings for buildings because it's not watertight. So if it weren't for the canopy over the whole patio, that wouldn't be an option. It also brings the them attached to furring strips that are attached in the mortars means when it comes time to reverse, it'll be easy to reverse. It's just holes in the mortar, then the mortar has to be repointed periodically anyway. But it brings up the question of so when when the next tenant takes off, removes the siding, when they they see the blue brick again.

So for that reason, we we, as a staff recommending that the brick be painted underneath it before the siding's installed, which brings the, paint color. You know, the applicant sent two, three swatches of brick paint were where the colors weren't named, and I thought they were all fit within the brick color thing, but what actually came in the application was the bare dark walnut. And that is a color that brick comes in, not brick that's been used in Round Rock before. If the Commission hasn't addressed whether it has to be whether materials should only be things that have been used before in the district. So if it's like a brick color, would it have to be a color that has been used before in the historic district or does it not matter?

If you do, if you decide that it doesn't matter and it can be just anywhere then yeah, this is the selected stain or pain is fine. If you do want to, refer to the, colors in the historic district, these are all the brick buildings in the historic district. The one in the upper right, the brick, fell down and that's been covered and been replaced with limestone. And you can see they run from pretty much yellow to beige to varying shades of burnt orange. And the doctor's office on the right, that's a red red.

There is an example of a dark, nearly as dark brick, but that is also on a recent addition. It's on the cooler behind 118 East Main. So it's not a historic example, but it's there. Moving on to the sconces. Sconces were selected to complement the Art Deco interior.

And we can note that although the building dates to 1876, the period of significance for the district as a whole is 1870 to 1930. And staff believes that the sconces are they have a contemporary appearance but they're not uncomplimentary to the district as a whole and recommend approval. Then the back door, this was replaced early in this process of changing over and it was the wooden door was there, was not in good condition. The previous door was not the wooden door was not a historic door. We're pretty sure it was installed also around 2013.

But the condition of the or appearance of the original historic door is not documented because they didn't take pictures of the back of the building. So when you are trying to replace a when you need to replace a feature and you don't know what it looked like historically, the secretary's standards recommends designing a replacement part that is basic is simple understated and doesn't call attention to itself so it fills the function but doesn't but looks contemporary and doesn't attempt to look like it's historic itself because it isn't. And in this case, it's a half light, a flat steel door, and it's pretty basic and utilitarian and could certainly be considered understated, so staff recommends approval. Would probably would have been nicer, but it's in the understated, has the wood the metal has a utilitarian function for durability. So in summary, based on standards nine and ten, staff recommends approval with additional con conditions.

The brick must be repainted before the siding is installed. The if masonry paint color color dark walnut is appropriate. If you disagree, define an appropriate color range. The for the siding, the southern yellow pine with a stained dark walnut is appropriate, and it's to be attached to furring strips that are attached to the wall only at mortar joints. And the installed wooden partition is appropriate, the installed globe sconces are appropriate, and the installed steel half light back door is appropriate.

Questions?

Could you take it back to the recommendations? Could you take it back to the recommendation?

Thank you. The applicant is here, by the way, if you have questions for him. Did you have did you wanna add anything? No.

I was just gonna ask. So that dark walnut, I didn't see it like we did a little digital image of it. But would that terracotta not be acceptable?

Can come up. You you can come up and Come up so that you hear.

Well, it looks like one of the buildings yeah. So this wouldn't be acceptable? Acceptable?

That'd be fine. But

Yeah. Yep. The the three I'd I'd I thought the brown one looked good, but when you did your rendering of it, I I think maybe that one would look better.

Yeah. Those are the you have the swatches you sent. I think they were from me your phone The one on the bottom came from the manufacturer's website, so that's their, you know, ideal lighting. Actually, it's probably just digitally generated. Yeah, all three of the top I thought fitting in the range of of brick colors. Okay. One on the right was, kind of dark, but, others range. Did you have a have a

No. That was it. I was just wondering about that.

Okay. Kirsten, can I talk? Kirsten, I I don't understand why if we're gonna paint the brick, we need to put paneling over it.

You prefers to have the paneling over it and the idea is to, like, the next tenant is probably going to want something different. His bottom, sorry. The next tenant is probably going to want something different on the walls. The wood paneling is what he prefers. Because you guys had conditioned the paint and last time we went ahead and we're choosing a color. But we're recommending that even if you put on the siding that it's painted underneath so that once the when the siding is removed, like the next tenant or whatever, that you don't get this, oh, blue. Because you don't want to be left with that inspiring people to paint their brick.

I don't understand the dark brown rather than a lighter color more in line with the limestone and the other brick.

Yeah.

Was just a color I picked. I thought it would match with but I didn't know what it

would look like until I saw it up there. I thought it would look

or or this screen over here. So I think the one of the lighter ones would probably be better.

This is darker than you anticipated?

Yes, ma'am. Okay. It is. And about the wood siding, that's just so it matches with, like, the the tables and the partition wall Right. And stuff like that. Right.

Matches the decor.

Kirsten, in the staff analysis, has any of the other brick in town been painted or is it just different shades of original brick?

Just different shades of original brick. The only painted masonry is the concrete block.

Kirsten, am I understanding that then the wood paneling could be removed in the future by other tenants, and then the painting underneath would be

Yeah, furring strips are like thin strips that just hold something off the surface a little bit, and in this case, it's so that you're when you have the planks there, you're not putting all those holes into into the wall, but you do it, vertically so then you have like what, four or five, six things per vertical thing and they can be spaced out over the basically, fewer holes. Mhmm. And also more reversible. And as long as the holes are in the border and not in the bricks themselves, we're happy.

Could you go back to the slides, please, of

the other brick walls in downtown?

And also if I could ask the applicant to come up and share with us based on, his realization of the dark color, which is he envisioning to apply the first

on the left?

Maybe the bottom right one.

The really dark or the

No. The This burnt orange color. I I think it looks like terracotta, but, yes, more of a burnt orange.

It's it's one of the contemporary ones, but, yeah, but it's within like

Kristen, could you go down to the colors and bring those

up? That one or that one would look good, Is it the birch?

He's looking at the first edition behind 01/2018, the orange one in

the middle. Behind the Korean place and the Coco's one.

Right. Yeah. And Coco's is the yellow one on the left. That was actually originally in bus depot.

Oh, really?

Yeah. So, Kristen, if you could bring the color swatches back. Swatches? Mhmm. Thank you.

Do you remember the names of the other colors?

I could, Google lens on, and it'll bring it right up. Yeah. So maybe the one on the left, the top left would be good.

Yellow? Yes.

More of a golden Mhmm. Something.

Okay.

Thank you.

Back to recommendations or

Would you take it back to the motion? Is that it?

That's it.

Is that it? Okay. I'm sorry.

Yeah. That's it.

I just want you to walk back.

Please.

And I was just gonna add, I don't know if you can catch it in one of those pictures, but another reason why we did paint it is because they had to have had some on there over the brick before. Like, I don't I don't know at what point because there's rebar coming out of the mortar in some places. And then in some places, there is like, I guess, they use some sort of mortar to put whatever they put on the wall. So that's another reason why we painted over it because there were these big spots where

they

used something to glue it to the brick. So so anyway.

And just so I understand that, could you have done tuck pointing to fill in the mortar? Would that have been an option as well?

To to what?

To do tuck pointing, basically filling in the mortar over the rebar and other

No. Because, like, in one of the strips, it comes out a couple inches. We thought about cutting that off. And then, in a couple spots, whatever they use to put whatever they put on the outside of the brick, it's thick. You know, it's like it was like thick cement. We thought about chiseling that away, but that would have taken forever. So we just decided to paint it a color. I mean, it is the color I preferred, preferred, but we had to do something with it because not just that there was other damage from, you know, just electrical being ran in the smoke pits and all that stuff. Yeah.

I have to say I appreciate the safety again that you put in, not just beautifying but the safety of, know,

so thank you.

Yes, ma'am. Thank you.

And I appreciate that you went to the trouble of getting back to us so soon.

Yeah. Yes, sir. No problem.

Is there any other discussion?

Before we do this motion, do we want to go to a lighter color than the dark walnut in the motion? I mean, it's been discussed.

Mhmm. Mhmm. You're right.

I think he was agreeing on the one on

the left, the lighter lighter color.

What I would call the number one. Yeah.

You can also have him provide a swatch prior to painting to staff if you want to build that into the motion as you've done in the past.

So I'll move to have a motion to provide a swatch before painting. Is that correct? You

just need to do the whole motion altogether.

Okay.

Right? You don't need to you can amend the motion. You can create whatever motion you want. Okay. And you can amend the staff recommendation however you want. You just need to include everything in the motion that you want to include it.

Okay.

So Well,

I'll entertain a motion for item f one.

Any more discussion? Are we

done? Okay.

I'll make the motion. Excuse my voice. It's awful. Brick must be repainted before siding is installed. Masonry brick masonry paint color is still up for discussion. I think we decided on the lighter color. I would like to add in here maybe subject to staff approval on the color. Southern yellow pine with stain is appropriate. Siding the attachment to furring strips that are attached to the wall only on mortar joints. Install wooden partition is appropriate. Installed globe sconces are appropriate. Installed steel half life backdoor is appropriate.

I'll second that motion.

Well, we have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? Kersten, would you poll the commission? Okay.

Commissioner Conrad? Yes. Commissioner Ilim? Yes. Commissioner Simmons? Yes. Commissioner Peterson?

Yes.

Vice Chair Whitaker? Yes. Chairperson?

Yes. Item G. G1, consider a discussion regarding the implementation of the historic preservation commission's FY 2026 goals.

Good evening commissioners. There's not a presentation associated with this item. It's an opportunity for you all to discuss the implementation of the goals that are in your packet, which you had adopted last month.

So, Commissioners, I would like to open this up for discussion.

As

we have these, 13 goals, and working with our strengths, I would like to take any volunteers that would like to take a lead in any of these item goals for consideration. In realizing that there is a need for staff help with certain goals, if there's any ones that you would like to step up to or even consider how to implement these, either schedule a dedicated time to work on these as paired up groups or forming subcommittees or assign one or two of these goals to commissions, commissioners and then have low, goal leads, put them into action.

I would like to help out number four if possible, consider a future restoration plan for the Sansom House.

I would like to be considered for creating number 10, creating the scoring rubric for local legend selection.

Any other? Any other suggestions, volunteers, discussion? If not, thank you so much for volunteering. Thank you so much. Item H staff reports.

Okay, I'm just going to highlight a couple items out of the from the November monthly update. So first on November 6, we presented the local legend awards for Doctor. Reverend Doctor. A. W.

Anthony Mayes and RR ISD, which was accepted by the chief schools, went very nicely. Regarding training, the last week there was a webinar, session on design review roundtable additions, which actually those are actually really pretty helpful. They get people from around the country to describe one of their projects and then people will kind of poll to say like would your commission approve this? And so kind of seeing the range of what is considered what other cities consider appropriate for for them is always interesting. So and that's the recording is available for ninety days.

If you were registered for the summer short course in August, recordings the are going away on the twenty fourth. Our next, lunch and learn will be February 10, featuring former HBC chair Pamela Anderson doing a presentation on Trails, Tales, and Tradition, European Migration, and Stagecoach in History. In zoning, the mixed use zoning ordinance and zoning chain and rezonings were approved on October 23. And the Palm House, they've opened the bids and selected a preferred bidder, and they just need to bring that contract to the council to to get that going. And then they think it'll be about three months of of work once it gets started.

Do any other commissioners have any upcoming preservation related events that they know about that they would like to share with us? Any announcements in regard to upcoming events?

I do.

I knew you did.

Preservation Georgetown is putting on its yearly home tours. December tickets are now on sale for $35 on our website. And if you've not attended it, it's it's a bow and a wonderful way to see the preservation that can take place whenever everyone works together. We had four houses. One had to be dropped because air conditioning was put in wrong and ruined the floor.

Oh,

no. Yeah. So that's not going well. But we have four homes. We have the united I mean, Saint Paul's Methodist Church. It's its hundredth anniversary. And then we also have Mood Hall at Southwestern that we just added, which is the first boys men's sorry, men's dormitory at the university, and it's just been redone completely. And so it's preservation at its best. And so it will we'll actually have four houses and two buildings this year, and it's well worth your time. And it's for both days.

If you buy a ticket, you can use it either day, or you can do part of them one day and part of them another. It's really fun to see and get to go through the houses and learn about them, the architecture and what's been done. And we're we're paying homage to I just forgot his initials. Mister Belfort that built almost all of the square. He owned a one of the big lumber yards in Downtown Georgetown, and he built 80 of the homes in the historic overlay. And four of these homes are his. And the the mood center, he didn't design it, but he did help build it. So we're paying homage to him, which is really, really something to see. So come and see it. I think you'll enjoy it.

Sounds fun. It is. And I'll be so glad when it's over. Sorry.

Any other announcements? If not, we are adjourned at 06:34. Thank you all so much.