Board of Zoning Appeals - Regular Meeting

All right. All right. Hey, good afternoon everyone. My name is Jason Barney. I served as the chair for Veronic City Florida zoning appeals. I would like now to talk about that. I would like now to call to order the May 13th BZA hearing by first welcoming all of our board members, all the Reno City staff, our advocate for today and all members of the public who are present for today's hearing. This hearing is being broadcast via YouTube. We ask that you please turn this on off on all phones and electronic devices during the hearing. If you have registered to speak on today's application, the public comment portion of the application has begun. Please then wait to be recognized in turn. We ask that you please then approach the podium and state your name and

residential address clearly so that the secretary to the board may record the proceedings accurately. And based on the amount of people that we have scheduled to speak today, we ask that you please try to limit your comments to 3 minutes and try to offer new points and new content versus restating points and content that have already been made today. It's important to note that all persons shall be afforded an opportunity to speak and state their views concerning all aspect matters. So in light of all that being stated, Mr. Clerk, we begin to have you please take the role. Mr. Barney, Mr. Here, Mr. Barer here. Mr. Hamlet here. Mr. Logan here. Mr. Miller here. Mr. Barney

here. Thank you. Board members, do we have a motion to approve today's agenda? So move. Second. Thank you, Mr. Logan. Thank you, Mr. Garner. Mr. Clerk, we take a vote on approving today's agenda. Sergeant, I Mr. Barn, I Mr. H. I Mr. Hi. Mr. Miller. Hi. Mr. Barney. I board me. Do we have a motion to approve the minutes from the March 11th DA hearing? So move. Second. Thank you. Handler. Miss Clark. Can we take a vote on approving the minutes from the March 11th hearing? Missman, I'll abstain since I did not attend it. Mr. Garner, hi. Mr. Hamler, hi. Mr. Logan,

hi. Mr. Miller, I and Mr. Barney. I Okay. Do we have any unfinished business to attend to today? All right. Thank you. Moving forward, can we go ahead and read the first application of new business into record? First, we have an application by least of these ministry to appeal a zoning administrator's determination dated February 25th, 2026 pertaining to the zoning use classification for property located at 420 Avenue bearing official tax map number 1012406.

Thank you. Um, is the applicant present today? Okay. Would one of you like to speak to your application? All right, great. Thank you. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Uh, yes. I'm Jim Cowan. I'm an attorney with Ken Perry PC offices at 1328 Third Street Southwest in Ro, Virginia.

Right. Thank you, sir. Go ahead and tell us why you're here today. Give me one moment to grab my notes. Thank you, members of EZA, Mr. Chairman. We appreciate the opportunity to be with you this morning. Um, we're here in support of an appeal of the February 25th, 2026 uh zoning determination. Uh, but not as to the entire piece. I think as was mentioned in the work session, the part that's being appealed is the classification of the exterior lockers and the portable privier portagon being defined as outdoor storage. That's a fairly a fairly narrow issue. Um there's other items that were in that determination. Those were continued to work uh through with city and and we'll follow those avenues and recommendations that that were made. Uh so this is a fairly narrow appeal from from our place. It really doesn't deal with the location operation uh the warming buses or some of the other activities that that go there. Uh the requested relief is that the zoning administration determination be be reversed. Um and the uh board determined that these two items do not count as outdoor storage under under that. Uh in the alternative, I think you also have authority under 15.2309 to modify the decision and determination. Uh and you could recognize these as incidental, accessory or operationally necessary to the approved use of office or or here supply pantry. And so that's the piece that's that's before the board. um we don't believe that those items are properly uh falling under that definition of outdoor storage and there's a few reasons for that. Um I think in doing that maybe the simplest way is to start very at the very at the very high level right I think as the zoning administrator indicated during the work session uh RON has an inclusive ordinance meaning

right you got to find where your use fits and if you can't find a definition that fits that applies to the zoning category you're in then you don't have that use I think that's a a proper statement of the rule in looking at that here I think you have to start with the first question is and I'll take the storage lockers first and then then move on to to the privies. Do those rise to the level of use separate from the approved primary use of the property? That approved use as as was noted in the in the zoning administrator's submission and we acknowledges obviously this office use and then the supply pantry use are the two things that are under that certificate of occupancy and are permitted uses in this zoning district and are the current use of the property uh by the applicant and by by the least of these ministry. Um our view is that they're not an independent use but they're rather they are properly seen as part of the supply pantry use under that certificate of occupancy. Uh they're incidental. They're they're part of what we do there. The definition of a supply pantry approved definition is an establishment engaged in the provision or sale of food, clothing or other essential items at no charge or for less than market value where no on premises consumption of the items distributed occurs. It says such establishments may commonly refer to as food banks, thrift stores, or clothing banks. Uh our view is if you're essentially here, if we're supplying essential items to the homeless and and serving that population in our community, a population where there's much need, uh it stands to reason they may have somewhere to need to store those items from time to time or otherwise they have to carry them on their person at all times uh because they're unhoused many times in these situations. Think of toiletries for example. uh think of other items uh personal items that you might have that you need that you would be really happy to have gotten uh from the ministry but that you really can't carry around with you. You can't go to a job interview carrying them with you or or you might need to store somewhere safe and preserve them from theft or not have to hide them somewhere or find a location.

And so we think that in looking at this, the easiest thing to do is to look at this and say uh this really is just um incidental, accessory, or operationally necessary to the good use rather than a separate use that needs to find some definition. There is no definition for storage lockers uh in in in the code out there. And so I I think we kind of start there when when we read through it. If if the determination is of the board here that they do rise to the level of a separate use I I think all of us we read it it's you know then zoning administrators the what the heck thing is the closest thing where where do I put this and here they elected this outdoor storage component and our view is it doesn't really it doesn't really doesn't really fit there um and for some very practical reasons I think we noted in our application if you look at the supplemental regs it talks about some examples and it's things like outdoor storage of of bulk materials like you would have at a place that sells mulch and and rock for your yard. Right? If you have that's stored outside, that's right. That's that's a that's a type of outdoor storage that's only allowed in certain districts. I can't just do that out in the parking lot uh anywhere in the downtown district. And so you think, well, that that's pretty easy for me to see. When I look at the the storage lockers here that you've seen photos of, I think if we're going to define that type of thing attached to the building as an outdoor storage use under this under this definition and that definition of course talks about keeping or storing other than a wholly enclosed building any goods, items, materials or merchandise. And it says shall be permitted only as an accessory use where allowed by this uh chapter. And so the question is is this a specific accessory use just incidental to the operation of the business or is it a more general accessory accessory use uh when you look at it and I think you've almost and our view would be if you take the view of well what happens if we decide that this type of thing falls under that category. Well if I go down to FedEx and I've got a FedEx box attached to the outside of a

building but I attach my hose inside an enclosure to the side of my house. If I have an Amazon locker attached to my building. If I'm at the CVS and there's a drop off there or a business has a night dropbox, all of those are something attached to a building or they they're not a building, but they a structure. I don't know. I guess we could argue about about that piece of the code as well and and get down there. But we have all types of uses where something and things are temporarily put somewhere attached. And do those fall under this? Our view would be no because they're just incidental to going to the UPS store. they're incidental to having a home with a box on it to having a business where people drop things off at night for a pickup or something like that. And so I think you can if you think of it in that broader context, it makes more sense to think of them as incidental. And we think we're closer to that than we are to somebody storing large amounts of gravel out in the parking lot to sell for for kind of outdoor storage of a product that's being sold. And so uh that that's really as we look at it kind of where we think we can we can look at this and if you go under the use table uh I think one of the comments came up is well if it's not outdoor storage well then isn't it just not allowed right if you say it rises to a level of use and it's not incidental accessible you know incidental accessory or operationally necessary which we think it certainly is and miss speak to that in a few minutes then There is a general accessory use category and definition and that says it's a use of a land or structure or portion thereof which is customarily accessory and clearly incidental and subordinate in area extend in purpose to the principal use of the land or structure and located on the same lot. Um and so there's a further definition of the code in 36.243 243 that that talks about accessory uses and structures and says their principal uses uh which are allowed by right or by special exception may include accessory uses and structures as defined and has some requirements for where you go uh and do that that I think would be would

be met here. So we think you got to put it somewhere. It's kind of just a general accessory use related to the supply pantry operation that they're doing. We don't think it's a whole line of of independent uh use that we're out conducting some business that's different from the operation uh of u uh of the least of these ministry at this location. We think it's just part of that and I think that gives you some places uh sort of where you can where you can look at that and where you can fit that under these under these definitions. So our our request would be that you that you look at that issue and and look at it sort of in that in that manner. Uh because to find that anything attached to the building with so many stores in uh is going to need is going to be outdoor storage under this statute. I think all those other types of things I just described, you can think of all kinds of things. Uh it made me think of back in the day of Blockbuster. Go drop your video back off. But there's all kinds of businesses that have some sort of temporary storage or product related to their business of that of that nature. I don't know if we have a UPS store here that has the extra accessible after hours lockers and those sorts of things, but those are incidental to their business. It's not some different use that they're engaging in. So, so we think that interpretation was a little broad and would like to would ask you to consider it sort of in that in that light and in that in that manner as a function of of what they're doing. We're not trying to create a new principal use. Uh and we and we think it can can be placed under that under that. That then brings us I guess to the second one which is the the portable privy and is it outdoor storage and you look at that same definition. Um I I guess there are some things in it for some period of time for storage but I believe that's uh incidental to trying to to prevent their accumulation in other parts of the of the property or or neighborhood. It's not it's not stored goods or merchandise right used as needed. It's temporary. It's not a permanent structure. I think you'll hear from the sound of all their they've had them there at times. they get removed, they get cleaned, they bring them back uh to support and that they are also

incidental to the services that they're providing there at the at the building um and don't really make sense as outdoor storage. So, is that a related accessory use that's subordinate to to the services that we're providing through the ministry at the property? Uh certainly they're not open at all times of day and and and you know obviously in being a good neighbor uh they feel like having that available on the property at times particularly at higher use times uh where where their need is the greatest is is something that is incidental and incillary and supportive uh of their use of the of the property. And so we think that outdoor storage label is a little bit challenging to to uh to to apply there. Um, I think you do note that they're often used, right, with construction or things that require a permit. Uh, but we've looked and I can't find where the portable toilets, privies, or these type of facilities are regulated under the code. Certainly, I think the city has the right to regulate them to require a permit or to say you can only have one if you got a construction permit. Uh, but as I've looked at the code, if I'm doing landscape work in my yard and I want to have a portagon out there and it's work that doesn't require a building permit, I can rent one from somebody and I can put it out my yard. There's no statutory limit on how long it can be there, how often it has to be moved around, right? And these things can are portable and placed at different times at different areas on the on the property where where it makes sense to to do so. And so we think that portable nature of that and the type of use it is really really doesn't fit under that label and should be found as as not a separate use of the of the property that has to find a home. But more importantly, it's not a regulated use in the city. There certainly are municipalities that have regulations about putting a porta pond. There's certainly some that have ones if you want to put it out by the street, you have to get a permit when you're doing work and you want to have it out in front of your house. I I don't see where we have that here or something in the zoning code really talks about it. That does create kind of a gray or a strange area. Uh but from our purposes um it's being provided incidental to the services that they are providing to the

people that come in and get food and clothing and essentials uh when the facility is there and they don't have adequate at certain times u in indoor uh facilities and certainly want to be a good neighbor and not not have uh have sanitation issues creep out over into the into the area. So we think on that part you kind of go through that same analysis, right? Is this is does this rise the level of a separate use? Is it a struct It's not a structured building. It sits out there. You pick it up, you move it around, you empty it, they bring you a different one a week or two later, however that works out. And so we think it really doesn't fit under that. So we'd ask that you analyze both of those and say that they do fall in uh to to part of the supply pantry ministry work that is going on at this site and not rise the level of use. If they do, we think they're either in that sort of incidental part of of it that falls under that the section I referenced at the beginning, or it's just an accessory use that's clearly incidental and subordinate uh to the primary use of the building uh and the services that they're providing there to uh to to folks in need in the neighborhood. And so that's uh that that's really um our argument sort of summarized for why why we would ask you and why we appeal this part. um we felt like on the other uh we tend to agree that we there probably wasn't a better category we could we could put uh put those items in and so so we'll work through that to through the proper channel. um we're asking you to find that u the presumption of correctness that is given uh to um a decision by the zoning administrator that that here that that's been rebutted by both from a legal standless argument and then you'll hear a little bit factfully about that next from his son of all and we'll ask that you overturn the decision on that basis. We certainly appreciate and respect your your time today and letting us share our thoughts on this and and why it's essential to the ministry. And with that, I was going to ask the son of all to come up and and speak for a couple of minutes and walk through a few things.

Miss, could you briefly just state your name and position? Most of the folks, I think, know what your role is, but just for anybody that resial address, and then you can state your position after. Yes, sir. My name is John Sandival. I'm at 602 Marshall Avenue Southwest Ron, Virginia 24016. I am the founder and the executive director of the least of these ministry. Thank you, ma'am. Could you raise your right hand so I can swear you in you solemnly swear affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and both the truth. I do.

Okay, great. Go ahead and tell us why you're here today. So, I'm here today to um try to better explain the use of the outdoor lockers and the outdoor um privy that are located on our property at 420 Love Avenue Southwest and how it is um utilized in conjunction with what we are doing as a ministry to those that are experiencing homelessness. is is there anything else that you'd like to say at this time? Um, yeah, that'd be helpful if you spoke to the locker use and and use.

So, the lockers that are on the outside of our building are utilized by those that are experiencing homelessness that um tend to utilize them for a change of clothes or their um IDs, their medications. um being homeless doesn't exclude you from high blood pressure, insulin dependent diabetes, all of those things. So, it's often difficult to keep up with those type of um items when you are homeless and you have to leave things places in order to attend appointments or whatever the case may be. And so, um, those lockers are assigned to individuals that are experiencing homelessness and more specifically unsheltered homelessness, not those that utilize our local rescue mission. And so, our ministry provides the locks and the combinations and we assign them the use of those while they are experiencing homelessness. So, they have the ability to utilize those um because they are outdoors, they can utilize them at any time if they, you know, need to change clothing or whatever that situation may be. But um

and are those regular customarily used to to store uh essential items, clothing items they get from the supply pantry? Correct. Part of the operation. Yes. Yes. We found that the lockers um help eliminate the thought that clothes are um discardable. We find that we're doing laundry for people in the other aspect of our ministry. So when we are giving them clothing and things of that nature, they can hold on to it and maintain it. So it's not like you're having to give them clothing every day that they come to take a shower.

Yeah. And and maybe share the benefit of that to the operation of your of your supply pantry. Well, the benefit to the operation is that we are donorbased, so we don't have to keep begging for clothing and and hygiene items to give out every single day. But there's also, in my opinion, a benefit to our community because one of the complaints that I've heard from citizens in the Renault Valley is that they don't want to see people's belongings thrown about. They don't want to see book bags laying around. But if people don't have anywhere to store them then and we eliminate these lockers then it's not going to eliminate the problem. It's going to exacerbate it in my opinion.

Could you tell us how long the outdoor lockers have been on site of your property? Yes sir. So our ministry opened in that building April 1st of 2021. The lockers were installed on our building August 3rd of 2021. Okay. Has the outdoor privy been on your property since around the same date? Has it ever moved off the property and been returned or has it stayed there?

It has been there since November of 2021 and there have been switch outs and things of that nature. Um 16 incidences I believe um where it's been um and we do pay to have it cleaned two times every week. Joe made an effort to make sure there is an outdoor privy on site on most of the time.

And if I can be very transparent with you, we we see our port John being used by dog walkers, by city employees that are picking up trash, you know, like emptying the trash. That is open to anyone because our city unfortunately doesn't have public bathrooms. So when people are walking by, it's open for anyone's use. How how does it support your ministry and supply pantry operations and the effective operation of that?

So because of the increase in the homeless population, we do find ourselves serving a larger number of people and so a lot of people are inside our building during operations. Some of them are outside our building depending on the weather. So uh the porta john gives them the opportunity to use the bathroom. Um it also was very beneficial during our warming bus operations because our building was not open um for people to go in and out for the bathroom. So we were able to provide that so that people could exit the bu the buses in order to use the bathroom. I also feel that that has a benefit to our community because if that portage John is removed, where are people going to do something that is bodily required? You you have no choice but to use the bathroom. So, that's going to be another citizen complaint because people are using the doorways for bathrooms or the yards or whatever. But what they don't have any choice as far as I'm I know

you ref made a reference to 16 times. It's not 16 times it's been cleaned. Is that 16 times one's been removed a few days later new one comes is placed somewhere on the property. Maybe explain that a little. Yes. So it's been removed and returned 16 times. I believe it's either 15 or 16. I'm not positive. But um it's cleaned two times a week and emptied two times a week. board members. We have other questions for the applicant at this time. Thank you for coming. I just want to make sure I understand the timeline correctly.

You began operations in April of 23. The lockers were installed in August and then the uh first appeared in November.

It was 2021. We began operations April 1 of 2021 and the lockers were installed August 3rd of 2021 and the warming buses uh I'm sorry the Port of John came on site November of 2021 because that is when we launched our warming buses and realized that in order to have a warming bus you have to have somewhere for people to use the bathroom. I have a question regarding the uh lockers and the placement of them who place them. Was there any other thought uh over there was there and another place that those lockers could be placed and the u residents to have uh access to them? The only place that we could think of was for them to have access outdoors and that's why the decision was made to put them on the outside of our building. Um, I think to open the indoors of a building 24 hours a day for people to access their lockers, I think that would create more of a risk than where they are now. We have multiple cameras on our lot. I can monitor those cameras from my telephone 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Um, and they are in clear view for not only for their safety, but for just the the purpose of being visible to the the community, whoever. And one follow question. You think there would still be a demand for the lockers even without the supply pantry operations?

Do I think there would be a demand for the lockers without the supply pantry being present? Yes, I think there would be a demand for it. Um, but I think that it where it's located with us being the one that distributes the items, it makes sense for it to be located on our building. There is no one that are providing lockers anywhere in the valley for people's belongings.

Mr. Moore, has there been any other written public comment aside from what the board has received already? Um, yes. That should have been made available to you all prior to this meeting. Um it got entered into the public record. So Okay. So all the public comment has been in the public record as far as written public. Correct. Thank you. Mr. Moore, could you go ahead and tell us what staff's position is regarding this application? Sure. Um and you all may be seeing this.

Thank you. Um, on February 25th, 2026, the city of Reno issued a zoning determination letter alongside two noticens of violation, one for regional housing services and one for outdoor storage. The zoning administrator determined the current use of the subject property as a regional housing services facility with associated outdoor storage were not permitted uses of the subject property. The ter termination also stated uh that the appelllet was operating outside of the current certificate of occupancy on file with the city. As such, the use of the property must conform with the permitted uses allowed on the current certificate of occupancy. Any other uses of the property that are uh permitted within the downtown zoning district would need to be updated through the issuance of a new certificate of occupancy. The appellant is offered to comply with the city's determination surrounding the regional housing services portion of the zoning administrator's determination. Staff looks forward to working with the appellent towards resolution of that specific zoning violation. However, that's not the subject of the current uh appeal as um was staged by the appellent. Um the appellent has appealed the determination of outdoor storage being conducted on this um subject property. In particular, the outdoor storage lockers that open onto um an asphalt parking lot um in a portable privy. I'll pull this up on the screen for you all to sort of see here. um different photos of those. Um in particular, the outdoor storage lockers that open out onto the asphalt parking lot and a portable privy that sits adjacent to the building within the

same parking lot as the storage lockers. A notice of violation is an official determination uh and it's subject to an appeal um to the board of zoning appeals in accordance with section 36.2-562. The decision on such appeal of any order, requirement, decision, or determination made by the zoning administrator and the administration or enforcement of the chapter shall be based on the board's judgment of whether or not the zoning administrator was correct in the interpretation and enforcement of the zoning ordinance. In this case, the zoning administrator based on all the evidence and a thorough reading of the all permitted uses within the zoning code and their respective definitions acted within the zoning administrators clearly stated powers and duties found in section 36.2-B41 of the zoning ordinance and came to the conclusion that the portable private outdoor storage lockers most similarly match the definition of outdoor storage, which is not a permitted use in the downtown zoning district. Since the subject property is zoned downtown, the outdoor storage use is not permitted on the subject property. Um, and then the next section here is about um my findings. The decision to classify the use as outdoor storage is based on the following findings. The subject property at 420 Luck Avenue Southwest received a certificate of occupancy for office general professional and supply pantry on January 3rd of 2023. An office is defined as an establishment primarily engaged in providing administrative, clerical, and other services not involving manufacturing, assembly, storage, display, or direct retail sale of goods and not including medical services. Typical uses include real estate, insurance, management, tax preparation, call centers, data processing, computer software development, travel or other business

offices in organization and association offices. A supply pantry is defined as an establishment engaged in the provision or sale of food, clothing, or other essential items at no charge or for less than fair market value where no on premises consumption of the items being distributed occurs. Such establishments may commonly be referred to as food banks, thrift stores, or clothes banks. And then finally, outdoor storage is defined as the keeping or storing other than in a wholly enclosed building of any goods, items, materials, or merchandise. Outdoor storage shall be permitted only as an accessory use where allowed by this chapter. For purposes of this definition, motor vehicle inventory or for uh sale or lease, motor vehicle rental inventory, motor vehicle and commercial motor vehicle fleets associated with the business establishment, the inventory of a nursery or commercial grain, and the inventory of a storage building sales establishment shall not be considered outdoor storage. The approval of the certificate of occupancy that was issued for this subject property was based off the floor plan. um that was provided to us. Um that's this one here. Um notably, it does not include any um outdoor storage lockers uh or or portable printing um on the site plan. Um it is important to highlight the definition of supply pantry specifically prohibits the on-site consumption of items being distributed by the operator. The appellant states in their appeal application that to carry out its permitted use in a professional manner. Least of these must provide a location for its patients to store what few belongings and valuables that they have.

Moreover, because the property cannot be opened at all hours, the lockers must be in a location that patrons can access at any time. Stat argues that the mere act of storing the items on site once received is suggestive of consumption on site which is in direct conflict with the supply pantry use classification and further shows that the least of these is operating outside of its current certificate of occupancy. Staff also acknowledges that other items may also be placed in these lockers, but certainly the items being distributed on site end up uh being stored there as well. And I think Miss Sandival alluded to that when she said, you know, people's medications, things like that, um, are also being stored in the lockers. Furthermore, there's an error in the Helen's argument. The zoning ordinance definition of outdoor storage specifically excludes uh any wholly enclosed structures. The language of the definition of outdoor storage within the zoning code actually excludes any wholly enclosed uh excludes items within any wholly enclosed building. This is a subtle but extremely important difference in the reading of that um use definition as structure and building are separately and distinctly defined in the zoning ordinance from appendix B of the zoning code. Structure is anything which is constructed or erected with a fixed location on the ground or attached to something having a fixed location on the ground including buildings, walls, fences, signs, manufactured homes, swimming pools in ground and above ground patios, parking areas and loading areas constructed or erected with a fixed location on the ground means that an item that is stationary and that cannot be readily added without special equipment.

A building is a structure with a roof supported and wholly enclosed by walls and intended for shelter, housing or enclosure of persons, animal activity, process, equivalent goods or materials of any kind. From the construction of the above definitions, one can quickly reach the determination that while all buildings are structures, not all structures meet the definition of a building. The subject storage lockers are certainly a structure uh as they're attached to something having a fixed location on the ground including buildings. However, the storage lockers fall short of the definition of a building nor are they integral to the building with which they are attached. The storage lockers benefit from being bolted to one side of the a building because they are not self-supported with walls. Additionally, they lack a roof supported by a wholly enclosed walls. The lack of a roof can be reflected by the fact that there is another structure attached to the building above the lockers to protect the lockers from the outdoor elements. The necessity of additional overhead protection from natural outdoor elements such as rain supports the fact that the subject storage lockers are not designed for use outside of a wholly enclosed building. Nor are they integral to such a building. Nor were they designed to be standalone buildings themselves. Because of this, there's no exclusive on the subject wall lockers provided within the definition of outdoor storage. The subject portable privy does not even rise to the definition of structure, let alone a building, as a portable as the portable nature of its use excludes it from having a fixed location on the ground. It takes no more than four individuals without specialized equipment to move even a field portable privy. Because of this, there is no exclusion of the subject orbital privy provided within the definition of outdoor storage. In accordance with section 36.2-841 of the zoning ordinance, the zoning

administrator may render interpretations of the zoning uh I'm sorry, render interpretations of the provisions of the zoning code, including useful interpretations. The zoning administrator determined that the characteristics of the use described as storage lockers and the portable outdoor privy fall within a specific use classification with the zoning within the zoning ordinance outdoor storage. The appellant and the representative have argued in their appeal application that the outdoor storage use classification should not be upheld because it because the portable private outdoor storage lockers are not specifically listed in the definition of outdoor storage and that there are elements to the definition and supplemental regulations for the use that do not perfectly align with the uses taking place on the subject property. Section 36.2-204C3 2-204C3 covers this scenario and states for a use not identified in the tables, the zoning administrator may determine that such use is substantially the same as another use otherwise permitted in the use tables. The city of Renick zoning use tables are constructed as inclusive which permits only those uses that are specifically named within the corresponding use tables. With an inclusive zoning ordinance, the burden of proof is on the land owner to show that the proposed use is permitted. Um, and there's, you know, case law that um that follows that. Set another way, those uses that are not listed in the city zoning code specifically or generally are uses that are not permitted at all. An example of this would be uh a landfill. A landfill is a use classification that's not listed specifically or gen generally within the zoning code. Therefore, landfills are a use not permitted within the city of Rodick. It is clear that portable privies and storage lockers are also not specifically listed in the

zoning code either. And so, if the appelllet is unable to find a more suitable use classification that is also permitted within the downtown zoning district, then those more specific use of storage lockers port in portable privy are not also are still not permitted. Certainly not every use being conducted on properties within the city is fits cleanly into the list of use classification desk uh definitions listed in the use tables within article 3 and appendix A of the zoning code. And while the appellent has made the argument that the outdoor storage use classification determination by the zoning administrator is weaker than a perfect match, the appellant will still need to make a stronger case for how the portable premium storage lodgers are more similar to something uh to some other permitted use within the downtown zoning district. This is something that the ele uh the appellent has um uh today um addressed. And so I would like to take the time to um to address what we heard. Um I think the case was made uh that um the outdoor storage lockers and the portable privy were accessory uses onto the permitted principal uses u being conducted on site. Principal uses permitted within a district can be accompanied by a range of accessory uses. Permitted accessory uses are also included within the use tables for the corresponding districts. Um outdoor storage, even as an accessory use to a principal use, is not a permitted activity in the downtown zoning district. In order for the appellant to make the case that outdoor storage lockers and a portable privy are indeed permitted accessory uses not otherwise listed, they would need to make the case

for how these accessory uses are customarily incidental and subordinate to the permitted principal use of the property. There's a library of case law that holds the customarily incidental and subordinate um criteria for determining uh whether a use is an accessory use. While the subordinate nature of the outdoor storage lockers and uh portable privy uses are debatable and I I want to I want to address that part. Um there was a question asked by I think Mr. Miller about whether or not the storage lockers um there would be need for those outside of supply pantry use. And the the answer to that I I think we heard is that yes, they would. And so um to me uh the subordinate nature of the outdoor storage locker use at that point is no longer clear. Um, and so, uh, I think the the outdoor storage lockers fail, um, at a subordinate, um, criteria level, um, as it relates to to an accessory use. The term incidental incorporates the concept of a reasonable relationship with the primary use. It is not enough that the use be subordinate. It also must be attendant or conccomittent. To ignore this latter aspect of incidental would be to permit any use which is not primary, no matter how unrelated it is to the primary use. in Wley versus Dorchester County Board of Zoning Appeals. Um, in 1994, the courts ruled that an accessory use must be one so necessary or common uh commonly to be

expected with the associated principal use that it cannot be supposed that the ordinance was intended to permit it. It would be extremely difficult to think of any example where the outdoor storage lockers are part of the function of uh supply pantry as was um stated by the um appellant. Um you can think of places like um Goodwill or Salvation Army. I can't think of any um supply pantries where outdoor storage lockers are present on site. um nor would they be required to be in order for the primary use to function. It is even more challenging to comp contemplate the instance where a portable privy is customarily incidental to either of the principal uses listed on the current certificate of occupancy uh for the subject properties. Now I can think of ways in which um these two um these two activities were incidental and subordinate uh in nature to the unlawfully established regional housing services facility. Um and so um you know because the because the the determination um was not appealed on the regional housing services uh use classification. Um that's something that is uh that's a uh been determined already. And so um again this appeal is not about the regional housing services element. um the zoning administrator has determined that that use is not a permitted use within the district and so any accessory

uh uses that were directly related to that use are also not valid. Um, even if a use case could be made for how the outdoor storage lockers and portable trivia are accessory to a regional housing services facility, as previously stated in the background section of the staff report, the zoning administrator issued a notice of violation on the subject property for operating this principal use. the downtown zoning district which does not permit such a use. The appellant did not appeal that determination and so it's a thing decided. The zoning code is silent on portable privies as a permanent use either as a principle or accessory use following the same line of argument as above that this means that they are not permitted uh for permanent use on a property anywhere in the city. This is why the city does not have businesses skirting building code requirements for restroom facilities in the buildings by installing portable privies on site. All lawfully permitted usage of portable privies are directly tied to temporary use permits. Section 36.2-429 2-429 of the zoning code covers temporary uses including the authorized temporary use and its respective permitted locations, durations, the maximum number per calendar year. Without a permitted temporary use for which the portable privy is directly tied, the keeping of a portable privy or use on any property is therefore unlawful. And then finally, zoning code 15.2-2309C 2-2309C states, "The decision on such appeal shall be based on the board's judgment of whether the zone uh administrative officer was correct. The determination of the administrative officer shall be

presumed to be correct. At a hearing on an appeal, the administrative officer shall explain the basis of his determination, after which the appellant has the burden of proof to rebut such presumption of correctness by preponderance of the evidence. Um, the subject property is located within the Dtown zoning district and based on the findings above, the zoning administrator rendered a determination that the outdoor storage lockers and outdoor portable privy are considered outdoor storage. The outdoor storage use either primary or accessory is not a permitted use in the downtown zoning district. Thank you.

Mr. more. Board members, do we have any questions for staff at this time? Um, Mr. Chairman, uh, just for clarification, Easter more, you mentioned that the in your determination um, storing items on site and and we are considering the lockers themselves, not the use that they happen to store things in the lockers. or are we considering both in this part of the intervention? Um, Bri, can you restate the question? Sorry.

Okay. So, so what are you considering? Are you considering the lockers themselves as the item that is being stored regardless of what the use of those lockers is? Correct.

Okay. All right. Um and just for my clarification. So secondly, um can you differentiate this the keeping of a bank of lockers on on your parking lot to a dumpster that stays on your parking lot or a goodwill collection box that you've allowed to stay on your property or a like little library boxes that around? But what what's the differentiation? Um, say that again. Understand that the determination that the buyers are are being stored and item

and the items inside. Correct. Certainly. All right. There may also be a dumpster that stays on that property year round or there may be a goodwill collection box that stays on that property year round. What's the differentiation? Yeah. So those items that you were talking about, the dumpster and the um uh the the other item um I mean just

yeah those will be those would typically be incidental and subordinate in nature to the principal use being conducted there. And so you know uh refuge container I mean those are you see those all over the place. Obviously, people need a place to put their refues and all. Um, those are incidental, customarily incidental and subordinate to um, uh, most businesses. Um, with the outdoor storage lockers, um, that's not the case.

And I I just think something and I use the Goodwill Collection Box as an example. There is a business that I think of uh that is a uh car repair shop and they have allowed Goodwill to place a collection box on their property. That's not really incidental to their Yeah, I'm not aware of that. Um I would say that that's not incidental subordinate to the nature of the business that they would fall under the same u potentially. Yeah, I would have to take a closer look at the circumstances. Uh,

um, what was the name of that case you mentioned earlier? I wonder. Um, that was why versus Dorchester County Board of Zing Appeals, 1994. And in the case, the courts ruled that an accessory use must be one so necessaril necessary and commonly to be expected with the associated principal use that it cannot be supposed that the ordinance was intended to prevent it.

Thank you, Mr. Moore. Would the applicant like to to discuss any points made by staff? In fact, yes, sir. Go ahead. Would you approach the podium, please?

Thank you. So, first I'd like to say that we've been doing the exact same services for the last 5 years. We haven't changed anything about the services that we've re that we've been um giving out. Our warming buses have operated for 5 years. They were advertised on Reno City's website as emergency crisis shelter during the winter. Our Reno City Police Department brought people to our bus 24 hours a 900 p to 7A anytime they came across someone that was unsheltered sleeping in a parking lot because we were the only place that would open the doors no matter what time of night or day it was. So when we got our certificate of occupancy, the city staff members came into our building. The warming buses were on the parking lot because it was November of 2022. Our lockers were attached to the side of the building. Our entire facility was toured. All of the services were there laid bare and they made the determination of what our certificate of occupancy reflected. We didn't apply to a specific um operation. We just were transparent about what we provide. And so that's how we got our certificate of occupancy. So for someone to say that we unlawfully created a warming bus option to address unsheltered people is not true. We have never been told that we were doing anything unlawful. We've gotten awards from the city of Rowan Oak for community partnership. So

I I apologize. Um so I just wanted that to be said that this is not a new thing. This is a situation where some people have become unhappy with what we are doing and they have made the decision that they want to shut down what our operation does on the periphery of our building to offer people a dignified place to use the bathroom and a place to store the only thing that they have to their name. That's right. That's good. on clapping, it would be greatly appreciated. Sorry. Thank you.

If I could briefly respond to to one or two items, counsel. Um, you know, I think you have to think about the use and I think you had some great questions. It's difficult to me to see how uh a dumpster that is a refuge container can be there permanently and it's not outdoor storage, but a privy that's on a property. Uh that's a refuge container of some sort uh as well, right? Some somehow gets some some differentiation. While every business may need a dumpster for trash, I don't I think if you think about the operation of a supply pantry and particularly one that is serving a homeless population with this level of demand that incidental to that, those number of people coming there to to obtain food. This isn't just a good local shop where you go in and buy things at a thrift store. Obviously, they're they're serving a slightly different need than that in the community. Both are both are very valuable needs, but that that you've got to think about the supply pantry and the operation of this particular business and is it incidental to that that it rises to that level that you would consider it necessary to that as those cases talk about or or comment. And I think if you think the operation of this particular supply pantry, as she's described it, the level of need, what they provide to people during the day, why they're not open at night, why these folks might have related to to the service they're trying to provide, it's it is really necessary if they didn't have a place, right? They wouldn't be able to supply the need. They wouldn't be able to fulfill their mission as a supply pantry because that need would be recurring every day, right? Those essential items. I don't think it destroys that that outside of it being incidental or necessary or or or really an integral part of the service they're providing as a supply pantry that there would be a need for storage lockers outside of that. I think everybody acknowledges that we have a homeless problem. There's lots of needs. They're not meeting all of them. There would still be other needs, but they've described I think here pretty clearly why it is incidental to theirs. And I think the necessary part has been described pretty pretty clearly. Is it so common as to be expected? I I would

tell you I I don't you know do any of us have enough to know beyond Miss Fondal what is customary or needed to to run this type of supply pantry to serve this population in our community. She's the expert on that. And so I think to the extent she tells you this is essential. We've been doing this since pretty close to the beginning and here's why. Uh that may be the best evidence of what's customary to operation of what she's doing. Now, the fact that other types of thrift stores or discount stores or other community services may not have the same need or may decide that the pros and cons of that don't make sense. I I don't think that really affects it. I think the analysis here is we have a very specific approved supply pantry use. It's been the same as she described from the beginning. She's I think described how this is necessary because we answered a lot why they do part of this. I think you go back to does it rise to the level of a separate use or is it really just an integral part of this this function? um you know how do you treat as a as a structure an outdoor storage box I think you get into the same kind of arguments and questions you had here all the other things that flow out if all of a sudden you can't have these type of things storing anything outside like a uh you know the other examples that were given of a goodwill box on on the property um I think in their business having a good box would be incidentally related maybe you could argue about it somewhere else but the things we're doing are directly related to the service that we're lawfully providing hiding out of that property. We did not ask for permission to do it related in this appeal related to the warming bus use. Was it supportive of that use? Yeah, potentially. And if that's the only use we're making of it, then maybe that would be a problem, right? It wouldn't be incidental. It wouldn't be an accessory use. And so I do think you go back to there is a general accessory use definition. It is a permitted use. That definition in the code of that type of accessory use talks about not that a use of a land or a structure. I think the zoning administrator said these things are a structure customarily accessory and clearly incidental and subordinate in area extent and purpose to the principal use of the land. I

think we made a pretty good argument that it falls within that category and that that's a better fit than this outdoor storage use. And I would cost you I think if you go down the road that this is an outdoor storage use. the other examples I gave of the UPS store, of a dropbox at a business, all those things would have to be treated similarly, right? Well, gee, if everybody says, "Do a customer have to have that, then I can't have one at my pharmacy." And so, I think that that comes into play here, and we'd ask that you that you consider that that description. Just one question. Could you reiterate in your perspective why the lockers are not customarily incidental to the uh operation period?

Sure. Um you know I I cannot think of any other locations operating a supply pantry use uh that would have outdoor storage lockers that are um accessible to folks uh 247. Um uh number one um number two it's almost functioning as something completely different than the storage uh I'm sorry the supply entry permited use classification itself. Um we had testimony from Miss Sandaval and um I think some other members that you know demand for these storage lockers would be present on the site whether or not the supply pantry use went away tomorrow. um and the the office general and professional as well. And so because of that, the subordinate nature of the storage lockers themselves um doesn't meet the subordinate um criteria for an accessory use. And so because of that, the use is not permitted. the accessory use even is not permitted uh even as a general accessory use as um as uh the appellant was just stating. Um also wanted to address one other thing uh about the dumpsters. So the dumpster question in particular uh that is a separately defined and regulated um activity in the zoning ordinance as well. And so, um, that's actually regulated in, um, uh, the accessory uses, uh, section of our ordinance. Um, so we have a specific supplemental regulation as it relates to, um, specific accessory uses.

Great. Thank you, M. Before I open up the public hearing on this application, do we have questions for staff or for the applicant?

I have a question for that. So even if it was support the organization on today's ruling, will they still be I guess will they still have to zone because will it still be illegal of what they're doing because of the district had at least support them once a day what they're requesting. So if you support them, so if you support to overturn the strateg they still have to come back to res what they're trying to do.

Um I'm not sure I even understand the question. I'm not sure what they're trying to do. I I think we're trying to understand that as well,

right? um as city staff, you know, they have decided not to appeal the regional housing services component of the determination that was made. Um and so, um your question about you would have to I think no, I think it's a fair question for us to respond to. Uh I think we did not appeal the the the other portion of the determination where the the the way the warming buses were being operated functioned within this other zoning category and and the same kind of logic, right? Is there a better place that fits in the code for the service that was being provided in the manner is being done? We would not be able to do that. If you overturn this today, we'll be able to maintain the lockers and we won't have to take them down and we'll be able to maintain the privy on the property. uh we would we would still I think be subject to the finding that was not appealed that a zoning change would be necessary at least to operate the warming buses in the manner in which it was done in the past over these past several years. Is that is that responsive to your question sir? Yeah.

Okay. And if I could also add the warming buses, we were already moving towards compliance with that when we were cited because the warming buses only operate from November 1 to around March the 5th as soon as the weather starts warming up. So they were closing anyway. So we didn't feel that this would necessarily be the time to try to appeal that as well.

You might just have one additional question. Um what course we touched on this in the work session. Um it sounds like the lockers in the privy have been present for a number of years and um why has it this point been brought to the attention of the board of zoning deals? Why has it taken so long to answer it last so long?

Yeah. So code enforcement um they um while they're they are active in the community canvasing the neighborhoods, they don't catch every uh zoning violation that is occurring. And so um a majority I would say of the uh code enforcement violations um are uh sort of brought to us from neighborhood complaints. And so in this instance um we had had a slow trickle of complaints coming in. It sort of reached ahead uh this winter um when we got a significant amount of complaints from um surrounding property owners that had just noticed an uptick I think in um the amount and frequency of uh the use occurring there.

Thank you. this morning. Could you reiterate what our duty is as far as it it relates to the phone that the that you staff made?

Yes, I can do that. Um, the notice of violation is an official determination that is subject to the appeal of the board of zoning appeals in accordance with section 36.2-562. The decision on such an appeal of any border requirements decision or determination made by the zoning administrator in the administration or enforcement of this chapter shall be based on the board's judgment of whether or not the zoning administrator was correct in the interpretation and the enforcement of the zoning ordinance. And more specifically, I'm going to read the state code um on that which says that and this is state code uh 15.2-2309C. Um the decision on such appeal shall be based on the board's judgment of whether the administrative officer was correct. The determination of the administrative officer shall be presumed to be correct. At a hearing on an appeal, the administrative officer shall explain the basis for his determination after which the appellent has the burden approved to rebut such presumption of correctness by honorance of the evidence.

And I think you are attorney but maybe your attorney can explain to us what the uh burden of proof of proponents of the evidence means. That's a good question. That's kind of something that you need to decide for yourself. That's kind of part of your role. So, you are a um quasi judicial board. Um you are acting as kind of the judges here. I don't want to um influence um but um I guess let me just Can you repeat the burden just so I make sure I'm saying it?

Sure. The decision on appeals such uh I'm sorry, the decision on such appeals shall be based on the board's judgment of whether the administrative officer was correct. The determination of the administrative officer shall be presumed to be correct. At a hearing on an appeal, the administrative officer shall explain the basis of his determination after which the appellant has the burden of proof to rebut such presumption of correct correctness by the preponderance of the evidence. And that term that's a term of of law not evidence.

So preponderance of the evidence usually means more likely than not. So more than 50% is the common um understanding of preponderance of the evidence. One further question.

I have I have one more thing that I'd like to interject. Sorry, this is um I want to get back to um the uh accessory structure being like an Amazon drop off location or something of the sort. Um I do want to I do want to um sort of differentiate that sort of thing and what is being conducted on site. So um you could think of that drop off facility as one of these lockers. We have uh I haven't counted them but are there 20 individual lockers um on the lot? There are 72.

72. Okay. uh undersshot the uh my destination there. Um there's 72. And so the intensity of this uh of this is also just completely different than um what you might see in an Amazon single drop off or a mailbox for instance. Maybe if you had 72 mailboxes all lined up. Um mailboxes are also treated separately. Um there a um uh they would be a permitted encouragement. Mr. Ch, if I could follow up with your question um relating to the duration and why it took as long as it did for this to become an issue. Um you stated, Mr. Moore, that typically uh zoning violations such as this are completely although your compliance folks do look around as they're out.

Sure. Um, so with the complaints that were received over time, um, would you say that some or most of those complaints were related to these two zoning violations lockers and approving or was it other things or isolation?

Certainly some um, honestly a lot of what I was respon being, you know, asked about had to do with the loitering nature. people sort of wanting to understand what was going on there. Um there was a noticeable uptick in um uh littering um clothes clothing clothing items being sort of left behind all over um Luck Avenue and some of the surrounding streets. So um it was really questions at first about you know what's going on over here? What is the you know what is the juice being conducted? um that sort of evolved into uh you know how did the portable privy uh wind up on site uh what are the lockers uh you know what are they associated with um that sort of thing so you know as I think the use over there sort of um uh the demand for the use sort of spiked I think that's when you know more call started to come That makes sense.

Okay. Other questions for staff or for the applicant? Uh you all can be seated. I'm going to go ahead and at this time open up the public hearing regarding this application. M clerk, can we have the first person who's registered to speak today? We have Prescott.

Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Could you uh state your name and residential address for us? Yes, thank you. My name is Katherine Prescott and I live at 421 Day Avenue Southwest. And could you raise your right hand so I can swear to you? Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes, sir, I do. Okay, go ahead.

Good afternoon, members of the board. My name is Katherine Prescott and I live at 421 Day Avenue and I own properties on Luck Avenue and Marshall Avenues. I am here to speak in support of the zoning administrator's determination. Zoning is not just a list of restrictions. It is a contract between the city and its residents. When we buy or rent property in the D- Downtown district zone, we do so with the expectation that the rules on the books will be followed. The stated intent of the downtown district is to be a walkable highdensity urban core. Directly adjacent, our residential districts are intended to provide quiet enjoyment and stability. When a business or resident bypasses building and zoning regulations, that contract starts to break down. First, let's look at one of the specific items under appeal, the outdoor lockers. The ordinance is clear on this. Outdoor public storage is not a permitted use in the D- Downtown district zone. This is because, as we have seen, it encourages folks to use the lockers at all hours and can congregate around them and often sleep there. This is an example of good intentions leading to unintended consequences. This is not to say people experiencing homelessness don't need storage. Of course they do, but they need secure storage that's indoor and supervised. Salt Lake City, Utah, for example, has one such facility. It's called Dave's Place where they currently store the belongings of about 540 individuals experiencing homelessness in clean sanitized 90-gallon bins inside a large warehouse that is owned by the city. Dave's Place has posted hours and they have staff on site during all hours of operation when persons experiencing homelessness come to access their personal free storage. Another example is the Bishop Weaggan Resource Center and Day Shelter in Salt Lake City. Again, there is a monitored and secure storage area inside the wagoned resource center, which also has a closed closet,

and it is a day shelter. The operations manager there tells me they run a tight ship. They employ security staff that is present at all times. They are open. The manager says they strive to be good neighbors. So with their trained and professional security team in conjunction with the Salt Lake City Police Department, they do not see their patrons or other individuals blocking the public sidewalks or loitering and camping out on their property or neighboring properties. The Port Lot site is also problematic because it encourages the outdoor use of their property at all hours. The city code is also clear on this issue. Portable toilets are only allowed during active construction projects or special events. They are not meant to be used as a permanent solution to inadequate indoor plumbing facilities. For these reasons, among others, Tot's operations has have evolved beyond the uses on their certificate of occupancy, which is supply pantry and office. Its current use intensity is not intended for the downtown district. Therefore, I urge the board to uphold the zoning administrator's letter of determination. Thank you.

Thank you, ma'am. Uh, Mr. Clerk, we have the next person registered. Sure. Monica Roiki. Afternoon. Good afternoon. Um, my name State your name and residential address for Yes. Monica Roiki and I live at 411 Day Avenue Southwest. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do.

Good afternoon, members of the board. My name is Monica Roiki and I own a home on Day Avenue. In fact, the same Day Avenue that the city spent a lot of money to upgrade and create the intent of the zoning code that uh was right next to the downtown district. In fact, the historic uh H1 district. Um, I have been working in the architecture, engineering, development, and uh, and consulting industry in Rowanoke, Virginia for 25 years. The codes and the zoning ordinance are a thick bunch of books and they are the law in our city. Um I certainly respect anyone who is tasked with um enforcing and even understanding the zoning cords codes but they are pretty clear. The stated intent of the downtown district is to be a walkable high density urban core and directly adjacent our residential districts are intended to provide quiet enjoyment and stability. the operations at 420 luck taken as a whole undermine both. Secondly, we really have to address the whole of use. The zoning code and the building code work hand in hand. And so for example, the temporary toilets, the temporary use of a toilet is is uh addressed under a temporary use, but any permanent use of plumbing facilities is addressed in the actual building code. I definitely do uphold the zoning uh administrator's determination and in addition for the building to comply to the code and any changes in use. Of course, the code says that for a change of use, the entirety of the building or

the use thereof needs to be brought up to the current building code. Right now, that's the 2021 building code. And as such that compliance will require absolutely registered uh architecture and engineering plans and that in turn will be addressing things like sprinklering of the building. Um, this certain use does also have other requirements under Virginia's state law for the type of use that it's being providing uh for vulnerable populations and not not least of which is paid and licensed staffing. Luck Avenue sits on the literal edge of our old southwest district and the historic overlay exists to preserve Rowan Oak's most significant historic assets. When a property directly abuing that district is allowed to devolve into something that does not meet the building code, it not only challenges its neighbors, it challenges everyone who is building or developing a property and do they also need to meet code or are they off the hook as well? Thank you.

Thank you ma'am. Could we have the next person respond?

Hello, sir. Could you state your name and residential address, please? Yes. Uh Matt Prescott, 421 Day Avenue. You raise your right hand. You solemnly swear that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. I do. Go ahead.

Good afternoon, members of the board. My name is Matt Prescott. I live on Day Avenue and I'm here to support the zoning administrator's determination. I also own commercial buildings on Luck Avenue right across from at least of these and several residential lots on Marshall and Day. While I appreciate the services Tot provides to the community over the past several years, they have been illegally expanding their mission beyond their allowable uses of their CO into a comprehensive service center that is non-compliant with state and local regulations. These additions should have triggered requirements for comprehensive plans prepared by registered design professional to comply with the relevant plumbing, fire safety, health, and occupancy codes. The fact that that did not happen is both the fault of Tot and the building and planning departments. The property is currently being used in a manner that exceeds the safety design of a group uh B structure and conforms more closely with a regional housing service as the administrator has detailed. Uh this unlawful this presents a high risk both to the patrons of Tot and to all of us who own and rent buildings in the neighborhood. Tot asserts that its provision of outdoor lockers is within its permitted uses. They are not. The lockers function as outdoor public storage and encourage their patrons to remain on site before and after their hours. The use of a permanent toilet is also not permitted. It's defined in the city code as only uh allowable during active construction projects for short-term events and for temporary hardship situations. It's not a solution permanent solution for inadequate indoor facilities. The lockers, the two metal storage sheds, and the portagon all combined to create conditions for an outdoor campground. We have seen and continue to see individuals camping on

Tot's property and our neighboring properties on a nightly basis. Camping is not permitted in the downtown district. The imminent opening of the new ramp house on Helm is causing very real concern for those of us who live and work in this neighborhood that there will now be two providers operating just three blocks from one another with duplicative services. This illustrates how our zoning ordinance needs to be amended to make sure there is not a concentration of such providers in one area. T- lot's operations, while well-intentioned, have been reckless and irresponsible in relation to the neighbors. From the outset, they should have created a plan for client management for their own staff. Supervising how their patrons gather before, during, and after their hours. Allowing their patrons to block public sidewalks and trespass on neighboring properties is unacceptable. Allowing their patrons to sleep on their property is even more so. What has evolved here is an intensive institutional use of the zoning ordinance explicitly directs away from the downtown district. I respectfully ask the board to uphold the zoning administrator's decision.

Thank you. We have the next person

could you please state your name and residential address for Yes. Uh, Cat Klein, 383 Mountain Avenue, South. You raise your right hand. You solemnly swear or affirm the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, not the most truth. I do. Go ahead.

Yeah. I want to start out with a reminder that two or more things can be true at the same time. People can care very deeply about our unhoused, but at the same time support our current planning, zoning, and code enforcement guidelines. These things are not mutually exclusive, and the argument fails that if one supports one, they cannot support the other. I live on a corner in Old Southwest and I see people every day with all their belongings move past my house and I say aloud therefore the grace of God I am not alone in those feelings that are unhoused deserve and our help and compassion. I have not spoken with any of our Old Southwest residents who do not support providing aid and comfort to our unhoused. I'm also not here today to question the incredible work that Don Sandival and her team have done for our clients. She has provided critical care and nurture to folks where others could not and she and her team are to be commended. But Dawn cannot solve the city's unhouse need on her own. Every city in America is struggling with the best approach to help our own house get the services they need. And we all hope that our city prioritizes a sustainable and focused effort versus relying on emergency and ad hoc solutions by various groups. I am a volunteer board member from Old Southwest neighborhood which borders on the area that tot and other businesses and luck reside. I support historic preservation which includes working with the ARB members of planning and our code enforcement folks. My primary role on our board has been to make sure that I review any challenges to any ARB zoning planning or code enforcement decisions to understand if the current guidelines are being applied fairly and equally irrespective of the quester or the benefactor of the action. And while I may be sympathetic to my neighbors in those endeavors, these guidelines must be applied with neither fear nor favor. If the laws or guidelines need to be changed, then I will help support that course. But as a board, we typically do not support special exceptions, changes in use variances, or in today's case, an appeal. Our posture supports the the city and their requests for compliance.

It is our assumption that these law and guidelines are there for a reason. In closing, I think it's obvious to all that there's a lot of passion to help these folks as much as possible. But to be effective, our laws and guidelines were created dispassionately and must be so when they are enforced. To do otherwise bypasses the initial thought and review, therefore codifying the current and future unintended consequences. Thank you. Thank you. We have the next person.

Yeah. Sir, could you please state your name and resial address for us? Yeah. Jeff Grapho, 2560 Woods Medical Court, Salem, W. You raise your right hand. You solemnly swear that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing of both truth. Yes, sir. Go ahead.

Good afternoon. My name is Jeff Grafo. I'm here to address the current use of 420 Luck Avenue as it violates the intent of the downtown district. I'm in cotification of the rules in place. Uh I'm a property owner u that is adjacent and shares a driveway with 420 Luck Avenue. Um as you know in the district um as we made the investment um we uh bought the property back in 2019. Um and we chose Rona working with the economic development center um because we wanted to establish a technology center and we wanted to bring a um good you know provide jobs for young professionals um upwards of about 100 folks um that would be able to work downtown be able to live downtown um in an area that's safe um which is why you know when we worked with Ron Oak and saw the ordinances um we felt it was a good investment um over that time We have we've struggled um and part of it is um is safety as an example there are unintended consequences I think someone just stated with the intent of providing these services um with our property backing up right to 420 luck um having the lockers available having the portaotti um people do loiter there are encampments they encamp on our property there is trash there are needles it's dangerous um and it's actually safety concerns when you have all this. Um, our folks aren't even coming into the office um because there's um we've had instances of um people being uh um harassed as they've parked and be able to come to the office. Um our vestibule is on the corner of Fifth and Luck. Um and again, that's uh nightly. We have people that camp in there um leave needle, can't even come through the front door. We cannot bring clients in there. um as we have um had people leave the company uh we've not continued to make investments

um in that property. Um so it's hurting our business. It's hurting what the intent was. Um and you know it's unfortunate because we do believe in you know working with Ron Oak and working here and providing good jobs. Um but having said that we had to comply you know as we took that building you know and what it used to be um made the investment with all the you know coding ordinances that are in um the uh downtown district um and there's a rationale for that right it provides stability provides safety um and it's kind of I think you know as people have said you know it's kind of a un I guess not a formal contract but is a contract um that there would be a consistency um of you know compliance Um, being a good neighbor is important, I think. Um, so, you know, we do I'm here to support um the zoning administrator's um findings. Um, and so I appreciate you guys to uh and the the entire board to consider that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Spark. You're the next registered person. Bill Chapman. Good afternoon, sir. Could you state your meeting presidential address for us? Yes. My name is Bill Chapman. I own multif family properties at uh 120 Luck Avenue uh 351 Campbell Avenue 301 First Street, 400 Salem Avenue, 357 Salem Avenue, 403 Salem Avenue, 416 Salem Avenue, and within a couple of months, uh 501 Salem Avenue. You raise your right hand for us. We solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide may be the truth, the whole truth, and not above the truth.

I do. U the Rono zoning ordinance makes the definition of a supply pantry clear to provide goods for a customer to purchase or receive at little to no cost. And like other retail outlets such as convenience stores or markets, the customer is provided with a code required indoor bathroom that it can use at its discretion while shopping. Once the customer completes shopping and has purchased or received goods, the transaction is complete and the customer leaves. A supply pantry as defined provides no additional services. Consumption of goods on the premises is specifically not permitted. As such, there is no purpose, need, or permissible use for the permanent use of an outdoor temporary portable toilet by a supplied pantry as defined. In addition, temporary portable toilets are temporary facilities by design. They are used when indoor facilities aren't adequate or permitted outdoor events or as part of permitted construction or renovation projects. None of these conditions exist at the T-OT supply pantry. Furthermore, temporary portable toilets, portaotties or porta johns are not defined as permitted uses, temporary uses or accessory uses in the city ordinance. Section 362 315 makes clear that any use not listed in this table is not permitted in multiplepurpose districts. The downtown district is a multiplepurpose district. What I've discussed in its simplest form are the rules. Now I'd like to discuss the importance of enforcing them. I'm a developer who has built 20% of Royal Oak's downtown housing stock along with multiple restaurants and offices. I have a symbiotic relationship with the city. I create muchneeded housing and entertainment options that generate

economic development and revenue for the city. In return, the city provides a rules-based system that protects my investments, our residents, and business owners. Our relationship cannot exist if one side doesn't do its part. It's also important to note that I understand the need for a city to have services for its people. I've been a financial supporter of the rescue mission for over a decade, have to their facility, and believe they run a firstass operation. One reason we're here today is because the TAI supply pantry is not the rescue mission, not by use or zoning, and from what I have seen, not in the quality of operations. By the zoning ordinance, campgrounds or encampments, public portagons, and 72 outdoor storage lockers for public use are not uses allowed in supply pantries or in downtown parking lots. Setting a precedent for non-compliant uses in parking lots would have a significant negative impact on my properties and their marketability. I respectfully ask that you uphold the conclusion of findings issued by Ronick zoning administrator. Thank you. Sir, we have the next registered person.

Robert Paul.

Good afternoon, sir. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Yes. Uh name is Robert Culp, 2322 Carolina Avenue. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, old truth, and nothing but the truth? I do.

You go ahead. Thank you. Uh I'm a residential contractor, rental property owner, architectural salvage dealer, and a resident of the city. And I'm concerned about the enforcement and the even application of our city's zoning and building code ordinances. As a manager of over 10 properties in Old Southwest, I have a keen interest in protecting our group's investments. We have taken several properties which were very neglected or condemned, rehabilitated them at substantial cost into safe and attractive residences that provide good housing and real tax revenue for our city. Throughout the 20-year process of rehabbing, maintenance, and management, we've been carefully supervised by city planning department. As to the zoning code compliance, building code compliance, and general maintenance code requirements. This process comes at a cost. I suspect that at least 20% of our construction costs are directly related to some code requirement. This is how it should be. to protect all of our citizens, homeowners, tenants, business owners, for-profit, nonprofit, and yes, the unhoused. Through several property ownership groups, we provide highquality housing for over 24 families and have land that might provide for 20 more. That is if we can feel confident that the city's zoning and land use rules will be enforced evenly and properly. It's been clear for several years that Tots on Luck Avenue has not been held to the same standards as other businesses and yes, they are a business. The facts as to the conditions that have developed on Luck Avenue are really not in dispute. The impact on the neighbors of Tots is real and needs to be acknowledged. The impact of poorly or unregulated services for the unhoused throughout our

city is becoming more evident by the day. The neighbors of Tots are citizens of Bruna just as many of the unhoused are, just as the management of Tots is. We are the same. We should be treated with respect, compassion, and fairness by each other and our government. I respect and support the goals of Tots and serving the homeless. It is the manner of implementation that has right rightfully been brought to your attention. We are hopeful that the board will ensure that the city code is being evenly enforced as written and together we can make ronic a better place to work and live. I request that you support the zoning administrator's decision. Thank you.

You want anony's anon to vote? Good afternoon, sir. Could you state your name and resial address, please? Got it. Anthony Savola, 1836 Greenwood Road here in Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Great. Go ahead. Thank you.

Thank you. Um well, thank you for the opportunity to speak with you on this. Uh it's been a little bit of a tale of two cities here today. Um we hear about a population in desperate need and no one denies that. And then we hear about the impact that providing services in a way that's not in compliance with our rules and regulations is affecting others in that same community. U we're not here to debate or question the need for the services, but we are here to say those services should be delivered in a manner that is in compliance with appropriate regulations for the different types of facilities that are choosing to operate in this part of the city in this zoning uh category. just as the businesses and the residential owners and the developers need to do. As additional services and expansion have occurred with TOT, it seems that they are not in compliance and they have been served appropriate documentation by inspectors to the city. The appeal has been filed dealing with two of the violations and then there's mention been mention of the warming buses being removed. It's not clear if it's going to come back or not. Uh but as the number served has increased, the impact on surrounding businesses and residences and there's a neighborhood that already hosts additional service providers uh is uh also increasing and this affects quality of life, safety and the investments of those operators and residents. These regulations are in place for a reason and the zoning designations are there for a reason. The reasons include safety both for the individuals receiving the services and for others who have residences or businesses or investments in the area as well as ensuring that those facilities are operating in an appropriate manner given the nature of the zoning category that they are in. While it appears that Toti for a considerable period of time as it expanded and added services, does not justify allowing the violations to continue. Rono, as we know, is the major source of services for our entire region's homeless population. The impact this has on businesses, visitors, and residences of the neighborhoods hosting

those services is not insignificant and can influence the ability of the neighborhood to thrive and attract investments and approve the city's uh tax base. It is to be hoped that a comprehensive review of the most effective way to provide and most effective location to provide those services could be undertaken perhaps in the context of the mayor's task force. That's not an issue that falls under the purview of this board. Uh but in the interim, this board should require that the least of these make the changes necessary to come into compliance with all the appropriate regulations. changes such as perhaps moving more services indoors, moving to another location, or providing appropriate staffing to monitor the use of the facility. They should do this to come into compliance with all the appropriate regulations and correct the violations cited. And we would ask that you would deny the appeal. Thank you. And I do want to also recognize in my few remaining uh sec seconds here, Mr. Moore, getting through that whole discussion without needing an oxygen tank. That was pretty impressive. Thank you, sir. Miss Clark.

Haley D. Good afternoon. May you state your name and residential address for us? Haley Dean, 4137 Woodridge Drive. Raise your right hand. Can you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes. Thank you. Go ahead.

Right. So, my name is Haley Dean. I work for Caroline Loraca Event Design which is located at 419 Luck Avenue directly across the street from Tot. I'm here to address the current use of 420 Luck as it violates the intent of the downtown district and poses a direct threat to the H1 historic district at Deuts. The downtown district is designed for a synergy of commerce, professional offices and highquality urban living. It is a district that demands a high level of site maintenance and architectural sensitivity. These are the conditions that I often encounter when I report to work at 419 Luck Avenue. There are people sleeping in our doorways, sleeping under the van that belongs our business and is in our vehicle bay, drug paraphernelia, trash both left by telock clients and also people pilfering through our trash. Um, public urination and our property has been vandalized repeatedly over the years. These behaviors have been accommodated and tolerated. 420 Luck sits on the literal edge of our H1 historic district. The H1 overlay exists to preserve Ron's significant historic assets. When this property is allowed to devolve into a cluster of metal sheds, outdoor lockers, and portable toilets, it creates visual blight that bleeds into the historic corridor. These structures are industrial in nature. They do not belong on a sidewalk or in our regional urban center. The lockers and the bathroom present at TOT um provide a magnet. Uh the hours of operation posted by TOT and the actual hours that people are present do not align. We have people lording in front of our business throughout the day and night. They trespass frequently and are very comfortable waiting under our awnings. The behaviors of the guests lead to an atmosphere of intimidation for our business. Caroline Loraca, the owner of the business, had intent and

made a significant investment on plans to expand her business in 2021 due to the presence of our neighbors and the um dwindling of behavior. She elected to not uh pursue that improvement. Instead, we are at a point where we choose not to even invite clients to our business. We cannot um we are never sure of what kind of displays of behavior and paraphernalia might be outside our business. So we choose not to have clients visit. The overall intent of our zoning ordinance is to provide predictability. When one site is allowed to operate in persistent non-compliance, the impact is felt across the entire neighborhood. Neighbors who follow the rules find their property rights diminished by nuisance use that the code says should not be there among unpermitted structures on the sidewalk signals that the city is no longer enforcing the contract it has with its property owners. On behalf of pled we respectfully ask the board to protect the integrity of the downtown district. Thank you.

Thank you ma'am. Lar McKe. Good afternoon sir. Could you state your name and residential address, please? Larry McKe, 420 Church Avenue Southwest. I I'm the president of the uh 420 West a Church Avenue um condominium association associated with that address. Okay. Could you raise your right hand for us? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you, sir. Go ahead.

Yes. I I'm the uh president of the association uh that Haley just spoke about with Carolyn Laroka. Our building complex is made up of six units uh between Luck and Church. Uh I wanted to come here today to expand upon the supplemental background that I received and this supplemental background uh is titled the public safety record at the property. I just want to give you a couple of in events that I have personally had with my business. My business is uh on Church Avenue entrance. We have our complex is both Church Avenue and Luck Avenue that that building. Um so uh we know all know that uh the homeless do not stay in one place. Um they meander about the uh neighborhood. I own a cafe coffee shop at 420 Church Avenue. Uh the homeless uh come into my business and they are a real distraction from my real customers. They ask for free food and free drinks. And um well, I'm I'm not a charity. I'm a for-profit business. So I I say no, I have no free drinks, no free food. Uh they come become very belligerent and argumentative. They walk out of my business and on two occasion have vandalized my business.

The first occasion I can clearly remember someone poured I have a uh small uh wood furniture in the foyer and they poured water all over and water and wood doesn't mix so I damaged the the table I had out there. The second time that uh I had to argue with this uh person, um he didn't I I kept asking him several times, "Do you want to pay for some food?" And then he rambled on. "Do you want to pay for some food, sir?" He rambled on and he he finally left. You could tell he was uh kind of disturbed what I was telling him. Well, right after that, um, I went into, we have public restrooms. I went into the public restroom and I had to clean feces off the wall. So, my question to you folks are, if you came into my cafe coffee for a sandwich and a coffee, walked into my restroom, and saw feces on the wall, would you return to my cafe? Thank you. Sir,

Bill.

Good afternoon, sir. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Yes. My name is Todd Atkins. I live at 15147th Street Southeast 24013. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Yes. Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but truth? Yes, I do. Thank you. Go ahead, sir.

Thank you for letting me speak today. Um, we got a problem. And the problem is not lockers and toilets. The problem is the failure that and I'm including myself in this failure. The failure of the city, the churches, the organizations in the city to do what we need to find a way to do which is to love, support, help, and engage those who are homeless, addicted to drugs. Excuse me, sir. Could you please

and and those who are mentally ill as well. Um, you know, if you take these lockers down, if you take the porta potty down, it's not going to decrease the amount of people sleeping in the parking lot or downtown. I don't think that's going to, you know, I may be wrong on that, but I I didn't I was kind of blown away that we were here about lockers and and and a portaotti to be honest with you. Um, you know, I want the best for this city, which I think all the the business owners and other people that are here have spoken about. And so, you wanted to hear something a little different and not kind of uh, you know, uh, what we've been hearing. So, maybe maybe I'm your guy. Um, you know, if we want the best for this city, it is connected to the way we treat those who are being cast aside and those who are being marginalized and those who are not being seen as um well, they're being seen as secondass uh citizens uh in our city. Okay. We don't want to really do away with lockers and a portaotty. We want to do away with homeless people. Let's just name the elephant I think in the room that a lot of people would really prefer. Um I live in Southeast so I encounter probably a lot more homeless people than are being encountered downtown to be honest with you. Or maybe it's kind of the same. Um they're not wanted. Okay. They're not seen as valuable people and we got to find a way to love them in the

way they deserve to be loved in the way we're called to love them. Um, thank God we have people like Don Sandival and her husband and Tots because, you know, I'll be honest with you, the rescue mission, you just can't look at that place as the, you know, the one time they're the solution. Let's shovel everybody to the rescue mission, right? What we need are innovative leaders in churches, in the city organizations, business leaders that are willing to think outside the box, right? And willing to do the things that are necessary to to love these people the way they deserve to be loved. Um, so I'm here to support um awarding the appeal to Tots and I would also support which is not on the agenda. We need to find where we can change city codes, right? The problem is maybe not with the appeal. The problem is the way some of these codes are written, right? they need to be re-evaluated um in some respects to figure out a way how we can do things better.

Thank you, sir. Yep. Thank you for your testimony. Good, Mr. Clerk. Do we have anyone else registered to speak today? Do Hinton.

Good afternoon, sir. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Uh, Bill Hinton, 7:45 Montrose Avenue, Southeast, Reno. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Yeah. And I'll affirm, brother. We don't swear in my situation. You solemnly affirm that you shall provide the truth, the whole truth, do nothing but the truth. I do. Thank you, sir. Go ahead.

U, thank you all. I am the pastor of Central Church of the Brethren, which is at 416 Church Avenue directly in front of Tots's operation on Luck behind us there. Um, I'm also a child of this city. Spent a great deal of my life in this city. And the gentleman before me, and I appreciate everything he said. He said a lot of what I wanted to say. Uh, you know, we're not dealing with the bigger issue here of, you know, we're not trying to get rid of lockers. We're trying to get rid of people. And we don't have an answer for that. Um, I would say to Don, I heard her apologize earlier. Don't apologize for following God's call on your life, Don. Uh, but it uh if it has to start here, it has to start here. But it's grown past um I've been 20 months about at that time at Central. It's given me the great opportunity to meet many of my neighbors. We love all our neighbors, including the unhoused, the disenfranchised, the people that are our neighbors one week and we don't know what happened to them the next week. I appreciate these business folks and these residents. Uh I've been in the meetings they've had. Uh it's tough for them. We need them. We need their investment in our city or we won't have a city. But what we need now is our city. It's not up to them to build more shelters or to to help Dawn or anything else. I don't think they despise what she's doing. I think they need their business properties to be managed and and and accessible in the way they're asking. Um, you know, as the church and as the pastor of that church, we're right in the middle of that. We love them all. We want to support them all. And we are demanding our city do something. And if it starts with you, that's fine. It's got to go up the line. It's got to go to the mayor's office. Like I say, I was born in Rono. Ron Memorial Hospital 1960. And most of my life, Rono's been studying something.

And we pay people to study. Y'all want to give me some money? I'll study the homeless problem. Y'all give me some of that money. I'll try to find you an answer, but the problem is we're wasting all that money. And we've been wasting all that time. And getting rid of the lockers is not going to remove the people. They know they can knock on the church door. I'm going to do whatever I can for them every day. They come up and use our water. They treat the church property pretty good. I don't pick up needles and things. And I think it's because I we do what we can. They know we feed them from time to time. We do what we can. We can't fix it either. We're surrounded by churches. I'm not sure what they're doing. I talked to some of their pastors about the problem and they don't want to talk to me about it. And I'm going to name names cuz some of them are pretty big churches filling up blocks down there. It's time for the city to step up. Get the county involved. Get the outlying areas involved. If nothing else, have a backbone to go to the city to town of Venton and Ron County and say, "Quit picking up people in Venton. Go down to Rosies on Friday night. Pick up the people hanging around Rosies panhandling for money." And they drive them up to Walmart and drop them off in Reno City. and then they end up at Dawn's or they end up at the Mission or the Ramhouse the next morning. The city doesn't even have the backbone to go to the town of Venton and say, "Don't bring them to us. You do something with them. They're in your territory." But I would ask you, at least for today, even though I stand with these businesses, I understand their ache and their problem. I think right now we need to overturn this thing. We need to let Dawn do what Dawn is doing because nobody else is doing it.

Thanks, sir. Thank you. and the DW.

Good afternoon, ma'am. Could you state your name and residential address for us? I'm Linda Dwire. I live at 6016 Flamingo Drive Southwest Rowan Oak and I am an occasional volunteer with Totang. I'm so I'm sorry to interrupt you, ma'am. Could you raise your right hand so I can swear you in? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you. Go ahead. Sorry about that.

Okay. Um, having listened to everyone, you know, what I want to say keeps changing. So, so many people have covered so many points. But the thing we're not covering is what happens when the lockers and the portaotti are gone. It's not going to keep these people from coming into the neighborhood. It's not going to keep these people from going to the bathroom on other businesses properties simply because they have no other choice. Think I mean downtown is a big area. It's a big area. But there are not like in a mall there are not public restrooms that are open for them to use. And if the city isn't going to provide them with anything, somebody has to. And there's nobody earning a salary at Tot. Tot is run completely by volunteers and to say, "Okay, you guys need to bring them inside. You need to staff the place 247." It simply isn't possible. You know, uh we can't offer them any money. What money we have goes towards services for our unsheltered friends. They're citizens of Rowan Oak. They're children of God and we have to take care of them. And I I think a lot of the business owners would agree with that. So, I hate to say it, but I think it falls on the city to do something to help Tila here. Tila can't do it all. How difficult would it be um for there to be public restrooms, I don't know, Elwood Park, you know, anywhere. So, we need to think outside the box and find solutions before we take this away or these people will still be coming in here. They will be stashing stuff. Um,

my church is about my former church about two blocks away and we had a very high elevated front porch above a lot of stairs and there was bushes around. So, up there on that porch on the side was a nice hidden place where people used to stash their stuff. um in um you know backpacks and they may have been sleeping there too. I don't know. And people wanted to throw those away and we convinced them leave them leave them leave them leave them leave them for a couple of years and they finally said no this person's just probably gone to jail or left town because it's still here. I'm like, no. So, they throw it away and all I can think is that person very well may have lost everything they owned because they had nowhere safe to stash it, to hide it, to put it. So, before we take away what options have been provided by TOT, let's provide some alternatives or we're just going to create some more chaos.

Thank you. Thank you for your testimony, Miss Clark. Amber West. Good afternoon, ma'am. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Amber West. I'm homeless. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes, sir. All right. Thank you, ma'am. Go ahead.

My name is Amber West. I'm homeless and Miss Don has been providing me the things I need to get by because I have no job at the moment. And the lockers I have to speak on because in so many situations I have been blessed to keep that locker because um IDs, socials, even to get a a job for a small period of time because everything else, you know, it it's very important. You lose one, you have to start from from the dirt to get everything back. So that was one of the things. And then the lockers keep it from your things getting weathered. I have things for my kids, you know, and I like to keep them kind of gives you a little bit of hope. You know, sometimes your locker gives you a little bit of hope. It has what you need, reminds you of where you come from and the things you need to get back to. So, I think they're very important. Thank you ma'am for your test.

Good afternoon sir. Could you state your name in residential address for us? Yeah, thank you sir and board members Scott Sworzel 250 Thornblade Way Blue Ridge Virginia. Right. Could you raise your right hand? Yes. Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I affirm. Yes, sir. Thank you, sir. Go ahead.

Thank you again, everyone. So, this cannot be an us versus them situation because it's really only us. It's all of us and we're all in different spots. Uh homeless people are not just on Luck Avenue as it's been mentioned. Every morning when I pull into the Elmo garage, I have to wait for all the folks come. I don't have to. If I choose to wait, have all the folks coming down from the mission on Taswell to go in town, they'll go into the park, they go in Elmo. There's a couple of folks I speak with every day and just check on them and make sure they're okay. It's every day. So, we're talking about T-OT, but it's a bigger issue than this. And I appreciate we have the opportunity. I've been volunteering since last July, and I've learned so much and honestly, I didn't know. So, if you really want to know what's real, let me know. I'll schedule a time to take you inside the facility. will volunteer, will visit. I'll take you on a tour. Don't get your information from people who have never been in the facility or much less been on the parking lot. Don't get your information from social media. Not just you guys, anybody. Okay? We clearly already established the city's approval of our current operation as reflected in the certificate of occupacy data 2023, which included the existing lockers and the privy that were placed there in 2021. I want to also just clarify that the earlier

are you okay Mr. Logan?

Go ahead. I want to clarify an earlier comment with Mr. Sandaval made. Uh the lockers at Tot are customary uh customarily and subordinate to the pantry use. Uh if you visit the property and observe how they are used, you'll greatly understand that situation. It's a back and forth uh because they don't have places to put their stuff. Her comments were perhaps taken out of context because she wasn't referencing general use in other areas. Lastly, Mr. Hogan, I'm sorry, Logan from way back there in one contact. I thought I took Mr. Logan, um thanks for your earlier inquiry. One of the things that hasn't been brought up yet today is a very important aspect here is that this violation suggested tacit segmentation and targeting of specific members of our community. The reason is we spent an incredible amount of time talking about source source facilities, lockers and toilets in particular. Yet there was been no reference to two actual storage buildings on the lot. 75 ft from the end of the lockers. So storage is storage. The only difference is our homeless folks don't use those. They don't have access to it, right? So please, please consider what's going on here because there's way more than I think than what's actually being presented. Thank you very much for your time. Appreciate you for your testimony. Clark,

we don't have any more registered. Okay. Is there anyone else in the crowd who would like to speak today? If sir, could you please approach the podium?

Good evening, sir. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Raymond First, 1353 Clark Avenue here in Morocco. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you, sir. Go ahead. Two years ago, I got out of prison. They dropped me here in Rome. This woman helped me. She saved my life. She helped me get back on my feet. I got a home. I got a wife because of her. How many of y'all have asked her, "Can y'all help her?" None of it. Sir, if you could just keep

No. No. Nobody has asked. If you could just keep your voice at a at a normal talking level, that would be appreciated, sir. This is very very strict to me.

That is There are people out here that need help. Desperate need help. Sleep in the cold, sleep in the rain. They have nowhere to go. nothing. Y'all want to dog them. That's what this is about. Dogging the people that can't defend themselves. That's all this is. I want to defend them. I want to help them. I go down there and help every time I can. I help at the pantry, up at the mission. I give back. Maybe y'all should give back. Mandy served. Anyone else? Is there anyone else who would like to speak today? Okay, Mandy, could you approach the podium, please? And all the way in the back. This is back there.

Good afternoon, ma'am. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Uh, Lindsay Mills, 990 West Riverside Drive, Salem. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes.

Thank you, ma'am. Go ahead. So, uh, surprisingly speaking, um, I have been on both sides of the vents. I have been homeless and I have been privileged. Uh, one thing that I see in common from all of the ones who are not in support of the T-OT issue is they are all privileged. They have spoke about owning businesses. They have spoke about owning properties. Maybe they've never experienced what it is like to go from nothing to something. I am testimony um of going from nothing to something. From not having a home, from losing all four of my children to now having a beautiful place that I'm about to buy, as well as a daughter who because of Dawn is in college with a minor in social work and a major in social justice to help the homeless community. Tot has shown us that we are here to help everybody and no matter whether I've got it now, some people just don't and I treat those people with the same dignity. We have helped Dawn with dining with dignity, an event that she puts on um through Totwood Park. Um and I don't know that I've seen anyone on this side of the room in the front rows. Um, I've only watched these things on YouTube, so I don't know what I'm supposed to say when I'm not, but I've never seen any of them volunteer. I ask that they maybe just spend one day. Come volunteer. Come see what God has done. There are people that come through Teot that may not have ever known hope and they get it there and maybe a hot dog and some chips, too. We volunteered before this morning. It was great for me. It's what I needed as an

emotional reset. It doesn't matter whether you take the lockers or the portaotties out. There is a bigger issue at hand. And the bigger issue really isn't homelessness. It's people not willing to help or see outside their privilege. And that's a problem for me. I appreciate everything that Dawn has done for me when I was lacking. And I appreciate everything that I can do now for her, for tea, for the community because I'm no longer lacking. And I think that earlier someone said the list of books is this thick and rules are rules, but rules are meant to be changed because the only thing that's constant is change. And if things don't get changed, then things don't get corrected. and maybe there just needs to be a little bit of change to create a bigger change everywhere else.

Thank you for your testimony. Uh is there anyone else who would like to speak today? Okay, the gentleman in the back.

Good afternoon, sir. Could you please state your name and resial address for us? Yes, my name is John Schaeer. 497 Stam Road, Ron Oak, Virginia. Thank you, sir. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing above the truth? My affirm. Thank you, sir. Could you go ahead?

Um, I think that first of all, the homeless terminology is terrible. It would be like calling someone out about their religion or their race. These are people and people that need help. people that need to be helped up, supported. And I think if nothing else, this accusal process, if it could be postponed, set aside, changed, whatever needs to happen. People mentioned the rescue mission. The rescue mission sustains homelessness. They do very little to get people off the streets. Don has programmed in place, and I know the lockers seem like a major inconvenience, but it's a stepping stone. It's a place to have their goods, their medication, their personal belongings where they could be safe when they go on a job interview and they try to become productive servants of the world. They have nothing else. That's all they have. And they need a place to keep it. And horrible as it may sound, if you take away their restroom, they're going to go somewhere. They have no choice. And again, they're homeless temporarily. We hope we hope to get them home some point. And they're people at the end of the day. their people. We should be helping each other up, not pushing each other down. And I know rules are rules, but they're meant to be changed and they're made to be modified. I can't think of any laws that stayed in place more than 10 or 15 years without modification or change. And there's time for things to change to make things better for people. And I hope somebody sees that light because one thing everybody needs to realize. And I don't care who you are in the room, how nice your suits are. I'm not claiming anybody. But we're all one day, one event, one illness away from being homeless. So, I don't want to join them. I got very close recently. I realize what it comes to. Now, I'll do my best not to, but I also do my best to help Emma, and I hope everybody else does, too. Thank you.

Thank you, sir, for your testimony. Is there anyone else who would like to speak? All right, ma'am. In the blue. Good afternoon, ma'am. Could you state your name and residential address for us? D. A 11:22 15th Street Southeast Rono. Andy, because you raise your right hand, do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

I do. I don't have anything to testify. I just have a couple observations about things that have been stated today. Um the first thing that caught my eye from Mr. more was um he mentioned that um the city doesn't catch every zoning violation even though sounds like a at least a year or more has um passed since um the items in question were installed. Um but I will say that both the lockers and the portagon are obvious and they're in broad daylight so I'm not really sure how they were overlooked. My next uh the next thing that sort of wrangled my brain a bit was about the operational uh no sorry the outdoor storage versus general accessory. I just want to say that based on what I gleaned from today um these aren't bulk materials. It's not merchandise to sell. As far as I know, Tot doesn't sell anything. They're not a thrift store. They're not a Goodwill. Um, I would say that what T-OT is storing sort of as a a unique classification, which isn't listed, it sounds like in any of these ordinances, um, what's stored in these lockers are personal effects, personal belongings. And I just want to link that to the utility related to Tot. So, I learned recently that T-OT has washing machines and during the few hours each day that they're open, people can come in and they can wash their clothing. If you're homeless, obviously this is very difficult to do. So, laundry is a service that TOC provides to people. So, they have clean and dry clothing. Some of the clothing might be their only clothing, might be their favorite clothing. It might be a gift from their mother or their child. Who knows? We don't know the

significance of the clothing, but certainly it's important to have. So, the service is a laundromat, basically, a free laundromat service. What do you do with your clean laundry that you're not wearing at that moment? You store it in a secure locker where it stays dry and where it stays clean. So, I would say that is a direct link from I think this is the thing you guys were trying to catch them up on. um that this is an integral that the lockers are integral to the services that T-lock provides that as far as I can tell are authorized and certainly legitimate and certainly needed. Thank you.

Thank you for your testimony. Is there anyone else? Okay, ma'am. Could you come forward? Good afternoon. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Lisa Parker, 230 Mlen Street in Salem, Virginia. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you. Go ahead.

Um, I don't have anything to dis to reference. Um, I just wanted to ask one question of Mr. Moore. the address 350 Albamore Avenue Southwest, which is the um address of the Virginia Haruction. And for those who don't know what that is, they pass needles out. They pass um tourniquets out to keep drug addicts drug addicts. That address happens to have multiple lockers mounted to the side of the building which are used to put needles, tourniquets, narcan, and things like that in for drug addicts to be able to come and get those items out of the lockers when that business is not open and they are closed. so that drug addicts can continue to get clean needles, to get tourniquets or whatever that they need to remain drug addicts. So, I would like for somebody to explain to me why although they are not in the downtown district, they are in a multi-use district, why they are allowed to have lockers to distribute needles, which we have businesses complaining that they find needles. This is where the needles come from and the city supports the Virginia harm reduction. They support a company or a person that goes out in a van to keep addicts addicts, but you want to take away lockers to people who are unhoused and everything they own go in lockers. I I would like to understand what that how this is a balance of I don't care what district it's in. Why are we even supporting a people who are keeping our drug addicts drug addicts but we don't want to help those who are homeless and

need assistance and need somewhere to house or put their clothing or put their medications or put their Narcan or whatever the case is. It doesn't matter what they're storing in the lockers. The point is that's all they have. And if it's okay for the Virginia Arm reduction to utilize lockers on the side of their building to put needles and things of that in so that people can come by and get them out of these assigned lockers. Why is it not okay for a homeless person to have a locker on the side of a building that has a, you know, they furnish clothing, they they furnish deodorant, they furnish toothbrushes, toothpaste, and they need somewhere to put that stuff because if it's found in the streets, the city um police officers are told to disperse them, to throw them away. So, that's all they have. And that's all I wanted to say. Thank you,

Mr. Mo. Would you like to comment on any of those questions that somebody asked? Um, I can either do that right now or at the end. All right. Is there anyone else who is registered speaker would like to speak today? Okay. All right. Ma'am, could you come forward?

Good afternoon, man. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Yes. My name is Sheree Braxton. My address 2403 Cornell Drive Northwest, Ren, Virginia 2412. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide here today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I affirm. Thank you. Go ahead. So, I wasn't prepared to speak today. Um, but as an ally of Tot supporter, volunteer of what Don does and the ministry she does, I just wanted to add that with the Lisa, is that

her last statement about addicts. Um, so often we I guess misconrue that or assume all homeless people are addicts and that's not the case. I am also a paycheck away from being in their same position along with many other people here in this room, especially in the economy that we live in. Can we even afford to get to work? I'm not sure. That's a question for another day. But some services that TOAT um does offer outside of the things that are in question today um is they have HIV and hepatitis C testing events and they have Blige behavioral health path program every Friday and this is just from their website. I literally just pulled it up 10 minutes ago. Um the homeless assistant team is on site every Monday and Wednesday. So to my knowledge Dawn does not support anyone. um she will support them and love them but she would will not tolerate people who are users or who brings that into the facility. That is something that she is strongly against but she will still work with them to get them clean and to provide a healthy space in downtown Reno for everyone to thrive whether you are sheltered or unsheltered. And so I just wanted to take that moment that all homeless people are not addicts. Um and we have a chance to love them and bring them back to life. love them back to life is something that my church calls and says and just as partners in the community we have a chance to do that right here right now in this room and I pray that you um just make the best decision.

Thank you ma'am for your testimony. Is there anyone else who would like to speak today? Ma'am in the back could you come forward? Good afternoon ma'am. Could you state your name and residential address for us? Yeah it's Hannah Jarrett, 2518 Bar Road Southwest. Thank you. Could you raise your right hand? Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony that you shall provide her today will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Affirm. Thank you, ma'am. Go ahead.

So, about 10 years ago, I was a homeless case manager, and I sat with Dawn when her office was her dining room table. Um, we talked about what in the world we could do to help these people who were struggling. um because they found themselves the paycheck away from homelessness. And I've heard lots of things today and I just want to reiterate a couple of things about Dawn and about the um services that she has provided and the person that she is. Uh we have housed people together over the years. We have also evicted people together over the years because Dawn is an accountable person. Um, just like the last person said, she has standards and rules um that she makes the people that receive her services follow. Um, and she holds them to a high standard because she wants them to be treated with dignity. And so I believe that she is carrying out her mission with accountability. Um, and I think that should be um, honored. I also think that she is honest and several people have said and pointed out the fact that um she was awarded that um occupancy certificate when all of these services were already in place. She didn't hide anything. She didn't put anything in the back room um so that nobody would see it. They were already in place um and they are visible for those people to see. So I think that her um honesty and integrity should also be honored. Um she is not trying to be deceitful. She is one of the very um few people who has put a whole lot of effort into addressing a problem that exists. Um so I would encourage you to award the appeal.

Thank you for your testimony. And is there anyone else in the crowd who would like to speak today? Okay. Say you know what? I'm going to go ahead and close the public comment portion of this application. Miss Sanduel, I'm going to give you one more chance to respond if you would like to to prevent any any of the public comment that you've heard here today. You don't have to do that. It's up to you. Um, I apologize. I didn't know today would be such an emotional day. So all of the services that we s that we provide at the least of these ministry have all been there since the beginning. No none of it has been deceitful, unlawful, behind closed doors, unpermitted, none of that. All of this came about, as I shared with you earlier, because as you can tell by the public comment that people want the people that we serve to go away and if they can eliminate the programs that we operate on the outside of our building, they don't have to see them. I can assure you that at 59 years old, I didn't get this gray hair from hair color. It's from the stress and the strain and the way that I have tried to be a good community partner and I do not allow people to camp out on our parking lot. I don't allow people to even sleep in other business way businesses doorways. I will stop and I will ask them to leave. I didn't bring the homeless people to the area that we're serving in. They were there when we got there. Everything that we have done has been a pipeline to be from the beginning to the end to provide permanent housing for people. We've reunified families. We've renovated a 19-unit motel to make

transitional housing. We are literally just trying to go from the beginning to the resolution of homelessness. My prayer is to work myself out of a ministry. They'll have to have something else for me to do. But I just want to first of all thank you all for taking the time to listen. I I know y'all worn out from just everybody talking, but um I do believe that in my opinion this these violations are trying to fit a round peg in a square hole. I think that the violations were recommended, if you will, and then followed up by the city and have now become zoning violations. I don't think it was anything that the city came for us for initially. I think it all stemmed from what someone else said and how someone else wanted us to operate. So, um, I appreciate you. I don't have anything else.

Thank you very much, ma'am. Um, first of all, I want to thank all of the uh members of the public who made the choice to come out here today uh for this hearing and um for choosing to make your voices heard. More importantly, I want to thank Mrs. Sanderball for your ministry to our community. I think that it is undeniably needed and it has undeniably both enhanced and saved lives. After listening to all of the information uh provided here today, listening to both sides, listening to all the public comment, listening to your testimony, listening to Mr. Moore's information. Uh I have come to the conclusion um that based on the need of these lockers uh and and the need that would withstand the fact of whether or not your organization existed on this property that they are not customarily subordinate to your organization and therefore represent the definition of outdoor storage. And therefore it it's my conclusion to uphold the zoning administrator's decision. That being stated, I don't think that my vote is going to solve any problems that members of the public were here discussing today. In fact, I think it may create additional problems.

Thank you very much. I'll let the other board members speak. I I want to thank all of you for coming in and for your very heartfelt testimony and your description of what you see in their day-to-day workings community. Uh ultimately today we're here on an extremely narrow question and not the broader uh policy questions, you know, regarding you know the unhoused. Uh I I agree with my colleague in this instance. Uh but at one point uh Miss Sandal very like evidently talked about the importance of you know dignified you know places for her clientele type of stuff and that that goes to show this this goes beyond you you know like incidental and customary like there are very very important you know public policy issues that need to be addressed but the the the board of zoning appeals is not the not the venue for that. Yeah. Well, um I just like to say that I really appreciate you coming and making the presentation. I'm familiar with your organization. Uh as a matter of fact, I almost recuse myself because I've through my church made donations to your organization. And not only that, uh, from the other standpoint, I'm familiar with the rehabilitation on Day Avenue. I was involved with the rehabilitation on at least eight of those homes over there. So, I'm familiar with that. So, I've got uh an interesting involvement. I think I can be impartial. In fact, I know I can be impartial on this. And it's going to be just as conflicted. I'm going to be just as conflicted on reaching a decision as everyone else is

because I know that a number of you uh uh um um agree that your service is is just about in in well it's indispensable really. Uh the thing I have one question before I I close and I just want to and I'm sure this has been addressed the problem was addressed by the zoning board if because of the delay in recognizing the um violation. Was there anything or any mention made about um grandfather? Is that allow is that part of the code and that that can be both addressed to both you Mr. Moore and uh the city attorney?

Um I can try to address that. Uh no there's no there's no legal nonforming nature to uh what's being conducted on site. I want to be sure because I'm looking for any way I can but to support the decision and I don't want to leave any stone unturned. Thank you. Other board members um Mr. Chairman, I again and and everyone here, I appreciate the um u testimony that all the speakers have given. Um I've learned a lot and as Mr. Barner said, I uh I'm conflicted because I feel like they're they're very good arguments on both sides. Um, I foremost would hope that the appellant and the city would work together to find a solution to this because as a couple of speakers pointed out um whether we decide that lockers and privy are outdoor storage items or not, it's not going to fix the problem. So um uh I I feel like this particular matter is a little inconsequential. I feel like the appellant acted in good faith. Um I question whether the lockers of the uh rise to the definition of outdoor storage. But I'm troubled by the fact that there was inconsistency in the fact that the the

um I can address that. So outdoor storage specifically excludes uh outdoor um I'm sorry uh items that are stored within a wholly enclosed building. And so those structures would rise to the definition of building uh which is why they're excluded from uh what we're talking about today. Okay. Even I've been out with not fixed to her foundation and I don't these are not my they're outstanding to be picked out of specialized

um my uh my hope is that there is a solution. There might be a a change to the ordinance at some point um that would address this action. Um, however, this very moment I'm inclined to uphold the determinations of administrator. So, Mr. Oh, we got a vote or everyone is finished making their statements.

This is a horrible thing. Um, I thank you for your mention because you are doing a lot not just Toronto as people are coming from all over Southwest and I do thank you. Um, for what we are voting on, I have to vote on that part that we're voting on. I wish we were voting on this whole whole thing and just to help but unfortunately our board is not perfect. So I will have to go by the

I'm going to echo some of the comments like colleagues here from the board. I think we brought up the issues that we don't have the ability to address in this board and I hope that we lifted those issues up to people who are going to hear them and maybe start to address them. But we're just party to following the zoning law as it says and following what the zoning administration has suggested and that's our only goal and our only business here for us today. So I would have to vote to uphold.

Okay. Just a second. I'm going to ask for a motion in a second to overturn the zoning administrator's determination at 420 Luck Avenue. The I vote will overturn the zoning administrator's determination. A nay vote will uphold the zoning administrator determination. Do we have a motion to overturn the zoning administrator determination at 420 Avenue? Mr. Logan, do we have a second? Mr. Garner, Mr. Clerk, could we take the vote on overturning the zoning administrative determination at 420 Avenue? Sure. Miss, no. Mr. Garner, no. Mr. Hamler,

Mr. Logan, Mr. Miller, Mr. Barley, nay. And the zoning administrative decision is upheld.

Thank you everyone who has come to our state board this application. Moving forward on today's agenda, could you briefly ask those doesn't forward. So, city council has requested of the work of commission that they hold their hearing and that is to facilitate these public toend these hearings and across the house on June 10th, 2026 or soon after the matter of

Thank you, ma'am. This we take brother discussion with the negotiation.

And our last item on today's agenda nomination and election on Mr. Chris Miller for vice chairs. Do I have a motion to approve Mr. Chris Miller for vice chair boards? 71. Thank you. We have a second floor

Mr. Mr. Mr. Mr. Mil. That's a German