Planning Board - Regular Meeting

all my people here. Yeah, you are.

All right. Thank you very much, Andrew. Uh, welcome everybody to tonight's planning board meeting. It is November 10th. Uh, notice is hereby given in accordance with Mass General Laws section 40A and the Norfick zoning bylaw section 3106.11 and 3106.13. A public hearing is being held tonight, Monday, November 10th, 2025 at 7 Oh, I'm reading the wrong thing. Back up. Start over. We'll just edit this in post, right? Yep. Perfect. Okay. So, in accordance with the provisions of Mass General Laws, chapter 38, section 20, notice is hereby given that the planning board is meeting tonight, Monday, November 10th, 2025 at 700 p.m. in town hall meeting room 124. Members of the public are welcome to attend this person. Uh, attend this in person at 1 Liberty Lane, Norfick, Mass, or by remote Zoom connection provided. Please note that in the the inperson meeting will not be suspended or terminated if technical problems interrupt the remote connection. Um all right here with me tonight uh I myself am Gary Sullivan vice chair acting as chair in absence of Chris Montfort. To my right is Gary Surl. To my left is Melissa Mayo. We have Chris McCarthy our town planner. We have Betsy Peler administrative assistant. Uh who else is in the room? Not many people.

Dan Seager is on. Dan Seager is online. Hello, Dan. Good evening. Because Dan is online, we do need to do roll call vote for any votes. Um, yeah. So, let's get this started. So, what's up first? Public hearing 700 p.m. 19 Valley Street. Yep. The applicant has requested a continuence until our December 9th meeting. They're still addressing all the peer review comments from Beta.

Okay. All right. So, I will uh do we have to vote on Yeah. So, I'll accept a motion to continue the 19 Valley Street public hearing until our December 9th meeting. So, moved. Second. All right. All in favor? I Oh, sorry. We have to go roll call. So, uh we'll start with Dan. Dan Seager. I. Gary Surl. Hi. Melissa Mayo. I. Gary Sullivan is I any uh nays? No, we're good. Okay. Well, now we have to wait till 7:30, right? So, but the good news is we can

business new business 28 long. Yeah, we can go right through the new business portion of your agenda. Great. And then uh hopefully you'll be ready to roll at 7:30. Is there good news via TW uh regarding 28 long meadow? Cuz you said good news or or was it good news we get to go through this whole list? No, good news was to be able to go through the Okay, that's fine.

New business, not good news for 28 Long Meadow Road. So, in terms of 28 Long Metal Road, I prepared a letter that uh stated that the planning board had voted the director of planning development to be the agent for the planning board as it relates to 28 Long Meadow Road. I then uh prepared a letter that I sent to director, the DPW director for the town of Norfolk who has the enforcement arm under the storm water bylaw and that's a really as a practical matter because we don't have a we have an interim director.

Yep. And no assistant director nor do we have a highway superintendent either. that person's has taken a position with another community. I'm not sure how much actual finding will happen until we have kind of solidify that position. Okay.

Cuz that's but everything is lined up for that to happen. Um because you already voted for the finding. As soon as they if they're able to find, they can send fines. They don't have to be consecutive. they could just send out send out fines. So every the table's been set to do that. We just need to have them do that. So I don't believe any's been sent out to date. So

okay. Um related to that in a way the conservation commission really hasn't seen any progress either. um they have reached out to the D to see if they can step in and use some of their authority as a state agency to move that along. There hasn't been any movement of the there hasn't been any further boommy yet. So, okay. So, not really good news to report on that front.

Okay. Well, we've done everything we can, I think, for that. So hopefully we can iron out the uh the logistics of starting to find properly. And and there's been no interaction. No one's come in uh from representing uh 28 Long Meadows since. Okay. There's been zero. Okay. Didn't know if someone just went on, but I guess not. Um yeah. Okay. And once you take steps, you start moving forward. It's not reversible. At some point, you're you're just marching forward at that point.

Okay. Yeah. It's not reversible. So, in terms of finding, it's finding forward. Yeah. Not back, right? Yep. Okay. Uh, I mean, I will try to reach out to the applicant through their legal counsel to see if I could get some. Yeah. You know, I did hear from a legal counsel for the owner a while ago, several months ago, but they haven't heard anything since. Okay. Interesting. That is what else do we want to have? Minutes. Yep.

And then master plan implementation and B1 discussion. So that's that should be a good discussion I would hope. Okay. I I like B1. So the question is which one what would you like to tackle next? Let's do the minutes cuz that seems to be the lowest hanging fruit. It's not exciting, but All right. So you. All right. Do you want me to jump in with that, Gary? Yeah, sure. You want to start with the October 14th ones?

So, I think both the October 14th and 27th minutes have been distributed. Um, we'll start with October 14th. Any questions, concerns, or edits with the minutes? Discussion. Looks good. Take a motion to approve. So moved. Are you second? Uh all in favor of approving the October 14th, 2025 planning board minutes as distributed say I. We have to roll call this. We have to roll call this. All right. Uh Gary Surl I. Gary Sullivan I.

Melissa Mayo I. being here as I moving on to October 27th. Any questions, concerns, or edits? No, sir. Not that I hear or see. All right. Okay. Um, yeah, go ahead. Any mo a motion to approve? So move. Second. Second. Uh, all right. Gary Sorrell. I Gary Sullivan. I mayo. I uh Dan Seager votes. I

Okay. You want to jump to master plan implementation committee. So that would that'll be Melissa and Dan to talk about that?

Yep. Dan and I have been working on this. Um, so we moved all of the, you know, the master plan, um, output is, you know, one big PDF. And so we moved that into a spreadsheet so that we could sort it if we need to in different ways just to kind of see how it makes sense, um, for different owners or if we need to have almost like subcommittees based on topic. Um, so Dan and I met about that uh, about a little over a week ago now. Um, and what we were trying to figure out is what makes the most sense in terms there's a lot of information in there, but some of it is more of like the day-to-day. So, for us as the planning board, for Rich as the planning director, for DPW in their day-to-day. So, what we talked about doing is separating it out so that it's more of, you know, this is your day-to-day as an employee or as a board versus these are the things that we need to work on as a, you know, committee or subcommittees. Um, so we tabled that for now because we had town meeting coming up and I needed to work on some stuff for that. Dan did put together a one-pager. Um, I don't know Dan if you have it readily available um to share, but it was just, you know, he put together a one pager to kind of explain what this what we're looking for, what it would be, and then the next steps for all of us. What we were thinking is continue to work on this through, you know, the end of the year. Dan and I can work on it together and then get it kicked off, start getting the people for the committee first first of the year. Um, so that'll give us some time to all work through it, review the ultimate, you know, the what we have for items for committees versus employees or boards just to make sure everybody's in agreement with how we categorize it and then we can move forward. But Dan did put together a one pager. Um, if Sorry, Dan, I just put you on the spot with that one. But if you don't

No, that's okay. I I'm just I'm working on I've got two different devices here. So, my technical prowess will probably take me a little bit to try to share this. Um maybe what I just say briefly is that you know as Melissa said we kind of tried to think about breaking it apart from what are you know more policy objectives um that are kind of implemented broadly as work is done versus what are the kind of actionable targets or or goals or um items that come from the actual plan itself. Um and then we talked about what is the um you know what is the possibility for a sort of an implementation committee that doesn't get overly bureaucratic or burdensome but does um you know bring in some kind of knowledge and residents and and other views to continue the good work that was done and engagement as part of the development of master plan itself. Um so I I can this it's pretty high level. Um I think certainly can distribute it to the board and kind of you know talk through it once you've had some time to to absorb it. But the the kind of upshot of it is that it would put together an implementation advisory committee for implementing the goals of the master plan as well as sort of market monitoring um and sort of understanding the kind of metrics for progress and success of those uh goals. We we talked with um Rich and Betsy as well as Carol Green and the the um town clerk's office to kind of think through what's the most uh logical way to implement and appoint a committee like that. And what we sort of came to was it have it be a subcommittee um of the the planning board. And so

what we kind of started to do here and certainly can take feedback from the the board, you know, either now or or in between now and the next meeting, but um think about who should be sort of the representatives of that committee. Um we've got a couple open questions to to chase down whe like sort of how many people could we have from the planning board before we necessarily trigger a plan specific planning board meeting and stuff like that. But logistically speaking, it would be a subcommittee that's kind of reflective of the the group that worked on and will need to implement the master plan. Um, and then as part of that, if there's specific subject matter areas or topics that kind of need, you know, ad hoc deep dives, um, that group can sort of assign those off or create sort of ad hoc subject matter, you know, groups to to kind of run with something and then come back and report on on progress. So, um, yeah, that's kind of the high level. Again, we're trying to strike the balance between making sure we're doing this, um, transparently and engaging as many people as possible without kind of creating something that's overly burdensome and bureaucratic so we can actually, you know, focus on implementation. Yeah, we were thinking, you know, just like with the master plan steering committee, we had our regular folks that were committed and then so that would be the subcommittee, but then having the ad hoc groups is something that um Dan and I talked about as you know what I hear from people is often times they don't want to be part of a a committee or a board because of the time commitment or because of the unknowns or because you know it's there's a lot of different reasons. Mostly I think it comes down to the commitment. Um and you know everybody has busy lives. So, if we can have people, that's another reason we talked about breaking it out into topics because maybe people would be interested in a particular topic in the master plan, but not necessarily all of it. Um, so then maybe we could just have these ad hoc groups of people that are like, "Oh, I can jump in to help with that one or give you my feedback or whatever it may be without having them be feel

burdened with, you know, a three-year commitment or a 12-month commitment and just having more ad hoc meetings to get more voices um into the process. How do we get the pool of volunteers for the different groups? Are they already people working on different groups in the town in different committees?

It could be. I mean, Dan, what you have in your document is really like we would have people that are already part of other um committees and boards, right? And then we would have and that would be our regular standing group and then we would have ad hoc groups for people that want to jump in and help where they can. the ad the ad hoc groups, which is cool idea. I like that. Um, let's say everybody jumps at this and there's a hundred people that want in. Like, do we just go to a lottery system or is there like h how do we pick the We haven't gotten there yet. Okay, fair enough. But that's a No, it's a good question. I think if we get more things to investigate if you got 100 people that are interested,

I hope we would have that many people interested, but um no, we haven't gotten that far yet. We we just this there's a lot to uh to break down, but any of the questions that you guys have definitely feed them our way because we need to think through it all. You know, the groups I thought that was the case with the um uh the original uh B1 committee, right? There was a good mix of people. Um different skill sets, different life experience, different ages. Um but uh it seemed like there was a good balance. Yeah. Yeah, maybe was just lucky at the time that we we got a good group of people.

You could always if you get a run like huge turnout, you could always people could maybe prioritize, but they might be more interested and see how that lines up too. That was more of a hypothetical more aligned with what Gary Surl is saying is the how do we ensure there's a good mix. Yeah. So, right, which the lottery wouldn't do, right? Necessarily. So,

so we like maybe we think about asking for backgrounds, interests, you know, experience. But I think that was part of the B1 thing that I did. And I we did not not at that level, but we did some of that for the for the master planning committee, right? Because we were looking for we we're looking specifically at age demographics. We were also looking for backgrounds and stuff like that. So, okay.

Yeah, I think that all makes sense. What I would maybe recommend for next steps on this is we can answer some of the remaining questions that we had in putting this together and then um send something out to you know the the board for review and talk about it at the the next meeting. And then I think um part of that conversation can be about you know how we recruit people um you know how do we potentially see people with different you know backgrounds or or interests as part of that and then kind of divide some of this this stuff up into implementation. Mhm. Okay. Thanks for doing this work. Sure. Yeah.

Kind of couldn't not do it after I was How many times did I say this can't just be a pretty document, right? Yeah, exactly. Kind of convinced yourself to I did. Yeah. Okay. So, that's it for master plan implementation committee. Uh we got 10 minutes give or take. Not enough time for proper B1 conversation or uh we could certainly start right and see what your thoughts are on your man. Okay. You seem really energized when it came up on the agenda. Yeah.

Yeah. So what I did was I had a meeting with Jawan Park and actually and Josh Viala and Josh Fial if you remember was was in the beginning in terms of working on the B1 study when we had the B1 study going on. Alexis is um she's actually leaving MAPC and moving on to another agency. So she so in in terms of sitting down and discussing with Joan and then Josh was good because Josh kind of provides some context between when we did the B1 study 2019 a while ago now.

Yeah. and then um he was very involved with the master plan so forth and then we kind of talked about where we gone recently with some the the study from MEPC regarding the B1 um jeez so what the thought was that towns the B1 district itself is not particularly large in scale So, we're not talking about a large geographic area with multiple properties. um which in of itself we have some properties that are vacant and then we have some that are developed which might be partially redeveloped or they could be if the economics supported they could be tear downs redevelopment down the road depending upon um how how things proceed in terms of the market and so forth and different sit um situations with the properties. So the thought was instead of trying to create a set of standards that you know might apply well to one site and then another site not so well and then create but then the the idea would be to create give the planning board we have some we have standards already in the B1 district but through a special permit process give the planning board the flexibility to modify a site a project on a sightby-sight basis. So that what that would do is there might be circumstances that fit well in terms of the B1 requirements but yet in others they may not. So the board would have the flexibility through the special permit process

and part of that process would be essentially like a concept plan that you an applicant could submit to the board. We'd have a public hearing as part of the process. So it would be public feedback into that and talk about it. the different standards whether you know setbacks, height, commercial mix, um the amount of the number of units in terms of a project from a dwelling standpoint, the affordability component. So a whole host of different things that you could kind of consensus build what would what makes sense through a concept plan and then you would see what the standards what they meet and they don't meet and whether it makes sense or not or maybe there's some give and take right in terms of how you shape the project and then they would come back for a special permit. So, it's kind of a step process and what the it does create flexibility. Um, it's kind of hard in terms of one size doesn't fit all and it really works in terms of, you know, an it can be a little more of a heavy lift for an applica in terms of a applicant or a property owner because, you know, this could be it could be a little back and forth, right? till this doesn't quite work. You might be spending time kind of getting to that point where you have a consensus plan. But what it does allow them is the ability to kind of approach the board and get the feedback from the board ultimately be the permitting body and then get public feedback instead of sometimes you you bring a project in and it's a it's could be a crapshoot, right? You don't know how how the board nor the public may react or not, right? So that's that's kind of the pitch to do it that way which is more simplified

which again you know there's pros and cons to every solution but it instead of trying to as you can see when we started back in 2019 there was a whole series of provisions in the zoning that we were looking at to make some changes to and some did get changed but not all of them right? you know, we never really settled on one one particular thing. And there I highlighted in your in the share drive like other sections of the B1 that we haven't even touched upon that could come into play too that again would create that flexibility. So that that's kind of the and high level pitch.

The ultimate goal is to get more development in the B1 district. That's that's what we're it's the top of the pyramid. top of the pyramid is a good development in the B1 district. So it might in some cases you might have a little bit more commercial end side of it to the equation. There might be a little bit more residential. But if it's the idea is to kind of create the balance that's going to work that we want to have somebody permit a project, design a permit and fill that space whether it's commercial, residential, we don't want to we want them to we want projects to be applicable to our bylaws and not skirt them development but with the you know within the framework of the bylaw. Exactly.

Correct. Yeah. Um because it's as you know you're going through the process trying to sit in a auditorium and explain you know shade trees and street trees and then buffers and then how these things interact where the utilities are located versus not and you know gets a little bit tricky without something real tangible. So this is a way to kind of marry both

in terms of concepts. Now, you know, obviously there's a lot of faith in the board, but you are elected body. It is a special permit, so you can say no. It's not by right. So, there's there's some built safeguards for the the community as as a whole. Um maybe one committee looked at ideas like this. we didn't get very far with him cuz we want to keep it simple, get something out the door that we could iterate on at some point in the future. And that's also why the 40R conversation stopped and things like that. So, be great to have it back at the table. I haven't talked about this in so long, though. It's like I feel like I have to go brush up. Um I mean I do think it's a I think the focus for us uh for the last couple of years has been to try to find ways to compromise with things or developers or the state to find ways to regain some control over things that are being developed in town. This is just a further extension of that. So it makes sense to me. And so really what I'm in terms of asking tonight is if this concept, you know, has merit and you want to pursue a little bit further, you don't have to make a decision tonight. But I don't want to necessarily have MAPC going down a track of, you know, one way the other actually and not, you know, come back with something that, you know, the board at least would be considering.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm just thinking back to some of the conversations we've had with builders that have come to our meetings that have said they were surprised that we didn't have any flexibility, right? So, I it's a it's a tough one because, you know, people in town want everything to look a certain way and so the bylaws create that, but it's also restrictive to the folks that want to build on the areas that we want to be built, specifically in the B1. So, I think we do have to have come to some sort of middle ground on how we're going to do this because if it's too restrictive, then we're not going to have anything built and folks want things built and they want it to look the way that they want it to look. But the way that um 40B can be, you know, we could just if we if we don't do something to try to find a middle ground, we could just have 100% residential downtown and we won't be able to do anything about it, right? So I think that's something that's important to note as well to folks

and the position you're in today is that through that B1 you did create the design guidelines. So there there is a template in place of you know how the idea how the the buildings will look how they oriented and so forth. So there is a most of the B1 is great. I mean from what we've heard from developers it's just a few things that just don't work all the time. So you know most of it it's not like it's work that was wasted. You guys put a lot of time and effort into that and it it's great. There's only a few things really that come up kind of repeatedly. Yeah. And why do you think it hasn't there hasn't been a lot of development then? Well, I mean there's a couple of big things.

The first big thing is that here we go. Um, no, no, not necessarily that. I mean, so right off the bat, the economy has changed dramatically since, you know, this the B1 originally started before CO, right? So the whole world in terms of how we do things has definitely shifted. I mean, there'll be some shift a little bit back, but that's definitely played a big part. And the other thing that's underlying to a degree limiter is the fact, you know, we don't have uh sewer. Yeah.

In town centers. So in terms of that is definitely a big component of it because you know if you're looking to change out tenants you know certain tenants have different septic wastewater requirements than others. So you know the buildings that are in in the center today are on older systems. So um so that definitely plays a part. Um the commercial split we've heard about

the commercial split is pretty I will say right off the bat we know which is definitely a a hard stop is the ratio commercial to residential because it's based on footprint size. So that that definitely doesn't work. Maybe it seemed like it worked but when you actually try to put the boxes on on a plan and figure that it doesn't work you know. Um so that's clearly been one. Um, yeah, there is there's one potential development that the height is an issue. Well, actually, I shouldn't say that. It's not the height, it's the number of stories, right? The height meets the height, it's just the number of stories. But, so

there's other I don't think the height would it may not be an issue. Right. So, um, and you know, depending on the story level, that might not fit every site either. Right. Right. So that's one where it's it's a very particular lot that does actually kind of go downhill, right? So it's not exceeding the 46 ft. It's just that it's going to be four floors instead of 3 and 1/2, right? So it still doesn't exceed the 46 ft, but it's also downhill. So it's going to appear to be shorter than it is versus the lot right across the street from here obviously would it would look very tall potentially. Not I mean it's still 46 ft, but you know it does it appears to be shorter anyway. That's one where it's almost like double restrictive.

Yeah. No, definitely. And that's a much bigger site, too. So, in terms of that site, but so overall, that's so again, that's the we looked at, you know, not we looked at a couple sites. So, for instance, where you know, where NCTV is across the street, there's three different buildings on that property. Um, you know, I know from prior discussions the owners like said that, you know, the sewer is definitely important part for redevelopment, but some of these other requirements could bump up too for if they wanted to do some redevelopment and not the whole entire site, right? So, for instance, the hardware store, you know, it's in the back of the property. doesn't really that doesn't really work necessarily what we're trying to achieve in the center of town but maybe they put a all residential building cuz they already have commercial on the site or maybe there's some commercial you know what I mean

so it creates a flexion so that's the whole notion that was another one that came up right the mixeduse has to be in the same building same building instead of being able to separate residential from commercial which could work on certain lots and then even the location because I think of 15 not 15 Rockwood Road but um well 16 whatever where the liquor store is. Mhm. Like that building, you know, sits up on Rockwood Road, but down the back you might have a mix where you could have commercial, commercial, residential, or you might have residential, commercial, you know what I mean? So, Mhm.

there's flexibility there, but the bylaw is pretty restrictive on how you go about doing it. So, anyway, that's the that's the takeaway. So, is that something you at least would want to consider?

I would. Yeah. I I think we we should I think we're going to have to to be able to have those conversations with the developers that we really truly want to be able to build something that folks in town want here. I think we'll probably have to have some examples to show, you know, like the one the perfect example of 46 ft. It meets 46 ft, but it's also going to be four stories, which is not allowed, but it doesn't change necessarily anything from the outside. So, if we could have some examples, I think that would be helpful because otherwise it might seem like you're giving all of the control for anything that's built, you know, especially in the center of town where a lot of people care about it and what it looks like. Giving that control to a bunch of people that perhaps you've never met as much as we are, you know, out there and try to meet as many people as possible. Um, but for folks that don't know us well or when we switch off on to, you know, go to other boards or our times up, terms are up, you know, I think it's putting a lot of uh faith into potentially future people that you don't know.

So, definitely true. But we would definitely include the public in the process at the site level, which I think is really important, too. Dan, is that Yeah, that that sounds good to I mean, I think what the the concept is right. We need to make sure that we put the right guard rails in place so it doesn't turn into a blank check for anybody. But I think that, you know, the ability to make common sense adjustments to help revitalize whatever we can and gain local control over whatever we can, I'm all for. Yeah. All right. Well, I'll give them some. We got to get back to 7:30. Yeah.

Okay. Thanks for that, Rich. Okay, so now we have a 7:30 public hearing for 50 Fruit Street. Are the two are these two two separate public hearings or the same? So you can um the storm water management permit is continued from our October meeting so we can take we can discuss that and then we can open up the uh scenic road act hearing. Okay. Sure. So, let's start with storm water management permit first. Is there anything? Is there any formality or reopen that? I don't pay enough attention to these meetings. Reading a notice. No, no, there's no notice.

There's no notice. It's just a continuence. No, you could just uh afterwards he you he will. Yeah. Okay. Which I'll wave cuz I don't like long sentences or anything. Okay. Okay. But storm water's already open. Yeah. All right. We have so online Dan American American engineering is uh Hey Dan. Good evening. Can I share my screen? Absolutely. Let me make you co-host Dan.

All set. Perfect. Thank you. Okay. Uh Dan American Legacy Engineering here on behalf of the applicant. When we met last uh we were just basically awaiting the peer review. Um so we do receive the peerreview comments. Uh we provided a revised site plan. Uh mostly minor details, spot elevations, a few changes to some of the storm water management details. One of the infiltration systems moved a few feet.

Um not nothing really substantive. Um, the other thing, um, our neighbor at 46 Fruit Street did attend at the last meeting and I told you that I would meet with him and I did and he requested that we, uh, provide a diversion swale. So, we added this here cuz he has I think you might recall that right now water comes down the road and in the existing condition goes into the existing driveway and kind of goes through here into his backyard.

When we relocate the driveway, that's going to address that problem. But he was also concerned that overland runoff just from our lot heading towards his backyard could be an issue. So, we added a small swale here that would basically pick up all this overland runoff and divert it behind his property. Um, so it's not a problem for us and uh easy easy to accomplish. Great.

And that's about it. Any questions you have? Happy to answer. Beta did perform the peer review and everything's in order. Stephen Lee is online with you with you all if you had any questions. But um Steve, does anything jump out at you here that we we should either have more information about or or you know think think longer about?

Um good evening everyone. Uh Steve Lee again with Beta. Um no I we went through the the initial peer review. The comments were pretty minor and um we since reviewed the submitted material and they've complied with all of the items we had. Again, there was nothing major and then the addition of the swale um only improves things for the butters. So, um as far as we're concerned, um everything is all set. Great. Thank you, Rich. There were no other butters that had issues, right?

No, just the the clear. No, I don't think so. They're probably I'm presuming they're satisfied. They're not online tonight, but I'm presuming they're satisfied with the outside house being addressed by the the looks like it should solve the problem. Yeah. Um and we'll continue to work with them. They have other questions or concerns. Appreciate it. Anybody else have any other questions? No questions. Just thank you for working with the neighbors. Yeah, absolutely.

Okay. Um, so we close the public hearing if there's no well open up the public comment first if anybody has anything to add from outside the planning board. More than happy to hear. Not seeing anything. I'm not seeing anything either. Okay. Um I'll accept a motion to close the public hearing. So moved. Second. All right. So roll call vote. Dan Seager. I. Gary Surl. I. Melissa Mayo. I. Gary Sullivan votes I. Stormware management permit for 50 Fruit Street. Public hearing is closed.

Now you have the seating. Now we have to open public hearing for 50oot street for scenic roads act for to remove a 35 ft section of stone wall for proposed driveway. I'll accept a motion to wave the reading of the public hearing. So move second. Okay. Roll call vote uh for this uh Dan Seager. I. Gary Surl I. Melissa Mayo I. Gary Sullivan votes I. passes unanimously. We are waving the reading of the public notice. Okay. So, what is this?

Moving the driveway. Right. Oh, right. Right. This is a request to relocate the driveway. Um, you can see here, this is the existing condition. There's the driveway here with an existing gap in the stone wall is 38 ft wide. the applicant would like to relocate the driveway further up the road. So, we would create a gap further up the road that's the same width, 38 ft, and then we would take the stone materials from that and use it to rebuild the stone wall where the existing driveway is. And as I mentioned, this is the issue the neighbor has with the drainage y

where the water comes down fruit street and goes into our driveway mouth and then goes across the site into their backyard. So when we close that up, it basically forced the water to go down into this catch basin which runs further down the street into another catch basin further down and then it discharges into a wetland that's down slope of the neighbor's property. M basically an even swap of the existing opening for a new opening in a different location. Yep, this makes sense. I always enjoy the scenic roads act, but it is very uh some sometimes just silly.

Well, cuz Yeah, taking from one putting it in another, it does seem a little silly, but it does make sure the roads look the way folks want them to. Yeah. Okay. Um, okay. Does anybody have any questions, concerns, comments on this one from the planning board? No. No. It's very straightforward. Very straightforward. Dan, any uh comments, concerns,

questions? No. Okay. Uh, anybody from the We'll open it up to public. Uh if anybody has any they want to add, questions, concerns, comments. Not seeing anything. I see nothing.

All right. It's pretty straightforward. Thanks for being uh concise with that. And uh rebuilding uh part of the wall, which is awesome. Um or you're moving the wall, which is great. Um, I'll accept a motion to close the public hearing for 50 Fruit Street Scenic Roads uh, act. Uh, so moved. Second. Roll call vote. Uh, Dan Seager I. Gary Surl I. Melissa Mayo I.

Gary Sullivan votes I. Public hearing is closed. Um, do we have to vote on these vote? Yes, we have them. Do it tonight. That'll be That would be great. That would be great. Get them and we have to vote for them separate because there are two public hearings. Yes, please. Yep. Okay. Um, do we need any discussion on this or can we go straight to voting? We can view the uh right

the storm water management permit. You got a copy of that. I think we've all reviewed that decision for stone. You have a copy in your pack of a written decision. Dan and Dan, you see it in the share drive?

Yeah, I got it open. And then uh likewise for the scenic road, you have a hard copy and then Dan has I'm missing uh I might not be missing it. I might just be not at the right page. Conditions. Okay. Conditions of approval. It's 38 ft, right, of the stone section of the wall that will be moved.

38 38 for 38. That was pretty straightforward. the um the condition that you have here in this document for the uh decision for the wall alteration. It says the DPW will oversee the removal of the stone wall. What what does that mean? Do they have to be on site to watch it or do they just need to make sure that it gets back put together?

Still inspect it after Okay. after the work is done. Yeah, maybe. Well, hopefully. Yeah. But they're not really they're not overseeing in terms of as if it was a DBW project. Is that the word that oversees maybe imply that? Is that what you're thinking? Yes. Yeah. I didn't know if we were going to have or just um

replacing the stone wall or remove and replace something that says it will I mean it does kind of say that in the previous decision. Does it say that? Yeah. So, conditions number seven right here. It says the Department of Public Works shall oversee the removal of the Stonewall. I just want to make sure we're clear on that so that uh you know, they're just inspecting it afterward. Maybe she'll oversee the work

or approve or something just so it doesn't seem like they need to be standing there while they do the work. We usually use oversee for this stuff. Oversee is that removal and replace or I that's that's the part that I Yeah, we could probably be more explicit with that if we feel it's necessary. Um,

removal slash replacement. Yeah, it's really relocation. Relocation. Yep. Relocation. That's perfect. One word answer. Perfect. Relocation. There you go. So, essentially that just means they're going to go out there and make sure it's been done, right? Low effort. And then uh probably the same for the police department too. Maybe I would say must be notified prior.

It says where Okay. Where appropriate. Must be notified prior to the removal. How about the relocation of the snow wall? Yeah, I think we just swap out removal for relocation there. I can make those changes tonight before you guys go and have maybe Gary sign it. Okay. Cuz there's a probably strong chance a little detail on that job. Oh, because it's so narrow there.

Yeah. Okay. Okay. So hearing no further discussion on the storm water management permit, we can I'll accept a motion to approve the conditions of approval for 50 Fruit Street storm water management permit. So move. Have a second. Second. Okay. Uh roll call vote for this one. Dan Seager. Hi. Gary Surl on Melissa Mayo I.

Gary Sullivan votes I. So that is approved. And then are we happy with the verbiage edits for the uh the wall alteration? Yeah. you are with the the swapping out removal with relocation removal of re relocation in two spots, right? Yep. You can vote it as you can vote it as amended.

Okay. And so just to be clear, the three spots are under the actual condition, the Department of Public Works shall oversee the replacement of the stone wall. And then two sentences down, the director of public works must be notified prior to replacement of the stone wall. Relocation. Sorry. Relocation of the stone wall. Reation of the stone wall. And then under police department shall be notified for potential details during the relocation.

During the relocation, it's a replacement, relocation, and relocation. Um any further discussion on this one? No. We are excellent wordsmiths. So this is always great to see us in action here. Um okay. I will um accept a motion to approve the decision for Stonewall altercation concerning Scenic Roads Act 50 Fruit Street. As amended. As amended. So moved.

Second. Okay, roll call. Yeah, good. Excellent. Excellent. Okay. Um, roll call vote. Dan Seager, I. Gary Serell, I. Melissa Mayo, I. Gary Sullivan votes I. Passes unanimously. Okay, so that's it for 50 Fruit Street. Yep. Thank you for your time. Have a good night. Thanks, Dan. Thank you. Good night. All right. So, now we jump to our 7:45 public hearing for 100R Pond Street wireless communications facility site plan. Do we need to open this one?

We you do. And there's a notice of public hearing. If you'd like to wave the reading, I'll make a motion or I'll accept a motion to wave the reading of the public hearing for this one. So, have a second. Second. All right. Uh, roll call vote for this one. Dan Seager, I. Melissa Mayo, I. Gary Surl, I.

Gary Sullivan votes I as well. Public hearing reading has been waved. Okay. Hello. Good evening. My name is Ed Perry. I'm an attorney at Brown RDI. Um, and thank you for waving the reading to save us all some time. I thought I was in a vortex. It's been 10 past 10 5 10 since I got here and I've been It's a decoration. Yeah. Keep forgetting about that clock. So, I'm here this evening representing SBA Towers and AT&T. And if I could share my screen, I have a little bit of a presentation. Absolutely.

Okay, you should be good to go, Ed. Thank you. There we go. We good? We see it up here. Yep. Terrific.

So, as I said, I'm here representing SBA and AT&T. SBA owns the owns actually the two towers that are currently located at 100 R Pond Street. Uh those are both what we call guy towers. So, they're big tall uh towers, not much of a foundation. The towers could support AT&T's uh installation. As I mentioned, my application materials uh neither of those two carriers can upgrade. So, they're dealing with old equipment uh not providing great service. And so, we came up with the brilliant idea to uh do what we call a drop and swap or in this instance a drop in swaps because we'll actually remove the two existing towers. Uh on the screen is just a list of the folks that are here uh on board uh online on Zoom if you have any particular questions. Uh Raphaela Cardona is representing SBA. Martin Lavin is from CS squed who did the radio frequency engineering and we also have a PE um with us from Kimley Horn. Uh so what you're seeing now is the ASBIL survey. Uh those two triangular looking things are the existing guy towers. As I said, they're just skinny towers sitting on foundations with those three guy wires coming off each. Uh, and as we go through, I'll just explain uh what we're proposing to do. That little red box there is where we're going to bump out the fence compound and build a new uh monopole uh if in fact it gets uh approved by this board and the bless you uh zoning board of appeals.

So, you're dropping the current tower. We're going to take both of them out. Actually, be taking both towers out. Okay. Uh as I mentioned, the tower here on the right or to the east uh contains the two carriers. It's my little uh arrow going. Yeah, let me see it.

Uh so that's where Verizon and uh Dish are located. We're shifting the tower. We're not shifting it. We're going to take that tower down once the new one is built. Uh it'll be a new monopole so it can accommodate AT&T, Verizon, uh AT&T, Dish, and T-Mobile. Uh and then the tower to the west will also take down. There are no existing carriers on that. Uh the nice thing about the project here is that Dish and T-Mobile can leave their groundbased equipment in place. Uh AT&T can use an existing concrete pad uh that is already located in the compound. And basically we're just taking the existing tower, shifting it over about 25 ft or so.

And the the monopole, do those also have the guy wires?

They do not. So that's the nice thing about this is a modern, you know, more modern uh tower facility rather than have the guy wires or that kind of erector set type. Uh as a matter of fact, I think the Northfor zoning bylaw requires monopolles if if we use them at all. U so this is this is a large site plan of the compound. So this here on the right hand side is what's existing again the existing tower. It's about 218 ft tall. uh is located here. That'll get removed. And then this round uh circle here is the depiction of the monopole where that'll be located. So it's about a 25 ft shift. AT&T will install its equipment cabinets here uh with its backup power generator. This the monopose. You'll see there's no guy wires. AT&T would be at the top. T-Mobile then dish. And then there would be room for a future collocator. And the height on this is

180 ft. So it's about 36 37 ft lower.

There is a I think it's a 4ft lightning rod, but it's not really visible. It's a it's a narrow uh lightning rod that attaches to the top of every monopole. You probably just don't see them as you drive by. Uh we're going to go with the stockade fence, wood fence that we already have. We'll expand it. Uh I think it's about I think we do about a 33 ft expansion of the compound to accommodate the monopole. Uh just this is just a picture of the two existing towers. Uh this one here as I mentioned does not have any carriers on it. This has T-Mobile and Dish. Both of these will come down. And just a closeup so you can see the antennas of the of the carriers and the compound. I think there's a lot of work going on up there with the solar farm. etc.

Yeah.

Uh so the site's in the commercial uh zoning district. It's in the the uh communications overlay district 4. It's about 8.43 acres as I mentioned with the solar project going on. Uh there are two non-conforming guide towers because monopoles are not required. Uh so they're non-conforming. Uh the existing one that we'll remove is 217 ft. will push uh Dish, it should say Verizon, it should say T-Mobile and Dish over to the new tower. Uh it'll be 180T pulse, so it'll actually be lower, lowering the visibility. Uh it doesn't have to be lit. Neither of the two towers right now are lit. Uh this one won't either. Uh we can go up to at least 200 ft. And as I mentioned, we'll be bumping out the fence compound by about 33 feet. And while we have to go to zoning for the use, planning board might just want to see what AT&T's network looks like. So these are all of the AT&T sites in the area. Uh the where all of those arrows, those blue arrows come in is the proposed location. I think we're about 1.3 miles uh from our closest site. So AT&T clearly has a gap in coverage. As you'll see here, uh this is this blue star here. I better get my glasses for this. This blue star here labeled MA1829 is AT&T's site. Uh we would, you know, drive to get green coverage if we could. Uh orange is is adequate coverage. Uh but if we could get green coverage everywhere, everybody would be covered with highspeed data service. So this is AT&T's existing footprint. And I'm going to flick to the next one. You'll see that it lights up with lots of green and orange. So, we'll get good coverage throughout this area. Uh, AT&T also provides firstn net service for our first responders. I think the Northfor

fire department and I think the county uh public safety of course is also um it's a metacomt metacomt. Yeah.

Yeah. Uh these are just some statistics that we put in the application materials. Uh at the uh orange signal level which we call NEG 93 would pick up 1300 people uh additional people in the uh in the town of Norfor uh who are living there. We also will cover about 15.6 more miles of of roadways. So bottom line is we're taking a site that has two kind of old school guide towers uh which aren't even allowed any longer at least in Norolk. Uh we'll take them out. We'll replace them with a new Martin 8ft pole. It'll give flexibility for anybody else that wants to colllocate. We'll move Verizon. We'll move T-Mobile and Dish over. We'll attach AT&T and we'll be done with the project. So, no impact, no negative impact of uh current T-Mobile or Dish users, but an in increase in service for AT&T users.

It will be a and and T-Mobile will actually improve because they'll put newer equipment on the on the new pole. They can expand and put full antenna arrays. Uh the way we're going to sequence, we've located the monopoles. We can construct the monopole, get AT&T on board, and then we can move over T-Mobile and Dish. they can do it, you know, simultaneously so they can maintain service throughout the time. So, okay. Really not a much of an impact on site plan. I know we need a special permit from the uh zoning board, but and we're not adding impervious surface or we're using existing roadways, etc. So, with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions. What's the special permit required from ZBA for? Yeah, the use.

The use. Okay. Okay. But it's already being used for this. No, it's a new It's considered a new application. It is a little perky. Yeah. And it's in the wireless overlay district. It's in the wireless overlay. I checked that last. Anybody have questions? I do a quick question. Sorry. Um just to confirm. So, what you're saying is that they it won't need aviation lighting because it's the new tower will be under 200 ft. That's correct. Okay. Um, are there any, you know, near-term or midterm or any other plans for any additional towers on the site once you've taken the tube down?

Uh, no. This would, I mean, this would provide, you know, capacity for someone else that would come along. If Verizon happened to come along, I mean, those are the four major providers. Uh, but if any other service entity came along, they could, you know, certainly use the monopol. But there's no other plans for any other towers on the site once the two are taken out. Correct. There are none. Thanks. Yep. This isn't going to be one of those terrible monopoles that are trying to look like a tree, right? It will not. It will not. Have you seen those? No. They're huge in New Hampshire. They're They look ridiculous. It's like We We try to talk people out of them, but Okay. A for effort.

Um I guess we'll open it up to public, right? Yeah. Um if if there's anything ready Donna Donna Jones North Street um the picture that I see now off to the left is a water tower town water tower and our mech communication and police station. Um how far is the base of the monopod from the water tower? Question then I have a second. I don't know if I want to have the specific answer, but I can give you at least 100 ft. At least 200. Oh, definitely. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Sorry, I'm running.

So, can you can you see the map? Can you see the map on the screen right now? So, I'm going to show you this. I have sight plan. This this this uh this distance here where I'm it's line B. Okay. That is 194 ft from the tower. Oh, yeah. So, if you're talking about And that's just to the property line. That's to the property line. Yeah. Yeah. So, I don't have the So, down at the bottom left, there's a circle which I assume is the water tower. This is the water tower. Oh, bottom left. Bottom left. Okay. And it's almost 200 ft to this line here to the property line.

Okay. I don't know where the police station is. Is that just south of It's off the to the bottom left. Let me see if I can get a I do have Google Earth thing. I wanted to verify that is very unlikely that if your monopol pole fell, it would fall under the water tower. Oh, without question. Well, the the pole is 180 ft and we're at least over 194t from the property line itself and we're required to be one times the height of the tower. So,

okay. And um we're about probably going to get new police radios and I just wanted to make sure the the tower didn't interfere with police, fire, uh dispatch communications. Yeah, it it will not. I expect the zoning board will either condition it that way. The FCC doesn't allow us to interfere and we work with public safety all the time. So it's that interference with public safety is not an issue. We will not interfere with them. Thank you. Thanks, Donna. Is there a hand? Uh I see Peter Diamond, your hands up. Go ahead.

Just for clarification, there's only going to be one monopole once you take down the two. Is that is that correct? That's correct. That's correct, Peter. Yep. What is the diameter of the monopole at the base as it rises up? Probably tapers. Yeah, it it does taper. Uh, Zach, are you are you on? And do you know the answer to that? I do. You may have to let u I just let me stop sharing and see what I got here.

I don't think you showed any pictures of what an actual monopole you might have at another site. No, he didn't. He He's looking up some stuff right now. I'm just looking to see if uh C can we let uh Zach Meoff from Kimley Horn into the meeting? He's on right now. It looks like he's muted. Yeah. Okay. Can you hear me? Hi, Z. Quick introduction. Hello.

Fantastic. Hi. Uh my name is Zach Medof. I'm a licensed professional engineer in Massachusetts. have close to 20 years of experience in uh telecom uh structural engineering. Um you're correct uh sir this will be a tapered monopole. Um the base of a 180t pole is going to be about 6 ft.

Thank you. And uh so it's a solid monopole. is I'm asking these questions because there's a solar field there and I'm just curious on the the shadowing effect. Um yes, it is a tubular pole. Um I also work in the the solar um industry as it happens. Um I can tell you those those um arrays will see uh zero impact from this structure and um in fact uh less overall um impact from what they are uh currently seeing from the um uh two existing towers.

Okay. Thank you. Welcome. Thanks Peter. Any other questions? Seeing none. Looks like a hand up. Who's Ed? Ed is up here. I think that is that's Yeah, that happened last meeting, too. Yes, Andrew. Uh, okay. Um, so what are we looking for out of this? We at this point, just close the hearing. Just close the hearing. Okay. Um, I'll accept a motion to close the public hearing for 100R Pond Street wireless communications facility site plan. So moved.

Second. Okay. Roll call vote. Uh, Dan Seager I. Melissa Mayo I. Gary Surl. I. Gary Sullivan votes I. It is unanimous. We'll have a decision at the next meeting. Okay. Great. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Um, okay. Town planner updates if there are any. Uh, yeah, there is. Are you sure? I forgot to uh Well, it's it's fine. Uh, Mr. Garopoulos, he left, so I was going to say why he was here. Um, thought he was here for pond for Well, he was, but he's also a co-owner of uh the golf station. I don't know. 242 242 Denim Street.

Yeah. If you remember a while back when 8 Sharon A, I think it was Hav was approved, I asked them if they would consider lowering the exit sign. Yes. For the drive-thru. Yeah. and they did. So, I just want to give them credit. They did it. I the pleasant good experience of not being uh my my side cut off. So, you get a chance to drive. You can see it actually. Uh I was there today and I didn't even notice it. But I bet you um I don't look when I exit. I just kind of go right out. So, next time I'll stop and

Okay. So, next time next time you'll be able to see. So the difference though is that you're a very tall man in a truck. So my car is the same height as yours, but I'm significantly shorter than you. So it it impacts me, probably not you. But I will check it out tomorrow. Yes. So now if you drive by even a regular auto, you know, not regular but an automobile, not SUV. Yeah. You'll have clear line of sight. Oh, that's great. Right. Great. So I thought that was good. Right. Share that. That was nice. Kind of a nice thing. Uh, and then I don't know if you really need to talk about tail meeting, but you have to flip a coin, I guess. But who's doing what are we both doing? Like

you did all the work. I think you had to actually do the presentation. Wait, I did all the work, so I have to also do the presentation. Uh, what did I do last time? MBTA, you talked too, though. Damn. We It's just really Melissa and I giving all these presentations. Gary, please someone Well, I know unless you want to pitch it to Dan, but you were kind of part of the authorship. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's fine. No, it's fine. We'll figure it out. Both either of us could do it or

we'll both be ready for it and then we'll Okay, we'll flip the coin. I'm sure people I I just every time I get up there, I just want to be like in my Troy Mccclure voice from the Simpsons like, "Hi, I'm Troy Mccclure. You might remember me from such things as B1 zoning in MTA overlay." Oh, wow. There you go. uh punches up a little bit nicely. We're always at the end. You should definitely do that.

All right. Excellent. Um as you know that you discussed that you're October 27th meeting. The moderator, town clerk, so forth knows that you're going to be um requesting a substitute motion to print to substitute motion or friendly friendly substitute motion. Motion. Okay. Okay. So, one of one of the planning board members will have to substitute what what? So, the current motion is to IP. So, we're going to do a substitute motion to vote it as written for both articles. That's what you sent. I think that's what you sent. Actually, we have an email to say. Yeah.

Okay. Just a reminder, you need to do that. That was it. So after the presentation well no be before we because the before the before the presentation's done the motion is going to be brought by advisory right and we're going to get up after that and we're going to make the substitute motion or does Jay usually do the presentations first and then the motion now I'm forgetting but I think it's the we'll have to speak to Jay but you probably have to do your motion first, but they know it's it's not they know. They know. Yeah. He'll we'll ask them before town meeting what the order is, but Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. This is a new one for us. For us. Yes. Uh no, we did this. Which one did we It didn't work in our favor at the end, but we did this a couple years ago. There was a There was an IP motion that we got up to Okay. Okay, I take your word for it, but that's maybe Yeah, maybe I'm thinking of some other group. I'm I'm involved at a lot of groups. You are. All right. So, substitute motion. Thank you for the reminder. Then, uh I don't have anything to report on SH even though it's there. Okay.

And uh that's a So, we just have to go through our meeting schedule. We're all good with Tuesday, right? Yeah. Second Tuesday every month. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I kind of built the rest of my schedule around it. So, me too. Was there something on here about the schedule? Yeah. It just said two 2025 meeting schedule typically second. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Gotcha. Our next one will be the 9th, which right then you'll I believe works for everybody. Mhm. So, we'll put that uh give you that date calendar. The 9th is also still the Medway Branch workshop.

Oh, yes. That's good. Geez, I I should have uh unanticipated business. Um and that starts before the meeting, right? So, that's 6 p.m. Yes. Here 124, room 124, town hall. And there will be a workshop

at the counts on aging. Oh boy. Have to look at my email to see what I said. Let me look. Did I put my put my email on the share? You might have to look. Hold on a second. and it's going to go out in the December newsletter. News from the branch meeting. Great. Sorry. The newsletter is called News from the Branch. I believe so. That's the title, right? That's pretty good. I like that. Yeah, it's catchy.

Yeah, it's catchy. Used to be the silver. Yeah, I like News from the branch. Yeah, me too. All right. So, let's see. And then on December 3rd, I'll be at the River's Edge Community Center to uh make a presentation. What time is that at? 10:00 a.m. I'm not even up yet. I'll try to make it. Okay. Um, you're at the senior center on December 3rd at 10:00. December 3rd is River's Edge.

River December 1st. Then I'm at Senior Center on December 1st at 10:00 a.m. Okay. December 1st. Wait a minute. Hold on. That's not true. He's lying. Okay. All right. Let me just check the Just Wait a second. Ah, it's the same day. December 9th at 11:00 am at the senior center. Yeah. I don't believe in Oh, no. Actually, you might get a newsletter. I mean, I do get the gazette. I used to get the gazette.

No, no. News from the branches. I mean, you do qualify. And I do know I just haven't seen that. U the newsletter. I'm going to get one special delivery. Oh, look at this. Special delivery. I I have not noticed the news from the branch, but you know, I have qualified to receive this and I have received for many years now. Disclosure age, but yes. Um, so anyway, December 9th. Okay. So, December 9th is the senior center. December 3rd is River's Edge. And for anybody wondering what we're talking about, that would be the multimodal path, right? shared use path along Medway Branch which is the former Medway Branch Rail Line which

right now consists of Medway Branch Roadway. Mhm. And the Medway branch shared use path will go when if it achieves its full completion from beginning to end, it will go from Town Center at the MBTA commuter rail station out to Dean Street and then and then a future and then part of that would be a then there could be Spurs off of it but a connection River's Edge and then goes to the Cham Woods. Yeah. All the way to get to Dean Street. Okay. Right. So,

also exciting because it's part of our master plan. So, we're, you know, it's a baby steps. It's a small little step, but we're connecting one point to another, and that's what we, you know, folks in town wanted in the absence of space to have sidewalks. Yes. So, it's uh good. and we'll we'll kind of talk about the the span of the how does the word get out? How do how do there are obviously five houses that you definitely want to show up, but aside from that, how does the word get out to come to these meetings? Huh? You know, oh, so I different locations. How how do people know to show up? There's advertising

in the news from the newsletter. We'll put it out on Facebook. Um I sent a letter, individual letter to each of the home property owners along Medway Branch. Okay. So, they received that in the mail. Good. Um, in fact, I got a phone call and email from a couple of them already. Good. Um, so, and then we could share it on the other pages, too. Just Yeah, we can put it out to uh you'll put Well, it'll be on the town of Norfolk one, but then if any of us community Yeah. the Norfolk community and Facebook page,

when you talk, you're talking about the whole project start to finish. or just the first phase or just the design portion of the car? It's really it will be the it'll include the whole project. Um probably be a little bit more focused on the what I call the first phase which is Barnstable Road to Tucker Road. Y um we have some visuals that we could show. Yeah, we had you had maps before showing it going through. Yeah, I'm going to map helpful the maps I have already. I need to do a little little sprucing up kind of I feel like I saw a visual at some point showing what it would look like with like that kind of like barrier like a crosssection.

Yeah, we have we have cross-section that we could have as a visual. Um but I want to supplement it a little bit more. It's a little bit Yeah. And when you talked about that, I thought you described it as a 10-ft wide path at one time that runs and and then um knowing that there's only one path that goes by the um uh transfer station and the the DPW, it's that raised trail when you go into the town woods. Yeah, when you go into towns. Yes, exactly. So, is that going to be done over in some way along the top? Yeah. The ultimate plan would be to have it so it be a accessible surface. You know,

it might even be widened because I'm not actually sure that that's 10 ft. There's a lot of encroachment. The typical the the typical is a 10 foot wide. Yeah. Sh path. So that's a little bit more that would certainly be more involved cuz it's a little tight. Yeah. design engineering wise, you know, the but yes, it would be um in terms of phases, we're looking at phase one is that I said Barnstable to Tunka Road cuz there's no sidewalk there now.

So the the objective is we applied for complete streets grant money to to build that first phase. So if we reward the money that gets built which is the 10 foot wide shared use path separated from the road and then we would ultimately I like to say will be phase two is look at going from the TPW transfer station outward. Um, and we might do Tucker Road to Boardman as part of that phase two, like two pieces of it as phase two. The the last phase because it would involve the MBTA would be going from Borman Street to the commuter rail station.

Nice. So, very nice. Yeah. You know, um, it's a good start. Yeah. Yeah. It's a good Yeah, it's a good start. So at minimum then if this gets approved um then at least you have sidewalk from Barnesville Road all the way down to Borman Street contiguous. So um and I think I'm excited to go to the senior center. I think it you know talk to them about this project walking groups you know the whole I mean just you know Yeah. When we were during the master plan process, I think you and I were at maybe it was River's Edge. It was River's Edge. Yeah.

And they were talking they really wanted to be able to walk more safely and, you know, sidewalks of course, which Right. So, I mean, this this does I mean, if we were able to accomplish this, then it gives them a connection to to the senior center on to town center and not have to and a pleasant walking experience at that. Right. That's nice, you know. Yeah. So that's pretty exciting. So we have that all teed up. It's not as good as a Montreal, but it's pretty good. That was who was it? That was a year or so ago. They were someone was going to do demos with the little Yeah, thing that went up in the air. Yeah, the Podway. Podway. Is that what it was called?

Down Sh. Yeah, that was up there. Is it still up there for There was like a little Yeah, it's still up there. I don't know if it's taken off. There's no wait for the first buyer. Yeah, that was that was for it. Yeah, second Simpsons right. So, we got all that Dan, right? Got it. Loud and clear. You don't need any additional parking to support this, do we? Excellent. Well, no. I mean, I followed your suggestion. So, yeah, we can walk from the senior center to the the new coffee shop. That's delicious. That's where Dan and I had our meeting about the master plan. Yeah, it's really good coffee shop.

It's asking me where organic buzzies have been twice. I've gone, Betsy, you got to go. Weird hours. I ran They They do, but I I ran up. They closed at 3:00. I ran up there right before they closed. I got a couple of Oh, I thought it was three. I think it's four. But I I got a couple of shots of espresso that were excellent. And I saved some. I made espresso martinis out of them. Really? And the people are so friendly. They're so They're very chipper. Very early in the morning. Is that is that something like that? What was it? It's a honey honey bean. Honey bean. Okay, it could be busy. Good. If we got there before it closed. Yeah, sounds pretty exciting. I think it's exciting. Coffee is exciting obviously, but

coffee is always exciting, but pathing is also the p this Yeah. Um, not to get nostalgic, but this was Thursday marks my eighth year here. Wow. and this this project or the the notion of making this into a shared use path was one of the first wow things I was trying to move forward which obviously here I am 8 years later and we're back at it but oh I feel like when so when it's done we should have like a ribbon cutting and you can like or you can just run through it. Yeah, that would be nice. I like the idea. So it's not a ribbon cutting. It's a marathon engine. Marathon here. It's easy to get through.

I'll just be excited to Yeah, it'll be. So, anyway, that's it for my update for this evening. Thank you, sir. Congrats on your eight years. Yeah, congrats on 8 years. Yes. Almost gold watch time. Not on my tax dollars. I don't know. She's just like I don't know what's better. Titanium. I don't know. Something. There is something for every year. Just like an anniversary. Yes. So, what is I will say how many years she's been here. You know, one Well, it might kind of age her or something, you know, okay, we're I will accept We already know that Gary gets one of these in the mail. If there's no other comments,

I probably could. For no other unanticipated new business, I am more than happy to accept a motion to adjourn this meeting. I have a second. Second. Okay. All uh right. Roll call vote. Dan Seager. Hi. Melissa Mayo. Hi. Carrie Surl. Hi. And Gary Sullivan votes I. This meeting is adjourned. Thank you everybody for joining and listening. Thank you Jim.