Board of Finance - Regular Meeting

Uhhuh. At 7:01. Yeah. Call to order at 701. Okay. No wasting time. Meeting. Meeting has begun. I would like to move up to the first two items on the agenda. The Sound View Commission and the Water Pollution Control Authority. Does anyone have any objections to moving those two items up? Hearing none. There's unanimous consent. And that's that's what we're doing. So, we'll start with the sound view commission and we have to find that under the sheets, right? I thought it was on first one. I'm lost.

It's on It's on page two at the very bottom, but it really is all on page three. Top of three. There's just one line and it's just the title on this one. Frank, you're online? Yes, I am. Okay, bear with me for a minute, Frank. I see it. No problem.

All right, so um it's really just the first few lines on page three with um a proposed budget this year of 45665 compared to last year's 43134. And I guess the principal increase is in the contracted services. Do you want to talk a little bit about that, Frank?

Last year we we did make some changes to the budget. Our original budget was a little higher requested. Uh and um we came back and um uh Martha had asked us to look at some of our services and see which ones we could defer. So we deferred some and took some money out of the contract to services um which is what we did and we just put it back in for this year. I think also one of the inurrences Frank is that you're having additional speed humps. So that's why your contractor for seed humps has increased. That's correct. Yeah. You can see Anita's Anita's note on the right explains where you get the $10,000.

Yeah. Because it's never been at $10,000 previously. No. Yeah. Like Martha said, we and also we we moved around some of the categories um based on what Anita wanted to do and Martha in terms making some things more consistent with the rest of the town budgets. So other items have gone down. That one went up the net increase of $2,500 and other items went down. Yep. Anyone have any questions for Frank or any comments for the board? Yes.

Um the portaotti service is that the fee for this year has just increased or is that because it seems to have gone we we budgeted higher last significantly higher last year than the year before but we didn't quite use that. I assume that's because we have some more coming. Well, we have June 30th, right? May to to June 1, but is that going to cover the remaining $8,000? It seems like a lot for two months.

Full month is about five or $6,000 and a half a month is is a is a little bit less than that. Does that include the drop off service, Frank, at the initial setup? That's all included in We budgeted for that for this year or last year, this current. But to to elaborate on on Anna's question, the the actuals for prior years have never exceeded 125 and the actual as of January 31st of this year is only 11,000. So, I guess the question is where did where did the 20,565 come from?

Because you're going to have another you're going to have about 6,000 more added for May and June before you you close out the year. So, that 11 will grow to about 18. Okay? And then 20 will get us through this rest of the summer and into the spring of the following year. I know you answered my question. And I didn't anticipate that people were going to be using the porta putty that much before July 1st. Well, we have to have them there as soon as the beach. We have to have them. We have to have them there. It's just there's a big jump from 2425 to 2526. Well, that's because we had a different person. Okay, that was my question. Our different contractor changed because somebody sold.

We're very pleased with this contractor. He's doing a great job. Okay. Yeah. Well, for 20 grand, he ought to. Well, he's there. He's there three, four days a week. He's there every weekend. Uh six o'clock Saturday morning, six o'clock, Sunday morning. He's there Monday morning, uh Wednesday morning. He's there a lot. And he's important to keep it clean, usable, and he's worked with us when there's been fireworks thrown into the portaotties and people have made a mess out of a portaotti. He's cleaned it and dealt with it and been nice to us. Still, I'll make a motion for the 45,65. All second.

Yes. Okay. Andy makes it Andis seconds. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. I. Any oppose say nay. Anyions? Yes. Y Thanks, Frank. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. So Frank, you can it's up to you, but there will be discussions in capital, but I didn't know if you wanted to stay on, but I can fight for you if you want. Where do you I can stay I can stay on for a while. When is that coming later on? It is. It's coming up after this all this. We got to get

Thank you. We got to get through water pollution control. Yeah. Okay. Next item up is WCA. So could I just say something before we start for WPCA? Yes.

We did not have a a a budget really presented to us from WPCA at first. So Anita and I initially put in last year's request. Then Andrea Lumbard came in in Jan at the end of January, beginning of February and changed some numbers with Anita. And then Mary Jay, who's online and is the new chair of the WPCA, reworked the numbers with Anita and I over the last few days. So this is and their committee members WPCA. Yeah. And Andrea. Andrea has resigned, but she's help was helping Mary. Mary Daylor's the new chair.

Okay. Did she have to lobby hard for that position? Not true.

What's the number? Uh Martha, the number I'm I'm looking at a bottom line of 91158 for this year from the board of selectment for this year. Yeah, it's the 113 two columns to the left the 91 board of selectment approved because that's what we had because we didn't have the the previous board chair had not provided us with a budget in December. So the new number is 113476 right it looks like that increase is in legal there is a increase in legal I'm not legal and water testing

so if I may this is Mary yeah go ahead and comment please

so the the water testing since we're sort of at a bypass right now with the sewer project was a recommendation that came from the board of selectmen that we go back and test again since our data is from 2007 and our environment has changed significantly since that time. So today I actually got a quote um from environmental consulting who did the testing prior in in the past for us and I thought it was very reasonable to open the five wells in Sound View. They estimated 2,350. And we'd like to do that three times at the end of March and June, August, and October. And that will give us before and after the majority of the people are in town. Um, we feel that that would be a good base for us so that we do know if we do have groundwater pollution or not.

So that's why the water testing was put in. Well, I mean, that certainly makes common sense. Is that the kind of testing that DEP was relying on so many years ago? That is the testing from the wells.

That's what they got. It's the same wells. Um there are five wells in Sound View versus 10 for some reason in Hawk Nest, but we have five wells and um Dennis believes they're all above ground, so there shouldn't be any added complexity in opening hopefully in opening them and drawing samples out and having them sent to the lab. Good. But but when DEP tested some years ago, they found there was contamination and we're hoping that's changed.

That's always been a big question, but yes. Um and I we believe that our environment has changed significantly. The wells that showed the most or significant pollution was um well I think number two which is in the town parking lot and the other is on Harford Avenue near the two buildings that have been torn down for years now. So and those one of those two buildings I think Frank knowies was actually cited for pollution and that building has been gone for quite some time. Mary, are you looking to have this testing done this spring or next spring? I'm hoping to get it done very soon. Well, then this is that's this current year's budget, not the budget we're working on.

Right. So, we'd have to look to see if we have the funds now. Well, actually, I heard Mary say she wants to test at several different points in time. What are the points in time that you would do the testing, Mary? Well, we were hoping to do it sometime late March before the influx of what you call the beach people. Um then in June, the toward the end of August and then again in October. We feel those looks to me like you've got two tests in this fiscal year and two tests in next fiscal year. True.

Which means we ought to we ought to reduce the 14,000 for next fiscal year to 7,000. and you want to make a request, special request for this fiscal year unless we have money in the budget. Anita, no, she also added another 4,000 was for the report at the end. The additional $4,000 was going to be 10,000 for the testing $4,000 for the report. So, we'd be reducing by 5,000. Got it on there. But hold up because you might have to do testing into the spring of next year. Yeah, you can't just say we're going to only do testing for one round. I mean, what I heard was March and May. So, I was thinking, you know, this year. Yes.

I mean, I don't have a problem with the money, the amount she's requesting for next year, but it sounds like she might need we don't want to wait till next year to get testing done. Um, so, so that's a separate issue that we have not had any instructions from deep at this point in time. So, maybe we could Wait, Mary, and then if you needed an appropriation of $5,000, you could come before the board of selectmen this year to get it done in the spring.

Whatever is best, I'm agreeable to. I do think as um the department of health had recommended that really testing should have been an ongoing basis like quarterly anyway. And so perhaps going forward this would be a continual line item. Doesn't Ledge Light do regular testing over there? Does testing of the sound but not necessarily groundwater.

Individuals do um testing of their their wells um and we are collecting that information as well. We also have test results from Connecticut Water on their wells which looks really good. So, we're trying to collect as much information as we can. Where are the Connecticut water wells? They're on the other They're north of north of 156.

And we have one test well I have their test results from Connecticut Water, but we also have a private well who's very close to the Connecticut uh water wells whose uh wells came out great. So, we're trying to get other um samples from other properties along North 156. So, as much data as we can. So, does this testing meet the deadlines that deep might be imposing? They haven't imposed anything on us, right? Anticipating. Well, I mean, it's great to collect this information. you just want it to be able to be used. And

and and Mary, is there any reason like you're doing you're saying late March, June, late August, and October. Is there any reason you're not testing the other half of the year? Like typically when you see environmental testing like this, you want each quarter of the year. I understand that you also want to watch and see what's going on, but sometimes that's hard to see because um impacts, environmental impacts don't move always that quickly through the water table. So, you might not see something in August. You might see that in December or November depending on a bunch of things. So, you know, deep might ask you to adjust that schedule as well.

That's where I was thinking. We're trying to get a baseline before the area is heavily populated and then during the peak season um to see what differences there are. But also I agree with you and I think that going forward this would probably should have been a line on a long time ago to do it at least quarterly. Right. So that would suggest that we leave the 14,000 in for the next fiscal year and in addition appropriate $5,000 for this fiscal year. If if what

Well, we're going to have more information. They even have they haven't even had a full WPCA meeting since they all got elected. I mean, it they did, but they didn't have a true total agenda. I just would like a little bit more guidance for them before they come back for an appropriation. I mean that can be done. We're meeting almost every week. Board of select guidance. I just think we need more guidance from what people are going to expect from us.

They've only spent $5,000 a bill for um consulting. So some financial fees of 50,000. So they're still under $35,000 for there. So the WPCA has money left in this year's budget if they need it. Okay. So then let's agree, Mary, that we'll vote to approve I think the 14,000 for next for the next fiscal year that begins July 1st and then the WBCA will talk with Martha and the board of selectmen about doing testing this fiscal year before July 1st.

That sounds great. Thank you. So, the other increase that's in here is legal counsel, which I guess isn't really a surprise, but it says adjusted by Andrea Lombard. Can you just explain how we got to that number? I have no idea. I can't explain that. Uh I think at one point she thought it was recommended by the board of selectman but no I I can't explain how if you see her what was provided it was the 2526 budget but not the actuals really. So

yeah it's difficult to explain. I mean, I I would suggest that the legal budget is really pretty uncertain at this point because we don't know what fights we're going to have, right? You're going to have fights with Deep? Are we going to have fights with the other beach associations? So, I mean, people, you know, we can agree on whatever you want, but it's the shot in the dark right now. I don't think it needs to be that fine. Well, let's move it. We can increase it next year as necessary. Well, the board of selectmen recommended originally the 45 leaving it flat from last year. Um, again, if they get in a legal battle, they're going to come back to us anyway.

So, just so you know, today we paid a bill for bond the bonding council. The bonding council had basically been working for free over the last two to three years with uh Steve and WPCA because they were thinking they were moving towards a referendum where we were going to bond additional funds. Normally that would have been rolled over into the bond, but because of the fact that we're not bonding at this point in time, we our referendum failed. Therefore, he sent a bill and he had told Steve it was well over 45,000 um months ago and it was it was 512

52. So Anita paid that today and they may be over but we had we wanted to pay him because he's done an excessive amount of work, right? But they will be still under the year. Well, how how about appropriating 50,000 for next year understanding it's arbitrary. Okay, whatever you want. And and that'll give us a little more cushion if we so we don't have to go to a town meeting. That make sense to folks?

Yeah. So, so 50 instead of the the 68, Mary, with the understanding that it's going to be what it's going to be and if you need more money, you just come back and talk about it. Thank you so much. Yeah, the new number would be 95476. How do you How do you get that? We're going minus 18 is 95476. Yes. Gotcha. I'll move. Oop. Sorry. 113. Well, it's 113 minus. We reduced the legal by $18,000. 95476.

Yep. I'll move 95476 for the WPCA. Second. Anna and Kim. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. Any oppose say nay. Any abstensions? That's approved. Thank you. Thank you, Mary. And thank you for for the job. I think it's probably not the easiest one in town. See you tomorrow, Mary. Okay. Thank you. Yep.

Okay. Okay. So, let's let's go um back up the agenda to capital outlay. Did you give us new sheets for that? Yes. Expenditure. Well, then there is a single sheet, but there is also a sheet. David had asked us to David had asked us to do some projections for future years out. So we did.

So that's the two sheets that are stapled behind it which has all of the additional information going out to the best of our knowledge as of this time. right? So it's substantially similar to the shape that we got in our books.

Yeah, there's just a couple things that um the sheets that were on your book. Um basically we added her management from 20 to four new and that's because they're applying for grants. Um so they kind of needed the 40 a total of 60 promise. They have 20 carryover and they have um that's they have 20 this year. They're going to carry that over and then they'll lose 40 next year. We'll give them the safety.

I can explain what happened on that one if anyone Which line is that? Is that 1511? Um that is that the permitting docks neck creek. Okay. The other change from what is in your book is um DMS4 storm water. We moved that into public works and not in supporting the public works budget and we took that out. So it was not reduced. So them are basically the two changes on the new sheet.

Um Martha I've got a couple of questions on the painting the exterior painting of town hall. Mhm. The note says one side per year per Eric. Question, should we go out to bid and do once every four years? So is the question whether we should paint the whole town hall every four years? Well, that was our discussion last year. We were doing one side per year. Okay. And and so it is the professional consensus that uh the building needs to be repainted every four years. I looked to David for for that question. I I I raised that point last year and I did ask a reputable painter in town about that was necessary.

Nothing was decided whether they just ended up we only ended up putting in half of what it cost to paint one side into the budget. So no one said a definite like we're going to do this every four years. No one said oh we're going to do it every year. No one but we started saving right saving for it. Right. So I think they're two different questions. That's the dollar amount on the one side and the timing on the other. I don't think Martha finished. I haven't I haven't said complete sense.

Um as far as the it right now the glare from the snow, you really can't tell what the building looks like because it's all white. So we haven't really looked to see what is the need for this year. I think Eric at this point in time put in two sides to do two sides for this year if need be. If not, we will reassess and but we still think that you need to put some money aside because eventually we will have to repaint the entire building. But we've got 8275 in the current year budget that we haven't spent any of. So does that mean if we do the 165, we'd have enough money for three sides of the building?

I believe we would. And then do we just wait for two years out and just maybe it's cheaper to have the painter come and do the whole thing at once. If there's not a side that I mean some sides of buildings get more sun and more wear and tear. Uh it may need painting or some care more often so we don't get rot. And in the last year we've done some tree trimming to keep things away from the building. We've also done some rellandscaping where we've kept things pulled things away from the building as well. So there's not that much as effect on the building as there was.

So ba based on these numbers, is the thought that the whole building uh would cost about uh $33,000 to paint? In other words, is it $8,000 per side? No, last year we shrunk it down to 8,000, which was only half. It's usually about 14 to 16 per side. Per side. Per side. Well, it's almost three tiers. If you're in the back, it's like going up three stories. Can we get a quote for without having it being done this year? Get a quote for the whole building in today's dollars. Granted, it might change. Uh and then get a quote for the back side of the building or two sides or find out from the painter and say, "Look,

what do you recommend? Is there an efficiency here to doing it all at once or it's a big enough building?" I can ask Eric to do that tomorrow. No, I'd be more than happy to. I think that'd help us in making a decision. So, is is the 8,000 carried over to this year that we didn't spend last year? We would ask for that. He'll request he'll request it. I'm sorry. He will request to have it carried over because that'll give us 20 25,000 assuming that we budget the 16. So, what do people think? I mean, I'm happy to to budget it and have the uh Eric and the and Martha make the prudent decision when to paint.

Yeah, I think that's fine. I agree.

So, um Sound View restroom facility 125 and that's obviously budgeted over a few years. Um, what's the 125 based on? I'm sorry, where are we? J Sound View restroom facility.

Uh, that Frank is online and you can talk to him. Um, we took it out last year because we were waiting to see what would happen with sewers. So he had asked for an appropriation last year, a line item last year and we took it out because we knew we weren't ready because of but basically what we're and Frank you can jump in but basically he's asking for an engineer to do some work and then possibly to give us some ideas of whether we're going to go to comp. I'm thinking we're thinking composting at this point, right Frank?

Yeah. So, we have this this current current fiscal year, we have $20,000 in for um restroom facility consulting. Uh so, we're looking at that as being the conceptual plan, you know, kind of getting the community involved. What are we going to look at? Community event uh community input, a couple of different plans. And then now after that gets resolved with from that consultant, we need to go into some type of engineering program. to prepare uh construction documents and go out to bid when when we're ready to do that. So, Frank, the number Go ahead.

That's what the 25 is for this current uh uh for the budget request. The 25 That's what this 25 is for. I don't I don't know where the 25 that you're talking about. We're talking right below. It's right underneath the next line item. Oh, the next line item. Okay. That's for the engineer. But up above it, it says 125,000 spread over three years. Is that because there's an estimate of 375,000? It's 125 each year we're funding it.

Yeah, it's just it's it's Yeah. But again, Martha, you want to respond to that because we talked about that the other day. Well, if you see what we've done is we've put in for 26 and 27 and 28. We've given you $30 and uh $350,000 spread out is what we're anticipating request, but we won't know. But we're just saying to you if you're going to put it's like saving for the fire engine, right?

You put 125 away this year. We'll have the engineer start to do some studies. We'll have more better numbers next year, but our Frank had some initial numbers about 350,000 to build a restroom facility down there. And they had some I found some beautiful plans that were drawn up at one point in time to improve the parking lot and put in this bathroom facility. And I found them and said to Frank, "Whatever happened to this? It's not there." So, we're talking about this um restroom facility in Sound View, but we were just moments ago talking about portaotties down there. We have to have portaotties, Candace. This wouldn't be done for three or four years.

I see. Okay. So, this is these are this is not anything existing right now. No, we don't have anything. Okay. Sorry, I didn't know. We have a fenced in area with six portaotties. One is a handicapped one. So, um, the restroom facility engineer, we you have $20,000 from this year that hasn't been spent and you are asking for another $25,000 for next year. Is that for a total of $45,000? It's not clear in the note.

We're anticipating that this 20,000 we're not quite sure how far we're going to get with that 20,000. Uh, we obviously want to make sure that there's a lot of community involvement in terms of the design and the concept. So that may chew up a good portion of that 20,000. Um and once that's done then we have to go to the next step is that okay once we've got the design you know concept squared away okay what what are the engineering obstacles we need to accomplish and how are we going to resolve them. Now, obviously, some of the some of those engineering obstacles can be put into a a design build uh proposal, but we still need a professional to help us put together the design bill proposal. And that would be for the 25,000 budget request for next year.

And Frank, I don't agree with the notes on this because I know that it's not correct, but it says the restroom were thinking 350 over three years. And then Anita put in notes $15,000 for footwash and $15,000 for soil survey data and engineer. And you and that is where I am. No, I I I didn't put that in for this year. That um I'm not sure where Right. So, it's just it So, there's no footwash into this project unless for some reason he engineers it to the side of the bath house. Okay.

Yeah. It would be integral to the bath house, you know, foot wash or outside shower. Okay.

Do you have quotes for these 20,000 and 25,000? No, we're just kind of kind of going off of what we've spent, you know, what we've talked about in the past and what we've used in the past. Um, we we really don't know the 25,000 for this year. We're not quite sure whether that's enough or if it's too much because we haven't got the conceptual plan done. We have to get the conceptual plan done first in order to get to the next step. So, that's what the 20,000 is for the conceptual. Now, we might be, you know, very fortunate and and run through the run through a couple of different options. Everybody's on board. We got a conceptual plan done for uh, you know, very little amount of money. We can then uh use some carryover funds um and start the engineering or we may not. We don't know. We're just trying to to work with what we can get and and put some fairly reasonable numbers down on a piece of paper for everybody to look at. Frank,

we get conceptual. We get the conceptual done and it looks like the engineering is going to be vastly more than 25,000, then we would have to come back and and for another appropriation or defer it to the following year. Frank, I would think that we could take the conceptual plans that we had from before, which gives version A and version B, and at least start there with an engineer to say this is what we had thought of years ago. Do you think either of these would work or is some is there something better now? Oh yeah, I would certain I would certainly think that we should drag those back out because we've already paid for those.

Most definitely. We you know we've got a lot of information already put together. So it's let's you know let's let's not reinvent the wheel. Let's figure out what we've done. Is it does it still work? Are there some modifications we have to do? And then let's take it from there. Let's we have a a good starting point. Okay. So, can I Okay. Can I ask a question because I didn't realize this was Well, never mind. I can see you.

So, couldn't we if if you're going to do a conceptual plan, I would assume this conceptual plan is going to have a gazebo in it. Is that correct? because it's going to be within. So why are we budgeting for a gazebo for next year when we won't even have the conceptual plan going? I didn't I didn't budget for a gazebo for next year. Okay. So you didn't need to move it to this year. I didn't I didn't put anything in for next year. I don't see anything in the next line. Okay. So we can take that So we can take the 18,000 out that you budgeted

last year. After we moved it, we moved it a year out because we knew you weren't ready for it. Now we're just going to take it out and when you get your conceptual plan, we'll have it. That's right. We'll just bundle it all together. That would be the wisest thing to do. So there's 18,000 we've saved on that one. See, Fred, I can do it. Get it down. It was

Okay. Yeah, but he didn't request it this year because he didn't need Um, I I am a huge fan of doing something down at Sound View. I'm just really concerned that these numbers are very, to use the word conceptual and they're not really based off of any particular quote or discussion with a professional to like give us a ballpark of yes, this is going to be around 20,000 and you should budget for that. Um, I I feel like we've gotten in a little bit of trouble with that scenario before with town projects. So, I I don't I know that not approving that would put you way behind, though. So, I'm not sure. How does everyone else feel about this sort of roundabout of thin air number?

Which which number? The 20,000 and the 25,000. Well, 20 is already approved. 20's in this year's budget, right? So, like another 25 just because it might be nice. So, Frank, uh the money we allocated for this current year, the 20,000 has anything been done? No, we haven't had a meeting. Okay. Since then. All right. And by the way, that 20,000 was your suggest the the board of finances suggestion. Okay. So, that's what that's why we use the 20,000 because that was your suggestion. So why couldn't we carry the 20,000 over for next year, right?

And wait till I I agree with Anna that conceptually I would like people who want to have capital projects to come forward with a drawing, some concrete um bid uh quotes or bids or something, you know, just to pull something out of thin air.

I did provide that to you last year. I provided a a a wide variety of conceptual drawings and some and some cost estimates that were hard hard cost estimates from several years ago. So that was all provided last year and we budgeted the 20,000 but the project hasn't gone anywhere. So if we budget another 20,000, it's hard to justify that when the project hasn't spent the original 20. But but let me let me get a clear understanding. The conceptual drawings are sort of the first step. That's what the architects do first and then the client says, "Yeah, I like those conceptual drawings." And the architect goes to the next step, right?

Have we the board of selectment of the board of finance approved the conceptual drawings yet? There aren't any. No, because there aren't any. I The conceptual drawings I happen to find by fluke in a file and Oh, I thought Frank said he presented them to us last year. Last year he had I did present those to you last year. Yeah. But they're not in this year's book. Okay.

So, we should have transferred over the material that he gave us last year and we were not we did not prepare that well for you because it was not understood that we were working from those same exact um conceptual drawings. So, we don't know. I'm more than will willing to also call just to end Jacobson up Nathan Jacobson tomorrow and say what do you think an engineering cost is like for a bath house for a beach society a beach little area what would you think using those conceptual drawings that you have

I can do something with the conceptual drawings that we have because I want you to understand that our board chairs are all volunteers to this town and they do the best they possibly can and sometimes they have their own things with their own work, their lives and they get delayed and so this year the 20,000 wasn't looked into. I know that Frank and Michaela worked very hard last year working with the consultant trying to get their uh survey of Sound View taken care of. Um, so one step at a time, they're doing their best, which is great. And I'm not saying that I just I just think we could move the 20,000 from last year into this year's budget and you'd be

I do think you're going to need more than 20,000. So maybe you put five in this year and then we'll have 25 total. Well, we can't move. Sorry, we're going to we have 20,000 that's unspent from the current fiscal year and we have a request of 25,000 for the next fiscal year. So I think a question is do we need 45,000 or is that more than we need and I just pulled up last year's file and it doesn't have a quote for what the conceptual

he didn't say a quote. He said he had conceptual drawings that I could email them out to everybody. Well, they're just saying, are they there? The drawings are there, the things that he provided. So, another suggestion would be we got the 20 there, you carry it over, you give our volunteer committee time to do more work, and come back and say, geez, it's going to cost us $35,000 to move the ball down the field. And we allocate what's necessary and we put nothing in the budget for next year. We've got 20 sitting there that hasn't been spent and we still don't know exactly what's going to happen in Sound View with the sewers. I agree.

Right. So, we're kind of in the same spot we were a year ago in that regard. Only go so fast. I mean, I think we're everybody said we're supportive of it, but you just putting another pile of money in there. Not that it's a big one. And I I would recommend the 125 that we eliminate that as well. That'd be my recommendation because I mean you we'd have to go to town meeting and this would Yeah, you're going to have to go to town meeting for this project anyways, frankly. It's not going to fly with us unless you don't want to build it for three years. Not to mention not to mention you could get a grant for this because it's recreational. It's recreational. It's shoreline. It's

however doesn't impact just the town of old. However it works. I mean, I I just find that sometimes the grants, depending on what they are, I mean, if it's federal that that that 350,000 can can balloon astronomically. Um, yeah, you know, I go have to go Davis Bacon, then, you know, the numbers are just out outrageous. Um, so, you know,

Frank, there's there are grants that come across my desk every single day. There's recreation and trails grants. There's all types of grants that are staterun and um appropriations from our senators for small things to big things. In fact, I just got it today that Murphy and Blumenthal's dates next week for me to sit in to see what they would like for congressional direct spending. So, there are things, but we have to have the plan in place for them to go forward to ask for it.

Well, I would say that plan solid. We'll finish conceptual plan and then and then take it from there. If if it looks like everything's we finish conceptual plan in six months and and we want to go directly into engineering, we'll come back to you.

Okay. I have $20,000 to start with. I think I have every other point to be made and that's that we're mixing our capital general fund budget at capital projects with capital projects funds and transfers out. And I'll give you a good example. the new vehicle at the animal shelter that we're apparently squirreling away money for on this schedule, but we're not going to need that money for five years. So, if it cost 60 grand right now for a vehicle, just escalate that at 4% or whatever, but put it in year five. And town hall is another painting is another good example of what maybe should be in the building improvement fund as opposed to in capital because capital in my mind is you're going to need it but you need it in that fiscal year. you you're not squirreling away cash um through because we had this issue forever with um rollovers uh and that's why we we expanded uh the amount of capital project funds that we had. So there's not so many of them, but there's enough that it makes sense to kind of um rationalize that. So uh when I think about that, um what we're talking about Frank with falls in that category as well. Um, and if we think that we're going to start construction, because what this shows me

is we're not going to start construction for a while. So, if we know that, then let's squirrel away money in the capital improvements fund. Um, and then we start spending in 2829 or at the end of 2728, but the cash is there and available. Um, so I I offer that as well. That's a little bit more work on on this uh spreadsheet. And then we'll we'll get to the actual um capital projects funds transfers as well, transfers out, but transfers in because I'm noticing that the roads once again is just a million bucks for the next five years. last year. That's where we discovered we were short by a big chunk of change. And I don't know what happened to those changes without reconciling um last year's figures with this year's figures. So, but that's

that was your suggestion last year was to put a million away a year. Well, I I don't know. I I'll I'll check and see, but a million bucks. I can't remember what the total was. We were last year we were putting away it was 800,000 and we sat and we did the math out that over the next five years we were going to need $5 million or something like that. And so we said, "Well, if we need $5 million over the next five years, we need to be putting a million dollars a year away." But I remember bigger numbers and again without reconciling it I'm not going to do it from memory right now but we had one big year in year like 2.6 million bucks.

Yeah. Four mile river road coming. Yeah. Y button ball's coming too. Yeah. Four mile river is one of the longest roads. Well town. So I mean Dave is raising the question whether the $1 million is the right number to be putting in every year. Right. and we have to, you know, go to edadante if if if we're not confident that that's the right number, it should be visited with us, right? Well, we we had for a long time the road schedule that was a perennial sword in people's side. So, we we know what that is. We know what it was last year because we had some confidence in it at that point. So, if it's been updated, that would be great to take a look at and see whether

Ed updated it this year because he found that there were some problems with some roads and so he moved some things around according to the needs of the roads. So, this year we were going out to bid. Our bid opening is I believe March 20th. It's a Thursday. Um I don't want to get ahead of ours.

I'm just saying I'm just letting you know that we'll know. Uh, no. It's got to be the n 12th or the 19th. 12th. I think it's the 12th or 19th. It's on a Thursday. We have the bid opening, but it's basically Flat Rock, Hatchets Hill, um, Hawthorne, those roads that are off of, uh, Hatchets Hill and, um, this second part of Browns Lane. Yeah. And an estimate an estimate out there that was there was $733,000. Okay.

Was that last year or this year or again the spreadsheet exists? So still33,

but that's not the do, right? That's why I sent you. That's what he gave me. Okay. So that's not helpful. It's not helping roads right now. The the issue Dave has raised the question whether $1,000 for roads every year is the right number. When you have got when we've gone out to bid and gotten new numbers, we should revisit that and hopefully before the budget is finalized, we can tinker with our budget last our ending of bid last year was 460,000 for all the roads we did. What happened for a single year? It's for the the the time period going forward. But to to Honor's request that we go back to Sound View and to to Dave, your question about the 125,000, right?

Um whether that should be an appropriation in the budget or whether we should put that into a fund, you know, a a sound view,

which is part of the budget as well. Senator, I understand that and that's a perfectly good question, but I thought people were saying before it's too uncertain at this point to allocate any money. They'd rather just wait until we have a project and if the project is $350,000, we put that in the budget in three years. I'm not saying that I agree that that's the right way to do it, but that's the question. In other words, should we begin to fund that future project even though we don't know its dimensions? We know it's going to be a few hundred,000 probably. So, should we start funding it or not? Yeah. I'm just dialing in because I know when Frank goes off, I'm not going to have a person

maybe you shouldn't fund it and know that you have the plans in place and well, and what are the pros and cons of funding it? Right. The pros and cons of funding something uh is that it it mitigates the the big hit to the um to the tax rate in one year. It spends it over a period of years. The bad news is people have to start paying it today. Well, I this conversation I mean we we morphed to talk about roads which are milliondoll projects and this is a $100,000 project. I don't think a hit of $100,000 to This budget is significant enough to warrant.

It's a $350,000 project, which if you've gotten any quotes on construction lately, may or may not be a good number, especially when it involves plumbing. I think our transfer station building cost us $250,000 five years ago. And that is a lot simpler. Yeah. I mean your your Bulma the the builder

inflation index is 6 to 8%. So you could look at 3% two and a half or whatever it is but that's not what the costs for construction are. So I mean I'm kind of agnostic on it and I think that our our capital expenditures in our budget this year is going to be significantly increased over last year. Martha, is that your sense? So, so you know, this isn't a perfect year to add to the budget. Yeah. Whether it goes into a fund or not. So, I'm I'm really kind of ambivalent. Yeah.

I also think just, you know, if the voters decide they don't want to do this project after looking at whatever the total cost is, and we've already allocated $125,000 for it somewhere, that might not be the best way to go about this. So, I would like to see the full project cost. I mean, we just took a gazebo out because that's going to go back in at some point. It would just be nice to see a whole project and then fund that appropriately. And I understand like breaking that fund up and if we had that cost in front of us right now, I think that would be great. We could totally do that and include it next year. But we don't. So, I don't like the idea of just, you know, making assumptions that things are going to be passed and that they're going to be certain costs when we really we we really aren't sure. May I say something? I'm sorry. That 350,000 just didn't get pulled out of the air. That was based on real numbers that I provided last year. So it wasn't it was based on some some factual information. Uh so that's I mean that's where that came from. It just wasn't, you know, something we think it would be about 350,000. It was based on information we had from previous years in terms of uh you know designs and structures and types of plumbing and things of that nature. And at that time the cost for uh composting toilets was about the same as as uh as u sewers. So it was a little different. The only difference was landscaping and and topography composting because you have to actually build up a bu hill so the thing sits on top of it. So that's that's the difference. But so that that 350 did come from real numbers.

Okay. Yeah. And I I mean I wouldn't be opposed to sort of a good faith investment in a capital improvement fund for investment in sound view um you know even if because we know at this point we intend to do something um and that it's going to be expensive um so let's see what Martha didn't um the other question I have and Frank I think you can answer this one is the speed humps cost. So, we have $15,000 budgeted this year and then in your regular budget, you have um money to install them and remove them and whatnot,

but they have that 15,000 hasn't been spent yet. Are you anticipating purchasing those between now and the end of the fiscal year? They'll be they'll be there for I didn't want to in the fall and have them sitting in the parking lot for that long, so we just figured we'd order them in the spring. Okay. All right. Great. So Martha, let's get back to the restroom. Has the board of selectment decided uh that it supports a $350,000 uh restroom in Sound View?

We voted on this budget to send it to you. As far as we're concerned there, we continue to spend 20 thou about 20,000 per year on bathrooms now and clean up from bathrooms. So you can spend that over the course of the number of years that we've done it. you've already paid for three bathrooms over the the course of all the time you've rented. What we're saying is yes, we see other towns that have put together composting toilets or whatever that worked very well and have lasted them for years. We would like to see a design concept and improve sound view.

Yeah. So, I think since the board of selectmen supports this, we don't know what the precise plans of the bathroom are going to be, but we do know it's going to be a few hundred,000, so we might as well start funding it now would be my view. Well, maybe we bifurcate it and we've got 45 for design in the capital budget this year and then for the um capital project funds we fund 125 this year, right? And then the remainder. So it comes off of No, I I agree with that. Yeah.

Yeah. But that's an accounting question, not but not not an appropriation question, right? Yeah. But it's it's equally important if we're going to complete the work. No, no, no. I'm saying we're we're still going to raise $125,000 from the taxpayers. We're just going to put it into the fund. Yeah. But we're not doing the full 350 is what I

Right. Yeah. and we can we don't have to fund the fund uh the same amount every year. And I'm I'm imagining that as the plans emerge and we become more confident that it's actually going to happen and we have a better idea of what it's actually going to cost, we can put in maybe a h 100,000 this year and 150 as and sort of award that project more money as they become more robust and increase our confidence that they're actually going to deliver something. We just don't want to go back to rollovers. That that was just a nightmare. I think so. So, you're saying to put the 25,000 in?

No, that we're saying the 125,000. I think we're going to approve it, but we want to put it into a special sound view fund. No, you put it into um capital. We don't they don't have a sound view fundwide building improvement fund. That's capital. That's for wide, right? Okay. And it that one has our age back right now and other stuff 18 the fund 18 that's public building that's more about repairs. Yeah. for it with fund. So that would be the the if you're going to put money in because

all righty do we have a list of these funds somewhere in front of us that I can and it's this big one right there. Oh yeah, got it. Ending right there. Yep. For now. Okay. Then to move on, we got to we got to move forward. What did we decide about the uh Sound View engineer? We have 20,000 from this year and were we going to strike the 25,000? Yes. For the next fiscal year?

Yeah. We're going to carry over the 20 from last year into this year so that they have that to spend on. So the changes that on the budget areing what both of you are saying differently. Say what? No, we're moving the 20,000 that they have from this year. Yeah. Into next year and we're moving the 25 that's in there. Okay. We're deleting the 25. So they still have a budget for next year, but it'll be a carryover. And the 125 we're moving over to the fund to the fund to fund number and the 18,000 for the gazebo we're that's gone completely that's incorporated that's that's going to be part of the the 350 eventually

Frank's going to build it by himself right Frank yeah before I die so I just want to make this yeah this is different than the white sands one which is the so shelter one okay what else can we take away I think that's probably enough but what number does that leave us live here at Nita. Well, do we have any others before you go numbers? Oh, I'm I'm just talking about the general government because we're Yeah, there's just a lot of stuff in here. Yeah, we can keep going.

I have a question way down below, Martha, about the body cameras for the police that we're funding over a period of years. What What's the law on that? Was there a deadline by which we had to have our police outfitted the uh body cameras? They are outfitted. I believe these are new ones that will the state police are going to this brand Axon Axon and and whether we are still able to stay with the state police for them to download it or

have to do it ourselves. This is the standard camera that everybody's going to. So you're saying we we the police have the cameras today and we're legally compliant that this would be an evolution from the existing camera as far as I know which I feel like is going to happen all the time now that we have to have some it's it is I'm trying where is where's what where we shifted to public safe now yeah we're down under the request you guys would go down the page instead of just jumping all over the place because it really doesn't make much sense. All right. So, well, do you want to stay in general government and just

I wanted to know if there's any more questions for general government and then I'll be more than happy to take other hits for all the other departments. I and maybe this is someplace else in here and I just haven't been able to find it. Um, Hannes Park, there was discussion about a playground at some point in time. It's here, but where is that in the budget? Did we pay for it already? Been paid for. And how did that get paid for?

We had already had this discussion one time it where it was not really appropriately bidded out because it had been quoted years ago and the person held the quote for us for like five years and then they purchased it. But how is it being paid for? Like my question is is that that was that was this year that that happened. On August 7th, the park and rec park uh commission voted to purchase to initiate this project not to exceed $75,000. And it's not clear where $75,000 is going to come from. Where is that in here?

It's already been paid for Candace. It's not where it came from. Anita, they've already paid for the playground. It was paid money is And is that just the equipment or did that include all of the installation fees?

And we said that town the that we could help with some of the mulch and things to lower the Well, I said that and then I talked to the installer and he said it's not going to save you any money. It'll be the same by the time you buy the mulch and you do what you have to do. He said it'll go faster if we just do it. Okay. So, what is left in Hannes Park to keep working? I feel like we keep hearing chunks of Hannes Park, but we never actually we have no line items for it. here.

It depends on 169,000 and that is um 26 that is on the monthly. Okay. in that but also they had a park there's approximately $50,000 sitting in our miscellaneous fund that was a fundraiser that is a loted to park and park alone but but is that for the playground it was a fundraiser they did all the money to do

Candace was on that committee it was for the park beautifification it was very loose ly defined unfortunately and it's for enhancement of Hannes Park. So

routine maintenance like I personally interpret enhancement as new improved things not just replacing existing broken down things. And if you look at the PowerPoint that the Hannes Park Enhancement Committee put together two years ago, over two years ago, they also agreed with that philosophy and did not think that the $53,000 donation fund would go towards the playet. But at this point, I'm not willing to die on that hill. I would just be interested to know where how $75,000 was spent in Hannes Park. And

I don't believe it was $75,000. It's not. It's sitting in that 169 Hes Park playground. Replacement was given 60,000. The expansion of the fence insulation was 20,000 and it's the full 80,000 is still in that fun 169,000. that's in they're not doing the fence. They're not doing the fence. The fence is they have to reallocate the money elsewhere, but right now it's airmarked 20,000 for the fence. So, the reason I think this project cost $75,000 is because there was a meeting on August 7th

where the the commission approved $75,000 for this project and they instructed Sarah Van Vleet to go and take the town credit card and spend it and you can hear that in the meeting in I'm just concerned that we're going to find a I don't think we paid for your credit Harrison have an additional 30,000 improvement plans. There's 30,000 given. So really and truly 60,000 to 30,000 and there's still the 20,000 for and this is just sitting at the is gone. But they have to tell me

they did in a meeting they said the fence is gone. I don't know. He need to do something to move that money back though. I don't know what I think that we should have a conversation with Mr. Dunn who is not in town right now. So I think that you are going you we need to get to your capital budget. Well, that's what I'm concerned with that there's that we're going to end up with something else in the capital budget that's like not here because this is this mysterious thing. What what's the status of the playground? I remember the order was placed for the materials, right? We've had and we mentioned this at a board of finance meeting. They placed the order,

but you think it hadn't it hasn't been delivered and installed? I haven't been to Not right now. There's 18 inches of snow out there. No, there's no playground out there. I have no idea what the status is. I don't know if they've done any site work. Um I've la asked for a plan to see how it is to integrate into the other um plans for the park. I've never seen a plan Now, we were here before when we saw a plan for the docks for, you know, $5,000 docks. You had plans, but not for $75,000.

No, I I my my recollection, which is fuzzy, is that the parks and rec commission did not follow proper procedure. No, they did not. with respect to the playground, but nevertheless, they had already placed the order and we didn't uh we perhaps couldn't and certainly didn't try to have that rescended. Right. That was my only question was like, do we need to add um a one-time fee to get this thing installed? I do not believe you do because I already had that conversation way back when.

Okay, Martha, I'm just asking a question, so it's a yes or no answer. I'd have to go back to the minutes, but I did come back to you and I went reviewed this in our minutes at one point because I did go and sit with Don. We had a conversation with the vendor and we went through it and I explained to the vendor what had happened and explained to him that I wasn't trying to cancel the order, but I needed to know what all of this entailed. And I got a breakdown and I came back to you at the next meeting and went through it with you at that point in time what had transpired. Who's you? Is it that board of finance? Yes. Okay. I don't recall that discussion at all. Oh, really?

I don't I don't remember that. You asked me to go and have a conversation with Don and we did. We sat in my office and talked to the vendor on the phone together. Don was right next to me. So, this conversation in your office, I was not present and none of us were present. Is that correct? I But I came back and reported that I did have the conversation and what the outcome was. I'll go back and look. I'm not concerned with that. I'm literally asking just for right now just to make sure we didn't need an extra, but it sounds like we don't. So, we're all set. That was the That was the question and that's the answer. Okay. So, let let's continue to look at this sheet and raise any questions.

The opaque emergency management group. Say what? Emergency Management Group. We had 130,000 bucks last year, 150 requested this year, 120 next year. The top of page two, and then it's all nonreimburseable. It's Oh, I was still I was back at Animal King on page one.

Apologies. Um cuz sort of to your same new point, we're not getting a new vehicle for animal control for $12,000. So is that something that should be going into a fund because we know we're going to need to replace a vehicle? Well, I think we're saving up over five years for a total of 60, right? So the same idea in avoiding carryovers. Should that be going into a fund as opposed to being in the current? As you can see, there's a whole subset of things that go into that fund. Right. I'm just raising that to fall into that category. Anita,

what do you think? We're funding a $60,000 automobile for the animal control center. Should that be a fund? Is there a fund that we should be putting that money into? The fund that we use. And as you can see is um the 12 12,05 is there for the fence and you see it coming out the negative. That's because right now anything for animal control, we can take it out of the dog fund. Right. So that's fund 11. So if there's money in the fund, we can use that money to pay for items for the animals. No, but not for the vehicle. You can do it to improve the building, right? building.

I don't think she keeps that title there.

So, it's either you do the carryovers or maybe Yeah. You put it in in five years just for the full amount, right? We can't um there isn't. We can't deposit into the dog fund. Like we can't No, you can't buy vehicles out of the dog. That's right. No, that's state. Okay. No, but we could create a new fund. We can create new funds. Town vehicle fund. Yeah. It just seems to me if we're saving up for something over a period of years, we need a fund to capture that to accumulate that money.

But and the other part is $50,000 or 60 in one year really is that much? Absolutely. So, it's either put it into a fund or not funded at all. know that we're going to have to buy a vehicle in 5 years. Right. I mean, put it in capital outlay. We now have the five-year spreadsheet. So, you know, in 3031, there should be a $60,000 item under animal control new vehicle. Okay. Instead of having $12,000 over the next gross, we were trying to work something more and maybe because it's 60, but we were trying to work more towards the way that we do with the fire department and the vehicles there.

Yeah, but their vehicles are multi- mill. They're million-dollar vehicles, not 60,000. Two in a five years. You never know. Could be. Dogs get picky. Okay. Thank you. Any questions on fire department capital

air packs went up a lot. Well, I think that 276 will be carried over or it's number of packs that have they age out. Yeah. Yeah. And it might be fewer packs have to be replaced and they have that's they've applied for a grant for that. So we might not have to spend all or any of it. We emergency management's here Dave too. If you look down there's $150,000 just below the um

that's looking you were looking at the back. Were you at the next page or on my the next page. Oh, it's 150 on the first page. This is the communications upgrade for more radios. Um, been doing this forever. Single page. Is this the final page we

this one? There you go. But are we are we on are you guys on a different page than this capital? No, that's

and that's just the capital outlay. That's the 300 capital. I think it's the same numbers as the one you were looking at. Yeah, it's just missing all those other columns, right? 736. So, this 150, the request, it says it's um replenishment of the $30,000 that we took away last year, but that was because it wasn't reimburseable. Right. This 150 is not reimburseable either. The 120 that's in his budget now, that's the bill that is that's

in the operating budget. This 150 originally he told me was reimburseable and I asked the may I say so they're going to give us 270 bucks. He said no. So this 150 would be town money not mil. So and I know he's explained this to us before. Is this now just a recurring annual cost? I mean, we've spent money on radios this on this upgrade over the last or is this the same idea where we're transferring or we're carrying over money to

No, this is him still buying radio packet that is for the emergency management. And this was because of the upgrade. This was the upgrade though, wasn't this? There was like a big communications change. We did Essex and then something different. Exactly. And then something else happened here. Had some ordering issues. They ordered and it didn't come in. There was a delay from the vendor. But we knew this was going to be like a four or five year commitment to doing this. So is this our final year of this? No, next year is 120 next year. So Oh, so we're not done.

So we've spent $600,000 on radios. Or is this more than just radio? It's repeater towers. Um yeah it was more it's more than that it and it's to get all our EMS fire police and public works on the same frequencies along with state police there were some dead zones right certain if you went into certain areas of between little hills the conversations coming back to me by the way I couldn't you couldn't get them and this proved very helpful during the last storm

yeah they were so this true capital that we're buying more equipment every year. It's not that we're accumulating the funds up for some big carried over that was because of the shortage. There's a shortage of equipment due to the supply chain. So is that the why he hasn't spent 130 this year and we're only at 4,800 any order there. It's very well that the order is in but because we have not received them we can't we can't pay for them. Okay. Okay. So I believe that is my understanding. The order is in we have not received

and it's all because of everything going on in the world. Mhm. I mean, perhaps at some point after this budget season, it'd be helpful for us to have because this is a major project that's been ongoing, is to get an update as to where we started, where we are now, and when do we get to the end, what's needed to be done. Yeah. I mean, this has been going on for 10 years, really.

Yeah. I mean it I think it honestly started after 911 when they you know when there were communication issues in New York because the services couldn't communicate with each other fire police in New York and it kind of rolled out to communities like this that you need to be able to set up so that your um town services re-uped it. Yeah. If you remember, right, Andy, are you saying you did it after 911 and then started again in 22 and 23? This is an up. I think we did something then and I think now you're right. When he did this initial presentation, it was because they were trying to get everybody now on the same systems, but there are these spots between Essex and Old Lines.

We were on the same systems. A lot of them were on the same systems, but then the radios went from analog to digital

and the dead spots come into play there because analog and digital behave differently with terrain. And um so that's what adds to the price tag when you have to put repeater antennas in different locations. They built one at public works. There's a tower there at public works that's partially to serve uh that we paid for that happened eight years ago, nine years ago, maybe maybe 10. I don't know. Long time ago. It's been a couple different iterations of this in the 20 something years I've been on the board of finance. But it is a real thing. The technologies changed. Y

and you got to stick with it. Um I'm amazed that there aren't grants out there for it. Maybe not now, but maybe a year or two ago there might have been. I don't know. But um I think it'd be we don't need it now. I think we got to allocate the money to keep the ball rolling. But I think it'd be helpful for us and maybe the board of selectmen. What have we done? What are we going to do in the next two years? Or what are we going to need in the next five years to get this done? And then we're probably going to have to do it over again because technology will change again. I don't know. Well, and if they have if there's shortages going on, if they know the the timeline of the shortages because if they're not going to be available to order, then we should postpone putting the money in the budget because they're not going to be able to spend it on anything. You may not cost up if you don't plan one day of placing orders for money he doesn't have budgeted

or anybody else. Okay, good. So again, last call for any questions on this page. Well, now we're on page three, right? I'm on page one on capital. Are you working? You're working on the single sheet. Capital expenditures. I'm on I'm on the doubles. You're on the doubles. I'm still on the single page. You're on the single page. Skype. I got a question down under police. Replace 1991 generator. I know. Per Where where are you now, Andy?

I'm under police. It's like the fourth line item up from the bottom says request. The generator says request. Yes, those are the cameras. No, the those I'm fine with. I'm fine with the cameras. I'm fine with the tasers. I'm fine with the the new computers because that is a real thing. Um the 1991 generator per who? Eric Goolson. Okay, that's Eric trying to let you know that the generator needs going to need to be replaced. Okay, it's 1991. And then below that, it says 1980.

That's propane needs to be pulled and replaced. Probably feeds the generator. Is he pulling the tank to replace the tank? I would think 1980 and $8,000 is what we think is going to cover that. Two years. Okay. Wait. Yes, it doesn't. Yes. Facilities request. Eric, it's probably in your book. It's under back. There's probably backup because Ann Eric gives you backup for everything. So, it should go to your back. I didn't look at that. So, they have it. Capital. You pull this one out.

No, I know. But I think it was five grand maybe. Anita, the the budget for 267 on this page is 736,695. Have you recalculated that? Yes.

Fire department um flame works through all this move cameras. the react. So,

okay. Sorry. He has a sheet for each department. Police department police department. He has a quote from Zealot for the generator for 20,000. And he has a quote for the gen. He has uh the generator for the underground propane tank is $8,000. A total of eight or is it 16? 6 20 28 20 20 20 for the generator and eight for the propane back. You have a whole sheet from Eric sticking to the sheets we got tonight.

I know. But this is Eric's backup data. So he's he goes he has it for every building what his capitals are. And he goes and gets his quotes from all of his people. It says right under it tank cost based on 2020 senior center. Oh, did I not change tank thousand gallon tank install? So, it's based it says that number is based on the 2020 number for the senior center. And was that senior center tank install a new installation or was that a replacement in 2020? Anybody know?

Because if it was a replace I'm I'm looking at his backup his backup for that building for this. No, those are above ground, aren't they? We're talking about It says it's a 1980 underground propane tank and that's got to get replaced. And he said in here the tank cost is based on the 2020 senior center thousandgalon tank install. Is the thousandgalon tank I'm assuming that's an underground tank if it's 1,000 gallons. Was that a replacement or was that a new install? Does anyone know? Well, I wasn't around in 2020, so I don't know because if it's a replacement, there's also going to be, which is what we found out up at

I'm more worried about that the 2020 isn't 2020. It was more like 2025 or 24 when we built the center and we missed a number because they did so much with as far as heating at the center when we renovated it. So, I'm not sure if the 2020 is incorrect. Well, I'm just worried that we're not including all of the environmental that you're going to need in there because if you're taking out a 1980 underground tank, you're going to need to do all of that soil and water testing. Is propane the same as Yeah, it's going to be treated exactly the same. Um, I don't want to guess the numbers, but you know, I'll put it on.

You can always add that in again. We can approve it tonight for what it is. It is. Just so you know. Thank you. I wouldn't have thought of that at all. Right. So, we're going to leave this number alone for tonight, but Mark was going to check with Eric and have him revisit it. So the new number for the general fun capital 5569 596695 556 695 and that replaces the 736. Yes.

695. Okay. And just to make sure you did what what my notes indicate, you took the 125,000 for the sound view and moved it. These two pages, you deleted the sound view engineer and the sound view gazebo replacement and you moved the animal control 12,000 into a fund. Correct. No, just 12,000. We moved out,000 in 3031. So we just deleted it entirely. So moved out in 30. Got it. So whatever. Yeah. 30 31. Whatever. The last year we had 12 grand. 5695. I'm sorry. 596

55 556 of 695. I'll make the motion for total capital expenditures of 5.56695. Okay. Second on a seconded. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. I.

All oppose say nay. Any abstensions? Not it. And now we want transfers out. Well, capital project funds. We may have some changes, right? Because of um sound view. Yeah. Right. So, um you can either look at the bottom part of the the long capital or you can look at your book.

What's the long? Um, currently we have the million dollars for roads,

but nothing updated for 3031. So that's where this right nothing was put out there because when we discussed this last year, we put out five years. So we didn't have this transfers out. I'm not sure where I mean it sounds like Ed has made changes to what the road plan is. So it would be good to look at what the plan for roads is. Um been a little busy the last two weeks. Oh I know.

So he hasn't come in to sit down and do a long conversation. just we changed that number last year based on what was upcoming in the next five years. So if that plan has changed, it will be good to re-evaluate those numbers. So what what page should we be looking at? Anita, it's um either way you can either use the one just are we just talking about transfers out now? Yeah, we're on transfers or the bottom of that long sheet I gave you. All the numbers are there as well. It's in both.

Okay. and transfers out for anybody who might be a new member means really a transfer from the general fund out of the general fund into a special fund. And the special funds are the ones that I give you the reports um I give you, right? And there are other funds that aren't listed here. So not all the funds are listed. Is that these are just ones that are getting transferred out? Okay. I give you the monthly how much money on

fund four the second fund is the one where we're talking about the money that took out of the capital outlay now and which which fund is that I know but they're not listed here as fund for. Yeah, it's on this one. This one is it's over here we got tonight. Second sheet. You got to go to page three about twothirds of the way down. Building improvements three. So they quoted the number.

Okay. So I'm just going to numbers that I know 140. We're adding the 125 for the white the view. Why are these important? Because this isn't capital. This is capital. This one is capital expenditures. I'm not I'm just looking at this. This is the transfers out and they're not in order. What is it goes in the computer? I mean, okay. But that was the way the numbers. Yeah, I know. Okay. So, the building improvement fund is going up by $25,000 and that includes 25,000.

So, that includes the sound view restroom, right? Yes. So, now the green. Okay. So, that's at 140. Is that we just said? Okay. I mean, I know Ed's not here, but I know when he was here, was that last week? Yes. He did say not really as part of the meeting. He did make comment that the roads are taking a beating this year. Yeah,

of course. You know, I think we can all see it. We haven't had it this cold for this long a period of time. We haven't had this many storms. So, we may want to look at again, he's not here. And but changing that million dollars for next year, um I don't know, to 1.2. And you know what? Oil prices are going up. So that means asphalt's going to cost more. Um, at least they're going up right now. So, we're not buying it right now. I I do think that's another thing we should we should revisit. We'll approve numbers tonight, but let's uh have Ed revisit the uh funding schedule for Well, you'll have a better idea of what we're going to be paying per

how can you get the linear fit in a few week two weeks time and we can readjust before you do your final calculations. um and see how they that price compares to last year's price. Right now that fund has $860,000 in it right now. So that's the price you get that you can work with for this coming year. Yes, it will the number

we we've gone out to bid. It'll we'll open them and then they'll do the roads. Uh well, these roads won't be at the shoreline so they can be done anytime after July 1st. So he'll have them them come in and he'll get them scheduled for the 26 27.

Martha, I I don't remember um and I may just have been asleep a discussion about the Hannes Park dredging. I remember discussions regarding the feasibility of it, but not that the board of selectman decided to appropriate money to do it. Well, this the dredging for Hannes Park, we did have a conversation about that with Park and Wreck when they came up and we were upstairs in the mezzanine room, but the swimming area is just basically silted in and you can wander out there for a long time before you can get really wet. Um, and so they've talked about this for years. I believe last year they put some money in and we took it out. Um, but the dredging project is probably going to although Mr. Dunn thinks we can get it done for much cheaper. We had two quotes last year. One was for like 30,000 and another was for 900,000.

400. So what did I see 400 somewhere? Yes, it's on here. So, Mr. Don thinks 400 is more reasonable

than the 900, but he does not have a quote from the dredging. He has to go through he's going to have to go through a hydrographic survey. He has to go through an environmental study to see how they will before Deep is going to give us a permit. He's going to have to go through a permitting process. And I have explained this all to him that you can't just clump it all together and get dredging taken care of for 400,000. He's got this is a process. It's not going to take one year and it is certainly not going to come in at $400,000. When the board of selectmen discussed this with the um park and recck commission on August 18th, I think you were pretty unanimous in asking them for some sort of site plan so that we could have an understanding of the scope of this project and I still have not seen a site plan.

This is for dredging of a water area. This isn't a site plan for the park. But wouldn't a site plan describe the area that needs to be dredged? Well, you have really and truly I believe that you would have to have an engineer come in and explain what area they're talking about to to do some work on it. So, I think an engineer has to start this maybe. So, because someone who understands the dynamics of a lake, they go at it more with we'd like this, we'd like this, we'd like this.

We agree. I think we're I think we're agreeing. Yeah, I I would before we I think any number we talk about without knowing the scope of this project, we don't have an engineer who tells us how deep, how wide, how far. Permitting I can't imagine what the permitting would be get something like this done. I would guess it's going to be between 45 and $50,000 from the other things that we've seen for permitting alone. Well, it is our own park, right? So, we're not asking for Long Island Sound. So because we do own the lake between the two towns, do we share this expense with line?

Well, not park and rack right at the moment, right? We just had a conversation with them about all this. Well, no, but the maintenance of Hannes Park and the beach. Has that historically been shared with them? Well, if you remember, right, they asked if they could get passes to go to Hannes Park and you said yes. I didn't. I said we'd have to have a discussion. But the truth is is that if they're going to pay for part of it, they should be able to attend there. Now, I don't see an overcrowded No, I don't want to get off the weed uh they do they do everything from Rogers Lake Authority. They split 5050

within the waterway like the high tide mark. This kind of falls under the high tide mark, but I think it sounds like a $400,000 ask is a little ahead of itself in that I think there should be money allocated for engineering and for permitting because nothing's that all can't happen in a year, I don't think. And then maybe we're we're looking at and quote this fund of putting I don't know if we put $75,000 in for next year and then then I would put it down $300,000 for the following year right

where based on the studies that may be a number for the work. It may not be is the $50,000 line above that intended to be the engineering for that. Yes. Is are those two numbers associated with they're associated with each other? They are. But it it sounds like Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Oh, no.

No. Um, the engineering cost for that. I think it comes for isn't is that the engineering cost that I think I'm a little confused, but I think that's supposed to be for the uh White Sands Beach bathroom because there'll be an engineering cost for that because the 50,000 is on Anita's note says 455 is comprised of 400,000. Well, that's on another piece of paper. 50,000 for engineering and 5,000 for the cross lane restrooms. It's this um Oh, I'm sorry.

This backup that he's got here says Hannes Park dredging 400 engineering 50. Okay. But I I mean I'm I'm sympathetic with with Andy's approach and maybe others feel the same way that we don't have enough information right now to begin to quantify well to authorize a project, let alone quantify it. So, we ought to go step by step and we ought to fund the engineering,

you know, the engineering and and the board of selectmen, I think, should be involved in making sure I'm I would be uncomfortable just saying to the the parks and rec department, you go do it and come back to us when you have a report because I don't know that they'll do it the way you would do it. Um, so it should just be, you know, go about it in a in a thoughtful way. Is there a juncture at which the town's people would be asked whether they're interested in spending half a million dollars? Well, that would be in the budget and they, you know, would raise questions for the general budget, but line items are submerged. So, they don't often the survey that they did. Do you know the survey was 189 people?

Do you know that the some of the other surveys in towns the things that we paid for have only been 300 people, but we've paid for it. So, I'm not saying that we are, but Candace and I think it does wholeheartedly have to go out to the public, but I think that there are people in this town who would like to have the lake back to swim in. I'm sure there are and Rogers Lake Association is doing so much to make sure that the health of the lake maintains itself so that we can enjoy it that it would certainly be nice to have a swim area. Uh for those people who prefer to have their kids swim in a lake versus the ocean

and I personally agree with that and Rogers Lake is a wonderful asset to the town of Lime and all line and the ability to swim in a freshwater lake is a great thing. Yes. But we have to find out is it practical and feasible and how much is it going to cost? So So the dredging like that last keep that open. I understand it was it was dredged it was dredged once before, but I haven't found the historical data of how much they pulled,

but I do believe it was stretched before. And um I'll continue to go through the files to see if I can find when it was the year exact year that it was. But a lot of what it is and just in some conversations you know they change the boating and sometimes when you do that you're changing the boats are all supposed to go I don't know is it counterclockwise or clockwise around a certain way and they do safety of boating and that's fine but because they do that the silting s tends to go in the same thing and then you silt in whereas if boats go different

anything to do with Haynes Park because boats don't go south of the first island there. Um Okay. Well, I'm not I guess my point is a consideration last for a while. How about jet skis? No, they can't get in there. I think they're goose. How about if we you know, leave the $50,000 in there for engineering. Move the $400,000 out to 2728. And obviously that's not approving that expenditure at this point. just keeping it as a thought is the 50,000, but at least shows, okay, we're listening to you. Here's the 50,000. Get the engineering work done to then find out what it's going to cost us. But

I would also note in here that um I don't know who just said goose down there, but if you're going to spend a half a million dollars or more, we really need to figure out the goose problem because people are not going to use this space. And if they're not using the space, then it is going to get silted in. If people are in there using the water and we've seen a total reduction of geese once you put the goose scrum scram scram down, but we also have a date with region 18 because their gooseenator is working well and we are doing

have you seen it? is a remote control scary looking thing and uh the facilities they bought it for region 18. They're going to come and do a demo for us. Goes on land and on water and um the Ron Turner says all he has to do is get out of his car and take it out of the trunk and they fly away. They they don't want anything to do with it. Right there. We need to buy a few of those. It's five. It's about It's about $4500 done and it's ours forever.

Well, that works on land and on watering concern. They don't like the colors. It's human operated. So, you have to pay an operator to to Yeah, exactly. Well, this guy built them and he's patented it five Somebody might have said, "Well, the geese do get acclimated to live." So it's it's a wonderful idea, but we need more research before we buy it. Train the lifeguard. I mean, they just sit there and watch nothing. So maybe at least they have

they're not even there is just going back to keep us on track. So, thank we talked about the 400 grand, but the 45 grand for the tech uh refresh every year um that was recommended by um CT comp. We're going out to bid, but the IT committee has to get together. So, that will most likely change, but we are working on them. Okay. So, where are you Dave? He's under it. just up a couple of the way down there. Okay. No, he's up above

it capital fund number 25,00 grand a year in perpetuity. We spent money last remember we allocated the end of last year we allocated money to buy a bunch of laptops. Yeah, it looks like that was spent. There are things that are aging out, but as Martha said, uh, the contract is going out to bid. So, that's another just question mark. I'm just thinking a process moving stuff along. So, I'm hoping that the IT committee will meet with Tom. Have you heard from him before since he sent you those new numbers?

He was looking to set up a meeting, but I haven't had time. Between snow and some travel. Yeah. Um, we need to about 40 documents that I haven't had time to read. But back to the parks and wreck line item that that now is 455. Andy has proposed that we take the 400 and take it out of the budget and just move it into capital expenses in two or three years leaving 55,000 50 for engineering and then 5,000 for the uh the restrooms according to Eric. I don't know what that's for, but assume it's a good number. What about something for a gooseinator?

That's not in this year's budget. This year's only

um rented from staying in that park and wreck one the top line item there. Townwoods park security upgrade. Oh zero. It is zero, but there's Why is the zero in 2425 red? Is there a reason for that? I don't know. I just wanted to make sure that wasn't called out for a reason for us. Okay. We're not going to have cameras there. Okay. So, that's my question. We're just done with all that. Okay. That's fine. I just wanted to make sure we weren't missing something. She was bored. So, she found sheet. So,

and what is happening at the Cross Lane playground? Anything good? A bathroom? A new a new bathroom or just like a renovate? You know, that's good because it could use a little refinish. Even some paint hasn't been since I was there. Next year or the 400 we're putting into next year, but not saying that we're going to do it. It's not approved. It's just there. No, I just put it. That's the difference between the the bold ones are the newer ones that got added. The ones that aren't in bold are the ones that we've carried over and people still need people.

Are we done on that page? Are we moving down through public works? Um I Yeah, I'm on in the capital and number 25 fund miscellaneous. I know we all love that miscellaneous fund. Um, that's 5,000. That 5,000 been there for cords, monitors, all the places, but he's not spending it. Yeah. And is that a budget item or is that a capital item? That money, right? But like currently

I mean are cords and plugs and stuff are those capital items or are those just like regular budgetary like you have a budget for junk in the um capital project right they last longer the approximately of the 183 58,000 is not marked for anything. It's just money that has been accumulated in the back. So that is interest. So we maybe don't need a $5,000 miscellaneous expense. Does anybody else should be a supply, right? Feel like that

doesn't seem like miscellaneous little stuff shouldn't be capital. You're trying to eliminate this unless you have to buy unless you have to buy a laptop in any given year which we didn't plan for like a new employee or somebody loses one or it's stolen or something. But I feel like we can allocate money for that, right? We don't need a mism. It's okay with me. Especially if there's 58,000 miscellaneous dollars already sitting there that we haven't used by you want to take it out for every year on moving forward. I mean, I don't particularly like miscellaneous. I don't like it either. And

if it had if it had like a if it had a name like it was for supplies or something that might make more sense, but I just feel like if he's not using it and then yeah, just take it. Does anybody else agree with that? I don't want it. If it's for miscellaneous supplies, those aren't capital expenses. So if it should be out of this budget. Yeah,

it's gone. bus. That seems like a oneoff seems like a capital item.

The bus the bus that is to pay to go to the parking lot, right? The other number as you can see the 57 going into the 57. And to let you be aware that there's some things that Eric um needs the money for that it's off to the side he used for bus bar for the fire alarm stuff that's out of the rental. So that's why I chose a number there and then I had to take it out the fun for all those students. Doesn't feel like capital to me, but maybe I'm wrong. So it said he says here that we could spread this over two years.

I'm trying to figure out I'm looking at both spreadsheets both trying to trying to reckon the bus barn one in in the transfers out piece of paper that was in our binder. He says that the 243,000 and change for inland paving could spread over two years. Put in one and you'd like to spread it over two. Is there a particular reason, Martha, that you'd like it in one versus two? Just get it done. I mean, that raises the question, could it be postponed by a year?

We're going to have an expensive budget this year. And if oil prices go up, continue to go up, you'll have an expensive budget next year. You can't predict that. I can't. But there will always be something that's going to come up. So we haven't even gotten again this is it's just a large expense. So I was like, you know, well, what you would do is instead you'd probably do it in maybe June, July, July. Yeah. So that here it would work.

Right. Right. And they can move the buses out and they empty the lot. And I don't think I think that bid was given when it hasn't gone out to bid. It would have to go out to bid. That was an estimate given I think when they were doing the firehouses. They the Lime Street firehouse. He kind of got a quote. But it's not a bid. So, so this has to go out for bid as well. So, it's probably not. So, could it happen this summer or is this already a planned expense for the end of the school year next year?

He got this quoted 12924. So, is when he got the quote is so this has been here. We moved it last year. So it was also there. I believe it was on shared and then we moved it and so it was but he said yeah if you want it out more

well I'm assuming it should be done and maybe can be postponed but I would recommend leaving it in the budget now and when we get the final budget numbers and see what the aggregate is and how much we have to go back and move or or cut. We can revisit it at that time. Any other questions on um the uh transfers out and with the changes that we've already discussed what would the new number be? The number would be 2,442.

Again, please. 2 4 4 5 0 2 442500. So, it came down less than 300,000 because we added some as well as taking something away. Yes. In other words, we took out the 400,000. But um we transferred stuff from move the 125 which is significant. Yeah. We ended up hardly moving the needle. Yeah. And it's essentially doubled in two years. You look back at 24 25 it was 1.3 million.

I mean I think a lot a big chunk of that is the roads. Yeah. And last year was only.7 year. Did we increase the road improvement fund in there to one point? I think we kept it at a million. We kept it at a million. At a million for now.

Can we get the line footage price for this year? So that could potentially go up. Yep. That was something that hadn't gone out right. We went out to bid last year and it came in lower than expected. Yeah. 300,000 must. Yeah. So it's hard to say what that mean. We had a lot of interest in the bid. Yeah. Lot of interest. People have been calling asking questions. So that means that I mean last year I think we had five six bid bidders. The demand for paving is going to go up probably this year after this winter.

Anita, what number is the fire apparatus and equipment fund? I just can't find that on There's a few of them cuz they separated out they gave me it's the um the fire and you found what she found the big sheet there. It's a 128 265 two of those together this year. Okay. So it's number 20. It's fun 20. Yeah. Okay. So, um, but there's nothing in it for this year. Well, it's not on this sheet.

It's not Oh, it's not in order. It's here. So, the forestry vehicle. Is that a vehicle? In 2025, we put in 128 and a half. And then 2020 and then for this fiscal year, we have another 128 and a half. But the fiveyear total is still 128 because it's from next year five years forward. It doesn't include Oh. Oh, it doesn't include, right? I remember. I think somebody said that before.

So, when we finally have enough to buy one of those vehicles, do they come off the list or just start from scratch again? Start again. Start again. Keep going. 2 million. Yeah. We actually were sitting at the Kerma Lunion and were offered to buy a brand new hook and ladder for 1.2 because one town ordered two by mistake. What? They ordered two. How can that happen? Oops. Director of facilities was sitting next to me saying, "Would you like one?" because we really could get rid of this. Finance director offered me goes, "I'll give it to you for 1.2." Well, they paint our name on it instead of theirs.

Oh, yeah. It's not even It's just It's on order. They just They've signed the contracts and Oh my goodness. Wow. So, any questions? Any more questions on the transfers? be determined. To be determined. I mean, it sounds like there's a few things that we have. Yeah.

Questions on. Um, you want to sit on it and I'll get you the answers to the questions for Eric for the police department and to make sure that the environmental testing is included and to talk about the uh painting for the building wholeer part and to get a little bit of an update from Dave on the radio project. I had edante to revisit the paving costs as well, but we can't do that for a few weeks. Do we get the vote? I think we should vote on it tonight and then we'll come back and change it if we want to. Doesn't sound like any of those are significant. Whatever. I'm fine with the paint outside the building. Looks good.

Anybody want to move the 24425? I'll move the 2442500 for um out. Is there a second? Second. Candace and Anna, if if you if you folks don't want to vote on it tonight, don't don't don't. But all in favor, say I. I. I. Any oppose? Say nay. Any abstensions? Okay. And you know, it's easy enough, but I'd just like to be able to check this off at least for the time being. No fine tuning. revenues.

No changes. So that's just in our book. Oh boy.

Okay. The single sheet. The other single sheet. It was not their option. Oh, this is interesting. So for on on the revenue sheet, you have an estimate for taxes of 44 million um up uh from this year for 40 million8. Um I assume that that's just an estimate and we shouldn't worry about that yet.

Yeah, that's an estimate right now. Um I already have the granless number so it's an estimate. That number is actually comes by what to balance the budget. So, it's right now at the time I printed this, that was the number to balance. Okay. I'm just looking at it and thinking that's going to be I can't do the the arithmetic, but it's a significant increase. 10%. It's not quite 10%, but yeah.

Wow. We got to charge more for parking.

It really shouldn't say parking fines. Well, that's that's only for the fines because they now separated out. Previously, they were not. That's why I had to put them both together. years and this fiscal year they started separating out on the spell how much is defined and how much is the parking lot that's why you'll see on the bottom parking lot just separate okay got it so they now are separating out say separated out again so you can see how much we are collecting separately

so let's take a look at building um the the estimate is is significantly below the actuals historically And the reason for that is current year and last year he had housing new housing developments and he doesn't see any on horizon. Well, but it's going back to 2223. The numbers are 441, 438, 420, 430,

and we're at 373 already as of 131. Just seems low to me. He I did speak to Mark and and Mark is saying that he this he's had people were doing stuff to their houses, people were building, people are doing we've had a couple of housing developments and he's saying he doesn't see anything. He sees a slowdown for the coming year. He says but again we can't predict. Well, that's what he's trying or see anything at the time. That was about two weeks ago. He's being conservative. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

I think we bumped that number up a couple years ago because it had been consistently over Yes. You can see over there we went from 300 to 325. Well, then we had gone from 170 to 300. Yeah. Then it went up to 300 and then 325. I mean, I'll go to 350. Um, have the fe have the fees changed? He changed his fees last year.

Not all but some. I can ask him and I know he was doing some homework on it earlier this year because he was had asked for some information. It would be nice to know like how many of these numbers included housing developments over the last four or five years. Um because you know the 363 and 2122 may have been due to a little bit of that COVID money that people got and then were these other ones increases because of housing developments. It would make sense to be like, "Yeah, we had three years of housing developments and now we don't have any more." So maybe 363 would be more in line, but 429 I can tell you for 2425 the actuals that was mostly Buttonball, the houses on Button Ball.

And you're going to see the there he does have those houses on Buttonball that are still to be developed on the corner of 156 and Buttonball. Those haven't all those fees haven't come in yet. And those are anticipated next year, not in the next couple months. Going to build every single house between July 1. I'm getting a fiveyear average of 409, but Mark knows what's approved. We don't. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Okay. Is it like a flat fee or do you get more for a bigger house than a small

square footage per square permits based on the square footage and per squareish be also deserve so what's the project is is that right it's on the square footage and not the estimated cost for build a new build and then it's all the but you pay fees on kitchens new roof driveway driveway permit is very long low, right? That could be, but that's not right. Zoning is also kind of like all over the place. And here it is. I just take about the same amount approximately the same amount of money and I just spread it over different numbers. What What is that? What is their revenue stream?

Their revenue, but it's so wonky. They do permit. I mean, special permits. Yeah. Special permit. zoning, zoning, inlands, wetlands. I mean, something really got screwed up in 2014. We budgeted 10,000 and they only came with $187, right? But it went into the other ones because planning, zoning, DVA, uh, land use, inlands, wetlands, or all the city department. So, it depends on how they it turned money in. So, you think that in the year 2425 there was a zone a coding problem? higher than inlands wetlands. The next year in lands wetlands does more. So

I don't know that year we were all down. We didn't make much money. Something didn't happen there. It's not going to move the needle. No, I mean it's not. Yeah. It's $44 million in unliquidated encumbrances. What are those? That is basically your car. Your carryover is the one who gave back. It's at the end of the year once we go carry over again and you get it back. Okay. So, we have to show it as a revenue management. Okay.

All right. So, I I increased building right now. I'll put it at 350. What about um I'm sorry, the parking passes at the beach. Parking passes at the beach. I went up to 60. Okay. Because of 74. Okay. And we haven't finished this. We haven't done this year. But that also included um the parking fines last year. Oh, so we took the parking fines out. We fines out and put fines above. Gotcha. Because they're showing it now.

Gotcha. And that was like 20 grand. So you're expecting me to So parking p that line for this year will be what we sell for parking passes and the fees that we take in from the parking lot $60,000. I'm just want to make sure it's parking because well it's the word it is parking passes in beach just throws me. No, I mean if it said parking passes and parking lot then I would know that those are the fees but beach doesn't is that what it is? It includes

saying you have parking lot on the next line. So I'm trying to determine how what's the parking lot? Oh these are um you used to call them beach passes. Beaches and then we change them to parking passes. Yeah. No, no, no. Parking lot. The next line down. What is parking lot? Must be our revenue from the sound view parking lot. But she's But I'm not bringing in $60,000 for beach passes. Parking passes for the beach. We sold Michelle. What did we sell last year? We sold 1700

1700 at $305 a piece. So I don't you know I I don't know how we got to 60,000. I mean and then the other thing is is for revenue and that's the other thing is the private parking lots. Where is that income stream for the p private parking permits that we do for the six or seven parking lots that we is that in one of these? I'm assuming it's somewhere in here like building zoning. Isn't it? We don't vote on the revenue anyway, do we? I think we have we have I don't think so. I don't I mean it kind of is

what it is what it is. But I think it sounds but but we vote on the on the budget and the mill rate and all that stuff, right? So we have to be comfortable with the revenue assumptions. It sounds like there's some areas here where Amita and Martha might have to revisit where things are categorized. I'm sorry, but this is the first I saw of this particular It's the first we've seen it too, but which is fine, but for us to sit here and pick it apart to me doesn't make any sense. Like it may be premature that we have this about the beach passes the 60,000 historically it's consistent, right? She moved stuff out of it.

These fines, that's why this is a new line that came out of there. Well, no, not the beach passes. These are the beach parking pass. He took that out of the parking lot. Well, that's Martha's question because it says parking passes beach, right? It's the one. It's the one underneath. I misspoke. Maybe just clarify. Just clarify for all of us and tell us what we're looking at. I put it over here. See, I find out of this line, not the one before. That was just based on average. I was misspoke. I looked at the wrong notes. That's okay. What are we looking at?

I said the wrong notes. That is where the fines are coming out. So, this is this is the check we get for the lot. This is the check we get for the lot. This was based on your beach. You can't use the word fines. Fines are what a police for ticketing things. That's why it's up here now because that's what they give them. They give them a fine. So, this is parking lot. This is the income we get for parking charges, right? the kios years ago was the kiosk. Okay. Now, but where does this $60,000 That's how they give us the money for the the people pay for the the the houses. That's the houses ones. That's the ones that you get the beach passes.

So, it's it's so it's parking passes and parking lot. It would be parking the private parking lot. Private parking. So it can't just say beach because that throws I think passes him to beach law. Let her redo the feet. You got to redo the sheep, Anita. So that it's it's too confusing. There's so much down there that's coming into this. Flip it over there. Yeah, I know. I know. But but on that line item, Anita, why is there only $12,600 so far this year?

For September, at least like August, September, July, August is most of the money comes before June. pass May, June the money and we pay for the beach parking. Yeah. You want a pass? You buy it. And and our private lots pay us in May, right? Michelle, my little private lot person May. And then July 15th is the second one. So that's why the 12,000 is probably sitting in there. The majority of that is probably that July 15 account 3.5% a couple of years ago. We just got to rename things so it's clear because you just can't we can't

I know I know but we're getting more in tune. We're getting more question who who's in like who is the the supervisor of this the crossing guard the school crossing guard the police department. Do they offer training? Um, and could you maybe find out if that's a possibility? Well, I would be more than happy to talk to Derek about it now that I don't know that she was ever truly trained on like which movements with your hands mean stop and go and it's very confusing. I just want you to know that I stood there. She's very nice person. I sat there one day and she let one car go.

Yep. And I was like, why can't the rest of us go? Because no one's turning in. Yep. But she had us all stopped. And then some guy went around me and went right through her.

And that happens. So it happens every day. And I I just think that if she's going to allow because right now she stops traffic in all directions and allows the buses to go on the wrong side of the road and pass everyone. And there are sometimes people who come from the other side into the bus into the wrong lane. So now the bus and the car have to do this and they have to put it's very confusing and I think it's very dangerous and I think it would be great if there was some training offered to her because I feel like she was hired as like a low-wage employee and it's a I will tell you this training she didn't think that she was going to be happy at Mil Creek. She's almost offered to quit and then she's but now she's very happy there. Oh, great.

And the high school seems to be doing fine. Yeah. Without totally fine. Seems to be running down at Lime Street seems to be okay in the morning. A whistle or something, too. Okay. So, why don't you I'll make a meeting and you you're going to come. You do. You're gonna come. It's pretty wild. Not the traffic creek at what time? Like 2:20. Yep. It's insane. It is. So, that was why it would just be nice if maybe she had a little bit of like how to move traffic. But, okay. Well, you know what? There's probably a T2 school for that and I can see if we can send her. That'd be great.

Oh, no more fem. Oh, goodness. for interest. I I guess the 3.5 objections out there are saying any place for business checking between three 3.9 um for next year for the fall. So I who contribute the $2,000 for the fireworks? Do we have an anonymous donor?

That's that um Dave takes in for he takes a check in from the firework people um and then he pays people out of that. Oh, they because they give him money because they we provide them with fire department monitors up at so they don't have to bring people down. That's what he's do they're doing. So they're taking their fees out.

I need to take a look at the pilot state property reimbursement that you brought down and you say per state report CCM estimate, but why uh why would the property reimbursements go down? I think that based on the state budget, they may be able to reduce the percentage that they re that they reimburse the town intergovernmental six006 property. That's what CCN gaping

but it doesn't I'm just thinking out loud and saying the state budget is great. So even if the statute permits the state to pay less than 100% of what they're supposed to, there's no reason why they should this year. That's just the information that we get from CCM. Yeah, it's you know it's 17 $18,000 is not material and it says the proposed change was $18,000. They came down 18,820513

and they get it from the government proposed budget. Change the formula maybe. So it it it sounds to me that the only number we might want to entertain increasing is the building permit number. What do you think?

I mean our professionals are giving us their best estimates. I don't how how do we as a board of finance know any better? Well, it's just that that this number is lower than it's ever been on this chart. But which one? Maybe that's the trend. I you know we have comfortable going. I think you know I would think we can let Martha question him again. But again, we're not voting on the revenues. We've got other items on the agenda tonight that are a couple anyway that need to be voted on. I think this is the first time we've all seen this. Maybe other questions will crop up. He said to talk to Mark,

we'll probably get an updated one when we get to the end. Yeah. Right. Okay. So, let's move on. Where do we find parks and red salaries?

204, right? No, that was Yeah, that was because it was just salary. We just didn't have salaries in those. That was the one before we salaries. I'll share with you just the number for the salary. So he's going to give you the number. Just giving you the number. Are you just giving it to us orally? Yes. What is it? Can you give us a second? Just wait. Hang on. What number is it? So we can write it. going to get a new

okay 80,6 the salaries come to 334 646 six for a total of 41536 for park and w50

3 415306 I got6 so the the approval of the salary portion again 334646 and that's the parking rep and then Towns Park is 8,516. Can you say that? Gatekeeper. Can you get do that again? Town Woods Park. What?

Town Woods Park. The gatekeeper is 8,516 8516. You have already approved 1569. The new total is 165206.

The the new total including the salaries that just for Townwoods Park because broken out here it's broken out on here as parks and wreck and then Townwoods and then other. Okay. So Townwoods will approve the 156 but now it's what instead? You have to well you can just if you want to just approve the salary one then they act together whatever however you would like to do just add the set just approve the two salaries she'll change the numbers and you'll have the other so so the the two numbers that are new tonight are the park and recck salary at 334646 and the town wood salary at 8516 correct do I have a motion to approve those

so move Second comment and Candice. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. Any oppose say nay. Any abstensions are approved.

And then we need a motion for the 8,516 for the gatekeeper. It was all in one. Yeah, that was included. The motion was and you voted.

Okay. What's next? Approval of minutes. Just to get discussion on the table, I'll make a motion to approve the minutes and then

second. We could Andy and Anna, if you folks go to page three, Michelle, go to page three and look down at transfer station. I'm the only one left. Everybody else left. You there? Yep. So, if you read the first sentence, this covers the daily operation of the transfer station.

That's the only comment I have. Everybody ready to comment or say you don't have any?

No. The motion been made and seconded. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. Any oppose say nay. Any extensions that uh the minutes are approved as amended there? Any other business? Yes. Yes. Yes, ma'am. Make a change. Um, we got the final number for Valley Shore and they are we approved 1834 is now being 179 939.

Where where is that in the book? It is 205. It's 205 safety. A decrease of what? first page about a third of the way down.

Just came in the other day. That's nice of them. They know it. the one

and then and I'm sorry and you don't you give me the number one more time. The new number is 179 939. Okay. So, we we approved the 183. Should we take another vote and approve the 179? Take 3,400 out of the budget. Yes. Yep. I'll I'll move 179 9339 for uh Valley Shore Public Safety. I'll second. Any discussion? All in favor say I.

I. Any nays say nay. Any oppose say nay. Any abstensions? So that was done. Any other other business?

I just have an update. The Grassy Hill Bridge project will go out for another year. We'll ask for an extension in uh we have two residents that have asked for that have been we haven't obtained their easements yet. So, we cannot go out for a bid on a state project without the easements in place. Uh, we are working with um an appraiser who does DOT projects to work on um one resident has requested some financial assistance with the easement. So, we're getting an appraisal on that. And also the other uh resident has not been in communications, but thanks to Mark Wayland yesterday, um the person has said they're coming in to talk to me. So hopefully that will move forward because we've made multiple attempts with certified letters which he has signed for but has been um basically not responding to phone calls. But I think that's going to change or we hope it does. Um the other item is that uh we had talked about having a town car here at town using one of the old police cars or um Mark Wayland. He doesn't feel that that car is suitable because of getting in and out. But Eric Olsen came to me and said he would like to use he would love to have a car here and not put the mileage on his truck. He's more than happy to use his truck when he has to go pick up something that needs a truck, but he would be more than happy to use the police car. So, he and Derek McGregor will um he'll get a tour of the car from Derek McGregor, and then we'll figure it out how we're going to uh utilize that car here at town hall starting in July. So, it'll get her off the lot. And then I think Anita too will have a car, Derek has a car that we can put up for sale as well.

So that's my big update. Thank you. Anything else? Motion to adjurnn. So moved. Andy seconds it. All right, we're adjourned.