Historic Preservation Commission - Regular Meeting

Hello, everyone. I'm calling to order the Historic Preservation Commission's regular meeting on Thursday, August 13, 2026, at 6 PM. Public participation is encouraged. The meetings are conducted in a hybrid model, providing both in-person attendance and virtual public comment. via the zoom via the zoom link below virtual attendance via zoom is the only way to remotely provide public comment free registration is not required for public comment via zoom instead zoom participants will utilize the hand raise function to indicate indicate their desire to speak on an item the meeting is also live streamed on youtube and on spectrum channel 10. um roll call please

Chair McHatton? Here. Vice Chair Sims? Here. Commissioner Neeson? Here. Commissioner Akins? Here. Commissioner Walker? Here. Commissioner Passaccia? Here. Commissioner Moore absent. All right. We stand for the Pledge of Allegiance.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty

Okay, do we have an approval of the agenda?

I move approval.

Okay, second? All second. Can we have a roll call? Do we need a roll call? All in favor? Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Aye. And now we are reminding everybody about public communications. This is the time set aside during the meeting for members of the public to address this legislative body on items of city business other than what is scheduled on the agenda. Matters raised at this time may be briefly discussed by members of this body and will generally be referred to staff or placed on a subsequent agenda. Under state law, other than for emergency items, no action can be taken. Do we have anybody in the audience or online that would like to speak with something that's not on our agenda? Yes. I pulled out a card. Do you? Is it? So is there an item that you are?

I have two items, one on an agenda and one not on it.

Okay. Yes. Maura's going to go get them.

Hello. My name is Jill Dolan. I'm a resident of Ojai. I am a historian. I am an actress. And I'm a community volunteer. And I want to say thank you to the people on this commission for the work you do and the time you put in. And on the other commissions as well, I was dismayed to read the opinion essay by the editor of the paper last week, kind of snarkily referring to both the Historic Preservation Commission and the Planning Commission. I don't know if she was just trying to get a rise out of people or what, but it was an opinion piece, not a factual piece. I want this panel to know that I appreciate you and I think a lot of people appreciate you and you're not just sort of dad flies off in the wilderness somewhere I was a member of this commission many years ago and I know that it's not easy I know you take it seriously and I thought the comments in the paper were inappropriate and so I just wanted to say

I like you all right thank you thank you so much okay anybody online no sure not more like that that was really nice can we have a museum report Brian

Okay we have a new exhibit that has just gone up that's being reframed as probably as we're sitting here by Wendy and Roger and their crew and that is the annual Ohio Studio Artist Show and there are a lot of paintings a lot of wonderful colors uh yeah so it will be opening soon uh probably in the next week and so i encourage everybody to to come out and and attend it again a very beautiful show all throughout the galleries so thank you for that

So now we go to the consent calendar we have our minutes from the meeting of July 9th do we have any changes anyone sees on anything Last month when we got to

talking and it and it's it's in the minutes july 9th 2026 page 204 under item number 10 on fast track process for historic landmarking for individual property owners interested in landmarking mills act when we got to that part uh i looked at our staff person and she looked at me and said well that's pretty much up to you guys did it run out of time okay okay and and so it says the report was received and filed and then I turned to the chair and I don't really think there was a report that eventually came forward on on on fast-tracking the process so

I'm sorry, which item are you talking about right now? The annual historic reports?

I didn't have a correction on the minutes, but now I do. Every page says two of four, which is why Brian says it's two of four, but it's not. So it's actually just, if you look at item 10, wherever item 10 is.

Yeah, that last line says the report was received and filed. And I don't think there was a report.

It really wasn't a report, no.

That's all I had. OK. Thank you. You're welcome. We'll omit that from the minutes.

OK. So besides that and the numbering, does anyone else have any changes? No? Anyone want to make a motion to approve the minutes?

I'll move to approve the minutes. I'll second that.

And Brian is seconding it. OK. Can we have a roll call? Neeson?

All right thank you now we're on to item two can we have the staff report

yes thank you chair uh for the record my name is Lucas Seibert community development director here for the city of Ojai the item you have before you tonight is a discussion item and really an opportunity to provide comments to the planning commission and what I have here is I'm going to set the table for the discussion I've also got Ginger Anderson who is online who is going to go through a presentation very similar to what she had put together So it gives you guys kind of the context of the project. That's that's moving forward in the process and then we can certainly have some dialogue and then looking forward to the comments from this body and uh just to give you some context to this this is a project at 107 north ventura street it is a project that first came forward as a concept review before the planning commission in 2024. during that concept review a member of this Commission, not acting as a member of the Historic Preservation Commission, provided some very noteworthy comments. Those comments were taken back and reviewed by the applicant at the time, as well as staff. And we determined that there was a need for a historic resources report to be put together. In 2025, that report was put together by ARG, which is a part of this packet for your comment, for your review and comment for tonight. And during that time, it was determined that that report would flow through staff or through the city versus through the applicant. The reason for that was instead of having it go through the applicant, not saying that we wouldn't trust them, but there was always, anytime that we have reports going through a developer, there's always the idea that there's a need for a peer review. To take that peer review out of it, having it reviewed instead and processed at staff level seemed like the appropriate mechanism here. Now you may be asking yourself, who's paying for that? It's still the applicant that pays for it. We took the information in, the fees that went along with that, and from that was born this report that is before you tonight for comment. The triggering mechanism for this body reviewing it, because it is not a landmark site, it is not within a historic district, a locally designated historic district. So because of that, the triggering mechanism is actually born within your code, your historic preservation code. And I believe it's subsection O. of your code so within that it gives authorization either through City Council or through the Planning Commission to to defer items such as this and you've seen items in the past not necessarily historic preservation or historic resources reports in the past but certainly this one is meriting some comments before this body for consideration before it goes back to the Planning Commission for their review and then the project as a whole is is required to be reviewed and then final determination made by City Council at a later date So with that, before I have Ginger speak, and I do believe that we have Evan on with ARG as well. I see her there. And I just want to give you the framework by which, because Ginger's going to talk about the project just as a whole. I kind of want to talk about the nuts and bolts of the project. So it requires a number of different applications. Because the use is being proposed to be changed and they're looking to change the zone, the whole project has to receive a final review. And the triggering mechanism for that is a zone change. A zone change cannot be done by this body, by planning commission. It requires city council authority through an ordinance. So that's the reason why that piece is going to city council. The project as a whole is being reviewed and considered. The whole project, including the HRR, goes to City Council for product determination. So that's why you're here, and we're certainly looking forward to your comments in regard to the HRR, and then hearing from Planning Commission based on what we hear from you tonight. So Planning Commission is scheduled for next week, and then a subsequent meeting before City Council, likely the second meeting or the first meeting in October.

Do we have any questions for staff Yes I have a question on this so So a few years ago the process took place historic resources report essentially was put together it's April 2nd 2025 and then it sounded like you said that the Planning Commission basically put it on hold and that's why we're not seeing it until now because the question I'm getting is why is this popping up now when the reports that are A couple years ago, I asked the applicant, and he said, I have no clue.

Yeah, so it was in a draft format from 2025 until recently. So here's the interesting thing about how this works. Because subsection O requires the Planning Commission or City Council to defer items back to this body for comment, the final version of that report wasn't ready until recently. Having a conversation with Evan and ARG got us to a final format where it was in a draft format for the better part of probably a year. The reason for that is because the overall project was in a draft format, meaning we had incomplete items that needed to be completed before we could take it to Planning Commission and then City Council eventually.

OK. Yeah. I just wanted to get that clarified because, again, comments are popping up that basically, to the degree, we're out there hunting for ways to impede something. And in fact, we're sitting here waiting to review something.

sure and just so you know the way in which the code is currently written it does require either the city council or the planning commission to defer those items because it's not a because this isn't a landmark site or within a locally designated district it doesn't have those same triggering mechanisms either minor work permitters a major work permit for review

I would like to differ on the point of Section O, which is about review proposed amendments, etc. So this paragraph is about other duties of the HPC that have to do with reviews of various projects that might come in. And it's divided into two parts. The first part has to do with landmark properties and proposed landmark properties. And then the second sentence is about all other projects that involve design review permits. And so the first sentence says, at the request of the Council or Planning Commission, review proposed zoning amendments, applications for permits, or applications for zoning variances that affect proposed or designated landmarks and historic districts. Okay, that's one thought. And then the second part of that is review and comment within 30 days for for the public record of any and all historic resources reports prepared for any other project required in design review permit, conditional use permit, and development agreement zoning code permit. and I was part of the committee as was Brian that went through the code and tried to clarify and come up with suggestions and what we discussed was the fact that a lot of times these historic resources reports are incomplete or they're not correct they need to be vetted and they not only need to be vetted factually but also in terms of the local culture and the local feelings about historic buildings and we are a commission that represents the public and so it was important we felt to get something in there that would allow the HPC to review and to comment on any historic resource report that comes in because As you know, the consultant is not the ultimate authority on whether a project has a significant impact on a building. That rests with the city. And that's including you and including the planning commission and the historic. But you can't just take, and I've read so much about this, you can't just take what a historic consultant does says in their report as the authority and this gives the opportunity not only for the historic preservation commission but also the general public to come because a lot of times we might not know all the facts and somebody in the audience steps up and says you know my grandmother lived there and here's Here's what she has to say. And so the legal, I think, definition is the fair argument test, which is that if a case can be made that a building could be historic, then it needs to go on for further study. And this really gives the public an opportunity to participate, which is really the whole purpose of of CEQA is not to have the decisions made in a back room or by a consultant, but to be made at a public forum. So I really hope that we can meet maybe with the attorney, the city attorney, and if that's not clear, which I think it is clear, maybe figure out a way that we can reword it so it is clear. Because I really think that it's important that we vet any historic resource report that comes in and that was the conclusion in 2019 when this was written.

That is, there's some overlap there. This is item seven that we're going to be talking about our ad hoc that we worked with city council to come up with exactly that. Not just what the words are, but what do they mean and are we all agreeing what they mean?

And I think that, go ahead.

I was going to say, if I could respond, I get where you're coming from and I heard that from the planning commission last week. Here's the thing, in the seven years plus that I've been here, this is the first time that I've heard of that specific section being taken in that context. So there's an intent and an understanding of what maybe Commissioner Akins as well as Commissioner Walker had worked towards in 2019. That's not the way in which I had been prepped on how we were evaluating that. Now, obviously there's different ways in which to interpret it and then to move forward on it. I know your understanding is pretty clear because you were the author of it, right? You're the one that both of you worked tirelessly to bring that forward to city council in 2019. was well aware of that effort it was it was a fairly robust effort obviously it happened after before I I was here so we were taking that over I was taking that over through our department so yeah I get where you're coming from I do think and this gets to some of the items that the city attorney had brought forward for City Council consideration one of those items is in fact the historic preservation law and and taking a look at that and providing some clarity on it. So I think those different pieces that we're teasing out here, the one you just mentioned right now that we're talking about tonight in terms of process and procedure, I agree needs to be teased out because I'm looking at it and in the seven years I've been here, aside from hearing from last Wednesday, I was pretty confident in the way in which I was interpreting it. So I'm hearing a different way in which to interpret it, which is,

It happens but I need I need a code that's clear Has there ever been a time when a HRR came before you that that wasn't put before the before the HPC or is this the first time So maybe it never came up before

Okay, so maybe it hasn't, I can't think of an example where it's come up distinctly. But I know I've vetted through that question before.

And I think one of the reasons it says 30 days is because we really recognize the need for these to come before us quickly, at the beginning of the process instead of as an afterthought. Because once it's gone for two years, like this project has, and then all of a sudden this pops up at the end. then it makes it almost seem hard to believe that this would become an issue so late. So it seems like the 30-day is a good deal because then we can do that work, we can clear it or suggest changes to mitigate or whatever, and then they can be on their way with their architect.

I was just a little dismayed in watching the Planning Commission that they didn't even want it to come here and neither did the woman from Bronstein they saw no need for it to come here and there was quite a bit of tension you know and finally okay if you can get it back real fast you can you what do they need to see it for so I just We want to be a friendly body and get in there, and we don't want to stop progress.

Sure.

But if we can't see it legally, you know what I'm saying, they really shouldn't be saying we have no right to see it. You get what I mean.

I see where you're coming from from there. I think you were hearing some of the opinions from the commission in terms of process and procedures. Right.

Right so I would like to add that whenever an HRR is contracted the HPC should be notified it is in letter O of our functions and powers like we just discussed and it's important function to assist in the preservation and integrity of the city of Ojai and its historic resources This HRR is dated April 2nd, 2025, and the application for conceptual review was August of 2024. So now this HRR is 17 months old and just coming to the HPC. So when historic reports come to us this late in the process, it often causes frustration, expense, and could be even litigation. Having the HPC be the first stop in the process allows the HPC to educate the city and applicant of any and all reasons of concerns we might have about the property as well as give the public a place to come and be heard. Comments back to the conceptual review phase become educational and efficient. so we have been working with the city and the council to make sure that that is a top priority and goal so I'd like to thank the planning commission for bringing this back to us tonight even though it's out of order but we are working on the process it's just going to be coming up in item 7 which has been a year and a half long ad hoc with city council to try and look at our functions and powers and say okay we're seeing this you're seeing that let's decide which one or some sort of middle and and then work from that so we're all speaking the same language it's not you know different uh versions of the same thing and i thank you all for giving us copies of the sequel book so we're all looking at the same book the same year everything is makes more sense when it's we're all looking at the same information and and that's what we just want to do is get in early we are we're not a deciding body we just just do comments and education but that makes more sense early on than late in the process

Well, from a SQL standpoint, you're the first commission that I've ever heard of that's asked for the books that we use on a regular basis. So it's kind of interesting. It's what? You're the first commission that's ever asked for the SQL books that we use. It's the same SQL book I've been using when I was working in cities in L.A., so.

I've noticed we have a very, I'm very proud of the seven of us and are willing to spend a lot of our personal time and effort reading these books, taking classes, getting educated as we can so we're not just talking from a place of opinion but a place of fact and law. And so thank you for getting us those books. Great. And yes, they're very dense. When you handed me the book, you said when you started, it was like this thin, and now it's like...

Yeah, these books never get thinner. I've noticed over the years they just keep getting thinner. Okay, so thank you. I think that's a part of setting the table, which is what I was hoping to do. Now I'd like to turn it over to Ginger, and I do believe Evan is on as well to answer any questions that the commission may have. Ginger, do you have a PowerPoint presentation that you wanted to go over? You're on mute. Ginger we can't hear you we can rip lip read we can't hear you yeah you're either muted or Sherry is she on mute not that I can see you've got her off mute I'm guessing Ginger's in the top left is that her correct I'm calling James hold on I think it's on Ginger's end because she's off mute over here at least it looks like

about now perfect ah there we go there we go okay we found one that works okay all right um hi everyone good evening i'm ginger anderson with brownstein i'm a land use planner not an attorney um i am sorry i couldn't be there this evening uh thank you for um having us tonight um the purpose of my presentation will be to go through the total of our project what we are and are not proposing to do um just to give kind of more context of where we are. So as Lucas did a great job, we came to Planning Commission in 2024. The applicant and our team spent some time getting a complete application put together. So we were working on providing additional details that Lucas had asked for to be able to understand and digest the whole of the project. and making certain revisions to that project. So there has been some time. And then kudos to Lucas that once we were deemed complete, the time to hearing at Planning Commission was actually pretty quickly. So I do appreciate that. So I'm going to I'm told I can share my screen. I hope it works. Can you see my screen? yes yes yes we can hear you i see it thank you great all right um so i apologize this i'm just recycling my uh presentation but this is the overall project description it's going to be a spa and wellness center that functions as a component of the hotel el roblar there is a desire of course to continue to serve the community as they have shown to be to be doing thus far with the hotel opening it's going to be used primarily by hotel guests during peak hours and times being the weekends and high seasons and then it will be available to local residences residents during off-peak hours and times and we were that's that's embedded in our project description and so there is this idea that potentially additional local um Availability and capacity would be available depending on. You know, they can see right at the hotel and all of that is really driven by parking. So that's kind of a conversation for planning commission. But in terms of the building itself, there's going to be interior modifications to create a fitness area, lobby treatment rooms and locker rooms. And back of house areas. The exterior improvements are rather limited. They're primarily focused to the southwest corner of the project site, and that's where we're going to remove some paving and impervious surfaces and replace that with spa-like landscaped area for respite lounging, hot and cold plunge. And additional wayfinding signage to safely deliver guests from the hotel to the spa. And then some limited amount of courtyard landscaping in front, which is meant to be more of an organic decision over time as to kind of how that looks. And I'll talk more about that in a minute. There is an existing residence on site with two parking spaces which will remain and the parking area is proposed to remain the same as it is now as well with eight parking spaces on site along the north edge of the project. So all of that is shown on our plans. where this is kind of the open courtyard area. This will all stay, all this parking stays, the house and this parking stays. And then this area back here is where we would be the most, the majority of the change would occur to create a nice planting area. So From there, what we heard from planning commission was more questions about circulation and waiting, finding courtyard fencing and things like that. And we feel we've done a good job to respond to those issues or questions. This is just more about the operations of the business. And then the courtyard landscaping and fencing at one time, this was proposed to be fenced off and then based on feedback that we got from Craig and from others was to kind of open this up so that we created more of a visual permeability from the public right-of-way into that courtyard. And so now what we've got is an idea to screen that somewhat but have a visually permeable barrier there with some gate and some planting. And the purpose of all of that is because there is a need to secure this area at night and in off-business hours. So there's a little bit of a need to close that off in a certain way for that kind of security issue, but trying to do that in a way that's respectful to the open courtyard. So that's kind of what we're seeing in this elevation. This is more about the circulation and wayfinding. If you've been to the hotel, I got to go recently. They're very accommodating and wonderful, and they are very helpful with wayfinding and signage and with direct guests out the front door and over to the spa using the existing signage. Pedestrian sidewalks, this is just some of that really nice signage that's around. And then this is the rezoned piece of it, which is the property is currently PL zoned, which is very limited in what's allowed. um and probably why it's been sort of underutilized over time and so then what uh the vmu zone does is opens up all a lot of different types of uses um we are proposing a cup to allow the use that we are proposing um and then this this column shows you what's allowed in both um zones so i don't know if you're interested in that the reason but um essentially it's uh I think going to create a site that is more sustainable in terms of use and contribution to the local community. So that's kind of my presentation. I know Evan's here and to talk more about the um historic report but i think what i want to highlight with that is just that the whether or not it is uh qualifies for landmark designation is not something that i'm going to argue um or or want to argue it is not in my purview and nor do i think anyone Really thinks that's a part of what we're talking about tonight. But I think that the takeaway is that there is no impact to the structure or the site, because as you see in our project description and plans, we're really not doing much to the site. The purpose is sort of to reuse the inside. uh pretty up the outside and essentially leave the rest kind of as it is today so just to show those elevations and kind of hit that point one more time the property the building itself has been modified over time these are elevations showing what it is now and then the proposed is quite minor it's painting some wood leaving some roof area. And then I'm noticing that this elevation did not get updated. But I would direct you to the elevation in my presentation as the updated set of plans that shows that visual openness here. So other than that one elevation, excuse me for clicking around so much other than that, that difference to this elevation, um, you can see there's really not much going on to the building. So, um, yeah, I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts and, um, I'm here to answer any questions if you have any for me, um, maybe there for Evan, I'm not sure. Um, but thank you. Do we, um, let's, let's open public comment first.

Do we have any public comment on, on this item?

How about online No Okay does anybody have questions for the applicant I want to close the public hearing or public comment period Sorry yes I'm closing public comment Commissioner Akins Just wanted to clarify one thing and I mentioned it to you when I talked earlier I think we're taking some type of action on this minor or not I did go on a tour yesterday and so I did I was taken around the grounds by Sean from across the street and shown the different areas it was and I've watched the changes over the years because I'm you know on the museum board But one of the things I do is I want to lay out, so you have the back corner that they're talking about doing something there. That back corner abuts the back of the museum, where the museum collections is. So there's no one there, no noise there. If there's any noise on this side or any disturbance at all, it's not going to affect the museum. The other people that are right in front of it, and there's quite a distance between them, is the mob shop. and so I really enjoyed the tour I did get to peek into the large building and was shown the the hopscotch courts that were still on the cement inside there and so if you can imagine you know opening this up to to families to individuals and instead of it just staying there dormant it was very impressive Thank you anyone else

speak I just think that the spa situation and all of it really goes well with what it used to be when it was World University it all sort of ties in with the you know the spirituality and all of that that I think will be brought in to this facility with the yoga and with the meditation and with the quietness a little different than when it was a police station or City Hall or what other things was it It was a lot.

Chamber of Commerce.

Yes.

Yeah. Are you done? Yeah. Commissioner Walker?

Well yes, I'd like to reiterate what's already been said. I really appreciate what they're doing with this building and I appreciate everything they've done to try to accommodate. I do have some comments that I've thought carefully about but I wanted to write them out because I wanted to make sure that they got to the Planning Commission as I intend them to. Tonight we are reviewing the historic resources report for 107 North Ventura Street, the former World University campus. The Planning Commission requested this review, but it is also part of this commission's responsibility under the Ojai Municipal Code to review and comment on any and all historic resources reports prepared for development projects other than landmarks. I think that responsibility is especially important here. About a year and a half ago, the El Roblar owners announced plans to repurpose the former World University campus as a health spa. Early plans contemplated substantial changes to the design of the building. As you may recall, they said they wanted to mimic the design of the El Roblar Hotel. More recently, the applicants have submitted plans that retain much of the historic mid-century design with some notable modifications. what we did not know during much of that discussion was that a historic resources report had already been prepared and submitted to the city fifteen months ago it is also written in city code that the planning department must notify the hpc when they discover a potentially historic property which was not done During this time, in fact, the property was repeatedly described as not historic. Yet when the report was finally released, its conclusion was essentially the opposite. The property is historically significant and eligible for designation as both the City of Ojai Landmark and for listing in the California Register of Historic Resources. this is an important finding and one that should have been part of the public review process much earlier historic resource reports are prepared by qualified consultants to help cities meet their responsibilities under They provide professional analysis and substantial evidence. However, they do not replace the judgment of the local agency. This distinction matters because consultants can make mistakes, research can be incomplete, and reasonable professionals can disagree about significance or impacts. local commissions also bring knowledge of ohio's history setting and community character that an outside consultant may not possess ohio has officially taken a protective approach toward historic resources The city's initial assessment study guidelines state that Ojai intends to maintain a low threshold for determining whether environmental review is warranted in order to provide the fullest possible protection to the environment. That philosophy is important. The question should not simply be whether after alterations enough historic integrity remains for the property to continue qualifying for the California register. A historic resource can remain eligible even after an inappropriate alteration. That does not make that alteration insignificant or unacceptable. And just think if the wall around the museum were eliminated, that wouldn't mean it wasn't eligible to be a landmark anymore, but it wouldn't be something we would approve because that really does provide the setting for the landmark. The central issue for the Planning Commission is the proposed barrier along the Ventura Street side of the property, originally shown as a seven-foot wooden fence and now redesigned as a planter with tall hedge. The Historic Resources Report itself identifies two important character-defining features, the campus' U-shaped plan facing Ventura Street and its central open courtyard. Yet the proposed barrier would visually close the open end of that U-shaped plan and substantially screen the very courtyard the report identifies as an important historic feature. That is difficult to reconcile. The relationship between the buildings, the courtyard, and Ventura Street is part of how this building has historically been experienced by the public. A six or seven foot visual barrier across the primary elevation would significantly change that relationship, and yet the report says that it wouldn't change it at all. This fact does not automatically mean the project cannot be approved as submitted. It means the impact should be clearly acknowledged, considered, and mitigated where reasonably possible. i appreciate the applicant's decision to replace the solid fence with landscaping and a planter that is an improvement but a tall hedge remains a visual barrier a lower treatment perhaps approximately three feet could provide separation and landscaping while preserving the visual relationship between the courtyard, the U-shaped campus, and Ventura Street. Ultimately, this design decision belongs to the Planning Commission, and we all are limited to a three-foot fence at the front of our houses to provide security. so that there is some kind of uh or forefoot so I don't think it's unreasonable to ask that a three foot that would allow visual connection with that what is really one of the central character defining features of the property There was also a larger procedural lesson here. The report existed for approximately 15 months without review by the Historic Preservation Commission and apparently without being brought to the Planning Commission's attention. During that period, the property historic status was inaccurately represented to the public record. And there were many debates at those planning commission meetings where people debated whether or not it was historic. And yet now we know that it's confirmed that it definitely is historic. Historic review is most useful when it occurs early. While designs can still be adjusted, not after major decisions have already been made. The report provides substantial evidence that the former World University property is historically significant and eligible for both local designation and California register. I believe we should accept that fundamental conclusion. But I also believe the Planning Commission should work with the applicant to preserve one of the property's most important character-defining relationships, the open courtyard and U-shaped campus as they face Ventura Street, the property's primary public elevation. This would protect an important part of Ojai's history while still allowing this property to enter a productive new chapter. Thank you.

Anyone else have anything they want to add?

I have something I want to add I do really like what I read about in the packet about the project and it seems like it'll be well done I mean in spite of some of our differences with the El Roblar when that was first presented to the HPC Some time ago, the owners of that property have certainly proven themselves. They have great taste, and I think that they'll bring that to this project. Also, in reading the historic report, because I had experience as a teenager both being called into the police station that was there at that time, But also, I was in a trial there in the large room at the west end of that campus there. I believe it was a satellite of Ventura Superior Court. And Judge Richard Love presided there. He lived like a block away. But there was a court there in the late 60s and early 70s at least, and that is completely missing from the history or the historic report. So I just wanted to add that for the record.

That's another reason that it's important that an HRR goes into record at an HPC meeting it has its proper place in history so when somebody in the future wants to go back in and look at this then it's in the right place they don't have to go well maybe it was at this meeting or maybe it was that meeting it's where it should have been when And then having historians and commissioners weigh in, it all is in the right place. So I appreciate that.

It also proves that it doesn't have to be a structure to be worthy of coming to the HPC. Because this on its own, I believe, as having been World University and Place in the New Age spirituality movement would have on its own is that yeah, yeah would have made it a Historic resource not just because it has a building associated with it. So we would have missed that So I think it's that was a great report I think except it's missing a

It really did play a big part in Ojai's history. I think everyone knows that the alternate New Age spirituality going all the way back to 1922 when Krishnamurti arrived has really been an identifying part of this community. We don't really have any elements of that within the city limits. They're mostly on the outskirts, like a Krotona or the Krishnamurti Foundation or Meditation Mount or Mayor Mount. These organizations and their buildings are not in the city, but here you have right in the heart of the city this wonderful university that really played a role not just in Ojai, but also in the state of taking these New Age spiritual practices and making them into academic subjects now it's pretty common to go to a university and take a class in yoga or take a class in holistic health or something like that but that wasn't the case back in the mid 70s so this was really a pioneering um effort by by uh mr and mrs uh reyes and they just did a wonderful job and Back in those days, I remember Sousa Francina was one of the instructors there of yoga. And it's kind of a testament, I think, to Ojai that she became a city council person. And it's really had an impact on the city to have had that organization here for all those years.

Would it qualify as a national in a few more years?

Well, yeah. It said in the report that it was really qualified to be on the national register. It's just that its period of significance overlaps the 50 years that the federal government picks as how far back you have to go. So in a few years, when it passes that 50-year mark, then it would be eligible for the national register.

So I agree with Lorraine as far as it's very fitting to what it was and what it's going to be. I do think that one of the things we want businesses to be is successful, and if we can help do that without thinking about the building. Like if you were changing the U shape, I think that we might push harder. But I'm really okay with the fence, because there was once a fence. And even the, I don't know how anybody else feels about it, because it could be moved, it could be taken out at a later date. And once you're inside there, you are experiencing that courtyard feeling. And I do want to understand that it's a spa, so you want to have that privacy. If somebody's walking from one treatment room to another in a robe, I think that that should be accounted for. You're not putting a wall there that's permanent. You're diffusing it so people walking by won't let there be privacy. So I don't really have a problem with that. I would like to say that the applicant bought this property I think in 2024 which means that they probably are paying higher property taxes than if they had bought it a long time ago and so if they wanted to come back to us and to Landmark and they wanted to talk about Mills Act that I think we would be really receptive of that.

anybody else if i could chair i do believe evan has her hand raised i know she want to respond to some of the pieces okay let's do that evan we can't hear you hi yes uh thank you good evening commissioners

My name is Evan St. Charles. I'm an associate principal with Architectural Resources Group, as you know, the preparer of the HRR. I just wanted to make a few clarifications in terms of our identification of character-defining features of the property, just maybe to provide a little bit of context. So when we did identify the central open courtyard as a character defining feature, that was primarily intended to be open as an open air, not necessarily that it was to remain open to the street. For instance, if you were adding square footage or completely infilling that courtyard, that would be considered obviously an impact to that character defining feature. but adding a landscape buffer or even a fence as mentioned by one of the commissioners it is a temporary or reversible change that would not impact the u-shaped floor plan of the building in any significant way or in any way it would not impact the floor plan of the building or its ability to convey its historic significance which As you know, in the HRR, we did not find the building eligible for its architectural merit. It's really based off of its association with World University. So those physical features are not as heavily weighed as the fact that this building was a spiritual place and its reasons for significance are tied to that association as opposed to its architecture and its built physical fabric.

Any comments? No. Does anybody else happen to want to weigh in on fences? Thank you, Evan. No? OK. Move on. I guess we're done. Are we done?

Wait, wait. Oh, I'm sorry. So sorry. This is Ginger again. I did, because the Planning Commission wanted comments and I heard a comment about not having any real, you know, care about whether there was a fence there or not and then another member who said they did want a fence i i want to i guess what i would love is um know planning commission won't know what to do with that we had a commission that one person said one thing and one person said another and there didn't really seem to be much other than you know that this was a good project which i i appreciate and i i'm not trying to stop you from that but could could we get some better uh direction on what's going on with the fence i mean i know the client is open to adjusting um what they have proposed now is is that landscape barrier is um and does have an interest in getting that closed off at night there has been issues with a homeless uh aspect to it and you know skateboarding um and things like that so can we get can we start just from one side and work our way can we start with commissioner neeson oh

Okay, I would say based on the fact that the significance of the property is largely derived from its association with spirituality and not with the actual architecture, I'm okay with the fence or plants as well. Commissioner Akins?

So when I met over there we met on the on the east side of the building right there where the opening is for the for the horseshoe shape area there are the very large pots there that have you know wonderful healthy plants that are growing there they fill that area they give you you know if you're walking you can you can walk into those but they're somewhat protective they're beautiful beautiful to see and I understand what the chair is saying about being able to you know run in your towel from one side to the other without the guy in that second balcony looking but I just think the way the end and I know I talked to Jeremy about this when we were setting up the tour I know that he had talked to Craig about that area I just think that it's so beautiful the way it's set up and it's not not a pushback it's kind of a involving type thing because it's not really a place where you're going to go and picnic or doing something something like that it's just a nice uh close uh comfortable location where you could sit and just you know meditate or in between appointments enjoy it so i would go no fence sorry what was that no fence no fence

So you're thinking plants with no fence?

Well the plants yes fence no

I'm torn. I think that you can do a nice planting area there if you allow the plants to be more than three or four feet. I don't have a problem with them being eight or nine feet. And I think in landscape, you can put some sort of a fencing in there that would essentially be hidden amongst the hedge that would make it secure. I would investigate that. I know it has to be secure, you can't leave it open or it'll be a real problem in this community. People will love going in there when it's closed. I don't think the police department wants to deal with that. So it needs to be secure, but I think that you can do it with plants. Not necessarily a fence. And if you put a fence there, then it needs to be an open fence. And so if you do an open fence, why put a fence at all? That's my opinion. Commissioner LaSasha?

Well, I'm not a designer per se, but having watched the operation across the street at the El Roblar, I mean, they've done some creative things with fencing and walls and so on over there. You know, maybe they could figure out what they could do with perhaps a combination of plants that don't act as a complete screen, but something that allows some character to that edge while allowing people to look in there And I certainly get having some kind of a fence there, but, for example, they have a wall near their swimming pool that has little square openings in it that allows you to kind of look in there, but you have to really crane to look, and that's an interesting creative solution to something. because it allows the passerby to look through at the pool, but at the same time providing privacy somehow. So maybe they could come up with something unique that way, because they do seem to think about things and come up with good answers.

Oh, there you go. It needs to breathe. Do you know what I mean by that? The space needs to breathe, because it is a space of spirituality and from the history. It needs to breathe. That sounds silly, maybe, but... It sounds very new-agey of you. Well, I've been here a lot of years.

Okay, I think that's everything. Does that suffice for you? Is that good? No voice again, I don't think.

Yeah. Oh, you did. No, I think that's, I think that's good. I think we're, if I could summarize that we're good with plants and some sort of fence because of the security, the majority I think is okay with plants and some kind of fence for security, but that it has to be an open breathable fence.

I just think that that's such a beautiful view in through there that the more visibility you can provide the better I think the museum has a wonderful fence around wall around it and it it serves the purpose of providing security in there so I think there's something they could do with that to allow the public to see the beautiful buildings and and yet provide the security Thank you

Are we done yes okay I'm gonna go on to the next item in here somewhere

The next item is item number three and this is regarding the annual 2026 historic preservation award and at the July 9th meeting the Commission discussed potential nominees and selected candidates to consider as recipients for the annual award and also a lifetime achievement award and if this was based on specific criteria And at that meeting, Commissioner Akins nominated Wendy Barker, Commissioner Besasha, Drew Mashburn, Commissioner Walker, Brady Hahn, Commissioner Walker, Jim and Robs, and Commissioner Walker, Brett Bradigan. so the biographies are in your packet for review and discussion and tonight you may select your nominees and request staff to draft a resolution for the for the Commission to adopt and then for the council to ratify direction and I thought I had erred, but I did not when it came to one of the nominees from last month's meeting. So with that, I'm going to open it to you to discuss your nominations and then make a determination, of course, based on the criteria that was provided in your packet at the last meeting.

Do you have any questions for staff? Do we have any public comment?

No Okay I'm closing public comment You know what I know you don't have public comment but I will say that we received several comments in favor of Yes Yes so four comments all regarding the same the same person

Having camped out at the museum there for a while you know we've had Wendy's been there I think 11 or 12 years we snatched her from Escondido where she had been sometime before that is the one that's primarily responsible in working with the exhibits committee for putting exhibits together worked with Brady Hahn on the exhibit that Brady did which was fabulous to me it was translated both into English and Spanish which is enjoyable I We have done oral history interviews on individuals going back 10 or 15 years and so what they had set up was a table down the middle of it and a name and so somebody could pick up It's like party lines for those of us that actually knew what a party line was. You could pick up the phone and you could actually listen to the conversation going. I could listen to myself talking to someone who had passed away 10 years ago. so a lot of good thought went into this and getting Wendy and Roger putting it all together made for just a fabulous example of as it says talking about the women of Ojai going all the way back to the very early days and so I'm very happy with the with the nomination of Brady Hahn and nomination of Wendy Barker having seen the work that they've done over this past year firsthand I have a just a question how long has Wendy been at the museum do you know 11 years I think

Do you think that it should be lifetime or annual because every year she has provided so many valuable resources for this commission or do you think that's like down the road She's too young to be Down the road, but it has been multiple years. Usually annual is like they did this Yes contribution during you know, so I don't I don't know I'm just asked I mean we could do annual this year and then down the I mean like Craig got an annual and then eventually a lifetime because you are older and the lifetime in your packet on page two of two in the top paragraph The last sentence is that the lifetime achievement award will be granted Only and it's underlined in extraordinary circumstances

I like that and I appreciate that and if you don't mind you know I'd be happy to pass that along but I think in Wendy's case this is something that she's currently doing I think she will continue to have fabulous examples again working with the community Ojai studio artists when I walked in and saw all of the paintings that were being put together it was just amazing and enjoyable I looked at the last exhibit she did which were world-renowned artists in many cases and in there and the people brought to the museum from from distances so you know It would be great for her to get the recognition now kind of maybe helps her along the way but I don't think we're done seeing good stuff from Wendy but thank you very much for that

And also, I would like to add that we meet every week for our historic sign project, and it's at the museum, and she always comes in and offers, as a museum professional who knows about putting on exhibits, she offers her input, but doesn't run the thing or anything, but she is very helpful in the process.

I think we should just approve them all I'm good with that you want to go through one by one or does anybody have any problem or think it's better that we just keep it down to a couple or I mean I'm fine with four and one it's up to everybody Are you open to a motion Yeah Okay I would move in conjunction with my fellow commissioner that we approve all five of those individuals Anybody want to second that

I'll second it.

Can we get a roll call?

Neeson?

Yes. Akins? Yes. Sims? Yes. McCatton? Yes. Walker? Yes. Visagia?

Yes.

All right. Item number four, which is the Ventura and Ojai Valley Railroad Heritage Trail. Yes, as I mentioned, we... Do you want to see if we have a staff report first?

Oh, sorry.

That's okay. You're pretty much just going to... I mean, you will just be jumping in in a second. All I was going to say was that at the last meeting... Wait, before you... Oh, go ahead.

I've got to make my leave. I've got to go pick up a kid from a sporting event, but I will continue listening online just so that you guys... Because I know you were talking about 7. I know you mentioned that you wanted me to listen in, so I will be listening in. All right.

Come back again.

No, she said come back at the end.

No, I said come back again. Oh, I'm sorry. Another time.

Sorry. Okay, so item number four is, yes, the Ventura and Ojai Valley Railroad Heritage Trail. And I was just going to open it up for you, Commissioner Walker, stating that on July 9th you brought in an example of a design for the Nordhofen Ojai train depot sign that was Absolutely beautiful and tonight you're gonna provide a further update so I'll hand it over to you Actually we have public comment we have Jill Dolan

It just turns out that I used to work for the city of Ventura and in 1999 I was given the task by the Public Works Commission or office whatever they were to plan the opening event of the lower portion of the Ventura River Trail and I thought you know maybe you'd like some ephemera from that event we had a we had a lovely very expensive they spent the money invitation we had a we had a like I attended kind of thing and a map of the whole thing and some other announcements what year do you say that was 1999 I was there that was just the lower portion so that connected to here and the image that is over the counter in Jim and Rob's of the train that we created that for the opening and it was on the on the site we got somebody to donate a bicycle that a kid that a kid an adult wanted and then they saw this poor little kid who only won 10 shoes and he swapped anyway I thought maybe you'd like this for your that'd be great thank you thank you so much all right wait do we have any public comment online no I'm gonna close public comment now Craig

Yes, so the project started with the county and I think it was 1982. They bought up the right-of-way and the upper portion from Foster Park to Ojai was finished in 1989 and then the lower part was finished in 1999, making it really a pioneering rails-to-trails project. It was one of the first of these and it's really been successful. Our committee to create the signs has been meeting regularly every week, even though during the summer we've had a lot of absences because of work and because of people going on vacations like myself, so it's sort of slowed us down a bit. I would like to report that we have access to the photographs and materials from the Ventura County Museum and they're co-sponsoring the project with the Ojai Museum and they wanted to see the example of the first one before they kind of agreed to the whole thing and I heard back from them and they said they were very happy with what they saw they thought it was beautiful they're completely on board so our plan is to work on the section from Ojai down to Foster Park and then we'll work with the people from Ventura to hopefully continue it down to the beach So with the long turnaround time from the company that makes the signs I'm not really sure if we'll be able to have the first four done by Ojai day we're trying but it might be it'll have to be later but we just have to work as fast as we can and we're at the mercy of a lot of different factors so But things are going along. We have the first sign completely done, which is the depot sign. And we're almost finished with two other signs, the Ojai Jail and the Metellaha Station down at Rotary Park. And then we're beginning the work on the Libby Park sign. So hopefully we'll get those four done, get them in. into the ground and let everybody see them and hopefully there'll be a lot of support for moving on with the other 23 or 24 of them. And also I continue to give talks at various places about the project. I just spoke yesterday or the day before to the Gables and the residents were real happy about the project and very supportive. That's it.

okay I'd like to add that I was lucky enough to have Rick and Craig both out of town last week and so I got to go and see the jail one and it was just very beautiful nice group of people working really hard to make these look lovely and yeah I mean I can't believe the quality of the images and they just just beautiful really really nice There was one thing I had asked there, and I'm just going to ask you, Maura. I want to make sure that if there's a list, like running with public works of getting actually into the ground, that we're on that list for those first four, that just to have it that they know about it, that they know it's coming down the pipeline.

So I know that you spoke with the public works director.

We did speak with Lindy and she knows about it Okay well I'll touch base with them and whenever there's some actual timing we'll coordinate Okay thank you Going on to item number five which is the historic resource inventory survey update do we have a staff report

yes again back to the last meeting commissioner walker reported that hrg was conducting research one place was at the ohio valley museum researching archives and the consultant is on track to deliver a preliminary draft of the contact statement and i'm going to hand this over again to commissioner walker

Do we have any public comment? Anything online? Nope. Okay. And I'm closing public comment.

Okay. Well, I spoke to Sian Winship, who was in charge of writing up the contact statement. And they're finishing that up. They sent me a preliminary draft, which they marked for internal use only. Don't let anybody else see it. So I didn't have it put into this document. uh packet but they said if anybody on the commission wants to review it and provide input that they're welcome to do that so if there's anybody on here that would like to take a look at it and provide comments though they need the comments by the end of the month hopefully And it's a huge file. I don't know if you have a Dropbox or something that we could put the file in so people could get it out of your Dropbox, because it's like 173 megabytes, and I can't send things email.

Okay, I'll work with staff on that, on how to send that.

But anyway, if you're interested in looking it over, they've really done a good job, and they've done an amazing job of taking the original work by San Buenaventura and incorporating it into the update, the new work that they're doing. But then plus they're adding a lot of other information. And this context statement kind of puts the whole history of Ojai, divides it up into themes, into sub-themes, And it's really important because then in the future when you're looking at a property to see if it's historic, you'll have some context in which to make those determinations. And they're very good. It's just amazing what they've been doing. Anyway, that phase of it, about 75% of the context statement is done and then as they go through and actually survey the buildings out there and the various properties, then they'll take what they learn from the survey and finish up the context statement because there'll be stuff they learn while they go through and actually look at the buildings. So the next step that will start in about a week or so is the actual field work survey and they'll be coming to Ohio I believe to start on August 24th and the first step is to do a reconnaissance survey where they go, it's just on Street View and they go on Street View and they look at each property and they make notes and compile a database of information And then once they get that then they'll go back for the second view which is they'll take that list and they'll research the buildings a little more to come up with the final determination. So they say that they're on track with the schedule and everything is working fine and they're looking forward to coming up to Ojai and actually getting in the field and looking at the buildings.

Can I have names of commissioners that would like to review this contact statement?

Yeah.

I would like to. I would like to. Sure.

Everyone. I guess everybody.

Fantastic. It's so us.

So we'll also send to Commissioner Moore, even though she's not here, to say that she wants it.

Okay, thank you. Thank you. And also, there was a meeting today that we had with Maura, Craig, myself, and HRG. And just wanting to let us know that basically everything that Commissioner Walker just said, but I just wanted to let you know that it did correspond with the first meeting that I've had with them since the beginning that we started. So it was very, very informative they're very smart people it's very exciting to see their enthusiasm toward it for this project and i think it's going to be very helpful they really do want to zone in on if you're one that you know it's you there's a real solid reason so it's going to be a the chunk of small chunk of home of properties that end up in that one um it'll be clear it'll be clear for the city clear for everybody and that's really good and then most everything else will fall in two and then i had asked that three which on our current survey means they couldn't see it from the street and they didn't can get enough information if we could use our our historians in town and the Commission to really try to whittle that three down so we can have as few properties in there as possible that between all of us in the community we can find out enough about that those properties to give them enough information to have them task it to one or two

And it's important to realize that the buildings that are identified are identified as potentially historic and not historic. So they're just lists of buildings that need to be studied further.

That's only studied further if they wanted to live.

if they want to alter it or demolish the building or if they want to apply for landmark status it doesn't mean that you can go by this survey to actually make a decision about whether it's historic but that it it has potential and it should be studied more than one of the most important things about it is that it a two is identified probably 90 of the properties in ohio will be a two those don't have to have any further study so when Lucas is looking at a property that's being that has an application for an alteration if it's a two then he doesn't even have to worry about it he doesn't have to notify us or or study it further so that'll be a big help I think And once again this is not um when we say it should be studied further we're not going to be the ones that study it further unless they are doing something actively because otherwise it'll just right well we've had surveys going back to 1985 there's city surveys of historic properties and probably nobody knows that they're probably most of the people don't know their properties even on the survey because it's not like you're called up and said you have to do something. It's only if you decide you want to demolish that building or if you decide that you want to make an alteration that then a check would say, well, we need to just study that further because it's a one.

Any other questions? Okay, let's move along.

We are now on item 6 which is the City Beautiful award discussion Right so item number 6 the last time the Commission spoke about this they were talking about when they decided to come up with a three-minute presentation to take to City Council and so that's something that's still on your plate there are some there is some information in the packet for you to review that was provided by Commissioner Akins and

I'm going to turn that over to you So what I did was I looked at what Commissioner Akins had provided and I was thinking that first time what our goal is to speak in Commissioner comments and ask council to then at another date to put it on their agenda. So I did write something up, but you can have Commissioner Eakins talk, but just asking them to consider it on a future agenda, because that's going to be our first step. And then once we, if they agree to it and it becomes thin, will be more of a presentation. Commissioner Eakins?

Yep that's actually the first time I've heard that so on this there were some adjustments made at the last meeting that was suggested by the chair and so I called those out and I went through those at the beginning of the last meeting and they're just incorporated in this document When this first started as in the March 12th article it was the three minute mark came up because the thought and misunderstanding was that we would be speaking as a part of the public and in talking with that and talking with the mayor it would be a commission report and so it would get more time than just the three minutes that scream through whenever I get up and do three minutes so so there is more time that's actually being allocated that other than that is just getting ready for a time slot to be to present this to the City Council get that information they'll have the information that's would show up in their paddock package and a lot of Q&A that's in here so people can understand different things one of the things the idea too is opening having the HPC be the focus group that things flow through but other entities like even even now we're talking about historic designation awards well somebody could have come up to either any of us and said hey I think you're missing the boat I really think this is a person that that deserves the historic award and we would go you know I think that person's right and then we would come in and we would nominate that same thing if somebody had a City Beautiful Award something that they thought of that maybe we would consider they could come to any of us and suggest that and then it would just be us being the focus point for getting that to the City Council I originally set this as going at the beginning of the year so that we're not overlapping on the historic award that we're doing now that was so if they were to approve this this wouldn't take place until the beginning of next year again you can see you can see the talk that was given by Edward Drummond Libby that Craig provided to me you can see two plaques that I did together what I did was I walked around the city and looked at the different plaques this plaque actually is the exact size it's I think seven by nine inches my good friend that does all of our plaques who I was asking if he could create the plaque for me got a little busy and my wife said, give it a shot, to which I said, yeah, that's not gonna happen, but I popped chat GPT and came up with the different things, tried to tie, what I tried to do is a City Beautiful Award and it's in the package listed themes on each of those. And also on each theme, there are individuals that are assisted to that, to provide us support. you know if someone makes a nomination maybe we don't know much about that there's an individual attached to that theme that could could give us some counsel and some guidance so you can see education there there's a whole list of what the many themes that we could choose again this is all in a draft form I have a question regarding the award is that it's the first initial cost of doing like his image of Libby

once they have that is it like a file that we don't have to pay for that first cost of that face or is it each that's a good question I don't know I can certainly ask him tomorrow

What else? That thought just went right through my head. So it was interesting in doing this. So the picture, this picture is a publicly available image. That was another thing that was key. The first, the younger image, I believe is one he gave the 1907 talk. And I looked at that and I went, that's not the Libby I really know and love. And so that's why I added the older person here. That's the one I tend to see more. So again, it's up to us what we want to do on those kinds of things. again lots of questions lots of thoughts but I think it is at a good point where we can take it to council and get some guidance some direction and some yeses and some noes

so i have another question so when you said this is the first you heard of it so i want to make sure i got it right what i thought is when we asked maura would we be going asking council to put it on their agenda or would be asking council and public comment or commissioner comments and she said probably the best way not to have it be such a long process would be doing it in commissioner comments first so that to me in my head was a the teaser version of it you know getting getting their interest in it where they wanted to debate it and discuss it and at a different time so getting the commissioner comment one is like a mini presentation and then a bigger presentation if they take it on is that what you think

my thought was that with seven minutes having lots of experience at three minutes that I and with them having the package ahead of time that I could highlight the the parts the pieces I introduced that to them so they could they could go back and then they could go forward on that I mean if they're they're very supportive of it and several people I've talked to including the people in the themes are very supportive of that Again, this is a City Beautiful Award. It's recognizing what has made our city the beautiful place that it is. And it's not just physical things. For example, education. If we have somebody in one of our schools that has a student that comes up with something that's just going to get people off of their cell phones and focusing on that, that sounds like something that's made the city beautiful. And we talked about how it could be a festival or an event Yeah there's a whole and it can be something that's historic like this this place is historic you know if you go I figure we all know who it is before I went to the city I would actually go talk to these people too so they wonder but yeah there's And so it's not just current stuff, and it's not just old stuff. It could be just what we want to recognize through all the different levels and all the different individuals. The other one I put forth, and I mentioned this before, was to Julie . Here's the question. If you were learning, you came to Ohio and you wanted to learn about the Chumash, where is the one and only place you would find that? that's at the Ojai Valley Museum and so what I suggested and talked through with her is the fact that she would give some information not layouts of villages but you know communities that existed in the valley and it was some kind of description and we could put that on a plaque and put it right there in Libby Park where the other thing is so when people come they can go oh yeah and find out from a different place for because it's a culture that's so important to our Valley but you can't find it anywhere and she really appreciated that idea Does anybody have any questions for Commissioner Akins

So are we ready to have him bring it to the next Commissioner comments at the council meeting that whenever you are ready to do that do it It was very very convenient that you captured both individuals that have some say into that time frame so let me know we'll be ready for you Thank you all We are on item number seven which is the functions and powers that we keep bringing up as our second item tonight when we were talking about what we do when and why so do we have a staff report

Yes, this sure is your evening, this evening, the commission, all the items except for number one. So this item, the Historic Preservation Commission Function and Powers, there's an attachment here in your packet. This was created by the ad hoc committee. And it reviews the function and powers of section 4-2 excuse me, 4-8.05 of the municipal code. And the draft of how the ad hoc committee is proposing to revise that is here for you to have reviewed and now to discuss.

Thank you. Do we have any public comments? No. No? Okay, that's my closed public comment. So I want to give a little back end of this. When we had our joint commission meeting with council the year before last, we asked to form a ad hoc with two members of council and two members of the commission to work through our functions and powers and see why we all were, at that time, feeling like we were really banging our head against a wall. We'd think we were going down the right road and then all of a sudden we'd be pulled back and we did understand why. So if we're all looking at the same functions and powers, but we're coming up with different versions of it, then we need to get in the same room and figure it out. And it wasn't really necessarily a rewrite or even rewriting any of it. It was more just we need to work on the interpretation and we need to have an understanding because we are... We're volunteers, yes, but we are city officials that are appointed by council, and we are here, we are tasked with the job, and we want to make sure that we are doing right by the city, by council, by the people who put us here, to make sure, and the residents of the city of Ojai, that we're doing our job right. And so the best way to do that would be to have this ad hoc. So we started meeting, at first it was with the mayor and Kim? Where are you, Kim? There you are. Sorry, I have these reading glasses. I have a choice. I know I can't see you. And Craig and myself. And we started meeting, and then at a council meeting, Mayor asked if anyone else would be interested that he would step down if someone else wanted to. and Leslie Rule said that she would like to do it and we did the bulk of the work with Leslie and then Leslie dropped out a couple months ago and we didn't want to add another person to it because it was already confusing with Brown Act so we wanted to make sure that we we brought Andy back in and then what we were really careful on doing is items that we talked with with one council member we didn't talk to with the other so we you know with it with the mayor so we made sure that we stayed we didn't cross any lines you know and then we also When the we got it done and it got to the document that you see before us it was All everybody making comments, you know, it was the mayor it was myself and Craig I asked Anybody else in the community that I talked to we also had Maura we had Lucas at a meeting we had one of our attorneys which Some some guy in a screen not sure who it was, but he weighed in as well and we went over it What's before here is? the best way that we could talk about what we believe our functions and powers are and when i spoke with the city manager on the other day the main thing that we keep saying tonight but we're going to repeat it is getting us in early if we're supposed to see something or weigh in on something because it's a potential historic resource then get us in early and um that's that's the overall arch of ada o is get us in there early i mean that's that's that if you want to just have one line um what's interesting about this is a is the longest because that it was we could not figure out a way to shrink it down so i actually read this backwards when i go i go from um the other direction just because it's mostly just everyone was in agreement and so it was like check everyone's in agreement and I did use because I didn't know what to say because I didn't want to write down the three council people on the same document because it made it look like a quorum without having to explain everything so I wrote the consensus understands and Commissioner Akins I asked him if he had any questions and he's like I That sounds so lawyer-y. What does that even mean? Who's the consensus? And so I explained to him why I said that, because it was for lack of a better word, but in case anybody's wondering, it meant that everyone that's on the ad hoc unanimously agreed whether it was what iteration of the um the ad hoc was working on that particular letter agreed that this is what we all agreed to be the definition of our function and power so that's why i said the consensus so it's kind of confusing but that's what if you can think of a better way to put it happy to do it so if um didn't everybody read it does anybody wow so does anybody want to have a discussion about any of them and where might you're seeing problems with the way things come to us that you think is still not clear when it's like does anybody have any anything that

Yeah, I would just like to say that it's been a great experience to be on this ad hoc and just to sit with you and the other and the council members to just talk about procedures and how we do our work and what the needs of the community are and the needs of the city. That in itself has been really important and I think really good. I think one of the things that I think about is that when you look at the city and you look at our various buildings and spaces, there's quite a few historic buildings in Ojai. We really are lucky to have so much wonderful architecture. and lucky to have so many things like this world university that sprang up here and went on for 40 years and who would have thought a university in downtown Ohio and one that fit in with Ohio was kind of part of Ohio so there's a lot of that that gets lost over time and people don't really realize that that history is there And so it is important to have a way to catch those buildings before we lose them. Not only to lose them all at once if they get demolished, but to lose them by the death by a thousand cuts, you know, when they just get demolished. altered and changed so much, but to be able to pick out the buildings that are really historic, that means they tell the story of our community, and to be able to feature those and protect them. And the city's general plan really, it says that we are supposed to identify and protect the historic buildings within the community. And then I think who's best able to do that? and you have a commission. A lot of cities don't have a commission. When I went down, when Rick and I went down to the Ventura County Commission, their Cultural Resources Board, they would adjourn as the Ventura County Commission and they would re-take up as the Oxnard Historic Preservation and they would act as if they were making the decisions for Oxnard. and i thought well that's sad i mean here we have people who are interested and are qualified and to have your own commission is really so important but we're there really aren't that many cities in ventura county that have their own commission so we're lucky to have that And the city has always been very generous in helping us to educate ourselves for paying for classes and trainings. And we have a great variety of people on this committee. So I really think that oftentimes we hear people say, well, that doesn't have to go to the HPC or it shouldn't go to the HPC for some reason. And I keep thinking, well, why wouldn't you want it to? If there's a... property that is even remotely possible that it could be something historic, why wouldn't you want your historic preservation commission to look it over and to try to help inform the decision makers, whether it be the council or the planning commission, about the story of those buildings. So I really favor this idea of trying to get in early. And I've gone through other cities. I've gone through the county of Ventura. And when you go through what they do, if a property comes up for an alteration or a demolition, it says right in their list of procedures that the planner has to go out and stand on the property and see if there's any building that looks like it could be over 50 years old. and if there is then there's a whole list of things that that person has to do to investigate they have to go to the bird which is the database of historic structures they have to go to the Cal State Fullerton list of historic buildings they have to there's a whole process well I'm sure Lucas is too busy to be going through the history books for every building that comes through but you have a commission that that's what they do you know that's what they're trained to do so I think when we go through this list it really does spell out a lot of important functions and powers for the for the historic preservation to do and the more we can use the commission I think the better for the community

And I know that council did speak about our functions and powers and of course after all the work that we have put through I didn't mention that the second joint council meeting with we asked for an extension of another six months which brought us to the end of June to finish but so this is a year and a half process with unanimous support from council to continue to get this done so I was nervous and I spoke to our city manager and I said will we have a seat at the table and he promised us that we would have a seat he's shaking his head yes he's never it's very nice to have him here tonight thank you for coming but he said that we would have a seat at the table and this would be the document that we would be you know working from so and so he said he suggested that we come back to the full commission and get a recommendation to then bring this on to to council so that's what we're here tonight so we don't have to go over each and every one unless you have questions so it's up to you all and we have kim uh councilwoman kim mayne here to also answer questions because she's been on it for the entire time just It was a lot of hours. Yes. We learned a lot. It was fun because, I mean, even when our examples are heartbreaking, they are lessons learned. You know, when we talk about things that may have been lost or may have been not had come to us and why, even though it's like it hurts, it's a lesson there. And it's, you know, that we learn from it and fix this so we're all on the same page. so we had every time almost every time we would come to the monthly meeting at one time it was weekly with Leslie but when it got back to monthly it was another example it's like I really want to come here without examples and that's when we'll know that we're on the right track is and we're in agreement here is when we stop having another example so yeah if we can get a consensus from everybody to bring this on to council so whatever the discussion that they want to have about our functions and powers can begin Questions?

Okay so again yeah I went through it quite a few times one because it's small print and I brought my cheaters

I do wish, it was in color, so it was like a light green, but on this it is hard to read, so my apologies on that.

It's crazy when you're sitting down in the congregation and you look at the you know the upper level people in church and they all have dark frames on their through their things going cheaters yes I'm of that age so one of the things I think I was was is something that could be misdrewed and I know based on a comment made by the city manager when we were talking about this maybe a year ago or so is the fact that we talked about the fact that we as a commission cannot be restricted from going and identifying historic properties and if we once we identify a historic property then it seems to mean like we have to take some kind of action now that we've done that when really we're only building a library okay we're not for you out there watching we're not and I like somewhere in here it says that the homeowner can remove themself from that effort that's going on so you know keeping track of that so I'm just kind of and that's why I was trying to read through it to get the nuance of how you say to somebody we're doing our responsibility in the We're doing our responsibility to find out where historic protection and we're finding the places we need to protect and there are a lot of wonderful ones like someone's house back there so it's just how to be kind of super sensitive that we don't get people who are looking to misunderstand us and then then convey that and again I just got the impression in that meeting that our city manager who had done this kind of thing and the city he came from has some lessons learned that maybe he can be helpful to the to the group going forward so so that was the the the you know gives us the power to do all these things well we're not we're gonna you know it's like Craig well you know yeah would you like to review this document well I'd like to review it because I'm gonna learn not because I'm gonna criticize something or take it apart I often will talk to Craig who shares something with us and ask him if he can email that to me and I have nice piled over there that I read over and over again so that's the only thing you know I was trying to look at how in reading through this look at how it might be misconstrued and if there's something that we can do maybe a little differently or word it somehow differently to keep that from happening but other than that I think you did a very fine job very fine job going through this doing the different areas if you're gonna read the what's in our packet make sure you have title 4-8.05 next to you in larger print and go from there so again thank you for all your work on this Do you have anything you want to add?

Are we good? So do we have the blessing of the commission to use this document to move forward to have the discussion with council about our functions and powers? Yes. Okay. Thank you. We are on item number eight. Do we have a staff report on that?

Yes, I'm going to quickly turn this back over to you because tonight is, or this item is for each commissioner to report on the condition of the selected landmarks that was agreed upon in a previous meeting. This is regarding maintenance and protection of city-owned landmarks.

Do we have any public comment? I'm really trying to be thoughtful of that because the other night when after that long meeting with everyone that was here with Ojai Roots and then I ended up finally going home it's like 9 30 and I was home and I was raising my hand and I was like public I'm like emailing you I'm emailing Lucas I'm emailing Sherry and then finally they noticed my hand but I was like I need to be more mindful of that and always make sure that there's nobody out there with their hand up so I'm just I made myself a note to ask on each one and so no public comment we'll close public comment and um this did anybody visit any of their properties yes I did I walked the um

around the I circumnavigated the arcade yesterday and I'm not really sure how we're supposed to report things that we find and Just here just for starters so All right so what I'm going to report might have already been there but because of this new emphasis you know I observed it and that is the I mean I hate to point out this business because they've had so much attention but the Ojai Mountain Farm the building that they're contained in which at least the back of it sides are made out of brick so on the eastern side of the wall which is above the adjoining buildings roof there's two large tags graffiti up there which the public can see and they're you know like three or four feet tall I happen to take pictures of those too oh you've seen that oh okay they've been there a while well you see but nonetheless I think it might have had something to do with the fact that there was a very tall ladder propped up there for a very long time well whatever reason there it is and you know it's kind of weird to have that there in a town of our stature. But that's all I noticed. I mean, everything actually looked pretty good as far as it goes. And the CESP wall is also on Craig and my walk that we're tasked with. And everything there looks fine.

Great. Anyone else?

I'll piggyback on that because Rick and I have the same landmarks. I did notice that when I looked at the CUP for one of the businesses that has outdoor seating, that as you look through the passageway that goes from the front of the arcade to the back of the arcade in the CUP it says that the seating should all be kept to the left of the of the pathway because you know it's supposed to be out of the way of the pathway between the pathway and the fountain and it's really extended all the way over almost to the fountain that's there So when I'm putting myself in the mind of a tourist and I'm walking along in the arcade and I look through that passageway, what I see are chairs and tables. You know, I don't see a vista through there with a way to the back. and I think it may be blocking their view and maybe discouraging some people from actually walking through. I think I've said something in about this to the code compliance, but I think they maybe should go and ask that owner to bring his tables and chairs in line with the passageways so that when people look and see well what's down that way they see there's more stores and that there's something happening in there and then of course there's a lot of things that we've talked about before there are signs you know neon and things like that but i i'm assured by code compliance that that's all on the agenda and will be taken care of so i'm hoping it will With the CESPE wall, the only thing I noticed is something I've noticed for a long time is a couple of years ago, somebody backed into the wall and knocked it over. And so all the pieces came down. And the city, to their credit, the workers came and they put it back. but they didn't put it back the way that it was historically and so I don't know it isn't something that's a high priority but it would be nice someday if maybe the city could hire a professional that knows about historic grouting and stuff that could come and redo that part to look like the other parts so it's very bright so different i thought it would um mellow over time but it's still staying that pretty bright white and it doesn't you know how between each stone there's this bead that goes down of of grout that goes down it makes it look very professional and very artistic and then you get to this section and it's just kind of odds and ends of grout put in there so again i appreciate that they put it back and i i'm hoping that maybe someday when the city has a few extra bucks they can hire someone to go in and restore it

I share mine with Commissioner Nason and we talked back and forth about what exactly are we looking for with the character defining features of the tennis courts because I looked under landmark number one and It gave a very long story and list of why it was becoming a landmark, but it wasn't the HRR. It wasn't clear with the character-defining features. that it was like I didn't really understand what it exactly was and so before our September meeting we were talking about really wanting to know what understand what we were looking at and what to look for so we really got a good idea so I don't know if where I would know that I just because I know there's the it's like there's all these different parts in into it so if I'm what are we looking for we're looking for like spray paint shipped stairs you know things but what are the character defining features that we're looking at so we can see if there's like wood rot or something that we should let let everybody know about so I wasn't sure if that's that's how this whole HR thing which I'll talk about in Commissioner comments started because it was like well where do I find that and is it digitized and that was a conversation but so do you if does anybody have any direction about what exactly is the list for the tennis courts that's character defining features that you know anywhere that I could look besides the the

application for the landmark that was the only thing I could I found probably Tony Thatcher would be a good source and he's got a little book out on the history of the tournament is it just the is the landmark just the courts or is it also the tournament

It says the tournament it says the courts it also mentioned that at least in this landmark thing that the tree which I know it's County right Yeah that's a separate one But it was listed in this particular document that's why I was like I don't think that's what I'm supposed to be necessarily looking at and I wasn't sure so I really wanted to fine-tune it because we're gonna kind of every other month one of us would do it and so I said before September meeting let's really try to get a list of what the character defining features are so we could I mean we want to look at it as holistically but also the character defining features to make sure that there's nothing you know being like defaced or missing or you know

It does say in our code that if a historic report is over, or is 10 years old or 20 years old, that we can ask that it be updated. So maybe that's something we could do. We have some of these people that have been connected with the tournament for so long.

Yeah, I mean, if we could figure, I'd rather maybe use our HRR money on something that isn't already landmarked, though, you know?

I will reach out to Tony Thatcher On the tennis court I would talk to Tony but I think much of his stuff especially in writing the book is at the museum so you might check with Wendy also

Do you have anything about the museum or the jail?

The museum and the jail every time I'm in Libby Park I walk over to the jail and I check and see and the plaque is still perfect that we put up there a number of years ago

So is the new sign going to be in a different spot than that sign and that sign is going to be removed?

No that sign is going to stay where it is. I'm talking about the bronze plaque.

No I was just thinking about the other one since the one that I saw the other day that was the

Yeah we decided that hopefully our sign next to the trail would encourage people to walk down and take a look And on the rock wall I found out I think I got called then I called Perry and then they called Public Works and they came up I found out that the rocks that they brought up were actually from the boneyard down in the thing that came from the building that fell down. But you're right, it's not the same.

They actually like the, they used to have all the pillars from the old bank down there in the city yard. I don't know if they still have them, but their original idea was to take those pillars from the front of the old bank and put them about 50 feet back from the entrance to Libby Park, you know, where the fountain is, and have those pillars sticking up. But it never happened, so, but I don't know if they're still down there.

Just so you know we have a 19 page document that's linked to the historic landmark list on the city's website I think that's the one I got

I think I went on the city and then I clicked from the landmark and then it went to it's not really an HRR it's more of a landmark application and packet

So at different times in history, different types of documents, well, they were named different things. They were not always named historic resources reports. And then also just different things were required at that time.

Yeah, it wasn't like a nice clean list of these are the character defining features, which is what I was kind of looking for. Which is what would happen if we had one prepared today. Yeah.

Just a different way of producing documents. Okay so next is the education update Oh before you get there so this is the first time that this this item has come up you just first the first meeting that we've been able to put it on an agenda and it's gonna be a monthly a monthly thing so a couple of things were noted tonight about the plaza and I want to know what your expectation is with reporting these things and then also what I'd like to let you know what my expectation is or what staff's expectation is because it's awkward if your expectation is okay now I've reported it tomorrow and something's going to happen I really need you all of you to if you have a complaint about something to submit it to my OHI and please Please call us. You can call me direct, but for instance, I'll be out next week. It's best if you call extension 112 and anybody who answers will put this into my OHI for you. But we need to report it.

it needs to be reported and I don't think that that was the intention of this report this monthly report so let me know what your expectations are I did have a meeting with the city manager and I asked him about the intention of the MyOHI with commissions and he said it never was his intention for commissions to use MyOHI that he was going to speak with you. And hopefully when we have a new associate planner, anything that the commission wanted to say would go to you rather than go to my OHI.

Okay, so let's skip the first part of putting into my OHI, but if you could call us between 8 and 5 and talk to Ida or Sherry and then it will get to the planner again I won't be here for a week and it's just best anyway if staff if the counter staff is the ones who that you're reporting to so but if we backtrack a second was it your expectation that this was the opportunity to tell staff that something's going on out there and then it get reported and dealt with? I think we should talk about what that expectation is.

Yeah, I think probably throughout the month, you don't have to wait until this meeting to let us update. It would probably be best if we saw a spray paint on the brick facade I mean the building then it should be notified right away emailed to Maura and eventually to this new person did they hire somebody sorry the new associate planner do we have one yet no it's gonna be a little bit

So I just looked back at my notes because the city manager did speak to me after your meeting and and yes the notes are had the words my Ojai in them however it wasn't for you to go to my Ojai and I already retracted that but I'll just say it again that he did say that to me but what he did say is that you would you would contact you would contact community development so so please contact Community Development and and it might whether it's a phone call or an email if you email me please always just as always that we've talked about in the past please always include Sherry and Ida in case one of us isn't here and then and then it will go from there

So obviously we're not expecting overnight results and because that's not realistic so what I think the intention would be would be we see something we email the three the trifecta of those three and we say this is what we saw just to let you know with our walk and then at the meeting you can say on so-and-so date I let community development know that this was going on and then hopefully we'll have follow-up at some point you know we I don't know how to do the follow-up part of it because I don't, it's like if the next month you see it, are we reporting it again?

Right, because like you said, things don't happen overnight. And so, and I can't talk about specifics regarding code compliance in this meeting because it's all confidential. But, you know, so I don't even know how to finish that sentence. I was going to talk about the plaza. Yes. Yes.

Can I jump in there? Since I actually filed a code a mile high after our discussion. So our church is located, if you're going out of town and you make it to the left on San Antonio, Bristol's on the other side, across the railroad tracks, that street from there to the Wilson property, every time I drive over it, I'm like, I'm gonna lose a tire. It has so many potholes in it.

Okay so that would go directly to Public Works just so you know Community Development's not dealing with the streets Okay so I did I sent it to my Ohio I sent it to Public Works because it looked like the more appropriate thing so I'm not sure how you get responses You can give them a phone call as well but that is how you would do that and then the follow-up So who of you, I'll just pick on Commissioner Passaccia, we've received my Ohio concerns from you. And have you been responded to saying that we're going to look into this or anything like that? Have you gotten any responses from staff?

No. But I was schooled on that by you saying that I would not be receiving feedback on it. I was aware that you got it somehow and I turned in this complaint which by the way was on a landmark and it was a pretty major complaint I would say. And I did it not on my OHI, but I filled out a form and gave it to someone at the desk and they accepted it and said that they would enter it in my OHI. So I mean, I didn't specifically get like a formal, I don't think I did. I mean, I may have, or I don't know.

The reason I'm picking on you is because I thought there was communication about that being submitted.

Well, if it was, it was very minor.

And once something is put into code compliance, then you can be informed of that, and then there's going to be silence. That's true. You won't get any more information. And I'm clear on that. But then, of course, if you don't see something happening,

please I all I can keep suggesting is that you you contact us and and ultimately when it comes to code compliance you're going to be contacting me Well with this specific complaint I don't really expect anything to happen immediately I mean it's such a large thing that you know I mean it could be years before anything is seen

Well I put in a complaint too on my OHI and it took me three hours and calling James and I said to him you go through this my OHI thing and it tells you that you need a password a username and a password right okay I don't have a username and a password because I've never done this before so it says click here to sign to get a to register you click there and nothing happens

I don't want you to ever have to go through that again. Please call me.

But I'm just saying, I think everybody needs to hear this.

I receive so many. I mean, I receive 12 a day. And I'm not picking on you.

The problem is, this is a ridiculous way for anybody in this community to communicate with the city of Ojai about problems. Half the time, People don't know how to do it. I said to James, I'm on my laptop. Well, you're not supposed to be. You need to be on your phone or your tablet. I said, I don't do that kind of stuff on my phone or my tablet. I do it on my laptop. So that brought up a whole bunch of more stuff. Oh, I see. It doesn't work. It's broken. We'll do this instead. I mean, there are a lot of people in this town that don't know how to do all of this. I mean, I'm pretty old. I'm learning but there are a lot of people that are a lot older than I am that have do not know or want to learn or have the capacity and so I think there needs to be a much better way for the citizens in this valley to communicate about problems about safety issues about all sorts of things

When people call us, I promise you, we don't send them away. We take their complaint.

You can still fill in forms. I mean, I did it. Yeah, and I did that. And there is no problem.

Right, but I've never heard anything except for, yeah, we got it. It's like, okay, we got it. Well, I'd like a response to be, what are we doing? So I understand the only way I can get a response is to fill out, there is a government form that I can fill out to ask for all of those my OHI things to be released to me. It's public knowledge. And that would cause the city a lot of problems if I were to do that. Because then they'd have to go through all this stuff. But there is a legal mechanism.

So it's true that once you submit something and it goes into code compliance, that staff is not going to be able to give you the details of what's happening. But I still want to encourage you to contact us if you have any concerns about anything in the city.

So am I understanding that? if I was to email you because I saw spray paint on a historic building then somebody in the city is going to put it into my OHI yes it's gonna be put in yes we will put it into my OHI okay and when you put something into my OHI do you get I thought you got some sort of a number like a like a reference number yes okay so is it possible if we as a commission if one of us emails you and then you say we received it we put it into my OHI and here's your numbers so if you want to check on it in a you know however could we have that number so we know what it is, so we can know how to trace it back to?

Yes, but still, so... The idea right now is, prior to this conversation, is that somebody, whether you submit it the way you just said or it goes straight into my OHI, however it gets in my OHI. So my goal is that the person who submitted it, often it's anonymous, so we can't respond. But if there's a phone number or an email, that we let that person know that we have received your concern. That may be all that we can say. Once we've received it, that means it's now in code compliance and it's confidential information. But we've received it, so please know that we're dealing with it, whatever that means. I mean, I have code cases that take years. And some that take a minute. Some take a phone call. Hey, you can't have four feet high grass in your front yard. That's easy. Well, actually, that's not even always easy. Sometimes that could take months. Graffiti could take a year. And sometimes many citations. So when you're responded to that thank you, we've received your concern, That may be all, we can't then say, we can't then tell you that we contacted Mr. Jones and this is what happened and we can't do that. Yeah. What my hope is is that we walk out of here and that very soon somebody sees something so they can have a win. There will be a success story. Whether it's the chairs and tables being moved further to the left so they're not in view. And that all the seating out there is in compliant with the approved CUPs from many years ago. That's a goal, right? And I want there to be a success story for Commissioner Walker and for all of you. But again, it's not going to happen overnight.

So, I mean, this is just a, probably shouldn't be asking this here, but if there's spray paint on the side of the brick building that is right now Ojai Mountain Farm, Ojai Mountain Farm is the leasee.

I know exactly where the spray paint is, and it's a code compliance issue.

But who's responsible? Does the city?

It's a property owner because it's a privately owned building.

Because it's all connected but not connected. That's what I was wondering.

I have a question about that because when I was thinking I think I did call about the Ojai Mountain Farm the graffiti and then I thought well what's the policy did they make the guy who owns the building clean it because what if they tell him he's got to get rid of it in a week and he goes and sandblasts it which would ruin the building so that caused me some concern that that when we're talking about historic buildings how do we make sure that it's done properly so it won't ruin the building brick is so sensitive especially that old Yeah because it says right in the guidelines you know you shouldn't use sandblasting you shouldn't use this and that when you're dealing with masonry on a historic building so I thought well you know I hope that they I mean are they going to have a course and how to take care of their building I don't know I could see how your job is very complicated Yeah it's a complicated So I hesitated almost to complain because I didn't know if I wanted them to just go out and try to clean it.

That's a great question.

Thank you. I've taken note of that, and I'm going to look into that. Thanks.

So we have an understanding of what we're going to do. We're going to either send an email or go on to my OHI.

Or send an email, call me. Or call the front desk.

If I can suggest, though, I would prefer if you send an email so there'd be a paper trail, so you have something.

I prefer that as well. If you do call me, I'm going to follow up with an email to keep it in writing.

All right.

we have her can i just ask a simple question because i've done things with the my ohai and i never get any response so it's like i don't know if it was accepted is kim's mic on i don't know i do see um you know i noticed with the um i believe i called and turned into with the um ohai mountain farms because that's been months ago that i spotted the graffiti but is there some type of a tracking so i know because of rules you can't tell us here's what we're doing code compliance and all that

but could there be something added to the site that once you put in your complaint and we know you received it it's in progress and then you have to close it out so then you know okay they're working and then so councilwoman i i can't change the site okay however i i it's my goal and and i'm ultimately responsible now um because of my position is to make sure that unless something is submitted anonymously that there's a response my it would be wonderful if everybody if everybody submitted an email address so we can email right but i would like there to be a response to every single person and that's that's my goal here is to say we have received right we have received that um and i don't know if there's anything on there that says if you don't receive you know how do you know if where it went right i mean if you

I went through my OHI app, turned things in, and then there was another thing. I'll just put it out there. With one of the businesses, they had things out front that were blocking the walkway. So I turned that in, and I did get a response. So I was like, oh, grateful. And they said it's been taken care of. They're no longer there. Well, they were no longer there because it was not during business hours. After five. So they brought it into the lobby. So when I drove by, I thought, oh, yes, there they are. So I wonder when I come back later this afternoon. Well, they were back because the business was open. So things like that.

Thank you. Two things there. One is good news, one is bad. The good news is that you got a response.

Absolutely.

Which means that your concern didn't go into a black hole. It actually went to somebody and you know that for a fact. Absolutely. Okay, so that's number one and that's a goal of mine. And then that's the good thing. So then the bad thing is the fact that the stuff was brought in because it was closed. So that's not good. So thank you. It just adds up.

So I check the business hours because it will be different when the business is open versus closed.

yes of course I'm sorry I just want to laugh partly because it's late but also yes right but what would be fabulous is if you if you want to give me a call or send me an email so if that specific address is still doing that we can have it taken care of that is kind of funny

Okay and now we're going to item number nine the education update can I just go on to do that So there's an upcoming with the California Preservation Foundation that is coming up on September 15th and September 22nd It is a boot camp, so it's a little bit longer. It's 10 a.m. to 1 p.m. on both those days. It's applying the Secretary of the Interior standards, making consistent, defensible decisions on historic properties. I think it's a really good one. It's called an intermediate level seminar focusing on the Secretary of the Interior standards for the treatment of historic properties. It has some really good speakers. I think it would be great. So I had asked Ida to put it out to the commission, and I don't know if it's just because it's so far out you haven't responded, but I think it would be a good one for anyone who wants to see it. And that's all I have for that. So we can go to item number 10, which is future agenda items.

So at our next meeting September 10th we have the fire department representative coming to talk to you or us about the arcade and we'll have a draft resolution or a resolution back to you regarding the awards and you'll start talking you can start talking about Ojai day and potentially have 718 Foothill Road repair and replacement decking that would be a public hearing item that's for that's for the next meeting For October can we put the school district on again I will let you know if it needs to be bumped but we are

communicating with the school district to try to see what kind of help we can be and give them support and if we have anything to report it would go there but if it's not timely I'll you know kick it down the road also can we bring back the fast tracking of the landmarks for historic properties in the Historic contributing properties within the state historic district. I Know on us looking back I don't know if it was our minutes or the minutes from the time before but it just said fast-tracking landmark properties, but so if we can be very specific that it's only for contributing properties within the state historic district and the I just spoke through email with the Treasures of Ojai people so I'm gonna reach out to them and get another meeting with them and they're gonna help us with a presentation to hopefully then come to hear in October and get your support to then bring it to council and I just spoke to Christine Lazzarato from HRG just to make sure I had it right what she said so I make sure I properly cite the information and then I will reach out to the attorney that I spoke to to make sure that I'm keeping everything right I heard the conversation today and she said that uh she said to make sure to talk to this the city attorney regarding that in our code and seeing if that can happen yes because originally she had suggested either that or just everyone within the district that was contributing would just automatically be a city landmark but no one on the commission or even the future potential applicant really thought that was the best route because not everybody wants to do that and you know there's more overreach and there's more things that happen it gives people an opportunity to choose to want to do that and and they are very proud of their building and they want to put in that extra effort and so all what we're trying to do is give them an avenue to do that that does it's not overly costly and time-consuming and and redundant with information so that is I'd like for future agenda does anybody else have anything you want to be on future agenda

Ojai Day I left a message with Richard Sennett and called Dwayne Bauer and it rang a long time so I'm still getting hold of those two for upcoming Ojai Day So we have Ojai Day on September and October

and then can we we would like to request a booth again because that was a really good opportunity to to educate and communicate and this time we'll have more of a focus on our trail last time was the plaque this time will be more on the the trail project So last time the city did it for us. I don't know if that will happen again.

So I think for Ojai Day, what you did last year was connect with Christy Rivera.

Right. But then when it came right down to it, it was the city who made it happen. So I don't know. I will make the initial one again, but I wasn't on the back end and how it happened. Okay. We'll find out how to get a booth. Okay. does anybody have any Commissioner comments I have one and it came from looking for that the tennis court HRR and I had brought it up to the city manager as well about and to the museum about making sure that we digitize our hrrs so we have a record of them and they're tied to the property i asked today to a hrg if we could have another column just as a little like check mark if they have an HRR I spoke with Brian who he said that the museum is the only place that has a binder that has any record of HRRs and it's like how did that happen well because Brian for the last 10 years or so every time there's one in our packet he takes it out of the packet and gives it to indy and that's how this has been created and hrg today was very happy that that existed because that's the only place that they're all in one spot and um so that needs to be modernized where it's not just you know in a binder that it is digitized it is with the property it is does link so um that is something that i would like to bring to um maybe not next week next month i'd like to keep next month as as loose as we can because i would like to make sure that we give the fire department our full attention and not have like a super packed agenda if we don't have to so i'd like to maybe in october talk about that and see what we can do to come up with ideas of how

because Maura was saying maybe getting an intern or something because it really is having to go through each address that is potentially historic to see because if there was an HRR it would probably be in a it'll be it would be in the address file um for every right everything is in the address file so it is digitized but you're right if it's not a landmark then it's not in one in one spot

So yeah, that's something that I would like on a future agenda. I don't know if I have any support. If anybody else agrees, that might be a good thing and maybe in the future, but not immediate future, maybe October, November.

I also digitized them by going to our thing going to the packet seeing what what you know page four to eight and then print it as a PDF Right which is great from this forward but it's the old this stuff even the stuff before we were on the Commission and you know it's like even in old HRR is a good starting point for

if somebody wanted to create a new HRR it would be you already have all this information you know so it's like if that's in there then each of it all should all be in one place and it should be something that ties to the commission and to yeah

I have a commissioner comment I'd like to put this out there because I realized tonight that I'm not going to be at that meeting but I want to pass this on to you guys to for somebody to bring up to this fire department representative. My wife owns a downtown business, and it's behind the arcade, so it's in the area of concern. Recently, we had an incident at the business, which is in a complex of three buildings. I had to break into a locked corridor that was outside. In doing so, I discovered this corridor was full of boxes. These were all adjacent to large electrical installations. And I called the fire department about it, and I asked them about it. And they informed me, contrary to my belief, that the fire department does not do inspections anymore on downtown businesses like they used to. It used to be a thing, a very regular thing. And there is now what's called the self-inspection program. so i'm just throwing that out there for you guys to maybe ask about this on my behalf but also on on the landmarks behalf now mind you this business is not in the landmark but it is in the downtown it's it's right behind the chevron station and also there was no access I mean of course the fire department would just break the door down but it seemed like a great way to start a fire in there and I forget what the issue was I think there was an electrical issue in fact so anyway I just wanted to throw that out while I could I'll make sure that that's addressed

So Rick, the individual that we contact is Nick Cleary. He's a Ventura County division chief. And he's the one that always goes to the city council meetings, sits in the back. That's how I got to know him. But of course, when I talked to him a month ago, he was on his way up to Washington. He did mention that to me the inspection is not taking place Anything that you want to add?

I just want to say thank you.

I'm kind of sad that our little ad hoc is coming to an end.

And like I said, I wish I would have monitored the hours because we did spend a lot of time. But thank you, guys. It was fun. I learned a lot. And I appreciate you. So then I guess we'll be seeing that on an agenda and hopefully getting things dialed in.

ease the process for everyone assuming that it's going to go to council and council is going to discuss it and then it's gonna go I mean I'm sure that will be still I always promised that we'd have a seat at the table so I'm sure that I don't think this is over yet so We want to make sure that everyone is just in agreement. Like I said to Lucas, even if there's things that we're not even happy with, it's going to have to be compromised. It's what government is. At least we know. So we're not.

I think once it falls into place and everybody sees that you're working together and it can lighten the load for everybody and take away a lot of stress, I think it will be wonderful. But change takes time, right?

Thank you so much for all those hours I'm working on a project and I'm going to actually meet with Wendy tomorrow about this the OI Art Center Theatre is producing Our Town and as we all know Thornton Wilder went to school here for a little while a long time ago and one of the things I'm proposing to do to to promote the show but to promote like Wilder days or something is to create temporary temporary like flyers asking the property owner if I can put a QR code on a on a building they're only like half a dozen that I can think of in the downtown area that Wilder may have known in some capacity and so it's not gonna it's only gonna be up for a little while if I can make this fly but I thought maybe you want to know what are these signs doing up here so anyway it's yeah Wilder days come and see us so is it gonna be at the Art Center the play oh yes the play will be at the Ohio Art Center it's in September but this is just to keep you like if you see some other little history thing it's great

I went to them when they were doing our town at the Thatcher school