Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

regular meeting of the North Augusta Planning Commission. Um, all right. I'd like to start with roll call, please. Aaron Slade, Red Harbison, Bob Bigger, Lisa Christie, Chelsea Widow. Okay. Motion to approve. All right. Moved. It's been moved and seconded. All those in favor, please say I. I. All opposed. Okay. All right. Mr. Paradise wanted to confirm the agenda. Are there any changes to the agenda?

Uh, no, ma'am. All right. Um, okay. So, we're going to get started on RZM25-003. We have um one recusal this night. All right. Thank you, Vice Chair. And his um form is on file. Okay. Yes, ma'am. All right. Okay, we could start, please.

This is a request for uh reszoning by Hindel Mako HFT LLC to reszone approximately 4.93 acres located at 404 East Martintown Road. It's commonly referred to as Crossroad Shopping Center there next to Publix. Um there's three parcels involved. This is a request to reszone from planned development to general commercial. You see the three parcels there in yellow. Um this if you look at the gray on this one, this shows that is planned development. All all three all of those parcels are zone planned development. Now the two out parcels have recently been subdivided. We were discussing development from those parcels and I realized one is there's no general development plan for this PD is is existing non-conforming basically and for them to do a general development plan it would not conform with the PD requirements because there's not a residential component there's no mixed use there And generally what we did what we have done in the past um on these PDS like this as uses changed use the general commercial for for the usage. Um but when we got into the design of the site plans I said wait a minute. Yeah I'm messing up here. We need to have some specific um we need it get it zoned correctly. So, we're using what the zoning is. So,

we had always used general commercial. It sits um in a general commercial quarter. Um it, as the saying goes, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, maybe it should be zoned like a duck. And um so talking with the developers, they agreed, yeah, we we will come in and ask for it to be reszoned to general commercial. And basically that's just making it conform uh to what's already there.

Any questions for Mr. Paradise? All right. So just so that um we'll go over the the protocol for um comments and anyone who comes to the podium. Um for any members of the community or me applicants who come forth, please give your name and address so that everyone in Facebook land uh knows who you are. for the community. If you have comments, we ask that you keep it to about two minutes to allow your neighbors to also have time to contribute and ask that you share new things so that we have new perspectives and new things um to consider and and not necessarily the same thing that the person before you may have just said. All right. And with that, if we could please have the applicant come forward and we'll have the applicant come forward, then we'll open up for questions. Um, all members of the community will come forward at one time and then the applicant will respond to all of the questions and comments at one time.

Uh, good evening members of the planning commission. My name is Dennis Troder. Um, address is 3510 Wheeler Road in Augusta. Um, 30909. Um, with Jordan Troder commercial real estate. Uh, one of the members of uh, Henbell Mcdana HFT LLC, which is the land owner here. Um, as Tommy's mentioned, we are um, appreciate y'all hearing this tonight. We have, uh, acquired all this property in 2019. Uh, it was PD zoning at the time. And just like Tommy said, we've been all operating under this the the terms and the conditions of general commercial even though it's zone PD because there were just no supporting documents. Um, and this is really a um come time for us to come in and clean this up um and get uniformity across Martintown Road with the other GC general commercial zoning. Um, we have um we've carved out two out parcels there. I believe y'all are aware of the the YMCA and renovating the old Big Lots uh property now. They they own that. But we happy to come in, work with Tommy and uh Kulie for a while now. They're wonderful and um use this as a chance to clean up kind of a just a lingering zoning item out there. I think there's a probably a few other PD zonings in the city that have a similar situation as this, but this will be we can get this done. It'll be one less um one less non-conforming use out there. Happy to answer any questions y'all may have.

All right. Any questions for the applicant at this time? All right. If you'll have a seat, we'll see if there are any. Right. Thank you. Community, we'll have you come back up. Thank you, Mr. Troder. All right. Opening it up to the community. Are there any questions of Mr. Troder? Mr. Paradise from the community. All right. There being none, commissions, any discussion or questions? I had a question. So, the family wild parcel is going to remain PD. That's not under Mr. Troder's ownership. Is that going to affect his buffers by it being dissimilar zoning against?

We have not looked into it. I would not think so. Okay. We are going to look at that P the existing PD as as general commercial because it it it just doesn't work.

Any other questions? There are none. Is there a motion? I'll make the motion that we approve the reasonzoning uh RZM25- Z003 approximately 4.93 acres on 404 East Martintown Road um from plan development to general commercial. Second. All right. It has been moved and seconded. All right, no other questions. All those in favor, please say I.

I. All opposed. All right. So, passes unanimously. Thank you. All right. So, next up we're going to talk about um tree preservation and um my understanding that there was some discussion about it last meeting in November and then then we asked Mr. Paradise to bring forth some other information um and thoughts around it. He did so. We have since um also received an email that is um available uh from uh Jason and u sorry I'm trying to get all this together. Um yeah from Jason Woodinger from the Ivy Group and then Commissioner Wadell. So what we're going to do is um I want to lay out the plan for what we're going to talk about with trees just in general. So this will be the beginning. This will not be the end of the discussion around trees. What um we were thinking about doing is making this um a series of almost study sessions and in in the same way that we did the signage. So um letting this be the starting point for discussions, we have Mr. Paradise has one or two questions he'd like some direction on and some things that we need to consider. Then in subsequent meetings, we'd like to invite the city's arborist as well as an a landscape architect from that would be affiliated with developments um as well

to come talk to us and present. So we'll have those perspectives as well. and then we'll get into how we adapt our code in particular um given the other things that are also in our code to look at trees based on on that information. So if there are any concerns or questions about that then please share that also gives everyone plenty of time um if you have additional information that you would like to be for us to to consider and to read to get it to Mr. Paradise in advance of the next meeting or two. so that we all have that um and have plenty of time to read it and consider it and the public also knows that that information is available as part of the regular P. Okay. All right. If there again if there are any concerns to that process and you all have any suggestions, please share. So with that being said, um I'm going to turn the floor to Mr. Paradise now. I know Jason is with us and would like um him to go over his email with us and things to be um considered as we have this discussion. And Miss Badell, if you'd like to All right. the um looking at it when when we discussed it last time or when when it came up, I started drilling in or trying to drill in grasp where I thought y'all wanted to go and I really struggled um on that. And as I dug into it, I go, "Well, first thing we need to do is probably look and see where we're at." That's what I want to do tonight is make sure that y'all or make sure you're you got it in your wheelhouse kind of where we're at in the regulations. And that's was the purpose of the memorandum. Um, but our current ordinance regulates

buffers. It re regulates parking lot landscaping. It requires street trees or now in the we we say street trees but now it is required on the lot. Uh subdivision entrances requires landscaping and then there's the catch all as I call it. Um there's general landscaping for the commercial sites. And what a lot of people may not realize is we require landscaping for single family residential prior to the certificate of occupancy. And that was something new to me when I came to North Augusta. So what are the general landscaping requirements? You've got at least 10% of the net lot area has to have tree canopy either with the existing coverage or installation of new tree. How do you calculate that? uh a large tree is calculated at 400 square ft. A small tree gives you 200 square ft of canopy coverage. Now, if you look in some of the ordinances and you and as we go through this, it's very difficult to compare um ordinances because they're not apples to apples. um required parking landscaping areas both perimeter and interior are excluded from that lot area. You know in Aken you'll see 20%. We do 10% but those are excluded in 20 in Aken those are included. So that's just some of the little finances that we need to look at as we go through or I want to make sure you're aware of as you go through. Yes, ma'am. Um, so when you say the 400 feet and the 200 feet, is it at tree maturity? Is that what we're talking about?

It is basically a large tree when when you're doing the calculations for the tree canopy coverage. A large tree gives you 400 square f feet. But that's when the tree is planted or when it's fully grown. When when it's planted, but whenever it's fully grown out, it'll give you that 400 square f feet. it it doesn't give you 400 square feet because it's either a two inch or a 3 inch tree when it goes in, right? And so then do we have any kind of stipulation on how long is there any timeline on getting to the 400 square f feet? Does that make sense? Like are they planting specific types of trees that will grow to maturity by a certain date?

And and I'll get into that. We do have an approved tree list that those have to come from. We also require the um perimeter of the building, the footprint um to have shrubs planted around there every 5t have to be at least 2 feet in height and then everything on the lot has to be flower beds, grass, you know, within a year the the grass has to be coming out. And then when we go to single family residential, and this one really um because we see so much single family residential and that's where a lot of this clear cutting is at um I wanted to make sure that y'all had this in your wheelhouse because like I said before I came to North Augusta, I wasn't aware of this. But at least 20% of the total area less the primary dwelling must had a canopy cover either by existing tree cover or by installation new planting. And again you get 200 for small tree 400 for a large tree. again around the perimeter. Anything visible from the street, they have to have ground cover of light or shrubs 18 in in height every 10 ft along around the perimeter of the building. And then within the first year, you have to have that ground cover. Um has to be matured, flower beds, that type thing. Um th this is typically installed prior to our

certificate of occupancy. all of this. In addition to that, um, in the new development code, instead of putting the trees in the right of way, uh, they're required, in addition to all that other stuff, um, they're required to put a tree large a large tree in the front yard within 10 feet of the front property line. Now, where that goes, you know, the developer can shift that wherever the homeowner or he wants to put it, but it has to be on their property now. And of course, as the code goes now, we don't go back and inspect single family. If the homeowner comes and cuts those trees down, there's no requirement that they we we don't require that they maintain them. And this is just a little another little caveat that um unless you work in it, you don't really know is city code. There's a section in there that does requires all sites of disturbance greater than 20 acres have a phasing plan reviewed and approved by the city engineering department. So when you see clear cutting, they're only only going to let them open up 20 acres at a time. And then if if they do more like down at the hive, there's a phasing plan so the plant so that the plan behind them is stabilized and that's sediment erosion control mainly then and I don't know you know we talking about tree preservation you know what what is the post development requirements. What do we have in there after the CO is issued,

we're gone, the developer is gone. How does it has to be maintained? You know, it has stumps, tree parts, litter, brush, all that has to be gone and disposed of in accordance with city code. In other words, they get to keep the yard clean. And this we we look at on commercial sites more so than residential. All of the landscape that's required to be maintain required to be there um is required to be maintained. Um if it is gone, it can be required to be replaced. Um this is not something that staff has prioritized or that the city has really done in the past. Uh but I think where it says at all times and is appropriate for se was to be maintained in a neat and orderly manner in a healthy vigorous and attractive state. Um I think that gives us you know if we require we could require them to replace trees that may have been removed or died over a period of time. Um, and this one says you will remove dead, diseased, deteriorated plants and replace at the next planting season. And the next planting season is is important because you you realize the plant is dead in the summer when everything's green and it's brown. But when it's 100° out there, you don't want to be planting trees. So cut it down, plant it back the next planting season. Problem there is you have to stay behind the property owner because they tend to forget. And landscape areas have to be kept free of trash, litter, weeds. Basically, it

has to be kept clean. And if after 3 years uh additional plannings need to be made for it to form an effective screen um it can be required or if it's not being maintained additional types of screening could be required by the planning director. I don't know if us going ever going back on that and all landscape this one's a biggie. All landscape areas have to be protected from vehicle encroachment. In other words, if it's um not a parking lot, it's some place where trees are planted, they're not allowed to be parking in there. This one is basically the standard for how trees and bushes are spo I say trees and bushes, how trees are supposed to be pruned. They're the ANC standard. um I is the uh normal standard that the professionals use and how to trim trees. And this one uh requires the landscape involves slopes, cuts, fields, terraces and they have to be graded to prevent erosion. Um and yeah, it has to be maintained to prevent erosion. And this says basically if if you're using existing um trees to get your um to get your canopy cover, you have to measure to the drip line of the tree. You don't get the the whole tree coverage. You just get actually on your property what's being provided. And you also have to do a tree preservation zone to pro protect that tree during the um construction process.

And that is a very important deal as we'll get through in tree preser tree preservation protecting the trees that you're going to pres preserve is important as not cutting them down. So the question is is you know this is kind of where we're at. And I didn't get into all the other landscaping and you know because I've I was trying to hit kind of the high points, but where do y'all want to go with it? And basically and and in drilling through looking at some ordinances trying to figure out where y'all wanted to go from last month, I realized that a tree preservation ordinance doesn't prohibit clear cutting. Uh but it regulates required by development. So, and I say that because um I want clear expectations of of where we're trying to go. Um and in a typical tree preservation ordinance, it divides the land into three categories. There's one that's woods. It's not being developed. It's just out there. How do you handle those? Uh those are the and then you get into the ones that's being developed and that's when you get into tree surveys that types the development the engineer and then postdevelopment you know how do you handle it after the developer's gone and into perpetuity. One of the common requirements for a tree preservation ordinance is one you have a list of protected trees. Now the list of protected we have a list of

approved trees at this time by the city horiculturist. These are the trees that can be used to get the um inches or the tree cover that's required by the ordinance. But what this is, it's a list of protected trees and that's a different list than an approved tree list. the protected trees go is a list of certain species and then whatever the ordinance the ordinance specifies a size of these trees that are required to be protected. In other words, if it if the tree is a half an inch around, it's probably not going to be protected. If it's a 4 inch tree, it probably around it probably will be or you know those typically are. So one one is the size of those trees. And then you also require tree survey. That's the civil engineers going out and they're doing a survey of where every protected tree is at on that lot and the size of each tree on that property to determine how many inches are going to have to be removed for the development to move forward. And then the code requires how many inches of those inches have to be replaced. Right now we do not have a tree fund. A lot of a lot of ordinance have a tree fund so that if you can't replace a certain those inches, you pay in the tree fund. Um and then that money can be used by the city horiculturist plant trees throughout the city at various

public places. Right now under our ordinance is if you don't get a waiver, you don't get the project. So, um, typically what you have and and in the past they've come in and asked for a waiver from the planning commission and they've been granted. Um, now under the new ordinance that waiver would go to the board of zoning appeals. Then we go from the protected tree, we get to the big tree like and whatever those trees are, but you have a list of possible grand trees or it may be the same list of protected trees. And if it's over a certain size and it's larger than the protected size and what we're talking about is like oaks and um big oak trees and that type thing. And I I use the term grand. They could be his there's a lot of different terms you can use for that. So how whatever term y'all want to use is fine, but those have to be included on the tree survey, too. And they cannot be removed at all unless the planning director determines no alternative. In other words, if they're putting a shopping center in and this big grand tree is sitting in the middle of where they're going to build the building, then there's no alternative. If it's out in the parking lot somewhere, there probably is an alternative. One of the issues you get into there though that that that's tough from just my experience is you have to put protection around those trees because if you don't protect the roots um they'll damage and they'll event

it'll kill them. So, what you have is, if you're not careful, is they'll be building stuff like curbs and parking lots inside that protected zone. So, it moves in as the development goes. And so, the root barrier, it it's tough to police. You have to stay on top of it. And this is what I was getting to there. I got ahead of myself. It's got to be protected by the construction activities. They can't be um using it for a lay down yard. And um and really you have to be careful about allowing curb and gutter. You know, when they go in there to put the curb and gutter um that get move moves that protected barrier back. And so really a lot of times you don't have that protected barrier that's on the plans when you're getting to the field. So that is was my questions and discussions. Um you know it's kind of where we're at with the ordinance we have now. My questions is where do you all want to go from here?

So what we'll do is if there are any questions for Mr. Paradise, we'll do that and then we'll ask Jason to come forward if he has any things about his um Commissioner Wadell. She could share. And let me ask Tommy the on the end of your memo you had should undeveloped vacant land be regulated if post development is regulated should it exempt. Do you want us to have some conversation around those questions for you tonight as well? If if y'all are ready to have those conversations that would be helpful.

Okay. Um and we once we hear from Jason and Chelsea and see how that discussion goes. We'll see if that if you think that still works and then um that may also help give more direction for the city arborist as well as um any other guests we'll ask to to come present. Gotcha.

Okay. All right. So, any other questions for Mr. Paradise or discussion clarification needed? All right. Would you like to come up? Thank you all. Jason Winker, uh 672 Industrial Park Drive, Evans, Georgia. Appreciate the time and I hope that as y'all go through this, y'all, um I just ask that y'all would continue to involve us in the discussion. I know Tommy mentioned that you're going to have some other folks maybe from the city participating in the discussion, too, but we'd love to continue to have a a seat at the table. Um so, I sent Tommy um just a you know several reasons why we do this. We cut trees from a development standpoint and I think he sent it out to you all.

He did.

So I'm not going to read it line by line because you all have everything but I just you know want to go through the the process um in a bigger picture. I think we get the reputation of we we enjoy cutting trees and we we don't I mean it's all it's a business decision. It's not it's it's expensive. Um but there are financial reasons we do it. There are um constructibility reasons we do it and a lot of those are outlined in in what I sent. A lot of the reasons we cut trees are because the flat land has been already developed and it's very difficult to keep trees in place when you don't have flat land. It's much easier to do it down at the coast because you don't have to grade everything. You know, it's not as easy in this area anymore. We learn real quick from the market when we build a house that um the market doesn't like. And so we don't like to sit on houses for 6 months, 9 months, a year. You know, we we we get practice real fast. We don't like to practice a lot. Buyers like flat lots. And it's amazing even it's amazing to me how many buyers don't like trees. We'll have houses that are finished that we may have been able to keep trees in the back or the side and they'll come in and put in the contract. We want those trees cut down because we're worried about them. Or we go through um houses that have been recently completed and sold and see newly planted trees out at the curb ready for trash pickup because they'll go pull them all out as soon as we plant them and they move in the house. So, you know, there there's a there's a I think a big desire from buyers to have open yards and probably even more after the hurricane came through. Um, you know, another reason we do it, you know, Tommy Tommy mentioned this in in the importance in preserving the root system. Well, when you build a house by code, you cannot have a tree within a certain distance of a house. By code, you have to control the storm water

coming off that lot. So by the time you build the house and clear trees away from the footprint, clear trees for the swailes on the side and the rear lot line, you don't have anything left. So, you know, there's lots of other reasons why we why we um go in there and clear these trees and, you know, for a safety factor, too. Um clearing trees also is part of grading. And I know, you know, mass grading a lot of people don't like to see, but that's again that's the reason we do it is because there's no flat land left. We can we can fix water issues upfront. We can do it in a comprehensive manner instead of trying to grade each lot one at a time. We clear trees initially. We can get it all cleared and out of there. A lot of times we grind up, you know, the tops and the stumps and we use that as an additional mulch um barrier around the site. We're also doing that before the roads are paved. If we're doing if we're clearing each lot, you know, lot by lot as we go, then we're running dump trucks in and out for every lot on newly paved streets out to existing streets, and it's just a lot of extra wear and tear. Um, so those are just, you know, in a in a brief overview, um, some of the reasons that we do that. And again, I'd love to for us to to be able to stay involved in this process as y'all move forward. So, thank you.

Thank you. So just want to let you know certainly and that's part of why we want to continue the conversation. So we didn't want everybody to think that this was the only No. Sure. So we definitely will and really want to make sure that it is balanced as well. So would you know are planning to invite um a landscape architect from a firm that works with developers to to share what if you had a landscape architect who is a developer? That's f yeah. If you had that recommendation that you got one right in front of your Well, in addition to you Jason. So, in addition to you, um, so we'll Yeah. So, we'll we'll try to have a couple different Okay. Yeah. Because we know that you will always welcome and we'll share your voice. I love to come see y'all.

Yeah. And we appreciate you coming. No, we do because it makes it easier and we want um and again, by extending this conversation, other members in the community who may be passionate about it one way or another also have time to come and share. Yeah. Okay. All right. Thank you. All right. Thank you. All right. Are there any other um let's open it up to the public if there are any others in the public who'd like to share any thoughts initially. All right. None. You want to

I'll just speak really quickly since I obviously gave you guys a long memo. Um in general, I think I mean you can read what I said and a lot of these are just like ideas and concepts sort of what Mr. Paradise was alluding to of ways that we could potentially look into to see what to do in order to find a direction. Um, but I think overall my position on the issue is simply that um I think especially after the hurricane, we all know that a replacement tree is not really replacing the tree that was there to begin with. And I think that it it is very fair to say that it will be more timeconuming and more costly, but I think trees are the preservation of our trees and our culture in this area is important enough that it's worth those things. And so I just would encourage you guys to take a look at the list of things that I've I've written down that are possible options that a lot of these came from the Edgefield proposed tree ordinance. Um so our neighbors um to the side and I I do understand this is obviously a very complicated issue in many different directions. I look forward to the ways we all decide that we can be productive with it. Um just to make my own personal opinion that we can maybe discuss after about the post development for Mr. Paradise. I think that we have a very comprehensive post-development um ordinance for all landscaping and I am very specifically interested in the during development phase of what happens with trees. Um and so I think that you know sort of like the followup and and sending out code enforcement and the things that really require a lot of time um are not necessary because it's way less likely to find a tree at the street that was 25 years old than it is to find one that was just planted yesterday. So, I just think that we sort of eliminate a lot of the the issues that everyone has on both sides. Um, and maybe even possibly create a little less work for the planning department if we can keep in place what's already there. Um, a lot of the things like sewer and storm water trees help with those issues. So, it it's all in just sort of how we frame

it. And, um, I think trees are really important and especially ones that have been here a long long time. And I think it's worth maybe a little bit of a headache to figure out how to to preserve some of them. All right. Thank you. Um and okay, let maybe we can start since you brought it up if there is um any are there any concerns or interest in discussing land that is yet to be developed. So vacant lots open. I guess Mr. Paradise. If you just have a vacant land, can you just clear all the trees off of it if you don't have any reason for it?

Yes, ma'am. I mean, because people sell I mean, people sell lumber, so that's not a Yes, I think that's worth discussing. Okay. So,

all right. So, vacant lots and then um and then two, clearly I think there's interest in developed or developed land that is being developed. Correct. All right. And then what about um postdevelopment which is and and I think we have some post development and it's required for certificate of occupancy for um before you get yeah your certificate of occupancy but I think Mr. Paradise's question was what around do we want to get into single family at all? Um,

yeah,

in having worked for a builder, developer, selling real estate, um, in my mind's eye, I'm thinking more of the grand tree. I'm not thinking of the little four caliber or whatever because I, you know, I get the cut and grade. I understand all of that. But personal experience, there was instanc instances where, you know, you knew what your plat was and maybe you had a tree that was like right in the middle of the property line. didn't, you know, interfere with water flow or anything like that. And maybe it was a 100 foot tall tree with well over a whatever required canopy and and it didn't interfere with the footprint of the house. um it added to the character of the neighborhood and if you keep one of those out of you know and clearcut everything else you know the the small stuff but so I think in a residential application um I think it's definitely worth looking at because I do think there's some some compromise in there developers

okay so that's with developers but now with with postdevelopment and single families oh yeah do we because I was just going through to get that for first and then we can back back into the I like the idea of having if single family residential a grand tree protection you've got a 36 inch live oak I don't think to chop it down okay so postdevelopment

a good reason of coming to the commission and saying I'm expanding my garage or if you come to me with an arborist that says the tree is dying it's fine just to cut clear cut out large tree Okay. So, postdevelopment and then um I guess we don't need to burden city staff with having to look at every tree that's getting that's what I was going to ask the process then because we because because but the grand tree requirement trees over 24 in that are live oaks oaks or cedars should have some say.

So, just to make sure. So, and so that we can include this in the discussion and ways to think about it. What would um implementation of that look like? Right? So, we're not talking about from a developer perspective, but I got a big old tree in my yard. I'm terrified. We just had the hurricane. I'm getting the rest of these trees cut. A, how would you even know? Right? So, are we talking about a permitting process for them to have to come do a tree of a certain size? If not, then are we talking fine? What? So, just to to be clear that that's what we're doing and getting into. I just want to make sure

just as a little bit of a I guess contrary opinion to that, I'm not necessarily sure that if it's a 25-year-old tree on your private property that you own that you should have to come and ask me. It's just your land. That's why I think that we should have some consideration for individual homeowners and lot sizes of a certain size. I do understand that if you are terrified because you have three big trees in your backyard from the hurricane and you want to cut those down, that's your property and I think you should be able to do that. But I don't think the the developer should be able to come in and cut down the 25-year-old tree before you ever move in because it's not his property or it won't be hopefully.

Now, um Dr. Croft, if I could interject a minute,

whatever comes out, we need to keep it needs to be simple. Um and so that because remember when you're talking about single family residential these regulations, you know, the developers, civil engineers sitting back here, they understand the regulations. They work with them day in day out like we do. But the homeowner, he's not going to understand it. So it needs to be simple. Um, so you know, so if and I guess what I'm saying is is I would suggest not lot size, not lot sizes because that's so iffy. You know, if if you're going to regulate single family, you regulate them. If if you're going to exempt them, exempt them. Um, but lump them together so that it's easy for the public to understand.

Okay. So maybe what we should do and then you all can tell me um is let's try and work on vacant and developed first and if we come to some agreements and definitions around grand trees and then we can go from there because I don't want us to get caught up and get distracted on single family because I'm sure we will have a packed house um if we tell the folks they can't cut down trees after hurricane. So we just need to some folks are still cleaning up. So I I think we just need to um maybe if everyone is okay with that, focus on fake and develop first and then we'll discuss. Is that amanable? Okay. All right, Miss Paradise, we got one big couple big questions down.

Y Okay. All right. Um so we got one and two. Um so permitting process and fees for removal again would that be applicable to so in reference to the the two classes that we just discussed right okay all right so I think there's some agreeance around that um and then a discussion rather

clear and then um one of the things do we want to include possible additional buffer requirements between single family develop And and this is one of the things that came we we have buffer requirements. No doubt about it. Um but what we don't have is undisturbed buffer requirements. And it's just like at the hive. I got a call. They've cleared all the way to my yard to to the property line and there's supposed to be a buffer there. Well, there is. and and they will go back and replant that buffer according to the landscape plan. It's not an undisturbed buffer. Is there some places that you may want to put undisturbed buffers in the code? And um you know with single family residential maybe buffers of a certain size between subdivisions. Um because that is where we get a lot of complaints from is whenever they start grading next door or you know out from the street where people can sit. Yeah. That's just an idea that was um given to me. I think Columbia County might do something like that. But anyway, that's just something if y'all wanted to look at Sorry, I didn't have a mic on. So, yes, we would like more information on that, please. Are there any other questions or things that you need for direction in

terms of um subsequent conversations?

Uh, no, ma'am. I will see if I can get an arborist or have somebody uh to speak to you next month. Um and I'll start drilling into this and and doing some research and whatever research y'all want to forward to me. I would ask that if you want something included for um the commission if y'all could have that to me the Monday or the week before the meeting. I forget what those dates are. Um because the agenda goes out the Wednesday before your meeting. That way I can get it in the agenda packet. Anything after that would be emailed to you and put on the dis. We want to get the information out there. We don't want to sit on anything.

There anything everybody all hard clear for next steps or any things that you all want to make sure you're included?

Just a a general question. So developer A comes in and says, "All right, this is our approved plat, whatever, and we're getting ready to go in and cut." And I know some of the comments have been, you know, we don't want to put too much stress on the city staff if we enforce this. So what can you tell us what that looks like from the city staff? Is someone physically going out there to say, "Okay, I got my eyeballs on it. Now I'm going to issue this." What does that look like? What is that process? They will one of our code enforcement guides, they will um in in in in the plans with the tree survey, there will also have to be a landscape plan and and those plans will have to show and in the grading plan those trees that are protected and there'll be a ring around the tree depending on the size of the tree will be the bigger the tree, the bigger the ring. And that ring is where the tree protection orange fencing goes around to keep the grading and everything out of the area. So the code enforcement officer will have will need to go out there and walk through the woods and make sure yes, here's the tree. Here's the ring is 10. It's required to be 10 feet out is 10 feet out. Okay, this one's good. Go on to the next one. or sometimes they may protect it as a group if you got a group of trees together. But and then they will need to keep an eye on it during the construction process. Make sure that tree protection stays up and also um that they don't start using it as a layown yard and they don't encroach into it. And from the um review um standpoint

um in the review process we will have to be diligent on minimizing the impacted impact on the protected trees. Basically we curb and gutter usually. I think one more thing to add, looking at preserving of existing trees, especially the larger ones. Can we look at giving developers more incentive to save them? Whether they count for more a larger percentage. I don't want to just say, hey, now you we we got all these we're requiring all this landscape, but we're not we're also not going to give you anything additional for saving these large trees.

Well, that's a great idea. So like a credit some sort of credit back to that's a great idea and and I would certainly think that would you know go toward their canopy cover the existing tree. Now, are you talking about canopy cover pl Let me research a little bit more than that. I mean, I'll look at um North Augusta public safety because I'm familiar with that. We saved a ton of large Theodore cedars, live oaks across the front of that property

and we had to go back with a ton of small trees to still meet the requirement. Some of them are heavily shaded out by the large trees that we're saying. So, I think there could be more credits given And I agree just because we do have a great code with what we have to put in, but sometimes in some of these commercial developments, it's so much and then they don't get maintained and it ends up looking a little so if we have this these grand trees that have saved, I think you're accomplishing the goal with that. So I I think that's a great idea, too. And so and also um if you could help us think about this I guess does it make sense to would those credit differences would they need to be different if it was commercial if it was residential if it was because I I think those would have different implications requirements. So just I think food for thought. Anything else we like to There may be some more thoughts started.

I think this is a good start. Okay. All right. Thank you.

All right. Thank you. And we're gonna have a balance. We're gonna have a balance presentation and conversation. All right. All right. So, um, Mr. Paradise, we're going to, uh, do your November staff report, but, um, before you do, just wanted to, um, a thank you all for, um, voting me to serve as chair again next year. and thank my and thank my vice chair for stepping in and his leadership as always and look forward to serving with him again another year um as well. And Tommy would like to make sure that as we close out the year um I always thank your team but wanted to make sure that I thanked Cully, Phillip, Paris, Phyllis, Estaca, Landon and you Mr. Paradise by Name um for the end of the year, for all of the work that you all do and for um all of the conversations that you all have and the ways in which you make our jobs much easier as you help us move North Augusta forward. So, I wanted to thank you and thank them for all that they do um every day u for us as well. So, please share your staff report at this point. We

we will. And um I I apologize again. And I'm bad about not have being prepared with staff reports except to say that November was um going through getting to the final parts of the final plat that was um kind of the title wave of those that came in. And now it kind of slacked up and now it's starting to pick up again as um the engineers and the developers as uh Collie puts it are cleaning off their desk for their Christmas holidays. They are sending their piles to us.

So again uh thank you all. I wish everyone um wonderful holidays and a great new year and we will see you in January. And so with that um journ so moved