Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Good afternoon everyone. Welcome to the November 4th meeting of the city of Myrtle Beach Planning Commission and calling meeting to order. I'm going to start with a roll call. Sharon here. Joe here. Austin, he's absent and we haven't heard from him. Okay, thank you. Uh Danielle excused. Betty here. Bill here. Zeb is excused. And Paul here. Thank you everybody for being here. Uh we're going to move quickly to the first item. Pen, do you want to tell us about that, please?

Uh yes, ma'am. The applicant sent an email in requesting to uh continue this item until the next meeting. Okay. Request. So if uh I can have a motion, please. I would like it. I'll make a motion that they request for approved for continuance. Okay. I have a motion from Paul. I'll second it. Second from Sharon. All any further discussion minutes. Does anybody want the minutes? I went right past them. You didn't let me You didn't let me talk about them. Like this. That was it. That's all you could I was afraid get [laughter] down.

Really? Um let's go back to the minutes. I'm sorry. I'm backing up. I'm backing up. Approval of the minutes, please. I'll make a motion. We approve the minutes. So good. Thank you, Paul. And I'll second them. Thank you, Sharon. All any other further discussion? All in favor say I. Okay, we have approval on that. Okay, back to where we were. Uh Ken said that we have a continuence. The applicant asked for a continuence. So once again, I have a motion from who was motion Paul to continue

and a second from Sharon. Any further discussion? If not, all in favor say I. Moving on to the next item. Kelly, are you doing this? Yes, ma'am. Okay, thank you.

Thank you. This is um request from Robert S. Jackson agent to annex approximately 65 acres off 29th Avenue North um and to reszone from Ory County Highway commercial to the 29th Avenue North Spiritual Center. Here is an aerial view of the requested annexations in blue. the current zoning map and the proposed annexations again in relation to the zoning map. This is the second request from Robert S. Giten agent to annex approximately 3,394.77 square ft off 29th Avenue North entry zone from Ory County Highway commercial to the 29th Avenue Spiritual Center Park. a aerial view map highlighted in purple, the current zoning map, and the proposed annotation in relation to the zoning. Finally, a 29th Avenue Spiritual Center PUB request from Robert S. Gitton, agent, to create a planned unit development North Oak Street, 29th Avenue North, and 27th Avenue North, known as the 29th Avenue North Spiritual Center PU. Here is a boundary map showing the proposed PUD and the boundary map in relation to those previous proposed annexations. A quick overview, this will be the continued mission of the Habad of Myrtle Beach. It'll consist of a traditional

school and worship center, a mikvah and long-term housing and short-term rental units. It'll have a total area of 6.4 acres consisting of eight parcels. And the 8,000 square foot spiritual center will be the PUD's anchor. It'll have four apartment floors on top. Some dimensional requirements have stayed the same from workshop. However, please note that the minimum front setback has changed from 20 ft to 10 ft along the perimeter of the putt and the exception will be that top golf boundary setback which will remain 20 ft. These five phases may be developed simultaneously in one or more subphases and in any order. Total number of residential units will not exceed 86 units within 37 separate buildings. Total bedrooms will not exceed 232. As you can see from the chart, there will be five phases. A zoning comparison summary between 29th Avenue Spiritual Center PUB and Highway commercial district. A minimum side and rear yard setbacks for HC1. The 29th Avenue Spiritual Center PUB parking standards table. Please note the minimum total parking spaces of 225. And finally, our findings of fact required. I'm happy to answer any questions that you may have for me. The applicant is also in the room.

Okay. Thanks, Kelly. Okay, commissioners. Bill, thank you.

Um, the request, it showed us current school. shows center, community center. Those are all going to stay as you understand it in an existing place or is there any is because based on map I think I'm seeing a new school building built on the property near the golf part. So they're looking at Okay. So in none of the phases does it describe that being done. So I know that we talked about that all it says is

first phase will be existing school and worship center. Okay that's to be built. So see the rest of this residential. Now what does it say about a new school built a new abot center new banquet? Whatever you understand was when when it was That's a really great question for the applicant. They didn't say that. He can further explain that they weren't going to be in any order. Well, it's not showing those being done in any phase. The phases may be developed simultaneously in one or more subphases and in any order.

Um I I think if you look at the the narrative that they provided, they do call the new school. schools going to remain in operation until such time that they do build that new school. Um my reading the first phase would be when they were to do that the worship center and the new school building the first phase. Well, they can do any of the phases at any time as they've written, but that is the phase that would be encompassing all that. It says existing schools. Exactly.

Make sure that I think that's your question. or existing. Is that Yeah, I just want to know what's going to be built when and which phase they determine. Now, it doesn't show in that phase part of it. It doesn't show those new buildings. So, he'll clarify that. That's something that needs to be cleaned up. Yes, sir.

What other anything else for Kelly? Is there any particular reasons when we look at the exhibits it doesn't show the whole landscaping for the whole entire just section only and doesn't show the comprehensive review that another good question for

this was But this was just they're conceptual. They're conceptual to that extent of course is the full house for the

and this was just received by your department.

Yeah, this that was received yesterday. But again, this is conceptual documentation. So they're just trying to give you something that's a little bit illustrative to show what their intentions are that landscape plan will have to go before CAB for final approval. I understand the final approval, but we in order to prove don't we need to see the whole property. We need to see all the landscaping, all the lighting, all the signage, everything.

Complete plan. Meaning, I mean, they're showing this as a portion, but not the complete. Right. Well, so what you're approving is the language and standard for what they would have to achieve, which is part of the zoning code, what they're actually written in the document. Again, this is illustrative and conceptual. They will have to meet the standards that you're approving here, but the a shrub might not be here. It might be I understand. So what you're what you're saying is you look under the landscape buffering open space requirements for the entirety of the bud. This is for the entirety of the whole bud.

Landscaping will meet or exceed all landscaping buffering up space requirements as described in article 9 landscaping [laughter] and tree protection of the 2019 city of Myrtle Beach zoning ordinance. So the landscaping requirements for this PUB are the same landscaping requirements for any development within the city of Myrtle Beach. Right. Uh so so that's when whenever Cameron is telling you that is what will be decided by the community appearance board. The level that they have to meet is in the text of the PUD by the ordinance and that is what will have to be approved whenever they go before the community appearance board. Um correct in regard to that

but in all these exhibits I don't see anywhere they're existing properties being shown what's going to happen to it potentially. I mean well then that may be something that you need to ask for if that's what you're seeking because uh as far as we as a staff are required to go he answers that whenever he falls under the article 9 in the body of the PUB that the article 9 standard will be adhered to I'm not speaking of article 9 which is landscaping I'm speaking the actual development for the whole Thanks. [snorts]

And like I said, that's something that you as a board, if that's something you want to see, that's something that you as a board can ask for. Thank you. Appreciate that. Okay. Anything else, Bill? Not right now. Okay. Any other commissioners would like to comment? Sharon, Kelly, questions for Kelly. Yeah. And if they don't fall through and within a timeline, whatever, this would or go back to or county or would the land stay in the city and be mum. Are you asking about the annexation part?

This is a very good question. that could be addressed by go ahead and and annexing the property and assigning it a mumm on the classification and then just putting the grand dunes puds on the classification property on it with the adoption of the PUD is how that could be handled. Okay. And just to clarify the text of the putt reads that this put if this pud shall terminate each parcel within the shall refer to HC1 zoning designations. I would say within the city, but the annexation stay. Yes. Because we're addressing them separately. Therefore,

that's actually answers the question. Okay. Anything else, Sharon? Betty, no. Joe, no. Paul, no. Okay. Um, well, Kelly, you've done a good job. I think we're going to move to the applicant now. Is that okay? All right. Hello, Mr. Gayton. Thank you, Madam Chairman. Well, we we we have a lot of questions, so that that's just the beginning. So, can we start with uh Phil's question? Sure, please.

Yeah. So, this is similar to what we talked about last at the workshop. The reason we don't attach detailed landscape drawings, the same reason we don't attach elevations is because if they become part of the zoning ordinance, then when CAB makes a change, I would have to come back and amend the D. So that's why they're not included in there. You did bring up a great point last week when we were talking about Richard's flower shop on the corner and what was going to happen with that and your concerns over that. There were two cases that you were correct on. one was there's only 14 ft there that's outside of the rideway which is why you see that that boundary changed from 20 ft to 10 ft. So they've already been to CAB with a conceptual non-aggenda item to review for that building and what they're doing is putting a new facade on it. They're putting two parking spaces that would run parallel with the building so you would not back out into traffic anymore and then they'll have a buffer still between there and the rightway itself. So that that was correct and you pointed that out last time. So that that is one thing that's already in front of CAB as a non-aggenda item. So they are working on that elevation in particular. You had a question I think about the school. So there's two steps to that. The existing school will be renovated and then ultimately when the PUD is built out, there will be a new school building that will replace the existing school building. There's two steps to that.

Okay, Bill, does that answer your question? Any questions from the last time? Well, then I need to go back to staff to ask if they don't show where this [cough] [clears throat] new school build is going to be built. It's not Does that provide a problem? There's a map. Does that provide what now?

It doesn't provide a problem to again as we talked last time. It's in the narrative. So that is part of the combat club. They do have to build a new school building in the future. Um if it would be more clear, we can implement the language with the phasing to make sure it's specifically called out. So these exhibits are then valid to Your text is the text isn't part words that No, it actually it gives it quite a bit of flexibility, does it not, Mr. D? I mean phase one may be phase four.

No, I'm saying it's where the school be located. Is there ability to be able to put it anywhere on the property or is it going to be designated?

Is that designated where the is going to be it's not as we talked about last time there are definitely some financing challenges in the way the PE gets developed and evolves. We anticipate that the the last building will be the large building which is also the most expensive one but that could change depending on what the donations look like and how that comes about. That could be early. If that happens early, then it would make more sense for the school to migrate towards that building rather than stay out on Oak Street. And I think Zeb brought up a good point last time also is that ultimately when the PD is complete, there's a high likelihood that they're going to want to control the perimeter of it. I don't know if you recall his quote was that he wanted to make sure no fence or wall was within 5t of the boundary of the property. So we revise that to address that as well.

If if you put you also added may may put in a fence or a wall. That's right. So it's not absolute. That's right. Anyway, if we do, [clears throat] it would have to be at least 5 ft off the boundary of the property.

Would would it the would there be landscaping front of that wall between that and the sidewalk? Is there room for that? Yes, to the extent that there wasn't any additional rightway acquired since majority of the perimeter borders on 29th Avenue and on Oak Street, there could always be additional rightway acquire acquired. But as long as the boundary of the property moves, then we'd still have to keep that fence or wall 5T off the boundary wherever that boundary falls. Okay. Well, you have uh truncated the the setbacks too. So, I mean, is that absolute? I mean, that's [clears throat]

So, part of that was, as we talked about last time, that border with Top Golf is going to be difficult. So, if you look in there, you saw an example of what that boundary buffer would need to look like. It's more layered than any other boundary because you got to have a layer below that goes all the way up to the canopy trees to try to avoid some of that light exposure there. I don't think you can have essentially a buffer in less than 20 ft. So that 20 ft has to remain. So the top golf section stays that way, but you're you're truncating the rest down to 10 ft,

right? Because we only have 14 ft in some places and even less, but we don't have any more any less than 10 feet anywhere on the perimeter. So that's why, as an example, if we' stayed 20 feet on the Richard's Flower Building, we'd have to demo that building, which is not the plan. So,

okay, commissioners, continue asking questions. I have a list, so I want you all to get in here. U so hopefully you get all my questions answered before you get to me. So, uh, Bill, you're digging. Do you have And you have a lot of writing. Um, so help me with this. I might have missed it in exhibits because this is the first time we've seen it where I can actually see it. I did forget that you said I don't know. I could read that. I took two magnifying glasses of what they [laughter] sent. I still could not read it. It's not legible.

I thought they were coming with the packet, but I don't know what happened. But anyhow, um, so help me take through when you move the school to the new place, what's planned for the existing property where the school's at now because it's not show I couldn't find it. Is it in this exact same?

No, it's not. [cough] Change out [clears throat] there because we really don't know what that front will end up being. Right now, the Richard's Flower Building is planned to be the commissary as we talked about. It's also going to be the welcome center because what they don't want is to have a guest or a potential guest going internal to the PUB where it's essentially a worship center. So that's what the perimeter will be. Theoretically, the reason I ask this because we talk about how the parking squenched is they may develop this thing as it's showing and that could be if there is issues with parking

that land that's not showed as developed might have to turn into that excess. Okay. So, the question I have asked is if you try to build something on land, would you have to would they have to come back to the commission where they haven't yet proposed anything to be built? because you got your you got your list of permitted uses. So they can they can plop them anywhere. Okay. So that land could be available to require addition parking. So right now based on the current plan, we need 192 spaces and we're providing a minimum of 225 to make sure that we've got some extra in case something happens. [clears throat]

But I think what everybody would like to see is that the main building would become the focus of the whole project and the perimeter less so because you can't control the perimeter nor can you create a worship atmosphere from the perimeter. So those those buildings that are there do buffer the internal spiritual center part of it but they may very well be demoed at some point not replaced if that's what the larger building demands. So is Richard's is the flower shop is going to be a welcome center. So that's absolutely staying. Is that an absolute?

Yes, that building standing. It's got two functions. It functions as what we're calling the commissary which provides the meals for the students in the school. But it also leaves a place where if you're coming to the project and you're not sure where you're supposed to go, you would come there for information. rather than what we don't want is people walking in or wandering into the synagogue trying to figure out where they're supposed to sit.

So, it's going to be an absolutely gorgeous I mean th this is one of the highlights of Myrtle Beach. This this this is a beautiful corner for all of this being developed. This is a wonderful uh uh creation that's going to happen. But I want Richard I want the floral shop not to look like it looks now because I think that's the feedback. The non-aggenda item at CAB got that same feedback pretty clear that the frontage at Oak Street and we talked about it last time. If you could ever acquire the other lots between Richards and P boundary on 29th that would be ideal. They are pursuing that but today they don't have any commitments to be able to

So Mr. And all of that back out parking on Oak is going to it goes away. Correct. That's that's gone. That's that's wonderful. So where does someone who goes to the information center? I have a lot of questions about parking, but I don't want to get in everybody else's way if they have questions uh before that. So So everything would be internal except those two spaces we talked about. So as an example, if you're coming down 29th, you would take a right in front of the Richard's building. There' be two spaces there to go in and get your information and directions on where you're going. And then you would pull back out in the traffic facing traffic. When you say pull in, where I mean, are you still backing out?

No. You come off of 29th and take a right just short of Oak Street to the front of the building. Okay. And then when you leave that building, you would pull back on to Oak Street. Wouldn't go back to 29. We'll have to wonder if two parking places is adequate for that center for just for welcome and information. So there's no students that are driving and anybody who's coming to the worship center is going internal. Right. Right. It's it's not like a it's not like a condo project where everybody checks in on Saturday and everybody checks out on Friday or Sunday and Saturday. It's not the same thing.

And one of the question [cough] [clears throat] might have been as so today they have an average of about 300 worshippers worshiping with them. When this is complete they think that number will increase to around 400 at build out of the school currently has 160 students that are there. That's gone up over time but incrementally there's never been a big jump. It's just grown as the community's grown and they they anticipate the same thing will continue to happen there.

I guess my concern was uh you just mentioned if if the congregation grows to 400 or the student population grows somewhat uh have you taken in consideration that increase in your parking because I applaud you for putting it on there but I couldn't tell how many parking space 225 225

there are there are a lot of challenges I'm glad you're talking about parking there's a lot of challenges here to me for parking I I don't like to overpark anything because nobody needs more paving, but I certainly don't think that we should have underparked where it filters into the neighborhoods. That's very concerning. That's what I was That was my concern. We're going to have enough parking so people don't have to park out on the street or go into another neighborhood. That was my concern.

It's It's very I mean, I bought it up last time and you did and you did, you know, did do the little chart that signifies but there's I I my concern last time and remains to now there is going to be a staff you're going to have a common service you're going to have housekeeping where where are all those people going to park they're not going to walk to work sure so if you remember we talked about that last time one of the things that makes this unique is on their holy days and holidays they can't drive. So they're not bringing a car to this facility.

So the staff the staff also it's all the house housekeeping I mean the people that come from

so housekeeping as an example would not be service during the peak holy days or holy hours for a couple of reasons. One because you don't want non worshippers interfering with that experience for your worshippers. So those will be scheduled during the downtime which is when it makes the most sense and they won't interfere with the worship process. It it's again I think we're so in tune in Myrtle Beach to watching what happens with condominiums and this is not the same. One of the things that made them want to address this is because like the rest of the community, they have an aging population and that aging population is not going to be able to walk to get there on holy days and a lot of them won't be able to provide their own meals or the other necessities that they would need from a community of believers. So the whole point was can we figure out a way to take care of our own congregation rather than having them deal with it somewhere else.

And it's it's a a marvelous thing that's happening. [clears throat] My concern is that uh for parking, if you're not concerned about the staff who which has to be staffed somehow with housekeeping and cleanup crews and uh everything that takes place in the commissary, food preparation, uh there has there has to be a staff for these things. Uh so even though they're not they're still going to be there in high holy days, the staff. Correct. I mean the sheets need to be cleaned. I mean

room housekeeping will not be there on holy days. That those would be third party services. So that as we said the current plan would require 192 spaces. The reason we've got a minimum of 225 is to take into account even on holy days when it would be staffed for the synagogue not third party service providers that would be there. then there's room to accommodate that additional growth. Would this be viewed as uh in some form in some uh area a retirement community like a covenant towers or a brightwater?

There are elements of this that are exactly that. there's a a place to accommodate your older worshippers who aren't able to take care of

if you go to Covenant Towers which isn't far from this location. Uh half the people do have cars and when you go to visit them because there's a staff there, a kitchen staff and housekeeping, you can't find a parking space. It looks like an abundant parking area, but I spent visiting there many many years, so I know there's not there's not enough parking once the staff is there and half of the homeowners have their own vehicles. So, it's it's it's challenging and then they start edging out onto the street into the other neighborhoods. That is my concern. That's that's the that's what I see. I I as I said I don't want to overp park anything. I don't want a lot of pavement, but I certainly don't want it bleed over for parking.

Yeah. And I think you see that today if you look at what's going on in the existing synagogue, which also has food service for their worshippers there. You don't see a parking problem today for the [clears throat] same reason. They're already providing the services that they're providing here, but what they aren't providing is somewhere to house these worshippers who either want to be there for the short term just for holy days or actually want to use this as a permanent residence where they essentially a retirement home.

Are there are there any long-term care facilities within There's no memory care section. There's none of that. It's straight. It's just straight apartment, condo, whatever you want to refer to it.

It would be similar to the independent living portion of port side is what I would compare it to where you you have your own space but you don't have a nursing staff that's coming in. You have somebody that's checking only on you obviously because if you don't show up for meals then somebody would realize something's wrong. We need to check on them. or you have somebody if there were an emergency that you could call and it would be right there. But no, it's not it's not a nursing facility. Okay. Does anybody have any Okay, go ahead.

Reason you won't have a parking issue right now is because where the school's at, there's there's 32 spaces. 22 were in the car when I drove up today before coming to the meeting that were there. So that's 16 extra spaces. At the center there's 18 parking spaces. So that's 34 spaces right there. And that's why they don't have the problem. I think you've already gotten understand why the concern's [snorts] at. They have the ability right now could alleviate that by just saying we're going to designate because you got to remember this publicly based upon two how many parking spaces? Well, there's a chart for the uses 225 225 withund 92

required. Okay. So that's 30 spaces. [snorts] If they get to the point they completely full develop this, we know it's going to be busier one way or another. You have a bigger school. You're going to have a more community activity. You're going to have more people at the commissary. It's going to be bigger. It's going to be grander. And so that's where I think the difficulty is at because basically where they're at today is just accommodating where they're at today and it's doing a pretty good job but it's not allowing any leeway for growth that they were predicting it to be. So that that's a hard hurl and we may be it may be totally wrong but we don't want to be wrong the wrong way because this puzzle going to be approved

right for those spaces and that means there has to be no spaces for the remaining here's the way you are going to Mr. fact you are going to have lecture you've mentioned lecturers and special events and uh destination weddings this is all in

so here here's the way I would think about that in term of what Phil just said you got 35 spaces there that are accommodating 300 worshippers today so we're talking about adding 100 worshippers but adding 90 additional spaces 190 additional spaces so I think we're more than accomodating the growth for what we anticipate, which is another reason why we put the minimum 33 spaces above the required is because we know that we're going to need some flexibility there. And that the current standard, even though we're accommodating 300 worshippers, may not be the same once you move to 400 worers.

We want we want this to be Wonderful, right? I mean, to me, this is one of the most exciting things that we've seen come uh, you know, for the community. So, we want it to be great for everybody, including the surrounding neighborhoods, to be beautiful, to be inviting, to be welcoming, to to have, you know, a sustained life of generations there. So if you decide to build on that property that's been undesated, it's still the same parking requirement.

Well, it's a minimum of 225 versus when you look at what's in the parking table. Then the uses are already accommodated in there. In theory, the only thing they could do would be add more residential on that perimeter, which has its own parking standards, which would then eat up the freeboard we got between the 192 and the 2. So they would have to Okay. So that's that's what I want to make sure if they when they develop the park that's not been designated, additional parks would require for that. Is that correct based on PU language? Yeah. If we add bedrooms, you got to add parking because there's a table for those.

So the bedroom standard there is based upon what they showed is built. So when they build something else, it has to be increased. falls within that use table which they can do. There's then an equivalent parking standard for those uses that they would and they met the parking standard based upon that table. I was looking well for just the res

but there is there is quite a bit of flexibility. So what happens with [clears throat] that flexibility? does the parking you know what h if there's if there's enough flexibility something else can happen building wise that challenges the parking I think it's important to keep in mind the minimum is 225 the end of the day they have to provide 225 spaces above that if they increase the number of doors or they are required for short-term accommodation one parking space per bedroom above and beyond that 225 so 225 is for regardless that is the enforceable number that we have. Anything additional would have to be above that number. So that wiggle room of 30 doesn't ever go down. It only

put that language in the document. It is already. I know what the table says. Any Can we move on from parking? We can come back to if somebody else has questions. Is everybody okay moving on from parking? Okay. I We're not trying to hammer, but we want it to be so wonderful. That's our goal.

As I said last week, I thought that workshop was one of the most productive we've had when I've had anything fun at all. And and the comments were thoughtful and hopefully they were addressed thoughtfully.

No, you you've done a a really nice job. Let's be honest. I mean, I hope you have with your team, whoever that was, we want more of him or her. Uh, can we talk about other are there things like bus pickup? Uh, and I mean, because I would like other retirement communities, they have vans that take everybody shopping and to the bank, in the grocery store, and everything. So, do we have availability for bus uh you know, van pickup? Also, are there bicycle racks because I assume that's part of the package and are there Uber pickup points and things like that for because if it it's kind of carless area. Uh so, are there things uh baked into this at all like that?

I have no problem addressing that. If that makes you more comfortable, we can certainly address that. From a programming standpoint, they're not far enough down the road that they've said every Saturday we're going to take the residents who can't take themselves wherever. Um, so there the men are going to want to go get haircuts and the women are going to get want to get their hair done. So just saying, yeah, I I' I'd be happy. I mean, I mean, I know not all of us have the same challenges.

Yeah, [clears throat] thanks. It's from being in front of this board. That's not [laughter] don't have those challenges anymore. But yeah, I think we can look at what port side did as far as accommodating those elements and incorporated in here. That's not an issue. Okay. Um, can we talk about open space because it said TBA so can we talk about that then? Sure. What is the TBA? I haven't gotten the engineers calculation on the open space yet. So, I don't have an answer.

I think you can assume from that that where it says that the minimum is 20% pvious surface that means that 20% is going to have to be green. for us, but it's not [cough] specifically set out as open space. So,

I I know that we have to talk about, you know, what um kind of public benefits. I know you didn't want internal public benefits, but we need to talk about what the external ones are other than the the cameras, the traffic light in at 29th on 29th Avenue and and things like that. Um there's also some storm water issues. Storm water issue, but that's required anyway, isn't it?

Well, now what what they're doing here is designed to accommodate that in the regional storm water detention facility that Bers and Chapen has. So it actually helped the whole 29th Avenue drainage situation all together. That public benefit is all outside the boundary of the project. There's no public benefit proposed internal. It's all outside. Okay. Does anybody else have any comments about public benefits, please? uh it has actually been addressed uh by staff at some I don't know there's so many pages here I can't page seven

thank you but a sta staff somebody wrote something that I thought was a good commentary what other things had to be addressed and also there is you have a monetary value and monetary value is not of our purview but this seems low to me but that's that's not for us to decide but if I get I don't think there's going to be anything left over

I was going to say if I get this putt approved that the originally proposed public benefit dollar be the first time in 32 years and I can see why yes where where's that page from page 33. Thank you. Um, thank you. Uh, the public works u was concerned about a few things. So, is there anything that you want to comment on that Cameron about those items for?

No. Okay. That Okay. Nobody wants to talk about anything. Wow. Amazing. Let's talk about maximum. Oh, you did. Thank you. And it's not that it's required. You don't want to ask it. It's if there was the need to be for fencing or something like that, where do you think their greatest concerns would be at from what you're see?

I miss that. Can you say fencing or wall if it was to be required? Where do you think the probably the areas that might be the most concerned based on the way it's being developed? definitely 29th and Oak. Um and I think you know the other part of this is I don't think they're through trying to acquire additional property to go into this PUD. So the other boundaries I don't think we'll ever get the traffic that 29th and Oak get. So those are it's similar to what we did on the J1 housing facility um on Mr. Joe White. is just you got to control that environment. Especially when you have an aging worship population and you have traffic that you don't control both pedestrian and vehicular on 29th and other. They're going to want to control that

can are you okay now? Yeah. Okay. Can we go to maximum height? Um you requested for You requested for the one building 60 ft. Uh and uh your staff said uh consider revising that language to allow the maximum overall to 60 just the the cargo for 42 feet in for the the residential seems unnecessary. If it's going to 60 ft 60 is easier to enforce. Yeah. Just from a review standpoint. That was my

Yes. I thought I thought it was a good a good point. So that's why I'm bringing it up. Does uh commissioners do you have anything that you wanted talk? I thought that was a good catch on that 60 foot for the whole Well, for simplicity sake I thank you. Um staff always looks for the enforcement side of it which is a lot tougher with two standards in there. I'm always trying to present to you all this is what our intention is. So we don't have any problem you make all over. I just wanted to be clear with you all that the residential portion would not exceed 42.

Uh and as Charles noted, the project has a 20 foot par perimeter setback. So those comments came in before the readressing of the 10 foot setback as we previously. So we're at 60 ft. There'll be a 20 foot requirement. I don't know. No, the 60 foot building is internal anyway. It's internal. So It's not that's not I'm just throwing it out. Question. Um, have you thought about signage and where it's going to be placed on 29 or wherever? Well, I think that welcome center piece of it is one thing that's driving it, which is why CF is already looking at that, right?

It's because that's going to be the easiest place to make people understand this is how you get there, right? No matter how good a job you do on giving directions, people are going to end up where they go. And like I said before, the synagogue that's there will be operating on an ongoing basis. That's not really where you want to drive people with questions, particularly during worship service. So if we go with the 60 ft on 29th Avenue, that whole road could be a 60 foot buildings put up there, 10 foot setback.

So all all of the buildings therefore though the residential units would all have to have elevators, correct? Because they're not usable during high holy days, the Shabbat. So you can't you have to use the stairs, right? Just saying. So they couldn't be that tall. It's a long walk.

You've seen the architectural proposal. So um that's I don't get to pick what the product type is, but I think understanding all those challenges could drive the product type. But right now they're fairly confident that both the units that are enclosed in the bigger building and the smaller residential buildings are viable for their office. The the multitude of individual structures is is a very interesting concept. Can can you explain that why we need 37 structures? Well, if you look at it, some of those are the detached residential units, the majority of those. And then you still have Richard's Flower, which is detached. You have the school building, which is detached. You have two structures on the annexation parcels on 29 that are detached. So, by the time you include all those, get to 37 total buildings is not a huge.

I mean, but what why why 37 buildings? I I think there's I mean, discounting those that exist. Yeah. I mean, you could make all your residential attached, but as you know, a lot of people aren't interested in an attached product. They don't want to share a common wall, particularly if it's going to be a permanent residence. They they would prefer to have some separation between the So, are they do they become rental properties or lease properties or ownership?

There no proposed lines. So they would only be rental properties. They would not if unless you did it as a condominium, that's the only other way you could create separate ownership. You could not subdivide the lots, right? If you did that, then all the proposed standards would come back into play, which would really destroy the ability to create this project, right? So you see these the short terms as being those individuals and the main building part of actual long-term residential. Yes.

How many square how many square foot are the um the singles? You don't know about how many square foot that'll be? There's 232 total bedrooms, but I don't know how many square feet they are. So, if we go straight 60 ft, could a building be put all the way down 29th and 60 ft high? For a point of clarity, highway commercial, which is across the street, can you see the understand it set but then mum can be at zero setback at the rightway with the road which is in zone in there. So it's it's a zero it's a zero. So if this was in your eight,

but it would be it would be in in line with the element of height within the zoning classification with the surrounding area. Right. Depends on the heights. But what I'm asking is this and thank you for that because that helps understand what we're trying to do is if you change this building configuration and there's none of these single families here and go straight with the bigger building this way. Would they have to come back for approval for that? What I'm saying is say this building right here, they determine just do the building all the way like that all the way down 29th rather than making a new but they'd have to come back for approval for that type of change.

I'm not sure if they would have to come back for approval. They would have to show us show us all the change that to make sure that all the other requirements within the PUD are being met in regards to the parking requirements, landscaping and everything along those lines. Yeah. And I'm and that and the reason [clears throat] I'm bringing that is that that's a 60 foot right along that corridor and it's a 10 foot step back. It's non-restrictive what's happened around it. I just want to make sure I understood it that that could happen. I will say also that current vested on that property which is E is 180 foot maximum height. So there's this in theory still a step down considerable step down from what the vested right is. Goodbody. Thank you.

Okay. Well, have we exhausted all questions? Could you go through the chamber foundation and things like that for this? I I have no idea what they're doing in terms of that. Thankfully, I'm not on the fundraising side of it. [laughter] Well, you're on record now. You may be as soon as you say that out loud. That's right.

I have a question about return. We talked about this last time. um given a 10 year with a 5-year possibility revert to revision. Um apparently they feel there's some um there's a product out there for this possessible venture and I don't think they would be able to get the funding for it if it people they couldn't sell that. So I'm I'm struggling with why there needs to be a 10 year and a five more. Like you said, it takes about three years to get

everything straight and set, but you only got 89 units. So if you did 30 units a year in three years, starting with year

four, which is a very if you can't get 30 units a year by year four, they're going to be in trouble anyhow as far as trying to develop it. Well, I think it depends on how they develop it because right now the focus has been let's acquire the land because that's the commodity that's going away the quickest. But they're not forced into building it like a track builder would and say I got to get these units up so it can carry itself from a cash flow standpoint. I think when you start dealing with religious organizations, they have a different motivation and it's not it may not look like what a typical real estate project would look like. They're not going to sit down and say, "Buddy Huck says we need to sell 40 units a year to be viable." Because that's not what they're doing. They're not going to the open market. They're going to a very select group of buyers who already have a relationship or will have a relationship with the worship center. So, the worship is what's driving the consumer.

You may think that they buy more land. That's what's going to require extend it because we've seen long-term puts before and all we do is extend extend extend and in those cases not the puds that are successful but the puds are not successful the land gets worse and worse and worse looking and long-term puds has not been a great thing for us but this is a little bit different we're talking about a religious organization and we understand that well another part of that I would say is I've had more um PUD terminations in the last three years and I've had PUD extensions.

Part of that's because honestly the old PUDS weren't written that well and then when they stall then there's no way to get out of it without collapsing the

and there's there's been many that stalled and many first first the pud started out with one o under one ownership and then other things happened and then somebody wanted to separate and they couldn't separate because the parking was I mean there's too much I mean I hope during the zoning rewrite that puds are addressed at the highest level because they they have gone astray generally. They have gone astray. They not what they what are first meant to be. Well, I think that part of that is what we've talked about several times is most of those were pre207 when the real estate market collapsed and everybody's big for downtown Myrtle Beach was a bunch of condo towers. I don't think that's the case now. Not only for council or the senior management, but also for the consumer. The consumer that's coming here today would prefer to have that detached product rather than be in the middle of a

the p the putts have become very cumbersome within they're they're falling apart under their own weight. Agreed.

So, um and I I thought this on page nine under section 16. I thought thought the reversionary zoning at I I thought this is a cumbersome uh sentence or paragraph, but um you know I I think the goal is that We want it to be a wonderful spot. So to linger for 10 years, 20 years, 30 years. That's, you know, that wouldn't be the goal of of this premier spot in in the middle of the city.

I mean, I I hope it's going to move quicker than anyone ever imagined. And I I just don't want it to, you know, the city council that you need 10 more years and then you need to go back and ask city council for 10 more years. And

you know, agree and and I think the challenge in that is the same thing we've seen in the condominiums. There was a time period when all the condominiums the sales velocity was out of the roof. So you looked at the declarant rights which really preserved the flexibility and they were really short. when the real estate market crashed almost all of those expired which would just created another problem within those ps because now the grand tour doesn't have control over their own project so that that's the reason for the 10 and the potential five as an extension I hope that's never an issue I hope I don't I don't plan on having to come back here and ask for anything I think this thing will get some momentum and when it does it'll carry.

It's a very exciting um project and I just want to call to one of the the good things about the way that this is written the issue where we have of trying to eject single parcels out of puds stems from the fact that those the puds call to what specifically would go on that parcel facilitating things on other parcels in this case where they have built in some of that flexibility. It makes it easier on the back end in case this doesn't come to fruition to solve that problem. So, yes, it can be a little bit cumbersome in the read, but I think the intention as to why it's written that way is very important. Yes, ma'am.

Staff have pointed out uh to what's your intent and intentions on improvement 26. Are we going to do a 5ft sidewalk landscaping on that one? Street trees and sidewalks. Could that be is that incorporated in the language currently? I could find it. Sidewalks along 29th Avenue, 5t in width and six depth. [snorts] So we shouldn't add that. But but a palm remember palm tree is not a palm is not a tree. [laughter] And we I mean you did a good job of showing good trees. But three palm trees are [laughter] there. I don't care if there's 88 and it's still not a tree. They're not trees. I'm with you. Yeah. So

yeah, I have no problem. to help them out with that. Yep. Okay. So, that would be good. Okay. Let's uh let's get some final questions. Sharon, anything else, please? Because we need to move on. Nope. Betty, any other thoughts? Joe, no. Your first pud. Joe, aren't you happy that you joined us? Got a smile on his face. The chairman might want to warn you that all of them don't look this. No, this is [laughter] this one's pretty special. The other ones even for me to it might not look like it.

Mr. Goten, you said you've done terminating puds, not Adam one. You sure pick a special one to come and refresh your memory. [laughter] Well, if you think about my last, the J1 and this one. Yeah, the J1. And I'm telling you, you need you need the team that helped you with this one. I'm telling you, they did a nice job, too. Paul, what what wrap up questions do you have? Answer all my questions. I think it's a it's a great project and I hope it works out quick. Sooner the better, right? I mean, because it's what's there now is is very pitiful. Bill, wrap it up, please.

Thank you, Mr. G. We're going to move on to uh this is a public hearing for all these items. So, um let's start with the first one. What's the number? What's the number 253? [clears throat] Okay. Uh do Okay. Do we're going back to uh the annexation um annex 25-03. And this is a public hearing item. Um yeah, get that up there, please. And um thank you. Uh do you want to summarize what we show in Cameron, please, so the public knows?

Yes, ma'am. So, this is the requested annexation to pull in the two parcels highlighted in blue. Those two parcels would then be zoned 29th Avenue North Spiritual Center PUB pending the uh approval of the 29th Avenue.

Thank you. Okay. If anyone in the public would like to address this item, please come to the podium and uh give us your name. Anybody in the public like to address this item? Okay. I don't see any request to uh to talk about this. So, I'm going to officially close this portion of the public hearing and back to commissioners. Um, I would certainly like to entertain a motion, commissioners, if we're at that point. Would anybody like to make a motion, please?

I'd like to move that we approve this annexation. Okay. I have a motion from Betty Ann to approve this uh annex 25-3. I second. I have a second from Paul. Is there any further discussion? If not, all in favor say I. I.

Opposed. Okay, it is unanimous on that item. Thank you very much. Moving on to the next one, annex 25-04. And Cameron, just summarize please before we open the public hearing. Similar to the last one, this is a requested annexation to pull the purple highlighted parcel into the city limits and pending the approval of the 29th Avenue North PUB zone this piece of property 29th Avenue North Spiritual Center.

Thank you. Okay, I'm opening this item to the public. Uh if you would like to comment on this, please come to the podium and let us know. I don't see any requests that anybody would like to address this item. So, I'm going to officially close the public hearing portion and move back to commissioners. And uh I would like to entertain a motion once again, please. I make a motion that we approve as written item 325-4 Avenue Spiritual Center. 25-04.

Okay. I have a motion from Paul. I have a second from Betty Anne. Uh any further discussion? Okay. All in favor say I. Opposed. Okay. It is unanimous. Thank you very much. Okay. Moving on to uh the next item. Text 25-05 29th Avenue. Spiritual Center HUD. Okay. Do you want to summarize that as best you can, Cameron? [laughter]

Uh, this is a request to create the 29th Avenue North Spiritual Center, PUB. [clears throat] Over the course of the last hour, you all have talked about this one extensively, so I'll just leave it on the boundary map and and leave it there. Okay. Thank you very much. Okay. Uh, would anybody like to uh address this item, please, that Cameron has summarized? Anybody? Yes. Hello. Hi, Deborah Crash. What is your last name? K R E S C Hide Edge.

Um, looks like a great plan. My concern which is been brought up by many many people within my area where I live and all the organizations I'm in it is about the um buffering the clear cutting the stipulation on the number of trees and how far the buffering should be. And also North Carolina when we did our we did our zoning and and appeals um and planning commission, we requested that there be a certain number of deciduous versus evergreens put into the formula for pug development because the the way it's been going in Myrtle Beach, if you just drive around, there isn't much of a buffer.

It's getting clearcut even though it's not supposed to. There seems to be a miss I mean, I guess a lot of people say planning and zoning commission that things are not working well together. No, ma'am. And trees are getting cut down and nobody's getting fines and nobody's checking on it. Okay. Well, let's let's just stick to this item. So, I I don't know where you're talking about specifically, but uh you have a challenge. You live in this neighborhood.

No. Well, I'm in Grand Dunes. No, my comment is about with this It looks great, but I think you need to start doing a lot more details on pud development to make sure there is proper buffers, proper landscaping, and not clear cutting.

Yes. Like today, the plan there is is not concise, but I understand it can't be concise until you get all the buildings up. I'm concerned about thinking about the number of deciduous versus evergreens, the number of trees to make my beach more beautiful. I mean, it's a Tree City USA, but it doesn't look like a Tree City USA because I've created Tree City USA. Thank you. Thank you for your input. Appreciate it so much. Uh Cameron, do you want to talk about Tree City and uh what happens with the putt and cap with the landscaping?

Uh the PUD language is follows along our current landscaping code that they've kind of frozen that into the putt at this point. They'll have to meet all the letter of the law versus current zoning code. Um something we're looking at in our upcoming zoning rewrite, but at this time they would have to meet all the letter of that before going for CA for final approval.

Okay. Thank you so muchbody. Okay. Would anybody else like to address this item, please? I am going to officially close the public hearing uh portion. I don't see anybody else that would like to address this and come back to the commissioners. Uh would you please um make a motion if you would please? Anyone

make a motion we approve it subject to including the 27th Avenue improvements be the inse proposed improvements and that there be a 60 foot height allowance straight six foot across the board straight across the board [snorts] Phil if you want to add that note about landscaping in front of a wall if there is a wall I'm fine with that Yeah, I was gonna ask him about the land outside landscape. Thank you, Phil. I'm in to add to that if there is a wall that there be an appropriate landscape that meets our ordinance when the wall is being built

and we are buffering and we have agreed that it's down to 20 10 ft from the 20 originally proposed. Yes, you know that it's down from there. Okay. So that's part of that as presented today. Yes. Okay sir. Very well. Very clear. Second. Go ahead. Did you finish? I am. I think it's very consistent with the conference. And are you okay with parking then Phil?

Um I think I'm okay with parking due to the fact that they have the excess land there that comes an issue. They have the ability to revis. We got a motion on the floor right now. The motion on the floor is to approve as presented with the inclusion of the 27th Avenue sidewalk. Um the landscaping on the inside of the wall and the 60 foot and the 60ft height across the board and the 10 foot the 10 foot that's in here. 10 foot. Yeah, but that's already presented. Sorry. That's how it was presented. So that's not a change in his motion. That's how it was presented. Okay. Still motion. That's it. Okay. And

second. Thank you, Paul. So, any further discussion? Okay. I see no further discussion is uh asked for. So, uh all of those in favor say I. I. Opposed. Okay. Thank you very much everybody. Thank you, Mr. Thank you all for your input. Very helpful on this. Appreciate it. We're bitten for you. [laughter] Me, too. Okay, let's move on to the next item, please. Elementary review.

A little voice. Yep, it's me. Um, so you have your white sheet in front of you or in your packets. Um, that is just base data. I'm sorry. Go ahead. That's just some base data. Um, population demographics, our stats. Um, it's got some population projections in there. And we are looking for your feedback on that. If there's anything that surprised you or jumped out to you, um, if there's anything that we've missed or you would like to see added into that data, please let us know.

Uh, I thought you did a good job. There was a lot of interesting little tidbits. Uh kind of surprising some of them not great. Uh did you put this all together? Not by myself. No, we had it was Kelly and Cameron's room. Oh, excellent.

It was there was a lot. That's a lot. It it looks simple the way you have presented it and I think the presentation was very well done too. So, uh, I will say just as a quick reminder, we wanted to get you all this white paper with the intention that over the next month and bring you for you at the first meeting in December, we'll actually have the document drafted up with its like full graphic design and suite to fit in with the comprehensive plan. We just wanted y'all to have the white paper, just the raw information in front of it. So that way we didn't, you know, create this whole big thing and then you go, "Oh my god, we forgot the data on this, this, and this." So, we just wanted your feedback on that um to make sure that we didn't miss anything. Like said, feedback that you have we can incorporate before we can fully figure out the design of it.

Feedback doesn't have to be at the next meeting. If it's something you want to email in to somebody if it's something you make a note of, you just want to pop into us with an email um is something that we will give consideration to and list down in I do have a question one question about it. has um said that our homelessness rates the highest in the state based on percentages. Um and in this study, did y'all identify possibly might be some reasons why we're experiencing such high?

So at the front end of this, I will say it's that number has been a difficult one to track down. Um, we have reached out to many different organizations in the area to try to pull that number together. I I don't want to venture a guess as to why that number is. There's it's a multitude of reasons. There's a multifaceted problem that every community is facing at this point. A really interesting question.

So, you all did great putting all this together. Uh, if you looked at other uh towns of this population, are we how do we fall as far as homeless homeless go? So I don't believe we've looked at that at this point. So that's something that we can certainly look at. Of course it depends on I didn't think it personally I didn't think it was that high for the population we have but maybe no but it is a question that's that would be very serious to you know is it a

southern is it is it a coastal is it a tourist is it you know the com combination thereof when I worked for the VA we found very weird situation. In the winter time, we had homeless vets would come from the north to the south and then go back in the summertime. So, it was a fluctuating population. I don't know how that is here, but I tend to hang around. Yeah. And I think the other thing you got to look at too, Paul, is that that we are only a town of 35,000 give or take, even though we seem so much bigger than what we truly are.

Right. Exactly. So when this document is finalized and this will help public understand it, does this then help drive a plan to meet the goal of population?

Use this as kind of the big framework of now what do we need to do to try to accomplish now we understand this information how to improve it. So much like we do with the economic development, what we're trying to do is set a goal for the city and then offer policies that the city council, the planning commission, that BZA, that CAB can hold on to when they're making their decisions to say, "Hey, this project aligns with these policies that we have in place to help address these critical issues." Gives them the big picture. Now, what to do? Yeah. Not just not do a study that where's the application now?

This is the study. Yeah. So the white paper is primarily the data that we found and brought together the work done earlier this year with Paul and Darcy to look at the actual the goal that we can set the pillars that we want to focus on uh groups and then also the policies that we can have help effectuate those changes. Um all will be comprised into that one document very similar to how we did the economic development one. Okay. So thank you team did a good job. Uh, next.

Yeah. So, um, the city has embarked upon a process called departmental performance plans, DPS for every department to kind of help, uh, push us into the future and look at a lot of the information that we gather and metric track ourselves to make sure that we're, you know, good stewards of the tax dollar and really trying to to maximize what we're able to do. And one of the metrics or one of the initiatives that I had put into RDPP um moving forward as a planning department is to really hone in on a few of the uh comprehensive plan elements. Um 403A of your findings of fact say that you look to the comprehensive plan when you're making decisions when things come before planning commission. And one of the ones that I really wanted to focus on uh over the next few months here is the element of resilience. um as a coastal community that's largely built on a small resilience play such a huge factor into what we do. So I just wanted to kind of drive that point to y'all that when you're looking at different plans, look at it through the lens of resilience and you know there's four different elements of resilience. What does each plan that comes before you how does that impact the resilience of our community? So I just want to run through this briefly. Resilience in a large sense is just an urban planning is the ability to anticipate, prepare for and respond to it as well as recover from adverse events while maintaining essential functions and adapting to future challenges. Calling to the current goal, our current resilience goal is to prioritize resilience in all city plans, policies, actions and regulations. So the four pillars that I want to focus on with resilience are environmental, social, economic and infrastructure. Environmental is the ability to withstand and adapt to things like climate change. Social resilience is ensuring that our community has access to the resources, services, and support networks. Economic is the ability for us to recover, absorb from, recover from, and adapt to shocks and stresses and infrastructures, things like transportation, utilities, water, and energy to withstand and adapt and recover from any sort of disruptions. Have a picture there of the the new deep

water ocean outfall. That's a great project example of a resilience uh effort that the city is undertaking to help mitigate storm water damages. Going into just a few of the things that this board could look at in terms of resilience. So environmental things like rain gardens, green roofs, permeable pavements and urban tree canopies preservation of open space, wetlands, forests and dunes. And then also smart growth strategies to try to limit sprawl and preserve open space. And then mixed use development. I'll say one of the projects that was most exciting for me so far was the um the mixed use on King's Highway that came in from Nation's home. That mixeduse development that really kind of compacted had some um commercial space on the first one and some residential above it really helps to keep open space and preserve the natural environment around us. So a good [cough and clears throat] example of this is a bioil. Bio rails are essentially containment areas that water can flow into to remove pollutants before that water is then put into the waste treatment facilities or out to the ocean or into the inter coastal waterway. Um this is a natural way of diverting pollutants out of the water before it enters into water sheds. So looking for things like bio swells and plans that are moving forward or rain gardens. Other one, social resilience is host neighborhood events to mutual aid groups, creating resilience hubs in underserved neighborhoods, and holding public workshops and partnering with local leaders. Cool one that's coming up in a lot of hurricane and tornado places are um modular um shelters. These we have the remnants of the cold war and our bomb shelters that pop up throughout communities. These are largely being built in like shipping containers or or small modular homes and they have access to all of these resources in case of natural disaster and emergency. Um so it's kind of a cool new cutting edge thing that's coming up. Economic um we did quite a bit of work on the economic development elements here. Uh look into expanding remote work

hubs and clean energy jobs, small business resilience funds and incubator programs as well as training workers in renewable energy, healthcare and digital skills. Good example of this that we've already seen is DC blocks coming in and just another avenue to increase our economic base outside of just the tourism. I think we all saw what happened. Joe, do you know what DC blocks is? Yes. Thank you.

We saw what happened after COVID and how tourism industry might suffer a shock. Economic resilience comes in having the ability to kind of withstand those pressures that a mono industry could face. Um so I think that's a good example of you know real world activity that the city has undertaken to help prevent those shocks from being detrimental to us. And then finally is just economic or excuse me infrastructure resilience. things like elevating electrical substations, creating micro grids or backup generators, and then the uh use of smart water meters that detect leaks. Um when we went to the Scaffa conference up in Charlotte, um there's a lady who gave a presentation from uh Charleston about all of their water retention that Charleston tries to manage because that city is essentially just a giant floating island. Um and she showed one of the coolest pictures I've seen. They have young male workers that essentially crawl through the old 1920s and 30s drainage systems looking for like pinhole leaks. Um, this is a good example of a legacy system that they cons continually have to maintain um as it diverts water away from flooding people's homes. So Charleston is looking to create fully integrated systems with their water retention and diversion that is monitored through different sensors and electronics. So that way they don't have to send people down into these tunnels essentially timing it at the right time of day. So that way the uh sea level isn't as high because those tunnels will completely flood up. So you have to time it specifically. They can't have a rainstorm. It was a really interesting presentation. But Charleston's moving to a completely new model.

Charleston better be doing something fast. So that that's a really interesting one of how they're trying to, you know, build in a more resilient infrastructure so that way they don't have these problems, you know, 30, 40 years down the road where again, young person's crawling through the the gutters trying to find those leaks. So I just want to bring this to to planning commission. So as we're looking at plans moving forward, I think when I look at the the pud that was here before you, that really did meet one of the social resilience elements when they talk about, you know, being able to help take care of their elderly population. That is a very resilient thing. Um, so looking at it through that lens can help inform the decision that you as a board make. So, does anybody have any questions? I have a few questions.

Guess when the monitoring device is built, they'll send a dollar down to fix it. Unfortunately, humanity can't go away too much. But any anything else, Phil? At least the kid meters isn't the first. There's There's no time here, for sure. Uh uh why do we have uh uh Charles? Why do we have retention ponds instead of uh underground everything like every other city in the United States of America?

Underground where everybody has uh sewer systems and drainage uh pipes and everything. We have retention ponds because it makes code I mean why why can't we do underground sewage and water like every other city in the in the United in the world basically? Why do why are we one of the few retention pond communities left because we're built on a swamp? No, it's not the answer. What do you think the answer is? Well, that's not the answer because there's many communities that are

okay. So, and they all have drainage systems and sewer pipes and etc. to move the water instead of having open areas of retention ponds. Well, I don't like them either, but I would assume beyond that it would be cost.

Well, just just a thought for the future, you know, because retention ponds are not basically They can be but they never are. Um another question I have what about uh a AI now? It takes tremend what what uh are you doing about AI? It takes an enormous way beyond anybody's expectation of power. Uh it it makes the water hot. It there's a whole lot of things that AI affects. But the draw of power and electricity is so big that nobody people are not being able to deal with it in different communities. What are we how are we addressing that?

So I think that's a question at a larger scale than just maybe a single municipality can look at. I will say it's something that I'm super interested in. So there's a company called Terowolf out of Connecticut. Um they're looking at building small scale nuclear reactors essentially the size of this room to completely independently power all data centers across America. So there are private companies that are working on solving these solutions in the first place. Uh there's another company I believe out of New York that is looking that is working on creating a closed cooling system for data centers. So they would need one draw of water but through their mechanisms and designs they would just need that one gush of water across the data center's lifetime and they have a recycling system that can just continually pump that same water for cooling purposes. So at the current point, yes, energy intensive, water intensive, but the free market is actively searching for solutions for those to make them more cost effective

because because with our growing population, uh power, water, pressure, the these are these are issues that are already affecting our community. Uh so um those think that we have to review and look at all and I'll say the federal government within the past month has shortlisted 13 different companies that are focused on nuclear energy generation um as kind of a driver for tackling the data center question. So um there's definitely some interesting free market exercises that are happening right now.

What are we doing about underground utilities? Uh we are a community that has hurricanes [clears throat] some might have heard of and um when there is no power for people who need power and I don't mean on a casual level I mean people who live on oxygen or have other um you know needs who can't afford to install a generator. What are we doing about underground? because many years ago we had a fund for underground utilities that seems to have evaporated somehow. Uh but many years ago when all of Ocean Boulevard uh was having underground utilities, we were going to do incremental throughout the city, not just in Grand Dunes, not just in Market Common, because it makes our our city look old and dated and it's also not healthy for people who need to have electricity. I just don't food or air conditioning for health reasons. So, what are we doing about underground utilities?

Well, I think that's where I brought this presentation to y'all. That's something with public improvements that, you know, could be on the table that you could ask an applicant for moving forward. So, to help assist with that. Uh well there was as I said there was a fund for underground utilities uh which came from some of the pugs that were created but I don't know where that that what has happened to that over the years because there was only so many much funds that could be put into the pug and then they said whatever's left over because there is a a percentage that that is calculated uh and it was moved into underground So, no answer.

Underground utilities are are the only option that Santi gives you on most new construction. Now, that's probably why the reason that the majority of that's gone away. Um, if you go to build a new building on the boulevard right now, you don't have to worry about paying to have those put underground. Sandy Cooper will put them underground, but that is their that's how they That is correct. That that's what happened with the boulevard, but it was supposed to go into the neighborhoods for for safety. [clears throat] That is something that we as a staff that goes well beyond our realm. That is something that goes to a city council or higher up chain for an answer in regard to that.

When we're talking about uh resilience, this this is part of to me the package of resilience [snorts] for the safety and health and welfare of a community. It's very important. So that those are things that that I think about the power the electricity for AI don't Let's not underestimate that because that's going to be a a challenge. So, anybody else have anything else to Thank you. I like where where you're going with this. I love this thing for Charleston because this last rainstorm in Charleston, I mean, it was

Yeah, look at New Orleans. I live down there. Well, it it is under sea level. Uh, yeah. Well, Charleston's only about two foot above it. Well, at least they're above. They're barely, but they're not under under it like New Orleans. I know, Chairman. I know you're going to chime me for another little funny joke. You got a joke. I know you were serious about what you were saying, but I have two daughters that live in subdivisions that have underground utilities, and I laugh at them every time there's a storm and their power goes out. And I've got overground utilities. My power never goes out. Well, I'll tell you what. Every time every time there's a storm here, our power goes out. Does it?

Yes, sir. Well, we must be waiting. You are very fortunate. I'll knock on this fake wood curse. It's all It's all wood. It just might be pressed together. This all Okay. Motion to adjurnn, please. Motion to adjourn. Sharon. Second. Second from Paul. Thank you.