County Commission - Regular Meeting

Just my What's that? Well, guilty by association.

Okay, we want to welcome everybody to everybody. Look at that. Thanks for coming. Um, appreciate you being here. Those that are online also to our work session. We're going to go through some have our attorney go through some things now. So, we'll turn the time over to him.

All right. So, I've got to start out with a story behind this PowerPoint and a shout out to Janet. So, back last year when we were talking about doing the open meetings act for the planning commission, it's kind of loud. She she made some comment that, you know, I would be doing the training and I probably wouldn't have a PowerPoint. And so, I when I heard that, I thought, oh, I better get a PowerPoint. And so I've readapted the PowerPoint that I did for the planning commission, added the close session uh discussion which wasn't really relevant to the planning commission. So that's why we even have a PowerPoint and hopefully it'll be more engaging and less boring than me just pulling up the code and going through the things that I've highlighted. So uh that being said, if there are questions as we go through, I can quickly jump to the code. I have that pulled up and then we can go into more details. Ah, you already see it there. I was going to ask before we started, does anyone know where it's found in the Utah code? But 524 Yeah, that's [laughter] that's where it is. Every

you all knew exactly where to go. Um, but there's certain codes that stick out like this one, grammar, you know, that we see quite a bit. All right, so today we're going to hit transparency. um definitions of meeting public bodies open to the public closed meeting notice and then enforcement. So as far as transparency goes it is called the open meetings act right this is something that the legislature the whole intent of the statute they they lay out at the beginning. Sometimes we talk about statutory intent and we have to guess or go back at committee notes and things to say, well, what did they intend by this law and we don't have to do that with OPMA because they lay it out and they say, "We want you to take your actions and have your deliberations openly. We want the public to be involved and be able to know what's going on." Um especially when you are making decisions that impact you know their their land use for example their you know the taxes that they pay they want to be involved in that discussion and so the legislature makes that very clear at the beginning. So to do that and to maintain that transparency, there are some things that I have gone through and just pointed out that I think are are important. So uh 524208, we're not getting together outside of meetings in a concerted and deliberate way to predetermine an action. So sharing information is fine. A lot of times we get information from the public, from our engineer, our planner and and we need to review that before the meeting because we don't want these meetings to last all the way through the night. So there is some level of

preparation. But as soon as you cross that line into the deliberation of that information and saying, "Well, this is how I'm going to vote or this is what I'm thinking." Now you're predetermining or you're going beyond. Um, it's okay to share the information and that's that's not restricted by the act, but as far as letting the public see how you're coming to that determination, that should be reserved for the meeting. Also, one of the the negative aspects or things that could be difficult and why we have in our policies and procedures that we don't vote by proxy is you may hear something in the meeting that changes your mind. And so if you're predetermined or you say, "Hey, I I have to catch a flight, but this is how I want to vote on this item, it's not fair to yourself, to the body or to the public because you may hear something that that changes your mind and you say, "Oh, I'd never thought of it that way." And so open meetings act while it is restrictive in some ways it's it's better overall because now we're all coming to the same knowledge the same input that's been given from the public the same uh explanations given by the experts that we rely on whatever it may be so that now we're all um making our decisions that aren't in a predetermined way.

Yeah. Does the legislature have to follow this? Uh, [laughter] because I would say yes. They're like they they try to get votes behind closed doors and things like that. Like they know how they're going to vote. That's a good question. I that's how they get something passed. I'm not exactly sure because what would be considered a quorum for them I think is different, right? So if there's 29 in the Senate, that's 15. Is it still 75 in the house? I think so.

But I can't pair off with say Matt and say, "Hey, what do you think about this and this and I might I'm going to vote this way. I can't do like two on two." Like we can't have that conversation like they can in the legislature. Yeah. So, I'm wondering if this doesn't apply to the legislature or if they don't enforce it on themselves. I'm not sure because predetermining an action, if you're talking one-on-one with the commissioner and saying, "Hey, this is how I'm going to vote and this is what I'm going to do." Then that does go against the

524208 which is predetermining determining ahead of time what you're going to do because and once again, maybe something comes up or you hear an illustration or an example or you hear how someone says this is how it would be applied and you're like, "Ooh, that's not what I and you may change your mind and okay

and and so I I think it also helps us eliminate litigation for example if we're meeting with a land owner um a developer you know someone ahead of time are like oh yeah well we're going to push this through or yes I'm going to and then you hear something you change your vote they're like well wait a second you know they said they were going to do this and and once again I don't know if they could be successful in legal action but it opens the door to say well I'm going to go after them legally or politically maybe through media social media whatever it may be so it's just safer um kind of that practice pointer at the end if you're unsure about it air on the side of transparency or if you if you're saying well this might be sensitive then maybe reach out to me um someone who who maybe is here on the ground like okay should we talk about this and say oh no we've these other things are going on behind the scenes especially if it's an administrative thing then it doesn't apply the same way if that makes sense cuz you there there are separation of powers but you hold legislative and executive authority in the same body for the county and so when you're acting in the executive the administrative side. Well, yeah, you're going to say, "What do we do about this internal um this internal issue or this issue we're having with our fleet?" You know, these vehicles, we're not bringing everything like that to this body because that's not legislative in nature. That's on the administrative side. So, there are some nuances, but if you're unsure, then I would just air on the side of figuring it out before you you know, say something that you can't

take back. So, yes, be transparent, but not to a fault either. There's maybe that balance somewhere in the middle. Um, yeah, great great point. Uh, any any followup to that? I I will look at the legislature. It makes me curious because I know we've got the session coming up, so that would be interesting.

They use their lobbyist for that. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So, and then that last point there, the default is open. So, the default is it's open unless you meet a you know requirement or or um an exception for when you can close the meeting. All right. So, the the definition of meeting is the gathering of the public body with a quorum present. So sometimes on uh we just did a selection committee for the public defender RFQ. We had two commissioners on that. Some of the the meetings that you go to, you've got the two commissioners. Usually in those meetings, they're going to be publicly noticed anyway. And so there is that notice requirement that's been given. But um with a five member commission, you have to have at least three for the quorum. And it's convened by the chair, right? That's the individual with authority to convene this body after following the process provided by law and for the express purpose of acting as a public body to receive public comment, deliberate or take action. So you don't have to you don't have to have a meeting to receive public comment because the public they may reach out to you individually. they may send an email as a group or individually. So, you can still receive that, but for the purpose of receiving public comment, we always have the public comment at the beginning and that's when we're encouraging the public to come and share what's on their mind. um deliberation though and taking action once again I know that we've said before okay you're maybe you're one of five you can't commit funds you can't approve this you can make a recommendation and bring it to the body but any action has

to be done by a quorum in a meeting and then the deliberation that kind of goes to predetermining an action save it for here you can share information but save the deliberation public body you qualify for it it's an administ administrative body of the state which you are created by ordinance two or more individuals ordered by tax revenue and vested with authority to make decisions regarding the public's business. All right. So it is open to the public and in unless it's closed the public may attend and they can provide comments related to the agenda or not. They're not required to speak only to the agenda items. And then um you know as you look at all of the agendas if there's a public hearing it's outlined on on the agenda. Do we have I don't know that we have any tonight.

We don't tonight. So usually it's in blue and or yeah and then it'll kind of stick out and that has its own comment period so that they can speak directly to that issue so it's fresh when it's discussed and deliberated. I think I you know as I'm looking back over the years I think we've done a pretty good job as a body overall of not interrupting the public comment. Uh sometimes it may feel irrelevant or not on topic or disrespectful or you know there could be a number of things but as the government as a public body we respect freedom of speech the ability for people to come and express what's on their mind. Now there are limits to that which we'll get into a little bit more in the policies and procedures. If someone is disrupting um even committing a crime, disorderly conduct, something like that, they can be removed from the meeting. This one's kind of hard because a lot of times you want to engage in a dialogue with the person asking the question. And with as a government body though, we can't choose favorites. And so if we engage with some and not with others, now we're not giving everyone equal protection. And so we just have to be careful of of opening that door because then we have to to do it. And so typically what we'll do is and and I I think we've done it recently. Usually the chair will say, "Okay, this isn't a dialogue, but we're taking notes and we can address that as we go through the meeting." Um, and then yeah, the chair we we have the the thing that goes up on the screen that's asking them to limit it to the time frame. And if they're going over, the chair can say, "Well, thank you. You

know, you've met your time. Go ahead and and uh sit down." Okay. Or do I just exit? All right. I'm going to go out. So, I I just thought it would be fun to show an example of maybe an off-the-wall comment u from from some guys. Anyway, it's posted online. Let me pull it up. All right. Nina Kelly, she's always She's Yeah. And so I I mean, she's not even here to defend [laughter] herself.

I think she saw this at the planning commission though. I I shared this there as well, but this is I thought just kind of a fun way to to show what may come up at a meeting. Uh, what up council? My name is Chad Kroger. This is my dog JT.

Council, I live to be balanced and at peace, [snorts] and no two things do that more for me than golfing with the bull and shooting firearms. I love both, but one of them makes my girlfriend uncomfortable. And after talking to her, it's become clear that guns are a huge issue country. Some people think themselves are the problem. Other people think it's mental health. All I know is we got to freaking do something. In Australia, where I did a semester, they had this gun buyback thing where if you turn your gun, you got money. Uh, money is chill, but what if in America if you turn your gun in, you got a new set of Callaway clubs and a tea time at the local club with three cool bros. I have mental health every time I drain a birdie in front of my dogs. It's epic. They're all cheering. Then, uh, Cart comes around the corner just looking all cute with icicle beverages. Daddy's been known to have more than a few Michel. On top of that, if you get more than one gum back, you could get some cool wedges or hybrids. And if you turn in assault rifles, you get a tea time at Augusta. I would honestly give you my rifle if you let me touch the grass on Augusta's Amen Corner. That'd be sick. Uh I'm not saying this would fix the issue, but

cuz people still do evil, but might keep our shots on the fairway. All right, JT. Thank you. [snorts] What up, council? My name is JT Parr. I'm here to butress Chad's point and to make a macro point about America.

People are dumb. [laughter] But they used to be nice, but now they're dumb and mean. It's like everyone's in an episode of Succession. It's okay to be dumb, but if you're going to be dumb, you should be loving. That's how my parents raised me. And I read some poetry the other drove home that idea for me. And your permission, I'd like to it to you now.

What's wrong with the world, mama? People living like they ain't got no mas. I think the whole world's addicted to the drama. Only attracted to things that'll bring you trauma overseas. Yeah, we trying to fight terrorism, but we still got terrorists here living in the USA, the big CIA, the bloods and the crips in the KKK. Madness is what you demonstrate. And that's exactly how anger works and operates. Man, you got to have love just to straight. Take control of your mind and meditate. Let your soul gravitate to the love, y'all. People killing, people dying, children hurt, hear them crying. Can you practice what you preach? Or would you turn the other cheek? Father, father, father, help us. Send us guidance from above. Cuz people got me, got me questioning. Where is the [singing] love? Where is the love? Where is the love? [singing] The love. The love. The love. [singing]

Thank you. Thank you. Is this for real? [cheering] Yeah. [applause] So, they call themselves like social influencers and they'll go around to different city and county councils or commission meetings throughout the country. So, anyway, when that happens, yeah, I haven't seen them here yet, but [laughter] are we supposed to keep a straight face when that happen? If we can. Okay. Yeah, because keep a straight face if that goes down. I'm going to need my Botox. [laughter]

So anyway, I think I mean sometimes we'll get comments that that you say, you know, do we have to keep a straight face? Well, yeah. I think we should be respectful of what anyone has to say. You know, for them, I think they're trying to be funny, of course, and and go around and influence people, but but if someone feels strongly about something, letting them come in, share it, and we can give respect. Um, and I I was giving that as an example. I don't think we've ever had someone sing to us, but you know, maybe 2026 is the year. Debbie, you got your gold.

Holy screens open. Yeah, that's how I research. I'm sorry. [laughter] Would you like to close our 75 screens or just this one?

Yeah, just that one. So anyway, uh here we go. Close meeting. So this is these are some of the new slides. I think the top three as I was going through and just thinking about what we typically close it for are the character, professional competence or physical or mental health of an individual. Um strategy sessions to discuss pending or reasonably imminent litigation. And then we've got the strategy strategy sessions to discuss purchase, exchange, lease or sale of real property, including water rights or shares. There are others that are in the code, but as I was going through, I I don't know that we've ever closed for another reason except for maybe collective bargaining my first year. But other than that, these are the three that typically come up. Uh there are some restrictions. So you cannot interview a person applying to fill an elected position, which I don't know that that's really a thing anymore since they changed um they changed the code for our form of government where now the the parties go through that process. Um back when there was unaffiliated, you could run unaffiliated, there wasn't a process in place and so actually the commission interviewed me. I remember that. Uh so discuss filling a midterm vacancy or discuss the character professional competence, physical or mental health of someone filling a midterm vacancy. So there are some restrictions on [clears throat] uh what can and can't be done even in those topics. But any questions about close session? I think we pretty much keep it simple to those. All right. And then now we're back to notice. So giving at least 24 hours public

notice. That includes the agenda, date, time, place of the public meeting. We do pretty good job on that. I think we even try typically to get it out the Thursday before to get that posted. So there's plenty of time. Sometimes we update it on Monday, but we have to do it at least 24 hours before the start of the meeting. Provide the annual meeting schedule for regular meetings at least once a year. We did that even sooner than January because we did it at the last meeting. So December, January, we post that for the year and then posts to the Utah public notice website and then somewhere at the anchor location we're posting the agendas before and then it talks about other electronic noticees and courage which we do on our county website even though it's not required. We try to give more notice. There are the emergency meetings. I think to my recollection we've only had the one. Is that right? And it was during COVID and it was when do we have another?

So yeah, we still gave the 24-hour notice. Yeah, we might have done

Yeah, for the flood. So, and if you give 24-hour notice, then it's not technically an emergency meeting. So, the emergency meeting is when you don't have to follow the 24-hour rule. if you say I think it was Brian Cowan was coming to talk about CO it wasn't 24 hours but even though we're within that we're holding that meeting that doesn't mean that we don't give notice at all we just give as much notice as we can and so if we knew at the 23-hour mark then get that posted as soon as possible because we want the the public to be aware and to participate as much as possible and that's where the statute says that we provide the less practicable notice.

Now, isn't there a stipulation within an emergency meeting that basically states that there has to be at least two of the commissioners that agree to an emergency meeting and then they request it to the chair and the chair then can say, "Hey, yeah." So, so it it can't just be one person, right,

putting that meeting on. Um, sorry. I might have to go in and set myself to whatever. Do not disturb. Right. Okay. Um, so, so yeah, there is a process and if you want, we can jump to that part in the code after. Um, doesn't happen a lot in our county, but it can on occasion. The third bullet point probably happens the most often is that if something comes up from public comment or maybe something that you thought of that wasn't on the agenda, it can be discussed without notice, but it's up to the chair. So, if the chair says, you know, they brought this up, let's talk about this a little bit. We can't take any action on this. We can bring this back, but we can at least start the discussion. So, how does that work [snorts]

on a topic raised by the public [clears throat] um in a prior meeting and we come and we think we've got to have a meeting on that or the chair does then how does that work? Do we have to give notice on the official site that we're having that meeting or what happens there on that one? So, you're not giving notice on the site. So, it's happening in the meeting. Let's say that someone comes up here and they start talking about um like speeding on a road. He's talking he's talk you're talking two different things. Well, that's what I'm trying to figure out here.

Yeah. So, let's say someone comes up and they want to talk about the burm at the airport and it's not on the agenda. But then the chair, Chair Wilson says, "Okay, we've talked about this in the past. Let's just talk about it here. We can't make any decisions about that tonight because it wasn't noticed, but you can have that discussion as long as no final action is taken. Okay. And you're not expending any funds. Okay. Does that make Yeah. Does that help? Yeah.

So, I think that's probably the most common to come up and I think everyone's handled that pretty well when it has. All right. So for the enforcement, sometimes we will renotice or reschedu a meeting or if something wasn't noticed correctly, then we'll postpone it to a later meeting. And in large part, not only do we want transparency, but decisions can be voidable if the Open Meetings Act isn't followed. And so it talks about the typical is 90 days. So someone files a lawsuit to void a final action, they have to file that within 90 days. If it involves the issuance of bonds, then you know notes or other evidence of indebtedness, it's down to 30 days. And attorney's fees can be awarded to the prevailing plaintiff. And then it talks about how county attorneys are tasked with enforcing OPMA as well as the attorney general. But at least for our county, it would just be my office. And that's all I had for the open meeting. So hopefully it was less boring and more interesting than last time. Thanks to Janet.

That's great. Thank you. Okay. Um, do you want me to share my screen for this one or here? Why don't I should

Yeah, you share your screen. I'm going to go to do not install. All right. And I'll thank Kate on this one because Kate's getting us to adopt this each year, which is good. So, we can go through and and see if there's any thing that we need to update. So, this was CR2502 from last year. Um, part of what we just did is included in here as far as having meetings open to the public. Um, what's required to do that? Um, I I did notice that it has that when you go from four to five, it just has that hanging um,

page four to five.

Page four to five. Sorry. I think it's just the formatting where it has the page break. Um the the main one that I was looking at that I thought maybe we could just amend the way it's written is rule 11. [clears throat] This is on page 18 of the document. [snorts] And so this is where we were talking about earlier. There's freedom of speech. People can say a lot of things. They can say things that we disagree with and we we need to give them that opportunity. But it does talk about, you know, engaging in personal attacks, restrict um shall restrict comments to issues before the body

uh sorry decorum page 18 of the not sorry not the document of the of the rules of procedure what is [laughter] on my screen. Okay.

Okay. Yeah. Um and so just under that 111A and then and then it also says violations of decorum or conduct of commission members shall be addressed by the chair who may declare a commission member out of order. I don't know that we've ever had that happen. So that's that's positive. Um, commission members should avoid engaging in private discourse or committing any other act which may tend to distract the attention of the commission or the audience from business before the commission or which might interfere with any person's right to be heard after recognition by the chair. Um, this one I think we probably could work on a little bit more. Sometimes there's discussions between commissioners because I mean you're just kind of discussing something as we're waiting for someone to come up. Um there was also a discussion that we had maybe a year or so ago where we talked about not texting each other or something during the meeting because you know even if you're using your private phone and you're saying like oh can you believe this? you know, I don't know whatever it would be, but it's happened in other public bodies and it's gone all the way up to the state records committee and they say that under grammar, your phone is now subject to a grammar request and those messages back and forth because you can't claim it was personal use cuz it was regarding it was during a time in which your deliberation should be open to the public and you were in a meeting texting and So then it becomes subject to grammar. So just a reminder if if we can you want to speak into the mic, catch everything on the record, conduct your deliberations openly, even if you have something that you might want to say to the the person.

So are there any amendments you were making to the wording? No, not not on this one. This was more of just going over, but under subsection two, there are suggest Okay. So, we did talk, you and I have talked about rule 10, which is the one right above it. Yeah.

Where um with the conflict of interest right now, the last statement states um although state law does not require a commission member to abstain from vote voting or avoid participating in discussion regarding an item where there is a conflict or interest, the applicable member may determine it is advisable to do so. We, you and I had talked because back when Robert McConnell was here, he would restate the conflict at the beginning of the action item and at one point you wanted to add that in here. I don't know if that's still

Well, I don't know. I I think I I've also been told and probably Well, Mike, you might be the only one that was here with a prior council, right? everyone else was elected as a commissioner, not a council person. What I've heard is that there were and and I don't know if it was in these policies and procedures, but um there's varying levels of of declaring the conflict or removing yourself from the conflict. And what I've been told is that it used to be a council person would have to step out if they had a conflict while it was being discussed. Um, and and I don't know why that was changed or when it was changed and if that's change is good, but I can see how potentially it could be helpful to say, "Okay, I'm I'm going to step out." And and the reason I brought up Robert McConnell is I know that sometimes he would voluntarily step out even though he wasn't required to do so. Not with every conflict, but on the ones he's like, you know, I maybe shouldn't be involved in this discussion either. So, I don't know if you want to revisit that, if you want me to come up with some options for language. And there's probably a sliding scale where you say, "If you have a conflict, you need to step out. If you have a conflict, you abstain from voting. If you have a conflict, you declare it at the beginning. If you have a conflict, we just do it right here that you may step out. It's up to your discretion." So, just to give you an example of why this is at the forefront of my mind, I own property in Wasach County. The parcel next to me, we have a private road. So, it's eight houses on a private road. And when uh we Heber City did their big annexation, we requested to be left out of that. And we were the property owner

to the east of me decided to request to be annexed in which would have given the city at 1/8 access to a private road that's not big enough. It's not big enough for a firet truck. And our fear was that they were going to widen the road. The reason I bring that up is the city councilman um was also the applicant's engineer and as a commission you appoint the planning commission seat. So here I am as a citizen against this and the planning the person that appointed the planning commissioners, the county councilman is sitting next to the applicant in the planning commission meeting and then at the city council even though he abstained is sitting next to the applicant in the action item. Is that legal? Absolutely. Optically, does it look terrible? Absolutely. So it's just one of those optic things that we might just want to consider. whether it's a restatement of it or or what have you. I know we talked about the restatement,

right? I have a problem a little bit with that. If we really look at conflicts of interest, conflicts of interest could be I'm a relative of somebody else that's on the commission or I'm a relative of the person that's out there talking. And even though I'm a relative doesn't make it to where I'm going to favor inside of them. I mean, I know that one of our commissioners is related to somebody within one of his portfolios and uh you know whether or not that's right or not. It's just I'm just kind of curious. Okay, if we go to that extreme so do we need to define

we violate do we violate a conflict of interest? I mean I this so the statute defines a conflict of interest which is a business interest or ownership in a company

and so so it is defined so a conflict isn't necessarily a relationship there might be a nepotism you know HR thing that we would look at for that but it you know just being related or being friendly with someone it the conflict of interest under state statute is financial if it's specific to financial business ownership interest, something like that. And so it would limit it. And and the reason probably it came up more often with Commissioner McConnell is

he well his law practice that he's a partner of that represents applicants and and so that it wasn't just oh I know them or I have a representation agreement. And it's I'm an owner of, you know, a law firm that represents because I mean, if we look at it, every one of us have a conflict of interest. I mean, I'm in agriculture and I'm going to stick to agriculture. And I would consider that a bias, but it's not a conflict of interest under the definition.

That's where I wouldn't know the law on that conflict of interest versus bias. I mean, there's a lot of biases that we all have. Um, and I just I'm just trying to make sure that we're not conflicting of interest on all of these different things because I mean we all are related in this county. Majority of us are.

So it's it's my understanding that's why they changed it to where now those conflict forms that you filled out are published to the website and that's what's listed on there is what need would need to be announced if it if it hits that conflict. So you own a business and or um like [clears throat] our county treasurer, her husband and her son are on Morgan County payroll like they that is she just has to list that as a conflict because it's fiscal. So anything that was on that form would have if it triggered in a commission action item would have to be my opinion and that's why it has to be posted on the county website and they're due by January 12th which thank you for turning them all in. Um, but

again, to me, it's really if you benefit financially, either directly or indirectly through a decision the commission makes, you ought to exclude yourself. That's pretty my businesses on my Yeah, if one of your businesses were to come in and make an application, you would step out of that. I mean, if if we were talking in Commissioner Fel's situation, if we were talking specifically about a pay change for his spouse that works for the county, he should step out of that. Like, that's outside of that though. I mean, it doesn't

Well, like a prime example is Commissioner Nickerson was like, "Well, I don't bid on county projects for electrical." And I said, "Yes, but you still own a business in the county, and if we were to redo the electrical code as a county commission, you'd probably want to disclose that conflict, that that might help or hinder you in your business, which is an indirect potentially an indirect opportunity to benefit financially.

Okay. Yeah. See, I I keep thinking about because I'm related to a good portion of the county. So, as reszones or things come up, it's like is it a conflict and it's like I won't monetarily benefit at all? But I also think would be good because I know a lot of people like that's your cousin and you're going to vote in favor or against you don't want whatever it is. So, I don't think it's a bad to say this is a family member so that people understand that yes, I am aware and we're putting it out there so that everybody knows. Um, but I guess technically it would not be a conflict of interest, but it may be a bias. It could be looked at as a bias.

And I think that should be stated like, hey, I have no financial interest in this. However, this is a distant family member. This project, it's out there in the public that people understand. They know we're not trying to sneak, right? Because we're probably all related to somebody multiple. We can't make it too difficult. No. Oh, nobody's going to be here. So, did we make did I make that worse? [laughter] I don't think we made it worse. I think it just opens the discussion to say, you know, is there is there a sliding scale where

do we do we like how it's listed right now where it gives some discretion that says although it's not required by state law, they may abstain or I don't think with it. I mean, I guess [snorts] we could potentially have a problem, but I think everybody was pretty dang honest about Yeah. Okay. What's the next?

Um, so then under 112, the conduct of citizens and attendees. As we go on to the next, there might just be a clarification of wording here. Well, so A says those in attendance should be admonished by the chair when they engage in outbursts without being recognized, make personal attacks, or seek to disrupt the meeting through loud or boisterous behavior. Um, so that's, you know, the chair can just say, "Hey, will you please stop that?" But then B says, "Individuals should be requested to address their remarks directly to the commission as a body." Uh, concerning the agenda business, persons engaged in disruptive behavior shall be removed by the sheriff at the direction of the chair. I I think as I was reading through I was like, "Okay, well, I know that both are elected and I bet the sheriff would do that, but if we just said, you know, persons engaged in disruptive behavior may be subject to um removal in addition to criminal penalties or or something like that where

well because that's what it is. It's written into the code as disorderly conduct, but then it's not the chair directing the sheriff to do something because the sheriff may say, well, no,

no. [laughter] And so I don't think he would. I'm just saying that if we rephrased it to say, you know, the the I like in the next one it says upon request of the chair, county sheriff deputy will be assigned to the meeting, right? So the chair can say, "Hey, based on the emails we're getting, we think this might be more disruptive. Can you just have a deputy come or the or will you come and the sheriff may just come himself or or send a deputy or two?" So, I like how it's written in rule 12 because it's making that request and or maybe there's something that says persons engaged in disruptive behavior are subject to removal. Um where and do we say like through collaboration of the sheriff and the chair or you know something where they're working together to maintain

I think it would just be subject to removal period. Okay. And how that's done. Yeah. I think I've seen that once in six years. I can be your muscle. Yeah. [laughter] Well, we'll let Kate remove them because I'm so mean. Um uh so the sorry 11B would be individuals should be requested to address remarks directly to the commission as a body concerning the agenda business. Persons engaged in disruptive behavior are subject to removal. Period. Uh right here.

Okay. And then I think that rolls right into rule 12 really nicely because then if the chair foresees an issue, make a request and then it talks specifically in three in case of any disturbance or disorderly conduct within the chambers. At a commission meeting, the chair may request the sheriff or deputy to escort the offenders from the commission meeting, which I think is how it should work. So, anything else? Other than that, I think question I had. Is your mic on?

Yeah. Oh, okay. I'm getting nasty cramps from Jeremy that they can't. That's cuz I'm sitting back like everybody else. Oh, it's like because he can't hear you. I mean, I figured this could work for me. But anyway, um and I can't see now. My on item six, page seven of the packet.

Which would be of this item which is page four. It is under rural that's a two or a three. three and it's six where it states the reasons for a um um for the closed meeting. Why I mean we've listed items there but there are additional items within the code. Why don't we just leave it at code at the code the Utah state code instead of listing those items in case there's something else? That's the only question I have.

And I I think that we added the code reference last time. I'm okay with just citing to the code itself, but for at least those that are just looking at the policies and procedures, these are the these are the close session. The other ones are specific to the legislative audit committee. These are the only ones that could apply to the county even though we only use three of them.

Okay. The only the only question I have is some people will take take that as closed meetings are allowed for these purposes, but if there's another purpose under the code and we don't follow it and yet we break this, maybe you ought to have closed meetings are subject to these purposes and the code. That's all I'm saying. Yeah, I'm fine with that, too. And you know, if they if the state legislature updates the code and adds [clears throat] another thing that does apply to the counties, then it would be encompassed. That's right. Okay.

I'm just thinking from a public standpoint, well, these are the items, but you guys went out for a different item, even though they didn't read the code. So that's the only reason I was bringing that up. Yeah. Um, anything else on commission policies and procedures because we have 10 minutes and we still have to do travel. Yeah, I don't think so. Unless anyone else and that's 46. I think the only thing we considered changing on this one was um I do not book lodging. Yeah, I was going to say so I wanted to strike that. Great.

I think everything else is Oh, was there clarification? I can't I had a couple items on it. Let me get Okay. I think the main thing was the lodging just because of the Well, like do we approve before does have to be

well it's approved by quorum. Yeah, there was so we had a discussion earlier on where it wasn't an action item. It came up in commission comments and but we didn't have time to put it on another agenda and my interpretation of the policy at the time was as long as it's approved by a quorum it wasn't necessarily through an action item and I don't know if we need to clarify that it has to be through an action item or if it can just be during the commissioner comments and everyone says oh yeah there's this one coming up yeah we get a quorum head nod to it or does it have to be an action item? Good question.

I think comments would be during the commissioner comments would be fine. I I think it functions the same way because it's not an action item. The budget's already set. the public like I don't know that it would matter as much where they say well I don't want you to go to that fill-in-theblank meeting right because that's that's not really up to the public you said the you know if it's within the budget you get a quorum buy off that says yeah we think you should go to that I think the more informal will probably address some of those things that come up where you're trying to get early bird pricing and you don't want to wait till the next agenda So that's just my thought,

but that's how I interpreted it last time. So I'm probably biased toward that interpretation. I can agree with that. Okay. So leaving it as is except for item book launching. Okay. Okay.

And then another item I have a question on and that is um a pre-authorized item reimbursement of parking, mileage, gasoline, and it's on Under travel expenses procedures says need to if for requests of reimbursement of expenses over $500 are to be submitted to the county administrator administrative manager in advance. Well, what if you don't know those costs before the meeting? Such as we went to USA and we all ended up paying parking fees

over the whole day over not over not over 500. Right. So, that's what I'm asking is how do we how do I I didn't I can't interpret that very well. Can you help me? It's only if the costs are anticipated to be over $500. which for any driving within the state, you wouldn't be over $500. For any parking, you won't be over $500. And it's not cumulative everything together. It's individual items. Correct. Okay. That's how I read it. So, oh, it says expenses plural. Yeah. I just I can't I'm even thinking of

I don't know of a scenario for that. I really don't. But I'm just asking that question. Well, but it refers to the it says expenses, but it refers to those above. [clears throat and cough] Reimbursement of parking, mileage, gasoline do not require requests that they are under $500. So, it's limited to parking, mileage, gasoline, or frier bus passes, which even altogether probably aren't going to exceed $500 for any trip. And is this related to prepayments, not just commission for the whole, right?

No, it's the it's under general information. Travel and expense procedures because it does say authorized business travel for staff that includes prepayments must be preapproved. Yeah. And then it says you don't have to get them approved if they're under $500 and within the parking mileage or gasoline fer pass category. But if they are going to be in those categories and over $500, then we're supposed to give Bengates to sign off. And I feel like there also needs to be an update. I mean, rail transportation, we need to add Uber, Lift, because if you're flying somewhere, you might not rent a car. You might get an Uber, but there's no mention of Ubers or Lifts or anything.

Taxi. Okay. And I think there was a change that we made, not like officially um for out of state travel. All out of state travel must be approved by the county administrative manager or the commission chair. I think we added um that I put that on consent agenda. Is that out of state? Like say for instance, I'm going two and a half hours away to a trails conference. with that and it's out [clears throat] of state. Yeah. Okay.

Um uh that it was more like our emergency management director went to a training in in Iowa and so they were leaving the state and it's more of a it helps us be aware that someone on our insurance is going out of state. [clears throat and cough] Um especially if they're wanting to take a county vehicle or something like that, right?

I think that was its intent. Um, but I just wanted to add the wording that we'd add that to consent agenda. I would think with the commission since it's approved by quorum, it's redundant whether it's a instate or out of state because it's going to be approved by quorum anyway. I think that's more for anyone else. Would you and translate it that way? Okay. Okay. Anything else? Three minutes. for me. Do we need to add anything in the travel policy now that we have fleet vehicles that [clears throat] that we use them first?

That that's a priority over mileage reimbursement. They should try to use them versus their private vehicles. You know, that should be why we have them. Yeah. You know, then we're not having to re, you know, refund anybody anything. [clears throat] We purchased them. Let's use them. So, if that's the case where we only have two vehicles. I think I we've got three three vehicles. Um like to the day on the hill. So we have one fleet vehicle. So one at at large vehicle and I have the calendar. You have to book it with me. Okay. So I just

because I think Cindy used it for an election training. We've got our fair chair is using it to go to fair training. Like we have it's people are booking it for sure. So is it being used all the time? Not all the time, but a healthy amount. It's not sitting there. I can tell you that much. Okay. So, [clears throat] okay. So, we'll add some type of language that the fleet vehicle scheduling of fleet vehicle takes priority over mileage reimbursement. Okay. Okay. All right. Anything else? Bathroom break.

Okay. We'll take a two-minute break and be back for regular meeting. I think we can absolutely be done by Hey. talking. What's that?

My mom's out of town. [snorts] Good.

That's good. [laughter] Three, two, Okay, we'll go ahead and get started. Welcome everyone to our county commission meeting January 6th, 2026. Appreciate you being here and those that are online, we welcome you as well and appreciate you listening. We're going to turn the time over to Commissioner Fel now for an invocation and lead us in the pledge of allegiance. Our dear heavenly father, this afternoon we're grateful for this opportunity which we have to be here as a public body and to elected officials to be able to discuss the affairs of this county and how it can go forward and how we can improve upon what we have. We pray that thou will bless us this day. That as we discuss those items that are on the agenda that we will be able to do so in a [clears throat] very cordial manner and that as the public wants to discuss items that they can and that they can be able to say what it is within their minds. We are grateful for this country that we have to live in. We're grateful for this county. It's a very blessed county and we pray that thou will help us to keep it that way. These [clears throat] things we pray for in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

Amen. You follow me in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge

allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, Commissioner Fackerel. Appreciate that. Okay, it's a new year. Happy New Year to everyone. Hopefully, everybody had a nice holiday, Christmas, and and New Year. So, it is time for us to choose and elect a new county commissioner, a chair, county commission chair, and vice chair. So, I will turn the time over to nominate for nominations.

I would I would nominate Commissioner Wilson as chair. I'll second it. Oh, I guess it's not a second on the nomination. Just nominations. Okay.

I'm fine to do it. It'll be my last year for sure. Yeah. [laughter] Okay. So, we have a nomination for Commissioner Wilson to continue to be the chair. All those in favor? I. Are there any opposed? Oh, [laughter] one. That's an opposition. Okay. I move to nominate Von Nickerson again as vice chair. Okay. Second it.

Okay. I have a nomination and a second for Bond to be the vice chair. Continue. I'll Yeah, I'll kick you. It's fine. Okay. All those in favor? Are there any opposed? Okay. Okay. Doesn't have to move the signs. Okay. Okay, we have uh five consent agendas this evening. I assume everybody's had an opportunity to look at those. I sorry, I made an error. Okay.

I put um Commissioner Blocker's appointment to planning commission in the packet twice and I never put the RFP in, which is consent agenda item five. So, in other words, we need to take that out. We need to take that out because you've you have not seen it. Yeah. Okay. So that one will need to be removed then. Y but we we got that uh resolution in there twice. [laughter]

Okay. So that um then just for as I read through the the uh rules and learned a few things today as I read through those I will try and do better of just for the the the [cough] uh public. Um, our consent agenda items are approval of the minutes from December 17th and a receipt of a letter of resignation for the weed abatement board member Lewis Dillery. It was a notice of an opening on the weed abatement board and it that is now open for submissions and notice of opening on the community and e economic appointment opportunity board that's open for submissions. Okay,

Mr. Chair, I move that we approve consent agenda items 1 through 4 and that we remove consent agenda five and postpone that for a future meeting. I'll second it. Okay, I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Blocker. All in favor? I. Are there any opposed? Okay, motion carries. Cindy, were there any modifications to your minutes [clears throat] from the ones that were in the packet? Okay. So, but you printed a copy and so I can pitch mine. Okay. Thank you.

Okay. Any commissioner declarations of conflict of interest? And I assume everyone's been able to turn in their

Yes, I have. conflicts of interest for the year. Okay. Appreciate that. Okay. [clears throat] Now is the time for public comment. So, we'll welcome any public individual that like to come up and and share anything that they have. They have you have three minutes. We'd like you to state your name and where you live, your address, and uh that's not a time period where we can interact with you, but um you're welcome to state anything that you'd like to the commission now. So, turn the time over to the public. Okay, seeing none, we'll move on to our presentation. Blair Stringham. Get to see at least once a year it seems like.

I'm happy to be here. Welcome.

So, yeah. Good afternoon, commissioners. I'm Blurstream with Utah Division of Wildlife [clears throat] Resources and I'm here this afternoon to present our payment of taxes to the county um which we do each year. Uh this year the amount is $5,64.84. Um this is um in lie of the taxes that we pay for the land that we hold here in the county. We have about 20,000 acres that we manage for wildlife. Um it's hunter and angler access as well as um a lot of great habitat for deer, male deer, upland birds and variety of other species. So, we just want to um reiterate we really appreciate the county um all that you all do and we've worked with multiple commissioners in this county on WMA issues. Um Commissioner Nickerson's been on our deer committee lately and just a lot of good things happening up here and we appreciate that partnership and hopefully you'll reach out if you ever have questions or issues.

Thank you. How much was that, Blair? Um it's $5,64.84. Okay. Thank you. Appreciate it. Who you leave the check with? So that's me. Oh, you I guess here money. Okay, we'll get it in the right hand. I will get it to the treasure. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for coming out. Thank you.

Wilson going. No, no fire call uh quite yet. [laughter] But uh my name is James Wilson. Um haven't met any of you guys yet, but I'm looking forward to working with you guys. Um I know Dave Vickers served a long time and those are some big shoes to fill, but [clears throat] looking forward to, you know, high levels of collaboration with all the fire departments in here um and make them succeed in the wildland um arena. A little backstory on myself. I'm originally from Chicago, north, 30 minutes north. Um, good luck. Um, Bears fan. Um,

no. [laughter]

Um, so I grew up in Chicago. I've been out here for 13 years. Um, I have a big background in snowboarding. Um, I actually ride for a company out of Salt Lake City. A big backcountry enthusiast. Um, as well as just snow studies and stuff like that. um got into wildland firefighting, joined a hot shot crew. Um was there for about six years, half those years were in leadership positions, squad leader, that kind of stuff. Um this last year I was able to take a little, you know, foot off the gas, if you will. Um, since I knew I was going to get married in the fall, I wanted to be home more and I worked as an assistant warden for Davis County as well as Utah County. Um, so gaining those slides as a as a warden. Um, the biggest thing is, you know, I'm I'm excited um to work with you guys as well as, you know, Morgan Fire Department, Mountain Green, Wasach Peaks, and, you know, the community. Um, one thing is I would say just, you know, House Bill 48 obviously, um, we've come out with, you know, a lot more information on that. Um, this week there should be an assessment, a lot assessment, um, tab that you can you can ask for those lot assessments and that should be updating um, this week. U, but just keep an eye on that. um especially the map is going to be the biggest thing. But um yeah, just looking forward to working with the community of Morgan County and um yeah, so

thank you. Yeah, you got a great last name. You realize that uh your enthusiasm might be diminished just a hair being married now, right? Well, [laughter] there's a lot of house projects that come with it. So I'm still on That's right. [laughter] you know, she comes first. Exactly. So, yeah, excited and thanks for allowing me to speak and uh yeah, looking forward to working with you guys. We look forward to working with you. Still hope your team loses on Sunday. Hey, I just became a Bears fan because they're doing good this year. I'm [laughter] wagon jump. Thanks, James.

Thank you. Okay, Sean. Good [clears throat] evening, commissioners. Um, so I'm just here tonight just to give you an overview of the new map that went live on the 2nd of January. Um, this is again, it's live and it's ready to go. We have taken down all the old maps and now we are officially using this new Morgan County GIS data map. So just to kind of give you an overview of it, when you pull up the map, this is what it goes to as default. As you zoom in, you're going to start to see the parcels. All the white lines are parcels, the tax parcels. And then as you start to zoom in more, you're going to start to see that blue overlay color. That is meaning that there's a recorded subdivision that's been recorded and is now been placed on the map and the PDF is now available to view on that. Simply click on that blue the parcel. Sorry her screen is this arrow up here. Hit that arrow and you will go over and you'll see Young Chrysler subdivision. That's the recorded subdivision that I just clicked on for that parcel. And this is the PDF to that

subdivision. It's a PDF. It can be downloaded, printed anywhere. Anybody that has a you can look up look these up on your phone. If you have access to the map, you can have access to all this. It's pretty neat.

Pretty nice. As you go over on that arrow more, you're going to start to see sub mapaps. And if you scroll down, you're going to start to see section maps. Now, when you hit the section maps, these are now the digital tax parcel maps that I've shown before. Um, these are all for these are for tax purposes only, but this is showing ownership. So, anytime a document gets recorded, ownership changes, it's going to show up on here for anybody to access.

Sean, when when if somebody were to come in and have something recorded, how much time would you say, and I wouldn't hold you to, but are we is this updated weekly, monthly? How quick would you think would happen? So currently right now um if if the document passes and we're able to work it, we're we're so it's a um

really quick commissioners. This is Charles and he is our GIS specialist. He is the guy that has made this possible and um he's he's the one that's helping taking this county further for us. We've heard good things about you, Charles. Well, thank you. What about the bad things? Um [laughter] so the ownership stuff updates every Monday. Um so like this section, uh the hyperlink for the parcel info takes to the Morgan County search portal being done with Medici. Uh I'm not quite sure what the update iteration is for that, but the ownership stuff is updated every Monday. So, so fairly quick then.

Yeah. And we want want to get to daily eventually. There's a lot of moving parts right now towards moving to a new system and then once we're in that new system, we do want to move towards uh daily. All right. Oh, that's excellent. Thank you, Sean. When does Enterprise go live? So, Enterprise is is is live right now. So, we are currently we've transitioned from Ezri. We are now in Enterprise. Um, we are [clears throat] meeting with Pro West who is going to help us transition fully into enterprise next week to kind of get that ball rolling. Um, but we are currently in enterprise right now. That's your question.

Yes. Right. You want to keep going. Um, speaking to how long it it takes for ownership to show, originally um, before I came into office, it was about a year. You would see the majority of ownership changes. Um, so going from a year to a week is a huge, huge deal. Yeah, we're like Charles said, we're hoping to go daily. So every day we're going to be running the um the script to ownership changes.

So would would that be the same? So I I was in the other day we're talking about you know surveys and having the lines make sure everything was is correct. Is that kind of the same thing as ownership? It' be basically weeklyish with regular surveys. Yeah. So regular surveys. So there's a difference. So when record a recorded document is what changes ownership or that's that document is going to change whatever it's stating to say a record of survey is only being filed and that's just to be made public to the to the public. Um but a lot of times the documents will be reported with the record survey and and that will

okay

create the the changes um on record of surveys. So how you see blue on here that represents the subdivisions. There's going to be a color on here. You can put one on here to show everybody. You see this yellowish color? [clears throat] So those that yellow color that's going to represent reckless surveys. So soon you're going to start to see all the recordless surveys that's been filed within the county on here as well and you'll be able to you'll show the record survey number on them. We also have a ledger that we've created that has all the record surveys that's been filed within the county. the number matches the ledger and so you can either find them on here. You can you'll be able to search them on here or search them in the ledger and then go to the map. Either way, you'll be able to um so the biggest part for this the whole the bigger picture for this map was how how can we get it down to one map countywide. So to help with all the departments we got together and we have combined all the maps into one. So if you come over here these are now the layers for each department. So you'll have reporter layers, surveyor layers, planning and development layers, collection layers, clerk and auditor layers, successor layers, emergency management layers, and that hexagon is the the imagery that's behind it. That is always going to be on there as default. Now the par the white lines, the parcels, they're going to be on there as

default as also the subitions. So, anybody who gets on the map anytime, every time these are going to be on their head, you can turn them off by coming to the recorder layers, hitting that I turn them off and then going to the surveyor layers there. The surveyor layer is a a work in progress. Um, as we get the data in, it will begin to update and we will start to add the layers to them. But if you then you go, you can turn off. So, if you wanted to see everything on this map, I'll just turn into it for you so you can see as if everything was on. And you can kind of see how much control. So every color, every wording, it's a different layer. So all this is combined into one map. Each department still has control over their layers. [clears throat] But now we have we have the capability Charles inhouse can change, update the department. Yeah. I have a question for you if I can.

Okay. On this map in particular, this Morgan City boundary,

you got these the boundary is which one of these lines? Because I mean you've got you've got some green, some purple, some orange, blue, some okay but those within that boundary there was some different layers or something in there. What are those distinctions? So all those colors I was I was just showing what all all those all the layers were on. So all the colors on there that was just me showing you all the different layers of how much data that we were controlling in the county. Um and now that we're you know we're able to show them show all those layers on this one now. So the city boundary and we added a legend over here also that will show maybe I can come down and ask you that at another time if it's not important to anybody else.

It's up to these guys. What what's your question? My question was just that. I mean, we've got some different items in there that were different colors within that city boundary and I'm just wondering, okay, are those have those been annexed into the city? Are they completely are they are they county or are they part of the city basically is what I'm asking. That red the outline of Morgan City is Morgan City,

right? anything in inside of that we're still showing parcels because everything is still getting anything to do with the city still gets reported within the county and so anything to do with so you're still showing we're going to show subdivisions we're going to show record surveys we're going to show the parcels um addressor layers there that's everything current though it's not future annexation and stuff like that correct But if any future it will be shown,

right? Well, I'm just looking at it because if it's within the city boundaries and you've got some little outlines that are green, which are like the counties and yet they're so showing up within the city has that would mean to me they'd be county property within the city. That [clears throat] is a red flag. I guess I don't understand. Okay. If you can go back to the one that you had, but this building is county property within the city.

Right. But individuals because we're not supposed to have, in fact, it's one of the legislations coming up here this year with legislature where they're not going to be able to allow them to have an island within the city. So, you're saying that it's non-countyowned property. No, I'm saying are they county owned property or are they individually owned properties within city limits that our county, you know, that the county has to manage or take care of. Okay. [clears throat] To my knowledge, there are no privately

own I need to know so that I can go forward with some, you know, with help with legislation this year. I don't want to hurt some people and I want to make sure we don't give everything away either. Okay. So, I have it pulled up. Okay. Okay. So, you've got right is the city part of this like township or section number 33. Is that part of the city or is that part of the county? So, the sections and the townships have nothing. They they are okay. Let me let me show you this one here. No,

the city boundary is this one here. No, it's the dark red. Hang on. Let me let me show you.

Purple then is what? Within that boundary flood plane. Okay. No, it's flip, isn't it? I just don't want us to have a problem with the legislature.

Okay. You know what would be nice if there was like the color coordinated next to the department. You know the layer that's coming up so we know what color to look for.

We can do that. Um, but then that's why we created the legend over here that I have up now. So every color is now labeled. So if you have a question on what color is what what the color represents, you can go to that leg legend and you can see that's what I was looking for.

What that is for. Um now Blaine the the city has the the the boundary. So this red boundary you can kind of see it. I can count all the later as well. Let me do that show that red boundary Morgan City that is the boundary of the city. Okay. There was an island. Okay.

Where where are you seeing an island though? Yeah. So, that's not an island. It looks like it, but it but it's not. It's connected within the city. See those two connections? How How is it connected right there? That little leg. right there. Okay. Right there. All right. It is within the city boundary. Does that answer your question? Yep, that does. Okay. Thank you.

Um, if there's any questions going forward, you you're more than welcome. You're always welcome in the office and me or my office Charles more than happy to help.

Thank you. you know, this is a this is obviously new to everybody and so there's going to be a lot of some changes, you know, from different departments, but if you have any questions, please come. Um, so that kind of the majority of this new map, the most important thing is just all the layers now that can be turned on and off. Anybody can view a certain layer, just one layer or multiple layers, uh, voting layers, the assessor layers. um but it it can be changed and updated within that's awesome

and I I want to give a big thank you to you commissioners for allowing us to do this without you none of this would have happened um it wouldn't allow Charles to take this on and get this done so thank you for to do this do you have any questions what's an example the clerk auditor layer. So clerk and auditor. So it is the the trash district trash. That's for Cindy. That and the election layer. Those are Cindies. [snorts]

So there's two colors, the red and the blue. Um each each color is representing a different route routes different pickup days. the election obviously and Sean has reached out to the school district and is presenting to them next week and um because they're interested in maybe getting some layers too of like who goes to what elementary school, that kind of thing. So great. So another another way to collaborate. Thank you for doing that. Now this is great. I had fun playing with it. Pulled it up and just it's messing around. It's pretty awesome.

Thank you. Thank you. Questions. Should satisfy anyone that's nosy at all. They can find out all they want. [laughter] Okay. Yeah. I just got to get paper. Thank you, Sean. Okay. Action item.

All right. So, um last commission meeting I talked to you all about how much work that is needed uh within the county for with the LSS section corners um surveyor needs within the county. Um, now today, tonight I am asking for approval for to create um an in-house surveyor position. Um, I had Casey go through and run some numbers kind of throughout different counties and this is what he came up with. Ranges from 85 to 100,000 um yearly salary. Um I I will say that it is hard to get a private surveyor to come to government job. Um most likely a pay cut. Um, but the work that needs to be done, it it I I would strongly suggest that we look at starting out at 100,000 for the position to get a good surveyor here that will do a good job for county. Um side note of that I was able to go back to 2015 and gather up all and now this just this includes PLSS and then the reviewing of subdivision plats for the county. Um so for PLSS related work um it totaled up to $414,523. Um, for subdivision reviews, it came up to be 526,64.

So, over a million dollars in 10 years.

Um, and to be honest with the PLSS work, we have nothing to show for to be honest with you. I I showed you I explained to you where we are at. We have nothing. Um and espec you know for the subdivision reviews it can also go a long ways. They're in house I think the turnaround time would be a lot faster. Um I think Josh would agree that having an in-house surveyor you know went off was contracted. So we're not having to wait however long you know one to two weeks for them to get their comments back. they're in the house in the building and they're reviewing them in person. So, and they are they're they'll be able to collaborate with all the other departments that so now I'm I'm here asking for approval for

so 100,000 that doesn't include benefits, correct? And do we have office space for a service? [laughter] Yeah, it's that truck. He's going to be out there on the field all the time. That is a work in progress. He can have my clus closet office. Well, if we ever get the other portion that we asked for or want to try to do, which we have not approved, we can have them. So

that that will I mean obviously yes we'll need to figure out where where that office would [snorts] go but that that will come. Um and to to be honest with you this won't be a fast transition. We obviously [clears throat] want to get a good surveyor here that will do Morgan County a lot of good. Um and we you know we we want to get someone good and we want to do this right. Um but then also we need to office space for that as well. So, so to break this up in chunks, would it make sense to one decide as a commission to post this position and then two, if you're agreeable to post this position, pick a salary range.

So, I think that's the next step we would have to do. I don't see um I as I looked I didn't see anybody that has the recorders offices the portfolio assignment. So we don't elected officers don't have portfolio. So, um, who who would do all the interviewing in that? And first, usually

the first state code. If the county does not have a surveyor or an elected surveyor that falls under the reporter's office, though, I would like to have oversee the survey. I I do have a question. So, if we're looking at these, obviously we have salary and we have benefits. What kind of equipment would we also have to purchase?

So, we we learned the hard way on that one. Uh because the commission was very uh generous and gave the attorney an additional attorney, which we did in the budget. We approved salary and benefits, but no computer, no [laughter] test. So, you're going to be getting a budget adjustment for that. It's about $2,500 for um like the laptop and the tech, the email address, um the Outlook account, and then any cost of furniture desk. Well, and I mean like surveying equipment. He's always going to need a truck cuz we have a few, but I mean I think that if he's going to be out and about, he's going to be in it every day. So, I I I'm just we need to know the full

kind of idea. We learned about the attorney, but as far as what kind of equipment are we going to be purchasing, you know, is this a yearly upgrade to equipment, software, just those kind of things, just so we have a, you know, we're not going to hold you to the penny or at least I wouldn't, but get a good ballpark of what is it really going to cost to set up a surveyor. So, would the commission be adverse to the idea of at least letting us know if you're good with this and then we can bring it back next meeting with a full spec out of expenditures? Yeah. Just so I have at least You're going from a million task I know tasking staff to You said that million was over how many years? 10. So about 100,000 a year.

But that's where like you said we've got very limited that we're paying right now. Yeah. Where this would be in house and we have you know five day a week access to a survey. And what would be our plan for for pass through charge because a big portion of that was passed through on you know through that office. So it goes to revenue already. It's just right now we have an expense line that expends it out. So we would just have to determine how much that we would charge to have the surveyor do which is now a great time to do it since we're doing the

foods. I think it's worth doing. I do think um I'd like to try to I mean I see some of these at like more entry level I'm assuming surveyor positions. I'd like to think this is the type of job that somebody would probably grow into. So, I'd like us to start a little lower on salary than 100,000. Um, but I don't know what we'll get. So, well, we could have a range. Maybe that's the range. You know, maybe it's 75 to 100,000 or something depending on certification and experience. Experience.

So, Commissioner Men, were you talking about the surveyor two? Yeah, surveyor one and two. I'm assuming those are so when you're looking at that that is so a surveyor so the surveyor one and surveyor two work under a licensed surveyor so they don't have to run so they're not a licensed surveyor they're not certified surveyor three and up have a certified they are certified and licensed to survey so your weaver your weaver county surveyor three would be licensed and he's at 95,000 or she's at 9500

I guess The other thing I'd ask Sean is is sometimes we we forget how good of benefits we do provide as a county for our employees and so in compar comparing other counties sometimes we forget that portion of it too. So it sometimes that's that's a big deal to that would be a big deal to me being self-employed I see what I get to pay. So it's it's a big deal. So How does Ground County get off with 43 44,000? I mean, their benefits are almost as much as their salary. He's elected. Is it elective?

I I'm not sure where that number is coming from. I I don't might want to reach out to him. He could get a pay raise. [laughter] He gets a free pass, too. and come to aieve beautiful county. So, it sounds like you're good with commission tasking staff to move forward on at least flushing out the budget. Yeah. Yes.

Want an official motion on that? On action. Okay. Mr. Chair, I move that uh we approve proceeding with determining a an official and total budget for the potential of hiring a full-time surveyor position within Morgan County Clerk Office reporter's office. I'm sorry. [laughter] I'll second it. Leslie will take an employee. Leslie doesn't want to serve. I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Nickerson. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Motion carries. Get with you. Okay, Erin. Thank you, Sean.

Thanks, Sean. Um, so I can't believe it's almost been two years since I've been here. Um, and Aaron has always kept in the back of my mind that at some point we really need to repair the rain gutters on the library building. Um, our building is how many years? Uh, 28. And we don't think they've ever been maintained. Um if you look at the library itself on that main um circular area, you'll see a big stain down the center and that's from our gutters leaking. We just did a an emergency repair to the lobby building for leakage and have to do some more because it turns out there's damage from what what did that Corey said there's sheetrock damage from a

the earthquake in 2020. Yeah. And we've never fixed it. Yeah. Um, so that's of course an issue. Um, so rather than keep kicking this can down the road, I figured if I put it on the agenda, we at least can talk about it and see if we want to get that done this year, get it done next year, patch it, what have you. But, um, it's the newest building we have in the county short of, um, the public works building, but it's that stain kind of hurts my heart a little bit. And we have where the senior center is um how it's draining improperly is eroding the foundation.

And you all probably remember that better even than I do that part of that senior center porch extension was an addition after and when the addition was put on it was not put on correctly. For example, they just cut the fire alarms so we didn't have a fire alarm in the library for a decade or so. They also just Yeah. We're good now though. Looking at you, Erica. [laughter] Um, and they also did not connect the gutters correctly. So, right there where those two sections join, the water just piles down and it's starting to get away at the at the foundation. So, I'm sure this fall and winter you've noticed a lot of water sitting over water.

So, is that something that you've turned into public works and they have ignored or Yeah, [laughter] we have capital improvement money. I mean, I I don't see why we're not So, we're asking for an RFP. Is that what we're asking for to find out how much this is going to cost?

Yeah, essentially. And to to go to your We have building authority money um because the weather was so great this last year. We've a lot of the money that we budgeted to spend this year on the fairgrounds improvements, I had to pay out 25 um which got real creative, but um so we will have monies in that budget that were intended for the fairgrounds, but we ended up having to pay those out in 2025. So, well, we should be saving some money on salt, right? [laughter] and wait,

not that I want to use a lot of it, but we do have a fund balance in the library. We need to do some So, I just like to at least get it out for our see what it comes back and then when we get that dollar amount, we can identify a funding source, but at least we can get that moving. And is that process necessary for the cracks in the rotunda ceiling? It's less than $5,000, wasn't it? No, it was 15. Then yes, we we would have to do that as well. So, we do also, and we've talked about this before, is this a sheetrocking thing? Yeah. Yeah. But it's in the the tall rotunda in the center. So, it's a little bit more difficult than just Is it behind the bricks? Uh, it's the ceiling. It's the ceiling sheetrock.

Okay. So, wasn't some of the bricks also taken out too to determine where the water was coming from? That was But that was down. That was down below. And we we patched that. That's patched and Yeah. Will you reach out to me and get a couple I can give you a couple of names that people that are Yeah, I could really use some help prioritizing projects because there are a few things that need attention and we just need to decide what to think water. What do you want to talk because it's just going to get worse and worse. Matt, is that something you have capacity for to go by the library and have walk through with Okay, be happy to.

Okay. But in the interim, we'll get something scripted up for um going out for bid or estimate for the rain gutters. Okay. Thank you. Thanks, Aaron. Mr. Chair, I move that we approve the RFP to to repair the rain gutters on the Morton County Library Senior Center building and identify Oh, we identified the source, didn't we? Uh we're going to post that until we say how much it's going to be. So your approval to step move to to approve the RFP to repair the rain gutter on the county library senior center. I'll second motion. Okay. We have a motion by Commissioner Nickerson and a second by Commissioner Newton. All in favor?

I. Any opposed? Mr. Chair, I move that we adjourn the public meeting and convene as a board of equalization. I'll second it. Okay. Okay. I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Blocker. All in favor? I I opposed. Okay. We are now a board of equalization. Leslie, when I you gave me the updated version for the packet, but it looks like it's blank. Is that He marked the other circumstances and then said there was an attachment immaturely. Okay. Thank you. Yeah,

I know. I saw that one. I'm sorry. [laughter] There's an application from the husband and also from the wife. The wife has additional issues. Um their first issue was green belt error and then she noted that it's a modular home and she thought the value was too high for a modular home. But again, remember you're just approving a late appeal. You're not approving an adjustment. The issue is it's just are you going to accept their late appeal?

Remind us the criteria one more time. Yes. Put that down on the end. Here you go. Uh can this like continue to go on and on and on all year? March as a deadline related. No, I have a question on this too. with the current law for 202. Can we re can we approve anything to do with board of equalization until we've gone through the courses? Yes. Because this is 25, correct? Okay. Don't forget to sign up for your courses. That's true.

We wouldn't forget. [laughter] They won't let you forget. So, are you guys in agreement that it's a factual error? That's not what we're here for. What we're here for is are you going to accept their lay appeal? We have to decide if it's a factual error. If they if they are to see if it right here. Yeah. County records that that paragraph right there. But that's what she's saying is it has the wording factual error. on that one. The rest of them are not factual error, medical emergency, death, or other extraordinary unanticipated circumstances.

The applicant is here. However, I reached out to the state to see if they are allowed to speak and they advised us no. Okay. But the applicant is here. And this is for which one? This is Williamson. William is the factual error. the fact that it was classified as green belt but it's actually not able to qualify for green belt. Is that the factual that's what they're saying and the county created that error? Yes. Do you want to if if it's a factual error it's a factual error.

So with late appeals you have the right to be able to open it up for me or not. um we don't think that it is a that it's a factual error because it's actually a smaller acreage. So we are going through and we're auditing a lot of people um and going through and doing that. So it's it's it's totally up to you where you want to make that. What it does is it makes it have the opportunity for the assessor to basically go over it again and check it. Um and then with the what was the other part of it? And the other thing with the modular homes once they're established or they're affixed to a um a basement or whatever they do, we actually assess them as real property. So they are assessed just like everyone else that's in the county because it um they do have a depreciation schedule that's a little different. Um but everything else should be fine. I

I did not understand your response on the green belt. The green belt, what is the acreage on it? I can hold it on our new parcel map. So it's 5.1. What we do is we take one acre out um as basically saying that is for the home for the home lot because we have to make a lot value and then everything else. So it it basically does not qualify to be in green belt cuz basically you there's always five six acres one for home and five.

So it has to be 5 acres or more to qualify in green belt that is for a use and it has to be for a use right we got that. But um it is five acres and we have been going through the whole county um and cleaning that all up for everyone. So what it does is it changes those four plus acres. It changes them to secondary land instead of being in green belt. So basically they have to have six acres if they have a home on it. Yes.

And it has been done. You know there have been some that have been for many years that have still stayed under green belt and whether they had something adjacent to them or they changed. Um, but we have been trying to clean all of those up mostly because they weren't able to be managed with the previous assessor because she had other things too. So that's why I had a green belt specialist come in uh to be able to organize those things. So you're requesting it because of our problem. They're requesting because based on factual error, the taxpayer is requesting saying that there is a factual error. So, it's your judgment whether you want to open that up or not.

And the factual error in their application is saying green belt and that it's a modular home. What does it hurt to have them look and they can't look at it again because the books are locked unless you give them permission to look at them because the assessor can't make any changes because it's no longer applicable. We have so so if it become I mean we have to approve it one way or another but correct. Um, so if it's not green belt, which has not been evaluated as green belt, right? Correct. Yes, I changed it this year. It changed it this year. So, they're going to be paying more taxes. Sorry, guys. Not fair.

That's that's what we would need to make sure you know where we want to go with that. But that is but your recommendation is that it's not a factual error because of how you are identifying green belt and how we're cleaning all of the ones that were smaller than 5 acres and what were you saying about a foundation cuz this says the modular home is on blocks. So when they um become a modular home they do have a different depreciation because of what how they're built, right? Um, but the value of the home shouldn't really reflect any like it's going to sell for the same amount with the land and the and the home.

I'll allow you to say something. Just a second, but you'll have to come up. You're going to have to come up to the mic.

Problem number one, the green belt issue. We just bought the property and we were getting charged for back taxes that were never on record. The title company never knew about it. We bought it. They reassessed it. Oh, you guys should have been paying all these taxes for years. They send us the bill. So that's that's what we're asking you to do.

Someone put the property in Green Belt when it never qualified. So now we're expected to pay taxes as a roll back when we never own the property for one and the county was miscat or the property was miscatategorized saving them the taxes but we didn't own the property at that time. We didn't commit the heir. Um so I just that's a $8,000 that we're expected to pay that we we never even owned property and we didn't make the air. We didn't falsify any documents or anything. Okay. So, it's just a hardship that we're having to carry.

So, when we know when we found out about it, we called here immediately. We didn't wait until we immediately. We didn't even understand. Okay. Insurance. Is that something a title a title company should have caught? Correct. A thousand%. But it wasn't on record. Green belt is on record.

But it wasn't known that the property should never have been in Green Belt because if I go down to the assessor's office or the I tried to go pay my taxes and they have the property listed as 5.56 acres that the property is not that large. So someone within the county put the property 5.65 and that allowed it to be assessed with green. So when we purchased the property, they're going through and cleaning up their records and it was noted that the property does not qualify for green belt. So then we were charged to roll back. Okay.

So was established I think I I think we understand now. So, the title company was right in notice and posting on their title report that it wasn't green belt, but it's not their fault that it should not. I think I think on this situation we should open it. That's my personal opinion, but I'll look to the rest of you for yours so we can have a vote on it. I move to approve the late appeal request on the basis of factual information for John P. Wilkinson. I'll second it. Have a motion by Commissioner Fackerel and a second by Commissioner Blocker. All in favor? I. Any opposed?

Okay. Thank you. This usually so they'll tell you next steps. So then about the assessment of [clears throat] the value. So all this does is open it up for you to appeal the detail and then you'll have to go through the appeal process. You're welcome. Stressful. I absolutely hear it. We'll live to fight another day now. So thank you. you will be fighting over a board victualization. [laughter] So I will send you an email tomorrow um letting you know that it was approved obviously you know and I will send you the application and then you will apply to the board of equalization and you will come before them again. So

yeah so I'll email you in the morning. [clears throat] Okay. You have another one? Uh this one is from Chase Hansen. This one and he's stating that the reason he wants this approved is because the issue arose after the deadline and he has quite a bit of writing on his as well.

Yeah, from what I understood on this one, he he had varables and there is quite a difference. So I don't I don't know what that difference is because I don't know size of homes and things like that. But So how did it arise after the fact? Just because he didn't know the dollar amount till after the fact or talk to his neighbors. She says neighbors. Can you cut talk in the mic? Sorry, I'm just the clerk that takes the paperwork. I don't know all the

and I have the Well, you may as well stand up. There's a couple. I don't know all of these. Sorry. This is um Hansen um 907129. Sorry, I'm just gonna because I'm pretty sure that we have

Escalante. So what happened is we said that there was we did fix him to a primary. We have already fixed it fixed the home to make it as we did it in board of equalization as a factual error. We just said that we would give him the primary cuz [clears throat] he had non- primary. So he had some I kind of did him a good one and tried to help him out there. And so he ended up getting primary on the home. And now [clears throat] what he's trying to do is go back and say, "Well, I want my value changed." Okay. So, he already went through the BOE process and it was a and his

and we just made it as a fact. Yeah. Because he was right in that window and we said, "We'll we'll basically help you out here. We'll put it as primary." And so, I did make that that correction, which hindsight I probably shouldn't have, but that's okay. And so, um, we did change it. And so what I did is just said this is what it is and that he we changed it to the primary and now he's coming back and saying that the value needs to be changed. So they had the valuation though when you changed it to primary. Correct. Correct. And the value hasn't changed since that. The value didn't changed. They just changed it from non- primary to primary.

Well, and I think it's also important to point out that yes, you might find another home that might be valued less, but that might just be because that home hasn't been reassessed in the last few years. where there's some little does get differ probably end up in and every home is a little different. So, they don't come in just because we make Exactly. Some of them are just a little off on acorage. I mean, it can be a lot of different things, you know. It can be um they decided that they wanted to finish their basement and then there's someone that doesn't have a basement. It just depends on the home and how it's valued. And so,

but we're not looking at value tonight. We're just looking at if they qualify under one. And you do have to remember, you know, September 15th is the deadline every year. September 15th is the deadline for the board of equalization. So they have 45 plus days to take care of this. Now we're here at late appeal. So now that's something to kind of be considered as well. Is there one of those four extreing, you know, can you swing that back down? Extending circumstances. So was there a mistake in the sides? No, there's there's not a mistake in the size. We do have the we have whatever is given to us too with the building permits.

That's what we use to be able to uh value the square footage as well. And then when we're out into um we're able to look at those. I'm not seeing any any that they meet any of these exceptions. I say yeah that was going to be my question is I mean is he saying the a factual error is the it's assessed improperly is that what he's trying to say is that's not really that's not I would say that's a factual error that's that would be he's going to have to have but even there it's not factual error and it's not against

well and even with an appraisal that's one thing that we ask as the assessor's office because Utah is a non-disclosure state uh a lot of times we don't get the the value of the what they're you know like their closing documents and stuff. So that has to be given to us um by them voluntarily. Voluntarily. Yes. Correct. Or we go through the MLS listing, the multiple service listing to find verified sales. Leslie, that parcel number is not pulling. Ah. Oh, okay.

So, it changed the parcel number, man. That was saying the builder submitted the wrong plans, the blueprints. Yes. So, is that true? So, it was over valued in

square footage. One of the things too that we actually have to reassess as well, but we did not realize which was never given to us. I mean, but there was two in the Rome subdivision. there were two different builders that were building and they say one of them is lower um not even lower class maybe just that they were built that they were built a little more um economically

and so um we're going to go look through those because we have valued them all the same I don't really see that there's a big difference in them but there maybe is some slight differences so we are going to re-evaluate this in 2026 here to just make sure where our numbers are and if we have like a certain builder um to another builder that's in that same subdivision if there's some differences um then we can adjust. But a lot of them are a lot of like inside features that they're talking about and we really don't focus on those. Um sometimes you know if they are kind of an overbuild we're not we're not actually assessing them. We're we're more assessing um how many bathrooms do you have? What are your fixtures? You know, we're not we don't really care whether it's all wood or if someone used steel in their stairs. You know, we're not we're we're looking at some structures, but that's not really a big driver. But his square footage is correct. What we have the information we do have the square footage correct. So from the information that we have

from the blueprints or that were submitted by the builder. Well, we go out to the homes too and we we you know do a tape to be able to verify that our square footage is similar, you know, and there's things that we can adjust. But yeah, if he wants to make sure I mean that can be done anytime too for the next year if we need to adjust those. So it's just really what whatever you guys decide. So thanks. Any other questions? I'll look for a motion

to deny CR262502- have a motion by Commissioner Ferrell. I'll second that. And a second by Commissioner Nickerson. All in favor? I are there any opposed? Okay,

your last one will be from Levi Harper. Uh his is a non- primary residential exemption issue. Um he marked a factual error also. So why is he coming to us now at so late after his taxes came? You know, because I think you I think they're receiving their tax notice and seeing. Wouldn't they have noticed that when they paid the bill? No, this this happened to my son. I I mean by escrow you

you have to know what you're looking for to to see, you know. So, well, I can agree with this just because he did the stuff he had to and and even from the county, he um he did everything up on June 22nd and uh thought he was all okay. I think that's our factual error that we did not tell him correctly that it was he was being taken care of in 2025 for that 2025 year. So my opinion he should probably get the board. Okay. So you think we should open up then? Okay. But that's just me. Well, if you if you make an emotion, we'll see what anyone else.

Is there any other questions beforehand? But otherwise, my motion could stand if you want. I mean, I'm just looking through this if I if I may. So, it's when I see the late field request, it says for the 25 property tax assessment. Oh, we're actually looking at the 24. I just want to make sure I'm reading this thing right. I don't I don't want to sway anything. So, this is what it is. I'm reading the application.

May 22nd, Janelle has her assessment into the state auditor, right? She's going to the auditor now, the county auditor. So May 22nd is my deadline that I have to have assumptions of what everyone is. We do try and send out primary residential exemptions when we know about them at the very very beginning of the year until May 22nd. Um this was not fulfilled or filled out until June.

Okay. So what happened was we said, "Hey, just so you know, if you're going to do this, you're going to need to do the board of equalization. You have till September 15th to make that decision." So there is an email that Holly has sent to them that said this will be for the 2026 year unless you go through the board of equalization. That didn't happen and now he's looking at it saying it's not changed to primary. Uh we do have that email that says that you know it would be for the 2026 year that they would get primary. But it's one of those this primary residential exemption is a really hard space. Number one, it's a state law that the taxpayer is the one that has to sign the paperwork and they have to basically declare whether they're going to be a primary residence or not. They have to live in the home 183 consecutive days. So, think about that as well cuz you have to live in that home for 183 consecutive days to be able to qualify for that. So, we do have evidence on this one saying, you know, we did have an email saying you it's going to be for 26, but that is something that, you know, if you want to open it up, you're more than welcome to and we can look through it again and double check everything. Um, but it is a hard thing and it's something that I hope more people are starting to understand that you do need to declare what your intentions are on the homes because I don't know what you're planning on doing whether it's going to be a rental home or a non-primary home.

I think we made the mistake of we this isn't how we've done it in the past, right? Well, it's been it's always been assumed that it is correct. So, since I have been the assessor, I have tried to get out information and even on, you know, on the paperwork right here, it even says September 15th. No, I I understand that you've you've done your job. All I'm just saying is we have we have made a standard and then we've changed it. Yes. And I think

so since I've been the assessor, that is one thing that we have changed because of all of the builds that are non- primary. Um, so you can't live in a building that is not livable yet. So a lot of these new homes um are at they're at non- primary until stated otherwise. So they do have to declare it. Um, if it was my space, I would say that everyone needs to do uh a primary resident residential exemption every year. Um, but that's not what my space is. So, cuz it really does need to be declared and it is a hard space to understand what people's intentions are. Um, a lot of times we I guess that people will start renting their home, things like that. So, there's lots of lots of things that we had to think about. But yes, previously everything was primary and then um we basically had to reach out to the ones that were non- primary. So now we've changed that thought process of you have to declare whether you're primary or not.

Sure. Is that just for our county or is that per state codes? It is state. It is state code. It is state I mean the primary residential exemption is state code. I mean the way we do it and the way we do it there's a lot to do. State code. Yes. It's not code but we choose what we do. It's called a standard of practice is what it say. When I moved in here I didn't have to declare

Yeah. And you know what the funny thing is? Everyone says that, but everyone has signed a paper. So when you come back, if you want to come into my office and see if you've actually declared whether you have a primary or not, more than likely we have that signed up because we have been going through and finding all the ones that are old and sending them new primary residential exemptions to say we don't have this one on file and there's very few. But a lot of people when they come into their house and they move into Morgan, they're like, "I've never signed that paper." And then we pull it up and it's like, "Oh, look, you did. You signed that paper." Is that something that the title company sometimes does?

I've actually started talking with our realators and our title companies because I think it's an important thing for them to be um notifying these people that are coming in and when they're buying new homes and stuff. A lot of people are even from out of state that we're starting to see and they don't know what our state codes and state laws are. And so it's something that this is one of my nemesis is is the primary residential exemption because it's a hard place to be um to make that. But I have to make a decision May 22nd. So So my my your son

No, I'm just No, my I don't think it hurts to open it. let them look at it and if they want to appeal it to the state, they can appeal it to the state. Um because I think it's right there. And I know one thing I I spoke with Janelle, we've talked quite a bit about this and like one of the issues was when people purchase a home and you've got a stack of papers in there, you don't know what you're signing, you just want to move into your home is to make sure they're adding that to those documents. but also on the new builds. Is there something we can do working with, you know, when these people are when, you know, your son goes to buy build a new home part of the application process there should is there a button there? Okay, this is going to be my primary. Let's get that filled out now. So, when it gets to Janelle, it's already there even with a brand new construction. [clears throat] So, we've talked about that and how do we work with the planning department? So, you just make this easy for the people that it's not, you know, you're filling out your your permit application. Well, you click on that and you fill it out right there with your permit application so that when they it all winds up to the assessor with their occupancy, the form is already signed. It's already been done.

You know, they don't get caught in the excitement of building my first home. Those kind of things. Um, I did have a question, Janelle. So, 183 days. So, if somebody purchased a home September, moves in, do they they obviously don't get that exemption for that property because they're only there for four months. Unless Unless the other residence was there, unless it was their primary, then they qualify through their primary for that additional time. Okay. But like on a pre I mean a home that they build and they occupy it on if it was a new construction, they're only there for four months.

So there's there's a couple things that are going with that, especially with the new build. Our lean date is January 1st of every year. So a lot of times they're building that house and January 1st they're maybe at 30%. Right? So then they're non- primary because their house isn't occupied yet. So they're like, "Well, my house says non- primary because it's non-primary come November and they are living in it in September." Well, at January 1st, your house was at 30%. So we took a percentage of that and said these are this is what it is non- primary that's what you're going to pay and then next year we put it as primary at full value.

So one thing that we've also been working on is is once people's homes are around that 50% mark we're trying to make sure like hey this is not junk mail you got to sign it. So, that's one thing that we've really been working on as well, trying to get them to sign the document before it gets to 100%.

Any other questions? Okay. I move to approve to have the CR26-2503- BE late appeal request to be opened up. I have a motion by Commissioner Felro. Second. I'll second it. Second by Commissioner Blocker. All in favor? I

I. Any opposed? Okay. Motion carries. Mr. Chair, I move we adjourn the BOE meeting and reconvene the public commission meeting. Second. [snorts] I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Ferrell. All in favor? I.

Any opposed? Okay, we are now back in commission meeting. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and good evening to the county commission. Action item G4 on your agenda for tonight is for the LDS Mountain Green Cottonwood Canyon Road subdivision, first amended. That's applica u excuse me, application number 24.067. The applicant is Samuel Perry of Perry Curtain McConi Law Firm. Uh the owner is the corporation of presiding bishop of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The project location is 4210 West Cottonwood Canyon Road and identified by the parcel number and serial number in your meeting packet tonight, Mr. Chair. The zoning is split um overwhelmingly uh R120 with a uh split designation of the agriculture A20 zoning with the acreage uh uh being 20 28.97 acres. And the request is for a lot line adjustment to lot four of the LDS Mountain Green Cottonwood Canyon Road subdivision. Uh some some detail for you, Mr. Chair. The acreage of lot 4 will receive approximately uh about half an acre uh from from the neighboring property owner to uh the north of the of the line in the subdivision. The acreage for lot 4 would would increase from 28.97 acres to 28 excuse me 29.47 acres. The line itself uh the lot line is moving approximately 42 ft to the north. So staff doesn't find that this is a a plat amendment uh that doesn't meet the intent of our code. It's uh been reviewed by the planning staff, county surveyor, the Mountain Green Fire Protection District, the county recorder, and the county engineer. Uh all providing

recommendations for approval and finding that this meets the or uh staff lines that we can recommend approval of this application. The utilities are provided by the Cottonwood Mutual Water Company and the Mountain Green Sewer Improvement District. The planning commission heard this item on their regularly scheduled meeting on December 11. Uh there were no comments made during the public uh meeting portion. Uh nor was there much uh discussion from the planning commission. Uh the planning commission voted to recommend approval to county commission with a vote of 4 to zero. Chair Maloney abstained from voting. It made its way into the motion that perhaps this should be more of a boundary line adjustment. Mr. Chair, staff has looked into our code and and find no mentions no mentions of boundary line adjustments in our code. Uh this is more like a lot line adjustment as as defined in the county ordinance. Um otherwise Josh and I are happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you

Jeremy. So is the lot line adjustment right where that arrow is down? It's right here. Oh, it's over there. If you go to the next exhibit, uh the one after true. Um it's Yeah. All right. So, this dotted line, it doesn't show up too much on the blur, but that's the line to be vacated. And then the the new solid line above that is what I was mentioning, moving approximately 42 feet to the north, approximately half an acre for the new to. So, are they purchasing that from him or is it just a It was surveyed incorrectly.

I don't know the answer to that. Guess it doesn't matter, but um I spoke to the attorney for um the applicant last week. Uh my understanding is that there's just some adjustment between the property owners. I don't know if money was exchanged, but the two property owners are working to adjust the boundaries. Okay. Any other questions? Okay. If not, I'll look for a motion.

Um, I chair, I will move that we approve the request for a lot line adjustment to lots. I'll just read this. I move we approve the LDS Mountain Green Cottonwood Canyon Road subdivision first amended application number 24.067 allowing for a lot line adjustment located at 4210 West Cottonwood Canyon Road in unincorporated Morgan County based on the findings and with the conditions listed in the staff report dated January 6, 2026.

Second. Have a motion by Commissioner Blocker and a second by Commissioner Ferrell. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Motion passes. Just for your information, I just looked at it on the plat or on the GIS and it looks like there's a fence, an existing fence on the new lot line, if that makes sense. So, it looks like that property was already assumed to be part of the applicant's property. All right. Yeah, kind of handy. [clears throat] Okay.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Action item G5 is the Cottonwood Spring View PUB third plat amendment. That's application number 25.028. The applicant is Jeff Holden who owns uh two lots in this subdivision addressed at 6348 and 6358 South Wasach Back Drive identified by the parcel numbers and serial numbers in your meeting packet tonight. The current zoning is rural residential one uh and is governed by a development agreement, a continuence development agreement. The acreage combined of the two lots is 1.23 acres. And the request for tonight, Mr. Chair, is is for a lot line adjustment between the boundaries of lot 710 and 7-Eleven of the Cottonwood Spring View AUD subdivision. And again, some details about the change.

So the combining the two lots, correct? Well, they're separate lots and the line between them is making an L shape. Yeah, it's an L shape. Kind of a flag. Not exactly a flag lot. They have the required amount of frontage in All right. The current line goes through and just splits the property. The proposal is to make that L-shape. Okay. Yeah, I have a question on that if I may. What is the zoning there? It's R1 under, but it's okay. Got a development agreement. But you're a PUD, so they have open open space, so they have smaller laws. Well, but what my concern is is if it's a if it's an R1,

you can't you can't look at it as an R1 because the development agreement control.

Yeah. um staff uh when this was first brought to us, we uh combed through the development agreement, the overlay agreement, and the uh PR ordinance because all three all three documents control the development of the Cottonwoods gets kind of confusing. Uh nowhere in any of those uh documents does it list a minimum lot size. Uh it lists minimum housing sizes, things like that. Um building envelopes. Um the reason I saw this and I determined that um it met the minimum size is because within that phase there are lots that are smaller than that. So, uh, as far as staff is concerned, the sizes of the lots meet the the zoning because it doesn't reduce it any smaller than existing lots already in that phase.

So, on this not adding any lots either, right? It's No, it's just moving. It's not adding anything. But with that addition, now that they're putting this L-shaped one in there, does that allow them to come back in and say, "Oh, I want two lots now out of that." Uh, no. Correct. They wouldn't have the frontage. Um, technically they could put an accessory dwelling unit back there, but they can't sell that separately and it can't be used as a as a short-term rental. Okay. Okay. That's helpful.

Other questions? No, we can make a motion. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, chair. I move that we approve the Cottonwood View PUB third plat amendment application number 25.028 allowing for a lot line adjustment located at 6348 and 6358 South Wasach Back Drive in unincorporated Morgan County based on the findings and with the conditions listed in the staff report dated January 6, 2026. Second the motion.

Okay. I have a motion by Commissioner Blocker and a second by Commissioner Newton. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Okay. Motion passes. Okay. Honorable Rail Lane Blocker. Honorable. Okay. Um I would like to nominate Travis Taylor to the Mountain Green seat for the Men County Planning Commission. you met him before. Um he was one of the applicants that came and interviewed here for the atlarge seat. Travis Taylor um if you've read his application. Yeah, looks like he's wellqualified.

He's very well qualified. So I am nominating Travis Taylor. Is that your motion? Do I make a motion? Yeah. Does it have to be a motion? Yeah, there it's a motion to accept the resolution. Okay. I move that we accept resolution CR26-05 appointing Travis Taylor to the Morgan County Planning Commission. I'll second the motion. Okay. I have a motion by Commissioner Blocker and a second by Commissioner Newton. All in favor? I. Any opposed? That was motion carries.

That was an approved, not a a name. Yeah, this is your indigent, but I didn't I didn't you never sent me like a contract.

Well, so so we're going to work out the details of the contract to match the RFQ. Um, so I I've I was kind of involved. It's a little I I didn't want there to be a perceived conflict of me being on the selection committee, so I wanted to stay away from the submissions. But as far as drafting the RFQ to say this is what the county needs for indigent defense in the county, um I did draft that there was a submission and my understanding is that the selection committee was forwarding a recommendation of Colton McCay. And so I'm just looking for um the commission to approve the selection committee's recommendation and some direction to draft an agreement in line with the RFQ that I'll bring back at the next meeting. So, why would you need an RFQ after we've gone through and

No, he's I'll draft a contract around the RFQ based on the terms within the RFQ. So, it won't be something opposed to what we've already put out. I'm not going to bring something that's surprising. It'll match what we've asked them to submit for. Mr. Mr. Chair, I move that we approve uh the award of the RFQ for public defender ent indigent defense services to Colton McCay and ask the county attorney to proceed with putting together an agreement for that service. I'll second it. I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Ferrell. All in favor?

I I Any opposed? Okay, motion carries. Um, I did put a copy of the existing portfolio on your desks if you guys wanted a scribble. Um, the only thing I am requesting based on attendance um is that we swap um a recommendation to COG for the JPAC joint policy advisory committee making Railene Blocker the primary instead of the alternate. So, I have a question on that. Okay. Um, who was the primary on that? Steve Gail.

Oh, okay. I was wondering about should we maybe change a lot of these things that are with the WFRC instead of being alternates on it if the city's not going to perform their duties and do what they've they wanted to do. Should we be changing it back to us since we are going to those things or when we have been going? That's really the only one that hasn't been shown except for regional growth and Blaine is the alternate on that. Tony London is with the city is the primary and he never attended there. Yeah. So we could flop that one. I think we a suggestion on that if you want. Yeah. And I'm okay with that.

And then CEO I'm not voting anymore. Right. Right. Okay. Maybe the same as we have growth is going to be primary and blocker on JPEG is going to be primary. [snorts] Any other adjustments? Well, I would like to have something else. and and I've and I've uh

I've talked to council on that and just give me a little bit of time on that. Okay. Okay. I I move that we approve the portfolio assignments as currently listed. Um with those couple of changes which is removing FRC WFRC and also removing the word voting from CEO and TAB. Correct. All right. Second. Okay. I have a motion by Commissioner [clears throat] Newton and a second by Commissioner Nickerson. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Motion passes.

And Mike and I did have a meeting with um WFRC the other day and I said Morgan County definitely shows up and represents. So, he's very grateful. All right. So now we're voting on what we went through today. Is that what I'm understanding here? Uh yes on policies and procedures 604. Did anybody have any additional have questions or concerns on the travel policy? Uh so the first one would Oh, did I put it in the wrong order? It's just second in under action item eight. Oh,

okay. Oh, good grief. I skipped a whole number. Good work out of you, Kate. Um so rules and procedures uh we're adding um per the work session um and per commissioner facel's recommendation in subsection six which is the closed meeting when we're going to clean up um how that lays out on the paper and also add and pursuant to any um and any other pursuant to Utah code annotated should there be any um what was that it as far as amendments ments. Oh, wait. Think under number 11, you uh 112B or C

are subject to removal instead of shall be removed by the sheriff at the direction of the chair. Subject to removal. Yep. Um and those are the two amendments that were brought up. Were there any additional? Okay. And then we'll just update under rule 165 where it says a copy of the latest edition of the rules of order and procedure resolution and then we'll just name it CR26 whatever shall be available to each member of the commission. Okay. Do you I'm assuming you would like that digitally. So do you did we need did Mike did you say the CR number in the last one last question?

Oh for portfolio. Oh, no. I can do that if you want. Right on. Yeah. Just Yeah. Mr. Chair, I move that we approve CR26-02 appointment of the 2026 commission portfolio assignments as amended. As amended in this evening's meeting. Okay. I have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Nickerson. All in favor? I. I. Any opposed? So, are we calling this 8B? Yeah, I guess so.

Okay. 8B. Mr. Chair, I move that we approve CR26-03 establishing the Morgan County Commission rules of order and procedure for 2026 um including the amendments made this evening during the work session. Second. Have a motion by Commissioner Newton, a second by Commissioner FC or Nickerson. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Motion passes.

Okay. amendments to the travel policy that were discussed is um at the end of authorization. Oh, sorry. It helps if I move to the document um at the end of this travel um travel authorization and responsibility adding and placed on consent agenda for in reference to out of state travel. Um we are removing and lodging from county administrator shell book. Um we're adding language that fleet um use of the county fleet takes priority over uh mileage [clears throat] reimbursement and we are adding in the reimbursement section um here we go language to include Uber lift taxi etc. I think those are my only notes might miss anything else

anything else that she's missing you remember. So, you're going to put Uber, lift, and I'm going to put [clears throat] ride share apps and taxi and or taxi. Mr. Chair, I move that we approve CR26-04 amending the Morgan County travel expense policy with the changes discussed this evening. Second. I have a motion by Commissioner Nickerson and a second by Commissioner Felro. All in favor? I. Any opposed?

Motion is unanimous. Uh on the next one, as some of you got text messages, I registered Commissioner Ferrell, Commissioner Blocker, and Commissioner Nickerson to UAT Day on the Hill um yesterday. It is my understanding from your text that Commissioner Newton and Commissioner Wilson will not be attending. Is that accurate? I will be out of town. Correct. I'll be in Egypt. He's paying it. I'm gonna be hiding behind my wife. Uh and chair, the next two items um were postponed to this meeting and neither item is ready to be um addressed at this time and we are requesting an additional postponement.

Mr. Chair, I move that we postpone items 11 and 12 to our next meeting. Second. Have a motion by Commissioner Newton and a second by Commissioner Nickerson. All in favor? I.

Are there any opposed? And I just have a few quick updates. Um, no, we have not selected a fire chief. In the interim, emergency management director and deputy chief ambulance director, um, Erica White has stepped in in full stress and is doing phenomenal and we're very grateful that she's taken that on. We do have interviews this week um, and we're hoping to select a candidate sooner rather than later. We also have interviews this week for the deputy fire chief fire marshal position in the interim. Um Chris Tma is certified to do those fire marshal inspections and he is going to be our interim for that until we get that. Um

so what better job he's going to do it as essentially I guess comp time but the comp time will be build to that budget line item. Okay. How are we compensating Erica for extra? To be determined. Okay.

So, the hard part with her is 60% of her pay and all of her benefits are emergency management and 40% of her pay is from ambulance. So, we're still trying to figure out if we're going to lump summit. Um, but we're having her track those additional hours. Um but they're they've both stepped up and and been absolutely amazing. Um and and she can't qualify for the she cannot. No. Um is there an exception in that to where she can work towards that? It would take several years. Okay. To get the certifications that she would need.

Okay. But yeah, um we I don't know if either of you are going to talk about it in your commission comment. Then you can um We had a meeting yesterday with Summit County. Um we found out that their manager has a much larger budget that they can approve and a ridiculously long leash. It sounds like Yeah.

So, what they're saying is um part of the issue we brought up is this 37.3 acres that were purchased um in the fall of last year that were outside the 910 cattle ranch, which technically is landlocked within 910, but it was a different property owner. um their commission didn't even know that they had bought that because their county manager has like leeway to spend up to like $3 million without approval [laughter] to which I looked at Matt and Vaughn was like hey and 500,000 but it was a lot sounds so without the commission even knowing to me that's just

so the the sticking point obviously for um what the commission has passed on to me and what we discussed the sticking point obviously was that we're going to have another county owning a a large sum of acreage in our county. It turns out that the purchase agreement is deed restricted that it has to be one owner. And so the compromise that we have come up with um and the attorneys are going to work together to draft anou. Um actually I'll just pull up the email because it was very well written um by Jessica. Um

one owner could be an entity that consists of two counties. Summit County.

Um so this is what we agreed to um putting in anou. Um, we're going to I want it to be deed restricted that they cannot annex without our permission. Um, we are going to put in theou so it's clear as day. The law enforcement portion of this is theirs, this is ours. We're not sharing jurisdiction. Um, Summit County, we're going to require them to do a payment in lie of tax. And what that means is if right now they're paying $1,643.18 in property taxes, they're going to pay $1,643.18 in property taxes in perpetuity. So we'll at least get some tax taxes off that. Um they will be paying green belt roll back on all of that ground. Um they pushed back on that and actually their attorney said actually that's in the agreement is they would have to pay green belt. So they were actually going to have to pay green belt to themselves.

The whole thing not just the 37 acres the not the 37 acres because the 37 acres was never in green belt but the 1800. Yes. Okay. Um they have to notice us of any future land acquisition. Um they said it's not their intention to purchase any more property in Morgan County because they're already working on another 838 acre purchase towards CAS. I know but in in the um aside from there there's at least one more strip of a want to become their own state. So there is one more strip of the money the 910. It's like literally almost a easement

like an easement that they're trying to purchase that they are in negotiation contiguous parcel same as the 37.3 acres they wanted at all. So they asked me if it was okay if they purchased that and I said again not the governing body of the county. So you will have to make that request to the commission. Um so if we say no what happens? I think it's just advanced notice. I don't think we can say no. We can't say no. They can buy they can buy in. I'm glad Mike Schulz is on our side.

The other thing we discussed is right now it is not their intent to have an access on the west side of that property um being the Morgan County side. However, it is in their future plan to do a trail along the full perimeter of the property. So, we also requested that should an access be created onto the property on the Morgan County side that we be we come back to the table and discuss what that would cost us in road maintenance because since it's not a state park, we won't qualify for the access improvement grant. it's would be their property, but since they're them turning this property into god knows what in 50 years, that's a lot of depreciation on our roads. So, that was discussed as well. They did give us paper copies of me, a giant binder, paper copies of literally everything um that I have not dug into. And we reiterated the importance of us having a seat at the table. Um that got a lot of push back mainly from their county manager and their chair. I think more because they were thinking our seat at the table was well we want a trail here and we want a fish pond here and we want an education center here but instead it's like hey it's our like it's on our county ground like we want a seat at the table if you're going to put in a water park and the access is coming off Morgan County. Yeah. Like we need a seat at the table cuz that's going to cost us a lot. So I think um

agree to that. I don't know for sure. Is because we were I was I was confused. Is that a county or state road? Jeremy Ranch. That's actually private. It's private road. Private road that's maintained by the county. That's right. In historically No, wait a minute. Hold up. It's not a private road. It's not. No. It's on private property currently, but because it's been maintained by the county for so long, it's now a public road. It's a public rideway, right? It's a public ride.

I mean, the same thing exists throughout all of our county where I mean, I own half of the road in front of my house cuz it's never been deed out. That road hasn't been deed out, but it's a public road because it's been maintained by the public. It's like Deep Creek Road, right? Same situation. It's been maintained by us for all this time. We grade it every year. We And yes, it's not paved, you know, but but we maintain our portion, but we don't have a written easement. We have a a just like deep creek. We don't have it's a historical use. It's a 10-year under the statute and and so there it's been it's not like a landowner up there could couldn't go and put a gate in it and say this is our road now.

But we did put one in ourselves. We can put a gate as a public and close off a public road, right? Which but a land owner can't do that. That was another thing that got brought up on the road is well, if you intend that to be a main access, we don't plow it. So, so what are you going to do? If you need us to plow it, we're going to need anou just like we had for the state parks to plow it. So, or we don't have to plow it either. We don't have to. Correct. Because right now we have it where we do not plow it.

Right now we do not plow it because there's a gate there that we put in as a county. So therefore we don't need to plow that but it is ours. We maintain it and all that other stuff. I just wanted to understand that. Yeah. No it's a public rideway. I mean it it's been used as an easement for I mean probably well over a hundred years. Not just not just and I think the I think you only have to do it for like 20 years or is it 10 it probably been a notorious use for 10 years statue. Yeah. So that's repaired the repaired it when during the floods of 83 we repaired it and then the old trappers loop get shut down.

It was deed back. Deed back. Now, I don't know if it was ever um I don't know if it was actually deed out in the first place or if it was just the right of way was given back, but it was it was given back. Yeah. Wevers, but Weaver County kept theirs. So, what happened to ours? Why did we give back a lot of stuff in those couple years, including the um Pioneer Trail? That's too bad. It was a poor decision. Oh, yeah. Sure. So, that's all I have. Okay. So, so back with that.

Thanks for the work on that because that that was a little bit of stress thinking about how that was going to all work out. I I felt like it was positive as I think they did too after there was a little friction there from that. So, the tax though, I have a question on that one. You say it's in perpetuity at that rate. What happens if inflation doubles? So it's it's called a conservation pilt and that's what it is is it locks it. So I'll get with you more offline but okay

a conservation pilt locks it at the value that it is at the time it becomes exempt from valuation taxation. Okay. So talk later. Okay. So then as far as that then there there's 1,800 acres then and that 37 is what they bought also. So they correct but that separate transaction separate transaction. It's already closed. It's all within one. It will be they have not closed yet.

And there's one other little sliver that attaches in the same area right there. But yet there will not be any public access to it or will there be So that was another misunderstanding when they said it's private. What they meant is it's not closed yet and therefore it's still private property. So people need to stay off. So people need to stay off of it until it becomes okay. But it will be public property.

Okay. So public can go up there and hike. Correct. Correct. They did say there will be sections that are they'll be they're working with DNR and whatnot areas that are vital to the wildlife that will be closed to public access to protect the wildlife from kind of like they do up by Strawberry where when the cow the cow calves and all that they'll close areas down to protect the wildlife. Um they but they don't know what that is but they're not going to allow any hunting. Well, that's part of the decrease. That that was by the seller said absolutely no hunter or you're not buying. So that was a deed restricted. Okay.

All right. And who's going to take who's going to just a second thing for us.

Yes. Um yesterday I was able to attend the inaugural ceremony for the new second district veterans court which um will service Weber Morgan and Davis [clears throat] counties. Um, it makes sense that we finally get a veterans court having Hill Air Force Base up here before veterans would have to go down to Salt Lake or Provo. But what a great program. I was very impressed. Um, Jenny Wilson gave a heart compelling speech. Um, Judge Craig Hall explained the whole program and Governor Cox also spoke about giving veterans when they're when they're in the field, they have purpose, identity, and community, but when they come home, sometimes they lose that. And so, this particular court is geared towards those that have drug offenses or criminal offenses, and they're given the opportunity to come to this court. It's not a traditional court where there's a a prosecutor and a defender, more um they're given a mentor who's also a veteran and who helps them through things. and then they graduate this court anywhere from 18 to 24 months. Um, and hopefully they find their purpose, identity, and community again. So,

it's awesome. Really great, really great program. I would love a point of contact on that if you have one. Craig, uh, yeah, Judge Craig call.

Oh, yeah. He's one of the men spearing it up because there is a veterans app from our generation and the like 911 generation that a lot of people don't know about. It's not very active in Utah, but it's essentially that's what that is is we're taught Army of One like you handle your own business. You don't drag people in when you're having mental health crisis, but this app allows you to to go on it at any time. there's a a group getting together for coffee or doing puzzles or a board game night and so you can voluntarily go instead of feeling like you're imposing on somebody's time by needing camaraderie.

That's awesome. And it's it's called Team RWB, Red, White, and Blue Team RWB app. I wonder if they know about that. Their hope is to find out they use their mentor in [clears throat] that way. Like if they need someone at 1:00 in the morning, they'll call their mentor because they need someone. But that's the hard part is we suck at reaching out, right? So, especially if we feel like we're going to bother somebody. So, is team R team RWB and RWB stands for red, white, blue. Okay. But it's an app.org.

No, it's an applica. There's live yoga at 2 am. There's fitness challenges, but then there's also stuff like like when I was in Kansas City, we had a group that we on holidays um when there's not a lot of people visiting the veterans home, we would go to the veterans home and we would take them out in their wheelchairs and do wheelchair races in the uh parking garage. So,

I asked uh Judge Hall how Morgan County can be of service and um he said he would get to us, but he just mentioned funding, prosecutors, defenders. I don't know. He wasn't 100% sure. So, thank you. Okay, Commissioner Newton. Um, the only thing I had, and I [clears throat] don't know if we want to make any changes surrounding this, but March 17th, which is our second meeting in March, that's the night of the caucus meetings here in the county. Oh, the Republican caucus or all caucus?

I don't know if it's all or just Republican. Didn't they tell us April 25th? Yeah, it's Republican. I know that. Oh, well then maybe they've changed it because I got the notice that it was 17th. Okay, then maybe it doesn't matter. We'll confirm that, I guess. Okay. Okay. And I'm going to make a note yesterday. So, is that Democrat that's March 17th? I think so.

On the other one. Okay. Cool. Um, that's all I had to want to bring up.

Okay. Commissioner Fra. Um, I just have two requests that we consider in our planning departments or as a code amendment and to have an A zoning for smaller packages, properties like an A5 or A10 instead of forcing people to go to R R2 or R R4 whatever it might be um because there are some people that have been have requested to me um that I mean all they want to do is separate a lot and they want to give a they want to sell the portion to one of their kids and the other portion they want to keep for themselves for an agricultural piece of ground and that's all they want but once you turn it to an R2 then it becomes a lot and they don't want to turn it into a lot they want to build on it. They don't want any of that stuff and they don't want that. So, so I would like to see us do some kind of a code amendment.

So, if you if you subdivide regardless you turn it into a lot, whether it's a 20 acre lot or a 2acre lot or a 500 foot lot. So, so changing it to have an agricultural zoning wouldn't accomplish what you're thinking. Why wouldn't it? There's there's no difference between RR5 or A20 other than the uses. Okay. So, what are those uses then different? Well, residential is allowed in all of them, but you can go look at the table to see the uses.

But what you're thinking, I think could be accomplished, but not by not by simply saying we want a a five or an A 2 acre lot. You'd have to you'd have to do something totally different than that. That's not how our code reads because I mean I mean they were told that they had to um basically put it into an R2 and

cuz there's nothing smaller than A20 under the A section. But to be clear, just because it's agg versus residential doesn't change the use other than there's some more I would say harsh uses under a that aren't allowed under residential. That's the difference. So, will it help them or not? I mean, because I mean, unless you I mean, because if they want to put a house on an RR2, they can actually put in two homes on it or three homes on that if it's R2. Depends on the size of the property. Six acres. Yeah. So, they just want to go and have it to where it stays agriculture until they die.

Well, they can do a splits. Yeah. as well. And so there there's a splits that are restricted from residential use unless you go through the subdivision process. But if the intent is to build a house on even one of those, they're going to have to go through the subdivision process.

Okay. I'll tell them that. Then the other thing is is I know nobody's brought it up yet, but I know and I have talked about it is the detached accessory dwelling unit code that we put in. you need to go back to that drawing board and look at it because allowing people to go and put in a humongous house and call the old house their accessory dwelling unit I think is wrong. That's not the intent we had planned on when we put that into code. And so I'm requesting that we go back and say, "Okay, the original house is the original house." And when we put in that other code, it was 75% of the size of that original house instead of having other homes that, okay, well, this is a 2,000 foot home. Now we're going to put in a 5,000 or whatever amount, 75% more. And so, uh, because that's the direction it's gone. And I'm worried about that. I'm worried about that with the detached accessory dwelling units because then it makes us have two two homes, big homes on a piece of ground that is not was not our intent because then we were going we're basically going in right now and with that we're saying, okay, we're subdividing our own piece of ground with a detached accessory dwelling unit. And that's not right. We did not want that. We wanted to be able to have a smaller home for somebody to come and be able to assist or if we had to bring parents in or whatever to be able to give them a place to live. And because I mean, [clears throat] we're out of control right now with wanting people to go and continually build and build and build. And I mean, we're looking at properties that are maybe six acres and now they put on two big homes on it. It was just became a subdivision. and we're bypassing a subdivision process. And I think and and a zoning process. And so I think we need to go and if we're going to have an accessory a detached accessory dwelling unit, we need to be

looking at it can't be any bigger than the primary home. That's my opinion and I just thought I'd bring it up to you because we haven't done anything about it and yet homes are being built. Well, I don't like the idea that they can I don't Yeah, I don't really like that they're bypassing and and maybe I'll just say that they're not bypassing the subdivision process cuz if you build a detached accessory dwelling unit, you're not creating a subdivision because a subdivision, at least under state code and our code, has a specific definition which means you're creating lots and that's not happening. But you are creating two structures on one parcel that have to be sold together and that can create problems potential in the future. So yeah, I I just want to clarify it's not subdividing, but it is creating the issue that you're talking about because when you try to sell it, you're selling basically two homes and

it's a loophole and it could be different than Well, it's and I was going to bring it up as well, so I'm glad, but I've had numerous people come to me because there's been so basically somebody was building a a detached ad detached accessory dwelling unit and then with the understanding they were going to have to tear down the old home. Yeah. Well, once that got passed, they were told, "No, that is now the primary. The old home will be your accessory."

And so, you don't need to tear it down. And we're like, "Oh, great. Now I have a rental." And so that there's been I've had the same and I know BL and I have spoken because I've had several people like I think this is being abused where I think the I I'm feeling. It's like basically my home I can come and say well now I want I'm just going to build an detached ADU behind my home and rent out the front. And it's like I I think it's we build that ADU which is small because it's to give our kids a place to stay while they're trying to get get ahead or our parents to have a place to stay or something like that. is not to I'm going to go build a bigger home and then redesate which one's the primary and and basically what the same thing that that Blaine is saying is um

well the bigger one has to be the primary as I understand and well it should and and that's how you're going to tax it should be the original is your primary not the new bigger one is we're not going to change the designation of because I think the way that but then the taxes would be but they shouldn't what I'm saying is if your if My home right now is 2,000 ft and the code says that my detached ADU has to be 75% cannot be more than 75% the size. I can't go build a 5,000 foot and then reverse the designation.

So that my ADU must be smaller than your current structure, I think, is the the concern that people have. I'm not sure. I mean, playing devil's advocate, I'm not sure it matters. I mean, because you're still a if if the intent is to create a place for someone else to potentially live, family or whatever, who cares if they want to live in the existing house and you build a different house? Like, what's the difference between I mean, other than you might build a smaller structure, but people build big houses all the time. I I don't see any difference. You still got two families potentially living there. I think that when you look I mean

the neighbor may not like it because they're going to say, "Well, I didn't like this big house next to me." But that's also I mean, we don't all get to decide who who gets to build what next door. To me, as long as you meet the requirements of of setbacks and square footage on the lot, you know, you're not building a house that covers the entire lot or whatever, why does it matter? So, I guess the question then is if the original existing structure doesn't meet our current zoning for setbacks and whatnot, then I think you got a problem. And that's where I I think the conversation needs to start. Both structures have to meet the setback requirements if you're going to do. Sure. I agree that that I think you're absolutely right

because I know that somewhat you drive by and it's like that one's like almost on the road because it's been there for 120 years, you know? It's like so that one doesn't meet. So it if you're going to alter or build a new structure, okay, that one no longer meets the code and you've changed your you've changed everything with this lot. If it's back in on a 20 acre piece, [snorts] you know, but if it's like an RR1 along our wonderful tunnel zone and that old house is sitting up there on the road, it it's within, you know, it doesn't meet our code. So, I think that's where I think the conversation's like, what was the intent? And I and I I totally see where you're coming from. It's like with the why does it matter? Um,

I mean, I could see a neighbor being upset because they don't like that the next door neighbor built a big house, but at the end of the day, I think I don't know, you know, how is that any different than them coming in and saying, "We're going to level both houses and build two new ones, one big bigger than the other. It's the same thing, and it would qualify exactly the same way. Yeah, that's true too. Under the current, you know what I mean? An ADU is an ADU and and yes, we limited the square footage because the intent was that it's not, you know, a huge structure and the intent was to provide hopefully more some more affordable type housing. Um, but I don't know and and maybe there's something I'm missing.

There's only a few people that fell into that. It's probably worth a discussion. Yeah. And that and I think that's all it is like let's look at that code and are there changes that should be made that shouldn't be made. There were some people that fell in that interim. I think what what you're saying that we're going to tear down that were planning on tearing down and then all of a sudden like never mind I don't have and and they had like all the the neighbors were like they knew that the house has come down. I was like no now I don't have to. And the people like what do you mean you don't have to? You know it's like wait a minute. But I would also say, yeah, maybe they don't have to, but as the neighbor, you could build a a secondary unit too on your property if you want. I mean, that's your choice, you know. But I think that's the thing is just

seems more like a jealousy problem of people upset that their neighbors building a bigger house. That it's not a matter I don't think it is that. I think what it has to do with is okay, we set up zoning for whether it be RR1 or whatever it might be, we set up that way. Now, if it's on an RR1 zoning and you put in a cass or not a cassita in this case, you put in another home on that RR1, it defeats R1 because we didn't want two homes on an RR1 unless it was two. By by doing an ADU, yes, you are having two homes on on any of the lots that qualify for an ADU. That

when we put an ADU into place, we agreed that there could be two homes on a lot. Now, the difference is you can't subdivide those and sell them separately. They're they have to be sold together. And I would think as a homeowner, you would also want to be a little careful about that because if you have two huge houses on a lot, you're going to have a heck of a time selling that down the road, right? That's going to be a problem cuz nobody's going to pay you $3 million for a oneacre lot with two giant houses on it, you know? Well, maybe they will in 10 years. I don't know. But and have your So to me there's some I I just think there's I mean I think it just needs to come back just look at our code. Sure. And and just are there things that it's worth looking at and having a discussion.

And so and I think it's just you know we both I know I have and I think Wayne have have had people come to us and ask us like what is going on? What is it? And just having a conversation looking at it. Are there issues? Maybe there are no there aren't you know. So, so why do you have to then um if you've got a lot that is RR1 and it goes into I mean R1 but yet they've got 10 acres or 8 acres, I don't know what it is. They have that. Why can't it just be separated versus having to go into a reszone?

Well, if it's zoned, you don't have to reszone it. If it if it was all zoned R1, but you have say seven acres, but it's one parcel, you don't have to reszone it. You just have to subdivide it. So, you have to go through the process of subdividing into individual lots. Why is this? And so, why is this home this particular instance that I've had calls on tonight? Um, why is it that they have to go and have it reszone to R2? I don't well I don't know the scenario so I can't posted that way too what it was posted as a reszone to have a reasonzone done for R2 you guys can look

are you talking A20 it's currently A20 uh as far as I understood it was R1 if the zoning complies the zoning complies you don't have to reszone it if the zone if the underlying zoning it was coming before the commission this week planning commission you want to look what talk to the planning official planning department about that because I mean it's been an uproar in my ward and probably yours too on that one. So I'll tell you two and three. We have one, two, and three. I might know I they might be coming to see me.

Oh. Anyway, that's all my comments for now. All I had was the same just conversations with people about that. Okay. I don't I don't have anything more. So, we'll adjourn. And as I read today, we don't need to vote on that.