Business Improvement District Board #2 (historic Third Ward) - Regular Meeting

Hey. Good afternoon, everyone. We will call to order the regular meeting of the historic preservation commission for Monday, 10/06/2025 at 03:04PM. I'm Alderman Baumann, chair of the commission, and please call the roll.

Anne Peeper Eisenbrown. Excused. Sally Peltz. Here. Lipko San Robinson. Here. Tricia Keating Khan. Here. Matt Jaros.

Here. Jordan Morales.

Used. All involved.

I expect him to come later in the meeting. Okay. Very good. Here. First item is 240748. Red illusion relating to a certificate of appropriateness for mothball status at 266 East Erie Street, the the Catherine Foley Tavern or Catherine Foley Tavern Restoration LLC.

Oh, I

Carl here.

Carl, do you have any updates?

Oh, you can't yell from them.

We we

gotta have you on the record here.

Yeah. So, I mean, MPAs say

for the record?

No. Essentially, no new updates. I mean, they've taken care of MPAs taken care of mothballing. It's it's you know, they're in a fundraising fundraising mode, but it's weather tight right now. So, you know, the roof has got a temporary EDPM membrane on it. All the windows are are boarded up, and doors are secured. So it's just kind of mothballed for now. We'll review again in six months.

K. Sounds good. So is there a motion to extend the mothball for six months? So move. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Right. Very good. Item two, file 250774. Resolution relating to a certificate of repose for partial window replacement at 2452 North Grant Boulevard at the Grants Boulevard Historic District for Robin Anderson.

Correct. So miss Anderson recently got an order for about 10 windows replaced on the front of the house, act all over the house, two on the front. At the time she first made contact with me earlier this year, the real estate listing photos from 2020 were still available online. I made a copy. They were very clearly in place before she bought the house.

So she has met all of their partners. Her get a proposed purchase from unrelated buyer, minimum of three years has passed. No immediate safety hazards. It's more than 10 win she did not submit a bid, but it's more it's at least 10 windows, so it's easily over a thousand dollars to remedy. No previous site no previous citation for the work, So, she does meet the criteria, and staff recommends approval of the proposed.

K. Any questions, comments? Is there a motion to grant the certificate of repose? So moved. Second? Second. All in favor say aye. Aye. Okay. Very good. Moving on to item three, file two five zero eight two six. Resolution relating to a certificate of appropriateness for replacing bathroom windows at 2864 North Sherman Boulevard in the Sherman Boulevard Historic District Amber Walker. So on the south wall of

this house is a recently remodeled bathroom right there. Miss Walker proposed filling in those windows with glass block. That is not something we approve. The way she has remodeled the bathroom, she could easily put in privacy glass in the existing windows or build a new window inside the original window. Was established from an exile.

Anybody here on this aisle? Any questions, comments? Your motion to deny the application for So moved. Here. Second?

Second.

All in favor, say aye. Aye. Alright.

South Windows. Right, Jim? What? South windows.

South facing. South south facing windows. Said

north. They're they're extremely visible in the sidewalk.

Right. But they're facing south. I thought you said north. There's Okay.

We do we have we do allow glass block on basements now.

Correct? In basements except for the front of the house. K. Very good. We've never approved it above grade.

K. Moving on item four, file two five zero eight two seven. Resolution relating to a certificate of appropriateness for door and transom window replacement at 2105 East Lafayette Place in the North Pointe South Historic District for Atkley and Michael Adam.

Thank you. So this is the Andrew Hathaway House, Grand Queen Anne constructed in 1887. Howland Russell was the architect.

On this place. Okay.

The applicants, so I tried to do a bird's eye view from the back. So, essentially, this is a second floor on the upper porch, and it leads from, I believe they said, a bedroom to the to the upper porch. So approximately right here where the area is circled. They're proposing removing the the two the French doors and the paired casement transom windows, and they provided images showing that, there is, you know, a significant amount of deterioration, probably too much, at least for the doors, to to be feasible to repair. So here are some images of the existing.

This is from the exterior, so, obviously, a lot of deterioration, right there. So they're proposing, replacing the the French, doors and the paired, transom with a with a single light single door and a single light transom window, and they're proposing an aluminum clad Marvin product. The preservation guidelines for the district state to retain the original configurations of panes and doors to respect the stylistic period or periods that a building represents. So you can see with the the the window adjacent to the French doors is vertical in nature. The French doors are vertical in nature, and removing that and replacing it with a single light door and transom doesn't feel appropriate to the architectural style.

These are older images from the late eighties and mid nineteen nineties that show that there had been there had been a storm door installed there at in front of the in front of the French doors. So staff is recommending denial of the aluminum clad product as not a not a material that we typically approve, And staff recommends that they come back with a a wood French door that matches the existing style. There hasn't been any evidence to show that the transom windows are deteriorated, so staff is also recommending that those be in place and that if the applicants wish to install a storm door to better protect prime doors, that that would be a more appropriate way to go.

Okay. I'll know. Bush. Any question of staff on this one yet?

Pardon me?

No. Go ahead. I just asked some information.

I'm the homeowner, Ashley Adam. Thank you for the opportunity to be here. Talking to the mic. Just wanted to provide a few additional comments and context. If you view the inside of door number two exhibit, we've been informed by contractors that the French doors that are currently installed there are unlikely to be original, probably redone over the years.

The first clue is the hinges, that most of the hinges throughout our house, in fact, in the transoms above, you can see have the decorative finial ball tips. And you can see the hinges on the door as well as the hardware are very standard basic low grade quality materials, and we were told this is likely a kind of handyman type door reconstruction attempt. We chose to request the clad material as we've looked at the composition of the materials today, the structure of the roof, the can't change the way the water flows. There's a significant downfall there that bounces off the patio. And with a storm in front of a new wood door, we've been advised that that would buy us time but wouldn't be a great permanent solution because it would contribute to further condensation and and water trapping issues.

So we're requesting partly for those reasons. Another, this will be the nursery of our child in spring. So this would be something that we can't have the risk of mold, wood rot, etcetera, coming into the home. It's on the exterior of the home, not visible from the street or either side of the home. We have no neighbors on either side, no sidewalks or passageways that would lead to any visibility of this, hence the request for the clad door. We do agree that the transom above is not facing significant deterioration risk and could probably be just preserved modestly to by more of a lifetime there. But for the reasons I mentioned, we're proposing the clad door. So just wanted to provide that additional context.

So your testimony is that this rather advanced and significant rotting is caused by the drainage off the roof bouncing on the deck and then splashing against the door constantly.

Yes.

I actually can appreciate that problem, Can you look at

the two historic pictures? Could you bring those up again? I'm gonna assume that the one on the left is older than the one on the right.

Correct. Yep.

Okay. The one on the left did not have a drainage scupper from that upper area. The one on the right does, which which doesn't look historic to the house, quite frankly, but it seems that that is at least something of a remedy to all the snow and the water on that area coming out there at that point then, which wasn't there in the old in the old picture. So that should, it seems to me, help that condition of constant water and snow piling up against the door. So that's probably helpful.

It does help with it. Yes.

Do you do you have the original drawings?

No. I do not.

You know where he's got them?

Historical Society?

Wisconsin Architectural Archives. It's in the library in the 2nd Floor.

Okay.

I don't know for sure. I've never looked up this house, but I can almost guarantee that those drawings are there at the Wisconsin Architectural Archives Milwaukee Public Library in The United States. It would help us a lot in sort of being kind of like principled in what we think a replacement would be, and the drawings will show what was drawn there originally. Because I think you're saying that what's there seems to be kinda like a handyman. The house probably, like, a hundred, hundred twenty years old. When was it built?

The house is 1887. It was held by the county for a number of years through the nineteen hundreds, purchased in the, I believe, the nineties by owners before us, and I think they're the ones that did a lot of the restoration work. And I would suspect in that time frame, late nineties into the early two thousands would be when the store was reconstructed or or built Mhmm. New.

Yeah. And I no reason to think that's not plausible. It seems we're craftsmanship and so forth. Mhmm. But two issues here then. One, I think you can get those original products, which you should get anyway

Yeah.

First of all. Secondly, cladding some of those decisions bias don't happen with existing in existing buildings, so we kinda open up a floodgate of stuff that we have. Now we can talk about and consider cladding, but that's with new construction in historic districts, so there's a big difference. This is not new. It's a beautiful house, unbelievable house, really great.

And I guess I think in the spirit of it being such a great domestic landmark for the city, I'd like to see if maybe you can take a chance of finding those original drawings and give us some grounds to make a reasonable and educated decision about it. I think we all know about the water problems and rotting, so we're sensitive to that for sure. But unless other commissioners disagree with this, I'm almost suggesting a motion to hold it. I know winter's been you know, not today or the last two days of 90 degrees, but it's gonna be here soon. So I kind of appreciate the fact you wanna get it done and going.

But I would say that I I I would make a motion then for the commission to hold us to next month so that you can kinda get those original drawings, and we can have a really nice and confident decision about it. Okay. So that's that's my motion then to hold it for a month.

Okay.

So so

That's okay with you?

And you can So probably if you wanna know how to get the drawing.

So it'd great.

Tell you how to help with that.

Okay. Okay. Great.

Don't stick around, and he will consult with you.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the opportunity.

K. Very good. Well, listen.

The motion is to hold or hearing. Is there a second to that?

Second.

Spy. File 250841. Resolution relating to a certificate of appropriateness for replacement of the attached garage at 2135 Northlake Drive in the North Point South historic District for Pola and John.

We have a corner lot here at the number of in the. Kinda jaunty angle as things are on that section of Lake Drive. This is the current state. This three car garage was built in 1960 while the how it was used as a rooming house of questionable legality. The current owner is essentially doing a a facelift on it and because it needs some deferred may has some deferred maintenance issues, is not exceptionally attractive, and the garage doors are too small for modern units.

Slight landscaping changes to adjust air up from yard. Overall, slightly taller because the current current railings are not current to current code heights. New metal railings, new garage doors, work finish with limestone header over the garage doors. It's a significant upgrade to existing without any real change in footprints. And while we don't usually attach garages, this is just essentially just a reface on an existing one.

The staff is recommending approval as drawn.

Okay. Questions or comments? Your motion to approve the COA?

So move.

Your second? Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Okay. Very good. Moving on to item six. File 250828. Resolution relating to a certificate appropriateness for rooftop solar panels at 2591 North Summit Avenue in the North Point North Historic District for Chris Sanger.

Great. Thanks. This is the August Rome House Tudor revival from nineteen o nine. The applicants are proposing solar panels on the front elevation the front east elevation of the house, which is not a not a proposal that staff can approve at the staff level, hence, coming to HPC for review. So they this is the mock up that they received from their solar energy contractor, so it would be quite visible.

It is a corner lot, so even moving it to the rear would be somewhat visible, but a preferable location. They also did get their, energy provider to to provide a mock up on the rear. So it would they they sent an email indicating that their their contractor indicated that if they were to move it from the east, the front, to the west, which is the rear, their production would be about half of what at least the contractor is saying it would be on the east on the east side on the front, and it would likely be not economically viable. They're they're saying to move it to the to the back. However, it would be highly visible on the front facade.

So staff is recommending denial. And if they wish to to install it on the rear, staff can approve at the at the staff staff level COA.

Can you show a sales or image? Yeah. That's an east surface where those solar panels are.

That's what? I'm sorry. That's an east facing

Yeah. I mean, it's the way Summit is oriented, it's Okay. It's, you know, sort of Southeast.

Okay. Oh, so Yes. South East.

So what street

is is the cross? This is Northwest, but not the West.

Because it

Is that for you?

Yeah. So look at the the what they want, their proposal. Go to the plan. There. 246810121416182021. Now do yours. I counted yours, and it was 22. How how come that is half?

Well, they talk about What's the other one? Well, the half is the amount of sun exposure that I

Yeah. I know. Because it's tilted a little bit. But if it were straight north and south ridge and you're just saying that that ridge is tilted a little bit.

Well, right now, we're looking, like, 45. You see what

I'm saying?

So right now, with the east

The way your image is is that is north directly out.

I believe this is a I believe so.

Kind. Yeah. Guess.

I was gonna say the

Yeah. There there are it would be slightly more efficient.

From what I have been reading, if it if it was if it was a true east and west, it would be not much of

that's literally that's a lot of shade. You know? That's a lot of shade. If you look at it, the east sun is gonna be coming up, and everything in orange is pretty much probably in direct sunlight until, let's just say, one, 2PM. You're not getting that back half until after that, and then that west sun gets so low. What have we done in the past? I feel like we poked this bear before.

Do we have a guideline for for solar?

We have a staff level approval, but this wouldn't their proposal on the front wouldn't meet what staff can approve.

We would follow the NPS on solar panels, which basically says no visibility on the primary side where where it or possible. Sure. And somehow I mean, on some houses, there is literally only one location. This would be a decrease in efficiency, but not completely disallow solar panels. Yeah. But

I mean, this is like a don't do it or do it type situation.

Right? That's what it looks like to me. I feel pay the price to do this.

Yeah. I feel like we've had this conversation before about I forget what house that was, and we were, like, trying to get them to push it to the back, but this is a lot easier. You know what saying? Where did we land?

We had we've had those discussions before over the last couple of years. What we've been trying to do and being reasonable here are saying let's work on some sort of compromise with this thing that by National Park Service standards is not really an acceptable thing. So what we've in these other houses, if you recall, the slope was not parallel to the street. The ones I remember, it was always parallel

Yeah.

To the neighbor's house. And Yeah. And we asked to push them back a little bit towards the back of the house. I think this is the first one that I can recall where it's front and center. That's this is right there at the primary side.

And

Yeah. Every other case has been a front gable house where it's

not

That's right. That's right.

Not as clearly visible. Yeah.

And if you're talking if we're talking floodgates.

Yeah. This is floodgates. No. I understand.

Say that those panels are okay on that. I'm for that.

No. Well

I'm for everybody having solar.

So okay. Yeah. And I think that came up last time too is saying, okay. How do we become, like, our how are we, like, being sensitive to the whole concept of, right, solar being like a I mean, you know, in architecture, we're always trying to push, you know, efficiency and sustainability. Right? But then we have this historic context. Obviously, this is like, I mean, this this is like, if you wanna get disrespectful, this is the one. Right? This is just thought on the front. So how do we handle that, though? Do we just say no solar because it's gotta be on the front and it doesn't discretion

to the notes?

Yeah. I mean, there are state statutes that allow, HPC to exercise its police powers promoting, health, safety, and general welfare of the community. It's been, I believe, the opinion of the city attorney that, that, you know, we're we're not outright denying their ability to ever have solar. They they would be allowed solar on the rear. It is a decrease in efficiency granted. But, you know, we're not completely removing the ability to have a solar energy system on their house.

Dishes and those things we're seeing years ago on the top of you know, the the idea is that you can put these in another spot, still benefit from some of the cost. Savings, maybe not all, but but at least some of it.

Did they say that putting on the rear kinda details it for them because of the actual energy consumption? Or

Yeah. They said from an economic viability standpoint, the only option they see is to have it on the front of the house.

Is that who'd that come from? Is that the energy company?

No. That was the applicant.

Okay. When we get, I guess, information from the actual, like, you know, solar company saying, hey. This doesn't make sense at all to do it on the back, meaning you can't collect enough solar to even, you know, recoup the cost over time.

I can follow-up with the applicant. And we

had the solar guy in here a couple months ago. Remember when we were in the main room at the end? Do you remember that? That solar guy was here Mhmm. Giving his ankle on on it with the applicant and so on. I think at minimum, we should think about that. I mean, we've been trying for years now to stop just this anecdotal no. It costs too much attitude.

I I mean You know,

for the last ten years. Okay.

Well, then what does it cost?

What is the savings? We gotta see real numbers. Yeah. Just sorta you think it's gonna be much better another way. So

I talked to one solar guy, and he was saying that so I was having a conversation about, you know, sunny states versus non sunny states. Yeah. And he was like, I don't this is almost like a myth that you're not collecting a significant amount of, you know, energy in cloudy situations because he talks about the efficiency of that they make panels down. So he's like, no. You're still getting, like, this amount of energy even though it's cloudy. So part of me is, like, if you're in a north facing situation and it's still daylight out, you know, what are the efficiencies that you're getting? Much energy are you getting? You see

what I'm saying?

Like, that always have to be direct.

So We gotta move beyond sort of myth and anecdote. Mhmm. I want to see some people in here testifying under the record that these things cost certain things rather than just speculating that some 100% expensive.

I mean,

because Aesthetically, that's a very significant amount of.

Yeah. I

mean, obviously.

So I get that. So we hold this in? That's the motion.

Would you like follow-up

with the applicant to get they said they weren't able to make it today. K.

Alright. I'll move to hold it over the next month and see if we can follow-up with some, at least, appearance, if not numbers by you know, in these other cases, we've said three remember that? For years now. We don't want one contract to give us a number. Give us three. And if you prove your point with the three, fine. We're all on board with it.

They did indicate that they had reached out to three contractors, and then

Well

they they got two two of the ones that they that were the most viable suppliers. They got additional quotes.

My viability may change with time. That's why I'm a little concerned by making a decision based on today's economic viability versus down the road when rates may be significantly higher, which I would assume increases the economic viability even if it produces less watts

Right.

An hour or a day or whatever the measuring unit is. So I'm a little concerned about using economic viability as a Well a at a specific point in time, namely today versus the long range.

That may I may even go further than that with you. Our decision shouldn't be based on economics at all. Now we know we know that that's not the real world we live in. I had talked about this for twenty or thirty years now. It's not the world we live in, but you are you know, whether something is appropriate historically, architecturally, or not shouldn't depend on what how costly it is. Right? There there should be some kind of statement that sort of says, you know, these sort of modern solar panels are not the right thing on a building in a historic district. This city is not full of historic districts. You know, I gotta get I gotta dispel that myth too. We have a couple historic districts.

A large percentage of the buildings in this city are not protected or are not listed. We have a small amount. And I think we should really be careful about our decisions in those kind of little selected, really, you know, beautiful and worthy kind of districts.

I see what you're

saying. Anyway. So I'll I'll make the motion then to hold it.

Okay. I'll put this on the record. We have overview of over of less than 2% of building city's building stock, less than 2%. So

Well, I had some this stuff.

Me the other day. Oh, you guys are so powerful.

What?

How does that

Well, I know. And I know where you live, and you know where I live. We can put solar on our house anytime we want. We're not in a designated restricted solar area, and you do see it on we're on the you know, we could get the state tax credit, obviously, but but we don't we're not under the authority now of the district. So

Here's a motion to hold. There's a second. Second. All in favor? Aye. Okay. Very good. Moving on to And the item Salvation Army. 250822, resolution relating to a certificate of appropriateness for conceptual design of an additional connect of an addition connecting 1730 North 7th Street and 1747 North 6th Street in the Central City Plaza Historic District for the Salvation Army.

K. You guys should remember this site from several hearings this year. Additionally, at the beginning end of this meeting, we will be dismissing the individual designation for the Northeast Building as no longer necessary because we listed all three as a district. So Valedian Army has changed their plans and to acknowledge the history of the site and is now planning an an all of 7,100 square foot two story and basement addition connecting the two northern buildings on at Central City Plaza. This is a general plan.

Entrance from Vine and from indirect entrance from 6th. Basement floor plan, main floor floor plan, increasing their use of space, and rent rates. This is a fairly thoroughly formed plan, but they want your input before committing to full fundraising mode. If they want to fence off the parking courtyard within within the motel, I'm recommending approving that as long as it's an open fence and playground equipment doesn't completely obstruct the view of the original facade. As long as the original entrance facade remains visible, that's perfectly reasonable.

Honestly, most of the critique is functional on certain issues. I brought this before design review team last week. They had some input on, particularly egress routes and loading dock location and some variances that are likely needed, for the entrances as placed. However, it does appear meet our, all of our, design guidelines except that, they haven't established materials yet.

I should yeah.

Okay. This here is a sort of stoop and ramp. The original entrance on 6th Street, it is severely deteriorated, and they no longer want to use that as an entrance and would like to eliminate that stoop and replace the doors with matching store aluminum storefront system so that the openness is maintained. However, it's no longer an entry. Any questions for everybody now?

You guys have any comments? Yeah.

I would just like major Beverly Gates. I just like to point out like. Just because

Major Beverly Gates. I just like to point out where the glass is there. We specifically put that a glass entrance so that we can keep the the, exterior of the cab company on that side as well, Very visible as a part of that of our design here. So most of it is being used for offices. Is that right?

No. So the 1747 Building so can you, like, speak into the 1747 Building will be used for our clinic and food pantry entrance. So kinda community service that way. The lower level of the 1747 Building will be our food pantry, which we open to the community. And then the the Bridge is kinda what we're calling it, the new structure that will connect the two buildings.

That is our dining area, kitchen, and then that part there is offices. The original structure at the 1730 Building really will maintain what it is, where it is the family shelter, our respite rooms, and then our men's and women's rooms, some laundry facilities, stuff like a few offices over there. But most of the offices will be in the new Bridge build Bridge Building is what we're calling it.

So I'd like to ask a question. Originally, the smaller building was gonna be demolished. Correct. Is this just out of curiosity? Be is this working out better for you, worse for you, more expensive, less expensive in terms of what you your ultimate goals are?

I mean, the ultimate goal is to, you know, create a more efficient building, you know, to serve people, you know, as the people the best that we can. Uh-huh. So, you know, we've been very educated, you know, in the process and the community you know, the Central City Plaza because, honestly, many people didn't know about it. Even people we found out even within the Bronzeville neighborhood didn't even know that that what that Central City Plaza did. You know? So it wasn't just us, but it's it's very interesting, and and we really have embraced it. So, you know, it's a it's a challenge. I'm not gonna lie.

Is it costing you more? I mean, it

just just architect fees, yes, because we've had to redesign.

Okay. So that's an additional line item, architectural fees.

Correct. Uh-huh. You know, we've had to you know, we know how much money that we're trying to raise. Uh-huh. So if we have to scale part back of the building, you know, if they say it's gonna cost 35,000,000 to do everything we wanna do, we have to delete some things because we know how much we're able to raise or that we're hoping we can raise.

And how much is will this project cost you in terms of raising money?

Our capital campaign is $30,000,000.

I see.

So it's not just for the building. I believe the building right now is at 25. Yes. 25,000,000.

And it's for 12,000,000 might be for operations, etcetera.

Endowment. Yeah. 27. We have an endowment, you know, an endowment to help us care for that new building as well.

So let me ask you this. In in the front is another building that you're not involved with. Yes. Yeah. Tell me what's going to happen with that building. That's not ours. I know it's not yours. I know it's not yours, and I know it actually, it's Milwaukee County's building, and I know no. No. No. It's not. It's Kalen Hayward. Sorry. But because this is so integrated now more so than even what you've had before, it seems to me, which will be a wonderful resource, an additional resource for the area. What's gonna happen in the front to have a type of environment?

Let's put it that way. Have you thought about that at all? I Since this entire thing has been designated?

I probably even replaced.

Okay. Just having his

with about two weeks ago. Uh-huh. When the National Trust Conference was in town and we presented on Central City Plaza, He was approached by, African American Cultural Heritage Action Fund about doing a comprehensive planning grant for that.

And and that is headed up by

The National Trust.

I see. And and so there's an intent to study what can be done with this so that it can be something treasured I think entire historic piece.

I think he will take advantage that of that. I haven't followed up with either the National Trust for him.

Have you you should take advantage of what you just learned.

I don't know. For a grant.

Yeah. There you go. There you go. Exactly. And I know county is leasing from

Yes.

They're

they're either the primary or only tenant.

And I know it you know, subjectively, I'm I that it's not I wish it would be maintained in a better way. So it's something you might wanna think about. And, again, it gets to be very complicated, I suspect. But it would be nice if this I mean, we've worked so hard now, and you have come along, you know, to understand the importance of this historic Mhmm. Absolutely. Project. It would be nice if that that's the last building, I think, that you own all we'll own every no. Tell me other buildings on that site.

There's there's three. We own two. We own 1747. No. There's three in total on that whole block of the Central City Plaza. Uh-huh. We own two of the three. 1747 and 1730.

Okay. So there's one left.

Right. The one that Caitlin came with me.

Oh, but that's exactly what I thought. Yeah.

Okay. Well, it's it's just, I guess, a plead a that I'm pleading with you to try to make this all work as time goes on.

K. And for the

Do they actually need a COA approval?

No. Just, if you think this they're here for an opinion on whether this is an appropriate design direction.

One thing is COA.

Because they're not

because they're not that far along yet.

Oh, oh, yeah. But, ultimately, you need see where that yeah.

And we just wanna make sure we're heading in the correct that that the bridge was something that was going to be acceptable, that, you know, the the east portion of our 1747 Building, you know, we we understand that, you know, we're supposed to not attach anything to an historic structure, but we do need to to maintain our bed count to serve as many, you know, homeless homeless folks that we can. We need to attach the Bridge Building to that east side of the 1747 Building that you can see the building. So when we, you know, met with Tim, we had asked if that would be something that they you know, that would be considered.

Will you be back again? Will this project be back?

Dealing. Right? Yeah. Yes.

So it'll be

When they're when they're when they're at the construction documents.

That's in the months to come?

Probably longer than that.

I see. So what's your opinion on the bridge?

It it works. I think it's probably the best solution for keeping both buildings in place.

It looks that way. It looks like a really,

really good solution. Consent approval. Pardon? Doing consent approvals. No. No. I'm not No.

Thank you for the information. That's basically the point of this.

I think the consent We can't

When we say consent approval, we get it.

Consensus, not consent. Yeah. So

We also I mean, the way we understand the way that the final approval when this was all, you know, deemed historic is that the landscaping in the parking lot was as well. So, you know, you know, to pay attention to where our parking lot is now in the 1747 In The Horseshoe, we're requesting to make that a playground to have a safe space for our homeless children, you know, that are staying there, have a safe place to play, you know, understanding that no structures could be too high, having a fence to keep them safe so no cars can get in, but also that, you know, that bridge will disrupt, you know, where the parking is, where some of those islands are, you know, kind of considered, I guess, that parking lot. You know, that was part of it. So we just don't wanna get too far with our architects and, you know, design and everything like that. And we know we have to come back, you know, for that COA and everything.

We, like I said, we just wanna make sure we're on the right track that this is something that seems supportive so far.

So I guess coming from an architect's perspective, and I know exactly what you guys are talking about because who wants to be in construction documents and then we say something that makes you happy. Right? Because that's a lot more we're doing, and then we're seeing a nice little build for that. She's basically asking us looking at these plans and those elevations, is there anything glaring that they need to change right now?

You know, my only question is does Wright architects, do they have a good sense on historic historic designation or historic buildings?

So we're we're in the process of many things. Like, if we're trying to go for new market tax credits right now and with that, there are certain historic folks that we have to work with to make sure we're following all those rules. Just like, you know, when when you deem this historic, we have to follow all these guidelines. So those folks, we need to, you know, get under contract with to make sure we're using the correct materials and everything like that. So same with Bray is that we know we have to have some type of his you know, architect that has that background with historic.

We have a lot to do, but this is the first stab at it. We're we're happy with this this design. We're still serving a 130 people and a food pantry in the community and respite and everything else. So like I said, just wanna make sure we're on the right path.

So I guess, yeah, is there anything glaring? And this is me kinda sitting in their seat, in their architect seat for two seconds and going, I see it. I'm looking at it, but I'm not as experienced as everybody else in this council when it comes to the actual historic nature of things, what we wouldn't necessarily be appropriate, you know, versus inappropriate from what I can see from a keeping of that minimalist

Mhmm.

Kind of facade. You see, mean, we're being very respectful, respectful, very very restrained in the new design. It doesn't even look that you know, it doesn't look that different. Right? Because there's such thing, and Matt knows this. You can go super different or you try to match it or you you know what I'm saying? So it's just like, I mean, they're setting it back a little bit. Right?

Right.

So this is us going let's, you know, poke the bear nail.

Right.

You know? Obviously, they're gonna give us materials and stuff like that in the future, you know, so we'll be able to review that at that time. But from an actual building form standpoint, I'm looking at that. If you can go back to that, street facade. That's the what's that fourth page of the document? Fifth page where it's like that straight on elevation. So that's one, but not that one. Keep going. That

one. That that's fine.

Okay. So that's fine. Okay. So what will I see from 6th Street? The only one that I'm seeing from 6th Street is the angled one?

Yes.

The 6th Street would when you go back on that other one?

Yeah. 6th Street is on the left in the 7th.

Right. So this is me going. I'm very interested now in what I'm seeing when I'm driving down 6th Street because in my mind, that's a very primary because the church I grew up in, our family still owns is two blocks from here. So I look at this every day right before I hit that left, you know, on Devine Street. Right?

So Go to the next

two things, I think. Next one. That would be this is no. Be back. That is next to the building. So this would be what's on the other side of that angle.

Right. But then 6th Street is on the other side of that. Right? No.

6th Street is on the other side. This is going north on 6

6th Street is just outside the image on the right.

Okay.

Going north on 6 is what you would see.

Okay. I can just say. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay.

So was

a little disoriented. So, essentially, from what I'm seeing, I mean, the only thing that I can see here is there's these strong verticals. Right? But even from a materiality, they're thinking there's kind of this monogamous type feel for it. Right?

Yeah. The original materials were

built up concrete. Yeah. Exactly.

Exactly. And looking at the window.

Exactly. The worst of it was the circles. Right?

Yes. You

know? So I get that. So I guess from this angle and this view, I guess I'm kinda for the sake of us being able to evaluate, do we have anything glaring to say based off of what we're actually seeing? I know nobody wants to approve anything today or anything like that, but is there anything that they need to from I mean, not necessarily saying like I like it, don't like that. We're talking about appropriateness. Right? Yeah. So is there anything inappropriate in this view just for the sake of them? They've spent this time. They're here. They're asking. Let's look. Let's provide a response based off at least what they're asking.

I think it has a good use of the land site plan. The site plan is efficient. It allows for your playground, your green space. It allows for access from all different directions. That's I think it's clever clever use of the space, and I I think it's the best you can do on that site. I really I I think you've done a good job of laying it out.

Thank you.

My Even after the review that

they even know we have some. You know, we have some notes and with the loading dock and stuff like that. And so and that's what we wanted. It's that feedback. You know? No feedback. We can make some adjustments around.

It's for design issues and placement. It's absolutely. Is it bridge corridor

that attaches to the existing building? How exactly is the existing building's west wall stays intact? But it's just the closed, basically.

It's an internal wall.

No. It becomes

an internal wall. 47.

Yes. The one on 6th Street. Right.

So and that's why we wanna have the glass structure there so we can have that open to appreciate the, you know, the windows and everything else.

That's really Yeah. Reasonable. Yeah.

Right. So that's why we had that. You know, on the 1730 Building on the East Side, there were no ornamental windows or anything like that. I mean, you can see that on some of that now. But to be able to serve as many folks as we can, you know, and be able to butt up to it is is where we're asking, you know, for that acceptance.

Now are you making any additional penetrations to that west wall of the six We

will have of the

1730 Building? Well, we'll have to create a corridor for it because right now, it's just, you know, it's all off.

If there's existing doors that would stay intact on the West Wall, 1740, if you wanna call that.

Okay.

Yes. This orange right here, they're not gonna be able to alterations of that.

No. It it's up. It it would be wrong somewhere. It's right in the upper right. What about that corridor? That's that's corridor.

There's nothing in it. There you are. Yeah. That's.

The original west wall will be fully enclosed, but this hole is in the floor. That's the best.

Openings or penetrations of the windows or door?

No. Already has to. I would Already has to. It does. On that side. Yep.

Make them more energy efficient that we wanna do.

So you're pretty basic book gallery up against the. But

we're still gonna have room for our own little criticism of the details. Right? Right. Yeah.

But I'm gonna look

on that. Now just to just out of curiosity here.

Moderate. Oh.

Oh, that educated you, dude.

Where did I go? Anyway,

out of curiosity, so new market tax credit historic tax credits? No.

New market tax credit.

No. But, mean, you would also have the option of If it's listed, it's gotta be listed in National Register.

We have been having our intern work on a national register nomination from the local designation. Okay.

Need to get talk to

you guys about that, but it's already locally designated. You lose nothing in gaining the opportunity of a tax credit. You would have to sell them to essentially one of your

corporate donors, but you can still use them. Right.

And it it's it's pretty minimal as well Yeah. I believe.

It's Well Yeah.

No. It's 40%.

Not as nonprofit owned, they would only be able to state a credit, which is 20

And Well,

there are there there are

federal credit, you

know, non profit.

You're talking Yeah.

But Beth Beth Beth will getting miracles for you.

Know a guy named John with the Alexander company? He is, like, a wizard in these kind of details.

So We work with the Alexander company a great deal in Madison. Yeah.

Perfect. Talk to John.

John is local. Joe Alexander. Joe and Madison.

Okay. Slam dunk.

Yeah. Yeah.

40%. Forget about No.

That that can happen, but I get you have a whole set of new rules now.

I know.

Because the park service is gonna be a critique component and authority in this matter of how that thing looks. Not that it won't, but as Nick started saying about ten minutes ago about this matter of should it contrast, You know, they're they're very different their stance. They don't want any confusion about what the original is and what the new thing is. It's gotta be very different. So

thing.

We'll be here forever. So we're not gonna get into that. But if you go down that road and you need Bray to understand this, and I know I have a number of my students work at Bray. So Bray should be well aware of these kind of factors in this matter. So, I mean, I I think it's fine. Looks like it answers a lot of questions.

To the U Shaped Building. You will be on the east wall of that building, the U Shaped Building. You will be altering that east

Where you see that light blue? Yes. Yes. That is where we need to have that corridor connecting the connecting the two, the new building and the old building.

It looks like they are maintaining well, within the lighter green too. Right? You're kinda pushing a hole there, or is that it's still not visible?

No. Part of the U shape?

So I'm touching the way you're trying to reset the there we go. Right. So they'll come right below that. No. That that opening. Yep. The right. The opening to the right. Oh. Is that the is that the transition between the new and the old right

now?

Yep.

So they'll still be punching. There'll be something there, right, as far as the size?

That's just where we're connecting Right. The two and yeah.

Right. So there's no opening there. Right.

Okay. Just windows from the other corner. So

Bob, to your I believe the modifications today. Gonna be some.

Right. Yeah. Which is fine. You know? I

Yeah. I'm just thinking. Just

be I would say you can get a probably a pretty good opinion from from John Beck pretty quickly whether this thing could succeed or not, and then you have to syndicate the tax credits. But it might be worth it if you do your pro form a and money numbers. You can add on to historic buildings. That's not restricted, but how you do it and the sensitivity is what's important.

Mhmm.

And that's why I made that nasty comment five minutes ago, but I do have some thoughts here. But your doors in the gray corridor that Bob was talking about there, you really need to perceive that building because it's an individual singular building right now. You need to kinda, in some ways, perceive it as an an independent standing object. Right now, you need to move those doors back off that historic wall. Know what I'm talking The one on the south up, the one on the north down. No problem. Four feet, six feet, nothing at all so that you can really get a sense of that, the volume of that thing without that condition. It'll help you when you use glass, things like that. Those are small details. We don't need to get that in into that today.

But, you know, as I said, I think it's fine. I think you've answered. And I appreciate you guys coming here too at this point for this kind of discussion. This is overlooked by a lot of applicants. So

And we've got you funded now. So

as. Your tax credits that non for profit in terms of obtaining new markets. Do you know anything about that?

I mean, we know that the ZIP code that we're in is in a highly distressed area. And I No.

I mean, 90% of Milwaukee is is in is in the right ZIP code ZIP code in terms of Right. Just talking about the non for profit status.

That I mean, our Chicago our off of the states where our territorial headquarters is, they're spearheading all of that right now. I see. We've supplied them with the information, and now it's their job to go out and find if there's companies, organizations, funders, whoever gonna you know, if we're able to take us on. Right. The the part of the problem is is that a lot of times for them to do it or to commit to it, they wanna shovel in the ground, like, in a year or in that during that year. And we are a ways off from our fundraising still. So so, yeah, I mean, we have to follow those steps.

Yeah. I it it's it's and I think with the current administration that we have, I'm not so sure that new market tax credits is as viable or as plentiful as they used to be. But, again, I also appreciate all the work that you have done. And I think it'll be something extraordinary if you can put together this creative money, as I call it, and then basic philanthropy. So I commend you.

Thank you.

Do we look at details like loading dock and dumpster locations? Because you do that. This dumpster location is kinda prominent. And the loading dock is is right next to the windows of basically sleeping rooms.

Yeah.

And you'll be I am idling trucks and diesel Bideable. Yes. I And the backup signals. DPW also had con

that they don't think getting a a mind to that location is viable at all.

K.

We struggled with that during design. We knew we needed one just to kind of in our planning phase. So that was that was our first shot at it, to be real honest. So but seeing it, you know, with with Tim's comments and the report that we got were very helpful, and then just share it with Brie. We move on to kind of this next step now.

Yeah. Sure.

Yeah. So I brought the yeah. I brought it into the design review team so all the planners and public works could weigh in on zoning stuff. And there are issues. I don't think they're super designed and unrelated to really be discussed here. Okay. Fair enough. They're they're noted to help. I wanted to find a great area.

Thank you. Could I help?

Yep. And that's what you were referring to, right, when you said that they looked at it and they'd given input?

Yes.

You're talking about this team that he's talking about. Okay.

Very good. So then

Very good. Thanks.

We'll hold this. Have to call the chair, I guess. Right?

Bank place on file. Place on file. Okay. Maybe back for a year.

Good Good luck with the big sales. Alright. Thank you. Thank you. Place it up.

Do have a second?

Second.

All in favor, aye. Aye. Alright. Next item, item eight, file two five zero eight three zero, resolution granting permanent historic designation to the Charles Danielson Apartment building at 3131 West Wells Street in the 4th Automatic District.

Great. Thank you. So I know the resolution title calls it the Charles Danielson apartment. That was he was the name of the developer who who built it, and that was the name that we went with, when the application came in, upon doing, you know, staff research on the property. Its historic name is the Edenside Apartments.

So, if we could get a a motion at the end to, rename it the the Edenside Apartments, which was its historic name. But, we're looking at the Edenside Apartments of 1924 at 3131 West Wells Street, which is the corner of 32nd And Wells on the Southeast corner. It was designed by Rosman and Wierdsma, and it was designed in the colonial revival style. So just for context, the property is located right here. The Shuster Mansion is just to the west, and the Shuster Bloodgood Apartments, which were recently designated just west of that.

So it's in the Mid Mid Southwest portion of the Concordia neighborhood, which, you know, is a largely residential neighborhood that includes properties from 27th To 35th, Highland to to Wells Street. The district's boundaries have a diverse array of residences that represent development patterns from the pioneer period through the World War one streetcar suburbs. And then, of course, Concordia, the former con Concordia College campus is located right in the middle of the district and encompassing 43 acres. The district has largely determined by a broad range of residential forms owing to its the fact that the development pattern of the district spanned about seventy five years. So there are grand Queen Anne style residences, examples like this one of colonial revival.

There's German Renaissance revival, shingle arts and crafts style. The Edenside Apartments where where the apartment is located was once part of Sherburne s Merrill's estate. He was the manager of the Chicago, Milwaukee, and Saint Paul railroad and the Milwaukee Road. The land was originally subdivided as part of Dousman's Subdivision in 1848 at a time when only Spring Street, now Wisconsin Avenue, and Watertown Plank Road existed in the area. The the property was incorporated with into the city of Milwaukee's boundaries in, in 1888, and then the area was, resubmitted, to Assessment Subdivision Number 50, which is shown right here, and that was on 08/03/1898.

So the area was starting to develop. Parcels were starting to be sold and developed for residential. This is the 1894 Sanborn map showing that the Shuster Mansion is in place, and there are properties on the North Side Of Wells and one property located adjacent to the west, which was a grand Queen Anne residence that was torn down in the late nineteen nineties. And that parcel a portion of that property is now part of this land That lot was incorporated or a certified survey map to combine them in the nineteen nineties. By the 1910 Sanborn, you can see the area is starting to fill in a little bit more.

And in 1924, Charles Danielson received a permit to construct a six unit apartment that had a cost of $21,000. The permit indicated that the size of the building was 62 and a half feet wide by 35 feet deep and two and a half stories. The firm of Rosman and Wierdzma designed the apartment building, and it was a firm that Charles Danielson was familiar with and a firm that he had used on previous projects, including the Franklin Arms apartments, which we recently designated as part of the Grand Avenue Apartments. Also, the Jean Ann apartments, is located on North 23rd Street between Wisconsin and Michigan. And then he'd developed a cluster of cottages in Washington Heights on 53rd And 54th Street that the paper wrote about as being uniquely cited to take advantage of a common common yards between these six six residential cottages.

Those were all designed by Rossmann and Wierdsma and developed by Danielson. Here's a photo of Danielson and some of the properties that I just mentioned, the Franklin Arms in the middle, the Jean Ann Apartments on 23rd in the upper right, and then the the what the paper referred to as cottages developed in the Washington Heights neighborhood off of Lloyd. And the property the architects for the Edenside Apartments were Rosman and Weirdsma consisting of Minor Rosman and Oliver Weirdsma. They operated in partnership from 1919 through 1930. They were known for large period revival apartment buildings.

They also did commercial and residential commissions. The Roosevelt Arms apartment was another one that they did on Wisconsin Avenue, also the Knickerbocker Hotel. The firm, quote, played a significant role in the development of large period style apartment buildings, a type that reaches apogee in Milwaukee during the nineteen twenties. Other buildings that they designed include the under Underwriters Exchange Building on North Broadway right across from Zeidler, Knickerbocker

Hotel,

the Marquette Apartments. The firm disbanded at the onset of the Great Depression. Rosman would pass away by 1940, and Wierdzma relocated to Oconomowoc where he founded the Oliver Construction Company. These are some twenty twenty three images of the apartment designed in the colonial revival style, but it's a really minimal minimally applied colonial revival, mostly evident in in the divided light windows, the flat arches with the keystones above the of the first four windows, and then the treatments at the at the entrance with with the the columns and and balusters and and plasters located there. It's had minimal alterations over the years.

It's really primarily just evident in replacement siding on the dormers on the upper level. A few, I wanna say two or three window openings have been partially infilled, but the existing wood historic wood windows remain intact throughout. The remainder of the exterior had been in pretty fine condition. Here's an image from 1931 when the apartment was sold. It's a little difficult to tell, but an image from the late eighties, you know, obviously, it looks like the same building on the 2nd Floor.

Porch railing is a little bit different, and then the balustrade on the 3rd Level has been has been removed subsequent to this photo. The apartment did suffer a serious fire in July that took the life of a young girl. And so when staff visited, this is a 2025 image, the building had been boarded up, but there were there were contractors on-site going in and out. So it looks like they are they have permits. They are doing work to restore the building, but, it's my understanding that at some point, subsequent to the fire, the building had been unsecured and much of the piping had been stolen out of there.

So it had some flooding issues in the basement, is my understanding, but, there is work ongoing to, to restore the building. But staff's recommending approval, for the following criteria for f five. It's embodiment of a distinguishing characteristic of an architectural type or specimen. It's a it's modestly applied, but a great example of of the colonial revival style applied to a small scale apartment building. The style was popular from the late eighteen eighties through the nineteen twenties and is most often found on single and two family residences in in the city.

The Wisconsin architecture and history inventory identifies 431 single and two family colonial revival buildings in the city, but only 32 apartment buildings that are in the colonial revival style. So it wasn't it wasn't applied super often in in apartment buildings. But like the Eaton side, prestigious firms like Martin Tallgrin and Sons, Tallgrin and Hood, and Henry Coke designed apartment buildings in the colonial revival style. Also for f six, its identification is the work of an artist, architect, craftsman, or master builder. Those individual works have influenced the development of the city.

As mentioned, it was designed by Rosman and Wierzma who are known for their their revival style commissions. In looking at their their inventory in the Wisconsin architecture and history inventory, you see that they've designed apartments in the Mediterranean revival, Tudor revival, neoclassical, and art deco. This is the only, though, neoclassical colonial revival style of of building that they had done that is inventoried. That doesn't mean that there aren't others, but they just haven't been identified. And the firm has a numb number of buildings that are on the national register, including the Knickerbocker Hotel, Underwriters Exchange Building, and the j William Hatch House, which is part of the Grant Boulevard Historic District.

So staff is recommending approval based on those criteria.

Okay. Any discussion? I see we have our nominator here.

Hello. I'm Laura Sumosier, and I am the owner of the Schuster Mansion Bed and Breakfast. So I am a neighbor of this building. So a while back I'm sorry. I can't tell you the year when it happened, and all of a sudden, I am hearing chainsaws, and I look out, and the largest tree in our neighborhood is being cut down, which is on that tree. So, of course, I called my alderman, and we find out that mister Barata has bought the property without even closing on the building yet. He is already doing the reconstruction.

It's, like, fifteen years ago.

About fifteen. Yeah. So thank you to mister Alderman here. He shut everything down, and Barada could not continue until he and I had a personal conversation in my dining room. So we talked about what should happen, how things should happen, and such. I did not want the porch destroyed. I didn't want that pergola in the front. I did not want the rocks lined around when we're trying to keep it as a historical neighborhood. Well, as it turned out across this, it stopped. So he kept the windows.

He didn't do anything to the windows. He didn't do any he didn't do anything to the building, period. He just fixed the inside and brought the people in. But across the street, he bought those three apartments, and now we have jail like apartments because they're they're painted in the gray, and they got the big lights and such. So we have to deal with that. Here's my concern. I am the one who asked for the house next to me, the Bledgood home, to be historical because he was gonna tear that one down. So we're historical there. We're historical. I'm also the one who asked for the Wisconsin apartments to happen.

Those three have been saved. The arms one was was designated halfway through here. Already got the windows in. So then we have the fire. And in that fire, they've destroyed part of the porch to make sure that the fire had not extended into that situation. And, of course, that whole apartment has been destroyed. So now it's boarded up. Yes. I'm the one who called the police as I'm watching the guys crawl out of the basement window with all the pipes in their hands, and it did flood the basement four feet. I have not seen anybody go in and out as far as things being maintained.

Here's my concern. I'm afraid that if this not become a historical building, he is going to mark it as one of his jail, gray house, rip the porch out, and take out the the old windows and put in brand new ones. And where's our historical neighborhood going? It's not going anywhere. And I just feel like this is the only way that I, as a citizen, can say, please help us to try to keep this neighborhood to be more historical.

Well, the bottom line is staff has done an extensive review. They've recommended approval or recommended that we recommend designation to the council based on f five and f six of the criteria, and that factual analysis is what matters. So we do have to have a public hearing on this. So is there a motion to convene the public hearing? So moved. There's a second?

Second.

All in favor, say aye.

Aye.

Okay. This is a public hearing. We have one member of the public who's the nominator who's already testified. Anyone else in the room or online wishes to testify at the public hearing? Seeing and hearing no one, is there a motion to close the public hearing?

So moved.

There's a second. I'm sorry. Second. All in favor, aye. Aye. All right. The public hearing is closed. Any further discussion? Is there a motion?

Motion to approve the designation.

Okay. Motion to basically approve recommending to the council designation of 3131 West Wells Street.

And maybe also get a

Oh, and then and then there's a proposal to amend the staff report to provide the correct name, which is the Edenside. Side apartments. Ah. Edenside apartments. Okay. So hearing no objection to that. So order so it's amended. So there's a motion to basically approve the recommendation for designation based on the f five and f six criteria. Is there a second to that motion? Further discussion? I'll say aye. Aye. Alright. We're good. Question. Thank you. So

he's gonna get a letter or their office is gonna get a letter saying that you're historical, So you have to follow criteria?

Well, wait a minute. Not not not right away. That'll happen after this goes to the zoning committee.

Okay.

And presumably, zoning committee will make a recommendation to the full council. And then once that happens, assuming the mayor doesn't veto it, there's a certain number of days before which the designation can become effective. So we're talking sixty days.

There anything else I'm supposed to do?

No. Just wait?

I'd like to take action. Alright. So if we see him doing what I think he should not be doing, am I immediately calling you to say, what do you do with the windows? Can't take down the porch?

By the way, it seems like it has the criteria for what we just did today, which was approve a full nomination. You would have to you'd have to do that, then you'd have to solicit them for emergency designation.

Additionally, neighborhood services has only held those to prevent demolition, but they have allowed it to stop permits if it has

Let's assume somebody pulls them

this year. He's talking about county permit work. Yeah. Yes. It's unconfirmed and done.

I was gonna say home permitted work is a big I

That doesn't stop this stuff at this point.

I get that. Window taking all that. All that. You know, it's all out.

So that's the problem. That's your option. We're still there. We we don't have remedies every

So he could really just one day come knock down that porch?

Possibly. Emergency designation. But even when we do that, unless we call for a special meeting, which has been very rare over these many decades, then it's gotta wait a month till our next mission meeting. That's the drawback. Yeah. That's pretty

helpful on file and even part of that.

Yeah. You can hold demo permits, but he's not gonna right. He's not gonna apply for a demo permit. So there you have it. Let

me just understand. There is nobody living there because of the fire. Correct. And it's all boarded up. Correct. And everything's been taken out of the building.

Well, that was another issue too that I had to call the police because the people who lived in that apartment kept on wanting to get in and kept on bugging Baratta to let us in, and they weren't letting them in. And then these don't know who they were. Just there was these guys that came with these trailers, and they went in, and they took out all the stuff. And this one family had these exotic birds and took the exotic birds and cleaned it out. So when they finally said, oh, yeah. You can go in, everything was gone.

Out of these separate out of these individual apartment, how many units are there in this building?

I think there's six brought it in health health Six. Nobody to relocate. They did nothing. They gave them one hour the day of the fire to get everything out. They used our garage to hold their stuff. Because what are you gonna do in an hour? You get to get a there's just no way. So they're piling up their stuff, putting it in our garage until they could find their place. They had no place to

to go.

Aren't there lawsuits that are or aren't there some Yep. Aren't there some issues that are going on with with all of us, with the landlords that are other properties that have to do with

I think there's always

attorney.

City attorney always has open files, but I don't think there's any lawsuit pending. I see. I see.

They're going for a small claims court. I know one of them is doing that. But the other problem with it is is most of those people didn't speak English. So they didn't wanna talk to investigators. They didn't wanna talk to Red Cross. They were in a really and the I don't know. I know that the daughter, she died. Here's another really sad thing about the story. So as I watched him pull out the girl, I said,

she's dead. This is the

way she looked. And then they brought out the mother, and they're working on her and working on and working on her. Last I know, she's still in a coma. So this happens about 11:00 in the morning. And one of the main gals who spoke English, who's translating through all the other tenants, I had her come into my house and sit down and take a deep breath and say, you need to gather yourself. You're you're dealing with a lot today. And she said, I just got a phone call from the husband. Now this is, like, four hours later. She says, I see on TV that our apartment is is on fire. Is everyone okay? He didn't even know that his wife was in a coma and that his daughter had died four hours later.

Did he live there?

Yes. I mean, like, four hours later. I mean and then I had found out from the reporter that the daughter had died. And then when they hung up, I go, yeah. It's really sad the daughter died. And she's like, I didn't know that. I go, I'm glad I didn't tell you beforehand. Let the hospital tell him his daughter's gone. The whole thing was just a mess. Just just a mess.

Okay. Very good.

Alright. Thank you very much. I appreciate all your effort.

Okay. Next up is our ratification of the staff approved certificate of appropriateness from item nine, file two five zero eight one seven through item 24, item two five zero nine seven eight. Is there a motion to ratify the staff approved COAs? Move to approve. Is there a second? Second. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Very good. There's a request to place on file item 25, file two four one four zero five, resolution waived to the permanent historic designation of the Central City Plaza Building 3 at 1747 North 6th Street in the 6th Aldermanic District.

This file is no longer needed since we created an entire historic district. Is there a motion to place this item on file? So moved. Is there a second? All in favor say aye. Aye. I remove, okay. Review the minutes for the September 8 meeting. Is there a motion to approve the minutes? I'll move. Is there a second?

Second.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Very good. Aye. Approve the 2026 meeting schedule. K. I guess we're gonna do that. Right? Alright. Is there a motion to approve the meeting schedule for 2026? Hold on.

I'll second it.

K. All in favor, say aye. Aye. K. Updates and announcements. The only announcement is that, today, we did file a nomination for historic designation of the, Milwaukee Arena and the Miller Theater.

The Milwaukee Arena and

The Miller Theater, otherwise known as the auditorium. So we'll probably hear that next month. Correct?

Yep. Anything

else? Okay. Is there a motion to adjourn? Second. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Very well.