Zoning Hearing Board - Regular Meeting

Good evening. Turn on. Yep, it is. Welcome to the Milker Township Municipal Building and the monthly planning commission meeting. This time I call the meeting of the October 7th, 2025 to order. All please rise and join us in the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the stand indivisibley andice for all.

Thank you. If you haven't already signed the uh attendance sheet back there, please do before you leave. Thank you. Next, I would like to introduce the members of planning commission, our support staff. Starting on my far left, Ray Reed. Next to him is Dave Fate Caba. Oh, I'm sorry, Doug Prosan.

Over here, Pet Caba. Uh Tony Sitter and Denise Bizaro, the recording secretary. On my left in the back is Jennifer Hayas in the township council. And next to her is Matt Wallinger, the director of planning and development. And on the right back there, Julie Majio. She's the assistant zoning development officer. And Matt Puzz is the zoning development officer. I am Jewire. Before we begin, I'd be call for a motion to minutes last month's meeting as written. So move second. Discussion at all. All in favor?

Anyone opposed? Thank you very much. Milford Planning Comm Commission is a recommending bar that hears testimony, asks and answers questions, deliberates, and passes our recommendations on to the supervisor who make the final decisions on issues brought before us. The subdivision and or land development plan discussed tonight, if acted on by the planning commission, will be considered by the township supervisors at their regular meeting to be held on Tuesday, October 28th, 2025 at 4:30 p.m. in this building here. The first item on the agenda for tonight. There it is. Kind of screwed them up there. First item on the agenda for tonight is TJK K TKJ Associates LLC is a subdivision plan to show the creation of 4,17 square foot parcel A from 317 West 12 Street resulting in a 12,439 square foot residual lot. Parcel A has become an integral part of 1313 Harper Drive resulting in a 24 635 foot lot located southeast corner of West 12th Street and Harper Drive in that in track 14. Who is here to represent that? Sir, up here please and give us your name and address. Chad Jakes from TKJ and Associates home address or do you want our business address?

317 West 12th Street. So, you're breaking off a portion of that existing lot and adding it to a different one. Correct. Right. Correct. Okay. Anybody have any questions for us? Okay, thank you. Thank you. Anyone else care to say anything about this?

Okay. The next item on the agenda then is the enclave. It's a land development plan to show this construction of a six duplex dwellings with associated storm water management facilities and parking at 3531 West Lake Road located the southeast intersection of West Lake Road and Lynon Avenue and track number nine. Someone here for that sir. Uh, hi, my name is Jake Schlasher with David Lair Associates. U, the proposed building here we're going to do is six multif family units with the proposed uh, storm water and development. With that, the main reason we're not attaching and uh, exiting and entering off of Westlake Road is we don't want to create any more traffic on that road at a high rate of speed. So, we think it's safer to come in and out of Lynen Road where they'll be heading most likely north as well. Um, if you guys have any more questions, I could do my best to answer them or find an answer for you.

Questions? Curb cut that was on Westside Road. Is that correct? Yes, we'll be and putting in a sidewalk. Correct. You will be putting a sidewalk. Um, I I did not design the project, but from what I look like it it appears so. I can confirm that. I don't know if we're deferring it or not. Is there a sidewalk on the uh development to the east? There isn't to the east. Okay, then maybe we would probably be deferring it then. Yeah. And there is a bike path out front.

Your plans um indicate they don't indicate, but are your plans to have any buffer zone on the back of the properties that face Lynden and also will be visible from Westlake Road. Will there be a natural buffer zone as part of your plan or what's going to go in there?

Uh my recollection and again I didn't work on this project. slightly familiar is there's a buffer C zone and I believe that is on it would be the the south line running perpendicular to Lyndon where the entrance is understand that but what about a buffer zone between the back of the three buildings to the west and Lynon and Westlake Road is there going to be a buffer zone there uh it does not appear so as of now need understand you don't need one by code, but is there a plan to put one in is my question. I'm not positive on that. I'm not positive on that. No.

Anybody else have any questions for anyone else to speak on this? Come up here. Please give us your name and address. My name is Michelle Michael. My address is 827 Clifton. My question is, um, I know that more people were more familiar with why they can't have the entrance on Westlake Road, which is a more common road as opposed to putting an entrance on a residential street. I run on that street and 5:00 a.m. it's already dangerous enough for me. I'm out running and I have lights on. But now we're entering a area where we're going to put a second driveway with 18 buildings, people coming and going. They're probably not paying attention as they're coming out versus I don't run on Westlake Road for a reason. So, is there a possibility to make the entrance on Westlake Road where there's already a road? We don't need to add a driveway to make it unsafe for people who already live there. There's no sidewalk, so the kids are already out playing.

The traffic study that they did on that is telling us that there's going to be uh per day the whole day with that whole complex which is pretty minimal and it would seem to me they would be safer to eat. How many how many residences are going to be there? Uh there's going to be 12 buildings or I don't know the number of res. So 12 units. So if you have so six buildings 12 units if you have two driving adults coming and going every day you're telling me that's only 30. That's what the traffic is. I don't think that's correct. That's what it is. That's the average. Yes. For this type of development.

Fair enough. But last time we didn't want a road there. This time we still don't want a road there. This isn't This is coming way up in the front where there was an existing uh means of egress.

Are you following me? Yeah, I'll pick up right there, too. Um, Dustin Thornton, 825 Lyndon. I'm on the right on the very back corner of where the development would be. And I I didn't come in today wanting to be difficult. We don't want to fight this. We want to get to somewhere where everybody can be happy. That's that's the first thing I want to say. Um, as far as this Lynon Avenue entrance last year when this was discussed or last time. I mean they said that they had to have two forms of egress. That's why it was on Lynon Avenue. They had to have two forms. They had to have two forms. That was said over and over and over and over again by the developers. We've now I realized today when I thought about this how many subdivisions, how many culde-sacs do we have that have one form of egress? So I realize of course that's possible. Now, I see they also realize it's possible and they're putting it on Lindon. This is going to sound selfish, but let's be real. We don't want the traffic on our street. If it's more dangerous to pull out on Westlake, they're still facing the same danger if they pull out on Lynon. Lynon is a road that goes nowhere. They're either going to Westlake or they're going to 12th Street. West Lake's 35, Lyndon's 25, 12th Street's 40. You're facing danger no matter what. You have to just learn to pay attention. I've been living on Lyndon for 10 years. I've been spending time on Lyndon my entire life. And it's always been dangerous to leave Lyndon at either end. 12th Street West Lake does not matter. They're both really dangerous intersections. And adding traffic adds danger. It puts more pressure on the people waiting in line to go because they've got people lined up behind them. And I I realize what you said about the traffic study, but

extremely unrealistic. I would say in our household with two vehicles we come and go no less than 10 to 12 times a day and that's you know six times you know round trip. So if that study is accurate that's debatable but some people go way way more than what it says and some people of course less. That's where you get your average but it it's not realistic. It's not and I I mean I I like the changes we see. We don't see the the duplexes coming way up by our houses. They're not using the woods. So, we are making a step in the right direction. But we everyone here will adamantly fight this. We don't want that traffic on our street. That's all there is to it. And it's it's really not selfish. The neighborhood's been that way. It's always been that way. Entrances all the way down Westlake Road. Every business, everybody manages perfectly fine. And these residents can do the same. If we could just get that one thing resolved, then this would be easy. I also um on another note, I thought that duplexes originally in the current zoning weren't allowed. Am I mistaken? There was an amendment in 200 23. Yeah, sorry. 2023 and the duplexes were added to the MU1 district.

Okay. I think that's all I've got. Anyone else?

Hi everybody. Dominic Berlin. I live on 820 Lynden Avenue or Yeah. Um so I'm just going to third the whole driveway on uh Westlake Road. I think they could keep that current driveway on Lynen, but at least put a second one on Weslake Road, so not all the traffic needs to funnel onto Lynen. Even with your traffic study saying 30, we can take that into consideration. But what also is not getting taken into consideration is how many people use Lynen Avenue as a pass through from West Lake to 12. My kids ride their bikes on that road almost every day. And we're constantly having to yell car so they get out of the way. And we have so much through traffic coming through Lynen that if you're going to put all of the traffic on the Lynen from six more places using one driveway one that could cause congestion in that one driveway and it's just going to add a whole bunch more traffic on the Lynon Avenue. Also, this might sound terrible, but I'm going to ask it anyway. Are these going to be open to section 8?

Okay. I don't know how that works. I'm not a very smart person. So, if I heard this correctly, they're shooting for which is another reason why the traffic study was as low as it is because it's I don't know this for sure but I believe it's they're shooting for older people to live in there. Okay. Who are you calling older my age? Yeah. So I would just say if you could still put a second driveway on there so at least it gives them more options on how to get in and out of their own properties too. Thank you.

I don't think you've given them enough credit for closing off that West Lake Road. Um they're calling it the Enclave, which is going to turn out to be what it is. It'll be separate, kind of a private little neighborhood, but if you opened up Westlake Road, then you're going to have people driving through both. And I think it would increase the danger to your kids. So, you're saying you'd think Westlake Road traffic would divert through that? They have both of them. You suggested they have two entrances. Yes. I think that would be a disservice to you. I I'm sorry. I just don't understand.

Well, now there's West people from Westlake Road to get out.

Yeah. I just I don't think that would happen, but I could understand how it probably cut through. Oh, I'm a truck driver. I see everything on the road. I understand. Thank you. Sorry. Thank you. Thanks. Anyone else?

Uh John Michael, 827 Clifton Drive. Um I just want to agree with the last uh two, three people up here. I think that there needs to be an extra access onto Westlake Road. And Mr. Prozanne, I thoroughly disagree with people cutting through there. I I don't think that's going to happen too often, especially with a parking lot being there and cars being parked inside of the enclave. It's just not going to be a reason to go cut through there. You're not going to save any time. Uh, so that's really all I have to say is I just think there needs the the plan looks great other than I think there needs to be an extra entrance uh onto or off of Wesley. Hello, Sam Comfort 903 Lynon Avenue. Um, regardless of the entrance or exits, if you insist on having two, you know, if they want to use that Lynon Avenue exit, why don't you cut the curb to make them make a right turn only, funnel it back out towards West Lake Road. There's your two entrances. You still keep your entrance and exit coming off of West Lake Road itself because it should be used. It's there. And if the issue of safety turning in and out of Westlake Road is a problem, why don't install your rumble strips and your little blinky gold lights at least on West Lake Road? I know that doesn't do much, but it's still one more point of emphasis on folks to slow down as they're coming down West Lake Road. Regardless, as Dusty pointed out, it's a pain to turn out either way, but whoever is using Lynon or Clifton or any of those streets know that you have to do the inch look for a bajillion times before you can make that turn. So, I guess to echo everything that's already been said, if you insist on having the two entrance points andor exit points, make the exit on Lyndon that's technically there, that little driveway, a right turn only to funnel you back towards West Lake. And then your entrance and exit cut is on Westlake Road. Thank you.

I just want to say something really quick. I know Sam didn't see a point. They don't want West Lake Road. If you want to be safe, put a sign for them right and everybody else in the world is going to be honest. I do it all the time where it says no right the property if I read it correctly. It's just to eress the property. I'm saying just to have that only ones and then you talked about having two people would cut through there and more traffic on London. That's incorrect. If that happened, those would be people that were already using Lyndon as a short benefit. We're all happy. They're happy.

Anyone else? uh our only a traffic study that you guys have and our belief is the traffic will not be increased because of the original building was a restaurant if I'm correct. So typically restaurants attract more more traffic more daily trips than a residence does. And the initial our initial plan, we had the drive heading south with a second drive on Lynden. That was because we had to skinny up the drive and put residences on both sides. With us making this drive bigger where it is proposed now, you're able to have one egress and ingress. So, um I I just want to echo the the safety concerns that we would have if you have two egress and ingress of Westlake Road right next to each other. It would be 100 150 feet between Lynen Avenue and then the one that other ones are proposing if that makes sense. So

above all 30 trips a day, right? Correct. Correct. And typically the daily trip the daily trips that are calculated by the IT are like they're factored of safety typically. I think your pre your previous point about what was there before the amount of traffic that created this and and the traffic before was in West Lake and all and the traffic won't be as consistent either. It'll be spaced out more, I would believe. Thank you.

Anyone else? Just really quick too. Why would you put your entrance on a tiny old street houses? Make it look nice. We said we can go back and for upper class as we keep being told where you want to pull it on road down the with all the flowers. We love it. We're all happy there.

And the same thing on the whole neighborhood, small nice building. traffic. Thank you. Thank you. So, are we saying

like it's 30 total trips per day for all of these units? That's the study that that's the study not just for this thing here, but that's the average overall that they've done traffic per not even per person. We're talking for all of all of this for the developers. Correct. Okay. So, if it is that minimal of a number, why can't we put this on Westlake Road only? The developers want to do it this way. I I The developers want to do it that way. I agree. Like I know what they want to do. You have to remember they were originally going up on this area here and making another eress on Lyn and that's all shut off.

We're not talking about that anymore though. We're talking about this. Correct. Talking about this now. Yes. So you're going to have that minimal amount of cars coming out on.

Well, you just everyone we keep saying minimal. If it is that minimal, why can't we just put it on Westlake Road? Not a Just hang on. Put on Westlake Road. Then we don't have to worry about any extra traffic on Lyndon. At least not a lot. Not not much. And there is already a curb cut and an entrance for the old uh aviation club and the restaurant it was thereafter. If it is that minimal at 33 cars, I really don't think it's going to affect that much traffic in that area of West Lake Road. That's just my personal opinion. I would just point out aesthetically it would the entrance on Lyndon would be superior to the entrance on

not if you just said not if you just said whatever Dustin just said as far as you could you could put like a nice uh marble sign out front or something, put some lights on it, hang some plants from it. You can make it look really nice. Lake Road. Yeah, we don't. Yeah. What's wrong with the Westlake Road? 33. 33 cars. You've said it many times. That doesn't seem like that many cars. I'm talking about the traffic on Westlake Road. We're interrupting the traffic on Westlake Road 33 times a day.

Yeah. I don't just clarify about this. Lake pull up there except one simple answer to the problem is waiting. lights when the traffic's all coming through as you can't get out. There's no prevent Our traffic and we all want our houses.

And they would have the same access. Okay.

I was going to say these people I I want to ask you a question. If you bought if you bought one of these units on the on the north end, would you rather have your backyard with a road in it or would you rather have it sealed off so it's private? I don't understand that question at all. If I lived in that community, yeah, on the north end, I would want to be proud to arrive at the entrance of my community. I want them to come to a nice community. tiny little

traffic is not real. Last year, last time the argument was they were saving they wanted to preserve the old trees. All of the trees they cut down were the old trees and that's all they did was cut down the trees. They left all the piles in the woods. They mow a strip by the road. They don't

answer my question. If you lived in one of those north units, would you rather have an enclave with trees and a buffer to Westlake Road or would you rather have a road entrance coming right past your house?

Mr. Chairman, Mr. Chairman, yeah, Mr. Chairman, I would call the question to end make a motion that we end debate because I think we're just talking past each other now. Come on. Come on up. Were you coming up here? The the converse of that question, Heidi Bender, 817 Lyndon. The converse of that question obviously is if you had small children playing on 817 Lyndon, would you rather add I know you're saying 30 some cars. I think it would be higher than that. Would you rather have an extra 30 some cars on Lyndon or would you rather have them on Westlake Road?

But the cars have already been there through the two restaurants that have been there. You have the same amount of traffic there, right? But there's an opportunity right now to add a level of protection for the children. There's an opportunity to do things different. And besides the restaurants did have the two entrances, we know ingress off of West Lake Road and egress off of Lynon, right? Probably had more traffic during the peak hours at coming on to Lynon, which you will not. Now, this is a this is also going to enhance your neighborhood. These are nice, wellbuilt condominiums going in here, town houses, and I think it would enhance this whole neighborhood.

Oh, I have no doubt that they're are going to be well built and I have no doubt that they will look nice. I have no doubt about that at all. But if there's a way to accomplish both the enclave and protect the neighborhood accomplishes is who they're trying to attract. They're trying to attract the 55 and older and keep the traffic minimum here. It's actually a good thing. It it's it could be worse. It could be worse. I agree. It could be worse, but it could be better. They're building this to accommodate a certain uh elderly population which benefits the traffic which is the big problem there which which is is not going to be a problem because it's not going to be any greater than it was

but also it could be better there could there's an opportunity right now to take a step to move that minimal amount of traffic onto Westlake Road. So while you say you know could be worse true I'm not arguing that point but also could be better because What I'm thinking of is, you know, my nieces four, nephews, six and eight, and I worry about them playing on the street. So, and I worry about added traffic because already right now we have cars whizzing up and down Lyndon since they did the airport extension. It's even worse. Hi, Janette Dugan, 825 Lynon Avenue. Um, you say 55 is elderly. I'm 43. That's 12 years from now. At 43, I work two jobs. At 43, I leave to go to job one. I come home. I go to job two. I come home. I leave. I go to the grocery store. I don't want to make dinner. I leave. I go get food. Oh, I came home from the grocery store. I came home from getting food. That's nine trips in one day. That's not That's one person. Then I have him leaving two to three times a day. 30 times. That's not I understand what your survey says. That's not That's not updated. That's There's no way. It's only going to be 30 trips with 24 people, 12 buildings times two people is 24 plus 55 and older. Does that Are we excluding children? Is it just adults? They're not having children in these buildings. Okay. Well, let's say they do have children in these buildings. I can tell you where the bus stop is for middle school and for elementary school. And I can also tell you that you're going to want to drive your child to the bus stop, especially in the winter time. My daughter is 11 right now. She's allowed to walk to the bus stop, which is three blocks away. In wintertime, she's not walking because it's going to be too cold. That's two more trips. Me to drop her off and drive back home. Me to pick her up and drive back home. Oh,

that's four. For elementary, it's on 10th in Lynen. They're still going to want to drive their little children up there unless they're driving them all the way to the school. What is the address of this property? Address? Yeah. Uh 3531 West Lake Road,

right? 3531 West Lake Road. So that's where the entrance should be is on Westlake Road. Also, last year when we had this conversation, there was I wouldn't say agreements, but openness to the entrance being on Westlake Road. She knew we wanted the entrance on Westlake Road. Still did this with the entrance on Lyndon. There is two, I hate to bring up the past, nothing but lies. We're going to keep the landscape. We're not going to tear down. 90% of those woods are gone. 90%. And I can tell you that 90% of those animals are in my yard. I have seen way more skunks, way more snakes, five million more spiders, deer. There's a deer right in my backyard the other day. And we've always had deer, coyotes. Like, they have gone up since the woods have gone down. um in 2017 and we keep talking about the restaurant, the restaurant, the restaurant that closed in 2017. So, we haven't had restaurant traffic in eight years. So, I don't really know what the restaurant traffic has to do with now, but now we're more worried about what's going on on Lynden. And I don't really think it's a big ask for the entrance that the restaurants used on Westlake Road to be on Westlake Road. That's all I really have.

Can I ask you a question? Would you prefer the restaurant to be there for this development? The restaurant 100,000%.

You have to come up here. John Boikio, 818 Clifton Drive. Um, we keep talking about the restaurant and the traffic. Um, one thing that we have to factor in is when you dumped all the traffic from the airport runway project down Clifton and down Lyndon, uh, when it was supposed to go down Marshall and then you blocked Marshall off. So you are talking about oh the restaurant traffic. My issue is soon as that runway went in the traffic picked up. Cars fly up and down our road all day long. I can't even sit on my front porch and have my computer and listen to anything because it's so loud and there's so many cars flying up and down the road. Um so to you an extra 30 cars doesn't seem like a lot, but when you dumped hundreds of cars down our street with that project, yeah, it's a lot. it adds more. Um, so that's my first point. My second point, um, how how big is the retention? Do you have dimensions on that? Is this to scale? It is to scale. You can see it is to scale right here. So, it's going to be relatively large.

Okay. Um, does that is that water is there a pump in there? Is it moving or is it just stagnant water? Okay. Okay. Yeah. I mean that is a concern of mine um with you know how the retention pond is going to be handled um up towards the end of this traffic. I was wondering what's going to happen with the rest of the property. Um is that going to stay the way it is? Do you have any plans for that? Okay. Not an issue for this. We're just looking at this development right now.

Okay. Um, is there, you know, potential building going to happen there? I know it's zoned residential. Uh, do you have any intentions? We're not here to talk about that. Okay. Okay. I think that's a concern and I'm not sure what they're going to do, but if they subdivided that off, they can put one house back,

right? Okay. And uh so, you know, there are concerns with the retention pond. What's going to happen with that property? Um and also, like I said, you know, you keep saying I feel like you're minimalizing the 30 cars a day, add in the hundreds that you already put down our street, you know, and then that extra 30 on top of that. So, it's a problem. It It's ruined our residential neighborhood. It's made it a a you know, it's a freeway practically. So, thank you. You say something else. It was the same thing. We got

that was that was related to exactly what I I just wanted to bring that up is that the restaurant traffic was never a thing. There was, you know, the restaurants were private. The first one was private. Everybody came in one entrance and out the same entrance. And then the restaurant that was there for a little while that I hear did well, I never saw it. I never saw a car there. I didn't realize the restaurant was even open. More than 30 cars a day.

But they were, I think, doing what a lot of people did in the past. And they were not using that one-way entrance as a one-way entrance. They were just going out the same way they came in the same way many of us have probably done at McDonald's once in a while. If you go to pull out, you see a bunch of traffic. You see, it's easy to go out the entrance. You just go out the entrance. And I I know, like I said, I've been there my whole life. It's the traffic has gotten really bad. That point was just brought up. I I didn't consider that. Yeah. When they brought Marshall down through, they put a lot of traffic onto our street. That's cars that we have daily doing highway speeds down Lyndon and their fault.

No, no, it's not their fault. We're saying that Lynon is no safer than Westlake. it and it's adding unnecessary traffic to us. We just don't we don't need it. There's not a reason for it. And and as keeps being brought up, we're we're being misled over and over and over again. And it's it's always this is the reason, that's the reason, and then the reasons proven later to be completely untrue. The the big issue is trust. What's untrue that we've that we that we have to have two forms of egress in the first place? Not you guys. Not at all. I'm talking about the developers. I'm saying they they told us they had to have an entrance on Lynon last time. They made all these changes based on your input.

They they made some changes but but they also and as was just brought up with the the unplanned part of the project once once they're in once everything is done they can freely do basically whatever they want. This is this is our time to take a stand. What I said they could put one house there and all the extra one house that would then have to have a driveway right through my yard. I'm sure it's their it's their property. It could come off land. It it is their property and that's why they they can freely develop it to code, but we don't understand why.

I can't discuss that today. We're just on this project today. I can't discuss what possibly might happen in the future here and attach it to this property. We're just looking And I think we've covered the traffic. So if anybody has anything else to go through other than traffic, we've heard the concerns of everybody here on traffic. And we also have our studies that we have to consider. And so we've kind of exhausted that, but if anybody has any other considerations other than traffic, we'd love to hear that.

Yeah. And that's I I think why traffic keeps coming up is because I I think I'm speaking for the group when I'm saying we don't feel heard. You guys are are saying that defending the traffic and it's there's nothing to defend. It's it should be a non-issue. You keep saying like it's it's what's better for those residents. When I said them earlier, I wasn't trying to be condescending. I'm saying them because they're not they're not here yet. They're not people. They're not us. They're not in the community at all. They're just I don't know who them. And that's that's the same thing. We knew what we signed up for when we bought our houses. That traffic issue they can consider before they buy. They're not here yet. They're still there. When they come, they can if the traffic is too scary, somebody else will face it. It's not that bad.

Go to the airport authority yet. I mean, that seems to be what you really complain about the traffic because of the airport. No, it's not the airport traffic. It's what the township did with the road going around the airport and then closing Marshall. They closed Marshall so that people wouldn't go all the way down and be going highway speeds through a residential neighborhood because they assumed dog legging to Clifton or Lyndon would slow them down. Sure, it slows them down, but they're still doing highway speeds. They're just doing it down our streets instead of those streets about

right, but that I didn't bring that up and that's not the issue. The issue is just put the traffic on Westlake Road. It's simple. It's not like it's not it seems to us that you guys feel like we're we're out of line for wanting that, but it's not

an issue. Everything everybody said, I think we've overtalked the traffic, but we're going to have our meeting and we're going to discuss all of this stuff and make our decisions based on what you have to say and based what we have in front of us. But if there's anything else that we need to that that we need to bring up, we should bring that up also. Anybody else has Yeah, fair enough. That's that's all I had to say. And I like I said, for everybody, I think traffic's the only real big concern. Talk about Yes, please.

Hi, I'm Nicole Fearsdorf. Um, I live at 817 Lynen Avenue. I just wanted to say thank you for listening to us, for our concerns, for making the adjustments you made. Like the plan looks so much better than I feel like it did last year. I I have to say that obviously the traffic is are I think oh you can hear it echoing that that is the issue. Um I do have young children on that street. I have a four-year-old um a six-year-old and an 8-year-old and so that is our main concern. But I did want to say thank you. I I don't feel like I feel like we all got off on the wrong foot last year. And I think that now this year that we can maybe try and come together and try and do this more as a team. And I think that if there's any way you could potentially alter your plan or even have not just the one entrance, maybe an additional, I understand that you're putting lots of money into this. I understand that you're have a vision. Um, and I think that if we work together, we could earn a level of respect and that we could all be happy. Um, so that's just what I wanted to come up here and say.

Have you considered running for supervisor? Okay. Anybody else with any new things?

All right. The I'm sorry. Please come up. This probably sounds very petty. I'm at 727 Lynen Avenue and um I just had an exterminator at my house yesterday who tells me my problem is coming from the trees that have been chopped down in that area. And there's carpenter ants and flying ants that look like termites and all that type of thing. So my question is, will that get cleaned up in the meantime? But they want these homes are going to be pretty expensive down here. They want to make their place look nice. They're not they want this to look nice, I I would think. And they're going to attract because of the price of them. They're going to attract a pretty nice client there. It would be it's going to be a plus for all of these houses. And they're they're not going to want that area, I'm guessing. to the south to be just a junkyard. They will, I would guess, clean it up and keep it nice. This is going to be a nice project down here. Did you notice how they kept all of the trees? I don't remember what kind of trees are those on Westlake Road. You guys kept those up?

No, no. The flowering the flowering green roden those beautiful roden. Hopefully, they'll leave them up, but they don't have to. They can do what they want with them. But they have the roadies there and they're trying to keep that nice and I'm sure that they're going to do I'm not sure. I would guess that they're gonna they want to make this nice too. But you have to realize this is in a transition point right now which is probably why you're having the animal and uh things going on. But they're going to I would guess clean this up and where this retention basin is will be nice around there. Well, there are trees next door to me that are diseased and falling over and ready to fall on my garage and they have not been removed and you can plainly see they're diseased and that's fine. You know, if they're diseased, they should be removed. But I just wondered what was going to happen with them.

Thank you. Okay, anyone else? You have anything more to say here? Come on up. Come on up. There's one thing I want to mention before you get up here. And with the traffic, especially during this season of Halloween, there's one person up on Lynon that has an incredible Halloween sculpture that slows all traffic down. I don't know who that is, but everybody should Everybody should take a second and go look at it. Keep that up all year long. That's another that traffic. Yeah,

maybe he'd be in violation or something if you did it all year. Okay.

Uh so the questions with the pond, um as the the lady there mentioned with the pond, it would actually there wouldn't be trees behind her or that brush that's kind of sitting there that's preventing or causing the infestation. And it's it's not a uh retention pond. it's going to infiltrate. So with the numbers, I believe at the 10year storm, it's going to be 0.06 cubic feet per second, which is it's very minimal for for for the amount of storm water that could be if we had it be a uh a pond that stores water. So we we ran our test uh probably probably four or five months ago and it infiltrated well, which helped us. So it will look it'll look like an empty pond for 95% of of the time.

So you don't have to worry about mosquitoes or any of that because it infiltrates so fast. Correct. Correct. Because we made our surface area at the bottom enough to handle that water. Correct. Yeah. Yep. Okay. Anyone else? Sir Mark Miller 728 Lyndon. Um, I was just curious, uh, what they're going to do with the gas well that's on that property. That's basically right behind my aunt on 727. There's a gas well back there. I don't know if we have info on that. That again, that's not part mark. That isn't part of this plan.

Oh, that's not part Okay. I don't think so. That's really not relevant to I just saw it was by the retention. That's why I was asking. Is it an active well? I don't know. There's a there's a box over top of it. I don't know what could that could that have actually been a water well that's left over from the old days. I think I've seen it back there. It might be actually just a pump well. Is that what it Okay. I don't know because there's a box. There's no metal pipe. I'm guessing Okay. I don't know. But I think that might have been an old water. I was just curious because it's by that retention.

One of the older homes in the area that you guys live in was out in the country. place on Chelsea that has a well existing Okay. Okay. But I don't think that's a gas. But it it will have to be uh addressed especially if it's near the retention. Okay. Okay. Okay. That's all. Thanks. Thanks Mark.

Anyone else? Okay. That is the only two items that were on the agenda for tonight. We will take a few minutes here and then we will discuss these two items and uh give our make uh notes for the minutes of our recommendations to supervisors for their their meeting at the end of the month. Don't forget to drive past the spooky hauler by aren't you getting paid for this man? Yeah, you got to look at it. It's spectacular. Hey, next time don't give them 20 bucks before and take it a picture.

I will do that. Are you ready? I have a comment.

All right. Oops.

I don't think so. All right. uh T TKJ Associates Associates subdivision plan to show the creation of a 4,17 square foot parcel A from 33 uh 317 West 12th Street resulting in the 12,439 square foot residual lot parcel A become part of part of 1313 Harper Drive resulting in a 24,635 square lot located souththeast corner of West 12th and Hartford Drive and track 14. I hear a motion motion to approve.

Second. Any further discussion on this at all? All in favor? I opposed.

Thank you very much. All right. Then the Enclave land development plan show the construction of six duplex dwellings with associated Water management facilities and parking at 3531 West Lake Road located southeast intersection West Lake Road and Lynon Avenue track number nine. I hear a motion. I'll second. Second on the motion.

The motion again to approve. To approve. Any further discussion,

Mr. Chairman? Yeah, I I I had a few things to say. Um I think our job really is listening. Um I'm not always sure this dialogue in the way that happens is the best, but it's sometimes what happens and maybe it needs to. Um, to the neighbors, I would say this. You're not selfish. You're being advocates. That's the American way. You present your thoughts. Uh, developers present their thoughts. Um, it's our job to kind of try to see both sides based on current zoning and and and development planning for the whole township. When I look at this plan, I I think of some of my own life experience. So, I grew up on Love Road, if you know where Love Road is, by Laurel Hill Cemetery. When my parents built there in 1960, my mother said to my father, "What the heck did you do taking me out to the country?" Um, I saw 200 houses built there with two ways uh in and out. Uh, so it changed the dynamics, but it also helped bring people to Mil Creek to pay taxes, to be make a community. So I think a lot of this is a back and forth. Not one side's right, one sides wrong. We're trying to find a balance here. Um, when I look at this plan and I look on Lyndon, if those were single family house lots, you probably could get four, maybe five right on Lyndon where people would be backing out maybe onto the street, which would not be an ideal thing. Uh, if this target of uh empty neester is 55 plus, uh, half of these places might be empty half the year because people will be in Florida or Arizona or other places.

So, will there be more traffic? Yes. I can see from your perspective wanting things to be on Westlake. Uh, for me, as I process both sides, um, seeing the need of the township looking at that neighborhood, um, I fall down on the side that the first plan, and I give give credit for this, you spoke out. um I didn't think it was a great plan and I give credit to the developers who said in trying instead of trying to push it forward, let's go back to the drawing board. So maybe not ideal for anybody which you could either say is everyone loses or maybe everyone wins a little bit. Um but keep advocating. Again, we recommend go to the supervisors, speak to them, which is your right and it's what makes our country great when we can actually talk to each other. So, u my vote will be affirmative, but I I respect those developing. I respect those who are advocating for your neighborhood, and that's the way the process is, and we're better for it when we can do it well. Okay, we have a motion on the floor and a second recommendation to the supervisors. Any further discussion?

All in favor? I anyone opposed? Thank you. Before we That's all the items we have on we don't have any new business or any business discuss. Uh keep in mind folks that the November meeting will be on the 11th or second Tuesday of November rather than first because of elections. Uh gives everybody here a chance to get out and vote please. Thank you. I will entertain a motion to adjourn. Second. Anyone stand?