Town Council - Regular Meeting

Motion recess executive session reconvene in open session. Second. All in favor? I. Motion to extend the Newport Vineyard and Winery LLC lease through and including the 7th day of May, 2036 and authorize the town administrator to execute the documents. Second. All in favor? I. I. Motion to approve the NC2025-0194 tax appeal settlement and authorize the town solicitor and tax assessor to execute all documents. Second. All in favor? I. Motion to seal the executive session minutes pursuant to section 42467 of Rhode Island general law. Second. All in favor? I.

Okay, let's move on to um the planning board interviews. We are interviewing one new candidate. Um so number two, planning board interview of Matthew Scarzinski. Motion begin said planning board interview. Second. All in favor? I Okay. Hey, Matt. Hi. How you doing? How you doing? Thank you guys for having me up here. It's an honor. Good to have you. So, we're going to ask you eight questions. I think you have the you've had the questions, right, sir? To be able to prepare. So, um Okay, very good. So, Matt, the first question is um why do you want to be on the planning board? So, I think my view do I have a time limit for this or is it just like in general? Answer the question.

We'll let you know. Sorry. It's not going to be it's not going to be 30 minutes. So I'm just making sure for the for the sanity of everyone sitting behind me. We want to keep our sanity. But yeah, sir, keep them very pointed and direct. You don't have to go on and on.

Okay. Um, so the reason why I want to be on the planning board is, you know, the same reason I want to help this town. I think the planning board has an immense opportunity to help people from a high level that directs our resources to the correct people and allows us to go in and to create a strategic plan much like many of the commissions that I've been learning so much about lately um to create a vision for the next 5 years, the next 10 years for Middletown while helping every generation all while maintaining the character. I know that's a difficult thing to say, but I think we can do all of it if we have a diverse set of opinions on the planning board, which is going to help our town, which I grew up in, which enabled me to have a great education, which enabled me to have this be beautiful scenecape to to be here today. So, that's why I want to be on the planning board.

Excellent. Thank you. Uh, number two is uh what experience do you have that would qualify you to be a plan board, a member of the plan board? So I think I've mentioned this aboard before but my background is in mechanical engineering. I have a masters in engineering management and as of this summer I will be completing my masters of business business administration my MBA all from UMass Law. I have served as club leadership president for multiple clubs at my school. I have a strong drive to see measurable results and I think a technical skilled individual on a planning board towards zoning regulation and towards our future climate crisis and cost and affordability crisis is um something I can bring to the table um and I feel that I am qualified for.

Okay. Thank you, Mayor. What useful knowledge or perspective from your own personal experience would you bring to the position? So, I have a keen perspective um and a lucky relative. My uncle Scott is actually the um planning board director or the town director, the city planner for the city of Burlington up in Vermont. Um you know, ironically, a city smaller than the entire island's population, but we have very nice talks every once in a while and we talk about what things can we do on a local measure. And he mentions the planning board a lot like they have a huge influence despite being a volunteer board that is elected by you guys. I think it's an incredible opportunity for our built environment that we spend 99.9% of our time in that determines our mental health, our physical health, our mental our financial health, our um you know social well-being all in one town. You know, unless you're a hiker, you're spending 99.9% of your time in a built environment. Why don't we build a better environment for the people of this town? And I think I can bring my vast engineering knowledge and a strong town's approach to um show true measurement.

Okay. What do you think is the most important responsibility of a planning board member?

I think the most important responsibility as a planning board member is the answer you might not expect. It's integrity. And I think in a world where today we are so divided, I think speaking to everyone and listening to all opinions is incredibly important and maintaining integrity is the most important of all those. While being open to new ideas, I think those ideas should bring character and make sure Middletown is being fought for by the v genuine steward as a member of that planning board, which obviously I want to live in this town for a while. And I think I can make a genuine impact um through the responsibility of that board. And I also think that creating a better tomorrow means working with all members not just in silos of the boards but coming together much like um the comprehensive commission for the um the 2035 commission came together and created a a beautiful plan which I had the opportunity to read through.

Okay. What would you like Middletown to look like 5 years from now?

See that's a great question. Um, personally, um, my view of the town is a more walkable, human- centric, vibrant town that respects our natural resources and can work to create a built environment for all generations that is not subject to simply pushing people out of this town because it's not just my generation. It is our elderly folks. It is my parents who are trying to downsize. It is so many individuals I talk to on a daily basis who are struggling with that affordability crisis which really comes down to our housing in our the way our city in towns are built. And I think I can bring a really good perspective that you know I mentioned I read the the comprehensive draft plan that Melissa and the group plan put together and in there mentioned what I'm talking about here. So, we have a framework, right? None of the things I'm saying here should come as a surprise. We have a framework for the future of our town. It is simply taking those ideas and implementing them into actionable results. And that is what I want to do in the next 5 years because I think on the local level, we have a huge say on what can be the future of our town.

Okay. What do you believe is Middletown's most important land use issue and how should it be addressed? I think Middletown's most important land use issue by far is how we do zoning. And I say that coming on to the planning board and not the zoning board because the planning board sets precedent in my mind especially with new state law changes which enables the planning board to have oversight of the like how we do zoning, minimum lot sizes, things like um how we think of building for people and zoning and um we we have multiple abandoned properties that have been sitting vacant in this town. Think of Benny's 2019. That's been vacant since then. Think of the plot next to IHOP before my time, but my dad's girlfriend used to work the Burger King there, right? That's been vacant for how long? 30 seconds.

McDonald's, was it? Yes. Boom. Thank you. See, don't get it right. Oh, I appreciate it, sir. No, no, it's See, I didn't know. I but um and also the place next to Burger King, which I think, correct me if I'm wrong, used to be a Ruby Tuesdays, right? That's been that's been abandoned for 15 years, right?

If the character of Middletown is blight and abandoned buildings, I don't think we're thinking right. Right. Why have developers not developed in those locations? There's clearly a reason. zoning. There's no incentive for them to build in those places and there's not going to be unless we change things. So, taking a forwardthinking approach, which kind of leads me into the next question. Um, I'll let you ask it first. So, thank thank you so much. No, I appreciate I want to make Wendy's job a lot easier.

Matt, what what ideas or suggestions you have regarding economic development economic development in Middletown? Do you want me to spend the next four hours on this? Give the cliff notes. Okay. So,

along with the open ideas of listening to the people behind me and the many ideas that come forth through the commissions which are incredibly important and I've realized with being on the conservation commission that it is an incredibly important commission and along with everyone else. However, I've drafted a few preliminary ideas that I wanted to touch base on quickly. So a discontin discontinuous thinking mindset is something in management information systems that is to step back and think what processes structures and business models are working and what's not. Why are we doing things a certain way if at all? And I say that because we've been doing things the same way since the end of World War II. And it's committed a lot of different results like car centric infrastructure for people who can't walk. It's a struggle. Or people who can't drive. And it's also created a lot of social problems, but I'm not going to get into that. What I'm here to suggest is a bottomup forwardthinking idea of how we can make Middletown a better place. some ideas talking about parking minimums and why they exist, minimum housing lot sizes, maximum coverage percent of said lots, setbacks of all types, and the personification of why single family zoning is the only alone allowed by right. So, we aren't building skyscrapers. It's not the goal. But to create what's in the Middletown comprehensive update plan at least in certain zones like the Atlantic be district or the one across from Potsy Field could be a movement and that could create a lot of opportunities not just in housing people but the ones that are never looked at like the financial responsibility of this town. I think the town has been struggling. I think they're doing a good job but down the line like you sir have mentioned that down the line we don't know what's going to happen. We don't know where the finances are going to go or where

money's going to pop up or if a fire truck breaks, right? We need $500,000 to buy a new one. Like, oops, a million. Sorry. These days, inflation's only going to continue. And with all the stuff going on at the federal level and cuts getting come back, we need a tax base that's going to provide for this town no matter what. And this regulation, we're holding ourselves back. we're holding ourselves back not only from making people's lives better, but from also creating a better and more balanced place. So, those are just some of the ideas I have. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. And we saved the toughest one for last. Oh, gez.

Regular planner board meetings typically take place in the second Wednesday of each month starting at 6 p.m. And special meetings are called on as needed um as on as on as a needed basis. Are you able to attend them? Yes, sir. Okay, that's it. Thank you very much. I thank the board for their time. Thank you. Thank you. Well done, man. Good job. Okay, let's move on to boards and committees. Um, so number three, appointment one member to the economic development advisory committee. Uh, term expiring January 2031.

Motion to reappoint Tom Qualch to the Economic Development Advisory Committee. term expiring January of 2031. Second. All in favor? I I Okay, we're going to move on to the planner board um appointments. Does Does the Does the council want any time to digest Matt's answers or are we good to go? Good. Good to go. You okay? Yep. Okay. Okay. Number four, appointment of two members of the planning board. Terms expiring February 2029. I make a motion to appoint Matthews Gerzenski and Arthur S. Weber Jr.

Okay. Uh, are there any other nominations? Uh, Peter, I like to make a motion for Mike Fenton. Okay, Dennis. I'd like to make a motion for Leon Amarant. Okay. All right. Any other nominations? They're all They're all out there. Okay. So, we're going to vote like we normally have been voting. Is that how you want to do it? and you'll you'll tally him hopefully quicker than last time. Okay. Then you can come down and assist me. Okay. Council Conton. Uh my votes for Michael Fenton and Matthew Skazetski. Okay. Dennis

running is for Leon Amarant and Michael Serinski. Okay. Tom Matthew and Artweber. Okay. Myself is Matthew and Art Weber. Barbara, Matthew and Artw Weber. Okay. Chris, Matthew and Leon. Okay. And Charlie? Uh, Leonitis Samurat and Matthew Skerzinski. Okay.

I have Matt and then I have a tie. That's what I have too. Okay. So, between Michael Fenton and I'm sorry Leon and Leon and All right. Do either of those have four votes or are they three? Both three. So, both. So, you need a major under the rules. You need four. So, it's not a tie. You just don't have enough to be nominated. Yep. Now, we do vote again. So, we have to revote for those two, right, Peter? So, Matthews, Matthews in. And now you have to vote again for Now we have to vote again for Okay. Uh, I vote for Art Weber. Okay, Dennis. I'm voting for Leon.

Okay. Art Weber. Vote for Art. Art. Vote for Leon. Okay. Leon. Okay. Art has four. Okay. So, we have Matt N. Good luck. Okay. Appointment of one member number five. Appointment of one member to the Tax Exploration Committee indefinite term. Motion to appoint Mark S. Weber to the tax exploration committee for an indefinite term. Second. All in favor? I. I. Okay. School construction. Do we have to wait till 6:30 for this? Yes. Advertised that way. Yes. Yes.

Okay. So, by regulation, we have to wait 4 minutes uh cuz that's how it's advertised or else we'll be in violation of the open meetings laws. So, we have four minutes to wait. Okay. Want to take a quick recess? Motion recess. Second. All in favor? I. Okay.

Gracie, were you all set? Wendy, you good? I'm good. Motion to reconvene. Second. A motion to second to reconvene. All in favor? I. Okay. School construction number six, communication of Justin Bernard, Middletown Public Schools. Recommendation approval of amendment for prime consulting materials testing and special inspections for $145,870. Motion to receive said communication. Second. Have a motion to second to receive. All in favor? I. Justin.

Good evening. Thank you. Um like I said, I am recommending an amendment to Prime Consulting's um uh purchase order in the amount of $145,870. Uh the reason being is when originally we went out to RFP for materials testing and special inspecting the firms, it was based on an assumed amount of inspections um which varies greatly depending on logistics schedule and um you know construction manager sequencing. So now that we're in construction, we know how many tests that we've done. we understand about how many tests that we need to, you know, to complete the project. Um, I requested a an amendment um from Prime, reviewed it multiple times back and forth with Prime until it was settled on uh the 145,870 that I'm putting forth uh in front of you today.

Okay. So, I don't know a lot about building a school besides it needs to be on time and on budget. And when we start taking a little left or a right, I get a little excited. I'm sure we all do, but I'm sure things happen. So, help me understand this that So, so we didn't know, this isn't the first project done, right? So, we didn't know that we'd have to do this amount of testing. It varies um a lot between from project to project. Uh, which is why I carried $300,000 in the budget for testing even though the original um purchase order was for just over $175,000. Right. I saw that. And this puts us over by about $21,000.

Yep. And we're not even How do you plan to make that up? We're going to use uh savings from the um hazardous materials uh proposed savings, potential savings.

Thank you very much. Any councils have any other questions? Let's move to the resolution which is resolution of the council in reference to it's number eight I'm sorry number seven resolution of the council in reference to approval to a award change order number one in the amount of $145,870 for additional material testing materials testing and special inspection services to Prime Consulting Incorporated funding for the change orders from the school improvement bond proceeds and all expenses is recorded in the school department's capital projects fund and the town administrator is authorized hereby to execute this change order on behalf of the town of Middletown.

Motion to pass said resolution second. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All in favor? I. Anybody oppose? Number eight, communication of Justin Bernard, reference to Middletown Public Schools recommendation for approval of supplemental services HMFH Architects for $530,75. Motion to receive said communication. Second. All in favor? I. I. Justin.

All right. Thanks again. Um so this recommendation is for the design work um for renovations at the Forest Nav Elementary School. Uh originally the HMFH's contract was for the design of the new middle high school and design of Valley Elementary School. Um, in working with uh the folks at the town, we've determined that we would like to try to get Forest Avenue um basically uh renovated so that we have three like new schools um for the district starting in 2028. Um, and what this allows HMFH to do would be to design, um, improvements, you know, to the, uh, ADA, uh, accessibility, um, renovate all the restrooms, um, design new windows, um, design a new mechanical upgrades, put a new sprinkler system in the building, which, uh, currently, um, it'll be it would be the only school in the district to not have, um a fire sprinklers service. Um replacement of the flooring with moisture mitigation uh you know to solve some of the moisture issues that the uh the building currently has. Um and replace the uh existing non-compliant um limited use limited access um elevator with a code compliant elevator. Um and lastly, lastly, everybody's favorite, um it also, you know, they'll design the new monument sign, which they've done for the two other schools. Um so just a little history um we've HMFH and Collier have been working on this for about a month now going back and forth

just to solidify the scope um and bringing the uh the costs to what collers feel is a reasonable amount for the ones that they are um going to perform. Um, and with that, I am, you know, recommending that an amendment uh for supplemental services in the amount of $530,75 um be approved. Okay. Uh Sean, where does this funding come from? So, right now, we'll be using uh I believe the resolution, let me just I don't want to misspeak.

It's from the school improvement bond proceeds. I just want to make sure this is explained uh you know. Nope. Again, I just don't want to misspeak from the Understood. Thank you. And Justin, some of these just while Sean's uh getting that information. So 1994 there was an the addition was put on Forest Avenue. So those windows are being replaced potentially if the council votes in favor of that. And also there's original wood windows from 1957 in the older wing that'll be replaced. Do those do those have to be um like hurricane meet the hurricane proof windows code?

Not necessarily, but they will they will meet all you know applicable codes. Okay. I know we did a project or there was a proposed project for the $10 million bond back I don't know 10 years ago or whenever it was roughly in that time frame. We were going to replace the windows at the high school at the time. But what happened was um they came back and said, "Well, now the cost has changed because you have to meet they have to be hurricane proof windows." And the cost went from like a million dollars to like $3.5 million or something crazy. So that's why I asked I certainly don't want you I'm not saying you would,

but I just want to make sure that you know I'm sure we're going to meet the code, but something changed. we don't have to meet the code now or maybe we were just being you know I can't speak to what was I understand that um but there are different instances depending on uh the actual location um height of a building elevation of a building type of um type of windows whether it's curtain wall um or just windows which will determine whether or not you know a window needs to be hurricane um hurricane rated and the design team will um ensure that all codes are met when they do this design.

Yeah. Okay. Just curious cuz that that always bothered me and stuck in my mind. I'm like nobody's going to be in the building in a hurricane. Hopefully. Well, it was a shelter so maybe they would. I don't know. Mr. President, that's probably it. Yeah. Yeah. Because of the shelter. Yeah. To protect the investment, too. Yeah. Well, yeah. I I get it. But, you know, you can replace them all again for that the price that it went up, Charlie. Oh, I thought you had your hand up. Oh, I do. Oh, okay. Okay. Thank you. You are, Charlie. Are you done? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right. Thank you, Mr. President. Tonight, I am Charlie. Yes. Um, so Justin, this to be clear though, this is a $530,000 change over just for architectural services. Correct.

So, do we have an estimate? like and I you know there's no one up here that I won't say no one up here but I I've been strong supporter of the school but I I feel like this is where sometimes we start creeping a little bit and we start diving into other schools which weren't approved with the bond. So what idea we have out of this $530,000 what's the project going to come out of that? How much is that going to be? Uh the budget is still very much in development. um estimating uh the full project to be somewhere around $6 million.

Yeah. See, I that's where I mean I have a a hard time with this myself personally. I support the construction of the school. I stood out and and fought for this thing like crazy. Stood right there. But I think we need to stay focused on the two schools we're improving and and and keep this if we're truly say on time on budget like we can't we can't have a creep into something else. We never know what that would turn out to be. Like I sat through meetings with the architects many times and opening up buildings, old buildings like this that 6 million could turn into 8 million really quick. So I personally am not going to support this. Thank you. Okay. Uh Tom,

so I'd just like to say if you've tracked the progress of the new middle high school and Valley Elementary to this point, you realize that we are doing very well. And the same people that Justin and the design team that have got us this far are the ones that have looked at Forest Avenue and had said based on the way that we're going, we are able to touch this school not with just some paint but to actually make a good improvement in the school and they have not overstretched us at all to this point. And I have no I have all the faith in the world that this will continue on the same path. the numbers, the how this project is trending is incredible and we're not going to derail it now. So, I realize that, you know, maybe all the numbers aren't out here yet. We don't have the construction costs. I mean, that's a ballpark, but where we sit funding wise and our contingencies that aren't even being touched here, this is the right move. And for all the money that we spend on Forest Avenue school here, that is reimburseable. So, this is the time. this is the time to do it.

Not only is it reimburseable, but under the same memorandum of agreement, um it'll be eligible for the 20 bonus points uh that we're going after after with the middle high school in Valley Elementary for a total of 55% reimbursement. Right. So, we're and and again, like I've been a very strong supporter of this, Justin. You know this too, right? But like I don't see a spreadsheet here that shows me where we're coming up with the $6 million. I I don't have that in front of me. So I I don't we have that much left over. $6 million that we can put in6 million $6.5 million.

We have that much money and we're still going to stay below, you know, we're not below the 190 still. So that's a very important part. We the voters voted for $190 million. Um, so I I don't have in front of me that shows that we have this $6 million sitting around in this budget. If we do, great. But again, we were focused on two schools. And I think this is where sometimes people get a little uneasy about this as well. Like, you know, let's you don't know something else could come up. We're not done with the schools yet. And I and I know it's trending. You guys are doing an amazing job. the school building committee. One of the reasons I stepped away because I couldn't devote the time that's going into that, right? It's you guys have done an incredible job. I'm not questioning that whatsoever. I just don't have in front of me where we're coming up with that $6 million right now.

Yeah. Funding I would have to defer to to the town on the funding. Sean,

uh so to your question, so the the project is recorded in the school department's capital projects fund. Uh so there there is the $190 million school improvement bond proceeds and as has been discussed there are contingencies that we haven't touched on either the high school or the uh renovation of the uh Valley Elementary School. So there's there's there's money there. Uh we also continue to earn bond interest that we continue apply for the project and we also have bond premium that that can be applied to the project. Uh when we sat down uh myself and Ed Collins and the team with Justin um we sort of put it worked around this idea that it's about a $6 million project and the goal has been so Forest Avenue has been part of the project discussion from the beginning. It's part of the memorandum that we signed with the Department of Education. Um, and I think it it has been uh the last piece to the puzzle in a sense because we've always hedged conservatively of having enough money available to finish the new building and the renovation of the Valley Elementary School. The projects that we've identified are to bring the Forest Avenue into code compliance. Um, so as as Justin talked about sort of making this uh actually I don't remember exactly what he said but but but our goal is to have a code compliant school at the end of the process. And again as far as the projects we're looking at it's renovating the bathrooms. There's six multi-use restrooms in the building. Replacing the windows. Uh we have issues with the current windows. Mechanical upgrades. Um and there specific units that we've identified. unit ventilator replacement ACs to data closet AC and deutification to the 1994 wing and learning center. Uh we don't have a sprinkler system in that building. Lower

level flooring that's replacement with the moisture mitigation. Uh the elevator, we have the uh the small elevator. We don't have a a code compliant elevator for students and teachers. That that is a a a real functional library for a school community. Uh ADA improvements and and that has a lot to do with doors um uh in parts of the building that aren't wide enough for students that require ADA access. And then finally, the the monument sign. Um I think we've had uh three or four meetings just looking at the budget. there is adequate money. Um if there isn't then we would peel back the scope of the work. Um there is some some opportunity to do that. Uh but to the point about reimbursement uh we would look at um we would be eligible for the reimbursement the 55% reimbursement like the rest of the project. And what's unique about this is because um it probably would mostly be paid for with interest in bond premium. What would happen is we would spend the money, the the $6 million. We would get the 55% reimbursement over a three-year period. It wouldn't be over a 20-year period. So, that would immediately come back to the town and provide relief uh to the amount of money that we borrow uh right away. It wouldn't be spread over that 20-year amortization period. Uh so, as far as bringing it forward, um I'm I'm extremely confident that this would not upset the budget. uh we're still working with that $190 million bond number um but also taking advantage of again bond interest and bond premium that came along with that borrowing um so we can get it done and I think it's important again uh when we when we first started the project and actually if you think about the last time we processed some change orders sort of on the larger side um we had taken money out of Valley

Elementary School in the budget and applied it to the middle high school pro uh new building because we wanted to make sure we had enough money to finish that part of the project. We did. So, the change orders you process or the changes in the budget that you process move money back into the Valley Elementary School renovation which which now is a real uh comprehensive uh renovation uh including uh furniture and playgrounds and it's going to be a really special place for you know second through fifth graders. What this will do is for our entry level students into the school district, it's going to provide a code compliant building. Um, you know, and and again, I think we we've always been working back to make sure we have money in the project. Um, again, you know, we made sure we could build the new building. We made sure we could do the renovations at Valley Elementary School. The last piece is to bring Forest Avenue into code compliance. um and really I think in the end deliver what the community wanted was a a comprehensive uplift of all of our educational facilities. Um so um we can certainly provide a schedule that that shows where we can get the $6 million if that's what we end up spending. Um you know that's certainly what the architectural plan is designed on. Um but I think we get there. Uh and even that $6 million number that it's it's a loose number. Uh that's been beaten up pretty well between the team uh the architects um as well as our project manager. So uh but again it's it is 55% reimbursement that will go away. These these these improvements which will be required at a future period if we miss this window would be only be eligible for 35% reimbursement. Uh and then I think just I think just to talk about how we would sequence this. Um

the goal, you know, the goal is to be in the middle middle high school for September of 2027. Um we'd be at Valley Elementary School in 2027. Um this would be we would be we would go into this building in 2028. Is that what Yeah. the the intent would be to have the building ready for this uh 2028 2029 school year.

So, what would happen is we would actually we're gonna we're probably going to we're going to take students out of the Forest Avenue school, put them at a quitting school temporarily, and then hit this hard so that it's on schedule. So, by 2028, everybody's in the school that they want to be in. Um, so we we we've also looked at that that work schedule to make sure um not only are we sticking to the schedule, trying to stick closer to where things are more affordable, um, but also to deliver on having students in their buildings and in the least amount of time and also not to disrupt anyone's education. So again, you know, something that Ed Brady has always brought to every meeting is making sure we're not using temporary spaces. um students aren't being interrupted by having work going on while they're in the classroom. Uh we have this this this flex space with the Quinnick School uh where we'll be able to take those K through ons the the the small teacher uh students, put them over there for a period of time, bring Bentley in, hit that building hard, and have it ready for the following the following school year. So, uh, again, I think there's a number of stars lining up, uh, from funding to having the swing space that that make this a once in a-lifetime opportunity.

Go ahead,

thank you, Mr. President. I appreciate that and I I agree with all that. Like, I understand why we want to do this, but we keep talking about bond premium and we've already used that once. And you know, I think it's it we just talked about a couple meetings ago how we're forecasting taxes to keep going up in this town over the next 5 years, tune of 4% maybe on average. So that bond premium would be nice to come back to the taxpayers who, you know, who supported this and voted for this. Um, I I understand I I I went through these schools and I think when I wasn't on the council and I tried to convince many of the people up here on this council of all the code compliant issues that we have had, you know, relief from for a number of years, there was hundreds per school and I get that completely. I just need to see that we're not going to keep pulling from bond premiums and this 190 is actually 193 or 199. 190 is 190. We we can't change the 190. We have no legal authority to exceed borrowing of 190.

I understand that. But we've used we've already used bond premium to pay for playing fields for the new schools, right? We did that. No, I No, we haven't used bond premium to pay for the for the fields. We use bond interest.

Bond interest. Yep. Sorry for using the wrong term. My my point is the same is that we're counting on bond interest now or whatever you want to call it, but this wasn't in the scope to begin with. This school is never in the scope. And I and I worry that we're now shifting away from keeping a project that is a home run for this town and is is going to be an amazing addition to our town. And and I just worry about that six million turning into nine or whatever it is once we open up walls because the experts when I was on the building committee told us when we were up here fighting for 60 million, 90 million just to fix our schools up, the architects were always telling us how, you know, you open these schools up, you you don't know where the cost is going to be. That's what we fought for. So just by my opinion, I'm one one of seven up here and I've supported this this bond and and this school additions like anybody else has, but I just I have a hard time when we keep diving into bond bond value, whatever you want to call it, Sean. I won't I don't want to use the

No. And I think I just add so I'm just on a personal level and sort of and there's no one here from the school department to talk about this but moving beyond the bricks and mortar this is probably in my mind the most important part of the project. It's it's the last piece but it's the most important. We talk about we talk about what we're going to do different in the schools. Um, and we talk about and I' and I've heard the cynical comments, you know, oh, it's a high school, it's going to be the same and, you know, nothing's ever going to change. But I think this building actually does change things. And and the reason I say that, we talk a lot about with students that, you know, one of the challenges that we have is parents don't have the opportunity to learn how to be like parent teachers. This idea of homeschooling for every kid. And Forest Avenue School is a fundamental change on how we introduce people to to our school district. It's not only an opportunity for the prek K and and the ones, but it's an opportunity for new parents, young parents to come into a small space. Um, you know, there there's probably not a better point in anyone's life when they're a young parent, but it's an opportunity for the school district to get these people uh signed up for the Middletown way of educating students. And I think if we don't address bringing the building up to code, if we don't make sure those spaces are are really great spaces for those new families to our D school district, that in that that pathway into how we're going to educate kids through the renovated elementary school and into this middle high school with with vertical learning. Um we miss an opportunity. Um you know, basically there it's that that front door in your house. If the front door looks crappy, then then you just sort of have an

impression of it. But having that the gateway to education again beyond bricks and mortar to the program itself, um having a great space that that that a young parent wants, not not a high school parent, but a that just that that fresh parent. Um and having that excitement and trying to get parents excited about being great parent teachers is is critical. And I think that this is actually one of those things that moves the needle when we talk about trying to improve the outcomes to education uh within our town. And I and I I understand the dollars. I I understand it probably better than anyone in this room uh because you know Mark Mark and Patrick know it too because they're they're working on these numbers. Um but these numbers work and and and I and I'm again confident on that with the work that I've done with with Justin and with Ed. um as well with Mark and Patrick. Um we are below the 190. We're not borrowing more money. Um we just have again these opportunities. And then and lastly, as far as trying to maintain cost, we can do this for 45 cents on the dollar instead of 65 cents on the dollar. These these are these are these are ch these are improvements that are going to be have to be made at some point in time. um along with every other improvement that we have to make whether it's a road, it's another building, it's a truck, it's a whatever it may be or tax relief. But but these things are going to come and they're going to come at a more expensive price tag. Uh but again we we have an opportunity to do that now um in a manner that's uh cost-effective and um and and most important we can manage time and deliver the the project uh in a manner that the community has wanted from the very beginning as the council president has articulated at every meeting that we talk about this project. So

okay one last respectfully. Sorry. Yeah. So, usually when you come to us and ask for change orders, we get a whole Excel spreadsheet of where the budget stands, how this affects it. I don't see it in my packet tonight. Does anyone else have it? Fair enough.

So, it's kind of tough for me to make a decision. I'm a numbers guy. I look at these spreadsheets and I'm not saying I agree with everything Sean just said there, everything he said about education and how important this is. But I also know if we want to keep people in this town, we got to stop raising the taxes and and some of this money we're getting on this I call it a bond premium, whatever you want to call it could go back to the taxpayers. So that's just my feeling. I Thank you. Okay, Charlie. Thank you. Uh Tom,

so I would just like to say that this is a a pretty droning, depressing conversation when it should be terribly exciting because I sit on that school building committee and when this project first came up and we were dealing with ride numbers and and how much it was going to cost and what we wanted the school to look like and you know, we wanted all the latest greatest stuff and then the numbers started coming in. we had to scale that back and and you know maybe we can't do everything that we want to do and as Sean mentioned you know maybe the valley school can't get everything because we got to make sure the brand new school is going to get get it done right well then as the as the project came forward it's like wow we did better here we did better there we did better there we we got some extra money hey let's put it back into valley right and now we were at the point where we can make all these improvements to Forest Avenue who was going kind of got left by and and correct me if I'm wrong, but we do have to touch every school. So, that was always part of this. It's just now we can really go in and make a big difference. And we're not going to exceed the amount of money. And we're doing just what we're supposed to do. Improve the school system, infrastructure, and education opportunities in the town. This is this is like we should have confetti. And we don't. And Charlie, I get it that you you don't see where the where where we're ahead. We're ahead. We're ahead. I know you don't see it on paper. I don't have it either. I can't I can't tell you what it is, but if you watch the progress of how we've gone, nobody's sticking our neck out here. And maybe Sean can give us some rough numbers so we can see where it is and then you'll feel better. But this is this is phenomenal.

I Yeah, I I'm sorry you feel depressed about that. I'm just asking financial questions, you know. Well, I'm not going to just rubber stamp stuff up here. I think I've I think I've And I know maybe it annoys people when people ask questions up here, but

I I am 100% behind improving our schools, you know, and I've stood out there and I fought for this and every time I see it, I I'm so proud of what we did, especially the building committee, too, and all all the work that's gone on to it, including uh you know, the counselors here that have been a part of it. Tom was a a huge voice in in finally getting this through to people who only want to give us $60 million, you know, to do band-aids again. So, I get that completely. I just also understand we're we we have a lot of taxes increasing in this town going forward. And I worry about the affordability of this town as well. So, if you can show me how this is all packaged together and and we're not going to raise taxes anymore, then that that's fine. Um, but again, I don't I don't have the information in front of me to vote on this tonight myself.

Okay. Um, so Sean, I have some questions. So, good conversation. So, I guess my first question is a legal question. Is that when the uh the legislation was written for the bond that the voters voted upon, Forest Avenue was included in the in the in the legislation? Correct. Okay. So legally that's that's we're we're good there. Correct.

Okay. Can you explain say we say we're not going to do this and so there's how much in how much in bond proceeds when they sold the bonds and is it the difference in the interest that what was projected or thought was going to make and that what actually came in is that how the bond proceeds work. So for the first trance of the bonds and I Mark Mark would have the exact number it's it's 90 plus million dollars that we've already borrowed. When those bonds were sold there was a bond premium paid somewhere north of $6 million that was that was was also provided to the town. Okay. And that sits on the balance sheet of the capital projects fund.

That's the funding you're referring to partially. And then we also receive interest on the unused portion of the $90 million that we borrowed. Okay. So, so it's not above 190. Period. We legally cannot borrow more than $190 million because no one will give us allow this to happen anyway. We will never be able to borrow more than $190 million. Having said that, say we said we're not going to do this and now it costs 835. those bond proceeds.

So, so again, we're using money outside of the 190. So, the project budgets increasing. So, you're not going to go down to 183, but you couldn't apply that to say, okay, you couldn't apply that to this or could you apply it that money to reduce 190? Yes, you could borrow less money. You could. Okay. But that money but this money here potentially this money here is reverse re reimburseable by 55%. 55% correct and it brings our schools all up the code. You would be in code. Yes.

Okay. So if it's and we would have to see those numbers. So let me ask you a question. So, if we vote on this tonight, is this money spent going to be spent if even if we say we're not going to do that for the architect? The only thing that you're approving tonight are the fees for the architect to do the design work for Forest Avenue and the actual project budget would need to come back to you for review and approval. That's what I'm saying. Before that additional the the actual project funds could be spent, right? But that's what I'm saying. I'm saying, "Okay, we're going to spend 530 and we could still say no." Yes. The numbers could come back higher, right? Yes. That's the risk.

And they could come back lower, right? And that's the risk. Okay. Having said that, so the the the number is right now it's a rough number at $6 million. Correct. Rough number. And where did you get that number? that was based on the 2021 assessment that was done of the school um at today's cost at today's cost with the additional uh items that were not included in that assessment like the new elevator.

Okay. So, say it comes back at at say it's 6 million and we say okay cuz we're within the 190 and that 6 million's reimburseable at 55%. So that's 3,575,000 that we get back in reimbursement within 3 years. Is that accurate? Yes. What happens with that? Does that go to pay down the debt? That goes to pay down the debt. Okay. Where does it say that? That's your decision. Okay. It's an unrestricted reimbursement to the town. Okay. The council made what decision?

From 6 million cost to for the project, 3,575,000's reimburseable. The ended up you end up it's end up costing 2,925,000 to renovate and bring Forest Avenue up the code and was still within the 190 mil 9990 million. And it was Forest Avenue was written in the legislation bond. It is written in the legislation and approved by Ride. Okay. How long was this project? I don't like the fact that we'd have to move kids to Aquinic. Why can't If we're replacing windows and bathrooms and an elevator, why can't that get done in the summertime? It's too much work. Yeah, the elevator

The elevator is probably the biggest problem. It's right in the center of the building. So, so they we need to move the kids out of the building for for that one year for a whole year. This would take a whole We're building a whole school in two years. Well, the this uh this project will probably take about 8 months. Okay. Which we don't have enough summers to do before we run out of time. Okay. Get it done. We only have until the end of 2028 to get all this work done um in order to be reimbured. Yes. Okay.

So, the idea is to move the students out after the um 2627 school year. Uh start the work in June of 2027, have it completed well before June of 2028 when we have to go in for reimbursement and students would um return to Forest Avenue in September of 2028. So if Valley Elementary is going to be completed in 27, is that accurate? Yes. And two through five is going to Valley Elementary, all two through five in the correct. So it would only be

it would only be prek through one that would be moving and it would be a seamless move because we're moving all of the students at the end of the the 2027 school year. Um 6 through 12 are moving into the new middle high school. two through five are moving into Valley Elementary and then prek through one would move into Aquitic Avenue for one year and then move in 2028 back to Forest Avenue permanently. Okay. Okay. Any other questions? Dennis, thank you. Yeah.

Um I think it's a good conversation. And it is exciting uh to me that you know the progress we've made with the high school and the junior high. Thank you. Looks great over there. You know, I'm excited for that. Residents are excited about it. Um this, you know, this landed on my desk on Wednesday, so I haven't really had a chance to to review it. I hate to say that, but I've scanned through it and so on and following most of the conversation up here. I'm following Sean's number somewhat. I would ask that we we now I don't want to table it, but I I think we should continue this so we can get more numbers, have some more time to digest it. I think the public probably would want to hear a little bit more about this as well. This is the first time they're hearing of it as well. This is $6 million of their money that they should have a say in. We'll have the ultimate say here, but I think they should have an opinion on it. So, I think we should continue it, get some more details. I'd like to see if maybe we get some, you know, some visuals. I don't know if we can do that. I see that on

that's what we're asking for, Dennis. Not not to cut you off, but this $530,000 will allow us to get the design moving. That's to me that's that's a lot of money. Agreed. So, before we do that, I mean, I know we've done things where we spend $50,000 and we get something pretty good back. I mean, I'm seeing a drawing here of a a section. I'm not really sure what that is. Yeah, that is just a an area of uh where the survey would be done in order to facilitate the new um fire sprinkler service inside the building. That's a survey to

Well, survey would be outside the building because we have to bring in a new water service um from Forest Avenue into the building. Okay. So, things like that. I mean, so honestly, again, this just got in front of us. Um, again, I like what I'm hearing from numbers and so on, but to look at this for 3 days, 4 days, and I really haven't had a chance. My work schedule's been pretty tough. Um, I' I'd ask the council if we could continue this for till the next meeting again, give the public a chance to digest it, and then we could make a decision at the next meeting.

Is there a time frame on this? It would be beneficial to get started on this sooner than later. Um there is a you know u a design period. It's going to take probably uh 6 to 8 months for design. Um and then we have to go through three levels of uh the ride um approvals at schematic design, design development and then 60% uh construction documents. Um, not to say I'm on I'm trying to rush the council, but the sooner we get the design team working on on the design, the sooner we'll actually have hard numbers. So, right now we're budgeting based on an assumption based on um a complete assessment that was done back in um 2021

and and you're this is your a professional at this. I don't know what you do for, you know, how you do what you do or trying to give you any guidance on that, but $500,000 for uh, you know, to validate what we what was put in there in 21. We're looking at 5 years and we have, you know, recently put a lot of money into that building. So, I get it. But that's what you're saying you need. I I would hope that Yeah. 2021 that was a that was a a visual assessment versus a complete design. Um

and again I don't I think it's kind of a heavy lift. I like the idea. I'm hearing that things are coming in under budget.

We're using bond proceeds to keep this moving forward. We're going to get the reimbursements. We're talking about regionalization here. I'm not going to say we're going to wait to see what happens for regionalization, but we're talking about that. We're talking about what type of education is going to go where. So, and I'm not saying that's a, you know, that's a done deal. It's probably far from a done deal, I would have to say. But I would just ask to get a couple more weeks. You're saying it's going to take five to six months. I don't think two more weeks is going to, you know, jeopardize the project to get us an estimate to tell us what this is going to cost. And so I'd like to hear get what Sean's saying numbers-wise. Let's see it on paper, put it in Excel, let us look at it, digest it for a couple more weeks, let the resonance hear it, think about it, and let's let's table it just for, you know, another two weeks or just continue to for two weeks from now.

So, in two weeks, you're not going to have an estimate, right? No, we won't have an actual estimate until after 6 months. Uh, probably two and a half months until we get the schematic design. the first estimate design. It's you know the estimator. It's the same process that we followed for the other building. So they've got to do the design work. It goes to the estimator. We reconcile it with the builder. We go through that whole process. Has to come back for approval. Yeah. Right. Correct, Charlie. Yeah. And I think it's important to note, Justin, like I'm not looking for to you tell me it's going to be $6 million. I understand that $530,000 is going to out of that we're going to really dial that in. Right.

Correct. But what I need to see is an explanation of where we stand on all these budgets right now. It's been a while since we've actually I've I've seen that. So, because you haven't needed to come to us for a lot of things for change orders and stuff. We we're getting that every week. And so, that's all I want here, guys. Before I can approve $530,000, I feel like I'm doing my job to just say I'd like to see how we're going to make this happen. And I'll probably get 100% behind it. If you can show me that in the numbers, then I'm all for this. Trust me, I take heat from people sometimes because I support schools so much. So, thank you. School building so much.

Okay. Uh I'm going to ask the council, is there uh an appetite to continue this? Peter, move forward with it. Dennis, continue. Yes. Tom, I'm good. Charlie, yes. You want to continue this? Yes, please. Chris, I'm fine continuing it with till the March 2nd meeting to see the preliminary budgets just so we can make that determination as we continue it. Okay. We we need to make that decision then. What do you mean? Until the next meeting. You want to continue it till the next meeting? Yeah.

Okay. That's what we're going to do. Okay. We'll continue this. So, if you can get the budget, Sean, to Right. And when we say budget, it's not you're not going to have an estimate. You're going to have the estimates that we're I just want to be clear. It's the estimates that we're we're sharing and we'll we'll provide you u the budget. Okay. And I just so just to be clear to the public, too. We provide you budget updates. You do all the time. I just don't want that to be, you know, something they may not have been included on the docket tonight, but you regularly receive budget updates as well as the school building committee. I just want to be clear about that. Right.

No. when we but when they were coming for um all the bids, when you were coming for all the bids, we would it would say, "Okay, you saved, you know, $3 million on concrete, what you budgeted versus what the bid came in at. You saved at one point where six or seven or eight million under correct under budget." And that's all we're looking to see. Y Okay. Before we make that decision, but thank you. Sure. Thank you. Okay. So, we need a motion. Thank you. We're going to need a motion to continue, Tom. Motion to continue passing resolution until the next meeting. Second. Is that a sufficient motion? You need it cleaned up. Number eight. What is it?

We already received number eight. Y. So, we'll put a new on it and we'll just continue the resolution. Okay. Okay. We have a second. All in favor? I. Thank you. Thank you.

Okay. Let's move on to public forum. Um, pursuant to rules of the rule 25 of the council, citizens may address the town in one subject only. Said subjects of substantive town business neither discussed during the regular meeting nor related to um job performance or personnel. Um, all uh citizens may speak for no longer than 5 minutes and must submit a public participation form to the council clerk prior to the start of the meeting. Any items discussed during the session will not be voted upon. Uh we do have a few forms. Um and then we'll check Zoom so I don't get scolded by the clerk. Um Melissa Welch.

Thank you, Mr. President and members of the council. Melissa Welch, 535 Walcott Avenue. Uh, I would like to highlight for the council and everyone um a community workshop that will be taking place here in the town hall tomorrow. I think you all got copies. Yes. Yes, we do.

Um, so I just wanted to encourage folks to attend. This is um being hosted by URI's uh landscape architecture program and they are working on their capstone project this year and they have chosen to focus on the East Pond area. So, kind of our Atlantic Beach District and the surrounding neighborhoods, um the the whole area. So, they're going to hold a workshop tomorrow night at 6:00, um inviting members of the public to come and provide their input. Um so, this is an opportunity to talk with the students and give some ideas about what we would like to see. Um spoiler alert, I've already told them about my boardwalk idea and so hopefully that will become part of their their plan as well. Um but what the result will be was this will be that the students will come up with a design plan with all sorts of features in it that will include things like walkways and resilient and sustainable infrastructure and improving connectivity in the area. That's their vision. And I think this will be really helpful in helping us visualize what could happen in this area. and it fits in nicely with some of the efforts that Newport is doing to visualize new alternatives for Eastman's speech. Um the students are also talking to Newport. So everybody's kind of on board with this idea and this is our opportunity as as a community to work with the students and to provide them some input. So I would like to encourage everybody to to attend that. Um I think it's a great opportunity and they also um last year they this same class did their capstone project in Jamestown and the work was really beautiful. So you end up with um kind of a design that looks professionally done. They've done a lot of the um the calculations behind it. They've instituted the best management practices in terms of environmental practices and things like that. So, this is really a great bonus

and um something I think that contri contribute to the town and to our vision of the future. So, I'd like to encourage you all to attend. Thank you very much. And I have extra flyers if anybody need kind of food's going to be here. Pizza. The best kind of food. Pizza. Excellent. I should say the best kind of food. Free pizza. So, please do come. That's it. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Uh do we have any other forms? Nope. No other forms. Anybody on Zoom? No. Okay. Let's move on consent calendar. Any councils like to uh take any items off the consent calendar? Okay, vice president. Motion to approve the consent calendar in its entirety. Second.

All in favor? I. Tom Lens and permits. Um I'm going to step away from number 14. So if you could take care of that, that'd be great. Number 14, application from Middletown Senior Center, 650 Green Avenue for a renewal of a bingo license for the 2026 2027 licensing year on Tuesdays and Thursdays and Fridays. They uh ask the fee to be waved. Motion to grant said license and wave said fee. Second. Any discussion? All in favor? I post. Good. Number 15, application for

I guess not. Okay. Thank you, Tom. Number 15, application for special event permit from a Quinnick community table for the Quinnick community table Saturday uh farmers market to be held at Newport County YMCA, 792 Valley Road beginning Saturday, May 23rd, 2026 through Saturday, November 21st, 2026 from 9:00 a.m. to 12:00 p.m. and includes uh a request to wave permit fee. Motion to grant said special burn event permit and wave all fees. Second. We have a motion to second a grant. Is there any discussion? hearing. None. All in favor? I

I. Anybody opposed? Thank you. Number 16, uh, application for special event permit from the Newport County YMCA for the 4th annual Charlie Holder Senior Memorial 5K road race walk/run and a 10K road race walk/run to be held on Saturday, May 9th from 7:30 a.m. to 10:45 a.m. Motion to grant special event permit. The holders are here. Yes, they are. That family is they better walk fast for two and a half hours, right? Okay. Uh yes. So, we have a Do we have a motion? The grant said special event permit for

Okay, we have a motion to second a grant. Any further discussion?

Hearing none. All in favor? I. Anybody opposed? Good luck. Thank you so much. Thanks for coming. Okay. Uh, number 17 is application for a special event permit from Newport County YMCA for the Newport County YMCA's 41st annual Thanksgiving Day pie run, five mile run, three mile walk/run race beginning at Newport County YMC to be held on Thursday, November 26, 2026 at 8:30 a.m. Motion to grant said special event permits. Second motion to second a grant. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All in favor?

I thank you. Number 18, application of the Middletown Prevention Coalition for a special event permit for Middletown Family Day. Fun, familyfriendly event designed to celebrate the importance of family engagement. A protective factor to be held at Second Beach on Saturday, September 12th, 2026 from 400 p.m. to 8:00 p.m. The rain date is Sunday, September 13th, 2026. And the applicant requests all fees to be waved. Motion to grant that special event permit and wave all fees. We have a motion to second a grant. Is there any further discussion?

Hearing none. All in favor? I. Anybody opposed? Number 19. Application for special event permit from Co Khog chapter Newport, Rhode Island for the Camporama to be held at Second Beach Wednesday, September 16, 2026 through Sunday, September 20th, 2026. Motion to grant said special event permit. Second. We have a motion to second the grant. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All in favor? I. Anybody opposed? Number 20 is application of Middletown Dunkin Donuts LLC DBA Dunkin Donuts 811 West Main Road for eviction house license for the 2025 2026 licensing year. This is new

motion to grant license subject to building official fire marshall and board of health approvals. Second. We have a motion to second a grant based on those approvals. Is there any further discussion? All in favor? I. Anybody opposed? Thank you. Number 21, application of Destiny Donuts LLC DBA Dunkin Donuts 159 East Main Road for eviction house license for the 2025 2026 licensing year. This is also new. Motion to grant said license subject to the building official fire marshall and board of health approvals. Second. We

have a motion to second a grant based on those approvals. Um, is there any further discussion? Hearing none, all in favor? I. Anybody opposed? Number 22, application of East Main Donuts LLC, DBA, Dunkin Donuts, 536 East Main Road for eviction house license for the 2025 2026 license year. This is new motion to grant said license subject to building official fire marshall and board of health approvals. Second.

I have a motion to second a grant based on those approvals. And these three Dunkin Donuts were recently changed hands. So that's why this has to go through this process. Uh is there any further discussion hearing? None. All in favor? I the communication number 23 communication of John Sagloski, president Middletown athletic boosters in reference to request for support for the 2026 Middletown High School senior athletic recognition event. Motion to receive set communication authorize an appropriation in the amount of $3,000 to the appropriated from the council president's discretionary fund. Second.

We have a motion and a second to grant. Is there any discussion on this? Hearing none. All in favor? I. I. Okay. Anybody oppose? Um number 24 at the request of myself in uh resolution of the council in support of the continued operation of the Newport Hospital Birth Center and Rhode Island House Bill 7272 H7272. Yep. Motion to pass said resolution. Second.

Motion to second to pass. Um, I think it's important that we keep uh support of uh any any uh initiative, especially this House bill uh to keep that birthing center um going here on the island. It's it's a safety health and safety issue um for for our residents um to make sure that uh we stay on top of this. And I know that uh our neighboring communities, I believe they're doing the same. So, it's important for that to happen. There any other discussion or comments? Okay. Yep. Okay. So, we have a motion to second to pass said resolution. Uh, all in favor?

I. Anybody opposed? Thank you, guys. Number 25 at the request of Vice President Weltz uh resolution of the council in reference to in support of Rhode Island House Bill H7071 relating to the prohibition of the on the sale or of the sale of invasive plants. Motion to pass that resolution. Second. Have a motion, a second to pass. Tom.

Okay. So, this is uh House Bill 7071 and it's prohibition of sale of invasive plants. Um I'm just going to read you a couple of the whereasses so you understand what it's about. Uh whereas invasive plant species pose significant environmental, ecological and uh economic risks to municipalities across the state of Rhode Island and in space in invasive species, displace native education, degrade wildlife habitat, and create long-term maintenance and remediation costs for municipalities, land trust, and private property owners. Um, and I'll give you one of the be it resolved that Middletown Council hereby expresses its support for Rhode Island House Bill 7071 as a reasonable and proactive measure to limit the spread of invasive plant species. And there's a couple people that want to talk about this will explain better than me.

Okay. Uh we do have uh Melissa Welch.

Hello again, Melissa Welch, 535 Walcott Avenue. I'm also the chair of the Conservation Commission and that's how I first learned about the concerns about invasive plants in our community and why I strongly support this resolution. I hope the council will vote in favor of it so that we can support this bill at the state level. Right now, Rhode Island is the only one of the New England states that doesn't have a law prohibiting the sale of invasive plants. And in fact, only five states in the country lack this type of law. So, we're we're lagging behind a little bit. And this is a significant issue for our community. Um, it's a major concern and dare I say it is a growing one. And what I learned through the conservation Yeah, I know. I'll be here all night.

Um, wow. All right. council president. She almost she's almost there. Yeah.

But seriously folks, so uh on the conservation commission about five years ago, we got a request from a resident expressing concern about invasive Japanese knotweed. And I didn't know what that was. I'd never heard of it. So I had to do a lot of research. I actually did a lot of kind of field work. Uh I learned a lot about this particular plant and how terribly destructive it is. And it's one of those things that once you learn about it and you see it, you can't unsee it. And I see it all over Middletown. In fact, all over Quinnick Island. You can find it along the stream banks of Paradise Avenue of the Maidford River. You can find it behind Shaws along Bailey's Brook. Just filling in the whole area. And I even looked, I was here earlier this morning um and I pulled in the parking lot here at the town hall. Right there on the corner on the other side of the stone wall is a little stand of Japanese knotweed. So, it's coming for you. And it's so destructive. It can it can grow through asphalt, concrete, stone walls. This is just one of the invasive plants that we need to be concerned about in our town. And a lot has changed. I think someone like me, I grew up here. I've seen the changes happening over the years. If you think about down by Hanging Rock where that marshy area used to be, you know, cattails and other things. Now, it's just a sea of fragmitees. those tall kind of um reads with the fluffy heads. They're just crowding out in uh our local native habitat, native plants. And you think about driving around along the stone walls you might have seen back in the day, some maybe some elderberry, some wild grapes, some bayberry, things that are native bird population and pollinators rely upon. Now it's just a a a sea of porcelain berry or multifllora rose. And those native plants are being pushed out. Um, and that's significant because as we lose our native plants, we lose the birds, the bees, the butterflies, the insects that rely on

them. And that really changes the character of our town. So this this bill, this resolution supporting the bill, it's a start. It's going to rely on DEM to come up with the list of plants. There's already resources available for that. In fact, we have some listed on our conservation commission web page, which is on the town website. So, if anyone wants to learn more about that, we've got some um resources already there. Uh but this is going to be helpful especially for homeowners. You don't you don't go to the garden center and say, "Hi, I want to buy some invasive plants." But you might not know. You might come home with this beautiful burning bush and not realize how invasive it really is. So, this is a step in the right direction. Um, it's also something that I will say we have incorporated language about reducing in invasive plants and increasing use of native plants in our updated comprehensive plan which you'll be seeing soon. So, this is consistent with where we're going in our planning for the town and I hope you will all support it and thank you very much.

Okay. Thank you, Melissa. Karen.

Hi. Good evening. Karen Barbara, 36 Walcott Avenue, and I am on the tree commission, but that's not why I'm here tonight. I am a 30-year landscape designer. I have a degree in horiculture. I'm a um state certified um coastal invasive manager, have been for 20 years. So what I thought I would do is talk about from my perspective and from other people in my green industry who are are designers and who steward land. Um we talk about this at every national conference at every symposium that I go to. Um we don't buy these plants anymore. So I thought I would tell you from your perspective of well the nurseries want to sell the plants that they have and I'm telling you I walk into a nursery and if they have invasive plants I don't I don't want them. We don't buy them. So uh it's in from my point of view and from my green industry point of view it's about time. And as Melissa was saying, um, we're sort of talked about, um, in at these places, how how come Rhode Island doesn't have one of these these bills passed to protect the environment? So, um, I just thought I would tell you from a person who buys probably more plants per year than any of you and puts them in the ground, we don't want these plants either. So, it's not like there are people banging down the doors to buy, I hate to say it, private hedge anymore. So,

it's cheap. Yeah. So, um it's just an it's an important thing to do and it's about time we did it. So, I'm I'm really happy that the town is supporting this. Thank you. Thank you, Karen. Okay. Any other conversation? All right. I just Oh, yeah. I I want to back them up. Like you hear the word invasive, you think it's this ugly plant. Like I had in my back wetlands, we had someone came over and told us we had this plant that we thought was pretty and like it was taking over our whole wetlands. So we've been knocking it down and now the rebirth of our wetlands has been like incredible. So people may hear invasive plants. They're actually some of them are pretty, but they're still not good. So I I fully support this. Thank you.

I didn't know you had a green I didn't know you had a green thumb, Charlie. I don't. That's unbelievable. I know how to knock it down. Okay. All right. So, we have a motion. Anything else? Everybody else? Okay. Uh, so we have a motion to pass and thank you for your comments. Uh, said resolution. All in favor? I. Anybody oppose? Okay. Thank you, Tom. Number 26, memorandum of town engineer through town administrator in reference to US DOT build grant application. Motion to receive said memorandum. Second. We have a motion and a second to receive. All in favor? I Yes. Well, I'm just saying Terry wants to speak probably after the Yeah. Yeah. I saw I saw the Okay.

Uh John, so I wrote this memo because uh we think this is a great opportunity for the town. John John is a town engineer.

Uh both Sean, myself, and Bob Hanley. We all think this is a good opportunity. Um, I don't know if you read the memo, but on the back of the memo, uh, there's three points. Uh, the overview of this build grant program is to, uh, fund projects, uh, that improve surface transportation infrastructure projects, improve safety, environmental sustainability, quality of life, and community connectivity. Uh further it says that uh the eligible projects include projects to replace or rehabilitate a culvert or prevent storm water runoff for the purpose of improving habitat of aquatic species that will advance the goal of the program. So what we're thinking of is possibly filling the swailes the drain swailes on the sides of Third Beach Road and Paradise A and maybe putting sidewalks in. We don't have a complete scope of work now. We're we're working on that and we're trying to get to the point where we get over the $5 million threshold so that this this grant will be considered. Uh if we get if we if we can come up with a scope of work that's over this this amount, the town would only have to pay 20% if we get the award. Ron Mansky says that there's only a 4% chance that we'll get this award, but we think it's a good opportunity for the town to move forward.

Sure. You know, and so Sean brought up a good point today. If your wife came to you today and said, "Hey, we can remodel our house and the federal government will pay for 80% of it. We'll get new roof. We'll get new windows. We'll put in an ADA walkway. What do you think?" What do you tell her? Let's go. Let's apply for it. So, that's that's why I wrote the memo. Yeah. So, I think I think um and you know, we're obviously going to have some comments on this, but um you know uh you spend a million, you're going to get 5 million. Say that again. If you spend a million, you're going to get 5 million. You're going to get Yeah. But you have to spend a million. So, right. That's that's that's money that we need to talk about, right? So, so I think, you know,

so, so, so John, I guess the thing for me is that there's a lot of activity on these roads, especially, you know, from March, April through October, November. Um, and there's a lot of safety issues there, right? Um, so I think I know you said that Ron said we only have a 4% chance. Well, I think last year you said that only 4% of the applications were awarded. Okay. So, who knows what'll happen this year. So, I think and what we would do is we would get the application in. We would use our lobbyists to lobby our federal delegation to support this. I mean, we would we would be it's not just fill out the application. There would be

see you later and hope, right? would aggressively pursue it. All right. So, I just my own opinion is I think that safety needs to be one of the top priorities. I don't know if that's a criteria. I imagine why it wouldn't be. So, yeah, because because on those roads there's not a lot of lot of places for pedestrians and bicyclists and and uh uh you know there's horses there. There's all kinds of activity on those roads, runners, joggers, whatever. there's not a lot of wiggle room there for them safety-wise. So, I think that's an important factor in in applying for this for this grant.

So, safety is it's it's in fact the first thing improved safety and environmental sustainability, etc. So, what we talked about today was possibly widening Third Beach Road and putting in a bike/pedestrian lane maybe uh instead of a sidewalk. I mean, that's one way, you know, to to to make the road safer. uh if if u I think on paradise a we're thinking about putting a sidewalk in and again that's a safety safety is number one you know as well as some some of the other things quality of life mobility community connectivity those are all in there

so with a 4% chance um and you don't know like you said so so having said that is I think you need to I think we need we need to say okay if we did get this grant you know How much would I think we stopped with filling in the gutters. I think that's a big I think you mentioned that. Y I mean it's nice pie in the sky sidewalks and maybe that could happen but I think initially you know let's get across the scope of the work and see where that money would be best spent if we were awarded that grant. So we're currently coming up with a scope of work and the the first thing we came up with was filling in those drain gutters. Yeah. You know and piping them and making the side of the road

out of the way. Right. Let's say that again. Sorry to cut you off, John. That's right. And making the sides of the road safe. Yeah. But in doing that, maybe we can put sidewalks in as well. And under the sidewalks, maybe we can have some kind of storm water treatment, you know, to to increase water quality as well. So, wrap everything in in in the same package, you know. Um, and there's a $5 million minimum for the grant. That's that's why we're trying to get the scope up. Okay. Yeah. So Sean, where would in our 4% chance where would if we were awarded this grant, where would the funding of the million dollar the town 20% come from?

So we would defer, I guess we talked about this internally, we defer the road money from the CIP for a year. So rather than doing whatever roads needed, the priority roads are, we would move that money over to match the grant for that one year. That that would be the plan. Okay. Okay, Tom. Even though that means I would take a hit when I walk out to my mailbox, I'm still for it because uh you know, if you guys can put in the time, I know there's a pretty short window, right, to to get the application in, but you're not going to win if you don't take a chance. So, I I'm I think it's a great idea.

Okay. Any other councils have any other Charlie? But to we have to commit to the funding before we submit the application. Is that correct? I I need to know that the council is going to support spending the money if if we put the application in. You can get the grant and and reject it also. I mean and and and I just I want to be clear. We've done that before. I think Paul's been here. We we've gotten grants and said no, we're not going to do it. So yeah, I just didn't know if you needed us to vote to secure the 1.3 million. So part of the application requires proof of funding. Yeah. So, we have to show proof of funding like a a resolution, an approved resolution. Okay. Any any questions? Okay. Oh, I do just

Okay. So, this the scope of this you said something about Third Beach Road. Is that included in this? Yes. Okay. And then you're looking at all the coverts all the way down Paradise. All the way down and then up Berkeley. Well, I mean, right now we're just looking at Paradise and Third Beach Road. We That's as far as we've gotten. We haven't Berkeley's a different animal. Okay.

Yeah. And I saw a highlight in here. It said projected to replace, rehabilit, excuse me, just projects to replace or rehabilitate a culvert or prevent storm water runoff for the purpose of improving habitat for aquatic species. I didn't know what was in our culverts that qualified for that. Well, if we can provide if we can provide storm water treatment, we're you know enhancing the water quality for the downstream habitat. So, you took that into consideration. Yes. I thought maybe we had some crawfish or something growing in there. No. Okay. I just saw it highlight as interesting.

There are northern leopard bullfrogs in that in that Maidford River, though. That's a fact. Okay. Um, okay. Thank you, John. We do have someone like to speak on this. Uh, Terry Flynn.

That's the fact.

Terry Flynn, 34 Warren Avenue. Thank you for the opportunity to address this issue on the agenda. I flagged it initially because there was no funding source. that that's a huge gap of information that's coming down when you're talking about any kind of uh funding for anything. And of course, Paradise Avenues came to the top of conversation when COVID came up and it's sort of been there. It's always been a problem. It's not going away. I I don't have a problem with the project itself. It would be great to have that functioning well, safe for for people to use whether on pedestrians or bicyclists. Um, one of the questions that came up from the conversation is if there's a 4% chance, what exactly is the cost to do the actual application? It looks pretty extensive. I don't know how many hours or what kind of depth of information that the uh folks that are awarding this grant are looking for, but that also is part of the the package. What are we throwing away for a 4% chance? If it's minor, if it's worth the return, great. But 4% chance is 4% chance. Uh again, I don't have a problem with the project, but like councelor Roberts mentioned with his well-placed concern with the school budget. Um the issue is the taxpayer burden. You know, it's our money uh that's going to fund this and the endgame thinking, which I thought it was great. I wanted to emphasize and to clarify that just because the town applies um it can that application could be withdrawn. We're not tied to the application. And a lot of people don't realize that even if it's awarded, the town can change its mind. I just want to confirm that we do not have to go forward with it. We could say, "No, thank you. Give it to somebody else. We're not ready. We don't have the

funds. The people have other priorities at this time." Whatever. Um I guess because of the $5 million ma uh minimum, it couldn't be split and maybe do one road over another. But if that opportunity comes up, something to think about, you know, if they if there's another town maybe that has a smaller grant application or it could be split and that way more communities could benefit. I'm not sure how strict they are, but things evolve all the time and to just caution the council on this um trend it seems or this philosophy of let's spend money to get more back on the dollar. You know, people are struggling right now. I've said this before from this very spot. Charlie brought it up. Thank you very much for that endgame thinking that, you know, we haven't even taken the second bond yet, I don't think, for the school to impact taxes. And it's coming. And this town, people are they're having to sell. they're having to take advantage of the market that this whole town the the town that you're building for those residents, they're going to be gone. Just because there's a sale and you can get something at 50 cents on the dollar if you don't have the money and the taxpayers can't afford it, that's not the decision to make on their behalf. So, please give that some thought going forward with these opportunities as you call them. Thank you.

Thank you. Okay. Is there any further discussion?

No, we did not vote. We So, we have a motion in a second. That was for the communication you voted on. So, we got to uh Now we're at the resolution. Yes, that's where I was going. Can I ask one question, Mr. President? Yes, sir. Is like is there a cost? Do we have to develop? Is this just a we apply for this and it's very simple takes like a half a day or is there an extensive cost to this application? It's mostly in in-house work between John and Ron Wansky. There'll be some hours that we'll expend with Steve Cabraw, but that should be minor.

I mean, we we prepare grant applications frequently. So, uh it's just the council's policy that we bring them to you before we make make applications so you're aware of what we're doing. Okay, thank you.

Okay, thank you everyone. Let's move to the resolution number 27. Resolution of the council in reference to US do uh build application grant for the planning and construction of storm water and roadway improvements on Third Beach Road in Paradise A, including removal of open drain drainage swelles on both roads, installation of storm water treatment, best management practices under sidewalks and under roadways, installation of sidewalks and repaving of all disturbed areas of roadways to accommodate new stormwater measures. And the town council hereby commits local funding of up to 1.375 million toward the pro total project cost and authorizes the town engineer and planning department to prepare and submit the above reference grant application.

Motion to pass said resolution. Second. Okay. Is there any further discussion? When when will this uh do we know the time frame of the award? to be honest, even if we did, with the way things work in Washington, it would be delayed. Um, so I I would say no. I I don't want to put a date out there. So when they when they put it out there, they don't say, "Hey, this will be awarded on." It's not like when I buy a raffle ticket on this date, we're going to pull the winner. No, we're we're very much subject to 4% winner. What happens in Washington DC? So Okay. All right. Okay. So we have a motion to second. Any further discussion? Hearing none. All in favor? I I

Anybody opposed? Thank you. Number 28, memorandum, finance director in reference to financial report six month ended December 31st, 2025. Motion received said memorandum and report. Second. All in favor? I. How you doing? We're doing great. You are excellent. What do you have for us, Mark? Good evening. Good evening, president, members of the council. I What I have for you are are your financial statements for the first six months of the fiscal year. Yep.

Um it's the other presentation please. Uh this is a very high level and the backup for these very high level numbers are in your packet. Uh for the general fund, your total revenues exceeded the expenses by 2.2 million. Your tax collections are a million dollars higher than the same time last year. And the next item is your tax collector's report. And all of the town departments are currently within their budget. They all have favorable balances. Mark, before you get into that, I'm just going to read the other one in. Sure.

You guys good with that? Just to make sure because you're probably going to somewhat related. All right. So, um, um, number 29, communication of accounting manager in reference to fiscal year 2026 quarterly tax collectors report as of, uh, December 31st, 2025. the town of Middletown. Motion to receive said communications and reports. Second. All in favor? I. Okay. Okay.

For your school department, the total revenues exceeded expenses by 2.4 million. And I'll break that out between the school general fund and all of the other funds. For the school general fund, the revenues exceeded expenses by 3.1 million. and all the other funds which are enterprise funds um some u enterprise funds they have uh agency funds um capital funds all those funds had the expenses exceeded revenues by 700,000 they also have grant funds and usually the grant funds are reimburseable so you would expect to have a deficit at this point for that section of the

that's just a timing issue it's a timing issue yes Okay. Cuz when you hear the word deficit, you get a little excited. Yes. But the operating fund, it's just the timing when that money comes back in from a reimbursement standpoint. Correct. Okay.

For your parks and recreation fund, the total expenses exceeded the revenues by 211,000 compared to 333,000 in the prior year. And just to note that the majority of the revenue in that fund is collected in the fourth quarter. So it's going as you can see compared to last year it's going according to norm for the sewer fund. Your total expenses exceeded revenues by 47,000 compared to 1 million of unfavorable in the prior year. So you're doing better than the prior year. Um and the the deficit is usually caused because you have bond payments that for the principal payments those are due in the first quarter where you collect the revenue for the rest of the year to make up for those payments. So it is expected to to have a little deficit at this time.

Right. Again it's just a timing reporting of a timing issue. Correct. Okay. Yep. your refu and recycling fund. The revenues exceeded expenses by 277,000 compared to 375,000 favorable in the prior fiscal year. Your pay as you throw bag sales are 6,000 higher than the same time last year. Your permit sales are 16,000 higher than the same time last year. And in this fund, the majority of the fees collected are September through November. So that would cover this fisc this report. Yeah. That's when you have to have your stickers. Correct. By the 31st of October.

Yes. Yeah. Now we'll go into the departments. If you look all the way to the right, you'll see the percentage used compared to the budget and most of them are where you would expect. So I'll go down to the planning department. It's 66% uh used and right now they have having some studies that were budgeted in a prior fiscal year that are happening now. So there'll be budget adjustments to capture that bring those into this year's budget. Down to the fire department 63% uh you do have your fire trucks that were just purchased. Yeah,

there's about 680,000 additional expense in that and we will bring forward a budget adjustment because that was budgeted in a prior year as well. Correct. If you go down to the Middletown Prevention Coalition, it's 99% uh that fund was budgeted for the first quarter only and subsequent to that it was approved for more. She had grants that were awarded. So that is why that's there. There's there could be a budget adjustment but right now she spent what she has budgeted and this is for six months. So we will bring forward what you have approved for her to continue because that was just you she got the grant award right? He got the grant award. Yes.

Yep. So when does that when does that show up? Um the grants will be showing up in the next they started but they'll show up more in the next report. Okay. Okay. And the community outreach is at 83% out. Um, and in that department, you have your civic support that happens at the beginning of the year. That's why it shows the majority used and that is a large expense in there. Yeah. Mark, I have a question on that. Sure. Do you know what that just offhand know what that civ appropriation number is that they It is in the backup. kept trying to find it, but I was like,

you don't you don't have to do it right now, but if you could. Yeah, it's a majority of the It's a good portion of that. I think it's like 300,000, isn't it? Yeah, it's north of 300,000. Yeah. Yeah. 303 or 305 or something like that. I can't I'm pretty I know it's three something. And just a last note, uh as you know, we've had muscle memory. You know, what are you gonna All right. Um, and in that fund, we have even the the amount that goes in the parks and wreck that are funded from all your programs, there's an appropriation from the parks and wreck to the general fund. So, all of the civic appropriations are in that fund. Yep.

And just one note, uh, for the snow removal, we are watching that budget as well. Most of it is spent and that thing's going to be blown up. It's about 80% spent already and we do have more snow predicted, but yeah, they're saying 11 to 14 or 17 inches potentially this Sunday night into Monday. Now, who knows, right? Right. You know, but we are monitoring. I'm just saying. Yep. I put that out there. We doing You didn't know I did weather, did you? To yourself. Okay, go ahead, Mark. Sorry. Okay, so that concludes that report. If you have any questions,

any councils have any questions of our excellent finance director's presentation? Thank you. Thank you, Mark. We appreciate it. Mark, I guess I just have a question with the school with the way the town helps the school and oversees that. Um, how's that going? Because that's always at least in the back of my mind, I'm sure it's another council's mind, too, is that that's important. It seems to me like it's been a pretty good pretty good working relationship and it seems to be working. Yeah, it is a very good working relationship and as time goes on, we're assisting more and more. We're doing a lot of uh budget work right now with the school department. So,

yeah. And I'm sure with with Billy and the new as the new superintendent, that transition still in process budget. That's that's not an easy thing to do in a year and a year and a half, you know? Right. So, yep. It's going well. Yeah. Okay. Because after this budget cycle, we're going to tell him when he shows up that Saturday, the honeymoon's over, you know. Yep. No, I'm just kidding. So, okay. Okay. Any questions of Mark? Excellent. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Let's um let's move to number 30. Uh memorandum of town administrator in reference to survey results from boards and committees and commissions. Motion to receive said memorandum. Second. All in favor? I

I Sean.

Uh just based on your last meeting, you had uh there was discussion about the committee's um might have been two meetings ago. I had I had Moren put together a couple surveys to gather some data for you. Uh because that seemed to be an ongoing discussion. Um the first was that uh there was a long a long discussion about the committee round table uh where you would bring together chairs from the various town boards and commissions together uh to share ideas and exchange information. Um we asked a few questions and the the results are provided to you um in the packet. Uh basically um would you be interested in participating in a committee round table? How often would the round uh would a round table be uh be most how often would a round table be most useful? What format would you prefer? What would you uh what do you see as the primary value of the round table? So, um and then the last question, what concerns, if any, would you have about participating? Uh basically providing you information to continue your discussion. The second thing that we did, we worked with the clerk's office. Um, we looked at the last 26 months. Um, there were actually 20 resignations processed by the clerk's office during that period of time. Uh, we sent a survey out to those people. Uh, what are the primary reasons you resigned from the committee? How manageable was the time commitment required to serve effectively? How clear was the committee charge, role, and scope of authority? Don,

can you just speak into the mic a little bit more? Sure. Thank you. And how comfortable did you feel expressing viewpoints that differed from others, including when town council members were present? So, uh, while there were 20 resignations over the 26-month period, we only received four responses to that that one question. But, uh, on the docket itself, you have a summary of what the responses were. In the information part of your docket, you have the individual responses. We didn't make that part of the public record tonight. Y

uh but again it was provided to you uh for your review as you continue your discussion about um the idea of creating the the round table as well as your concerns. I think it was mostly related to um if a town council member was present that somehow that would have a chilling effect on the the function of the committee. Uh so hopefully this information will provide some backup for your your continued discussion. Okay. I think council's Charlie this was your your recommendation and um if you have any comments not to put you on the spot if you don't you don't that's fine I want to give you first opportunity to

yeah thank you for uh putting it out there I appreciate it thank you the clerk's office as well for helping out with that as well um reading through a lot of the comments I think there's a great comment I think there's general interest for a round table some people don't want to do it but you know it's fine like I I think um I think more importantly is I you know it I wanted to be clear like I I didn't say it because I don't want to attend these meetings. I just want to make sure people are getting the most out of these boards and committees because they're truly volunteering. So this is great information. Um it'd be nice to I I don't know what the summary is here because I'm reading through them myself, but to me it seemed like the round table is is of interest of of the chairs of the committees.

Okay. Anybody else feel that way? I don't know. Uh Tom, do you hand up? I just um I didn't know the survey was coming, but I thought it was well done. I I thought, you know, whoever thought of the questions and put it all together, that was was that was nice. Appreciate it. I agree. Okay. So, uh you want to sit on this? You want to move forward? You don't want to move forward? What What's the pleasure here? I just I have a couple questions. Could you speak into the mic, please? Yes, sir. Thank you, sir. Um, I'm just I don't know if we have them. Do we have written charges for all the committees? Right.

And if we don't, could we do that? It doesn't have to be done today, but just so I think for the counselors and the people on the boards have a better idea of what they I mean, a lot of them have been there a long time. They have an idea of what they're doing, but just to be clear to everybody. Yeah. So, we do have charges for all the committees. there's a resolution or some document that creates them all. Some of them have stronger charges than others. Um Wendy, Karen, and I have talked about trying to carve out time at some point to and and that's the thing. I know it's tough to do, but I mean that would be a benefit I think to everybody if at some point we could do that.

Um then I also think I think to a certain degree it's kind of obvious how you assign someone as a member or a liaison. And I think there's a benefit to having more situations where you're a liaison, so you don't hold up the meeting if you can't make it, like you don't affect the quorums and things along those lines. Um, yep, I agree. That was one thing. Um, and then the other thing, only other thing was, and just because I'm on that one, Discover Newport, that's that's a board member position, not a liaison. That was just a to point out that's a voting position.

Did all the boards and committees Sorry, are you done? Okay. Did all of them respond here, Sean? I didn't They did not. Um but you in your packet you have the detailed information from the ones that did and they do identify what committee they're responding in. Yeah, that was one of the things with I looked at was um it was it was good information. Again, as Tom said, I thought it was well done as well. Uh, couple things stuck out was the charges. I'm not sure if someone were clear on the charges. Um, some are looking for better communication. Um, so, but I think there's 19. I think I counted 19 committees. I had 33 last time. Well, I have just on this sheet that was

Yeah, correct. Okay.

19 committees. Of those 19, there's seven of them that have two leaz council leaison. The first thing that came to my mind is do we need two on everyone? I I think I I don't know. I don't think so. I think if I think some of that was done because if two people wanted to be on it, we said okay. I think I think some of that may create some uncomfortableness. And I'm not saying that's the case because I think out of the responses the majority of them said they were comfortable if the council person was there. But I just think from a time perspective, from a as a counselor, it's a lot. Um, and I know that's not why this you're saying that's why this didn't come up, but it's a lot. I mean, let's face it, it's a lot of and and look, you get what you ask for and that's what you do to make a difference, right? But this is about the committees and communication and and but it affects the councils as well. Um, so could you be more effective on one committee versus having to be on five? Do we need a liazison in every single committee? I don't know. So that's something we really need to kind of kind of think about and that's just some of the things that that I saw come out of this. Dennis,

you know, would it be I know the liaison goes to the meeting as much as possible and we're supposed to come back and you know update the council which I don't think we all come back and update the council on what's happening in each of the meetings. Can there be a chairman report they submit once a quarter that says, "Hey, I'm chairman. this is what our committee has been up to. Here's the top three or four things we've been doing. You know, just gives the council a little bit of an update on that. I mean, it's just I don't know, getting them all into a meeting, which is effective, too.

But I don't know, sometimes like in business, we'll have groups that will just say, you know, we'll have a chairman's report or whoever's leading the charge there put the report in. It says, here's what Open Space has been doing. This is what, you know, things just an idea. Yep. Yep.

Yeah. And one of the things that kept popping out was the hybrid approach too. Like there there's nothing that says we have this has to be in person, right? Like cuz this is not violating any open meetings laws. So like I think the last thing I want to do is put work on volunteers. But you know I I do think if they can interact on a regular basis there will be opportunities where we you know we talked about sidewalks on paradise. Well the bicycle and pedestrians are going to say well we need bicycle paths there too. you know, so that's that's the kind of information I'm looking to have the committees share with each other. So, but thank you again for this is good information. Okay. What do you what do you guys want to do with this? Do you want to do anything with it? You want to sit on it?

Well, do I mean the boards and committees fall under your office, right, Sean? And I know it's budget season right now as well. So, you you the council are responsible for the policy related to them. You create them, you eliminate them, you tell them what to do. They're advisory to you. Um, I'm ultimately responsible for making sure they're they're doing what they're supposed to do. I don't I don't direct them, but I'm I'm making certain that they're they're they're doing what they're supposed to do. Is that that by charter? That's by charter. That's by ch I want to make sure I knew that was the answer. I just wanted to put it out there. Yeah. And that I mean, in theory, it applies to the library, board of trustees, and the school committee. Although it's sort of a

I guess I'm I'm advising them, managing them uh the same same as the solicitor would. So, um but they're they're receiving their authority from you. Okay. Um but you you were going to say something. There's a question. I just want like there's we we have to I mean from this is good information, right? We have to kind of make a recommendation though, right? On this and there's a number of different things. So I don't know if we have someone from the administration off make that recommendation to us or one of us makes a recommendation then we talk about it at a future meeting. Those are the kind of the two paths I see.

Why don't I bring recommendations forward? I'll I'll talk to Wendy because Wendy does a lot of this work too and then um we'll go from there. We can we can have a discussion. Yeah, I think that would work well. Okay. See where it goes. Tom, I was just going to say that I think this is good information. and it came out. All of the boards and committees have been contacted. So, we give it a little bit of time to get back to all our all our meetings and see what comes out of it. Then we can discuss it again. So, that would be saying sit on it for a little bit.

Okay. Well, in the meantime, Sean and uh Wendy can at some point in time get us this information. I don't think there's any pressing need here. Um although the information would be good because we need to follow up on it, but it's budget time and when we we can get that information that'd be great. We can continue our uh participation in these meetings and see where it goes, you know. So, okay. All right. Very good. Motion to adjurnn. Second. Second. All in favor? I Thank you.