Board of County Commissioners - Regular Meeting

And followed by the Pledge of Allegiance, which will be led by Richard Voloshin. Good morning.

And I see that you are a Vietnam veteran. Would you like to tell us a bit about your Army service, sir?

And a Purple Heart recipient. Thank you. Thank you very much. Our agenda this morning will consist of an additional item. It's Consent 9, which is adopt a proclamation commending Jacob Crosby and Parker Bassad upon the achievement of Eagle Scout. There's one request to withdraw from the agenda, and that's Public Hearing Quasi-Judicial No. 2, which is a request for certification of an agricultural enclave pursuant to Sections 163.3162. and 163.3164 Florida statutes. There are no agenda polls. Is there a motion to approve the agenda, including the consent agenda?

I move approval of the agenda and the consent agenda.

Second. Any objections? The motion is approved. We will begin with proclamations. The first proclamation is a proclamation declaring Purple Heart Day

Our next proclamation is a proclamation congratulating the 50th anniversary of the Treasure Coast Regional Planning Council in Martin County, Florida.

And our last proclamation is a proclamation declaring Florida Water Professionals Month in Martin County, Florida.

The first request to speak forum I have is from Angela Harrison. Ms. Harrison will be followed by Victoria Blake.

Thank you. Victoria Blake is next, followed by Larry Cohen.

Thank you. Larry Cohen is next, followed by Mike, the armed fisherman.

Thank you. Mike, the armed fisherman is next, followed by Justin Dukas.

Thanks, Mr. Taylor. Thank you. Justin Ducasse is next, followed by Yamila something.

Thank you. Yamila is next, followed by Candace Callahan.

Thank you. Candace Callahan is next. And Ms. Callahan is the last request to speak for my half.

Thank you. Next comes Commissioner Comments. Commissioner Vargas. Yes.

Yes, I would like to send a special recognition to the teachers, administration, and all of the support professionals that support our schools, all the other professionals that support our schools and our students. When this gentleman, Mr. Voloshin, was speaking, I remember being in Lao Cai, Vietnam, and near the Lao border in Cambodia, it's mountainous, and rice paddies tucked right into the mountainous range right there. I have a couple of questions. This Bill 1365, has Human Services looked into this? I'm sorry, I'm asking Mr. Donaldson, Ms. Elder.

Well, we've spoken about that before, so is there any remedy, any other pathway?

Yeah, I'm going to look further into that with my fellow commissioners from other counties to see what they've done to get ideas there. The other thing is Mr. Taylor was here and he was talking about the FOIA too slow. I've seen it very fast. Is there a problem in that department addressing his request?

Okay. So he hasn't made an application here with this county? It's through the sheriff only. Okay. I needed to be sure about that. Thank you.

There's been a lot of interest in helping the unhoused and a lot of comments made for many of our meetings and I know there's a lot more that we could probably do but something came to mind that doesn't really get mentioned and that is what are we doing now and there are some things we're doing now. We have a category of spending in our budget called Grants and Aids. And I thought I would just mention that we do provide several of our grants and aids that bring benefits to the unhoused. I'm looking here at a list. One is called Veterans Homeless, $10,000. Another one is Treasure Coast Homeless

Another contribution that Martin County has made to the homeless is in I think about 2010, I was asked to contribute substantially to the construction of the Miss Butterfly facility in port salerno new monrovia um it's a facility for homeless mothers and i thought it was a very worthy facility and i did contribute substantially to the construction of this project it's been a wonderful success since then so you know we we have made inroads we have addressed uh homeless and we haven't done enough but we certainly keep moving in that direction to make sure that we

And also, I just wanted to mention the agenda item that's been withdrawn from the agenda today and that's public hearing quasi-judicial number two. I just wanted to say that Jenna Nobby was the staff person who prepared the staff report and I want to say that it's the best staff report I have ever read. The proofing that she did on this extremely complex, complicated issue. was remarkable. It was so professional. It was a pleasure to see our staff solve this very, very complex challenge. So thank you, Ms. Nave. Commissioner Candy.

Thank you very much. A week from today will be Election Day. We have The election and the opportunity for voting has already begun. We are in our early voting window. It started on Saturday. Also, if you had requested a vote-by-mail ballot and have yet to turn it in, you still can. You can either drop it off at the supervisor of elections office or mail it in. I know I'm serving on the canvassing board with Commissioner Vargas, and that supervisor of elections, Vicky Davis, had said she sent out approximately 15,000 or 16,000 ballots, and only about 6,000 have returned, which is a pretty low p

And in regards – And let me add that all voters, regardless of your political affiliation, are eligible to vote in all of the local elections this year. True. Which is kind of unusual.

Yes, true. Sometimes if you are a one-party affiliation or another, the ballot would be specific. But all seats are available for every, as Commissioner Hertz said, every – whatever your – political party affiliation is, you can vote for all of the seats. Except, of course, if you're in an unincorporated Martin County, you don't vote in the city of Stuart, you're not voting in Indiantown. But for all of the seats that are available for you to select, you can. In regards to the unhoused situation that's been discussed quite a bit. I had a conversation with the ladies that spoke this morning sev

I look forward to learning more about the dignity bus. And then I just came back from American Water Resources Association meeting, which is one of my favorite meetings of the year. Several years ago at this meeting, on the way to the meeting, we were in our district two, we were having an issue with Monterey subdivision and contaminated wells as cited by the health department. I remember Drew Bartlett was just moving from the department, the DEP, over to director of the South Florida Water Management, and I want to thank him again because of his actions in connecting district to our office wi

Very nice. Thank you. Mr. Donaldson. Ms. Elderer. Okay, in that case, let's proceed. We'll take up public hearing quasi-judicial number one, which is a public hearing to request approval of the major final site plan for Southwest 96th Street Monopine Wireless Telecommunications Facility Tower. This is quasi-judicial. Any ex parte disclosures? Commissioner Vargas?

I don't have any and they've been filed. Commissioner Campy?

I don't have any and they've been filed.

Is the applicant here? Yes. Anyone who's going to be providing sworn testimony, please stand up, raise your right hand, and be sworn in.

How tall are these towers usually? Is this common, 120 feet?

How about the development order for the convenience store?

So if I'm not mistaken, there is an existing convenience store gas station that's next door?

How on earth do we permit these things next to each other?

Okay. And this application is the tower separation setbacks and fall zone criteria of our land development regulations shall not apply to any stealth tower.

So if it wasn't a stealth tower, the fall zone and setbacks and tower separations would apply?

Can you explain why? I mean, just because it's disguised as a pine tree, why is it not subject to fall zone protections?

Would the applicant like to make a presentation?

Tell us about the fall zone protections.

And I see that there was a consultant who was hired to do the, I don't know what you call it, the, yes, so who paid for that consultant?

Have we been? I see that there's an outstanding balance.

Okay. Thank you. Any further questions? I wish it was an American flag.

I wish it was an American flag. I think the pine trees, you know, I get that it's stealth, but I mean, they look like cheap artificial Christmas trees.

So then they'd have to comply with the fall zones. No, it's stealth as a cell phone tower. It's obviously like, for instance, in Palm City, a long time ago they put one on a church property and it was a cross. I like, you know, obviously if you see a flag on a massive flagpole, you understand it's a cell phone tower. I just think Or even the one that we have that's right around the corner over here is just a monopole. That's not stealth, I guess.

I just think that that sort of – your eye erases that, whereas when you see these large artificial pine trees that are way taller – and I get why they have to be that tall – than the surrounding landscape. They just look sort of ridiculous. But I get that falls within the definition of stealth. I just like the concept of a really large American flag would be more appropriate than a cheesy, for lack of a better word, pine tree. But that's just a personal opinion. It won't affect my decision making.

So the 120-foot height is a common height for such towers?

Okay. And I have one question for our county attorney. How? This issue of towers in Martin County has been an issue in the past where people have wanted the county commission to intervene and perhaps prevent a tower from being located somewhere. I think there was one right in a neighborhood that created a stir.

So a level of discretion would just be the general principles of judicial decisions, competent and substantial evidence in the record

This is a public hearing. Would anyone from the public like to address us? Thank you. I don't see any. Back to the board. Was there a recommendation?

There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That motion passes unanimously. Thank you. We will now move on to Department Quasi-Judicial No. 1, which is an Article 10 appeal. Consideration of an Article 10 appeal by Corey Beaton regarding denial of building permit No. So-and-so for the construction of a single-family residence. This is quasi-judicial. Commissioners, Commissioner Vargas, any quasi-judicial disclosures?

I do not have any. That form has been filed.

I don't have any, and they've been filed. Commissioner Campy?

I don't have any, and that's been filed.

Let's see. So, commissioners, this is the procedure for this is unique. Follow along on page 335. We will now have the summary of an introduction of appeal by staff.

I thought that we didn't have to have people sworn in because we're not accepting any new evidence.

Questions for Ms. Elder before we turn it over to Mr. Beaton? I do. I have a question. Okay.

Ms. Elder, so based on what you just told us, we are deciding on those three criteria, not necessarily on whether or not we feel that it's a legitimate project.

So in other words, to decide if we felt that the technical process was followed correctly. Not if we agree that it was a good project or a bad project. Final question. What would the applicants, what could he do if he's unhappy? What's the recourse based on today's decision? What's the next step in the process for him?

And I understand everything you've said. And I've looked at this before I came to this meeting. I had a lot of questions. So in the event that the applicant is unhappy, file a lawsuit against whom?

Okay. It was my understanding that he can get a building permit. However, there's a little bit difference in so far as the land. Mass. He was going to be building on and it has to do with something dealing with the regulations going back to the 1980s. Is this correct?

So now we take what? The vote dealing with Mr. Donaldson's

Mr. Beaton, you'll have 20 minutes to talk with us.

Thank you. Questions for Mr. Beaton? Are we allowed to ask him? Yeah.

Mr. Campy. Thank you, sir. Just as an aside, what do you do for a living? Firefighter. Interesting. You did a nice presentation. Second question, am I allowed to just generally ask questions just for background? Like what did you pay for your property and when did you purchase it?

It's a two-acre is the criteria for being allowed to have the building permit, correct? Correct. Two acres or more. And what is that? I'm just doing this for reiteration. What is the county saying that you, what is their interpretation of the amount of property that you have?

2.01. So that's the little extra is what's in the water?

Commissioner Vargas. You know, having been in real estate for many years, I really admire the lengths you went to. I would do the same thing as you if I were planning on moving my family, my homestead, my last home, I think forever home, to this piece of property. You certainly have spent a lot of money looking into, is this the right move for my family? And then also to sell your homestead?

That's admirable to me. When I have been involved with the county, not this county, but another county, and looking at property, I too had to rely on what staff said because that's the only way I can say, well, you know, this is a good avenue to take, or no, I really should do something else, but you've done the other something else in addition to that. Policies here should not be floating and should not you know, be constructed as situations come up. We're talking about three other properties, 1984, 2016, 2023, which were labeled as mistakes. They could have been. However, you're basing your

Identical. So having said that, we're talking about submerged lands, riparian rights, and this is the key component. Is that correct? Correct. To be able to allow you to go forward. Okay. But you certainly have the land mass without interfering with conservation areas that would be unbuildable, correct? Correct. Okay. So having said that, I understood that what you're looking for, I understand what you've done to spend $1.3 million is a chunk of change. And as I say, it's very hard to remake that again. Okay. I just wanted to clarify, I think your report was thorough, complete. It was very und

Any further questions? Would staff like to give a presentation?

Right. Commissioner Hetherington. I have a couple questions. I might have some more. So the lot was split prior to your ownership? Okay. And then you started to go into this, Pete and Paul, you mentioned the comprehensive plan. I think it was 4.1E. How do you define in that policy what is owned? That's where the two-acre requirement is defined? What defines in that policy substantiates lot ownership?

Can you pull that provision up so I could see how it reads? And then while you're doing that, Mr. Beaton, you said when Mr. Schilling had said reference 4.1e, you said it does not say that. What's your interpretation of what it says?

Any further questions? Commissioner Heathering.

That's what the, yes. All right. Let's get back to the procedure here. Commissioner Vargas.

Okay. Just a couple of comments. Did a realtor sell this parcel to you or was this a for sale by owner?

Okay. You may want to pull out that policy because there was some question about the ownership and it was divided. Just a suggestion, you can consult an attorney about this, a real estate attorney.

Thank you. Staff had made testimony, I guess. that there was an application from the previous owner to change this and that you withdrew that application. Why?

I'm asking questions. Thank you. Next question, I had heard testimony that said you could have contacted the DEP, yet you chose not to. Did you ever reach out to the state DEP or anybody at the state level? Absolutely not.

The applicant had said, this is to staff, the applicant had said that there have been other homes built in the same area. Were all of those lot sizes two acres or more or any of them less? Actual homes that are currently existing there now, are there homes on property that's less than two acres or are they utilizing water to get to two acres?

At least one, potentially more. Correct. Yes. Thank you. I heard testimony that said that there were approvals in 1984, 2016, 2023, and then now. Are those the approvals that you're speaking of, Mr. Schilling?

I understand. I'm just trying to run through the points that I had heard from staff's presentation and the applicant's presentation. These are things that caused me to write a note down. I had heard that at the hearing that you conducted, Mr. Donaldson, that there were only supposed to be the administrator, the attorney, and the head of the growth management department with the three people that were supposed to participate in that. However, there were six people at the meeting. We heard that it was Mr. Walden. We heard that it was Mr. Daugherty. Who was the other person?

Now, when it's supposed to be only three, is that a...

Understood. But is there any requirement that it only be department heads? Is there any requirement that it only be three people?

However, we're hearing now that Mr. Doolin did speak.

Right. So, Mr. Walden, you did not participate?

Some other questions. The roadmap that the applicant spoke of, that in the beginning of your presentation, sir, you said that during your due diligence, you did what Most people, smart, savvy people that are about to make more than a million-dollar investment would do. Do diligence. You said that you spoke to, and what I liked is a lot of people would tell the commissioners, I spoke to someone at the county. Who did you speak to? I don't know. makes it much more challenging. You do know. You said during this testimony that you stood up and swore that you would tell us the truth, that you basic

Okay. So were those e-mails, that e-mail chain or this Your Words Roadmap document, Was that presented to staff and to Mr. Donaldson so that we'd have a better understanding of how you got to where you were?

Okay. I heard from our chair and from Ms. Elder what the procedure of today's agenda item is meant to be. that we weren't going to necessarily be hearing additional testimony, even though to me this sounds like testimony. That being said, why isn't Ms. Offenbach and Mr. Fox here? Are they not allowed to participate in this? She seems to be integral in the process that he decided to make this investment. And even post-closing would have been his at least guide through the process. It doesn't get to Mr. Schilling. It doesn't get to Ms. Elder. And it doesn't get to Mr. Donaldson. It goes through

I'm not asking why they were there. not at that meeting. I'm asking why they're not here.

But a lot of what we're discussing is hearsay from staff and from the applicant. Their names have been mentioned several times.

Believe it or not, I actually can differentiate and discern between the two. So to me, there's really two conversations happening at the same time. And from the applicant's point of view, it's mostly about, hey, I looked at this property that I would tell me that I could purchase and build a single family home, not a neighborhood, one house on one piece of property. And it was a 1.7 with a 2 wet, 1.7 dry. To get them to the two, I can imagine the conversations any of us can put ourselves into that same circumstance and say, do we buy this? Can we build a house on it? No one is buying a piece o

So we're only getting to see this right now, this morning.

If I'm going to do a process of specifically did the process work itself out, this wasn't part of it. We did have an admission that mistakes had potentially been made in the past. Mr. Donaldson, I obviously hold in very high regard. I was one of the people that voted to make him have the position that he had. When Commission Chair Hurd asked us if we had any ex parte communications, I said none and that's been filed. Now, that's not just because I had not spoken with you ever or anyone that represented you. I hadn't spoken to staff either about this particular item. There's the agendas come ev

This was not a absolutely you were wrong and staff was right. It's not an absolute that the staff was wrong and you were right. That's why this process, as far as I know, this third step, you appealed it and then you appealed it again to Mr. Donaldson and then you appealed it to us, is designed so that the five of us can use our opinions, our life experiences, to decide if we agree or not. I would never want to be known for as much as I like Mr. Donaldson to be his rubber stamp. I'm certainly not a rubber stamp. I don't believe any of the five of us up here are going to be rubber stamps. So in

I echo much of what you said, and I won't repeat it, except for the fact that I don't think it was your responsibility to reach out to DEP to substantiate what your survey and everything claimed. I think your title, your survey, actually was evidence enough. And I think there's enough reasonable doubt. We have tremendous staff. There's enough reasonable doubt to me that at least one of the three criteria, one is due process, Fairly applicable. I have questions about how the 4.1 either was interpreted versus what it says on the document. And I think that you presented evidence, so I'm going to

Commissioners, I'm looking at the supplemental memo that was given to us this morning. And it's a copy of an email correspondence from Amy Offenbach to Corey Beaton. And among the things that it says is zoning A1, future land use, rural density. And I'll read from comprehensive plan. The minimum lot size for development required by the zoning and future land use is two acres. Furthermore, it says there's a 75-foot shoreline protection zone from mean high water line, wet side of seawall or backside of mangroves exceeds rear setback. So she's quoting the comprehensive plan and the development re

I'm really, really nervous about proceeding with, because you then say it's okay to not comply with the comprehensive plan requirements.

Well, I think the only difference, Madam Chair, respectfully would be that you said he knew that he didn't have two acres, and I think his testimony today was the argument here is that he believes that he does. That's the point. I'm not agreeing that, you know, it's roughly two acres to build. He had 1.7 dry and 2.01 wet. The question is, is that portion that's wet able to be part of the calculation or not. He's not saying, hey, I thought I had 1.7, and that's what I want. The argument that I'm hearing is that he believes that he does. So when you say he knew that he didn't, I don't believe th

May I? But I disagree. He knew that his boundary was two, and he knew that his dry land was 1.69. And he also knew, or he should have known, because Amy... Offenbach wrote to him and said that you also have a shoreline protection zone from the mean high water line. And you knew that there was a difference between mean high water and boundary. You knew that that was a three-tenths of an acre difference.

Yeah, my question is, are we ready to take a vote? You had enough evidence. No.

Commissioner Capps would like to make a comment. Commissioner Capps.

So there are two big issues at hand here. The first one is policy 4.1 , which basically, according to our staff and our county attorney, means that we do not count submerged lands in lot size. And then there's the issue of whether you own the submerged lands. And I heard the county attorney say earlier that even if it were determined that you did own the submerged lands at some future date, we still do not count submerged lands toward lot size. And I'm gathering that that is an important precedent and policy in our comprehensive plan. And I am satisfied with the county attorney's analysis and

We have a motion and a second. You've got to vote on it.

Was that outline coming into this hearing?

Thank you. Can we go to the agenda item and see what the recommendation was? Because from what I understood of the presentation introduction was that we were to decide if we felt that the process of those three criteria was met, not approving necessarily the building permit. Because what I'm hearing from my colleague, Commissioner Capps, what I'm hearing from staff, this gentleman is obviously very capable of making his presentation. I was making my determination on whether or not I think he should be allowed to build his house on his property. Was he given a fair process through this? And I'm

Okay. Mr. Walden, can you provide clarity?

Understood. But now he's hitting the reset button. He thought that he had a different path forward. It ended up right here in front of us. I know that our staff will be professional and unbiased in helping him go forward. We can't tell him what to do. He might just as readily say, I'm hiring an attorney and suing us. I hope that's not the case. But he's hitting the reset button. So what I would recommend for all parties concerned is that whatever has happened in the past, remain in the past, and we take what you've heard from us today, and we don't even know what the decision will be. move for

I've lost my train of thought, except for I did want to chime in that I believe that private property rights are so very important to me, and I think there's enough doubt here that I lean into having this resolved and for you to be able to build your family's home.

Correct. Does that mean that he's going to be receiving a building permit?

Okay. So I've heard everybody's comments here from the DAI and, of course, the department. And I worked with them last year and a half, and I think they're wonderful. There are inconsistencies here. We have to do the right thing. I disagree with Mr. Donaldson. I want to follow along and go ahead and approve. the motion that was made by Commissioner Campy and seconded by Commissioner Hetherington to move forward. We want to do the right thing with you. You've done a lot of homework. I understand.

Yeah, I want to make sure that that's not the case. It's not just to review the information that has already been done. I want more of a robust review. Mr. Walden said that there was some possibilities to work something out that can have a house built on the property. I would also ask staff to go back and review the Pentelago approvals decision. Those were inland waters. It's not the same. I understand, but it was when we were counting. I remember the debate of whether or not those lot sizes would count water. I get that it's not the Loxahatchee, but I'm just trying to create a situation. I'm

Well, let me ask you a question on that, then, because basically our decision is to agree with that or not at this point. What will that entitle for him? He's got to go all the way back to the drawing board?

Okay, so it would still come back to us? Yes, sir. Sir, you heard that. That's fair. What are you thinking about that?

Okay, so let's do this, because I think we need to wrap this up. I hear your point about splitting it, and if I lived in that neighborhood and it's a two-acre neighborhood, I don't know if I would want, because how many vacant lots are still there?

So let that be somebody else's problem. You're going to try to figure out a way that says the two acres combined two acres of what you've been paying taxes on all this time, that's the avenue you're going to have to take. But I'm just saying that my motion is that you and staff go back and try to work that out.

I don't think we're there. I would reassure you that this is a group that they're not vindictive. The five of us will be watching. This is a professional group I have the highest regard for. They heard us. They sat right here. I'm looking at Mr. Doolin, Mr. Schilling, and Mr. Walden. You're going to be in good hands. They heard from us that we want you to be able to build a house on the property. So short of you being over at the courthouse, let's see if we can't work this out. Because it doesn't do any of us any good, you or the county taxpayers, to let this go to the next level of a lawsuit

Okay. I make a motion that directs staff to create a building permit for this gentleman on his property.

Second. I will amend my, oh, was that the original motion? Yeah, I was changing my motion.

A building permit in violation of the LDRs and the comprehensive plan.

Any further discussion? No. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? Opposed. That motion passes 3-2 with Commissioners Hurd and Capps dissenting. Let's take a 10-minute break. Thank you. We are back, taking up Department 1, which is Office of Management and Budget Items, which require Board approval. Ms. Murley.

There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That motion passes unanimously. We'll take up Department 2, which is contracts that meet the threshold for board approval of $1 million or greater. Ms. Brotherton.

Thank you. Questions for Mr. Pertheson? Very well presented. Motion to accept that. Beautiful work.

Yes. I have a question. The, excuse me, 3,681,500, you're transferring from the capital reserves, so how is that going to be replenished? Let me pass that over to Mr. Donaldson.

Okay. I was trying to clarify, this is not an additional expense to our taxpayers, correct, to replenish that account?

This is not something that we're borrowing funds for. I think you and I had a discussion about.

Just wanted to be certain about that, because you and I spoke about another matter, I think, that dealt with borrowing funds.

Any further questions? There's a motion and a second. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That motion passes unanimously. Thank you. We will now take up Department 3, which is adoption of a resolution updating the list of county-owned properties appropriate for affordable housing under Resolution No. 24-6.15, adopted on June 18, 2024, and authorizing the sale of such properties through public auction.

Questions for staff? Would anyone from the public like to address us?

Okay, so I'm understanding it's to sell both parcels via auction, or the other is sell one parcel and then donate it to a land trust. Is that correct? Correct.

Mr. Ranieri, would you like to address this?

Thank you. I think that that's a great idea for several reasons. One, we We constantly speak about how we're trying to address affordable housing and transitional housing for our residents. This will be a concrete step to show that we're actually trying. It's not massive, but it's a step. It's like a starfish. And then also, we went through a tremendous amount of effort, both on the private side and the county employees, to create the land trust. And if all we do is create it and then just let it wither on its own, then we haven't accomplished much. So this is a step in the right direction to

Yes. Mr. Ranieri, who would be building this housing?

I think that this has been something that the Golden Gate community has looked at for years. And I would like to see it sometime in the near future because community, the land trust has been effective it seems in Hope Sound. I would love to have a presentation on sort of the status and the success, because I know Commissioner Jenkins and Commissioner Capps are very intricately involved in the land trust. But I will support this, but I would like to see the community land trust sort of a presentation in the near future on where they're at and where their vision is and where they hope to go. Sur

This is by way of review about what a land trust is for those who may not know. The land trust owns the land and the occupants of the housing own their house or their unit in the apartment building or condo building or whatever you want to call it. And this enables them to stabilize their housing costs and to build equity. Correct. Those are the purposes.

And also, this is just another example of a partnership that we're creating. And in order to protect Martin County's interests, we will, of course, have development agreements and contracts that will provide protection to the county for the contribution that the county is making in perpetuity. So we've done them with Habitat. We've done them with Miss Butterfly. They're different. The legal department makes sure that our interests are protected.

That guy right there is going to make sure. Those three.

So there's a motion and a second, right? Yes. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? That motion passes unanimously. Wonderful. Thank you.

We are now at the end of our meeting. Mr. Erler, would you like to speak to us? This is the end of our meeting. Okay. I don't see anybody else who needs to speak to us. Commissioner Hetherington, any further comments? I'm all set today. How about you, Commissioner Campy? You talked out yet?

No such thing. Oh, gosh. But I have nothing to add currently. Thank you. Commissioner Camps? And Commissioner Vargas? Thank you so much.