City Council - Special Meeting

How you doing? Okay, we're about to get started. It is six o'clock and we are having our special city council meeting September the 8th at 6 p.m. and this is regarding the Fiscal year 20 7 but that. Madam clerk.

Thank you, Madam Clerk. We will now have a moment of silence and the Pledge of Allegiance led by Vice Chair Spiritus.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Okay, are there any additional solutions or substitutions?

Can we add on to the agenda for discussion purposes, owner's rep? CITY'S OWNERS REP?

NO, FOR ALL OWNERS REP ENGINEERING, MOSTLY ENGINEERS, THE OWNERS REP ON OUR PROJECTS.

OKAY, IS KERRIN HERE? OR IS MR. BAILEY HERE? I SEE HIM SOMEWHERE. I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM. WE CAN ADD. IT'S A PROCUREMENT. OKAY. I WANTED TO JUST MAKE SURE IT'S APPROPRIATE. Madam Attorney, could we add that to the agenda? Madam Clerk?

And this is the regular agenda. This is not just for the budget. Okay. We can edit it.

12 under discussion yes on this rep mr chair please let the record reflect that mayor douglas lawson is present okay are there any further addition deletion the substitution hearing none i entertain a motion to approve the agenda as amended so moved been moved by vice chair spiritus seconded by Councilwoman Lanier. Is there any further discussion on the motion? Hearing no discussion, Madam Clerk.

Yes. Are there any disclosures for the agenda this evening? Hearing none, we'll move to

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

. . . . . . . . . . . We did adopt the regular agenda.

So we are under Item 9A, Ordinance is Offer Free. My motion to adopt the agenda was as amended.

Yes, as amended. That's correct. Madam Clerk, do you have something to say?

NEW SPEAKER THANK YOU, MADAM CLERK. I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADOPT THIS ORDINANCE. NEW SPEAKER SO MOVED. NEW SPEAKER IT'S BEEN MOVED BY VICE CHAIR SPIRITUS. NEW SPEAKER SECOND. NEW SPEAKER SECONDED BY COUNCILWOMAN LENIER. STAFF, WOULD YOU GIVE US A BRIEF PRESENTATION, PLEASE?

Walter, can we get the presentation up, please?

Okay, excuse me. Please let the record show that Councilwoman Miller-Anderson is now on the diet. Continue.

So, Director Sherman, with the request of the debt service, bonding, do we have an opinion of council that says whether or not the loan, I guess, that we're going to be taking for the City Hall project is not considered a bond and doesn't count towards THE CITY'S BONDING RATE LIMIT?

NEW SPEAKER EXCUSE ME, WE DID HAVE A PROPOSAL FROM THEM. AND IN THEIR PROPOSAL, IT SAID THAT THEY WERE GOING TO BE LEASING, AND THAT'S WHAT THE PREVIOUS CITY MANAGER TOLD ME, WE'RE GOING TO BE city hall so my question and i asked you this once before at a meeting is does this count towards the city's bonding limit and that's going to impact this as well so i would like to know something in writing an opinion from legal counsel telling us whether or not this counts towards our bonding limit or does not so if you have a capital and i can i can get something for you but and i'll i'll go there rat

So then it will be counted towards our bonding?

I finally got the answer that I've been looking for.

I think the city should have a written opinion from bond council on that anyway. Certainly, we can do that.

Thank you. Mr. Chairman, thank you on vice chair. Are you done? Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I'm just curious, how do we get to the 0.8 mils on the debt service millage? How is that determined?

Yes, Chair. I'm sorry for taking this up, but these are really important issues. Here we are now, you lowered the bonding limit, the percentage on the millage for the bond. Did you include the possibility that we might bond that $60 million in capital?

Okay, is there any further discussion? Mr. Chair? Yes. Vice Chair Spurgeon.

So, Mr. Sherman, do you have the $115 million in bonding included in this budget?

Okay, so the full $115 million. My concern to the City Council is not too different than the previous speaker. If this homestead law gets passed, we're going to lose $9 to $10 million. So do we have a plan B? What happens in November if this gets approved? What are we gonna do with our budget at that point? Do we have an exit ramp, a plan B where we can cut things at that point where we're over? I don't wanna do it at the last minute. We shouldn't have this pass and then all of a sudden we're running around like chickens without a head trying to figure out what we're gonna do with the budget.

So you're looking at the 40 employees and going back to 2022, but I don't know if that's going to do it because we have contractual obligations. We gave substantial raises from 2022 to now. So 40 may not do it.

Okay. And thank you for that. But if you could send that list out to us, because I understand that your thoughts and opinion, but I think the board should make the decision on what employees should be cut and should not be cut. Police and fire. What does the ballot initiative say when it comes to police and fire, when it comes to, if this passes, can that budget be cut? Can they be limited? Is this going to be the fiscal year? That's going to be the benchmark based upon that ballot initiative. Because to Dr. Spiritus's point, we need to make those cuts, but also at the same time, this doesn't

I mean, you'd have to go back and start cutting out certain programs.

But we as a board have to identify because staff took that out. But we have to make sure that they understand, to Mr. Sherman's point, what cross agencies can we work with at the county and state level to help bring additional programming and funds to the table? And that's exactly what intergovernmental affairs and economic development does. So I don't want just staff to make the determination of cutting positions when we understand what's the need of the community and where financially we can be. So that position we added back in, but that's going to be vital to bringing in more revenue and r

Perfect. It will be or it was. It will be reposted? It will be, yes, sir. And that's going to be Intergovernmental Affairs, Economic Development. Got it. So I think that that position will help, to Mr. Sherman's point, with bringing in some more revenue from the county, if we can kind of find those cross-programmings from non-profits, for-profits, and government agencies, and that's where they can go out and get those dollars for us. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Okay, so two more questions. I'm sorry, I just want to GET THIS OUT BECAUSE WE'RE VOTING AND IT'S OVER AFTER WE VOTE. SAND, YOU HAVE $1 MILLION BUDGETED AS PER THE COUNTY CONTRACT FOR SAND FOR SINGER ISLAND THIS YEAR. AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DO THAT AGAIN NEXT YEAR AS PER OUR AGREEMENT. YOU HAVE THAT IN THE BUDGET?

YOU KNOW THAT WE'RE PROBABLY GOING TO HAVE TO, UNLESS THE CITY MANAGER IS SUCCESSFUL, AND I KNOW I'VE BEEN LOBBYING THE COUNTY COMMISSION, HOPEFULLY THEY'LL COME TO THE PLATE AND PAY THEIR SHARE AND HONOR THEIR CONTRACT WITH US, AND I KNOW THERE'S EXIT RAMS THAT THEY COULD USE TO GET OUT OF THE CONTRACT, YOU KNOW, WHICH THEY'VE DONE ALREADY, AND HOPEFULLY THEY WILL COME BACK TO THE TABLE. THEY SAID THAT THEY ARE WILLING TO COME BACK TO THE TABLE IN THE FUTURE. HOPEFULLY THIS IS THE FUTURE. BUT WE HAVE TO BE PREPARED, HOPEFULLY UNDER THE DISASTER FUND, WE CAN GET THE ADDITIONAL $3 MILLION WE'LL

not sure why we even had that discussion then at the briefing when you said there was a 12 million dollar deficit if you would have explained it the way you just explained it now it would make more sense so you were talking about future budget the next year's budget and what the staff was asking not about the existing situation correct so existing we're we're right now on a balanced budget and we're headed to have a surplus of about a fund balance of about We'll have a bigger fund balance right from the previous years. What will our actual fund balance be?

So these aren't monies that you've already put into the next year's budget, are they? That fund balance or is that monies that we can't?

So we can't, well. It depends how you look at it. But we do have the ability to rebudget that fund balance money for other items, correct? Right. And do we know what the cash component of that is?

So then the fund balance will only be really $3 million. The rest of it is on paper based on cash and cash income coming in. When do you think that that will go? Well, it won't go up. It'll stay the same. That cash will stay the same at the end of the year. So we'll have about $3 million is what you're projecting. Okay, thank you.

Mr. Sherman, every year the state requires us to have a balanced budget. Is that correct? Correct. So we cannot carry a deficit into the next fiscal year. That's correct, right? Right, yeah. So every year, sometimes we think that somehow something that we may, and I'm not saying anybody in here, has a major deficit and it's going to be carried into the next year and we're going to be solid with that deficit The law doesn't allow us to do that. Go ahead.

The point is we cannot carry a deficit. We do not carry a deficit. My next question is, I know each department was required to cut so much out of their budget, whether the percentage or whether the fixed amount, how did that work this year?

Okay. Are there any further questions? Yes.

So then you didn't ask the department heads to cut anything from this year's budget?

I'm talking about this current fiscal year did we ask the employees to cut their budgets from this fiscal year no no let's go here now so it's only the future so instead of asking for a five percent increase you told them to stick to a two percent increase correct okay you think that would be enough if this new law gets passed

Okay, so then when the department heads do this, we save jobs. I'm sorry? If the departments do this correctly, we should be able to save some positions in the city rather than having to eliminate those positions. What did you figure that in with the 40 already? It'll save you from having to lay off individuals. So it will save us. Okay. So that's why it's important. And I just want to go for the record. I want to agree with Mayor Lawson. There are certain positions that actually make us money. We don't lose money. We make money from them, like in the governmental affairs department. I think i

And let me just say, I know at least one of those positions has already been ever fired, maybe two. I know the economic development position has been advertised. There was an issue that surfaced today that came to my attention about that position. Someone was applying for it. Okay, Mr. Sherman, are there any further questions? Seeing none, Madam Clerk.

And Mr. Sherman, there is going to be a presentation on the operational budget where we can have questions about each department,

So. And what did we get the public comment from the last time we did. OK, it's been moved by vice chair spirit. Seconded by Councilwoman Lanier. On the motion on discussion of the motion staff.

I see that our debt service fund is up to $11 million. Are we moving forward with submitting any applications to diversify our funding and some of the capital projects that we have, like a water plant? I know we talked briefly about WIFIA. We talked about some of the bonds. We talked about some other things. First question, where are we with the WIFIA? Have we submitted an application for that yet?

Sorry, before we go forward, you said that the WIFIA is the highest interest?

So that means we have not submitted an application?

I don't recall the board meeting or the decision of the board to make those decisions in regards to going with the SRF versus the WIFIA because of the, at the time, highest rate.

So that discussion was to not proceed with WIPIA?

So in my discussions with some legislators, EPA, and travelers to Tallahassee and Washington, understanding that the interest rate may have been higher, but the point of diversifying our financing options gave us the vehicles necessary to not max out our bonding capacities, to have other forgivable loans and grants and programming that we can actually go after. and also with the WIFIA application that gave us the other leverage to make sure that we could give some of that options forgivable. I remember Dr. Spiritus went up to Washington with the former mayor one time, and that's when the first

Thank you for that clarity. I understand that, but I'm thankful for the hopefully the public and maybe my colleagues. But what I'm trying to explain is we need to alleviate some of the pressure on our bonding capacity. These other vehicles and these other funding options alleviate those pressures to help with offsetting some of the costs to the residents. Even though the interest may be higher, these are other vehicles that we can look at. And we want to make sure we look at every funding vehicle versus just the bonding capacity. Because we've presented the lease back. We've presented the WIFI

Chair. Thank you, Mayor. Vice Chair Vierdijk.

So thank you, Mayor, for bringing that up and letting the public know where we were and where we are right now. As you know, Director Sherman, CDM has already put in an application for resiliency funds as well. And there are other funding sources out there that we're going for at this time. But I have been meeting with our congressional representatives on trying to get the WIPIA interest rate down. And I think I'm hoping that we will be successful in doing so. And that will make obviously the WIFIA program much more competitive. What are our interest rates right now?

right now we're probably closer to four and a half where we were with the 115 million so it's four and a half compared to 5.2 is it with you with 5.2 okay so the what what's the fixed rate though if you don't count srf because srf gives us not only money i think the public should know that the usrf they're probably going to get a 20 grant out of that as well as a loan interest loan uh but so what's the fixed rate on the on the uh the market rate that you went out in the general market?

About 4.5%. Okay. So we're basically looking for less than 2%. Yeah. Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Sherman and ACM, there were some items that we requested to be included in the budget. You all were going to go back and do some adjustments. And it was indicated that when we add somewhere, we had to take from somewhere because we have to have a balanced budget. We had that discussion. I don't know if you have that list, but I have a couple of items here that I remember that we asked for staff to go back and adjust. One of them was the COLA. Has that been adjusted?

I'm sorry, how much are we getting from sales tax? I'm sorry? Sales tax.

Is it based on what we produce, or is it just a general formula based on population?

I had a situation in New York, quite frankly, which was a general formula. It made no difference whether we created $100 million, $300 million in sales taxes. It made no difference. We got it all based on a formula.

I'm your chair. Good point. Mayor Lawson.

Thank you. Where is the parking revenue in regards to revenue?

Is it going to be in your presentation here that's coming up?

at the bottom of the enterprise fund parking fund.

So this slide is the general fund revenue, just the first line. This is the only fund we're looking at which is itemized. Correct. On the slide we're on. Thank you, sir.

NEW SPEAKER, IF WE CAN GO BACK TO THE BOND, $28 MILLION. SO THAT IS EVERYTHING EXCEPT EXCLUDING THE UTILITY DISTRICT.

Okay. So the 11, I just want to, I'm trying to figure out what we're paying for the bonds per year, you know, for what we, and you included the 115 million in there. And I guess the, The extra $20 million, $25 million we put into the police department and we did some road work. That's all in this number that we're paying out right now.

Okay. They're zero because of what now? I understand that we're going to carry some funds over, but why don't we reflect what we project it to be. That's just a question.

Chair. Mayor Lawson. That was my point. Thank you, Mr. Chair. The community grants program, we've decreased it, but we have funds available to move forward based upon what we actually applied for. The thing with that, I need staff to make sure that we're marketing it. And this is for Walter Communications advertising and putting it out like this education grant. We had a speaker come last week that discussed we need to advertise, make sure we bet it, put it out properly, give multiple organizations an opportunity, because what we heard for years is that the community benefits package that we h

Mr. Chairman, one of the questions that I often get is why doesn't the city have, and we used to create special programs last time I was here. We had a a roofing program for senior citizens that we had gotten some money from somewhere and we allocated it for doing roofs for senior citizens. But the question I get is why don't we have a home improvement option on the city side like the CRA side has? And I know it's on the limit, but my question is, and it may be a question for Mr. Sherman, could we use some of the home, I mean, some of the MEEHOP funds that will be coming in and delegate some o

As you said, that would be a good question for Mr. Sermons.

okay i'll address that later i don't think he's here well mr mr chair if i if i can comment on that we created a program we did that we did the renaissance and the reclaim cra was supposed to manage it here the funds in the mehop were used in other areas so we created a whole housing division so we need to allocate money and budget for housing department on the city side to help residents outside of the cra we did that in previous years but it wasn't followed by staff So this year we need to allocate a dollar amount, make sure the programs implemented across the city and make sure those funds

served a time in our society. Correct. Chair? It may be on fixed income now.

So I think we need to just finish those comments. We need to make sure that those monies are directly budgeted for a housing department, and we use those funds, and they can be replenished from MHOP, because we've been waiting on MHOP to possibly pay into it. But now that MHOP is now an ordinance that will be on second reading, we'll have more money coming in, but we need to allocate money for the housing department now.

We would need to put that in an ordinance, I think, in order to effectuate that. Vice Chair Spiritus and then Council Member Lanier.

Mayor, I do believe that the CRA did receive funding from the state. The state had a program. It was for everyone in the state to fix their roof. and some other critical structural things on their homes. And I believe the CRA was a recipient of those funds. And they did leverage that, I think, with some of their own money. That's a very worthy program. If we want this to become a self-sufficient program for the future, you might want to consider making it a very low interest loan for some people and a grant for others, depending upon THE FINANCIAL SITUATION, BUT IF WE MAKE IT A LOW INTEREST LO

NEW SPEAKER GOOD IDEA. THANKS. VICE, COUNCILWOMAN LYNN AIR.

Wait, wait, wait. Did you understand that there's going to be a carryover in those areas?

And where do we cut to fund it? When we add somewhere, we have to cut somewhere.

Now, how much is being carried over at each?

So educational, it's going to be more than what it was allocated last year. Is that how I'm understanding that, Mr. Sherman? You said the education is going to be $250,000. $250,000. And it was allocated $200,000 last year?

OKAY. SO I THINK THAT ONE IS ON POINT FOR WHAT IT'S BEEN. IT'S GOING TO BE 250. OKAY. WE'LL VOTE ON IT.

OUT OF THE HUNDRED, IT'S GOING TO BE 60 THERE.

I think I can probably work with the... Just the destined area to reduce the $40,000.

What are you saying? That's going to be 250 in the educational. Are you suggesting taking 40 away from that and making, what are you suggesting?

Yes. So this is where an intergovernmental affairs person comes into play, there is a tremendous amount of money out there for community grant type programs in the state and in the federal government and private, by the way. So I think that we'll be able to make up that $40,000 if we hire a competent intergovernmental affairs person.

Councilwoman Miller-Anderson, what's your organization called?

Wait, wait, wait, slow down. The city administration, I've seen in the governmental affairs, Where is the economic development position?

Chair? I said six months, I see three months there for freezing those positions.

Yes. Councilwoman Lanier, then we'll go to public comments.

And another purpose is to be independent from the city. And the way it is situated, not reporting to the city manager is totally inappropriate.

We're going to have to go to a referendum. And I do think that it's time to review the charter again. It hasn't been reviewed in five, six, seven years. That is a living document. And when people know when I said living, it requires changes as we identify issues that need to be addressed. Sometime soon, I want to talk about establishing a charter committee that can make some recommended changes to the charter and at some point, it'll go back out to the people to vote on. Chair. Yes.

NEW SPEAKER I AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUE ABOUT THE INTERNAL ORDER. very important that that person be independent it's also very important that that person meet all the requirements to be hired and it's also very important that that person not share information with members of our committees and boards and the community because things are coming back to me that i haven't even heard yet so i think we have to tighten up on that and hopefully the city manager RIGHT NOW CAN WORK ON THAT? THAT'S BECAUSE IT'S TIED TO THE CITY MANAGER. IT'S NOT COMING FROM THE CITY MANAGER. IT'S COMING DIRECTLY FROM THE GO AHEAD. YOU'RE INTENTILE TO YOUR OPINION, COUNCILMAN.

I strongly disagree with my colleague. I have information that she does not have, obviously. And I can tell you that... I didn't say that this person does not have the qualifications. I said, whoever we hire and keep in this position should have those qualifications. So I'm just going to go through those qualifications and I will do a comparison. I haven't had the time to do that yet because this internal auditor was hired one, two, three, and we will do that. Thank you.

Mr. Chair, I'm his next speaker. Vice Chair Spiritus and then Mayor Lawson, and we've got to move on.

Okay, thank you. I just think the members of the council should become familiar with what the rules and regulations in the law are pertaining to an internal order and a state investigation. and what information is allowed to be discussed and shared with the community and what is not. Clearly, that's not the case of what's going on right now. And we'll look into it. Thank you.

Mayor Lawson, and then we move it on with our budget. Thank you.

And to that point, we shouldn't be discussing qualifications, whether they are or not for an employee. This is not our employee. And if the charter or the law states they should report to us, we can make that determination. But to just discuss whether they are or not qualified, they were not hired by us. And if state law does require us to make that hire and they report directly to us or an outside agency will do that. I don't think this is the proper audience or the proper environment for us to discuss the qualifications of our auditor. So what we'll do as a board is just direct staff. Do we

I heard Councilwoman Miller, Anderson, then vice chair Spiridon, and we're going to cut this conversation off.

Are we not are we going to hear from the department? Individually?

We've already heard from each of the departments.

Put a motion on the floor and let's vote on it.

I know. I'm just saying we can settle it for the motion on the floor. And that's fine.

I know you got your two. But the thing is, I know we talked about it before. And that's how we came to the conclusion of having this additional having this meeting and the other meeting, because we said that we would continue with what did not take place. So I'm just trying to figure out when did things change where we said we were not going to hear the rest of the department give their presentations. Like they always do. I mean, I don't know what, did something change?

If you have any questions for any department.

Well, I would like to if I could see their presentation.

Okay. And all due respect to the mayor, we vote on funding every one of these employees, and we have a fiduciary responsibility to know what their jobs are, what their qualifications are, and what the responsibility of that position is. Thank you.

Okay, we're moving on unless there's a motion on the floor to do anything different.

I'm trying to understand why do I need to make a motion for something that is always a part of the presentation? When was it determined we were not?

I'll tell you why. Some of us have said that we've heard the presentations. We were here. I'm not prepared to go back through all of that again. I'm just saying put a motion on the floor. My mind is not going to change. Just put a motion on the floor.

Chair, can I just talk about this point? The city attorney, the city manager, the legislative group, we had the same conversation about a week or so ago where it was on the agenda for them to present, but then it was, oh, it wasn't, it was a mistake. It shouldn't have been written that way and all of this different stuff. And then I asked then, could we get them to, since we had time, could they go ahead and start doing it? I don't know, whoever didn't want to, I guess we had three that didn't want to do it. It didn't happen. Or it was that, oh, we have more days that we can, HAVE THIS MEETING

COUNCILMEMBER LENIER. I heard Mayor Lawson first and then on Councilwoman Lanier and then we're going to move on or somebody put a motion on the floor. We're not going to go back and forth about what we thought we were going to do and we're sitting here being a dead horse. I see you breathing over there, Ms. Attorney. Did you want to say something? Go ahead, Attorney Wood.

And that was my point, Mr. Chair. I wasn't sure which departments Ms. Miller-Anderson was looking for. But if we could just identify whatever departments that we hadn't heard from, because I think the board heard from every department. But if there was something that was missing, of course, they can bring that back. There was a certain... Ms. Miller and Ms. Lanier just identified a few, but I believe Mr. Sherman did give a presentation on those departments that you just named. So we've heard from every department individually.

Wait, wait. They fall under a department. They fall under city administration. we have a presentation from city administration yes we heard divisions not no we're not going through every level of the city we'll be here for two weeks on every level of the city we should be hearing it we we got it from the city administration when the city administration gave their presentation look please put the motion on the floor we're about to move this is the I'm not sitting here to 2 o'clock this morning because somebody else did. They've done this. I'm not going back through this.

They fall under recreation. They fall under the departments that gave presentations. Jesus. What's up? Public comment, please.

They fall under departments that we heard from.

If you have any questions, you can ask them.

We talked about the legislative budget. Did I miss that one?

Remember the same. We left it the same. We took $1,000 off and we left it the same. $10,000. We did all of that.

I will entertain a motion to approve this item. So moved. It's been moved by Vice Chair Espiritis. Seconded by Councilwoman Davis-Preneur. On discussion of this item, staff.

And that's including the pool over at the Callaway?

ON THE MOORING FIELD, DO WE HAVE A COST ESTIMATE ON WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST PER BALL?

What I'm asking, you know, in the mooring fields, we have those big concrete balls that float that they hook up and they're anchored to the ground by us and they just hook up to that ball. I just want to know what the cost is per ball so we figure out what size mooring field, if we want to do a mooring field, what size mooring field and what our cost would be to get it implemented. That's all. Awesome.

But Mr. Sherman, you do know that the people do not want 80 slips there. So the council is going to have to work on that number based on what the community tells us when we hold that meeting. Come back with the actual drawings. Thank you.

okay um public comment card mary bram chair this is just for this item yes uh next i'm gonna go right into the general public comment okay

We need to vote on the motion that was on the floor for the public comment. Okay. Madam Clerk.

Okay. We're going into the general public comment. portion of our meeting now. Public comments shall begin at 7.30 p.m. unless there is no further business of the City Council, which in that event, it shall begin sooner. In addition, if an item is being considered at 7.30 p.m., then comments from the public shall begin immediately after the item has been concluded. Please be reminded the City Council Board has adopted rules of decorum governing public conduct during official meetings. which has been posted at the front desk in an effort to preserve order. If any of the rules are not adhered to

OK, madam, we're going to get somebody to help you. Right now, there are two assistant chiefs in the back. Turn around and see those two guys right there raising their hand. Please go to them right now. ACM. Already had a discussion with them. They're waiting on it. Tomorrow, I want to know how they resolved it. Absolutely.

Thank you for your comment, ma'am. No problem. Thank you.

Next speaker, please. Excuse me, Miss Ruth. Excuse me, ma'am. Oh, you're going. Okay.

Thank you for your comment. Next public speaker.

On a serious note, we do need to address how we're going to deal with those who paid up front. I know that could be a yeoman's task. We cannot just do it for one person. We need to develop a process by which to address that. And then whatever we vote on, that's what it's going to be.

I did want to make a comment about the speaker. If the board could entertain me for just one moment. If I could have Director Neiman come to the front, please. There were comments made at previous meetings by staff, employees came to this microphone and concerns. And I believe there was a concern with a specific employee. Director Neiman, the employee stated that they weren't given an opportunity. In March of this year, was there an email sent out to offer an opportunity for the employee that spoke in the microphone? And was that an acting role to help with assisting with training and elevation of that employee?

And they're currently employed. So residents, when we hear certain narratives or people come to the microphone, let's get the entire story before we put or chastise a director, an employee, or anybody within this community. This is also a message for all of our employees. This is an organization where we're trying to be as transparent and honest as possible. So I need my employees not to come to the mic to have discussions and issues that cannot be resolved with their staff. or handled within administration. As I say in every agenda review, let's keep the business of the city underneath the wr

with the executive director. But since you brought this up, I'm going to ask you a real simple question. Did you recommend that those two employees be given the position and be put on a temporary basis?

THANK YOU. YOU ANSWERED MY QUESTION. THANK YOU SO MUCH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR. Thank you very much.

and i'll leave it at that okay and let me just say i wasn't going to say anything um you was about to say something yeah i just want to be cautious with the board because some of these internal issues are being handled with hr and other entities that are looking at all of these issues so um let me just say that i i support mr nieman fully if there was a mistake made um and i don't know it is i don't know what the year was But he had never said anything to me that wasn't true. And people have their own agenda of why they attack certain people. And I'm just saying from my perspective, if there w

You're talking about yours. Okay. I'm sorry. Finish your point. Okay. You spoke your experiences. I'm speaking my experiences. My experiences are good.

my and the utility department is doing a lot better under mr neiman since he's been here right chair i believe he's doing a lot better because of the employees who are there chair but we will get off of that yeah we'll get on for that yeah i just i just want to follow up what you said i just want to make it very clear that mr neiman has done an excellent job uh we now have clean safe water coming through our pipes we've upgraded our existing water plant our new water plant is well under construction right now you can drive by you'll see all the work going on there my hat is off to the board an

Next item. We have 12C under discussion.

AS LONG AS YOU MAKE IT GERMANE TO THE BUDGET.

OKAY. WELL, IT WILL BE GERMANE TO THE BUDGET. CAN WE HAVE MS. AYMANS COME TO THE MIC, PLEASE? Good evening, Director Ammons.

Thank you. You know I respect you and I think you're doing a great job. I'm just bringing this up just so that we can have a discussion about it and maybe moving in a different direction, maybe stay in the same direction. I'm not sure yet. Yes, sir. We did have a discussion about owner's reps before this council, and it was my understanding that we were, well, you advised us that the list that we had who are owner's reps. And just so everyone knows, an owner's rep is usually an engineer or an engineering company that we hire to make sure they were getting what we paid for based on the contract

But we're talking about millions of dollars right now. So this does have an impact on our budget and how we're going to function. I just think that we'd be better off putting together a list of experienced engineering firms, and I think that we should tighten up our RFP and RFQ requirements for this. It should be an engineering firm. It should not just be a construction manager. You know, when you're talking about building a $45 million, you know, firehouse or a $400 million water plant, you know, it's important that you have engineers doing that, not just the construction manager. Constructio

I've got a question. When we prepare a rotating list of owner's reps, how long does that list last?

So my question is, the rotation of the list only lasts so long and then you go back out to develop another list.

Understood. Chair? Yes. Vice Chair Spiridon.

So to build on your comments and direct names, we're going to have a lot of projects. city projects that are coming out. I mean, I noticed you said, of course, you made it clear that the UD district's projects weren't included. The UD district has about five or six projects, major projects, that are going to be coming out of the ground real soon, if not already coming out of the ground. But then the city has, of course, the Marina project. And we have other projects. Do we have an owner's rep on the related project?

Right, Chair. So just, you know, we have a substantial amount of money invested in that project as well. and we want to make sure that our money is being used in the right way and we're getting our money's worth out of it. It's important that we have an owner's rep. You do know that that lease expires and then the project becomes owned by the city. It clearly is not going to be me sitting here when that happens, but someone's going to be sitting here. We have to look out for the future generations. So I think it's important that we have an owner's rep on projects, even when we lease them, as l

I think we can put the discussion on another meeting, the owner's rep process. We can have a discussion of how we want to do it and give you all time and us time to think about how we feel would be the best process. And we can even have discussions in the interim with staff. and then come in to here with the discussion. Did you have a comment? No, that was me. Ms. Attorney?

Understood. But the issue with the owner's rep in general.

OKAY. AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.

CHAIR, CAN WE PUT THIS ON THE NEXT CITY COUNCIL?

CAN WE TAKE A VOTE ON WHETHER OR NOT WE'RE CONSISTENT ON GIVING THIS DIRECTION?

WITH THIS SPECIAL MEETING, WE CAN TAKE A VOTE IF YOU LIKE.

Make sure you all agree. It's a consensus. Next meeting. OK. Thank you. OK. ACM closing comments. Please talk into your mic.

If I could just add on that, that's the people in Lakeview Park had that discussion that what was happening is one of the boat operators, commercial boat operators, was bringing their boat down a residential street rather than using the street that was really set up for the larger boats. And it was causing all kinds of havoc in their neighborhood. So I know that it's being looked at by the city engineer and city staff.

Chair. Councilwoman Miller-Anderson. No comment. Councilwoman Lanier.

Chair, I would just like to bring up that we should look at in the future oversight of our projects that where we give money to other agencies, whether it be CDC, housing authority, what oversight does the city have? And that might be with the owner's rep discussion at the next meeting to make sure that we continue to have oversight to make sure that we are getting what we put our money into. Okay.

And our next regularly scheduled meeting has been moved from the 16th to the 20th.

Yeah, I mean, 22nd. So that would be considered our next meeting there. Councilwoman on David's premiere.

I just want to apologize for being late. I had to go to my job for this evening, but I do have a question. I do have a question. Where did we end up with the internal auditor? Is that going to be coming back up or what? What would you say? And I want to walk in at the end.

Oh, that was a discussion whether they were going to give a presentation or not. And that's when we had the discussion that they fell under the city's managers. I mean, the city administration's presentation.

OK, I know when I got here, it was more disgusting than whole position. So I'm saying that.

Oh, yeah. Not in public. There was some we we did have a discussion about revisiting our charter that said that position REPORTS TO THE CITY MANAGER.

SO WHO IS REVISITING AND WHEN WILL WE GET INFORMATION ON IT?

NO, WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS ESTABLISHING A CHARTER REVIEW COMMITTEE BECAUSE IT'S IN THE CHARTER WHO SHE REPORTS OR WHO THAT POSITION REPORTS TO. AND THAT IS HOW WE'RE GOING TO ADDRESS IT THROUGH A CHARTER INITIATIVE. OKAY, THANK YOU. MAYOR LAWSON, YES.

No, it was just brought up tonight. It was.

Okay, well, I want to go a little deeper into it. So that's why I'm asking. I heard you all saying that it's not appropriate to do it here. So I want to make sure that it is addressed. Yeah. We.

Staff. we need to address establishing a charter review committee and the processes associated there too that's the first step yes sir i was just advised we could probably get with the clerk and go back and see how the first one was established and then we'll move forward and then we can decide if we want to follow the same process or alter it or or as long as we stay within the parameters of the law

Okay. That's another item to put on our next agenda on the 22nd. Mayor Loftus. Thank you.

Just want to announce that we have the Healthy Lives, Healthy Wallets initiative. It's been launched. It's on the city website under the mayor's page. That is from the grant that Mr. Range wrote. And that'll be a initiative to help with families, low income, moderate income families, in our community. So you can go online, register for the actual program. There's 35 families that we will be accepting. The program will start October 1, but we are marketing and advertising it now. So please go online and register for Healthier Lives, Healthy Wallets.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mayor. I have no comment. Meeting adjourned.