Board of Commissioners - Regular Meeting

Yes, thank you so much for this. Going back to the first performance measure, I'm just curious. So having lived in suburban Ramsey County for almost, well, three and a half decades now, I will just say, you know, when our kids were going through school in Roseville, the percentage of of kids of color and the diversification of people went from about 15% to over half in the 15 to 18 years that we were there. And then when I was working in White Bear Lake, that school districts were also seeing those changing in demographics. So I'm really happy to see. that we, as a county, are working to make

And I'm also curious to see if there's any exponential or a positive factor of the cities who also had their own programs, meaning if Shoreview and Roseville have been encouraging some of their programs as well, do we see that having kind of primed the pump or created a culture of those programs being available or any kind of way that we are coordinating them, if we're seeing the results greater in certain communities, and maybe we have more work to do in other communities. I'm just thinking of the role that we can play in encouraging our local partners to take advantage of whatever levers we

Well, and I just want to say that throughout my time, I've been at a number of these community economic development and different kinds of meetings with the municipalities and community where Ramsey County has been at the table and providing information. And I really do appreciate that as do people in community.

Thank you, Madam Chair. First off, I just want to say thank you for selecting these two measures, especially about our impact in the community and then also identifying who or which residents are utilizing the program. That is really the only way that we can build in and make sure that there aren't any racial inequities in access to our programs. I know you mentioned some of this too around the limitations of the program. What is the average number of families that we're helping through these two programs?

And do you also have data on kind of the family size or is that asked?

Okay, yeah, I think it's really important as we talk about and how we invest in our programs and then also just as where we've been talking about how we may have a bigger impact and where is that, Overall, we need more housing units, period, across all the continuum of housing. So that's why if our cities are doing rehab programs, the state has home ownership programs, I don't think it's a bad time for us to consider about our role in supporting the development of more housing units as well as more on the continuum that includes both supportive housing and other types of housing as well. So I

Thank you, Madam Chair. And thank you, Director Olson, for this presentation. My question is around the percentage of the first-time homeowners who are also first-generation homebuyers. As we look, I guess I would love to get insights on the county's role as we look towards the future and knowing that there are a few developments, redevelopment projects that are coming our way, whether it's as Rice Creek Commons or in Falcon Heights or in St. Paul, even though we don't serve as the land use authority for these properties, what role do we have to better influence the creation of more stock to p

No, that's helpful to hear and encouraging to know that we are, despite the limitations that we have over some of the control of how these things are pulled together, that we are leveraging whatever influence we do have to really push these projects and these developers to really consider the needs that we have as a county. The other piece, it's not listed as a performance measure, but I think it's also really important. And I appreciate you highlighting the performance measures that you did. But I also have been thinking more about the who. Who's developing these different properties, these d

Thank you. I apologize for my tardiness, so if this has been covered, please bear with me. So on our first slide here, is this data, I understand this is our data from our programming, but is this data from that year that they close, or is it from the year that they go on to our property tax system? And I guess, do you want me to continue where I'm going with this? And I ask this just because maybe it'd be good if we had data or do we have data that kind of shows the bigger picture? Because if this is just for our program, like I see the American Indian community is at 1%, but I know that ther

Thank you, Madam Chair. Just thank you so much for all of your work in your departments. When I first got elected here, which wasn't all that long ago, a little over 10 years, I said, what are we doing about housing? And they said, that's not what counties do. We don't do this. That's what city, other people do that. And so you have come so far and it's just so amazing and exciting that the work, that the community and economic development group has done, and I agree, Madam Chair, that we just need more housing. We need more funds to go into affordable housing, and you were talking about the d

It opened up a door that was not there. It's one of the things that happened. We didn't have the ability to do it.

Yes. I just want to say that to the point that we're all talking about, about the role of the county and the newness of the emphasis on this, the idea that we talk about St. Paul and then suburban Ramsey County, but just a reminder that Ramsey County is made up of part or all of 19 unique municipalities. where local zoning code, planning commissions, all the different dynamics within the multitudes of neighbors and goals and wants of the local community come into play when we talk about getting shovels in the dirt and housing built. And so I really appreciate that you talk about new data oppor

Okay, so if we go back to our first slide of the number of culturally specific community engagement sessions held, I kind of have a couple questions. So one, what does that engagement look like, and how did that change the way we do the work? So do we know if this engagement encouraged communities of color who we were engaging with to participate or attend some of these events? these locations. Like I've been to Battle Creek many times, Water Park. I know the makeup of the people who use it, but like Manitou Ridge Golf Course, right? Like did that encourage more communities of color to come an

That makes sense. Thank you. And then the total acreage for the next slide. I know you gave us some examples that, yes, you do partner with other organizations, but can you give me a specific of where? Is this where we're thinking of when you remodeled the golf course and we added in some of that, more of that natural landscape in that area? Is that the space we're talking about here? Or is it more going into our parks and not mowing it or planting more natural or...

Okay, and then I guess my last question here goes to the last slide. Do we have attendance data on who attended these culturally specific facilitated programs? I mean, I think it's wonderful that we hosted them and we contracted with people, but do we know who attended them and how many and just if that work is being fruitful and it's actually meeting the need of the community?

And then when we charge the fee, do we charge the fee for straight across anybody who wants to attend them? So whether you're a Ramsey County resident or whether you're a non-resident to participate in them, it's the same amount? And I only ask that because I went to Anoka County Park for my son's birthday. Let me tell you, they charge for everything. So I'm just saying, do we have similar fee structures where we're charging non-residents and residents Different fees for using our services with Commissioner Miller.

I've heard similar that they charge for use of their dog parks. They charge for use of parking, right? And I'm just curious at how much revenue that helps generate that can go back into programming. I saw in a slide ahead that you haven't got to that some of the funding challenges to restore lands is that maintaining them. Well, I wonder if this is an area that we could use to offset that cost and help with that. So we're still following our climate equity plan, but we're also being you know, fair and equitable to our residents as well.

Thank you, Madam Chair. And thank you, Director McCabe, for the presentation. A couple of questions going back to the culturally specific community engagement. As you look towards the future in the next few years, are there any specific groups or organizations or even demographics that you're hoping to increase engagement with?

Gotcha. And kind of a follow-up to that, have we, have you all as a department, utilized some of the different communication platforms? I'm thinking specifically of, you know, Mung TV or the launch of the new podcast as ways to further engage folks in the community.

That's great to hear. My next question is around the culturally specific programs. Seeing that residents not feeling safe or comfortable to participate in activities, a piece of that I wonder and want to get your perspective is maybe a lack of that representation in the room, specifically of the makeup of our staff, of those who are coming up with these different ideas and ways to engage and ways to to come up with the different programming. Would you say that there is room for us to go to ensure that our staff, parks staff, really reflects the diversity of the county?

No, I think that's encouraging to hear and to know that that's something that you'll be focusing on is great. And I just bring it up because as we think about some of the trepidations by residents, of course, who's presenting is an important piece. I wanted to make sure that we're thinking, you know, the step before that of, like, who's in the room making the recommendations and coming up with the ideas to ensure that they, you know, reflect the challenges, the concerns, the different areas that we know we can build excitement with certain communities and to make sure that those folks who refl

Yeah, I really appreciate that you're lifting that up, Chair. I come from a park and rec background when I worked in older adult services. And even really well-intended folks, I think that there's a reason why football and soccer fields were accommodating to each other and pickleball and tennis courts have been accommodating to each other. It's because the park and recs department know that their parents and their kids are engaged in those sports. And it may be why perhaps culturally we don't have badminton and volleyball together as easily or cricket and baseball fields coming together so eas

And that's my follow-up, which is the idea of alignment of park and amenities against the other opportunities within a community, whether it's a municipal park, whether it's school district parks or playgrounds, whether it's private or nonprofit, you know, is there a big YMCA that has really great amenities in the neighborhood? Just to make sure that we're using our investments and the taxpayers' dollars and creating as, you know, in a collective space to say to ourselves, not only where are there gaps that we can fill, but where are there duplications where we could step back? And just making

Yeah, and I'll just say, knowing that, too, within our Building Stronger Together, where we are doing our best to look at, you know, what is the best use of all of the things that we have? How are we maximizing a benefit to community? And so I appreciate that strategic coordination.

Thank you, Madam Chair. First, I just really want to say the work that your department does is so dynamic in terms of the facilities, the space, and the amount of work. So that's why probably choosing some of the performance measures is difficult too. And I also wanted to say that it's reflective of the work that you are doing in terms of the engagement. and also using that engagement to help inform the programming and the work that you're doing. So I just want to say thank you for doing that. A suggestion I have is I think you're on this track already about the number of specific community en

Yes, that's great. And then for the TCO arena or some of our, I don't know if any other big ones, but TCO is the one that comes to my mind. But I know that we have like open skating hours. I think a feedback or like what I've experienced too and also heard is that folks who haven't ice skated, like even though we have ice skate that's free there, folks don't know how to use it. So is there like an intro course or some programming that you can introduce and say this is an intro course or just an hour to learn? basics of how to ice skate as an example.

Yes, absolutely. And then my other one is just around kayaks that you had mentioned too. There is a barrier for just to be able to have equipment, right? Like if you have a kayak, you need a big car. You need storage. And so do we have rentals available for kayaks too? And are we looking at our regional lakes and areas where it is accessible or up to the standard that we have in other lakes throughout the county?

Okay, yeah, that is great to hear. And then finally, I just want to name that for your culturally specific facilitated programs and services slide here, I just want to highlight and uplift that these are things that you're considering and have been doing too, such as purchasing equipment, program equipment, such as bikes, archery equipment, fishing gear, cross-country skis, to reduce barriers to access. So I think it's just really important that we lift that up and about how you're taking the feedback that you're already hearing from community members and implementing it.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Just thank you so much for your presentation, for all the work that you and your team are doing, Director McCabe. You have a... It's a challenge to be balancing, you know, all of the different needs of our community and, you know, where our parks are and making facilities available for everyone in every way. And I think you're working on it and thank you for all your continued work in that. Just to, I so appreciate the questions of my colleagues. And I just want to highlight that I appreciate that you're available to partner with community when community comes to you. A

Good morning, or mid-morning. Good morning. Okay, my question goes back to, let's go to our first slide. I have a couple questions. So with rating of the county road pavement and I understand that 17% of our county roads are in poor condition or rated in poor condition. My first question, are these roads that we maintain or are they just in general all roads in Ramsey County?

We maintain, not our county roads that the city of St. Paul maintains. It includes that, okay. And then my next one goes to, is the future investments that we're making and the plans we have to fix some of these roads, does that help us reach our goal or bring us close to our goals of 14% by 2028 and then 12% for 2030?

It does, okay. And then does this also, like how does that work with the transfer of roads? I know that we've transferred a few roads into our system or we've transferred a few roads out of our system over the last six to eight months. How does that also tie into, and I know like in White Bear Lake, like we've made it very clear we will not take over ownership of that road until it is fixed, right? Right, right.

Yeah, it does Okay, and then the last point it says the data is collected by MnDOT every other year We do our I'm assuming do that we do our own data collection on and assessments on our roads as well Or are we just taking MnDOT's? Collection and what do they do with that information? Is it like score like hey Ramsey? You're up here at 17% but Hennepin's at 20 or Anoka's at 14, right?

Okay, thank you for that detailed information. Okay, I'm going to skip now to the third slide on the chloride level. I know that this is the average across all Ramsey County lakes. Are we seeing higher numbers in certain areas and are we doing a targeted approach for those areas?

I'm not sure. I know this talks about our usage, but how do we partner with our cities to know their usage as well? I have a few constituents that reach out to me about this topic often, so I'm kind familiar with some of this information. And then with our benchmark, are we measuring, like, is there a water quality benchmark we're trying to get to versus the usage of the chloride?

And then when we do road updates, I'm sure we take into consideration the water runoff and where the wastewater enters the system at and how can we prevent that spread. So maybe adding a curb and here's the sewer or making sure it gets into where it's supposed to go.

Okay, perfect. Thank you for that. And I just want to also say, driving on White Bear Avenue is so nice now. So thank you very much for getting that part done. Yeah, that's exactly why. So I have no more further questions. Thank you.

I really appreciate your line of questioning, Commissioner Miller. And it goes along with some of my questions as well. Yes, I love it when, after the county has done a road, I just, I love being on that road. And one of my constituents had a good monitor or measure. He would write to me and say, my teeth are rattling on that, you know, on that county road. So now it's a teeth rattling measure. So when I'm driving on a road, I'm like, is this a county road?

So I really appreciate the work that you're doing because as much as we get a little frustrated by detours, I'm so excited that almost everywhere I go in the county, there's a detour and I'm on a county road and we're getting some work done. So thank you. Thank you for that. I appreciate it. I'm happy to have the extra time to help our roads be safer for our residents. So thank you for that. And just thank you for all of your responsiveness to my constituents. You know, I have constituents, they live in a senior condo that's next to a road that we're redoing. And they're very nervous that the

Yeah, so we just, because of just all, is Hennepin the first, is that it? Yeah. And the second, yeah, just because of the times that you can, so it's a density kind of issue.

And I really appreciate that. I will say that you probably all felt this as well when you get new development or redevelopment in your area and the entities want to put an entry level, a driveway in and out of a county road and we say, our engineers say, no you can't because it's not safe. But they said, no, but then you can't get into our business. And we said, well, you have to go this way then. So I have a number of developments in my area, I'm sure we all do, where we've had to say, here's how you have to redevelop this. Because as you said, we're an older county, and we have a lot of acce

Yeah, thank you, Madam Chair. So given that this is an issue that we hear from our residents all the time, could you just very concisely remind folks, if constituents want to know how their neighborhood roads have been rated and when they may be next scheduled for replacement or repavement, where should they go and how do they track projects that are ongoing in their neighborhoods?

Thank you. And then if there is a project ongoing, is there a way for them to get updates if it is a major project?

Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. I just have a question about the rate of crashes, the county road system, too. Is that data that's available on our website, too? Where may the public access this information?

Okay. And then for the county road pavement condition, do you have a list or an order of priorities for this in the work plan that you have for addressing it?

Okay. Yeah, I'm just trying to tie in also just the performance measure here to not only the Building Stronger Together one that you had identified, but our transportation and transit plan as well that I don't know if we'll get yearly or annual updates on it, but I just wanted to

Yeah, that's great. And then the last point is just around, I don't know if this would be a measure that you would consider, but just around community engagement around the projects that we're leading. making sure that we are engaging community members that are reflective of the community there, as well as the different types of users on our facilities. I know that, at least for the White Bear Avenue corridor study, I'm seeing good results from that engagement, but I think it's equally important to keep track of as we work to build the plan, but also to secure additional funds that's outside o

yeah okay yeah thank you and then um manager just the last point and also for consideration for um a metric in the next two years for the next supplemental one is um i know that we moved uh some of the contracting um and tracking um who we're uh contracting with um whether that be like the small women minority owned businesses for construction um is that we we should be able to track that as well for our public works department that I would like to see us because it connects in with our other strategies around building intergenerational wealth and it's something that's across departments as we

But when it comes to... My point is we made a slight policy change about best value, right? And we were starting with public works. So that's why I wanted us to start measuring that.

I'm just going to put this out there. Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm just going to put this out there because we're all trying to resist the temptation to talk to you about all things public works related. And for me, it's all things like active living, parks and trails. But I'm just going to put it out there because this will probably come before us in the legislative package, I hope. is this new phenomenon that's affecting our trails and our walkers and bikers is the motorbikes. It's these really fast bikes that young kids are using and they're impacting people's willingness to go on our trails

I will say that. do other trails are feeling it as well.

Any trails around like ride those scooters and those bikes. You're talking about me taking away the fun.

Because I own an electric bike. I mean, don't take away my electric bike. But we do want to see some regulation or whatever. I think legislators will be dealing with it. We'll probably be dealing with it. Just wanted to present it as an issue that I think we're going to have to work on, because we want people to have fun.

You can take that. We won't lock you in.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Let's see. I just had first had some question around the first measures, the assessment quality and equity percentage of prioritized compliance measures met. I'm curious, from 2024 to 2025, what helped to make that change to 100%?

Okay, great. And then for the restrictive covenant discharge here, I'm glad to see that that's what you're working towards of canvassing and meeting with all of the property owners there. I think that's a good measure for us to continue to look at. And then the other one for consideration for performance measure is actually the property tax refund, the homestead property tax refund rates. Because we always hear from residents about our property taxes, but it's also a low income household, seniors, and even veterans. would be eligible for it, too. And maybe this is a cross-departmental work bet

Yeah, okay. Yeah, and I don't know where this lives or which department it lives, but I know that there was an effort by the county a few years ago encouraging residents to utilize a website about where they are owed dollars and actually collecting it, right? So I don't know where that can live or where we can continue to measure that, but that's essentially money that's left on the table that our residents are leaving. So I just want to make sure that we continue to monitor and or find a way to continue to promote that.

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for all of your and your department's great work, Director Chapman. We really appreciate it, because we do get calls from residents about their property taxes and their values. have a lot of questions about maybe if they've gone up or not because they've done some work on their house, or maybe the person next door did. So I appreciate that you are answering all those questions and are helping our residents understand their differences in value. So first of all, just appreciate that. applaud your efforts to deal with the restrictive covenant discharge. I've

It's a great connection to communities. Really, I agree. Just being out there I think helps people feel listened to and heard like someone is paying attention. Okay, so thank you so much for that. I know it's not one of your measurements. I'm just curious, you know, about calls to the assessor's office regarding their property tax values. You know, does that pretty much stay about standard or, you know, the same? Are there times that that's been way higher than others? This is calls about value and, you know, property tax and such.

And I just want to say, I appreciate that we're stressing that March through June, because we do get calls at the time that they're paying their property taxes, which is now coming up this fall in December. And so we get calls about their value then. And we say, no, no, you've got to do this from March through June. So I think we're all working really hard, making sure that people understand when they need to ask us questions about their value when they need to appeal it it's not when they're paying it it's when they get their property stats tax statements in march so we'll just keep saying th

Well, I don't know if I want to go back in now. Sorry. I felt like you kind of wrapped that up. No, no, I didn't mean to do that. Go ahead. You can do it. On the first slide, thank you so much for this, Pat. Can you kind of help me understand this equity piece a little bit more on the 24? I know we're in compliance. I know we're at 100%. I appreciate that. I also appreciate Commissioner Zhang's question on what changed to get us there. But with these 24 measures, how are they assessed? Because they're not ours, right? They're the... the state's measures that we measure. So where's the equity i

And so do we see that across different neighborhoods, though, in different areas? And how do we... Maybe I'm just... I'll have to go back to you on that one because I'm not sure how to say what I'm thinking.

Thank you. That's very helpful. I appreciate that.

Can you talk a little bit more about AI and the appeal process I think you were talking about?

So let me ask you this. Some of their assessments, so they do differ from us, right? Is what I'm hearing. Is that correct? Yeah, yeah. And how has that been decided either through the appeal process? I mean, to what extent have they been correct?

And I get all of that. I'm trying to go down the road of where you're concerned. If you get 100,000 appeals and 50% of them are correct.

No, I understand. I'm trying to get to a couple of things, Pat. And one is that maybe the status quo isn't the best model to begin with, right? And if it needs change, then how do we learn from what's currently in the environment and get ahead of that curve instead of trying to fight it? Because you might be fighting a losing war here. So I'm trying to get a sense with AI if I understand the mechanics. And then the other piece is one of equity. How does this impact Is this a plus to a lot of folks that are lower income that can't afford to go through the process? Is that a more economic route

But they don't have to do the... But the homework to get to you is part of the process, right?

There's something missing in there that has to do with the value. Because on one hand, you told me you got 54 people, and I don't think you could cover the waterfront even now.

I had a lot of opportunities, so a lot of things doesn't mean I can get there, right? Yeah.

Well, and that's what I'm getting to. And that's what we're doing a lot of it. How do we utilize it rather than try to in any way impede it?

Thank you, Madam Chair. Two quick things. One, I just wanted to go back and highlight again, like you have, Pat, the importance of the property tax refund program. And to Commissioner Zhang's point, something that I think we should for sure on our end do what we can to continue to gain exposure to the program. also i think it's it's an important thing for us to continue to push uh amc on uh to make sure that this is a a statewide effort especially as we push i think should continue to push for making it automatic through the state legislature so i just wanted to name that because i i do think

Yes. Actually, that was the question I had, was what kind of support we were giving to staff if we were expecting this greater... professional acceleration, so thank you for that. Following up on the question of AIO, listening to you talk and having had this question raised earlier this spring around the generation of these letters, my mind just goes to the generation of any kind of thing. I mean, the idea that anybody could just decide to say, sign up for this and we'll send out any possible request to any possible government entity at any possible moment. Don't miss out. And the volume of ju

Yes. And I just want to have you further elaborate on that appeals process, that there is a community board that are colleagues and residents outside of us that are part of that process. Can you explain that? Because that's another level of trust, that it's peers that are.

I thank you, Director Yang, for everything that you and your staff do. As somebody that has three libraries in their district and who visits them monthly, I appreciate each and every one of your staff that welcome me into their space monthly. My first slide is gonna go to, our first slide, my first question goes with, This is great seeing, and I appreciate the effort to purchase more culturally and ethnically diverse material. What is the utilization on the material that's being purchased?

Then my next as we were purchasing these materials I just want to make sure just like I just want to add the note in is to make sure that we're purchasing materials that are written by Authors that are reflect what they're writing. So I know often time in the native community Non-native people like to write about us But it's just better to purchase it from an actual native author for that's an example that I was just wanted to give I

And not just for the native community, but for all communities. Okay, and then my question, I did have a big question on the slide, but I did see it that it's on the next slide. So when we go to the performance measures, can you talk a little more about these challenging and complex incidents that you and your staff are experiencing? Maybe give us an example would be helpful. And then how are your... how do you respond to that in real time, right? Like, if you've mentioned here and you said in your presentation that, you know, you've required more staffing or, you know, partnering with service

While we're on staffing, you did mention in the last slide the steward and cost savings. You did mention the update on the subsystem. And I'm just curious to see how that has changed and how is that working. As someone, again, who's in the libraries, three different libraries monthly, I can kind of see and I can kind of see how busy sometimes it really is. And so I'm just curious how the subs are working and... if that's successful and that has actually played out or if that's something that we need to reconsider. And why I say that is because I don't want it to get us into a situation where n

Okay. And then you mentioned also evaluating facilities across Ramsey County to identify where to make strategic investments. What does this look like, and when, or what does this, or could this look like, and at what point, or when should the board expect to be updated and be engaged in these conversations as well? And is that just more like maintenance and modernization, or is that decisions on a different, on providing services?

Thank you, Madam Chair. You know, I had similar questions that Commissioner Miller had just because we are seeing that level of need in all of our public spaces. So I have a question about are we working across different departments? I'm also thinking about our public health, like for our ARI, our public health responders there. Has there been a relationship that has been formalized or what is the cadence of the partnership?

Yeah, that's really good to hear because I'm sure you're tracking the conversations in St. Paul about closing a library and really they're trying to make up some of the costs for community safety type personnel for the other libraries too. So those are some of the things that they're balancing. My next question is about the fees for using the community spaces. Do we have fees and are we asking for different fees for nonprofit, for profit partners?

If you're a county resident, non-county resident, are we charging fees?

Okay, thank you. Wait, wait, wait, wait one moment. Sorry.

Awesome. Thank you, Madam Chair. And this is a really quick question. Going back to the library materials, I'm glad that you were highlighting the effort to make sure that those materials purchase reflect the communities that we're serving. Out of curiosity, out of those diverse materials, how many of them are from local authors or artists? Do we track at all how many are local to Minnesota?

Thank you, Madam Chair. My colleagues have asked such good questions. I'm going to try and distill mine as well. First of all, Director Yang, thank you so much. We just so appreciate the work that you're doing. The libraries are, as many of our departments and entities are just transitioning all the time to be the best that we can be and provide the services that our residents most need. So thank you. And I've been lucky to serve on MELSA, which is our regional library system. So I get to hear a lot of the good things that we are doing and to hear things that other libraries are doing. And I a

And I appreciate that. And our community loves this availability. And I really do appreciate it. I'm glad sort of that we don't charge for it, because it does allow access to everybody. And we also need to be sensitive about the cost to us, too. So I know that that's in your mix all the time. I do have a question. We do charge for copies and for 3D printers, though. Do we charge for that?

I know that. And I know a lot of people really love to use it. I'm not opposed to charging a bit for that. Because I think that that just goes along with copies. And that's a pretty good deal for copies, let me just say. So I'm hoping that you do look at the charge for 3D printing items. And... Also, the mailing versus virtual notices, I'm very conscious of this. You know, when you have seniors in your community that really want hard copies and, you know, I do a virtual newsletter. So, you know, we do have a couple people that we print it out for and either hand deliver it or mail it, which, L

Pardon me? Yeah, as a county. I think you said that you have a whole mailing list of people that still want to get hard copies. So you're printing and mailing hard copies.

We do have a handful of patrons that are homebound.

Well, I appreciate that. I know that we're trying to be accessible to everyone that we can be, and I appreciate that. I was just curious. You said 10% of the St. Paul residents register for Ramsey County library cards. Do you know how many percentage of Ramsey County of the suburban library people register for St. Paul cards? And I sort of thought they were interchangeable, but clearly they're not. And you can just explain that one more time.

Yes, and I know that our library cards are available in all the seven counties. I mean, we can... Can we use our library cards in the other counties, or do we have to get a card there? I forget.

And I really do appreciate that coordination, learning from each other and everything. And that's commendable. So great job on that. I will say that other libraries are doing really amazing things. And I'm not sure we could ever do this, but I think it's Dakota County. They're allowing people to get access to their libraries at all hours, like when there's no staff there. Not all hours. Pardon me? Not all hours. Oh, really? Is it just from when to when?

We went into it. Okay. Is it just certain hours, like till midnight or something? No, it's not that late. It's just a few hours before. Is it just a few hours before and a few hours after? Okay. Okay, good. I heard it differently, but that's good to know because, yeah, that's really interesting. But I think we're just learning and understanding what other libraries are trying to do to serve their residents. And so... Just curious, just a couple more things, Madam Chair, because this is all so fascinating to me. I love our library of things. Can you just explain what that is? Because I think it

That was my question. You do everything. And our community loves libraries for all the things that you do. I really appreciate our county manager talking and you working on any location of services for any of the things. We used to have bookmobiles. I think St. Paul does. We may do. But, you know, we have library, I think we have bookshelves at our service center in Maplewood. Or, you know, I mean, I know that the libraries, maybe that was just when the library in Maplewood was under construction. But, you know, all the things that you're looking at to really serve our residents I think is rea

My guess is that in your library of things, do you have both DVDs and the DVD player?

Okay, that's impressive. The question that I have is along the lines of this conversation around reviewing our physical spaces within the libraries, reviewing, and I love how you're deciphering out the different populations that are using the libraries in different ways. And then how some library renovations in different locations look differently because of the needs of that community. And one of the things that I've really been a part of a number of conversations throughout the different communities where we have our libraries in the northern suburbs. And I have to say that there's a lot of

Well, and I'll just kind of go further on this and say that I'm really happy that over the years, the library has had representation at the Suburban Ramsey Family Collaborative's collective table, and there's a weekly call of service providers who get together because it's always a changing set of faces and needs and resources that are available. So it really is that constant communication that is above what we can expect a librarian, even a very invested one, to be able to keep up with. And I'm just wondering, what resources do we have collectively to the library as itself? Is to say, who wou

the study carrels, the meeting rooms, and reservations, and all of those things, and fees and things like that. And I know I said this last time when we were in budget season, and I'll just throw it out again. I don't think it has to be an on or off binary toggle. The idea, if we have multiple rooms and multiple study things, I think I mean, my guess is we can still have a no-business activity policy and have, you know, 20% of the rooms that are fee-based reservations so that you can collect a little bit of money. And if somebody does have that very important nonprofit community activity, you'

Thank you, Madam Chair. I always try to get all my things in one, but then I always think of something else. And thank you for this. And I just thought we might want to give a shout out to our advisory board of our library, who we do appoint. And I'm guessing, I'm hoping that they are really helping contribute to the conversations about how we are providing the resources that our community needs. And I'm going to ask if you want to, you can comment on that. But then also, just to say that, We talk about us being one door, and I remember hearing this, how amazed I was that sometimes our librari