Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

It's 6 o'clock, and I'm calling the Planning Commission meeting of September 2nd, 2026 to order. Could we have a roll call, please? Chair Murphy? Here. Vice Chair Chesley? Commissioner Reich-Schmidt? Here. Commissioner Hanson? Commissioner Stewart absent. Thank you. Could we have the Pledge of Allegiance led by Jonathan?

Is there anyone here wishing to address the public communications portion of the meeting? That would be communications that are not agendized. I have no cards. Is there anyone online, Sherry? No. Okay. We will close public communications and move to the consent calendar. We have the minutes of the Planning Commission of August 19th. Are there any changes or problems with that agenda? OK. In that case, the minutes will be approved as distributed. Disclosure of site visits and ex parte contacts.

Okay. No conversations. I previously visited the Flowers Amongst the Cottages, but have not visited the other sites.

Okay. no ex parte and did not visit the sites okay I have visited the site of the cottages among the flowers previously drove by it today and I have driven by the other site we'll be looking at the Planning Commission is going to be reviewing the approved phasing plan and consider an adjustment to the cottages among the flowers could we have the staff report on that please hold on i have to recuse myself i live within 500 feet of the project thank you

So the phasing plan, which was agreed to by the Planning Commission in 2008. Correct. Was the result of the settlement, like part of the settlement was coming up with a phasing plan?

So this project has been going on for- So the phasing plan was just part of the original project approval?

The settlement didn't touch any of the phasing that had been pre-approved?

Would you explain to us, or perhaps you would like Mr. Becker to explain to us, the need to make this change?

You're trenching for phase three and two at the same time?

And do you anticipate filling phase two with residents before starting phase three? probably or it'll be in conjunction with that yeah dust seems to be a very large issue for the residents in that area um are you able to do anything beyond wetting the ground down to keep that from driving everybody crazy

Could you explain a little bit more about what the foundation is? You mentioned a pin foundation, but I don't know what that is.

What's the reason for going in at angles?

See, you were mentioning how for phase two, this red line from

So can you clarify that? Because the diagram looks like it's a part of phase four, I guess, but you were saying it's a part of phase two.

and i guess if we had the utility plan we'd see where those lines were coming through there is that the is that the deal um i have some hard copies thank you

I had the opportunity to go and view the Samaria units last year when we were looking at this. And they were really very nice. Great.

So any other questions for Jeff? Not at this time?

At this point, I will open the public hearing. And I have a card from Anita Cram.

Have you filled out a card, sir? I would. Is there anyone online? No. OK. Then we'll wait for this gentleman. Thank you, sir. Ellen, what is your last name?

Do you have any questions at this point?

Lucas, can you respond to some of the items that were brought up in the- About the historian? Anita's comments, both about the history, the unit choice and approval. I think those are the main ones.

I understand that Mallory Way is landmarked.

OK. Is there anything similar going on at the cottages? In terms of historical landmarking, review, is there any consideration?

And have those mitigations all been met?

Jeff, do you have anything to add at this point?

The implication was also that there is some relation to the historian and the approval of the Samara units. So can you maybe give us a little more clarity on that?

Do they prepare reports and submit them to the city, or is there a process?

i'd like to ask an unrelated question but it came to my attention in attachment f page three of eight this is regarding the existing drainage ditch or small river however you want to look at it And it indicates that there should be a report to be done for this. What is the status of applying for the lake and stream bed alteration program? And to the Fish and Wildlife, a separate application, is that Has that been completed? Are we clear on the protection of that drainage ditch?

If a grove of eucalyptus is removed, how does that change the amount of water in the channel, the ditch?

Will that be taken into account then in this final?

While you're up there, Jeff, I was hoping because obviously some of the concerns are about the intensity of work on the site. It's a main concern, it seems like. And so I was hoping, you know, you're talking a little bit about what's happening with phase two right now, which is that the buildings are lifted. There's excavation happening for the foundations. All three are lifted. Two are lifted.

Yeah, primarily by hand. Is the third one also need foundation, new foundations?

So basically you're moving into maybe forming and pouring foundations on those buildings? Right. guess if this were well no so then and then if this were to get approved what would sort of be can you kind of take us through the scope of work for for the phase four zone just to understand what's kind of happening concurrently on these on these two areas

Roughly how long does it take to put in the foundation for the Samaras?

Those would be actually in one day So is there any? So the trees need to be removed. Is there any other site grading that needs to happen before the pins go in?

I like the idea of getting the landscaping started earlier with this proposal Well they're still going to have a lot of site work to do around it after this they're just going to kind of be sitting there waiting No the landscaping was going to start They won't be occupied you know they'll just be sitting there basically sort of like the unit that was in the parking lot

Well then maybe in response to Judy's comment is a question is does it stop once the Samara phase forward does that work stop once the Samara units are dropped or is there other work that would then continue to happen before the utility trenching?

I think I read that you're going to do the landscaping.

Where's the path? It's the one, it's above the road?

Oh, this path, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, okay, okay. Okay and then right so then they're basically at that point theoretically they're sitting there on site waiting for the utility work to start once phase three begins which is six months out a year out Probably a year out maybe a little bit longer I guess then a couple of questions. What if, as you said, theoretically these pinned foundations should kind of go in pretty quickly. Yes. But you also don't know for sure. you know what kind of what's the what's the is there like what's kind of the the backup or the you know because if we're sitting

What do you do when you hit a rock with this group?

They actually put another one in somewhere else.

But you haven't done any, there hasn't been like a test pit done or something to see sort of what's, what might be generally there?

What else is left to do in phase four? If we approve putting the Samara units in concurrent with phase two, is there anything left to do in phase four other than to connect the utilities?

That does have to happen now because you want to be able to cover it with the fire road.

So these blue magenta lines are already running under where and orange already running under where the fire roads going to going to go.

Do you have approval already to pull all these lines from Oak Street?

So then the real, the real, okay, so the pipes are kind of already there, so it doesn't really have anything to do with the fire road, because I guess, yeah, it doesn't really have anything to do with the fire road.

Yeah, it's happening in phase two, but the work that's going to go underneath it is already done anyways.

So then really the reason is mostly just to test it out and do a display. That seems like the main goal. Which, if it can happen in a couple of weeks, seems like not a big deal.

Yeah, that whole process. I mean, the units are ready, basically.

So theoretically, this whole thing is actually phase four would be almost, I mean, a large chunk of that would be finished before phase two is even like halfway kind of done, potentially.

Work on your end, not so much work on the site.

Okay Thank you Jeff, thank you the public hearing was closed earlier Anita It's We we asked there was no one online I So, point of order.

For everybody. I did that once. It was a mistake.

Locate that person online, and I will reopen the public hearing at this point.

Thank you, Teal. At this point, I'm closing the public hearing. Lucas. The directions, our job tonight is to review the approved phasing plan, which obviously we have been doing. Proving the change in phasing require a resolution? I didn't see one in here, and so I'm wondering what that process is.

We would need a resolution with either option? Yes. So we're just going to direct you to prepare a resolution depending on what we decide?

Does anyone care to tell us what you think of this?

I mean, I'm a little torn, I guess. I think that on the one side, I think what's a little hard to know is how for us to know what will happen. I think as rightly has been pointed out, the phasing was set up to kind of stage things for the public interest, for people living around it to reduce the intensity or hold the intensity of action on the site to a certain level. And

it was also intended to help give the current residents time to move within the projects yeah so that makes sense too

well yeah so i mean this this doesn't really impact that element because there's nobody living there and there won't be anyone living there No, I mean in the units. Judy's comment was about how the phasing was established around the ability for people in the units to also be there for longer periods of time, if that's accurate. So phase four, there are no units there currently. is no one living in those units so it doesn't really play a role in this the intensity of work does i think and i just think it's hard to know what on the one hand these units seem like that should be pretty straightfor

Yeah, I mean, I think that's the point, right? It's like, okay, there's less of something. The foundation system is far easier than digging a hole, forming it, pouring concrete, or putting the rebar and pouring concrete. It's still work though, so I think that's why it's not exactly. clear to me 100% what I'm yet to be convinced that we should just say yeah let's do it Do you feel like convincing him?

It's an interesting point, something I was kind of thinking about, but for some, I mean, and I don't know why, but for some reason the community has not noted that. That doesn't seem to be maybe as much of a value to them. And I'm not sure why. I guess we didn't. you know but for some reason because i thought that too it's like this is a this system that they're looking to use is you know it's an efficient system no matter what it's going to happen at one time or another yeah and by moving it forward you are increasing the intensity of the action for probably a few days to a couple weeks

but it does get the whole thing done sooner, which I would imagine would be a huge benefit to the community as well.

And it allows him to put residents into phase two

did not take into account the surprises that were going to come along. For example, the movement of the utilities from Aliso to Oak Street. So I think you have to be flexible and try to

get things done efficiently and that does seem to me that this refacing would do So if we directed you to prepare whatever resolution we've directed you to prepare basically then we would still have time you know we'd still come back and vote on that resolution next time Or just sign it if we direct what the resolution

If we approve it tonight, does that give the Becker group the opportunity or the ability to go forward with planning?

OK. I think the chair is ready to hear a motion.

Is there a second? I will second that motion. Any further discussion of it?

Yeah, I mean, I think what I would just say is I think, you know, I would kind of encourage the community to think about the discussion we had tonight. I mean, we have obviously Some opinions, some questions still. I think if they could find a way to respond to some of the things that maybe we're not 100% on, that would be a useful thing between now and the next meeting when we were to vote on this resolution.

Well, I think in particular this idea that, hey, this project might be able to be done quicker. Might that be a nice thing? And I think I'd be curious to get a response on that because to me it would be, as someone who works in this field, i think this seems does seem like a positive because you know let's say there are issues well then you're tackling those issues now and you're getting it done sooner which although i can appreciate the desire while you're in the midst of construction that you don't want it to intensify also having it done sooner it has has its has its virtue so yeah okay

OK, I think we are. Ready to call the vote, Hanson. Yes, Chesley. Yes, Murphy, yes. OK, do you need anything else from us to prepare the resolution?

OK. Thank you, everyone. We will now move on to item three, which is a tree permit and zone clearance.

oh my more you didn't kill enough trees Maura this is two inches thick you know okay oh thanks

Have you been by that? OK, we are ready for the staff report.

thank you do you have questions for the staff okay in that case we will hear from the applicants

Much easier than what we're looking at when you reduce it for 9 by 11.

Brett are the proposed trees the ones that are in yellow on this plan They are in yellow

How close is the closest tree to the house?

Is the landscape artist who planned where to put the replacement trees here?

I'm asking if the person is here. The landscape architect is not here, no. Thank you. Okay, do you have any questions for him at this time?

I just have a question about the mitigation proposal Are you going to address that?

So I just had questions. If you could walk us through the mitigation. So I see that your appraised value is $119,600 of the nine trees to be removed. And then that is 125 inches of trees being removed. And the replacement trees is 31.1 inches. So that leaves a total of 94.3 still to mitigate, inches to mitigate? Okay, and then on the trees that are planted,

So that 94 inches equates to 8,815 using 24 inch boxes?

Yeah, because I was just confused, because when you talk about the dollar value, it's $119,600 appraised value of the existing trees. And then you subtract what you want to put into the tree fund, which is $9,675, which leaves a total of $109,925. That's a big number. You can massage these figures any way you want to.

It's clear to me. I just wanted you to talk me through it because I was seeing it. Yeah. And it is a big number. But I think for me, it's more important to have replacement trees, young ones that can establish well. in our climate and have more of the younger trees and fewer of the big box trees. Right.

Why are you replacing all oak with oak if indeed that kind of tree ever gets a disease or pest?

It's really hard from a layperson to see all those oaks so close together and wonder if they're growing into each other and will these new ones increase that impact Okay um a couple of things first of all the new oaks are being planted or not being planted in any crowded situation The one on the south is that southwest corner on the left the front left corner uh close to oh yeah yeah It looks like it's being planted right in the middle of that grove.

OK. Any more questions? OK. So it's our job to look at one, two, and three and tell them what we approve? Is that correct, Maura?

Yeah. OK. We're going to open the public hearing. And I have a card from Leonard Claff.

Would you care to address Lenny's? confusion and our confusion, so

Yes Since the site can accommodate that number of trees I think this number is irrelevant Yes that's correct

will you remind me does the does the tree replacement does the ordinance talk about tree replacement having multiple trees like if there was one tree being removed you would have to replace with three or something like that is there anything like that in our ordinance and I think there's something like that in the county so no this is it right here

In the city. Yeah, in the city. Okay, but then it goes back to instead of the small trees, you're talking about money in lieu.

The money goes to the tree fund, correct?

It goes to the tree fund and that buys small trees.

No, then he calculated that there's 43 boxes would make up the remaining dimension of tree diameter, and that accounts for the $8,800, which would then purchase 43, 24 inch. All right, because this was very unclear.

Do we have a tree replacement plan in the city where exactly where we want to plant trees?

Yeah. So I guess my concern or my hope is that the tree fund doesn't just sit there forever and no trees being planted anywhere. So it would be nice to have a proactive, like, OK, we got 9,000 coming in. Where can we plant trees? Like, we're going to plant trees.

Yeah, what is it sitting there for? We could have trees in the ground.

And does the public works, does that come out of this tree fund to pay public works for the time?

Is there anyone online before we close? Two more cards came in. Is this a new one? That's a new one.

There we go. I don't think we talked to that person.

Thank you. Michael? In Abbey? What is it? Inaba.

Thank you. Thank you, Michael. Is there anyone else?

Thank you, Catherine. Is there anyone online, Sherry?

Could we invite her to raise her hand? Maybe you can tell her how to do that, Sherry. Teal, you're back.

Thank you, Teal. We will close the discussion and bring it back to the commission. It does feel to me like We're just sort of finding some places to stick some trees on a lot that already has big, beautiful, mature trees. I don't know if that's our decision, though.

You mean you'd rather see all of it go to a fund? Yes. That's for the...

Or at least part of, more than what's here. Putting a tree into that woodland area, there are a couple of them there that just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. So I guess.

There's some placements just to fit the nine trees on the site.

When these two appear mature, they're going to be very close together.

I guess I'm okay with the nine trees where they're planted I have no problem with that I guess my my hiccup is the mitigation fee yeah so the nine is fine for planting and I think it's great that he's going with at least some 24 inch box because those are the two inch trees I am understanding So there's also a 36 inch box and a 48 yeah so I mean those are gonna be four that's fine but I'd like to see more 24 inch box I guess my issue is just the mitigation fee itself

Is there a possibility to reduce the number of trees that are being planted and increase the amount of fees in lieu? Is there a combination there? A compromise?

I'm going to interpret that that is yes but there is a total there ultimately What does the code say about does the code just say that as long as the mitigation proposal utilizes I forget the acronym. The Tree Association, whatever the ISA standards to calculate the amounts. It does say the ISA standards, yeah. And so what we know is there's several ways to come to different numbers with the ISA.

ISA standards. So whatever. I mean, there's two ways to go about it. We could say this should be, you could do another calculation, I think, which is what Teal's asking, what Katrina was asking, going from 100 and whatever it was, 119,000 to 8,000. is using two different maths, right? Like, of the 119,000, you're using one math. You're using a math that's about the diameter of the existing tree canopies and how that relates to an equation related to that. And then you're equating how much to pay based on the new trees.

So it seems like maybe something's different. Sherry? Thank you, Teal, for your comments. So I think that this is probably the crux, and I guess we'll get to continue talking about this maybe. But so the question is there, I think the question for us is do we feel this is, Well, I don't know what's within the rights of this, I guess, body in the sense of like, well, this is one way that is accurate according to the ISA. There could be some other, which I think Jan was probably right, would be sort of oppressive to the, whatever it would be like 60,000 or whatever it would be to kind of make th

I think it'd be nice to know what it actually costs to plant one of these.

Yeah, I mean... so if he's saying it's double for say a 24 inch box right for me that would be easy enough and when we have an arborist that said it costs about the value of the tree for a 24 inch box then take his 8 815 which is the actual cost to buy the actual trees and then double that figure for the cost of the physical planting of the tree. I'm OK with that.

I think that might be less than the sanitary sewer hookup fee.

Please come. If you can help us get to an answer, we would appreciate it.

How big is a tree in a 48-inch box? Diameter-wise?

OK. So you're saying that that would be more than double. It would be very expensive.

As I understand it, the smaller the tree, the better the chance that it will survive. What is the comparison of the 48-inch box compared to a 24 in terms of survivability?

Without an irrigation system and I'm again looking at that Grove you cannot put in an irrigation system Because you would endanger the existing trees. So How would you go about getting those two trees in the grove to live?

Is there something in the conditions of approval to guarantee that those trees live for a certain amount of time and if they do die within a certain period of time they would have to be replaced?

Katrina, are you talking about the existing trees that are protected, or are you referring to the new trees coming in?

Yeah, there is, because I'm reading a bunch of conditions.

Yeah, I know we've done that in the past. Have you ever, have you ever,

conditioned anything regarding the protection of the existing trees if they take a beating? I mean, there were a lot of things that the contractor is going to have to study and perform.

I have another question for Mr. Ettinger. On the landscape plan, does the landscape architect specify, like what are the specifications on the tree apart from the size of the box?

Does this plan say where the 24-inch 36-inch or 48-inch boxes are?

Does anyone have a thought in terms of what you would like to move but not well yes we would be moving to recommend yes Making a recommendation to the director and

We can, I think we can make, well I can try to make a motion. Motion to adopt the Planning Commissioner Resolution number 26 with the proposed amendments to it. Increasing the mitigation fee to double what is proposed in the mitigation plan. And requiring a replacement plan for the trees that are to be planted if they fail within five years.

I would like to remove the two trees that are planted in the existing grove.

My only concern with that is as not landscape architects or arborists. I don't really know if we should make that call.

Well, I'm basing my suggestion on the arborist's advice. One of the arborist's advice.

Would you accept that friendly amendment? I mean what's the goal because I guess we're kind of saying that we need a replacement plan anyway so if those trees didn't succeed they would have to be But they could endanger the entire Grove because you're going to have to water them for several years and that water is going to be used by the existing trees which is detrimental to their survivability

Well, from my own experience, I've planted a tree very close to an existing tree and it's thriving. The existing oak is fine. It's in my front yard. You can all look at it. It's on the street. I don't know. I wouldn't want to take out any trees that they're willing to plant. Michael?

He figured out that there's 94 inches remaining that needed to be. And then if you divide that by the 2.2 diameter, which he's assuming the 24-inch box, then that equals 43 boxes. And that 43 times the 205 is the 8,000. No, no, no, no.

I mean, what's your thought? Because that's what we're working on, problem. Right.

Well, they're also planting the nine, so we have to... We've already deducted that.

I think it's even more complicated because that number that we're talking about, that's only for the replacement of the remaining diameters.

No, it's the 94 inches. So we've got inches and we've got the appraised value. I mean, if you just go straight inches. So we have 125 existing inches.

But that's what he told us. That's what I wanted to clarify.

Because he's saying that there was $119,000 of the appraised value of the trees. Right. And that equates to 125.4 inches. Of diameter of trees.

Exactly. But I think that's why it was a little confusing, because he was saying this equation, the way it's written in this proposal, is that the what's being replaced is 31.1 inches of diameter, right? And so that 31.1 is then minused from the 124 that theoretically is being removed from the site. And then the remaining 94 is being- Now we're talking diameter inches. Just diameter of inches, yeah. And that's how they came to this amount, which is the amount owed based on the remaining amount of diameter of inches that hasn't been accounted for. None of that takes into consideration the surfa

And that's inevitable. I mean, we can't replace what's there.

We have a friendly amendment that has or has not been accepted yet.

To remove the two oak trees, replacement trees from the woodland area.

Does that mean, like, put them somewhere else on the site?

I don't think there is anywhere else to go. I suspect that this was, let's find a place to put nine trees. I don't know that we need to put nine trees in. I think that if we put in whatever the owner reasonably feels is area that's in need of a tree, that's fine.

I think that's what they're doing. That's what they're doing. That's what they're proposing.

No, because they're putting them into a grove that already exists. That's what I object strongly to.

But elsewhere, please. There is no second that Friendly fails. We are back to the original motion. There is not yet a second on it. OK. Any further discussion? OK. Roll call, please.

Reichsmich? Yes. All right. You have it.

Moving on to item four, and I don't believe I have any cards for item four. Is there anyone in the audience wishing to speak to four? Anyone online? No. Okay. Then we are going to go to the staff for your report.

Yeah. It's at the bottom. Oh, OK. Yeah, my computer ran.

I just wanted to say I'm glad you put in black walnut because that comes up in CEQA. So if you have a... report done by a biologist they're going to identify the black walnut and it's going to be considered an impact if you take it from a sequence standpoint but then our code is silent on it so that it creates a conflict so i like that you're putting it in so it's consistent

On page attachment D, page 85. It discusses how community development department tracks the trees through the permits, what's being taken out, what's being added, and reports to the planning commission annually. I don't remember this report.

I bet Sherry has it. Sherry has it from, she started it at one point. So I know a long time ago it was done.

And it's not on a GIS map. And it's not on a GIS map.

Is it Public Works who decides which neighborhood and specifically where in that neighborhood to plant the new trees that the $33,000 is supposed to accomplish?

Could we hear from Public Works how many trees they've planted in the last few years?

And the number of trees they plant depends on the amount of money they have?

Oh, so it's limited by the public works budget to plant the trees?

So this fund could just skyrocket if the public works budget doesn't.

We've got 33,000 sitting there. We're probably going to add several thousand more. If the Public Works Department is limited in their planting, in how much they can spend planting trees, That in lieu fee fund is just going to continue to grow. I would like to see some accountability there in terms of using the money in the fund to help them plant the trees or something. I mean, there must be some ways that this could.

OK, I guess we really can't tell them what to do, but I would like them to get the suggestion that they find a way to plant more trees.

Within the public right-of-way. So the street tree inventory, that's what we're talking about. That's the reference. Correct. The City Works record of all trees in the public right-of-way.

The public right-of-way exists, I think, right underneath the utility wires. So we're suggesting that they plant in the very place that is going to eventually require them to top the trees, which is, again, not a healthy thing to do.

So you're saying that Public Works is likely planting shorter trees from the approved list?

I wanted to clarify something too. The community forest management plan, says trees planted in the public realm and the city-owned lands. So I think that this is also encouraging private property owners to plant trees that are on this list in their, say, their front yards, anywhere where there's public view. So that's in the policy. So it's an encouraging thing, but it's a document. that identifies neighborhood trees in the public right of way, but also in the public realm and in the front yards.

So we need a lot of education. I didn't know this existed before Friday.

I was on the original committee to write this.

I know they took it off when they revised it, but they kept the old Council and the old planning Commission, but they didn't keep staff your name.

OK, we will open the public communication.

Yeah, this is encourage private property owners to plant.

No. OK. Thank you. OK. So you're looking for comments and no action, right?

Do we have further questions or comments?

It just seems like maybe we have to address the monetary thing in some way Are we talking about the money piece? Yeah just because it's still I mean this is what we did tonight is directly out of here you know it's the mitigation on any of these chapter 11 yeah where else it is wherever it's brought up it's the same it's that it's those same i two i three i uh in conjunction with each other and so i don't know but it seems like it's it's not and then you have you know michael who even us having a conversation we couldn't it was very hard to to be speaking on the same terms it's tough because w

But they even have multiple ways. Yeah, there's more ways.

I think it's OK to have a combination of planting and mitigation fees. Yeah, that's all good. But the mitigation fee is complicated because, you know, you can't go strict diameter because if you have a 20-inch diameter tree that's not healthy, you know, that— This came up recently.

But that's part of the dollar calculation, not the inch. But it's hard to evaluate. So if you're asking to replace by inch.

The value is based on an assumption of the health of the tree Right, the dollar figure Yes But not the diameter Yeah, it's a combination Yeah, so there's two things we were looking at, though We were looking at, okay, we've got 97 inches to replace Or this appraised value to replace Totally

And what he was saying is that actually this isn't actually about the diameter of inches. It's more about the surface area.

So I just caution being overly simple about it because it's very not simple.

It is highly complicated. I kind of think we have to think about it like, well, what are we trying to promote and create? Because it's like a little less about, then we could almost say. this tree could be worth a million dollars, but what really matters is we need, we want something to go in to the fund that will actually produce the planting of a tree and create the outcome we're looking for. We don't need a million dollars, we only need whatever X for that because we just need to know how do we push this thing along. that's an evaluation to like I don't know yeah for us to understand how va

And that's what we want is you know you know we have the mature forest right now we don't have a lot of trees going in and so we're we need to plan for our future so that's why we're talking about little smaller trees that will plant and thrive yeah In the right conditions But like in the forest document there are a couple areas you know like

I mean, I'm sure there's a lot of arguments in a lot of directions, but I kind of think that could be okay because I think in the end, this is a small community, this is a small valley. Like we're all in it together, you know, like to say, well, I'm not responsible to put one tree back because like I'm not because I don't have to, you know, it's sort of missing the point because enough people say that. And then, yeah, the tree canopy gets compromised.

That could be part of the tree fund, because I think one issue that we will eventually run into, too, is the public right-of-way. Well, it's concrete. We don't have... I mean, there's parks, but do we have to fill all the parks with... There's a limitation as far as what the city owns and where plantings can occur. So we could still think about whatever the cost and whatever goes into that fund in the same manner, but if there's this overage, that's fine. That could go to a that could go to planting a tree on an individual's property, which is going to always have a lot more space and garden o

So maybe, you know, in those instances where there are trees that come down that were hazardous, you know, at no fault of the owner, you know, just false, that may be some kind of planting plan, you know, where you plant 100 acorns instead of an actual tree or something like that. That could be some kind of mitigation plan for the loss of that tree instead of, you know, just one for one replacement.

Well, I have another idea that could be playing to the, would be the idea of creating a, you know, because some of the things that Michael was saying seemed very relevant, you know. It's going to depend so much on how these individuals are locating and choosing the tree that's coming in, what that tree, the characteristics of the tree, obviously the size, but multiple elements of the characteristics. yeah is it in a pot was it in the ground was it sourced from San Diego was a source from you know just just down the road you know I think that there are opportunities within and it's this is I do

Mm-hmm Have we given you sufficient comments to take this forward?

Both of those would be moved, leaving this with just the resolution that we requested tonight?

When it's ready. OK. Yeah. So are we canceling the 16th?

Roll call, please. All in favor? Aye. Any opposed? Okay. Okay.

While you're doing that, would you make sure that the notification comes directly to me and not just to the address? I don't get them when they go to the address. Wait. Long story. I'll fill you in later. OK. Sounds good.

Do we have a commissioner member report? Lucas, weren't you going to tell him about the CEC adoption flex? I'm sorry. I can't hear her.

It would be helpful to get a report on that.