Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Recording in progress. That's your seat. All right, everybody. we uh will reconvene here and end our our brief recess for technical reasons and come back with agenda item number 9A that's our secretar's report. Thank you chair. Um just to give an overview to the planning commission um there is a list of tenative tenatively scheduled projects that are coming before the planning commission. Um those dates just want to be reminder they are tenatively could change and be pushed out a couple of weeks depending if the items are ready to become before the planning commission. So we have tenatively scheduled on August 4 is the Fairview and Northgate plan development

zoning map correction and the Fair View at Northgate plan development amendment to increase the residential units from 178 detail single family residences to 245 units. and August 18th, an appeal of a manual use permit for a hillside development at 128 Carolina Street. And then just a reminder, there's a following list that are not yet scheduled, but can be expected to come before the planning commission, which is a 98 room hotel with on-site amenities, the Vista Cove residential development of 51 units, the KB rollingwood residential subdivision of 130 units, and of course, continuing the housing element program implementation zoning amendments. And with that, um, the second part of tonight's secretar's report is a update on the mayor island's development agreement annual review for 2023 and 2024. So I would like to turn it over to Brian Eggy from the Maryland company to uh give a presentation on the development agreement annual review. Good evening. Hello. Hello. Uh good evening, commission commissioners. My name is Brian Ngi. I'm the senior vice president of operations for Mayor Island Company. And uh thanks for having me here tonight. Um, I thought what I'd do is do a a quick run through of um what we do on the island. I'm not going to get into details. I'm not going to go through the uh the DA report for both years. I'm not going to do that. Um I'm just going to kind of go through some some highlights of what we've done over the last couple years. We didn't give this presentation last year because we just things didn't line up for various

reasons. So, um, I'll try and hit both ears, make it brief, and then hit on a couple of, uh, things that we're doing on the development side as well, and then open it up mostly for Q&A. If you guys have any questions about what's going on in the island, I'll do my best to answer them. Sound okay? Okay, let's see if I can get this clicker to work. Okay, so on the screen, you'll see um, this thing works. Um, Mar Island Company. If you've heard this before, I apologize. We give this uh review a lot. Um sometimes people have questions about who is Mar Island Company and it's really a a mixture. Southern Land Company was hired by the owners to be the uh the manager and um operator of the island, developer of the island, but they're in Tennessee. So people are saying, "What what's a company in Tennessee doing in California?" It's a legit question. Well, what they're doing is they they came out and they helped us hire the team we have out here. So, even though we're we're employees of Southerntherland Company, we're all specialists in Mar Island. We are hired from around the world. The people that work on our team, there's about 22 people, all very, very savvy, very specialized in working on uh militarybased conversions. So, that's what Mayor Island Company is. It's even though Southern Land Company is our the company we work for, we are operating as Mayor Island Company if that makes sense. And this is the executive team um from left to right. Keith, Cheryl, myself, and Andrea. We all have different things that we're we're uh we work on. I do operations. Keith does the finance. Cheryl does uh marketing and communication and events if you've been out to the island. And then Andrea does the development and construction. This map you probably can't see as well as I'd hoped, but um it it's a

representation of who's on the island. We don't own the whole island. We own a a portion of it, about 20%. The whole island's about 5,000 acres. We control about a thousand of it. Not today, but we will ultimately have a thousand once the Navy transfers a couple more pieces of property to us. So, you'll see the state land on the west side of the island has a good chunk. the Navy is still out there doing some cleanup and we'll transfer that property at some point and then there's some independent owners out there and uh the like. So, we'll jump into some of the things we're doing on the operation side of the last 24 months. This is building 535. It's a little hard to see because the screen's small, but on the lefth hand side is what it looked like before. There was a lot of peeling paint. Um it just was dull looking. And so, we we do this a lot. We'll go around and freshen up the paint just to keep the island looking uh appetizing for new businesses to come out and to keep the tenants in the building uh you know in a nice looking building. There's another example on the left is more peeling paint. And we didn't actually put anybody in this building. We painted it. Uh it needs a lot more work inside, but just for aesthetics, we wanted the building to look nice. It's right next to the new pickle ball courts, which I'll show you pickle uh the pictures of, but it sure makes the the place look a whole lot better when it's cleaned up. Um this is an example of the residents on the island were having trouble with um kids riding motorcycles up this vacant lot into some open space and causing trouble back there. So, they called us and we came in and put a fence across there so that we could uh try and secure the place a little better. and it seems to have done a good job. Um, kind of a boring picture, but the idea here is that this is something we do every day. Our facilities team goes out and has to clean out storm drains and uh whether it's, you know, a small one or a big one, they get clogged very

easily. So, we uh we have to have guys go out and clean them and they do this every day to keep everything moving out there. And uh it's uh they're kind of unsung heroes. So, I like to show them and what they do. Um, this is an example of an old Navy era um, boiler in building 459. It'd been around forever and ever and ever. Um, we went in and swapped it out for a state-of-the-art boiler, increased efficiency, got rid of the old asbestous wrapped pipe, and, um, it works 100% better. Now, this is a conversion of a empty space in building 112. Um, we moved in the players academy. Now, that empty space is used to train children in soccer, baseball, anything else they want to go up there. They have coaches available and uh they're up there seven days a week doing all sorts of really cool stuff that a lot of people don't get to see, but they're up there doing their thing. This is a a picture of um kind of a collaboration of various people and Ken Wright was the one that instigated it with the Historic Park Foundation and it was an old German artifact that was in uh Alden Park and it was falling apart. it was rusting and literally was going to just completely fall apart and be lost because I think there's only one or one more in the world of this particular thing. So, we partnered with Mar Island Dry Do who lent us the uh the crane and um we went over and picked it up and put it inside the old museum. And so, it's out of the weather. It's stored there for a day when hopefully we can get a hold of somebody and get it repaired or at least reproduced. This is a picture of us adding parking down at uh this is probably a couple years ago now when the dry docks were really booming and we didn't have enough parking down there. So we ended up

demoing out a couple of old bunkers that were not historic um and we put in more parking. So, we went from a dirt, gravel, messy lot to a brand new parking structure that houses another 30, 40 parking spots, which at the time meant a lot. Right now, it's a little bit empty, but uh we're hoping for uh more contracts to come out of the Pentagon shortly. This is kind of an interesting picture. Um if I didn't tell you what it was, you wouldn't know, but we get this a lot on the island. We get bees in the buildings. And so we have a gentleman we work with up in Napa and uh he comes out and will open up the buildings and take the bees out and put them into a bee box. And we have a lot of people know this either. We have 20 to 30 hives of bees up at the old golf course and we make honey up there and they pollinate the whole island which is a great thing. And that honey is sold at the the coffee shop. So if you want to come get Mar Island honey um you can. But this was building 47 and uh they opened it up. We put it all back like it was never there. And uh those bees lived another day and didn't bug anybody. This is just a picture of u a refresh on landscaping. We do this every day. I have a full-time landscaping manager on the island uh who who just wanders around the island looking for things that need to be spruced up or added to. And it's incremental. So, if you come on the island periodically, you'll see things change a little bit. You'll see the coffee shop get spruced up. You'll get uh places that didn't have any plants added to. Um and so I want to give a shout out to him. He does a great job. Another example of a before and after. Uh one of the mansions on Walnut didn't have any landscaping per se. And then on the right hand side, you'll see we added baskets on the porches, um landscaping around the periphery. And we're going to start, we've been doing it for the last

two or three years. will continue to do that so that officers row uh looks as good as it can. Another example of the same thing, just more planting. And this represents trees. It's often overlooked, but they're not overlooked when a branch comes down. So, we spend annually in the six figures just pruning trees, just getting up there. And if you've ever seen somebody climb a eucalyptus tree um and hang up there with a chainsaw, uh you'll appreciate the work it takes. But yeah, we we spend a lot of money on just just working on trees, making sure they're they're thinned out, they're safe, so we don't have any branches come down and knock on wood if I had it near me. Um we haven't had any major major trees come down in quite some time. This is an old tennis court. Um, the building in the background is one of the buildings I showed you earlier that we repainted. Um, this was a mess. It had literally had trees growing out of the the surface. Um, and so we went um and decided we would redo this for the public. So this is what they look like now. Um, brand new pickle ball courts, three pickle ball courts, uh, a tennis court, and two basketball hoops. So that's uh, we're really proud of that. That's right outside our office. I get to hear click click click of the the paddles all day long. That's the coffee shop. If you haven't been out to the coffee shop, it's in uh Quarters N. Um it's quite an interesting place. Uh bustling with uh coffee drinkers. Another example of landscaping. We put in flowers and and spruce that place up. And the walkway along Walnut is not just your standard concrete. It's it's uh a little more ornate. Uh they're hexagon pavers and when they break, there's no

mold for them. So, we went to the trouble of having one of our contractors build a mold so that we could reproduce them. They're a very odd shape. They're not the same on all sides. It's never that easy on Maryland. So, we made a mold and we went through and we replaced about 30 or 40 pavers. So, all the pavers up and down walnut on on that side of the street are uh are level and safe. So, there's no more tripping hazards out there. This was an interesting one, too. I've only done one of these. They did a a flag retirement uh at the uh Valleo memorial there um on 911 which was just fascinating where they uh they burned the flag which I had no idea to retire it and that was really an amazing event. And then in 2023 we brought in some new businesses. We have obviously the Quarters coffee house is in quarters N. um the San Francisco Maritime National Historic Park Foundation. They're they are uh now on the island as you've probably seen the ships parked along the waterfront. So, uh the I think we've got four of the five here now and we'll get the last one, the Eureka will come up, they think in August. They're waiting for the perfect weather pattern in conjunction with all the structural work they have to do in San Francisco to get it up here. So hopefully we'll have all five of them up here in in August and we can I know people have been talking about having an event on the island to to celebrate them being here and that's that's a good thing. And then the other question I get is when can you get on them? And I don't know yet. You'll have to talk to the Maritime Museum about that because they're in charge of them. But I'm hoping early next year they'll have something ready to go to at least get on one of them. Um the other ones uh the companies that came in NorCal Museum Sighting, that's a little bit of a misnomer. They were already here, but they expanded um into some other space. And then we've got the player academy.

That was the space I showed you uh earlier that has the uh the green turf in it where they they coach kids up there. Uh SunMaster moved their headquarters down here from Napa. And then the uh the Gold Rush is the honey company that makes the honey for us up at uh the golf course. And then in 2024, we had an assortment of businesses come out. Gelati uh opened up a branch out there. Uh North Bay Site Services, a homegrown company is is now on the island as well. Uh Lead Schools is on the island, Sweet Treatments, um and an assortment of others. And the job count, this one uh is discussed in your packet. Um you see a downturn employment, which no one likes to see. Um, that one is really wrapped up in a couple of things. The major piece of it is Mar Island dry do that can fluctuate a lot. It's not a standard you got 200 employees and it stays there, maybe goes up or down a little bit. Uh, they can go up by a factor of 10. They can have 150 employees and then over the next six months can have over a thousand employees because it's all transitional work. It depends on what's in dry do and they will ship people from all over the country. So they're on a downturn right now because of just a transition at the federal level in in the government and um so they're they're they've got a couple of ships in dry do but nowhere near what they were in the past. So that's a little bit of a change there. And then there was a consolidation over at what used to be factory OS and is now Harbinger Homes. They've consolidated down um doing great as a business just don't have as many employees. So that's said those are the two big ones. And then there's assortment of other things. is we're going to try and get this number up if we can over the next couple of months. We talked about the Quarters Coffee House. Come on over and say hi. Um if you like coffee, they do a great job. Um

more pictures of that. Uh then these are our four signature events on the island. We have a lot of events, over a hundred events out there every year, but these are the four that we sponsor and pay for. We do the decked out, which is a concert series along Walnut. We do the spirit ships uh celebration, which if you've been out there this weekend or on Friday, uh we did the drone show and all the things that were happening on the waterfront. Uh that all came out of our pocket. Then we do the Halloween block party in October for the kids and uh bring out all sorts of things uh each. It's also where decked out is along Walnut there in in officers row. And then light night is the lighting of our big uh 50-foot Christmas tree at uh it's outside the distillery. I don't expect you to read this, but it's a summary of events. Like I mentioned, it's we do a lot of events. 235. I said over 100. It's much more than that. And then uh last year we had over 100,000 people come out to the island. And that's from zero to 100 because there didn't used to be anything on the island back, you know, 5 years ago. Now we're up to 100,000 people every year come out. Uh we also have a public art program out there where we rotate art pieces every six months and uh we've got new ones out there. They were just placed not too long ago um on the prominade and then there's one in the historic core there as well. And then the navigator app if you wanted to I'll kind of step back a little bit. For years we talked about how do we represent Mar Island um best and with the museum closing and other things happening we wanted to have people have access to information. And we always thought that Mar Island was more than just a building with stuff in it. It's it's a museum in itself. You can walk around there. It's the trees. It's the

waterfront. It's the building ways. It's the dry docks. It's the trails. It's the parks. It's everything. So, this app you can actually go on and download it for your phone. You can walk out to Mar Island and wander around and it'll tell you where you're at. You can hit buttons and it'll tell you stories of things. And that's going to be that's already in place and we're going to be building on that over time. So, we're going to try and put more stories about each individual building, more stories about uh park history and things like that, tree history. So here I'll I'll touch base a little bit on the on the the development items that we're working on currently. Conley corridor. Um phase one is it's a it's a much on the lefth hand side you'll see the whole Conley corridor outline. Uh phase one is on the right hand side. It's just the coal sheds and the prominade and a little bit uh to the west that's being u worked on right now. It's been submitted to the city and I uh the planning department is is looking at that right now. This is the beautifification plan. These are just renderings. Um, obviously, uh, we've also submitted this to the city and it has been returned. We broke it into two different phases. This one's a little more complicated. The the North Island is is we don't just own everything up there. We have the Navy has a piece of it. It's about 33 acres. The Navy retained has to do some environmental cleanup. So, until that gets done, we had to break this into two phases to kind of work around that. Um, so that's that's why there's two phases, but we submitted uh phase one and we did get that back and uh we're talking to the city now about how to uh get that going. So hopefully they'll get started shortly. And this is the it's just a representation of the uh draft specific plan that we sent over to the city in October. Um they're working on it and um we're hopeful that that will continue to move forward and um good things will come from that.

I think that's it for my slides. Um, but if anybody has any questions or wants to make any comments about anything in the report, I'm happy to do my best to answer them. Great. Thank you so much, Mr. Maggie. Um, does anyone have anything like to ask or comment on? All right. Well, do good and tired through the chair. to the chair. Do we do we have any public comment? Uh yes, we will do that. Um let's see. Uh so no one has any questions before we have a public comment. No more comments. So we will uh if you don't mind, we'll have a public comment here and I can come back up if uh public comment drives any questions. Thank you very much. And while he's coming up, we do have one speaker online who would like to speak as well. Oh, great. Uh, good evening and thank you for this opportunity. Um, I hope I'm not speaking out of order, but I'd like to comment briefly on the site specific plan itself, which I know all of what we've just seen is a part of. Um, my name is Paul Ty and I'm on the executive committee of the Sierra Club Solano Group. I have some general comments to make on the draft plan. Uh my remarks are an overview and they'll be followed up with some specific comments on various points of the plan which I've already uh given to the chair. Uh they're in accord with the Sierra Club's California housing policy and with the Solano Group's general direction for for Mayor Highland. Uh

first we believe that this is a solid professional visionary plan. We hope our remarks can help make it better and provide assurance to all parties of its successful completion. Uh secondly, we propose that the city appoint a mayor island citizens oversight committee to monitor the progress of this plan and report to the city and the developer at least annually how goals, objectives, and standards are being met. Thirdly, we advocate for more objective standards on performance with regularly scheduled updates and enforcable consequences if targets are not met. Fourthly, we ask that performance metrics be made specific to this plan and stated clearly rather than referring to other documents, including ordinances at the city, state, and federal levels, which may be overly vague and imprecise and could lead to trouble in the future doing due to varying interpretations. Fifthly, we suggest a planning approach called a formbbased code. We feel that the plan is overly specific about property uses for particular parcels. Formbbased code describes the overall feel of a particular neighborhood rather than dictating uses for individual lots. This avoids a zoning straight jacket and also avoids incompatible uses. Economic conditions change over time and we want this document to provide usable guidance for the long term. Thank you for considering my views. Thank you very much. Appreciate that.

And I believe we have someone online and we have uh um member Matul. We'll go in person first. Go ahead. I was just going to add one more important thing that uh some people may not be aware of. So, um there's been um remediation that's been happening on Mar Island. It's been happening for a while. And so, I'd like to um uh let people know that that remediation is going to be concluded is scheduled to be concluded in the fourth quarter of this year. So, that's going to be another component that will help us move forward with with the economic development. A lot of development that's going to be able to move forward. But so that I just wanted to make sure that this commission and the rest of the community was aware that the re remediation um is scheduled to be concluded um for the fourth quarter of this year. Thank you. All right. And then we have um a speaker online. Is that correct? You can go ahead. And see, go ahead and unmute yourself. Hi, Planning Commission. Um my name is Anne Carr. I'm a Leo native. um and uh have lived here long enough to have known when the uh Mayor Island was actually operating as a base. Um so I'm always looking forward in these kinds of reports to see what kind of progress, if any, has been made on the jobs aspect for Mir Island since we lost so many jobs when Mir Island closed. Um I'm wondering if um Brian Nai can answer what he thinks the total employment is on the island at this point even uh from companies that apparently don't participate in his survey. So they don't lease from Mir Island Company. Um because I I would just like to know where what our stance is for total employment on the off island. I'm curious about whether Mar Island Company

has identified any economic sectors that are good targets for trying to bring in more jobs that we so desperately need. And I'm curious about what our status is with respect to the movie and television business. That's we've seems to have um recurring and then disappearing episodes with um but that seems to have been a good fit for some of those large spaces that we have on the island. Um, one thing that I think would I'd like to see on the island, which has some jobs capability associated with it is, um, that I'd like to see the exterior of the officers buildings painted and that could be a jobs development or a job training opportunity for young adults even though there might be lead abatement and, you know, historic property uh, kind of considerations. that's something that can be trained on. Um, and I think it would give the island a big boost if the if the exteriors were simply maintained better. Um, and going along with that, um, I would really love to see some sort of I guess it would need to be a joint project between the city, the museum, and Mar Island Company to refurbish the admiral's house. Um, it would be a natural setting for weddings and events in conjunction with St. Peter's Chapel. So, there's there's something there that might not be a huge number of jobs, but it would elevate the the island overall. And then finally, um, we used to have a museum on Mir Island. We need to have one again. And um I would really like to see whatever is holding up the process for finding a home for it to uh to be

explored and resolved. Um that could be an important part for overall tourism in in Valleo. Thank you very much. All right. Thank you very much. Um I think there was a couple questions in there for Brian. Would you mind addressing those if you could? I didn't write down all the questions, but um I'll I'll try and address the jobs one. She wanted to know overall jobs in the island. Um she's referring to the fact that we only grab uh job data from our our tenants. We don't go down to Alco or Earthquake Protection or to Toro or to the other federal agencies out there. So when you when you look across the whole island, I'm guessing a little bit. I have to go look at historic data. Um but I'm guessing it's I I throw this number around. It's somewhere between 4,500 and 5,000 jobs, I'm guessing, overall. And it fluctuates a lot. Like I said, you could fluctuate a whole thousand just for Maryland dry dock alone. So, write that down, but don't write that down. And then there's a couple more comments about painting the mansions and and those types of things. We're we're on that. We we we uh run into an regularly, so thanks an for calling in. And uh we're working on all those things. Thank you very much. Um, if no one else has any thoughts, I was just going to say I the care and the uh pride that you all are taking in the that landmark property out there is showing more and more uh each year and uh I encourage you to continue with it. It's the, you know, the attention to those small details, whether they be odd-shaped octagonal papers or a well-trimmed eucalyptus. Um, they're the things that actually accumulate to make uh for a property that people want to continue to invest in. And I just appreciate that you're you're investing pride and effort um first and that's the thing that's going to come back to

redound upon us with uh with jobs, with businesses, with residents, and with a place that is a landmark and some place we can all be brought up again. Thank you to the chair. Oh, please go ahead. So, one item that uh Ann had brought up towards the end, it's kind of a question that many of us have had in the past is do you foresee any collaboration with the city to find a new building or refurbish the building for the museum? It's a good question and we have talked about this over the years. Um I think it's better directed to the historic park foundation really. um they've got control of the artifacts that make the museum. Uh we've got buildings and we've we've offered to work with them to move it to a different location, but it's not quite as easy as just picking everything up and moving it. Um the building it's in is not structurally sound. It's not a small price tag to fix it either. It's north of $20 million. And so that's probably not the right location for it. But um it would be up to them to find a space and we're willing to sit down and talk with them about what space would work for them on Mir Island and and make it work. We did move the library out of the museum. So all the paper that was in there, all the really important books and documents have been moved out and we did lease them a space over in building 112. So if anybody wants to go and do any research on a on a ship, on a building, on a loved one, you can go to the museum's library. It's there and uh open to the public. So, contact the Historic Park Foundation about that. But, yeah, we're we're ready and willing to go whenever the time is right. One other question. Uh, building, I believe it's building 700 across from um the dry docks. Is that a building that's getting refurbished or is that a refurbished building? 700. I'm think it's 700. It's one right across from the brewery. Right across from the brewery. Uh, I I'd

need to know more specifically because I might answer your question and be wrong about it. Is it a brick building? Is it a Is it a concrete building? Is it a wood building? Concrete bu It's It's a brick building. Two stories. Okay. About 40,000 square feet. Okay. If you send me the the building number, I'd be happy to give you everything I know about it. But, uh, I apologize. I thought it was 700, but if it's right across from the dry docks, um, there's there's a couple of them. Building 106 is there. It's a brick building about two stories, more like one. 118 is a two-story building. That's where Western Dovetail was in there for a number of years. That's been red tagged by the 2014 earthquake and hasn't been rehabilitated yet. That might be the one you're referring to. I will get that number for you. I'll verify it. Great. Any other questions or comments? All right. Well, thank you very much. appreciate you taking the time. All right, and we will continue down with our agenda to 9B, the city attorney's report. No report this evening. All right. Well, thank you very much. And then coming towards the end here. Um, do we have any reports from any of my fellow commissioners this evening? I did have a question for planning and I don't know if you can answer this or if you'd be able to provide provide someone that would be provide a more concrete answer, but in regards to the Broadway project, there appears to be an issue as far as getting a certificate of occupancy for it and I was getting a lot of feedback from individuals and so there are questions from individuals within the city as far as is there a new timeline for it opening or accepting individuals. Um, I apologize. I don't have the specifics on that. I do know there was a temporary CFO that was issued. Um, I'll

have to check in with the building uh official to find out more details and I can maybe share those with you after the fact. Okay, please continue. Anyone else? Uh, I did want to mention um to piggy back off of council member um um Matulac uh two things. one, I did enjoy uh the joint session um incredibly um I thought it was extremely um impactful um and it was an opportunity uh well a meeting of the minds I'll say that um you know information can tend to get lost in translation and so it's really good to be on the same page um and I was glad to see that there um were members of the public here um meaning you know it was accessible Um, and so I appreciate that to Manny, um, Director Paula, you know, everyone who's here, you know, for, you know, for all your time really. I really think that being a public service servant is a tremendously difficult and challenging job. Um, I am one myself um 9 to5 and it is a very thankless job. So, I'm going to say thank you very much for being here away from your families. Uh, number two, it is 707 week. Um, it is the first of many to come. Um, and so I highly encourage all of our city leaders um, and community leaders to be present and really embody and embrace what it means. I'm not from here, but I've been living here so long that, you know, I am a part of the community. And I think uh you know the the natives get a little jealous of us folks who moved in and because you know we can't say we're born

and raised but you know I'm here to let you guys know that people who move here are incredibly proud to be here. We may not like what's going on here and we want to fix things but we absolutely love this community. And I think um I would implore you to check out 707week.com um and connect with the founder Sheay Miles who is a descendant of Hattie Miles who we all know and love who created um House of Acts. Um and so if you don't know anything about House of Acts, you probably ain't from here anyway. So, so um 707week.com is the website and I know that everyone here will enjoy some of the festivities. So, thank you so much and thank you Brian for your report. All right, anyone else? All right. Uh I also just want to say uh I really enjoyed the the joint meeting. I think we probably learned some things about how one of those joint meetings uh can be structured. Uh given the number of people that we have and the range of uh issues that we want to try to tackle, uh it's probably a little bit difficult to try to uh focus on two tools and what is a very large toolbox that we want to deploy in order to solve some of the city's problems with regards to housing. Um, so I'd encourage us to think about how we could uh expand that conversation um a little bit and talk about multiple tools and kind of compare them a little bit more. Um, and maybe even we can think about you know some uh how we could do those agendas in such a way and schedule the comments uh so that we are getting everything that we want out of them. Um because uh those that could be a very very long meeting. We would may still be in that meeting if we didn't have this meeting. So, um, I think it's very worthwhile and I'm

happy to brainstorm with anybody about how we could create a meaningful agenda and structure something that would be most useful and I encourage us to do that. That's the end of my report. Um, I do not believe we have any ad hoc subcommittees at this time. So, with that, I believe we are at everyone's favorite uh agenda item. Uh, it is adjournment. So, with that, let's subjourn here at whatever time it is, 8:13 p.m. All right. Thanks.