South San Francisco Unified School District Board - Regular Meeting

identific Fore! Foreign! Foreign! School meetings. Hello. I'm calling the meeting of the South San Francisco Unified School District Board of Trustees to order. Is 6:30. All right. Roll call, please. Joanna. Trusty Lamb. Here. Vice President Murray

here. President Anthony here. U we could all rise for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Item D, land acknowledgement statement. We acknowledge that the South San Francisco Unified School District is located on the unseated ancestral homeland of the Ramy Shaloni peoples who are the original inhabitants of the San Francisco Peninsula. We wish to pay our respects by acknowledging the ancestors, elders, and relatives of the Ramy community and by affirming their sovereign rights as first peoples. Item E, community forum introduction by Superintendent Shantara Moore.

All right. Good evening, President Anthony, members of the board, cabinet, members of our community. Thank you very much for being with us this evening. Last year, our community forum focused on mental health and safety, two foundational elements of student well-being and belonging. This year, our focus expands to two new topics that sit at the heart of our strategic plan and our careore values. The modernization of Los Certos Elementary School and the topic of artificial intelligence. Our first conversation on Los Cerritos connects directly to our strategic plan priority five equity- centered systems. This priority calls on us to look critically at how we do things across the district to identify and remove barriers and to make decisions that keep equity at the center. Tonight's discussion is deeply grounded in that commitment. Our goal is to ensure that the facilities of all of our students reflect the care, quality, and opportunity we want for every child in South San Francisco Unified. This is not just about modernization. It is about a human- centered design and ensuring that every student regardless of zip code learns in an environment that communicates you matter, you belong, and you deserve the best we can offer. Our second topic is on artificial intelligence. It aligns with strategic priority one, exceptional instruction, and our portrait of a graduate. Under this priority, we commit to testing and growing innovative and engaging learning experiences that help students develop the abilities described in our portrait of a graduate to learn, to thrive, to navigate, and to impact the world around them. AI offers exciting new ways to inspire intellectual curiosity, creativity, critical thinking, and problem solving, key aspects of our learn aim, and it challenges us to help students navigate technology fluently and responsibly. Tonight's conversation is about learning more about how we do that in ways that are thoughtful, ethical, and always human- centered, ensuring that

technology supports teaching and learning rather than replacing it. Both of these are designed to inform the board and our community, excuse me, to allow us to reflect on our ongoing work to build systems and experiences as we always strive to do that are equitable, that are innovative, and aligned with our shared vision for our students. As always, we are here to listen, to learn, and to collaborate together as one community. At this time, I'd like to invite Director Lorie Shelton, who will share more information about the background and context for the Losertos modernization project and provide some options for the board's consideration. Thank you. Good evening, President Anthony, board of trustees, cabinet, and the South San Francisco public. Um, thank you for having me this afternoon. Um, I want to take you back to uh where we began in several months ago in talking about Loserto's uh modernization. We began the project assessment late uh February 2024 and ended in October 2024. At that time, uh, just prior to completion, we'd learned that we had, um, PUC land that we were operating our playground, that we had, uh, been, uh, had some issues with our use permit, and that a few items such as the solar and the parking were not allowed, and that was something that we would have to discontinue. Um, we had some uh additional information um with the South San Francisco uh fire department and learning that we uh needed to rearrange our emergency

vehicle driveway. So there were a lot of issues that came forward as we completed the project assessment that required us to rethink our initial assumptions about what work we could do at uh the Los Certos campus. I pallet. Okay. Apologize I am not advancing. Okay, thank you. Sorry, a little technical difficulties. Next slide, please. So, tonight we're just going to take you through uh reposition where we had existing um campus conditions. We're going to talk through the campus modernization options. We're going to discuss the interim housing options that were directed by the board. Uh we'll get into cost and timeline and we'll talk about next steps and take whatever questions that you may have. Next slide, please. Next slide. So, just to reorientate everyone, this is the uh Los Cerrito's uh elementary school existing campus. Next slide. The red highlight is the PUC area that is um the property where we have our play structure, parking and solar arrays.

Next slide. And so the uh yellow is just identifying those areas that are in violation of our use permit. Next slide. So for um this next slide, I am going to and I apologize. I need to introduce my team. Um so we have uh our architects that are HE and with us we have Rob Hillary and Leah uh Marthnson and then the uh Kitchell uh representative is uh Erica Codon and then the my staff is uh Calvin Wonk and uh Gina D Martini. And so we will have um uh sorry catching up um I will have uh ask Leah to come up and just talk through the existing campus uh be as it is today and then we'll go through uh where we project it to be in the future. Hello everybody. Thanks for having us here. So just to orient everyone in terms of if you're not familiar with the Lertos campus, the um building to the top left, so north northwest of the site is the admin building, building A. It also houses some of the student support services. Next to it is building B. That's a multi-purpose building. It houses some student support services on the stage which is obviously something that needs to be changed when there's any modernization. Um the remaining buildings on campus are mostly uh classroom buildings. There are two portables. Those are the ones kind of in the center adjacent to the outdoor lunch area and those house the library and then more support and um afterchool programs.

So do I have a click or should I say next slide? Next slide. So, just to get back a little bit to Lor's point, we spent about six months on the project assessment. We met with the school site committee as well as Lori Lori and her team throughout that process. Don't expect anyone to read those scribbles that are on that plan, but that is one of many site plans that we looked at with the school committee to really understand what's going on on the site, what the key priorities were, what the school community really needed. And out of that process, we identified three sort of primary goals among many other things that were also identified. And those were to improve security and access particularly around the front door and how students come in and out of the school. Um to make sure that there were actually enough classrooms for the projected demographic enrollment specifically around um incoming TK and kindergarten students. And then third, Lertos, as I think probably everyone here knows, has a very um extensive student support program need and we really needed to provide better consistent appropriate spaces for those services to the students. So next slide. So coming out of that process, we identified a potential scope of work that would fit within the budget allocation. And that was essentially a new building at the center of campus that would house the library, student support services, and some additional TK or kindergarten classroom spaces large enough to meet current ed code. And then some refreshes to the existing classrooms, mostly finishes and HVAC system, a little bit of site work for the outdoor gathering and classroom spaces, and then security and fencing improvements, particularly again around the front door since that was a priority. So all wonderful and awesome

and then this SFPU sort of threw that plan into disarray because it it doesn't work without the access provided from that SFPU site. So Rob's going to walk through the options and sort of what the thinking that we came up with after that fact.

Thanks again for everyone uh attending tonight. So, you know, we've been working, I believe, probably last four or five months coming up with various options uh once we found out that part of the campus that we have the the parking and the canopy and and some of the the play structures on um and also a big item is the emergency vehicle access. So, fire trucks. So, a lot of that those elements now have to be on the campus. So, uh we've added several options. Tonight, we're going to go through two uh options that we feel are the most viable. uh those that meet the campus needs as well as some of the the budget constraints. Um and so with that, next slide. Oh, I have it now. Great. Get that. Uh Lee already kind of went through this a little bit uh in terms of the existing campus, but in terms of what's required, uh again I mentioned emergency vehicle access and so that is your fire truck ambulance. Um all that now has to be accommodated on the site. So if you look to the kind of the right side of the screen, the red dash line, uh that is essentially your property line. So everything now needs to be on that left hand side of that red line. Um, also in terms of requirements, you know, we have the outdoor play area, uh, TK and K. And then, uh, the outdoor dining space and then, as Leah mentioned, the 17 classrooms that are the the new programmatic requirements that we need to all encompass on this new approach to the site. Couple other ones were the staff parking that is going to have to be displaced and then also the off- streetet uh, drop off. I will say that the the bottom two the we did not get into the the options that you're about to see. Um as you'll see we we're packing in a lot. So with opt

sure y is that better?

All right. Great. All right. So option one is a two-story classroom building. Uh just to orientate everybody north is up on the page. So I'm going to try to do my best. Normally I'm usually standing by the screen pointing at things, but I'll do my best to kind of orientate as as we walk through. So to the north, you see kind of the lighter color building. Those are all existing. You now start to see uh sort of a gray colored area. That is your emergency vehicle access now coming onto site. So with that, you know, firet truck being the worst case scenario, we got to provide the proper turning radiuses, uh a hammerhead type turnaround. It eats up a lot of space. And then below that to the south of that emergency vehicle access you can see kind of the bright yellow and the orange colored building uh or spaces that is the the start of the twotory new construction that we're proposing in this option. The the blue element that's centered in between your existing building H which is the southernmost building u in addition with the the two-story building that's the TK play area. Uh all spaces that we're showing are the square footages that is in your current edspec. Uh so it it meets the district standard for sizes um for play area as well as the the programmatic spaces. Uh you can also kind of see to the east of the pink block. The pink block representing the library. Uh that's a a dining area. So again, we're displacing what's currently on the site. Have to provide new dining area. And then there's uh more area below that to the south where we're showing the upper grade play structure. That's the one that is going to have to move from the you know the PUC property over. So with all that uh just to kind of give you a ballpark of where we landed with classroom counts in this particular option we're at 18. 17 is the requirement. So you are getting additional um classrooms in this this

option. You're also getting more new construction of classrooms. So, it's a function of if you look to the the right side of the screen, kind of those green blocks, those are the new classrooms on that second level. Uh here's a blowup of that u same plan. Uh still not quite legible in terms of the the wording, but just to kind of point out, the yellow is the the TK and kindergarten complex. Uh orange is the Exploratorium classroom, and the pink is the library. And again, the TK play area is the the blue uh rectangle in the middle. And then the kind of darker purplish color that represents a modernization of building H. And that is for resource specialist's SLP reading specialists. So we kind of created a nice community of of student services. And then again on the second floor is the the green representing the upper grade classrooms. And also with this option, you get the ability to um have a teacher workspace as well as a a smaller collaboration type room. So we were able to get a lot in a two-story option. So with this option, uh this is representing where you kind of see the the blue dashed line that that idea of uh we're affecting that portion of the campus. So the southern portion of the campus you can you can see sort of a diagonal hatch in the bottom right hand corner. Uh that's a light modernization we call it. So um you know some lighting upgrades, some interior finishes, things like that. And then as we mentioned to the the left of that on in building H would be the uh student services. So building H would remain but building E which is your current kindergarten uh classroom building would be removed. The portables in the center that is the library and as well as a uh resource and after uh school classroom and then

building J would also be removed. And so in the the southern portion uh that would b basically be the construction area that's going to be affected. So with that, we're also starting to think about the interim or the temporary student h housing needs as a result of the construction. Uh if we were to to maintain the northern port part of the campus, the southern portion uh would would essentially be under construction that's resulting in 14 portables that would be needed for an interim or temporary housing situation. All right. So, with option one, just a few more considerations. Um, just to kind of give you a a summary of what we just talked about. So, you are getting an additional classroom with this option. Um, so you have more classrooms overall beyond the program. So, 18 instead of 17. Uh, you get more open space and that's a result of that twostory footprint. And with that, you know, you get the a little bit more play area um than you'll see in the next option. And then overall, again, because you have less buildings and more open space, you get some better sight lines of visibility throughout the whole campus. Um but again, a two-story massing is not what you have there currently. So it's a little bit different vernacular than what's the existing context. So going on to option two, this is a one-story classroom building. So with this option, you have two new construction uh sort of the the one in the center that you can see is the the pink and the orange. That is the library and exploratorium spaces as well as some student support in the again kind of dark purplish blue color. Uh and then the TK building being a separate structure over on the west side. So on the left side of the the plan uh and

then you'll see that kind of the bigger difference of the play area now becomes really adjacent to those TK and K classroom spaces. So it it creates a true kindergarten and TK community in in this option. Uh and then building J unlike the first option would remain and we do a little bit more modernization there to create more student service type spaces. That's the again the dark purple color. Uh and then you know building H has again some some minor modernization interior refresh. So with this one what you end up getting is uh 17 classrooms which meets the programmatic requirements that we developed with the the site committee. Uh sorry was there a question? No. Okay. Um so so in this option you get a little bit more of the existing classroom spaces uh instead of new construction. So again looking at the blowup uh just to point out again to the the west side kind of the the the yellowish color that's your TK buildings the blue the player adjacent directly uh accessible from those classrooms and then centralized would be your library and exploratorium type building and then building J and H would remain in that southern uh portion of the campus. Uh and also, you know, you start to see the more of the diagonal hatch pattern. Again, that's that emergency vehicle access coming into the site. Uh a little bit less of a a you know, hammerhead, so we're able to kind of condense it and try to preserve as much sight as possible. Uh and then you also see the the upper grades play structure. Uh again, you're we're sort of limited in terms of placement once you start adding that emergency vehicle access and dining and various buildings to where that new play structure would be directly outside of a classroom.

So again, talking a little bit about the demolition and potential phasing of this, it's very similar. Uh, this one has potential options of, you know, doing less construction all at one time, meaning that there's a couple different new buildings. So, with the new buildings, you could you could do one uh and and kind of, you know, keep that a contained construction area and then once that one's completed, then you can move on to the next building. So basically, you're segmenting the site, but for all intents and purposes, we we sort of decided that very similar, we'd probably want to maybe close the southern half of the campus just for student safety. Um, so with that, it's the same portable count that we'd be looking at is 14 for that interim student housing. So again, considerations, the the difference between options one and two. With the second option, it's a singlestory building mass. it is two buildings. Um, which is actually a somewhat of a benefit if you were to look at potential phasing of construction. Uh, and then you know again the play area is a more direct connection as opposed to the first option where it was a little bit more out in the open. Uh, and then the sort of one drawback is that with the the multiple buildings, you end up with a little bit less sight. Um, and so it's it's a little bit more contained. Like I mentioned, the the upper grades playground is directly adjacent to a classroom instead of having a little distance from buildings. Same thing with the dining uh becomes a little bit closer to buildings and things like that. So those were the two uh sort of proposed new options for the campus. Uh now we're going to get into the interim housing options and and with that based on what we felt were the needs of those 14 portables. Uh we looked at Sunshine Gardens and Ben ele or Ben High School. So Sunshine Gardens Elementary School

and Ben High School. Uh with Sunshine Gardens just to to kind of set it up. We looked at multiple sites. It's a little uh larger footprint in terms of open space, things like that. So we're able to truly investigate uh different areas on Ben. We we looked at one site and so we'll we'll walk you through those options here. So, as mentioned with Sunshine Gardens, we looked at three sites. The first site being in the south uh west portion and then site two is over the existing hardscape play area and then site three is is I call it up the hill. Um uh kind of your your field area to the the northern part portion of the site. So what we did is we we looked at the first site. Well, we looked at all three sites. With the first site, um you know, just some highlevel highlights. Uh we we did a layout in terms of the 14 portables, and we'll we'll show you that in a minute here, but it does fit the site. We can make the 14 portables for Losertos work in that site, one quadrant. Uh, one advantage is that because that site is closer to buildings, your utility runs are are pretty short, so that's a cost savings. Um, it's also a very flat site and so we're not moving a lot of earth to make it work from an accessibility standpoint. Uh, and then, you know, some of the potential drawbacks. So these are both plus and minuses as we did the analysis is that we had to take we'd have to take a portion of the existing play area for Sunshine Gardens. So you can kind of see that um kind of in the upper portion of the the green site one area. Uh but there's also the ability that we could use that blue uh again I'm used to pointing at things so I apologize. uh you can use that blue play area uh in the middle where we're showing the site one. And you know the the other advantage to this site is that

currently the emergency vehicle access enters from that uh southwest portion right along the side there. And so we can get that access to these new interim housing or new portables. Uh so you don't have to modify anything in that regard. So a little bit of a cost savings there as well. Uh and then also one of the the advantages we thought with this site is that it feels a little bit more integrated in the overall campus but yet somewhat separate. So Los Certos would still maintain their own identity but there's also the ability to have some shared amenities such as the kitchen and and also you know potentially admin uh staff support things like that. Uh so with site one kind of the big picture conclusion is that we you know we can fit the the 14 portables within that site. Um and we'll review costs a little bit later but uh it's it's a viable site unlike site number two. And I'm not going to spend much time on this because the conclusion was is that we could not get the 14 portables to fit. And so with that um there's some advantage to the site but doing our test fits we couldn't make it work out. So, I'm not going to spend much time on that. Um, site three, I apologize it's labeled incorrectly in the upper leftand corner, but this is site three. And so, the analysis with this is that uh given kind of the the hilly terrain up there, uh there's a lot of site development involved with with that. And so, the more site development we have to do, the more cost there is associated with it. Um, it's also going to be the furthest run to get uh utilities to those portables. And just to get the emergency vehicle access up that hill in that area, we're going to have to do a lot of again earth movement and um a lot of retaining walls, uh, ramping things like that just to get up to that site from accessibility,

handicap type u situation. And so, you know, with that, it's also a little bit more isolated. It's no longer in the front of the campus. And you know, I can just imagine dropping off your your child in the morning. What does that look like in terms of getting access to the back of that site? Um, so I mean, one advantage of the site is that it it's expansive. And so with that, it definitely fits the 14 portables and we actually looked at it. If loss Cerritos was uh entirely say we we shut down the site for construction, we could actually move the entire site over to to this site three. and we did a again more of a diagrammatic layout, but we can show you what that looks like in a second here. So, in terms of uh Sunshine Gardens, we're recommending that first site that we looked at. Again, it holds all 14 portables. Um, and just to give you an idea of the the portables that we're anticipating, uh, displacement of 10 classrooms, uh, based on the construction needs, one administrative portable, uh, one for student services support, uh, one library, one restroom, and one advantage of Sunshine Gardens that we have a shared kitchen. So, we didn't provide a portable for the the kitchen functions. Uh, the other advantage is that you're close to parking. And so, you know, we'd have to look at could that parking lot support additional admin staff, parents, things like that. But there's that ability to again have shared amenities uh with with this location. Um the gray areas within that you you know, we're nothing's been designed officially, but we're showing some dining. We're showing uh potential play areas. So again, spatially this site accommodates the needs. So again, site three is the one that's up in the hill, uh, you know, higher portion of the site in the norththeast corner. Um, and this is showing that we can get 23 portables, which would be

taking the whole campus if everyone wanted to be together over to this site. Uh, so again, 17 classrooms, one admin, one student services, one library. here. We don't have the ability to share the kitchen anymore. So, we provided a kitchen portable. Um, and then given the expansive uh or layout of the site, we we'd wanted a couple restroom portables just given the distance of of uh accessing. And so, uh you know, here we we'd still rely on the shared parking up front. Again, the ideal, you know, distance or the distance is not ideal. Um but it it could be worked out. Oops. So again, going back to to site one, um just to kind of point out some of the considerations, you you you know it is a shared facility, right? And and so um it would put a potential strain on Sunshine Gardens, right? Because you are now occupying their campus in a fairly uh sort of noticeable portion of the site. Um, and then, you know, there's also potential concerns with additional traffic in the area, right? Because you add more classrooms, you got more parents dropping off. Uh, and then, you know, like I mentioned, parking. We'd have to do an analysis to see what Sunshine Garden looks like currently and and understand what Loto's parking would add to that to see if it could really fulfill both campus type needs. Uh, and then, you know, just sort of a visual impact for your neighborhood. As we know, portables aren't the most attractive buildings, and we'd be putting them up front, and that would really kind of be the visibility uh from the public uh street frontage. And then, uh let's see. Oh, Sunshine Gardens. Uh just to point out, currently that is going through design for modernization as well, and there's a construction timeline

associated with that. So we'd have to wait for that construction to be completed before we could even move the loto students over to this campus. So you know we'd be looking at 2028 for that move. So as mentioned Ben is the other campus that we looked at. Uh we looked at one site here and that is that field that's located right outside here. And so again with this one, you know, we had earmarked 14 portables in terms of need needing displacement from Los Cerritos, but given this location, we would need a kitchen portable. So that's why we're showing 15 in this option. U and so you end up getting same 10 portables for classrooms, one restroom, one admin, one student services. Um and then you know areas for new dining and play as well as uh you know again talking a lot about emergency vehicle access tonight but it's a very important item. U given kind of the the site size of the site we need to provide a loop for a fire truck to get in and out. Um so you can kind of start to see that working its way around in in that field. Uh and then you know we feel that there's ample parking existing and so shared parking seems like a uh it wouldn't be too big of a constraint. And then uh you know with that you'd want to rework some of the fence and gates just to get better access into the the interim campus. Uh similar to Sunshine Gardens we looked at interim housing in terms of could it support the entire campus and the answer is yes in that whole field. we can get the 23 portables uh to fit plenty of area for uh play and dining. Uh so so again, you know, we'd rely on some shared parking with Ben. Um but, you know, we can make it work out and get everything we need on the site. So again, kind of going back to, you know, construction at Los Cerritos,

you're marking those 14 to 15 portables. So, you know, half the site moving over to Ben. Um there's there's plenty of space uh at the field. It feels like it would actually give Los Certo some independence from from Ben itself just the proximity to where this is located. Um and then you know we again we feel like there's more parking capacity here than there is at Sunshine Gardens and so a little bit less strain on the on the neighborhood in terms of that regard. So, next Leah's going to talk about cost and a little bit about timeline.

All right, I'm going to get to talk about the numbers that you may have flipped ahead to look at anyway because everyone already always does. But, um, before we get into them, just wanted to sort of set some baseline assumptions so that you know what you're looking at and we have some context for the numbers that we're going to talk about. So first and probably the most important, these are based on earlyphase planning. We haven't done construction documents. We haven't gone through a full process with the school and with the campus. So these numbers are early and there's a fair amount of contingency that is associated with that. They're also based on current market rates and recent projects, which is the information we have to date. I think we all know that there's a lot of economic unknowns that could also impact costs in the future. everything from tariffs to the overall economy. Um they also at the moment do not in include construction cost escalation. I'll talk a little more about some of the factors that are impacting timeline, but just as a general um thing to keep in the back of your head, anytime the duration extends, we're going to get increased costs because of escalation in prices. So for example, Rob mentioned Sunshine Gardens. We know that is going to start later because of the current construction of Sunshine Gardens. There is some cost impact associated with that and that'll be true for any kind of phasing or extended timeline.

Can I just ask one really quick question for the interim housing at Sunshine? Uh is it only if you did site one that it couldn't start until 2028 or is it both sites?

No, it would be both sites. they're doing a significant renovation and we would not try and do two of projects of that scale at the same time. Um so I'm going to share costs sort of shown in two ways. The first one is really construction costs. That's the cost that you would get from a contractor. The bid day cost to the um district. So that include that does not include consultant costs, DSA costs, surveying, some of the other administrative costs that would come along with the project. We're also going to show an estimate for total project costs that includes kind of a industry standard for what that would be just to get a sense of the scale. But um that's why you're going to see two sets of numbers relative to cost. Oops. So, a couple of other unknown things to the first, you know, this is still early design. Just keep in mind things that we don't know already. Um, again, Sunshine Gardens, the exact timeline of either of these projects at either campus is a little bit of an unknown. Um, we know there might be additional infrastructure needs on both of the interim campuses based on the population and how big that interim count that interim temp housing um, approach is. And then also we there's a lot of questions still about how it would actually work for Los Certos. Is it the full campus? Is it a partial campus? what are the operational needs at the new site? What stays at Los Certos? And so the exact nature of what that temp housing is, there's still a lot of questions to work through. Um, and then there's some other associated cost. For example, the SFPU sent Lori a bunch more fees that they're going to ask us to pay. So that's another kind of cost variable as we go through these. All right, I'm going to get into some numbers. I'm going to start out with the cost for the two Los Certos modernization again construction costs and then I'm going to share the um the

interim housing cost options and then we'll look at what that means for the project overall what the total cost is to do any of these project options. So again these are the two option one is the twotory option option two is the onetory option. Um, you'll see that the onetory the one-story option is for obvious reasons less expensive than the two-story option. It involves less new construction, less square footage of construction overall. So that's that variation. Any questions? I'm just going to keep going to the really big table at the end unless anyone has any. So in terms of the interim housing cost, there's a few more options. We have two the two possible sites at Sunshine Gardens and the single site at Ben. And then we have the variable whether it's partial temp housing or full campus temp housing. And so that that really ranges and you'll see the largest costs are really associated with that Sunshine Garden site three. That's the upper site on the hill. And that's really because there's much more significant site um earthwork infrastructure components associated with that site regardless of the scale of the housing. Excuse me.

Yes. Would you please um clarify for me that these um projections are for just interim temporary? Yes. Because I I'm kind of getting uh mixed up with the um permanent versus interim.

Yeah. We've been throwing around intram and temp and I apologize for the confusion. These numbers that are currently up are only for the temporary campus that would be located at a site away from Los Cerritos. These numbers on the previous slide are the construction costs for the modernization of the Los Certos campus. Okay. So, the the total cost for doing any of this needs to combine both of those two things because you can't do this without paying for temp housing somewhere. So, that's so that's one more question. Yeah, go ahead.

You you mentioned the fees for the San Francisco PU. What is that cost for? as I understood it, um once the the school eliminates the solar panels and clears the area of the PUC um that we were illegally encroaching upon or Losertos for a certain it was my understanding that we would not be able to use that that in any way that we were left out. we could not put any use it in any way capacity that we had been using or plan to use and in the future they may let us use a portion of it for a playground or a play structure. So the PUC has indicated um to me that they will allow us to continue to use that area as a playyard. We're just not allowed to build anything on it. However, um if you recall from my previous presentation, uh there will be a period of time which we don't have the date information yet that they're going to be doing construction on that uh area. And so it will be unavailable to the school to utilize, which is kind of why we're trying to also carve out some play space on our own property for that period of time, you know, or we'll have to come up with another option on students being able to use some play space. But PUC has indicated that we'll be able to continue to use it. However, they will be charging us an annual fee.

Oh, okay. I get it. But theoretically, if we if we rebuilt the campus to be within the line, we don't necessarily need this space anymore. We could go without it and just not get the permit. Depending on the option you choose, potentially. Potentially.

Got it. Well, we would we we would be out of the parking spaces, which is what it's being used for. And that's a concern of mine at the moment, too, that we haven't even thought about or put it on paper because I know for a fact that the boys club across the street are the only free spaces and then in the park, which are already very small amounts. So, I'm I'm not looking forward. It's a really constrained site. Like, it's we looked at a lot of options to try and get even a few parking spaces in it. And when we look at the once you take that SFPU slice away to maintain safe access for like you saw how big that EVA path is like China's Yeah. So I mean we would certainly something that we can continue to look at but if you look at the plans like is super tight. There's hard to get away from that fact. Okay. Thank you. Sure. All right. Big table number one. This is construction costs. So again, you know, there's a lot of option. You know, the top is the options for the interim housing. The left side are the two lotos modernization options. So, the large um font in the middle will be like what is the total cost to do a project? And that's going to range construction cost from roughly $25 million up to $35 million if we did the more expensive project and you did the more expensive interim housing. Um and again, so this is looking at construction cost. there

is uh an overall project cost industry standard is to add rough that you need to allocate roughly additional 40% for project costs. Erica, did I say that right? 40%. Um and so when we do that math, obviously we haven't calc um components of that, but looking at an additional 40%, we're then starting to look at a project cost of ranging from 34 million all the way up to 48.4 million. And I think in red, which is showing up really small on the screen from here, the original Losertos budget allocation was 20.3 million. That was going to cover that original new construction modernization that we showed up front. And so you can see in parenthesis under each option is the delta sort of the the difference between the allocation and what would be required to do those options. I'm gonna leave it here for a minute. Does anyone have any questions about cost? Go to next slide. Okay. All right.

All right. So, oh, timer. Yeah. So, quick. This is just a general timeline a sort of we obviously a lot of unknowns on schedule but roughly we for a modernization of the scale of Los Certos we'd be looking at roughly eight months of construction sixish months in DSA and then a year and a half of construction. So we'd be trying to manage the interim housing project the construction of that work to go faster right up front so that it was complete by the time we were ready to start construction at Los Critos. And of course, as with anything, when we're in these early phases, there are a lot of schedule unknowns. Um, we would probably want to go through um want to specifically point out if we did interim housing at Ben, we want would want to do some sort of project assessment um at Ben to identify if there's any of the spaces at Ben that could perhaps be used for the interim housing, if there were any um potential for the interim housing to serve a long-term use at Bayen that would sort of offset some of those upfront costs. But, you know, we'd want to figure that out. Lori, do you wanna All right. Can I just ask one more question about timeline? Um, you said for Sunshine Gardens either site would be a two-year delay, but for Ben and but this for the Sunshine, could you do some of that planning and stuff concurrently with us waiting for the actual space to be available versus bait in do we if we're going to have to do a project assessment plus this plus this, does it also end up being two years? I would anticipate the project assessment at Ben is shorter, but yes, to your point, we could be doing uh some of the planning at Sunshine Gardens if we go that if we make that decision. All right. So, we want to get into uh next steps.

And Sarah, our team's hope is that um when we leave here, we can get uh board direction on what design option that we want to move forward with with the Los Certos campus, which interim housing option that we should be considering. And then um I know that at some point we will have to have discussions about funding options. Um fortunately for Mr. Oh, he's not here today. So, that's a whole different conversation. Um, and then after we have some of those um items determined, then we can start working on schedules. Um, and if the baiten assess the beten interim housing option is uh determined, then we'll we'll start working on planning for that so we can really understand what's happening at that site. Um and then work on uh the rest of the design for uh Losertos and the interim housing plants. Um so a lot of this we have mentioned before some of the board considerations um just transportation to and from whichever interim site we uh select. Um things like uh traffic parking and um the existing programs at the site. uh all of this again we've been talking about staff parking and then any other um design uh situations uh related to the PUC and so um with that I'm going to open it up for questions. [Music]

Hi I have lots of questions. Um what kind of outreach do we conduct to in the community parents, teachers, staff and um community? At this time we have not. We need to make a decision on what interim housing options we want to select so that we can do outreach and get their input on that. But at this early stage we have not done that.

So without that I would not be able to give any direction myself. Um, so we have an engaged parents, teachers, community. Plan two, um, one of the things that it said is that it's because of the two stories. It's it's taller than most of the buildings in the community. And so there there may be a problem with the planning commission and with the community because they tend not to like things that look like that. for our construction projects, we don't go to the city planning department. We go to the state uh the division of state architects.

Okay. Well, we should still engage the community. Um I didn't know that we just had the two options that we were keeping Los Cerritos. I thought that we were considering possibly merging um merging lotos with another school. Um we what what is the enrollment at lotos? Do you know that? So under 300 how much

do do you know how many of those students are special needs students that we brought in so that we could increase your enrollment? Um, I'm sorry I didn't ask you the questions ahead of time, but um, do we know what the um, what the enrollment at, um, Sunshine Gardens is? I'm sorry, guys.

307. So we have two schools that are teetering at the very edge when we where we should be closing them because 300 is is the magic number, right? And so we could put like all this money into Los Cerritos into the school and they could fall below the 300 as could Sunshine Gardens and then we'd have to consider closing them. Um that's why I thought like combining the schools in some way would be a better option.

Um can I can I jump in? I I raised this question as well um in terms of trying to understand enrollment projections and I and but there's some interesting data from like a past I guess there was an enroll like a population study or something and that was projecting that losser like should have increases just based on future development. Now I know that that was done a number of years ago but um I just yeah I question like jumping to like let's all these kind of things but anyway that's that's what I want to jump in on

the you might have answered this but how long would the kids have to be relocated like for plan one and then plan two because we could do plan two in stages it said but like plan one, they would actually have to leave campus. Do we know? Yeah. So, depending on how we phase the construction, which we don't know just yet, um if we said that that whole southern portion would be um all of the construction area, we're looking at probably 18 months of displacement. 18 months. Yeah. For both of them or

Yeah. Again, the option two, you could potentially build the TK classroom building, finish that, have students occupy, and then move towards the library. Um, do that building. So, you could do a multi-tered fade phase construction, which could actually end up elongating it, but it keeps more students on the on the site. So, Okay. Yeah. um what would happen with the solar panels because I don't think I saw them on the

the solar panels will be removed. Um however, we um have requirements to add solar panels to new buildings. So, whatever new buildings uh we would uh build would have solar panels likely on the roof. Okay. Um, but we'll definitely have them, right? Um, on plan one or the first plan. Um, the the Kinder Playard, where where would that be? I see one yard in the middle, but I don't see any.

Okay. course it's way in the beginning.

Yeah. Okay. So, actually, yeah, if we go to the zoomed in one. Yeah. Here we go. So, that that blue rectangular portion where it says play area, that's your TKK. Right next to it is play structure. Got it. Um, on plan one, um, do they lose the black top and green space? Sorry.

On plan one, do they do they lose all green space and um, and the black top? Both places will lose their I mean both plans will lose their outdoor classroom space. But do they do they have green space and um, blacktop? Uh so with you kind of see the diagonal hatch that being emergency vehicle access that needs to be maintained as an asphalt hardcape for a drive aisle. So we we couldn't plant landscape in that area. You can't do buildings in that area. Um so all that would have to be asphalt. Uh what we're showing is just some representation of of like game markings. So you see like four square things like that that could be on that asphalt and not interrupt the EVA emergency vehicle access. Um in terms of landscape we're not there in terms of design yet. This is very high level just trying to get what could fit a test fit on the site as well as some some rough order of magnitude costs so some decisions could be formulated.

Okay. I I guess those are my questions. Um, as I said, until we engage the community, the parents and teachers especially, I, you know, there the teachers are going to lose all of their parking spaces and I I have gone there for many many functions and it the parking there is really hard anyway. I don't know where they would park. So one consideration is if we do not modernize Losertos, we will still lose parking. The parking lot will be gone. We we the bare minimum construction that we have to do at Los Certos is to remove the solar solar array, remove the play structure, remove parking.

So we can also lose teachers. And so I that's why we have to engage our teachers and um and our parents. You know, I I I've talked to a lot of the parents. They have they have major concerns. And um and that's why one of the reasons that I thought we were looking at more than just you know at our last um presentation that was not one of the directions that we were given to consider. I can't remember. That's what I thought. Um, okay. Thank you. Any other questions? I have a question.

Yeah, go ahead, Mina. I've got a lot of questions, too, but go ahead.

Okay. Um, I like Ben because it's these will be the only all day students and there's parking and uh versus Sunshine Gardens for the interim placement of 14 portables. But I do have a question for the um the the modernization. Will all the structures that are currently there be replaced? No. If you um look at uh just example the buildings that are on the upper portion the the north portion of the campus those remain. You mean those old barrack ugly things?

Unfortunately, yes. Oh my god. Let me let me absorb that a little bit. That's terrible. That's a 70 year old campus. You mean we have to come back and put another portable in there somewhere? Because these are but I don't know. You can hold it. You you can only hold it so much idea with the second story only because it may will that is that me or will that free up any kind of space for the children?

Okay, it will free up I like that idea best. Thank you. I'm not sure where to begin. I uh I I am a little concerned about not having uh community input ahead, but I understand there's sort of a chicken and an egg perhaps of like well we have to push for one because you know you you know you as architects need to you know dive deeper into whichever option and direction. So um I uh I guess I'll just wait uh wait into it. I mean, I I think of the options, I I mean, I appreciate option one because it does feel like there's a lot of potential architecturally for like a better flow, better um uh just, you know, better space setups and and whatnot, you know, but um but I don't know if I can justify the, you know, having that 7 million, you know, or plus uh difference um to gain basically one classroom. Um the both options do meet the the scope that and just to confirm both meet the original scopeing of the pro of the modernization project. So we're not like going to get like short change. I don't want people to feel like they're short changed by picking one or the other because both do meet all the goals. Is that correct?

Okay. So um yeah. So I feel like option one I mean I'm sorry option two you know it still meets the goals. um it's still kind of in our ballpark, you know, of the original scoping because I think no matter what moving forward, the the costs uh we have to assume that the costs may go up from what we've estimated. So, I think to start off already high um and not gain at least on numbers wise, I mean I think space-wise it would be it could be fantastic, but numbers wise um not gain that that much and already kind of putting ourselves in a deeper hole is a little bit hard for me to uh go in that direction. So, um but that said, I think uh even option two there potential to uh do a really great job, right? I mean, I trust you guys to do, you know, some come up with something fantastic, even with having to modernize, you know, our existing buildings. I think uh I have great appreciation for architects and your skills to do create uh spaces that are usable and uh and friendly and all that kind of thing. Um, and then as far as um the interim housing, uh, I think just having such a delay, uh, if we pick any of the Sunshine Garden options is is a non-starter for me. I I don't feel like having to wait until 2020 to start and then already like whatever option we picked for the Lost campus, like to already have to pad in like another 18% on top of that or more uh, because we had to wait. I mean, that to me is a non-starter. Uh I And it's too bad because I think like being closer to maybe kids uh you know, another elementary school could be a good option, but um to have to wait. I don't I don't feel comfortable like uh going that way. So, um, and I I think I

asked also ahead about, uh, the possibility of using some of the existing facilities at either Ben or or Sunshine, uh, to hopefully cut down on the scope of the inter room housing like maybe we don't have to buy as many portables if we can use a classroom or so or some offices on the existing campus. Uh, could you speak to that in terms of both options?

So, I'll speak to Sunshine Garden first. right now because we have done the project assessment there is no capacity to use any of the existing um space. Uh so that is um not an option for us but Ben we have not done that analysis. Um there is the potential that there might be some programs that could be uh placed elsewhere. Um so we that is a potential we just don't know the answer to that but that is something as we would be evaluating uh Benen on an assessment perspective we could determine um so that is is it is definitely a consideration

okay thank you and then uh as far as uh which I I I should probably have studied the map more but like which grades would go into the inter room housing like let's say for the partial that has not been determined we would look to the cab uh site administration to help us make that determination.

Okay. And then uh lastly in terms of when kids do move there um I mean this is further down the line but I feel like you know we're going to have to yeah really talk to the community about this and like what supports uh we can offer because you know splitting a campus I'm sure it's hard but hopefully the promise of like hey we're going to have this brand new campus you know in a year a year and a half two years time um hopefully that's uh something worth uh waiting for but um to uh how can we support the students who do have to move temporarily

and part of our discussions with the site administration will be understanding what their needs are so we make sure we um at least from a facilities perspective have those um uh spaces in place but again that is working really close with the um site administration to be able to understand that so unfortunately I can't answer that at this moment but that is something we would be looking to answer. Okay. Yeah. I just wanted to put it out there that and I'm glad at least we know that I I assume we know we we need to do that but to put it out there. Uh so thank you.

Um I know that at the last meeting I said that we couldn't make any decisions or I couldn't make any decisions without talking to the parents. I went on to the campus and I told the parents I said look we will not make any kind of decision without um including you. I told like I told I was going there a couple of times a week and I told all the parents that because that's what I was told at the last meeting that that the parents would be included on the decision that no decisions would be made unless they were um they were told first and um I I'm just really disappointed right now because um because they weren't engaged and they should have and and um and then as I said the teachers losing their parking that is huge. I just don't know how we can move forward without engaging that community, the parents and the teachers and its staff. So that's I mean I do think it's really hard to I understand what you're saying. Um I don't we had the study session in what March and that was super preliminary. We didn't even have plans. So like going and saying hey maybe we're going to do this maybe we're going to do this you know I think there probably is some space for codeesign once you get to the next phase. Um but uh I yeah I don't know. Um so I I have a couple questions too. Um so first question is kind of about uh site 3 at sunshine. Um you mentioned that there needed to be a lot of grading and a lot of work. Um as we're seeing with Westboro in order to have the field and whatnot, we also had to do a lot of

grading and a lot of work. So, if we were to do something at the site three um and we did all this grading and work and then put portables there for a while, a would it be ultimately beneficial for the Sunshine Garden site to have a newly graded and more usable field up there? Uh that certainly could be a possibility. um it was never expressed to us during the project assessment phase that they had an interest in that but that could change.

Okay. Um second thing is with Sunshine Gardens um and if you don't have question answers to this I don't know that it's okay it's I didn't ask these ahead of time. Um, we know that they also have a lot of work to do on their own campus. And my question is, well, I mean, will that also require a displacement of classrooms? I remember last year when they did the HVAC and they did the administration wing like those were they were kind of like occupying some temporary space. Would they also need uh interim housing for the work that's being done at the campus? So right now um Sunshine Gardens is is moving into their design development phase and we've we know that uh as we do some of the classrooms we'll have to have some uh interim housing units. We have not gotten to the point where we've designed for that but we've estimated a few classrooms for that. Um so the answer to your question is yes that will happen. Um to what extent nothing compared obviously to Los FTOS but yes we'll we'll need to do that as well.

Okay. And then um thinking about other site needs that are at Sunshine. I mean I think the Boys and Girls Club uses that hardscape surface where most of site one is. Maybe not the green space, but they're using the the area there for their programming. So having the temporary site there like what would they do while Lostos was on that campus in in theory?

Well, we basically split that c that uh side of the campus in half. So you have the upper half, excuse me, um the upper half and then maybe there's a potential to utilize um the kyard uh and split that uh for access with them as well. So that will be something that we would have to uh engage the site administration with on how we would move forward with that.

Okay. And then um also thinking just about site three, um I respect Pat's concern about parking. I mean, people do drive to school, right? Um, could that front space that's kind of currently site one, could that become parking for additional, you know, the interim housing in the back or additional other uses there? Create a paved parking space uh permanently. Um, it could, we haven't done that analysis, but that's a potential option.

And would that also probably cost that would add to the cost? Okay, that makes sense. Um, okay. Um, those are my questions. Thank you for fielding them on the fly. Um, I I far prefer option number one. Um, I think it is a more elegant solution. I think it is Yeah. better use of space. No, not this one. I like the two-story building.

Oh, got it. Sorry. Um, I think it provides a lot more space for teachers who've been crammed and resource teachers who've been crammed into totally inadequate spaces for a really long time. Um, the other the one-story building really feels like it still has a lot of constraints on those resource spaces and I think that they should have more space to do that work. Um, so I mean I'm a real preference. I have a real preference for this. Uh, I also really like that the TK yard is uh in the middle uh and sort of surrounded. I think that's sort of a joyful setup to be honest. Um, my my preference is also so when I was in elementary school, we had to move like our fourth and fifth grade to a different campus because they were modernizing our campus. And I loved it as a kid that I was like not at the same campus as K3. Um, but I also think it was probably really really hard on the administrator to have two campuses. Um, and given that uh, Miss Prasad already has three campuses on her site, like I can't imagine her playing, you know, backup quarterback on a fourth site if Miss Hong can't get there for something, right? right? If there's like that's just it's just too much. So, um I know it's I'm choosing kind of both most expensive options. Uh I you know I realize money doesn't grow on trees but deserve I mean it it would be much easier and much more cohesive for the campus to move together and to have one administrator on one site um and one community on one site um as we make the rest of the site much nicer.

Um so my preference is option one uh and frankly I think it's Ben. I I really like the idea of using site 3 at sunshine. It's not significantly more than Ben. Um but listening to kind of the concerns, I I think you guys over the the years that I've been on this board know that I feel more urgency to act than to continue to sit and hope that some better, cheaper solution materializes. Um, and I I don't think site three having to wait another two years to to possibly occupy site three for the full campus um interim housing is not my best option. So I would if I'm voting right like option one full campus Ben that's what I would vote for.

Thank you. We we have a very split vote though. I mean we've got somebody who's not voting right. We've got uh I think Mina, you were option one Ben, but I don't know if you're full campus or split campus. I wanted I like the twotory. Yeah.

But you know, I'm going for the crazy parking situation that I see almost daily, too often outside of Loser that I notice the same issues at Sunshine Gardens. So that's that's a Sunshine Gardens is embedded in neighborhoods. It's got homes and people with their cars and garages. Um Ben is sort of out there. It's got the field. It's like it coexists really well with the neighbors. And I don't see or hear many complaints. Trust me, I listen to the complaints of the neighbors. We don't want to step on their toes. But I hear from the neighbors at Sunshine Gardens that we don't like too much X. We don't want this. So those little things just hang in my in the back of my mind and I thought we don't I don't want to anger the neighbors. We're there at their, you know, they start complaining, we're we're in trouble. And I don't see that it's very user friendly for even when I go to functions, there's no place to park. I mean, I hope I'm not using somebody's space, but parents that come there, I, you know, I almost feel like walking sometimes, but it's kind of far. But this this is my concern that Sunshine Gardens just doesn't offer too many options and we're not leaving our cars soon anytime soon or bringing bikes or all those things at you know the new age thinking.

I mean it's a little longer neighborhoods and that's how but you could you can walk from you can walk from Los Certos to to Ben. You can't walk. I mean, you can, but it's not a nice walk, right?

Right. Like, I mean, Ben, Ben is significantly closer to the current campus. Yeah. No, I you know and I about the thing about what we tell parents, you know, it's difficult cuz parents have a pre, you know, they don't understand construction jargon and we don't know what they've been told or they understand. So there's a I always I was to tell telling the superintendent that we have a a u messaging gap somewhere that the parents just aren't getting it and someone has to straighten that that out because I understand that um we we didn't make any decisions about uh closing one school or any of that because that's what the the rumors and I don't want to spread any rumors, but we got to straighten the message. That's that's all I have to say. Thank you.

I'm sorry. Pat already asked if she could say something, Amy, before you say anything. Um, well, since we are divided, can we possibly have like a study session where we invite the parents and the the teachers to sit in and is that is that a possibility? I mean, it would be at the direction of the board, but I'm just asking. Yeah. Can I ask Dr. Martis come up?

Yeah, that's absolutely possible. We did send the message out to the community that we were going to be hosting this and having conversations about it. And so, the board absolutely can do that. And if I may just comment for questioning, uh the board was given talking points so that we were consistent and those same talking points were also shared with the principal who shared it with her parent community so that people would be clear on what our next steps would be. But if that is the pleasure of the board to hold a study session um then the board can direct me to look for a date and time to be able to do that.

How would a study session differ from this path? It would be session. No, I mean a study session is typically still a board meeting that has public comment which is basically what's going to happen here, right? That is correct. Do we have any on here?

I don't know how what the what the outreach was. I understand that you let the community know, but um you know that this would just be about Los Cerritos. We would invite the parent community, the PTA, we would we would invite the teachers so that they can make their their voices heard. Amy, uh I need to think about that.

No, actually you had other comments. Well, no. I was thinking back I was, you know, looking at the the cool table. Thank you. Uh, of the the cost. I mean, I think you are, you do have a point that the c housing the full campus, you know, it is not that much more. I mean, not you know, you know, a million. It's still it's still quite a lot, but you know, close to 2 million. But um I I still do have concerns about yes starting um as much as option one I do agree would probably be the more elegant solution I I am concerned about the cost. So I I don't know if I can be con convinced right this moment to to pick

my the board doesn't need to weigh in on this anymore unless if if Pat isn't going to vote on anything and say this then I think what it sounds like is that the next meeting would be with the community without the board and saying hey here's here's what we presented to the board at the community forum and we'd like your feedback. back and we'd like to hear from you and see what you think. Um, and then we can just bring it back as an action item uh at a future board meeting after that. Would that be appropriate? Okay. Okay. We can definitely do that. Thanks. I think that's great. Thank you, President Anthony. Um, can I have a quick question?

Yeah. Yeah. Um, the city I mean the district has quite a few sites. Um, are these the only ones we're considering still? Cuz I I got ideas too that we could um talk about, but it seems like we've decided on these two sites. We did. Yeah. Trustee Richardson, if you recall back in March, the board we talked about various possibilities and these were the two sites that the board gave direction on for us to explore further. So yes, these are the two that that you directed me to work with staff to ensure that we prioritized that and brought it back. Okay.

Can I add one ask one more thing? Um I know we couldn't really do an analysis of like how to fund the the gap because you know we have 20 million allocated from the bond but now it could be 3540 or whatever. So uh can that be part of I don't know whatever meeting or I I don't know. I I think I need that piece. I don't think the parents need to weigh in on that. No offense, but No. Okay. Yeah, that point taken, but when could we have that kind of uh that piece of information?

I think when we bring something back before the board, because it'll include very similar things that we had here, if and we know that that's a question that you're going to raise that I can work with Mr. O to make sure that we have additional possibilities if there are additional possibilities for that additional 20 plus million. Right. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. All right. Um I didn't receive any comment cards for this item and I so I think do we do I I'm looking at Dr. Moore. Should I just take that during public comment or I think we should split the the topics if we can. So if you have a comment card on Los Certos, please bring it up. Thank you. You can just go straight to the podium and get give it a second because we got to start the clock. All right. Thank you, Erica.

Good evening, board and community. My name is Erica Ruiz and I am a parent of Losertos. I have two children at the school. Um, I also had two children at Martin when they were going through the modernization process. So, I was actually pretty surprised that the community has not been involved in this process because I remember at Martin we did have a meeting where they went over the options and they did include us in that process. So, like I said, I'm really really surprised that Loserto's community has not been involved with this because obviously it's going to be a huge impact. Um and I strongly suggest that um we do get invited so our voice can be heard um in regards to you know the estimates that are being provided right now. That's also very important for the community to know because you know as a property owner I want to know if there's going to be any additional um funding that's going to be needed and how that's going to come upon. So, um I would just ask that we do please get in included and that we participate in these discussions because it is um extremely important that we do so. So, that's just my two cents right now since I don't really have a lot of information. I'm kind of learning a lot about, you know, the plans right now. And the only way that I knew about this meeting today was because I got the the text message. That's why I came in. So, thank you for listening to me and I look forward to that meeting. All right. Thank you. Okay. Uh, we'll wrap up this part of

this item and we will move on to artificial intelligence unless you have anything else. Glory. All right. Thank you so much, President Anthony. Yeah. May I suggest that we take a 10-minute recess so we don't have to interrupt Dr. That's fine. For our captioner. Yep. That's fine. So, it I have the time is being uh 7:54. So, we'll come back at 8:04.

All right, we are back. Yeah, there's there's this is it. You're you're up. This is your first presentation, isn't it? Congratulations with South City. Yeah, I know. Yes.

Yes. Good evening, President Anthony, Vice President Murray, board of trustees, Dr. Moore, Cabinet, and South City Community. My name is Dr. Campbell, assistant superintendent for teaching and learning. I want to first thank trustee Sheay who is not in attendance for naming this artificial intelligence as an area of interest and for the rest of our trustees voting that this should be a topic of discussion for our community forum something I am very passionate about. So again my name is Dr. Campbell assistant superintendent for teaching and learning and I'm going to take you through a presentation for on artificial intelligence. So first slide has to be the alignment. It's short so it doesn't Can you hear me? Yes. So the first slide obviously has to be the alignment with our core values, strategic plan and portrait of a graduate. Um artificial intelligence can and should be used to enhance the student um education and outcomes and experience for our our students. Um our presentation agenda is as follows. So the first will be an overview and implications on artificial intelligence in education, the impact to the educational community and profession as a whole, our current use, um potential future use, and the need for guidelines and policies related to AI. So I won't say artificial intelligence the entire presentation. So from moving forward, I'll just say AI. All right. So many of us know AI is when a computer can do things that normally humans will do with thinking. Um, so some very early examples that I'm sure we are all engaged in AI, Siri, Alexa, right? A chatbot that can answer your questions.

A lot of um, healthc care and just customer service uh, platforms and organizations use chatbox to answer those questions that, you know, a human can answer. the first level of that, a car that can drive itself. Um, being new to the San Francisco area, Whimo and those things. It's amazing. Have you ridden in one yet? I I have. Yes.

Um, and obviously a website that can recommend movies based on, you know, the things that you like. Um, I do want to name before that, you know, artificial intelligence has been around for quite a while. um its first uh its first its birth if you will started in uh 1956 at Dartmouth and it just has over time uh been slowly integrated into our everyday life. Um, now I I'd like to ground everything we do in research. And so I was a part of a fellowship specific to AI with Google and GSV where I learned about this study that was done in 2017. It's a deep study 163 pages. I wouldn't, you know, if you have time and like to read, you can, but the executive summary of that is that, you know, jobs lost and job gains. Um, technology and AI will reshape the way we work. Um, and so that's not a a it shouldn't be at least a scary concept. It's just going to define the types of skills that would be needed. And so this report in 2017 went in depth for all organizations, education, health care, many different types of business businesses and all over our nation just to name like what are the things that will shift in the future. And their predictions led heavily that in 2030 is when we'll like say like these these um the roles that and some of the skills and the roles that we currently use will be different in the future. And we see that happening currently. Um policies institutions need to proactively plan. And again this is why it is my pleasure to be before you having this discussion. So I want to go into the implication on

education uh need for lifelong learning and reskilling. So this is such a positive um aspect for us to take within our educational community because we are charged with teaching our future and the need for lifelong learning is not just for the youth is for adults. Um, but the report suggests that we would need different skills. And with that said, for those who are already in the work industry, if they're going to require new skills, then we know that we're going to have to teach our students skills and involve them and engage them in their education a little differently than the way we were educated so that when they are done and they go to their post-secary, you know, desire, they're able to be competitive in their in their future. Um AI also has an implication on helping with inequity. Now here it's talking about you know there's a risk that access to artificial intelligence and technology should be something that educational systems think about to make sure that we level the playing field for all students. Exposure and access just like exposure and access to grade level instruction is important, exposure and access to technology will be explicitly important as well. Um the growing demand for education and educational spending. So when we think about AI platforms, when we think about technology, we have to make sure that we are selecting technology programs and software and also thinking about how we continue to replenish because tools and systems can consistently and quickly become outdated if we're not thinking about how we continue to replenish. Um some of the tools we might use 10 years ago won't be compatible with some of the future things. So it's obviously something we need to think about. I

liked uh I wanted to bring attention to the shift in skills required. And when I think about a portrait of a graduate and we think about the critical skills that are needed, the creativity, critical thinking, collab collaboration, communication, soft skills, um the ability to have social and emotional intelligence. These are all things we aim and aspire to provide all our students as graduates. And so it's deeply aligned in the work that we do here at South City. There's institutional change that would occur. Um there's a need for varying platforms. Obviously, the pandemic taught us quite a bit about learning online and now while learning styles are different and 100% online learning is not for everyone, there are people and you youth that could benefit for those from those opportunities. Um, credentiing is important when we're thinking about um fields within education and the changing role of staff and educators. So, I want to rest here a little bit. Um we all know that you know in our schooling many of us went through schooling where there were rows and you know your teacher taught and you just kind of captured all the information you can and there has been a shift in education where we want the teaching to go more to facilitation of whether it be discourse which is one of our academic priorities here at South City. Um but the facilitation of learning means that the teacher's work is generally done before the students are in the room. It's in the planning for the activities for the technology for the questions so that when the students are in the room the cognitive lift is heavily on our students and that they can show us what they're learning and what they're capturing. Another thing that will be important for AI if we're going to

integrate and use it um when we're educating our students is to have the the context that or the understanding that students come they're assets. They're assets. They come with knowledge and they're contributors to the learning environment. And so we're freeing up the time for deeper student interaction and conversation. And that's a deep implication on education. So positive impacts, we talked about critical thinking, right? We need to think about how we redesign curriculum um so that the skills again, they're less automatic. It's less rope memorization. It's less um like the fluency of individual skills and it's more leaning on the ability to problem solve. um to be able to think about situations differently and then solve for it. Um those are skills that many um organizations in the future are looking for um our youth to have as they enter into the workforce um with teachers and staff. Professional development should begin to shift from again that content the content delivery as the only um owner of the knowledge to a facilitator of the knowledge used in the room because students will be able and and with technology are able to grasp and get a hold of much quicker quicker in my days when there was an encyclopedia and those types of things. they have access to information um so much easier. And so now the role of an educator is to help our students understand like what they see might not always be fact. Like how do you research? How do you make sure that resource is a real resource? And how do you critically think about the information that's being provided to you? And then another positive impact is that

you know we're going to have to think about the investment in technology and then the infrastructure for that technology as we venture to you know engage more with AI. So this is a a positive impact the expansion of equity and access. So I want to name um as a part of that fellowship I had an action impact project to work with an AI company that I'll talk a little bit about later um and it's not a plug or anything it was just a beautiful opportunity to help that company uh design a platform where there was already uh uses for teachers to build games for you know related to the content for students but really um lesson planning for the varying needs in a room. Um AI could potentially be a positive, you know, use for teachers. We know that differentiation is a word that we say that is needed, but it is a hard thing to do when there are multilingual learners in the room, students with that require special services, um and just different learning styles. And AI could potentially help teachers who know the students in their room in an AI platform can type in the needs and interest and maybe the grade level, the standard and what they'd like to do and it could help with the grouping and the diff differentiated instruction um for teachers and hence saving them time. And so that's another huge positive impact or potential use for AI. Um it allows you know the flexibility in credentiing again for adults and still always need to name funding because these software tools the resources will continually need to be refreshed to again to

essentially keep in in step with the movement and the pace of AI and technology within education. So current use I want to thank um our edtectosa Jench Chan for providing me current use um or previous and current use because I was unaware um and I'm learning. So in 2023 24 there was this introduc introduction to chat GPT tips on how to make sure data remains private and some collaboration on how it can make the professional life more streamlined. something that I just referred to previously. Um there was a partnership with Common Sense Education to pilot some literacy lessons schools um one school did it engaged and had a good experience and there's the feedback there from that 2425 the techtosis created AI guidelines for staff. Um, I want to name with AI there's continually a concern about academic dishonesty and I want to name that concern for academic dishonesty has always been present and while AI can help prepare an answer um teachers know and get very closely accustomed to styles of writing and are able to identify. Um I want to say that the student use of AI to generate thought I myself um use AI because sometimes it's difficult to get started in your thinking right and this is how you should be using it. It's not necessarily representing your thinking for you. It's just helping you get started in instances where it's difficult to get started if you have writer's block or something like that. Um so there's a creation of an AI team consists of teachers at all of our levels. Um there's an agenda posted

there. there's some attendance of adults to you know some PD uh magic school is actually referenced here and there's more attendance of learning and then for this year there's attendance to learning and att and and with a hope to reconvene that te tech teacher leader team um to really begin to fold in AI team members and really make some plans for PD and some different programs for teachers who some who might be already using and some additional programs. So I talked a little bit about professional use, professional use, uh personalization of learning is where I see the biggest and quickest, you know, help in our system. As I come in as the new assistant superintendent for teaching and learning and and am conducting learning walks and really getting intimately um acquainted with our classroom environment and instruction. Um it is important to build a strong foundation for instruction in our system and to ensure that that tier one instruction that first best instruction falls well on at least 80% of our students so that we don't have the upside down triangle effect um that many reference with MTSS where we are looking to remediate or have tier 2 for so many students that it's really difficult to do tier 2 and tier three for that amount of students and so a really strong potential use is to use AI to better differentiate and meet the needs in um our very diverse classrooms. Again, also with teacher support, right? So, it's professional learning or a personalized learning for students. It's teacher support um we always hear and it's at the teacher level, leader level.

Time is a commodity that somehow we continually need more of and we never can find more of it. And so AI could be used to truly reduce the time it takes to do the work of a teacher um and still not uh diminish the quality that we give our students. Um there's a potential use for special education support uh speech to text and any other you know accommodations many other I shouldn't say any other many other accommodations or modifications required for students um even scaffolds for multilingual learners. Um, translation is a service of course and it just uh can help with language learn learning. We know that here uh language acquisition whether it's designated or embedded is um a need within our system and we're building that and AI can help us do that better. AI can help with data um driven decision making. We can drop information and data in it. Now I want to flag we're not talking about student data. We know Furpa, you know, open AI is different than closed networks. And so I know at some point I talk about I already named it like policy around how we use it will always be important because we want to make sure we protect our students and their information. But college and career guidance students can drop in their interest, right? The things that they want to do and learn about careers that they might not have learned about previously. Um, we can think about school safety operations. If there's like a an egress or a flow concern, we can use AI to kind of help us with that. Um, we might be able to use AI with the previous presentation and some of the challenges we had with parking. Um, and we could also again use it to enhance student engagement. When I think about the design of lessons that really take in

student interest, we know that curriculum writers are, you know, really expert in doing so, but it's really difficult to write a curriculum that will meet the needs and be culturally relevant of the diverse population. And so, we could use AI to help um connect and create stories of problems that students can identify with. And the last thing is just the need for guidelines and p and policies. So first and foremost we want to protect academic integrity. And protecting academic integrity doesn't mean that we don't engage with AI. It just means we do so in a responsible way and we teach students how to use it. Um it is a tool by which they are going to or they could use it to better express what's already inside of them. Right. um and it's not a tool to replace their own thinking. Um we're we can ensure equity and access and so the policy we should write guidelines and policies so that we are ensuring that students who might not have access get access and it's access to not only the technology but access to the grade level learning that I mentioned earlier. We want to promote responsible use of and last but definitely not least on this slide is protect data and the privacy of our students. We want to support educators and create guard rails with the innovation. Um create space for educ educators to try. Um the SAM model for technology refers to substitution all the way to re um redesign and we want to see lessons in classrooms that could not have been possible without technology versus the substitution for like a smartboard with a chalkboard. And essentially we want to prepare our students for the future. Um we recognize

AI is not going anywhere. It continues to enhance. Um, and we do need to shift how we do school, if you will, so that when students are engaging with our everyday instruction and they get to postsecary or whatever that endeavor is, whether it's career or college, they're viable and they are candidates um, who are competitive for whatever that post-secary endeavor is. And so I'd love to have a little call to action here. So in the report, like I said earlier, by 2030, right, millions of jobs will exist, but the work that people do within them will be different. And so currently, that's our seventh graders when they graduate. And it it might sound funny, but our current kindergarteners will graduate in 2038. I can see someone checking the math. Um, so 2038 we we do want to absolutely like incorporate learning that prepares them for the future that they're actually going to go into. And that's it. Thank you. Are there any questions?

Sorry, I was asking President Anthony. Um, I know some of our youth are here and I'm so appreciative if you are staying uh for this presentation, but I wanted to invite maybe if if it's all right with the the public comment. Uh, if you guys want to make public comment, you got to fill out a card for me. Oh, fill out a card and then if you want to do public comment, do I move my stuff? I know you have one. [Music] Oh, sure.

Yeah. Um, I know this is probably too simplistic. Is there a mother computer somewhere in the sky that solving all these little dumb questions? we going to ask because we don't know any answers and we'd like to know that that feels like a hypothetical question.

So the teacher in me will say there is no such thing as a dumb question. Every question highlights you know the need to learn or know more. I actually don't know the answer to that question. I want to say no based on what I the information available to me. Um, there isn't a superco computer somewhere, but there might be. I don't know. There's just a lot of small computers together. Yes. Recognizing patterns minute by minute. Yes. Second by second, millisecond by second. Yes. Sure.

First, I want to say congratulations on making your first big presentation. We appreciate it. Um, I I listened to a podcast or a a webinar actually from CSBA and um I don't know if well first of all I think we need a policy and um I don't think a policy has come to us about AI yet. Um, CSBA has a policy that we can, you know, we can take and and they they there was a two-year AI task force um and the CSA CSA CSBA did a lot of um study on it and um one of the things that I learned is that the safety of the student information is like probably the most important thing because people in the the dark web um they they like to get the student information because you know they don't have credit and they can easily access use their information. Um so where am I going with this? Um, so I don't know the the vendors that we use. I saw chat GPT. Um, I guess the state there's a state law AB1584 that went into effect in 2015 that says that we have to really protect the the students um, information. And and how we can do that is through the

National Data Privacy Agreement. If you go on to site.org or um it it tells us which vendors to use. So if a vendor and I don't know what chat GPT has, but you look at the vendors and and whoever signed their agreement saying that they they will adhere to a certain level of security of of our students information, then um if they've signed it, that's fine. They're you know there's somebody that we might want to do business with. But if they've declined and there are um there are AI companies that have declined a sign then we that's something that we should look at. Um also um open and closed generative AI and that's like open AI would be open to outside influences where closed would not. So we would want to lean towards closed um generative AI. Um the last thing is just something I read not in this task force or anything but um we have to worry about bias because um because the the AI learns from the people that are talking to it and so if they if they have a biasy then if they have biases that that's also goes into the thing and as you know as all of us know there's a a lot of bias in in the world. So So that's something that we have to really be careful of and and I know like Google when I Google something, you know, you get that little AI stuff on the at the beginning. Um I never like trust that. And I'll tell you why. Well, because it's AI, but also because

also because it's been wrong on more than one occasion. I've looked at it and so now like I go down and I look where the the information came from and then you know if it matches that's good but it's not always right. So those are my comments. Thank you. Yes, Trusty Murray you are exactly right. You've done great research. Um open AI is different than close and chat GPT is open and what you said at the end is exactly what we want to instill in our students. How do you read information and not just take it? Think critically about it. Find other sources and really get to um what the right information is. And as far as privacy, there are many tools um like Magic Schools again is an example of a tool that could help write IEPs. And in my former district in a policy, we never put the student information in. just the accommodation needed or um the special service that a student has to get ideas, but again never entering in the actual student information.

Well, one of the things that I was thinking about is that once we start allowing kids to use it more independently, we'll have to we'll have to to figure out a way that they're not putting in their information because we don't want that to get out there. And um and I think it's it's great. I think especially for the the purposes of education, but we have to, you know, we're at the very beginning, so we have to like have a really good policy and we really have to do our research and make sure that we're we're not impacting our our community in a negative way.

Agreed. Our students are still writing their public comments. We're gonna keep talking. They are. Are you trying to write it? Sorry, I'm just Are you trying to write the comment or just Yeah. Oh, very engaging academic discourse. Okay. I was Yes. intense academic discourse. Academic discourse. Yes. Yes. So,

portraits of future graduates. Anyway, uh I I actually had a hard time preparing for this presentation, but I I love the plethora of information. I think I was a little bit overwhelmed at first because it's like, "Oh my god, AI is everywhere. It's like the matrix where we're just surrounded by AI." I mean, my my daughters use like the AI things where it generates whatever some random image, you know, just stuff. I mean, it's just everywhere. So, even if we were trying to not kind of avoid it or think, "Oh, it's a separate thing." I don't think that's possible or realistic. So, uh, and I appreciate like that you've presented all the ways that it's intersecting with us. Um, so we definitely have to, uh, you know, put pay attention to it and figure out how to integrate that into how, you know, we're approaching, uh, our teaching and learning. Um I and I'm I'm just probably gonna end up rambling here, but I mean I think my my feeling is that um you know I want to do all those things you said especially towards the end but uh how do we do that you know while pacing ourselves and you know while integrating what we're already doing you know obviously I don't think we want to add on more than more or at least add on what more than we can handle um but at the same time um you know it does a lot of new things. Um, you know, we I want to make sure our yeah, everyone is trained up on what we need to and offered the support that they need to learn these uh about these issues and these topics. Um, I think uh and you pointed out the ways about how um how important it is to stay aligned with our our values, you know, our vision and our strategic plan, our goals and all that things. Um because I think a when we use AI well as a tool as I believe it was intended then it actually um it requires the critical thinking the

problem solving skills um the creativity um and not otherwise if it is yeah replacing you know your thinking then like what's the point right and I um I mean I think the other piece of it is that uh our youth uh just need to be or no just assured like, hey, your voice matters because if if we give our voice over to an AI, then you know, then we've lost it, you know, and and I I'm I'm kind of paraphrasing uh Miss Nearte at Westboro. I heard her say that one time. So, I just wanted to shout out to Miss Nvarte on that. Um yeah, it's very important to keep hold on to our students voices or, you know, our own voices as well. But um so that's kind of my thought and I think I say with that we can have our student voices.

Oh yes, let's have the student voices come. Students. Thank you so much Theo. Thank you so much Angela. I think you guys are presenting together. Yeah. Cool. Oh yeah. Hello. My name is Angela Tien. I'm the leadership treasurer at Westboro Middle School.

Um I propose or sorry, we propose that AI can be used in schools for lots of purposes. For example, teachers can post review lessons that uh can help out students when they are home and reviewing their homework. Um, another thing that can be used uh with AI is students can ask AI questions that can respond to them in real time. A personal problem that I have is when I get my homework on Friday and then I get stuck on a problem and I get really frustrated when I have to wait the whole weekend just to ask my teacher about this question. So, I think AI could really help by answering that question in real time. I can review it and if I still don't understand it then I can ask the teacher as part of uh keeping my brain going and getting new ideas. Uh AI I also think can be used as an idea generator. Um some people believe that AI is just thinking for you but on the contrary I think it's like a pot of soil where if you plant your ideas in you can use it as a base for your ideas to flourish. Uh I apologize if I stutter a little. So I understand that some of you may be worried that teachers and students will be tempted to be dishonest academically uh through grading and uh writing. But teachers have resources to monitor students when they are doing their work. Especially in school, we had this thing at go uh Westboro called GoG Guardian and teachers are able to see what the students are doing. But every wrongdoing has a consequence. We will learn when we

use AI wrong cuz we're humans. We adapt to everything. So, we are the future of this world. we will learn to use AI and adapt um appropriately. So yeah, I think AI should be approved for usage. Thank you. And um so with all this in in mind, we believe it's a good idea for schools to evolve and adapt with changing and improving technology and to have students and teachers use AI to foster a better learning environment. As Angela said, students are students of the present are the teachers, the architects, the scientists, and the lawyers of the future. So, I believe they should learn the skills of the future. Thank you.

I dig that public comment. Um, Amy, did you have anything else to add? No, that I couldn't have said it better myself. Thank you so much.

Super. Uh, Mina, did you have anything else to add? I learned so much today with with you explaining it to me. It's no longer this little thing that we learned. Actually, last at the last conference at the California School Board Association, they had a a presentation and they said, you know, use Chat GPT or Gemini. And and I was like all jazzed up. Whoa, I learned so much. I know now you know I know uh uh what is this AI? I said wow it's no longer a mystery to me. I have a a friend AI your friend. Is that silly or what? But I appreciate you you bringing it to um out of the shadows. Really? We need to hear it because it's here and we probably using it right now.

We are definitely using it right now. Um I appreciated the presentation. It's um I I like what Mina said that you know AI could be your friend. I think that's dangerous. Uh because part of AI is pattern recognition and seeing what makes you happy and giving you that again and again and again. It's sort of like social media on steroids. Um, and so I, you know, I think thinking about as a thought partner is is probably a better way of of framing it and and using it for our students. Um, Theo, I really appreciated that. Um, you brought up the fact that you you have these questions and it's like you need to unlock this one thing and then you can unlock the rest, right? And then that AI can really help with that. There is definitely a challenge, right? It's it's easy to get around AI safeguards if you have like a tutoring app where you say, "Well, solve this." And it sounds it sounds like you want me to solve this. Um, you know, let's let's step by step. What you know, what would you do first? And it's like, well, what would you do first? You know, and you could kind of that you really have to have a well-designed AI in order to to buffer against that. Um, not that I don't think it exists, it's just um something that's constantly evolving. Um we are having these conversations a lot at work right now. Um obviously uh this conversation here in this room today is is primarily about using AI and teaching and learning. Um I think it can really help with having I like the idea of review lessons. I know we've talked a lot about um some with with our new math curriculum that people feel like they need more practice. They could use AI to generate some more practice uh exercises. I mean that would be great. um you know, building on the reading comprehension and having somebody help you with some phonics, right? Like again, it's sort of like having that that personal tutor. I think that's a really wonderful um option. Um thinking more back office, um I've seen some

really really interesting tools. I mean, I I'm glad that you guys both mentioned IEP writing. um taking taking these ownorous tasks um you know using using AI to uh help you generate contracts, help you generate um scopes of services agreements. Uh we use it um a lot for writing staff reports. I mean not that your staff reports aren't beautiful and lovely, but I know they take time and that is a uh really good use of AI. Um, we're using AI for reviewing permits um or we're being proposed to use AI for reviewing permits to make sure that things are complete and correct um for reviewing RFPs. So, from like a backside thing, I think there's a lot that you can do um from an efficiency and money savings thing. Um they can make uh digital twins of buildings and uh have really efficient HVAC by turning things off and on when the grid is. So there's a lot of really uh amazing potential uh for using artificial intelligence to support a lot of things in this district. Um I know, you know, everything evolves. Uh I don't expect one policy to cover all of those things, but I do hope um that we'll continue to see those policies evolve and and get feedback from students about how they want to use it. One thing, uh, my friends a professor at SF State and they kind of went all in on AI, the CSU system. Um, and one of the things that she does, especially for the academic dishonesty piece, is say, "Look, I do want you to use AI. I want you to think with it. Just give me your notes, right? How did you prompt it? What did it tell you? How did you redirect it?" Um, and and teaching how to say, "Well, what was the evidence that you had for that?" especially if you're trying to use it to to prove something, right? I mean,

you're right. Gemini uh on Google often gives you false answers because it's a true answer and it just tries to make the answer fit for a lot of different things even though it like it's true in one aspect and then it's not true somewhere else, right? So, um that's something I think really important to think about. So, that's um that's my thoughts on AI. Thank you so much for the presentation. Uh, any other final? No, no, we have one more public comment, but she wanted to go at the end. So,

good. All right. So, Christina, would you would you come up? Good evening, everybody. I'm Christina Hong. I'm a mom of Isabella, who's a 12-year-old, a sixth grader, uh, going to Altaloma Middle School, and a Burberry Bur graduate. Um, really nice to see everybody here at the board of trustees. Uh, thank you for, um, having this community forum, um, Dr. Moore and, um, all the school board. Um, I just wanted to share quickly. I'm the new incoming um 17th district PTA VP of programs and I'm really excited because I was able to for the next two years be part of a couple of initiatives and three of them one is AI in education one's on cyber security cyber safety and another ission about to help um be the liaison. So 17th district PTA, if um everyone's not aware, it's 86 schools that the PTA we represent here in San Monteo County from Daily City down to Menllo Park. And as VP of programs, I'm acting as the liaison between the parents, the students, the teachers, staff, and the different school districts. So I'm super excited and honored to be um the VP of programs for the next two years. And I just want to put out there that if there's any programs or initiatives in the three areas I mentioned and any other areas actually um that you need support on from the PTA standpoint, I would love to be that for um our district of course

since this is my hometown uh but also you know the other uh 89 schools in Sanonteo County. Um, I really believe that, you know, AI and education is definitely here. You know, for us, for our young people to be leaders for the future, you know, competing with outside um and around the world is super important. So, thank you very much. Thank you. I don't know what we probably never start at the clock. That's all right. No, if you have any questions right any other final public comments? 30. You got three minutes. John's here. Sherry's here. Want to make a public comment? All right.