Planning Board - Regular Meeting

this evening. So one of them, you all got an email copy of the letter from the Board of Selectmen about the library. Thanks, Sarah, for shepherding that effort. So my understanding after reading this is that the library can go ahead under RSA 674.54. So then their action item would just be to notify us, the library, the public trustees should notify the Planning Board and the Board of Selectmen at least 60 days prior to the start of construction, at which point the Planning Board has 30 days to get them a public plan. And if we are following RSA 674 and 54, it's non-violent. So we are hearing the plans, we are commenting on how they do or do not meet our regulations, but the folks at the library are not obligated to do anything with those comments.

have a two comments on the letter if that's okay um um i would say 674 says um reflex uh talks about if there's a substantial change in use our substantial news there isn't any change in news at all no so i don't know why i need this place at all

What do you mean? Well, you know, I mean, it's not changing. Why is that?

Well, yeah, I mean, why are they? And I'm not I'm not speaking for the library that they're not planning to bring the plans or anything. I'm just talking about the way I would interpret it. Want somebody else to explain to me why it's different? I mean, it's not being the use of it being changed whatsoever. All they're doing is building something bigger, but still not the library. I also have a question as to why this is kind of procedural. I know you want the public trustees to present. I say you, but you know what I mean. The application, the public trustees don't know the building. So I don't know how they can sign the application.

So nobody needs to sign the application necessary, right? It's a matter of who provides the notice. What notice? Who notifies? So the question is, who notifies? Let me find it.

A public carrier is requested. yes who's responsible for taking the actions to bring that problem hearing to the front we would normally require applicants to pay for a notice in the paper notice of the cost of sending out butter notices if it is not clear in the statute whose responsibility it is

Well, I'm talking about just as far as anybody else that filled out an application. I mean, right from the application, it wants the name of the landowner. And if an engineer or somebody is presenting, then, you know, they have to fill out a form that says that.

Our compensation materials for the planning board require the information about the landowner and the app. Sometimes they're the same. Many times they're not.

But if the applicant is different, doesn't the landowner have to?

Well, I would presume.

Authorize whatever the right. You know? Yes. I mean, that's my kind of only issue. That's requesting the public trustees. That they still help me present the application because they really have. I don't want to say nothing to do with it, but. I mean, I understand the other ones that. takes the money from the town, distributes it, you know, takes care of the operation and all that stuff, but they don't really have anything.

I don't know if that's the right word, but to do with what's going on.

But I mean, even besides that, if there's no substantial change in use, why do they have to do anything?

Well, it's a substantial change in use or a substantial new use. Yeah, but there isn't.

There is a substantial change in use. The change in use is expansion of the use on the property by 30%. You're going to have more employees, you're going to have... That's another whole thing. When we do a change of use cycling for businesses that exist, this doesn't happen a lot in Canada. But when I do change of use public areas and other towns, The change of views could most definitely be there's an expansion now. The original approval said that they're going to go Monday through Friday, and then they find out that they have resources to go on Monday through Sunday. Okay, I see what you mean. It's a change of views because the views on site is changing. And in this case, the building is getting larger. The footprint is larger. Right. undoubtedly anticipating they will now have space to do other things whether that's expanding programming or there's a reason why they want more space okay and it is a change in the intensity of use of that company all right That's the way I would look at it. That's the thing.

But, well, you're smart. Well, I don't want to say smart.

I'm not smart at all.

More experience.

I would look at the use issue maybe differently, wouldn't you?

Well, yeah. To me, it's still going to be above the library.

Yeah.

To me, the use is above the library.

Well, we're talking about land use issues. When you think about why there's an employment hearing at all, it's so that it abutters to a problem in that understanding about the changes that are happening on that person. And in this case, there is a change happening on that person. It's going to result in conditions and experiences that will be different after construction than before construction. They're going to have to do something about parking. This expansion is going to say that more people are going to be invited to the library. It's a bigger library. And where is that parking? That is no place. There is parking for three cars.

Oh, I think they don't think so.

I was going to say maybe four. But there's no avenue by which we can require it. We can tell them that we think parking is a concern.

Exactly. Exactly.

But there's no enforcement.

We can nudge them into a greater conversation with the elementary school about sharing the resource of the parking lot that the school has, but that's all we can do.

Well, that doesn't do anything in the daytime, really. I mean, you can't, school can't really give up their spaces in the daytime, I wouldn't think.

Yeah, I think it's a lot of times that I'm under that where I'm like, I need lots of space.

Yeah, I didn't mean necessarily that it's always full, but it would have a lot of potential for those spaces to be filled. As opposed to being able to say, okay, every day you can have, I don't know, 30 spaces.

Yeah.

Okay, well, I got it.

It's not the way I would interpret it, but

um so peter i'm wondering but you can tell me if this is not required because i'm wondering if the planning board should reach out to the library and just say that based on the letter that we've received from the board of slugman our understanding is that at the 60 days prior to construction we'll provide written notice to the board of slugman and the planning board got construction started, and then we'll work to schedule here.

Okay. And I got to say, I've read this section now five times trying to figure out what the suit is. It sounds to me like they're not asking us for a public hearing. They're telling us... They're telling us that it's going to stop within 60 days, possibly within 60 days.

Yes.

And then if the trial wants to hold a public hearing, they can hold which to me that says the expense for that level here is the tax. The town is responsible for doing verification of ours. Because we're the ones saying we want to have this discussion. Yeah.

Well, before we get there, here is a perfect moment to split. in order to get government into language they need a town body or organization to sponsor or be the advocate which is the public trustee well that's what the board's weapon says right so that's right well i was going to say yes i believe that trustee is going to have to have a public meeting to all of them they're not asking to have a public meeting

They're not asking anything yet.

This is not the library trustee. This is the town public trustee.

No, that is not the library. The public trustee is the library.

The social trustee and the public trustee.

But they're the library trustees. I mean, they're done. But they're probably like the public trustee.

Right. So they would have their meetings have to be followed just like these. So they need to hold a meeting that is publicized. for them to make that decision.

To make a decision if they're going to sponsor this as a municipal or landowner's type application. If they decide they're not going to, then the whole process starts over again, and the governmental land use is not available to the library because there's no entity that's willing to do it. Right.

Well, isn't it expected that the trustee's or home to, say, a big pipeline construction in 60 days?

I don't know. I think I know they're still discussing it and figuring out what that means for things like long-term operations. You know, acknowledging that the lease that we've put out says that we, the town, are responsible in DuPage for additional handrails operating costs. So if they decide to hire something that's twice as huge or whatever, they're recognizing that that is something they need to think about from the public trustee side of things, because they would be responsible as the governing body of the library to figure out how to fund it if the town budget doesn't complete that funding.

Well, if they don't have as many of them, what the town gives them.

Right. So I think they're just looking at all angles. I think they're looking at whether it's parking, whether that's the plan overall. they want to make sure that they understand all of that before they say, yes, we're coming to find more and submitting this application and ask all of our outside experts.

Which, either way, even if it's not submitting those municipal views, the town is still not paying more money. So if the library chooses to apply as regular commercial views, all of those questions still need to the answer.

Oh, right. That's still fine. Because, I mean, the lease is already. Yeah.

But that's, that's, if they're not able to use our application procedure for the van. Yes. That means that they're paying for all of those expenses.

Yes. But so there's nothing that says that an applicant has to own the property. No. That's what you guys are saying. Well, I mean, somebody applied to do something on my property.

Well, I mean, I didn't say that. We required to prove that you had spoken with someone on your property.

That was my point. I didn't think anybody was agreeing with that.

So who owns the frigging thing that the library is on?

Is the town all that social trustees aren't? I've seen the deed. It's exactly what it says.

So they can't. But you know something? So they'll get into the volume. Exactly. But they're not the public trustees.

Well, that's that's the point that forward us on in the lawyer.

How many public trustees versus total trustees?

There's three publicly elected trustees. I don't know how many social trustees there are.

I don't know. They've added some over this whole process, so I don't know exactly, but there's quite a few of them.

Oh, so the private trustees outnumber the public trustees on the board of trustees?

No, there's only one of the trustees. There's two separate boards.

Oh, God. They have to change.

Well, the social trustees are probably the most non-profit that owns the land in the Yes, that's the way the deed goes. So I understand there's only two towns in the state that still have public and social. That's what I've been told. And I mean, it seems absolutely ridiculous. But if you read the deed, Hilliard presented it to be owned by social trustees. And I mean, he actually said, you know, like one of them has to come from Exeter and one probably from the academy. I mean, it's very... You know, but it's their choice.

So the social trustees will write a letter authorizing the public trustees to submit the application on their behalf. Well, that's not the application. To submit the notice on their behalf if they choose to pursue 674.54. And then I think to Glenn's previous point, If we elect to have a public hearing, which I think we need to, the place isn't big enough, then we should ask for the school gymnasium and block out the whole set. No, but in all seriousness, then the planning board or the town cares. I mean, we haven't used any of our miscellaneous budgets, to my knowledge, like if we needed to use that in Elizabeth others.

we have, we didn't send any mailings this year, so.

It's, it's floating on the wall. And it's, it's, the starting point isn't defined yet. We don't have a starting point because we don't have any more sponsors. Once we get a sponsor and it's public gets their word in there, they'll decide, public trustees will decide, if they decide yes, Then it goes and then it starts.

So, Glenn, is it appropriate for the planning board to reach out with our understanding of next steps or that's not something that's needed at this point?

No, I think somebody has to do it. And it appears for this that the Board of Selectmen feel this should be in our hands. And using that logic, yes, I think we should let them know we expect to hear something. Okay.

Well, they have. I know they have. But I'm thinking that if I, if I had the right, or if I'd been here and proposed something and then a notice was put out by the Board of Selectors, I would want someone to tell me personally, like, okay, this is what we're expecting of you.

Yes. And I guess we, from the Planning Board side of things, we should address it through the public trustees.

Well, yeah, that's, I mean.

Not anyone else. That might have been the other trustees, but I don't think there's a way around it.

I'm going to address it to the public trustees, and then I'm going to note that we're CCA-ing the social trustees and the board of select.

Well, I mean, I think the social trustees know where, I mean, it's not, I don't think, I don't.

Do they draw?

Oh, yeah.

You're supposed to be. A member of the public trustee sitting on the social trustee board. Is that?

Are you sure? I don't know that you're there. I know Susan Baskin goes to a lot of the meetings. I think she's the chair or president or whatever of the public trustee.

Yeah, she came in and I gave her a lot of information on the libraries. So I'll educate the other members because there's still a debate on our trustee.

Would anyone on the board like to review this letter before it gets distributed?

Oh, if you want.

Can I talk? This is weird.

Even later. I just thought it was strange and I I guess I looked it up just because I wanted to know, sure, in my mind, who owns the building. Like I said, I saw the deed and everything. But I said, because I was looking at one of our applications, and I said, well, I'll look at the tax card. And if you look at the avatar list, it says that that parcel is in the name of the transit.

Things that make me go,

Well, actually, that parcel is made out to the volunteer fire department.

And I don't know that they own that piece. The fire, the fire trustee.

They have an organization that owns that building.

Is it the association?

Yeah, it's the fire association, I think it is. It doesn't matter.

But anyway, I just. I just thought that was an interest. Legally, when you're looking at titles and all that stuff, I thought that was weird to see that as what it's, I mean, I can't see the whole tax pattern online anymore. All I can see is the very front pages. I mean, it's my own, you know, whatever.

We need to ensure that we are

informing the people who own the property as well as this as well as the public trustees well that's social justice yeah but that's why i can make sure everyone gets it yeah yeah to the public trustee is probably in the yes to the public trustees having the social trustees having the board of selection i mean because it is in response to their initial letter

So if public trustees decide not, then we have to have social trustees apply just like anybody else.

If they won't.

If they won't, yeah.

Now, what requires the public trustees to have a public ? What are they required?

Is there a strategy to discuss it with me before they make a decision?

To get the voice of the public to find out what the public thinks.

All they got to do is look at Kensington Connects.

Well, they're probably less than efficient. So they are subject to 911 today, which means they can't make a decision outside of the public hearing. Okay.

They have to make the decision.

It's illegal for an elected official to make a decision outside of the public meeting.

So that's what's going to kick in the requirement that their meeting be followed.

The social trustee needs to go and have to follow And you need to make a decision. OK, you can't make a decision, but not on the right.

I would say actually, I don't know.

I would say as a representative, every meeting needs to be both.

Well, did they notice them? Peter, do you know?

I'm sorry.

No, I guess maybe you would know. I don't know whether they do or not. I mean, I don't. I mean, Sean's got something to do with the public. If when the public trustees at the meeting, if they notice it,

I'm being a little loosey-goosey with the law. if they need and they have a forum, it should be a no decision.

I think, I mean, I'm not saying they don't.

Even if they're not making the decision. But if they're making the decision that this would require it, it has to be done. Perfect.

All right.

We have to look on our webpage to see if we could say again that, because I think they have a second.

By the way, I want to say, I don't know if it would be unobvious, but there's a lot of

I'm sorry. Okay. So I'll address this up.

I'll send it to Glenn and Dan for a second set of eyes and then we can send it out. Just if I can make one point for just from things that I've heard about folks that are not pleased with this decision that

The board of selectmen didn't decide whether it's governmental use. The board of selectmen is abiding to the RSA as it's interpreted by . So we didn't decree anything. We didn't approve anything. We didn't say, yes, that's what we were saying. The RSA says that public libraries

It's also not like you made a change. No. I mean, that's the big thing. That was the thing. It was like, yes, there's no change.

It's been, it's just, it was never like a decision or something. Right. For the record, yeah. Yeah, there will be a lot, I think, a lot of questions about costs and who owns the costs. I have also heard folks say that the town vote against increasing taxes means that nobody wants a library.

I don't think that's- And I agree with what you said, but all it said was that we didn't want to spend the money. Yeah. I think it's too vague for us to use the word. It says anything about construction. Yeah, other than the mine.

Yeah, let's say that a majority of those voting, you know, a super majority of those voting do not want to construct a line. Do not want to construct a line. Do not want to construct a line. That's all I'm saying. Yeah. If you make it to a super majority as the majority,

more people vote for it or against it or more people voted against it yeah i want to say this it was significant it wasn't by a few votes it was um they don't have to make it the two-thirds no or not in a slot so it wasn't 50 it wasn't 50 50. no it was a lot because if you wanted the library it was disappointing um

Any other comments from the library before we move on to the next item?

Before we have this meeting, is the lease public knowledge? Yeah, it is. The only reason I say that is because so many people are talking about, and this is a question I had. They had the meeting back. If you're making a bigger building, you're, I mean, not even talking about staff, Odds are, the electric bill's going to go off, the heating bill's going to go off, you know, whatever. So, I mean, those are legitimate questions. But is it, I guess it wouldn't be for us to say anyway, but if it came up at the meeting, that's what's holding, making people be against it. Shouldn't they know about the lease that says, yeah, town's not going to pay it, even if they're out on it. I mean, the architect's saying, you know, it's going to be efficient and all that, and I'm sure it is, but I got a new furnace and my heating bill was still up.

Yeah, I think, so I know this was a success in Zion and it was the first time I made a lease without the sign in public. Well, yeah, and they were against the question that different requirements came up with us, particularly around the increase costs. I think someone from the library that's here would have pointed out some question too, that it wouldn't be any different than a budget process. So the lease does not obligate the town to take on additional operating costs. The library would have to report a stock payment if it would, and in other words, if this is a request to add, and we can have that conversation publicly, they might say yes, they might say no, and then the town votes for that. There's plenty of opportunity for discussion.

Is it a multi-year lease? Is it like five-year lease or one-year lease?

I think we wrote it as a hundred-year lease, which is what the previous lease was written as.

Oh, wow. It's absolutely a lot of stuff.

Yeah, and I think the proposed changes are mutually agreeable.

But the significant thing is that it's the sole discretion of the social trustee.

Social or thought?

Social. The entire library and that staff. The librarian is responsible for the staff and the salaries. Well, you're right.

I mean, I believe it says that in the, well, in the lease, it says that they appoint the librarian and she chooses the staff. That's the way it's written. But the money. Well, that's what I'm saying. The money doesn't come through them.

Salaries, the money is paid by the town. Salary and rents instead are determined by the social trustee.

Right, so if they're going to get a bucket, then they have to decide, is that bucket too full-time? Yeah, they tell us. Then the town goes. And then after the reg is approved, there's a bucket of money allocated to the livestock. And it's up to them to say, for two full-time people or six half-time people instead. Like, they distribute that money. AMONGST THEIR PEOPLE.

IF THEY THINK THAT THEY NEED AN EXTRA, I DON'T KNOW, 12 HOURS A WEEK OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT BECAUSE OF THE NEW SIZE OF THE LIBRARY, THEY'D HAVE TO FUND IT OUT OF THE PUBLIC TRUSTEE BUDGET.

BUT THERE'S HELL OF LIKE EVERY OTHER DEPARTMENT They'll say, we have six people that are part-time and they get paid X dollars per hour. They're going to work so many hours. They budget $5 amount of this. We got two full-time times, blah, blah, blah. That totals up to a year of X amount of dollars. So it's not just we give them a bucket and they spend that.

No, they are authorized by state law to be in charge of the money given to them from a tax. So in the budgetary process, if everyone's in charge of that money, wants to make changes for lines, they're absolutely authorized to do that. As long as it's reasonable.

It has to be a reasonable amount that the town authorizes.

Well, but I would say- Right, but once they've authorized, that money is given to the library, and the library is in charge of how that money is administered. It's not the town. Right. Because they make changes within their lines. They don't offer us to do that. That's the way the municipal budget process works.

That's basically correct. But when they submit back to the town, what they spend the money on, they have to supply all the receipts and all the documents.

they're going to be able to explain why they opted to do two part-time instead of one full-time person. They would be responsible for saying what that means.

Well, if the planning board knows they're going to overspend on, I don't even know, say advertising. But they have, as I understand it, you can ask around. You still get the same.

Well, I did it with the land use administrator position. I was vacant for six months. We said, okay, well, that means that we could, you know, change what the hourly rate is to try and entice someone. Correct.

We're talking, it says that the social crises are responsible for hiring the library.

202.

Okay. Is that where I ran?

It sounds like . Well, actually, I think . Okay.

Are we ready to move on from the library?

Yes. Thanks.

I'm not sure we are, but let's do it anyway.

Okay. Yes. Next item is equally fun.

So 267 South Road. There have been some emails and things to update you all on mainly as it relates to enforcement. So 267 South Road is building block comments. Some of you all may know that they have been occupying a facility without a garage fencing um gino issued a notice to the hate um i think earlier this week saturday saturday probably delivered saturday um Basically, they don't have a certificate of occupancy for the building, so they've been having outdoor classes, but that still leaves a toileting concern for students that are on site there. There have also been some email exchanges back and forth with the police chief about what is required and what our conditions of approval were for opening. I'll just give a summary because I went through all of the documentation on this last night. When we initially heard Building Hall at Commons back in the summer, we approved with conditions, we issued a notice of decision. They then needed to increase size and change the site plan because of the increased size of the system. The March meeting, um, where I was not present with Justin chair. There was an amended site plan review applications. At that meeting, there was. An additional condition, which admittedly probably should have been the condition of the 1st approval. Um, but there was an additional condition that. the safety plans would be submitted and accepted by the town. Police Chief Kane has not received those, and that's blown up over email in the last couple of days. The emails also mentioned, just so that you all know, that a planning board said that, maybe I should just read the lines. um the planning board voted that the planning board's decision was not contingent on the chief of police opinion of our business endeavor um i reviewed all of the meeting notes so the only thing we said about the police of chief or the chief of police excuse me was that the chief of police did not need to approve the driveway permit because the driveway permit is already going to be approved by NHGOT. So the only thing that the planning board stated was that police chief Payne did not get to weigh, did not need to, since he wasn't at that meeting, the driveway permit approval was not contingent on what he said about the driveway specific. He does still need to understand the safety plan so that in the event of an emergency over at that site, his team knows how to respond. I spoke with him today. He also has some concerns about the way that the site is operating or was operating last week. vacated or where exactly that landed. It was his understanding that in addition to the high school kids being on the site, perhaps maybe some of the younger grades had been taken there for some sort of outdoor learning type activities. And so he mentioned to me that he's struggling with kind of the safety plans when they run from the same numbers. because he's not sure if the numbers are accurate. So if the safety plan says 66 students, those are high school students, you can account for those 66. If folks are being bussed over, maybe five was there or something else outside, is there actually 66? Where are these additional people coming from? I don't think that's anything that the planning board can do it?

Our approval for that site was 66 students. I don't care if there are 40 high schoolers and 20 middle schoolers, or 30 middle schoolers, 10 elementary school age kids, and the remaining 30 are high schoolers, but there is a cap on the number of students that the planning board said could be on that site. And we should hold firm with that. And they should understand that. But we didn't say, I don't remember us saying that there couldn't be other students in the building block environment. Everyone said.

I mean, I don't think that they were necessarily, if the intention was to bust people over and use the outdoor classroom facilities for lower grades, I definitely don't think that that was like just closed to the board at the time of the application. But the number of students was very strong. And we did discuss if it was an event open to the public, parents, families, etc. you know, we discussed measures for that.

Right. Those numbers could exceed that.

Right, because that was not an everyday activity.

We did.

Chief Kane also asked for an understanding about the police detail numbers they've been, and it is noted in our meeting notes. where he was here and shared with the applicant that, you know, should there be traffic concerns, the police could request a detail and it would be at the expense of the applicant. What do you think about understanding that we authorized whatever number of students was in that plan? I think it's 66, but I will confirm.

Yeah, I think you're right. It was 66 teachers.

That could be right, 60 total, or 66 total, 60 students, six teachers, is that right?

I can remember originally that evening that we were thinking that the police had to sign off on it.

And then towards the end of the meeting, we decided that maybe we shouldn't have to sign off on it, that we would take care of it.

Right. They didn't need to sign on the drivers specifically.

Yes.

Because it was a concern about the traffic pattern and whether or not the police chief felt comfortable with the traffic pattern. And he didn't feel as though to provide an answer until he knew whether it was going to be a forward stop. And so he said, Well, NHDRT is going to authorize what they feel safe.

So then we took them off.

So we took them off of the driveway only. But the condition of the March 18th approval still applies where he must sign off on their safety barriers.

Anything I missed on that?

Just on that approval side of it, he never, not bound to approve any of their plans, but all he wanted was plans by them and whatever the entity was so that he could prepare his adjoining plan, emergency operation, evacuation. That's what his sole intent was all along, not to- Yes.

Thanks for clarifying that. It's not necessarily that He wants to approve. He doesn't want to develop, like, approve with that. He wants to have a dialogue and understand and accept the plan so that. His folks in the field are safe. And can assist in the event of an emergency. Yes, so they are working through that. Um. something that feels maybe redundant to me, but since it's come up more than once, I'd like to suggest that we consider as a board noting, especially when we have commercial applications before us, that a certificate of occupancy is required to open the building. I mean, I feel like that should go without saying, and we know that that's part of the process, but since we are now having This is not the first time that we've had a site occupied without a CO. Whether we make it a condition or simply state it for the record, it is on my list of priorities if we see another commercial application to make sure that we tell the applicant we're not looking for business until that's- Yeah, I think that's a great informational requirement but are you suggesting we make that part of our notice of decision well i don't think we can i don't think i don't know if it needs to be a condition i don't think it's it's not but i think that like informational like that is something that yeah i think that's what we'd like to make sure that we have and on the record it should keep common sense yeah i mean if something happens and yeah i mean But since we've now seen this more than once, I don't think it hurts to have it on the record that that is what you need to do. And to that end, Peter started to prepare some kind of close-out checklist of things.

Yeah, I was trying to pull it up. I put together two different things. One was a punch list for town planning and zoning work. Every time there's a notice of decision and there's a condition on it, it's going to pull on a form that I'll maintain so that we can check off when all the conditions are met. Because as you just saw, Carly has to go through a whole bunch of things to figure out all the different conditions. And I went through all the forms and listed all the conditions on here. And I just had who approved it and when, so that whenever it comes up, situation if we don't all the conditions in one spot well isn't it right now yeah i think it's a great idea it just keeps everything in front of the place and we decide on one spot and then i put together a project close out the process we can send around to everybody but it's basically saying once the uh applicant notifies the cleaning board from town building inspector that the construction activities are complete Then the planning board verifies the punch. This punch list is satisfied. And the other team gets their contractor to update the drawings based on any changes that were made, any deadlines that were made. And those final drawings then get submitted to the planning board for signature. Before they get to signature, the building inspector will take a punch list and those drawings that were updated, and he'll walk the site, verify their drawings, whether it's the town engineer or the inspector, depending on our ordinances, the town engineer. They walk the site to make sure everything's done. No comments from that, and it goes back, and the engineer then provides us a mining order and drawings that the planning board chair signs off. and they get their certificate right and see if those drawings are signed. So there's a couple of other things in there, but it's basic, keeps kind of in order so that we don't have to keep track. The seal is the building department's job. That's not the planning. So all we need to do is make sure the drawing that is being submitted to the registry represents what's on the center and it's stamped by an engineer. so that there's no issues in meeting as well. So I'll pass it around to everybody. I just didn't get a chance to send it out. I just, I couldn't. Yeah, I'm just surprised that people would actually be in a place, business without having a CO because I couldn't think.

Shelter.

Their insurance, you know, like their insurance on that one. It would be so hard. You never know what people are going to do.

I mean, that they would be robbed by people in prison. Yes, but you can't. Yes.

They're surprisingly the company that turns companies.

I'll say, I'll say right now is that they, you know, amended the notice to Banking and they do important bodies on site now. So this, they still can't be in the building, but they can be on property.

Yes, that was a letter in the issue by the court team to the state. I think, well, I think so.

But even still, if they're on the property, And the safety plan hasn't been approved and there is an active shooter. To go to the extreme, right? The police chief has no way to respond.

I think I know they've been issued by general as the health officer. Yeah, that's right. So that was what was amended. I don't think he had. I don't think he called the Right. I mean, they don't have to see us.

Well, we discussed it with the chief, and the chief was adamantly against the cleaning, and it was quite a discussion period with the building blocks and the town assessor and the health officer on Monday. That's all I'll say about that, but there was a lot of discussion about it. You know, on Tuesday, Wednesday, Tuesday, Monday, Thursday. Yeah, because they have a situation where their liability is a risk if something happens to a child or something, an incident happens.

Just trying to find it that you have in the notes somewhere. We have up to 60 cars. I'm trying to find out if it's in the notes or if it's on the drawings, the number.

It was on the drawings. It was on the drawings. I think a few of them made a comment that the numbers weren't matching up. Yeah. And even in their, one of their, their initial segment was that they got two different numbers. Yeah. And Seabrook Plantly has 67 children and seven.

Yeah, they're different plants have different numbers per.

So they have to get everything to coordinate.

But to Glenn's point, it needs to coordinate with what was submitted to the planning where there cannot be a change.

Correct.

And that number is their max capacity for that site. Once a month event during daytime operations, we are under the impression that we approved

It's just a kind of a tangent on that. In their plan they submitted for their parking where the child picked up in Davao, they talked about just coming in that circle and coming in 12 cars at a time and then, you know, they added to the traffic study and they added to their latest handbook to the people and to other documents that they now reserve an area on the parking, which was for students and teachers. They reserved after the for overflow parking from parents if they come in before or after their time were delayed, they go to this other area to park. They're not on the street.

Well, I was told that. they just simply wouldn't be allowed in.

That's why I'm bringing up, they told us something, now they put on the plan something else. And without .

So what happens, in that instance, if the meeting notes reflect a different conversation than revised plans?

Our approval was our approval.

And if they vary from it, we will repeat to the buyer. I mean, you're not complying with our approval.

Okay. So then it's up to Gina to say that that new person does not comply with what was approved by the people.

Correct. We asked legal about that, and they stated that not only the conditions of approval and any agreements made during the meetings are

They're bound, both parties are bound up. Yes.

Because that's why we do this.

Because there were things put up about the impervious soils and everything that they were agreed upon. We'll make that change or we'll take this note out and do this with the note. That is just a condition, but it's an agreement basically that holds as much together. Perfect.

Stay tuned. It's mainly enforcement right now, but I did want to bring up the item specifically, you know, the representation of what the planning board said or didn't say. We all know how important our meeting notes are, but a good reminder that if they don't accurately reflect what happened, then our words get twisted.

So that's for Junos. QUESTION TO ME WAS ON ENFORCEMENT. HOW DOES THE PLANNING BOARD ENFORCE IT?

THE PLANNING BOARD CANNOT ENFORCE IT.

THE PLANNING BOARD SIMPLY GAVE AN APPROVAL AND THAT APPROVAL SHOWS ON OUR NOTICE OF DECISION AND OUR CYCLE. IF THEY'RE DOING THINGS THAT ARE MATERIALLY DIFFERENT FROM EITHER, THEY HAVE TO STOP WITH THEM. come back and amend their plan. Yes. Right. That's always an avenue for them to take. Okay. But until they do that, their responsibility is to plan with the site plan and the notice of the city. Okay.

I'll try to put the situation. And they go in. Because it should come from the planning program. If we notify them.

No, I'm not notifying anyone.

It comes from Gina. If he wants to ask us questions about either document, about the notice of decision, or the statement.

I don't want to sit with Gina.

You can certainly do that. Okay. But the actions all have to be documented.

Okay, good. That's what he wants to figure out. Yeah.

And if Gina wants to call me or you want me to come in and sit with him sometime next week, we can talk about it. I'd be more than happy to.

So were there children there today?

Were kids there today? It was September 18th, right? They had to be taken.

Now they're allowed to be there if they're outside.

They cannot be inside the building. Which I still think is a question. Theoretically, no.

In the greenhouse that was updated fire suppression system?

No, it can't be in the greenhouse or the barn.

Yeah.

Or the what? The barn.

So where can they do it? I was just asking.

So I can't. Teachers are allowed in there because they can't talk. As is, but you can tell them. Yeah. It's not going greenhouse. That's what we're saying.

Why are we allowing students on the site at all?

Really good question. I feel like we should not allow students on.

What's it like?

Yeah.

Thanks.

because if there was some sort of emergency, we said, oh, you guys are allowed to do it without a certificate of occupancy.

Who said if they brought the fortified wind link, they could? Well, it's because it was originally on the grounds of the toilet. I think the grounds are broader than the toilet. I think the grounds don't have certificate of occupancy.

So certificate of occupancy for

under the building for a building it's really for the building yeah so can you i think that's i mean i've had some conversation with gino about it last week but yeah that's one of his questions is like can we tell them that they can't occupy land but they don't yeah i don't think there's anything written that would prevent that you Well, I think it's ultimately up to that insurer, right? They're assuming any interest by doing this. As long as they don't have to challenge any liability.

Well, that's the thing. Maybe we do just pass it along with the accountants. No, I don't think so.

I think that's going to be a bad experience. I mean, so would they submit a paperwork that their teaching to a level of any public school can get their own facility, that they can't go inside, they can't use greenhouses, they can't go in the bar, they can literally have children in chairs and buildings for hours on end. I think they have to because they get dropped off.

Yeah, but like, my university, like Tulane did this with the architecture school when it was under construction. They put all the architecture students out in glorified tents on the quad for two years. And I'm like sitting there going like, I wouldn't be paying that tuition to sit in a tent. Are you kidding me?

It's insane. It's insane. They wrecked it all in Tuesday.

Yeah.

What are you doing with kids?

Well, Not ours to decide, but maybe food for thought for Gina will be a comment about the town not being viable.

I don't know if you could really say, you know, liable, I mean, if it's... An attorney is going to save you a while. Yeah.

If something goes wrong and the attorneys look for the biggest faults, We're the biggest pockets in this session.

Well, especially if their insurer drops it and says they're not paying, then it'll have to go out.

I do not think that you're very well covered if we're saying they don't want to split the occupancy, but we're letting them put students on the problem.

I know. But what do you do?

Well, I guess I would say, haven't we asked council about that?

I mean, this council has been involved in all. Filing injunction. He filed a paperwork on Friday before. So he's comfortable that we were saying. No, no. That was the big thing. He filed a big thing on Friday.

But then we amended it.

Yeah.

Because they brought on 45.

Yeah.

I assume he talked about that. I.

I don't want to say he did. I'm not sure. I think it's probable that he did. I'm sure he would just do it on his own.

I mean, I think it's the Board of Selectmen's question about liability. I don't know if the planning board has authority to do anything, but I'd like to raise to you as a Board of Selectmen representative that we have concerns about students continuing.

We'll always let you know how things work. Chinese are wonderful people. I'm not saying we're not wonderful people. But when they go on a liability dance, they're looking for whoever has the biggest leap in thoughts. Because they'll find a way to make it everybody's fault.

And that, I really don't think it's fair for Gino to act on that decision. I don't either. I don't think it's up to Gino. Well, it's up to him.

But I don't think it was a health issue only. That makes sense that there's so much more, but it is more than a health issue.

Yes, so I don't think it's like he has to follow what we say. And they have not met the conditions of approval. Therefore, they should not be allowed to operate the business. And you know, should not be allowed to.

Yeah, this is this is a school and the school has a building. In school, the town saying you can't use the building. So how does that mean you get to use the land map? I don't get it. Right. I don't get it. It's not an outdoor rec center. It's a school.

Well, in fact, there are, like, major schools that operate on an outdoor rain or shine philosophy, but that is not what we have.

Well, sure. Wow.

Yeah.

Kensington has a summer camp, but I'm sure there's insurances that cover, they have approval for operating an outdoor summer camp.

Yes, they go to the school and get caught inside the school, right?

No. All right. Anything else on this item?

So my action. Why did I see a age of 2006 tracking set? So from what I was able to look at yesterday, that's the result of the ZBA saying,

They're adding a traffic study? That was May 2026. They submitted their final practice study.

I think that was because they were waiting on information about the four-way stop versus.

From DOT. In the back of that study is the four-way stop information, which if you can understand it.

Yeah, no, I don't understand the traffic engine.

Yeah, that's all. A lot of this was, they never told them that this was issued in May, and it was never submitted to us until this day. And it was only because.

Yeah, I mean, there's a lot. There's a lot.

But it's kind of. Okay, that's fine. I just didn't understand. Okay.

I think it was one of the conditions that said it was a practice study out of a young baby. after we look at what we saw the results of the DLT stack, the DLT stack, yes, the supplementary .

So my action item there, for this matter, is just to confirm what the number of people um for the note on the plans and then i will follow up with the police chief tomorrow what number we're we're calling yes that's that's the absolute number yeah because there's questions which number can i

and then just to clarify in their interpretation and then all along they've always stated this is a mid to high school type environment.

It's a high school environment.

Mid school to high school, sixth grade to 12th. That's in all their documentation. Yeah, I think they always included what I considered junior high. So I'm not saying that a lot of young kids did, but Sixth grade was 100 years old-ish.

Yeah, something like that. I was a peanut when I was in sixth grade, so.

Okay, informational reports. Can I just make a quick question? Are you here in Chino? Is Chino in tomorrow? Is he going to Brazil?

I'll send him a note.

Okay.

I can touch base with him on Friday, too. and figure out what.

I'm listening to the CEO process. We are waiting on one more piece of equipment to be installed. They have a tank. They have a pump, but they don't have a valve. And they're waiting for the valve to come in. And once the valve comes in, then they can test the fire sprinkler systems and all that. And then they can get the fire chief to sign off on the safety of that. They have drywall and fire-safety walls to put up in that room that they built. The room they built was bigger than what was on the plan, so they had to redo plans to get all that stuff done. They're probably 10-plus days away from it.

Well, and that's assuming that there are no problems with other conditions, right? Like, they still haven't met all of the the condition that I was concerned about that they have not met was the one that Justin added in March, which like I mentioned, I think should have been there all along, but that they have to submit and have accepted safety plan. And from my conversation with the police chief this afternoon, the preliminary plan that he renewed has many references to Exeter, which is obviously a different size and scale from our town. And he doesn't feel like he has the information that he needs to safely respond. I'm more concerned about the safety plans and the amount of time that it will take to reconcile that. Maybe that can be part of that conversation

in terms of the condition that they've got to get this approved before they can help them.

We can't give them a sale until they've submitted. It says submission and approval of drop-off plan, emergency operation evacuation plans, and emergency response plans to be filed under TANF. That means they've got to be submitted really to the planning board. so that they're on file with the tenant.

And it's what the addition said, submitted and accepted or submitted and approved.

Yes.

Meaning that they are required by adequate. It's not just dropping off plans and good to go.

Yeah.

There needs to be, you know, confirmation that they, that that includes the information as required.

Yeah. So that's, That's the one everyone's most concerned about is that they have to get all these funds set up.

Which we were under the impression of the planning board when we approved this, that those were well underway and we'll move those things and it's like maybe they stalled out.

Cool. Okay.

Now, anything else on 267's out there? Great. Interracial witness. Do you have anything there?

Just the part that I've put from the CIP, as you did, the CIP chart, just to put it in, to put together the comments.

It's not official. I just wanted to get everything on there and make sure it was It's a little cleaner.

These are the changes I can definitely.

I think there's just like a few alignment things that I'd like to see us.

I did it in Excel and pulled all of it to work. So things got a little bit off a little bit.

And my only comment would be since we Like under project type, I don't know if the person needs to abbreviate. Like building as abbreviated. Like, I don't know if we need to abbreviate anything because there's room in that field.

That's my first question. Yeah, I know.

Should there be a line that says other? I mean, would everything be covered by those five?

I don't have the thought of it. Yeah. Oh, space for explanation. And then the assembly sheet on front and

five or six of these sheets, and then one cover page that ranks them and shows them the priorities in the last series. You know how the, what it is and what the priority is.

Well, I don't know if you need a cover.

Do you need a cover page?

You guys want to talk? At one point.

Then I would have to go back to the one that was.

about like the order of priority could just be on this, give high, medium, low, but we could like, I don't know, priority one, add on total or whatever, and then they just put them in order here. see your papers as i printed out everything that said you'll leave all the comments on it last time oh you never did yeah so i think that's what don't say problems a lot of names are kind of

be in different years, which is looking at six different years. So, you know, we may see priority one on five or six, but.

Yeah, so maybe we need to.

That's why I'm looking at a summary sheet that would have, you know, the budget under priority 23 each year.

And then, yeah, if you want them to have a summary sheet, I think we need to create like a draft of it.

I'll give you, that's what I said, I'll create a cover sheet for this. When they give you the packages, it's the cover sheet, you go and listen to whatever they're requesting. So I know, you know, I know what to give you. Okay.

So I think the only thing here is like a ranking that's specific.

Does anyone else have any comments on the form in front of us? All right.

You know, I've been reviewing and I spent a lot of time for formatting. So I will send that file back to you.

Do we have a lot of work?

Yeah. You're supposed to sleep in. Well, we are also in the process of making an office at work. One will make the next mandatory work from home for like three weeks. So that does come with an extra time. So yes, CIP review and then master plan review are online. Is there anything else? Was he amenable to virtual or does he still want to? Do we feel as though, I know at the last meeting we went back and forth on impact and whether or not we felt that was something that we should pursue. Do we feel strongly about having that informational session?

We may have learned that.

We really shouldn't do it in this.

Do we want to just go over our list of meetings by him and see if there's one he is available for?

We did a presentation for NHMA.

We talked about that last time.

Do we have that? I think we did. Okay.

I'm sorry.

I remember when. Yeah, because it might have been removed in the beginning of August, like August 8th. Oh, should it be? Yeah. Oh, yeah. So let me track that. If we can get that, then we can just watch them. Exactly, yeah.

And I would also be fine with us using meeting time to watch it. So we could watch it at a workshop.

Let me track that down. I think I signed up for that and I wasn't able to go.

So they will send it to the electronic program, comparatively. And they have a page we go on to. Yeah. Yeah.

And I wasn't, I was able to hear something because another person in the town hall was able to abandon their work. And it was pretty good.

Yeah.

So let me try to track that down.

Okay.

And then we could watch that on the set. Yeah. Yeah, okay. I think we also have a note about November 3, and then just not in December. Not sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think it's three on three off, right?

Yeah.

So we could watch it in November.

I would be very open to changing .

I think it was .

Yeah. Well, let's maybe we watch the recording and see what questions we still have. And if we feel like we need a Q&A session one time because we have questions, maybe . I mean, we're trying to get it to do

an update for Kingston. Remember, Kingston's much bigger than Jacksonville.

Yeah.

It's got to be about 40 grand. And that's, we already have a system.

That's going to be the update to the system. So it's, it is what it is.

Well, that's, I mean, I think when people first hear impact and money, they think, oh, that's great.

Free money.

Yeah. Then why don't we figure it free and break it? Yeah.

But if you're charging $10,000, it's only $4,000.

You have to actually implement. And that's a charge that $40,000 weekly for one year, you may be able to apply now. And at 15 years.

Apparently, the new standard is two years. I've never heard that. Because in case, we've done it. two 13th of the year profits. We've had this in the middle of the 90s and we did one in, we did one right in the end of the 90s, I mean, and one in seven for the tween. And now we're doing another one starting in 26. And being told in the future that the tween is not going to be able to take over.

Well, and it's, I think it's something people need to understand. Say it's $10,000 for $5,000, $50,000. It's not $50,000 in the guidelines. You know, it's to be spent. These are specific ways that are laid out. If you don't meet the criteria, you can't spend it.

Exactly. That's why we should be listening to them, really. Okay, so we'll follow up on that.

Or on articles.

Do we have language from other towns, Len, if that's still on your radar, from multi-family housing, temporary signage, and dragways?

Yes, I actually started to work on the language, but I'm nervous about that. So, I would have that in for us at the COVID meeting. Okay.

And just as a reminder for everyone, they said that we are aiming for public hearings in December and January on the Warren articles to get those in in time for the ballot. I did share after our last meeting. I have not heard that. from the brand manager about what the right of way to use for time. We don't need to discuss what we need to do. That's all. That's all. Meeting notes.

where we put the ones you know i'm trying to see if they were in the driveway once does they have to worry about how they like it put you there oh okay i'll just they're very picky sometimes about the language yeah they can be so i'll just see if they didn't run that into their damn business but they still are

Has anyone reviewed meeting notes? Are we ready to discuss those tonight? Or would we like to move back to the next thing? I read them all. Do you have comments? Not very many. No, I know.

I know. I was actually asking. One more time.

She said not very many. They're not very many. No, they're really not.

actually so i guess that's what's good july here right there's nothing i didn't write anything on it um august um it's one little time today um mrs smith feels like she can be a partial basis on regulations as opposed to your personal opinions i just think it should be her

There's another one I referred to as Ms. Smith.

Ms. I missed that.

What was it?

It's like back to that.

If we do these photos on page two, like halfway down, members generally agree that Ms. Smith could remain impartial.

Ms. That's a Ms. And then if it's Ms. Smith, yeah, it's just too different.

Which, as in?

It says Mrs. Smith on the front, so.

Yeah.

I'm definitely a Mrs. Are you a Mrs.?

I'm a Mrs. And that's the only thing I saw on the map. Okay, so let's go in order for July. Mary had no notes. Does anyone else?

notes for July. All right. Hearing none, I would entertain a motion to approve the meeting notes from our Wednesday, July 15th meeting as written.

I'll second.

already beat you to it oh sorry i didn't hear you i'll be there um sorry i didn't go comfortable voting yes sorry okay unanimous vote on july you know today i think september 16th but we were voting um you mean they know it's from august 19th we had them in front of us are those the ones that you had comments yeah just um should i believe it's supposed to say bar down at the one two three third bullet under my name the end of the line peter do you have that correction um now on the first page

And the number three under my name is 34.

At the end of the line, it says to your personal opinions, I think it should be to her. And then it does say this is one place as opposed to Mrs. On page two.

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, four.

Just to be consistent, it's all in. Nothing wrong with that type. Anything else?

Just one other little one, page five, the first paragraph.

We're planning to propose two acre lots.

So I'm trying to be plural, actually, just two acre lots. I just add information. Where is it? Okay.

This is a pretty good review.

Yeah, no, I really, I did read through this and then I'll see.

With that, I'll entertain a motion on the meeting notes from August 19th. I'll make a motion to approve the minutes from August 19th, but just those small changes. I second. All in favor? So that's August approved, and that leaves us with September 2nd. That was our last vote. The only thing I noticed here, Peter, on the last page, adjournment, the motion of information has been filled out. I didn't find this motion. Plus it says page four through. Page four. It's really four pages back, right?

I can go back to it.

Yeah, I was going to say, I don't actually have that written down. I'm actually pretty good about it.

I'll go back to the video. Usually it's in areas.

Has it been wrong?

No, no, no. It's the first. Just say it like me. Okay.

Any other comments on the workshop meeting notes?

First page, the very top says Wednesday, September 2nd, but then at date, it says September 8th.

Yep.

Did you believe in it?

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, and board responsibilities. And so I had a bunch of charts to show everybody of things, whether, you know, how we get to meetings. But most interesting thing I found is that once the meeting minutes are posted in five days, I can take down the audio and video from the website, which they're not considered required. So...

But then I, for the first five days.

Well, until you have the meeting notes available.

I'm not doing it, but it's...

I was going to say, I would bring that to the board. It's a question we want to proceed. I think there's a... I don't know if there's a transparency question, if you're taking down the reporting.

Do you trash it, or does it just get, like, archived somewhere?

I haven't done anything with them. I'm not doing anything egressive.

I feel like the only reason to remove them would be if they were running into some sort of like, uh, data-losing capacity.

It would be good to minimize what was on the site or something. I don't know that there's otherwise a good reason that we would need to remove them.

It's only, the only reason they stayed is because the amendments on the legal document A lot of them.

Well, that's very good.

But I think it might cost more if you take it down.

If you wanted to do something, you could say, okay, we'll leave them up for X amount of time as opposed to taking them down right away. Well, I'm just saying, if you decide you want to do it, you could put a time frame.

There's a difference between saying, here's our official records on the website, and for the archive of videos, you can go to YouTube or whatever it is. I'd go to, like, meeting on the Kensington website to go to the archive at some place else. Yeah.

You know, it's probably a conversation larger than us, but that's good to know.

So, I'll get through September 2nd, or I was going to say. I'll change this. There are no other comments. I will entertain a motion to approve. I'm in motion.

If there are any, then it's just the number of cases and then who did the most.

I have three of four and four of four. I have four.

Yeah, I have plus one.

Oh, no kidding. I have three of three and then four of three. The copy, Peter, are printed here by the group.

All right.

So September, Mary's going to motion. Do we have a second? I'll second.

All in favor? Aye. No, it's not good. So yes, sir.

Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second. Second.

Second.

Second. Second. Second. Second. It was the 15th.

And we had two that were canceled. Well, that was, okay. March 4th, April 1st were those canceled. Okay. Looks like they get it must be. And that brings everything up to date. All right. Our next workshop is scheduled for October 7th. And then our next meeting will follow on October 21st. Do we have any hearings that we know about? That's a good question.

Great.

That's going to come back.

I didn't want to do a question.

Who does? I don't remember where exactly, but I know that the giant boy was a question.

Before we close, can I just inform you of something? Sure. Hi. You know, I submitted a contract with a few people on July 1st. Oh, my goodness. So I'd like to send one in for you to consider at the next meeting.

Isn't that very good? I haven't thought about it.

It's a bit over a year. No, I look, I submitted it in September. So now I'm, I'm, you're following me further back. It's now going to be October 6th. So I apologize for that. It's never changed in design. It never changed the amount of clothing. I'm just getting later and later in the year. Why don't you do two? It's really silly. I should really be better.

And then John, remind me, we review and recommend to the Board of Selectmen.

I'm sorry?

We review your contract and recommend to the Board of Selectmen. Or can I just approve it?

I think you just signed it. Wait, I'll make sure. It's the same. Yeah. But I don't know. I'll send it to Peter. Okay. All right. Anything else?

would like to make a motion to adjourn mary's winning tonight it says that they appointed the library okay they pointed a librarian should not be a trustee and in consultation with the library they actually put all other

employees block and determine their compensation. I was worried that was going to be someone that I didn't know about.