Planning and Zoning Commission - Regular Meeting

I will.

I have the dabble. I have and I sorry my hand okay I'll call the meeting uh for planning and zoning commission regular meeting uh this meeting is held in person as well as on zoom Zoom, you can dial 719-359-4580 to listen into the meeting. The web ID is 8638055264. So first uh thing is I'd like to motion I'd like a motion to seat the alternates [Music] so far. Mics are always the best part of the job.

Aha. Uh I move to seat our uh two commissioner alternates. Uh second. So I have a motion from Commissioner. Madam Chair, you need to turn your mic back. I have a motion from uh Commissioner Serly and a second from Commissioner Cowan to seat Commissioner Alternate Lear and Commissioner Alternate Corkerin. Okay. All those in favor I

Any opposed? Okay. So, let's do the roll call, please. Commissioner Leer. There we go. Microphone. Uh, Commissioner Cowan. Commissioner Sipperly here. Chair Connor here. Commissioner Hen here. Commissioner Gaiman. Commissioner Corkran here. We have a quorum.

Okay. Right. So, um, next is any conflicts of interest for the agenda for items on the agenda this evening? Seeing none, let's move to the receipt of the minutes for we can do them together if uh that's okay with you guys uh for May 2025 and or us and April 2025. I don't know what happened now.

Oh, I was just wanting to vote. Watkins is also new to his position tonight. It's a night of firsts. I should cancel. So, if you want to stop voting, Watkins, that should take you out of that screen. I move to approve the April 22nd meeting minutes. I'll need to recuse from the May 27th meeting minutes as I was not present. Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you, Commissioner Sipperly. For April,

can I get a second for April? the second for April. Thank you, Commissioner Cowen. Uh, all those in favor, can we just do a raise of hands?

I Okay, seeing anyone abstaining. Okay, I think there's the night of first. Maybe we'll just let you get together. Okay, we're good. Okay. And then um I will need a motion for the yeah the May 27th, 2025 meeting minutes to approve.

I move to approve the May minutes. Thank you, Commissioner Cowen. Second that motion. Okay, I have a motion and a second. Uh, all those in favor, just raise your hand. We can vote now. Oh, we can vote now. Oh, okay. We'll call the vote.

Motion passes unanimously. Okay, thank you. Lord, what was that? I don't know. This is a very distracting device. Um, no offense. Okay, so um, next agenda item is comments from citizens, whether it be uh for items not on our agenda this evening, whether it be online or in the room. I don't see anyone. Okay, now I have to drink water because I just swallowed down the wrong tube. All right, seeing none, we'll move on to our first agenda item. So our first agenda item is planning item sign041 off- premise sign permit Glenwood Vet Clinic. Take it away.

Uh this is Emry Alson, Community Development will be presenting on off- premise sign permit. I'll be sharing my screen. Okay. Uh so this application is for an off- premise signed permit. Uh it is for 2512 and 2514 Grand Avenue. Uh so this property uh again this is an application we have not done with planning and zoning commission. Uh it is for a sign located off premise. So the vet clinic is at 24 2514 south grand and they are looking to put a sign at 2512 South Grand and by definition so this is code definition of what an off- premise sign is. And so it's any sign that's off your property. Um, so you have your property where you can put signage as soon as you want to put a sign elsewhere. It requires first an off-remise sign permit approved by planning and zoning commission and then they would in addition have to come back to community development for a sign permit. Um, so this is would be the first step in their process. Uh, typically you'd see an off-remise sign like this. It's like a billboard. Very very off- premise. In this case, uh, with the sign locations, this is what we're looking at. So the vet clinic is back here and then you have the property of 2512 on Grand and the vet clinic right now just has what's called like a lot of times a flag pole lot. They have their access to Grand and where they would like to put a sign is off their property and so that's why this application is here tonight. Uh this is what the vet clinic is looking at installing. And so again this would come back to community development for review as part of the off- premise sign

criteria. we do review this this type of sign, this size of sign, it would be allowed on the property at 2512. Um, so there's not really any issue as far as that goes. Again, it's just consideration of can the vet clinic have a sign off premise. That's what you're reviewing tonight. And so there's one action item to consider approval of the off- premise sign permit. Uh staff has recommended approval with finding conditions in the staff report. And so your options tonight are approve the off- premise sign permit. Uh deny it or approve it with additional conditions or continue the item. Uh so there's only four criteria for an off-remise sign permit. Uh one is that it will not harm the public or impair the intent or purposes of the code. And so staff finds it does not. Uh as part of the condition of approval, the applicant would have to come back and submit for a sign permit. uh they would have to show that where the sign is placed would not affect any drivers entering Grand Avenue. And so again, that would come with review of the sign permit with staff. Uh second criteria is a significant hardship would result with such off-remise sign. Um without a sign in this location, the vet clinic does not really have the ability to advertise to grand and show where they are located because their property is their access driveway. So there's no place to place a sign within their property. Uh the third criteria is that it should comply with all the applicable size, height, and placement number of signs on the property. And so sign dimensions and number would comply with what could be on that property um otherwise. And then the fourth one is if the off- premise sign is proposed in the public rightway, that sign would also have to get a rideway encroachment license. And so that would be if they wanted to have it in the rightway, which they don't. They're looking at having it entirely included on 2512 South Grand. Um that would just be an additional basically permit that they'd have to get, but that goes to city council would not be heard by planning and zoning commission. Um so

again, uh staff has found that it meets all these criteria. As far as reviewing agency comments, um fire department approval of an off- premise sign would assist with emergency response. Uh right now there's not a good way to know where that vet clinic is. uh engineering department uh just has included. So what a sight distance triangle is, it's a drawing just showing where that visibility is for a driver that would be entering Grand and they've just requested that that drawing be included with when the applicant would come back for a signed permit if this is approved and that's been included as a condition of approval. Um there's been no public comments received and then the applicant does have permission from the property owner. uh 2512 South Grand that was developed as a residential apartment building and as part of that process the two parties have uh basically a property agreement between the two. Uh the the apartment building uses their act the vet clinic's access for some things and they have some different things regarding the property including permission for the vet clinic to put out a sign. So there's no issue with that. And so again, this is one action item and this is planning and zoning commission is looking at approving the vet clinic to put a sign that's not on their property. That's full full sole focus of this item. So um these are the findings that it meets the criteria. Uh these are the conditions which are listed in the staff report. And then finally, if you find alternative motion for recommend for denial, uh you need to use the criteria and have your own findings for um denial. So that concludes presentation.

Okay. The applicant is also here too. Okay. Um does anybody have any questions for staff? Seeing none, does the applicant want to come on up? Can you state your name and where you are or who you are? Sure. I'm Sam. Uh I am the owner of Glenwood and Silt that clinics. Um sorry, I was fixing a fo with crooked legs. So they don't It's horrible. They don't follow the time laws.

Um so yeah. So, I'm just I just want we just want to sign so people can see us, find us. Do you have any presentation for us or does anybody want to ask any questions? No. Okay. Commissioner Gin has a question for you. If I can figure out this mic. So, I'm just making sure from the picture this up here that the place where you have the sign, that's where they just built that big apartment building. It used to have a sign there and you don't anymore. Now, you're going to put another sign up. Is that Can you see my mouse? Yeah,

you can. Yeah. Okay. So, the sign was right here. Okay. And so when they redid this whole easement here, they took out the sign. Yeah. And so they basically to like that sign lived right here. It was in the asphalt. And so they took that whole thing out. Okay. And so that was kind of one of the conditions of them doing that driveway was they were going to let us build a sign on their property.

Perfect. And that was also part of it was we we were told they knew that they were not going to put a sign up for the apartments. So they were happy to have us just put a sign there instead. Okay. Any other questions from anyone else? Okay. Well, thank you so much. Thanks. All right.

Okay. Any uh so now we're going to open it for public comment. Seeing no one online or in the room, I'm going to close public portion and bring it back to the council for discussion or a motion. Okay. Commissioner Cyperly. Uh I do recall um reviewing the apartment building and the uh effect that the construction of that building would have on the driveway at a past meeting. So this is not an unexpected request for a sign. Um it seems as though it is very well justified in in terms of the firefighting um and just finding finding the building as you're cruising down that road. It it can be difficult to spot that driveway.

So this is this is not a surprise that we're seeing this application before us. Thank you, Commissioner Sberly. Commissioner Cowan, I'll make a motion to approve the application for off- premises sign permit according to the findings and subject to the conditions of the staff report. Commissioner Cowen gave us a motion to approve. Commissioner Gman, I second that motion. So, I have a first and a second and we'll call the vote.

Okay. Motion passes unanimously.

Okay, great. Thank you. Congratulations. All right. Next on our agenda is hold please is planning action item of variance for Euro Italian underground signage. And we'll give staff one more minute. Thanks. Come back. You guys have pets.

I do. So, you know meount.

That's on record that you've been recorded. Okay. Okay. Uh so this item is for assigned variance for Euro Italian restaurant. I will be sharing my screen and presentation. Okay. So, this item is for a sign variance uh for the Euro Italian underground restaurant at 715 Grand Avenue uh properties uh downtown in the mixeduse central core zoning district. Uh and it's consideration of variances. Uh we have two different variances. uh one is for number of attached wall signs and then the second variance is for location on a building frontage that does not face a public parking area or public entrance. And so the restaurant's located here uh at 7:15 Grand right there as highlighted. Again, this star just places it in the downtown and again it's within the M2 mixeduse zoning district. Uh so again, first item is for number of signs. So, in a multi-tenant building, a tenant is limited to one while projecting a roof sign uh per use. And so, they're looking at having two. And staff recommendation is for denial of this variance with findings and conditions in the staff report. And so, again, planning and zoning commission actions are below. And then the second item is for basically the location is to allow a wall sign that would be on a

side of a building that does not a street parking area or other area open to the public with a public entrance. And so staff has also recommended not denial of that item as well with findings and conditions in the staff report. Uh so again this is a variance. Uh so there are the seven criteria and the application would have to meet all seven and then I just provided here uh the word hardship is used a lot in the criteria and a hardship is a condition by which a property cannot be put to reasonable use under existing regulations subject to showing proof of these criteria. And so that tonight would be focus of your review is considering to what extent a hardship is uh experienced by the applicant in their variance requests. And so the first is so again the number and so this the applicant uh recently purchased a restaurant and put up some new signage. And so there's they've put up four different signs and the ones that we're looking at in terms of this variance are this west wall sign on the alley and this east wall sign on the front uh sidewalk uh underneath the bridge. And then they also did put up these two other signs uh which I'll talk about a little bit but are not focus of this v variance request. Uh so just quick science summary. So this east wall sign, this was placed and this was previously permitted. And so this is what's considered a sign face change. And so this is considered wall sign number one. And so again, if it's a multi-tenant building, you get one wall sign. And so this is number one. This second sign is considered suspended sign. Uh that was also again previously permitted. Not focused to this variance. I'm just pointing it out. And then this second sign. So this is their wall sign number two. And so this is really subject to the variance is they're having two wall signs when they'd only be allowed one. Um it is on the back alley. The previous owner, Italian Underground, had a sign in this

location as well, which was never actually permitted. And it had been in that location since at least 2009. And so it had been just there without a permit. And so the new owner um the building owner told them to go ahead and then that got put there. Um but again because these need permits and that's a second sign. It does require variance which is why we're here. And then again um this is also not a public entrance to the building which comes into play with the second variance. Uh so again so this is for number. Um and then again they have a sign on the door which is an allowable sign without a permit based on its size. So this does not get counted as a wall sign. And then they also have an outdoor dining area. And so this outdoor dining area is city rightway that's leased to the restaurant and as part of the regulations for outdoor dining. Uh signage is not allowed to be attached to outdoor dining. Uh if the applicant wanted a sign in this area because it's in the rightway that would have to go to city council. So that wouldn't be something that planning and zoning commission would review. Uh removing the sign has been included as a condition of approval if the commission were to approve the variance. Um so again with a variance you have the seven criteria you have to meet all seven. Uh staff found that four of the seven criteria were met and that's how staff arrived at denial uh for the variance. And then action item number two is the wall sign. It's for this specific location being on the side of a building which does doesn't have a public entrance. Um, so it's the key part here is it's and and so this is it does above a parking area. It does above an alley. However, it does not have a public entrance on this side of the building. If this door were a public entrance, this location would be fine. But again, you'd still have to have the variance for having the two signs. So that's and that's the important word there.

And so similarly for this uh item staff found that only four of the seven criteria were met. Um that it does have some exceptional shape. Um this is a unique property. You can't drive to it really. Uh the only way to access it is by pedestrians by walking and so a lot of people are approaching it from different directions including um from the west and that alley side. Uh it doesn't harm the public or impair the intent. Um it we talk about intentive sign code and part of that is directing people uh to places. So if you are trying to find Beth Plaza, this sign uh does help you with that. It doesn't require violate any building or fire code and it's also the minimum variance. Um they are just looking for one sign. Um however, staff found that this doesn't really produce an undue hardship. Uh limiting signage is not prohibiting it. So there's still ways to advertise. Uh and then again we also have the criteria that it's not related to purposes of convenience or financial burden. So again regulating signage not prohibiting it. There are other ways uh to advertise. Um so again with the variance you'd have to have seven out of seven which again why staff has found recommendation for denial. Uh as far as reviewing agency comments on fire department approval of the signed variance would not affect or inhibit the emergency response. Um so that was really the only applicable department that had a comment on this. Um, no public comments have been submitted um, for this item. And then again, so there's two action items. One is for the number of signs for a specific tenant in a multi-tenant building to exceed the limit of one and staff is finding for denial. And then the second is for that location on a side of on a side of a building that doesn't face a street parking area and doesn't have a public entrance. So those are the two items under review for the commission. And then as always, here are the findings and then the conditions listed in the staff report. And similar to the application previous, the variance would

be the first step. If approved, the applicant would then uh move on to doing a signed permit with staff. And so that would be the second part. Uh and then again, if you find recommendation for approval, the you'd have to have these findings and provide why you think it meets that. So that concludes presentation. Okay, thank you very much. Uh, are there questions for this variance? Okay, Commissioner Cowen.

Yeah, thank you. I'm just curious how how does this how how does this get brought to our attention? How is this here? Sure. Um, so a lot of times if new signage goes up, if we have a new business that comes in and they put up signage, if it's uh oftentimes you'll get complaints, you know, from different members of the community and upon investigation of that complaint is found that they exceeded the signage allowed. So, okay, that's how that came about. So, dimensionally, it's it's been the same. We have just new color, new designs,

correct? So, this sign right Oh, just share my screen. Uh, the sign that was replaced on the alley is the same exact dimension as the previous one for Italian Underground, but had been there again without a permit. Um, but this was not a larger sign, a different sign, very same style, no change in illumination, change, no change in placement, just went over the existing location of the old one.

Okay. And someone took offense, called it in, reported it. Correct. Okay. um the the sidewalk sign that's attached to the rightway. Are there through this process of the city identified other people in violation of this? And if so, is there similar action being considered? Do not have any pending violations for this one. Um have not looked into other locations.

I think I'll jump in here because I think I know where you're going. Um, and just to expand on what Emry had mentioned about the process. So, when we get complaints and we get a lot of complaints on sign code because other people know it and then they see something that they realize doesn't conform and then we get a call. Uh, then we are required to follow up on that complaint which is part of the research that Emry was mentioning. And in following up on that complaint, we let the business owners know the sign is in violation of our sign code and this is how these are your different paths forward. one of which is the variance procedure in front of you tonight. So, we try and let them know what what's the violation, you know, what they need to do to fix it. If they want to just solve it themselves, they can do that or they can come in for a variance like um Euro Italian is doing tonight before you guys. We get signed complaints all over the city and we do respond to those. Our neighborhood services coordinator, Lynn, is out. um we do a lot of education and trying to tell people about this, but a lot of times this is what it results in in the process to come before you tonight. So, just some clarification there.

Thank you. And I think I'd also add that that timeline for compliance. So, if you get a letter, it's 30 days as your first letter to comply and then you get a second letter which is another 30 days to comply which at that point if no compliance is received it does move to municipal court. So, like with this example, business owner got the letter, they came right in, submitted the variance, and that's how they chose to move forward with it. Getting informed of the process. Gotcha. Um, the refacing.

Um, yeah. And this was new to me, like learning through this. I guess I was on the assumption that kind of going back to our conversation regarding discussion around the Walmart signage question that we had last year. And I think we kind of came part of that discussion was if they just simply replaced it as it was, they wouldn't need to be there. Um, and from that then I kind of thought, well, if we're just replacing existing dimensions, um, then we're okay. But apparently that's not the case always. Some of the time, none of the time.

The sticking point with this is this sign on the alley was never permitted. So there were back in 2009 there was a code letter sent to the building owner and it was never addressed and then over time you have staff changes in this case business changes and it was never addressed. So had this like let's say this went through the variance process in 2009 and they were approved for both of these variances that's an approved sign location. It would have just been a sign face change for an approved sign location. And that's why these ones there's no issue on the front of the building. Okay. But I guess just forformational purposes anytime we want to make a change. Do we always have to do a face change application if we are changing up? Yes. Okay. Yeah. Good to know.

And that's a that is a the cost of that permit is free. It's just review. It's just the process. Yep. Gotcha. And then one more. Um and I just want to say for your information what you just described, there's a difference between a legal conforming sign and a legal non-conforming sign and then one that we've been actively working with on a complaint. So as long as you have a legal conforming sign that the sign face changes Emmery just described is fairly straightforward. In this case we were dealing with a sign that we were actively working on the code enforcement side and so it wasn't it didn't have that status. So they can't do a sign you can't do a sign change on something that is not legal and conforming. Right.

Yeah. Makes sense. Yeah. Thank you. Um, and lastly, kind of like on that back wall sign, if they say remove the sign, but maybe they got together and did a mural. Um, what's any implications there? Uh, so that is paint. Um, there are some stipulations. No, there are some stipulations in code that talks about when you have copy advertisement for a sign. And so that's a fine line between what is signage and what is a mural. So, if it was a giant mural that said Euro Italian underground, that would be considered a sign. Uh, if it was a giant mural of spaghetti meatballs, that's art. Cool. Thank you. Appreciate it. Thank you.

Commissioner Cypr, are there any other um businesses along the Bethl Plaza that have um signage on the on the side away from their main entry door? know there's a lot of restaurants down there and probably lots of them are in a similar situation. You don't drive by it. You know, smoke for instance. Are any of these other businesses advertising on a non- entry door facade? So on this particular block, so like Daily Bread, Sunday, Hookers, none of those businesses have signage. I think the only one that does is the Bail Bonds has a neon sign that sticks up above Slope and Hatch that's been there for a very long time. Yeah.

So that's the only one I on this side facing the area and that that frontage. So, is the city currently considering any wayfinding to help folks find our downtown restaurant district in Bethl Plaza as a whole for like all of the businesses in the plaza?

So, they do have, you know, as you walk in the downtown area, there definitely is the way the the brown and blue wayfinding signs. As far as for specific businesses, um there are not. Uh, one thing too is, you know, when you think of sign code, sign code is for commercial businesses all across town. And so that's highway 6, that's highway 82, it's also applicable to this location. And so that's where when you have a sign code, you inevitably that's why we get a lot of sign variances because it's you have to write it broadly. Um, so in the case of specific restaurant, specific business, no. Um, but the wayfinding does direct you to Beth Plaza, to you know, Seventh Street, those places. would so when these restaurants are advertising do you think they list their address as Bethl Plaza because I sort of think they don't

and you might not be able to connect their address with Bethl Plaza I mean although everyone has a map in their pocket these days I'm just I'm wondering you know how can we help the restaurant achieve the goal of bringing people in who are kind of confused they found a spot to park they don't know where they are and this you know as I'm saying this probably is a is is a common condition downtown. So, the city did do a wayfinding project um pretty close to after CO. So, I'm thinking 2021. And there are a couple locations in downtown that have maps. Um I I'm actually not sure as I'm saying this that they have restaurant names, but it kind of shows it's got Bethl Plaza on there and shows like restaurant row, things of that nature.

Um we haven't done any updated wayfinding, you know, with specific um restaurant names necessarily. Um, and I can't say that we've heard too much feedback from the tourism side, um, with people getting too lost. As you mentioned, we all carry a very large map in our pockets. Yeah. Um, but I always try and stop tourists that are looking around like this and direct them where to go. Yeah. As do as do I. And too, with installed signage, when you have specific places, that's always difficult because if a place goes out of business, changes hands, changes names, then the sign starts to be obsolete. Yeah. So, after a certain number of years, it might not be accurate. Right. Okay, thanks.

Okay, Commissioner Gryman, I was wondering um the purpose of this uh code where people can't have more than one sign and the location can't be on the back side.

Sure. So, that's probably two-part. Uh so, first is when you have multi-tenant building, if you have a building like a strip mall and you have seven tenants, uh if there were no sign regulations, people could have as many as they want. you end up having a lot of times visual clutter like how many signs do I want as a business owner? I want as many as I can have. And so that's the intent of that. Now where sign code places it is you get one per tenant. And again we also recognize and that's where so like pointing out this front uh it's for types of signs. So here this suspended sign is in a different category. So, there's still two signs attached to this building for this business, but because they're different types of signs, you get more. And so, the limit is wall, which is like what this one is, um, projecting, which would just be coming out from the building, or a roof sign, so like top of the roof. Um, so that's what the limit is for a multi-tenant building. If this were a single tenant building, so let's say that this entire restaurant were here Italian, the limit's two. And so, sign codes, it still is limiting. Um, and again, that's where the number is. And as far as the location, the idea is is if you are truly trying to have signage to direct people to a building, if there's not a public entrance on that side of a building, the idea is you want to direct people and have signage be in the most useful locations. So, if that's a public entrance, that's where you need to be going. That's where the signage is. If you have a building with four sides and one entrance, there's four signs on it. How do I know which which sign is the most important? Where should I be going? And so sign code is always trying to strike the balance between you want advertising, you want be able to find places, but then also too, you want to avoid visual clutter and having it be too much signage and not be useful. And so that's what it's always trying to strike the balance for. And so that's what you're

How many tenants are in this building? Um, so there's Italian underground. Uh, so it's known as a silver club building. So they have the Italian underground. There's also a retail shop. There's offices above. Um, so there's probably four or five businesses. applicant could probably confirm. So if all four or five businesses had three signs, it would be pretty crowded looking. That was the idea with sign code. Yeah. The way the limits are.

Okay. Thank you. Um I have a couple questions. So the front of this building is that like the window has the painting Italian underground. So, it seems like there's one, two, three, and then is that a menu to the right of Oh, is that a historic plaque? Thank you. What's that? Yeah, there's one on the door, too. So, there's like almost five signs in the front of that.

So, correct. And again, this is where we have the different types of signs. So, like window signage that doesn't require sign permit. There's some limitations on how much window you can cover, but that doesn't need a permit. Um again, so you have the different types of signs which allows people to do different things. Um so this one is more about your total number of wall signs and then that location. And same thing with this door sign that's uh because it's less than three square feet, it doesn't need a permit and it's fine the way it is. And then for action item number two, can you talk about that other Yeah, that the entrance thing. Is that cons that's considered a to the right in the window? That's a sign. Correct.

It's not like a number. Yeah. So this is again if this were a public entrance, we wouldn't have this second variance for the location of a sign. you'd still be talking about the number that it's two wall signs for a tenant in a multi-tenant building. Um, and so that and again the way it's worded is you have it's and so it's this place abuts an alley. It abuts a parking area that's open to the public but this is not a public entrance. So it doesn't meet the full Oh, I see. I missed that piece. Yeah. Okay.

So it's pretty specific in particular. Okay. Thank you, Emory. Is there any more questions for staff Marjorie or commissioner earlier? Hold on. Just to clarify because I got a little muddied right there with this statement. So, if this were next to a public parking lot and there was no public entrance, then it would still not be okay or it would be okay.

So, if if this door although if No, it's okay. It's it's a lot of ifs, ands, or buts. If this were a public entrance, we wouldn't have this variance. If this were another entrance to the building, this second variance we wouldn't be talking about. We'd still be here though for that action item number one, though. Okay. But action item number one aside, this not being a public entrance, if is it that is what makes the decision? Because I think my confusion in looking at this prior to the meeting was that it I didn't realize there was an alley there. I was like it is next to a parking lot, but even if it were next to a parking lot, it still wouldn't be okay because it's not a public entrance.

Correct. Got it. Thank you. Okay. All right. Any more questions for Emory? So, hold on. So in order for this applicant to get the variance, we have to prove one and two. It can't just be correct. Right. Because to have the sign, they have there's two variances to allow this sign on. They both and they have both have to pass. Correct.

Good question. Okay. All right. So, um, now, uh, applicant, the applicant, if you'd like to approach and state your name for the record. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Angie Stanford. So, I I have a little speech that I kind of put together for everyone. Um, thank you because I'm learning a lot from Mr. Cowan asking questions. I want everyone to be aware that all the signs that I put in, those are all the signs that were there before as I spoke with Mr. Emory. Most of these signs were approved in 2003. Since 2003, nobody looked into it. I was told when I purchased the restaurant because that was my first question because I knew I'm going to change the name of a restaurant because I am not what it was. I am a new restaurant, new ownership and totally new menu. So I asked the question if I have to get hold of anyone from the city locally or anyone to ask permission to change the signs. They told me only the awning was the one that I have to ask permission. So without hesitations I invested the money to put the same exact signs, same new name with the same exact spots. So it's a little bit confusing. It's been confusing from the day I bought this restaurant. But as I mentioned, good evening everyone. My name is Angie Stanford. I am the owner of your Italian underground restaurant here in downtown Glenwood Springs area. I am here to request the commission support in keeping our west facing wall sign. The building is unique situated uniquely situated with very limited street visibility and sign plays an important role in helping customers find our entrance especially from the parking public parking lot located in the back

of my building. Most uh buildings in downtown coreface uh face the street. My restaurant does not. The west side is first thing customers see when parking their vehicles and the sign key is visibility and wayfinding. Please note anyone coming in downtown area by car or even uh sher ride, Uber, lift, etc. has to get there by using the public road which is only accessible behind the building. The front of my building is by foot traffic only. The west sign pointing points potential customers toward Battle Plaza, a main public space and help them find my restaurants. It supports downtime vibrancy and walkability. It helps guide food traffic from the parking lot towards Battle Plaza and my restaurant. Without it, and let me emphasize again, potential customers may not know where the entrit is or if the business is open. How am I expected to keep a small business running or pay pay taxes to support the city if customers are being pushed away from the restaurant because they can't find it? And let's everybody remember the restaurant is located underground. So even though we do have a patio outside that is pretty much zero income because people don't don't even understand that we have the patio. We mentioned to guests that hey there's a patio people don't don't don't see it. Somehow it's even though I decorated with flowers I put extra lights for visibility. I put the signs where they were. It still does nothing you know for us. Here's the thing. We recognize the code code limits with wall signs to the frontage with public entrance. However, our building is unique that is facing faces a public parking lot and the pedestrian pad to the Bethl plaza. The west side functions as the facto entrance even and even if there's no formal door, the spirit of the code is

met. The sign helps with wayfinding, supports downtown visibility and is modest in sign. As our own staff report mentioned on page nine, what was emailed to me? Although the site of the building does not have a public entrant, the adjustant alley function like an entrance to Battle Plaza and staff finding finds that due to unique location of this building and the adj uh adjacent alley that the sign meets the spirit of the regulations. The statement just goes on to prove this wall west wall sign is vital for my restaurant and its potential customers. I moved my business here to Colorado, but more specifically to Glennwood Springs as my love and pride to your city is exceptional. I really put in a lot of time, work, and energy to get this restaurant on its feet again. I do all I can to be part of this community together with you, support local as much as I can, and I would deeply appreciate the same in return. Thank you for your time.

Thank you very much. Does anyone have any questions for the applicant? I I I actually just have one. Um uh how else do you advertise? Do you do like I try advertising pretty much to every um every paper and booklet that you guys have here in Glenwood? It is a lot of money. I spent over $7,000 uh as of last year

until now to advertise. I am also on the on the maps which a lot of times that means nothing to my guests because 99% of the guests coming into us are asking for where are signs where there's parking. So automatically it's behind the sign that you see that is behind as it shows over here on the screen is asking the guests and showing them where to go for the restaurant. So that's one main key. Google does not help us with anything because Google somehow uh their map and directions direct guests somewhere here. I had reviews from guests telling me to work with with Google. Google is not a person and it's impossible to work with them. I tried to fix the website and um I sent emails to Google uh support team to please um figure out how you can find and figure out your maps to be appropriate for our guests because last time I had a couple that was frustrated because they walked all the way by the courthouse somewhere and they figured out they were in a wrong spot. So they said, "Oh, I think we have to turn around because this is nowhere downtown anymore." So by walking back and asking people around, they finally found it. They ended up on the parking lot and they saw the sign. They're like, "Okay, here. How is this possible?" So, that was the first thing the guests told me when they entered my establishment.

Do you do you do walk-ins or is it reservation only at your restaurant? Walkins. Walkins. We try reservations, but it didn't work. Yeah. Well, thank you. Anyone else have any questions? Nope. Okay. Thank you so much.

Okay. Um, I'll open it for public comment if anyone's here to just mention this issue. All right, seeing there's no one, I'm going to close the public portion and bring it back to council for discussion. Any discussion or a motion? I would say Marjorie or empty seat one, but I know it's commissioner.

Um, I think my concern is that even though when the property was purchased, this wasn't in her knowledge, it's a non-conforming sign that has been unressed. Um and along with the fact that um the sign code really is has been created for equitable kind of representation and and I think I do have concerns of a non-conforming sign creating some kind of competitive edge. That's all. Thank you, Commissioner Leer. Commissioner Cipperly,

I will um agree that the um the sign mounted on the west side of the building obviously does help direct people towards the front door. However, if all of the buildings along Bethl Plaza wanted signs in the alley and along those public parking lots, I think we would be really subjecting our downtown to lots of bit of visual clutter. Um that is the reason we have the sign code as it is written. Um, so although I I I've a very compelling argument to allow a wayfinding sign in the um along the parking lot, I would I would hope that maybe the city or the DDA could help um direct people towards Bethl Plaza to the benefit of of all the business owners down there.

Thank you, Commissioner Sberly. Commissioner Cowan,

I apologize. not a not a comment, but a question just kind of feeding off of that. Um, as we've been talking about these alley redesigns and making things more accessible and walkable downtown, is there some plan part of this um some way finding kind of a grander scheme to help these downtown businesses so it's not an ad hoc piggybacking off of nonconformity kind of approach to this? Um, I'm not going to speak for our public information officer if we've got any more wayfinding projects in the works. I know with the DDA, they have a facade improvement grant that they manage that helps businesses um downtown, and I think they can incorporate signage into that that helps pay for conforming signage. So it doesn't um solve the issue of needing a variance in this case, but there is that um out there for support.

Yeah, we can certainly pass along ideas from planning and zoning commission related to wayfinding in light of this as you guys have them. Yeah, thank you. And kind of addition to that, I just when I look at this instance, you know, you take that sign away which I think helps break up and provide some definition to that wall. you take that away and to me this is subjective but that's pretty ugly um the way that looks right you know ugly wall ugly wall um so I guess if we're okay with an ugly wall instead of a sign um you know I guess that's one of the things in front of us tonight um and part of my question is okay if if nothing then what ugly wall so

and obviously that's part of your guys' discussion tonight um you know staff has the sign code just like our code. So that's what the community has currently decided upon as what's acceptable for the signage in this town and it is very challenging at times to look at a scenario we're like well that's not so bad but we have to apply it very equitably across the board and so we don't get the luxury of those uh types of interpretations but you do in the form of variances um so I would just state that is that's what we have to do on our side and sign code is probably one of the are just challenges um to implement citywide. It's it's challenging um for business needs, what the community wants for aesthetics. It's it's just a hard thing to do.

Oh, sorry. I was thinking Commissioner Cifly. Um, if they if the applicant had a window in the door facing the west side, would graphics be allowed and said window like it is allowed on the window on the front? Correct. So, they would be allowed to have some type of window signage if there were a window on either if they had a window or a glass in the door, they could put said signage there, but it would be obviously much closer to the the street on the west side in the alley side. Yeah, if they had a window, they could put a window vinyl in. There's some stipulations like how much the window you can cover. Um, but that would be required without a permit. Excuse me. Would you would not need a permit. Okay. Thanks,

Commissioner Cowen. Yeah. And it gives this clarification. Another question and the applicant might be able to clarify this, but I believe that is if I I think I've I've eaten there and I've seen that door is kind of through the kitchen, right? So that door that red door we see that is um that's part of the restaurant. Correct. Do you want to approach the um mic? The sausage smells as good advertisement as

Yes, sir. The back door is the entry and exit from the kitchen. And you can also walk through the restaurant. Apparently before guests were exiting through the kitchen in the back instead of walking around because a lot of guests tell me, "I'm I'm just going to go through the kitchen." I said, "You can't. It's because of hazard. Just just something happens. I I can't." And they said, "We always used to go through the kitchen." The direct I I can't. You know, this is sadly. Thank you. Thank you.

I have another question for you just to kind of reiterate something that you mentioned about how expensive the advertising is for you. Um if you were to not have the signage that I guess has been there since 2009 illegally, but um how much do you 2003?

Since 2003, sorry. Um, so how much do you think you would have to spend more if we were to uh deny this? I don't know. How much will it cost, you know, to get on the internet than just do virtual advertisement? I don't know. It is quite costly. and with a sign in the back. I don't want to say anything, but I think there's just a big blob underneath because the board because the my my boards um my signs are metal. The boards before were wood and they were attached to something that was underneath. So, I honestly don't know what's under that sign

regardless whether you guys allow it or not at this point. So, Okay. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. Um, if I may. Yes.

Thanks. Um, so I was just conferring with Emry on something that you guys might be interested in our sign code. We do have an allowance of a section that sign codes that do not require a permit. Um, it's very particular and there is one that is for directional signage. There's some limitations um that you can't have more than four signs per property and one per entryway um from a public rideway. It can't exceed four square feet. So, this is a very small sign um and shall not exceed 42 in in height, but a directional sign on the back of this property would be a possibility.

Can you clarify directional sign? So, like an arrow that's 45 in high or 40. Can you repeat that? Sorry. Um it's four square feet, so it can't exceed four square feet. So, it's meant to be a small sign, two feet by two feet. Um, indicating like directional items. So, it's kind of a ancillary sign. It's not obviously as large as what the applicant has here, um, but is additional options. We have additional additional options that we allow that aren't, you know, such a large visual representation of a sign that there are.

So, I just wanted to point that out. It's much much smaller than what you're seeing here. So it would be a large reduction for scale and you can this is 10 square feet the one west right yeah that's that's 10 10 square feet how much four would be four would be more comparable uh to the door the one on the kick plate the one on the ground so that is two and a half square at all. Little lack as far as scale.

And the only the only reason you see some of these signs there is because the signs were there before. So, instead of leaving an empty spot or a hole, I just put the signs back right where they supposed to be because I figured, oops, better put the signs where it was instead of leaving an empty spot and get a violation for, you know, trying to look like it's damaged or, you know. Okay, hold on. Um, Commissioner Cowan, do you have a question for the Yeah, question. The Do you know the sentiments of the other tenants in the building? Have they expressed concern with these signs or

Nobody did and I did spoke because one of the bigger bis biggest businesses in that building as mine which is a restaurant downstairs and the store the clothing store right above me. So they they said to me that when they leased that place they asked for the signs and the only reason they were denied because they were told here in the city that my signs or the signs of the restaurants are grandfathered in and no one else can put any other signs in there.

So that's exact statement was sent to me when I purchased the restaurant that they're grandfathered in. That's why I didn't need it any uh permits or I didn't have to ask for any permission besides the foyer. That was the only thing I was told. Uh other businesses in there, I think they're more by appointment because it's a massage parlor there. I don't know. But they're constantly changing. So I don't think they're just Emory, did you have something to add?

Yeah. So I was I was just going to add so like that's an example of again when you have a multi-tenant building, you are limited to one. So the clothing store, if they had asked the city, hey, can we have another sign, a wall sign, the answer would have been, well, you have your one out on the frontage. So if you want another one, that'd be a variance. So again, that just illustrates that when you have multi-tenant building, you get one wall sign, but they could presumably put up a a 2 by two, correct? if they wanted with again the limitations with a directional like a directional 2 by two sign if they wanted to.

And that's again why with a multi-tenant building we have owners do a master sign permit where they allocate the amount of permitted signage and then you'd also come down to two and you have like a directional sign. If that building already had four directional signs for four other businesses and you were the fifth business, you'd either have to talk to the other owners, you have to figure something out. So again, it's when you have multi-tenant building, you have a lot of competing uses. Um, in the directional signs, I just have a quick question. I have a quick update. Oh, it wouldn't be my last planning and zoning commission meeting if I didn't get something wrong. I Oh,

and I will be the first one to admit it. So, with directional signage, when you actually go to the definition in our code, which is a very long section, um this actually does not apply because directional signage relates to um an on-site sign that directs the necessary movement of pedestrians or vehicular traffic. Good so far, except without reference to the name of the business, products sold, or services offered. This definition includes signs locating public facilities such as restrooms and emergency facilities. So, unfortunately, this does not apply to our current situation. My apologies. But could it if it had the same colors as to the other signs?

It just wouldn't be able to mention the business name, which I think is what is desired. I know. I know that Billy question, but like, you know, more business entrances this way. Um, but it specifically does state that it shall not mention the business name or the product sold. So, you can't say spaghetti and meatballs this way. Um, either. So, sorry to get your hopes on that one. I thought I'd double check and I was wrong. That was great. Thank you. Okay, that's art. Yes,

there could be some art updated. Okay. Uh, Commissioner Lear, thank you. I think um because the question of aesthetics came up with the wall. I know we don't have the evidence of the photograph, but I'm thinking about the common experience of people coming into town and parking in that parking lot and maybe they don't know about any of the businesses on the other side, but that parking lot up is adjacent to the alley of another building with restaurants. And I'm curious if we have knowledge of whether there's signage on that building about those restaurants. There isn't. No signage. It's a brick wall like this. Okay.

Correct. Okay. Um I think I just encourage also the comment of some kind of designation of restaurant row on the wall. Not referring specifically to a business, but that's not for this group to decide. But it seems like if that's an issue of finding restaurants then there that wall could be used more fully in a I agree in a non-specific way. Thank you Commissioner Lear. Commissioner Hton turn you on.

Was was there this is I guess for staff. Was there a sign code in 2003? There was a sign code in effect and would this sign have required a permit in 2003? Um probably I will tell you that 2003 um the city was definitely just starting to modernize. I was first couple of years that I I was here in my first stint with the city. Um so hard to say kind of the the level of resources or looking at things or even catching things and the planning staff was probably half as big at the time. So, and and I didn't go back to 2003 to see what sign code would have been and if it would have been allowed. Um, the longest I went back was I found a letter in 2009 that was stating that that sign was not in conformance. And again, we've had code changes over time. So, what was maybe out of conformance in 2009? Is it, you know, how does that line up? today. This is where code is and that's why the business owner is here.

I guess my question is it was potentially legally existing nonwaring.

Let's see if this was addressed since 2009, I wouldn't be here because I would have been already aware that these signs were not allowed if everybody done their job when it came to the signs from the get-go. Because if you guys even checked it from the previous owner that owned it for two and a half years, they didn't had permit to have their their signs, but they told me they just redone the signs. And I am okay because their grandfather in to put the new signs in exact same sizes, exact same spots. And I did exactly as I was told to obey by the rules and regulations as I taught. So a point um we do sometimes experience you know the the the actual grandfathered in and if an applicant wants to prove that it's their responsibility to go back and have the records. Um the city obviously does not control what landlords or previous restaurants tell their new tenants. We do deal with quite a bit of misinformation and we have been dealing with this particular sign since 2009 and have a fairly extensive file on it. So it it is documented. That is not the fault of you. I perfectly understand that. Um but it's also not something that we can control what is said to new businesses and it's something that we deal with every day. Okay. Any other comments or discussion from the council? Thank you again. Okay.

Thank you so much. Okay. So, I'll bring it back for another round or a motion. Commissioner Cyperly. I move to deny variance items one and two of planning file 1525 signed variance for Euro Italian Underground. So, yes, because we have to do them together. Is that correct, Emory? It's two separate action items. Yeah. Can Okay. Action item number one. One. Yeah.

I move to deny uh action item number one of planning file 15-25 with the findings and conditions on staff report page 10 and 11 or the number of signs. I have a motion from Commissioner Cyperly. I second that motion and a second from Commissioner Gin. And with no more discussion, we'll call for the vote. The yes is to the nine. Right. Yes. We're going with your motion.

Motion passes by a vote of 5 to two. Okay. And then for action item number one, variance request. I'm going to ask for a motion. Commissioner Sipperly. So for action item number two, location of signage for uh planning file 15-25 Euro Italian underground, I recommend denial of the um variance request based on the findings and conditions on staff report page 10 and 11. So I have a motion from Commissioner Sipperly and I move a second. Commissioner Gin,

I'll second. I have a motion from Commissioner Cyperly and a second from Commissioner Gin and we'll call for the vote.

Motion passes by a vote of 5 to two. Okay. All right. Thank you. Moving on to planning item 042 2025 special use permit for Tesla chargers. Good evening. Just get give me a couple minutes to get set up here. You're doing a lot.

Do we need to intermissions? the city should take more responsibility. Okay, whenever you're ready, Watkins.

Okay, good evening. How's everyone doing? Excellent. This item is to talk about a special use permit for a Tesla charging station. You'll notice um one little detail about this is that the uh numbering scheme that we use for our planning items has changed a little bit. That reflects the new permitting software that we've been implementing these last Oh jeez. That that's that software is awesome.

Yeah. And I put the important stuff first, my presentation. Um, so this location for the Tesla charging station, uh, is at 138 and 124 West 6th Street, um, which is kind of an out of the way location that's behind the Lita Inn and the, um, it's the Tequila's restaurant. And this is a a special use permit. So that means that it's a kind of land use in which um there can be kind of varying land use uh impacts to the neighboring properties or to the community or kinds of uses that have really varying impacts. And so special use permits are the decision of you planning and zoning commission and it's primarily to make sure that there are no significant impacts that haven't been mitigated. And so your focus tonight is going to be on the six criteria of approval for special use permits that I'm going to get to here in a minute. So the project summary of what this is about is pretty simple. Uh 17 electric charging stations um by Tesla. Um 12 superchargers and five level two chargers. And there's some associated landscaping with that. Um technically what the the use that we're considering here is is parking as a principal use. So that's what requires the special use permit. um show you some kind of graphics about where we are and what it'll look like. Um so if you can see this, this is the aerial zoomed out a little bit. You've got I7 to the west, the restaurant and the hotel to the east. Right now it's a mostly vacant lot. It's um kind of gravel uh mostly impervious I would say and pretty underutilized. This might be a little bit hard to read and if you can see my mouse. Yes. Um, where I'm trying to trace now is a property line. So, I mentioned that it's mostly on a vacant lot. There are some of the site elements, mostly things like curbs, um,

and some non-charging parking spaces that are on the Lita Hotel parcel. Um, but it is mostly on the vacant parcel that's behind the hotel. Here are a couple pictures what it looks like like right now. Not too much to see. And now I'll get into the the six criteria of approval. Um to approve this permit, you all need to find that this application meets all six of these criteria. And the staff recommendation is that it does. We think that it the use is compatible with the surrounding area. The impacts of the use on surrounding areas have been adequately minimized. Um I'll say with conditions of approval as recommended. Um use we think is consistent with the general purpose and intent of this code. use will comply with all applicable standards of this code of which I'll go into a little bit of specifics in the next slide. Um the use is in conformance with comprehensive plan and other city plans and policies and that the use minimizes adverse impacts to the health, safety and welfare of the inhabitants of the surrounding areas and city. Um so it's landscaping really is what we're looking at in that condition number four. Um complying with all applicable standards of the code. Uh our code does require some somewhat stringent um landscaping um kind of improvements and with the conditions of approval as we've recommended um it can meet this. They're exceeding a little bit the number of required trees. Um and also I meant to mention there uh there could be some storm water requirements. We cover that in conditions of approval. Um those are kind of some nitty-gritty details that we would work out in the building permit phase if this is approved by y'all and they move forward. Um they would also be giving us a lighting plan to make sure that they um are not exceeding our maximum um illuminance levels. Terms of the comprehensive plan um it doesn't speak too much to this kind of

use um but there is a a policy which is to plan and incentivize EV stands for electric vehicle and ebike growth and operations. So we think that that does meet this. It also meets the intent of the future land use map. Um a few referral comments. Uh storm water from the engineering department. They want to make sure that um since there will be some more um imperous um surfaces um that the storm water that we're not causing any problems to anyone uh any surrounding properties or to I7. Uh the public works department is responsible for recommending that access easement be in place through the hotel property. Um which I should mention is the same owner. So the parcel in which this um the charging stations would be located upon um is also owned by the same this has the same owner as the Lita hotel. Uh and then finally the fire department requested that some um part of this parcel is being used for storage of stuff like oil and adhesive and other things on the site. So, we want to make sure those are properly disposed of. Um, I haven't received any comments from the public, though. And so, uh, as I mentioned, staff recommends approving this with the conditions in the staff report. And I have them here for you. Well, these are the findings. Um, they're also in the staff report. And then here are the conditions of approval. These are just what are in your staff report. So, um, with that, that's all I have for you. So, I'll take any questions that you have. And then uh we also have a representative from the applicant team here to present to you all too.

Thank you, Watkins. Okay. With uh does anyone have any questions for Watkins? Seeing there's none, let's have the applicant of come on up. State your name and who you are. Why your presentation got a share?

All right. Thanks.

Uh, good evening. My name is Drew Sartell with Tesla and I'm here to represent the project. Um, thank you for considering the special use permit for our charging station project. We've enjoyed working with staff. Um I'll I'll just share before going through a few slides. This will um be some of the information same information that Watkins just shared, but um just uh want to share that we've met with staff twice now kind of leading up to this meeting and have worked to refine our proposal um to meet and comply with feedback and requirements that Watkins and staff shared with us. And um so this is this is our second if not third iteration of the layout and kind of considering how to best utilize this little bit of an odd-shaped uh vacant parcel. Um I will share that uh we we Tesla are building out charging stations nationwide. Um I I represent our design team locally here in Colorado. Um I live on the front range and when you enter communities like yours, sometimes land can be hard to find, right? sometimes uh clear area that is underutilized parking uh especially in these mountain areas can be challenging. So we were happy um to learn in working with the owner here at the hotel which um we we worked with him previously on the front range down near DIA. So we have a a second property with him, a charging station on a second hotel property. But to learn of this property that was underutilized and available uh for a use like this was good news for us and exciting for us to consider. Um so with that yeah you you know where the property is. Um uh I will share that there is um Watkins it was part of your uh report but there is one existing use on the site. It's a fiber optic structure building some some kind of varied infrastructure um that is in place with a chain link fence. So, we're uh designing around that property, kind of considering access for those

operations in tandem with with what we're trying to uh do here. Um, so going to the next uh the next slide, this this is just a map of our current charging stations along the I70 corridor. So, we continue to fill in the gaps and add to this um this network and we are, you know, here today proposing this project as we see um a more near-term need for additional charging stations. We do have one other site in town. You you probably are aware of an existing supercharger station in town. Um it's six six chargers at that location and it does get heavily utilized. Um it sees about a thousand charge sessions per month. Um anywhere from 50 plus charge sessions a day. Um that that obviously is a a useful beneficial charging station for us. We have had some challenges in the past with um it's a busy parking lot. So when it's uh that parking lot is fully utilized, sometimes we see none parked in those stalls and therefore um you know to a challenge challenging basically that next EV who pulls in who needs a charge, right? Who's either in town or working their way up and down the 70 corridor. So we're looking to add capacity basically uh to that charging station. Um, with this site, um, as Watkins stated, it'll be 12 level three DC fast chargers as well as five level two uh, chargers as well. And that really is to supplement and benefit the use case at this property. So, being a hotel, um, you're going to have overnight guests uh, traveling in EVs who need a charge session overnight, right? So, as they're staying at the hotel, they'll use the level twos. Uh, hopefully that's that's kind of the point of offering that. anyone who needs a fast charge and is not a a guest at the hotel, you know, that's the benefit

of of the fast chargers. So, looking to kind of mix and match the use there um for the use case that it's provided for. Um let's see, next slide. Um yeah, again, just uh existing conditions basically with this vacant lot. Um there's there's a number of different, you know, light poles on site that illuminate that area. Um, I'm assuming for a safety purpose today, we'll be looking to modify that slightly and work with staff to comply with with lighting standards. Um, it is full of debris. I was I was out there today walking around, but yeah, there's cleanup that needs to happen and um already talking to the property owner about kind of the next steps if if and when this moves forward, the requirements there. Um, and as I I stated to that fiber optic building on site that we're looking to work around and uh kind of work in tandem um and with the owner who obviously signed a long-term lease to allow them on site. So, we're looking to obviously make this compatible with with that operation as well. Some pictures um from from our survey efforts um from being on site. Um, again, I'll just kind of walk through this, but the the red here are the 12 level three DC fast chargers. Um, I will note this this stall right here, if you can see my mouse. Um, we are trying more and more to implement trailer friendly stalls. So, you're seeing more and more EVs tow RVs, uh, trailers, maybe bike racks, things like that. uh that really is beneficial on our charging station sites to have a trailer friendly stall where it's more compatible and easier for those users uh to make use of a stall like that. So that that's the intent here for that stall. Uh the blue are the the five level two charging stations. Um I will note uh with our projects there is an ADA compliance. So we'll need one ADA stall for a level three, one ADA for level two. So, you'll

see that with with this striping here and a connected sidewalk uh to basically bring pedestrians back onto the hotel property. Currently, um this this side of the property, if you're familiar with it, there are large um cast in place basically walls, right, that kind of surround a portion of this property. So, we're thinking about pedestrian flow, too. if they're plugged in charging there. Uh more often than not, they're getting out of their vehicles. They're trying to go find food. They're trying to walk to use a restroom, perhaps find a drink. So, um this connectivity and this visibility or connectivity back to the hotel property, if not around to the the Mexican restaurant is going to be helpful and useful. Um lighting compliance in yellow. Uh utility equipment sort of in orange over here in the corner. So, we're we're already working with staff and on a utility design and utility cost to basically bring in that new service. It's pretty straightforward, which is great. Um, ADA sidewalk connectivity, like I said, and landscape compliance, as Watkins said. So, working with staff to um basically meet meet the landscape requirements as part of this development for this parking lot. And then grading and drainage improvements. So, we'll we'll be overlock grading this, paving it, and then in this um upper left northwest corner, uh be basically improving that with some form of storm water retention or detention pond, mostly most likely retention just to retain that um that difference in runoff from pvious to impervious uh from historic conditions. Um, and then as mentioned as well, we're already talking with the owner of the hotel property about securing an access easement in the case where this parcel in and of itself is sold in the future. We want to maintain those rights across that hotel property um for access to our to our project. Um, I just wanted to show example

photos. you you have a charger in town, so you probably know what it looks like. But just to kind of walk through um other sites um in and around Colorado that we're working on, but here's the existing Glenwood site. A couple pictures here. Um this picture down here is a more recent site that we opened about maybe six months ago now in Highlands Ranch. Um Edwards, Colorado, uh just down just up the highway here, but we're actually expanding that site right now. It's under construction, but that that's a historically an eight stall site, expanding it by four stalls. So, a little extra capacity there. Uh Gypsum, we have a site. I will flag that the charge post, you'll see kind of the old version in the Edwards photo and the newer version. This is our version four uh charge post. This is what we'd be installing here uh at this site. Um just to flag that difference. And then um yeah, we're obviously having sites in the mountains. Uh we have a full service and operations team that um goes from sight to site that checks on compliance with snow removal, uh safety, damaged equipment, kind of all those things. And we pride ourselves for maintaining these sites well uh with um very good uptime for our customers. So here's here's a a site in Rifle. um another site of ours in Frisco and a hotel there and um and then down in the lower left here, a site in Aurora that we recently opened as well. Um so yeah, that concludes just a couple slides that I had a little bit more information for context and happy to answer any questions that you might have.

Thank you, Commissioner Hton. I was hoping you could tell us a little bit more about the supercharger cabinet. Is there a mechanical equipment in that? Is that a condenser or chiller or something? There seems to be a fan or something on top. Um, sure. What What is that and what what is the guts of it, I guess? Like what is what is in it?

Yeah. So, they're they're supercharger cabinets. They're roughly the size of a refrigerator. Um, kind of big white boxes. um they are what's called a rectifier. So they're they're turning AC electricity into DC, which is what the cars need. So opposite of an inverter, right? Um so it's a rectifier. It's got lots of different electrical components inside, but it does have a fan on top for cooling. Um and yeah, what else can I say about that? They they have front clearance access. So a door um that needs to maintain front clearance. And um yeah, that's basically where we're bringing in uh the the cables, the wiring from uh the switch gear. So transformer to switch gear, switch gear into those rectifiers, and then rectifiers out with DC conductors out to the charge posts.

Okay. And I guess my second question be more towards staff, but does that meet our definition of utility or mechanical equipment that would have to be screened? Yeah, it is mechanical equipment. um no screening required for it. Um but that's um I think I mentioned in the staff report that is that kind of allows it to be within the setback whereas a building wouldn't allow to be that close to a setback but for that kind of brown melted mechanical equipment it can be. So sorry that it wouldn't need screening at building permit or it would not. Okay. Okay. Thank you,

Commissioner Cyperly. Thank you for the information. Um, I had a couple of questions and maybe I have limited knowledge about electric cars, but will this these chargers only charge Teslas or other electric vehicles as well? Um, all yeah, other electric vehicles as well. So, we are consistently opening our network basically. So, um, majority of other car manufacturers at this point have adopted the same standard that the Knack standard if if you're familiar, but the North American charging standard, um, those vehicles are Rivians, GM, Ford, Nissan at this point, um, a lot of these other car companies because they're not native Knacks plugs in their cars, um, they have adapters. Okay.

So, um we're starting to see more and more of our charging stations um supporting Rivians and Ford Lightnings and it's exciting to see. And so, yeah, this will be open to to all EVs. So, they're free to use and this is open to the public, the general public. They're not free to use. Okay. You have to pay to use them. Okay. I wondered how that worked. You need an account and uh yeah, there's no payment at the post. It's all done um basically handsfree. Uh, so when you when you plug it into the vehicle, it it basically talks to the vehicle and is all taken care of through through the car. Okay. Um, at least for Teslas, um, I can't speak to to other EVs, but um, but yeah, it's it's it's not free charging. It's not free. Okay. But it is open to the general public,

but it is open to the general public. So, which brings me to I I noticed on the site plan you have a a designated pedestrian path to get to the hotel, but then how do the pedestrians who have walked in there, who have driven in there and plugged in their car, how do they get back to town or where they're going? Is there a pedestrian sidewalk along the access road? Is does it connect to other bus stops and sidewalks?

Do you want to take that? Sure. Yeah. Um, so there's when you study the site plan, and I understand that it's really hard to see here, but there are some internal sidewalks on the site, so they can get to the um the parking area and the um the access aisle on the hotel. Um there are not sidewalks there, so they would be walking through the access aisle in the hotel. Um and from there, they can connect to the the um multi-use trail on six and to the rest of the city. Will um people who need to charge their vehicle have to proceed through the parking lot of the hotel in order to get to this um charging lot?

They would. Yeah. Or they could go the other way which is also through a parking access is what you call it. Um to tequilas is the one way that we were talking about but they could also go the other way which is that would be the northeast I think kind of going through there. Um, next to those buildings, will there be signage to direct people to this charging station or is that something that's also handled by these smart cars? The smart cars tell you tell you where to go. We haven't talked about that yet. Um, and can we're happy to accommodate that through our other processes, but that's not part of this application. Okay. You want to

Yeah. Yeah. Typ typically we're not providing wayfinding signs. Um, I will I will state that there is a requirement through state funding programs like Nevi where they do require um wayfinding signs. So, they're not necessarily assuming these are all Teslas with the built-in navigation system that basically take you right there. But with this application, we are not proposing any, you know, street frontage wayfinding sign signage.

So, how do people find out where to charge their car? uh many ways the the car itself through the user interface will take you there. Um plug share is an app where you can look up charging stations and um Google now you can search for any EV charger basically and and find find your way to those. Um so there's many different avenues but a lot of times now and in most most of these vehicles there are uh built-in iPads if you will into the cars that will that will direct it's really reduce the need for signage on the streets. Exactly. Okay, thank you. Plug in.

You plug in your trip and then along the trip it tells you where to stop and plug in. It's great. It's very user friend. Okay, are there more questions? All right. Well, thank you so much. You're welcome. Thank you.

Okay. All right. I'll bring it back here for um council discussion. Anybody have anything to say? Okay. Oh, and or uh public comment? No public comment. Or anyone online? Seeing there's none, I'll close the public portion. And um with no discussions, I'll ask for a motion. Somebody make a motion. Can I make a motion?

All right, I'll do it.

I take one night off. All right. I move to approve planning item 0422025. Uh the application for um parking as a primary use for a Tesla and electric vehicle charging station off Highway 6 with the findings and conditions on page five and six of the staff report. Thank you, Commissioner Sipperly. I have a motion and like a second. Commissioner Leer,

I'll second the motion. Okay, I have a motion and a second. And if there's no more discussion, let's call the vote. Uh motion passes unanimously. Uh MPC1 is commissioner Lear and MPC2 is commission corporate.

Okay. Well, thank you so much. I for one am a big fan. Okay, moving on. Um, those were all of the action items that we needed to take care of this evening. And now for commissioner comments. Commissioner comments. Anybody? Lear Owen Sele. No down there. Okay. Thank goodness. I just wanted to say goodbye to Hannah and congratulations on getting your new position and we appreciate all of the help and guidance you've given us over the years um both here and on the other commissions and through all of community development. So, thank you for putting in your time.

I was going to make a motion to not allow her to leave and I would really like a second because I do have the power. She doesn't work here anymore. We can all hang out without public noticing it.

A Um, oh, thank you, Commissioner Sipperly. Anyone else? Well, I echo that. I'm going to miss you a lot. I think it's been great. You've really led us in a, you know, really positive way and it's been amazing. So, we're uh the city is going to be missing a big hole. So, whoever takes her fills her hole, let me know. Okay. direct your comments. With that said, I'm

uh well, thank you for that. I've appreciated working with all of you as well um for short amounts of time and long amounts of time and you guys do amazing work and this is where us as planners and me as director really um get to have probably the most fun. Is that Yeah, I can say that. the most fun and you know uh really seen you guys develop and also previous P&Z commissioners develop over the last eight and a half years some moving on to council. So if you have questions about that um ask someone else because I won't be here. Um updates from community development. Obviously we have a position that is open and out there to the community for community development director. Unfortunately, we also are saying goodbye to our community um development technician, Haley Paris, who's been with us um for about nine months, and she's been amazing. So, we also have that position posted as well. Feel free to share those around with people that you think would be interested in joining a fairly amazing team here at City of Glenn Springs in the in the planning and building world. Um, we do have applications for next month. I believe it's going to be quite full. I'm looking at Watkins and I'm looking at the people that are going to still be here to inform me. I believe we might have a code change coming back to you guys for um sidewalks in relation to accessory dwelling units that was push put back to staff from city council. And what else am I missing?

Another special use permit. for a dispensary. Haven't had one of those in a while. Uh Emory, did you have anything on for August? Okay. And Jim and Jim also part of the awesome team mall. We have something coming forward from the West Glennwood Springs Mall reboning. Um so full agenda. Um thank you Amy for stepping in tonight on your first chair assignment. You did great. And that is all I have for you guys. So I'll see you on the other side on a bus.

Thanks so much. All right, meeting ajourned. That was fun.