Appointments Committee - Regular Meeting

Being here on time, I appreciate it. Okay. I'd like to call to order the Committee Vitality Safety Committee meeting of May 28, 2026. Is it recording?

Yes. Okay, great.

I didn't hear it. Sorry. Clerk, will you please call the roll? Council Member Palmer? Here. Vice Chair Scott?

Here.

Council Member Walker? Absolute. Sure. Here. So do we have anyone here for public comment? OK, great. Then we're going to skip public comment. And we're going to move right into our presentation. And I've brought Nancy from Empowering Voices today. She's going to talk about outcomes with system-based advocates. And I just have a couple of things I wanted to say before you got started. So we're talking about improving outcomes in the justice system for victims of domestic violence. And I know our judicial system is complicated because it spans a lot of different levels of government. And so I've invited Nancy here to talk about and present on the topic of systems-based advocates that I call community, like a court-appointed advocate is the other thing that I've been calling it. And she'll walk us all through the system and how it works and the impact this resource can have on our city and our community. So feel free to get started whenever you want. Okay. Does that work? Okay.

Okay.

It should work. Okay, good. Good afternoon. Thanks for having me. As Council Member Ringo mentioned, my name is Nancy Shattuck. My day job, I actually work with the Administrative Office of the Court, and I'm a system... I do work with the different court levels there, but I also do victim advocacy and have for about 25 years. I always have to remember how old my son is, and that's how I can remember how long I've been an advocate. So, yeah, so today, as was mentioned, I'm going to walk you through systems-based advocates and their work in the criminal legal system, why they matter, and what the data shows about their impact on outcomes for victims and communities. So why should you care? Why does this matter? So this work exists because domestic violence cases are uniquely complex and high risk. Victims are often navigating fear, trauma, financial dependence, and safety concerns all at the same time. And because of that, it's very common for victims to disengage from the criminal legal process. That might look like not replying to phone calls, not appearing in court when we ask them to, or even asking for charges to be dismissed. And the reality is our system is heavily, it needs victim participation. Like in order to prove that a domestic violence crime occurred, people in Washington have the right to confront their accusers. And so we need victims to participate in the criminal cases. And so with that, when the victims disengage, oftentimes cases fall apart. And with that, cases are dismissed and there's no real worthwhile intervention. And that's a real critical gap. And that gap is where advocates come in. So systems-based advocacy is a little bit different than community-based advocates. And so community-based advocates are the ones that we see at like the Family Justice Center or the YWCA or any of our local agencies. But a systems-based advocate is embedded within our criminal system. So they're usually either within the prosecutor's office or they're with the police department. And we work alongside the courts and kind of have a different role than what a community-based advocate has. First thing is we have immediate direct access to victims after someone has been arrested, so we have that really good opportunity for safety planning and to talk to somebody immediately after an incident has happened. We can talk about immediate and long-term concerns, and then we can talk about strategies to empower them to make informed choices about their own well-being and identify just options that they have. Um, second education about the court system. I don't know if you've ever been involved in the court system, but it is not easy to navigate. And then when you add trauma on top of that, it makes it even more difficult. And so part of what the systems-based advocate does is educate folks about what can happen, what can't happen, what their role is, um, what they can expect where, you know, just kind of where they fit in. Uh, third communication. So bridging that gap between the victims and the system. making sure that they're up to date on status of the cases, when court dates are happening, like if plea negotiations are happening between the prosecution and defense, like victims' voices should be heard in that process. So that's part of what a systems-based advocate does. And then the last thing is connecting them to resources. So the advocate at like the YWCA or if they need help with housing or finances or childcare, you know, just the gamut. We're just problem solvers and trying to help people get connected with what they need. Um, so like I said, we're different, um, but we work together. Like it's really important to have both available in the community. Like we shouldn't have one and not that other. And so, uh, you know, I've worked with, uh, local members like Nadia at the family justice center, who's our director now, which is super exciting or Abby McLean, who's at the YWCA. Um, and we're constantly working together on cases, uh, to ensure that victims are getting the resources that they need. So just to have a clear understanding about kind of these two models of advocacy. So again, the system-based are the court-embedded, like we're part of the prosecutor's office or the police department or within the court system. And then the community-based advocates are those external partners that are usually in nonprofit organizations. And one of the big differences is that a systems-based advocate is not confidential. So one of the things, like when I'm working with victims, I ensure that they understand, like when you tell me, I'm going to tell the prosecutor. Like they need to understand like your position and what's going on. Whereas like a community-based advocate, somebody at the YWCA or Family Justice Center, they do have that confidentiality and they don't have to share information to prosecution. And both are important because there's sometimes that potentially a victim doesn't want the prosecutor to know something. And so always don't tell me, then like make sure you're working with who's appropriate. But again, we compliment one another, um, And having that direct access and integration in the system is what makes us most effective to navigate and really impact criminal cases that are going through, in this case, your Tacoma Municipal Court. I have this fun little diagram. So this is just a DV case kind of from start to finish. So it usually starts with a 911 call or police getting called in in some way. So once the police have responded, Um, they then determine, you know, make sure everybody's safe and then they're going to investigate and they're going to figure out, is there a probable cause? Did a crime occur? Is the assailant on scene? Like should they be arrested? All of that. Um, and it can feel really fast. People don't have to thoroughly understand that, like, they don't press charges. It's ultimately up to the prosecutor. So that's part of what the systems-based advocate does is usually, like, next day. So say, like, somebody got arrested last night. I get the police report the next day, and then I'm calling that victim. I'm like, hi, my name is Nancy, you know, and explaining to them, like, so it looks like so-and-so was arrested last night, and there's some potential criminal charges pending. Like, how are you doing? Do you have any questions? Like, what do you need? Um, and then from there, it goes to the prosecutor's office and the prosecutors are the ones who then actually decide if they're going to open a criminal case and if they're going to file it in the court. And so with that, if they do decide to press charges, they can ask for conditions of release. Um, so a lot of times it's important to know like, were there alcohol or drugs involved? Was there a firearm involved? Um, you know, was, is there a prior history that maybe the police haven't been called to the past, but it's important for us to know about that. You know, just all that thing that might not necessarily be within the police report. It's important that the prosecutor have that information, and that's something that a systems-based advocate does in getting that information for them. Then they go in front of the judge. The judge is ultimately the ones who make the decisions around, you know, what those conditions actually should be. And I'll take a step back. If charges aren't filed, because sometimes people get arrested and a prosecutor doesn't press charges, the very common, a victim should still be contacted because you know, when officers go out on scene, they give them a card. There's like a little blue card that they get that tells them their rights. Um, I don't know many victims who actually do that. And, you know, again, traumatized kids are crying, figuring out like what I'm going to do the next day. So then how would somebody call and say, Hey, there's not going to be criminal charges. They're likely going to get out of jail this afternoon. Do you have any safety concerns? Like, do you, are you interested in getting a protection order? Do you feel like you're going to be okay? You know, what, what do you need? Like, how can I help? And so that's kind of just that like warm voice on the other side of the phone, helping them know that they have options because that's really what it comes down to. Um, so once it's actually in the court system, criminal cases are long. and take forever to resolve. And so first you have your arraignment, which is your first court hearing. And then it goes to a pretrial status. Like when somebody has pled not guilty, pretrial hearings can be anywhere from one to two to nine to 12. And it's usually about a month between each pretrial hearing. And, um, that's where we lose victims. You know, they lose interest. They, they move on. They have other things to worry about than this criminal case. And that's the other part where assistance-based advocate comes in is keeping them involved in the case, calling and checking in before hearings and seeing how they're doing. Like, have there been any violations of the new contact order? Did you report it? What's the case number? You know, following up on that and making sure that jurisdictions are connected is super important. And so that's something that assistance-based advocate does. And then the last thing is, So if they're continuously not guilty, it could go to trial, right? So we want to keep victims on board. But also, victims have the right to make a victim impact statement, which is, I mean, it's exactly what it sounds like. It's where they're explaining, like, how did this crime impact their life? And I don't currently know how that's happening in Tacoma and how victims are being informed that they have that right, because there's an RCW that says we're supposed to do that. So I'm really curious to know how that's currently happening. Um, but so this is, um, thank you chat GPT for helping me make this flow chart. Um, but yeah, so this is where I think it's important to realize that like advocacy isn't like an extra service. Like it's something that's ingrained throughout this whole thing. And it's just as important as law enforcement, as a prosecutor, as the judge, as probation, like it's really in the jurisdictions where I work, like it's just It's not even, I'm not an afterthought, like I'm part of the team. So then going back to the idea of like, what is the purpose of the systems-based advocates? I mean, the big picture is that we improve outcomes. We increase victim safety by enhancing security and wellbeing of victims involved in legal proceedings. We improve engagement, meaning victims are more likely to stay involved in cases. against their abusers, reduce barriers, and promote equitable access, especially for historically underserved communities. And that means we minimize obstacles and difficulties individuals face. And we support informed decision-making, and we help individuals to make well-informed choices throughout the process. I'm never going to pressure a victim to go forward with a case. I really feel like my role is to educate them, help them understand their role, and make sure that their voice is heard. And if they don't want to participate, then my job is to tell the prosecutor that and help them like, let's be creative. Let's figure out how to have there be accountability for the defendant, but also keep this victim safe and not continue to traumatize them. Um, and the last part is that, that legal foundation. So, um, we have, so I did write down the RCW at 7.69.030 is the victim notification RCW, where it specifically says that victims must be offered the opportunity to make a victim impact statement and sentencing. And I think like it's a technical requirement. So for example, I know there's other jurisdictions that they'll send a letter to people and say, you have a right to make a victim impact statement. But like, I've had like, I get letters, right? And it's just not the same. It's not as meaningful. Victims don't necessarily understand how to do it, what to say, like, what do I even ask for? So that's part of what a systems-based advocate does. So then I, in 2025, got my master's from Evergreen Tacoma. And my capstone, I studied systems-based advocacy in different jurisdictions. And I specifically looked at Milton and here in Pierce County because I am the advocate for Milton. And if I just didn't have an advocate. So it was a very good experience. comparison because they sit next to each other. They're a little bit different in some of their demographics, but they're pretty similar, really. And they see a lot of the same folks, you know, like as Tacoma sees with University Place or with Lakewood, like we see folks probably, you know, they don't, people don't just stay in their jurisdictions, they all go around. And so when we look at the data, there's a few things. So Milton, again, has a victim advocate. We see a lower dismissal rate, which was at 20% as compared to 26.6% for Fife. Also, in the cases that are resolved without going to trial, we see more varied intervention methods. So we'll see defendants being ordered to do domestic violence batterers treatment. We'll see substance use disorder treatment if that's needed. There's just better interventions, really, because there's just more information available to the prosecutor for them being able to decide, like, well, what should I be asking this defendant to do? Um, in Fife, they do have more convictions. Um, but what the, what you'll see is it's convicted close. So it's just a guilty finding on their record, which is great. Cause then, you know, historically we could see that somebody has a history of this, but it's not necessarily like, is there any change of behavior because of that? So with this research, it just shows that systems-based advocates help bridge credible gaps. And without advocates, I think we see predictable patterns. We see lower victim engagement. We see a higher dismissal rate. We see more retraumatization and missed opportunities for safety planning and less effective intervention outcomes overall. Part of my master's capstone, I did a victim satisfaction survey. So we contacted victims. I had a couple of volunteers that helped me and we called victims and talked to them about like, how did it feel to go through the criminal justice process? And the folks in Fife, again, no advocate in Fife, didn't even know like what was, didn't either didn't know that charges had been filed, didn't know what the outcome was, like had no idea. And what was interesting was then, because I wasn't interviewing people, but then I would follow up with that person and be like, are you interested? Like, even though I'm not the advocate, I still feel like morally obligated to tell you what happened. So I would call those folks and let them know, like, well, this is what happened. And then in Milton, overall, you know, people were like, yeah, I knew what happened. Sometimes I didn't like what happened, right, because they didn't always like what the prosecutor decided to do, but they knew what was happening. They felt like they had a voice in it. And they were just part of the process. And through my work, again, I'm the advocate with a few different jurisdictions here in Pierce County, McKean County, and Mason County. I get cases that have cases in common here with Tacoma. And so I'm the advocate in University Place. And again, like Milton and Procresta and Ruston. And they're often confused. They don't know what's happening. I can see it because we have statewide systems. So I'm able to see what's happening so I can let them know. I give them phone numbers of people in the Tacoma office. I'm like, you can reach out, you can ask questions, but it's really hard when we're putting the onus on the victim to be the one to reach out when really it should be somebody from the office who's keeping folks informed. So I see this as a really great opportunity for Tacoma to really engage victims in this process. So we don't just have local data, there's also national data. So there's research from the National Institute of Justice and the Urban Institute. And what they showed was that when victims feel supported through the process, they see better outcomes across the board. Victims often reported feelings of feeling more satisfied with the process because they were informed, they felt heard, they were supported instead of feeling lost in the system. There were stronger prosecution outcomes because the victims were more likely to stay engaged, participate in the process and cooperate when they had someone walking with them. And so really that then leads to better safety outcomes, lower rates of repeat victimization, and it builds trust in the criminal legal system. You know, people felt like the system treated them with dignity and care and that they were more likely to have confidence calling in the future because domestic violence doesn't usually just happen once. something that happens again and again. And if a victim doesn't trust what the system's going to do, they're not going to engage again in the future. And so this all centers around the systems-based advocacy kind of model. And that connection and support really does matter. And when victims feel informed and supported, they're much more likely to stay engaged. So I have some local Examples, so we can see in Pierce County, the jurisdictions that have a systems-based advocate, those without a systems-based advocate. And then King County, there's not a jurisdiction in King County that doesn't have an advocate. Every place does. And then I also looked over at Spokane, and the larger jurisdictions have systems-based advocacy, but the smaller folks don't. To help you see kind of where Tacoma falls within these municipalities, the administrative office of the courts produces like yearly caseload reports. You all switched over to the new case management system a couple of years ago. So it's not, I can only get to 2023. So when I pulled the 2023 numbers and you saw 815 non-traffic criminal cases filed. So that includes domestic violence, trespass, theft, like all of that, right? Puyallup also saw 899 non-criminal cases filed, so a little bit more. There's a little bit of a different charging strategy that each city has, but I served as the advocate in Puyallup from 2003 to 2014. They've had a full-time advocate since 2003 when I started there. And when I was there, I would see about 350 cases a year of domestic violence. And I reached out to their prosecutor and she said, I don't have an exact number. She's like, but I think we're around like 400 right now. So about half of that. So I would say you can pretty much assume you're probably similar and probably have about 400 cases a year. But so that means there's 400 folks not being contacted. The next thing I looked at was kind of tossed, right? So in 2023, the advocates up in King County did a salary survey. And so those numbers were between about 87 and 94K. And so I did an adjustment to 2026 and it was between 95 and 105. So that's an in-house, like an employee, right? So then on top of that, you would have you know, benefits, you know, all the things, pension, all the stuff that goes along with that. Another option would be having contract advocates. So like that's something that I do. And depending on which city I'm in, it's usually between 45 and 65 an hour. So then you would have to think about how many hours, you know, that person's going to work and all that.

But so that's another option.

And then there's training and overhead because, you know, we like to keep updated on what's happening in the domestic violence world. So I think the main things that I just wanted to share was that there is evidence that shows having a systems-based advocate does improve outcomes with criminal cases. It does increase engagement of victims in the system. It does promote equitable access to justice. Cases move more efficiently through the criminal legal system and better long-term safety outcomes are supported when there's a systems-based advocate. And ultimately we strengthen the system, not just for the case outcomes, but I'm for the community at large. Like there's just a better, folks are more likely to access resources if they need them when there's assistance made to advocate.

That's what I have to share.

I did not pause for any questions.

We're going to ask you questions. I just want to thank you for joining us. One of the things that really stood out for me that I just wanted to just mention is that Um, many cities see how many cities actually have one and we're like this huge city and we don't have a court appointed advocate, which is, you know, I think it's valuable and you've just shown how valuable.

And it is a discussion point. I will say in the community, like Tacoma doesn't have an advocate and it is a point of, because what happens is if a defendant is charged with a felony, it goes to Pierce County. Right. And then they get an app, you get an advocate. But if it goes through Tacoma Municipal Court, if it's a gross misdemeanor, you don't get an advocate. And so it's hard. Yeah. Yeah.

And I think residents of Tacoma should get that same level of service. And I just wanted the people on this committee to know that I'll be bringing forward a budget request this year asking for a pilot program of like two or three years, because I don't think 18 months is going to be enough to see if it makes a difference. And I've been talking with our city manager about how we might fund this, and I'm just excited about exploring the options for funding, possibly with a grant that I believe the Tacoma Police Department applied for. And as I said, I just think the justice system is very complex, and I really appreciate you coming. I was just hoping, before everyone asks their questions, would you be okay just explaining again? I think it's complicated because what what is a domestic violence case for a municipal court look like compared to domestic violence? When we think about it, it's intimate partner at the, at the like level of superior court. And so could you just talk about the difference? Because I think it's really important. I want to also say, I really noticed how you use the word victim because we're talking about people in the court system. We're not talking about survivors. That is a different thing. So I appreciate you really being really intentional about your language. Thank you.

Yeah. So, through the municipal court, any crime of domestic violence is really any kind of familial relationship or intimate partner. So you will see dating, married, exes, all of that, but we'll also get parent-child, we'll get roommates, like any kind of relationship between people can qualify it as a domestic violence crime. And then really any crime can be qualified as domestic violence. So like usually we'll see assault. So assault in the fourth degree are So non-felony level. So that would be things like slaps, pushes, kicks, you know, things where people aren't necessarily injured. What about with a gun? If somebody broke a gun and threatens you, that would be superior.

That would be superior part usually.

Yeah. But there's injury. Yeah, there's injury, but usually like we don't see broken bones. We don't see like if somebody got a concussion or had to get stitches or We do see strangulation, unfortunately, which whenever I get a strangulation case, I'm like, I don't know if I should have it. But yeah, so we do see that sometimes. And then like malicious mischief is when people do property damage. So any kind of damage like in the apartment or to their vehicle or, you know, any of that kind of stuff to control them. Harassment, so threatening to harm somebody, threatening to harm their families, like interfering with 911 calls. You're not allowed to take somebody's phone if they're trying to call 9-1-1. Definitely a municipal court thing. A municipal court, yeah, that doesn't go felon. Theft, like if you steal somebody's stuff and there's a relationship, like we can charge that. Truck path, you know, you can't go to somebody's property if they don't want you there. And of course, violation of no contact order. The majority of violations of no contact order get charged through municipal court. They don't get charged as a felony. There are only charges of felony if somebody has had two prior convictions, so they've been found guilty, or if they assaulted them while there's a no-contact order in place. But all the other violations of no-contact order are usually found through municipal court.

Thank you. Now I'm going to let my colleagues ask questions if they have any.

I'll jump in. Thank you. Thank you for being here. I just had, you did a great job explaining it, and the question about the differences between this form and spirit form was one of the questions I had. So just on one of the last slides, the cost and resourcing slide, on the part that says for training and overhead, where it's $5,000 to $15,000, is that like, per person, per advocate per year to train them? Is that training for the whole team of people working around?

Yeah, I would say five is for one. Fifteen is if there's a team. So there's national conferences that are really criminal domestic violence type conferences. Last year I went, there was one in New York, so I went and it cost like $4,000 at the end of the day.

Yeah, just trying to understand that. And then the other one, so you were saying that you know, there's potentially like 400 cases that folks are. So with, if we're seeing about that many cases, what would be the appropriate amount of advocates? Like obviously with the pilot, we'll probably look at like one advocate. Like what would be the, for the case? Yeah.

You know, knowing city of Puyallup has similar case numbers. I honestly feel like one, if they're like well-trained and know what they're doing, it's great. I mean, two would be amazing, but I think my caution would be having a position and then hiring somebody who doesn't have prior history or understanding or experience just because it is complex, even for advocates and even like between community-based advocates and systems-based advocates, like it's very, very different. And so, and I, knowing that Tacoma hasn't had an advocate, Part of what an advocate does is educate the prosecutor and the police about the trauma that victims experience because, so I'm just going to be candid. So usually prosecutors that you see like at the municipal level are younger, right? Like you said, past the bar type of thing, right? Like that type of thing. They may not have a ton of experience working with domestic violence. A lot of prosecutors don't like working with domestic violence because victims are messy and they don't want to deal with the emotions and all the things that go along with it. And they also may not understand like, why do they want to dismiss it? Why do they want to, you know, because it's difficult and because, you know, life just hit them. And so I do think that it is important to have someone, not just that can help the victims understand, but also help the prosecutors and the police department. And really like, that's one of the things with the jurisdictions where I work is I go in once or twice a year, Talk to them about what's going well, what's not going well, right? Because, for example, when I first started in Puyallup, they were not good about getting victim phone numbers. And I was like, how am I supposed to call people if I don't have a phone number in the report? So that was something. And I would contact the sergeant and say, I need you to get the phone number. So then the officer would have to go back to the house and they don't want to do that. So then what would happen? They would get the phone number. It was an amazing thing. So that's also a really big important part is just ensuring that all the parts of the system are working the way they're supposed to.

yeah i know i appreciate that i just i i was a community-based advocate yeah back in the day and so um and i just know that like having you know other people around that were doing that advocacy work helped with the case management piece of it and so um you know i i know that some cases don't take as long or they're not as intensive or you know things like that and so i wasn't sure if like just the sheer number kind of would dictate like what we should probably have because if Even if it's like for one really like well-seasoned and knowledgeable person, like sometimes it just seems like she might be better. I appreciate the context. So I just wanted to make sure that like, especially like if we are looking at a pilot, like we're looking at the pilot and looking at like

starting here but we're ultimately working to this or is it you know like we can do this and use those numbers to say this is exactly what you keep doing right so i think it would be super interesting to because i think it would be easy to research and look at for example like if it was something that y'all started in like 2027 right you could look at your numbers from like 2020 to 2026 and look at how many cases were dismissed, how many times, you know, like look at those numbers and then bring in somebody and then look at those numbers and really look, is there a difference? And I mean, yes, you will be a difference.

Yeah, I think anything with the court system, even sometimes figuring out how to pay a parking ticket can be difficult. Sometimes when you're like, yeah, it's too hard. I think as humans, sometimes you're like, that's just a lot. Even if I know it might lead to other problems, whether you know that consciously or just subconsciously. I think that any time that you can welcome somebody into a space that they are you know not familiar with that they're uncomfortable around that they don't know how to navigate especially on top of that piece of like this is you know people aren't often showing up to court because they're having a great day you know unless maybe you're filing for your marriage certificate or something. Right, right. So yeah, so it's just, yeah, I think that being able to have somebody there is key at multiple levels and for multiple things that go to the court, but especially for this. Thank you.

Yeah, thanks. Thank you. Thanks for the presentation. Lots of great information. Tacoma doesn't like to lag behind other cities. So that's surprising that others have it. don't um I'm very interested in learning if there's grant possibilities to cover this um that would be amazing um question about the demographic of folks that you service if it's because you listed off a bunch of things and it sounds like that's some of them are not necessarily like gender things that people would oh yeah deal with and so I guess I'm wondering is it mostly like women or would there be like children possibly that

Yeah, good question. So majority women, I would definitely say, I don't know my exact stat, but I want to say it's between like 70 and 80% probably women that I'm serving. I speak Spanish. And so I'm the victim advocate for Burien. And Burien has a very large Spanish speaking population. And so it's been really helpful because it's not easy to communicate through an interpreter. And so it's really nice to be able to speak to somebody directly. I don't speak other languages, unfortunately. But so that's something that I've been able to do. Sometimes I do have children. So there are situations where parents cross the line. And so I have had children. Usually there's a non-abusive parent that's available. So I try to talk to that person. and ask them if it's okay to talk to the child, you know, depending on the age of the child. I usually let the non-abusive parent make that call if that's something that they want me to talk to. I don't know. What else about demographics would be helpful?

That was what I was curious about. I guess I'm wondering, too, you know, if we had, are there other versions of this where it's not just domestic violence, where there's folks that are there for people who just need help navigating for other cases as well.

No, that doesn't. Yeah, no. So I will say that, for example, in Milton, we get a lot of hit and run cases, but so the prosecutor sometimes will ask me like, can you call the victim on this case? And just ask if they need any restitution for the car damage that was done. Cause I really don't mind talking to anyone. So I'm like, yeah, sure. Like I did it today, you know? So it's one of those, yeah, I can call them like it's not a big deal. So, but there's not really, other advocacy that's not really domestic violence related, at least through municipal court level. Superior court, yes. They have advocates in all of their different departments that assist folks with the felonies. But when you're looking at the municipal or district court level, there's not that same service usually.

Just interesting. Yeah. Seems like something that could be useful. Yeah. Before I... I was elected, I was researching a little bit about the court watching, the court watcher system. Yeah. And just seeing if that's kind of parallel. But it sounds like, you know, this is more formalized and more follow through and that sort of thing. But I wonder, hand in hand, if something similar could work together. But yeah, thanks for the information. Yeah, for sure.

Thank you. Yeah.

Thank you, by the way.

And so is this... I know there's like the core of, what is it? Is that just for children? Okay. That's what I thought. And then is this, is there ever in any of the places where there are advocates around this specifically, do they ever kind of like, I know you said that you will call other folks, maybe, you know, like the hit run and things like that. Does this ever work ever? Sometimes obviously DV includes sexual assault, but sometimes that's like sexual assault happens by itself. And then there's, you know, so is there a realm in which this advocate serves both of those populations or is that like a separate thing?

Yeah. Most sexual assaults are filed felony. So they don't, yeah, they don't normally come through. However, we do see sometimes we'll see assault with sexual motivations. which does come through municipal court. I usually assist with those as well.

Thanks for that question. I do want to say that the data shows that domestic violence is oftentimes a sexual, a lot of times can be a sexual, started with a sexual assault kind of thing. I wanted to also just tell the people on this committee that I have talked to the prosecutor's office, to people in the prosecutor's office, and we had a huge backlog where people weren't hearing from somebody for a year, 13 months, about wanting to file something. And so a paralegal was caught. And how effective is a paralegal who doesn't know how to talk to a victim? And so many cases were just being dismissed. And I think for me, as someone who sees the system of somebody comes through, and this is what judges will say, and we've interviewed judges as a counsel for municipal court but like municipal courts that first stop in the system of people who if they're not if we aren't giving them diversionary choices people who are a defendant then possibly we'll see them again in superior court and I think this is an opportunity to stop that cycle and I think also when we talk about youth violence this is an opportunity to work on that as well and I think we will see changes in our juvenile justice system by having court appointed advocates at our city. And I think the reason that we don't have a court appointed advocate has a lot to do with how Crystal Judson Family Justice Center was set up and the hostility about having to pay for that. And the people who are involved in that are sort of mostly gone from our city. But I really want to see us come to a sense that a system appointed advocate is an important part of a system. And I really appreciate this conversation we had today. It sounds like people support this, but I also think we have to convince the rest of the council that this is important and hopefully we get some funding for it. But I do think it'll change things at our city and make it a better, healthier system. And we'll see better outcomes for people who are victims so that they can become survivors.

And so that's just the goal. Well, I'm going to tag onto that because you're right. Municipal and district boards I mean, it's the people's court. The majority of cases are not filed felony. The majority of cases come through municipal court. And it really is, you know, people don't call 9-1-1 the first time they're assaulted. They call 9-1-1 many times after that. So then to think about, like, somebody called 9-1-1 and then they weren't contacted but 13 months later. Like, why would I call 9-1-1 again?

Yeah, so the next morning after a case, Crystal Judson gets all of the numbers from felony domestic violence and they call those people and they ask them, are you interested in services? And so the fact that we're not doing that for me is just like we're dropping the ball on supporting people who are experiencing, like you said, someone who slaps you around. Will you remind the people on this council about when someone is strangulated, like when there's an attempt at strangulation, what the chances are of their potential death?

Oh, it's like astronomically. I don't remember the number. I think it was 700 times. Yeah. And it's, it's one of those red flags that like when I'm talking to someone and I'm, you know, I'm talking to, cause a lot of times victims will minimize what they've been through. Cause it's, it's hard, right? This is someone that they love. This is someone that, you know, they've, there's just so many dynamics there. And so then like helping them understand, like this is, This is serious. Like, this is really bad. What happened? And like, it's not your fault. Like how many victims get to hear that? Like, it's not your fault. You didn't create this. You don't deserve it. It's not okay. Like, that's such a huge thing to hear. And especially like when his family is calling and saying like, why did you get him arrested? Why did you do that? Or he's calling you from jail and saying. baby, I'm so sorry. I promise I'll never do it again. You know, or whatever they're saying. Yeah.

And isn't, if you are an attempted strangulation, you can be, have a kit, like they'll do a strangulation kit at the hospital. It's free. Actually, it was Senator Noble who passed that a few years ago. And so, and they have done a lot of study on this at Crystal Jensen. So I really appreciate this conversation because I don't know why it is, I mean, it's court. It happens. Domestic violence. Yeah. I think it should be filed as like a felony in superior court. So I thank you so much for coming today. This is really helpful. All right. Thank you. I don't mind talking about it. Yeah, really. I've just been waiting for you to come. So thanks so much. I'm also working with, The Domestic Violence Commission, just so you know, they meet the first Thursday of every month at noon. And you can actually go in person at the YWCA, but they have us in link. And they're wanting to send letters of support for this. They want to come and do public comments. I just want you to know we have a lot of people in the community who are going to support us if we bring this forward as a possible opportunity for funding. All right. All right. So on to the next thing. Just topics for upcoming meetings. And I'm going to ask Tony Esperanza. Did I say it right? Close. Esparza. Esparza. Okay.

I added an extra couple. Esperanza. Esparza. Esparza is just a name. Great. Just a minute. Thank you, Chair Bamba. So on June the 11th, we're going to hear about the results of the Juvenile Justice Task Force. We'll have staff from both the Pierce County Executive's Office and Pierce County Superior Court, and they'll present on those results, which provided some guidance on a new juvenile justice facility to potentially replace Raymond. And then on the 25th, we're Community and Economic Development staff on both our Rental Housing Code and Landlord Fairness Code, discussing how we approach compliance and enforcement. That's an informational briefing. And then we do have scheduled all the way through July the 9th. And we're going to hear from Councilmember Janie Hitchen, along with Mary Connolly, a policy analyst from Pierce County on the Unified Regional Approach to Homelessness, which is an effort of collaboration with jurisdictions across the county to potentially launch a unified regional approach.

Thank you. Can I ask a favor? I went, I don't know if Council Member Scott or Vice Chair Scott or Council Member Palmer actually, did you go to any of the stuff that Pierce County did on this? It would be great if they could get information ahead of time because it's a lot. On all topics? No, just on the first one. The Juvenile Justice Task Force, just because I think it'll give them more If he just shows up, it's harder to have good questions. And I think having information ahead of time that includes what they did and the process of what they came out with would be really helpful. And not just like a week before. I think they need more time than that. That's possible. Thank you. Yeah. I just found it really, I feel like you know me or something. One of the things I know, I looked at the land at Raymond Hall and I thought, are you going to have housing? And no one had thought about having housing for families that come to support their juvenile who might be at Raymond Hall. And I think you'd have a more supportive system for that youth if they had their family unit and you could kind of work with the family unit and like providing them some counseling, some other outcomes. Like, are you missing housing? What can we do? Whereas if they're not there, it's harder to work with them. And then we're in the court system again. And so maybe... finding another way. And so that was just one thing I thought, and I thought you might have some good ideas. All right. Are there, um, um, so I just like to ask, are there any, um, Oh, I'd love to get, do you have an update on CPAC?

Uh, yeah, there's been a little bit of change in the, a couple of people left CPAC, um, the chair. Adrienne Jones, she got a new job opportunity. And so she's moved out of Tacoma. So she stepped off of CPAC. So we have two, we have a, the vice chair has moved to chair and then we have a new vice chair. And then they had an update on use of force. The next update is going to be from the Office of Independent Investigation. That next meeting is on It's next Monday, no, a week from next Monday. And just doing a lot, they're talking a lot about, there's a, they're hosting an event soon, but they are, I can share it in an email if I can't find it while I'm talking about this, but there are, they've just been working a lot on figuring out kind of what they're, role is, like how they're oriented with new leadership. And then also, um, doing a lot of focus on their outreach work and how they can, a lot of the things that they do is showing up at various events and tabling. And so kind of looking at like, how can we create the event? So people are coming to us, not just like we're at an event and hoping that they might stop by our booth. Um, and so one of those is an event that I was coming up soon, um,

Did we all get an email about it?

You might have. I wasn't sure if they had finalized it and had actually put it all the way out, but it is on June 27th. It'll be, and it's like an ice cream. You can go get some ice cream and hear from TPAC, meet some of your community members, and ask any questions.

One of my things was I was thinking that in the future, and I think I mentioned it to Tony, it would be great to have an update on TPAC, but it sounds like... like if you could have an update for our June 11th meeting from the use of force, that would be really interesting. And we just want to know how we can support you. Cause like you got a good job doing that.

Yeah. And it's, we have, there's also some shifts as well because it was, Ted was the staff liaison. He is switching off. So Jacques is now the staff liaison. He's partnering with Christina Khan, the policy analyst. And so they're staffing that committee as well. So, there's just, there's been a lot of change. The momentum is still there. They're all very dedicated to, you know, the work of CPAC. And so that's still going on a little bit, just a little bit of, okay, it's moving around.

Did something change with these, of course?

No, no, no. I think they just kind of do an update, especially when they have new committee members. And so a lot of, there's quite a few new committee members. So some of it is just getting pulled stuff in.

Yeah. I can't remember if you could just, go through when we will be doing the CPAC. Do you remember when CPAC interviews are?

Oh, interviews.

Yeah.

Yeah, because I know that you're missing people, so. Yeah, I think now there are, because Adrian, there's already one seat. There might be three seats available now because one was already open. One person stepped off. Okay. And then Adrian stepped off, so I think they're open.

What was Adrian's name?

December 10th.

Well, it's not until December. Oh, it's not until December 10th.

Oh, December 10th.

Well, that's really late. I don't know if that could be earlier. Is that hard for you?

I think I would be okay with it. I think originally the plan, because a few of the members were like, are we going to get some more folks on there? So they were asking about it. I think with our city manager, I think he was trying to be cognizant of the fact that there's a lot on you know, our committee schedule, there's a lot going on with the shifts of things. And so like all the other stuff the staff is going through as well. And so you just, I think it was the plan was like, let's not overwhelm it and let's just leave it to December. But that was when we had just like one vacancy. And so it might be worth a conversation out there.

Why don't we add, Tony, why don't we talk with the, talk to staff? You're the staff, but why don't we figure out if it could be moved up, if that's something, or if they think we should leave it at December. I just want to be supportive because I think that that's a lot. I mean, three on that committee, this is like a really busy committee, and so I just want to support if we need to. Okay, great. All right. Has anyone been to any other board or commission meetings?

Nope.

Yes? Nope. Okay. For ones that are part of us. I have been meeting with different people from the different committee commission. So hoping to get to Thera. That's one I have to get to. They always have lots of good things going on. All right. Can I get the last motion? Move to adjourn. All those in favor signify to say aye. Aye. We are adjourned. Thank you so much.