Board of Zoning Appeals (bza) - Regular Meeting

I didn't know that. Do they have to make that? All right. I am uh wondering if they've had a school year this year. I'm going to call tonight's meeting of the board of zoning appeals to order. Um and ask Danielle for a roll call, please, when you're ready. Andy Jones is absent. John Dilberger, present. Darla Brown, present. Jane Gore, here. Michael Harrison, present.

Okay, first item on our agenda tonight is uh to approve the minutes from last month's meeting on March 25th. Hopefully, everybody had a chance to review those. I had sent back some suggestions. So, and Michael and Danielle, I think, sent out a revised version later today or yesterday afternoon. I did not have any changes to suggest to the revised version. Anybody else? And I'll move we approve the minutes from last month's meeting on March 25th. Second. Roll call vote when you're ready, please. Daniel Michael Harrison,

yes. Carla Brown, I'm abstaining since I wasn't here. Jane Ber, yes. John Delberger, yes. Are approved as written. We don't have any old business on the agenda tonight. First item of new business is docket number 26-se [snorts] which is a request for approval of a site plan amendment to an approved tourist home. Every year you're ready, Kale. We'll hear your staff report. Okay. And these these petitioners will not be here this evening. I see. Okay.

All right. This is staff report for Waggler tourist home special exception amendment pocket number 26-se4. Hearing date April 29th, 2026. Petitioners and property owners Ken and Lisa Waggler. Request is amendment to the original tour special exception 25-se to add a screened in porch. Ordinance provisions. Brown County Area Board of Zoning Appeals Resolution 2022-01. Tourist home special exception guidelines and conditions and chapter 1 section 2 and chapter 3 sections 1 and four in the Brown County zoning ordinance. Location 6194 State Road 135 North, Morgantown in Jackson Township. The home is on the west side of State Road 135 North and is approximately a half mile south of the intersection of State Road 135 North and the railroad track. Zoning and current land use. The property is zoned primary residential are one with a special exception approval for a tourist home that has a residence garage and a pond. General findings. One, during a meeting held on July 23rd, 2025 under docket number 25-see-10, the property was approved to allow the existing home to be rented on a short-term basis. Two, the tourist home is located on 3 acres. Three, the petitioners are requesting to amend the site plan to allow construction of a 14 by 16 14 ft x 16 ft screened in porch. Four, that a proposed site plan change should have no impact on the operation of the tourist home as there will be no added guest phase and therefore will have no additional strain on the septic system. The following conditions from the original approval should remain in effect. One, alter conditions and guidelines will be met. Two, the number of guests will be limited to six. Three,

a local manager will be utilized. Four, the septic system will be installed in compliance with the Brown County Health Department's requirements. Five, the building permit will be completed and inspected prior to operation. Six, the property boundaries will be delineated on a map inside the home. Seven, a notice will be posted that the discharge of firearms is prohibited. Findings of fact. Section 3.1 of the Brown County zoning ordinance authorizes a special exception for this use in the designated district. Findings: tourist homes are allowed in R1 zoning districts with special exception approval. Two, the requirements for special exceptions prescribed by this ordinance will be met. Find bindings. The special exception requirements in the ordinance will be met as long as all the conditions in the 2025 approval remain met. The board may grant a special exception for a use in a district if after a hearing under section 7.2, it finds that one, section 3.1 authorizes a special exception for that use in that district. Do you want me to read through these?

Uh, no, that's not necessary. We're familiar with them. All right. Staff recommendation. Since the special exception exists and there will be no change to the number of guests or septic system, staff recommends approval of the site plan amendment to construct a screened in porch with the original conditions.

This is looking north from the driveway, south from the driveway. This is a drive from 135 to the back to the tourist. These pictures look a lot different. I don't know if you guys remember the pictures from when they were previously approved, but they've vaguely things are looking a lot different. Yeah.

And then this is the driveway looking back out toward 135. And then Miss Waggler wrote a note on here that this is what the porch will look like except for that theirs will be screened in, not glass porch.

All right, that is the end of the staff report. Okay, thank you for that. Any questions from the board for Kayla? How about cards? Uh, five were sent out and four were returned.

Okay. Um, are you folks here to speak to this petition tonight? Not, not this one.

Not this one. Okay. All right. That's not So, there doesn't seem to be anybody here who wants to speak for or against this petition. So, I'm going to bring this back to the board for us to decide. Um, I did notice I did go back to the minutes from that July 23rd, 2025 meeting where we approved the special exception. And in the minutes, it says Mr. Dillberger asked the petitioner if he had any management experience and Mr. Wagler stated he did not and would be hiring a professional management company. And that was one of the conditions of granting a special exception as Cayla pointed out that a local manager would be utilized. So I was surprised when I read the letter from the Wagglers and the last sentences say our cottage will be managed by the owners Ken and Lisa Waggler and just in time professional cleaning service. Neither of which sounds like a local manager which Mr. and Mrs. Waggler agreed to use last year when we approved this. So, it sounds to me like they're admitting they're not in compliance with their special exception. Am I missing anything here, Kayla?

So, I was reading back through that report and I don't have the minutes. I can pull those up, though. Um, I do. But it just said the local manager will be utilized. That was in the report from 25. Yes. And in the minutes during the the hearing on that petition, it says Mr. Dilbert asked the petitioner, and I do remember doing that. Yeah. If he had any management experience, and he said no, he did not and would be hiring a professional management company. He's telling me now that he and his wife are managing it.

Okay. So, [snorts] I'm disincclined to approve an amendment to the special exception until he comes into compliance. That's just my position. I don't know how other people feel. I I really wish they would have been here tonight. I didn't I did not catch that. Yeah. So, maybe he's gotten professional management training in the interim. I don't know. But he's not here to address this. So, So anyway, how do other people feel about it? I obviously I wouldn't have wasn't uh on board at that time, but I like your uh thoughts on that.

What if we did this? What if we continued it to the next meeting and have them either bring in a contract to Kayla showing that they've hired Hills of Brown or somebody or they can appear and speak their peace? Yeah, I like that idea. I'd like to continue to do this, let them know my concerns and have them respond to them. And for the record, I have no problem with adding a screen porch to this. That's a great idea.

Nice looking porch. Yeah, nice looking. All right, then. I move that we continue this petition to our meeting in June. uh and that we ask the petitioner in the interim to uh clarify the last couple of sentences in the letter they submitted with their special request which seems to say they are not in compliance with their one of the conditions of the special exception they were granted to May or June June isn't that our next meeting May Oh god it's April sorry

sorry yes you're right I'd rather continue it to May then and that is May 27th. May 27th. Okay. Yes. Thank you for that. Second straight. Second. Nobody second. Um we have a motion to continue. That's been seconded. Roll call when you're ready. Danielle Darla Brown. Yes. Jane Gore. Yes. Shiron Dberger. Yes. [snorts] Michael Harrison. Yes.

Okay. All right. Next item on the agenda was docket number 26-se05. Uh the petitioners are requested that we table this petition to a future meeting. I don't have a problem with that myself. I move that we continue docket number 26-se to the May meeting. May 27th. Yes. Thank you. I'll second it. Okay. I have a motion to continue this petition as well. Roll call vote when you're ready, Danielle. Okay. John Delberger, yes. Michael Harrison, yes. Darla Brown, yes. Jane Gore, yes.

Okay. All right. Next item on the agenda is document number 26-se. This is a request for a special exception to allow tourist home. Whenever you're ready, Kayla, with your staff report. Okay. Staff report for Papish Tourist number 26-se. Hearing date is dated, April 29th, 2026. Petitioner and property owner Steven Pavlish for suburban properties of Ohio. Request a special exception for a tourist home with a maximum occupancy of two guests. Ordinance provisions, Brown County Area Board of Zoning Appeals Resolution 2022-01, Tourist Home Special Exception Guidelines and Conditions and Chapter 1, Section 2 and chapter 3, sections 1 and four in the Brown County zoning ordinance. Location 6491 Beach Tree Road, Ninevea in Hamlin Township. The property is on the south side of the road and is approximately 2350 ft northwest northeast, I'm sorry, of the intersection of Beach Tree Road and Sweetwater Trail. Zoning and current land use. The property is zoned secondary residential R2 and a small cabin exists. General findings. One, the property consists of three acres. Two, the petitioner is proposing a one guest room tourist home with a maximum occupancy of two guests. Three, the cabin consists of approximately 388 square ft of total floor space, which includes a bathroom, kitchen, and a living room with a Murphy bed. Four, the home exceeds the 50 square ft per guest space requirement for two guests. Five, the home and the septic system are located outside the boundaries of the

average 100year flood as indicated on the flood insurance rate map. Six, a parking requirement of two spaces should be easily met as the site plan shows a horseshoe driveway. Seven, electricity is provided to the property by South Central Indiana REMMC. Eight, Brown County Water Utility Incorporated provides water service to the property. Nine, the state of Indiana health department approved a change of use on March 4th, 2026 and delegated the plan review, permitting, inspection, and approval of septic modifications to the local Brown County Health Department. The system must be permitted and remain in compliance with the pump and hall contract through the local health department. 10. along with oversight of the owner who resides in Ohio. The petitioner states that local manager Cole Chudy with Evolve will manage the tourist home. 11. An inspection was completed on December 10th, 2025 by David Frenzy of the Hambling Township Volunteer Fire Department. The driveway was deemed acceptable for emergency service with the removal of some plants and a and few very small trees near the drive entrance to improve ingress and egress. 12. According to the petitioner, the property boundaries are marked and a map of the property will also be made available to guests inside the home. 13. Notice will be posted that the discharge of firearms is prohibited. 14. There are no residences within 250 ft of the proposed tourist home and no tourist homes located within 1320 ft of the proposed tourist home. Recommendation. If the board approves the petitioner's request, it should be based on the following conditions. One, all tourist home conditions and guidelines will be met. Two, the number

of guests will be limited to two. Three, a local manager will be utilized. Four, the contract for the septic system and permitting requirements must re remain in compliance with the Brown County Health Department. Five, the recommendation of plant and tree removal by the Hamblin Township Volunteer Fire Department will be completed prior to releasing. Six, the property boundaries will remain marked and a map will be made available to guests. Seven, a notice will be posted that the discharge of firearms is prohibited. Findings of fact, the board may grant a special exception for a use in a district if after a hearing under section 7.2, it finds that one, section 3.1 of the Brown County zoning ordinance authorizes a special exception for this use in the designated district. Finding special exceptions for tourist homes are allowed on property zoned secondary residential are two and two, the requirements for special exceptions prescribed by this ordinance will be met. Do you all want me to skip just down to the after all the findings?

Yes, please. Okay.

Okay. And three, granting the special exception will not subvert the general purposes served by the Brown County zoning ordinance and will not materially and permanently injure other property or uses in the same district in the vicinity. Finding staff finds no evidence that approving this application with the rem recommended conditions will materially and permanently injure other property or uses in the same district and vicinity. There's no evidence that the impact of this tourist home on neighboring property will be substantially different than the impact of tourist homes previously approved. Staff recommendation. If approved with the conditions listed, the petition appears to meet or exceed conditions A through H of the tourist home guidelines 2022-01. Therefore, staff recommends approval of the petition. This is looking east from the driveway on Beach Street. West the driveway. The front of the cabin. The rear. And then this was turned originally, but you guys have this in your packet. That's the floor plan.

Yes. The site plan. Nearest residence approximately 350 ft. Nearest tour tourist home approximately 2,640 ft. All right, that's the end of the staff report. Okay. Thank you, Kayla. Any questions from the board for Kayla? Yes. Well, yes. Okay.

I got a copy of the survey. It shows that the property is 133 ft wide. The plan that's been submitted here is very misleading. He's got two 87 foot dimensions, one to each direction. You take that's 174 ft. The house is 25 ft. That's about 200 ft. The uh he says he's going to post the piece of property, you know, the map make that available. This map doesn't indicate where the property lines are at all. Um I don't know how the property lines are marked. Um, my feeling is if the owner couldn't draw a map for the property lines, I don't know how the people stay in there are going to stay in the property. Um, I I'm not suggesting that we disapprove this.

I think it would be good to have a a reasonable map posted uh one that reflects the dimensions on the survey. Um if you take the under 33 ft, you're 60 ft or less from property lines on either side. Um it's also skewed. So there's bits. We'll tell them how close that is. I just one of the letters written expresses concern about inadvertent trespassing. I see that as as quite likely with the narrowness of this property and the type of map that we have here. And perhaps we could have a requirement to post a map that's drawn properly and just so that the people that are staying there would know that they're aware of where where they're staying. You know, this is a nice piece of property. people are going to wander around. And I think we would be remiss if somehow we don't uh put some notice out there to help people stay where they need to be.

Yeah. Kayla, I don't suppose you know how the propertyy's marked currently, do you? The boundaries? I do not. We have the petitioner here, though. Okay. Then if there's no more questions for Kayla, then I'm going to Thank you. Yes. if you identify yourself. Steve Steven Pavlish. Yes, sir.

Um the the owner. Uh the cab is owned by Suburban Properties of Ohio, which sounds like a big name. Suburban Properties of Ohio is actually two people, big name, small group. Um we are fans of Brown County for many, many decades. and uh bought this house, Skull Cabin, one room with the idea of visiting Brown County instead of having to stay at Brown County Motel or whatever. Uh we bought this with the idea of using it for my part-time habitation. I'm semi-retired since 1975. I've been in a property management business, uh renting houses. Um you have all the documents there. Sorry about the I I did the drawings of the property line. I thought I did correctly. Um, and whatever it takes for to satisfy this board, I'll I'll do some other drawings or whatever. But, um, if you folks have any questions, I'd be very happy to answer them. Okay.

Um, so it said the property boundaries are marked. How are they marked now? Do you If you if you're coming off a beach tree and facing the house, a surveyor, there was a surveyor there. A surveyor put a red ribbon around a tree and the other side goes to the beginning of the driveway. Uhhuh. Um so to any markings the rest of the bound are the boundaries marked just just in front. Just in front. Just in front. Yes. Okay. So just at the road. Okay. Right. Exactly.

Um the way way it's set up is the house which is a small one room log cabin the size of someone's living room. The way it's set up is um it's the log cabin with a grassy yard, but once a grassy yard ends, then you go into woods, which is still our property, right? So, it's I don't think anybody would be trespassing because you have to you need almost like a uh like a machete to get through it. I mean, it's definitely thickened.

Trust me, people will come to Brown County and rent that cabin specifically so they can enjoy the woods of Brown County. So they they will go into the woods. Um you can mark property lines in various ways. One of the ways that people do in this area often is they'll put a purple mark on a tree at the property boundary about head height. So it's right where you'll see it. Um and you can mark the property boundaries that way. Um you know or anything else. But it is going to be, you know, if we approve this, it would be with the condition that you actually mark the boundaries in some way so that somebody who's renting there knows where their prop your property ends.

Also, while I'm on record here, I'd like to thank Kayla and Danielle and even Logan who's not here. They've they've helped me through this. I'm I'm new at this. Yeah. They helped me through this and uh they made it somewhat easier for me. So, I'd like to thank them. No problem. Um, so I I am not familiar with Cole Chudy or Evolve. So could you or Kayla give me a little history? Cole and his brother, they own two uh two vacation rentals of themselves. Oh, I see. And they're trying to get into the business where they would have become a uh a local property manager,

full-time property manager. Also, I would like permission here to be also a manager. I I go to the cabin a couple times a week. We just came from there cutting the grass. Yeah. Um I I've been I've been a landlord since 1975. I'm 76 years old. Um that's my my only skills is property management. So does this Cole live in Brown County? Uh he No, he lives um he lives on a border Brown County. I'm not sure what town he lives in, but his his buildings are uh uh Indiana University near Indiana University. Okay. The ones that he he rents out. Yeah. I'm not I'm not sure where Cool is. Yeah, it's in within an hour

running from the bus. He's He's like He's like 45 minutes away. Yeah. Gotcha. Gotcha. And he he was very helpful as as we we bought this cabin June of 24. He was very helpful telling us do this, do that, do this, and whatever. Uh guide us where it would be uh approved and hopefully to where we are right now. Understand? Well, we the reason that we ask for a local manager is because we want somebody who's available 24/7 to respond uh in a timely manner to anything that might require a response. That makes

sense. And we want to make sure that the neighbors have the contact information for that person so that if they have any concerns, they can reach that person as well and they can respond in a timely manner. So that's why we want them to be local. It makes that makes sense. Yeah. Um, and I guess Okay. I didn't have any other questions for the petitioner. Did Did you have anything else you wanted to share with us or just you want to take questions? Hopefully to answer your questions. Um, okay.

This this is this is my home. I'll be staying there quite a bit myself. Um, it's um nice historical cabin and uh I'm very fussy about um what happens to it. Right, Kayla. From my understanding, um, do do human beings of any age count as guests? That was a question. Yes, that's what I thought. Okay. Just wanted to make sure. That's what I recall from I read that somewhere. Okay. Probably eight years ago.

Okay. All right. Good. All right. I I asked that so that you know because one of the letters we got expressed a concern about children who would be prone to wandering into the woods and getting into trouble because the woods contain animals and uneven terrain and that sort of thing. Absolutely. You know, and there's a pond near on some nearby property and that sort of thing, right? Okay. We can be very specific, you know, in those rental guidelines. They they weren't objecting. They just were concerned. Right. They Yes. Exactly. It it really I guess if they had a small child that would be with them, an infant or something like that. Um

that's what I was trying to figure out. If you're under two, you count as a human being or you know because you're limited to two guests. So I'm trying to understand if so um letter A in the guidelines and conditions at the very end a guest is an ind individual of any age. Oh my okay. All right. Got it. Thank you for that. Um I don't think I have any other questions for As for the fire department. Uh in one of the photos it showed at the beginning of the driveway a bunch of plastic pots. They were close to the driveway. We moved them out. Um Okay.

Oh, the planters. Yeah. Um right there. Right there. We we moved them out. There was a couple little trees we cut away and uh those will have flowers in them probably in a in a couple weeks. May maybe not so many pots. Looks kind of junk what it has. Oh, I don't know. He has agreed. So he really looks like my front court. Right. Right. It wouldn't be out of place here in the county that um I do not have any other questions for Mr. Papers. Does anybody else?

So in conclusion, I guess we're always supposed to ask for your approval for whatever type of zoning I need. I'm not really sure. Um I would appreciate that. Well, what you're asking for is a special exception to for a use that is not permitted in this zone except by special exception. So, that's what you're asking for. Yes. It's not a reasonzoning or anything like that. Okay. Well, thank and thank you for your time. Sure. Okay. Well, I didn't ask how many cards. Uh, seven were sent out and five were returned. And then I believe we had the two letters that you all have in your packet from neighbors. Yes. Um

I'm curious what what did those letters say? I'm I'm kind of curious.

Well, uh one of them uh was from Mr. N's uh Bersoff and it's they summarized their concerns this way. They had some concerns about the safety and liability due to the wooded terrain in a nearby pond. Um, they said there were past observations of rental use, including the presence of children. I think that they were concerned because there were children. Um, they were concerned about potential unintentional trespassing onto adjacent property. Uh, and then we had another letter that was from Mr. Mrs. Harold and they expressed similar concerns. uh they were concerned about increased activity in what they feel as a quiet lowdensity area, the presence of short-term guests, unfamiliar with the surroundings, which might make them prone to getting into trouble of some sort. I think uh they had potential safety concerns also about the wooded terrain and natural features. Uh and they thought that might affect the overall character of and privacy of neighboring properties. Those were the concerns they expressed

and Daniel's getting a copy of those for you. Okay. We we uh we bought this office two years ago. We made some pretty good u improvements to the building itself in into the surrounding group. So So we we are good for Beach Street and we are good for Brown County. Um I would probably the children observed who were probably family friends of mine who had two little ones there which we made them aware you know that it is not a good place for children to go wandering off and but

when we do going forward running it it will definitely be u in any kind of Airbnb advertisement or anything be period. So nothing from that. I would I would encourage you if you get the opportunity when you're using the cabin yourselves, if you get a chance to introduce yourself to the neighbors and so they know you um sometimes people get to know your faces and know who you are, it goes a long way. Oh, thank you. We did we met um I guess he was the former sheriff or that's someone that he was in former law enforcement

and we kind of hit it off right away. He walked over and introduced himself right after he purchased and um my was my son's a police officer. So I don't know we just kind of hit it off. He very nice. He took our phone number and we took his and he said we keep an eye out for us which we really appreciate. We we like having good neighbors and we want to be a good neighbor and um and I know they built I don't know which direction but you know they built the boat storage place next to our property but that's been very low key and nice and very good to the west. Yes to the west. Sorry.

Okay. Okay. Well, I don't see anybody here who wants to speak to this petition. So, I will bring this back to us on the board to discuss and decide. I I personally am inclined to grant this. How does everybody else feel? Well, perhaps I spoke at the wrong time. I I I think we should approve this, right? I you know the letters that were written I think the concern about unintentional trespassing has validity. The others are things that could be written on any application we have for the owners part I and they are on most of them by the way.

Yeah I this this is a very narrow piece of property and it's and it's goes there. I think that somehow we ought to have some provisions in here. Perhaps the tree marking is a is a good suggestion, but something to help the people that were there know where they need to limit their activities. So, you'd be okay if we approved it with the the condition that the property boundaries be marked, which was one of Kayla's suggestions.

Yes. I mean, you know, more than what's there because obviously what's there didn't help this this map, but what you were suggesting something like that. I wouldn't be fine with that. Darling, any any concerns? No.

No. Okay. All right. Um, then I'll move that we approve docket number 26-d6, which is a request for a special exception to operate the tourist home, provided that the following conditions are met. Um, all of our tourist home guidelines conditions will be met. The number of guests will be limited to two. A local manager will be utilized as the petitioner indicates they'll do uh contract for the septic system. The permitting requirements remains in compliance with the Brown County Health Department recommendations. uh that the plant and tree removal recommended by the Hanland Township Volunteer Fire Department be completed before the property is rented. The property boundaries will remain marked and a map will be made available to the guests. I think as Michael said that's important because this is a very unusually shaped piece of property.

Yes, it is. People will assume that the property sort of is around the house and actually it's quite unusually shaped. Are you are you asking for just a piece of paper with a drawing on it for the I'm asking for both that the boundaries be marked in some way and that there be a map that shows the property. We can do that. Okay. And finally, that a notice will be posted that the discharge of firearms is prohibited. Absolutely. I'll second. Thank you. Uh, roll call vote when you're ready. Please stand out. Michael Harrison, yes. Darla Brown, yes. Jane Gore, yes.

John Dberger, yes. Your request has been approved. Second. Thank you. Appreciate it. And can we get your name? My name is Lyn Lynn Schneider. S H N E I T E R. Thank you. Thank you. Should should we go? Yes, that that finishes our agenda. We're we're going to continue to have some discussion ourselves, but it's not related to your request. So, you're welcome to leave. You won't insult us. Hope you have a food catering. No, I'm afraid not. Our budget is very low. Well, we really appreciate

Kayla's loaded with money. Right. But thanks, folks. Thank you so much. Take care. I'll get you an approval letter with all those conditions written out. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Well, I I had put a an item on the agenda to discuss tonight, but I really hate to do that without Randy present. Um, do you do you know if Randy You probably don't know if he's going to be here in May, do you? You wouldn't have asked him that. As far as we know, he will be. Okay. All right. Is everybody else planning to be here in May? What all do we have? All right.

Well, Darla, you weren't here from the last meeting, but what this was yet again another one of our variances, requests for variance from the setback requirements in the Lake District

and we ended up ultimately approving it. But I've become increasingly uncomfortable doing that because I don't feel like the fact that other people got a variance from a setback requirement and you don't get one constitutes a hardship as our zoning ordinance lays out the definition of hardship. Um in fact there is no hardship. The hardship is you want to build a house that's larger than the setback than the lot will allow. And we routinely say yes because we said yes to somebody else before whoever the first person was that God had really set the the pattern for everybody else thereafter. And at some point I'm at some point I' I'd like to stop doing that.

Okay. Um but whoever is the first person who gets a no of course is going to feel you'll remember Mr. Nixon and people like that. you know, whenever we clarify a rule or change our policy, somebody's going to be the first one to experience that. Yes, Michael. Well, I I was I was the only one that voted against this last time. Yes, you were.

And of course, I'm new. I I' I've got my own perspective and I'll I'm sure I'll adapt to what you all share as time goes on. But at at this and I'm I'm kind of very conservative to, you know, I I tend to honor the guidelines and I'm not saying y'all dishonor that. I'm just I'm I'm kind of by the book. That's my my tendency. Uh I will be disincined to I think without looking at the to approve things like this. We've had two come before. I voted against both of them. You might remember when they came back to the board, I first question I asked you is is how is this different than the one we disapproved the week before,

right? And I I really saw this one worse because like I said at that time, the height I don't see as a as a big issue to me,

right? It might be to somebody else. I understand that. But I saw this as worse because on one side you had four feet and on the other side there was a seven foot dimension. Now that so that's pretty tight. Um now I did have a misconception. Uh Caleb and I have talked and I when I had looked at the guidelines I thought the accessory building limitation was 5 ft. Turns out that's business rather than residential. Uh so part of my thinking at that time was I'm not going to prove anything less than what you have for yourself. So the 4ft dimension to me in my uninformed state was was a no-go right there. Um I'm not really saying anything other than kind of sharing you my my viewpoint.

Sure. One of the things that Kayla and I did talk about and I think it's something that has been discussed before is the uh Courtney Streetwater Conservation District approval which seems backwards to me. Um, you know, this this last one that we had, one of the the variances that they were asking was the distance from the lake. You know, the rear setback. Well, that seems to me the primary concern of the conservation district is to protect the lake. So, why are they not doing this first? The other thing is if they're doing it first, then you're getting more of a consensus of the neighborhood. And I would be more inclined to vary from my hardline approach, right,

if if that local board which is representing all the people were in favor. Yeah. No, that makes sense. It does. Kayla, historically, do you know why we go first? I do not know why. I [clears throat] can imagine. Dave, you have any history on that? Um, we go first because we really don't care what the I mean, legally we don't care what [clears throat] the what the Cordri Sweetwater District says. That's their their thing, their covenants that or their rules that they're enforcing. So, we you make your decision based on the Brown County zoning orders and that's it. Got it. Hopefully.

Got it. So am I right in saying they can be more restrictive in the lakes but not less restrictive than our zoning ordinance is the way that I understand that. Yes. I mean they can give any any approval they want but if it doesn't meet ours then there's an issue. Yeah. Right. Okay. I understand. Well okay. So there you go. So although it might make us feel good if they were okay with a reduced setback, that really doesn't affect our we're supposed to make our decision based on the zoning ordinance that we're operating under. Just less.

Yeah. Well, this a and after the meeting, Darla, so after we I kind of raised that and and Michael raised his concerns and then after the meeting, Kayla received a letter from the neighbor who unfortunately had not received notice of I saw that email.

Right. Right. And so the one person who would have come and actually chimed in and had some of the same concerns Michael and I did about the reduced setback because it affected her specifically was not here through an act an act of God, the postal service. But uh and so that just sort of added a exclamation point to the concerns that Michael and I had raised at the last meeting. Anyway, and I really would like us to think before the next meeting about where you come down on this issue. I mean, I also am a kind of a I'm not a maybe I'm not as much of a rules guy as Michael, but these are pretty flagrant variances we're granting from our rules for no reason that I can justify as a hardship. I mean, the only reason we're granting these is because people want to build homes that are larger than the lot will allow. That's the only reason we're doing them. And I don't think that's a sufficient reason. So, your contention is the fact that it's an oddshaped lot is I don't want to say it's of no consequence, but you buy the lot or you buy the house knowing full well that it's an oddshaped lot. You may be limited in what you can do.

Yes, you buy you buy the lot knowing that you have to meet the setback requirements for any construction you want to do. Now, it may not it may already have a variance and be outside the setback requirements, but if you want to do anything new, it's going to comply with the setback requirements. That would be my position. They're small lots. You buy a small lot, you realize you're going to only be able to put a small home on it. If you buy it with an existing big home on it, you're lucky. And maybe it's a good purchase. So, under what circumstances would an oddshaped lot, say a pie shape pieshaped lot in a subdivision, would that ever meet the hardship requirements?

These are not necessarily all odd shaped lots. They're just small. Yeah, but she's posing a hypothetical. I It's a good one to pose. Um, according to our zoning ordinance, the definition of hardship, it would be a difficult case to make. the petitioner would have to make it. And I'm not in my mind, it's hard for me to understand how they'd make that case. Um the the upshot would be I can't build a home. It the only hardship would be I can't build a home that's livable. To say I can't build a home as big as I want is not a hardship in my mind.

Yeah. I I would just say the number of variances that have been granted around corridor Sweetwater might lead a policy body like the plane commission to say let's rethink the setbacks for this specific area so that people aren't having to come and try to get variances that they don't really qualify for because they might want to allow people to build larger houses and increase the uh the tax base or whatever. or sure promote that. But uh yeah, so that's something that the planning commission might want to think about. That's a good idea. I wish Randy were here.

Yeah. Who else is appointed by the plan commission? Jane is here. Jane. What? You're you're appointed by the plan commission, right? Are you on the plan commission? Yeah. So, so you could take this back to the plan commission and say, you know, for at least the nearly two decades I've been on this board, we could regularly get requests for variances for setback requirements from the Lake District. And perhaps that number of variances over so much time suggests that the setback requirements may be inappropriate for that district and maybe the plan commission wants to revisit those. You put that in the comprehensive plan.

No, no, this goes to the voting [laughter] order. You're I guess you could put in the comprehensive plan. Let's not even go there. We want it everywhere. [clears throat] Oh. Oh, that's right. We're far away from a new zoning ordinance, but we could work with the existing zoning ordinance. Yeah. So would would you would you agree to take that back to the planning commission? Yeah, Jane, I'm also appointed by the the planning commission. So I'd like to I'd like to go with you if you do that. Great. Okay, great. Okay, that was I think you're appointed by the you're appointed by the commissioners.

Yeah. Oh, that's right. You're right. The other plan commissioner. You're more than welcome to come to the meeting, though. Um Yeah. Randy is Yeah. Yeah. Randy is the plan commission appointee to the BCA. No, you're you're right. Jane is the town council appointee to the BCA, but sits on the plan but sits on the plan commission. So, you could take it anyway. Yeah. It's okay. Thank you. All right.

I I there's no way that I can see that we could grant any relief to the letter writer. I mean, there's nothing. It's out of our hands at this point. Um, unfortunately her she's gonna end up going to court if she wants to do anything. He's too late. Too late. Oh, has she missed a deadline on that? Too late. Her time passed this week. Okay. All right. Well, anyway, and she was she was extremely nice whenever she cuz she called the day after the meeting. Yeah. And she said, "What happened with this?" I just was notified and we were like, "Oh, that's unfortunate." Yeah.

So, but she was we told her we were sympathetic and she said, "You know, we know I know it's not your fault, not the board's fault. It's right. Good old USPS." Yes, it is. Yes, it is. All right. Well, that was all I had to discuss. Dave or Kayla, anything to bring up? We will have three new variance requests next month. And how many from the Lake District? Two. Two. Yeah. Okay. Well, I think if we are going to become more draconian,

we should put out a news article or make an announcement or do something so that somebody doesn't get in while you can. And of course, this kind of thing. And this is the one night we don't have a reporter here, of course. So, yeah. So, it won't get in the Democrat. Oh, they're watching, I'm sure. Are they okay? Oh, yeah. If you're watching out there for the on behalf of the Democrat, if you could put something about this discussion into your article, it would be appreciated. We'll send them a memo. Okay. All right. Because Darla's right. I mean I I fairness to everybody so that they

I mean we don't normally issue press releases but I guess we could just something an article or

so we'll be a little bit full next month. We've got the three variances. There was someone that u requested an appeal. I don't think that's going to pan out. Okay. Um and then the two tourist home amendments from tonight, right? Two continued to I don't know if the ones who wanted to postpone to a future meeting will be ready in June. I guess you'll have to see. They are also not certain. I see. Okay. All right. Okay. Well, I unless anyone has anything else, I'd entertain a motion to adjurnn. So moved. I'll second that roll call vote to adjurnn when you're read Danielle. Darla Brown, yes. Jane Gore, yes.

John Dilberger, yes. Michael Harrison, yes. Right, we're adjourned. All right. Later, Gators. Okay. Thank you all.