Township Council - Regular Meeting

It's right here. Coming over. Mhm. I know cuz I'm getting ready to start the meeting. Thank you. Good evening everyone.

Welcome to the township council regular meeting of January 27th, 2026. This is a regular meeting of the council of the township of Montlair. It's being broadcast live on channel 34 and it's streaming live on the Montlair TV34 YouTube channel. It's available on demand and can and will be rebroadcast. Good evening, sir. This meeting is called pursuant to the provisions of the open public meeting act. The meeting was included in the annual notice of meeting schedule as set forth in resolution R-25-352 adopted by the township council at its regular meeting of November 25, 2025. It was advertised to the official newspaper on December 25th, 25, January 1st, 26, and January 8th, 26. It was posted on the bulletin boards outside of our municipal building and has remained continuously posted. In addition, a copy of the annual notice is and has been available to the public and is on file in the office of our township clerk. Please stand for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Madame clerk, would you please do the roll call whenever you're ready? Thank you. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Councelor Damato here. Councelor Harrison, present. Councelor Toller, good evening. Present. Good evening. Councelor Williams, present. Mayor Baskerville,

present. So, um at this time I I had invited our um our guests to um that were interested in uh being considered for the position of the planning board to come in at 5:30 and um speak to us and then adjourn into um executive session so that we could deliberate. But one of the um individuals who's interested is not able to get here until 6 um p.m. Should we discuss the other positions while we're waiting for that? We have some other positions that we could discuss for how do you think we should best spend the time between now and 6:00 p.m. when I expect that? And it's only three um people now who are interested in the I mean two actually that will be coming um to just share with us why they would like to be considered for the planning board seat.

Um we have three Yes, councelor Toller. Oh uh thank you. You said we have three candidates but only two can make it today. No, there are only two okay who are at this point in time still interested in that position. They're due here at 6 p.m. 6 pm. Yes. Well, there is another um deputy mayor. Sorry, I don't think we we haven't gone into executive session. No, I know. And and I wasn't going to because when we talked to the people, they don't have to be there. If we want to deliberate in executive session, we can do that. This is not executive session. I'm just trying to figure out since we seem to have maybe 20 20 minutes um here. I I do see

Can you please speak into your your mic so that the people that are at home can hear us? Thanks. I do see that um there is another item on the resolution uh authorizing executive session um in the same section where it said the appointments for various boards and commissions and it also says the appointment of the county attorney. So, we could maybe spend the next 20 minutes discussing that.

I'm fine to do that. Um, does anyone have any objections? Otherwise, I will adjourn us into the executive session. No. Okay. A motion to uh move into executive session uh for the purpose of what are we going to be discussing at this point in time? Um, township attorney. Personel personnel second. All in favor? Opposed. Okay.

You're back. Thank you. Okay. Okay. At this point in time, I'd like to make a motion, please, that we um exit the executive session and return to the um public portion of our regular township meeting of January 27th, 26. Second. All in favor? I

opposed. Okay, welcome back. And I am going to um invite two candidates that we have who have expressed interest in um becoming considered for a position that we have open on the planning board to come before us. They will each give between three and five minutes about why they think they would be an asset to the planning board and then we will discuss this in executive session. Hey, good evening.

Well, you this is a public portion of the meeting. Yes. But at this point in time, I'm waiting for two candidates who wish to be considered for the position of planning board or three. Um, and so if any of them are here, where is the other person that you said was coming at 6? the the friend that you wanted.

It's not my friend, but um I thought she was coming up. Do you can you reach her on the phone and just let her know because Huh?

Okay. Well, yes. Um hi. Um good evening, uh Mr. Sionis. Good to see you and and welcome. Um I know that you are one of either two or three candidates who will present to the um entire council here a little bit about yourself and why you think you would be an asset to the planning board as I spoke with you on the phone. I hope that you would be able to do that within five minutes. We've all had an opportunity to look at your volunteer interest finder that was on um on the uh online and so yeah, good to see you and and thank you. You can you can begin.

Well, thank you. I think I could keep this to three minutes. So, my name is Paul Cionus. Um, I've been a resident of Monontlair since 1979 and I've lived at 60 Heler Way since 1981. 60 Heller Way was a farmhouse that was built in 1850. It was built by a working farmer. Most people have no idea it's there on Heler Way. It's not typical of other houses on Heler. U, my wife and I have been married for 49 years. Michelle's a third generation Monontlair resident. She retired as a pharmacist about two and a half years ago after working at Grove Pharmacy for 50 years. Um she began when she was in high school and then when she went to pharmacy school and stayed there. We have two granddaughters and three grandchildren. I have a bachelor of architecture degree from Pratt Institute and I have a bachelor of science in landscape architecture from Rutgers. I'm a licensed architect. I'm a licensed landscape architect and also a licensed professional planner in New Jersey. For 12 years, I was a part-time faculty member at Pratt Institute u where I taught a um Friday class um called site design where I taught architecture students about planning and zoning boards. From 1985 until October of 2024, I was the owner of Cionus Architecture, which was a multidisciplinary design firm, and we averaged seven staff members. Um, I was proud that Cionus Architecture received a lot of awards. Uh we received awards for design, historic preservation, and also inclusive housing and including projects that that you probably know in Montlair like the George Hotel, uh 111 Grove, which is the corner of Grove Street and Walnut Street, um the old Red Cross building. We we converted about two years ago, uh former Christian Science Church on Hillside Avenue that's now known as Hillside Square, and the former Monontlair um Motor Vehicle Agency, which people refer to as Monontlair Bread Company. Um along with fellow

Montlair resident William Scott, I was honored by Homecore for service to the community in 2018. Then in 2021, I was honored by the Monontlair Foundation, which is the owner of the Vanble House and Gardens. Um locally, I've served on various boards um including 21 years on the YMCA board of directors. The last five were as the board secretary. Um I served on the Monontlair Foundation as their nominating chair. I've been on the Monontlair Housing Commission, um Ammani Advocacy Center, um headed by Joan McCuller, who just retired. I was on Monontlair Housing Association, which runs the Monontlair in at the corner of um Hillside Avenue and St. Luke's. And then I was uh past president of the former Monontlair Lions Club. Um I sit on various committees at at Union Congregational Church where my wife and I have been members since uh 1990. In October of 2024, I sold my firm. I sold Cionus Architecture to Gregory Schwitzer Architecture. I met Gregory at Union Con Church where we're both members. Um, I now serve as a consultant to Gregory Schwitzer Architecture. Um, I'm not an employee of the firm and this role will be ending. So, why do I want to serve on the planning board? Um, so in my opinion, the time is right. As the owner of a Monontlair architecture firm for 39 years, I was not able to serve on the planning board or zoning board while frequently appearing with projects before the board. I appeared and testified at the Monontlair Planning and Zoning Board, plus the Historic Preservation Commission over 200 times uh through 2024, plus another 125 times in other towns and cities in New Jersey. Now that I've sold the firm and will not be testifying, I have a lot of valuable experience to offer, including my knowledge of the site plan application

process, the Montlair zoning ordinance, New Jersey land use law, my ability to read and understand drawings, my patience, my even temperament. I have no temper, my ability to look at all sides and to be a good listener. Um my also my respect for the efforts I've observed over the years by various planning and zoning board members who are all volunteers over the last 40 years. There have been some terrific members that I I wish to match. Um plus what I've witnessed at planning and zoning board meetings in other towns including most recently in Lynen for example they had a terrific huge digital smartboard and not the screen like this that gets hard to read. um have been in Verona many times where they meet in a large impersonal space like a almost a gymnasium and they have no digital capacity at all yet. And then recently a few months ago I was in Chattam Burrow where the board members were still uh they still log on in Zoom. Um so I still had to go to the meeting but only one one person was there plus the secretary and everyone else was on Zoom. concerns I have about um being on the planning board that I need to share with you. Um our older daughter lives in Los Angeles with two of our grandchildren. So, we visit there three to four times a year and intend to keep doing so if appointed to the bar board. I would not schedule the trip um when there are board members. Um we'll be away for two weeks visiting them this February for trips I scheduled a while ago. My other uh concern that I that I'll bring up is if Gregory Schwitzer architecture has an application before the planning board, I would recuse myself from those applications. So, thank you very much. Any questions I could answer?

Thank you very much, council. Anything anyone wishes to say at this point in time from from from here? Councelor Tola? No. Um I just want to thank you for your um your background. Thank you. Um, I know your work, your all of most all of your projects fit in the character of the neighbor of the neighborhood, fit in character with the neighborhood. So, I appreciate that you are able to have a keen eye for that. Um, and understand what should go where and what shouldn't go where, and that's very important. Um, so again, I just wanted to thank you for your background, your work, um, and thank you for presenting yourself this evening. Thanks. Anyone else? Yes. Um, Councelor Birmingham. Now, thank you for coming. Um, I have a question.

Yes, I'm sorry. U, so when did you first uh indicate interest in this in this seat? About one month ago. Okay. And currently, Mr. Schwitzer is in front of the planning board with probably one of the most difficult applications that we have. Correct. And you've been advising him on that. Sorry. I mean, I've seen you advise him on it. Sorry. Yes. because it was his first time attending a planning board meeting in his career. Okay. Mr. Schwitzer's career was almost in entirely in New York City where he never had to attend a planning or zoning board meeting.

Okay. And have you had any experience in in in in planning itself? Yes. Okay. I'm a licensed planner and I've testified separately as a licensed professional planner. Fine. Excellent. And as I stated, I familiar with New Jersey land use law. Okay. Thanks. Thank you. Okay. Thank you so very much. That's quick. Okay. Um, is Jade here? We'd like to hear from Jade if Jade is here. No. Is anyone else here that wish to be heard before this body regarding their interest to be on the planning board? Oh, thank you. Hi. How are you? Nice to see you. I'm well. Good to see you again.

Hi. Uh, good evening everybody. My name is Nicole Wallace. I'm a Montlair resident. Um, and I am a urban planner as well. I went to NYU School for Urban Planning. I have a master's in urban planning. Um, just a little bit about my background. Um, I my entire career has been based in community-based urban planning. I've worked mostly in the public sector. I've worked for the city of New York. I've worked for the state of New York. Currently, I work for the uh municipality well adjacent to the municipality of Maplewood. Um I have I run the business district in Maplewood similar to what you have here, Montlair. So I work very closely with the mayor and the council in Maplewood, although not for the government directly. Um so when I say community based urban planning um everything I do is uh working on a very much a groundup approach. Um I've worked with community groups. I've worked with um I've ran you know two-year long um committees where we try to bring a whole bunch of stakeholders to a meeting. I mean these things take long times. These are huge projects and over two years we try to get pieces together. Not everybody's happy but also not everybody's unhappy. And maybe that's the win that you're looking for. Ultimately, um I am not a nimi. I do think, you know, change is okay. I think development is okay. But I think development has to be contextual. It has to be appropriate for your community. Has to be respectful of the um residents of these of the town. Um but I also recognize a healthy economy, clearly a need for more affordable housing in this state. Um and so there's a a big balance to getting the right projects and then if you support these right projects getting them to be the right size um you know those are obviously for the big

projects you know often planning boards or smaller more minutia things you know between neighbors and stuff which are also part important and important to uh be respectful for all of them. So perhaps I have a little different background. I'm not an architect. I'm not licensed that way, but I am an urban planner. I've been in this field for 20 years. Um when I worked for the city of New York, I worked directly on large large uh redevelopment projects and land use projects, but I also worked on open space projects. Um testified behind in front of the planning board, worked with the um the planning commissioner directly, weekly meetings in her office. So, a big variety of tasks that I did in terms of both technical, you know, reading the zoning code, interpreting it, but also the part of going to community boards, testifying, you know, in in New York, for example, there's a lot of weigh-in from the elected officials before a project can go through. And you really got to build these coalitions together, be respectful, hear people out, and come to a conclusion. Um I think uh while in Maplewood I've also testified between before that planning board and worked

No, go right ahead. Just ignore the noises. No. Um and then also worked was part of the committee that worked on their master plan the that they just put out.

So you know I do think I bring good experience. I think I bring a sort of unique experience as as this type of urban planner. I think New Jersey has a distinct definition of urban planner which is this very technical term. I think I'm definitely more of a wide broad-based urban planner with a lot of direct experience. Right now, uh, in my current job, I represent uh, the Maplewood Maplewood. I go to the Main Street conference every year. So, I'm very versed in economic development supporting small businesses as well as sort of land big land use planning projects. Uh, why I'd love to do this? Um, you know, I've been in this town, I grew up a few towns over. I've been in this town for 10 years. Um, you know, I take a direct interest in what happens in this town. I've been involved with a ve different issues and different committees. I think I've met some of you at the salon at Angel's house where we all come together and you we meet the candidates that are running, you know, so there, you know, I I do really care about the civic life of Montlair and I'd like to give back and it seems an appropriate way and place for me to do so.

Thank you very much. Um, Councelor Damato, thanks so much for coming. Uh, I just have one question. Uh, about how many months roughly uh would you say ago you first expressed interest to serve on the planning board to a number of I think I expressed interest under the old mayor. Okay. And we discussed it maybe 6 months ago. Oh, easily. Yeah. I've uh I think it was a paper application I first filled out when I first moved here. It wasn't even online. Okay. So, I've been interested for a long time. Yeah. I mean, we just wanna it's not like there's a Yes. You know, take a number, but but just if people have been have been waiting to serve, we want to know. Thanks so much. Okay. Um, councelor Toller. Sure. Thank you. Uh, thanks for your background.

Thank you. Um, you said you've been here about 10 years. Um, I listened to you. You said you bring like to bring stakeholders together. Um, you know, build a coalition. That's not really what the planning board does. They're there to review applications. I'm just curious if you can explain to us your expertise in urban planning. How is that specific to Bontlair? What?

Right. Right. I understand that. Right. So, so I guess I was only bringing that up in terms of just being a respectful person that you're listening to the concepts that are are coming to you. Um, so for example, when you're, you know, there's there is the legislation and the law, but obviously there's interpretation, right? or else there would every vote would be a zero some unanimous vote right so you're trying to um apply the law and apply the planning code to the thing but I think a planning code frankly is a rep is the um priorities and rep just like a budget represents the priorities of community a planning code represents the priorities to the community and so you know some of the things that come up when you're reviewing an application is what are the trade-offs? Are you going to give a variance? What what's the what's the trade-off between parking and height and the um the commercial uses people would like to see in the space versus the height versus the open space and some of that is prescribed by the planning code and by the zoning and some of that has areas where you can have a dialogue and have a variance for that. So I think that's what I would bring to it when I talk about thinking about it. looking at things both prescriptive and what's the what's the code and what's the rules and what do you have to allow it's 15% affordable that's not a variable you may sometimes have 20 a larger amount the amount of parking your parking ratio that's all required but then sometimes there's there's maneuver you want to find the edges when you're reviewing things also

thank you chair anyone else council williams the deputy anyone else? No. Okay. Well, thank you. Thank you so very much for coming in. I appreciate that. Sure. Okay. So, um I think that we should just move move along and then when we get to all the rest of the appointments, I guess, which may be at the end of the meeting, then we'll go back rather than to go back into executive and out and back again, we'll do all of them in executive session. So, at this point in time, um, okay, we have a proclamation. H, no one's here.

Oh, it's not 7:00, so maybe they're not.

Okay. So, we're going to hold on to that um until an individual No, we can um move right on into um public comment. There there's some people we can start with and then it'll be maybe 7 o'clock. Um are you all here because you want to make some comments or you just um visiting us today or what? You're welcome to sign in over here. Did you want to did you want to say anything about people signing up for different boards and commissions while we have some time like just to up now?

Okay. Hi. Thank you so very much. If you signed in over there, please. And now when you come up here, if you just give us your name and and welcome. Thank you for joining us. Good evening, U Madame Mayor and City Council. Uh, my name I haven't been here for almost nine years. I'm Dr. George Bennett and this is my wife, Dr. Karen Stevenson. I remember you guys. Good to see you again. It's been a while.

Uh, I'm a transplantee 13 plus years now. Uh, I didn't have an opportunity to go to the board of education meeting, which I really wanted to go to, but I got the dates confused. Uh when we moved here, we had four children that were in the Montlair school system. They came here with all the bells and whistles, independent documentation. My children struggled not academically in this school system. It was not a welcoming school system. But we eventually pulled out at great expense and my children got into two daughters at Chapen,

best or second best school America has to offer for girls. My son is at Horus man, right? And my other son uh went to Dwight. My daughters, two daughters are straight A students at Brown. And my son is not a straight A student at Brown, but very, very talented and doing very well. The reason I give that background is this. Monontlair is made up of really bright and wonderful and talented educated people. But the school district I have found to have had nothing but difficulty with the school district especially as an African-American and my son who had difficulties my eldest son who is at TUS to give you the contrast when we pulled him out and went private in New York City. My son took in 10th grade pre-calculus at Columbia University. Got early admission to the um college edge program. Got an A, followed up by calc 1, still a sophomore A, followed up by a struggle third semester B+ in calc 2. Now imagine doing that well at what I think is America's best university, Harvard also included, but and having problems and difficulties here in Montlair. Remember, in order for them to be admitted to the schools of New York, you have to do these far more competitive exam than the what you can imagine. Their SAT scores of course match and so forth, so forth, so on. and they're doing well where they are. How is it that a school that does so poorly with African-American students, other students could run a budget deficit of 20 million? Then, as I said before many years ago, want to use the town's people

and their home as an ATM to make up for the bud budget shortfall. This is gross negligence and mismanagement that has been endemic. My brother-in-law was slated uh by the council to be uh a janitor, master's degree later. He's fine, right? He's in his 60s. This is a tradition of Montlair. It is not new. It is not nearly new. It is ancient. This is incompetence at its worst level. You don't produce great students. And incidentally, well, you don't do well with girls either. And for all the money that's poured into this town by its residents who all they ask for is that the teachers do and administrator do a good job with their children. I say if you don't do it or you can't match it, they should be replaced in whole. We owe them nothing. We owe our children everything. and for $20 million shortfall to occur with a slight of hand and I read all the um data that I can how how the hell does that happen? I just wanted to

just a moment please councelor Toller and excuse me doctor I failed to announce at the beginning of this session for the public comment you get three minutes to say I didn't know it's my fault I didn't No I heard you what you said to the person before thank you so much so no I appreciate you coming so if you wanted to finish that sentence okay I think it's a travesty that we owe better for the town's people and for the students to have a situation where true education can occur and not this way behind and you know the achievement gap which I was there for.

Yes. Thank you very much doctor. Next guest please. Is there anyone else that wishes to speak? You would need to come up here please and sign in and then after that when you come forward please state your name. You have three minutes and we'll be very happy to hear you. Thank you.

Good evening everybody. My name is Janet Hubert. and I live at five ward place in Montlair. I am here evening specifically um to after hearing what he said second that I want to say that but in support of the south in fire station. Um we would like to see the fire station finished. We would like to know, well, I would like to know what happened with the monies that we allocated last year when we went to the fire station and had meetings with Miss Tally for the improvements on the south end. Um, with crosswalks for the kids, um, stop signs, crosswalks, lighted stop signs. I'd like to know what happened with that. Um, but I am very much would love to see the fire station finished. So I am here specifically in support of that. Um as far as the school system is concerned, I second that. When I came to Montlair, I came here broke. I didn't ask anybody for any money. I didn't ask anybody for any help. I was a very well-known person, but I was broke but not busted. And I want to second what he said about the school system being very subpar. and I had an African-American son who also was bullied beyond belief and so that he now, you know, still suffers from that. So, in support of the fire station, I would love to know what's happening with the funding. We would like to see it finished and we would love to have a fire station. Valley Road has their section of their fire station. Middle of Montlair has their section with a fire station, but on the farthest end of the of the south end, we do not. So, I know that money was allocated for it and in support of that, I would love to see it happen. That's all I have to say tonight.

Thank you very much. Thank you. Next guest, please. I was number five. I'm sorry. Um, if you would like to come forward. No, excuse me, Noah. Um, I'm I'm sorry. Take my place. I'm just getting my Okay. So, you want us to move forward? Um, you signed in already, right? Yes, I did. And you're number three. Are you number three on five? Okay. Who is there a number three? I'm calling on number three. The first two people who arrived before executive session took their numbers. So, we started at three.

Okay. Number four. Anyone? Number five. Okay. Hi everyone. Good evening. My name is Nella Gail. Um, I hope you all survived the Thank you, the government officials, the town council officials and township council officials, Dr. Mayor Renee Baskerville and and everyone here and all the elected officials for keeping us safe in the snowstorm in the blizzard of 2026. I think this was the hugest and largest snowstorm that we have ever seen in decades perhaps in 10 years pretty much in years. Anyway, I'm here to speak about a few issues tonight. As you know, we just started 2026, a new year last month and I think for 2027, I've been begging you this for years. I've been telling you this for years. Sorry. We should um we should bring back first night. It is first night I remember as a kid was very important to all of us in Monontlair. It was fun. It was festive and joyful. I would love Monontlair to recognize New Year's Eve for bringing back first night next year. Thank you. Also, as you know, it's like the middle of the school year already. We're halfway through the end. So, one vote yes. Yes. On March 10th. Oop, sorry. I didn't mean to. Anyway, um, as summer is coming up, so I just want to make sure how much time I have. As summer is coming up, as we're halfway until the beginning of summer, I noticed that Monontlair residents only can go to Township Cools once they're open. But I think it is very unfair. I suggest everyone has a right to go to Monontlair Town, even if they're not residents. For example, what if I have family friends

who live on the who live on East 51st Street in New York City and they want to come to the pool and I have to tell them no because it's only open to Montlair residents. That is very unfair and exclusive. What if I have a friend who lives like um far away who doesn't live here but he's visiting me for the weekend and he wants to go township pool but I have to tell him I'm sorry. Mlair residents only. I say everyone should be welcome to the township pools in the summer. Thank you. So, make sure it's open to guests who are not Mona residents either. Thank you. Thank you very much, Noah. Next guest. Um, number six, please.

And please just swing that back around to face us if you can, otherwise we can help you with it. Thank you. How are you? Good evening everybody. I'm kind of discombobulated. Excuse me. It's okay. I had a few things to talk about. Um, can everybody hear me? Yes.

Thank you. Um, hello. My name is Lynn Stockhammer. I live on Forest Street in the third ward. And like many of us not living in the fourth ward, I am woefully not enough aware of decisions over the course of Monontlair history and which continue to impact the lives and livelihoods and safety of families in the fourth ward. My bad. But I'm here tonight to express my support for the reopening of Firehouse Station 3. And I echo everything that Janet Hubert had to say. Um, this current location has functioned historically as a safe haven for residents, including our children. It's located near a school and local south businesses. The dispersement of the ward's mutual aid anchor and critically as well response time from the Valley Road location can cost lives. The importance of minutes in emergency situations has been testified to in earlier situations in earlier meetings, excuse me. Please vote tonight um for the resolution of 200K to allocate funds for the repair work at station 3 as and where it stands on Walnut Street. Please vote as if our residents lives depend on it. They do. Um I have a little bit more time. So um I'd just like to know um I should be writing to you all um about Millennium Communications Group which is being contracted to provide it support. Um good luck to them and I hope perhaps that they can set up something where we can have remote comment um from the public. Um, but I'm I'm very concerned as to whether it has connections to foreign governments. I tried looking it up and my skills are woefully inadequate. I'm also really happy to see Gray Russell back and the appointments and reappoints of those on the civil rights commission, including the high school and college students and Marsia Almeida and Rubina Spence, Maline Gale,

and those others who I hope to get to know who I don't know. Um, I did not find the senior hub resolution when I looked at the agenda. I did not have a chance to look at it again tonight. I don't know if it was added, but it was a blank page when I looked at it um yesterday or the day before. Is that available anywhere? Thank you so much.

Thank you very much. for for another time. Um, Jersey City has adopted a very very vigorous and rigorous resolution protecting Jersey City immigrants. I think that we need to look at language like this, particularly in light of the fact that um Murphy did not sign two of the most important acts with the um there were three bills to sign. Um these protections are critical. So, um, perhaps with some support of some groups that I'm in. Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Hi. You're you're number 10.

I'm number 10. Yes. Okay. Thank you.

Uh, Daniel Cruz, 40 Irving Street. Uh, I just came to uh speak on behalf of support for the uh South End uh firehouse improvements. Um, I know there's stuff going on right now with the board of education, but I haven't been keep too far up to date. I guess to that I would say as somebody who graduated Monontlair High School in 2010 that uh, Superintendent Frank Alvarez was my superintendent at the time. Uh, he seemed to be doing a pretty good job of things. And I think that Monontlair High School has an overwhelming amount of uh great programs whether it's the auto shop, the wood shop, theater, sports, and um my experience at Monontlair High School, while it was tough at times, also taught me a very, very important lesson, which was perseverance. And I was also fortunate to make some lifelong friends there. So again, I don't know what's really going on these days, but in spite of the problems that the system might be going through right now, that doesn't negate some of the best qualities of it, which is why people still move here to this day. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Okay. Um, at this point in time, I see I I believe that our um guests who have come to receive the proclamation recognizing January as Muslim Heritage Month have joined us. Is is that correct? Okay. Are you waiting for any other people? Because we can either continue um here or if you're all here now, I'm going to move forward. Um and then after that, we're going to go to the discussion with the Lacawana Plaza group. So, is your your group is here now? I believe so.

Okay. Then we would love to come and present this proclamation. earlier. Okay. Okay. It's all right. I'm excuse me. I'm still going to present this. I'm going to present it with you.

Huh? Okay. Huh? All right. Sorry. You finished? Huh?

Um, we're debating who's going to do the proclamation. No, we're really not um debating and I'm very happy that I um was able to get this on here and councelor Toller was a second and the entire council wanted to present this um and it's something very dear to our hearts and so what we're presenting today is a proclamation actually that was um presented from our then governor not not our new governor but our then governor and we want to read it in um our former governor and we want to read it in for the record. So, councelor Toller is going to start. Anyone else want to read a part of it?

Okay, come on over. So, let's see. There's one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight paragraphs. So, we have just enough. Okay. So, first let me say assalamu alaikum and let's celebrate is National Islamic Month. Uh my name is Amina for a reason. Thank you. Uh whereas on April 29th, 2023, Governor Philip D. Murphy signed a joint resolution number six of the Senate and General Assembly of the State of New Jersey designating the month of January of each year as Muslim Heritage Month to honor the history, culture, and contribution contributions of Muslims throughout the state of the state and nation. And whereas

now the second person for Birmingham

whereas Muslims first arrived in North America among enslaved Africans of whom historians estimate approximately 30% were Muslim and their faith resilience and service contributed to the foundation of our nation including courageous military service in every major conflict from the American Revolutionary War through the Civil War and beyond. And Whereas whereas Muslim Americans represent approximately 1.1% of the United States population numbering about 3.45 million individuals from diverse racial, ethnic, and cultural backgrounds. And

whereas New Jersey is home to more than 300,000 Muslim Americans, one of the largest Muslim American populations in the nation whose contributions to education, medicine, business, public service, the arts, and many other fields have strengthened the economy, enriched communities across the state. And whereas

whereas the township of Monontlair recognizes and appreciates the many ways in which Muslim residents have contributed to the township's diversity and positive growth, including in education, entrepreneurship, government, law, medicine, literature, athletics, music, culture, and all aspects of civil life. And whereas the township of Monontlair is home to residents of many cultural uh cultural, religious, and ethnic backgrounds and is committed to fostering an inclusive community in which individuals are respected, valued, and celebrated. And

whereas recognizing Muslim Heritage Month provides an opportunity to promote understanding, build connections, and highlight shared values of service, family, and community while reaffirming the township's commitment to diversity, equity, and mutual respect. Now therefore, the mayor and the entire council of this great township of Montlair do hereby recognize January 2026 as Muslim Heritage Month in the township of Mont Clair and encourage all residents to learn more about the rich history and the significant contributions of Muslim Americans to our community, the state, and this nation. Come on family, come on. Come on.

Come on in. Come on everybody. And and then who wants to Who wants to speak? You guys want Okay, good. Okay. Is there a certain order? Is there a certain ma'am? Go ahead. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much.

Yes. Okay. Thank you for being with us. in the name of Allah uh peace be upon all of the messengers to the day of judgment and thank you very much uh to the mayor and all of the council members. Thank you very so much for this wonderful proclamation and on behalf of the Islamic community here in Montlair, we want to give our gratefulness and for the recognition you're giving us for what we contribute to the town here. Um, we have our wonderful family here. Yes.

The Abushi family and I want to thank Southsam for her work and our wonderful husband who assists her. Uh, I'm going to be honest. He told me just today he said I just saw him tells me where to show up and that's where I go. It's true. You're honest. Okay. Well, thank you very much on on behalf of this Islamic community and thank you very much all of you. Thank you very much. Okay, come on. Come on. Let's Let's go. Who wants to come first? Is there an order? Come on. Come on. Here you are. Your turn. Okay. And then next, just move in whatever you want to say to us. Go ahead.

Inshallah. Next year, I'm bringing home the championship. All right. Your turn. You want to say those two? Just say thank you. Thank you. All right. Next. Anybody else want to say anything? No. No. You all want to say come on. Super Sonic.

All righty.

Okay. No, thank you for being here. Well, first of all, uh I wanna I'm used to a different mic at the deis, but um in the great city of Patterson, but uh I I want to thank uh the council and the mayor um and the administration, everyone here for taking the time out of your busy schedule uh to and of course the imam to commemorate uh Muslim Heritage Month. Um, Muslims uh uh have made great contributions both to our our country, our state, and our beautiful town. And and whether they're in DPW, fire, police, or residents who serve our community and uh answer the call of service that Muslims uh must respond to. So, thank you again for having us here. It's been an honor. Uh thank you for taking the time out of your very busy meeting to to commemorate contributions of Muslims in Montlair and throughout the state. And I hope everyone has a great night. Thank you.

Absolutely.

Briefly, thank you to the mayor and to the entire council for recognizing Muslim Heritage Month. I think this is um a beautiful tradition that hopefully we can continue in the town of Montlair. Um, I do also want to thank the council for um, if if some recall last year we were able to light for the first time in the history of Montlair the Ramadan um, crescent at the start of the holy month of Ramadan. Um, this year inshallah we plan to do the same and it is tentatively scheduled for Friday, February 13th. um would love for the community to join us and I am grateful that the council and the mayor have been so receptive and so supportive in our effort to continue um to bring that to the town. And I know that um last year it was so wellreceived and so appreciated by the Muslim community within Montlair and then and and neighboring towns as well who also attended. Um and again we would love to continue that tradition and um and make that a part of um Mont Clair.

Yeah, just custom. Thank you so much. Thank you to the mayor. Know that was a beautiful time. So yeah, it was it really was. Um I appreciate that. looking forward to it again. Again, February 13th. Thank you. Thank you very much. Okay. Next up, um, how many people are here for public? Put your hand up, please. And you have a number. I called you before. Okay.

She threw a lot of coconut by the way. There we go.

Give us one moment, please. This was just brought to my attention. So, thank you. I appreciate Yeah. I just also wanted to say uh that we do recognize that today is Holocaust uh remembrance day and uh a day of great meaning. I think for everybody it should go unsaid. Uh one whose you know meaning does not require a proclamation to uh to remind us of its of its import. So that's all just you can take a second to reflect. Holocaust Remembrance Day. H. Yeah. No, my my head and not my heart. Thank you so very much because that is very important.

Hi. Good evening. Good evening. My name is Claire Park. I think you know by now button. So here's my I'm going to try to do this quickly. Claire, push the um green light. Come on. Oh, that button. Thank you.

Okay. I'm going to do this quickly because I don't have a lot of time. So, here's what I want to know. In 18 months, what has this council accomplished? And I I'm not meaning that in a snotty way. I mean it really. What besides the leaf blower ban that took, as I understand it, an entire year to get approved and voted on, what have you changed, passed, repaired, or created? For example, the deer cull. Have you finally voted to return the grant? and avoid killing deer in this town because you're constantly hearing from your constituents at these meetings. I haven't heard any opposition there to saying no to that grant and making sure that the deer are not killed. Three, why haven't you public a publicly apologized for the sidewalk debacle? I understand that you have a million-doll grant, community grant. Why not use that grant to pay back citizens who were bamboozled into spending thousands of dollars? You corrected the law, but you didn't help the people of this town who paid that money out.

And how is it that before there were 400 citations and now there's been 40 since this all came out. And again, not the most egregious ones at all. They're still sitting there. On that same issue, if you plant the tree, if I plant a tree, I'm responsible for it. If you, the town plants a tree, the town's responsible for it and whatever it does, that just seems to me to be common sense. Four, you and only you have the power to change a zoning ordinance, as I understand it. Why haven't you, given all the debate here and the talk, change the building code now from having to have a mixeduse apartment house built in this town to just allowing apartment houses to be built without mixed use. We wouldn't be having this discussion endlessly about the traffic and all the garbage that's going to happen. No, we may be stuck with the one that we're going to have, but you have the power to make sure it doesn't happen again. So, how is it that it's up to a builder to provide a traffic study? I don't know. Have you ever heard of a traffic expert paid by someone else walking in here and saying, "Nah, they shouldn't do this." Are you kidding me? Not on their dime. So, we should do a traffic study. I would like to move that you consider the town doing the study because if we did the study according to the New Jersey state law of what constitutes a traffic study, it would not be these three day pieces of garbage that we keep getting from the so-called traffic experts. And I don't even know if they're experts. So I would like to suggest that we do that because we are in a different time now. Everyone uses Door Dash and Uber Eats and yet we are acting like that's

not an issue for the security and safety of our citizens. Thank you very much uh Miss Leata. I appreciate that. At these meetings we um allow three minutes and we do have a group that's coming behind you. Yes. One second. I challenge you as a citizen and a voter to act in our best interest and do what we elected you to do. Thank you so very much. Look ahead. Put citizens and homeowners. Thank you. Next guest, please. We didn't coordinate.

I'm I said we didn't coordinate. I didn't know what Claire was going to say today. I'm Gerald Fierce, 259 Park Street. And having attended several council meetings and conscious of the continuing financial administrative turmoil that I'm reading about in Monontlair, I have been dismayed at the lack of transparency, accountability, and competency that I am seeing in this council. I personally have been victimized by your actions which have made me question whether in the long term after being a resident of Monontlair for over 50 years I can age in place in the home and neighborhood which is my community. You have needlessly coerced almost 200 of my neighbors to unnecessarily spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on inappropriate sidewalk repairs. You have not explained who is responsible for this fiasco nor made anyone accountable. If I had done something similar in my job, I'd be fired. You haven't even apologized for your incompetency. And I have to ask, was it a malfeasance of some kind? Who was in on this? I think you should be ashamed. And I am following the lead of Frank Rubaki. And I urge all of my neighbors to do the same by submitting invoices to the town for the financial damage you have caused to us. And I ask you to explain and ameliorate your actions and to penalize whoever was responsible for this incident. And I'm submitting for repayment my invoice of $2450. And I repeat, was it incompetence or malfeasance? In either case, you should be ashamed. Thank you. Next guest, please.

You don't even have a reply.

Good evening. Good evening.

My name is uh Jessica Troop. I am the owner of uh Sanca Cafe, 319 Orange Road. and I have been asked to read a letter from the South End Business Association uh Dr. Carter uh to be submitted. Uh dear members of the Montlair Town Council on behalf of the South End Business District, we respectfully urge the council to vote in favor of the resolution to allocate $200,000 for necessary repair work at the firehouse station. Number three, for more than 200 for more than 120 years, it has been the cornerstone of public safety in the third and fourth wards, significantly reducing emergency response times in a densely populated area and the local businesses in the south end. As you're aware, Pine Street currently serves as our mutual aid station. When Pine Street units go out on another call, residents and businesses in the south end must wait for response from the Valley Road Firehouse. This delay is not a theoretical concern. It is a real and ongoing risk. Fire Chief Robert Duncan emphasized the importance of reopening station 3, noting that minutes matter in emergencies. As Chief Duncan stated, if you have a fire and someone is going to get there and start solving that issue for you in two minutes before someone else will be there, it's a big deal. Failure to reopen station 3 would place the safety of residents in jeopardy. The chief has also explained that given the current configuration of equipment and cover in equipment and coverage, there

are areas in Montlair that may not be reachable within 3 minutes. He has made clear that maintaining station 3 as an active firehouse is the best option to ensure adequate coverage and response times. and we stand firmly behind this professional his professional judgment. The township has already invested $400,000 to improve the structural integrity of Firehouse 3 so that it continue to function as a fire station. The requested $200,000 is not an ex abstract expense. It is an investment in public safety. faster response times and the well-being of our community is at stake. As as has been said, we are talking about what the money is going to do to make a difference in someone's life. If we can't do that public service, then what are we doing? We respectfully ask the council to recognize the critical role station 3 plays and to vote in favor of resolution 25 397. The safety of the south end depends on it. Thank you so much for hearing our letter. Thank you very much. Next guest, please.

Good evening. I'm sorry, deputy. What number are you please? Number eight. Eight. Thank you. Number eight. Good evening. Good evening. Happy new year to you council and uh thank you for what you do. I know how difficult it that the job is and the task is there. I've sat in many of those seats on that side. Deputy mayor.

Uh my name is Roger Terry 140 High Street be 50 years I'll be at that location this year. I'm lifelong resident of the township of Monontlair and I'm here tonight to speak about the police department which I served for 35 years in this community.

Public safety to me is very important and I'm sure it's important to most of your constituents here in the community. I think that uh the fact that the police department hasn't had a raise yet, I do not understand how that could be. I'm sure somewhere that you're working on that. However, every other department I understand in the town has gotten a raise already. The police department has diligent men and women who work out there 2407. If you just take a look at the past storm, what they've done with that of getting the cars off the street, making sure the streets are safe, making sure any accidents that people are well taken care of, and above all, public safety in the evening. And I imagine that I've heard that uh the last couple of weeks or months or so they've had a rash of burglaries at night

where people are waking up and individuals are standing in their house at night.

So we need public safety in this community. An OG like me definitely needs it, you know, to make sure that we're safe. and all the constituent all the residents in the township I'm sure that they want to be safe. So please whatever the situation is I don't know if it's an oversight I don't know because of maybe the weather I don't know if it's because of the holidays that you haven't had an opportunity to sit down and work over that budget with the police department. Please do so. public safety. Without them, your uh restaurants aren't going to be safe. The people aren't going to be safe. The schools aren't going to be safe. Nothing works without public safety. Keep up the good work though on your side. I know it's difficult. And thank you very much.

Thank you very much. Next guest, please.

Good evening. I'm Dr. Stevenson. How are you? I live at 88 High Street. met my husband already. I'm not as vocal as he is though. Um I actually wanted to bring up two points. I moved to Monontlair when I was three years old. So I am a graduate from the Monontlair high school system. Went through the full public school system and saw this as a wonderful place also to raise my family. And I think the achievement gap has been present from when I was in school. And it's been an ongoing I nightmare not only for the students but also for the parents that are here. And I think it is a big concern not only for the board of education but also then what does the role that the council members play in making sure that not only is the achievement gap discussed resolved but then now also the budget issue because the reason I live in Montlair because it's a beautiful town but it's becoming an unaffordable town because the taxes continue to go up and where is the money going? How are we explaining this? What is your responsibility not only for the citizens who live here but also for the children who are here? This is supposed to be the future for the town members and you are responsible for that and it would be important for us to hear what your opinion is as well as what is your resolution for this problem. Um and I look forward to actually hearing it from each and each each of you individually because I think it's an important discussion. And I think there's been too much quiet around this because the achievement gap has been a discussion that's been on for years. And a lot of what the achievements are of these children is because the parents supplement. They have tutors or they go to private school system or they just do it themselves. And that should not that that's important but that should not be in

place of having an excellent school system. This is why we moved here for the people but also for our kids. Thank you very much. Next guest, please. Okay, seeing none other, we're going to H. Okay,

Hi, Ellie Bagley, 606 Grove Street. Guess why I'm here? Uh I know that later this evening you're going to be voting on uh funding for the senior hub. We've been through a long process once again. One, two, three, third or fourth time. I can't even remember anymore. uh when we began the process, there were some high hopes that the possibility of a hub back here could happen. But as it turns out, once again, the space has been cut by more than half. The bud there's not enough money in the budget to build out the whole space this year. So, on and on we go. I just want to urge you to please consider uh incorporating funding for next year so that the entire space can be built out. But more importantly, as we move forward, please at what point can we get a promise from this council that a senior center will be incorporated in plans moving forward? This has been going on since 2008. I've said it before, I'll say it again. We have lost people. people who were working on this project have passed away waiting for this to happen. So I'm just urging you all to please consider a senior center, a true senior center for all those aging in place in Montlair. Thanks.

Thank you. Next guest, please.

Hi, my name is Ann Lapel. I live at 10 Crestmont Road and I've lived here for over 50 years. My children went to the schools and I've come before you many times before. Ellie and I didn't plan this, but I know you're here today to authorize bid 36 to fund the rehabilitation of one of the facilities offices here in 205 Claremont for yet another interim solution space for senior activities. I know fiscal exigency prevails, but please do not vote this, excuse me, do not view this vote as a success for this council. Indeed, none of our seniors see it that way. However, after meeting with manager Markx, it seems that this is the only way forward to alleviate serious overcrowding of our existing facilities in our times of fiscal crisis. But before you leave this council tonight, I am asking you to pledge to keep the quest for a permanent, fully outfitted senior center top of mind. The seniors have been in front of you too many times. Do not put the burden on us to thread this through the needle. It is your burden. You took away. Now you must give back. I urge you to think about the potential of an alliance with the schools as they look at underutilized buildings. Perhaps there is a creative alliance that would give us access to space for a senior center. It could be a win-win situation.

Truthfully, the seniors of Monontlair do not want to be here year after year. It is up to you to secure a future path that future councils cannot undo. Given the track record here in Monontlair, when that future ribbon cutting actually happens, many of us will have passed on. Please keep this in your vision and make it permanent. Thank you. Thank you very much. Next guest, please.

Good evening. Diane England, 158 Orange Road, Montlair. Uh, shout out to Dr. Stevenson, class of 84. Um,

uh, here for a couple things. One, I want to thank you all as a council for your support of the Dr. Martin Luther King breakfast. I was there and for this to be a priority for you all in the town is wonderful and we want to shout out to that committee for keeping that going. So, that was great. The other thing I wanted to talk about is that we are five months away from the summer and I want to thank Deputy Mayor Susan Chen Anderson for conversations about youth employment. I do wear another hat and I work with uh good successmies in Montlair. You may have seen our farm stand in the summer but we train kids on resume writing and interview skills. The issue is is that there's no jobs available. So, uh, Deputy Mayor and I were talking about looking into Montlair, possibly expanding jobs in Montlair. Dr. Baskerville back in the day. Uh, we used to work with M andDC and students were placed in different jobs and got uh, stipens for that. And thank you, Dr. Baskerville, for many years of supporting youth employment, but we're back at almost zero. So, I don't know how we can creatively do this. I know the county does pay students if they are placed in certain jobs and maybe Monontlair can be a hub for that. The other thing is is that I'm thinking about, you know, everybody complains about, oh, Monontlair's turning into this restaurant town or development and this, but maybe if there's a commitment from restaurants to hire one teenager, then maybe they go on this list of, you know, town buddies or something like that. Um, and for our I I'm sorry to see our director of recreation leave. Um, Michelle's been great, but the age is a little too high for counselors, too. Maybe we can come to junior counselors. Um, to be a lifeguard cost money, so I don't know if

we can come up with different ways to get scholarships for young people, but I'm here for it. However, we can help. I know Mr. White who works for the town, I met him at one event. Um, but if we can come up with a way to create a pathway for young people to get employed, that would be great. The last thing is is that um

one sec. One sec. No, I only got three minutes. Um, the uh finding a way um councelor Toller about I know maybe you've been contacted by Dr. Alfred Davis's family about keeping his legacy alive as well. And there's been a charge to see if we could name that area the Dr. Alfred Davis Plaza or something in the Southoun area. The reason why it's important is because he was instrumental in many things that revitalized the South End, helped with culture and things like that. So, if we could think of a way to do that, I'd appreciate it. But the kids first. Thanks. Sorry.

Thank you very much. Next guest, please. Seeing none other um we're going to move forward and uh my apologies but I hope that the people who are going to do the Lacawana development uh presentation are still here and we welcome you uh forward for the presentation and discussion. She needs a break.

We're going to take a five minute break. give you guys an opportunity to get set up and then we'll be happy to move on. Um, everyone please stay and and listen to the discussions because I'm sure a lot of the things that you will be interested in also. Thank you.

Welcome back everyone. And at this point in time, we're going to move on to the uh Lacawana redevelopment project between the township and BDP Holdings LLC. And welcome. Thank you for joining us.

Good evening, mayor. Good evening, councilors. Uh my name is Neil Zimmerman. I'm an attorney with the law firm of Waters, McFerson, and McNeel, and we have the privilege of being redevelopment council to the township for uh Lacawana and and other redevelopment projects. Uh the background of this is that BDP H hold Holdings was conditionally designated as the redeveloper uh by resolution R24-16 in on September 24th, 2024. Uh when I say conditionally designated, they were designated subject to the execution of a redevelopment agreement. What is a redevelopment agreement? And the reg development agreement is an is an agreement between the township and the redeveloper as to what will be built on what timetable and uh uh other required matters. Um this is customary p practice. You don't want to designate a redeveloper without knowing what the heck he's going to build. So you uh it's it's very typical uh customary in fact for the uh developer to be re uh designated subject to the execution of a redevelopment agreement and we we negotiated a redevelopment agreement a draft agreement under the direction of the economic development committee and then the full uh council with the assistance of Mr. Marks and Miss Tally. In this particular case, the redeveloper proposes to build the project in phases. This is also fairly typical for a project of this size. Exhibit B to the redevelopment agreement shows the phases which the redeveloper and the township have agreed on. That exhibit shows four phases to the west of Grove Street and two phases to the east of Grove Street.

uh they're interrelated because infrastructure on the west side needs to be brought over to the east side in order to uh service this. I'm just going to give you a little bit of a highlight on this. Miss Tally is going to go into the uh proposal in more detail. Uh the redevelopment agreement also has a timetable exhibit D. It's a timetable on which the project uh will be built. The redeveloper anticipates that the project will take 6 to 8 years uh to fully build out. Uh that allows for lease up time as well as uh construction. Uh and the redevelopment is crystal agreement is crystal clear that the supermarket must be in the first phase. That was from day one that was a requirement and the the redeveloper is uh uh has is amendable to that. It also has the covenants that are required by the state redevelopment law. Uh these covenants uh end when a certificate of completion is issued. Uh certificate of completion is a gold standard for any redeveloper. It's what terminates his obligations under the redevelopment agreement. Uh the certificates will be issued by phase as the project is built out. There are specific provisions in the redevelopment agreement as to the public benefits that will acrue to the t uh township from the redevelopment. Uh foremost among this is the required 20% affordable housing and the required 10% workforce housing. Uh there there were also provisions as to the use of the main plaza in front of the supermarket for municipal municipally sponsored events and a requirement that the redeveloper will uh need to maintain the historic resources. The redevelopment agreement is uh uh is

only the first step in the process. The redeveloper still needs to get all the required governmental appro uh approvals. The redeveloper advises us that he intends to file for site plan approval within six months after the redevelopment agreement and the pilot uh financial agreement are signed. So in summary, the approval of the redevelopment agreement will be an important uh first step in the process, but it's only a first step. There's still a long road ahead. We still need uh they still need to go to the uh planning board and as well as get all their other required governmental approvals, but this gets the process started. So, at this point, I'd like to turn it over to Miss Tally who tell you more about the specifics of what the redevelopers pro uh proposing and then my partner Joe Ragno will explain a little bit about the pilot. And then finally, Mike Hanley will uh who's the township's consultant as to the uh finances of the pilot will get into those details uh for you and the public.

Okay. Thank you very much. Good evening, Mayor and Council and members of the public.

Good evening. I just want to give a a refresher uh of what is in the Lacawana Plaza redevelopment plan because it was adopted in May of 2024. So, it's been quite a while since the plan was adopted. Um the redevelopment agreement was crafted to implement and reflect various components of the redevelopment plan. So the first uh slide I have uh displayed tonight is the regulating plan uh that is in the redevelopment plan. Um it embraces the concept plan that uh the redevelopment plan was developed to advance. Uh this regulating plan identifies five buildings. You'll see building A, B, C, which are on the west side uh of this project of this 8 acre project. uh and buildings D and E which are on the east side. Um so this regulating plan identifies where these buildings are located. Uh it ties very closely to the phasing plan which if I get this correct the phasing plan um will start on the east side I'm sorry start on the west side with buildings uh A as we uh as Mr. Mr. Zimmerman may have said the construction of the supermarket which is a particularly important component of this redevelopment plan will f start in the very first phase. Uh and that is um sorry fa that is in the very first phase with building A right here. Uh also in that phase is the the rest of building A which does include the parking associated with that building. The

uh office space however that is associated with that building uh will be structured but not completed because it's not anticipated for that be that to be completed until the final phase which is uh phase the red phase shown on here. Um the second phase will be or phase B will be building B which is the building that fronts on Glen Ridge Avenue. That building includes mostly residential um and some retail at the first level as well as associated parking. And I believe part of the office space uh that's on the um west side is also included in that in that building as well. Um buildings uh D and E will be phase two 2 A and 2B that those are the residential/ retail buildings that are on the east side of uh Grove Street and those will be completed after uh phases uh 1 A and 1B which is buildings A and B are completed. The final the third phase is the building C which is an office building here at the corner of Grove Street and Bloomfield Avenue. Um and then the fourth phase will be the uh uh office component which would in the upper floors of buildings A and B. All of this uh is included in the redevelopment agreement is a timetable. um A and B will be uh which are shown in blue here will be done in the first uh 3 years of uh after start of construction. Um whereas buildings um C and uh D and E

or which are shown in green will be uh started after uh buildings A and B are completed uh and will essentially go from from years four through 8. uh building C is shown in the orange color here and then the office component which is on the top of mostly building A partially part of building B will be uh in phase four. So this kind of gives you an idea of how this project is intended to be completed. Um it's not going to take forever. We had a very def definitive time frame incorporated into the redevelopment agreement. We also included in the redevelopment agreement a discussion of the the benefits because I know there's many um questions about why are we doing this? What are the public benefits that are associated with this? So we identified them in the redevelopment agreement. Again it includes the 20% set aside for affordable housing. We will be getting 60 units of affordable housing. Uh in this project we'll in addition to that 10% of the units are reserved for workforce housing. Those are for households that make between 80 and 120% of area median income. So that those units will be uh reserved as well. Uh we'll get the supermarket uh pursuant to the redevelopment plan. It'll be between 30,000 and 50,000 square feet in size. The redevelopment plan is pretty specific about what the definition of a supermarket is. And that definition is reinforced in the redevelopment agreement. Means it's a multifunctional supermarket that serves the needs of the majority of the of the residents. It's not just a single brand or limited uh grocery store. Um we have specific historic preservation um objectives and requirements uh in the in the

redevelopment plan. They're referenced in the redevelopment agreement. P preservation of the many structures on this site that were identified in the redevelopment plan uh and incorporated by reference in the redevelopment agreement. It includes construction of a bike lane. Um the way it's designed is a cycle track along the Glenidge Avenue uh roadway within the right ofway. Uh it does we anticipate require um the expansion of the cartway on Glenidge Avenue to incorporate a uh a cycle track uh at that location. Again, the developer will be required to put in that uh cycle track, that two-way bike lane uh on Glenidge Avenue adjoining their property. It requires construction of a bus shelter uh on uh Bloomfield Avenue and it incorporates the enhanced architectural design standards that are included in the redevelopment uh plan. Absent a redevelopment plan, we do not have the ability to hold the developer to the stringent design standards that we do have in this document. Um, and it is uh quite thorough and uh one of the other benefits of the uh redevelopment process. The other significant benefit which um we have uh included in the redevelopment plan and again is referenced in the redevelopment agreement is the public open space. not just identifying the public open space as it's identified in the redevelopment plan, but committing the developer to making the the main plaza, which is this area here. It's the area that will be in front of the supermarket and adjacent to the historic waiting room. That main plaza has to be available for public events. So, we've

defined that uh in the redevelopment agreement to reinforce the fact that this is public open space. It's available for public events, including township events. Um the other public open spaces that are identified in the redevelopment plan and in the redevelopment agreement include the station area redevelopment plan, I mean the station station area plaza. And I have to say that we included these concept plans for these part these open space areas in the redevelopment plan because we want to make sure that the developers held to the designs that were presented to the township. uh including not just the um the hardscape, not just the plaza areas, but also grassy areas um and a lot of uh the landscaped areas that are associated with these with these open space areas, these plazas. Um this is the linear linear arts plaza which is on the east side uh the west the west the east side here and then um I think that is it. Yes for the public benefits. So I I would like to just wrap up the discussion of the redevelopment agreement to say that this is one step in a multi-step process. Um the resolution that has been drafted requires the developer to submit a site plan to the planning to my department uh going to the planning board to start the site plan review process which would be the next step in this process uh which will probably take um quite a uh six months to a year before the planning board before we actually get to the approval stage. So, I'd like to bring up Mike Hanley to talk about the financial aspects of the redevelopment

agreement. The financial agreement. Joe, did you want to go? Well, I was going to stole my thunder. I'm sorry. Thank you, planner. Uh, good evening.

How are you? Mike Hanley from NW Financial representing the municipality. Um you know the in addition to the redevelopment agreement we are looking at a financial agreement related to this project. There are a couple of important things we review. First and foremost whether a financial agreement and the assistance associated with that is necessary for a project like this. As um Janice clearly described, the redevelopment plan and redevelopment agreement were very important to the municipality and you worked on them for years to get to a place where you are getting the public amenities and the improvements and the type of development you want on this site. And it's a very complex development that includes um historical improvements, rehab of an existing building, infrastructure improvements, and that is can create a very expensive project. There are projects throughout the state that are facing challenges similar to this, but this is very difficult for because it has all of these highcost items. Um and while revenues have increased across development types particularly residential and industrial not as much as it relates to office um they have not kept up with the costs with interest rates and with the challenges associated with this site. So you can see on the screen you have an investment here that will be over $300 million in your community. It's a major

investment. Um, and if it were conventionally taxed, it would have a negative project value, a yield on cost that was below 5%. Um, neither of which are economically desirable for an investor. Um, even with your assistance and we think the terms that have been negotiated here and we'll go through them on a later slide, the economics are not strong for the project. Even if you determine that you want to move forward with this financial agreement, you can see the uh yield on co cost is just over 5%. Um, and you do have a slightly net negative net project value. Now this developer wants to move forward under these terms and believes that the performance of this project will exceed what's expected and what's projected and is willing to take financial risk to cause that to occur. But um you know myself and my firm have reviewed this project and we think there is no doubt that financial assistance is justified. go on to the next slide. So, you know, why wouldn't a municipality ever do something that is different from conventional taxes in the context of causing a project to move forward? And the the first reason after the development reasons and the policy reasons for getting the project that you would like to incur is financial and it's to generate more revenue than you're getting today. You know, this project is generating something like

$400,000 in taxes to you. and that is, you know, you have gotten through the redevelopment project because it is an underperforming site in your municipality. When it's fully built out, that $400,000, even with your financial assistance, will generate over $2 million in annual service charge, which is colloquially known as a pilot. Um it you know the financial agreement does not mean that the developer does not pay. The developer does pay but instead of paying as a conventional taxpayer the municipality does becomes a partner in the project and they are paid based on the revenue that's generated there. So you will be paid based as as a percentage of revenue generated on the project. That percentage of revenue is tested and you will receive an audited financial by a licensed auditor in the state of New Jersey each year. um that identifies exactly the amount of revenue that's generated and determines whether or not the projected tax payments are sufficient. And if the revenue is in fact greater, you will receive a true-up payment that is in excess of what you build. Um, and as you can see, this assumes the whole project is built as one at once, but the existing taxes of $16 million can be turned into over hund00 million over a 30-year term. Um, so we'll go on to the next slide.

The um the pilot is calculated two ways and there are some acronyms on the screen. They're the two left columns. As I discussed earlier, you have the percentage of gross revenue. So the whatever the developer brings in in revenue, you are entitled to a percentage of and I would say the terms that have been negotiated here are very favorable to the municipality as it relates to what are received in other pilots around the state. starts at 10% for 5 years, increases to 11% for 5 years, goes to 12 1.5% um through year 20 and then 13 12% from year 21 to 30. There are there's also a second test uh in the column we call it OAT. It's otherwise applicable taxes. So if the percentage of applicable taxes that is implied in the particular year is greater than the percentage of revenue that's what you will receive. Um there's an additional protection for the municipality in these agreements. The developer will have to form a limited dividend entity such that if the developer exceeded the maximum profits under the statute, those profits would have to be paid back to the municipality. All of those things are protections and benefits for the municipality. But you are a partner in the project and its success is your success. Um so I that uh is the end of the summary and happy to take questions

around the financials or uh you know I'm sure Joe and Janice can answer other questions around the documents or the plan. Counselor um we'll start with uh councelor Damato. I just have a small question. Thanks for coming out, Mike. Um, there's also uh the land the tax on the land itself stays as a as a separate stream. Is that correct? Or some portion thereof.

Yeah. So the the calculation will determine the total amount of dollars that are received. The land will not be exempt. So the project will pay land taxes throughout the time it exists and has a pilot. The those land taxes will be credited against the pilot payments that are made.

Each portion of the project as it's the credit will only apply to the portion of the projects that com that is complete at any particular time. So if 20% of the project is complete, 20% of the land tax will be credited against the pilot and the balance will continue to be land taxes. And then eventually when it's 100% there will be a credit for the land tax portion and the balance will be paid as the pilot as the remaining pilot portion. And if you were going to simplify that to for people at home, it just means that basically they still pay but there's essentially a refund for it.

Correct. Okay. I have another question which is a bigger one which is that we're looking at columns of numbers. These are all projections. Correct. These are all projections. How would you uh characterize uh uh um uh the probability of these numbers being accurate? I think I totally trust I actually very much trust your alluding all projections are not accurate, right? Especially about the future, right? I think as Yogi Bear said,

the assumptions that underly the numbers are fair. They, you know, we took a look at all the types of rents that are being collected and agree that they are reasonable rents across the development types and are likely to produce this type of a revenue stream when built out. Now, they assume that rents will grow, which is consistent with our historical experience. Um but they could grow faster, they could drop, they could grow more slowly. We are going to be a partner in the revenue stream and to the extent the developer does better we will do better as well.

Thanks council uh council Harrison just to follow up. So currently, what roughly what is the breakdown between the land taxes and the taxes on improvements on the property?

Uh I I would have to check. The total taxes are $400,000 now. I would um but I I have to look at which how it's split currently. Um but the it's as each piece is developed it will receive a new assessment both as it relates to land and improvements. Okay. And the but the the land tax will continue to be paid the same as it is now and broken down county, schools, municipal budget based on however that breakdown is for that year. Is that correct?

Correct. And the land taxes will increase, you know, as as a result of new entitlements and improvements over time. Okay. And the just the the what is your guess when the pilot play payments will start when it would they wouldn't start until the supermarket is built and generating revenue. Is that correct? Correct. you they the annual service charge begins when you have temporary cos on the building and revenue is being generated

and based on your experience about how long is that likely to take from now uh 24 36 months nothing further deputy mayor Oh, sorry. Maybe you I might have you may have actually asked my question question.

Uh yes, but I I do it's related. Um I number one um the agreement maybe you can sort of break it down into layman's terms for the people at home. So um um it says in section 4.1 um that the entity is supposed to pay us um an annual amount equal to the greatest of the minimum annual service charge or a percentage of you know the gross annual gross revenue equal to x percent or the annual service charge related to the staged adjustment. So does that mean that um what can you just explain in layman's terms what that means and also I my other question was when would we start to realize um when would we be able to anticipate getting the first

Yeah. So I mean in the short term we're going to be relying on the percentage of gross revenue. That's how we we will be paid. Um the percentage of otherwise applicable taxes really wouldn't be likely to kick in until towards the end of of the payment stream, but it will be tested each year to determine, you know, initially it's 0%. So it doesn't you know it would not be in those years but in years where it gets to 60% or 80% that might be higher than the percentage of gross revenue

councelor toler I think this has already been asked and answered but um well I know I've asked it in the past and I know the answer but I just I'm trying to put it on the record here. Sure. Uh will there be separate pilots on both residential and commercial? Well, there there are phases. So the phases of the pro it is one pilot but it will start at different times by phase. So then it's just one lump sum basically right. Mhm.

Uh well, there will portions of the project will start at and finish at different times because they're completed at different times, but it is one global agreement. Okay. And did you mention that there's a negative 6.7 million in this project value? Something about a deficit? Did I mishar that?

Yes. If the if everything goes as projected, the um developer is investing in a project that is right around a break even project. That's not the goal of most developers. This developer is taking risk on future performance that is not typical. And maybe you can't answer this might this probably might be more for the developer which we can't really ask now since you mentioned that I'm just wondering what upside would an investor see to help make up this deficit and this may not be in your wheelhouse. So there's

I mean the you know there are incentives in the world that that a developer could pursue whether it's tax credits of various kinds or um other grant monies in the world. There's also just the hope that this project outperforms what is a standard projection and that the believing in this municipality and the way it will act is will turn out better than what is expected. Thank you.

Are we councelor Birmingham? Um, thank you very much for being here. Um, do you mind just for the public and to refresh us, um, this process we looked at and you described the projected cost to build and then you look at because the these are not done pro bono. These are done for people to make money frankly. Um and then you looked at like the internal rate of return and as you said the the projected IRRa right now is lower than what is ideal for investors. Correct.

Correct. And we did, just so everyone knows, we did independently verify like we asked for a um we had our own firm verify these projected costs to make sure that they weren't being That's right. You had a professional cost expert come in to evaluate whether for some reason if these were inflated such that it would make the project appear to have more need than it did. Right. And they didn't, you know, they did not think the costs were inflated. If anything, they thought they were aggressive.

Okay. Right. They Okay. Um so and then can you just describe a little bit more what you believe are the challenge I know you know it's building on a historic site it's building over water it's building with old infrastructure it's building in the face of litigation um just some of in other words to get to the pilot numbers that we have if you just look flat at the pilots not the numbers you may look and say why aren't they But this other project, you know, that in Princeton or in Montlair, like Montlair 15 years ago, why aren't we getting these same percentiles? Can you just explain a little and it is coming back to this whole idea that the irr and the yield is

sure I mean like to try to come up with a simple example that that is easy to understand, right? Like we could have I we could look at two projects next door to each other, right? And if this project has perfect land that's buildable today and this other project has a remediation issue,

they even though they're next door to each other and they're building the same exact building with the same exact revenue stream, the project that's on a perfect site that's ready to build would have a different set of economics than this project that has cleanup, right? And so one project could have no need and the other project would have need. This project has lots of needs because it's a rehabilitation of an existing building because there are historical challenges because the municipality required certain types of improvements to be put on the project.

You know, between 10 and 20% of the project costs probably come from those needs. the infrastructure, the historical needs, the uh public space, etc. And when you drive up the cost of a project, it drives down the global economics of that project. And and I mean, I I can tell you the environment generally in the world has caused far more projects to have need than did five years ago or 10 years ago. And that's you know there are a number of cost items that have increased in a way that exceeds the value of the revenue increases. So interest rates went from you know developers borrowing at 3% on construction loans to 9% 10%. the cost of materials. We had a global pandemic, right? It's getting the um getting products to move around the world again has been significantly impacted by that and we're having tariff issues and um labor the cost of labor has gone up significantly. So I mean there are places and municipalities that had never given a pilot before 2020 that are giving them now despite the fact that we've all seen whether it's rents or costs of for sale product a significant increase on the revenue side. It hasn't outpaced the challenges of getting projects done. And can can you just clarify the land

tax credit? Is it is it on just the residential property or is it on all all of it? Because I thought it was maybe just on residential. No, the so the the commercial pieces, the land tax cannot be exempt. You would have the opportunity to exempt the land on the residential pieces. The statute allows that and that'll be a uh determined by you deputy.

When you spoke about the increased costs, what what factors into that? Are you also would we also be factoring in um costs of compliance with regulations associated with regulation, state regulations, environmental regulation? Um well certainly environmental regulations impact the cost of of constructing projects. Um the there have been some meaningful increases in the past five years associated with flooding and fire protection that that have caused uh building to be more expensive. Anyone else up here?

We're good on that end. Yes. Um, yes, Council Harrison, just to follow up on Councelor Birmingham's question, but the financial agreement does not exempt the land the residential properties are located on from It does not as it's right now. Okay. Um, members of the public that that wanted to ask a question. Yes. Oh. Um, so you want to go to the mic?

Hi, my name is David Greenbomb. Resident of Monontlair since 1966. former historic preservation commissioner. Uh uh I've been very involved with the Slackawana project for quite some time. I carry with me a great deal of institutional knowledge of the history of the project and the project and the uh the development plan. Um I have a question uh in terms of gross revenue the topline revenue number for which our income for the township the benefit to the township. Are there any offsets to those revenue figures for which we are entitled to our percentage uh that would be in the form of let's say tenant uh rent abatements or buildout expenses? Do any of those affect the revenue figures in terms of the um the actual gross numbers coming to the township? Uh yes, reimburseable expenses are often um deducted in the gross revenue calculation.

So what you're saying is that if we brought in a supermarket and we as an incentive to bring in the supermarket, if we if the landlord gave them let's say two years of free rent or um that would be a deduction in revenue if it was a free rent, right? Well, yes, there would not be revenue if it was free. And if they do any buildout, let's say for example they put in a $2 million offset to build out the space, would that in any way represent an offset to the revenues for which the township is entitled? Uh that that's should be in the cost and not create an offset. So the cost of construction even if it's a tenant fit out.

I mean it'll depend on the lease as they go forward. Right. But don't you think it's important to clarify for our purposes of evaluating our revenue projections in terms of the anticipated revenues for the township that we understand from an accounting point of view what offsets could be in fact deductions from the revenues the town would be entitled to? Yes. And so what methods do we have in place to protect us so that all these potential types of offsets, abatements, and other types of incentives for tenants do not work against the best interest of our community?

The I think the developer wants to receive as much revenue as possible. We are, as we said, a partner of the developer in this project. So to the extent they're not receiving net revenue, they're harming themselves more than the municipality. But it is customary to offer abatements and other types of incentives to attract tenants. Yes. So that perhaps could forestall revenues to the township. Certainly.

Um thank you. Um Mr. green bomb. At this point in time, I'm going to try to get some other questions if if other people in in the audience want to ask um a question and we're going to try to, you know, give like maybe one maybe two questions and just see what the time looks like here. Um if there are people Thank you. How are you today, Miss Mallaloy? Thank you for being here.

Hi, my name is Dear Draaloy. Um just have a couple of questions about um the pilot schedule um and the time frame in which first I'll ask the time frame in which you think this would be um stabilized. That's what you asked. It's going to be developed over many years as described in the redevelopment plan. eight to 10 years, you know, the the office spaces will obviously need tenants before they're built out. So, you know, we we don't know exactly when the revenue will come in. Okay.

Um but certainly it doesn't come in if the project doesn't start. I'm aware of that. I have a a real estate development background and I just wanted to ask the question so that people who do not can get clarity on and excuse me slow get clarity on that. So with regard to the pilots at what point do you think they'll start to trigger income at what phase of that time frame you just mentioned? As soon as pro pieces of the project are completed there will be income. So I would say 24 to 36 months there's going to be revenue coming into the municipality in excess of what is currently received.

So then potentially within 24 to 36 months a portion of the project will be operational and based off of the performer then you'll be able to tell the township what phase and what portion of the development will be operational to deliver what you just described. Yes. Okay. I mean, obviously it will require actions in the future, but there is a phasing plan and each in each phase there are specific amounts of development that are expected to be completed. And you expect the development to be completed, correct me if I'm incorrect, within 36 months.

No, that was when revenue will begin. When do you expect the project to be completed? entire project is on an 8 to 10 year time frame. No, I'm aware of that. I'm just trying to do the math in my head. Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

Hi, Ral Extlair resident. Um, did I I just want to be clear. data. I understand that the pilot is a 10% pilot. No, but five he can explain. Uh the initial the pilot begins at 10%. But it increases throughout the term of the pilot and it 10% uh is it correct that 10% is the minimum of a pilot can be? Mhm.

Well, there are ways to go below the minimum, but 10% is the minimum anticipated in the long-term tax exemption law, and it can last for all 30 years, which it does not. Okay. So, we are in the middle of a town cris. Your mic just went off. Yeah.

Okay. We we are now as everybody knows in a town crisis um regarding our schools. There is all kinds of discussion about pilots right now and I would like to invoke uh the memory of my friend Joan Pransky who asked why there is even a pilot on this project and to have it be the minimum when the town is going through this and we need money for our schools. I just cannot understand. And I'm not even addressing my other concerns with the plan, but I I'm shocked that this is starting at a 10% pilot. I'm just shocked.

Thank you. Um, may I can he just clarify, uh, Mr. Hanley, if you can just clarify the pilot program or the steps.

Yeah. So, as I said, it is not the minimum throughout the term. Um, in fact, it increases significantly throughout the term. It does start at 10%. Um, but increases at regular increments over the 30-year period. Additionally, when a town has financial needs, the best way to protect the existing taxpayer is to add taxpayers. And this revenue stream will be revenue that is not being generated from the existing property today and will offset costs that would otherwise have to be paid by the existing taxpayer which is everyone here.

And can we just councelor Birmingham Thank you, Mayor. Sorry. Sorry. Can we just spell out it's 10% for five years. Correct. And that's what I was looking for. And it is that is what is called typically the stabilization phase where it is typical that it is and we've gone we've talked about this. We we pushed back. We pushed back on this. 10% It's 10% for 5 years, 11% for the next 5 years, 12 a.5% for the next 10 years, and then 13.5% for the next 10 years. That's that's what it is, right? That that's correct. And as described,

the this is the type of project that The redevelopment law was designed for it's projects that would not otherwise be completed that you can't get more revenue from or meaningfully more revenue from or the develop the type of development that you want for your community and you've gone through this process for years to get to this point. Not just to generate revenue, but generating revenue is an important part of this decision. So, it's the development type, turning a nonproductive property into a more productive property, and generating revenue that offsets costs for existing taxpayers. Those are the reasons you would participate in this process if you choose to. and you none of you have voted on anything. So the you will have the opportunity to introduce and if you introduce adopt an ordinance but those would be the reasons to do it and you know if you could get 14% that would be better but it wouldn't get the project built. So that's the choice you're being asked to make

and you know you will make it one way or the other but it's not a you know the the economics of this project don't support a more aggressive pilot and frankly could support a less aggressive pilot and be justified. Council Damato please. Mr. Annley, you are our adviser. I am your adviser. Yes.

Have you in the process of looking at this calculated I mean so if we get $2 million 2.2 or whatever it is in that range of predictabilities that's top of line revenue that also has costs associated with it. Correct.

It does. Yes. How do how can residents best conceive of the costs versus you know it's not it's not pure profit as it were. Most importantly or sort of most obviously there are 300 housing units that are associated with it. Those will have costs associated with it. Do we have a benchmark of how we uh uh treat the costs associated with providing municipal services to one housing dwelling?

We do and there are there is a state model called the FAF model that we review and evaluate a cost per resident. Um, I would say it mostly overstates cost to you and because you are building an infill development in a part of town that you've been providing services for as long as Montlair has existed and government is much more a like a toll good than an incremental cost good. But we do evaluate the costs and the costs here will be will the revenues will be significantly

what is what is if I can ask just a ballpark you don't have to be you don't have to look at your notes what would be that that benchmark price per unit um it's done on a per resident basis but it's uh I think between three and 400 for this project I don't have to look And in terms of the so we have a type two school district which means that our finances are substantively separated. However, it is something that we have to think about especially at this time. What would we project would be the number of children that would be in those 300 units?

The number of children in the units is probably for this project between 20 and 30. you know the the unit mix is largely small. It's uh you know between many studios and onebedrooms which don't tend to produce any children. Um, Ruckers has studied, you know, tens of thousands of units throughout the state and continues to produce reports and update those reports that identify an expected number of children per unit. So 20 to 30 out of 300.

Yeah. We did we did two fiscal impact studies which are I believe are available on the website which we can I can forward to you. I don't have them with me tonight but we did do that analysis of the project. Yeah. Okay. So 20 to 30 let's say it's 25. Okay. And that if you take the tax the local tax levy for the schools it's approximately $21,000. So that's about probably $600. I would not use the local tax levy as the test on a per student basis because your tax levy incorporates all the costs of your schools,

not an incremental cost. A significant amount of those costs are not classroom costs, right? The you have large amounts of administration. And I I have the number. Um but it your cost per student for classroom instruction is I think in the 12 or $13,000 range. And is that part of our the fiscal impact studies that we have? Is that included? It is. Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Mr. Hanley. Um we're going to move on now. um and because we have uh quite a robust agenda. So the next thing that we have on um our agenda for the evening under presentations and discussions would be the establishment of school township committees.

Um yes, mayor. And in the I know we do have a full agenda today. And so um just briefly

um I think as a council we have been discussing the idea of forming a joint school township committee to acknowledging that um we are much interlin even though we do have um separate budgets we are much interlin. Um so I think we are in discussions with the school district to do this. It would be to explore um shared services um use of buildings um field space redevelopment plans and um sharing of pilots. Um the committee itself would have no power. It is just a deliberative information body um exploring things um and so that is where we are. We are in conversation and so we should be able to have a um resolution soon. Again, it is at this point we are thinking it will be um members of council, school board and potentially members of staff of of both town and um and then members of and the school district and members of the public will be um invited to participate. um inter and you know if there are some that are interested in shared services or some that are particularly interested in pilots and we would be able to involve them on an ad hoc basis. So that's where we are. I just wanted to um you know we can discuss that now. Um but again in the interest of time I just want to keep it short.

May um councelor Tony. Sure. Um thank you for that update. Um councelor Birmingham um I know that I emailed you requesting that we should really consider adding residents with some experience, expertise, and knowledge in both municipal government and school government. Um, I don't know if best use of those type of residents would be for ad hoc if we're really trying to come to some resolve. Um, I think it's really imperative that we invite them to the table. Um, we're not going to be voting, we're having discussions. Is that correct? To come up with something because

Right. Yeah. And I and I think we it's it's acknowledged that we do want public input. I I think to start off at least we would be looking to keep it with among council, school board and staff to sort of not go through who exactly is going to be appointed to this body because already it will be more almost 10 people on it. if we just are going with um you know it'll it'll be big enough already. So it is we we definitely want public participation and again it is deliberative so anybody can always you know give opinions and and share insights. Um but that's what our thoughts are now and again it is open for discussion for sure. I just wanted to put that and I hear you. I mean, you know, the size of the committee shouldn't really be a determining factor on who sits at the table. I think bring the right people to the table to make informed decisions and get the work done instead of

doing the work twice because now you need to seek out whoever, however. And to be honest, I'm not I just to get it started, I want to just, you know, get it started and then I think we can evolve as we go. Um, in terms of if it does seem like it's appropriate, again, it's not because it's not a power. There's no voting, you know, it's it's really just trying to get the most experienced people, knowledge, information to make the best informed decisions. I hear you and we'll we'll definitely

um so um thank you very very much for for moving this forward. Um, as we discussed in the finance committee, I thought it would be a great um, place to start with the finance committee who's already dealing with the finances and some individuals are already um, meeting with with members of the board to try to discuss shared services. So, I applaud you for um, you know, putting things down and I really would like to have the consideration given um, to the finance committee. There are three individuals there who work tirelessly to try to, you know, figure these things out. Every bit of the um the finances and so I just want to make sure that that's not dismissed as we move forward with the discussions.

I agree finance should be a part of the committee, but there's also operations. There's process and procedures. All those type of things have to be brought to that committee. So, it's not just the money, if you will, mayor, to just be respectful to just keep in mind that this is really more of an operational process and procedure, and you will need people at the table that understand the school district operations and procedures, not just the money.

And I think that that we we would definitely have that with the u members of the finance committee. Um, anyone else? Councelor Damato. Yeah, I just want to thank uh councelor Birmingham for working on that hard. Um and would say that the discussions that uh people have had about the sharing of non- tax revenue aka pilot revenue that the best practices that were suggested to us um by people like our financial adviser and others was to work around uh a committee and a shared service um framework um that would regularize it. And I would also like to say hi to our superintendent, Superintendent Turner, who is spending a night here. Uh, thanks for coming. Um,

I didn't even see her there. Wow. Um, and, uh, look, she's in the right place because a lot of people this evening were, you know, discussing things that had to do with the board. Thank you for all that you do, Dr. Turner. I did not see you back there. Um, Council Williams,

no. Okay. So, moving right along. Now, we're going to go uh to the pending ordinances on second reading. I'm going to open a hearing and uh public hearing without objections. Um, is there anyone who's present who wishes to be heard on pending ordinance 025-63, an ordinance amending chapter 327, vehicles and traffic, establishing article 9 for the sale and use of temporary no parking signs. Is there anyone present who wishes to be heard on this pending ordinance? Council members,

do you want to explain what Councelor Williams? Councelor Williams.

Yeah. So folks, this this is primarily the the genesis behind this was um the use of no temporary no parking signs in the central business district for the purpose of reserving spots so that certain establishments may have valet services in place. that really wasn't the intent of these temporary no parking signs, but there was no law in place that prohibited their use for such services. So, this right here, this ordinance right here, prohibits the use of valet parking without authorization from the township via resolution, among other things. So, the constituent that has been following up with us for several months Good.

We'll be very pleased. And just keep in mind with with ordinances, if it does get approved tonight, there is a 20day period until it becomes effective. So, please, this is second reading. Second reading. So, yes, there you go. Thank you very much. Um, okay, madame clerk. Oh, and I so move second. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Um,

yeah. Okay. Pending ordinance 0-25-64 an ordinance amending chapter 20 327 vehicles and traffic article 3 of the code of the township of Monontlair chapter 327-16 prohibiting parking at all times North Fitton Avenue. Thank you very much. Um are there members of the public who wish to be heard on this pending ordinance? Seeing none, council members So move. So move. Second. Madame clerk, please. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison,

yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Pending ordinance 0, excuse me, 0-25-65, an ordinance amending chapter 327, vehicles and traffic, article 3 of the code of township of Monontlair, chapter 327-20, time limited parking, North Fitton Avenue. Are there any members of the public who wish to be heard on this? Please come forward now. Seeing none, members of the council, does anyone wish to have any uh discussion on this? If not, so moved. Second, Madame Clerk, Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham,

yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you. Okay, now we're going to move on to new business ordinances. Uh members of the public, we do not invite you to um come forward on these, but we will have um a second reading and at that time you will have an opportunity then. So let's just start with um councelor Toller, will you please? Sure. Um this is new business ordinance uh ordinance to amend chapter 30 341-8 uh temporary service during building construction. Um I so move second. Any discussion? Yes.

Council Harrison, just a question. This at the bottom this says deleted language stricken new language underlined. Nothing is stricken or underlined. Is is this totally rewriting this section of the ordinance?

Good evening. Uh, no, this is not totally rewriting this section. Essentially, what we are requiring contractors to do is add a meter to any construction water they're doing. Previously, in the past, they just had to pay a $90 fee for water with no meter. Uh, since the end of 2024, the D has implemented a 15% unaccounted for water rule. So, you only are allowed to have 15% of unmetered water. So, what we're looking to do is reduce that any way we can. Council, I'm sorry. There's no problem with the substance of this. I just it's very difficult to know what's being changed when it isn't stricken and underlined to know what's different. The purpose is fine.

The the language we added was the meter and the backflow preventer. Everything else is exactly the same. Thank you, councelor Williams. Yeah. My only question here is I know that we provide water and sewer services for Glen Ridge and I just want to know if they're going to pass a similar ordinance because this this has to deal with metered water and you know construction and stuff like that. So So all Glen Ridg's water is metered at three entry points into Glen Ridge uh Lincoln Street, Bay Street and Ridgewood and Watch. So anything that would pass through those meters would already be metered on their end. So we are charging them for that whether theirs is unmuted or not. May I? Thank you deputy.

So this is just only during construction um or rehab of a property. Yes. That this is um so that this applies to So we any service that a residential service commercial service is required to have a meter as it stands. But previously during construction they weren't required to have a meter. Um, and the other thing we're doing to protect the system as well as the users of the system is to require a backflow pre. So if there is a problem in the system, it creates negative pressure and god forbid they have a hose into something, we won't suck whatever it is back into the system and create a larger issue. Thank you. Thank you very much. Um, anything? No.

Anyone? Was it moved? And there's a second. Okay. Thank you very much, Madam Clerk. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Um, that's um, Councelor Williams. Ordinance to amend ordinance section 327.

All right, I'm done. -5 vehicles, a one-way street code um of the township of Montlair, New Jersey. This is going to uh create a oneway on Lynen Avenue. And after about 20 years of trying to encourage people not to make an illegal lefthand turn there and cause a lot of distress for people that are trying to cross there, um this is now a a suggestion. Um and I so move second I'll third it. Thank you. Um discussion just one. Yes. Councelor Harrison.

Having observed people doing this maneuver for many years I supported this. I think it would be good for the township to pay attention to what changes people do that might change divert traffic to other streets and may need fixes there as well. because it's the logical thing to come around and then go down Granada. And Granada is not really a street to have Yeah. a lot of traffic just to monitor where people do if they I've been asking for signs since I got here. You know, I I see it every day. Uh I hear it from the residents

and no question. It's definitely needed. It is um Thank you. I agree with you wholeheartedly um councelor Toller. It it is a start and I agree with you. Um also wholeheartedly councelor Harrison. Yes. Um council councelor you said you've been I'm sorry mayor. I'm sorry. Councelor Birmingham. Yes sir. You said you've been at Is this addressing that or this is one of them? Yeah. Sure. Okay. And there are others and when I say signs I just mean regular signs like 25 mile per hour signs being installed. You know I counted nine on Upper Mountain Avenue and none on Orange Road.

Okay. And so to further address uh further answer your question uh councelor Birmingham there are so many signs at this particular area slow you know seniors crossing there's maybe six or more signs there um some of which thanks to councelor Toller some of which to then councilwoman Baskerville no turn you know and people just drive up to them and they continue to go there because they think it's like a thoroughare to get to the um parkway. But yeah, there's a bunch of signs there. Um so, count um Madame Clerk, please. Roll call.

Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Tolder, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you, Councelor Williams. And I won't jump in this time. My bad. I couldn't help myself. 20 years. 20 years. And I'm so sorry. Yes. Are you're going to Are you Are you reading the next number agenda the ordinance that's attached is not the one that I finalized for which the candidate? Okay. It's Thank you. I'm sorry. I just received the packet that's so I didn't see that it's not the one that I final.

Should we pull it? Okay. All right. to table it. All right, then. Um, until when's our next meeting? The 10th 10th of February. Okay, moving on. Ordinance. Um, thank you, attorney. Okay. Yes. Uh, ordinance to new business. Ordinance to amend chapter 3, administration of government of the code of township of Monontlair, Essex County. Oh, this is the deputy mayor. Why is this uh in the ordinance?

I don't know. Um and I don't even see it in here. This should be a resolution, right? No, ordinance. Does it need to be renewed the ordinance? Someone asked No, but someone asked the ordinance to be changed. Is it to include the terms to include a term of one year? Oh, I see. To the

council. Gotcha. Makes sense. I'll I'll move this forward here, but I just um and I I know I didn't ask for permission to start rambling yet, but I I think that this needs a little some tweaking here because um my question when I I read this at home was when's the oneear start? Does it start now? Does it start, you know, it it just needs some some tweaking here?

Okay. Um and so I don't know if it's substantive but when we came on we there was you know some people remember things a little differently so as to avoid that this was in in my mind the way it was discussed and it would be from the July time. So since we've now moved on into we're in another period now and so you know just to go to to July and then that way can be reconsidered that person can be reconsidered again or the council can you know reconsider another individual or what but I was thinking that um and it's it's often used in in many different um municipalities and it's been used here for a one-term period and so should we just add in there to begin uh July if that's when you know the beginning in July um whatever that that meeting is

like when we did this right we did it even before the the first meeting so I think to July to July and then you know like July 1 yes counselor toler I'm sorry if he's looking for timelines that's fine I think if we're if we all agree it's a year July 1 through July July 30th and the next appointment will be July 1. Right. I don't know if that's substantive. That's substantive. Okay. So, we will hold this and then put it next time to Yes. Um but we can introduce we can make that change and introduce it tonight. Okay. This is on first reading. Thank you. All right. Um and so did you move that?

No. Nobody. I'll move it. I I'll second it. Okay. Discussion. I'm against it. I don't think there's any I think that there's like zero reason to put a fixed limit. Uh you could make a resolution when you appoint somebody that there's a limit to it. You can always change the deputy mayor, but there's no what's the gain? What's the problem that this solves? aside from maybe some personal, you know, beefing, it just doesn't solve a problem and it and it limits us.

I think it's an equitable I think it's an equitable way for anyone that wishes to serve, not just on this administration, future administrations. Is it a fair play for every single person up here to have an opportunity?

And I'm not I'm not um understanding completely your remarks about personal beefing. I will explain um to you when when I thought about this uh when we voted in July, some of us recall that it was supposed to be one year and then and then revisit and some didn't so as not to have confusion and there's been confusion in other councils. And it's really not personal beefing about anyone because if you you listen to what's happening here, my thought is that since we've passed that one-year time, we just move to one year, which would be July, which really gives an individual longer this time because we didn't really have something in place. I don't want subsequent councils to go through this and not to have anything in place so that they know that after a year they they revisit that and the council you know may wish to have someone else be considered and they may wish not to but I don't think there's anything you know it's not like um beef with that and it extends the time period that we we some of us recall that we said before because we just didn't do it after a year, right? So now I'm saying we go to July and then at that time if you or Eileen or anyone else wishes to be considered, I think they should be able to be considered.

Okay, I understand that that that's your position. From what I've seen and what I feel, it does feel like it's driven by the existing circum interpersonal circumstances. But more importantly, the question is, why is this position suddenly needing to be subject to a one-year limit when tonight on the agenda there are resolutions to reappoint people to positions they've had for 20 years? Why is it bad that a deputy mayor rolls into 14 months when I mean, you know, when people have been in in in similar civic positions here for decades and that's why it's a little inongruous and I just feel like I mean, I'm just not going to vote for it. I would vote for something that said that during a reorganization meeting it could be done. That's a little more bland. But limiting one person to a one-year term when this body has, if anything, gone out of its way to have extremely long tenurs for people that serve in town. Like wildly long. So, so it just it it just doesn't sit right at all. But I would say that I think a common sense middle ground position would be to say that the deputy mayor will be appointed during the reorganization meeting.

Well, that that that's fine with me and that that actually should be once a year and so yeah, so we can we can change the language if if you like that better. Um and I appreciate your suggestion. I think that that's well well thought through cookies. We agree on something that's awesome. No, no, I'm just saying it's not I think it's I mean it's clearly substantive. So we Yeah. Okay. But we could reintroduce and it was um Yeah. I had requested if this could be that a little bit more a little bit time for the next meeting anyway. Um I wanted to look at Michael. Well, it it comes out to be Yeah, it comes out to be one year. And so I I I'd like to move this um and we already moved it and seconded. Yes.

Okay. Is there any further discussion? Yes, I just wanted to again say this is a more equitable way and I think councelor Damato a while back stated that he didn't like to see uh the same people being recycled to certain commissions or boards if you will and this is a perfect way to not do that. Let's do it for all of them. We can I'd like to hear from councel Harrison please. Okay. I I have since I thankfully wasn't part of the initial determination.

Right. I I have a I have a different take on this one. I totally disagree with Councilman Damato on it is highly beneficial for people willing to serve sometimes not but frequently to have people serve for long terms and I'm not of the view that automatically the deputy mayor should be changed every year but what the existing ordinance says serve a term to be determined by the council which means at any point time the council can just say, "Hi, you've served 19 months. Goodbye." That's right. And that's not a good thing. Right.

I think people should be for a fixed known term. And I think what's being proposed, not to say they can't be reappointed, but to say at any point a majority of the council can say, "Well, we don't like you as deputy mayor. Goodbye." I don't think is a good way to do business either. So, I think changing it is good. I think changing it so everyone knows each July we're going to vote and could be the same person, could be a different person. Could be the same person, different person. We agree. All right. Um, Mayor, I'm I'm Oh, I'm so sorry. Deputy, huh? I'm sorry. Was council deputy.

Yeah. Again, it goes back to what what the um what the issue is that we want to fix. And it sounds to me, it's not clear to me based on the discussion that the language as stated here is actually fixing the issue that we want to fix. So, um I mean we can s somebody can suggest different language. Um we can have it read appoint a deputy mayor um each July at the July 1st um for a term of one year um and you know maybe make it explicit that whoever is appointed um may be reappointed like something something a little bit more because the way it reads it's it's not clear the intent of of the council. So, um, that's my take on it.

Thank you. And I think that that we we established, um, that the the language, um, since this is on first reading, the language can be tightened up. Um,

I think that um, councelor Demato suggested a time and and councelor Toller suggested from July to July you want to do it at the reorganization reorganization meeting that's fine. I mean it's reorganization. I think you can find the language in any Falner act thing as it applies to the mayor in most of them. You just say you know at a reorganization meeting the council will elect a de a deputy mayor. I I have no problem concerning it. I just want to make sure that I have the right uh statutes.

Yeah. Uh and and and we will that pertains to the township in terms of the reorganization because Okay. Um madam clerk, roll call, please.

I asked the attorney if she had the language she needed for this and she said no. So Oh, I'm sorry. I thought councelor Harrison said that we can go ahead because it's on the first reading. Is that not accurate? We we we can, but my understanding is our attorney has requested time to make sure it is worded correctly. Yeah. Okay. All right. So, I'm not on the spot. I'm sorry. It's not on the spot. I'm not used to drafting. I'm going to request me to Well, yeah, but I'm not even going to respond to that because it wasn't on the spot when when we got it. We We could have we could have done that, but um thank you, Councelor Harrison, and thank you, Attorney. And so I will table this until the what's the date of the meeting?

February 10th. February the 10th.

And I'd like that the language to be read from the reorganization meeting. And then we could probably have that corrected by, you know, probably tomorrow. The next one, please. Who wants to do the next? Is that you? Um, deputy. Bill's list. So moved. I'm sorry, you read it already. Bill's list. Okay. Councelor Toller. Yes. I know you have something. I just have one question. Come on, counsel the door. Excuse me, mayor. Can I have a second? Second. Thank you.

Um, I'm just trying to understand. There's a vendor here. Um, it's Rick Ranger and one of the purchase letters is for paper towels for the crescent deck. I'm just the use and the purpose. And there are portable heaters and garage heaters. Are that is that for um the employees that work there? Okay. Paper towels are probably for uh the restrooms that are there. I don't know. I'm just asking. Yes, the paper the paper towels. Good evening everyone. The uh the paper towels are for the restroom. They're the the rolls of paper towels like we have here. Okay. For the for the bathroom and the uh heaters were for the uh toys.

If someone else has another question. Anyone have any um anything on the bill's list, please? I have a question. Harrison, I'll ask the manager. It's not affecting that we should be paying it. It's just I was puzzled and I'll ask him separately to and I just want to know public service. Are we up to speed and Verizon Wireless? Because I I see public service payment on here, but I didn't see anything for Verizon Wireless. Has that been satisfied? I believe there are rears for uh Verizon. I'm not sure the status of PSENG perhaps anyone because it was quite a bit of

I would defer to either Norma or Tarot you right uh councelor I could give you the the PSNG um bills that are on the bills list are from two sets of payments the last meeting MSI was closed down So, these are from two separate um payments. There's a number of bills pending. There'll be a number similar to this. On the next um bills list, but these represent mostly December payments that weren't on the bills list because MSI was shut down.

Thank you. I just I know I see them here and I know that we've been paying them every month. So, thank you for that. Um but like I said, my question was about Verizon Wireless. There was like $250,000 or something that was owed. Has that been satisfied or when will it be satisfied? We're working on it.

It was moved and there was a second. Yes. Madam Clerk, please. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes. Councelor Toller. Yes. Councelor Williams. Yes. Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Um the um this is yeah councelor Williams this is your night. Uh new business resolution resolution of the mayor and township council expressing support for legislation authorizing municipal use of traffic enforcement cameras. Uh so move second discussion.

Yeah. So, just to give a background to folks watching at home and folks sitting here, this is basically a resolution in support of the state legislature taking up legislation to allow for camera enforcing for traffic enforcement via cameras, which is currently not legal in the state of New Jersey. So, you know, many folks that have come up to me that I that I've seen, I don't want to make it sound like it's a bunch of folks, but people have come up to me and said, "Hey, why can't, you know, we put up cameras like they do in New York or whatever the case may be?" Well, it's illegal. Um, this will also help because we we can't post a you know, a police officer at every problematic corner indefinitely. This would allow for, you know, the traffic to kind of um the cameras to do the enforcement. I I would envision traffic cameras around schools to enforce, you know, uh the speed limit and and things of that nature. So, this is uh the intent here. And if this does pass, I I know that, you know, maybe not everyone is is in support of this. Uh if this does pass then this resolution would go to our state representatives and also the governor.

Discussion. Councelor Toller. Yes. Um I know I just have a question really more about the license plates readers because when we had the police department here, they specifically stated that they were using them for one purpose and we've I know I've seen heard from residents that they're being pulled over because their plates are being red. We want to make sure that this is not going to tie into that. Um because you know we say one thing and then we do the other all the time.

Well, this this has to get into the this this right now has to get into the hands of our state uh reps and there's going to be a long lead time before you know something happens here with the state with the license plate readers. I think we probably speak to Chief Confori and and discuss that issue. Somebody did come up to me and and say that as well with the license plate readers, but you know that totally separate issue. No, I agree. But I just wanted to make sure that this wasn't going to be similar because I did email the chief and the deputy chief and I haven't heard back. So, I just wanted to put that on the record for people at

Deputy Mayor.

Um, so I am in favor of this resolution. Um I think it's consistent with our vision zero goals. You know um residents uh re reach out to all of us um about speeding. You know there's just this just an impossibility for um police officers to be stationed on at every single intersection and and roadway. Um I I hear of uh you know cars passing school buses. So, um, this is simply a resolution to ask that the legislature, um, you know, as as councelor Williams said, takes takes this on. And I understand that there were, um, bills already, um, that were discussed by the legislature in the last couple of years, but didn't get um get any headway. Um, I mean, like councelor Williams said, I mean there are other states that explicitly allow them um to for instance um to enforce speed um or you know some of them like limit the cameras to certain zones like school zones or high crash um high injury zones. Um and this resolution as drafted also, you know, asks the uh legislature to um consider um safeguards like um limits on data retention and privacy and things that um we ought to be concerned about. So um it's not enacting it's not us enacting anything. It's just asking the state to consider um taking this on. So um I'm in I'm in support. I I just um I did have I did request a few corrections, small non-s substantive corrections. Um I emailed them um uh earlier today, just some punctuation and um and um I would also suggest that we um specify the names of the um the legislators that we want this to be sent to. Um, so if those corrections are made, um, I would be in favor of, you know, I think all as long as those correction

So were they made they were made and there's not. Okay. May I and and all of the um all of the legislators, right? I mean, did you just want to do So if you'd like, I can make a motion to amend. I can make a motion to amend

before we act on it. Okay. Is that all right with everyone? So the suggested changes are in the last whereas paragraph um replacing the semicolon with a period and striking the and then in the last uh paragraph the be it last be it further resolved um it should read uh be it further resolved that the township clerk is directed to transmit a certified copy of this resolution to the governor of the state of New Jersey Mike Cheryl the president of the New Jersey Senate, um, Nicholas Cutari, the Speaker of the New Jersey General Assembly, Craig Coughlin, and New Jersey, I'm sorry, New Jersey State Senator John F. McKeon, and New Jersey State Assembly persons Rosara Begali and Alexon Koyas Skill. That's it.

Um, yes, Council Williams. And just one last thing because you know I don't like to speak too much. I just want to thank uh you've had a good time Damato for you know uh being the co-sponsor of of this resolution of support. So thank you very much. I'm just I'm just trying to understand why we wouldn't send it to to all of them. I know you know who represents us. I know that very well. But I'm just trying to figure out why we wouldn't send a copy of it to all of them. I'm sorry, Councelor Harrison.

I am opposed to this resolution. I want to go through the reasons. One, it is a singularly ineffectual way to get any legislation passed to support a concept. Two, participation. And given that the legislature has not introduced a general bill repealing the existing statute, I'm not sure this goes anywhere. There were two bills in the legislature last year, both of which passed the assembly and had appropriate safeguards to address privacy. They were specific one to school buses, one to regular buses um to deal with the situation. They had the safeguards to have a resolution that that says that we urged the legislation to include safeguards to ensure privacy protection. If this if a bill goes somewhere, someone's going to wave say Monontlair supports this even if it doesn't have appropriate safeguards. and I want would want to see what the safeguards are and they're doing it and forgetting general big brother concerns. My biggest concern is called ICE and suddenly having cameras recording cars driving by that's going to be available no matter what they do or I'd like to see what safeguards that suddenly these very nice people who have decided immigrants are horrible people

being able to say here's a license plate that was driving here there's the person who entered the country improperly who owns that car and being able to chase after them is something that I want to be very cautious before we start doing it. Also want to bring out a little practical concern. When the cameras were allowed, NORC had them and what was discovered was all the their traffic lights did not have the proper timing of the yellow light. And so all the people who were issued a ticket for running a red light was invalidated because the traffic lights were not properly timed. So that would mean if we're going to do something in town, we're going to have to check every single traffic light and verify it is exactly 3 seconds of the yellow. Otherwise, it's a meaningless gesture and it's an obligation we would have. So I think I would strongly supporting the two bills that were passed in the assembly with the safeguards and doing that and meeting with our legislators and say would you do it and can you put in these safeguards and then supporting a bill doing it but there

that other than the ICE concern and I this is a scary world we're living indeed and I don't want to do anything that gives certain federal agencies an ability to track people that they do not currently have. Um, Councelor Damato and then Councelor Williams.

So, uh, I, uh, totally am fine, uh, and applaud, uh, Councelor Harrison in in being very concerned about the civil liberties aspects of this. I think that that's totally square. Uh totally fine. Um I would say we are already we have already voted to have cameras that are going to be tracking cars in the form of the safety sticks. So it is a and I do not see how that would be different if it is our own loop. And more importantly, one of the reasons that's unsaid, I think even in the resolution for why people in progressive communities support traffic cameras is because of of the of their use as being antibbias. Because people don't get stopped for what they look like. The cameras don't care who you are. The cameras take a picture of the car or they'll take a picture just of the license plate. And that is one of the reasons really people get behind it. Um and and I I just think that that you know so I understand your concerns. I think that that's fine. I also understand your point and I take it very well uh to heart about you know not having a lot of resolutions that are not about specific legislation. I think that that's quite compelling. I also think it's fine and maybe a good thing that we disagree and vote against each other on these things. I recall that I didn't vote for the climate super fund act and you didn't vote for the rank choice voting one. So if you vote against it, it's in a great tradition. Uh but but I I do like it on on the margins. I think it's it's a positive thing to push.

Council Williams, I'll go after him. Um I'm sorry, Councelor Toller. I No, you you know my my stance on back and forth. I agree with everything that uh Councilman Damato said and I'll I'll yield to Council Lola. Thanks. Um Council Damato, can you just clarify what you mean by um people being pulled over? What What was your statement again? You said something about these license plate, not the license plate, the cameras don't pull people over.

Yeah. In other words, like a a general and very I think a a fear that we all have or or reality is that when people are pulled over by the police, it's the police are looking at who's in the car. And the point is that these cameras are automatic. They don't care who's in the car. They're taking a picture of the bottom of the car. Yeah. That that's that's there's no there's no facts to prove that. Speaking as a African-American woman, I'm gonna get pulled over two times more likely because of a camera than you. A camera? Why? No, I'm saying you're saying it's not going to matter who's in the car. That's not true. That's not true. I don't I don't understand what you're saying. I know you don't cuz you don't get pulled over like I do.

So quick so quick question. So what he's saying is what he's saying is the camera doesn't matter who it's taking a picture of. So when the police get there, it's not going to matter who's in the car. That's inaccurate. That That's not That's not how the technology works at all. It's not It's not real time. It takes a picture and then it mails it to your house, right? It mails the ticket to your house. So, law law enforcement is not actually on the scene and the law enforcement that reviews the situation is in a station somewhere. So, there's no there's no interaction with the police actually. And more than that, it's not a criminal. I'm sorry. Were you finished on this end?

I'm just I'm just trying to debate, if you will, because he's saying there's no interaction with the police and we're saying and I'm asking him that he knows that. We don't know.

No, I Okay. And if a ticket does go out, is the ticket just going to be mailed out? Is it going to be hand delivered? Is it somebody they've been looking for? We don't know. Those are questions that you don't have. We we actually do know because we have the one of the largest cities in the country that utilizes this technology and it's it's already in play when you speed in in a school zone. And I I'll notice not that I did it, but somebody I know did it. Um the ticket comes and it it has a picture of you. There was no police officer that you know came over to you. So the police officer is not involved on the scene. And that's that's actually the whole purpose of this where their police officer isn't involved in it. So you don't have any sort of um

I understand that situation. I understand that part. But I'm saying when the ticket is issued, okay, there are opportunities where the police can say I'd like to issue this myself instead of mail it out. We don't know that. No, we don't know that. Okay. Um it's not a good idea. So did you do you want to say something else on this side? Hold on. Just one last there's another point that makes these good which is that because it's very inexpensive to do. You can actually lower the price of a ticket.

And by lowering the price of the ticket, experts have found that it actually becomes more certain and people will respond to it and speed less. And if they are hit with a fine, it's less of a sort of personal, you know, cataclysm for them. So you can have a $25 ticket and it makes sense. Again, it's, you know, we're not inventing this. I think it's 43 other states, 41 or 43 other states and they do it. And there there we can learn from the experiences of them. For example, you don't necessarily put the camera near a hospital because you want to, you know, give a little grace to people who may be rushing to the emergency room there. You know, we're not inventing the wheel. We just want to be like other progressive places that are concerned about traffic safety and despite what your fears are, concerned about having cops, you know, stopping people and and it's it's a low impact way to get a good result.

So, I think it might be a good idea to pull this until the next meeting because councelor Harrison brought up some very very good points quite frankly and I hadn't thought about them. Thank you, Councelor Harrison. regarding ICE and other people. Um, and so I mean, is there any reason that we have to vote on this today? I'd like to get some more information and some more some more data to substantiate the things that have been said here. I I think I think we should vote on it. I'm sorry. I think we should vote on it and if it votes down, it votes down. Just don't do it. I I I mean there's there's no reason to to pull it. Just just vote no. Oh, I mean Okay, that I mean that that's fine. Um I mean

you have expressed yourself a couple of times on this. They have and I I was just expressing myself because I had not given thought to that in general you know I like the idea but I certainly now have some questions about you know how this will be used and if it's going to be used in a negative way you know to actually bring attention to black and brown people then I'm definitely not wanting to vote for that. Councelor Birmingham.

Um, yeah, I I I will admit that a ticket came to my household um from New York City. Um, it wasn't me, but but that's the issue. That's the that was one thing. It came because there was speeding in the school zone. It's not attached to any particular driver. Um, and there's no points on your license. And so in a way in terms of like um just help trying to do what you want to do in terms of stopping people from doing something it was somewhat like oh yeah got to be more careful but it's not like oh I've got to go to class for my insurance or my insurance is going to go up etc. I know I will also recommend pulling this right now because I I feel this genuine fear here and I but I do think other states have used this. I I would encourage us all to look at the study that was done in Woodbridge, New Jersey, uh where they found they they put um cameras on school buses and they saw that each school bus an average of over two times a day was being passed by cars. And so I think that's part of the reason for this legislation because that is something you cannot have one police officer following around every school bus. Like that's just not possible to do. But at the same time, as somebody who almost watched my daughter get hit by a car when when she was crossing the street,

I do think it's something that needs to be addressed and this is a way potentially of addressing it. But I do hear the concerns. I do think we should look at school bus legislation and if that is a place to start. Um anyway,

that's and that's one of the bills in the legislature did that and I think moving slowly given the risks is a better path and I and and a more practical path. It's much more likely that two bills that passed the assembly last year are going to move forward in the near future and supporting those and pushing them rather than a pie in the sky. We hope something will happen. I mean, the reason the law exists is because of the public outcry that happened when towns were allowed to install. It wasn't just let's do away. It's because people were yelling and complaining. And I'm not sure given this the sponsor of that legislation banning them is still sitting there in the Senate. I'm not sure how likely something like that's to pass. And I'd rather do something practical that is limited. You know, in the same way the safety sticks, which I also did raise concerns about when we had and we haven't gotten to the implementation step. It's very different taking a picture parked of a car parked in a parking space versus cars traveling on the roads. Mm-m.

One car versus hundreds of thousands of cars going through an intersection. And so I think that there are um a lot of very strong and compelling reasons for for both. I I certainly would like to get your information um councelor Birmingham from the Woodbridge. So, is there again I'd like to suggest that we we pull this and just put it on the next um meeting and that should give everybody enough time. Certainly, it'll give me me plenty of time to get to these um other things that you're suggesting and the things that you're suggesting. Can we add self-service gas for the next one?

It's a joke. Come on. resolution. No, I was waiting to hear from you. What's I mean it's it's late everybody. I I don't have anything else to say on the topic. We'll just reintroduce it after folks, you know, take their time to do the diligence. Thank you.

Yes. The next one um is our deputy mayor This is a resolution appointing alternates to the environmental commission. Um, and I so move second. Any discussion on that? Madame clerk. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes. Councelor Toller. Yes. Councelor Williams. Mayor Baskerville.

Yes. Councelor Harrison, please. Number four. This is a resolution appointing members to the people with disabilities advisory committee. There was some back and forth as to whether all these people wanted to be so it just marshal. Okay. And the other two do not wish to be on there. Okay. Okay. So I would like to move it by amending it so that only Marsha Fuselli is being reappointed um to the committee. Second. Second. Any discussion? Madame Clerk.

Deputy Mayor Anderson. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes. Councelor Toller. Yes. Councelor Williams. Yes. Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Um, number five, I would like to have that discussion when we go into the executive discussion number six. Um, councelor Birmingham, please. Well, does that have to go to um does that have to go for or is everybody fine with that one? Huh? Executive session for number five also, please. So that's number five and six.

Five and six to come out and we'll discuss them in executive session. Number um seven please. Um resol this is a resolution appointing Phoenix adviserss to the position of temporary chief financial officer and director of the department of finance. And I so move second. Any discussion? the the the resolution we have has a blank for the account number that the funds are coming out of. It would come out of um Department of Finance uh OE the other expenses uh account line item.

It's listed on the uh the cert certification of funds there there's a cert there's an attached certification of funds with the account number. Okay. So it did. So that account number should be put in the resolution. Correct. Yeah. Okay. Anyone else? Madame clerk, please. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you. Um,

next please is Council Damato. Resolution amending resolution R25397 of Township of Montlair County of Essex, State of New Jersey, authorizing the submission of a grant application to New Jersey Department of Community Affairs for 2026 police and fire capital improvements. So moved. I'm sorry. Okay. U second. Okay. Discussion. Didn't we accept this money already? No, this is No, it's due by

No, it's due by January 31st. So, we have to approve this. The mayor has to sign it and it has to be uploaded or the manager has to sign it uploaded back to DCA by the 31st of this month. It's a grant application. It's a grant application. So, question was this your sponsor? Yes. Okay. So 200 So except the money, $200,000 gets done. Is that all that's required for this building?

No, it's not. This is a money that I sought out working with the assembly woman to ease the tax burden on our residents for repairs for station 3. No, this is not the complete amount of money that's needed. Further question would now you secured this money specifically for that was my ask. Yes. Firehouse three. Mhm. But there's going to be additional funds that are required for to complete the firehouse. Correct.

How much? Uh right now I believe there's 125 or 150 left over from the original 500,000 that was allotted for station 3. Uh under the past administration I believe 375 was spent. Um our former CFO before she left allotted 600,000 in an account line of the Mr. Mark's budget to 600,000. Uh, I'm pretty sure the fire chief has emailed every single one of us up here with numbers and the amount, but I will go over it again. Uh, middle, no, I'm sorry. Minimum 800,000, maximum 1 million. Again, this is 200,000. We have 145 in the kitty. There is 600,000 in an account line that would have to be moved by ordinance. And we're at the number to put the repairs in for station three.

Okay. So, and this is, you know, I I know that you want to get this thing done, but firehouse one needs, I think, a new roof. So, the money was already paid for that. Was that not the case, Council Birmingham? Did we not approve that at the last meeting? New roof. We We've approved that and we It was on the last bill list. I thought it No, I said Firehouse one. Isn't that Pine Street? Pine Street. Okay. So, what is your statement? Well, my point being here is that Firehouse 3 and I it's

has been uh vacant for I don't know 2 three years and you have other firehouses that are currently being used that need to be repaired. Mhm.

Why Why use these funds right here to repair a vacant firehouse? Hold on. I know what you're asking. I'm just saying. And then there's additional funds that are going to have to come after this to rehabilitate a vacant uh firehouse. And you know, taxpayer dollars, you know, are at a premium, why not allocate it to the firehouses that are currently being occupied? Um, again, this was my specific ask to the assembly woman. As I stated previously, uh, listening to the residents of Ward 4 in the south end who would like to see the firehouse reopen for a host of reasons why it was closed in the beginning was under a past administration. It was closed for repairs to bring it up to compliance. For whatever reason, this past administration did not decide to repair it to finish the funds. The money is still there. This money will help lessen the burden on the taxpayers. As I said before on the repairs, okay, the residents in the south end, you've heard from many of them. You've heard from the business district. They would like to see this firehouse open. They deserve to see this firehouse open. And to sit here and question why I'm requesting this money for this specific firehouse when we've all received emails from our fire chief with tons of information. We have a report here that shows that the firehouse should need to be open. This isn't about staffing. This isn't about personnel. This is about reopening a firehouse that serves as a safe haven in the community. It serves as a polling place. We have three or four schools in the neighborhood and the residents in the south end shouldn't have to wait for Valley Road to come put a fire out. Mayor.

Yes. Councelor Damato, I'm gonna with all respect to you, to everybody who is concerned about this. We are face, we're at a very important decision point in this community. We have degrading facilities, most importantly, our police building. And until we can secure one station for our police department, the idea that we're going to go out of our way to spend millions on a I never said I didn't say millions. It will cost millions. No, it will not counsel. I just want to allow

over time to to finish and then I'll call on you. Until we can build, until we can secure a single police station, the idea that we have to have an extra police fire station, which by the way, we have just received a very comprehensive professional review which made it extremely clear that there is there are no data which suggests that that this station is needed. Um, I can understand if people would like to have it, that's fine. I have no, you know, no problem with people saying that or believing that it's okay. But we're talking about wants and needs now that are very acute. And if we we have to focus for the time being on building a police station, and that's going to cost a lot of money. The the fire stations, other ones, which are the north end of town and the south end of town, they are perfectly matched. We need to be careful with our money. This is not saving us money. This is going to be this is a a an open door to spending a lot of money that we needn't spend. And and I think that that building can have a great life as something else. I mean, we have put money into it. It's fine. It's a historic structure. But but but residents of every part of town should understand that that again we have we have data which shows that there is no need no need to have this this third firehouse which by the way cannot be made as it's currently constructed into a safe working environment which is another thing there is no way that is it is a 100-year-old building in which people would be sleeping above fumes so what I would suggest is that we don't don't have to close the door on it today. But if we just um

remove one or two lines from this, we can accept the grant fully and at a later date we could program the money there if we so decided it. But to hold us to this three-station fire model when we don't have a we don't have a police station in a few years is something that will be an enormous mistake. Councelor Harrison. Okay. Do you have anything? Councelor Toller. No, I just wanted to respond to councelor Damato where his thought process is the south end doesn't matter. Um it's not Well, no counselor toler, you know. Um again,

so you're comfortable with sending money back, free money back for repairs? No. And there's money that's already in an account line for station 3. So I'm just trying to ask you to tell me how this makes sense. This has nothing to do with salaries or staffing that some of my colleagues have an issue or problem with. You've heard from residents. You've heard from the businesses in the south end. Okay? This station house was closed for repairs for a reason. And it the repairs were not finished. I don't understand why we can't just open the firehouse and return those staff members back to where they used to live. This is there's nothing more more to say about this. This just doesn't make any sense. since you mischaracterized.

Councelor Toller. Okay. So, councelor Toller, I I respect what you said and I just need clarification because I I agree with what you're saying and I want to know when you applied for the money. Yes.

Was it very specific that we were going after the money for um station three? Now I want to tell you that I participated in a very wonderful acceptance of monies for fire station 3. We had pictures. We had the assembly person senate. We had everybody there and it said even the check, you know how they give you one of those large checks, it says firehouse three on there. So my idea then is that this money needs to be purposed for the reason that we took the money. I'm in a position, just so you'll know, I've got before me something that I need to sign to accept the money. And I questioned that because on the thing that they want me, the papers they want me to sign, it does not say station three. And I raised that question and I said, I don't feel comfortable signing this until it says station three. Because if that was on the grant when you went and and you petitioned our legislators and were very successful and thank you then to me I don't understand no matter what somebody else thinks where the money should go and yes we need plenty of money. Some people might say, you know, we need to give it to the schools. So, we do need money. But the question is, if you went and you petitioned it for a specific purpose, then how can we now just pick pick where

I don't know, Madam Mayor, and I just wanted to also say that this report, even though councelor Damato says it doesn't specify, there is a time frame in here that talks about the differences. And I think it's either one or two minutes. And for me personally, I'm not willing to jeopardize any residents over one or two minutes and and some money. It's just it doesn't make sense. So I just wanted to clarify that there is a difference in here if you read the executive summary. So what are we doing now? May I counselor Harrison? There's a lot of talk for like this is council to let's hear um councelor Harrison then I'll come back to you. Yes councelor Harrison.

I a couple things to say. one, I read the report and I don't agree that it comes out with a conclusion firehouse 3 is not necessary. I I don't agree that it says it's a it's absolutely necessary. I think we have to have a larger discussion on what we're doing with the fire department based on that report, make conclusions. Second, not particularly relevant. This whole legislative process that happens every budget year where bunches of legislators throw things in the agenda, many of which are very worthwhile projects as this one is it's not a good way for the state to budget things. But I'm not going to fix that in my lifetime, unfortunately. Even assuming I'm living another 20 years, it's

they like it unless a governor puts his or her foot down and says I ain't approve line item vetoing every one of these and we're going to keep doing it. But there's no question that the what was put in the budget was for firehouse 3.

The had a big ceremony announcing it and doing that. I think it would be inappropriate for the town to take the money and use it for something else. I think firehouse 3, regardless of whether it ends up being a firehouse or for some other public purpose, is a building that needs to be repaired. I agree with councelor Damato on police. That's a priority. We're working hard on that. But I don't I think it's a separate decision whether we're doing all the repairs to the firehouse that are necessary, but there's certainly a valid use for $200,000 to be used.

Of course, you know,

members of the council have been trying to find places other than schools to have polling places. Firehouse 3 was used as a polling place for years. could certainly serve as one probably two polling places if it was building was fixed up. And if even if it's just done for that purpose, it would help meet a a very real need that we have. So we're not closing schools 700 times every time we have an election. exaggerating, but it's, you know, and I I think we should accept the grant as it was intended and then have the discussion as to what we're doing with the fire department as we're moving forward with the police department, the municipal building and making decisions what to do there. I mean the real problem here is town government here for decades has decided decided to ignore its public buildings and we're facing the consequences of that with we have a bunch of old buildings and a not very old building here that is in worse shape than some of the older buildings. Um, but

you did you want to go? Um, you didn't go yet, Deputy Mayor. The issue that I have with this is um we have not seen the documentation that was submitted um to in support of of this money. Um you know so that's number one. And um it was very clear we we heard a presentation last year from Chief Duncan about this firehouse. Um and and what I recall hearing from that presentation was that the intent was not only to, you know, repair it, but to expand it um and that it would cost millions. It could potentially cost millions of dollars. And we don't know exactly how much it would cost. Um I I agree that uh you know it is important to make sure that it's structurally sound and you know that we preserve the building. But the problem that I have is that this, you know, the the pursuing this money with the intent of reopening it and renovating it and expanding it seems to me a policy decision that we as a council did not make. So, um, my understanding when we were first presented with this was that this money would be able to from the state. the state was informed us that we would be able to use this money um for any any fire station. So under that un you know based on that understanding I was willing to accept the money but um I I just have issues with the way um you

know a policy decision was presented um without having gone through a discussion um amongst the rest of the council. So that's my position here and I Go ahead. I mean, I don't know who else wants to speak, but Well, I'm I'm I'm trying to to figure that out. Um, manager, did you want to say anything? Um, since we hear the deputy saying that policy decision, so does that mean then we just give the money back or then where are we? I'm trying to figure out. May I before the manager? Okay, I'll let him go. Go ahead.

Okay. I have to ask. I just wanted to say that um to for councelor uh deputy mayor Anderson the application you know it's interesting that people want to see the application submitted for this but many times you all don't ask for applications for half of the stuff we vote on. So again you can contact the assembly woman just like I did or her chief of staff and ask her to send it to you. It was uploaded to DCA. I don't know if they still have a copy of it. Um, in regards to a policy decision, I made a resident decision because I've heard from the residents in my ward and they would like to see this firehouse reopen. Whether the money goes to repairs and it doesn't open right away, that's fine. Um, but I don't think you all are hearing what the residents of the fourth ward are asking. Okay? And that's important to me. It may not be important to any of you up here because it's not your ward and you don't live there. All right?

Uh, not everybody. Well, I'm just saying I hear I'm hearing a lot of like, oh, we need to do this and do that. But you've heard from residents. You've heard from the business district and what their ask is. So, when do we start listening to the residents, all residents? I've seen people come up here in reflective vests and get what they want. I've seen people come up here in hockey jerseys and get what they want. What is the problem with putting this money to the work that it's that that's applied for? Okay. If you wish to see an application, again, please reach out to the chief of staff. um and see at the assembly woman's office and see if she can get you a copy like I did. I asked her, she said it's not there. You would have to check with DCA. They should have it on file. Okay. And I have

Manager Marks, please.

So, um I have instructed all department heads when when applications are being prepared to seek mayor and council approval, right? Governing body sets policy. We should not be um submitting on on at least from an administrative side, we shouldn't be uh submitting grant applications unless it has the seal of approval from from the mayor and council. Um with regard to um the the um the necessity of firehouse 3, um it's actually covered in the I had sent out an electronic copy. We had commissioned a a study on the fire department um six six months ago, eight months ago, thereabouts. Um, it was recently finished up. It addresses Firehouse 3. It really is a policy decision. I I think the response times uh for the South End are about or the the service area of um the Firehouse 3 are are around 5 minutes, which is an acceptable range under the National Fire Protection um association. uh the fire chief and and uh proponents of reopening uh firehouse 3 uh would like a you know a shorter uh time amount 3 minutes. So the the current, you know, uh response times are acceptable from a NFPA uh perspective, but if I lived in the area, you know, I maybe I would want, you know, and there's benefits and there's trade-offs. There's benefits and costs. Um the my from my recollection of u the documents that were submitted about how much it would cost uh to reopen Firehouse 3 or I'm not sure if it included like the addition or not, was about $1.3 million. So, I I know that the um uh the mayor and council previously, I don't know if I guess it was the previous mayor and counsel had allocated funds uh towards that project enough to get the project started, but not enough to finish it. So, it it is a

significant investment. $200,000 is not going to, you know, reopen. If it if the $200,000 were allocated towards uh Firehouse 3, it's not enough to make a discernable. Maybe you could, you know, complete one discrete aspect of u reopening the project, but it's not the $200,000 is not going to make or break, you know, firehouse 3 whether it reopens or not. Thank you. So, may may I ask you please, manager, are you aware of $600,000 that was set aside by um a previous um CFO or somebody in finance for this particular project?

I'm not familiar with it. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. I just I'm not personally familiar with it. I have the budget document. I'll email everybody. It was before Maja left. Okay. Okay. And I know councilor Jamal, you recall because you even mentioned it to me that there was money there. So, and I I also recall because the chief financial officer said that to me. I just don't know at this point in time where where that money is. And I'm just asking because if there's $600,000 and then this $200,000 then we're on our way.

That is correct. And I just want to put on the record while Chief Duncan did do a presentation with an addition um I don't know if you've heard from his from him again or if you've spoken to him um regarding what their needs are and what the dollar amount could be um you know that was one presentation with the addition. There is another presentation that he I believe shared with everyone um that they don't have to have the addition. That was something that was dreamt up by the last administration. is not saying that that's what this administration wishes to do or that that plan is etched in stone. What I do know is money was set aside. We have money in account line. We have an empty building. We have residents in the ward that are requesting and asking that this firehouse be refurbished or rebuilt, whatever it needs to happen, and re and get it reopened. And what I'm getting from this council is a lot of no. And if that's if that's the feeling, then the residents need to hear that. You just have to straight up and tell them, "No, you're not interested in doing that." Okay? Cuz I'm going to advocate for my residents because this is what they asked of me. All right? And I have that right and I have that responsibility. The same way we spent a million dollars on Clary Anderson that the whole town is paying for. We should be able to open a firehouse. It's just that simple. We service Glen Ridge. I'm sorry that we have a bad contract. There's nothing we can do about that. But this is not fair. This is not an equitable decision. It's just not. And so I'm this is timesensitive because we have some documents that have to be signed. Um and so um are we going to we're going to vote on this now or at this point we have to it's due by the 31st and you know that's all we can do is vote on it. This is money that I was able to secure to lessen some tax burden on the residents to help get these repairs done because I know that the majority of my colleagues, I'm just going to be honest, have a problem with the fire department for whatever reason. It seems to be personal. I don't know. But this

building has nothing to do with that. Okay. I I just want to say one more thing. Thank you. And now I'll call on Deputy Mayor. So to say to accuse people of having a a problem, this making it a personal thing is as far we've had people tonight that have accused people of having a problem. Please don't interrupt. Um I know I was not that person who said that. No, I know. But nobody calls out certain people when they do that and we're calling her out and I said it seems. Excuse me. I'm speaking. Excuse me. Let me just finish so we can just proceed with the rest of this meeting. Please, I did not interrupt you when you spoke. we may not get to the rest of the meeting.

That's just false. Um, you know, some of us received a letter uh by email, right? You know what I'm talking about. Um, saying that this request came from not from a council person, but from a member of the union. I'm going to say it. Okay. Um my understanding is this is a request to amend the resolution that we already passed in in December. So meaning we've already in December we voted and we voted to um let the grant application go forward

to uh for the money this $200,000 to carry out a project for um 2026 police and fire capital improvements. So the amendment is specifically to add um specify that it's for firehouse 3. If we if this doesn't pass, then um I'm assuming that the prior resolution still stands and that we approve the grant application going forward and we can accept the money to be res, you know, used on any firehouse. Is that correct, Mr. Manager?

I'm I don't understand because I don't think I got that that um email. So, help me to understand. Now you're saying I remember when we we voted on that, but you're saying even though that says for firehouse three, then what do you what is it now that you're saying we can do with money that also says firehouse 3 on it? It doesn't say. So the prior this is a resolution amending the resolution that we passed in December. Resolution R-25-397. Okay, that passed. Mhm.

Um and in that resolution, this council um approved um applying for and obtaining a grant from the New Jersey DCA for approximately $200,000 to carry out a project for 2026 police and fire capital improvements. And that's this money. That's this money. I just want to go on the record that council to thank you. If this doesn't pass, I don't know how we can go to any of our legislators above our pay grade to seek funding for anything else. This is really a sad day here in the township of Montlair. Um, two minutes matters. A lot can happen in two minutes and that's the what this report executive summary shows.

Um, executive summary also said that there's not sufficient data to Okay. But should we wait for a problem to happen before we decide, oh yes, maybe we should refurbish and reopen the firehouse? I'm just asking what what's the protocol? What's you know, how do we reach a decision about who what's important, how many minutes are important, and what residents are important? That's my question. Can we just vote on this? Councelor Williams.

Yeah. Yeah. A couple of things. Look, I've going on record. I don't like to go back and forth and stuff like that, but you know, I can't control. Only person I can control is myself. And I'm not going to I heard certain things up here which you know I I I was a little offended by and stuff like that. We have to get out get out of the habit of trying to characterize each other

and what someone just say what you want to do and accomplish. And if somebody else is against that, it's going to be plainly obvious. This is on video. We don't need to characterize anybody. And I don't I don't want to go back and forth here. I just want to vote on this and move forward. It's 10:00 tonight. You said, you went on the record and said, we're not going to have any more 5:00 5 hour meetings. Nothing over 5 hours. We're we're well approaching that and we haven't gotten through nearly half of this stuff. Have to come back in February.

Let's just vote and move forward. I'm I'm fine. I'm fine accepting I'm fine accepting the money for Firehouse 3 because that's that was the intent. However, you know, there are a lot of capex that still has to go into this which there's been no policy decision, no determination about opening up. So, if we want to take this money, which and you know, put it into a building that's going to remain vacant because there's no determination, that's not a good use of taxpayer funds. But I will move this forward because there's no plans in place yet. That that was my that was my whole point in this and I I don't want to go back and forth.

No, that's fine. And I I'm you know, we'll discuss this in facilities and infrastructure. We'll make I've made it an agenda item in the past and I'm going to continue to make it an agenda item. But that we still get the money and we can still spend it on firehouse 3 as the status quo is that we will get the money and it's unrestricted. Correct. Correct. All this does is restrict the money. So we can still this doesn't we don't even have to move this. Well the result is the same. I mean fundamentally this just yeah this just restricts the money that we're going to get anyway to use for firehouse three.

It just restricts it. That's right. Which I don't think we should do. I think we we will no matter what happens with that facility, that beautiful building, we will probably spend some money on it. So, we should take the money in, but we shouldn't tie our hands right now. There's no reason tonight to tie our hands. So, we by voting no, we get the money and we get to decide later what we're going to do with it. If is that true? Correct. Okay.

Councelor Birmingham, I'm sorry. Um, so I wasn't involved in any, we weren't involved in any of the discussions and the 600,000, just to be clear, was part of a capital plan, but was not allocated money. Okay. Um, and I'm looking at estimates for just that room over there that are coming in at almost a million dollars. So I I I will just say part a Monontlair is a residential tax base 85% plus.

Um in New Jersey to for communities with 85% tax base to have firehouses each two we have two firehouses operating right now. 90 n almost 99% of the properties are within two miles of a firehouse as we are currently positioned with all of them within two two and a half miles the south the go ahead okay um it is very unusual in New Jersey to have that situation with a fully staffed department career department um with an 85% tax base and this we're talking about affordability so let's just be open about it. So you know we're benchmarking our students now constantly and how much we spend on students. Just some other benchmarks. Milbour is 9 miles and has two fire departments, two firehouses. Summit is 6 miles and has one firehouse. Um Princeton, I don't know, is like 15 miles and has one operating firehouse. they closed their other one a few years ago. Um, just just these are just to give some comparisons here. Another comparison I'd like to make is just historical in terms of just the idea that again if we're talking about affordability here, which we really need to, we always, you know, we really are at a at a very pivotal moment here in Montlair. The original four firehouses that were built were built with a bond of $30,000. Four firehouses, which in today's money would be about $2 million for four firehouses. The budget in 1914 was $50,000, which in today's money

would be about one and a half million dollars. And I'm looking at from our former CFO the cost estimate for the fire department of 20 almost $20.5 million a year for our fire department. I'll jump forward to 1940 because these when when we invested in three fire trucks and two of them were engines, one of them was a truck that we managed to get for $21,000 which in today's money is $500,000. Okay, we just approved a million dollar truck. I'm sorry, a million dollar engine. And trucks are typically now going for $2 million. So, we got three truck three two engines in a truck for $500,000 in 1940. And today, that would cost us almost $4 million at least to get it. The reason I bring up 1940 is because it was this interesting moment. There was a fight in the council literally because these trucks were ordered and pe one of the council members was very curious as to the idea that the doors had to be widened and that they were ordered and they the um the trucks were too big for the doors. And this would include the two operating two house two and house three. And what the council member in 1940 said, he said, "Yes, it is true that the doors had to be widened, but simple inquiry would have revealed that all modern fire equipment is wider, and these firehouses were built many years ago. If that is treason, then I must be found guilty of it." Now, in 1940, these firehouses were already obsolete. They were not standard in 1940. Now, in 1940, we did not know that diesel fuel was a carcin a human carcinogen. That

was going to take us years to figure out. We didn't know what PAS was. We didn't know that toxic that firefighters were are exposed to toxins on a daily basis. These are things that it can be understood in Montlair that we maybe it could be understood that we allowed firefighters to be breathing in the fumes and the walls were black with diesel fumes and diesel fumes are highly carcinogenic because it's particulate matter. But we have this report right here that is basically telling us that none of our firehouses, we have three, none of them are at standard for safety for our right now. None of them. And all of them need investment. Now, I will just say again the the firehouse one is located in the southern end of town. It's not the south end. It is the southern end. The south end business district b business district is within a mile and a half, two miles of that firehouse. That is by most towns in this state. This that is reasonable. I would just say we have a lot of needs here in this town right now. We need time to digest this report. We need time to get real cost estimates on what it's going to cost because firehouses are particularly particular buildings and they need to really be built to a standard that was not even conceived in 1902 when these houses were built. And so I would just say we should take some time look at our and I also think we should commit as a community to monthly

reviewing our data and seeing where the fires are and what the response times are. Um, and I think that that should be something that we commit to as we figure out our policy and make decisions on these three houses because our firehouses are just one piece of infrastructure that we desperately need to look at. We have this municipal buildings, police department, our roads, etc. There it's a lot that we need to really be looking at. So, um, may Yes, councelor Toller.

Sure. Thank you. Um, Council Birmingham for that history lesson. Um, just one point of clarification. Uh, Hollywood Avenue, for example, in the fourth board to Pine Street is actually three a little over three miles. So, when you say everything is within two or two and a half miles, that's actually not true. And Hollywood Avenue is actually not the last street in the South Bend. So, just wanted to clear that up. Um, again, we're going to digest this report. Two minutes matter. A minute matters. Um, and that's really it. I'm just curious when you're calculating these miles, you know, are you including Glenn Ridge into this? Because our fire department makes calls. They're the mutual aid for Glen Ridge. So, when you're talking about a a residence in the South End being within 2.1 miles or 2 and 1/2 miles, if Pine Street is away at a call, then we have to wait for Valley Road. And is that more than two and a half miles? Well, this you know, Mayor, may I speak? I'm sorry.

Yes, councelor Birmingham.

This is a very good point. So I you know and this is where really we should do take this report and do a deep dive because I it is again it is just like the costs of everything to try and do what you did what we did even for example I'll get another you know when in the 1980s when the the school population of Montlair plummeted by 1400 kids the budget was doubled during that time we can't afford to do that anymore. more. We We have to really look at what, you know, what the costs are. And as I'm saying, we're getting co to do that room. We're getting the cheapest estimate we got is $600,000. I I really honestly I don't I can't conceive of making a safe firehouse without a significant investment. And so I apologize if I will look up the map on Hollywood. I certainly will. But um I think we really should commit because yeah everybody there are places in every ward that are a little bit outside of a zone but I really do feel like we have to look at what the you know what our data is telling us and month by month where are the where what's going on what why was there I you know we have um oh but I'm sorry back to your point about there are two engines and one truck in the fourth ward in Pine Street, right? And if it is true that they're going out on mutual aid, there should always be one. It would seem like there should always ask

Excuse me. Um, councelor Toller, I'm just reaching out to ask the fire chief if you would be so kind to come forward, please, and and just, you know, let us know your thoughts on on all of this. This is the first time I don't think we've heard from you since we got this back. So, if you would, you know, share your thoughts on this and what we're talking about. Okay. So, I'll just I'm not sure exactly which question you want me to answer. You called me up specifically for

Well, I I because you've heard, you know, the different opinions here and you've heard some people say, you know, couple of minutes doesn't matter or doesn't make a difference. I'm not trying to quote anybody but I'm just saying so what are your thoughts about what the understanding where I personally have not heard from you regarding this so what are your thoughts now that we have this back I know you know we put a lot of time and resources into having this done so what what are your thoughts today on you know what we need to you know provide the best services that we can for all of our residents

my position has always been clear and it hasn't changed I do believe that station 3 needs to be reopened. Um the times were talking about, you know, the study did say that there was not enough say evidence to clearly suggest opening, but it also did say that times would be reduced if it was opened. The data was not conclusive because of numerous factors in terms of response times. They weren't able to determine the response times accurately. So what they did was they did what they call bubble maps. So it's like the response times in a perfect scenario which doesn't include traffic and things like that. So you just have a starting point at one Pine Street starting point you know at station three and you see how long it would take you to get to these different points. Um it doesn't take into account that there's a train station on one side of headquarters. There's a school on the other side of headquarters. You have Bloomfield Avenue right there. And as we all know, traffic in town is um it's gotten a lot worse over the last few years. And responding from that area, you that is something you'll have to deal with. There is no doubt that an apparatus responding from station 3 and you kind of touched on it a little bit too. It's about having apparatus in different locations even for instance like the storm we just had, right? So we just had this storm there. The town were spread out in different locations. Something happens. This route is blocked. you're you're coming from three different directions. It's like a triangulation in a way. So, whoever gets there first, our response

um what we do with a fire

is based on the order in which you arrive. You know, first do engine, second do engine, first do truck, second do truck, things like that. So, if someone's coming up avenue and engine 3 is coming up Harrison Avenue, many times it's not just the south end. Um I know in the presentation we gave before it's not is it we're just thinking of it as a south end. Now grantite it does give a great deal of protection to the south end but it also gives a great deal of protection to the west part of town even going up north. So many times engine 3 is the first one to arrive because it just takes engine one forever to get up Bloomville Avenue. So it's it's not just there. Station 3 is also a safe space. You know it's when we have big storms and different things like that. has been a location where even the police that are on patrol whatever they come to the to the firehouse is uses way points when you do have these larger events. So it's more than just um you know responses from that location. We've had plenty of instances where people come they don't even call 911. They just show up to the firehouse and are looking for assistance and the firehouse is right there. Let me just get in my car and drive there or run out of my house and ask for uh you know go bang on the door for assistance. So, there's that. Also, um, now I've worked at all three firehouses and all four firehouses when we had those. I've responded to fires from all of them. And station 3 is kind of like you're on that island. You knew when you were down there, you were going to get in there and help. You know, you're going to be on your own for a little while. And that is the level of response you get because many times you're actually mitigating the situation before the next arriving rapid rat even arrives. fire doubles in size every 30 to 60 seconds. So time is of the essence. The report mentioned that you know it could be I mean I remember exactly it was at least a one minute uh change but as I said that's

using bubble maps. That's just everything is just perfect uh traffic going in. In the real life it's not that way. you know, we um did our own analysis based on actual responses to fire calls, and we saw about a two-minute difference on average to calls in the south end from Engine 3's arrival to the next arriving apparatus. And those are two fire calls because you do respond differently to if it's someone lock, you know, someone locked their keys in the car and the car is running, right? You don't respond the same way to that as you would as if there's a working fire. So, you have to be careful in which calls and which data you're you're pulling from. Um, did I answer any questions so far?

Thank you. I don't know um if anyone else here has to um like to ask the chief anything before we vote. So, the vote tonight is whether we accept the money. We've already Okay. So, what are we voting on then? I'm just trying to figure out just to restrict the money to firehouse 3. But I have a question very quickly. So we have two additional disused firehouses. We have one in the we have 647 Bloomfield Avenue and we also have one on Walnut Street. So if if three is good, wouldn't five be better? If we were if you're talking about responses, I'm saying yes. Do you believe that we would be better if we had five?

If you had five firehouses spread throughout town, yes, your response times would be better. Yes. Okay, good. So would you advocate for you said you you had worked from 647 Bloomfield Avenue and now I have. You can't possibly be. You're not you're too young looking. No. Um but that's that sits in a very strategic place as does the one on Walnut Street because it's above the fire above the train tracks. Correct. Should we look at those as locations for station for for the additional fire stations to this?

That's an interesting point. Um, I don't think it, for lack of a term, solves the idea of what I'm talking about. I think of those locations, station 3 would be the first one you opened up. If you're going to open up those two spots, if it's between those three locations, just say the council was committed to opening up all past firehouses, I would open up station 3 first, probably headquarters second, you know, 647 Blful Avenue, and then the one on Walnut Street. And if you were going to build one from scratch, where would you put it?

That's an interesting point. If the town was a clean slate, and one of the previous studies did mention this, that they would um they did mention u creating a new firehouse at the south end of town that would combine truck one and engine 3, but towards the but towards the southern end of town. I don't remember the exact street it said. It was on Harrison Street, but it but it definitely put it towards the south end of the town if you know if you could just buy some property and build a brand new firehouse. I I would just say that I think it's you you are doing the right thing and advocating for more of for your department. That's fine. That's totally fine. I have no I have no beef with this. Just be clear. I'm not advocating for the fire department. This is all about the residents, okay, of Montlair. That's it.

Understood. when something happens when and there's this thought process that when we buy a new fire engine, we buy these different things. It's not for us, you know. I mean, we don't take it home and do whatever with it, you know what I mean? It stays here. It serves the residents of Montlair. That's who it's for. That's who we're here for. And, you know, that's what we've sworn to do. But, Station 3 needs to be opened for those residents. Okay. Madam Clerk, roll call, please. Deputy Mayor Anderson, no. Councelor Birmingham, abstain. Councelor Damato, no. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, yes. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville,

yes. Motion carries. Um, we have some Oh, okay. Well, thank you for joining us tonight. I know you had some other things to do. All right. Now, we're going to go to uh consent agenda. Is that where we are? No. Well, thank you. Um nine and 10 need to go into the um executive session. H I think there Okay.

Yeah. I am I'm not I'm not Yeah, I'm gonna move to adjourn and put all of these that we were going on the um executive back because it is 10:30 2018 to 111. So let's go to the consent agenda. You want four? Yeah. So all four. So five, six, nine, and 10. No. What was Yeah. Four, five, six, nine, and 10. No, we no four. We did four. Okay. So, nine. Nine. We can do nine unless somebody has an objection. Anybody have an objection to the zoning board? Who's going on the zoning board? We I I think you're good to go on the zoning board.

Okay. We pulled we pulled We did and we're going to pull 10. Yeah. We pulled four, five, six. Four, five, and and 10. The housing commission. We need that pulled. Okay. So, um I'd like to um move resolution appointing members to the zoning board of adjustments. Second. Do you see who they are? Cuz I don't. Yes. Uh we are appointing two reappoints and moving one person.

Oh, okay. Yeah. Okay. Um, I moved you second. Madame Clerk, please roll call on the zoning board of adjustments. We re reappointing and um a new member. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Um, I'm sorry. What is this vote for? This is the resolution appointing members to the zoning board. I'm abstaining on this. Okay. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville,

yes. Thank you. Um, Manager Marks, please, would you help us get through the consent agenda, please? Sure.

Thank you. So item 11 is a resolution authorizing the award of a fair and open professional service contract to Waters McFersonson McNeel PC for Township Bond Council for calendar year 2026 uh under RFQ26-P07. Um item 12 is a resolution authorizing 2025 appropriation reserve transfers per NJSA4A 4-59. Item number 13 is a resolution approving increase to the bid threshold for negotiating and awarding non-fair and open contracts by a qualified purchasing agent below the statutory bid threshold minimum pursuant to NJSA 4A11-3. Item 14 is a resolution regarding the governing body certification of compliance with the United States Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Item number 15 is a resolution authorizing emergency purchase pursuant to NJSA 4A1-6 for CRJ contracting to install hydro stop hydra stop valve for emergency shutdown of water main break on Bradford Avenue. Item 16 is a resolution authorizing emergency purchase pursuant to NJSA4A1-6 for Frank Seamarero construction to repair water main break at intersection at the intersection of Park Street and Alexander Avenue. Item number 17 is a resolution authorizing emergency purchase pursuant to NJSA 4A11-6

for the road restoration by Krochia Company, Inc. on Alexander Avenue following sink holes created by the water main break. Item number 18 is a resolution authorizing amendment uh four slashrenewal to the fair and open contract to Suburban Consulting Engineers Inc. to provide professional services as utility engineers. Um excuse me um manager Marks, you're doing an amazing job. Thank you. But I just was wondering um if if the um if the council doesn't have any questions on on the rest of them, can we vote on the consent agenda?

I'm going to cause trouble. Oh, okay. Um Councelor Harrison has something. But I mean, if there's like one we should pull or two, right, versus I mean, do we have to go through all of them? you the attorney stepped away. Oh, I'm so sorry. But in my experience, I've seen governing bodies vote on the consent agenda as it's listed on the agenda and it's been put out to the public. So, if you wish to vote on a consent

Yes. And so my thought and and I can keep going this way if this is working for everybody, but um I was just wondering if we can pull like if you have one or two, three, however many you want to have discussion, we pull those versus go through all a bunch. Um councelor Harrison, I want to pull 13, 18, 23, and 24, and 29. Okay. Anyone else? 1318 23 24 29. Anyone else, please? And there might be one other from councelor Harrison. Deputy mayor, I'm sorry. What was that?

13 18 23 24 and 29. Councelor Williams, I have 27. 27. Council Damato. Yeah, I had the same. Okay. Council Birmingham. Um number 18 31 31 somebody say 27 already. Yes we have 13 18 23 24 27 29 and 31. How you doing councelor Harrison? You have anything else? 40.

Council Birmingham. Do we need to pull 36? That's the senior hub renovation. Or anybody want to pull 36? Yes, we'll have some questions on 36. Okay, we're doing really well. Okay. Um, manager, we have Oh, I'm sorry. 37.

37. 36 37. Anyone else? I have 13, 18, 23, 24, 27, 29, 31, 36, 37, and 40. Okay. Um, manager, would you help us? We're going to start with 13, please. We want to vote on the others. So, yes, that's a good um thing. Um, madame clerk, may we please I I move the remaining items on the consent agenda. Deputy Mayor Anderson,

yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you.

Manager, will you um go through the ones that we have pulled for discussion, please? Starting with number 13. So item 13 is a resolution approving increase to the bid threshold for negotiating and awarding non-fair and open contracts by qualified purchasing agent below statutory bid threshold minimum pursuant to NJSA 48 col1-3. Okay, this is I raised this the last time um our attorney looked at it. We have the ability to do a lower threshold, but our ordinance requires we do the threshold, which this resolution is adopting. And my preference is we amend the ordinance to do a lower threshold and introduce that at the next meeting rather than because I think it would not be good to go the higher amount and then do a lower amount. to function whether a majority of the council agrees we should have a lower threshold.

And so you're moving that and I'm going to second that. What are we doing with this? I mean I agree with what you say. Okay. I move with that this item be held pending introduction of an ordinance to hopefully the next meeting that would do a threshold of I'll say 35,000. Yeah. Second discussion. Um is it possible to get a sense of um I I for the difference between notification and approval in terms of it how much extra work is involved for staff to put because they would need to put resolutions together. Is that correct? Like if we

Yes. Okay. which would make your agenda much longer and make the awarding of contracts, you know, it would take much longer. Well, do we have a sense of how many or between how many contracts are over? No, that's okay. No. Uh-uh. We're going to We can pull it. We cannot pull it, but we It's like quarter 11 now. And And Councelor Williams was right. We've been here since 5:30. So, so I'm sticking with my motion. I think getting information as to what volume we're talking to between 35 and

51 51 is would give a sense of just so you understand the ordinance that you have the code already already sets it at 53. So, it's 53 right now. Correct. And he wants it lower. No, I understand the resolution before you just confirming, right? But but to approve that and then if a majority of the council agrees that we should have a lower threshold and then pull

no one can award contracts between the time that you're determined this is the second time. That's my understanding that no one can do anything right now. No, there there there's a there was a threshold that was in effect which I'm assuming you can still continue. The threshold is this 53,000 councelor Harrison Mayor if I may the threshold is adjusted every 5 years by the governor. So the way statute required Yes sir. So the way that the code reads right now, right, the township of Montlair, the threshold will always be whatever the governor sets it to be every 5 years automatically changes.

So if we don't vote on this tonight, then it's going to be at what 53. It it's currently 53 and it will remain at 53. Correct. And so by pulling this um until you know another time, it doesn't do anything. Exactly. Okay. No, ma'am. Uh, what the mayor just asked was by pulling this resolution, does it impact the current threshold? No. And that's what I said. Okay. So, I'd like to pull it and we can come back to it at the next meeting. Oh,

I mean, if if we have a lot of people that want to come up. My understanding is based on the statute and the ordinance without this resolution the qualified purchasing agent can do contracts up to $53,000. Right. Yeah, that's my understanding. Yes, that's that's what's currently being done. And so the request is to have a ordinance amendment prepared to to change the current requirement that we automatically follow whatever the governor says.

Thank you. I I I um got that. That's all right with you.

Okay. Um um number 18, manager, please. So item 18 is a resolution authorizing amendment 4/renewal to the fair and open contract to Suburban Consulting Engineers Inc. to provide professional services as utility engineers. I may have marked the wrong thing here. Um Oh, no. No.

Just don't run away. I'm like ready to run.

18. Here's 18. Just one. This is this is a simple question and of the map that you provided was very confusing as to exactly what work is being done and because there are solid lines and not solid lines and since

so everything within that zone where the letter is is what would be lined in this next project. So every there's no distinction between there are zone our zones for our sore mapping is lettered. Uh that's how it was done. So what we are planning to do because we have a number of issues in that zone. We found a number of collapse lines. We have a 24-in carrier line that goes to Third River that has major root intrusion and collapses that needs to be repaired. Uh what we decided to do rather than spreading this lining project out was attack this one zone because it has so many issues. Okay. You just do I assume when you say third river you're really referring to the treatment plant versus

Yes. the third river shoreline that goes to Pak Valley Shore Commission and you have at least one street that has the wrong name. That's just the mapping I use. This this mapping was put together in 2001. Okay. So the streets that run between Grove and Ridgewood, I'm assuming you're going down to the line that's going down to the line, but we're not going into Glen Ridge now. Oh, that's confusing me. Well, we stopped. Our source system stops at the line. We are no longer responsible once we get past that line. Okay. So, you're just doing the line.

So, any any lines that go into Glen Ridge go into the maj larger contributors. We have a few small ones that do, but for the most part, they go into We have a few 24-in lines. um that go into the third river or the second river tributaries that go to Pake Valley. You lost me. So we have a number of small lines in Montlair that all go into large trunk lines. These large trunk lines are the lines that go through Glen Ridge. All the small lines stop and come back towards either Grove Street or one of the other streets. They do not actually flow into Glen Ridge. Okay. So just dealing with my street. So it's simpler but applies to like six other streets. Yes.

Okay. So even though the line shows on your map going to looks like it's going to it's stopping at Yeah. So what what you would see at those lines is those are what we would call flush tank. They're dead end line parts of the lines and they would flow back or they would flow into the larger tributary the 24in line and then that would go into Glen Ridge. But that is only our responsibility up to the border because Glen Ridge also has lines that go into that 24inch tributary. So it no longer becomes our responsibility. Okay. So my wastewater is ending toward going towards Grove Street. End of the day. What street are you on? Harvard.

I would have to double check that, but yes, more than likely. Okay. A lot of the sewer lines are pitched back towards Grove Street and then Grove Street dumps into a larger line. Okay. And then my other question, it's the same thing. So the last I think it's six houses on Ridgewood Avenue on the west side are in Montlair and your map is showing the line going down Ridgewood Avenue. I believe that might be incorrect. I would have to double check that. But we only have the water man that goes on Rididgewood Avenue. There's a 6-in water man, but I don't think we are responsible for the sore mane. That map may be incorrect. I would have to double check that. It's showing that. Yes. But that may be again a little weird. You see the street names are wrong and

it goes to cuz Glen Ridge is the first couple houses after you cross and then you're in Boomfield. Yes. And then you're suddenly picking up Monontlair on. So we are responsible for the water man that runs to the I guess you would call it going north on Ridgewood A. There's a 6-in water man that goes that way. That is ours. But the sore mane I would have to double check, but I believe that is their responsibility. Okay. And the liner is going to go you go in the manhole. You put the liner down to the next manhole and correct. And what we try to do is if we can if it's short runs, we actually try to go through manholes. So it actually redo the bench in the manholes and then they cut the tops for us.

Okay. So this this is going to be should be quick work that it's a lot of it's a lot of it's a lot of footage of pipe. It's a couple months worth of work. Street. Uh yeah, usually a day or two on each street. Going to vote on this. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Um you move this and there was a second. I I don't think so, but I move it. Second. Discussion. Any further? Madam clerk. Deputy Mayor Anderson? Yes. Councelor Birmingham? Thank you. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville,

yes. Thank you. Number 23. 23 and 24 me. Why are we doing two firms for tax appeals and same amount of money and isn't it more efficient to have primarily I understand there may be conflicts but why two each the same amount? Um there were two there were two memos from George Lersie the tax assessor that accompanied the resolutions. I can't speak to specific. I assumed that he was recommending reappointment of the firms that had previously represented um the town. The specific reasons I'm out of law. I could if you want to table them and commercial and I believe uh Levi P from my firm. Okay.

So they are okay. So it's it's a commercial. Okay. Okay. Can I move both of them together? Second. Yes, you can. Madam Cler, Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you. Number 29, please. Oh, I'm sorry. 27. Yes.

That was I think a couple of us had this question. I was reading this and I didn't understand why the amount was increasing $32,000. Um 32,000 is for managed services. So those are the IT um network engineers who are currently updating, fine-tuning, repairing our network. Um the other additional funds were to create data drops uh over at DCS for the recreation department. Okay. Council Williams, I'm good.

And they're serving as our IT department now. Uh currently, yes. Okay. That that's not the long-term plan. Um but but they are and that's period. They're doing triage on our network.

Why would it not be long-term? Just curiosity. I I think once um the town updates its network uh it's I mean they're out they're probably topshelf outside consultants. You're we're paying a premium uh but we need to to get through this period right now. Um assuming that the network is uh rehabilitated and um you know updated then we won't need you know that level of service going forward. I can tell you um there was a failure of the 9 uh 911 system um last week and our as you may know our 911 service was out and 911 emergency calls were being diverted to Glen Ridge and other surrounding communities. It occurred after hours. Um the engineers from Millennium were here within I think 20 minutes even though it was after hours and they had the network restored 911s um restored probably within about an hour, hour and a half. So, I mean, they know what they're you're paying a premium, but they know what they're doing. And they actually by, you know, addressing e situations like that, you're you're saving time and more.

Oh, no. I I get it. Councelor Williams. Anything else on um number 27? Madam Clerk, I need a move it a second, please. So, move. Madam Clerk, Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. Thank you. Number 29, please. Um, I have a problem with extending them for three years. Okay.

Plain and simple. It's permitting us. And you might want to do different things because of budgetary considerations and three years is a long time. I understand the benefits of having the same firm doing it, but if we decide to move, this wasn't up to this wasn't up to three three years. This is saying that they we have to stick with them for three years. They they there's under the contract they were selected for was for up to five years. We did them for two years and this is giving them the three remaining years. Why can't we say up to three more years? I don't understand. I'm sorry.

I'm I'm just understand. I'm trying to understand why we can't say up to three more years if something changes and it changes because before we were up to five years. I guess I just misread this because I thought this was a up to situation too. This is like regardless of anything else we may decide we we're going to keep them. I I I I share your concerns. And this is this is not a reflection on services that is being provided. It's absolutely not. I keep trying to figure out how we can get to come and work for us.

Um I think if there was a legal mechanism to have that in the clause, I wouldn't object to that. Just having the uh the certainty of having that for 3 years gives a stability within the department and it's beneficial to us. We have significantly reduced the not to exceed for this. we will have um for the capital projects, we will be having uh the opportunity for the council to um vote on those. Um so this is strictly for the in-house engineering, the three days a week um that they're in office. Um it would be a great benefit to I think the township and the department. Can I ask councelor um to please?

I just want to ask a question of the manager or the attorney. I thought that we were that professional services contracts by their nature were capped. They they are. So professional service contracts are are typically one year. However, uh when you appoint a municipal engineering firm, it's typically for a longer length of time.

And and so we um if we're appointing them for three years, does that mean like we are hiring them for three years or they're still consultant per hour? because um that was a concern that I had and and so far we haven't been able to really get a good grip on whether it would be more cost-effective for us to have an in-house person full-time um versus this and and I really want to be clear that I am so excited about our engineering services. I am. But from the standpoint of trying to understand dollars and cents, I'm not really clear yet if this is making the best financial decision to keep doing this if this is hourly. Now, if we could say three years for X amount of dollars, then I'm all in. Can we do that? I don't think you want to limit yourself because there's a lot of, you know, capital projects that um, you know, the town may know about or may not know about, you know, emergencies that, you know, we don't contemplate today, but may be necessary six months from now, a year from now, etc. So, I don't think it it takes away um from the contract to appoint under the per like local public contracts law to appoint the firm for a one-year contract. So, I'm sure I'm familiar with Negley Engineering. I think they do an outstanding job. Um, I don't think and and Norberto um does an outstanding job as well. I don't, you know, if we only offered a one-year, you know, continuation of their existing contract, they're not going to walk away. So, I I think we're a good client. They're a good uh firm. And you know if if that's the you know the will of the council to limit it to one year then then we'll reassess the the you know through an competitive RFP process next year we'll we'll reassess.

Thank you. I respect your opinion. I think also from a financial aspect that they have agreed to freeze at the 2024 rates. So we are locking in that rate so there won't be an increase. That's excellent. Thank you. Um so is this substantive change to bring it down to one? and we have to to take it off and bring it back or what can we do? Madame Madam attorney, I'm sorry. Don't we have to vote on that? Vote on that change. Yeah, you would have to vote on it now. When would you have to vote? Well, I mean, does I I understand that you want to make that change. Oh. To see if people want to have three years. Okay. Okay. So, you want to vote on that?

Is this A motion. Are we making a motion? Change. Making a motion. We could award a professional. Yes. No. Not based on They're agreeing to hold their 24 rates for three years. So three years they're agreeing to So they're they're locking in their rate in M. Oh, I'm sorry, Council Williams. Yes. I I need that acknowledgement. Yes. Thank you. I appreciate the rest. They're locking in their rates for a three-year contract based upon 2024. Why would we want and potent? We're going to need engineering service past this year. Mhm.

So why would we not want to take a now I so before I get to my next I I forget we we did have a U conversation. I forget who it was with but I think Bill was involved. Well, and when all our contracts we put in there that we can terminate them, blah blah blah. So, so we're basically engaging in in a three-year contract. If at some point, for whatever reason, we decide that we want to terminate the contract in year two and we're getting the lower rate, why wouldn't we just lock into the three years?

Thank you for reminding me of that, um, Council Williams. I was not remembering that um at the time and I'm just still trying to get you know some clarity regarding to continue to do like an hourly thing versus get somebody in here. So based on what you were kind enough to share with me uh we probably would just stick with the three. Um let's ask councelor Harrison how you feel about that since this was your poll. I'm not voting for three years. real quick. Councelor Birmingham, Councelor Damato, Deputy Mayor, any anything further or should we call the vote? Okay. Um,

wait, I'm sorry. I'm I'm just reading the and again, this is not any commentary on anything other than I'm just reading the the note that we got from Austin. Mr. Ashley said the original agreement was structured as an initial two-year term with three optional one-year extensions. Mhm. So those are then being consolidated into a three-year block. Is that what this is? Rather than three optional one-year extensions. And is that right? In return for that, we're getting locked in.

Yes. Correct. Okay. Yeah. I I discussed this with our purchasing agent. This is acceptable to do. Um it's is that our is that the council's option? What do you think, Council Birmingham? I do have a question. Which is Yes. Council Damato. What are What are we spending on engineering? What are we spending on engineering? Yeah. I mean, it's we're way above this floor. So, the floor this is 300,000, but we're spending, right? Well, so that really depends on what we are looking to do for the year. So, like I said earlier,

um next month we'll be coming with the projects that we anticipate. We'll break those down by project for but those will be from capital right so we can we can prioritize which um projects we want to do um they're significant projects uh the next item that is coming up is uh the playground nishuane we have the upper mountain we have hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of engineering that needs to be done which is not unt untypical for a township of this size

so c can you can you tell me what we um engineering cost us for last year and the year before and year before like going three years that way or we can't do that like this. I I mean I don't have to have the information if we shouldn't do that. I don't know. Well, this well 2005 25s not to exceed was 875,000 if I'm not mistaken. But that's inclusive of capital projects, traffic studies. That's the whole that's the whole uh engineering cost for last year. $875,000. Yes. And that included what? I'm I'm looking for salary.

Well, for the for this portion, this would be the breakdown for what it cost us to have the in-house engineers three days a week plus a couple of traffic uh studies. That was around $275,000. Now, if you were to replace that with a staff, it'd be significantly more. Yes. um manager marks um at your request we had actually advertised for in-house um like engineering services for by employees. Um we didn't receive any applications of any professional engineers. Yes. So PE like PE like you have to have a PE license, professional engineer license to sign and seal drawings to

um so we couldn't bring those services in house because none of the applicants were actually qualified to um sign and seal drawings. Thank you. And so based on what um councelor Williams was kind enough to remind me now I'm just going to go back to councelor Birmingham. Did you have any other questions? Councelor Demato, Councelor Harrison. Um, Madame Clerk, would you please do roll call? May I have a movement in a second? Second. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, no.

Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville,

yes. Thank you. 31. Um, yes, this was my question. This is about the um a contract for the Nishawane Park completely inclusive playgrounds improvements which is in which is green acres funded. Um, and I'm just councelor Toller is not here. I know that this is something of great interest to her. Do we know if she's um does anyone know what her thoughts are on this project? and and and I guess I there you are. Is this um project where are we in terms of the design of the playground and the community input? Is that all to come or what where are we with that?

Ask Nberto to give a okay briefing on that one. Good evening everyone. Uh good evening.

Yes. So to answer your question, design is complete. Uh we have met with various community groups, stakeholders um councelor Toller as well. um over the last year plus uh since we applied for the grant. Um all that feedback was incorporated um and this reflects the final design. So we put out the design the for public bidding. Those were the bids received low bidder to the tune of $1.6 million. Um so that's what we're looking to award uh the construction contract for that project at this point. And there was a question on the cork. Yes.

Corken versus the port in place. So that reflects Okay. The inclusion that's included included. Okay. So what we did just to so everyone's clear what we did was um cuz it's a relatively new

product um particularly in this area um there was a unknown of what the cost of that would be. we had some pricing back from uh the the vendor. Um but because this was sort of an after the fact um consideration after we applied for the grant um we had a base bid contract which included the port in place surface material and then we had a separate what we it's what's called um add delete um alternative bid which essentially replaced the port and play surface with the cine surface. So there's a cost difference there. Um we were able to find the additional monies to cover the additional cost. So that that includes

Thank you very much. Um so you asked a question about councelor Toller. I know that councelor Toller brought this to the community had discussion and councelor Toller is fine with this the way this is. Can I just say one thing sorry about the quen. um where I went to school in Ammeris, Massachusetts, they they are doing a cork project and they it they initially delayed the decision because another town in New England in Massachusetts had problems with the core and Ammerst decided to go forward with it, but they negotiated like a longer warranty and more um

upkeep like with because it is very as you were saying it's new and there's only one, you know, but could I ask could we Look, could you look at the issues like Amoris was very proactive about making sure that what happened in the town over would not happen with with their project. So, absolutely. And they did put in like different a longer warranty than I think is typically given and things like that. So, yeah. Absolutely. Thank you. Um, and I'd like to thank you um, for all of your hard work on the projects and just, you know, showing up and and having new ideas. Thank you. Yes. And to all, thank you all for the appointment. We appreciate it very much. Thank you.

Did we have a movement and a second? No. Second, Madame Clerk. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes. Councelor Toller absent. Councelor Williams. Yes. Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Um 36 please. Is the uh resolution awarding a contract for Montlair Senior Hub renovation project? I'm going to move it now and ask for a second. I I'll second.

Okay. Um I I just wanted to get an idea of the timetable and you know what the next steps were. So I'm pleased to report we went out to bid. We had 20 biders pick up and submit uh bids uh for this project. So it's right um the subject area is right across the hall in what is now currently recreation and um section 8. So if awarded tonight um the uh we'll give the contractor a notice to proceed. Um, and they'll con they'll commence by the construction schedule. Um, they should be done by the end of May. End of May.

It's it's all interior renovations, which is a lot. It's not subject to weather. It's not um you don't have any of the outside factors with permitting or, you know, weather delays or anything. It's it's it should be all materials that are readily in stock. No, there's no long lead items. So it's drywall, it's plaster, it's it's uh you know lights, interior LED lights and uh in you know in stock flooring. So

um just one more thing I I know that um you know with the use of the space there was some concern about Wi-Fi connectivity. That's actually uh part so um the finance committee has been talking to Millennium on a larger um proposal for the network and that's actually included in the uh proposal for the uh the network. Great. Thank you. Um there's been a movement and a second. Anyone else have any further discussion on this? No. Madame Clerk? Deputy Mayor Anderson? Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Council Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes.

Councelor Toller. Absent. Councelor Williams. Yes. Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Thank you. Number 37, please. Um, yeah. This is my question about appointing the Star Ledger and the Monontlair Times as our official newspapers because I really don't like the Star Ledger no longer prints and I don't think people I don't know with the Monontlair Times like if that reaches a lot of people and I'm just wondering what why can't we like could we use the Monontlair local

the Star Ledger and the Monontlair Times are both qualified as online news publications according to the new law that was just passed and municipalities are required to do a bimonthly advertisement. It's like a transition period. Wherever we used to publish our notices is what's being suggested that you put it in those digital platforms telling people, hey, going forward, public notices can be found here and you include the URL link. uh transitioning people to the township website where official notices will eventually live. But until then throughout this entire year we have to advertise two times a month telling people where our public notices will live.

Is sorry mayor if I may ask are there any other qualified publications that we can choose from?

If there are I'm not aware I'm only continuing the practice for decades. Those are the two papers where Monontlair notices live. And it's not just for the clerk's office. It's the land use board and you know other boards that have to do OPMA notice. So there's a troubling aspect to this which is that the the Monontlair Times we are supporting a non-publication that appears in print that exists has existed only really in the business of like no public notices and then a few people who subscribe to it and it is a not a source of disinformation but a source of misinformation because they don't have an editorial staff and they print stories on the front page that aren't the real stories. It's not fake, but like if you read the paper, I see people in the library and I say, "Don't that's not what's really happening. There's, you know, because the story says like, you know, ribbon cutting at the at the ice cream store is the top story in Montlair." And I'm like, "No, it's that we're terrible is the story." Like, so we can't support them. It's bad news. But if we have to

I was going to say unfortunately the the statute doesn't take that into account. They're just qualified as an online news publication. Can I pass a resolution to keep Councilman Damato out of the library from bothering people? Second. My hope. Okay. So, did anybody have any further discussion on number 37? Please. Just one more question. Yes, council. I'm sorry, mayor. That um do people need a subscription for these to get these notices? Like do you need to be a subscriber to I believe all of the online news publications they'll have like a popup and this is just from personal experience. We'll say hey pay a dollar a month and you can see these.

Okay. So we but we are moving to online the it'll be on the town website. So this in that it'll be redundant for soon but you can look on the town website for free and get these notices. I've already set that up. Awesome. So, that's already there. So, everybody should know that on the town website now, you can go and find Yes, ma'am. those notices. Thank you. And the New Jersey Press Association has an online where you can find all legal ads. Yes. For free. NJPA. Yes. So, it's it's not the most user friendly

because you you put in a township name and said only those words and it's astonishing what ads will show up, but you know, I use it frequently, but you it is another free source of where you can look for and if you put in Monontlair zoning board of adjustment, you don't get too many stray ones. Madam clerk, may I have a movement in a second, please? Second. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams. Yes. Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Thank you. I think we're at number 40, please.

Um, this is more because I'm conf confused by the I'm confused by the heading of the resolution because it doesn't sound like it's what it's trying to do. Because while I'm all for preserving the New Jersey Historic Preservation Fund, I thought think I'm assuming we're this is for the grant that's referenced in the whereas, but there's an absence of information as to what we're doing here. Um,

I I talked to the HPC chair who sent this through me to have it looked at and uh I don't remember if there was a title on it, but as I recall, we have to we we really need to pass this, I believe, at this point. I'm sure we do. I I just want to know what I'm voting for before I go. Oh, this is online resolution. And there wasn't a, you know, a memo or and um Hold on. Yeah. Uhhuh. Yes. All of this, right?

Oh, okay. resolution. Can we just say resolution on historic preservation grant on New Jersey preservation grant administered? Are we accepting it or are we the grant? Are we applying for it? It's the whereas seems like we're accepting it. or yes execute a grant agreement. So that

authorized signatory is probably the the mayor. That was my second question is to I mean I mayor if I may I don't have anything besides this one sheet of paper but if I based off my memory anything to do with land like these historic preservation grants it is the mayor and the clerk who sign and seal it if my memory serves me right because it's not the first time that we're getting a grant like this and it involves land so it's usually you and Yeah,

sure. Oh, resolution. So, it's called preserve New Jersey is the name of the entity.

Yeah. So to accept grant from Preserve New Jersey Historic Preservation Fund. Oh gosh. and then insert mayor and clerk is being authorized to sign. Okay. I so move with those changes. really did you

where the mayor council decides to further historic pres no he changed the um top part the title okay you change the title and then it should be authorized the mayor and clerk yeah I heard them and councelor Harrison move second okay madam clerk Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Yes. Harris. Yes. Council. Yes. Mayor B. Yes. Yes. Thank you.

Before we go. Maybe we should do these. So, Carol is up. She She wants to be on. Yeah. But she's she's she expired, right? She doesn't. We can do both of these. Who's this? That's Santiago. He's He's I thought we just did him. Yeah, but he then moves up to alternate one. Okay. All right. But I don't want her to miss it. So, our next meeting is the day before. That's good. Let's do that. Good. Thank you. You're right. Let's do that. Go ahead. Council Damato, you have this one. That's for um planning board member Carol Willis. Okay. And then Okay. So you move that and I'll second it.

I move it. Second. We should say what it is. So this is a resolution um appointing members to the planning board uh to uh sitting members just uh one who is who is dropped off uh uh at the end of last year and so that she can she can be on there and I so moved. Willis Santiago Orba. Yes. Second. Madame Clerk. Deputy Mayor Anderson, yes. Councelor Birmingham, yes. Councelor Damato, yes. Councelor Harrison, yes. Councelor Toller, absent. Councelor Williams, yes. Mayor Baskerville, yes. No. I'd like to make a motion to adjourn, please.

Second. What? What? What? I'm sorry. I I just wanted to thank all the people in DCS that cleared all the streets and everything like that. I could tell they were working hard. I had to dig out my driveway like six times. Excellent job. Yes. Thank you. And the county who threw on my sidewalk about six times. Yes. Yes. Um Madame Clerk. I'm sorry. You There was a motion to adjurnn in a second. Okay. Baskerville Damato. Deputy Mayor Anderson. Yes. Councelor Birmingham. Yes. Councelor Damato. Yes. Councelor Harrison. Yes. Councelor Toller absent. Councelor Williams. Yes.

Mayor Baskerville. Yes. Thank you. So, yes, I did I did make a false statement because we've been here. It's 5:30, 6:30, 7th, 8th, and 9:30, 10:30. What is 11:30? So, this is 6 hours. I won the pool. Oh, man. So, that means So, that means he get gets us pizza cuz he won. Well, that was that was a one