City Council - Regular Meeting

good morning and thank you all for coming out today today we're just going to kind of go over where we started from the beginning and each of the lines is your request proposals and kind of go through and give the city's responses give you time to take it in. Um, we can meet back next week, discuss it out even further. I know the fire department's working on a few little clauses they want to do on some language cleanup as well, the administration side. And so I asked you to get that polished up and ready to go for next week as well. So we'll provide that to you next week and then give you time to review it and for the following meeting. But next, next week, if you want to come back with everything we discussed here, that's fine. So we'll just start off, you know, going back to day one,

Good morning, Nicole Cody. So we're gonna start in the order that you all submitted them. So we're gonna start with wages and incentives. This was originally proposed back in April and April 7th of this year. And so I'm gonna go through each item. I'll briefly read the description and then I'll read the city's response or counter proposal. At any time if you've got questions or you will need additional clarification or you wanna interject or we need to discuss item, feel free. Please feel free to just speak up. So I'm gonna start with Local 51's proposal item number one. This is regarding wages and compensation under Article 9, and the description is section one, seven and a half pay increase upon signing the agreement effective and the first pay period following September one, again in September one of 2027, again in September one of 2028, and then again in September one of 2029. So the city's response or counter proposal as presented in the previous meeting is the first year would be a two and a half pay increase with a 5% step increase, then followed by a two and a half pay increase effective the first pay period of the following fiscal year and then the subsequent following fiscal year and another 2.5% the following fiscal year. And the reason we did put fiscal year and we don't have a date is because the dates would be finalized as part of the final contract depending on the date of adoption. Item two. incentive pay section 2b increased paramedic assignment pay or pap while working on an ambulance from five percent to ten percent the city's response is the city rejects this proposal no counter proposal offered at this time item three article 11 incentive pay and Create a new section for field training officer pay at 5% above normal pay while assigned a probationary firefighter for the full term of the probation period of 12 months. The city accepts the proposal that this item is combined with item five, FTO slash mentor pay with an effective date to be determined. Item four, incentive pay, new section, bilingual pay of 500 per year once employee successfully passes the city administered language test. City will continue to research this item. Item five, New section, medical mentor pay at 5% above normal pay while precepting an EMT basic or EMT paramedic, three continuous months maximum dependent demand expected to increase substantially with EPFD moving to civilian to paramedic training academies. City accepts this proposal that is combined with item three, the effective date to be determined and pending additional clarification. Can you all hear me okay? Do I need to move the mic? I just want to make sure those that are joining us are able to hear. Sorry about that. Item six, new section, communication assignment pay, 5% pay increase above normal pay for FD uniform personnel assigned to work shifts at communications. The city does not accept the proposal due to the policies currently in place such as the eight for 24 and overtime when scheduled off duty. Item seven, incentive pay. Section three, education pay increase for all levels by $50 per month, associate's degree increase of $200 per month, bachelor's 250 per month, master's at 300 per month. City does not accept proposal due to current financial constraints. Instead, continuing the tuition assistance program provides assistance to the employees advancing their education. Item eight, article nine, wages and other compensation. Section eight, longevity pay increase to $10 per month per year of service, not to exceed $250 per month. City accepts a proposal, effective date to be determined. Item nine, Article 11, incentive pay, section one, Texas Commission on Fire Protection certification pay for structural firefighter certification levels increased by $50 per month, immediate 164, advanced 194, and master's 124. City accepts the proposal, effective date to be determined. Item 10, incentive pay. New section, flight medics and critical care paramedic incentive pay of PAP 5% plus 5% for a total of 10% while working on a ground critical transport unit, and pay of PAP 5% plus 10% for a total of 15 while working as a paramedic on an aircraft transport unit. Fire stars. Counter proposal, department is working on the policy to identify critical care paramedic 5% incentive pay.

As with all the financial offers, the date's to be determined since it's so late in the budget season.

SECOND SECTION, EXAMINATIONS AND PROMOTION. PROPOSED DATE FROM LOCAL 51 WAS APRIL 17, 2026. I'M GOING TO START WITH ITEM 1, ARTICLE 23, EXAMINATIONS AND PROMOTIONS, SECTION 1. YES, SIR? DID I? LOOK AT THAT, I DID. THANK YOU SO MUCH, SIR. IT DOESN'T WANT TO STAY THERE. THANK YOU. Article 11, incentive pay. Section 5, specialty teams incentive pay increased from $75 per month to $150 per month. Add critical care paramedics and peer support members as specialty teams. Members can stack a maximum of two for a potential maximum of $300. No cap on the number of specialty team members to be paid each shift. The city's counter proposal reads as follows. The city supports the addition of critical care and peer support as specialty teams, along with the stacking maximum of two for a potential maximum of $150 per month. No cap on the number of specialty team members and no increase at this time. Item 12, article nine, wages and compensation, section six, increase working out of class pay or walk to 10%. The city's response is the city does not accept this proposal and no counter proposal offered at this time. Now we're on examinations and promotions. Proposal date from Local 51 of April 17th, 2026. Item one as proposed by Local 51 is section one, requesting language change from days to calendar days for the 30 and 60 day requirement for vacancies. Hopefully I didn't add a word. The city accepts the proposal. item two article 23 examinations and promotions section 3a requesting language cleanup no change to the intent of the section new language proposed is three points will be added to the scores of an applicant taking a promotional exam who holds a locally credentialed paramedic certification the city accepts the proposal Item three, article 23, examination and promotions. Section four, last sentence, requesting a change from three to four assistant chiefs. The city's response, the city accepts the proposal. Item four, section nine, requesting language change for the entire article. An increase in the number of committee members under this section to nine personnel, this committee will be tasked with all items currently listed in the CBA from 2022 through 2026 with additional duties of research for third party vendor for test writing, research for third party testing facility, developing a promotional testing process that involves rank specific testing, and developing a standardized testing procedure and manual. The city accepts this proposal. Item five, article 23, examinations and promotions. Section 13, new paragraph requesting the addition of a new paragraph addressing issues with promotions involving specialized assignments and 40 hour positions. The counter proposal by the city is to combine this request with item four for further research.

And just with that, let's just have the discussion on where we need to be and how we can make things better as far as filling promotions and stuff. So I think having it in a committee where we can actually talk it through and get to a better place is the recommendation.

All right, we're now into the next section for drug and alcohol testing policy. This also included appendices G, H, and I as consolidated and proposed on April 17th, 2026. Local 51's proposal item one, All-inclusive, I'm gonna read the information provided as a summary, if that's okay, since there was, okay. Employees will only be issued a 30-day suspension if they fail to complete a city-mandated approved drug and alcohol rehab program within 180 days from the initial positive test. Employees are still subject to the disciplinary matrix and any relapse or a second positive drug and alcohol test during their career subject subject them to actions up to and including termination. If employee is determined to not be at fault, they should not be required to submit a post-accident drug and alcohol testing. submit to, I apologize, to submit to post-accident drug and alcohol testing. The city's response or counter proposal is the city rejects the proposal. The city recognizes substance abuse as a treatable condition and supports employee assistance, rehabilitation opportunities, and wellness resources. However, firefighters occupy safety-sensitive positions requiring the highest standards of fitness for duty, sound judgment, and public trust. Regarding positive drug or alcohol tests, the city believes disciplinary action shall remain available immediately following a confirmed positive test in accordance with the disciplinary matrix, applicable policy, and the circumstances of each case. Limiting discipline until an employee fails to complete rehabilitation within 180 days unduly restricts management's ability to address misconduct, product, protect public safety, and maintain operational readiness. The city also opposes the proposed restriction on post-accident drug and alcohol testing. Post-accident testing serves important public safety, risk management, workers' compensation, liability, and regulatory compliance functions. Determinations of fault are often not immediately known following an incident, and testing may be necessary to preserve evidence, ensure workplace safety, and comply with applicable laws and standards. The city is willing to discuss language that reinforces access to rehabilitation programs, employee assistance resources, and return to duty requirements while preserving management's authority to administer discipline and conduct post-accident testing consistent with departmental policy and operational needs. The next section we have is extra board and overtime, proposed on April 17th, 2026. Local 51 proposal item one regarding article 10, overtime. New section, comp time, creating a new section establishing the criteria for the use of comp time to compensate employees for work performed beyond their normal schedule. Standardized, excuse me. standardize the accrual rate of comp time accrual at one and a half hours for every hour worked, adding language to include the addition of one hour of travel when employee is compensated with comp time. This change mirrors the current one and a half hour rate and one hour of travel for overtime paid as seen in Article 10, Section 1, Section 3. The city accepts this proposal. Item two, article 10, overtime pay. Section 10, increase of maximum compensatory time accrual and payout limits upon separation. Increasing the request is to increase the maximum accrual to 480 hours of compensatory time with a maximum of 240 hours of payout upon separation. The city's response or counterproposal is that the city proposes increasing the maximum accrual from 144 to 240 hours of compensatory time, increasing maximum from 80 to 120 of payout upon separation. The next section. is leave, vacation and sick leave. Proposed date was May 5th, 2026. Local 51 proposal item one regarding article, 26, holidays and vacation. Section 2A, the number of vacation slots per shift, create three new vacation slots per shift, increasing the number from 44 to 47. We're required changing how two-day vacation are allotted based on rank as outlined in section 10. The city's response is the city rejects the proposal with no counter proposal at this time. The department is currently evaluating staffing needs as the current vacation slots require extra board. Item two, article 26, holidays and vacations. New section, vacation sellback. Provide uniform employees with the option to sell back accrued vacation or holiday time. Minimum bank thresholds would be established and it would mirror the current sick leave sellback program. So the detailed information that was provided by Local 51 was to create a vacation holiday sellback program with the following guidelines. 56-hour employees must maintain a minimum balance of 288 hours of combined vacation holiday leave, and 40-hour employees must maintain a minimum balance of 192 hours. Annual sellback limits for 56-hour employees would be 180. Annual sellback limits for 40-hour employees would be 120. Vacation holiday sellback would occur six months from the sick leave sellback. Here's the city's counterproposal. The city proposes the following. 56-hour employees must maintain a minimum balance of 600 hours of combined vacation and holiday leave, and 40 hours must maintain a minimum balance of 400 hours. Annual sellback limits for 56-hour employees would be 180. Annual sellback limits for 40-hour employees would be 120. And vacation holiday sellback effective date is to be determined. Item 3, Article 26, Holiday and Vacation, Section 2, Vacation Accrual Rates. Update the current vacation rate of accrual by .25 days per month for each tier. Create a new tier for employees with five to 10 years of credited service within the department. Increase the vacation accrual rates as proposed by Local 51. Years of service of zero to five years, accrual rate would be 1.25 days per month. Years of service five to 10 years, 1.5 days per month. 10 to 15 years, 1.75 days per month. And 15 to 20 years at two days per month with 20 plus years being at 2.25 days per month. The city rejects this proposal with no counter proposal at this time. Item four, article 26, holiday and vacation section four, maximum accrual of vacation time. Increase the maximum number of vacation holiday time that an employee can accrue from 75 days of vacation holiday to 90 days. The city rejects this proposal with no counter proposal at this time. Insurance and safety. Proposal date was May 5th, 2026 by Local 51, item one, article 13, uniform allowances. Section 1B, delete the word initial and change to annual and delete work jacket and tie from annual allotment. City's response or counter proposal is requesting language cleanup. The department is currently changing the word to match the current process. The clarification will be provided.

And that does include what we talked about for the promotional items and stuff, so you get them at your promotional time and the schedule. And even the next item she's going to cover is just moving the date. It's because we know the fiscal year starts September 1, and it's hard to get all those POs in place. So I don't want to promise October 1, and we just can't meet it. So that's the only reason why we pushed it.

NO, PERFECT. THANK YOU, SIR. ITEM 2, ARTICLE 13, NEW SECTION 1C, UPON PROMOTION ALL NECESSARY BADGES APPROPRIATE METAL BUGLE INSIGNIA AND APPROPRIATE NAME TAPES WILL BE PROVIDED AT NO COST TO THE MEMBER. THE CITY ACCEPTS THE PROPOSAL PENDING LANGUAGE CLARIFICATION. Item 3, Article 13, new Section 1D. Each member will receive new uniform allotment every October 1st. The counterproposal is by November 1st as the DCM stated. Item four, Article 24, Health and Safety. Section A, amend the structure and function of the Health and Safety Committee to meet current employee health needs and NFPA 1581 guidance and related programs as well as the implementation of new legislation related to firefighter health and safety to include but not limited to Texas House Bill 4144, Texas House Bill 198, also known as the Wade Cannon Act. So this amendment would increase the number of committee members to nine, allowing for more member participation, assign co-chairs for the committee, one selected by the fire chief and the other by the president of the Local 51, redefine the role of the committee to include those in the current CBA in establishing best practices pertaining to firefighter health and safety using NFPA 1582 as a guiding document. The committee would be responsible for helping develop best practices for annual physicals implementation of the Wade Cannon Act and other legislation as necessary. Advise and consent role within the selection of the medical professions hired to conduct annual physicals as outlined in NFPA 1582. Oversight and steering for peer support program. The city accepts the restructuring of all committees to nine members with a quorum of five members. Item five, article 24, health and safety. Section six, add section 6A, formalize the peer support team program and place under the revised health and safety committee. Formalize the peer support program and place it under the supervision and guidance of the health and safety committee as mentioned in item four of this document currently being reviewed by the department. Item six, article 14, insurance. New section, the creation of a labor management committee tasked with earnestly researching the feasibility and structure of a healthcare trust for Uniform Fire Department employees. Local 51 is requesting a formal discussion with the city to explore options for altering the structure of our current health insurance program to address premiums current costs, expected future costs, discussion on how the formulary is developed for prescription medications, provider changes, legislation on the horizon, and how that will impact the overall health insurance program, and development of a tiered system that would explore options to provide affordable health insurance for retirees. Please refer to item eight. Item seven as well, we were requesting to refer to item eight, but let me read it into the record. Article 14 insurance in line with the intent of House Bill 4144 discussing the change of the current insurance structure to include premium rates and inclusions of recently retired firefighters. Begin dialogue with the healthcare trust system with the appropriate city specialist Local 51 will coordinate presentations from other fire departments that have successfully implemented this type of system, providing a better understanding of Local 51's intention and commitment to taking care of our members, as well as lowering the financial burden for the city. Again, the city's response is please refer to item eight below. Item eight, in line with item six of this document discuss the proposed plan to move all uniform fire department employees to a healthcare trust to manage health insurance for active and recently retired firefighters. FORMED exists in multiple fire departments across the country, including Fort Worth and partially in Houston. Intent is to streamline healthcare for firefighters and substantially reduce the health insurance cost for the city. The proposed actions include create a healthcare trust committee tasked with earnestly researching options for moving to a healthcare trust system. This system has been successfully implemented in many other fire departments across the country, including Texas. The committee would create, created no later than one year after the signing of the contract with the intent of implementing a full healthcare trust system at the end of this contract, providing a full three year providing a full three years for research and development. So the city's response is the city accepts a proposal to create the healthcare trust committee and evaluate the creation of a discipline review board as well. The city rejects the proposal of implementing a full healthcare trust system by the end of this contract.

So if I could, I don't know if three years is gonna get us to be where we're ready to switch over, so we don't wanna commit to anything that neither side can do, so why go there? The two thoughts there, you were asking for this committee, and I don't know if I brought it out before, but I'd like to look at the possibility of setting up a discipline review board rather than relying on civil service, and so that's made up by citizens and department members, and they meet to discuss final issues on discipline. and so it's similar pd has one in effect it's going very well for them so i just wanted it doesn't have to be part of this same group but i want to make sure we start having those discussions to see if it's something viable for the fire department this is the final section administration with a proposed date from local 51 of may 12 2026.

Local 51's proposal, item one, article five, cities retained prerogatives, and article six, existing conditions. Description, article five, section two, cities right to command and direct working forces and subcontract functions other than actual firefighting activities and emergency basic and advanced life support. The request is to add a new section, use of FD personnel for functions outside the stated intent of Article 5, Section 2, and Article 6, Section 1, 3, and 4. Examples provided. Medical Integrated Health, or MIH, critical care treatment and transport paramedics, specifically Firestar paramedics, agreement with air methods. Emergency call takers, 911 center, staffing civilian call taker positions due to high turnover. Infection control officer, historically an RN position, not in compliance with the current first responder standards. senior management for health department during covid staffing of migrant shelters and first aid stations during migrant crisis drug mobility unit agreed agreement with umc staffed with epfd personnel proposal to use fd personnel to conduct annual physicals for fd personnel historically completed by contract contracted company concentra The second portion, add memorandum of understanding clause for all changes to job specifications for firefighter and emergency medical technician job titles and any additional tasks assigned outside of the stated intent of Article 5, Section 2 and Article 6, Section 134 in the current CBA and intent of the Texas Local Government Code Section 143. I believe the information provided echoes what was already in the description. So I'm going to move to the city's response or counterproposal. At this time, the city retains operational control but agrees that communication between Local 51 and the fire chief in these cases.

So with that, I think we just need to discuss on how we go forward. And we had more conversations with the fire chief. I understand the difficulties it's caused, and I do understand that part. But the department still needs to hold some operational control, so responding to an emergency. So not to hold it up to have it, but at least to make sure it's followed up immediately thereafter. So let's have those conversations to see how we can get to something that's amenable to everybody.

Item two, article 25, miscellaneous provision section one, providing copies of documents to employees slash stations. Amend the article to reflect current administrative capabilities to include the use of electronic documents. The city accepts the proposal. Item three, article 25, miscellaneous provision, section three, amend the article to include categorization of repairs needed at fire stations based on severity and timelines to address the issues or repairs. Create a tiered system for the fire station and facility repairs. For example, section 3A would be new. The city shall maintain a fire department facilities in safe, sanitary, and habitable conditions. Items listed below shall be repaired within timeliness, see forth under each category, unless delayed by circumstances beyond the city's control. So this includes station, oh my, I can't say it now, and skipping, and quality of life repairs, quality of life items, including but not limited to living room amenities, bedroom sleeping quarters, and cooking facilities shall be addressed within 14 days. There's also a section of critical conditions which include but are not limited to non-operable toilets, no HVAC during extreme heat or cold, no non-potable water, electrical hazards, sewage backup, lack of hot water for extended periods, and other conditions that materially affect employees' health or safety. The city shall initiate a response as soon as practicable and shall provide temporary mitigation within 24 hours. An urgent condition is partial bathroom outage, apparatus bay door malfunctions, non-critical by HVAC issues and response initiated with one business day and repairs scheduled within five business days. So the city's counter proposal is the city proposes to send this proposal for an evaluation and review by the newly proposed equipment apparatus and facility committee as seen in item eight.

So I understand the issue and we've all been there and we've had those long-term outages, whether it's restroom facilities or air conditioning, numerous items. I just don't wanna commit to something that the city cannot keep up with. The number of our contracts, we have contractors on call. There's so much construction going on in the community in the next few years. I don't know if we can meet those timelines. So I'd like the committee to evaluate it, track it, keep pushing for these goals, and then that way we'll know where we're at coming into the next negotiation so we can start memorializing them and getting them into a policy. But right now it's just, it's a difficulty getting things done, I mean, with anything in any of the fields. And so I just don't wanna over-commit at this time in something we can't meet.

Item four, article 25, miscellaneous provision. Section seven, amend the article to include language stating personnel will not be obligated or expected to use personal electronic devices to conduct city business. To include instances where city devices, networks, applications, or network connections are malfunctioning or not operating properly. The city's response is they accept the proposal for a language cleanup. Item five, article 25, miscellaneous provisions, section 15, delete the entire section no longer applicable. The city accepts this proposal. I'm now on page nine. Item six, article 25, section 16, discuss and address the 40 hour operations, former EMS text in the article may no longer be applicable. Discuss future hiring plans for EPFD and if section is no longer relevant and not expected to be relevant during the duration of this contract, the section should be deleted. Currently section 16 currently states fire department employees who are 40 hour operations personnel Former FMS employees will be allowed to qualify for and attend the fire training academy to obtain certification as structural firefighters. The fire chief will determine the number of employees who may attend each scheduled academy. Selection will be based on seniority. 40-hour operations personnel who do not successfully complete the academy will be allowed one additional opportunity to attend after every other FMS employee has. has had the initial chance to attend, and the city accepts the proposal to delete. Item seven, article 28, association due, section one, amend the section to include tech, include the following text. The city will electronically deduct from the pay of each employee who has executed an authorization slip membership dues levied by the association in accordance with its constitution and bylaws. Amends the section TO INCLUDE THE TEXAS CITY WILL ELECTRONICALLY DEDUCT THE PAY OF EACH EMPLOYEE. THE CITY ACCEPTS THIS PROPOSAL. ITEM 8 AS REFERENCED ABOVE IS A NEW ARTICLE LABOR AND MANAGEMENT RELATIONS. NEW ARTICLE WILL INCORPORATE ALL EXISTING AND PROPOSED LABOR MANAGEMENT COMMITTEES TO INCLUDE AS PROPOSED BY LOCAL 51 MEDICAL WELLNESS ADVISORY COMMITTEE WILL PLACE A CURRENT HEALTH AND SAFETY COMMITTEE AND GUIDE I'm skipping to the information provided. It has additional information. Guide the development of cancer screening annual physical initiatives using NFPA 1582 as a guiding document. Committee number two, an equipment apparatus and facilities committee, which is new. Number three, a professional development and promotional committee, which is new. Number four, a paramedic advisory and medical review committee, which is new. That was number four. Number five is rule and regulation committee, which is a restructure. And number six is the fitness committee, which is a restructure. And I failed to read the top part. Let me read that. The new article will incorporate all existing labor management committees, create new committees as outlined below, and establish guidelines for meeting requirements to include documentation, meet and advise, advise responsibilities for department initiatives directly affecting firefighter health, safety, wellness, work conditions, equipment needed to perform the job, program improvements, promotional opportunities, professional development, and compensation. as the list I have already read is requested committees which will require future discussions to structure and formalize. We are also requesting that all committees increase in member size to allow more participation and input and to ensure there are enough committee members present to properly conduct business. The city's counterproposal. The city accepts the following committees of nine members with a quorum of five. The committee's read as listed, one through six. Medical Wellness Advisory Committee will replace the current Health and Safety Committee. Number two, Equipment Apparatus Facility Committee is new. Number three, the Professional Development and Promotional Committee, which is new. Number four, the Paramedic Advisory and Medical Review Committee, which is new. Number five, Rules and Regulations Committee, which is a restructure. And number six, Fitness Committee is a restructure. And that concludes the list. Do y'all have any questions? And did I fail to read anything or skip anything? I hope not.

Good morning, Jessica Schling.

Good morning.

Couple questions. First, before I start, though, I would just like to give local 51's condolences to Odessa Fire. They had a line of duty death last night. Unfortunate. So I'd just like to put that out. And then also, if you guys can keep in your prayers, our water rescue team is currently deployed in Bandera, Texas, and they are doing search and rescue operations as we speak. So just keep them in your minds. My first question would be item seven on the TAP. ARE WE GOING TO BE ABLE TO SWITCH IT BACK TO THE OLD POLICY WHERE THEY GOT THE MONEY UP FRONT DUE TO THE PROMOTIONALS AND DEGREES BEING A REQUIREMENT? THE CURRENT POLICY IS YOU GO THROUGH THE CLASS AND THEN YOU GET PAID AFTER.

THAT POLICY IS A CITYWIDE POLICY. THAT HASN'T BEEN. SO NO, THAT'S NOT BEING ALTERED.

OKAY.

THE WAY IT STANDS NOW.

OKAY. MY NEXT QUESTION WOULD BE ITEM 10. the city's counter proposal of the 5%. Is that 5% on top of the PAP? That's correct. Okay. Just want a clarification on that. Moving on. Sorry, I have a couple.

No, please do.

We'll go to the item one for the drug and alcohol testing policy. I understand where the city's coming from. Question, if it's determined to be at fault or not at fault, MVA, can the employee go back to work while waiting on the results of the test? We recently had an incident where an apparatus was hit, struck, a vehicle ran a red light, was T-boned. Driver was not at fault, however, he was out of work for several days, because I believe he got tested on a Friday. Didn't get the results until about Tuesday.

He didn't have to take, that person did not have to take personal time, did they?

He had personal time, but I'm just asking, are they able to return to work until the results come in?

I mean, did they have to use personal time or were they off on administrative time?

No, he put off on admin, I believe.

Okay, I'd have to look into that just to see how often that's happening and what's the delay, unless you have some more information, Randy, at this time. Okay, yeah, let me look at those numbers and see what it looks like. Okay, thank you.

and then going to the leave for the vacation sellback would the time frame for the sellback be the same as sick leave or are we going to do it like middle of the year july uh something like that no we took your proposal into into account we're looking at how we can stagger those at different times of the year okay so the policies

We've said yes to the policy, but we're looking at how it best fits and which one gets paid when and in what part of the year, trying to keep it at a six-month interval.

Yeah, that's kind of what I figured. And then moving on to insurance health and safety. Item 8, the Discipline Review Board. I know PD is doing it. I know they've had decent success at it. Would this replace, is the intent to replace civil service? That's correct. Okay. And then moving on to the healthcare trust, I understand we didn't have a timeline. You kind of spoke on that. If both parties were to agree within the three years by the end of this contract, would that be something we'd be willing to look at and move forward to if the research is done and all that?

Yeah, I mean, that's what the base of the committee is to see if it's feasible and if it's doable. still with a three-year time the answer is yes but with a three-year negotiation yeah you still got to take it out to bid you still got to put a lot of things in place there's no possible way we can get it done okay so yes we're open that's the the we're agreeing to meet wholeheartedly and to have the discussions but the timing of it's what's difficult okay that's all the questions i have thank you How does next Thursday look for a follow-up meeting? We have council Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday is pretty well booked. Thursday morning's booked on my end, and then Thursday afternoon is my next available.

Thursday 25th?

Yes. Okay, we'll send some calendar invites out.

Yeah, looks good. All right. Any other questions? Anything?

No? I think we're good.

Well, thank you.