City Council - Regular Meeting

Good evening and welcome to the April 6, 2026 council meeting of my city common council. We're going to stand for the pledge of allegiance tonight. Ask Neil Bashion if he would lead us. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America [clears throat] and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

We'll have citizens recognition [clears throat] tonight by Sarah Goian, but we'd like to ask for a moment of silence, please, to begin with. Thank you.

Good evening. Okay. Well, as you're probably aware, is an election year. We've got primaries coming up on May 5th and a general election on November 6th. And in the spirit of tonight's citizen award winner, remember that you have until 11:59 tonight. To do so, and even if you're certain that you registered, you can make sure to verify before then that you're still not removed. So tonight I'm honoring the League of Women Voters of M Delaware County. The League is a nonpartisan grassroots organization working to protect and voting rights and ensure everyone is represented in our democracy. They empower voters in defending democracy for advocacy education and litigations at the local state and national levels. Now they do accept any gender not just women. That change happened a while ago which is why They never support or oppose political parties or candidates. Instead, they take positions on issues that affects positions that may align to others. Their focus is always on policies and measures that serve the public interest. The National League was founded in Chicago in February of 1920, just months before the 19th Amendment was ratified by vote. The amendment had to be ratified by the states and mobilized in May of 1958. The League of Women Voters has two separate and distinct roles. Voter service and citizen education. They they present unbiased nonpartisan information about elections, the voting

process and issues. and also action advocacy. They are nonpartisan, but after they study an issue, they use their positions to advocate for or against policies in the public interest to conduct their voter service and citizen education activities. They use funds from Voters of Indiana. Their principal goals are to build citizen participation in the democratic process, study key community issues at all governmental levels in an unbiased manner and enable people to seek positive solutions to public policy issues through education and conflict management. The Delaware County League is also proud to say that their very own spokesperson Linda H is also currently the Indiana State's president.

Wow. So, I want to thank our local for all they do to engage and educate voters in our city. Linda Hans would come up. She's going to accept this award on behalf of [applause] [applause] [clears throat] 11:59.com. As said, we are nonpartisan. We want to get information out to all voters because overy we've been working for voters's rights to make sure that everyone has a voice in our democracy. We're excited this year to be actually working to get information out to everyone about our voting centers. brand new as of last September. And back on one of the chairs there are preal for that emergency on election day. Find the closest map on

the really pleased to accept this award and thank you so much. [applause] [clears throat] [laughter] It's Christmas tree. M good job.

Next month will be Jerry Dishman for citizen recognition. [clears throat] Roll call, please. Dishman present. Selfie present. Macintosh present. Green present. Powell here. Garrett here. Gullian here. Basham here. Mason here.

Thank you. Would like to make a comment at the beginning of the meeting. Um, in regards to the Muny Central drum line, uh, some of you may know, some of you may not know, they placed second in state competition. So, they were the runner up. So, we appreciate what [applause] they did. Great job for those. Okay. Approval of minutes. Do we have a motion to accept the minutes? I so move. I'll second that. Okay. Roll call, please. Garrett, yes. Dishman, yes. Basham, yes. Macintosh, yes. Golian, yes. Selby,

yes. Powell, yes. Mason, yes. Green,

yes. Appointments to boards and commissions. We have uh Beach Grove Cemetery. Uh but we need to pass the ordinance first before we do the two positions that are there. So, are there any committee reports? Okay, we'll move on to ordinance previously introduced. Ordinance 7-26, an ordinance of the city of Muny amending chapter 93 of the city of Muny Code of Ordinances.

Have a motion to adopt. So moved. Second. I'll second that. Okay. Any discussion? Comments from the public? Okay. Roll call. Basham, yes. Macintosh, yes. Selby, yes. Mason, yes. Powell, yes. Dishman, yes. Garrett, yes. Golian, yes. President Green, yes.

We have been asked to uh postpone the appointment of this uh two positions on the Beach Grove Cemetery Board. they have enough at the moment, but we would we were asked to wait until next month for those individuals to give the council plenty of time to come up with uh individuals that want to do that. Okay. Okay. So, that takes us to new ordinances. Ordinance 8-26, an ordinance prohibiting the use of documents received from public records requests for commercial purposes. Mr. President,

yes, Mr. May I indulge um for just a second? Um Jagen, would you mind going to the microphone and if you would give us a legal summary, an assessment of what this ordinance looks like to you? Looks like well

do we need

I don't the ordinance itself is a it mimics the Indiana statute there's also a Indiana administrative code that's the exact same essentially it stops commercial entities from selling data that they're public information. It's a state statute. I said it's administrative code. My issue with the ordinance a few of you is the 10year restriction at the end of it. Um when I that's not in the code that's not in the administrative laws in Indiana. So that that jumped out to me uh potentially as arbitrary and whenever you're dealing with a potential first amendment issue, you don't want your jump. So

that's my 10ear really my only issue is the state statute. Okay. Thank you. In lie of that, Mr. President, I'd like to withdraw ordinance 826 until this issue is resolved to your satisfaction, Mr. Arnold. Thank you.

Brings us to resolution 5-26. Resolution 5-26, a resolution of the common council of the city of Muny, Indiana, updating appointments to the Muny Human Rights Commission. We have a motion. Good. I'd like to make that motion. We have a second. I second. Okay. Speak up. We have those wishing to speak on this resolution. Excuse me. Gretchen Cheeseman. I am a member of the human rights commission. And this is Shaquille Ber. She is our new human rights commission executive director. Hi.

Um we started taking a look at our um our appointments and we discovered that um the mayor appoint the mayor appoints two members and the council appoints one. And we got to looking at um who was appointed by whom when we went back through all the old council minutes and uh we came up with um some council appointments, some mayoral appointments that were filled by the council.

And so there's And uh we now have four members that expire in 26, four members that expire in 27, and only one member that expires in 28. So we'd like to get back to the um everybody has a three-year term with three [clears throat] by the council and one by the mayor. and we um discussed it in our meeting and came up with um what's in this exhibit one in the resolution which um changes Linda Muckway's term uh rei it revises it to January 1st 25 through May 31st 28th so it's a three-year term but and it it's especially now that all the terms have to be listed on the agendas I think it made everybody sort a lot of things out. So, this is our today.

Um, so we'll change Linda Mway's term and she is a council appointment. And then, um, Stephen Nip's term, he was a may uh, his term is vacant. It would go from a council appointment to may a mayoral appointment and it would be 6125 through 53128. That's currently a vacant um, seat. He is not appointed somebody to build that. So that gets us back to two mayor and one council um stack. Okay. Yeah. Thank you for sorting that out. Appreciate

Mr. President. May I ask question? Um, Gretchen, if you would, did I hear that you had um that you were working or you had a team of people who were working um perhaps across the spectrum of boards to justify these terms throughout this this the city board system. We had a intern mayor's office last um spring and she um went through all the boarding commissions. She worked with um Lacy and um and um and the city clerk and they verified all of the um that everybody has the certificates and all the paperwork that they need. Um, they looked at she she looked at all of the ordinances and who appoints whom and tried to figure out who had been appointed by whom. And I think they and now they've got it set up so that um they can all share a file and work off of the same file and everyone's not their own [laughter] um you know set of spreadsheets

and um I think it's been helpful. Good. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Is that something that can be shared that so that we can keep up with that also? Because I know it's been tough. We're all trying to keep up with it. We can download a version of it, but it would be as of that date. So, of course, I'm updating it as you guys make appointments. The mayor's office is updating it as the mayor makes his appointments. So, we're we work in the same spreadsheet alongside each other. So, that way, so it's a shared document. We have so it's a shared document and we can all be added on that then

um we can check with it or yeah they can add or yeah access whenever you want. That would be good. Thank you. So these terms for human rights commission expire May 31st. So the appointments um and we've got there there are several terms expiring. So Leah Britain is mayoral [clears throat] and Melvin Kelly are mayoral. Leah is not has asked not to be reappointed. Andre Mitchell who has served as our president. He is the council representative asked to not be reappointed. So there is one for the council and then Linda Muck went over. So you guys will have one appointment to make

in May. In May. Mr. President. Yes. I I I for one appreciate this work that you've done. Um and not just for your commission but for all of the boards and commissions. It really sets the ship straight. Thank you. Very it was a big confusing mess. So you're welcome. Thank you. And I got to give um the intern Mariah. Mariah. Um I have to give her credit for it because she really did all the work. Yeah. Fantastic.

You know, it got really confusing when it came to um boards that have appointments by the county and the council. You know, we know what we have on the city end, but we don't know what the county has or what the county council has. So, um it's probably still a work in progress. Thank you. And thank you, Lacy. Any other questions from council? Any questions from the audience? Mr. escape. Everyone coming at me ask question. Do you want me to time these? Are we being timed? I just have a quick comment. Okay.

So, I served on the human rights commission board before and I know there's a lot of things that are discussed there dealing with the city, a lot of complaints dealing with the city. Sometimes there are things discussed in executive session. So, I just want to say that I think it's a conflict of interest for a department head serving on this board because there are things that can be discussed with the city and I'm sorry but I just don't believe that things are discussed on that human rights commission that that department head that's given the job by the mayor will not go back and discuss certain things. So, I think that's a conflict of interest. And the way they treated the last director of the human rights commission, I was there. I saw it and I saw how they out her at the last minute. I think that was unfair. But the conflict of interest that's taking place with the community development director serving on that board. I think that needs to be looked into because I don't think it's right. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you for your Thank you. Thank anyone else with comment question.

Seeing none, hearing none. Well, I I too have some concerns about that. uh you know, if there becomes an issue in her office, uh how how would that be handled as far as a complaint with the with the uh human rights with her sitting on the board? Is your question if there was a complaint against me? Yes. Yes. Yes. In my official capacity as community development director or or a complaint a complaint period. Um I presume it would be addressed like any other complaint.

I was going to say Thank you, Caleb. Working on it.

There we go. I I guess what I would say if there was a complaint against me, I would not I'd have to recuse myself and not participate in it. [clears throat] Mr. President, yes. But would you have access to those minutes of that discussion? Yeah. Yeah. As a board member. As a board member, I would. Do you feel But I mean, there would be an investigation and agreed. Do you feel that you having access to those minutes and being privy to that conversation might be a a impedment to that employee discussing their concerns openly,

an employee of mine, any employee. Do you feel that a city of Muny employee might be hesitant to discuss their issues against any department head actually not just your department um if they knew that another department head had access to that conversation? Do you feel it might make them fear retribution of any kind? And I'm not I'm not saying I'm I'm talking about the employees feelings not necessarily what your actions would be. Do you think that would become an obstacle for our employees speaking freely about a what they consider a a violation of their of their employees rights or their human rights? Do you feel that it might be a problem?

I don't I mean I've been on the board for about a year and I've never I mean we've had uh the employees don't come the complainants don't come to the board meeting and talk to the board members. They talk to the director and the director does an investigation and then comes back okay to the board. So So you don't I would assume that if there was some kind of a conflict the city attorney who attends our meetings would point that out and I would recuse myself. Thank you. However I needed to

Miss Cheeseman. Um when I was on the board of dire I mean on the human rights board we had different committees that would investigate different you know we had do you guys still have that or did you change the procedures so not everybody's involved? I have not seen that happen since I've been on the board. Okay say no because and we're kind of starting from scratch with Shaquila. Yes. But I do agree the complaints go to the director and the director does the investigation and I do believe you have the right to form a little committee to help you through the process. Agreed.

So it doesn't have to be the whole board and it's probably best not to be agreed. You know, so that's how we used to do that in the past. So thank you. Any other questions? Okay, seeing a hearing none, then roll call, please. Garrett, yes. Yes. Yes. [clears throat] Powell, yes. Mason, yes. Selby, yes. Macintosh, yes. Yes. Green, yes.

Moving on. Resolution 626. Resolution 6-26. A resolution authorizing Mayor Dan Ridenower to apply for community development block grants and home investment partnership program grant funds from the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development. HUD. Have a motion to adopt resolution 66. Do we have a second? Second. Okay.

Questions from council. Questions for anyone wishing to speak? Go.

Uh Gretchen Cheeseman, director of community development. Um, so this is our annual um resolution that um uh gives the mayor permission to um apply for the community community development block grant and the home investment partnership program. We got our allocations today. So I'm going to have to ask you to make a minor change to the resolution. down there like about three or four lines from the bottom it has the um annual allocation that is based on the 2025 number

and so I need to ask you to change the home allocation to $471,998.35 which is the green box on the paper I gave you and the community development block grant allocation to 1,229 Um 1,229,825. Excellent. Excellent. And um this is essentially the same budget that we had last year

and it's uh or very close. It's a 7% reduction from last year for home and a.99 or just about 1% reduction for um CDBG. Mr. President, Mr. President, do [clears throat] we need to amend do we a need to amend this now before we go further or do we do we go with this uh for adoption? It needs to be amended. Okay.

Mr. President, I make a motion that we amend resolution 426 as articulated by the director. No, 426. 26 29 26 Okay. 626 Oh, 626. I got to turn my page. 626. 626. Yes. 626. We need a second. Mr. President, could you uh read those figures again? What the changing them to? The change on the home budget was $471,998.35

with a reduction roughly at 7%. The um CDBG CDBG budget uh would reduce to 1,229,825, a reduction of approximately 1%.

Thank you. To put those percentages in numbers, the home uh reduction is $36,763.76 and the CDBG reduction is 12,298. So, we have a motion to uh amend change amend to amend uh the amounts on both the home budget and CDBG budget. Uh do we have a second? I'll second.

Okay. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. I. I. Opposed? Same sign. Okay. Mr. President, now yes. I just wanted to ask u where the funds are going to be spent or do you have that kind of information? That's what's on here. Is it okay? Yeah. I just want to make sure.

So I mean I can I can uh um summarize that. So please um with the home grant we have uh there's a 10% cap on the amount of money we can spend for admin. um uh CHTO operating uh CHTO is a community housing development organization and we can give them up to 5% of our grant for operating funds

uh which is about 23,600 and but we're only going up to 10,000 on that a CHTO reserve which means if a CHTO has a project we have we're required to put 15% aside for that. So we've added a little bit more to that. So, that's $76,315. Uh, we have a down payment and closing cost assistance program that we um um work with Paststone on. Past also um a cho a chto. Um our other CHTO is Eco Rehab. They probably won't be doing any projects this year

because they're um really heavily involved in the Old West End project with um Intend Indiana. So, they'll probably um be real busy with that. Uh anyway, that down payment assistance is $45,000. home buyer development, which is um single family homes, is $138,60 and that usually gets added into the um reserve project and um rental development is 1555,623, um in the CDBG budget, we've it has a 20% um admin cap, so that's $245,500. $. Public service is um a maximum of 15% of the grant can be spent on that and we max that out to um $184,000 to our um four agencies that serve the homeless. Mhm.

which is um our um uh our our action plan says that um we're going to be focus on on uh serving the homeless with our public service money. A better way my mission YW.CA and Christian Ministries clearance is um tearing down blighted h blighted houses and there's a cap on that as well. We've got $225,000 allocated to that. We have a homeowner program that assists low-inccome homeowners with accessibility improvements,

HBAC projects, $225,000, and the remainder of $350,325 is um infrastructure projects. So, park, pading, sidewalk, um those projects. I thank you. And I didn't know if you passed these out to everyone out here, right? In the Yes. Okay. That's why I asked the question. So, yeah. No, I didn't have to. Okay. Thank you.

But if you'd like a copy, um I'd be happy to provide one. Our action plan is on um our community development department web page. It's out for public comment right now until April 20th. And we have a public hearing at 10:00 a.m. on Friday. I do. Go ahead. Um, Miss Cheeseman, were you expecting le I think you guys did a great job with all the resource, you know what I mean? With the cuts, were you I mean I think you guys did really well. Were you expecting to get less? I mean, in your process,

I just don't know with the federal fund. Yes. Congress passes a budget. Yeah. They put so much money in community development block grant and they run it through a formula and it trickles down to us. Yeah. But I think it's it's pretty good. You have your nice budget considering with all the cuts and stuff. So, thank you for job well done. Mr. Mason, you had a question. Yes. Uh on your public service. Yes. Is there all of these agencies have been funded? Uh yes. Okay. No, is there our fiscal year does not start until June 1st. Okay.

So last year we funded a better way my mission and the YW.CA Christian Ministries did not apply last year. So but they are in there and they will um they will all get okay. Now what if if uh there are other agencies that might want to apply then they for this other than homeless or addresses causes of homelessness can apply.

Well, what about community development? I mean just community development. that there are ways that that something like that could maybe be funded. Um well that's what the office is community developto project in home but our action plan that we adopted last year for five years says that we're concentrating on agencies that serve the homes.

Yeah. But I think you're cutting out a lot of agencies that need that may need assistance in accomplishing some of their goals uh by funding these same I'm not saying that they don't need to be funded but to fund the same agencies year after year when you got other agencies out here. Will you submit a comment for active? Yes, I will. Mr. Yes. And that's what I was going to ask is can you tell everyone how the easiest way to get to that action plan to where they can find it?

The city of Muny website on the community development page and it is in the announcement section. Um there's links to all the documents. Okay. Thanks. Quick question. You have trouble finding them, call us, email us. Yeah. M Cheeseman, is there a deadline? Like so those agencies had to apply for this year. So the agencies that want to apply what's their deadline for next year? Uh we publish a we do two things. We publish a legal notice that says that we're taking comments on our so next year it'll be our 2027 active plan. Okay. That's usually published in December or right at the first of the year.

Okay. Um we hold a public hearing and we ask people we tell you know we we or we tell people all the different kinds of activities that we can fund and we ask for public comments. Okay. Thank you. And then the applications are due at the same time in the legal notice we um notify people that we're taking applications and that and when they're due and how to apply them.

Thank you. uh m uh under the homeowners um rehabilitation one, are we making sure that I mean pretty sure, but are we making sure that the people that that get when they get that that they are getting licensed that whoever does the work maybe be HVAC or plumbing or something like that is licensed through the city and vetted. So, we know that uh Up to Co doing great. You know, the the we need to be up to par work when we're doing these um renovations in their homes. Okay. Thank you.

The the uh with the rooks, we run those um through our office uh with um a uh we have a contract employee that writes the specs and does the inspections and um quotes from the contractors and then we run those contracts of works. Okay, good. And uh we work with home savers on the HBAC projects and other accessibility. Okay, good. Thank you. Any other questions from council?

Any from the audience? Mr. Yer? Rick, newsman and author. Let's put this in context. The budget that the president rolled out the other day is going to kill community development grants throughout this country. That tells me the federal government uh who is the same as you don't care about the poor, don't care about the people because I've seen this in the last reconciliation bill where we can't get any money for people. uh this thing of doing things over and over. I do want to know what happened to a couple million dollars in Holden or housing money that was for homeless a couple years ago was supposed to renovate the old Harrison school and do a couple other projects that I haven't seen working with uh treatment and prevention programs here. We still have a lot of people out here homeless and needing help. and all the affordable housing, market housing being built is outweighing the affordable that needs to be done. But you might want to check with your president because this program is going to be gone if he has any say over it regarding the um permanent supportive housing project that Rick's talking about. It is it's been in the planning stages. It is about ready to go to it's it's um funded with a low-inccome housing tax credit project. Each unit has a um section 8 voucher attached to it and it is um set to close do the real estate closing and change purchase the properties and get the whole project moving hopefully at the end of this month. So, it's getting really close.

Good. Good job. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions or comments? Okay. Roll call, please. I make that I make a motion to adopt uh 626 as amended. Second. Now, yes. Dishman, yes. Golian, yes. Yes. Macintosh. Yes. Garrett, yes. Selfie, yes. Yes. President Green. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much.

I have two tabled ordinances. Thank you. Ordinance 2925. I will not be pulling that off the table. Thank you. Resolution 426. Is there any movement on that? No. Okay, that brings us to other business which is public comment. Okay, Mr. Rick answer

again. I hope your moment of silence tonight. you remember uh a disabled veteran who was killed uh young police in his home last week because of a welfare check. Uh that that still is going to burn my memory because after half a century I've seen other police shootings that were but that's something I think about what we're doing with law enforcement and how we're doing it.

Brings me to the drone. I found out today signing the licensing the people provide cameras, traffic monitoring. They're all over I think people here, I found out too that has new software, they can get your financial information and other information, too. I'd like to see a little bit more oversight in who you let in here, how they're using equipment and what they're doing to people. And as far as taxes, I know we only spend money. We don't necessarily have anything to do with assessment or taxation like the county does, but a lot of noise out there about higher taxes, not necessarily spending, but reassessment. You need to make more jobs here. What spend is money on running government? Do your job and bring people and jobs here. Thank you,

Mr. Waynecape. I want to comment on resolution 152. So, I'll read this and it says, "Whereas the community desires to create. So recently I heard that the mayor meeting somebody cancel the meeting. Is there anywhere in this that the mayor says he's in charge of this thing? Am I missing something? Y'all help me? I mean, sign the mayor in charge of this thing. I see there's seven board members on here, but he tends to think he's making all the calls. And the way I see it, he's just a member like anybody else.

Yeah. Am I am I reading this wrong? Nope. You're correct. Yes, sir. Has no authority to call a meeting, cancel a meeting, or kick anybody off. According to this resolution, correct? According to the resolution. Okay. Just just want to make sure and and roll this why I was not quick on getting the att Okay. Yeah. I I have no faith in this whatsoever because I think after this me saying this is going to cause him to not want to do

give that money. So I don't think it's a done deal. I think that money is going to be withdrawn or I think we're gonna find a way to not give it. And just to give y'all some background, you know, the center, the multi that was that that was tore down with the with the uh contingency of building a new one. Let us tear down your community center. We'll build you a brand new one because we need that property, but they never gave it to us.

Four years under Mc Shirley, eight years under Tyler, and now five years under Ry. That's 17 [clears throat] years. Nothing. So, and um another thing I want to say that building, I don't know if y'all know this, but back in the 60s when black people weren't allowed to go to the YMCA downtown, that's the only place they could go. And it was called the back then it was known as the black YMCA.

So, that building had history for us and they tore it down and told us they would build us a new one. And now we 17 years later, we still have nothing. So this playing games with this resolution. I have $500,000 for you, you guys, center, but no, I'm going to be in charge. And I'm going tell you, no, it doesn't work like that. So I don't think we're going to get that money. And I think it's a I think it's a disgrace the way the mayor is doing this. And like I said, we've been hoodwinkedked. We've been bamboozled. I don't believe this is going to happen. But we need if if it happens, we need to keep the cultural integrity that we had

in the multi. Yes, we definitely need to keep So all these other neighborhood associations. I hope that's just the the talk about getting it done and not coming in taking over that building. Yes. when it's completed if it's complet. Thank you for your comment. Thank you, Mr. Green. I'm sorry, President Green. Yes, you have comments. May I ask Mr. Arnold, will you review uh resolution 1525 and let council know your legal opinion of Mr. Skates's question as to if any member of that committee has the has um authority

authority? I know ultimately the mayor has the authority but does any member of that committee of which he is a member have authority of that committee? Could you provide that to council? Thank you. I don't think that speaks to that. Okay. You have May I make a comment? Yes, Mr. escape. I can guarantee you every member sitting up here is in support of the community center

and you know we're going to have to do what we need to do to get it done. It is overdue and it's not going to be 18 or more 19 years. I know I'm going to do my part to make sure it's done and the integrity of it is kept. You know, it's it's been way too long. And if I may speak on everybody's behalf, I think everybody on this council is in support of it. So we will work, we will do what we need to do to make sure it becomes it's given back to the people. So that was not against the council. It was against the person

and I just want to let you know we are in support. You this is where we Thank you. I I just want to make sure that Mr. Arnold had finished what he was saying. I've looked at the I've looked at that ordinance. I don't think all to who in charge of the commission should be calling meetings might be helpful to add that unless I'm unless I'm unaware of some other Okay. Could you give that in a written response just so that we'll have it on record um and then provide a copy to the clerk's office? Thank you. And then Mr. President, Mr.

M. Okay, Mr. Mason. That shouldn't happen until they've organized and and chose officers as to who's going to be the chairperson or the vice chairperson, you know, the the uh exe not executive body of the of the organization but

official officer. you know, once they organize, then they'll they'll have somebody who can call the shots. But for the mayor to come in and remove people from the board uh because he didn't felt like they were they were done right when this person actually voted for the person out of his community to be on that board was was totally wrong. Okay. Mr. Bilbury

the Christopher Bilbury. First [clears throat] of all, the mic's not working again. So, people's not being able to hear. People are speaking here if not speaking loud enough. I could donate a mic to the city or something, but this has to start. [laughter] Um, second of all, the problem with what you said, councelor Selby, is the mayor doesn't set up there, right? So, when you speak to the people up there, I mean, maybe you speak for them or they don't or whatever, they're they're capable of speaking

or not speaking, but you don't speak for the mayor. And the problem is it's the mayor is the one that's having the issue here with that. So, I just wanted to bring that up. Um, moving on. Uh yet again, uh since last time we were here, there was an issue that I attempted to email and get u communication from the sponsoring council member, Mr. Basham. And again, Mr. Basham, you refuse to email or respond back to me. Uh I don't understand what happens or what you guys I don't know. Hopefully, we can beat Mr. Basham and M. Maybe Mr. Skate can set his seat next time, something like that. I don't know. But when you guys are sponsoring council people, when you guys either write the ordinance or sponsor the ordinance, if you can't respond to people who have questions, don't sponsor the ordinance. If if you're not going to communicate with the public, it's it's gross that you continue to take the paycheck that the city gives you.

Do you have an answer for that? This was public comment as and I and listen and I'm asking [clears throat] you for your comment about this question. I'm tired of this. I withdrew the ordinance. Okay. So, what what was the issue with responding to an email? Why have you not been able to respond to an email for four years now? However long you've been up there, why can you not are are you incapable of emailing? Who are you looking to? I'm talking to you. You're an elected official. He does not have to. Three [clears throat] minutes. I can badger him all. That's true. You can, but I'm saying he does not have to answer.

Well, he doesn't have to answer. But it's ignorant that he doesn't. The ordinance The ordinance has been withdrawn until further clarified. I'm asking you why you can't email. What's wrong with your ability to answer to constituents? I had many conversations with people about this ordinance. Why could you not email me, sir? Could you Can you explain? You know, I wasn't this angry the 500 other times I've been asking you. Do your damn job or step down. Please watch your language, sir.

Excuse me. I'm just fine. All right. The crisis center. We got an issue with the crisis center. Can you guys look into that and see what's going on? Can you guys see what's going on with that? Wait, what's into it? Yes. Start doing your damn job, Dale. Or step down. It's gross. Thanks for the back, buddy. That's it for public comment. More public comment. No more. That's it. Thank you. here made a motion to adjourn the meeting. I second that. I'll make a motion to adjurnn. We have a second.

I second it. All those in favor signify by saying I meeting closed. Jur make a rule if you're not.

So what's the price that the whole thing? It's the whole thing. Never. It's not. And have have you seen the car? I've been trying to get sore.