Planning & Zoning - Regular Meeting

Okay. Time. What's that? Jim sit right here. Time is 7:04. Tuesday, October 7th. Town of Wiggins Planning and Zoning Meeting is hereby in session. Roll call, please. Commissioner Stan Bombgartner. Commissioner Jerry Ay, Commissioner Jim Musgrave here. Commissioner Jesse Borders here.

Chairman Jeff Palmer here. Pledge allegiance

to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands nationisible with liberty and justice for all. need to introduce the new commissioner, Mr. Jesse Borders. This is his first time with us. Yep. Hi, guys. I hope they well great in this position. All right. And we need approval of tonight's agenda.

I so move second. Okay. Motion in a second.

Commissioner Stan Bombgartner. Yes. Commissioner Jerry Ay. Commissioner Jim Musgrave. Yes. Commissioner Jesse Borders. Yes. Chairman Jeff Palmer. Yes. And approved. Next item is approval of minutes from meeting held on February 11th, 2025. That's the last time we met. There. Well,

you weren't here that You were half simple. Yep. Yeah, you were.

I so moved. Second. Okay. Motion with second. Commissioner St Bombgartner. Yes. Commissioner Jerry Ay. Commissioner Jim Musgrave. Yes. Commissioner Jesse Borders. Yes. Chairman Jeff Palmer. Yes.

Minutes approved. Okay. Now what everybody came here for? That is public hearing and public comment will be taken during the hearing. Public hearing and review of reszoning application PD plan for cottages at Aspen Grove. Before we get started, everybody that wants to speak, sign. I will now open the public hearing for resoning application and final PD plan for the cottages at Aspen Grove. The purpose of the hearing is to provide a public forum for all interested parties who wish to comment on these applications before the planning commission. Please sign the roster in the back table by the door if you wish to speak. Procedure for the public hearing will be as follows. First, we'll have a presentation by town staff. Next will be a presentation by the applicant. After these two presentations, we'll allow people who sign the roster speak at the podium for up to three minutes. Please do not repeat points made by others. It is fine to get up and say, "I agree with prior speakers comments." Please direct all your comments to the planning commission. After receiving public comments, we allow the applicant and town staff an opportunity to respond and answer any questions raised by the public comments. I will then turn the matter over to the planning commission. Commissioners may ask questions of anyone who testify. We generally don't ask questions during the presentations. Finally, the planning commission will discuss the matter and may take some kind of action. Public hearings are recorded for the public record. All testimony must be presented at the

podium after you give your full name and address and I swear you in. We have proper notification. Yes. Do any commissioners have any disclosure?

Diana, please present the staff report and provide any other information for the commission's consideration.

Thank you. Mark KS owns about 26 lots over by um Elm Avenue, Pearl Street, and the west side of Emerald. He has been trying to develop that land for several years. Um it is currently zoned R2 multifamily. Um we would like to reszone it to a planned development. the current set setbacks in our code are not um cohesive with what he has. The side setbacks in our in that district are 7 ft and the PD plan proposes side setbacks of 4 to 6 ft. The lot area in an R2 district is 8,750 ft, but the PD plan proposes lots that are 3,125 square ft. The minimum lot width is 70 feet in our zoning, but the PD plan proposes lots that are only 25 feet wide. These dwellings will be approximately 500 to 800 square ft, considerably smaller from what uh we currently have. Um the fiscal impact this development will have. The future budget of the town of Wiggins will significantly be impacted by this development. Mr. KS will be purchasing 25 water and sewer taps which will equal over a million dollars. These funds will boost our reserve for water and sewer associated purchases. There will be 26 more households to shop local. This would be a huge boost to Wiggins businesses. We just completed our um comprehensive plan back in February

and we spoke directly in the plan as to needing affordable housing. That speaks directly to um what the town is wanting to implement and this would be a step towards that.

Okay. Thank you. Are there any other staff comments? Nothing else to add? The applicant or the applicant's representative. Please come up to the podium. State your name and address for the record. I am Mark KS. Uh my address is 32661 East 151st Avenue in Brighton, Colorado. Okay. All right. Do you swear to tell the truth in this matter? I do. All right. You may. Okay. Continue with what you got there.

Primarily, there's been an issue statewide for affordable housing. What's happened in so many instances in in every town is that the fees um the lot sizes sizes of the homes all the requirements that have been required in the past have been kind of burdensome to try to come up with type affordable housing. In addition with the growth of the school districts and trying to retain new teachers uh has been an issue for all of the smaller towns as they've grown and for teachers to come in to afford $400,000 plus homes is is pretty tough. So this kind of fills those needs. At the same time, we wanted to create a project that was nice, and you guys can see by the drawings and what we've proposed. Um, these are not tiny homes. Tiny homes are typically around a 300, 350 square ft. So, they're more of a mid-range, more of a condo size homes. And you're seeing more of them in different places. So primarily uh it's also in a in a place in town which uh hopefully would help with the the sewer issues that are being uh worked on by the town itself and the funds that would come in from the sewer water and sewer tabs would help with that as well. So outside of that, other than what you can see that we've provided there, we're pretty excited about moving forward this project.

Thank you. Any questions? You want to wait? Uh yeah, we'll keep on going. Okay. Now we now open the public comment portion of the public hearing. Okay. Whoever. Sorry. Been a while. Deb Irwin, come on up. Deb,

my concern is the water. When please clearly state your name and address. Irwin, 214 North Agot Street. Hey, you swear to tell the truth in this matter. I swear. Okay. Now, you me

um the the water issue is what I'm concerned about, you know, um the water pressure, which we've discussed this three or four years ago, and that they were going to raise the water bills to cover new lines and stuff like that for, you know, over in this area over there. And um how are they going to fit all that on that lot and vehicles? I mean, to me, it doesn't make any sense. Where is everyone going to park? It's going to be a lot of traffic, and are they going to pack teachers and their husbands and their children in a little tiny place? I mean, I don't know. That to me just doesn't seem right. But my main concern is the water. You know, our water pressure is horrible. And if they build on there and take more water, then ours is going to lessen more.

Okay. And that's that's mainly my concern cuz I can't run water inside the house and then go outside and wa run water too because I don't have no pressure. And so like if the neighbors watering next door and I go out back and water, we don't have very much grass out back so I water it by hand. And um if his water is going, I got this little trickles. It'll take me 10 15 minutes to water it, you know, and it's just like I don't if more water's taken that's going to cause us more trouble. I may not have a trickle. Okay.

You know, yeah, I do. Yeah, I hear you. So, that's my main concern is the water issues. And I know it has also been discussed us running out of water. Is that true? I don't believe so. So, we're not going to run out of water? No, I don't believe so. I know people have brought it up, you know, running out of water and everything. And so, that was, you know, another one of my concern, but I want water pressure. Yeah. you know, I don't want to be out there trying to, you know, trying to water and I have no water because it's tough enough right now. Okay, that's about it. All right. Well, thank you. Uh, we have Heather Rodriguez.

Sorry, we're have anyone else tonight? No, kind of a joy. Name is Heather Rodriguez and I live at 210 Pearl Street. Okay. Uh do you swear to tell the truth in this matter? Yes. Okay.

So, one of my concerns was um they started working on this and I actually went back to look at video um before there was any notices handed out or any signs posted on the property. Um they had already started doing work over there. So, that was one of my concerns because that thought you're supposed to do that before anything is done. Um, and I do have video proof of me driving around checking for signs and nothing was there. Um, another one is the drainage and storm water runoff because it has been raining lately and because they built it up so high already, it's already draining off into my property and I could walk out barefoot and the water was past my ankles ankles high. So, I'd like to know what is going to be done about that. Um, and then traffic. The roads are crap. There's no sidewalks. There's not very good lighting over there. We're going to be having a lot more traffic. Um, right now it's a pretty quiet, small community. Um, we're very tight-knit and I'm concerned because our kids ride their bikes and other things like that and without better lighting, that's a very big concern of mine. Also, we can't use the alleyway right now. We haven't been able to for quite some time due to the work that's been going on. Um, which we used that regularly because when we bought our house, um, the shop, our shop entrance is in the alleyway.

Mhm.

And that's very common in this town. Um, I know there are a lot of other houses set up that way. Um, so it's making it harder for us to get to our shop. Um, and then, um, yeah, I think that was some of the main concerns that I had and I just wanted to know, um, what some of the insight's going to be for all that. And then I know they say that, you know, this is going to be affordable housing for the school and whatnot, but the school isn't even big enough the way it is. Like, we're to the point at the school district that um you know, they they don't even have room for any more kids. So, how we're going to house more people and we don't even have room for them in the school the way it is is kind of mindboggling to me. But um that's kind of all I had. So

well, thank you.

Yeah, Jose.

Hello. My name is Jose Munos, 301 Pine Avenue. You swear to tell the truth in this matter? Yes. I Okay. Yeah. Uh I seen what they going to do. I run a business here which will be maybe good for my business. That will be good. But I live in there and my center is the water. They're going to run the water to Pine Avenue. There's going to be too much water running in there because they what they did in the lot. They don't level that lot about the street, you know. So, the water runs that way.

So, all the water is going to run that way. And around my house, there is a lot of lost nails and a lot of stuff in there. There's things that has been happening there for a long time. And the thing is that what they going to do once they build this, they're going to do dishes on the side of the streets. So we're going to be in a flood zone. So insurance is going to go up. If they do that, what they going to do? They're going to like the post office. They're going to dig a big hole in there and they're going to run the water in front of my house. That's for sure. That's that's my concern that they're going to do that. And that's a lot of kids. I don't have any kids, but I have grandsons, too. And they're going to come to my house and play in there. And those places by the post office, if it's a lot of kids in there playing around, if one kid, two, three year old walking there, all in one of those holes, it's going to be a big problem for the town. I love this town. I moved 20 years ago. I love this town. That's nice and quiet. I'm not against a building or nothing. I'm against where the water is going to go through. I think we'll see. I'm not the only one who's going to have that problem.

And the streets, I wish they can fix it. I told them to put some more dirt in my street and they took street. They scraped the the there was a layer of uh hard soil, we'll say, and they scrape it. Now that's a mess. And it rains. It rains all over and there's a mess in there. Instead of putting some, they took some the house in this house on the corner of pine and I don't know which they went about this deep. Mhm.

Instead of leveling, they went and that's my concern just the water where it's going to ruin for me like the business like a businessman with the restaurant that works for me. I going to get business but where we live is going to be a problem. Okay, that's it. Sorry. No, thank you. Must be good. No, you did just fine, Jose. You did just fine.

Chris Sandival. Hi, I'm Chris Sandaval. I live on 211 Emerald Street. You swear to tell the truth? I swear I swear to tell the truth. Okay.

And I actually have pictures here, too. And how deep the dirt is around there, too. Feels like we're buried in a hole. One of them where the twotory house is with the thing. This is the alleyway. This is alongside my property. I like to pass this around to show everybody. Just one of the problems we're going to be having with this one is that right there. The one is lacks of transparency. I had to ask around a lot to try to figure out what was going on with her. And I got nothing against building. None at all. But 25 tiny homes, that's ridiculous. We have roughly around a little over 40 homes right there. That's around that whole area there from the little store all the way to road four.

And we want to put 25 little homes there. That's over half of what we have over there in a small area. That's going to cause a problem. And plus two, us not even be able to use the alleyway anymore. And every time I try to ask about, I'm like, I don't worry, it's okay. It's fine. I'm only hearing that from people that live on the other side of the tracks right here. No. See, nobody cares. Another thing too is the congestion, the plumbing. Yes, the water. And we can't just be going off like this just thinking, "Oh, we're going to throw some dollar signs in that. So, we're going to change everything around because somebody's got money." We got I mean, everybody here is for the people of this town. Yes, we need to make money. I get it. I used to be right where you're at right there. I know how it goes. But we also have to think about the people more than just dollar signs in our eyes. I got nothing against building there. It this would be fantastic, but within reason because as I can recall while like years ago that that was zoned to where you had to use at least four lots to build a house on there, not the little 25 lots. That was old news. I believe I mean we look back on those records to say that hey this was four lots. It was like that for a reason to build houses within reason. And also too, how much are these houses going for? And do we have teachers that are living out of town or something like that where they just have a hard time making it a commute? Or are we using the teachers as an excuse to try to justify this being built? Because if everybody here had more information what's going on, maybe we'd be a little more acceptable about this. But we don't. I talked to all these people here. None of them knew what was going on. I knew the most and I don't even know that much. And the last meeting was in February. This thing was being pretty well thought out for over a period of time now to say, "Okay, as soon as the dirt's done

in that, here's a plan and zoning meeting. Now, let's build houses." I don't appreciate the deception on this and I want transparency and I want something built within reason, not because of dollar signs. Because when I was on the council and that too and that when we were doing the Kya Park and that we had how many how many was that? 500 or plus taps and there were people protesting that but all of a sudden 20 taps and that and we should just bow down and say hallelujah with it. No, we got to think about the people and those homes and that we need to look about that will depreciate the value of our homes here. That's our investment and we can't be losing our investment like that. I built my own house with my own blood, sweat, and tears. And that break my heart to lose investment on that. That's something I work so hard on. And same with a lot of other people hearing that. I have nothing against the gentleman wanting to uh make something like that. But it has to be in within reason in that. And we got to think about the people and not put a dollar sign on their heads. And that's what I have to say.

Thanks, Chris. Thank you. Okay, that's all we have on the Mr. Somebody else. Yeah, this is when this is the time to do it. Come on up.

So, with the water problem, if it makes it more of a water problem, is it going to make it harder for us to sell our homes? That I couldn't answer. I mean, if you were looking for a home, I mean, that's the first thing we did when we bought our home is we asked the inspector to check the water pressure and it was good.

But then over the years since we've been here, it's dwindled and dwindled and dwindled and dwindled. So our concern is what's you know when we come around to maybe possibly selling our house that's going to affect selling it because of our water pressure you know and so that's a that's a concern of mine I mean I'm asking I don't know but I'm thinking so I'm not sure what the town has in plan I know there's been talk of increasing the water lines on going on that side of the track I think

but I don't know going to take a lot of money and grants so I don't know where they're at on that I think you Bo would have more information and he's not available this evening so yeah because I think it was about three or four years ago we had a meeting on the water situation um because and I was here because of the water pressure and everything and then they had a petition and everything and that you know because there there's just a struggle with the water. Yeah, I remember that meeting. I was Were you there? I was sitting right over there as a council member.

I'm old so I don't remember who was all here. But yeah, that was concerns of ours and I don't want it any worse because my husband hopefully is coming up to retire and we haven't settled on our plans yet. You know, we may decide to sell our house and move. You know, when you retire, you think of all these wonderful things you'd like to do. So, you know, I don't know. That's just a concern, too, right? Because, you know, we may want to sell our house a few years down the road, but if it we start having worse water problems than we're having now, then that could become a problem. So, thank you. Okay. Thank you.

I didn't put your name on. Yeah, I don't have a problem. Sure. My name is Bridget Sandaval. I live at 211 Emerald Street. You swear to tell the truth, in this matter?

Yes, I do. Um, I guess I just have a couple I want to know more because um I don't feel like we have been given. So I want to know like what the cost of the homes are like. Is it so much less if they're only 500 to 800? Are they going to be like a $100,000 homes or are they going to match more of what our community's homes prices are? Because like if they're much less that could drag our prices down and that would be a concern to me. Um, my other question would be like how and I don't know that much about how dirt and earth is supposed to be moved, but like where our property line is compared to where the dirt is. It's like a steep drop off like it is in the alleyway. Is it supposed to be smoothed out or I've seen kids like wander over there playing in the community and I like have to tell them like you guys need to be careful because there is big trucks and stuff like that. So, I don't know what the protocols are for that. That's your guys's job. That's just what I have seen. And it's concerning to me because like there is trees right there can like kids get hurt very easily cuz like maybe it gets real wet and it gets real muddy. I don't know. Um I do know that the drainoff that goes down Emerald Street where they put the sidewalk. I know that has been a problem for years and it's still not resolved. So, I would like to know like what the plans are regarding like um infrastructure with the street. Are you guys planning to pave the streets? Is it such a problem that you're going to have to at some point? I don't I don't know. But like even with that little curb right there, like it still carved a big gouge in the road on Emerald where where Elm is right there.

Yes. It was just a big deep gouge and it makes it almost impassible when the weather is bad. So, um, and then when the trucks were going through, it also made it really bad. Like everybody that would come to visit me would have to go the long way around. They couldn't come down. And I go through I used to go through the alleyway every day to come home, but I can't do that anymore. So, I go down Emerald Street to leave, but I would have to go all the way around, which, you know, that is also concerning to me. Um, and then like if depending on the prices of the housing, what kind of people are is that going to draw in? So, I would like to expand upon that. And where do you guys see the pictures of what the homes look like? Because I haven't seen none of that. Is it on the website? Is

right. Yeah, it's right. Okay. So, because I feel like that like I wish that that could be something that like is advertised to us because I don't know where to go for that. Like I don't do this kind of stuff. It's just all new to me and it's just seems like it's happened really really fast. Okay. So, that's what I want to know. All right. Well, thank you.

Yeah, I think so. I'm Bruce Barnett. I live at 2931 West 12th Street in Greley, Colorado, and I own the property at 114 and 112 Pearl Street. You swear to tell the truth? I do. Okay.

I have some of the same concerns of these other people. I have owned my piece of property for 30 plus years. The drainage has always been atrocious and it is no better now than we have put a sidewalk in or anything else. It still erodess my property and everything else. I am concerned about the traffic. We have a one-way street since a past town administrator put a sidewalk in the wrong

in the wrong spot that we have a one-way street. We're going to unless we fix that, we're going to have a one-way street forever and we need to do that. What conditions did they was going to be put onto these people like was put on the bank building? the bank had a lot of conditions they had to meet but to do what they did. Is this property owner having the same kind of conditions in their area there? Um, as for the the size of the homes, they're just a little bigger than what I probably have own in my two duplexes, but I'd like to also see a single dwelling house that's only 500 square feet is not a very big house for a family. It's a single person house. So, some of the accusations or claims that they said there's going to bring a lot of people in here, there's not going to be a lot of they're going to be one or two people. They're small homes. I have my two houses that have four people in them. They're very tight homes because they're 800 square feet. There's not a lot of room in them. So, I have concerns with uh reszoning to something to a 25 foot lot with no yard. No, no, nothing for anybody else to have without anything. So, that's some of my concerns.

Okay. Thanks, Bruce. Okay. Izzy, would you like to uh come up and Yeah. Um, as you guys are all aware, it's been a drainage problem because I've owned that a while. So, it's what's happened. You're talking what's happened previously.

Uh, in my case, all the water was run right into my property with no regard as to those issues. And I understand that it was been that way for a long time. So with this currently the town has done all of the excavation. They needed places to move dirt which saved the town a bunch of money and the taxpayers here by having the that area available to move dirt for their new ponds that they're digging over there now. So it saved in cost to the town. In addition to that, there's a a pretty good drainage plan. I believe that's being developed by Bo and the town to move that water. That water will be brought into the corner and kicked over into the uh ponds that they're now digging. So, it should alleviate most of the problems, I'm guessing, with the water issues currently. There's also been some uh drainage issues with the coverts being plugged over there so that they couldn't kick them towards the water was not getting kicked out of there towards the uh the existing ponds. So that's been a problem. So so the drainage has been a problem for me as well. Um the uh in regards to parking, all of these are 30foot setbacks off the street. All of them have twocar parking for each unit off street. All new sidewalks and drainways will be put in there. Curb and gutter uh down both the other sides that are existing. It will be it will be to match the existing uh gutters that the town has put in there right now.

Is that what's in the in your plan? In my agreement. So it's not to be set on property line. It's to be set 30 ft. That's in my development plan. That's that's here. 30. They're 30 foot setbacks off the street. So, they're not right on the street. Where the sidewalk? No, the sidewalk will be currently at the property lines where they are now, but the setbacks will be okay. 30 ft and the parking will be inside the property line and not on the street level. Gotcha.

So, there'll be no obstruction to the street whatsoever. Um the uh like I again like I said all of the dirt work has been being done by the town and that was an agreement with us to help the town to allow them to move the dirt there. Um the drainage the the lighting issues I that's first I've heard of any issues over there with lighting so I don't know that would be another issue for the town. And then the water issue, that's first I've heard there's been any low water pressure. So I I I don't live here, so I don't I'm not aware of it. I've been in the country most of my life and I've been on wells. So yeah,

you know, there's always some kind of water issues. This side of town's got a smaller water means, okay, than what that side of town does. So they may need to increase the pump size or whatever. I don't know. uh yet.

But perhaps uh with some of the funds that would be coming in to the town, it would help uh hopefully maybe they could direct some of those issues. I don't know. You guys would have to figure it out, but that's not really anything to do with us. And the current work that's been being done there, um again, has not been done by K's construction. That's all been done through the town. That's been the town. and the town uh with my agreement with the town was that they were going to do the drainage issues. And I wish Bo was here because he could speak to all these issues and I was hoping he would be here for this meeting. That's primarily who I've dealt with. And I've been through a couple of of uh town management changes over the last what four or five years that I've looked at trying to do something there. And that was initially zoned for multif family housing. So, I could have put an apartment building there had I chose to. Um, I don't think that's something that would be reasonable. I think what we have is reasonable. And as far as the retail on the homes, uh, we'd like to get them around the $260,000 range, which per square foot almost doubles what you're getting right now. So, it's not going to lessen the value of the current homes. If anything, it will increase the value of that side of town. It should beautify that side of town. And if you look at the actual houses that we're building, we put a lot of research into um making really nice street facads, street fun fronts that are attractive and successful in other areas. Um and and we're pretty excited about them. So it's nothing. There will be a yard, small yard, 25 I think by 10. There will be white white uh two rail white fencing across each that go across the front and to the front of the house and to the side of the house. Um and a tree in front of each house.

Aspen Grove. So there'll be an aspen tree in in each of those houses. Small front yards. Um very well-built homes, energy efficient, all LED. Uh they will be all built on crawl spaces. So, they will have a regular furnace, regular AC units, no heat pumps, no none of the shady stuff that you see going on with some of the tiny home situations. Mhm.

So, we we've taken we've researched this to make it a nice community and not we don't want to bring a bunch of, you know, not good people to the town. That's for sure. That's that's not our goal at all. I think we're going to see more retiree type people than you might imagine. So, thanks. There any other questions you guys have for me? Yeah, I haven't closed public comment yet. So, we'll do one more chance to come up and All right. Um, do I need a swear again or anything like that? Uh, no. You've already been

Okay. Um, I I see everything good in that, but it just seems like um hypothetically right now we're we're asking these questions and all I'm hearing is it should be like this, it should be like that. And then we're starting to focus back on development again, which this obvious thing we're talking about. I'm trying to focus back towards the people and that and and with just like there's been promise of dirt work for like me, my neighbor. I'm very concerned about my neighbor next to me. He is like in the lowest point there. When it rains, it goes up. He cannot park a car there. It'll flood all the way up to his door. And then we tell talk about the drainage. Why didn't we not channel that drainage before we even started doing the dirt? Uh, and that's one thing I'm I'm worried about there. Um, we talk about the water pressure and we're like, "Yep, water pressure." And then we go off to the next subject. Is there a solution on that?

Don't you think we should figure out a solution before we continue on that too? Or are we going to go through the same thing? Like with the dirt house is flooding. They got dangerously close to my house this year and that because of that dirt along with the problem is, hey, we're going to get take care of this dirt here. So, you're okay. Nothing. I just feels like I'm getting a bunch of um smoke blowing up my butt. Pardon? Pardon it. Um, what I would like to see and I think a lot of people would like to see here is actual information and not it should do it and actually it will do it. Uh, I said, "Well, and I I I really hope it does increase the value of our homes or keep them good, but even then, I would like to see actual written documentation proving that that will happen because it's we've been there a long time and yes, things has happened there real fast. Something that's probably been taken over a year to plan and all of a sudden overnight that raises concern because Lack of information forms assumptions. I don't like assumptions. You know the saying, makes out makes an ass out of you and I. I like to have actual facts, written documentation of what's going to happen here because it seems like we discuss it and then it gets pushed to the side. I really would like to know and everybody on that side would like to know because most of the people there, 90% of the people there didn't even know what was going on. that concerns me. What's the secret? That's what's telling me. I need to know everything about Everybody needs to know about it because it impacts everybody's lives over there. And like I said before, it needs to be about the people. It has to be about the people. Thank you. Thanks.

Yeah. Come on. that was the time to do it. So, my name is Jose. Uh, if they're going to build on there, pretty sure they're going to put a sidewalk and uh this street here. Are they going to put sidewalk and the rest of the houses and my street and the other on the side? Or they going to put surrounding this corner where they going to build? Uh, according to the plan, I think it's in the front down. Yes. Go down. What? Where's What?

What about our property? What about our property? We're not going to have sidewalk. We're not building nothing. They have to take that to the town board. Town. Okay. That that the only question if they going to get a sidewalk here we we have the same right to have a sidewalk and our street if they're going to payment and everything and just like they say make them little wider so the measurements right. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.

Okay. I have a concern on their 30-foot setback. 30 foot is not very much large pick anymore is 25 over 25 ft long. That only leaves 5t in front of them. They park over the sidewalk and everything else is hanging out. So they're saying, "Hey, they got such a great setback." I think their setbacks could be a little bit more with 125 ft lot. They could do better setbacks and everything else because it's all going to end up in the street. If there's two cars parked there, whether where's the visitors that could come in, they'll pull into driveways. I live in Gley. I see it all the time. They pull in driveways, block sidewalks all the time. You see it in what little bit of town we have now. They block the sidewalks. So, we have the room. Maybe the planning commission can make recommendations to have a little bit farther set back instead of a 30ft set back. More of that. I agree with some of the drainage is the biggest issue in the whole thing. I think I think Wigan should instead of building first, we should learn drainage first because it is the biggest hole in the world over in that scenario. It's like if this gentleman can wait, let us get our drainage figured out first and then come to build his houses. But let's drainage first. All right.

Oh, yeah. you can come up and respond. What they're doing now is addressing the drainage. Can you talk into the

I'm sorry. Yeah, they are what the town's trying to do right now is address the drainage. So, and it is in the plan and they are they they have places to move that water. They're going to move that water down those curbs to the uh the uh ponds that they're now digging. They had that's ex that's going to come under that corner of the street. They're going to open the uh uh channels to move that water out of there. That's the whole idea behind uh what the dirt work that the town's been doing at this time is to is to get that water moved. It's been that way for a long time. So, they're going to move it over to to the existing treatment plant is where the water's going to be going. So, and they're working with your engineers. I'm not sure who they are, but they're working with them now. the town is cuz that was going to be an issue for me as well. But so I think I think that things are going to be a lot better there than they have been for those folks that are down in that area. I think they're going to move a lot of the water away that that's been causing them problems up to now. I have a I have a question for the staff downstairs. Why are we doing the drainage for that property? Because when they done the development over here on the corner, the individual that's doing that development done the drainage.

Mhm. So my issue is why is the town doing drainage on a project that's not even ours? Who decided that one? I don't have all the information. I do know they're doing work on that retention pond over there and there was collaboration between public works and Mr. KS to um move dirt around. It saves everybody money and that's the extent of my knowledge of that plan.

Cuz when I done my house, I was in charge of the drainage on my property. I had to show a drainage plan for my property, making sure that my drainage didn't run into my neighbors. Did you have to do that? The issue was with Down's with drainage and um they had to move a lot of dirt at a at a pretty expensive pace on your property or

they brought it to my property at no charge. So they also are running drainways through my property which they don't have to pay for um that we took a lot of dirt that they would have had to pay to haul elsewhere. So it was and in addition to that uh we had agreed to run a new sewer line down that alley. So the alley is a temporary issue. They've got to get everything in there, get everything leveled up. We we will be bringing in excavator as well

to uh you know get the final grade basically based on what the town requires and um that it was it was a two-way street. You know, we agreed to do some work for the town and and alleviated some issues with the drainage. So that was the reason that they took that on. It saved the town money in the end. Okay. Do you have anything further right now? Okay. Um, I will now close the public comment portion of the public hearing. Okay. Before we turn to commissioner questions and deliberation, I want to state that the documents included as part of the record for this public hearing include all application materials submitted by the applicant, all materials included in the planning commission packets, all written referral and public comments received regarding the application, the notice of hearings, and the town subdivision and zoning ordinances. Does anyone have any objection to inclusion of these items for the record? Okay, questions from commissioners. Anybody got questions? I got questions.

I got a few. Go ahead.

First of all, let me comment that uh it sounds to me like the drainage issue is something that you should show up here for the trustees and ask them because they're going to be more in charge of doing anything. we don't really have any power to do that. So I would suggest questioning them about that. Um the other thing in terms of the water pressure, ours is we live in Kya Park, it's not very much, but it's sufficient and I remember you from before that uh that you've experienced some problems and I'm disappointed that they haven't helped you out on that. Yeah. Well, hopefully one of these days we'll get it done. We don't have that power. Um, as far as lighting in this new area, uh, we live in Kya Park and our street is dark other than, um, each home has their own lights. We have lights at the corner. So, I'm not sure you can expect to have well-lit streets. Um, in terms of I have a question for for you, sir. Um, did I understand that you have built some of these in other areas or or is this completely new?

I'm a general contractor. I've built many homes. Um, none of this size. Okay. What I'm saying is this concept, have you done this before? No. Okay. Is there any studies that show the effect in the local housing market in terms of costs going down or prices going down? Not that I I haven't researched that. I have seen that this is something that's being done the state right now.

Okay. and it's primarily for affordable housing which is by the way been mandated by the state. So it it's it's creeping into all of the small towns and are beginning to be required to have affordable housing. There's also grants and funds available for this type of stuff that can be very beneficial to the town if they can apply for those. I I'm not going to apply for them. I could, but I'm not. That's something that the town can apply for and those are funds that can be directed as you wish. I'm assuming based on the fact that you will be complying with the affordable housing uh request by the state.

Okay. Thank you. Um a couple personal comments. Uh, when I first read this, um, I personally like the idea, not knowing a lot about it. Um, I don't know if you could tell or not, but I'm kind of old and u I'm already supposed to be retired and I still work. Um, so I kind of looked at it and thought, well, one of these days I'm not going to be able to take care of my property. It's not that big, but still I've got weeds growing in my backyard I can't get around to take care of. So someday we may want to downsize. And this sounded like something perfect. So my first thought was I'd be in favor of it. I think we have a water problem and we talk about water but there's two different water problems. One is our tap water and one is runoff water. And so I'm hoping that the city will take care of your drainage problem. I think maybe we're all in for a long haul on the water supply and the prices of it. But even though I'm at first glance, I'm kind of like the idea. I'm not saying I'm voting for it, but my biggest concern is you and everybody else that's over there that's going to be affected. So, I personally would want to make sure that you're taken care of. Also, my first thought is this would be an improvement to our city, our town, uh that might incr increase the value of our property.

There's not much out there in the way of something downsized, apartments and all. So, I'm concerned what what am I going to do? So, I'd be looking at it many different directions, but my first concern is make sure that we do the right thing for the existing people there. Um, I I hope that it can be something that's going to be worked out. I do have one concern and I don't know how far we can go with this question, but we have a project that we started and it went through and then it hit a roadblock because of funds. So my concern is are there enough funds to complete the project?

Yes, there's enough funds and in addition to that we've been requested by the attorney to uh provide an LC letter of credit from the bank to do all the public uh upgrades. Okay. So they won't there won't be an LC there will be an L an LC on now not necessarily for the whole project but for all the the the improvements to the town we would provide a letter of credit for that but no we got enough funds to do this I just don't want to see what we have on our hands right now is a project got started and it hit a brick wall Yeah. and now it's sitting there. Yeah. And I don't want to see that happen again. We've had I've had numerous numerous people contact me over this project.

Okay. Um I've had people want to buy the whole project, which I don't want to do because I want to see the project done right. I want to see a nice an end pro end product. And you can see by the drawings, if you got a chance to look at those, this is not this is this is these are pretty nice units. These aren't just a bunch of little boxes like you saw thrown up in Brighton and other places around the these have some character to them. They're all two bedrooms. They're all two baths. They got fairly substantial living quarters. I think they're bigger than They're more accommodating than you might think. Put it that way.

Well, I was impressed with the overall look and cool. But thank you very much. I appreciate it. I I guess uh I'll step down off of my soap box. Anybody else got something? It's really not a soap box. Jury, uh as an old engineer, civil engineer, the first thing I noticed in this set of plan or this document is there's no preliminary grading, no drainage. That should have been in there. I have no idea where the water's going.

And I want to see that before I make any decisions. Period. Because by law, you can't run water where it hasn't historically gone. I I understand your concerns, but the concerns are the towns. That was the agreement that the town made. Who's to address the drainage? Who made that agreement? Diane was there during those meetings. And so we What meetings are we talking about?

We met um myself, uh the town manager, Craig Miller, and Bo Warden, the public works supervisor, met with Mr. KS, and there was talk of the town doing the drainage. The town was doing the drainage because they needed to move the dirt. So that was the reason. No drainage plan. Okay. But we still need to see drainage. I understand. Isn't it written in our land development code that the builder will provide the drainage? I'm pretty sure that's written in our land development code. Off hand, I don't know that.

So, did we step outside our land development code and give somebody a favor? Because right now I'm blindsided sitting here as the chairman of this board knowing that meetings have been happening behind our back. We're not included in any of it, which is fine because then it makes us a little biased, but I would like to had some heads up that we got something going on. And I'm getting blindsided wanting to make a decision and I'm being told that my town government is the one providing the drainage for a project that should be provided by the builder. Now, once it leaves his property and enters onto the street, that's the town's responsibility. But every water that falls on his land should be his responsibility to convey that water to the street or to her pond or something. That's what we did for Kaiwa Park. That's what we made the farm do. That's what we made Mr. Harrison do. And now all of a sudden, the town's doing a favor for somebody else. That kind of gives us the commission like it depends on who you are and we're supposed to be basing it off of our land development code and our comp plan not deals being made somewhere else and that should been put in here.

That should have been put in our that this is what's going on. Yes. Go ahead. I I think where you have a misunderstanding is that uh the town moved a lot a lot of dirt. So, is it my responsibility to address the town's issues with their ponds that they're digging and where they're moving their their dirt to? I Why would that be? I'm like, like I said, I'm still bl I don't even understand why what we're doing with ponds or anything. Is the ponds for your property or is the ponds for what? This is for the town. This is your your water treatment plant over there. Okay. Tons and tons of dirt and so

grading and all that was done by the town. So I was doing the town a favor in fact to allow them to move all that dirt there to save them from moving it elsewhere where they would have had to haul it a long way away. And they still have more to go. It's not completed yet. I have you been doing the excavation over there? You have, haven't you? Or Oh, okay. I thought he had. um which was a is a private company that the town has secured to do that. Mhm. And so I I guess I don't want to misunderstanding think that we just came in and said, "Oh, we're going to do this or do that." They needed a place to move dirt.

See, I'm not I'm not going to step on anybody's toes here. I'm just saying if I had been in charge, you move if you have the land and you give me a deal to move the land, you're going I'm scratching your back because you're having to raise that anyways. You're helping the town out. But I would have said in order to do that then you have to provide me your drainage plan of how this is going to work. I mean that's how we we can move the dirt so it works.

Well the other issue was I could have done nothing and just complained about the water and come to the town and said hey you need to take care of it and move to do uh trailer I mean u RV parking or multiple things I could have applied for differently than this. It's just a need that fulfilled a lot of issues. for the town and myself. I mean, it's a beneficial I mean, I'm certainly going to benefit and the town's going to benefit. It's It's a two-way street. It's not a It's not a one-way deal by any stretch of the imagination. And it's been going on for years. I didn't just start this all of a sudden. We started out with container homes in the beginning. Mhm.

Um and we've upgraded considerably since then to get to this stage of the development. Yeah. Thank you. I'm not I'm I'm not frustrated with you at all. Um I'm frustrated with frustrated with being blindsided right now that some stuff's not put into this plan for us to review. It's like should have been.

Yeah, it should have been. I mean, I I'm with Jim. I want to know where the dang water's going to go because I do not want to approve something that we do not have a plan in place sitting right in front of me that shows me where the water's going to go right now. It's going to go on them and go on them. It's going to go on Jose. That's where it's going to go cuz I see nothing on this drawing that says the water is conveying over to and we can't dump it into any dang ponds that are supposed to be going through our water treatment. That's right. If that's a pond, we can't put drainage drainage water over to it. Can't mix the two.

No, that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Who knows? We haven't seen a drainage plant. So, what this is like it's not But I don't know how there is a big if you drive down road you can see its

I think they're moving that as the drain outside of the existing ponds. Okay. One question I have for you. You're So, your sidewalks are not going to match up to the bumbled sidewalk that's currently to the south of your property. You're actually going to put them on the property line. Correct. So, we don't have a 25 ft street all the way down. No. To the north. We will be inside our property line and not in your property. Okay. Okay, that's my and and those are substantial sidewalks and we're going to match those existing sidewalks and cur curbon gutters. You're going to match up to what the town put in the new ones for width and

yes and drainage which are are good sidewalks. Those are wider than normal but they're not on the property line. Well, I don't know who did those. That was that was the town. So, I don't know. I'm going to put I'm I wasn't privy to that. All we agreed to was to match the existing sidewalks as far as construction.

But my recommendation that we don't match the current sidewalks because that's going to make a one-way street all the way north down be what? Maybe Elm or Pearl. That's Pearl. Pearl will be a one-way street all the way down to where his property ends right there. And because the sidewalks were not put on property line, those sidewalks were done by Paul Aro and he didn't want to inconvenience anybody and put them on the property line where they should have went. Now, if you look over here by the bank, if you've got cars parked on this side of of Pearl and you got cars parked at the bank, it's a one-way street. It's literally if anybody comes out of the bank and turns in and somebody's turning this way, you have a problem. and we're going to continue that on down. That would be ridiculous because it was not done. It was just thrown in there. I had an issue with that when I was on the council. That's what not before. That's why I got on the council so none of this would happen again. And now we're being told that they're going to continue putting the sidewalk where it doesn't need to be. Needs to be put on the property lines.

Yeah. This was always going to be on the property because I think Elm Street is a 60oot street and I think Pearl Street is 60 foot street. Supposed to be a 60 foot street. 60 or 80. Yeah, I think it's 60. And right now it's what 35? Anybody? You got anything staying like that? Well, most of my notes that I've got been answered. The only one I have left is uh school impact. I'm sure the council works on that, don't they? I didn't hear what you said. The impact for the school, the people living there, more kids in school. You'd have to school has to pay. Yeah.

They he has to pay the a fee to the school. Okay. I mean, that's in consideration here. Okay. Assumed it was, but Yeah. Want to be sure. I guess that's all I got. That and one to the fire district. Mhm. Yeah. I guess tax. Yeah. I think everything that I had written down was pretty much answered as well. I don't think any of the points were unheard. So, anything new you want to add or

um No, not necessarily. I'm pretty sure that everything's been pretty well covered, you know. Anybody else? Other than that, I would just love to see a drainage a drainage study and a drainage plan. That's my issue. That's my issue 100%. I got too many questions. Biggest done by an engineer.

Biggest is the drainage. Yep. and kind of wish that have been that would have been put in here that the town was in charge of the drainage. I uh c can I ask uh the guy I've worked with for 30 years doing these projects just for one moment. That's fine. Yeah, that's fine. You need me? My name is Bill. Speak speak in PA. I live in Denver, 3621 Monroe Street. You swear to tell the truth? Yes, I do. Thank you.

Um I've just been listening to the meeting and concerns and everything else here and I understand your concerns with drainage and what's going on here. Um Mark is here to ask for the variance. I understand you have concerns about drainage and plans and everything else. There's no reason to have the plans at this moment if the variance is never it's not even accepted or to go step in that far as far as doing all the civil engineering and everything else if we're not going to be accepted to build these homes. You know, I understand your concerns, but we're going to follow all the steps. We're not trying to break the law or codes or anything else. We're going to follow all the steps as far as submitting plans to the approval of the county or the whoever does your your plan reviews to where all the property drains out to the street. And I'm sure the city or the town is going to address the issues once it's on the road. You know, that's that's going to have to be reviewed and planned. I understand you guys asking where is it going to go. Well, it is going to be drained correctly because plans will be submitted once if this project is approved. Everything's going to have to fit to code and compliance. You know, everything's going to have to be done right. We're not going to leave it. We don't want to be in a lake over there. We don't want to put these people in the lake. We don't want to create no more issues for anybody. So, that's I I mean, I understand his concern about where's the plans for this. Plans will be submitted if the variance is approved. Really do wish B was here.

You have the option to disapprove the resolution.

Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, our job as a planning and zoning is to make sure it fits, you know, the land development. Currently, the land development code. I know we're trying to upgrade our land development code, but since we don't have an upgraded land development code, we have to base our decision off of our current LDC. And for our current LDC, we are definitely shrinking a whole lot of what our current land development code, but I do know that we also need to go by our comp plan. And our comp plan does state that we are looking for more affordable homes, more uh like tin not really tiny homes, but that was brought up in those meetings of having an area where there was smaller homes, stuff like that. My another big concern I have is with that area was only supposed to probably have what take them one three four like eight homes. So based on our water design of our system in 1970 that's what the design of the the water line going under the railroad tracks. So, by adding this many homes, that does put a a hamper on the water.

The eight homes, cuz I contemplated that at one time, just doing the eight homes. Ultimately, if you based it off of square footage, you would be you would gain nothing. You would probably lose because those homes could go as up far as 5,500 6,000 square ft. Yeah. But I mean on top of that though most homes are three bathroom two to three bathroom homes. That's that's average. You're I think on your drawing they're what? Two bathroom two baths. Two bedrooms. Yeah. So I mean you got laundry less impact than than a 6,000 or 5,000 square foot home.

Well as far as outside probably outside watering but inside watering is going to be about the same. I mean if you have two people living in a house whether it's two bathroom or four bathroom the the amount of usage of water is basically the same. Yeah. I mean, you flush the toilets, it draws that much water. I Yeah, I'm just assuming that these homes aren't going to be drawing six or five person families. No, I I wouldn't think so. I don't think so. I think they're going to be retiree type. And I considered at one time also just doing a retirement community there. Yeah. That period for people that are looking to downsize. So, we did consider that, but that's what we're at.

Okay. Square footage is what I'm saying. If I took the total amount of square footage and divided it back into what we have currently have versus eight homes that were much larger, it's probably going to be about the same. Yeah. Uh I just kind of closing comment make it quick. Yeah.

And um I mean no disrespect. I just want to be able to go off of things based off of fact instead of assumptions. That's all. Good thing. Okay. Okay. I don't have any more questions. I do, but they're not for anybody that's here. So, um, we will now close the public hearing and turn the matter over to the planning commission for consideration of the resolution listed on the agenda. If there's no further discussion by the planning commission, we have more discussion or think we got it, guys. You got anything, Jim?

Well, I'm kind of like you. I'm trying to look into the future. I know our development code right now doesn't really cover. Yeah, I think we need a little bit more information maybe from our own from our own council to to be able to make a final decision. Yeah, I get

we need all of that. I mean, I know what you said that sort of comes later, but you're asking us to make a decision on something that is going to happen later. We want to know now. I can't hear you from there.

Um, that's why I say that we're here just for the variance to approve the project. Then we move that's when we move forward submit plans with civil engineering and all that calculations where you invest into answering all these questions. At that point if the project and the land doesn't fit and I mean you can't make it work then it that's where it doesn't get approved to get built on. This doesn't mean your your approval of the variance doesn't say we're approving the build. I mean you are just saying yeah move forward with the project. That's when you submit civil engineering plans, calculations, drainage, everything else. And if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. That's when that's when people look into reviewing plans and making sure everything works or it doesn't work.

This is just to move forward.

To address you though, our job as the planning and zoning is to look at the future. I know that you were looking for that. So right now, my concern of the variance, that's what I'm I'm reviewing right now is not not you building or whatever. That's the fact that we're taking land that was only supposed to have roughly 6 to eight homes and putting 20 some on there without addressing what you can't address. So there's no way you can address it for us. Water, which is domestic water, and then drainage by adding 28 rooftops. That's a whole lot of water coming down. And it used to what used to be soaked into the ground is now not being soaked in the ground. It's being uh conveyed somewhere else. So our job as the planning and zoning commission is to make sure that by by approving this variance that we are looking that we have the best interest of the town and the best interest of our comp plan and our land development code going forward. That's what we're doing right now.

Yeah. You say be it was approved to build eight homes, correct? Well, that's what the original under our LDC. Yeah. or existing LDC. We built eight homes um 5,000 foot homes, which is pretty average for a roof. You know, that's 40,000 ft² between these houses, them 26 houses at 500 ft. You know, you're only building 12,500 ft. Yeah. But then you got 7 foot spacing in between each house. Now you're down to four. So I'm I'm actually a master plumber. So the whole the whole water issue, that's that's what I deal with every day. So I mean and and the I mean the water tabs and all that would probably help the Oh, I agree. I think

water, you know, to improve your water in the town and I do think the I do think I mean the water taps is a good thing. I think the sewer taps is a great thing right now. I'm just worried about them right there. That's what I'm worried about. So, it says four to four to six or something. It's 10 foot is your current. Yeah, there was seven foot side. We moved it to four and a half. I thought it was 7 foot. It is seven. Seven. So, and I assumed it was 10. Yeah. So, if it's seven, I'm even within the guidelines there. You went four to six or something. Four and a half.

Basically versus a 10 uh between both sides. It's five foot setback. And the front setbacks are a little bit different. We we overexaggerated the fronts by a long way. Yeah. To make bigger setbacks.

I didn't even see a setback on the back side. I mean, I really like the concept. I think the town needs it. I really do. I think we need something like this. I do. We need smaller, something more affordable, something that can help our teachers or young people that are just getting married or straight out of high school, college. Uh it's ridiculous that they have to go buy a $500,000 house. I mean, you know, it's it's crazy. So, right now, we need to figure out whether we want to vote to proceed further with this or not. I also tend to agree with Bruce on the front setback. That 30 foot might not be deep enough.

Yeah, I think might need to go a little more. That's Yeah, I know. He he would like us to go ahead and do this, but I don't feel comfortable voting until we get these answers from the uh from our own people. But we have to as to the drainage situation, the water situation. We need to know what they have planned.

Mhm. What what are what what are they I mean if they're in favor of it and they obviously some people are because we wouldn't be this far along but I want to know why or what what their plan is. I'm with you about the drainage and and the water situation now. So I just don't feel comfortable voting yet. They will have to come back with plans. Exactly. Yes. That's what he's saying is the this is just to let us know if you would allow the variance. Yes. That we're asking for doesn't mean this could proceed further without your approval and and the uh the rest of the town's approval. Yeah.

And there's another meeting after this which I believe addresses some of those issues. So it gives you time to go back. But again, this vote is just simply to say, is this a project variance-wise that would be acceptable to the town? Because we I obviously I can't continue to spend dollars after dollars after dollars and and have you say, "Hey, guess what? We're not going to approve it. That doesn't mean it means it would be acceptable to you if we meet the other criteria that you folks put together with your in-house people." Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Appreciate it.

I move that we postpone a decision until we have all the facts.

Well, we can't do that. Since we've opened up the public hearing, we have to make a we have to make a vote. Whether that be yes or no, that's what we have to do. So, I mean, we can put a yes. If you vote yes, you can also we can have it on there that you know we recommend our recommendations. So before we do the vote, we can say we recommend that front setbacks right now be moved to 35 ft and that we have other questions that we were looking to get answered before the next meeting or at the next meeting. Right now, we just need to figure out, do we want to give him the variance to take what used to be 75 foot lots, shrink them down? That's all we got to do tonight. There's not We're not approving him to build a whole bunch of stuff.

Okay? We just I know you have questions. I have questions. We all have questions. We just need to know does this fit our land development code currently and does it meet our comp plan for the future? So, I mean, we can have a lot of questions. We can have our own concerns and still send this on to the board for their opinion of it. We can also vote no. I think it still goes before the board, though. So, I mean, we can say no and it's still going to move on to our council, but we can say yes and it still moves on to the either way. It's going to the council. I think we've addressed a lot of concerns, listened to everybody, listened to the builder. So, I think it's been a pretty productive night.

Yep. Yeah. And that's 25 more water. taking up water. You're going to get more less. But again, this is just

this hearing again is just to say will this project this type of a project be accepted to the water issues not really have nothing to do with but it will well. No, I'm paying 1.2 two or three million whatever dollars it is to the town for those issues to fix my water. No, to address the water issue, not your water personally. I'm saying that's part of our water and sewer attack. Those funds go to those funds go okay support your your I'm sorry to support Yeah, you can just talk into the mic so everybody can hear.

Those funds go to the town to support those issues. That's what those funds are for. Yeah. the water and sewer test. That's something to take into consideration by you folks as well. That's a lot of money that you're walking away from. Yeah. That can help. And you and you need those services now. And that's why they're moving all that dirt and that's why they're doing all the things that they're doing is to help alleviate some of those issues.

Yeah. I appreciate it. Thank you. Okay. Discussion is Let's have a vote. I would entertain a motion on the resolution. So if we approve this and it doesn't happen, does it revert back to the old zoning or is that permanent change? This the vote tonight is to change the zoning. Yes. But if project doesn't go through, does that zoning stay on that property or does it does it go back where it was? I don't have the answer to that.

I think it's the variance is strictly for for this project. I think if this project fails out, then I think it goes back to our original plotting of the I believe. So you're not No. Yeah. Yeah. Very to the land development code. Okay. So, the next meeting is with us or with the council. The board the board of trustees is the next step. We're not in on that one. No, you can sit in as public, right?

You're going to you're going to put on our concerns to what? Yes. to when you address the town, you know, our board. This was our concern. Yes. Yeah. They'll know what we know. Yes. So if we vote yes, it moves on with the questions that we have.

Yeah, it'll move on. It'll go if if it's unanimous yes. Then it'll go that we unanimously said yes with these concerns concerns. Whether you vote yes or no, it will go to the board of trustees. And I in either situation, I notify the board what your concerns were, what this board wanted to do, whether it was a yes or a no. I give them your recommendation. And we know, we just she'll say, "Oh, no. We voted no." But yeah,

and we know from past experience, they don't always go with our vote. I agree with that except for that I don't I don't want to push into a situation that's not good for the town either. So I'm not coming here to be at odds with anyone. No. Yeah. With you or the or the town management. Yeah. I don't I don't I don't see that either. Yeah. I I don't want that to be an issue for you guys or for me.

You know, I come from small towns. You know, I I've taken care of Horse Creek Reservoir for 25 years. I ran cattle there for 18 years. I started Rocking Horse Farms, which they can look up. A gentleman asked me one of my projects I started. That one's in Brighton. It's easy to see. It's a nice project. It's beautiful, very, very successful. And um again, I don't want to be at odds with anybody in the town. I want to be on your side. And so, I may sound negative. Sure. But I actually like the project. I liked it when I read this. We just have concerns. Oh, absolutely. And I'm concerned about the people sitting back there

and I'm I'm concerned about some of the questions that have come up. That was my only concern. I personally like it. I think we need it. I think we need it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we're here to be a part of the community, not to be obstructive in any way. And so I just want you guys to know that whatever we can do, I mean, if it gets to the point where they start to ask too much of us, that's the reason affordable housing is not successful and that's the reason developers can't develop. And I'm just a small guy. I'm not uh Kya Park. I'm not any of those guys. I'm I'm a little guy, you know,

and uh so that was the concerns when we came here to begin with is that, you know, we want it to be nice and and that's why we went to the work and we changed from what our original plan to upgrade all this stuff. A dramatic improvements from a 300 square foot unit to most these are all coming in at 650 or better. So, it's a substantial diff. It's two two tiny homes. Yeah. So, that's where we're at. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Still got a motion or asking for a motion.

But if we uh deny this the council can still continue do what they want to do. We're just we're just uh you're giving your recommendation. Yeah, we're just we're just source of information. We're the first first to hear the the Yeah,

I'm I'm same way. I just heard learn about about I knew it but seven days ago this this is supposed to be okay this is supposed to be a quasi judicial meeting which means they're not supposed to know anything about this until it's presented to them tonight you guys were notified

I I notified everyone by mail okay well I notified neighbor numbers by mail. I have record of that that stated we were having this meeting tonight and that's all that's all that I sent you was that we were having this meeting tonight and this is all the information that we're presenting. Yeah. Yeah. And posted on the property. Yeah. It's post been posted on the property. I think it's for 30 days, correct? Or 15. What is the It only has to be for 15. It was about 20. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah, I mean we met all the criteria. So for legal standards,

it's not something that the planning department does not discuss planned developments with the public. Um for many reasons, but we can't just go out doortodoor and say, "Hey, we're thinking of doing this." That's what this is for. That is tonight. Yeah. We can't can't be privy to it cuz then we become biased. So the only thing I wish Yeah. There. Yeah. No. So

you're correct. You're correct. It is getting higher and higher. All right. Well, thank you for clarifying it.

You're a good motion maker. [Laughter] It's true. He did. Jim second both of them. So, might need a new guy over here. Mostly You make the motion. Motion to approve. Say I make the motion. I make the motion. Second. Okay, we got a motion and a second from Stan.

Commissioner Stan Bombgartner. Yes. Commissioner Jerry Ay. Yes. Commissioner Jim Musgrave. Yes. Commissioner Jesse Borders. Yes. Chairman Jeff Palmer. With conditions. Yeah. Yes. With conditions.

Okay. Resolution approved. Good luck at the council. May they'll be able to answer more questions than what we can. And people that are in attendance, before you leave, please go to the council meeting. Both there. Uh when would the council meeting? The 22nd. Voice your concerns with them because they

I believe. Yeah. They'll be able to address like the drainage obviously now and the water supply issues. So, we thank you guys for speaking and I appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, we do wish you luck. I mean, there's some Yeah, I know. I did a little bit. There's I could see my wife and I live in there. Maybe.