Town Council - Regular Meeting

All right, I'm going to hit the gabble hard. You ready? Is staff ready? Everybody ready? Um, good evening everyone. Before I hit the gavvel, um, Councilman Rambo has been teasing me about my wimpy gabling. So, let me call to order the uh, Wednesday, November 12th town count for our November meeting. Um, first of all, um, yesterday, since we now as a town recognize Veterans Day as a holiday, would all of our veterans stand up and let us honor you, please? Please stand just where you are. Thank you very much. [applause] Thank you very much. And let's give big honors to my friend, my colleague, former mayor pro Tim, and until proven wrong, I'm proven wrong, the longest serving council member in the history of Mount Pleasant, Gary Santos.

[applause]

We have plans and you'll be hearing a lot more about those. So Gary, don't go far. You're gonna um not tonight but coming up soon. Um so item number one on the agenda is uh prayer by Chaplain Roy and then pledge of allegiance to be led by Councilman Gary Santos. So please stand. Would you join me in prayer? Almighty God, I pray for this council meeting tonight. Give each council member wisdom, guidance as they deliberate on items before them. May every decision be righteous in your sight for our benefit and [clears throat] for your glory. We ask it all in your holy name. Amen.

Amen. To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you very much. Next on the agenda is approval of the agenda. Do we have a motion? Move for approval. Mr. Chairman, we have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion? All in favor, please signify by saying I. I.

All right. The agenda is approved. Item four, public hearings, awards, and presentations. A administration of the oath uh to the mayor. Is that first? Oh, yeah. Okay. He's here. So, if Judge Hess will join me and first lady Susette H. raise your right hand. I do solemnly swear I do solemnly swear that I am duly qualified that I am duly qualified

according to the constitution of this state according to the constitution of this state to exercise the duties of the office to exercise the duties of the office to which I have been elected to which I have been elected and that I will and that I will to the best of my ability to the best of my ability discharge the duties thereof discharge the duties thereof and preserve protect and defend preserve preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of this state the Constitution of this state and of the United States and and of the United States. As mayor of the town of Mount Pleasant as mayor of the town of Mount Pleasant, I will equally, fairly, and impartially I will equally, fairly, and impartially, to the best of my ability and skill

to the best of my ability and skill exercise the trust reposed in me exercise the trust reposed in me. And I will use my best endeavors and I will is my best endeavor to preserve the peace to preserve the peace and carry into effect according to law and carry into effect according to law the purposes for which I have been elected the purposes for which I have been elected. So help me God. So help me God.

Congratulations. Thank you all so much. I want to thank Susette for all she does um not only for me but for this town and I want to thank all of you for the privilege of of serving as your mayor and what a privilege it is and I would not want to be mayor anywhere else but South Carolina. just been the highlight of my my leadership endeavors. And now I get to swear in the two newly reelected council members, Tinky and Council Member Akano and our new council members, Miss Whitaker and Miss Crosby. If y'all will come forward and whoever is with y'all that's going to stand with y'all come forward.

[laughter]

and I will face them. I'll try to get over to the side and I'll try to do as good a job as the judge. You did a great job. Kathy.

All right. So, everyone will raise those being sworn in. Not everyone those being sworn in will raise your right hand and repeat after me. That's okay. I do solemnly swear I do solemnly swear that I am duly qualified that I am duly qualified according to the constitution of this state according to the constitution of this state to exercise the duties of the office to exercise the duties of this office to which I have been elected to which I have been elected and that I will to the best of my ability and I will to the best of my ability discharge the duties thereof.

discharge the duties thereof. and preserve, protect, and defend and preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of this state the Constitution of this state and of the United States and of the United States as a council member as a council member of the town of Mount Pleasant of the town of Mount Pleasant. I will equally fairly and impartially I will equally fairly and impartially to the best of my ability and skill to the best of my ability and skill exercise the trust imposed in me exercise the trust imposed in me and I will use my best endeavors and I will use my best endeavors to preserve the peace to preserve the peace

and carry into effect according to law and carry into effect according to law the purpose purposes for which I have been elected. the purposes for which I have been elected. So help me God. So help me God. Congratulations.

Thank y'all. Thank y'all for coming. Thank you for being here. Thank you for being here. I could get a picture.

You come over here. Yeah, that's perfect. All right, everybody give me a big smile. Good job.

Too close. [laughter] Hey M.

Five years. He's in your Yeah, I know. Are we still

maybe'll That's what

she was right. After that's going

Well, hey there.

All right, we are reconvened. Thank y'all very much and congratulations again to everyone. This um brings us to item 4 C which is election of mayor prom. I'd like to move that um Howard Chapman be elected. Second. All right. We have a motion for Howard Chapman. The way this works is that uh we can take nominations. If there's only one, we'll do a voice vote. If there's more than one, we vote by ballot. Are there any other nominations? All right. Um, we did have a second, right? Yes. All right. Any discussion? All in favor of Howard Chapman as Mayor Pro Tim, please signify by saying, "I." I.

All right. Congratulations, Howard. Thank you, sir. Thank you. And thanks to everybody that voted. [laughter] That's a very short acceptance speech and everyone appreciates it. Item 4 D, Charleston County Public Works Transportation Sales Tax Presentation. Yes, sir. And Mr. Mayor, council members, this is Eric Adams from Charleston County.

Good evening, Mayor Haney, members of council. Uh, first, thank you for having us uh here tonight. We certainly appreciate that. Uh, we prepared a quick presentation to talk about uh the transportation sales tax program holistically and the the future of the program. Uh main things I want to cover is kind of why we're here, what we've learned uh through the last 20 plus years of the program. um you [clears throat] know a call to action as well is is the public involvement that we would like to see.

So uh as mentioned uh the the program's been in place about 20 years. Uh but why we're here and what we really want to talk about is we as citizens of Charleston County are at a crossroads. The first sales tax in 2004 is set to expire in 2027. So the question is uh does do we the citizens of Charleston County want to extend that tax or not? So uh in back in September, county council formed a special committee so that this issue could be discussed in public in a very transparent way and so that uh public input could be received. The first thing they asked us to do is reach out to to you to municipalities to really have what we like to refer to as listening sessions. So, we want to come tell you about the program, but the main reason we're here is to listen to your input, understand what you need. You know your community better than than we do, and it may be different than what uh a different area of the county needs. So, we want to hear from you specifically. Uh we've learned that over the life of the program, a little over four and a half billion dollars has been committed to infrastructure projects. And I'll break that down a little bit for you. Um, this just gives you an idea of the allocations in different categories from the 2004 and the 2016 sales tax. It gives you rough rough percentages. Those percentages are just for historical purposes. It doesn't mean that a future sales tax uh extension would be set at those exact percentages. They're, you know, they're just for historical purposes, but they give you an idea of the amount of investment in each of the different categories being green belt programs, infrastructure, which is more thinking of roadway, bike ped, and then public transit. So, we know that over the life of the program, we've been able to leverage about $1.2 billion we've been able to bring in from the state and from the federal government because we've had the local option sales tax. So, that leveraging of that funds allows for more infrastructure improvements in our community. One of the other uh facts that we want

to make sure everyone is aware of is is with a a sales tax, we estimate about a half of the revenue comes in from non-residents of Charleston County. So whether that be tourists, commuters that live outside the county that come into the county to purchase things and also including the money we've been able to leverage through through grants and matches.

Here's some statistics kind of give you um overall of what we've accomplished. I know you're familiar with Johnny Dods Boulevard, which this county funded through the sales tax, Olive Palms widening, numerous intersections, sidewalks. Um, but you know, some of those things that that are in common with those projects is those are state roads. A lot of people don't realize over half the roads in Charleston County are stateowned. So, the state um in their defense has their hands full, right? They've got the fourth largest highway system in the nation and we're one of the smaller states. they they're really um have a lot of challenges um on their hands. They're behind um in maintenance, but also their focus now, if you look at their funding projections, is on interstate system and on bridges. There was a bridge in the upstate about a couple months ago that actually collapsed. So, you might argue rightly so, right? They're they're focusing their funding on on interstates where most of the commuters are um and then on the safety of bridges. And the reason I bring that up is the sales tax program is a mechanism for us locally to fill that gap. Right? The state has their hands full. They're probably not coming to address capacity issues on a local level or intersections. We do have that ability at the mechanism with the transportation sales tax to kind of fill that void. And it also speaks to just quality of life overall. And that's really what we're talking about. you know, whether it be in mobility, we're talking about sitting in traffic, we're talking about bike ped, we're talking about transit, and also quality of life and green space. You know, do you [snorts] do you want to preserve green space and preserve those things long term? Speaking of green space, the green belt program has been extremely successful. Uh 49% of the county's total acreage is protected, we estimate, which is second in all the counties in the state. transit. Um, Carta, who who manages and operates the transit program, has been able to upgrade the fleet, over 125 vehicles, improved bus stops, and very importantly is the Low Country Rapid

Transit project, which is regionally significant as an alternative to I26. We know that that corridor is extremely congested. The Low Country Rapid Transit provides a bus rapid transit that would be outside of the flow of traffic and run down Rivers Avenue and serve from the fairgrounds area into downtown Charleston. And while that doesn't directly affect um Mount Pleasant necessarily, it is important for the region, but funding for the sales tax program can also be implemented in increased route frequency, increased route expanding route services. So those are all things that are are considered or could be considered. We know that their service miles have drastically increased along with passenger trips have have uh increased significantly since 2004 with the sales tax being a very important uh funding mechanism for public transit. So what's changing and I think we all know this right uh since 2004 about a 33% increase in population. So that's about 110,000 residents just in Charleston County, not including Berkeley and Dorchester. We also know that vehicle registrations have gone up 40 41 and a half% since 2008. So we know there's more cars on the road. What do we project in the next 10 years? Another 42,000 people uh moving into Charleston County. More people, more cars, more traffic. So call to action. Where are we now? As I mentioned, council's formed a special committee to consider this. They haven't decided if they're going to uh put this forward in November of 2026, if they're going to put forward a referendum or not. They want to hear from from you. They want to hear from the community. Is this something that the community wants to do? Uh so now we're we're undertaking our listening sessions, which is what we're here doing tonight. We will continue to do this at other municipalities and then we'll host some of our own public meetings as well with the idea of we take that information back to county council in January. Uh and then we work on project list in the

early spring and develop a plan with the goal of developing a plan that is transparent and can be trusted by the public and identifies what will be accomplished over the 25 years of this program. So, investment categories. Um, first off, we're estimating about four and a quarter billion dollars would be raised over the life of this 25-year program. We've kind of broken that down into investment categories kind of for your consideration with a thought process of beginning with the end in mind. So, where would you like to see money invested so that at the end of the 25 years we accomplish what we set out to do? We've broken those down into green belt program as I mentioned um protecting purchasing land also access to waterways we've heard is important things that's something that's important to the town bike and pet you know closing gaps addressing safety issues um more sidewalks more bike access um and we've allocated that as a specific category in this for your consideration before it was just in the infrastructure portion now we're actually breaking it out uh for for your consideration public transit as I mentioned mentioned, you know, expanding services, low country rapid transit, and then roadways. So, roadways could be encompassing of improving pavements. One of the things I like to mention is, you know, I know our roads aren't great. There there's potholes, they're not in great condition, but if you look at our percent of good roads as compared to the state at large, we're 73% better of good roads in good condition, which I know can be surprising because we see our roads in the condition that they're in. But can you imagine if we didn't have the halfcent sales tax which funds $4 million annually into that program? Now we do project that over the next 25 years we need to up that the 10 million that we're putting in combined with other funding. It needs to be up around 30 million just to maintain the overall condition index of the life of the program and we have partnered with the town on that um through the years to get a better bang for our buck. Uh rural safety so improving rural roads

intersection safety. Could there be allocations specific to to address intersection safety? Uh and then bottlenecks. So that could be widening of roads, that could be intersections, that could be operational changes like signal coordination, which I know the town has been very upfront with that. But could we regionally uh develop a program or a plan where all the signals in the region are connected? So finally, the call to action. So to get involved. So we've got our questionnaire. We'll have ongoing workshops. We've got an email address. Uh people can stay stay informed through our website as well listed there. And then a QR code here uh that's also in the leavebehinds that hopefully you all have at your desk there. Uh you can scan that QR code and we would request um from the town that that by December 1st uh if you so choose to submit a a list of your priorities specifically in those investment categories. what do you think those percentage or what what do you think is appropriate for the town? Uh and then also getting into specific what projects uh would would the town like to see that would be priorities for the town. And then we've got some questions there just to get you think you know we want to know what have been the successes what have been the challenges of the program are those those categories that we put forward are those the right categories or do you know of others um that should be added so with that I'll conclude my presentation happy to take questions uh if you have any Eric just a quick question um they have had a couple of meetings it's either two or three meetings where they've asked the mayors to come and I I I let the chairman know that December 1st is not a great date for this body to try to have something done. Um so, but you know, the others, they have the election in November and they're sworn in in January. We have new council members. And um what's what's the date of committee day? Uh what's the first Monday in December? Is it's past the 1st, I think. But um what's that?

December 1st. It is December 1st. So, um I mean we'll talk with council and everything, but I I know from what I've been told that is not a hard and fast date that if we don't get it in, it doesn't get considered, but just understand that's a difficult date for us. Yeah. Yes, sir. My apologies. I remember that conversation. Sure. We could certainly do it later in December. All right. Thank you. Yes, sir. M um why why should our citizens trust the county with um more money after the main project that was supposed to happen for the town of Mount Pleasant was Highway 41 and it's been completely mismanaged and botched.

So I think um to your point, we've heard the issue of trust and and that's what this outreach and listening session uh approach is different than what we've done in the past. It's a new approach to be transparent uh to get the input from the public and develop a plan that can be trusted. So whether uh you know someone's you know trust levels with specific people, we're trying to focus on a transparent plan that can be u you know trusted and understood of what would be accomplished and what the priorities of that plan would be.

Okay. So, there were some recent quotes in the paper with some um elected uh officials uh of county council um essentially laughing at the citizens of Mount Pleasant um not saying very nice things about this community. Um this is not something that you can answer, but uh however, I do think it would be wise um for them to hear the message that a new sales tax will not get passed with the issues currently out here in the town of Mount Pleasant. If you look at the numbers of the last sales tax referendum that tried to be passed, um particularly that Highway 41 area voted it down by an incredibly large margin. Um and so I think until those issues are addressed and they come to the table, uh I know it won't have my support and I don't want to speak for anybody else, but um anyway, those are my thoughts.

Yeah, I I can't speak for our elected officials. I will say that from a staff perspective, we have always had a great working relationship with your staff that are in uh before. Yeah, I get it. Yes, sir. Hard to follow up that act, but yes, the my I I believe we voted the last time for what we're asking for and we we we turned in our top three and I believe the top one I think totally got ignored. I mean, is that is that is that going to is that gonna I mean, I guess I'm following up with his question. So, is that going to change? Because we I believe number one was the uh Houston Northcut 17 overpass. That's the biggest one. And that was and and not necessarily an overpass.

Well, right. The inter I'm I'm down. Yeah.

Yes. But that and then and and that was ignored as well. So, you're asking for our input. We rank them one, two, three, and then they don't come back one, two, three. So, and maybe maybe there's an explanation on on on what you guys see um from the county side that that matters, but if we're going to spend the time to put it on committee and spend the time to put on council and and and use staff money and time, we would we would like that to be listened to as as well. If we rank it number one, we're up here as elected officials. We believe we're representing the best interests of our citizens and and we think that's what they want. So, um, I'm not we're obviously not going to talk about tonight, but we Yeah, go ahead. Thank you. So, we could

Yes, sir. We understand. I think your staff's put together a great plan of priorities. The reason we ask again is maybe priorities have changed. Don't know, but uh and then ultimately county council makes a decision on on the list, but we're trying to develop that transparent process. Okay. Excellent. Thank you. Yes, sir. Mr. Ch.

Well, first of all, Mr. Adams, thank you for coming and explaining this to us rather than just sending us some paper to look at because that's what we had for the last one. Um half cent sales tax um is something that is near and dear to my heart. I had the privilege of working with the state legislature to get the law passed that actually allows us to do this. That was the same law that allowed Carter to get started after three attempts. One in 2000, one in 2002, and finally, as I said, and here 2004. Without the passage of this half cent sales tax, the local option for Carta dries up. Without the local option for Carta, there is no federal funds because without the local option, you are not entitled to federal funds. It's significant for me to try to work with county council to put together a plan that we as Mount Pleasant Council think is the best plan and to get it on the ballot. Certainly the Houston Northcut 17 is important, but there were some other projects that I also felt [clears throat] were important to Mount Pleasant. So, we as a council need to get together and there may be more than just the three that council member Iano mentioned. There may be some new ones. Um, I know we showed

the [clears throat] bike ped plans as significant, which they are very significant. County H council has helped us get to where we are now with some of these bip plans. So, um, I want to make sure that that continues to be part of the plan. Um, I would also uh say that if we can work together to do this, it'll be better uh than saying what we don't like. We need to say what we like and try to get those projects done. And so that that's what I would pledge to do to work with other members of council to come up with the plans that we think are most important to our community and then work with county council to get those plans on. There's one other thing that I didn't see on the list of types of projects was drainage.

Right? Obviously, drainage is very significant to Mount Pleasant, especially since losing the over $5 million from the federal funds to the Edwards basin. So, let's work together, come up with a plan, and then work with county council to get that plan involved. and please let's try to support it because there are a lot of people in this community that if they don't have Carta don't have a job,

they can't get to work. So, it's significant for our restaurants. It's significant for our hotels. It's significant for our residents that use Carter. So, that's that's all I have to say. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. M. So, we've talked about some of the infrastructure projects, but I'm wondering about the definition of green space uh and green belt. Do you guys define that? Do we define that? Are there restrictions on what can be included in that category? So, I actually have Eric Davis here with our green belt program. There he is. He can much better answer that question for me. Thanks.

Um, the county does have a a comprehensive green belt plan. Ultimately the department of revenue defines exactly what it can be used for and right now it's primarily for acquisition of land or interest in land. So conservation easements as well as fe simple purchases. One of the aspects that has been brought up uh the leadership of this with Mayor Cogwell is um more of and not to not to step on Eric's job and you do a great job um and all that but um if we let's say we all get behind it and and first of all um I have just encouraged the chairman to uh what was the green space percentage was it like 13 14 in the initial of course there is no plan yet this was a pie chart it was an idea it was 52% %

I believe 13 average over the two years

and we'd like to see that 20 um because as we all know our green infrastructure is part of our resiliency infrastructure too and that's less money we need for pipes to put in the ground and all that but um we we would like to find a way that there's a checklist for green belt spending that if we meet those things and we check those boxes we don't have to go through the green belt advisory board and then council to vote on money that we voted to give them in the first place and it would be a quicker way and um and it would take some of the regional politics that Mr. Rambo was talking about um out of it and and let us have more control which is I know a bad word but control over where if if we get some can get behind this and I I don't know how but I'd love to find a way for this to include undergrounding of power lines um because that is a this might be our only shot at a pool of four billion dollars you know for that kind of resiliency infrastructure but anyway we will have that conversation as a town and um I'm glad you brought that up. Thank you, Miss Whitaker. Yes, Mr. Tinky.

No, I echo the I echo the storm water. I think it's important. We all know where the roads flood today and those are real issues for us and so it's important to get those taken care of. I do think the the green belt as far as being able to take cars off the road uh is a very important part of it. And I I do think whatever ways that you can see that we can work together and play well together in the sandbox, uh we're all open to it. I mean, I I I know we all are. and that way because we'll work together as a community to help the community. So, but any ways that you think are are helpful with that, just let us know. We stand ready. Thank you. Is that it? Thank you very much. We appreciate it. Yes, sir.

I'm sorry. One thing I did talk to I talked to Councilman uh Sass and and I'll bring this up to council later, but you know, and and Mr. Rambo, you bring up a good point. I mean, maybe it's time to have a workshop with the county. Invite them in. Let's hug it out a little bit. And uh you know sometimes well they did they did but I think I think um you know we can get with Mr. Sass and he can he can try to rally them and let's just bring everybody together for a three three-hour workshop one day and um and lock ourselves in a room and figure this out and it helps humanize things. Right. So all right thank you. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Appreciate it there.

All right. That concludes item 4 D. Item five is approval of minutes from October 6, 2025 special town council meeting, October 14th special and regular council meetings and the September 25 financial statement. Move to approve. Second motion and a second. Any discussion? Uh yes, sir. Yes, sir. Um, I worked with our clerk on u a change that's strictly a scribers error, but there was a change made. So, just want to let people know that. All right. Any other discussion? All right. All in favor of the motion to approve, please say I. I.

Any oppose? All right. The minutes are approved. Item six is public comment. If you're here to make a public comment, please come forward. When your name is called, name and address in two and a half minutes, please. Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Just one speaker signed up this evening, Brian Stress.

Good evening everybody. Brian Stress, 545 Brand of View. As I mentioned, just wanted to introduce myself. I have entered myself as a candidate for the vacancy on the board of zoning appeals committee. A little bit about myself, I uh I've been in construction for 32 years in the industry. Started my career as a labor, worked myself up through the ranks from labor to carpenter, carpenter, uh foreman with the union, superintendent, national construction manager, and senior project director. Now, um I know my experience would be valuable for the position, not only because of my background to be able to assess and design and and details on plans, but to also offer alternatives for any projects that may arise for for u any individuals and be able to work with community members to help those projects progress. So, want to thank you for consideration.

Was that it? That's all I have, sir. Is there anyone to speak that didn't get the chance to sign up? All right, public comment is closed. Item seven is consent agenda items. There are no consent agenda items. Item eight is planning new business. And I just like to remind everybody that items one through four, well, excuse me, one through three are all first reading. Thank you, Mayor. Council move to approve item 8A1. Second.

Okay. Have a motion to approve and a second. This is six acres. Uh this is the annexation of two parcels on Chandler Road. Um and we're in discussion, but if you just give us an idea where Chandler Road is, please.

Yes, sir. So, let me zoom out there. There you can see it's just past Pepper Plantation, um across from Bulls Bay. It is outside of the urban growth boundary. Now, I'll zoom in a little bit. Uh, this particular parcel is actually a little over a mile off of Highway 17. Um, it is in the county. It is in the 10mi historic district. It does come to you with a recommendation for approval from both the commission and planning committee. Um while it is in the 10mi historic district right now um it's adjacent to properties that are zoned RC2. They are requesting RC2. So it is an appropriate zoning and in the county right now it is it will have the same density. However, the county is looking at changing their density to make it in rural residential to make it one unit per one acre. So, um, he does the applicant does understand that he's going to be one for three in the RC2 and that that will not change. And again, that comes to you with a recommendation for approval.

Yes, sir. Mr. Tinky, I personally would move to defer. That's how I'll vote because I think it's important to I think no uh November the 20th, the counties uh will be voting on these areas as well. Um, and it has a historic overlay. So, it reminds me a little bit about if somebody came to the old village and said, "Let's take this six acres out of the old village and make it something else." I I personally think we should wait and see what the county does before we move forward with this and work in parallel with them both on the historic designation as well as the zoning.

Yes. Uh, Miss Reed, I just want to make sure I understand this correctly. Um, it's currently zoned three units per acre in the county or No,

in the county it's rural residential, which right now is one unit per three acres. Uh, they have had first reading of their historic overlay zoning. So, it's already historic in a historic district. It will remain in that historic district unless it's annexed into the town. But what the the county is looking at is that overlay zoning. And like I said, that got first reading. It will get third reading. And the first reading passed with an amendment to increase their rural residential density uh from one unit to one acre.

And this um our um RC2 zoning, that's one unit per three acres as well. So, it's a a comparable um zoning as to what it currently is in the county. That's correct. Okay. Thank you. Point of clarification. I the motion on the table is only for the annexation. Yes. Just not the Yeah, I understand. I just wanted to All right. Make sure I had the um the facts straight. Okay. Um, if nobody else has their hand up, my question is, okay, which which one of these is the one we're looking at 6.5 acres. Which one is is the one applying?

So, it's it's portions of two parcels. So, it's this one here. If you can see my Yeah. And then there's that little sliver up there. [clears throat] And so, the proposal is to annex those two in. And here's what that would look like. And then add it to the adjacent RC2 parcel. And that would be the six and a half acres and you would get one for three. So you could get two units happen. Okay. Everything to the left along Chandler Road. Is that county or town? It is all county. That's correct.

So we're going to have this little isolated island that we're going to bring into the town and provide services to for two houses. Well, we already have this is all town here, right? Yeah. So, we already that's already in the town with a residence and zoned RC2. So, as are these two houses here. So, how many houses is that? Uh, one, two, three, I think. So, there's going to be five houses in the town.

And we got to go out there and pick up trash. and um do all those things. I I I'm just y'all I I'm not for annexation for annexation's sake. Um we I mean I don't know that the taxes on these would be enough to you know cover the services that we provide. So I'm I'm leaning towards being a no vote on this. Yes, sir. M

I'll just I'll just reiterate we have a letter from uh 10 mile. We have signitories on it. the neighbors would like to have it stay um in the county and u and and the settlement areas and and really respect their wishes. And I think it's precipitous again as we were last time to vote something in without really listening to the will of the county and to the people. Yes, ma'am. That's right. You mentioned there are already two houses that we that are just past this that are in the town.

Yeah. If you can let me go past if you can see this is in the town. This is in the town and this is in the town. Okay. So, we're already going out there to provide services for those three. So, this would just add two more residences. Yes, ma'am. Okay. So, we're already going out there. All right. Uh, the motion is to approve. This is on item A1 for the annexation. Again, this is first reading. We get another shot it this next month. Um, we might have to do a roll call because I think it's going to be a split vote.

Mr. Brownstein, yes. Mr. Brownstein votes yes. Mr. Chapman, yes. Mr. Chapman votes yes. Miss Crosby, no. Miss Crosby votes no. Miss Hyatt, yes. Miss Hyatt votes yes. Mr. Iicapano, [clears throat] yes. Mr. Ikafano votes yes. Mr. Rambo, yes. Mr. Rambo votes yes. Mr. Tinky, no. Mr. Tinky votes no. Miss Whitaker, yes. Miss Whitaker votes yes. Mayor Haney, no. Mayor Haney votes no. Six to three. Six to three. The motion carries. All right. First reading, ordinance number 2549. We will see that next month. All right. Item two is uh move to approve item two. Second.

All right. So tell us again this would be how many units per acre? It'd be one unit per three acres and they're looking at bringing in six and a half acres. So it would be essentially two new units out there and it matches the county's density. It matches the county's current zoning. That's correct. which the county is actually thinking about increasing correctity by bringing this in and zoning it this way, right? We're actually saving density essentially if the new if that overlay gets approved. That's correct. And we we had that conversation with the applicant and they wanted to come on in with RC2. Okay.

So, it'll be one one unit per three acres. Per three acres. Yes, sir. Okay. And this is simply the zoning. All right. with motion and a second. Any other discussion? All right. All in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? All right. Motion carries. First reading, ordinance number 2550. Item number three, please. Yes, [snorts] sir. So, this is an ordinance to amend three different sections of our zoning code. Uh, I'm going to start with the height and the detached accessory structures. Um, let's see. So, this first section applies here. I recommend approval for item three. Okay. Second.

All right. The motion is to approve. We're in discussion. If you'll just continue for us, please.

Okay. So, the first section would apply, as you can see here, in the old village historic district. Uh, specific to the old village, it would uh lower the maximum heights for detach accessory structures back down to 20 feet or the height of the principal structure. It would also increase the setbacks for a detach accessory structure from six feet to 10 feet. um this particular section here applies to all uh detached accessory structures throughout the town. So outside of the old village um and to the the ordinance amendments here are in this table. So what we've done is add footnotes. Right now you can have a six foot side and rear setback. Um if you were to uh keep your height at 25 feet but any portion of that over 18 feet you have to meet a 10-ft setback. Um, we've also added in the uh the fact that you can no longer you already can go up to 850 feet there, but you can um also cannot exceed that 40% of your primary structure. So, it's just an added level of kind of keeping the ADU in the same mass and scale as your primary structure. Um, and I I can go ahead and talk about bar as well if you'd like. Mayor,

I have a question before you move on. Um, from the accessory structures, um, outside of the Old Village historic district, um, the accessory structure is capped at what, 25 ft or no taller than the primary structure. That's correct. Okay. Yeah, that's uh, footnote number two down there. So, in all cases, whether you're in the old village or outside, your maximum height of your detached accessory structure cannot exceed your primary structure height. And is this only um uh the old Mount Pleasant area or is this townwide?

It's townwide. It's townwide. Okay. And then BAR, um again, this already applies to the Old Village Historic District. It's been in place for many years. The proposal and the amendment would extend it to old Mount Pleasant. And I'll show you those boundaries in a minute, but the bar would apply to new construction of residences and additions and accessory use buildings, any accessory use that's above over 144 square feet. Um, there are some minimums and maximums to this that are built in. [clears throat] And really this is about in those older neighborhood character keep maintaining that neighborhood character of these um of these older neighborhoods and um looking at the size mass and scale of these um rebuilds and additions that we're seeing. So this is bas um sir since we we have been

um maneuvering with this for quite a while. These are areas that do not have HOAs and um it falls upon the town to try to protect and give these neighborhoods the protection that I would say just about every other neighborhood in town. Of course, some of the older ones don't other older ones um um to protect the character of their neighborhood and to have, you know, where you don't have a 1500650T house and then right next door somebody builds a, you know, 4,500 foot house in the neighborhood. It just looks hodgepodge. and but we're also trying to protect their rights to to sell. I had some people that live on one of these streets today say don't make it too restrictive and I don't think we're making it too

and this also helps with resiliency as well. Thank you very much. Sorry. Thank you for

No, that's perfectly fine. So, this these are the boundaries of our neighborhood preservation overlay district. Um we did look the commission and committee both looked at whether it should extend to these other neighborhoods. Ultimately, the decision was made to have it apply to this area in highlighted. So, just up to uh Ben Sawyer Coleman. So, what this looks like then is an amendment to um the section of the ordinance dealing with the neighborhood preservation overlay district and we literally just took the language from the old village historic district ordinance, moved it over into this section, make it apply to that specific area, Old Mount Pleasant neighborhood. Um, and then the one thing we did remove was in the old village there's a requirement that 10% of your B has to be a front porch. That did not make sense in this area because there are other regulations that apply in this area which is within that neighborhood preservation overlay district. So those didn't work together. So we did remove that requirement. And then we also included right here um if you look at the old village BAR your minimum house size is 2500. That's because all the lots in Old Village are zoned R1 or R2 mostly R2. In this extended area we have some R3, R4 and PD. So we've added in that there's a minimum house size of 1,800 square feet and that's in proportion to the lot sizes of those R3 R4 districts. So those are the only changes to the to the meat of the bar ordinance that we carried over from the old village historic district. And uh with that I'm happy to answer any questions you may have.

Okay. Again this is first reading. Yes sir. So, um, if there are any details, I know these numbers can make your head spin, you know, you look at the things about cathedral ceilings and all that kind of stuff, building area, but if there's some numbers, we can hammer them out at second reading between now and then, this is simply first reading. Yes, sir, Miss Tinky.

It's a great start. Um there was question um or observation that if um the building height was not um was could not as high couldn't be any higher than the existing structure that the houses could be torn down. It would exacerbate demolitions. But I think one of the discussions and I wanted to know where it uh where it is was to say that anything 50 years and older would have an extra layer of protection so it wouldn't automatically be destroyed. And um so where did where did that go in the discussions at commission and committee level that 50 years because it's easy to show it you could just show your title and see that give you an extra layer of protection. Yeah, that's a great question and we talked a lot about that with the commission and you're right, it's easy to see. We know how many houses in that area are at least 50 years and older. It's about half of them. The challenge was what are those review criteria because this area in Old Mount Pleasant, they don't go to the HDPC. Um, so if we were to come up with some sort of criteria to to look at to give it, you know, a little extra scrutiny, um, who would do that? Um, what would the criteria be? So, we kind of these were some easy easier fixes. Um, we never really got beyond that discussion of, yeah, we can identify these older structures, but but then what do we do? Do we send all of those to the commission? Um,

I think it'd be a good one to look at because so many of these have been torn down because they don't have a layer of protection. So, if we could figure out some simplified way of doing it. Um, perhaps other areas have done it with the mid-century modern homes, etc. It'll be helpful because they're just going down right after one after another. So, we need we need that protection. I think Mayor.

Yes, sir. Um, I I agree with with some of the the changes um in this zoning code. I would say my overarching concern is that this these changes were prompted um by by a relatively small group of of citizens months ago and we haven't really heard much public comment since then. Uh, so I would really encourage uh the people who live in in Old Mount Pleasant specifically um to pay close attention to what's being proposed here and to hopefully give us some some feedback um on it now that we're kind of at a stage where it's relatively finalized. Um the one thing I I definitely agree with is the the building area ratio. It's been a concern of mine. Um, you know, seeing the the scale of some of the homes that are being built uh in Old Mount Pleasant. Uh, I do have concerns about the height of the accessory structure um not exceeding the height of the home. Um, I think in in some instances that that likely will encourage somebody to demolish the home um in order to to get that height on the accessory structure. Um, I also think that, you know, there's a lot of folks in Old Mount Pleasant, um, who have lived here for a long time. Their kids are growing up. Um, if their kids are going to be able to afford to live in Mount Pleasant, it might be an accessory structure on the person's property. And so, I'm a little weary about about that aspect um of this plan. And, uh, I'd like to to really hear from the public before our final reading. uh next month on this because I think it's you know we it's something we've all been discussing but we haven't really received much public input about it um to date and I'm also a little weary

about the idea you know although I don't want to see homes demolished I'm not sure creating a de facto um historic district in this area is going to be be very popular um with the residents um I just think that that people really need to pay attention uh to some of these changes um as they contemplate what their their future plans are with the property, whether it's remaining there and adding on or or building an accessory structure or whether it's eventually selling. Um these could have a dramatic impact on the value of the property. Uh so I'd really encourage residents to take a close look at these and and please let us know what you think.

Yes. Uh I I agree there shouldn't be a historic district and I also agree with your point. How many homes are we talking about in old Mount Pleasant? How many structures? I want to say there were about 2400 2500.

So 2400 I I think it's important enough to when in doubt ask the customer. And so I think between the first and the second reading 2400 is not a lot. And so I think if we had a simple flyer or something that went to them, we communicate them in the best possible way. I know Mount Pleasant Waterworks does a series of things. They put a sign up. They put um communication out in the form of a flyer. They send an email if they have it and with some schematics. Y'all did a great presentation to the planning commission. You did an ex excellent one to the committee where you showed how these things could actually work out and you showed how they would have freedom to build larger houses. It wouldn't be restricted. They still could add on to their houses, etc. But I think if we have some type of good communication put together to them, then at least we've done everything we can to let people know so we don't have something happen after the fact and people said, "Well, we didn't know about it." You know, we've we've really overcommunicated it. And I I think simple things like happened with um engineering did with the um Edwards u drainage plan was excellent. They put a tent out. They answered questions on the weekend. They put flyers out. They talked to people and then you had really buy in because really people felt like they had been heard. So anything like that I think would be great.

All right. The motion is to approve. Sorry. So could you go back there's part of this is the entire town as well is uh did you state that the height the the increase in setbacks for the height of detached accessory structures that would apply to all of town. B would not apply. Right. that change again on the entire town again?

Yeah. So, all of town, this would apply. So, um right now you can have a detached accessory structure at 25 ft height, six feet off your property line. Um what this says is if you any portion of that over 18 feet, you have to meet that 10 foot side and rear set back. So, it's a step back um the higher you go. And then also the maximum height shall not exceed the height of the principal structure.

I we just went through a zoning change. I think this is a very large sweeping change. The citizens of Mount Pleasant and um I I just I think the citizens need some more time to to see this and and the outreach needs to be real.

I mean, first reading. Yeah, I know it's first reading, but uh I don't I'm going to be a no vote because I don't I don't feel our citizens have been given enough time. This is a very large impact on a person's home value that people rely on. And um and and I know how first reading works. can't make changes and that second reading comes up quick and it just goes uh I just I mean I think with the the tree ordinance and we've done a lot of things to people's properties lately and and I'm starting to hear it and um I think we're taking a lot of rights away from people. I could agree with I I hear the setbacks. There's there's some things I agree with on this and there's some things that I think uh the citizens need to be able to come out and and talk about it. And I don't know that I'm comfortable having them both on the same on the same uh agenda item anyway. One is one is town sweeping and one is one section of uh of the town. I don't I don't know why they didn't actually come separately. So for for the lack of uh information that our citizens are going to get on their home, their single largest investment um to be given 30 days uh I don't think it's going to be a very good time. So for that I'm I'm a no vote although I agree with some of the things on here.

Yes sir. M ch.

Yes sir. Um Mr. Kafano, the committee in reviewing this has gotten a lot of comments where these large accessory growing units are right next to the property line and you can see in your neighbors windows. That's the whole reason for making this be this specific smaller aspect be townwide to keep people from building these large accessory dwelling units next to the property line and then being able whoever's in that accessory dwelling unit being able to look in their neighbors window. So that's the whole reason for it. We [clears throat] needed some kind of

Yeah, I agree with I agree with the setback stuff and I've seen it and I think we should also be including some things we could talk about. Obviously, we can't do it, but you know how windows are placed and things like that. If you're going to be looking over somebody's property, maybe you can't put they do uh what do they call it when the windows higher? Um they have a name for it. I don't I don't know what it is. I'm not in planning. What is it? I don't what is it?

There you go. Something like that if you're looking down on somebody's property. So, I think there's some things we could do with that as well. And and I agree with the 10 feet. I just think I I think the public needs a little bit more time than 30 days is is is my largest largest concern. This is their most people's single most um their largest investment is their property. And that that's what I fear. Miss,

um I would just say this has been a topic of conversation for years, for decades. people in these neighborhoods begging us to protect the character of their neighborhoods. And so I think we're finally taking action. And so I have no hesitation for for these um suggested items for us to approve. Okay. All right. The motion is to approve and this is first reading. This is item uh A3. All in favor of the motion to approve, please say I. Any opposed? No. All right. [clears throat] Motion carries. First reading, ordinance number 2551. Okay.

Item four. This is another one of these um vested rights. Move for approval, Mr. Chair. Right. We have a we have a motion to approve. Did I hear a second? Second. Second. Um just for a point of order, let's ask our attorney to uh describe this. This is sort of a uh we're one of the only ones that votes on I believe this, right? Sure. Others are granted by staff. Yeah,

some are. Some aren't. The originating body, wherever it comes from, would be the one to extend it. So, for example, if it came from one of our other boards or commissions such as DRB, they would vote on it. In this case, um this is a uh this is a planned development and uh impact came from an impact assessment. So, um that's why it's before council. And as you are aware, sir, the state it comes up and we say talk about this all the time. The state can't tell the legislature cannot tell you how to vote, but they can tell you what the result will be if you vote no. So that is the way it works. Okay, Mr. Yes, sir.

Um I think I asked a version of this at committee, but I'm asked it differently. Um we so can we not write a in our town ordinance uh that by our town ordinance that these are approved at a staff level if they meet the requirements in state law? Sir, we Yes, sir. This was brought up a few years ago and I believe I I I don't think there's anything in the state code in the planning act that would prevent that from happening. Um but we'll be happy to look at if you'd like. I don't know if that a proper committee is a committee. Yeah. Yeah. No, no. It's a proper committee. Is PJL or planning? Either or both. Yes, sir. Um I would

we'll we'll say PJL. If PJL could please take a look at that because uh I think it's silly that it's voted on. And then also when you have commissions of citizens, they might get public pressure or input on something like this that could get the town sued when it's a slam dunk lawsuit. I don't know why if there's really not a choice to be made, why did we vote? Yes. So anyway, okay. Thank you. I agree. All right. So, um I did not write down We didn't have a motion, do we? Okay. To approve. That's right. Thank you. I just didn't write it down. All right. So the motion is to approve and y'all understand the situation. So all in favor please say I.

I. Any opposed? Motion carries. Okay. Uh B, there are no planning old business items. Section nine is committee action items. There are none. Section 10, council business, new business. Uh, A1, adoption of a resolution by the town of Mount Pleasant authorizing a lease purchase agreement with TD Equipment Finance in the amount of 5,75,000. Move to approve. Second. Have a motion to approve and a second. Is there any discussion? All in favor, please say I. I.

All right. Motion carries. Item two is first reading again. First reading of an ordinance to amend chapter 110 and business license code of Mount Pleasant ordinance with the update updated SK class schedule and other changes. I'd like to make a motion to approve. Second. Um and this was discussed in finance committee. It's reviewed every two years. There's several um codes that actually are downgraded so they will pay less taxes, but it will be revenue neutral because new businesses are coming into the town as well. So it's revenue neutral and actually a decrease for several people. Okay. And there might be an increase for like one person. Anyway, yes.

Any comments? Yes. Yes. Um during our our um committee meeting, there was some discussion about um the requirement that nonprofits um get a business license. And there were some, I guess, questions about whether or how that would affect churches that run daycare um operations. So, just wanted to ask uh Miss Harness um if she's been able to research that and if so um what the town has found.

Yes. Um we did research that particular instance and we do not have any churches that would be affected in the town. So, that one comes off the board at December finance committee. We will come back to you with some specific examples of what that could look like for other businesses though, but churches and daycarees was not a good example to use. So, okay. Very good. Thank you. All right. Any other discussion? All in favor of the motion to approve, please say I. I. Any oppose? Motion carries. First reading, ordinance number 250052.

Section B, old business. There are no uh council old business items. Section 11, executive session for a legal and contractual legal advice and possible action pertaining to town owned property on phase and road. B is personnel consideration of applications to serve on the planning commission. There's one vacancy and consideration of applications to serve on the board of zoning appeals for which there is one vacancy. Do we have a motion to go into executive session for the reasons stated? So move second

motion and a second. Before we vote, council may take action on any item, including any subsection of any section listed on an executive session agenda or discussed in an executive session during a properly noticed meeting. All in favor, please say I. I. Any oppose? All right, we are in executive session. We will go upstairs.

Just just as a note everybody knows we'll rearrange the seating next next month now that we got a new mayor pro Tim and newly elected council members. All right. Uh please note that we have reconvened from executive session. No votes were cast. No action was taken. Do we have some motions resulting from the information and deliberation? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. I'd like to make a motion for property. Second. All right. Motion is to deny the extension. It has been seconded. Is there any discussion? All in favor, please say I. I.

All right. Motion carries. Next, please. Yes. Um, thank you, Mr. Mayor. I'd like to uh make a motion to appoint Corey Barber to the planning commission. Second. All right, we have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion? All in favor, please say I. Motion carries. Mr. Barber is appointed to the planning commission. Mr. Chapman. Yes, sir. um on the board of zoning appeals or boza. Uh I would like to recommend that we appoint Brian Stress for Board of Zoning Appeals. We have second. Any discussion? All right. All in favor, please say I. I.

All right. Motion carries. Congratulations. Mr. Stress is pointed to Boza. There being no other uh agenda items, no other actions, we stand a journ. How's that? Better better. All right.