Public Works Committee - Regular Meeting

to use somewhere and we can accommodate it, we'll let them do it. Same same for this. The land agreement will come later. We're just not there yet. Okay. But we're working on it. Okay. Well, it's it's I mean, it it's to me that's a I mean, it is it's a win-win. I mean, why not? I mean, I would take advantage of this, you know, in the position that we are. So, I don't know. Eddie, do you have any questions on it at all? So, is it is it your intention, mayor, to give the land to them? No. Okay. Okay. Is the next stop

after this? Yes. All right. I'd like to put my name. Okay. They haven't asked for the land. Um, but we've told them that at the very least, we expect maintenance of the land because right now, we're maintaining it. They also have talked about different facilities and we have told them, you know, we'd want to be able to take advantage of those if they whether it's a parking lot or a pickle ball court or a tennis court or a practice field, we'd want to be able to use that. But right now, they're not sure what they want to use it for. They have nice facilities.

Sure. Sure. Okay. I've been to the field there, but I don't know that I maybe years ago when they first opened, I went to the Mom and I went to the gymnasium, but I can't remember that. So, do you anticipate they're going to build anything on? No. This the land that is the cities now? Maybe restrooms. I think it's really the only thing they've talked about building. You'd be hardressed to build a lot of buildings. typically you can't build any buildings on those bios. It's usually passive uses.

It would be hard even to construct tennis courts or anything on there. That I mean I don't see any sort anything like a gymnasium or like a fieldhouse. I don't see that. So do you u and I guess we'll wait the agreement will come back to us. Okay. All right. I'll wait till we see the agreement. I feel like we're sort of getting our win right now. Yeah. Well, I do do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Any further discussion on this resolution? All right. Hearing none. And Mayor Claire is do you agree with Mr. Martin being a co-sponsor? Okay. Sure. We'll add that on there for you.

Martin. Um, hearing no other further discussion. Is everyone ready to vote? Does anybody need the resolution? You send it to Bone with the recommendation for approving.

Yes, we're going to approve it. But hopefully, Bob, this vote will and then we'll send it on to Bone after we do this. All in favor of the resolution 202522 which is approving an agreement with uh Pope John Paul II school for the shared use of the city parks and Pope John Paul and the Pope John Paul second school facilities signify by saying I I all oppose and that one passes. Um, now we're on to we've got a slew of other agenda items, but if there's no objection, uh, Alderman Dixon, I do not know where my constituent is.

Well, I tell you what, we'll go ahead and go on. Go ahead. And then if he shows up, we'll suspend everything else that we're doing. We'll get to you. Thank you. All right. Does any other alderman have someone here that we need to discuss? What is she? We just constituent wanting to be here for the Indian Lake um multi stop Lake. It's item number Lake Lake Terrace. Indian Lake. It's item four. So, we'll just keep it there and then we'll we'll give him the amount of time to do that. Let's go in with our trash collection update.

Good news again. um misses are still um remaining very low. The max that we had reported in one day was 13 which is just very extremely low compared to what we used to have. Yeah, that's that's extremely good. So, let's just keep that up, you know, especially especially in all this hot weather, man. They um Yeah, they're working hard. Yeah, they are. They're hustling. Okay. Uh we're going to wait on the Indian Lake Road. I'm sorry. uh for the lake terrace. We'll we'll pause on that and see. We'll make sure that's next time. Yes, it is. But we'll do that. Um

uh Creekwood Drive, excuse me. Yeah, the Creekwood traffic calming. Yes. So, uh this was one that we discussed a couple of years ago, um where there we had received a request for traffic calming along Cakewood. We did the analysis and found that the 85th percentile did warrant some traffic calming.

And um we proposed to move forward with the lane line markings, which we typically do for the first step. And um when the pavement marking company was out there just laying everything out, the residents were not in favor of the pavement markings. And so we decided we brought it back to public works committee and spoke about it and decided to hold off. Um and so the discussion has resurfaced. Um and was there anything else that you would like? Well, we received a letter. Yes. From Mr. Little. Yes. And uh he he is requesting traffic comment in the area. Yes. So uh

so based on that um we brought it back for discussion as to whether we would reapply, you know, try again and reapply the pavement markings. um with resident notification ahead of time. What about the customer notification? Is that going to come from We can you or we can do that. Okay. Okay. I'm sort of looking for some direction and some thoughts from board six and from this committee. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we don't have to make a decision tonight. We don't have to make a recommendation tonight.

Right. So, if you send the letter out, what would the notification is that just notifying them that you're going to stripe the street, that it's going to be done? I would think so. Or we could allow a comment period similar to what we do for for street lights, but the traffic committee recommended to do it. Is that correct? It was approved. Um, so it's not necessarily that we want to go put down the the landline markings everywhere, but it did meet the criteria and the land markings would be yellow stripes in the street and why on the sides, right?

Yes, that's correct. And one of the recommendation included um a bike lane. there was enough room on in the road to add a bike lane which would add some um walking area since there are no sidewalks. Well, I would like to move forward with the notification and kind of do it like we did the street lights, you know, and spear point air ahead. So, like a 30-day comment period. Yeah, 30-day comment period and then bring it back to us. Okay. at the next meeting or whatever. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. Um I don't think that's in need a motion that we can ask you to do that. The the committee can ask you to um ask public works department to do that. Is there any objection on that? Hearing none. We'll go ahead and just request it. Okay. And I'll tell you this not I mean it doesn't make any difference to me but do you Patty do you just want to say the committee has requested or would you like to say that you did or well let's let's keep it the committee okay keep it the committee the committee's asked you to do that

okay you want to speak on something um you know we're we're getting more and more complaints about speeding. We are I mean I'm seeing it. It's not me this time. Yeah. You know, so it's farms has complained about speeding, you know, hit Creek Road, you know. So I don't know the solution. You know what some states have done? They they are installing speed limited cameras and catching people electronically. Now, that's not Tennessee, but that's other states have done that.

But it's a it's a problem nationwide, speeding on streets. So, more and more I think constituents are going to ask for devices and stop signs for whatever, you know, to try to slow down people. Yeah. I know in Autumn Creek, we the HOA installed two of the solar speed limit indicators. Okay. And uh I've talked to some people there and it's helped. It has slowed people down in the neighborhood when they see they're going 30 miles 35 miles an hour, you know. Yeah, those are effective.

Yeah, just keep us get keep us up to date on that. what happens. Um, then we've got Pendon Lake Road and and um the R was R. It's a rectangular rapid flashing beacon. I see if you can say that three times real quick. That's why I said it slow. Yeah, I like the abbreviations. Let's go with that.

And so what do we have on that? So, um, these units, this is what we have installed on Saundersville Road at Ash, uh, Ash Crest there, near the library, and we've installed one on Indian Lake Road. Um, and so last year, we funded an installation at Indian Lake Road and HUD Court um because we had installed one just south of there at the other school crossing. And in evaluating this location, um we had some pretty significant concerns about the location of the marked crosswalk there. Um currently when the um whoever's crossing, the children or whoever, they're crossing from um the east side and then on the west side, they're actually crossing right into a drive lane. and the grades there are also um kind of an issue for students that are trying to access a school from that drive lane. And so in order to maximize safety and to make it as ADA compliant as possible or traffic engineer evaluated and provided a recommendation to actually move that crossing just a little bit south and to install new uh curb ramps there as well. And that would require some coordination of course with the county. Um but we we believe that to be a safer more efficient option for for the crossing there. So I just want to bring it to committee for discussion.

Okay. Any questions? Um near um what is that school on the quarter of any length? Thank you. I drew a complete It's four too. That's I think it's two. Yeah. No, we're one. What you talking about with us? All right. Um, do you have any questions or comments on that? No. Okay. If you do, just come back to the to the committee.

Um, I don't have any. I think that's just fine, you know. Uh we'll go ahead uh and talk about the arrow ahead street lights. Okay. Uh we received a request um from a resident to provide a street light on the road and uh our city engineer in performing his review found that there were no street lights in the entire neighborhood.

Right. And so he reviewed the entire neighborhood and provided recommendations for street lights that uh met the intent of our policy for street lighting. And uh so that went through traffic and parking and then that was one that we also brought to public works committee because we will be adding a notable number of street lights to our existing bill. And so that was approved. We sent out a notification letter to all of the residents in the subdivision because it would be pretty significant change. Yeah.

Um and gave a 30-day comment period. And uh we received some positive but primarily negative feedback. A lot of the the residents did not want street lights. But there were some areas where either we didn't receive any comments or they were positive. And so in areas where they were primarily positive or no response, we decided to bring it back to committee to decide whether we should install street lights at those locations and just refrain from installing any street lights in areas where we we've received a lot of negative feedback.

Okay. Uh are street lights uh required for ADA purposes intersections? Is there any ADA regulations regarding street lights? Possibly. I'd have to actually look into that to clarify that. But I don't know sidewalks. I don't know if there are any if there's ADA access. Yeah, there's not. I don't think I don't think sidewalk at all. Yeah. Okay. There. I don't think either.

So, you are propos staff is proposing one, two, three street lots in this area, right? We'd have four. Four. Four. Mhm. One with stop 30. Okay. I move approval. You need a motion or just We could use a motion. That would be good.

I I'll make a motion that we approve the street lights where there were no objections. All right. There's been a motion that we approve where street lights should go with where there's no objection by the residents out there in Airhead subdivision. I need a second. Okay. There's been a proper motion, a proper second. Is there any discussion on this at all? I know we were already really kind of discussing it, but does anybody need the motion re repeated? Hearing none, is everybody ready to vote? All in favor of the motion uh signify by saying I. All oppose, it passes unanimously. So the traffic, the street lights will go where there's no objection.

Okay. And thank you. Thank you very much. Okay. So those are [Music]

okay. Um okay discussion on the u the uh beautiful Hendersonville bridge um facade. Uh we need a update on that. I know we I know we've we've gotten some emails about it, but we don't we need formally to talk about it.

Okay. So, the last time you all met, uh, beautiful Hendersonville brought two proposals, I believe. One for the Saundersville Road bridge for the stone on the roadside to be removed and replaced. That was 37,625. And then one for the Drake's Creek Bridge that enters off of Conway Twitty Lane in front of the old uh DCAC building, the old main entrance to remove and replace the stone on the inside roadside of that bridge 49,623. Discussion was um for parks to meet with beautiful Hendersonville and Centurion Stone to look at and discuss the backside of the bridge. Also, on going into Drake's Creek.

Um if you look if you go and look at that, there are bricks falling off the the creek side. It has it's just as in disrepair as the inside. Um Centurion quote to do that Drake's Creek Bridge on both sides was 159864. Um, I think at this point public works and parks had discussed um just removing the stone and painting the bridges like the one that's at the Deemos entrance to make those all look the same, right?

Uh, we had had a quote to do that um to sand them down and and paint them. That would still leave potentially the outside of the one going into Drake Street Park with us knowing that bricks are falling off on it and people kaying under it and things like that. And it look it does it looks bad. It really does look bad. They all look bad. The two that are in question, they they're not a good representation of the city at this point. But I think for us as a staff um we will need direction probably from this committee or even above as to what you want the bridges to look like and how much you want to spend inside the roadside and if we want to remove the stone that is in disrepair on the outside of the bridges too. Um I don't think you got to make that decision right now. I think our job was to bring you more information and maybe bring you something in the middle of the year. I think that was discussed perhaps could be a potential adjustment mid year if there's money available for such a project or even next year. Um the bridges aren't they're not falling down, right? So, but they do look bad and it it doesn't look good. My concern with only doing the inside of the one going into Drake's Creek and I have not I'll confess we did not go and look at the one um on Saundersville on the outside of the creek side. But we we spend all that money and do the inside and then we leave the outside to still look like it does and bricks continue to fall off of it into the creek. What have we really done? That that's my concern on that. So that's my update. I'll take questions if you have them or it's the best I got right now.

Well, the reason Kathy brought this to me is because it's in voice that bridge and and I had mentioned earlier about the Gregs Creek, you know, bridge not looking good. Kathy uh with beautiful Hendersonville said mayor that you asked her to look at ways to beautify it. So that's why she got involved in this the situation. Uh so uh I guess from a city perspective, mayor, what what if it's okay? I'd like to ask what the mayor thinks about.

So long long ago, Kathy and I had a general conversation about bridges. Um my focus was on the bridges uh that that uh as you come in to enter on the east and west side, the big bridges of Vietnam veteran Boulevard is that that was really my focus. Uh but she mentioned that we have some other bridges that we've tried to make look nice. I wanted to sort of do something uh you know on the structures of those bridges that just just it had a little bit of decorative feel to it. U but she mentioned to me that we have some bridges that have a decorative feel that aren't doing real well right now. Um $159,000 is a hard hard pill to swallow. Really really is. Um I need to get my kayak and take a look um on the outside of the bridges.

Yeah. Um um and those aren't that the outside of them aren't real visible. Well, Drake's Creek is a little different because you're turn you're the way you're coming in and then you take the left turn. Um, I have a hard time spend that kind of money. I'll tell you. I think the cost went up astronomical when it when we put in the outside of the bridge because they're going to have to build scaffling in the creek to to do that. I think if we just did the inside, it would be a lot cheaper, you know. Uh, and that's what the bulk of the people look at.

I don't know that we need the the really what they are. They're vertical pavers is what they are because they're they're rocks, but they're not real rocks. They're very thin. They're just facade covers is what they are. Um, I don't know that we need to replace those. Um, if we could do something that's decorative, that's more like paint, I'm okay with that. Um, but I think you're right also is the most important part is the inside of the bridge, not the outside. So, did you get a bid on stripping them off and sanding them? Yes, we we brought that last to the last meeting. We had already had that estimate. It was like 139 to do both to take all the stone off and sand it down and paint it. Both bridges.

Mhm. Both sides. Even Sandersville. Yes, sir. Now, that was eight months ago. So, I have to get them to redo it. I mean, update it, but I can bring that back at some point. That's That's a lot of money to put new stone on that bridge. I don't think Yeah. So, you don't like the 159? I don't much like the 139 either. I don't either. Well, it's actually not 159. It's 159 plus. That was one bridge. Yeah. 30 36 or 37,000. Correct. for the other one. So, and that's without us looking at the outside of the

right, which the the other one, no one's seeing the outside of that as near as much unless you're in the creek because you you see the Drake's Creek one as you're driving into the park. You see the outside of that bridge without question. And we have kayakers and we don't determine when a brick falls off of it, right? You know, a lot of people use that bridge at Craigs Creek, you know, the the festivals and everything. People walk through there and I just think it it it it's a bad image for the city. I agree. So, so you need a motion?

I don't know that we need anything. I I just at some point we probably do. I I don't exactly know what we need. We don't have the money budgeted to do anything. So, I don't know that we would need a motion. Maybe we bring just keep thinking proposal back at some point and see if you want to amend the budget or do it next year or something. But so is stripping the stone and sanding it something employees can do or do we need to have a vendor do? You'd have to turn to your right to answer that question. Yeah, we don't really have the staff resources for that.

All right, so we've got bids. How do we turn that into properly procured service? Um, we could reissue a request for proposal. I did do that previously and we did not receive any submitts on it. Um, but it has been I don't know over a year, maybe maybe two years now. Time goes by so fast. But so we'd probably have to reissue that to meet the requirements of our procurement policy. If we receive no submitts again, there may be some justification to request quotes from contractors and then go that path.

Um, so on smaller projects, it's hard to get attention to it. So something that Metro's done is they've bid out like a fiveyear service contract to for smaller construction projects or major maintenance and we'll award it to five small contractors. And then when we have projects like this or with that uh building we had an issue with, you just get quotes from those guys and they can go to the market to get whatever. Yeah. So just an idea. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. So, what I'm hearing is just let's just think about it and then and then when it comes back or comes out, you know, we'll say

at some point we we need we're going to need a greater power than me and Sarah to tell us do you want it to put stone back or do you want do you want it painted? Yeah. It's probably something that the board will have to make. I think we can secure we can put out a bid and get options and alternatives. Yeah. and maybe even show you what it could look like, but then it would be up to BA at some point. Well, my preference right now is to strip it off and sand it and paint it. I just That's a lot of money. Two about $200,000. It is. That's and and I'm I'm wondering too to try to lower the cost. Do we need to do both sides of Saunders Bridge? I'd have to look at it just inside. You're talking about Saundersville Road.

Sersville Road. Yes, sir. Well, the the cost we have now is just Okay. Okay. All right. Um, so so you all know what we're doing on the the bridge right now, so I don't have to repeat anything on that. Um, let's go with the flashing yellow arrows. Sorry about that. That's okay. Um we recently implemented um flashing yellow arrow at um a blank on that location. We were we're looking at Main Street Dominion Lake Road. Yes.

Yeah. Any wrecks? No. No, it's been successful. Um the comments on the Facebook post were primarily positive.

Most people were very excited about that. We do have um three more plan locations. They started work this morning. Um there's some additional work that needs to be done. Excuse me. And that will be Cherokee and Main Street and then uh Indian Lake Boulevard at Saundersville Road and also the streets of Indian Lake. And so um through some of we've received a lot of requests since we installed the other one. Um, one of the main locations has been um, uh, Indian Boulevard at 386, the northbound left turn lane, and that's not it's not a good candidate. And so, our traffic engineer has come up with um, a plan to increase the capacity through there. So, he's going to double serve that left turn. Um, and so that was something that Alderman Robertson and I had discussed and he asked that I add this to the agenda.

Sure. So, why is that not a good candidate? And and first of all, the four uh are budgeted, right, to to do the four and we're going to use all the money on those four that was budgeted for for that. They're they're budgeted in our maintenance budget, not as a separate project. So, we'll we'll actually be looking to implement more as he identifies locations where they would be good candidates to have those added. Now, Main Street turning left there by Forance, you know, I forgot the name. Is that Saundersville? Is that Winston Hills? Winston Hills. Turning left. Yeah. There is no light there.

Uh it's just a green light when when the cycle light goes out. You follow me? It's just a green light. Yeah. And that is a heavily trafficked road. Yeah. Why can't we do the same thing there at uh Indian Lake and going on to 386? Why can't we do the same thing there? I don't I'm sorry. Maybe I don't understand the question. Okay. When we turn go out Main Street and turn left on Winston going out towards Saundersville Road. Yeah. Uh there's no there's a turn light, but after the turn light runs out, there's not a red light. There's a green light. Permissive the green ball.

Permissive green. Why can't we do that at uh at the location I'm I'm referring to? Sure. On 386.

Um primarily it's it's actually a sight distance issue. And so, and it it's a little counterintuitive until you really look into it, but what that the issue is is you have um the two lanes coming and then it branches out into the the dedicated right and then the other two lanes. And where it branches out, there's not very good sight distance. And so it's not recommended because of the the number of oncoming lanes combined with the site distance issue. Our traffic engineer has provided the documentation showing why um why that would not be a good location and it's actually required to be a protected lift which is the green arrow which is why it doesn't go to a green ball.

Required by who? by the track by the MUTCD because of the configuration of that. I get a lot of requests. Yeah. For that because people sat there and nobody's coming the other way and they just sat there and sat there and in fact they're telling me they're breaking the law. They're going to turn it. Yeah. They're looking to make sure no police. They just turned. Yeah. So I I I I don't understand the sight. I mean I I drive that every day. Yeah. and and I can see hundreds and hundreds of feet yards, you know, when the volume unfortunately. It can't be any heavier though than than Main Street there at Woodston Hills. It can't be any heavier.

It's just a little different configuration is is the problem. So, um so the double serve though should help that significantly. What that means is they'll get the green air at the beginning of the cycle and then again at the end of the cycle. So they'll be double they'll get double green time every cycle which is should help significantly there.

I don't know. I'll tell you this. I mean this is kind of changing the subject. the other night and I hadn't been able to do this in a long time, but my dog and I it had to be I and you might have to tell me, but we were we were going to go get a milkshake cuz we were going to split it and we were because it was late. It had to be like 2 or 3 in the morning and and cookout down at Rivergate is open that late. So, we drove down there to get our milkshake. The best milkshakes in town,

man. They're good. They really are. We get the cheesecake, blueberry cheesecake, and she loves that. Indie loves that uh that cheesecake. So, we went down there and the lights were flashing and I didn't even know was that just a mistake on Main Street or do they go on like that? Cuz I mean, man, there wasn't anybody out. But it was just, man, we were in and out of there like in five minutes. We were there, you know? Yeah. No, it must have been in flash because the flash operation has been discontinued for Okay.

Well, I fig I figured either we did it or there was a problem because Rivergate was on flash mode, too. So, I figured, well, it might have been T dot or something like that, you know, messed up. But, man, I was going like, man, this is awesome, honey. Look. And she or she's she's too busy looking at everything else in the world. But uh we we went down there and got our milkshakes because we hadn't been able to do that in a long time. And so we went down there and we're having or I'm having trouble sleeping anyway. But um yeah, I think it was around 2:30 or 4 to 30, something like that. So anyway,

now they're a good thing that you know, this is a good strategy for helping to better flow traffic. Yeah. You know, I just wish we would use it in more places and I'll continue to continue to fight for it. There you go. There's nothing like that. I I have fought I was thinking of that about the red light at Rockland Road and um Imperial Boulevard Road that how I have fought every year for that, you know, and but that's okay. You just got to keep keep fighting. and I finally got a a roundabout. Yeah.

So, anyway, uh Okay. Well, thank you for that information on the yellow arrows uh rolling acreage uh entrance signage. Yes, we um this is at Sely and New Shackle Island. Um their brick entryway signs and there's also a sign like in their their island there. Um and they are entirely contained on private property.

Um and they were con approved and constructed before the city was incorporated uh through the county. So um there is no HOA. Uh there is no uh maintenance or ownership designation other than the fact they're on private property. So each sign would be owned and maintained by the private property owner. There is uh one that's been hit again in a need of repair and of course the the property owner requesting they want to grant the city an easement for the city to take over the ownership and ship and maintenance of those signs. So it's a obviously it's a notable expense whether it's private property or or the city. We um you know there have been similar issues in the past I believe with Windrest. They don't have an HOA either. They have their those uh they have an island in the center and an entryway sign that was not being maintained. The city did not take it over. Um but the request has been made so I brought it to the committee for discussion.

So if the city took it over, would we have to replace the brick sign that's been knocked over which is going to be several several thousands of dollars? Yes. That's the intent of the request. Yeah. That thing's been hit a billion times. Yeah. Yes. So, did we we passed something about signs in neighborhoods, decorative signs that we would pay half of it or something? Uh um you recall that ordinance? There's something through planning. They have a sign uh grant program, I believe. I don't I think it might be for commercial signs, but I'm not positive that it is. I think it's private street. Yeah. house in the house

to do the more decorative cuz I I remember talking about because I said Burgdorf we've got to do you know get everybody around us to have those pretty little signs out cuz all we've got is those greens here cuz it I'd have to read that again. I'd have to read that again to see the exact wording to know if that would apply or not. I was under the impression that it was like the street sign instead of like the green street signs. Right. That's exactly right. Not like a Yeah. entrance sign. And I I could be wrong. No, you're right. I just wonder.

You're right. And there was a maximum amount the city would reimburse. Yes, that's exactly right. I think it was if there's any application of that for this. Sure. Yeah. All right. We'll put it on for our next agenda. Okay. All right. Um, light synchronization verbal update. How are we going on that? Is there anything you have?

Uh, we are still waiting for the tip to be amended. It was approved uh through the policy board this week. Uh, the mayor was present and had texted and said that it did pass. So, they'll be updating the tip. Once we get that updated um proof of the update, then we'll forward that to T DOT and they will appropriate the CMAC funds that they said they would apply to this project and then we we can request the notice to proceed for construction. We're getting close. That's good. And um is it Abby? Is that right? Yes, sir.

Yes. Um, did you have anything that you'd like to add to our committee? Everybody, I don't know if y'all know this was Abby and your last name. Miller. Miller. Yes. Uh, was gracious enough to sit in our committee and we're certainly glad to have you. Yes. Thank you. And you where do you whereabouts do you live, Abby? Um, I go to station camp. So, I live back down by the Kroger marketplace. Okay. Well, we won't hold that against you cuz it's out of said I'm just teasing. I'm just teasing. Well, we're we're certainly glad to have you and you come back and see us at any time and we welcome you into this committee. We might have to make you an honorary committee member. Yeah, I love it.

Okay. And where do you go? Um what grade are you in? I'm sorry. I'll be a sophomore. Oh my gosh. Okay. So, you're already are you thinking about colleges yet? No, not really. I don't blame you. just wait until that senior year and then I'd figure it out. Enjoy your stay in high school. We're certainly glad to have you and welcome. Thank you. All right. Um, other business. Do we have any other business? I don't have any. Okay. Well, then I just need a motion right here. Okay. 546.

Thank you. Okay. What are you doing tonight? Good. Well, I don't think I explained it very well, but