Commission - Regular Meeting

Morning.

Good morning everyone. We'll start with the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Good morning everyone and welcome to the Shauny County Board of County Commissioners work session. It's Monday, March 23rd, 2025. And uh our first thing on our agenda today is the Metropolitan Airport Authority. And uh Curtis Steven, we'll let you take it away. Well, thank you very much. Good morning, commissioners. It's nice to see all of you. We're pleased to be here to present our annual update to you on the what's happening with the Metropolitan Topeka Airport Authority. We have found that it's always useful to um use the keyboard to advance our slides. Okay.

Where did Stephanie go? I was we we rehearsed and everything. Um it's it's useful to Hold on. We got an IT professional coming up here. Okay. We were up here flipping through the slides like they were a deck of cards earlier. Okay. So, there you go. So, yeah, if you click

okay, got to be in it. All right. Just to set the framework and for many of us, this is old hat, but let's let's put a a a framing around this. We were created as a separate statutory authority in 1974 when Forbes Air Force Base was deactivated. Um and ultimately in 1978 the joint city county authority was created and our job as set forth in the statute is to basically take care of the airport properties here in Topeka that have been turned over to us. We speak in terms of three realms very broadly speaking. Topeka Regional Airport which is the uh former Air Force base south of town that many of us refer to as Forbes. We also own and manage Philip Billard Airport over in historic Oakland. And then finally, our third realm of uh influence there is the Topeka Regional Business Center, which is the industrial park between Topeka Boulevard and the airfield. And there is quite a lot going on in both of in all three of those areas that we're happy to tell you about today. But I'd like to introduce Eric Johnson. He is our president and director of airports. and he might just again lay a little more groundwork in terms of the structure of our organization so that we all appreciate what your MTA is.

Good morning. As you said, Eric Johnson. I'm president and director of airports uh for the Topeka Airport Authority. Um our board is set up with uh five uh board members. Uh two are appointed by Shauny County Commission and three are appointed by the city of Topeka. We have two board members with us this morning. Um, from that position, um, I work as the the president of the airport and, uh, the MTA reporting directly to the board. And now I have to figure out how this works. And we have approximately 54 55 employees that do a number of things for the airport. We have uh, police and fire. They work a couple of split jobs with the airport uh fire side. They do both structural municipal type firefighting. They also are specially trained for our firefighting, aircraft rescue firefighting. Um we also have law enforcement, airport operations. The airport operations people specialize in enforcing regulations uh by the FAA to make sure our airports are in compliance. We have a number of maintenance people, about 12 of them, that uh do a lot of the remodels that take place, maintaining the airfields, maintaining streets and and signage and so on. We also operate the FBO um up at Billard Airport, which is something we've been doing for a little over two years now. Um it's enabled us to lower some prices and and provide services directly to our tenants that are in the tea hangers. And uh there's some um others that fly in and out. Admin and finance of course um they do a lot of the the office work. And then of course we have Curtis and his assistant doing all the the lease negotiations and economic development.

So as you see we our financial end of it is uh um the source of revenues coming from our rents, our fees, our fuel sales and so on. And then of course property tax uh plays a big piece of that as well. Then the one everyone likes to talk about um commercial service. Commercial service has been something we've been chasing for quite some time now. Um we we're very close to it and thank you to the Shauny County Commission for stepping up um and providing the pledge that you did of half a million dollars to kickstart that in this community. It's brought out a lot of interest from uh other businesses in the community to also assist. We had uh uh an airline that had already provided us a letter of intent to come in and and serve here and then of course in the aviation industry with airlines. Something else took place and they not only stepped back from their interest in Topeka for the time being but also six other communities were in that same position. um they moved all their available aircraft to a larger market um in the west that had a guaranteed um profitability. So we're just we're not out of their uh system. We're just delayed with their system. Uh in the meantime, we're also meeting with uh other airlines. We just had a headquarters meeting with another airline here recently uh just last month that they expressed a lot of interest in what we're doing. but the timing isn't there quite yet for them. Um, and then in the very near future, um, next month, as a matter of fact, we're going to another meeting and we'll be sitting with about eight other airlines to discuss what we have. And with a minimum

revenue guarantee that we have in existence and the interest of possibly increasing that, um, I'm hoping that we'll have some good news to report back to you. And with that, I'll let Curtis take them over.

Thank you, Eric. So, there's some exciting possibilities there. We have another exciting possibility that is moving forward and I'm eager for this spring and summer and fall to play out because you'll be able to start to see some real changes in the landscape out at Spica Regional. We have engaged a developer from the west coast called Davcon Aviation and they have committed to stand up a very large widespan hanger there at U Forbes Field sort of directly adjacent to the apron. It's the sort of hanger that's big enough that you could and tall enough that you could pull a Boeing 777 into and and do work on it. It's what we've been talking about for three or four years now. Um the negotiation of that transaction took quite some time and we worked very closely with our partners over at the Kansas Department of Commerce because as you might recall the state of Kansas appropriated uh $10 million to help offset the costs of some of those some of that construction cost. This developer has committed to um stand the building up and they've actually also committed to uh commence a second project more or less in the same neighborhood there at the airfield. Frankly, their vision is much broader than that. They're interested in a number of other sites out at Forbes where they believe there could uh you know profitable aeronautical structures could be uh constructed that um would be good for us, would be good for them and would be a fair deal for the end users that they bring on board. So uh as the year plays out, we should see construction commencing out there. And ultimately by uh late uh 2027 if we stay on track that hanger should become operational. He is proceeding even though at this point pending text this morning or something I haven't heard from him. He doesn't have a tenant

signed up yet. He's that confident in the demand for this type of hanger that he's proceeding nevertheless. and he he is beyond certain that uh once the thing is built, it will um he'll he'll have it filled. So So the impact of that, just to remind you, is that not only will the construction of that hanger result in a a fair amount of economic activity in terms of the people that are needed to build the thing and the activity that'll go into that. But once it's constructed and there is an enduser in there that will be a the sort of large company that works on widebody jets of that sort, uh we can look forward to uh you know at least several hundred highpaying airframe and and power plant mechanics jobs u working here in Topeka. We validated that sense of the value of this project through an economic impact study that was performed for us by uh Witchaw State University. And and it's clear that when this thing is done, it will have been a great investment for the state and for uh our local community. So, we're very much looking forward to uh seeing DAVCON get started. We're also excited that just this in this last budget law that that that President Trump signed, there is uh just short of $6 million in there that's been appropriated to Topeka to help us rehabilitate what we call our abandoned north apron. There's a big part of our airfield that you really can't see unless you go out on it because it's sort of up and flat. But if you did go out on it, you would see that the surface of that apron is so beat up that you can't even run jets over it for fear that they would suck up debris and ruin

their engines. It's off limits. Well, there's about 35 acres up there, though. Something surely can be done with that property. Well, thanks to Senator Moran championing our our cause in this last budget round, uh we should be receiving roughly $6 million to start uh tactically removing portions of that old apron there. I might get to use this after all. um right in there and uh pulling that out so that we can clear the way for site preparation for uh developers that want to come in and start building smaller hangers there. Um the ground is graded in such a way you wouldn't believe it just from looking at it, but if you stand at the southwest corner of that big old site and look over to the northeast corner, there's actually an 11 ft difference. Uh you'd think an airport's flat, but it's not. So if you tried to build a one of those large hangers out there, it wouldn't fit correctly. But that site is perfect for some more moderate size hangers that are still very profitable. Those are 30 40,000 square foot hangers. The sorts of things that some types of aeronautical businesses make use of, but they're also uh in high demand for transient aircraft that are passing through town and need a place to uh pull their their plane in overnight. Now, this is a just a concept. We won't necessarily next year have that many hangers out there on the apron, but it's conceivable that once we start getting that old beat up concrete out of there, uh that we'll be able to start uh working with private money to stand up maybe a couple of them and then a few more and then a few more. Pretty soon, this will be a neighborhood of hangers that is profitable for us and being put to good use by the developers.

And if you compare that to the gravel field it is now, this is uh clearly going to be an epicm change up there on the north end of our apron. And it really wouldn't be possible without um Senator Moran's help because that that extra bit of money to get the concrete out of there in the first place is what it takes to get to get moving. It's 2 ft of concrete as you can imagine. So just removing that is is a chore all to itself. So we we expect good things for that. North Apron. Now, if we skip up to Buildard Airport very quickly, there are a number of um initiatives we're pursuing up there that again once they're completed, we anticipate, you know, they will just generate activity and uh and frankly customer traffic. First of all, we are continuing with our perimeter fence project. This yellow line there shows you the the current phase. It's essentially completed. Uh we do have the fence that goes on to the north up there and ultimately hope to uh encompass the entire airfield. That fence is um you know it's 8 ft of chain link with three strands of barbed wire on top of that. It's important to keep deer off the runway, but it's also important to create an environment that is secured so that uh our tenants who who deal with say secure information or are data intensive, that fence puts them in a position to compete for more lucrative contracts with the federal government, for example. And it makes it a little more authentic when we go to market and try to say tell the world that Billard is ready to become a sort of high-tech uh boutique in in aeronautics. That fence will make a difference. We're also pursuing the installation of a self-service fuel system. Uh that's seems minor, but it actually potentially

opens the door to aviators who are flying over at night and need to find some place to drop down and and get some gas at this point. If they're if they go over an hour that um our fixed base operator is closed, Topeka isn't a market for them. But this will make it possible for our base aviators to enjoy a little more convenience when they need it. and also hopefully attract more customers from the sky. Our flight academy is uh nearly completed and uh its student body is growing. The building over there has been largely renovated. We had our board meeting there last week and we were all impressed by what used to be the old terminal building having been really transformed into a modern looking structure that is attractive to the students and other aviators who will be visiting. So if you get a chance to zip over there um feel free to poke your head in and you'll see that the transformation is is quite astounding. Uh we are pursuing a couple of projects that I I think of as leveraging projects. Uh they they will have the effect of opening up parts of the airfield. Uh for one thing, the entrance road over at Bilard is pretty beat up. If you've been over there recently, you know it's got plenty of potholes. If you've been over there after a snow or rainstorm, you know that uh it doesn't drain water very effectively. Well, we're going to address that. We're going to regrade and resurface Sardo as it comes into the airport, but we're also going to install a couple of new service roads there on the uh the I don't know what you're seeing, your your left side of the screen. We're going to install a an access road to the north side of the airfield. Uh that will

achieve a couple of things. First of all, it will relieve congestion in an area that people like our our board member Mr. Mson can relate to. If you're not a pilot, this might not ever have crossed your mind, but there's a green line there that is not just a place where cars and delivery trucks, etc. drive during the day, but also active aircraft go through that. That's a taxi lane. The governor's jet uses that green line. So anytime you have a situation where you have, you know, ground vehicles and and uh aircraft operating in close proximity to each other, it's less than optimal in terms of a traffic flow safety situation. So this this north road will make it possible to get to that part of the airport without having to use the same taxi way that the governor's jet uses, for example. Um, it also makes it plausible to think in terms of standing up new hangers in those blue patches there, uh, that are developable areas. That's just grass at this point. And uh our long-term plan calls for either the extension of those tea hangers or the construction of new uh box hangers, which tend to be more profitable because you can rent them out in ways that they have a higher value to the to the people who want to use them. So So that north access road isn't just a road, it's it's kind of turning a key to open up that end of the airfield. And the same is true of the south road that we were planning to put in kind of on the other end down there. If you come in on Sardo and look to your right at this point, it's just kind of a a little gate, but we're planning to put a road in here that will again make it plausible to go down there with prospects and and you

know, private capitalists who are developers and say, "Can you see now how your hanger could fit in here? What you could do with this piece of property?" And those conversations will be a lot more feasible. I can tell you by contrast, I've stood down there with several developers previously and they agree that it that would be a nice place to build, but it's a little tough for them to connect if we had to kind of walk down a gravel trail to get out there. These roads are going to open that up. So, we are eager to pursue that and hopefully be more or less done with those before the year is out. So, Billard is going to be um you know, vivified in that sense. So, we have exciting things going on at both airfields that we're very happy to chat with you about. And I think if you stay tuned, we're going to find that the only direction is up here. And I'm sure that I speak for Eric when I say we're happy to answer any questions. So, uh, I'm curious, what effect is the 190th being gone? I mean, I know they they have a lot less planes at Forbes than they usually do. Um, I mean, does that have any negative effects on the airport itself?

Well, you're talking about that they're in, right? They're deployed. A lot of them, some of them are deployed right now. So, yeah, I don't know that you'd call that a negative as distinct from the mission leaving. Obviously, that would be disastrous, but no, I think that's just No, it really doesn't have an impact. And we've had multiple deployments over the years with the 190th, so I don't see that changing anything for us. Okay. It doesn't affect like fuel sales or anything like that. Or they do their own

fuel. They do their own. Yeah. that north apron you were talking about when you renovate that now right now it's pretty thick concrete. It was part of the runway at one time at the it was it's always been apron but yeah the air force built it and there must have been a time when our military had way too much concrete on its hand because everything out there is 2 feet deep and and that's pretty hard to work with. So the renovation you're looking at a much

Yeah. Actually I think tactically what we plan to do this this still needs to be worked through to the details but I think like if you look at this map and you see the um yellow squares. Those would represent hanger structures. So I think what we would do is remove the two feet of it's essentially gravel now to be honest with you. You get down there far enough, it's so banged up, you could practically run your hand through it. But where those yellow squares are, clear that out and make way for a developer to put in this the type of uh slab that they need for their uh uh whatever they want to do. And then we would, you know, take care of laying in the, you know, resurfacing, putting better apron in where the red is and where those roads are. So, we're not necessarily planning to rebuild the entire apron. That isn't necessary. It's it's preparing it for the private developers to come in and say, "That square over there could be yours. It's it's ready for you."

And then you'd have some that you could be like a hotel you rent for the night kind of thing. Yeah. We may do some of those. It's those are all possibilities. All right. Um you you mentioned to a carrier u another airline. Um what what do you think that would look like? Are we just talking about airline that maybe has three or four destinations or

sorry we're looking at a number of different things with the airlines. Um, as you know, the last one that we were talking with was a destination service and they wanted to grow that starting with one and quickly expanding to ultimately four different destinations. Um, for for a number of reasons, we're delayed on that one. So, we're talking again with more airlines um next month, a total of eight airlines that'll sit with us and and tell us what their plan could be and whether that's um a destination service or a connection to a hub. Uh the last meeting that we had, an airline was looking at um providing service to two different hubs. Um it's just the timing is not there for them yet.

Yeah. So, we're we're looking we're we're keeping every option open. We're looking at different uh types of service as well. When Kansas City did all their renovations, did that increased runway fees and things like that for airlines or

It increased not the runway fees, but the uh cost to operate um in that terminal building increased from about $7 uh per passenger and plane to $16 per passenger and plane. So, there was a significant increase. Um, Kansas City's also lost the number of seats daily. I think it's upwards of better than a thousand seats a day that they've lost um because the service has gone away. Some of those are ultra- lowcost carriers depend on um inexpensive market.

Is that what makes us look a lot more attractive now? That is exactly what we're selling to them because our per passenger uh fee will be less than a dollar um for each passenger plane. Okay. All right. I don't know which one of you this is for, but we've received a lot of correspondents from um a couple of different individuals concerned about the MTAa, a lawsuit that was pending in Shauny or is pending in Shauny County. Is is that lawsuit is that being appealed? What's what's going on there? Because I understand there's a judgment that was entered. I don't know which one

and I don't know I don't necessarily because you get into the legalities but is it something that's being appealed or looked at? It's I appreciate the the question. That's a that's a a topic that's on our mind all the time. Um we do have an attorney working on that. Um as you know probably better than most that um discussing an ongoing legal matter is probably not the best way to go. Um but we'll certainly keep you posted um through other means if necessary. All right. I appreciate that leaving it at that. I mean because it is something that has been brought to our attention by number of individuals and just please keep us advised. We sure will.

Any other questions? Well, I guess so the different items on here, we talked about the road at Bard and the possibility of new hangers. We talked about commercial air service, we talked about the taxi way, and we talked about the new hanger. So, so far, none of those have actually happened. Um, what's the timeline like when does dark dirt start moving on one of these? dirt start moving on the roads up at Billard um in June I believe is what yeah roughly June and that should be done before the year's out so that's going and blowing the MRO hanger is uh in due diligence right now um their um architects and engineers have been surveying the property and uh working with our team to really lock down the details on the utility placements etc uh I can tell you I understand we've got a little we got a little bit of time here. Is that accurate? Because I I can give you go into a bit of a side story on that if we've got time. Okay.

Um and it's actually somewhat encouraging tale once you once you get to the punchline. Uh the hanger to be constructed is the the optimal site for it is on the site of a hanger that's there right now that you've seen and probably cringed at hundreds of times. We call it hanger 619. It's the large kind of rusty broken windowed hanger that's due north of our terminal building. Can you envision that in your minds? Okay. The goal is to raise that and then stand up this brand new hanger in its place. Um the process of doing that required us to reach out to the state historic pre preservation office and get their go-ahad on it. Um to no in no discredit to that agency, they pointed out that arguably that structure given its architectural uniqueness and its importance during the wars uh probably would be eligible for registry on the National Historic, you know, registry if if we wanted to. And of course in our heads we're thinking that's exactly the opposite of what we want to do. But thank you for your response. they their response was authentic and and probably warranted, but what it did was it kicked off a a procedure on the FAA side up at the federal level where when they receive a communication of that sort from um the state historic office, they then have to walk through a number of steps before they can clear a site to be to be destroyed in a new hanger bill. We're in the process of completing what's called a environmental assessment of that site. Sometimes it is a very lengthy process, months and months over a year on

occasion because the various topics that are dealt with by an environmental assessment are wide and varied. It can take a long time. In our case, of the say nine chapters or so that have to be addressed, we're only really focused on one. One of the things that the EA deals with, for example, is active waterways. Okay, that gives you a sense of that's easy to dispose of, no problem. Okay, most of those are no problem. We are working on the historical part. And I'm encouraged to tell you that that we've had meetings with representatives from the FAA, representatives from Shipo, um representatives from the Combat Air Museum, and some others, all of whom understand that this hanger really isn't it needs to go. But there ought to be a way to preserve its memory for uh research purposes and just generally posterity. So, we are in the process of uh working through what's called a memorandum of agreement with the FAA and and Shipo probably that will entail doing uh a fair amount of scholarly research on that hanger and some of our other buildings and then potentially later on down the road uh the Combat Air Museum, for example, might stand up a museum display about it. Um, all of that is in motion and uh it's frankly going really well. The the people from the FAA have been very engaged and interactive and they understand our time frame. So, um, as long as it stays on track, we should be able to have that process completed in time for our developer to go ahead and tear the building down and stay on track. we might slip a month or two, but uh in general, we're we're on track. So,

that was a digression that wasn't strictly necessary to the main story line, but you should know that we're working that as aggressively as we can. And um the developer is doing his job, so we expect to see dirt move moving, you know, midsummer, maybe late summer. Um you asked about the air service. We'd all love to be seeing that happening sooner than later. Um, and you know, Eric's been having these dis these discussions. Um, we're pursuing other types of grant funding to help beef up our minimum revenue guarantee. So, all hands on deck to to bring that about as well. Did you ask about anything else?

No, but I'll I'll probably ask a couple more questions in related to those two things. Um, if if the hanger was not on the National Registry of Historic Sites and you had no intention of adding it to that National Registry, why bother asking? The process u required it. We didn't have any choice. So, any anytime that we want to um remove a building on airport property, we have to go through the FA to get the okay to do so. Right. but not the historic registry.

No, but that's part of their requirement. So, they need us to check in with Shipo to make sure that there's no interest and that it would not be eligible in this case because the building is more than 50 years old. That's a trigger and then come out to inspect it and evaluate it. They determine that there's that interest. Really, not us. We know what the building is and we've taken down a number of buildings in the past. This is the first time in my nearly 20 years here that we've had to go to this extent. Okay. And I guess big piece with that building is that control tower that's sitting on top of it. That's what drew so much of the interest, I believe. Now, didn't you guys just tear down another hanger recently?

Yeah.

Did you have to go through that entire process with that one also? the the the response from Shipo on that that was building 625 which is the one that uh Varys needed to remove so that they can start their production. The response response from Shipo essentially was knock yourselves out. the response on this building and and I I did want to take our time here because uh w with Shipo um their response to us on this building almost literally said if if you wanted to go get this thing registered, it'd probably be eligible. Okay, it wasn't a terribly aggressive, you know, chain yourself to the tree so it can't be cut down type of stance. And I and I'd like to be clear that uh in this case, Shipo is is not throwing themselves in the in front of progress. It's just it's it's an authentic response that yeah, given all of the facts that have been presented to us, it it fits the criteria for a structure that would be eligible. And then that starts the FAA's the the gentleman with the FAA really can't wave that off. He he has to go through this process now. Shipo's been engaged. They've been uh very helpful. They get that this really isn't about like saving this building. It's about saving its memory. And so we're we're in agreement on a many aspects of this. We have been fairly forceful about the necessity to move this along as quickly as we can. Don't let it get stuck on anybody's desk back in DC. it won't spend a single minute on my desk longer than it needs to. Um, and everybody seems to understand that. So, I know there have been instances where we we talk about Shipo and there there's a level of frustration. I I would like to distinguish that from this situation. They've been pretty good partners so far.

Well, I know that you have a plan B. Yes. Right. Um, so at what point do you decide like we need to pivot and you know this process is taking too long, it's going to be too expensive and and the revenues that we're missing out on by not having this done a year earlier are are going to be hurtful. At what point do you decide we're going to start doing plan B and just move ahead with that and then we'll worry about this hanger later on and maybe that becomes a piece of phase two.

Right. Exactly. I uh so first of all we are keeping DevCon informed up to the minute on all of this because that'll be you know they'll be the key driver of that moment. I would assume it'll be in the midsummer sometime, maybe early summer depending on, you know, if they get to a point where they say, "Well, you know, we would have been bringing our bulldozers out next week. Where's your process?" And if it still looks like it's months out, then there will be a a decision point in there. And I assume it's a it's a zone of time. They might say, "Okay, well, let's give it 60 more days and see where we're at." The the good thing is that the folks at Davcon understand this situation. I I don't know for sure whether they've run into it before, but you get the sense they have because their architects are almost designing the hanger from about 4 feet above the ground and up. So that a great deal of the design work will be ready even if they do have to pivot, right? Um, so the answer is they're key players in that decision and I would assume it'll be sometime in the July range when we all sit down and say, "Well, what's going to be?" But there is a plan B and they'll be ready to execute on that if necessary.

And are they helpful in this process? Are they assisting or are they just letting us do it? At this point, we have found it tactically advisable to have them not in the in the room. Uh they're ready to help. And in fact, uh one of the things we'll probably be asked to do is hire somebody to shoot some high quality drone footage of that hanger and maybe a couple of our other older buildings. Can we get low quality instead?

Yeah, low quality drone footage. That's I guess that's I guess what I I'm learning there's like museum quality like you know it's not just not just anybody can do it. Um and they've offered up that depending on the bill they're willing to kick in on some of that. So they're not leaving us to our own devices. It's just having the very people who are responsible for that building coming down probably wasn't the best way to frame up the conversation at this point. And I know we have I I believe a letter of intent. You have a letter of intent from Davcon, right? We have a signed lease. A signed lease. Okay. So there's

We're not at risk of them changing their minds at this point if this takes too long.

No, sir. You identified the exact It's not even a risk, it's the the pivot point. If we get to a point um it it it may make more sense to shift to that other site and then when it's finally ripe to remove the old hanger they'll that would be where phase two will be as as it is phase one is where the hanger is and then phase two is out on the apron and just switch them. There are some reasons why phase one is more optimal uh for grading reasons and stuff. So, they prefer to go with that, but if need be, we've got an alternate.

And then on the apron project, I know you said like it's 2 feet of concrete um and the top is sort of rubbleized already. Um I know that like if you have a driveway that was poured in the 1950s, now it's probably better concrete than if you have one that was poured last year. I mean, is there any benefit to using the you like the bottom 12 in of that as a base for a new slab or I mean instead of busting it all out and starting over? Well, I've asked that question myself a couple of times and um the answer tends to be no, but maybe you could

like if we've done cing to what the bottom of it looks like. That's how we know that it's so beat up down there that if in theory you could almost wave your hand around through this grally stuff that's underneath. Okay. So, it's all the way down. Design has changed in in constructing something like that.

I know you have an engineer here. talk either confirm or or tells but um the the 2 ft of concrete similar to how our runway was constructed is being replaced with 16 in 16 1/2 in of concrete in modern time. So the new runway isn't anywhere near as thick as the old runway was. Um same thing holds here. Um we we have evidence of alkaline silica reactivity getting the head nod. So um that is present in that concrete and they don't want to put new concrete on top of something like that and have it spread into the new concrete and I don't know all the details of how that works. I just know that it's frowned upon. Um the touring show that concrete that's there now is in is in extremely poor condition. Um, we have some areas that the concrete is heaved, um, two, three feet high, so there's large heaves out there. It's just time for it to be taken off. But to your point, I since neither of us are engineers, I mean, we tend to kind of ask questions like, well, why couldn't you, you know, surely some Gorilla tape would help here, but and and to that point, our engineer devised this approach that isn't simply removing every last piece of gravel. It's more tactical than that so that we can make those dollars go further. Um, and it involves getting the the dilapidated apron out where new hangers would probably go. And then we'll deal with the remainder of the surface and the apron and the roads. We'll fix that up, too. But there'll be different treatments designed to stretch the money as far as it can go.

Okay. And then this will be my last question, I swear. um with the commercial air service. Uh you know, I attended the presentation from your consultant out there and at the time it sounded like this is a done deal. This is a slam dunk. We're, you know, we don't have a contract, but we're going to have a contract any day now because it's just such a good deal for the airlines. And and then nothing happened. I mean, I know that there were conversations. There's a lot happening that we don't know about. But at the same time, we still don't have an airline here. And so, is that consultant still involved in this process? Are they helping us to negotiate with these airlines? Are they helping put us in front of these airlines? Um, what's going on there?

The consultant is still involved very much so. Um, he's the one that, uh, is setting up the next eight meetings that we have. As far as the airline that we had been talking to, you're right, we do have a a letter of intent. Um, we have on our end a signed minimum revenue guarantee. It was provided to them for signature. This what happened was there was another airline that was serving Burbank, California that because of some decisions that they made, they were basically being boycotted there. Um, so they decided to leave that market. It was a a proven established market. So the airline that was going to come here went into Burbank with every airplane they had and just pushed us back. Um, we were one of seven airports uh that felt that. Um, so ourselves and and six others, three of those had already um announced service. So that that was even a more difficult situation for them. But um we still have the letter of intent. They still like what they see here. They're just out of airplanes because of that other market that opened up and it was strictly a business decision on their part. So we're still pursuing it. Our um consultant is still involved and as I said, he's setting up the next eight meetings for us.

Okay. Okay. uh this Davcon they they have their own architecture and engineering people is that correct and then so they'll drive the whole construction of the building and all that and then the management of it right uh what about future maintenance and they're responsible for it they're be responsible that's good uh one last question u the fence at Philip Billard uh is the ultimate goal to completely go around from the airport and uh yes,

I remember talking to a business out there and they said that a a lot of their contracts hinge on on security and that was a big issue. Do we have enough fence out there to kind of satisfy some people so that they can get these contracts or or do we need more? I don't know. I think I honestly don't know whether if we had one of those business people here they'd say, "Yeah, I'm good to go." I don't think so. I I think that for their purposes, we need to get all the way around, but it could be incremental. I mean, having that west side blocked off is may I I'm afraid I don't know the nuances of that, how that scoring works. From my point of view, fencing it in is where this is going. So,

all right. Yeah. And will those be gated? The fence? Yeah. Yeah. So, like when the airport's not being used at night, it shuts it all up or Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, no other questions. Uh Curtis, thank you very much. Thank you. Appreciate your support. And uh thank you. Yeah. So, we Oh, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Um, we have public comment on our uh agenda. Is there anyone here wishing to speak? I have no one signed up. Seeing none. Uh, administrative communications. None. Commissioner Mays.

Nothing for me. Uh, I have nothing to add. And we do not have a need for executive session. So, we're adjourned.