County Council - Regular Meeting

Today's not the budget. I'm thinking it's a budget meeting. No, today's the real meeting. We're going to open the council meeting with the pledge. week behind. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Oh wait for Jim to start it some of us everybody I am on their time I get it. play. I know. And um a Herman's and Herman's song came on the radio and I did it. Were you guys out there conversing,

colluding? I was out this conspiring. I was standing right there. I know I'm short, but I was right out there. Okay. What do we have first on the agenda will be u the budget adoption? Deb, do you have You've got the budget. Anything you want to tell us or No, these have been verified um by Greg. You've already approved everything. You just need to go ahead and adopt the resolution ordinance. We we've already had the public hearing, right? We don't need to do that again. Okay. All right. Well, I'll make a motion to uh approve. It's an ordinance, right, Mary? Yes. And it's listed.

Yeah. It says ordinance resolution, but I know it's an ordinance. Ordinance 2025 10 C. the budget for Hancock County. Anything else I need to add, ladies? Second. All in favor? I opposed. Motion passes. Now, we have to adopt the solid waste budget also. Okay. I'll make a motion that we approve ordinance 202510D, um, which would be the Hancock County Solid Waste District, their budget for 2026. Second. All in favor? I opposed. Motion carries. Who was the second on that? Scott.

Scott. He's our representative.

So, we did that. We did that. And now, uh, we are running ahead, but it looks like Lisa is here. So, we'll hear from Lisa.

Timing worked out perfectly. Good morning. Morning. That's not writing.

You should have in your packets uh amendment, salary ordinance amendment. Um, can you not hear me? I'm sorry. You should have in your packets a salary ordinance amendment. And what I am doing is I have four employees who are all just outside of a year of hire. And when I hired them on, two of them had a higher level on the ad on the salary ordinance, but I haven't been paying them all the way to that until they're fully trained. So, they are now everyone is fully trained. And so, what I've done is taken those four salaries and added them together and divided them by four to make all four of those positions equal. So, it's no request for additional funds. It's just equalizing those four employees who have been with us now for a year.

So there's no additional money involved. No additional money rearranging. Exactly. What's their pay? This is for 20. This for this year, right? For next year. It's that Yes. In talking to Mary to prepare the appropriate amendment paperwork. We used the 2024 because that's what we're adjusting is 2024 approved for 2025. And you'll see the four highlighted the top two at the 434 455 and the bottom two at the 392. So I'm just equalizing those four. I understand. What's what's the numbers for 2026 for those four employees? Are they all equalized to

they? Yes. Yes, they will remain the same with the increase that Yes, they will remain the same equal salary. Not the exact same. There's going to be an increase to the 41 327, but they will remain the same. I just don't like giving two people a pay cut for 2 months. But they didn't. They're not receiving a pay cut. I'm not paying them all the way to the level. When I hire on, see, those two people hired in um under positions where the ladies had been there for six years. So, that had grown a bit, but I didn't hire them on at the full amount of the ordinance. They've been paid less than that. Got it. Any other questions? I move we accept the salary ordinance as amended.

Second. I'll second it. Moved and properly seconded. All in favor? Opposed? Motion carries. Give that back to Robin for a minute. I'm sorry. And Mary, just to confirm the date that this is going to go in effect, the payroll date is in that 1012. Okay. Robin. Oh, thanks. Your name is Robin. that out. Put her name down there as well. You don't need to sign it. That's what I think too. Thanks, Lisa. Hey. Um, Janine. Uh, where did Janine Janine?

Yes. Would you like to talk? I had been called and asked that the commissioners had a few things they wanted to talk about. And since Sugar Foods has uh taken themselves off of the agenda, I thought this might be a good time for you to talk about what you want to talk about, Mary. I I I received a call as to why they took themselves off and I I said I believe their building was sold, but I didn't know if that was accurate or not. I was never given an explanation as to why. I was told that it was their building was sold out from underneath. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't given an incorrect. I believe the building that they were going to uh lease was sold. I had heard that already, but I had heard they had also uh found another space. So that's they have, but they went ahead and took themselves off.

Do you want me? Yeah. Uh, I don't think they've got the other space negotiated, right? Randy could have explained it, but they probably found another space, but it takes time. I'm fine with that. Negotiate another contract with them. Okay, guys. We're going to let Janine, how do I look standing on this side? Good morning. I need a camera. Cool. You got two minutes, huh? You have two minutes. I thought I thought it was three. You need security, my bodyguard. The other one over here.

Okay. First and foremost, uh the commissioners passed a request for proposals and qualifications for uh an architectural landscape design for the county farm as far as the criminal justice center. So, that's just a place we'll have to start. So, we will have to come forward. um and look for funding for that.

Um relatively soon. We should have everything the bids we want by November. It will or December it will come to the commissioners. We'll open the bids. We'll turn them over to the committee. The committee will then give a recommendation to the council or to the commissioners of who they think it will best fulfill the job. Scott read it yesterday. Deborah's got all the dates and times to put in there. So, we're good to go there. And then also you received an email uh from Bill Spalding uh regarding a uh strategic fire and EMS study for Hancock County. Um it's going to it sounds like it it's incredibly important at this time. Um we're asking uh our requesting funding uh not to exceed $90,000. Uh and then I don't know if you read it but the uh the study is essential at this time because the anti anticipated legislative changes the shift of responsibilities from townships to counties will dramatically alter how services are funded, staffed and managed uh datadriven decisionmaking. The study will provide objective third-party analysis to support strategic decisions uh so forth and so on. But um we'd like to get this rolling as as as soon as we could.

And that and that was one of those questions I had. It's like what's the huge rush? Because it's something like yes, I agree with it. I think we probably need to do it, but why not wait till next after next legislative session to see what changes are made and then do it or something like that. Do you see what I'm saying? I'm not saying we won't do it. It's just like is there a huge cost savings right now and you have somebody lined up they're going to do it really cheap compared to what it could cost? No. No. That's not it at all. The problem is we're trying to get ahead of it. Um because this could possibly the legislative session is a short session this next time I believe. So you know this stuff's going to press through pretty quickly and if this goes through we want to be ahead of the game

so that we hire somebody you know by the time you go through that process probably going to coincide. Okay. Opposed to the legislative. Can you can you just break down a little about what this study is going to provide you as far as information?

You all have an email with that. Um it will uh address the anticipated leg legislative changes. Um without a clear strategic plan, we'll be at risk and unprepared to absorb these new responsibilities in a strategic manner that protects uh service quality and fiscal sustainability. That will be the big one. you know, if this h I it was the commissioners, I think several years ago that dismissed the fact that we had EMS in the more rural communities. Do any of you remember that? What was it? I do. Yeah. It's been several years ago, uh maybe even two boards ago.

Well, we used to have a contract with Greenfield for EMS out there. That kept getting raised and actually Green Township and some of them had a contract with Pendleton for EMS. Then we went to um EMS changed to I don't know what the words were but a full life system deal would tell you they went through a technology change and and then I don't know who the who is the contractor now for for the county for for the rural areas for the EMS is Greenfield still mainly Greenfield Greenfield still doing that as far as advanced life support

advanced life support was a new thing I know it doesn't sound new but That's what I was talking about. Some of the services they had didn't have advanced life support. So, we made sure that everybody in the county had advanced life support. And you know most of the small 10 years ago Wilkinson Shirley uh they do have their own um EMS ELS type uh haven't there been some meetings going on over the last year relative to um the um the whole EMS fire situation in the county.

I don't know if you all discussed that mutual aid or mutual aid. Yeah. I just recently learned too that Fountain Town is actually helping us with some areas on the west or on the south side and I don't but I don't know about EMS. Yes, they do medic there. So I just wanted it read into the minutes so that uh yeah sure you will see I can continue on pay so that it's read out

uh datadriven decisionmaking. The study will provide objective third party analysis to support strategic decisions rather than reactive peace meal responses. It will help us identify where efficiencies can be gained, where resources should be shared and how we can futureproof our emergency services infrastructure. Uh improve efficiency and uh service delivery. Provide a roadmap for managing departments more efficiently. Recommendations for shared services and regional collaboration, sustainable funding models that reflect the unique needs of different areas within the county. because you know what we have in Shirley and Wilkinson is entirely different than what they have in Green Township. So those are the types of things that they would address. Uh strategies to maximize return on taxpayer investment. Uh Jim, you had asked if there there were conversations going on. Uh maybe not so much at the local level, but those conversations are happening at the state level.

That's where this will all come down from eventually. Okay. So this is just looking at the uh uh emergency fire, EMS, right? What are we going to do if they eliminate township trustees and we have to take over all the fire service? Yeah, because we've done those, but we've never done fire. We've never done fire in the Bill has sat on some task force for the township trustees. Oh, has it? Yeah. Oh, that's good. I did not know that. That's good to know. A couple meetings. He's had a couple meetings. He's also on a task force with AIC regarding the township trustees.

You have a timeline that you're going to expect the information returned to you in your scope? You know, not necessarily because it'll take probably two to three months just to get the uh RFP out and select a provider that will that will work for us. And well, I think that explains why we we can authorize it today. It will start the ball rolling and um like Janine said, be ahead of it.

Yeah. We don't want to be caught behind the eightball because you know can't you might remember Jim you might remember when they switched from uh from like especially the uh ALS to BLS out there. It really put the communities in a really hurt hurting spot. So you know we need to know how we're going to manage the dollars and make it sustainable.

Yeah. And the the volunteer, as we've talked before, the volunteer fire departments um have a very low levy, very low. We did um kind of um assist them in getting some legislation a couple of years ago to up their levies, but they're still you take Jackson, Blue River, Brown, Green, they all have uh fire and uh uh EMS rates of like 6 cents 100. Greenfield is like 47 cents and

Sugar Creek is 48 cents and Vernon is 50. There's such a big difference. Now they're volunteer by, you know, by choice, but still they come in here for um uh monies from time to time because they just their levies are just

well, it's not easy for them. They have to get a legislative change to get that and that's that's on purpose. the legislature is trying to squeeze them out and it's been that way since the Shepherd report 15 years ago. The The only thing I It's not really related to this as much. I'm for this consulting, but I want you because you're a commissioner to remember I'm not for us throwing $50,000 to find out if Bren Eaton is doing his job. Okay. On that other consulting thing.

Agree. because I I mean if we're throwing around thousands of dollars, we have to pull this out of food and beverage, okay? So, just let's just remember what what we're, you know, cuz that's going to come up too. And I'm I'm for this, but I'm not I'm not for another I have a question I don't know the answer to. Usually, I do ask questions I know the answer to for the public. But here's a here's the question is has any um township uh city or county even done a study like similar to this about fire departments? They may have in the past. I'm not aware of any but that doesn't mean they haven't been uh that they haven't been done. Jason

I was looking at Jason because was it was it Johnson County Decar County? There's Jay's mentioned it that there's a county that has gone through a similar process. Bloomington Bloomington Bloomington Fire Protection District. They

know there's some good and bad that they've learned with this. And then I think uh Pendleton is right now just wrapped up their fire protection district. Um or they're in the that I don't know a whole lot about that. I've stayed out of that. Uh, but I can tell you this will be money well spent for this study. It will help uh for law enforcement to figure out how many, you know, officers are going to need in the future to cover those areas as well as police and fire. Um, don't do this now. If we don't start the ball rolling now, we're going to have a lot more problems down the road trying to hurry up and throw everything together if legislation passes with the stroke of a pen at midnight. Well, Buck Creek and uh the Greenfield uh fire district have uh been talking about merging. So, there are talks going on.

Are you still in those discussions? Oh, you're sure? Yeah. So, and you'd have to discuss that with them in particular. I do know like you mentioned our fire tax rate is 48 cents. It's 33 cents right now. to kind of clarify something. I support what you're saying. It's just we need to figure out which account we're going to fund it from. And so, are you asking for money today? I'd like to I'd like to be able to take it back to Bill and Gary and say, "Hey, you know, want to push it off for another budget meeting, another there's no reason to this. It would stay this. I mean, the conversation would be the same." Yeah. Might as well bid it.

We have two bids out there. one is a little more than the other. Uh we're more comfortable with the with the more expensive one, but it would still not exceed $90,000. Uh I think through uh Okay, that's so you're basing it on some bids. Yes, we're basing it on bids. So up to Well, and I think this is something we want to make sure that we get somebody that knows what they're doing. Even if it costs us a little more, this is going to be critical. And there is one that is very engaged with Hancock County and probably understands us better than than the other. 130. Has it been allocated any year? No. You have $130,951. He's not going to write a check today.

Okay. Why don't we advertise it? Give us a little time to think about it, too. Well, I'd rather give them the notion that it's going to move forward or not without more discussion about whether or not we're interested in funding it. And if we want to advertise it, that's fine. and and then get it paid out next month. Uh well, we need to advertise more money to be appropriate from food and beverage. True. Doesn't matter. That's true. But I'd like to make the decision today on whether or not we're going to move forward with the Could you pass it uh you know with the onset that it will be uh advertised and then you'll make your decision of which account to pay it off. But given the uh commissioners permission to move forward,

yeah, you dedicate the fund for We advertise. We advertise what fund we're paying from. So, I'm assuming you want to do an additional appropriation. You want us to advertise for an additional appropriation for the full amount or do you want anything additional since you only have 130,000 in there? Well, isn't this the last meeting that we can do any additional where we can appropriate money for this year? So if we drain everything in like food and beverage then we won't have any we we'll need to appropriate some more no matter what. And you can't you can't advertise November for December. Well the food and beverage we can. Right. It's just certain funds we can't.

Well, but the December 10th meeting is after the PL's deadline. Okay. The claims deadline is December 3rd. Well, they could do an extra check. That's what utilities are for. And we want some flexibility for the auditor at the end of the year to have some money cuz stuff comes in. Oh, does anyone and we're getting reimbured um thumbs up to advertise? What's the amount? 200. Well, yes. What he's saying is if you if we advertise that we're going to increase the food and beverage 200,000 then 90 90,000 could be dedicated for that and another 110 go into the pot.

I I understand that. I just wanted to make sure that we would I think enough that yeah that we've got enough that we don't have any other things that we foresee coming plus we understand that 90,000 of that is spoken going to be spoken about. Right. That'd be 230 40,000 in the food and beverage then for the rest of the year. Okay. Yeah, I think that's fine. Is that clear? That's clear. Yep. Thank you very very much. I got um Oh, well you you took away what I was going to say. Don't we need to do we still need to make a motion? Yes, you still have to make a motion to what Janine said

that we dedicate 90,000 of the advertise. I'll make a motion we dedicate 90,000 of the advertised money for the food and beverage go to the study for the fire department. Not to exceed not well not to exceed not to exceed 90,000. That's fine. Or 100 whatever you need. 90,000. Okay. Right. All in favor? Okay. Is it 90,000 or is it 100,000? 90. That's fine.

Thank you. The only thing everybody's got to understand that will be here past me, this will greatly increase the amount of money the county has to spend on fire departments. We've been fighting this since I've been trying to keep the small ones alive because they do are they're so efficient and we have not had any major cases where we can say that Green Township wasn't serviced well because they're a volunteer fire department. Okay, we haven't lost houses. We haven't lost people. We have, you know, I mean, you go down the road and you look back and you say, "Okay, for the last 20, 30, 40 years, we haven't had major issues." Now, when you when you do this study and and they get rid of the townships and we bring this whole county into a fire district, it's millions and millions of dollars. And then not only have Greenfield up here and Sugar Creek up here and Buck Creek up here, but then you have everybody up here and and it's it's just millions and millions and millions of extra dollars and the protection isn't going to be that much greater. But I the the state is forcing us. I think that's the way it's going to go. We've just been fortunate up to this time that we've been able to get by without spending millions out in the county for services that that haven't been needed.

Okay. You have to, you know, with the RDC, I mean, you've given what, 750 a year for three years, and that's going to go up and be more. Yeah. Yeah. And and that was only for three years. And I I know they're still probably fighting on how they would sustain that on their own. Yeah. Going forward. So, okay. So, let's for clarification. The motion is to approve the We voted on it. It's all done. Did we vote? Yes. No, we did vote. No, we didn't. We did not vote. Sorry. And then the discussion started. Oh, okay.

Act two. Uh we have on the floor a motion and a second for $90,000 to be spent on the study for the uh a strategic plan for the fire study. And uh we up to 90,000. Yes. Up to $90,000. So with a motion in a second, all in favor? I I opposed. Same sign. Um motion carries. And then also we have uh asked the auditor to advertise $200,000 to be appropriated for from food and beverage. Thumbs up. Yep. Thank you.

And uh one last thing that we would like to talk to you folks about and that's that we are um probably going to have to take a real serious I don't even know how to it. you know, some of the baiffs are older gentlemen that are retired policemen, not um there are times that Judge Davis was concerned panic button seven times I can't recall 11 minutes for somebody.

Janine, will you get the microphone? I'm sorry. I was going to share that with the sheriff and Bobby.

Yeah. So, our initial thought, and we met on this yesterday, uh our initial thought was perhaps what we need to look for in the future is hiring additional jail officers. That would be of course a uh part of the sheriff's department that could be uh circulated throughout the court system on a day-to-day basis. I don't know who would manage that. probably the the jail commander, I don't know, or the sheriff himself. I I don't I don't know. But those are some things, you know, we were thinking maybe six additional jailers just to fulfill the needs over here at the courthouse and annex. And there are times of the year where um we should probably have somebody over here full-time, you know, when taxes are due and our assessments go out. Deborah has mentioned that, you know, they get some pretty stinky people in here. in place of the bailis. Would that be in place of the boss?

Probably. Yeah. I sheriff, get up here.

Yeah. So, I also brought Major Campbell with me as well. He he kind of oversees the the court security um for me. Um, we've had good discussions over the years, you know, with the judges about taking over, you know, the bailis, um, and just kind of being under the premise of the sheriff's office and the sheriff and take care of the court security. Um, I can foresee some of the judges not maybe wanting to do some of that because it takes away some of their authority a little bit and their management of the courts. Um, you know, the the problems we run into sometimes. I mean, you know, we have one full-time guy. Um, and we have part-time, you know, as well. Um, sometimes the part-time, you know, they they don't work a lot because we can't, you know, they're not full-time. We can't force them to come in, you know, because they're just part-time. Um, and so we struggle sometimes with just the part-time doing it. Um so the so the idea would be is if it you know if we had jail staff um trained for court security you know they qualify their weapons underneath the sheriff's office um you know they they do their defensive tactics under you know the sheriff's office um and then we just they would rotate through maybe it's specific to hey you know this group is the ones that always work over here or it's on a rotating basis. It's just some things we haven't worked out logistically how that would work. Um but it it becomes difficult with the baiffs um for us or for me you know because they have to qualify they want them to carry weapons you know I don't really have any authority over them to qualify them to do that um the one that's over there currently in in superior one um he happened to be a retired officer um from Shelby County and so he gets his retired permit to carry from them um so you know so there's just there's some stuff with the baiffs that I can't I can't take care of so but I I foresee them wanting

some of them, but they're not there all the time. They're there during basically when the court's in session. And so if the judge gets done at 2 o'clock in the afternoon, they're gone. And so follow

it. Just it just it would be more consistent if we had full-time people or we only have one full time, but it would be more consistent in in the coverage that we're going to get. Um, you know, we talk about the annex and, you know, we're now having to do try to have somebody who at the BCA and planning, you know, meetings, um, because we've had some issue, you know, we had an issue in one of those meetings. Um, so we need to have people there, uh, to cover that. We obviously have the auditor's office and the treasur's office, you know, that, you know, we have money that's here. And so, I I foresee the future of, you know, having very similar um, system that we have at the courthouse where there's you have to check people in. um metal detectors and things like that. Um probation when it opens up, there's a security post that's going to have to take place at that location as well. And so the as the county grows, obviously we've, you know, everything else has to grow. Um and I kind of got called into this meeting yesterday by surprise. Um I didn't know it when I was walking by. Um, but it it's I sit in these meetings and I'm here most of the time in the council meetings and I listen to others come in and you know we talk about I need this person or I need a person and I need a person and we talk about it and usually doesn't happen you know just because of funding and so I've really never addressed it um knowing but I know that it needs to be it's an issue um but I but coming to you and asking for six people, you know, was like, "Wow, you know, that's that's going to that's going to be hard sell." Um, just because I see individuals coming in every so often asking, "Well, I need one for this or I need one for that." And it usually doesn't happen. And so, um, it would just benefit the whole county, the the courts, the judicial system, the the the the people, the individuals that work here, they need as much security as well. Um, if we could look at hiring some more staff for me to put over there

full-time on a regular basis. Um, I'll let I know I'll let Bobby talk. I mean, he's he's we have some, you know, we have some um he's got some applications right now for some part-time. Um, but it's just hard it's hard to be consistent with the part-time um and making sure that we got somebody there. Now, we we always have and I you know, he can we always have two there at least at the minimum. Um there needs to be more um to be able to cover that securely. And so, um we just we just got to look at something

a list of the employees that will uh transition out through retirement or not needed because they're part-time, how much money we're spending on that right now, and then a number on what you would like to put in place. that would be full-time and where they're going to be stationed after they're hired, whether they'll be full-time at the annex building or the courthouse and what the dollar amount. We're talking about how many people for this much money and how much money are we going to uh reduce because we've transitioned these part-time people out.

Yeah. So, so last year and I got those numbers. So, last year in 2024, we spent 55,000 in part-time. You know, that's this year we're right at 27,000 of spent in our part-time for for that. And so it probably should be more spent. Well, I But they're not there. They're not they're not working as much as necessary or for your staff. How do the bailiffs get paid? Oh, I don't know the bails. I don't have their budget. They're they're played by the courts. What's their budget? So, there is a different So, Jay that works over there and people come through. Those guys are yours. Yes. The ones that are downstairs, they're mine in uniform. Yes.

Baiffs. They're the judges. Are the judges? They're upstairs. They're upstairs. They're only there until the court is over. Court session. Yes. But is there people still up there after they leave? Staff staff. The staff is still there. And they're still his people are still downstairs. Yeah. And the problem is is I've been over there many times. I've talked to Jay a lot of times about this and they do need more people. I I don't know if six six might be a lot, but but they definitely need more people now. I mean, there are times where Jay's the only one there. Um I I know that's not their intent, but it does happen because of sickness or because somebody's called out to come over here. Shouldn't be where he's the only one there. Well, there's times that

there may be somebody roaming that that went someplace. So, that's the gist of what that is. I didn't mean to interrupt you, Scott. Oh, that's all right. You're fine. But two people is our minimum. Um, we we lost some people, some older guys that transitioned to a baiff. One's a baiff. Yeah, two of them. Yeah, two two of them are bless right now. Bobby, could you speak into the microphone, please?

Two of them are uh we lost two to bail. They they stepped down from here and like the sheriff said, uh, and another one retired. and those we we we've gone a long a lot of years with utilizing some really good uh former reserves of the sheriff's department that stepped into these these roles to let the county keep rolling with their score security for a lot of years. And now what we're getting into, like the sheriff said, we have enhanced uh physical tactics requirements um that the state has put upon law enforcement to make sure that they are proficient at the skill sets of of all the jiu-jitsu type maneuvers and stuff like that. Um, so it really enhances me needing to find a full-time person that becomes responsible for honing that skill set to be able to one do that when it's necessary, but then obviously we want somebody who's going to be congenial to the public and be able to handle the interactions there daily in a right way. So question I have is do you and I'm sorry Brad I can never remember how you are in staffing but do you not have available staff now that could filter through take shifts I mean I'm just trying to think of is it six additional is it is there any current staff that can

so I I think I know what you mean um so what I have been doing at this point is I have been util utilizing our our jail staff to fill in spots over there. Uh we we we pull them from the jail when there's manpower to be pulled from. And the biggest biggest thing that people need to think about is we have to allow for time off, too. And and when I don't have my jail staff there in in a full uh capacity, then I can't pull from there. So, I pull from another area to be able to do this. when I can't get my part-time people cuz they're working another job and I've got some great part-time people. Just the frequency of them being here is not going to be consistent on a on that basis. And then you're going to have to make sure you're bringing people in here that are fully trained, understand how to do this job um and the full operations of what's going on there. You talk about the number of six. Number six is not just for that building, right? Um I would say three people would be an ideal. That way you'd have somebody roaming and you'd have two people there at the uh scanner and then also one could leave if something else happens. Um but we have this building too and you guys know what what takes place in this building and it's it's a there's a lot of lot of lot of responsibility coming out of this building as well. Um speaking of the annex, I did want to add I would like to see a full-time here at the annex. People think we just push paperwork. That's all we do. Debbie and I had a problem. They went from her office to my office and then someone called 911 and Greenfield came. And another time when I had a problem, the police chief over there followed this guy over here and um we have had several problems and sometimes we can handle it and sometimes we can't. But I think if we had an officer here full time, it might stop some of that. But we have had problems here at the annex that people don't realize.

The panic button the panic buttons ring in through the sheriff's department. Is that correct? No, no. So, where do the where do the panic buttons ring in through 911 911 and so then it has to be dispatched from 911 to the sheriff's department? Yeah, I don't know. They do the dispatch. I just it bothers me that it took 11 minutes. I don't know what that particular situation is. Got pushed. So there so there was some

So there was some complications with dispatch that day that took place. There was some confusion on who was how to do it. I mean so there there was a little bit of delay with that. Um which didn't cause much of a delay. Um, I don't know if it was 11 minutes. It may felt like 11 minutes. Maybe it was. Um, I think Jay was there, but I think he was dealing with something else at the time. Um, and so that created the delay of getting up there. Um, there was probably a fear of some panic, too. You know, that's the point of the panic button. I I mean, if I push that button, I exaggerated to show up. Yeah. No. Well, like any any like any situation, you know, when you're in a panic, it seems longer than it really is.

You're right. Um I've been down, you know, it way to try to bring it down. It's it's not just protection. It's it's the medical emergencies and everything because the officers need to be trained in uh in using the AED and all kinds of stuff like that that there may not be any somebody in that in that court that's trained in that. But I I I know the aging problem is going to be a problem. I got more titanium me than Iron Man and I couldn't do that job and most of those people served with me. Yeah.

And I was one of the younger ones. Okay. So, they're older than me. So, uh if you're if the new requirements to s to carry a weapon and and to do all the physical stuff, there's no way I could I could work over there. Yeah. Well, these these officers are are doing the same required trainings as a full-time. Yeah. See, that's I think it sounds like there needs to be a very defined analysis done of the situation that's over there and then a recommendation as to what would take care of all the things that you've just went over. And then and we ought to include the judges in this. Yes. Yeah.

And Jim and I have had lunch with the judges and we've talked about this a little bit and then um you know and we've not I don't think we specifically spoke with the judges regarding uh sheriff's department taking and putting their baiffs in place too. But you know uh do that. So how much money do we get from the judges for the baiffs? No. And is that reimburseable from the state? Is some of that re is some of that money come back from the state for that reimbur for for that money because everybody's budgets over there. Huh? We talked about that yesterday and it's in my notes to to reach out to state for some of

it. Yeah. Just to see exactly what positions get reimbursed and and I I don't know that the baifts do. I don't know either. I don't bring money into our payroll, but I don't know that they can't. So, I'm it's definitely on my notes to reach out and help um find out if they can. So, can the commissioners with the sheriff's department and the judges put together a plan of what they would like to see happen and then we can look at the numbers after that happens? I think we've gone a lot of years here with some really good Jay's done a great job managing what he's been doing so far and uh we just need I I like the full-time aspect of it. not a part-time because

it's it's time I I feel it's time.

So, a small thing too, if you're talking about the BCA and things that that um need security because of something that's happening in the tiff districts, then there isn't a reason why in the future the tiff districts can't help pay for security for those things. I mean, we're searching ways now to get some get some wasted money out of the tiff districts that we're paying for things that we're paying too much for. And there's no reason why uh like I said, if if if you had a problem with a zoning thing because of a data center, then there's no reason why the county needs to bear that burden when the tiff district couldn't bear that burden.

Yeah. So currently right now since we had some issues at the meeting uh I have a road deputy that's coming in for that time period. So so that obviously when you have that happen they can't out there they're taking it's going to be more and more we got a mega site out there that's going to be something and then when it becomes something there's going to be every Tom Dick and Harry in here saying they don't want it. So that's coming. Yeah. And you're broadcasting those wide range of hours that's spread out. Yeah. Requires that part.

Yeah. And that's why I think the recommendation and the timeline needs to come from you guys as to where your deputies are and which ones get pulled off the road because they have to attend a BZA meeting or baiffs can or cannot get involved with the day-to-day security and full-time people, JCOs, whatever you decide there they are. I just like to see that all laid out.

I have another thing I'd like to ask. So, um, let's say there's a scenario recently, maybe that something got through the scanners at the courthouse. Um, do we know the last time that the body scan was maintenanced? Is it still working? Is the scanner that like our wallets and stuff go through up to date? Are they accurate, safe? Well, as far as safe, I don't know about the safe p. I mean, they're safe. I say, you know, they're safe. Meaning, are they catching the things they should catch?

Well, I would assume they are. Um, I haven't been over there to test it myself. I don't think the way it was tested was appropriate. Um, in the way it was tested, and I'll just say that right now. Um, that was uncalled for the way it was done. Um, so I walk through my my gun sets it. Yeah. Right. I walk through, my pocket knife sets it off. That's what I would thought. Is is there a sensitivity? Is has it been maintenance? That one that particular system there, the one you walk through is is specifically for weapons. Okay. And it does identify where it's at located on your body if it's on an ankle or whatever. So, it will identify that. So, you feel safe and comfortable that the machine is 100% up and running.

Now, we did talk about the X-ray machine because it really hasn't been um I don't know if there's software updates or anything that needs to be done to that. It really hasn't been done. Um, but that's a little, you know, was a little bit different, I suppose, than walking through the machine. Um, but we need to look into that. I just never really ever been approached to say, hey, you know, there's a problem with it, right? We had this discussion uh month ago. I would think it needs to be on a routine. Um, just like they come around and check our fire extinguishers once a year that you have a a maintenance agreement of some sort with someone that comes in and make sure that there isn't a problem that we don't know about and then find out

through something happening that oh, it didn't pick it up. I'd like to see a maintenance or something. There's Yeah, there's a lot of things that goes into that. Um, so if somebody walks through and they they happen to set it off or not set it off, they they also do a secondary search with a wand. And so they're there to do the wanding as well. And so um there's always a kind of like a backup to that that walking through instrument. X-ray machine have certification and and some type of a annual maintenance or anything on the X-ray machine? Yeah. software.

I've been over there. I've used that thing. It it it zooms in. I can see what is in the the purses, the briefcases, whatever it would be go through there. But if it starts to malfunction in some at some point, you're not going to know it until something bad happens. We've got a a county labor guy. He could be qualified to do that. Tell over there. You'll know malfun if it malf if the X-ray machine malfunctions. You'll notice it because it's going to be blurry. You're not going to be able to see anything. The visibility of it is still there. That's the the metal detector. That's different. Two different systems. Yes. Two different Yeah. So,

the walkthrough thing, I mean, you know, we can reach out to the company and see if there's any kind of certification to it. Never have heard such a thing. Um, but doesn't mean it's not available. How old is that machine? I can't remember when we shut that down and we added I put that in there. I was chief deputy. Um 1516 2015 2016 probably. Was it new when you got it? Brand new. Brand new. There was nothing there. But no 2015. 10 years ago. We do sometimes. Yeah. It might be time for a service update. Yeah. I I would agree if there's such a thing. But I mean again, they're pretty pretty simple systems. So it works. I don't know. I just thought we'll bring it up. Ask a question. Is it Now it works.

Well, you don't know that. I don't know the complete circumstances of what you're saying. If somebody walks through there with something about and it doesn't pick it up. You're not going to know that until something bad happens from that not being picked up. I can tell you within the last two weeks that I was over there, that device functions properly. It reads on scanning. It It detects on the metal detector. Um, you still have a human factor involved in this as well. Um, so you can never Well, you've got those 3D guns now or weapons that can be made that are not metal and that I would think would be a growing concern, but I don't know how you address that. Oh, I don't know either. Yeah, there are there are limitations. Yeah, there are limitations. Human beings can get

knives in that don't have any metal in them and stuff. But these guys over there, I think they do a good good uh amount of due diligence. I've seen it. Um, I'm not saying that they that that things don't happen, but uh those guys do a good job over there of trying to make sure what goes in and out of there is safe. I I'm not questioning them. I'm just questioning the hardware. I'm telling you the hardware is functional. I mean, two weeks. If you're happy, then I'm I'm sure we're happy. I'm not happy. So, there's things that need to be done with it. I'm telling you that right now.

And there may be a maintenance agreement on them. I don't know. But if if any given time we felt that there was a problem with them, be assured that we would have made sure that they were fixed. You know, but I'm he's been over there. I go over there occasionally. I'm comfortable that they're working. Um but we will look in to see if there's anything that can be done. Something we're not missing. Yeah. It just it just seems like something that important should have an annual check. I have to have an annual check. I shouldn't because you're important. You're important. They are important. rest of us don't get in your chair. I think the bottom line here really is the manpower. Yep.

And all of our employees, our judges, and the folks that work over there are protected and the folks that work here are protected. So, we're going to need a we're going to need it here. I agree. Like Robin said, yeah, I can say, don't forget I had when I was the assessor, I had an issue that we had that I had some police officer. We're going to need it here and we're going to need it at the probation. Yeah. Because all those people that go to probation courthouse now are going to be going over there on a regular basis. And I can tell you each one of us that have been office holders here, there's things that we handled we probably shouldn't have. But there was, you know,

we just did it. But things are different now with people. It's a little more scary than it used to be. You know, I had some guy out there came from court, was upset, and was harassing the employees when they came in to work and they were all sitting in their cars. So, I went out there and stood so everybody could come in. Well, I probably should. I'm sorry, Robin. What were you going to do? Stop him. What were you? She's so important to get her angle checked, but then she puts her life. Yeah. An occasion when we were across the street and we would get a phone call and say, "Oh, and I will tell you, I think they called somebody else other than you and nobody ever showed up."

We told them somebody was harassing people. I mean, threatening they, you know, threatening people out in the parking lot. And so we called for help and nobody ever showed up. Well, that's and the security is another good reason to proposal if if and when you guys can come together with things a little harder. Very very much. Yes. Thank you guys. Thank you. We're going to take you guys. We're going to take a five minute siesta here. Okay. I told you. Yes.

Okay. Thank you, Scott, for pointing that out. Tell her I'd already told you. Yeah, it's right here. We're live. Okay. Uh, meeting's called to order and on the agenda now at 9:30, we have a public hearing for additional appropriations. The first public hearing is going to be opened with a request of fund 10001, which is the general fund for $792,900 for the purchase of sheriff's vehicles. There any comments from the gallery? Yes.

Seeing no comments, I will close the public hearing from the public. And is there any comments or questions from the council? Uh just a reminder that it's to re it's coming from county general but it'll be reimburseed from the go bond. Correct. Yeah. Correct. And we're having um our phone call tomorrow with S&P to work through the of the bond. So do we have a motion? I'll make that motion that we uh appropriate um for the purchase of the sheriff's vehicles fund. Yes. 10:01 county general. Second. All in favor?

I I opposed. Motion carries. The second public hearing now open is from fund 4908, which is an EDA payment that will be dispersed to Sugar Creek Fire Department for $150,000. Is there any questions or comments from the public? Seeing none, we will close the public hearing. And is there any questions or comments from the council? Uh just remembering that's to be reimbursed from the RDC. All right, Kent. We'll make a note of that in comments.

Yeah. Yeah. When we get some money, we'll be sure and do that. Yeah. It's already in the RDC though. It's the EDA. Well, ask in the I know it's in it's currently in the EDA fund. It's in the They'll submit the claim to us, but we can move it back from Okay. So, um have a motion. I'll move we we um allow fund 94908 uh for $150,000 from EDA payments. Second. Second. All in favor?

I opposed. Motion carries. And that ends the uh public hearings that we had on the agenda for today. We'll go on down to action items and uh we'll listen to Jim tell us about uh the budget meeting update.

Okay. Uh we went through all the bun fund balances and uh they look to be adequate good shape. Uh we just did the sheriff's car thing. Uh we did discuss the 2026 uh levy appeal and we instructed uh FSG to proceed. Uh we passed an amendment to uh ordinance uh 2025 8C. Uh that's the uh geo bond I guess. Yeah. moving the interest rate from 4.5 to 6%. Uh Brent Eaton uh made a proposal for um to do an efficiency study in the prosecutor's office and we recommended that on to the commissioners. Jeremy Titan Typen uh asked for 120,000 more for the 2025 uh budget. for u attorney services in the PD office. We advertised that in the general fund. Uh there was a joint library update given. We passed a request for the Green Township Fire Department for $10,18,000 from food and beverage. And we also ask uh Scott Beni for a report on the U proposed lit changes that has been submitted to the DLGF. And I think Scott, you got back up on

I'll preface this for you.

So here's where we are on that. We finally did hear back from the DLGF which was Friday and they they looped in the auditor which supposed to do to start with. Um but we had prompted them to get back to us because we were concerned about making sure this stayed on the right path timewise. So we heard Friday there were just two like very minor changes which was good. So now we have to resubmit it to them. Okay. So in keeping with trying to get this made effective January 1, 2026, we need to have their final approval and we need to approve it later November 1. So, what I'm proposing we do today is with your leave is Jim will make a motion that I've outlined here to approve the amended lit ordinance pending final approval by the DLGF and based on their most recent request they made Friday for a few driven changes and you could that way you wouldn't need a special meeting maybe you know because November one is not going to help us on. So, and I believe that we can make that motion today. Do it that way. So, what would happen is you would just have to come in and sign off on it, you know, at at your leisure as opposed to trying to get everybody in special. So, that's what I'm proposing. And I wanted Jim to have the language for the motion. You guys can decide if you're Why? Why is it not an agenda? As an attorney, you know that. Why is it not an agenda item?

Because we just curve back from Friday. Well, then you still could have gotten it on there because it needs to be an agenda item if we're going to vote on it. I mean, that's I mean, come on. I mean, that that's how you got to do it. It's Well, no. We This is This has been This has been on the agenda. It's a contin Okay, I would agree with that. But since it's a contin something that's already been discussed, I I'm just a we're not changing anything. I understand, but I'm you know, I've always been a stickler on let's just put everything on the agenda or at least, you know, auditor business is a very general thing and then you get a paper that says here's what we're doing and that's that's fine. That's what we did at the last meeting though.

But it's just it's just nice so the public knows what's being what's going to be voted on. I mean, discussions are different. I don't have a problem with those. just to maybe give you a little cold comfort. And I think you were here last week. We So I would I would consider it as an ongoing agenda item in that sense, but I understand what you're saying. We didn't have any board from DGF as of last Wednesday. Exactly. They didn't even came in Friday. Yeah, they heard it Friday. Oh, okay. Yeah, Friday. They told them what

yeah they and then they looped in the auditor which was something they didn't do previously either. They were responding to me directly and you know FSG said hey Scott let's you you take the lead I did as the attorney but then they wanted the auditor to do it. Can you speak to the amendment uh that we're going to be hearing spec is there any specifics that would not be read? It's just the statute they wanted it debated. That was it. Okay.

So, it's not substantive. It's that's why I used the word scrivener change. There's nothing substantive about it. Truth is that could have been done a long time ago. You know, they could have helped us out and gotten an faster. got a dead. That's what happened. Okay. I I'm I think I'm comfortable with everything that you presented, Scott. So, uh we'll let Jim read it in and then we'll take a vote. Uh this is a motion to approve the amended Jim let we read it. So, I I get a lot of feedback that people can't hear us. So,

thank you. Hope you can read my writing. It's a little Yeah, this is a motion uh to approve the amended lit ordinance pending final approval by the DLGF and based on the DLGF request for a few scrivener changes this past Friday. What's the percentage changes? No screw. You've already looked at those and we put those in the ordinance and we There were no percentage changes. It was basically there's no changes in percentage. Yeah, there's no changes. We

if there be an amendment like that, you could I would have to do this. I guess maybe define the word discriminative areas. So what they did was which honestly could have probably been resolved right at in while it was in their lap is they said okay on it was like IC6- such and such they said add another number to this that was it okay and I was like yeah they didn't he didn't site the statue properly or he just left off a letter at the end which was a scrier's error was called I was doing this for you Scott I already know I know how then then you should be okay with it right okay

and I think just so that the public understands that in the past once we settle it we didn't have to do anything and now they want us to do it every year I believe just we're we're not changing it it's going to be the same rate it was I'm I'll second the motion well there are some changes you made this year so that's why we're calling it yeah Jim's that's Jim made the motion requirement every year okay we're going to accept Jim's reading of this into the minutes as a motion. Kent has seconded the motion. All in favor? I opposed. Motion carries. Thank you.

That's all there was to the budget meeting. Okay. Uh any I does anyone motion to approve the uh September 10, 2025 minutes? Second. All in favor? Opposed? Motion carries. Auditor business. I do have a couple of things, but Jim, could I ask you just to go back for just a second on your budget update. You had said something about a food and beverage right before the um motion you read in when you were going through your budget update, you said something about food and beverage and I didn't quite get Jeremy typing. I think it was um it was Green Township's$10,000 for their

for their Oh, yeah. For the Green Township fire uh request for $10,118. I had that down that we voted food and beverage 10,18.

Thank you. I'm sorry. I just didn't get in since I wasn't here last year. I wanted to make or last week. I wanted to make sure I was clear last year. Okay. So, we do have um a few things for auditor business. uh jury pay fund. And this is the fund that we always deal with every year. Um I've been told that we have quite a few more juries that are going to go on. We're already running very short. We're wondering if we could go ahead and get an additional appropriation for the jury pay fund of 15,000 to make sure that we have enough to cover throughout the end of the year. That would be one request that we'd like to make. up.

Thank you. And then um we also have um the commissioner's legal services. Um we are going to need an additional 32,000 3,200, sorry, 3,200 to finish out the year. And that that's just a budget transfer. If you're okay, we would like to go ahead and transfer. Um, let me find my line here. That for Mr. Beny? No, that's for the legis group. But I do have a few invoice. Well, but I mean what I was trying to think is like with uh RDC. Yes. Yeah.

That's why I asked that question. RDC pay for it. If it's some legal thing that deals with Yeah. Yeah. Scott, there's I I did like four. We want to transfer it to go through the RGC. Okay. Yeah. Gary and I work that was 35. No small potatoes are easily put and this is just moving money. Yeah. We're just moving it. We're just moving it from the miscellaneous up to the um right. We still have to advertise and do an additional appropriation. No, we just have to have council approval for the budget transfer. It's in food and beverage. I'll move any line item that's not within that fund and it's getting moved to another fund. Jim's motion for move to transfer.

Scott, would you mind not jumping in while I'm speaking, please? Would you mind? Thank you. Um, what I want to clarify is within funds, you cannot transfer without an additional appropriation that comes through the auditor's office and has to be approved through the council. That's what this is. It's transfer of funds. It's not an additional of monies per se, right? But we just have to have a we have

Yeah, we have to have a thumbs up. I want that clear. And again, the public watches these meetings and when we speak over each other or try to have conversation that everyone cannot be heard. It's a problem. So, I would appreciate that people respect the others that are speaking at that time and let them finish whatever they're talking about. I'll call for the question then. And the question is, well, there was a motion in a second. And so there's a second, Scott, you got mad at me about it. No, I didn't I didn't listen to you because I was And he said motion while you were talking, so I just Yeah. Yeah. So we have a motion and a second. So um we're just doing a thumbs up to advertise. Correct. No. No.

The motion did transfer. It's the transfer. Transfer. Okay. Gotcha. So we have Okay. All in favor? I opposed. Motion carries. Okay. So, then we have um Rick Roberts invoice. Um we need also to do a budget transfer for that, right? I don't know if I can't read my notes. A motion to pay it out of food and beverage. Oh, but we'll have to. And we want to pay it out of account 31515 professional services. May I speak?

For any copyright, this is to pay Roberts. He's been helping us um the committee for the county farm and he uh created the RFP that we just uh that Janine just talked about uh to go out and hire someone to do the uh master plan study. Um where do you want to see that food? Uhhuh. Okay. So, is that your motion? That's a motion. Second for how favor I $1,125. Okay. All in favor? I opposed. Motion carries.

I had a quick question. First was Jim. Second was uh C.

Before we finish auditor's business, uh there was an email sent out to all of us, but I just Well, I guess it wasn't all of us. It was uh just part of the auditor's office and myself that uh there's some concerns about the probation salaries and how they're set set by the state and as any raises that we give the state board of accounts has to uh attend and participate with the HR carry out to these salaries. Um I'm trying to read as I'm talking. Anyway, it comes down to uh concern from the HR department that probation salaries are based on annual amounts and that with us doing a 17th pay that we maybe need to restructure the way that we are paying through the probations because if we don't and that 17th pay will become part of their ongoing raises in the future. Have you seen that email? I did see that email and I thought that you guys had discussed that as a board during the budget process that as long as they are making what the state requires. I mean there's no reason that you have to give more than that and if you don't want to do that but um you did you guys did discuss it. So I think that that's something that you had on your radar. So, are they concerned because they get an annual pay, a yearly pay, and it's not in there as a weekly, which or bi-weekly, which we talked about would hopefully solve the 17th or the 27th pay.

Is that what you mean, Mary? Yeah. What this how this reads out, I'll just read this out. Uh for 2026, if the county adds an additional bi-weekly pay to their annual amount, their new salary will be scheduled as plus $1,500 from previous years plus $1,500 for this year plus the 2026 bi-weekly rate.

So then that's basically I mean we did everyone's raise and then gave the 27th pay. So that's the same thing. So I think the concern is what the state mandates that they be paid. They're well within that range. So I mean that's I think what you guys had decided at your budget meeting that you would keep that in mind in 2026 for 2027. But I mean,

I just want to make sure that the auditor's office is comfortable with the payout of the 27th pay regarding the probation department and that we're not authorizing an additional on top of that will be considered for the next year's salaries. All of that I

you guys aren't think they are not taking anything away from us from anybody. It's over my head right now. Contemplating that in 20 that or in 26 that that in 27 they'll continue to get that. Yeah. We won't be able to lower them down to whatever the state says they're supposed to get in 27. That's what Kelly's email said. Scott, is there anything that we can incorporate into our You wouldn't have to lower them down. you just wouldn't give them any additional if if it were over where you wanted to pay them. And I think that's the discussion you had during the budget meeting.

And and that was and that was my discussion because I brought it up that hey, we have people are set by the state, the the prosecutors, the judges, the sheriff, you know, all these people and and the and the probation department. They're all set by the state and everyone said, "Oh, no, they don't get an extra pay." So that's that's what I recall from that. Everybody correct. And that was not voted on or anything. It was just I remember you That's what we tal because that was a big concern for me and I brought it up and we all everybody said, "Okay, Scott, yeah, I understand what you're saying." If somebody through this process accidentally gets overcompensated, then in the 2026 budget, we may have to reconcile who gets raises and who doesn't.

And I think that's the point of this email is that we need to keep that mindset when we start the budget process for the next year. Deny them a raise next. we've got if we had to address early department and anyone else that's a discussion state have is that correct you know what I mean okay that's got to so it's it's a good idea to get that on everybody's radar so when that time comes it's not yeah just got to remember next year because he's he he's kind of that guy well I still think we ought to go to uh twice monthly payment that's Let's not open that.

Let's not open that. So everybody's aware of this conversation and then we will remember it when we start working on the 26 budget. Yes. Um I do have one more thing for auditor's business. Um don't know if everyone knows or not but our very own auditor Deborah KS was given an award at AIC. um an Institute of Excellence award and huge honor and she was given a second award for exceeding additional education. So congratulations. You make our county proud. So thank you. Thank you.

She's quitting next year. She's quitting. Yes. She's quitted out. She's not going to be out. She'll want a bonus. Well, she's excellent. Watch out. She'll want a bonus. I don't want a bonus. Well, that's what happens. You're in it long enough that you kind of know what you're doing and then you get an award and you got to go. So, we have some extra money in the dog fund that we punish people for for not giving their dog on a le. Thank you, Tina. Congratulations.

Thanks. Well deserved. Thank you for bringing that I couldn't you don't get those kinds of awards without the team that I have or the other elected officials and department heads that work very well together. So that helps helps us all. Yep. Thank you. Thank you. All right then. I guess we need to take a look at the Sugar Creek Township capital improvement plan. There was a copy of it in our packet. Is there anything that we need to do other than acknowledge that we received it? I think um let it be noted that we have received it. Okay. Um I'm not sure. I move we adjourn.

Well, the the motion for the sheriff vehicles. Was that part of the That was part of the special. Second the adjournment. All in favor? I opposed. Done. Mary's going to you guys.