City Council - Regular Meeting

Hey, Summer, I can't hear anything yet.

All right. Connie, would you lead us in the pledge tonight? Thank you. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. All right. Thank you, Tony. Oh, I forgot to call the meeting to order. Sorry, we did the pledge first. We have to do it again? No. Do we have to do it? No. I'm going to call the Moab City Council meeting to order on Tuesday, August 11th at 6.03 p.m. And we did the Pledge of Allegiance a little prematurely, but thank you, Tony, for leading us in the pledge. And then we're going to start out with our public comments this evening because we're having a workshop on speed limits and we want to give the public a chance to give us their feedback on the speed limit presentation that was in the packet. So that can help us with our discussion this evening. And so if anybody, Bill, I'm assuming you're here to talk to us. If anybody else is... Yeah, great. Wants to comment, if you could fill out a form with your name, and that would be great. Just, I don't know.

I'm just going to give this out right now.

Okay.

I'll give Tony one. Thanks, Bill.

Anyway, come on.

So time around.

Pardon me, that's for like two hours. I don't think you want any part of that. Ask my children. Yeah, so good evening. I'm here to bring to your attention some fundamental facts that make a few requests that might impact today's workshop. So I think we all know that excessive noise harms people. And this is based off medical and scientific research. And it identifies transportation noise from road traffic as a major health concern. And so the whole mantra is slower ATV is a quieter ATV is true. Slower ATV also does not appreciably inconvenience ATV drivers. So we think this is just kind of a reasonable request and a good place to start. For residents who live on or near ATV routes in Moab, the problem is constant. So we're exposed throughout the day, evenings and night to repeated ATV noise. And the cumulative effect of hundreds of daily ATV trips does have profound health consequences. And I like to put this in perspective. We feel like we're being pummeled by noise. So the chart is for illustrative purposes, but it's to kind of help you visualize how noise is amplified. So noise is measured on a logarithmic scale. So for every three decibels, the energy level doubles. At six decibels, it quadruples from that original number. So as a visual aid, air and water are kind of similar. But when we look at a pressure wave that moves through water, we see its destructive powers. It washes away beaches. It pounds riprap. But when sound moves through air, the effects are kind of invisible. But they're equally destructive in some cases. So when you take direct measurements like real data and you start to apply it to this chart, you'll see that at my doorstep, it's 78 decibels with a maximum of 81 decibels. That's two to four times the energy level above our code limits here. These are not trivial numbers. It's a problem. So what we're asking, I'm asking is, I encourage the city to lower speed limits to 20 miles per hour on the proposed roads. I think it's a great idea and then maybe a bit selfish, I think let's pick on Mill Creek. We encourage the city to resticker speed limit signage from the OHV to ATV. This will clarify and make enforcement, if that's your choice, of the 15 mile per hour speed limit for ATV legal. We propose that the city monitor maybe noise measurements as it means to determine the effectiveness of all abatement efforts for noise. And we're asking the city council and the mayor, chief of police to just pursue what I call reasonable remedies and not fear possible repercussions from ATV activists or the state. And we think the city has a legal authority and a legitimate evidence-based reason to take these steps. So excessive noise is a public health crisis. We need help. A quieter ATV just greatly improves the quality of life for all of Moab, and that's the objective.

Thank you. Thank you, Rob. Thanks, Bill.

If you have any questions on the chart, let me know.

Anybody else like to speak tonight? All right, we will move on to our workshop on speed limits. And just for clarification purposes, we will not be voting on this this evening. We'll vote on this in September. We did promise the public we'd have a workshop and have a bigger discussion and that we would vote on it in September. We tabled it till September. Also, we will be getting some more information I think will help you guys from the safe streets for all group that we contracted with and so that information I think we just received that today and so Michael hasn't reviewed it yet, or if he has he's just briefed it and so we'll get that out to you guys before we vote on how we're going to move forward with speed limits in September. So this is about speed. And then Michael will give a short presentation under presentations after our workshop on some ideas for noise consideration for you guys. And you know, we've been talking about that in our meetings for you guys. We'll consider at a later date, but wanted to give the public an idea of what we're thinking and where we could be going. So with that, I'm going to start with Lex and Levi. They're going to present the speed limit presentation that we got a few months ago. I can't even remember when. It was a while ago. Kind of refresh your memories, give you their recommendations, and then we can just start. And Michael has some things he wants to add, and then we will start the discussion.

Good evening, and thanks for having us back. We, as we've looked at this, again, this is a discussion and it's been an ongoing discussion. And as we've driven around the city and we've done our own research and worked through the ways that we're going to determine speed, things have changed. in our thinking and I want to get the feedback from the council on whether you're thinking the same thing as us. So once again, just for the quick basics, prime efficient speed limit in Moab, if it's not otherwise marked as 20 miles per hour, what we wanted to do is review some of the streets that were higher than 20 miles per hour to see if changing them was something that we should do or not do. And as we've worked through things, the roads that we've identified that we were going to look at, We've come down to only two that we're gonna recommend changing the speed limit on. And I can go into more detail as to why we don't want to make a change on some of the others, but the two that we recommend is from 400 East up to Sand Flats along Mill Creek, going to 20 miles per hour in that area. The other that we're recommending changing is 100 West, the total span of 100 West, which makes a lot of sense to go down to 20 miles per hour with as many pedestrian crossings as there are there in the foot traffic. But those are the only two that we're recommending at this point. Where we started before, we were looking at all of these, but that's where we've landed. Obviously, we'd love to hear feedback on that. Of course, we've got a couple of maps to show you, but you know what we're talking about. This is initially what we were looking at, making changes on, and this is all we're going to make a recommendation to do. I can go back up.

Yeah, can I ask what kind of got you to this recommendation at this point?

Yeah. Couple of things. One of the reasons we decided not to change some of the things, some of the streets that we initially were thinking we would lower speed limit on, Cane Creek, 400 East, 5th West. As we started thinking, those are our primary, secondary routes if we have to shut down Main Street for any reason. Those are our evacuation routes. Those are our workaround routes to get people through town. It made no sense to us to slow that down and make that a more difficult situation, especially in an emergency. 100 West, I think, again, is pretty straightforward for us. There's so much pedestrian traffic in that area. You're not going any more than 20 miles per hour anyway. We feel like that's a wise decision. And then on Mill Creek from 4th East to Sand Flats, we know that's one of the highest traveled routes ever. tourist-wise and with ATVs and people going up to some of those recreational areas, we feel like overall dropping that to a 20 mile per hour will help mitigate some of the noise issues that we're having and keep everybody safer in that area.

I would tend to agree with you on this and stuff. I was able to go out and drive these routes as well, and I kind of came up with a similar conclusion that you did, you know, as I was driving these areas, so.

I think we've all, after this discussion, I know when we talk in our meetings that we're all paying attention to how fast we're going, 25, 40 miles an hour now, which, you know, honestly, well, not the same. Yeah. Yeah. So it really, it really was insightful to see that difference. And for me, it was the same thing. It's like, ah, you know, 20 miles an hour is pretty slow, but I do want, Michael is going to share another option as far as the 15 mile an hour ATV thing, because I think that is something we need to be thinking about is we're going to keep speed limits at 25, you know, that the major arteries going to the trail heads where ATVs go, I think we still need to want to encourage our, Our drivers, really what we're proposing, the drivers and vehicles to recognize there could be slow ATVs on these roads getting to the trailheads.

So I'd just like to say, one, I'm very supportive of this. I, you know, having driven around and also sort of investigated all of this for myself, I'm especially supportive of the 100 West going down 20 miles an hour, just such a complicated environment in 100 West. What I would like to see moving forward with this is that we're looking at these both in terms of speed the education component and the engineering as we've talked about so many times I mean I think that with Mill Creek Drive. You know, we are getting ahead of ourselves, changing the, reducing the speed down to 20 miles an hour because that road doesn't give those cues to drivers. And I think that, so I hope that we'll follow this close behind with sort of a redesign of that environment, the fourth, I'm sorry, the Mill Creek environment from 4th East to Sand Flats. And then also as we're looking forward with all of these larger roads, really being thoughtful about just, you know, how far actually changing the speed limit goes when not in conjunction with the engineering and the enforcement. And so, yeah, thanks for your work on this. And I think this is absolutely a step in the right direction. If I can share.

Thanks. So, and we do agree that the engineering needs to coincide with the policies that are made. And the information we're getting from Kimlinghorn, which supports what we've been saying the whole time, which is we do have to have those cues, as you were stating tonight. And those cues, a lot of times, most of the time come from the way the road is designed. If a road's super wide and open and straight, and you put 20 miles an hour on there and there's nothing around, People aren't going to go 20 miles an hour. It's just not designed for that. So I think we see that as we're going out of town sometimes. So there definitely is some engineering that we need to follow up with on this whole thing. And Safe Streets for All is going to be proposing some things. And then we are working on the 4th East design and looking at more things to do on that. on Mill Creek. And then tonight, we're even going to talk about some striping that we're looking at to test for traffic calming. So it'll be interesting to hear that tonight. But let me just share this part with you, which is what we're going to do about the 15 mile an hour signs.

So just waiting for it to catch up.

Okay, so this is an advisory sign. The advisory is that there are ATVs on the street that could be going slower than the speed limit. It also signals what we believe this ATV speed limit should be. This is the way I think and we think that we should present this to the public, to the people on the streets is through a sign like this. So this is Mill Creek Drive and as you can see, just superimposed a sign on this picture from Googlers. just to show you what it would look like. They would not be on the same signs as the regulatory speed limit. They would be at intervals, basically in between wherever the signs are. They would be at intervals on the street, same intervals as what you'd see the speed limit signs. So they'd be just as present as a speed limit sign.

Is that a legal piece that they can't be on the same signs or how does that work?

It's questionable whether or not they can be on the same signs. Warning signs are generally, or advisory signs are generally not on the same side of the sign as a speed limit.

Because this is not a speed limit sign. It's a notification sign. And so if you put it on with a speed limit sign, it's going to appear as though it's a speed limit.

And I think with this comes education as well, where we need to educate people that we are asking them to go 15 miles an hour. It's got to be more than just this. And there's some other things we'll talk about in just a minute. But I think this is a good step in the right direction and also addresses the concern that taking down the signs that we have now, which we have concerns with, the concern that from the public that if we take them down, just everybody will be going 25 miles an hour. We won't get into all the legal parts of it, but we do think that this is a step in the direction of getting people to observe a lower speed with ATVs. Yeah.

So is it advisory because it's yellow? Yeah.

Yeah. I think this is an excellent direction to go, and I hope that Bill and some other folks are excited about this or satisfied with this. I like this.

Just out of curiosity, Levi, what's an approximate expense and time frame for installing all these extra posts to hang these signs off of?

Okay, so it's roughly $400 in materials at today's prices. That includes the concrete, the pull of the sign, ordering the sign, and then the labor and the equipment it takes to install the sign. Roughly $400. It takes about a week to install a sign. You have to call in a blue state. You know how that works. So three days for that. And then the plan and prep and install the sign. So you can install probably a dozen signs in a week. Dozen signs in a week. How many are we looking at total?

Well, we'll have a count for you when we bring back this for a decision. But we were thinking our proposal that we're looking at right now, and we're not making a proposal technically tonight, and I'll show you the process in just a minute, but that these would be on the major routes, even though the speed limit may not be changing. So obviously Mill Creek, Fourth East, Fifth West, Cane Creek, those major routes. And then we'd be looking at Third South as well and some other ones. And we'll have all of those

uh suggestions when we come back to the next meeting with sign placement as well as far as back to materials we have the signposts on hand we just have to order the signs perfect i i would propose that we remove the utv or the ohv signs um from no from the highway like you know because they're like on the bike path your heart you know they're They're hard to tell. They know what's going out of town. Yeah, they're poorly placed. Yeah, and stuff. But also, too, keeping UTVs going the same speed as traffic seems like a safety issue as you're going out to all those roads. The other thing I wanted to ask, and maybe this I haven't I've heard that people are driving. They feel like people are driving too fast, like on the. I'm terrible street names on. Is it third street? second south, that's on the north side of the food truck park. First north. First north. From the mark all the way down that street. Is that 20? That's too fast. There's a lot of near misses down by the food park of people parking and crossing over to the food park. There's so much foot traffic down there that is... I would love to, I don't know if there's any appetite or way to make that 15 just to slow people down through there.

Or signs that say pedestrian crossing or anything.

20 is generally a school zone speed or a pedestrian's in sight speed. So I think we can definitely look at that. I'm not... I'm not married to that idea.

I've just heard people say that the high traffic... Even anywhere where there's dispersed parking, in those whole areas, people are...

John Potter, On center street parking 15 yeah we're the streets on with dispersed parking where we have the Center parking here and we have the one lane on each side in one direction, those are all 15 miles an hour right. John Potter, First North didn't get into that because it just has parking on either side and there's a mid block crossing with a neck down as well. which should help to tame traffic. But we can definitely look at those and I'll go over the process for that. But for this recommendation, I think we're just focusing on the ATV side. So the ones that we're gonna be recommending are just for ATV, unless the council wants to throw another one in there like this, so.

I mean, I think as far as like the streets that were part of that initial proposal that I was the most concerned about and saw the most reason to reduce the speed limit for particularly pedestrian safety, you've kind of hit the two on the head, particularly 100 West. Like you mentioned the food truck park, it's literally the other side of that corner that I have had most of my close calls driving around. With people. Yeah, people just walk out in between a couple cars, don't even look, and step right out into traffic. So, you know, considering how much of that kind of pedestrian use is in that area, it makes a lot of sense.

Yeah, and Michael, I think if we're, you know, going to be voting on speed limits, we might as well include that. That's, you know, can't hurt.

Yeah, I think we need to evaluate a little bit more. The engineer needs to look at that. We haven't looked at that yet. I'm not sure the warrants are there for 15 miles an hour on a street that doesn't have a separated path for the cars. So it's 15 miles an hour on these streets because the narrow lanes and the parking on both sides where people could be coming from both sides. But we'd be happy to look at it and make it part of our recommendation when we come back for the September meeting.

Yeah.

Well, to Colin's point too, as we look forward in our general plan, like if we identify streets like that, that could A, support more parking because they're wide and B, we want to make them 15 miles an hour, that could be A longer term, but a bigger win in general.

And it could be as simple as a couple of minor engineering fixes to a road like that to make it a 15 mile an hour street. Because one of them is already there with the neck downs. But I think we, again, the engineering needs to look at that. But having something in the center or something else to slow traffic a little bit. Or even expanding the bump out so that it's only one way through like a chicane.

Or a raised crosswalk would be a great spot for that. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm just voicing concerns that have come up to me, you know, when I talk about it.

So we'll put that on the list to look at, and it'll be part of our presentation when we come back.

That'd also be great to look at with the downtown master plan, which I know is upcoming.

Yep.

um i appreciate you well i appreciate those who drift speed limit why are you looking at me um but several of you have made comments to me um and so i just appreciate additional thought and thinking about usability of the roads in all contexts um i really support the recommendation and the direction these conversations are going. I'm excited about Safe Streets for All and how that will continue to inform this. I think the advisory signage is worth testing. I still feel like it might be confusing for people. So I don't know. I'm trying to think through like, is there even just like slightly different phrasing or I think having it as an advisory sign I don't know. So I'm still waffling that.

I'm curious if the chief has any thoughts on... Yeah, we could talk offline about it, but I think you put a sign up with a speed limit on it, people will do it most of the time.

And that's kind of the point.

Yeah.

You know, but they don't have to.

But I think most people will be compliant and be good citizens. They already are. Yeah.

Good thing to test.

Positive outlook. Other comments, questions?

Thank you. Yeah. I just wanted to go over the process really quick because there is a new process with the new ordinance that was adopted. Do you want us to stay up here? Yes. Okay. Please change. Okay. So with the new ordinance that was adopted recently and is in effect now, there's a five-step process to changing the speed limit. And this was one of the reasons why we did change the ordinance was so that it was very clear who has the authority to change speed limits in town and how it's accomplished. So the City Council has that authority, but before that, we go through a process of evaluation, and then I review it and present my recommendation to the City Council, which will happen at the, I think the first meeting in September is what we're thinking. And then Council, it'll be noticed, it'll be discussed in a public meeting, and that will actually be the decision. And then we'll go ahead and and implement or not based on whatever the decision is. And I believe it's going to take us a bit of time to get going on this. I think we might not order everything just yet and see how things go, get some feedback from people, see if there's any feedback from the council. And then once the decision is made, then we'll order and we'll get moving right after that.

Yeah, and one of the things that I talked to Michael about today that it might be worth kind of stalling this out to the end of the season to the end of October. Just to avoid any kind of confusion if we change out signs, you know, people, you know, the start clean next year, but that's something for you guys to decide to

I think we're proposing in a way that is the least amount of change, to be honest, and kind of tries to keep the status quo with the 15, at least acknowledging the 15 miles an hour and only changing two streets, really. But we'll have a timeline when we come back in September.

Keep in mind there is a four to six week lag time.

Okay, so it sounds like even whenever we make the decision, it's probably going to be out. Something to think about also, if we do go with those advisory signs, they would only, I mean, we would go ahead and remove all the 15 mile an hour signs throughout town and then only have the 15 mile an hour on routes to the backcountry where the ATVs are going. So like 500 West, Mill Creek, maybe 400 East. So they wouldn't be everywhere. They would just be on those routes where they access the backcountry. So keep that in mind. And also, it makes me wonder if we want to do 20 miles at Mill Creek, because if we have the 15 miles there, that's going to encourage 15 miles an hour. Something else for you guys to think about.

i'd also like to keep thinking about i haven't heard from a little while but keep thinking about route finding right so you know as a compliment to these 15 mile an hour suggestions people right let's see if i can get an update on where that is okay anything else yeah anything any other questions on speeds Thanks, you guys.

Yeah, thank you. And we'll talk about this and you'll get a copy of the SS4A in the next couple weeks. So you can think about that also.

And the open house.

Yeah, there's an open house. When is the open house?

For the SS4A?

31st of August. Great.

All right. And now Michael's going to make a presentation on noise mitigation. Speed really, I mean, we did include ATVs because we know that, you know, slower ATVs can be quieter. But that is really based around safety, right? We want to keep our community safe. The noise mitigation really is specific to ATVs and actually noisy mufflers because there's a lot of vehicles out there that are noisy also. I mean, I hear loud trucks all the time, so it's not specific to ATVs. But anyway, Miles has talked to us all about his ideas, and they were good ones. And I think Michael wants to kind of express to you guys what we will be considering in the future. This will not come up in September. We've got to think through things. We've got to look at costs and that kind of stuff. But we wanted to give you an idea of some of the considerations you may want to take into for how we can mitigate this.

some of the noise we you know we're never going to accomplish it all the way that everybody would like but there are things that we can do so you take the weight thank you so um yeah this is uh this is a discussion basically on uh what we can do to monitor noise and what some of the research that i've done and what i've found based on some of the things that have been presented Here in this in this room at different meetings. I just want to say just anecdotally I the other day I was getting fuel and probably the loudest vehicle I've ever heard pulled up to get fuel at the same time. And it was not an ATV. It was a rat rod. And I think some of the street racers and things like that and those types of vehicles that are highly modified are what most of the communities that I've looked at are actually using this type of technology for. So the technology is called sound cameras or they're also, well, noise cameras, you know, something like that. And what they're stating is that they can They can separate the ambient noise on the street from an individual vehicle's noise by triangulating and using cameras and things like that, and really focusing on individual vehicles, which is something that would be helpful, I think. I think this technology is still in its infancy. There's not many places that are doing these things. And I'll just tell you a couple that are. New York City. They have a lot of loud vehicles in New York City, and they're using this to clamp down on this. Newport, Rhode Island, Knoxville, Tennessee, Kirkland, Washington is using it for street racing. And I think that's what has gotten a lot of these cities to really move that direction is because of street racing. Albuquerque, New Mexico... Miami Beach, Florida, again, back to street racing, most likely. It's a pilot program that they're using right now. And some of these places are actually issuing citations. But I don't want to get into that today. I think what I'm ready to move forward on today and to propose to the city council is a process where we reach out to a manufacturer and ask them if they would be willing to do a demo for us. I believe that in the end, this will be informational only. I don't believe that our state code would support any kind of ticketing or anything like that. But those are things that we can look into. But to move forward with this, there are manufacturers out there. I think my next step, if the council is interested in going this direction, would be to see if we can get a demo on it. I don't think we're at a point where we want to order equipment or anything like that. just like to to see if they can come out and show us how this works and see if it can it can accomplish the things that we want and in this case i think the thing that we want is to inform people of what their noise levels are inform ourselves of what noise levels are as well and see if we can get it down to um to a per vehicle or by vehicle uh guest situation. So it's not everybody. It's just the one vehicle. So that's what I would like to do. There's not a lot more to say on this. I think I found a lot of information about these things, pros and cons. I think as technology gets better, it'll probably get better. But I think we can take a look at it how it is right now and see if it's something that would work for us. Education is the other thing. And I think with and you're talking about education just around sound about noise. Yeah. So I think education is is definitely key with both of these things, with the speed limit or the lack of a speed limit, the suggested speed for ATVs. and the noise. We are looking at and we need to look further into what else we can do to get information out. I do think there's a lot more that we can do. I do think it takes a little bit more resources, but with a little bit of resources, I think we can get a lot of information out there. I think you might have seen, I hope you've seen, we've been ramping up on social media. You've probably seen Val talking into a lollipop at the community gardens and things like that, which is great. Do some more of that. I think we can also work the same way that we have with... with flooding and those types of things and target the people who might receive information about this, talk to all of the outfitters and things like that and just get as much information out there as possible. There's still a lot of work to do on this to see where we are, what we can do, what's the most appropriate thing to do as well as what is the legal thing that we can do. So those are all next steps.

Comments, questions?

I think that for me, like I like the idea of getting like a demo, you know, doing the demo thing. But I think with that, as a council or whatever, as a city, we need to have an end goal, you know, in what we want to accomplish by doing this. Is it just for education? You know, is it for, you know, is, can we write citations with it? You know, because to me, we're not really doing the public any sort of service, you know, by just, telling people what a vehicle is going by at unless there's some sort of, you know, if we have it as a demo and then we go, hey, this is out of control, you know, and our goal is that we are now going to implement it for writing citations is a great goal, you know, and stuff. You know, because I think already our MOAB city officers are already pulling people over for noise and people are like, I don't care. you know, and stuff that they're paying it and then moving on. So, so I think like, for me, I would like to see a broader discussion about it that, you know, like, Hey, we're going to implement this. We're going to, we're going to do a six month study, you know, see what's going on, see, you know, whatever that's coming in and then come up with, you know, concrete policies and procedures and, and, and whatever for, for curbing it, you know, and actually creating a way to remedy the, these noise situations for our residents, if that makes sense.

It does make sense. I disagree. I think the educational piece is, for me, is the end game. And I think that, you know, I like to think about a, you know, if there was one of these cameras on Mill Creek and, you know, a tour company driving down Mill Creek, And if I was on a tour, better yet, if I was the person leading the tour, if I was even the owner of the tour company, and I knew my vehicles were registering very high on this, I'd be really concerned about that, the optics. And I'd be concerned about how the people on my tour were seeing that, seeing themselves in these vehicles that are obviously, I would love to see the city code decibel level, the allowable decibel level, also on there as an educational piece. And I would just be very conscientious as a business owner if my vehicles were, because we all know too that there's a huge discrepancy in the noise of these different vehicles. And we have some tour companies that have, you know, what are relatively very quiet vehicles and others that have much louder vehicles. And if I was one of those tour companies that was registering on the louder side of that, every time I drove past this, I would be very, very much thinking about, uh, redoing my fleet that next year. And I think, so I think that, that educational pieces is really important. And I also, I mean, I, I also have so much appreciation for the speed limit signs, which are just really an educational piece. Um, the one now as you get off one 91 on fourth East, I mean, that one catches me every single time and I slow down and I, uh,

you know come come down to the 25 miles allowable on that street and so i i actually feel like just that that educational piece is is a satisfactory end game for me and i think we're talking about two different things like i i get what you're talking about too but i also think you have the um you know i think i think the utv businesses for that matter they want to abide by the law they they know that this is their livelihood they they want to be good citizens is what i think I'm talking about the WRXs, the Camaros, you know, the dude that ripped his exhaust off of his dog truck. You know, those are the people that I think, you know, that are as much of a problem as these other segments, you know, and stuff. So I think that, you know, I think that the majority of the noise is The noise is being caused by lots of different user groups and stuff. So I think having something to combat all that.

I'm personally really quite pleased to see this moving forward. I think we live in an age where technology can really give us advantages over problems that we didn't have in the past, and it is always evolving. To kind of both of your points, I do agree that I think that the ultimate goal really should be that education. And I would like to think that everyone would hold themselves to a standard. And if they realized they were in the same way that if you realize you're in excess of the speed limit, most people slow down, not for fear of a ticket, but because they're trying to do the right thing. But to Jason's point, I think it would be worth reviewing and evaluating whether or not within state law or otherwise that there is any way to give this teeth because while we may not want to initially especially you know six months survey whatever it seems like a significant investment to go to like to go to these lengths without at least determining whether or not having some kind of citation or otherwise is a possibility. And depending on what data these cameras show, if for some reason, like if we're seeing that very few vehicles are in violation, maybe we don't need to go to those lengths. If we're seeing many vehicles in violation, we should consider, we should have already figured out whether or not we could go to those lengths if we chose to.

I agree with that. I think that... I think it will really help to gather data to be able to do some of that storytelling to legislators about even just minor tweaks, like ability to do time of day restrictions where you can't drive really loud vehicles at night, or we're going to enforce it really strictly at certain times. And, or like that gives us more information about which vehicles, and I don't know if we'll track to this level, but even having some idea of like which types of vehicles or which user groups are causing the most, like I think to be able to have that data is going to drive those conversations about what works and what doesn't. And then it's also, it's not, moab city council or a group of citizens or something coming to a particular legislator and becoming a political conversation it's much more data driven about conflict impacts um so so i think starting with like i'd be stoked on a demo um yeah seeing how it works in utah um

Anybody else? Questions, comments? I think a demo would be a really, it would be a really good first step. And we would have to evaluate how, like Miles said, is this really, are we looking for a problem?

Are we looking for a problem?

trying to solve a problem that's not there. I think we really have to evaluate what we do with the data that we get and use it wisely.

Anything else? No. All right. More to come on this in the future date. We just wanted to make sure that you guys in the public understood that we hear them and that we're doing what we can to figure it out.

So pun intended. We hear them. Do we hear them?

All right.

Anything else on this?

Thank you. Thank you for that.

All right. Moving on to Cross Creek study. You know, by the way, just so you all know, it is the last meeting was the Alexi Val meeting. This meeting is the Mark and Dedar meeting because pretty much everything on our agenda is you guys. So Mark and Dedar or Mark.

Okay, we're going to get a presentation loaded up here in a second. Let's see if I'm good enough with my own computer here to get this to work.

So basically, we had the Cross Creek community engagement, and then what we need from you guys tonight is some directions to where you'd like to move this forward so that we can get to the design phase, which we have budgeted for. The funding for the The project itself we're still working on in terms of funding from FEMA or the brick grants or the federal government appropriations that we're asking for. So right now, tonight, we just need to get some feedback from you guys to move forward to design.

Yeah. Thank you, mayor. Okay. Yeah. So to that end, there's quite a lot of fiddly little details in here. Yeah. I'm going to kind of try to breeze through the background. I think a lot of folks already, you know, know a lot about that. We'll go through a little bit of the technical details, but what I'd really like to give you all time for is the alternatives themselves. So if we wanted to dig into those and have questions about those, so stop me if I'm going too fast. And oh, and I apologize to summer. I forgot to put the city branding on the presentation. Okay, so of course this began with the major flooding way back in summer 2024 and we had flooding previous to that, but we kicked off this study after that flooding that summer. So there's a little delay in there. We initiated that Saturday in October 2024. We began development of concepts and alternatives. We began public engagement starting in summer of 2025. That started off with direct stakeholder meetings with nearby property owners. We engaged with them directly in closed-door meetings. Well, I shouldn't say closed-door. They invited folks and things like that, but it wasn't an open house is really what I mean to say there. We continue to further refine our concepts based on their feedback. Then we had an open house in June of 2026. This was just passed. We had that over at the MARC. We had remarkably good turnout, so that was nice. And now we have a draft report completed that I am presenting to you all on right now.

So Mark, really quick, on your timeline, I think it's missing one thing, which is before 2024, the engineering department, with help from Hansen and Luce, did put together some engineering studies for this area.

Bone Collins, yeah. So there has been some other evaluation. Bone Collins did a creek-wide analysis where the creek enters the Spanish Valley all the way down to the river. Theirs was higher elevation view. Looked at a large basin up above town. Looked at levees.

That's not the one I'm talking about. I think it's Hansen on Luz where we had the There was a study that was done previous to this. There were mitigations that were proposed on private property, but they were all on private property, so it didn't actually move forward.

Oh, yeah, we did have an NRCS project with Gabian Baskets that was ready to go, but the property owners did turn that down. Sorry, I missed that part.

And then more floods, you know, and everything. So re-evaluations.

Yeah, that project would have been bundled with the Fifth West riprap project that we did do. Okay, so the scope of this study is to evaluate the stretch of Mill Creek between Main Street and 500 West to model the hydraulics for flood mitigation alternatives and existing conditions. propose new trail alignments that work with an altered creek to do public engagement and solicit feedback from the public and stakeholders, and to produce a final report that would not be bid-ready construction plans that would follow from after this point. And then just on the side there, I've got some little references that we might return to later if we have questions about the design flow rates. They're really important when there is the 1%, which we'll keep that number in mind. It's just under 10,000 CFS.

And what was it in 24?

24 was 6,660 is what the USGS gauge downstream from this registered.

After the confluence.

After the confluence, yeah. Okay, some technical notes. I'll try not to spend too much time on this. This is a different model to be differentiated from our FEMA flood study. They look different. The 100-year flows under existing conditions in our model for the study look different than our regulatory floodplain and floodway. They're just different models based on different topology. The topology for the flood study is from the 90s. uh the proposed alternatives here assume the 100 year flow rate we didn't consider any lower storms it was just let's just aim for the 100 year which makes it quite a lot larger than it would be otherwise um And then when we go into those examples, you'll notice that the water tends to behave a little bit different when we're looking at these exhibits. In existing conditions, and we have three alternatives, with the levee-only alternative, you'll notice that the water breaks out well above Main Street. which reflects more of the reality of what's happening. We have two alternatives here. One of these is going to end up being our preferred or recommended alternative. Assumes that all the water makes it through Main Street and is not diverted with the idea being that at some point all of that will be upgraded. We did not assume that for those other alternatives simply because the existence of the levee actually presents so many problems. So you have to account for the water coming in the backside in the meantime. I hope that makes sense. And then our proposed channel depths where we propose altering the channel through there. We assume that we are constrained by the Main Street Bridge, which has a concrete bottom, and the 5th West Bridge. So these are just kind of as a quick little reference in case anybody's interested. For existing conditions, we modeled the 10-year, the 50-year, and the 100-year. If you'll notice, that all breaks out well upstream there, as we actually have seen. Oh, and also note here that the 2024 flood was just a little bit less than our 50-year modeled flood.

Can you point out some landmarks?

Yeah. So on the right-hand side of this image, you'll see a, I think it's a yellow line going north and south there. That's the shared use path along 100 West. And then on the west side is 5th West at the very edge of the image there. The hospital just out of frame to the north there. And if you look closely, you can see in the contours, which are the white lines there, you can see the creek channel as it exists. This is all fairly new topology. We collected it just for this study. And then the yellow line through the middle there was the path as it was, including the old bridge crossings. Okay, so now we'll dive into each alternative. We evaluated three, the first being simply a levee to raise the trail up. This was probably never really a viable option, but we just wanted to run it to show that this is not a viable way to do it. We can raise the trail up on a levee. The problem with that is that you do trap water on the north side, if the levee is on the north side. And so you have to put culverts through the levee. So it's really only a trail structure. We evaluated it just to have it in there as an alternative. We're not recommending it. All it does is protect the trail. It offers really no flood protection. Alternative number two, try to split the difference between that, between a levee and increasing the channel size. Increase the channel size slightly and then put a levee at the north and south edges. This does accommodate the 100-year flood down it. It has a larger footprint than doing the channel only. We'll get to that later. And you still have to install flood control on the back side of it, on the north side of it, because that's so much lower and you need to be able to drain water that comes from off-site. Number three is our preferred alternative. That is simply a much larger, deeper channel. And how that plays with the different trail alternatives we'll get into as well.

What is the 30-foot wide concrete line channel in there?

So that is... Actually, we can... I think that is... We'll jump straight to that, actually, if you... So maybe I might be getting a little ahead of myself, but...

Okay, you can wait to answer that.

Okay. Yeah. Okay. So... So this is an image showing a levee. This is not protecting for the flood. It simply shows a levee with a trail on top and that the flooding will need to be allowed on both sides. Again, we're not recommending this one. This is combining a levee without culverts through it. This would contain the flood and an improved channel. As I noted earlier, we assume that the flood comes out of the main street bridge there. That's not what's happening in reality right now. If we installed this tomorrow and we had a flood the day after, we would likely see water along the north side of that levee. There would need to be a pretty substantial storm drainage system on that side that would take all that water downstream. Then this is our preferred alternative. Again, we assume water coming out the Main Street Bridge and that it's not breaking out. In the meantime, this alternative has the benefit that whatever water does break out is not kept from getting back into the creek. I'll also note here while we've got this one up that the alignment shown here, you'll see a big jog there right in the middle. That is following more or less the existing jog in the creek. We did discuss with stakeholders and the public in general that a final design for this would not necessarily follow that alignment. but we would have to contend with the confluence, which I'll kind of point to. If you can see my mouse there, this is Pat Creek coming in. So if we were to shift that south, we'd have to move the confluence that has unknown permitting repercussions and would have increased impacts to the property owners in the south or arguably impacted more because if we're combining with Pat Creek, then there may be kind of a redundancy to be to be, you know, combine the two. Okay, and then let's, oh, I'll also, actually I'll note before we get too far again, this also does require a little bit of ponding down at this west end. The bridge and the pedestrian underpass don't quite take this flow as they are currently, they would pull back a little bit. But that would go to that extent and then push through.

Is the trail alignment on private property at all?

Thank you, actually, thank you for pointing that out. So we went through a couple different stages for trail development here because that was one of the biggest things that we got feedback on from the public, from stakeholders. This was our initial proposition. We only had the one trail alignment, which was on the north side. This would keep us from having to put in any bridges, any pedestrian bridges, because putting it on the south side means you have to cross Pack Creek. And so this was our initial take on that. We ended up developing several more alternatives, which I've got shown on another exhibit. And all of which have some private property impacts to one extent or another. This one, to reaffirm what the manager said, would involve having to go through all of those private properties there with only small portions being in currently sitting on property. And actually to that point also, I'll point out that just doing the creek improvements here have significant private property impacts. Just to get any of these alternatives built, we would have to be securing property, either fee simple or in easement.

So really quickly, is this considering...

mill creek reaching 9 000 you know whatever so you guys what about like pack creek you know and like that pack creek arm coming down right there is there that weird uh so part of the philosophy here is we haven't quite seen that flood yet so it's just hasn't been driven by that um the flows i think the modeled flows are a little bit smaller they tend to be smaller um That very well could be the next step of this. We build this and then where the confluence comes in, the improved channel shown here would take the Pack Creek 100 year flood as well. And then that would have to be some other future project where we're making improvements to Pack Creek. Yeah. Um, okay. These are trail alignments, but actually I'm going to jump ahead just to get to, can we go back to that for just a second?

Um, I just want to point out the private property versus no, the next one. Yeah. The private property versus the property that is owned by the city of Moab, everything that is peach colored. is private property. We do have easements for the trail alignment that is A2 on the, from where Mark's cursor is going east. And then we do have a couple, I think we have a couple of easements west of that as well. But there's a, you can see moving to the the proposal that Mark had on the previous slide, how much of that is on private property. And it's not just impacted private property. We can't do this without private property's permission, without having some authority on the property, as you can see.

Yeah. And to kind of point out here, the one city-owned area that gets a little bit obscure, just because we do have a lot going on here, is this kind of long, narrow one right in there. is uh we do own that currently uh but there is a pinch point right here in the middle where we don't own any of that property we've got some easements in there for for some stuff but uh it's not wide enough for any of these improvements and the easements wouldn't cover it anyway um okay i'm gonna jump ahead and just show the uh channel um concepts uh well actually first i'll note really quick that um We evaluated hard surface trails, soft surface trails, and potentially bridge crossings is what we end up with in order to dodge private property in some cases. So this would be the narrow section closest to the Main Street Bridge. It's just already developed there. It's hardened, essentially. So we don't really have a lot of room to work with. So we'd have to have a narrower, deeper, concrete-lined channel through there. That's what this is showing. And then moving west, it would widen out. And this would essentially be what any of the bridge crossings would need to look like. Substantially wider spans than we currently have or have installed to span that enlarged channel. This is even further west where we would get even wider and shallower. We do show vegetation growing down in there. Some of that would be allowed to grow once larger trees or something came in. We would have to be actively doing mitigation for things like Russian olive. I think that, yeah. Okay, so now that we've seen those sections, go back to these trail alternatives. The darker ones, A1 and A2, those are both hard surfaced and they minimize private property impacts. They still do have private property impacts, but we tried to stay mostly on city-owned property. We could do one or the other, potentially both, where it splits on the east here. Note that the A2 does require a bridge to cross on the east end here. And then A1 would go join where we have an existing trail that comes through there. We have another little culvert bridge down there on Pack Creek. B1 and B2, those would be soft surface trails that would be located somewhere in the channel. This would just be for your joggers or your dog walkers. And it would be maintained to some extent. The floods would come through and it would maybe blow out a little shelf that we have in there and it could fluctuate over time what that thing looks like. And then C is the latest incarnation of our original concept where it just stays on the north side the entire time, but would have to go through all of those properties. Okay, I think that covers that pretty well. Okay, so we did do stakeholder involvement and a public meeting. I'll try to kind of hit the big notes there. We did hear back that if we could decrease the channel width, that would be preferred, or realign the creeks to combine with Pack Creek, as I mentioned earlier. We were told to preserve trees and generally minimize impacts to existing properties, to prioritize short-term maintenance in the form of sediment and debris removal. And we did get some general support for trails, but generally opposition to them where they went through someone's private property, with some exceptions.

And this is the feedback from one open house, right?

This is the feedback from, we had several stakeholder meetings with individual groups of stakeholders and our open house, yeah.

All together.

Yeah. We had lots of long conversations with folks and these are just kind of the broad strokes. Okay, next steps. We will finalize the report and hopefully begin design We currently are caught in a little bit of a predicament in that we don't have an alignment that everybody has ostensibly agreed on. So we would still need to resolve those property conflicts, which I would imagine could coincide with the design. We start doing that and we do even more stakeholder involvement. And then assuming that we can resolve all of that, and finish design somewhere along the way there. We will be pursuing funding. Hopefully we will secure funding either out of our own budget or from grants or bonds. And then we will go to bid and construct. There's a lot of information in there. So whatever you all wanna talk about, I'm here for you.

Mark, when we're talking about widening the channel,

significantly like that and then therefore eating into the adjacent private property what what's the legal process for that is that an easement is that uh so i believe that we can do that through an easement or just get fee simple property um uh be simple property is just we would own it outright yeah um the uh I will say there was varying feedback. A lot of folks wanted the channel to be narrower, but I think, I believe that we're more amenable to having some sort of improvement at all, whereas they may have felt very strongly against the trail. And so there's a version of this where you're getting one and not the other. The easements would be specific to one or the other.

I think it's worth pointing out, though, that if you if you refer back to one of the first slides that Mark showed, everything was blue. And that was a 10 year event, I believe. And then you look at the proposal, if you can go back to the proposal. And blue is inundation, right? With water. If you go back to the proposal, this is much narrower. This is extremely narrower. And then, so the point I'm trying to make is that the creek already goes on to private property. It follows the route that it wants to go. And with an improvement like this, we think that we can help channelize that much, much better. But this is the minimum width that we think that we would need for those types of improvements. Yeah.

50 or 100?

It's 100 feet down at the... And in fact, I think to top of bank and to the edge of the trail, if we did have that, it goes even wider. I have to reference my drawing.

And am I correct, Michael, with that? I mean, we are significantly increasing... the legal buildable space on these people's properties, right? And these adjacent properties.

There's a potential that a FEMA flood zone amendment could be done taking that into consideration. I don't want to say it's going to happen, but it is definitely more possible with something like this. Yeah. Should be able to do a map revision for something like that in principle. Yeah. Yeah.

So it feels like such an evaluation point to me.

Right. So the evaluation for FEMA would be with these improvements. Could you take it out of the 100 year floodplain, which now it is it is in the 100 year floodplain. Yeah.

Yeah. The last thing I'll say is that in all of the discussions about this section of trail or pathway, there's always been a pretty significant voice for keeping this area primitive and undeveloped and not a concrete pathway. People love this area. A lot of people in this community love this area for its wildness. I'm really attracted to the idea of having the, you know, an undeveloped pathway within the drainage, you know, especially if you have 100 foot wide drainage. I think that's a really exciting idea. And especially if that works with, I mean, I think I just heard you say that that would have to be two separate easements, which complicates things. But I think that's a really exciting idea.

Okay. Yeah, that's good feedback. Yeah, we did. At one point we discussed hardening the trail in certain places and where we couldn't get it all the way on the outside diving it down into the channel and there's there's yeah lots of creative stuff we could probably do there.

Yeah.

Yeah, I just honestly was about to speak up about that exact same thing. So I'm glad that you mentioned that. Like, I think there is a lot of appreciation for the fact that this feels like a little wild place right close to town. And so the more that we can do to preserve that and essentially like. I know that some of this engineering will have to be like a concrete bottomed, you know, portion, but what we can do to make that still feel a little less engineered. I don't think anyone, I want to say that we are doing that so that we can soothe the fears of people who are seeing a straight clean cut concrete Arroyo going back here. That's not what we're after. And then my other question is, you know, in regards to the trailer, otherwise like, how far away would that proposed trail be from the structures and the used property on these private property lots? Because as somebody who has a trail going right next to their house, I can speak to what does and doesn't feel invasive in a big way.

Yeah, I'll speak to that if you'd like me to. There are houses right about there, if you can kind of see on there. Um, and, uh, any, any trails that we did do, uh, we did discuss, uh, fencing and lighting or lack thereof, um, and, uh, and, and spacing, uh, apart from the channel or again, even diving down into the channel and having that almost be a sacrificial part of the trail in the event of a flood.

Sure. And with this drawing to scale, we're talking like 90 feet if the channel's a hundred feet wide and I'm guesstimating.

You know, we actually went out there and put in stakes. I think it was maybe about it was something on the order of 90 feet.

But still a significant distance. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I just want to point out still private property. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. But just what we would be asking of these private property owners if we ask for an easement or otherwise, I want to make sure that we're not overburdening them by being like, hey, can we put a trail right through your backyard? So, yeah.

And I think that a lot of those property owners, they're thinking two different things. You know, they want flood mitigation, but they don't necessarily want a trail. You know, so I think that it's trying to balance those two things, you know, for what they want to protect their properties, but maybe don't want to go through their private property and making sure that if there is a trail, it's unobtrusive. Right.

So give me an idea of what 100 feet is. I mean, this just seems huge. So four times this. Oh, you know, yeah. Yeah.

uh like fourth north if you go out there uh we have like 99 foot right of ways i think it's worth that uh through downtown we have 99 foot right of ways uh it's kind of hard to picture them because the property lines are invisible so like from here to the ballpark a little bit less than that yeah yeah Yeah, actually.

It's the creek now.

From the ballpark fence. I'll be back in a minute. The ballpark fence to the front door of City Hall is probably right in the range of 100 feet.

Yeah.

Close to it.

Nobody can measure it. And so this would be, did you say like a $7.8 million project roughly? Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

There would be – the way Mark showed it, there were different prices for different types of construction. But most likely the way this would roll out with design is that the portion from Main Street – where it's really hemmed in and we have a small channel there would most likely be one type of construction, which he showed, which is the concrete narrow channel. And then as we got down past that first pedestrian bridge, that's where the other would most likely spread out and be wider and everything. So it's a little bit of this and a little bit of that. Yeah.

But to make sure I'm clear, when we're looking at this section, we're talking about 100 feet of concrete.

Oh, no, sorry. I should have been a little bit more careful.

Concrete would be closer to Main Street.

Yeah, the only concrete would be where there's already... Most likely, the only... Show the narrow section there. Yeah. You can see how narrow it is right there. And we've got a hotel on one side and we've got the souvenir shop on the other side. We have very limited space there. In fact, we only own half of the creek on the first part there. We're working with the landowners, but we still have very narrow space. So that would have to be some kind of concrete channel. And it would be dictated, the depth of it would be dictated by the bottom of the or the concrete at the bottom of the channel on the Main Street Bridge. And then from there, as you see it widen out, that would all be natural with probably some gabion baskets, things like that, potentially in some areas. Yeah. But no more concrete bottoms past that point, past that first bridge.

Yeah. We could potentially do something like gabion baskets to put a little raised primitive trail, or this is where we kind of get into the very particular design of it. And I apologize that I kind of buried that it was not lined through there.

Yeah. What's the time you gave the kind of timeline, but what's like the or the next steps.

What's the timeline of like the final report and

Uh, we think we have basically a final draft at this point. Uh, so we'll just kind of collate it together and, and, and, uh, issue it as it is, you know, clean up some typos sort of thing. We think we're at that stage.

So let's come back to the council and be like, we want option C.

I think that's what they're asking for you guys.

We'd like to move from this phase to the design phase. When we come back, it would be hopefully with a contract for design with the proposed alignment for that, which could be massage still. But we'd like to move into design phase from here. So I'd love to get your feedback today. Can we see the options again?

Yeah. I'm even like, do I know what a levy is?

Show Caitlin those profiles that want to know the pathway within the channel.

Yeah. Okay. So these are all specific to alternative number three. That is our preferred alternative. And this is the Western, more than half of it, where it is unlined and wider and shallower.

On these maps, I don't know if it's clear to everybody or not, but you can see the dashed line is the high water extent. So you can see how doing this would be able to control up to 9,900 CFS with continued maintenance, of course, and all that kind of stuff. Because as water comes down just in a regular year, it brings silt down with it and fills in the channel. Yeah.

This is mostly a really extensive excavation project.

Mostly, yeah. A little bit of concrete on the east end.

How involved is the Army Corps in this? Fortunately, we're in the Army Corps' budget already.

well not yet but we will be yeah yeah uh so um so up until now we haven't really done a lot of these really big projects the third south bridge that we've uh uh done the design for um going through the permitting for that has been significantly more i don't want to say difficult uh than a lot of our projects before. We try to keep them to a joint permanent application where the state effectively handles it. But with these larger projects, it involves full on, it's a higher level with Army Corps, and more requirements start to kick in. And so with something like this, we may have very significant mitigation requirements. very involved yeah yeah so we may have to be going and doing improvements on some other stretch of the creek or in the wetlands we're we're obligated to offset our impacts where we are putting in concrete things like that but getting into this um bill that the mayor was talking about puts it on the radar of the army corps of engineers more than on the radar it's like in their in their packet so it allows us to a lot of funding opportunities big funding opportunities

So I would propose the third option, you know, or whatever sounds like the most.

So can we go back to the one you just, we were at? I'm sorry, yeah. So these are two options here?

This is showing really just different treatments along that stretch, depending on whether or not we would include a soft surface trail down lower here. And then if the upper trail were to be bordered by a gabion basket on one side or the other, we like the idea of a gabion basket wall, if anything, actually to preserve kind of a monument for elevation.

And the deep one would be coming right out of Main Street?

The deep one would be coming right out of Main Street. Yeah. Here, I'll go back to that image.

And most likely going upstream on Mill Creek on the other side of Main Street, it would look similar to that as well. Yeah.

I really like the trail in the drainage. And I think that that'll be the... I don't think any of these are going to be easy with some of the property owners, but I think that that could be the easiest sell. And I think it retains the wildness of that section of the pathway. I think that it can also satisfy the active transportation needs from 5th West to 1st West. There are ways that we can maintain it as such.

And we're hoping there's not going to be a lot of water in it that often, right? I mean, when these happen, they come through and then they dry out and you have to clean them up.

Yep. So it almost seems like the third option would also be less invasive for neighboring property owners than the second option because building that large levee next to the creek seems like, you know, like that looks like it encroaches more into their space than just channelizing the creek itself.

Yeah, yeah.

And it seems like that third option is also... More of a long-term solution in that you've expressed that this levee also already kind of has the obvious problem of if water gets behind it, then it has to find its way back into the drainage. And so either we would have to modify the levee to let it do so, or we would have to find another way to route it around. And whereas the third option, that water would naturally work its way back into the drainage and away from people's homes and property. Can we just make sure we're...

The options are clear.

Is this the one that's being proposed?

This is the one that we're proposing. Well, something similar to this one. The one that we're proposing is option three, which is all concrete from Main Street to somewhere halfway between the 100 West Bridge and Main Street. And then from there, tapering out. And then becoming more of a natural, which is the number two the rest of the way. So just, okay. So just wanted to make sure I understood.

Oh, okay. So up until 100 West, that's another alternative. And then from 100 West to 500 West, that's the more natural.

Yeah.

Where the trail, where Colin's idea, where the trail drops down into the creek to avoid private property, right? Am I right? Yeah.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. Yeah. So, but what I'm hearing is from Jason and from Miles is you would prefer to see this from Main Street. Would you go back? This type of improvement from Main Street to 5th West.

No. Okay.

I'd like to see this type of improvement from Main Street to $300,000.

Honestly, this type of improvement is minimally as possible.

Well, from 300 to Main Street, yes. Yeah, like this would be what would, I think, control from 300 to Main Street. And then after Main Street or 100 West, it tapers into those other options that are wider dispersed.

So it sounds like our proposal and what you're saying is the same.

Well, and it was my understanding that in option two, you talked about like integrating the two. So having some amount of levee and having some amount of concrete bottom space

Yeah, option two is you're minimizing the channel work, but you're not going as low, and you're going higher on the levee. Or you're not going as wide, sorry, on the channel, and you're going higher on the levee.

Yeah.

Either way, the more natural, less concreted version seems more appropriate.

Because we're getting into the wetland zone down there in the wildlife and birds and

So that was pretty good confirmation when everyone said, no, no, no. So that's fair. Yeah. So that. All concrete. No. So.

Like in Phoenix. Yeah.

But I think from third to main has to be that way. Oh, yeah. We're limited on space, just like we are in the first part of this.

And if I recall in the past when we talked about that, we could do concrete that kind of looks like Cobble Creek in the bottom, so it doesn't look like flat, like a sidewalk, right?

There are challenges with doing too much design because one of the benefits of having a flat bottom is being able to clean it very easily. So one of the things we talked about was having drop structures at certain points. And maybe there could be some ornaments, little waterfalls or something like that where it changes elevation quickly and you could do a little drop. And then we'd come in from below and above to clean out.

Prepping for the whitewater park?

Yeah. with our three CFS general.

We'll be rocks. They're going to fall off.

Yes, they will. But we, we will be able to, to clean those up much easier if we can just scrape our buckets along, along the bottom. And it, it, and, Once it's concrete on the bottom, which we're not talking about this section anymore. We're talking about upstream. Once it's concrete on the bottom, that establishes the elevation with all of our regulators so we don't need permission every time we go in to clean out silt and things like that.

And so this section will be deeper then?

Yes, yeah.

It will be deeper and concrete. Yeah. And we can't make it any wider because there's no place to go.

Yeah.

How deep would this have to be?

Can't go any deeper than what's in the bottom of the Main Street Bridge or the bottom of the Third Sides Bridge.

Causing problems down below.

Yes. Yeah.

Or they'd be undermining it to have to either remove material from underneath the bridge that's already concreted in or.

Yeah. Yeah.

What do you guys think? Are we there?

Yeah.

I think so. Do you get what you needed?

Yeah. Do we give you some direction?

Yep. We'll proceed with this being a positive, I won't say approval, but positive direction. Nice.

I'm curious about, well, this is way later, but maintenance and re-veg and kind of, yeah. That's going to be a challenge. Yeah. That's a couple of weeks for a long time.

That's going to just be an ongoing battle. Michael touched on when we do just have sand out there, whatever the natural bottom of it is, and when the floods come in and fill it in, you can imagine in years to come, it's not going to look like we built it to and we'll need to go and maintain it to something. That's going to be an ongoing challenge. We talked about ways to benchmark it to have posts or something to just make it a little bit easier to judge how much it's moving over the years. So that would need to be worked out somehow. And then we would likely be applying for permits every time that we went back and did work on it. That should hopefully be easier after the fact. Once we've got an established channel, we're just going to put it back to that. But we'll say the regulations there can change from year to year. So that's a little hard to predict. And then in terms of vegetation, we talked to our landscape architect about this. We talked about doing plantings and seeding and things like that. The idea that the flood might come and wipe it out. Coming out of this, we had the thought that we would sort of leave that part to nature, but de-vegetate to the extent that we would need to to keep the channel open. So remove Russian olives and things like that.

I would say vegetation and landscape design would be secondary to the ability to maintain it. Yeah.

So we're going to have ironweed vegetation. I know, that's my fear.

But if we make it easy to maintain it, we can also get in there and mitigate invasive species and things like that. I hope.

Well, remember this conversation. Because by the time we go to this, some of us probably won't be sitting on this dais. But just remember that this is something that we talked about, agreed upon, and moving forward. Because when it happens, it's going to create a lot of angst, I think, among the community. We get in there and start digging down into the creek bed and things like that, I think.

Yeah, the first time with 9,000 CFS. Hopefully we were like, oh.

They were really thoughtful, that city council. I really knew what they were doing. I mean, we do. I mean, we have to do something.

And we do have some challenges, as we pointed out, and we still need to work through those in order to even have the ability to do this kind of improvement.

Thanks, Mark. Thank you, council. More to come. Thanks, Mark.

Good job.

Since when we will see the design?

So I think the next step will be to do the documents and getting a contractor for the design. At that point, you will approve a contract.

Okay.

And then from there, at the time we present the contract, we'll hopefully present an idea of the timeline for the design process.

Okay. Great. Thank you. And

And in the next few months is what we're hoping.

By the end of the year? No, by next year.

Well, by the end of the year. I'll say there's some consideration for funding there. We'll have to go out to RFP if we're looking for FEMA funding. We'll want to try to coordinate the two of those.

Gotcha. All right. Very good. All right, I need a motion to amend the agenda to move item 5.1, the quarterly revenue update up to a presentation because you guys don't need to approve this. It was intended to be a financial update, but as Michael explained, we want to wait till we get the audit back before we do that update for your consideration. So if I can have a motion to move item 5.1 to presentations.

I can make a motion to move item 5.1 to presentations.

Motion by Collins, second by Miles. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Motion passes 5-0. Okay, Michael.

Okay, so I want to show you a couple of graphs. And as I mentioned, there's still a lot of transfers taking place. And the way that we do this is we have our auditors make all of those transfers. So like all of the what we used to call overhead, but is now internal service fees, all of those things are still being transferred and stuff like that. What we do know, however, if move this thing, is noise. So that was my reminder to talk to you about noise. So I wanted to show you the tax revenues that are now complete because we have received July's. July's gets retroactively credited to the previous year. It's kind of weird, but this is how it looks. so these um these are two full years 2025 and 2026 for tax revenues and and obviously this is not all of our revenues but these are the ones that are most influenced by uh uh tourism things like that when we say two full years we're talking july 1st to june 30th we are so i want to make that clear to the public because people don't think that way they think january december but

This is July 1st to 2025 to June 30th, 2026.

That's right. That would be in blue. So, so 2025 fiscal year, 2025, you can see what the total was there for all of the taxes. And then in 26, the total that equals out to a 4% increase over 2025 actuals. But again, We have been pretty conservative in our budgeting. So if you compare that to what we actually budgeted for revenue, for tax revenue for 2026, it's actually a 5%, 5.6% increase in what we thought we were going to get, which comes out to about, it's close to a million dollars. So this last year, we did see a bit of a jump in some areas. It's not massive. But if you look at, I'll show you a trend in just a minute. If you look at the trend, it's pretty consistent. So on this one, you can see the three years. Green would be 2026 and then purple 2025 and blue is 2024. And these are all the different trends. tax categories i just showed you on the previous page so you can see in in every situation except wrap tax and i'm sorry wrap tax shows zero on this but um that's because we moved it to another uh fund and it was actually more this year than it was last year it shows on the previous graph you can see it was 436 000 this year as compared to 420 000 last year um but every one of these uh has increased with the exception of franchise tax. And frankly, I couldn't even explain why that's the case right now, but it's also one of the smallest, the smallest line item in here. So if we look at sales and use, actually, I'm gonna go to the next slide. uh resort community taxes i went back to 2019 and i i put all of the resort community taxes in here and i want to just show you this one line because all of our tourism related taxes generally follow this same pattern which is from 2019 to 2026 there's been a consistent raise in fact It's been about a steady 5% to 7% each year, if you average it out over all those years. We had a big jump from 2020 to 2022, but, and I've shown you this before, we haven't seen a decline after those years. uh, salad days or whatever you called it. Um, so those good days, we haven't seen it decline back to where it was pre COVID. So we, we see it still consistently rising, not a great amount, um, but a, but still a respectable amount. I think my recommendation going forward would be, we still continue to be very conservative. Um, but as you can see this last year, uh, turned out pretty well. We, we, uh, budgeted conservative and we came in about 5.6 percent in total more than what we budgeted so and that's that's all general fund most of its general fund dollars so Anyways, that's all I want to show tonight. And then I just wanted to explain also that we will be having the quarterly update where I have the final numbers. And that's when we would ask you to make a motion to accept the actual update. And things are looking pretty much right on track to what I showed you at the end of the year when I gave you some projections of how we're going to end the year and the savings and those types of things. Revenue is no different from the savings or the savings is no different from revenue is showing pretty much what we what we had projected for last year.

Questions. We're doing good.

Yeah.

All right.

Thank you. You bet.

All right, next we have our two items on our consent agenda, the approval of the minutes from our regular meeting on July 28th, 2026, and the approval of the bills against the city of Moab in the amount of $244,555.50. Do I have a motion to approve the consent agenda?

I can make a motion to approve the consent agenda.

We got a second by Tony. Any discussion, Miles?

Nope.

Tony? No. Anybody else? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes 5-0. All right. On to our general business. Mark and Didar. consideration, item 6.1, consideration of approval of UDOT statewide utility license agreement. And from my understanding, we've got utilities in UDOT's right-of-way, and so this actually makes it so that it's okay for us to do that. I guess we've had our utilities there for a while.

Yes, yes. I mean, we already had this license agreement, but it's expired, and Nobody was aware of it and nobody let us know until recent. So I don't have a presentation. It's very straightforward. It's the licensing agreements, some sort of easement for any utility companies. have utilities in the state right away, which is Highway 191. And we have water, sewer, storm drain, some of them cross the highway, some of them run along. And for us to keep those utilities there, construct new ones and maintain We need to renew this license. And then our attorney has been reviewed this contract and he didn't react like anything. He didn't ask any big changes. So he would ask for approval for mayor to sign it.

When does it expire, Diethard?

It's expired in 2018, March.

When is this next one?

So this one is five years and it's going to renew automatically another five years. So it's going to be 10 years unless we appeal.

And then in 10 years, they'll forget to renew it again. All right. If there's any questions. I can make a motion. Okay, great. Thank you.

I move to approve the statewide utility license agreement between the city of Moab and UDOT as presented by staff and authorize the mayor to execute the agreement.

Motion by Collin. Second. I'll second. Second by Tani. Discussion, Collin? None. Tani? No. Anybody else? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes 5-0. Don't go anywhere, DDAR.

Yeah, I'm not leaving.

I will be waiting since it's a clock. Okay, so this 6.2 consideration of approval of a task order for the sanitary sewer master plan update to Bowen Collins and Associates in the amount of $109,479. Now, this is something we have to do every five years. It allows staff to kind of review the projects, see if there's any new projects, and then determine how we're going to fund those projects.

Basically, yes. Yeah, so we just updated our sewer model last month. So what we use for sewer model, any development comes and multifamily homes, we want to make sure that we have a capacity for those developments. So we take a look at our model. So next step is... we want to look at the master, may have a master plan, see what will be the future growth and what we need to support those future growth and where we have a deficiency and prioritize our projects. Now, not only we want offering, asking for master plan update, we also looking for the fee assessment for new connections for impact fees and then the rate. Last time when we done this, it was 2018. And they have been done this two separate. Now we just combine those two task order at one. I make the math. Seems like eight years past and it's cheaper to just combine what we paid eight years ago. So I'm happy to tell what we're going to do. come up with the study. But maybe I do want to mention one thing. So the sewer rates right now is calculated by the water use in the winter. So we're going to move from there. Just I think that will be the different, maybe like the public know too. We discussed with Obi, public work utility director. It seems like not many cities use this method and it's kind of not fair to second homeowners. Maybe they are not here during winter, but here they are summer. So it's very hard to tell. Maybe there's a water break. It's kind of became a challenge also calculation for the treasurer office. So we are moving from there. I think that's going to be the biggest difference if I want to highlight.

Questions for Didar?

So that will come up. The new So what were you saying on that, like the way they calculated?

So yeah, like sewer rate calculated by, so we don't have a meter for sewer, right? Like not what a water meter. So what we do is we look at their winter use. So we assume too, there is not much irrigation use then. So that much water should be ended up in our sewer line. So we will move from there. We're going to have a basic rate for the, I'm not sure what will be come up with, but the type of the units.

And that's what this study will show. Yes, yes.

And now we will bring back to you for adoption.

So right now we're using a pretty conservative approach to determining our rates. using the lower flows during the winter, which probably means our sewer rates are a little lower than they should be.

Yeah. Like, as I say, like, if you don't leave here during winter, we assume that you don't use sewer much. But if you are here in the summer, maybe, or the spring.

So are you adjusting to more of a spring?

We're not going to look at – I don't think we're going to look at their water usage. I think – I'm not sure what the recommendation we will work with Bob and Colin, but I don't think we're going to look at the water use and it's make it complicated for treasurer too. Like it's extra work for them to come up with that calculation and take a look every year. I think we may look at the unit number, maybe the water meter size. Yeah. But I will update you whatever method

How long do you think when we'll get this information back?

So this one, so they say there will be two phases. The first one is six months. So we will have the master plan. And on the four months, we will have the fee and impact fees and rates.

So one thing I was talking about this, I had a councilman walk me off the ledge on this a little bit. It's gone. One of the things that I was kind of looking at this and I was looking at the master plan for 2017 and it was like talking about like These areas need to have new pipes or something like that or these sort of things. And then with this new master plan, it's kind of updating that, correct? Yes. And I was curious. I would have loved to have a workshop or something going into this. It was like, hey, this is everything that we accomplished from the 2017 plan. This is everything that we did. you know we the rates were this we thought the rates need to be this high because these pipes need to be needed to be fixed at x amount of dollars you know and we were able to um you know fix all the high um you know the the high things that were you know it's like high medium and low or something like that i think was another thing and so i'm just kind of curious like when you're looking at this new plan and you're looking at the old plan, were we able to get a lot of the things accomplished that we wanted to, that needed to be accomplished with that 2017 plan?

Yes, that's a great point. I know what priorities, what those projects. We've done some of them, for sure. So when you prioritize those plans, projects, you look at the future developments, what will be, but now we looking at it, some of them is not there. So prediction change. So we did 100 West, we did no track line. And so other change, we have biggest change, maybe a Grand County water and sewer alignment change where they were tied, now is a different alignment. So we are gonna take a look to alternatives. Some of the like South track line, we realize it's a big challenge is on the creek. what we can do. So we realize it's so expensive. So yeah, definitely. We can come up with a list of what project we have done. We've done quite a bit of sewer projects. Grow was maybe didn't align with what we predict some of them did. But I think that there are different developments. So it's very hard to guess which aim to properties will be developed. Now, they are We didn't predict the apartments. There's so many apartments on the south side. So that's why we need to do these updates. We cannot use just the old ones. But we already did the critical ones. I think we did the big ones for sure.

Yeah, that's what I just wanted to make sure that we were kind of working.

Yeah, and I can say, you know, from the old plan, which informed bonding and things like that, and based on the resources we have left, we have resources enough left to do the sewer outfall, pretty much, which is a project that we've been working on for a while. And I believe the South Trunk line... And there's a couple of other smaller projects, but this organization has moved through a lot of projects with the last master plan.

How hard would it be to put something like that together?

We can just do something that we could even... make us accessible to the public as part of this. In the next couple of months, though, we can put something together showing all the projects we've done.

I think that'd be great. I mean, people don't ever think about sewer. Even they do when they go to the bathroom, maybe. But, you know, I mean, it's a big service that we provide.

Yeah, and I think even the bigger picture for some of us counselors, at least, if not all, and something that obviously came up at the strategic planning was just the amount of master plans that we have that seem to be sitting on a shelf somewhere and not a great understanding of how they're being executed. And so I think that I wonder if possibly this winter, strategic planning or something, we could get an update on some of these master plans that we don't hear much about. Yeah.

So, yeah, there's still some big projects to be done.

Right.

But we can definitely share all the ones that have been done and we have been working through that bond. It's getting drawn down.

So like that idea, perhaps for the sewer master plan, when we come back in, what, six months or a year, we can include, this is what we've accomplished. This is what we're looking at moving forward. Does that work for you? I mean, it's going to be down the road, but you guys can put that in your, however you guys remember to do what we tell you to do.

We'll also include the water in that as well, because Water Master Plan is the next, not today, but soon we're going to be presenting the Water Master Plan contract as well.

That's great, because those are our two biggest services. But in general, all of the plans, and I think we've made progress, and I think we're doing things now, even on our agendas, where you guys can see what plan this is referring to so that you can see that we are making movements based on that plan i think we're doing a much better job than we have i agree but it'd be good to see that all in one place and i think strategic plan would be the great the best place to do that okay can i make a motion sure i move to approve the sanitary sewer master plan update task order with

Bo and Conta associated the amount of $109,478 as presented by staff and authorized the mayor to sign the agreement.

Motion by Jason.

Second. Second. By Colin.

Any discussion, Jason? No. Colin, do you want to share with us what you did to Jason? It was awful.

Any discussion? Hey, I've had enough discussion.

All right. Anybody else? I feel like I'm separating the two.

All right. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes. Thanks, D-DAR. And don't you go anywhere.

She's going to turn over the mark.

Okay. All right. All right. So item 6.3, our last item, a business item this evening is a consideration of a contract with straight stripe painting incorporated in the amount not to exceed 200,000 for our striping. And this is what in two phases, right?

So this is phase two of the striping plan for the year. Right now, we have people out in our streets department striping. They're hitting crosswalks and things like that. We're going to finish up this week, and then we're going to have straight stripe come in. And you'll see in just a minute, their job is going to be much bigger, wider ranging, and much more impactful work. as far as new things. And then also put in some of the new high visibility crosswalks, which as you know, are very expensive. So we're not doing those every, we're not replacing them all at once. We're doing two or three at a time.

And we wanted to get those crosswalks in before school starts, which is next week, right? Or the week after?

It's next week.

You probably don't know anymore. I don't know.

Okay, so we are planning to do this under a standing state contract. UDOT maintains a contract with Straight Stripe. We have utilized them in the past. There's a few different treatments here. I'll kind of start high elevation. What's shown here is generally just re-striping existing striping. So we're just refreshing striping. We don't have plans shown for that because they're literally going to just go out there and drive the roads and put new paint down on the existing striping. In addition to that, we will be installing four new thermoplastic crosswalks. That is at Williams Way and 5th West. and at 100 north and 100 west, center and 100 west, and then down here kind of at the bottom, 300 south by the bridge. And that one is nearby the schools down there, so we thought that one was pretty important. Oh, and then I'll just kind of highlight, because I almost missed it here, that 400 East will be refreshing this drinking over there as well. So from Alexi and Levi, with their help... coming from them, they've developed this concept of green bike lanes where they cross an intersection. This is a NACTO standard treatment. That's the, I'm going to get this acronym wrong, North American City Transportation Officials.

National Association of City Transportation Officials. We're close.

You got the last three letters right. Yeah. They have a lot of these kind of more newfangled, kind of neat, novel, I shouldn't say novel.

They're Tried and true.

Tried and true, yeah.

They're on Cane Creek.

Yes, yeah. So we've dabbled with a little bit of this green paint on Cane Creek, and then also many years ago, we put a little bike lane across a turn lane on 4th East up by Suwannee. It's since worn away, but... So we'll be doing these everywhere on this map that we're doing the regular striping refresh. We will be doing those at every intersection is the plan.

That's on this map.

That's on that map. Yeah. So every cross street.

And eventually every, you know, others also eventually. Yeah.

Yeah, this is a standard treatment for going through intersections so that you're not in no man's land, so to speak, on your bicycle. And there's a lot of times no striping at all. Warns the vehicles and gives these cyclists some guidance.

Yeah. This will just be paint, not thermal. It will tend to wear. So over time, you will kind of see the tire tracks across them. And then... Oh, actually, I should have went with this. So this is kind of what that standard treatment would look like. Specifically at two intersections, these are both on 100 West. We are also, I can zoom in on this actually. We're also proposing to add hatching. This is Williams Way. Add hatching along the south side of Williams Way here. Put green down for the bike lane. And then these little dots here are channelizers. Just as a note, we won't be contracting with the painting company to do those. We'll be doing the channelizers in-house.

What are channelizers?

Oh, I should have come prepared with a photo of that.

Sometimes they're called candlesticks, things like that. Little plastic. Oh, that's... You can run them over, but they're a good reminder. And this is what we're doing. This is our low-budget traffic calming measure. And this also, as you know, is a right-turn issue where people are using the shoulder to make right turns. God, I speed, and I...

I don't know. I'm the mayor. But that intersection is a dangerous one because, you know, now with e-bikes, they're going so fast. I mean, there's been many times when I've looked and I've seen a bicyclist and I'm like, oh, I can make the turn. And they're like right up on me.

I think that'll be helpful. I'm sick and tired of people trying to make a right from the shoulder when I'm making a right and just making a big wide turn because I've got a big trailer. Right.

This is one of the bigger culprits here.

Yeah.

And we have talked about the trail mentality as you're going through intersections recently, and we will be talking more about that with e-bikes and not stopping before the intersection and stuff like that.

Yeah, so this will have kind of a double benefit of acting like a sort of soft bulb out here. So you have a little bit of increased protection, I suppose, for the people going through the crosswalk. Well, it's not a raised bulb out, but the channelizers will help there. And then similarly, this is 100 west and this is 100 north. We will be refreshing this crosswalk, by the way. It's just not drawn here. And adding a similar to Williams Way hatched area with channelizers here to act like a bulb out.

And this is an engineering thing that does help to go towards what you're talking about with the speed limit. It does.

The other thing, and I don't know how we do this, but on that Williams Way, 100 West intersection, if there's a bus, I mean, there was like a bus park. You can't even see around the bus. So you can't see anybody coming up. I don't know if there's signage or something. I don't know how we do that. But if you have big, tall vehicles parked right there, And maybe they can't park now there. I don't know.

I don't think there's any.

There isn't any parking, but I just remember recently there was some big vehicle, maybe it was in that first stall, and you could not see the bike lane at all.

Yeah, I have seen that, yeah. A van parks there or something like that.

We can look at that, look at signage and things like that.

It's everywhere. It's a problem. But anyway, Colin and Jason, do you have any?

thoughts go ahead caitlyn sorry i just know this is a big thing for you yeah um looking i guess i'm i'm that is such a congested intersection wanting to confirm that there's still enough roadway width where that's not going to make that corner really tight for people potentially kind of almost turn out at the same time, which happens all the time at the intersection. So I want to kind of confirm that right-hand lane, that there's enough roadway for that to be a comfortable two-way.

So specifically with the eastbound taking a right or taking a left?

Yeah, kind of both simultaneously.

How wide is each lane after this?

The eastbound and the westbound. So it's the existing striping. So if you drive it right now, this is going to be the same geometry. You'll just have channelizers where there's a bike lane.

It's going to be deterring people from coming next to the car and making that right-hand turn. Yeah, I'm just going to back up traffic there because I do it.

Yeah.

Yeah. yeah no change in geometry no changes over here yeah we're discouraging the right turn movement there yeah and i think that will i think that will a lot it will mean i guess part of i'm really worried that you're going to show up with your wheel wells just full of those channelizers Swap out one of them for a bollard and leave it like... We're kind of interfering with Caitlin's comments.

That's a good idea. Make one a bollard and don't tell anybody. It looks like a channelizer, but it's a bollard.

People won't test them after a couple tries. Yeah.

sorry all right we're getting caitlin my my only other thing i i feel like you answered the question but i also just wanted to confirm that um the bike lane is where it is just otherwise looking at this especially having ballers in there concerned that you know a vehicle or a bike isn't going to see it until you're basically right there and so making sure that vehicles have enough time to get where they're supposed to be but but that's just you're just adding markers where the bike path is coming up that road right yeah i can confirm that it will be striping the edge of the bike lane right here okay great yeah and the rest of the bike lane will be striped also yeah yeah white without the green all the way to me

And I believe the white line that separates that lane, that's not a lane, that's not a right turn. I believe that that line extends a lot further east on Williams Way, where they're often vehicles parked. So it's defined much further. So it's not like something beyond the edge of the road and then all of a sudden. feel like they're in the bike lane.

It's hard now because it's so faded. Those bike lanes are so faded. These kind of things, in my opinion, these small little things that we do have a real big impact on our community because they're visual. They can see it. It's out there. Anyway, I think this is great. Colin, do you have any comments?

I do. I like the direction this is going. I hope that we... can also come up with a broader striping plan to carry us into future years when we're looking at this area, and then we have next year's area, next year's area. And so that it's just a really organized many years out of what we're where we're going to be focusing our efforts, so that then we can buy be budgeting for it. And then I also, so what what kind of lifespan are we seeing with with the painted Is it really? It's got to be repainted annual.

Got it. This is a double coat, right? And even with the double coat, it just fades. This will fade slower if tires aren't driving on it and tires won't be driving on it if they're not running over the Got it. The things.

On that note, and Levi, maybe you can answer this, but I wonder if the thermoplastic treatments that we've been, that we already have installed, if they can be, can they be power washed or anything?

That's how I maintain them. That is. Okay. Just grab them and power wash them. Nice. That way we get the longevity out of it.

Okay. And that brings them back.

Yeah. Like Michael said earlier, we're going through these last two weeks preparing for the school opening next week. And we've tackled all the school zones, so the stops, the stop bars, the crosswalks. With paint, we weren't prepared to do thermoplasty yet. It was such a short time, but that will be done this week. So the ones that aren't thermoplasty, like with Suwannee, we scrub by the church and mortuaries. That crosswalk right there, it's thermoplastic. It's roughly 10 years old.

Okay.

Yeah.

Great.

Yeah, we're still maintaining it.

Great. We are doing some evaluation internally to see what the options are for doing thermoplastic ourselves, what that would save us potentially, as well as a couple of other common things like concrete and stuff like that that we'll be coming back and talking to you guys about. Great.

And then the last thing I'll say is just a plug for again, we we do have a master plan that can can help inform a lot of this stuff. So I don't know if that's come off the shelf in the last year, since we approved that non motorized. Oh, mutation master plan.

Oh, yeah.

Okay. But you know, as we're looking at these things, you know, again, we were as a council, I think pretty excited about, you know, we are approving these plans that they get utilized.

Yeah. But like Michael mentioned, our plan is to have all our road markings, the stops, the schools, the arrows, the bicyclists, all those be thermoplasty. And all the channeling lines, they'll be painted. Great. Yeah.

I want to bring in our RFBs as well, the rectangular rapid flashing beacons. We are looking at a couple of installations for those, but we are also looking at some redesigns and some mills and overlays for the areas that we're looking at. We do have a price for those, though, and we are looking at where those belong. And we've got the price as low as possible, and it's not super low, just FYI.

Is there somebody on staff? If not, I would take this on, but we lost a great opportunity when the school district lost the person who was in charge of the safe routes to schools. And I don't think they've reassigned somebody, but there is a significant amount of money through UDOT to pay for exactly that opportunity. you know something that is if it's on an established safe route to school which 100 west is we could put one at williams way we could you know that there there is money available and so i think that uh you know i don't know what the best way to to move that board is but but we should be contacting that the school district saying hey you know we'd really like somebody to to be reassigned as the safe routes to school person

I think he's coming back.

He's in town. I've seen him, but I don't know that he's coming back to the district. Do you want me to follow up on that? That would be great. I think the city can be more involved with safe routes. And I've been really involved with safe routes in other places. And a lot of times it is the city that's leading that because most of the infrastructure, if not all, is is on city streets because unless um safe routes is changed all of that money has to be spent on on in street existing street right-of-ways and it can't be separated trails and things like that so it's generally the city or the dots that are that own those right-of-ways um I'm not sure. One of the things that I brought up when we started talking about this was what's the safe routes to school plan? And that's not something that the school has shared with us. And previously, I think they saw it more as a policy thing, as evidenced by, you know, inviting all the policymakers to do the walks. But none of our operational folks have been involved in that. So, yeah, I think if you're okay with talking to them and asking if that's something that that we could talk more about and maybe sharing some responsibility too. Because our grant coordinator could apply for those if we're working together.

Yeah.

And who would be the contacted city? Would it be Val? I couldn't say right now. But I think somebody would get mad at me.

They're all like, you're already asking me to do all this stuff.

So, but I do think it's something we could look at. Okay. And you are right, there is a lot of money.

All right, any other questions or comments?

One of the comments, so the $200,000, this bid, was it just everything that's marked in red? Yeah. You've got more exhibits, don't you?

Well, so we've got a lot of backing documentation, but nothing really set up to, we could bring it up and we could talk about the numbers, but it's not formatted. You've got 400 East, though. Yes, yeah.

is on here, yeah. So as you scan that out, that's for the 200,000, this is what we're getting. But so I guess my question is, is like, what do we if we're having to paint all these stripes every year, what is the plan for painting 90 of what's not painted is that i think that's what colin was saying is that we need to have a plan right yeah and that's kind of what i'm but i'm like going like 200 000 is only getting us this you know what's what's what's the plan um because that was something i was kind of reading you know in the proposal i couldn't quite figure out like um what the $200,000 was getting us. You know, as I was kind of reading it through, like, is this...

Most of it's for the crosswalk.

Yeah, it's almost $50,000 for the crosswalks, I think. And then... So... You're right. There is a lot of paint that still needs to be applied to these streets. If we're only doing this much each year and it has to be done each year, how does that look? There's no way we're going to be able to stripe every street each year. Next year, what we would be looking at is doing another section like this and trying to get to all of the streets. I believe everything that we're doing on the streets are the bike lanes, the the intersection crossings, the crosswalks, and then we're doing a lot of the crosswalks that are paint, and we're also doing the parking stalls as well ourselves, including Third South. But yeah, I mean, this is what we're getting for $200,000. We're getting it all done within

week or two yes this will be pretty fast once we get it once we get it in in line essentially we just got to get it scheduled um i i'll kind of maybe add a little part to the consideration of how we plan these forward uh the striping tends to be one of the more flexible things we can do um with respect to right-of-way improvements or utilities and all these things Um, so oftentimes it just follows from, uh, uh, you know, what, what projects we've done most recently, do we need to refresh that paint? You know, was it a project at King Creek, for example, we won't do, uh, cause we just did that. Um, and, uh, and we're not necessarily always exactly sure where we're going to tear up next year. or if we'll get around to it next year. So this tends to be a kind of a flexible, I can't think of anything better to call it than a filler project. It's absolutely necessary. I don't mean anything other than that, but it can kind of squeeze between everything else that's a little bit harder to program, if that makes any sense.

Does that answer your question? Kind of.

Probably not. And then the other thing is that we're paying a lot for all of this. We can touch these things up as well. The areas that are being run over by tire tracks all the time, which is going to be all the green paint in the intersections, those kinds of things we can touch up as we go along until we can replace those with thermoplastic. So we don't have to call these guys in just to touch it up.

Yeah, and actually to that kind of that same end, we've discussed, I think right now in the cost estimate, 4th East will probably just do a single application because the paint is a little bit newer.

It is a little bit newer and we're looking at a redesign there.

So we're going to save a little bit of money.

So can I ask about the discrepancy in approving up to $200,000, you just shared ballpark $180,000. Is that just like contingency or is it If we have another $20,000, we'd do this road too?

Yep, it could work that way. The way we put these together without doing extensive surveys on any of these things, just as a matter of saving time and making it quicker. When the painter goes out there, you know, maybe we realized, oh, there was a little bit of painting that we didn't include there. We've got to go another 50 feet here, there, that sort of thing. So yeah, it is contingency. And then if something did come up later, we... Something always comes up while they're here.

It gives us an opportunity to fix the quantities that we didn't include, but also add a little bit to it as well.

Yeah.

All right.

I'm going to ask for a motion. I can move to approve the contract with striped painting incorporated in an amount not to exceed $200,000 and authorize the mayor to sign it.

Second.

Second.

All right. Motion by Connie, second by Colin. Connie, any discussion? No. Colin?

None. Well, actually, one comment, and I just want to point out that, you know, the $200,000 is a large pill to swallow. You know, it pleases me that a huge portion of this is going towards this thermoplastic treatment that is going to last 10 years. And so we're not necessarily looking at, you know, this year, this amount year after year, especially as we get more and more thermoplastic on the ground. So I appreciate that we are going to just a product that will last longer and be less work for your department, Levi's. Thank you, Mark.

I was going to bring this up during my updates, but just kind of in the context of last meeting and all the state, this is also a state procurement contract and partially like side request to Michael is I think it'd be really helpful for us to have a presentation and talk about policies about how the city uses those.

About procurement policies? Okay.

I think just a presentation in general would help us understand when and how it's used. But I think also looking at this and thinking about when we did the sidewalk project, Like, I really like this approach for contracted work because we budgeted $200,000. We can pick a contractor. You can design work for up to $200,000. And then we don't have as much of the budget overages. So it's kind of a common observation that I think is a really good use for this ongoing contract work that we want to do all the time. Yeah, so thanks.

Anybody else? Miles.

Yeah, I just wanted to kind of address what Caitlin was saying and thank you for putting all this together. I think it's important to note as we go through these different procurement processes what projects require a certain amount of specialized equipment that it's even harder to find contractors to fulfill them. Striping is going to be one of those where it makes a lot of sense to work with a contractor that is in the position to do something like that because of that. And I also wanted to point out and just thank Levi and the city crew for becoming more and more capable of doing stuff like this yourself. I think, you know, like on the point of your comment, Colin, and your comment, Jason, about are we going to end up spending $200,000 every year to keep doing this? The more we can do ourselves, the more we can maintain these things ourselves, the better we can do for the community without having to spend this kind of price tag every time. So we're working towards something, and I really appreciate that and wanted to acknowledge that.

Thanks, Miles. Jason?

No.

All right. We've got a motion made by Tony, second by Colin. All those in favor, say aye.

Aye.

Any opposed? Motion passes 5-0. Thank you, guys.

Thank you, Council.

All right. That is the end of our general business, and we'll move into city manager's updates.

So I just got a couple things. I was out of town a lot of last week in 70-degree mountain weather conditions. Well, Joanne was telling me about where she was the week before, so I was like, I got to do this. So I'm glad to be back, though. The Youth Garden Project has broken ground in Old City Park, and they're moving forward with that new community garden plot. City put out an RFQ, which is a request for qualifications for updating the downtown master plan. And we received eight submissions, which is great. This can partially partially grant funded as well. I remind you. And so we're excited to get that moving forward. We are trying to use the old master plan that was never adopted as a jump off point. So we don't have to reinvent anything. So A lot of it, I think, is still valid. We are pursuing a community forestry grant in my efforts to keep you updated on grants. We lost a big community forestry grant a couple of years ago. We're looking at going after another one and also a grant that could help us with infrastructure for the map, which it could include if we wanted to bus stops. That could be something. if it's something we wanted to pursue. There's a dark sky event, I think, tonight after council. Never mind. So Sergeant Jerry Neumeier just retired this week, actually. She served with Moab Police Department for 22 years. She was most recently the Sergeant of Detectives and did an amazing job over those 22 years. We just want to give her a a good send-off. And I know the police department had a good send-off for her. She did a great job for this community for more than two decades. So thanks, Jerry.

Thank you.

That's it. That's it.

We do mind updating the conversation you had with Jared about the uranium boulevard. I know that's something that you're interested in.

So I speak with Jared Beard from time to time, probably more often once a month or every other month about UDOT related issues and how they affect Moab. One of the things that UDOT has been looking at for a while at our request is a traffic signal study or warrant study at Uranium and Main Street. And I asked them about that just this last week in conjunction with a pedestrian crosswalk and potential hawk at Dogwood and 191. They said that those are on their books. They are scheduling to do counts, traffic counts and pedestrian counts after school gets in session. So they are moving forward with that. And that's just the warrant study. And then after that, obviously, there would have to be funding and all those types of things. And we will be talking more about that. But those are two areas I think are well past due as far as looking at warrants for those two things.

And they're going to combine.

They're going to combine them, yeah.

All right. Thank you.

Jason.

Jason.

a couple things um we had an airport board meeting last week um the airport they're finishing up the apron project which they've replaced all the asphalt um or not all the asphalt but a lot of the old asphalt that was breaking away um that's about done that was a huge project took them a lot longer to get get that finished due to just um asphalt having to meet certain specs at an airport, you know, and stuff. So they had to put it down, ripped it out, put it down, ripped it out, I think three times or something like that. There's a test section. It's kind of... They have some issues up there. The airport's working on lease agreements with hangar tenants up at the airport. SkyWest is taking over in October. So Delta... will be taking over on october 1st and then united will be coming in um on october 8th um united ran into some i think they said some training issues you know let's get everybody qualified and trained so they there's a week later so i think there they said there'd be one week where there wouldn't be flights to denver you know and stuff that first week that's what we're doing that um today i ended i attended a moab office of tourism meeting um it was a great meeting They did approve a $2.7 million budget for marketing for next year. They got some great stuff going on. I think it's pretty neat to see how these three new companies that they're using is working together. They're putting some great stuff. And Moab just got nominated for Best Marketed City or something like that. Some award that they're going up against like Buffalo, New York. There's like two cities in New York and then I think some other areas as well.

September 8th

They're having a big event. Remember the big event they did at Josie Wyatt's that we all attended. They're doing another one of those events. And on September 8th, it's a media kickoff for kind of next year with the new promotion and stuff. September 8th is a Tuesday. It's when we have a city council meeting.

They obviously wanted us to be.

And I brought that up. I brought that up to him tonight. I was like, you guys realize that the last time you did this, the mayor and every city councilor was at this kickoff event. And why are you doing it on Tuesday? And they laughed.

Anyway. So

So there you go. That's all I have.

Do they have the schedules yet for Delta United? Can we go online and purchase?

Yeah, they are online.

Is there two flights to Denver and back?

Yes, I think so.

And then one to Salt Lake every day, Monday through Friday.

I don't. I looked it up like a week or so ago, but I can't remember what it is now.

But it's up there.

It is on there. You can book.

Thanks, Jason. Tawny. okay i don't have a follow-up but i do have some um on the fifth the moab museum had a visioning workshop and planned presentation um it was focused at fundraising and um the infra infrastructure of fundraising and um how to maintain relationships with donors and um what else It focused a little bit on the responsibilities of the board. And I think they picked a good team to work with. The staff felt like they were getting good direction from her. And then I had a meeting with Mayor and Colin and had two meetings with the Kenyonlands Health Care Special Service District. and picked a consultant for our RFP for a proposal for our development. Yeah, that's it. Thanks, Tony and Colin.

I just want to start by saying that I spent half my growing up in Buffalo, New York. There is no amount of marketing. No, no, no. No, lovely place. Lovely place. Lovely place.

Everybody goes to Canada. They go to Buffalo. They go to Canada to spend the night.

On August 6th, I met with the mayor in Taney. And then the 11th, which I guess is today, I had a trail mix meeting, a couple of interesting things. One, we heard from our parks director that, do you all remember the wayfinding sign presentation? It sounds like the first 25 signs are about to be ordered. So we'll start seeing those up in town pretty soon. That's exciting. And then we also heard from the park service that visitation at Arches is down 12% this July from last July. Yeah, which was really surprising. I don't know if folks are just waiting for the shuttle or what's happening.

Is that it?

That's it for me. That's all I got.

Thanks, Caitlin.

On the first, I went to the Mow Pretty Child Care celebration for their new building that they just put up at their original center, which is very exciting. On the 5th, I had a meeting with the mayor and then also went to Mellie's Cone and Cup grand opening. How were the cones? I didn't have a cone, but the gelato is fantastic. I highly recommend. It's pink. Very cute. I wish I had known. I would have worn pink that day, especially because it's a Wednesday, but I didn't.

What is that?

You too. I mean, there's some lingo.

The rest of us are like, it's way over our heads. It's a mean girls reference.

I'm wincing. Love that that's on public record.

um okay and then on the 6th I went to a housing task force meeting um tomorrow is the housing town hall at the mark um we'll start at six there's gonna be a bunch of um people there tabling so like red rock flats and a lot of the new apartments are gonna be there with information We'll have Rocky Mountain Power, Wattsmart Program, Hatsu, Mackle, all the classic players. This is tomorrow. Tomorrow. Starts at 6. And then starting at 6.30, we'll have a panel discussion. I'll be moderating. Corey will be there. As well as Andrew Jackson and Rennie Day. Chris Parker from the Give Group.

Ronnie.

Ronnie Schultz. Yes, here am I. And I feel bad that I'm going to forget the others. But it's going to be fantastic. I think even in the prep session, conversation was lively. I think it's going to be a really interesting conversation about housing and kind of how to build attainable housing. And also at the task force meeting, we had a presentation from a guy named Gus with Rocky Mountain Power's WattSmart program. Rocky Mountain Power has a lot of rebates and incentive programs for heating and cooling. Ductwork, weatherization, there's simple rebates on smart accessories and appliances. You can just go to the WattSmart website and if it has an Energy Star logo, most likely Rocky Mountain Power will give you a rebate for it. So I've learned a lot, especially thinking about my home. And then we also discussed interlocal agreement and bylaws, kind of looking at a structure similar to trail mix of having appointed city and county people, both representing city and county and HOSU, but also having city and county appoint people to that board. So just be a 13 member voting board subject to Oklahoma. I think next step will be bringing that to Sedena County to have kind of internal meetings about what that looks like before it even comes to council. So that'll come to you guys next. And then I have a local homeless council meeting tomorrow. Tyler Clancy, who's the new state homeless coordinator, reached out yesterday morning. He will be coming to Moab or he'll be coming to Grand and San Juan County on September 1st and 2nd. wants to organize visits. So I'll be meeting with Rana about that on Thursday, coming up with an itinerary. But I would love to feature the city and lots of our partners within the city that are serving unhoused, unsheltered clients. So I think it would be a big deal to have Tyler down here and actually look at what rural homelessness looks like, because it looks very different than it does in Salt Lake.

um and that is it for me thank you thank you miles so um i had a meeting with uh the mayor and jason that jason didn't feel like mentioning but i think went really really well you know jason was late uh what i didn't say that um but otherwise i don't have a whole lot but something i wanted to talk about is a meeting i had earlier today There has been a little bit of interest in the community on Facebook lately in regards to the automated license plate readers that are utilized in our community. And I had the opportunity to sit down with Detective Drexler who heads up that program and have a conversation with him about what is being used, how your data is being protected, and how we're going about it as a community. And so I want to be clear, first and foremost, we use a contract with Motorola, not Flock or any of the other camera systems that are embroiled in their own controversy. We've chosen Motorola first and foremost because of how they protect your data and the fact that they do not broker your data. So, otherwise, there are cameras on the way in and on the way out of town that scan license plates and they've actually helped us combat quite a bit of crime and not just in the community but passing through the community and are seen as very worthwhile. But I want to assure you that there is not one on every corner. Nobody is watching your every move here in town. That is not their intent and that is not the way that the police department is using them. And Detective Drexler walked me through the accountability and auditing process that also comes with these. That is what we are doing to safeguard police. our community from anyone choosing to abuse this informational system that we have. It's robust and it needs to be so because as our police department pursues accreditation, that's one of the big things that you need to do to be accredited is to show that you are safeguarding people's data and using it in a specific way. So to everyone out there on Facebook land that is worried that we are working our way towards Skynet, it is a really interesting tool and a really powerful tool for combating crime in our community. We are, I can see that the police department is doing everything that they can to Use it in a responsible way and make sure that it benefits the community but does not infringe on our rights. And I just wanted to say that out loud. Thanks, Miles. Thanks, guys.

Is that it?

That's it.

All right. As Tani mentioned, Canyon Hills Health Care Special Service District is going to be signing or approving a contract with an organization called Elevate. Interestingly enough, when they presented to us, they shared a, you know, this is for the MAPS master plan, completion of the MAPS project. And they shared with us one of their projects, which interestingly was out of Buffalo, New York. Beautiful place. Yeah. anyway i'm very they're they're gonna win this contest with all really with all the promotions we're doing i know because all the two people that are watching us tonight but very excited about this contract we'll probably be kicking it off in september october a lot i mean i hope that it's an excitement to the rest of the community too because it's right in the center of our town it's an opportunity to create some good housing and you know, make our center of town even better than it already is. I went to the county commission meeting last Tuesday to see how they voted to actually stare them down to make sure that they voted on the water tank appropriately, which they did. They were very kind and very respectful to the city while we were there. And there's no problem with that. And I did sign that development agreement today. So the water tank is ready to go. And we should be seeing some activity pretty soon, I would imagine, within the year, right? They did extend it, so we've got until 2030 to get it done, but I think we'll probably get it done way before then. And then we're also on that same note, on the 20th, we're going to the state water resource division for funding. And we're feeling pretty positive about that. They were here. Did they do a walkthrough? They did.

They sent down one of their staff to do a walkthrough with staff.

Right.

And then we also have our bond advisor and our bond council joining that meetings because that'll be part of the process. Right.

So as anything, when you get a state grant, there is a process, but we're feeling pretty confident. We've talked to them and feeling pretty good about that. So we should have the funding and get it ready to go. I also, yesterday, I met with a gal named Erin Blackfoot. She's from the Norda Foundation. She contacts me every year because there's a lot of our local nonprofits apply for grants through them. There was a special grant last year. I think, Caitlin, you guys got some of that funding from them. This year they they're trying to extend that to rural communities as grant and I'm not sure what the terms were I think there are a couple years but all the people that applied last year. They were so excited about the progress that they made with their money with their funding which you know when we get donor money it's, it's a really big deal to prove what we did with their money and show the good intentions and how we accomplish things and so she was very thrilled. and excited about the direction that some of these Moab debt profits are going. And this year they funded the Multicultural Center to beef up their food bank because we know the Multicultural Center, their food bank is a little different than the one we see at the church and the one we see over here. They serve a different community and they needed some support and also Rim to Rim got some funding because they are growing grass out at the Mayberry Preserve that they hope will help with erosion along the creeks because they're taking out the Russian olives. You know, the question is, how do you get it in there and get it established before we get a flash flood? But anyway, so that's exciting. Two programs that we both as a city work with directly. So glad to see that them getting some foundation dollars. And then yesterday I met with Melody McCandless, the chair of the commission, to talk about the shuttle. I've talked to you all about this. There'll be a letter going to the county tomorrow. And there will be a ribbon cutting for the Arches shuttle on September 9th from 6 and 8 p.m. Y. We will be here at the city council chambers. So just wanted to put that out there. And that's all I have. Really?

Same day?

September 8th? That's two.

That's two. I know.

Anyway, that's all I have. And we don't have a closed session. So I'm going to ask for a motion to adjourn. Motion by Colin.

Second.

Second by Miles. Thank you, everyone.

Good night.

I did, I sent her. I said, there's not gonna be any city reps there because we have a meeting. I was like, all there.

I just said there won't be any city reps there because we have a city council meeting that takes time.

Yeah.