Historic Preservation Board - Regular Meeting

You know it's supposed to be .

We'll do roll call. Mr. Serrano? Present. Mr. Sada? Present. Ms. Headley? Present. Ms. Correa?

Present.

Chair Bonaduce?

Present. Ladies and gentlemen.

We have quorum.

Great. Well, today is February 19th, and this is the Historic Preservation Board. And we're ready to begin. We'll do the roll call. um,

I THINK IT'S FINE FOR THE BOARD TO DISCUSS IT, HAVE INTERNAL CONVERSATIONS, BUT I HAD ARTICULATED TO MR. BRITNER THAT THAT ITEM IS KIND OF GOVERNED BY THAT SPECIFIC CHARACTERISTIC OF INSTALLATION OF THE MARKER KIND OF FALLS UNDER THE FLORIDA STATUTE FOR THE FLORIDA BUILDING CODE. SO WE NEEDED TO GET AN OPINION BY THE BUILDING OFFICIAL and there obviously wasn't enough time to get it on the agenda because it was brought to our attention this week. But I think it's fine for the board to discuss.

It's okay if we just discuss it briefly maybe at the end so that you guys know what it's about.

Okay. Okay, that sounds good. So we'll add that to action. 6B. 6B. Any other comments? So we go to public comments. So no public comments. So we want to approve the minutes from our last meeting.

I move to approve the minutes.

I second.

All in favor? Aye. Motion passes. all right action items so up um is hp 2501 their certificate of appropriateness from warren bittner at address 2287 northeast 96th street and its replacement of existing tile roof through the residence

Great. So the applicant, Mr. Bittner, is here. He's requesting a certificate of appropriateness from the board for the replacement of the existing tile roof throughout the residence. The property is located at 287 Northeast 96th Street. It was originally built in 1924 and obtained its Miami Shores Village local historical designation in October 1985. In 1988, the property was added to the National Register of Historic Places. The residence is located on approximately 18,474 square foot lot consisting of five bedrooms, three bathrooms comprised of roughly 4,000 square feet in size. The original home was developed by Shoreland Company as the primary residence of its vice president, Ms. Ellen Spears Harris. The original roof is Cuban barrel tile. I believe Mr. Bittner has some samples, and he'll probably go into further detail of what he'd like the board to consider. The applicant is proposing to restore the roof as closely as possible to its pre-1926 hurricane photographs as proposed, and he's offering three different roofing alternatives. As such, staff asked the board to consider his request, and we are recommending approval. Thank you, sir.

Okay. Thank you, Mr. Nunez. And good evening, members of the board. My name is Warren Bittner, 287 Northeast 96th Street here in Miami Shores. And with me this evening is Daniel Arguelles, the president, if I'm not mistaken, of Artesanos Rooftop. Mr. Arguelles will also be serving as the contractor for this project. As Mr. Nunez indicated, I'm seeking alternative proposals. The first is a hybrid roof. The second would be a traditional, just artisanals, cap and pan, and the third would be an integration of historic Cuban tile. Now with all of these three alternatives, as you may have read, we plan on using first copper eave metals, which is very kind of distinctive. The standard underlayments, which we don't need to get into because that's something you never see. We're going to be using an artisanal vented eave closure in place of a weep hole. And Mr. Arguelles, can you show us what that looks like?

Basically, we finish off the ends of the tile with smaller barrel tiles. And we can actually break this off and then foam the narrow side to the wider side. And we can get the look of stacking along the perimeter, which allows for 100% water drainage. It's an aesthetic trade-off. It reduces the amount of work.

Excuse me for one second. Patricio, can you mute, please? There's a lot of noise.

Okay. Thank you. Just to get you know,

Okay. Can you guys check the video or something? She's saying there's a delay. Okay, they're going to check it. If you could mute, that would be great. Unless you need to say something. She's already muted. Sorry about that.

No problem. And what it does is it basically removes the cement and the weep hole that was added later, which is basically something that you can date. And when you're doing historical preservation, you don't want to say, oh, I had to do a Miami-Dade approved thing along the perimeter because those holes don't allow for the water to drain out. And this is a much more appropriate way to do that. It's also easier.

So weep holes are not original to this kind of architecture?

Originally, they used to be stopped up with cement, and they didn't put any weep holes. And then the water was damming up behind it. Right? And because we use back then organic underlayments, they would break down and decompose because basically it's just asphalt saturated, you know, toilet paper. Right. Okay.

Thank you. Okay. So in addition to the e-closure detail with that smaller tile, I had, when I drafted this application, I put in double cap detail along the perimeter. And the reason I did that is I initially saw when I looked at one of the pre-1926 hurricane photos, and the one I'm referring to is this one right here, this pre-1926 hurricane photo. If you look at this closely, You can see that there's double caps along the roof line. But in addition, after I studied it a little closer and in conversation with Mr. Arguelles here, we've determined that there may be double PANS OCCURRING AS WELL. SO DAN CAME UP WITH THE IDEA OF ALTERNATING DOUBLE CAPS, DOUBLE PANS IN A, NOT IN A MILITARY FASHION, BUT IN A HAPHAZARD FACTOR. BECAUSE THIS IS A VERY HAPHAZARD ROOF. CONSISTENTLY INCONSISTENT. EXACTLY. So that is one change or departure from what we're requesting here. Now getting into the roof itself, first the hybrid roof. The hybrid roof is a type of new, tell us about what the hybrid roof is.

A hybrid roof is basically an improvement over a roof system that has taken thousands of years to develop. It's probably the last patent, that last idea. And basically what it does is it creates a more modular system. I heard before you guys say, oh, that tile's very expensive and this and that. Well, it's expensive because it's two times the tile. Well, how do we reduce that? Well, if we come out with some more modern ways that increase the performance, maintain the integrity, Historically speaking, you can use more expensive tile on just half the roof. And the other half, you create a more powerful roof that's going to last you a long time. It's half the weight, and it's going to deliver two times the wind resistance. And that would be the hybrid.

So if I understand it correctly, then the facade or the parts that are visible would be?

Indistinguishable. indistinguishable yes and there's with a barrel tile roof there's a zillion ways how to do the same thing okay you can this is like the only roof that you could really customize and integrate tiles from around the world of different sizes right gotcha the metal pan or the pan the tile that's inverted instead of wasting tile underneath that's basically doing absolutely nothing except weigh it down uh every 18 inches you have a place where water can get up underneath If you were to make built-in channels, kind of like gutters for the water to flow off the roof, that would be desirable because it would minimize your piece count, minimize the workload. Delivery to the roof ends up being half the roof instead of twice the amount, right? And we're talking about maybe 10,000 or 20,000 pounds extra. And that's huge.

Can you show the board what the pan for a hybrid would be like and what the cap would be? Okay.

This is the metal pan. It looks just like what it is. It's just a utility function. But what it allows us to do is we could put cover tiles on each side. We could dress this up. We can make it look like a flat tile profile if you wanted to like a nice smaller shingle but this is actually cut down i took that's right a piece off the end so it's quite lengthy it replaces four tiles right so that replaces what would be the ceramic pan tile on the bottom the inverted tile that has no aesthetic correct is is what we're we're tricking you on okay and the cap how would the cap go on You could change the 100% aesthetic to be like a polished tile, right? Like your old Venezuelan type. Or you can use a handmade tile. And you can do a lot of things with it.

Now, I have to admit that I am not sold on a hybrid roof. It was not my preference to do that. But economics sometimes can be a factor. So at the time that we put the roof on, if Cuban tile is not available, I may consider doing this. But it's not my number one choice. But I do want to get approval for it. Second, if we do a – let's say Cuban tile is not available for us because there's no guarantee that it will be. A traditional artisanal cap and pan would then be used. Now, I noticed an error in my application. For pans, for the traditional and the Cuban tile cap, I put handmade artisano smooth clay barrel tile. That was a mistake. It was machine-made artisano for the pan. Sam, can you show them what that pan looks like? Handmade, yeah.

This pan has a double function. Not only can you use it as a cover on a hybrid, now you can use it as a two-piece mission by itself. You can flip it around and you can use it as a pan. And you have a smooth texture so that you don't have the cruel of mildew and stuff like that. That would turn your roof black. Low absorption, high strength. The best thing to do is to use this. And it's uniform. Now, on the perimeter, what we would do is we would use handmade tile. as a starter, and then we work these here, like that, so that you get the 100% aesthetic along the perimeter. Again, you're using trickery. You're using this in lieu of this. This also is a lot easier to install than taking this and wasting half the tile as a pan tile to the cover would make your roof It would weigh a lot more, right? But then for the person who's installing, they're doing twice the work. It's a lot easier to do this.

And you still get the aesthetics.

Exactly. And the pan tile is buried in the roof anyway. No one sees the pan tile. It's always in the cap tile that you see. And the cap tile, we would be using the handmade version. Now, the Cuban tile is where I want to go. Machine-made Cuban tiles. No, no, no, not machine-made. Handmade. Handmade, the original antique Cuban tile is what we want to go with. Now, it isn't readily available, but it does come up every so often. And salvage? It's salvaged. It has to be salvaged. Got it. And that's the whole, I attach to my application that portion of the Florida building code, which permits the salvage and reuse of that tile. Just because it is, you know, that's the only way we could use this. So my preference, the choice that I'm going to go with, if we can get it, is using the antique Cuban tile as the cap and a less expensive machine-made tile that Artesanos makes for the pan. Now, I'm not going to put the Cuban tile on every roofing surface. Part of it is in the back of the house, hidden from public view, and that part would be just Artesano handmade tile. clay tile with a regular pan. The Cuban tile we're going to reserve for those portions of the residence that you see when you're driving down the street or when you're coming up the avenue. The parts that are, you know, that only I see when I'm looking, you know, in my backyard are going to be, you know, lovely tile but not the antique stuff because it's just too expensive.

I have a question. Yes. When you say that you would use the other one instead of the Cuban version, which one is that one on those there?

Both these tiles are Cuban.

made using the same specifications as the 18th century Spanish style captured in the Florida Building Code. They have different geometrical shapes, they even have different embossments, artisan embossments, Masonic embossments, and all of this is written in the Florida Building Code.

It's very cool.

Now, this is just a very small representation. Actually, the tiles do have finger marks, finger swirls, things like that, transverse marks that you could actually see with the glint of the sun in certain, because it gives you a rendering, just like the perimeter where we're doing stacking tiles, where it captures a shadow, it creates an embodiment of something beautiful along the perimeter where you can appreciate it on the roof. It's something different. So that stands away from putting a metal piece on the edge of the roof, make it more contemporary. This is something that is very deserving and very noble for this project.

So it would have all that variation that you're showing there, not like the other one that you showed at one point where it's very flat?

We can emulate the photograph that Warren has here from the 1920s just with the artisanal tile because it's designed to look like the antique Cuban tile. But if we want the history and the code exists for us to be able to use because they're exempt from the strictures of product control, we are allowed to put antique Cuban tile and integrate it and reuse it because it's the only material in the entire United States that was so widespread and so used it's actually recognized to be a functional building material to be used again on a roof.

So I wanted to make it clear, the machine-made tile that Arnazados makes will only be the pan. It will not be seen. It will be buried in the roof.

Maybe from my perspective, we haven't seen anybody come in and propose We've even approved s tiles for historic houses when we've had to because the cost was significant and But if that's I think it's exciting.

Oh, I'm very Yeah, I have wanted to reroute this house since yeah knowing knowing that it was originally Cuban tile, but I couldn't justify it until this point because it's now starting to leak. It's 32 years old, and the valleys have failed.

Well, your house is so prominent in the village, being right on Shoreland Boulevard, that I think it could be...

And that tile is the one that you're showing. It's really nice. It looks handmade, which I think it's a very important feature, and that's very nice to be able. That's why I was asking, because there was another one that didn't have all that variation that you're showing in this one.

The machine that is the machine made one and we're only using that as the pen. So to the extent that I erroneously said handmade for the pan not I meant to say machine. And all the new tiles of course are have Dade County product approval, I believe I sent that to Mister Nunez already.

I think it's this way.

Yeah, this way, yeah. Yeah, no, it's going to be great. And it's, I mean, very exciting that it's actually going to be, yeah. It's going to look like the original roof.

Yeah, that's super exciting.

Great. Any other questions? You want to go?

Yeah, I make a motion to approve the certificate of appropriateness for 287 Northeast 96th Street.

Yeah, I second that. I second. All right, all in favor?

Aye. Aye. Okay.

Pass.

So does that mean that all of the options are available to the applicant? That's why I wanted to be sure.

Hold on one second, Patricia. I'm sorry, I didn't hear.

Everything.

I just wanted to be sure because there were three options yeah that he was talking about supply and demand with with some of the variations so I wanted to be sure that the board was okay with any one of these three options and hopefully the stars align and the original

is available, but it is challenging for that to happen. So I think it's for all three of these.

That's right.

Correct, because they all seem to be very consistent with the finish. And I know that for the underside where you don't see it, but the rest of it will be, will maintain that character. even if you cannot get the Cuban tile at the time. But whatever, the three options you're offering here, all of them have that character and will maintain the consistency with the historical.

Yeah, and I should add that even if Cuban tile does become available, it won't, the caps won't be 100% Cuban tile. They'll have to be mixed with some of this handmade tile that Dan was just showing us because it's just, it's too rare, it's too difficult to get.

Correct.

Right. Patricia, you wanted to say something? I'm sorry.

Yes, Madam Vice Mayor, if I may, I just wanted to end up saying that if there is someone in the village who will really make some period-appropriate renovation, it's Mr. Bittner.

Agreed.

Thank you.

Agreed. All right, it's approved. Yes.

Okay. Can I provide the board with a little antidote here? Sure. If today were just after Hurricane Andrew, we would not have been able to come to you and request to put Cuban salvage Cuban tile back onto the roof and that is because the back then it was the South Florida building code that applied didn't provide for the salvage and reuse of that tile And indeed, the provisions that you now see in the Florida Building Code were lifted from the South Florida Building Code and incorporated into the Florida Building Code. And those provisions were the brainchild of of this man, Dan Arguelles. He was the one that recognized the need to salvage this tile and to be able to reuse it. And it was up to that point, after Hurricane Andrew especially, it was being just removed from the roof, put in a dumpster, and taken to the landfill, which was a crime. Well, Dan and I met right here in this room on another job that he was doing. I sat on the board at that point. And Dan convinced me to team up with him to be the attorney to put his concept on to paper and then he and I went to a preservation Commission after preservation Commission throughout this county to every major municipality went then to their city council or town council or whatever got endorsements to do this, and ultimately ended up before the board of rules and appeals to the county, and then finally the county commission who passed it. So, and you were the first board that we made our presentation to, and you were the first ones to endorse the provisions of the historic Cuban tile ordinance. And today it is, yeah, it is so cool. It happened right here. And so I thought you would appreciate that story.

That's very impressive. Very impressive.

And you did the roof at the Little Flower Church?

I didn't do the roof. We sold the material to that church. Oh, okay. But I did the City Hall of Corps. The City Hall one, yeah. Two times.

Wow. And this solar tile integration?

Yes, we have. Wow. With a hybrid system, which was actually adopted to your, by this board for, I think it was, in front of your commission, right? They actually put language for the use of hybrids in Miami Shores, because at that time they didn't allow metal roofs. I'm not sure if they do, but since it has a metal component. They are allowed now. They do now, but they didn't like... We had to actually put language in there just in case. So part of that was we have a solar thermal tubing that's like an entrance level solar water heating that's actually hiding underneath the tile where we're capturing the heat from your roof And what the trick here is, is it gives you 30% federal tax credit on your entire new roof, right? With no cost cap limitation until, now it's until 2032. And then we also have photovoltaics, right? Which we have a thin film. We have the only Miami-Dade County NOA approval for any solar panel, period. We have the most cutting edge technology. We combine the house to reduce the amount of tile by making it modular, right? The footprint of the solar panels actually remove tile so that you don't have to do the same thing twice. And then we have solar thermal, so you have dual generation. You have, you could use it for pool heating, but you get the tax credit for domestic hot water under qualified solar water heating property under IRS 456-95. Cool. Wow.

That's great. Thank you both for your commitment to historic, authenticity and also to innovating in a modern way as well thank you so much thank you thank you thank you all right all right so 6b we want to talk about the marker okay now to assist me folks

On this I prepared a little notebook. Oh my god What else is new Okay now first of all the cover This is the style of marker that you approved last February. This particular one is placed in front of a house in St. Johns County. I believe it's in St. Augustine, but it's in front of a house. Now, so first thing, tab number one. This is the building permit application that I submitted for the historic marker that you folks approved. And behind it, I attached the application for certificate of appropriateness that you approved last February. You approved the plate color, the letter color, the emblem, the marker style, the size, et cetera. Even the text. We approved the text. And the text as well. Now, the last sheet on page one is what you see on your computer screen when you apply for a building permit. And I've highlighted that my application was assigned SGN 0125-114. So this just tells you that that's my permit number, okay? So tab number two. First thing that I did was submit this application. And then the various disciplines started reviewing it. First was Mr. Nunez, who, thank you, Mr. Nunez, he signed off on this, and it says approved by Eddie Nunez. And then William Diaz was the building plans examiner. And if you turn the page, You'll see his comments. Well, I didn't do anything right, apparently, in this application.

Because I had never submitted one before.

But he rejected it for various reasons. And at that point, I decided, well, I need, because I'm not the first one, I need to see what the village submitted. Because there's one sitting out here in front of Village Hall. And I need to see the one that was placed, the application that was done by the church because theirs was put up before mine too. So I come to the front desk here.

We still have the one for the library pending.

And the library has not applied for a permit yet. However, their marker arrived from the foundry a week or two ago. So they're going to be coming in for a permit very, very soon. and they're going to encounter the same problem that I am now in now when I when I asked for the file concerning and this is a tab 3 this is the permit that was granted to the village and it was to install sign and it was all approved And I asked to see the file. It was not to be found. It just wasn't there. So no problem. I then asked to see the file for the church. And that's tab number four, because they also have an approved application. And their file was there. And the very first thing in that file was tab 5 which was a Engineers foundation signed foundation calculation for wind and he determined that if and if you turn to page two of his report and He determined that if you include a 6 foot by 6 foot by 5 inch concrete slab all the way around the marker, then it would meet the requirements of the South Florida, excuse me, of the Florida building code. Okay, that's what he decided. Then we turned to tab 6. Now on tab six, there's a little bit of a difference between, this is the, tab six is the building plan that the community church presented to get their permit approved. And you see right here on the top, they're saying see wind load calculations and they provide a diagram. They didn't, put in the requirements that the engineer did they only use the requirements or the recommendations of the foundry and that is digging a three-foot hole in the ground putting the sign in back filling it with concrete and you're done there was no six foot by six foot by three inch slab called for in this building plan nevertheless it was this building permit was approved and both at Village Hall and the church those signs were erected.

Okay. What year was this?

This was in 2023. Last year or the year before?

It was very recent. Not long ago. We started the initiative of the markers about three years ago with John McKay. No but this permit is being specific.

This one of the church? 2023. January 2023.

So what happens next? I took those two documents.

So just to summarize, they installed it, but not according to what the engineer required.

And I didn't know that until I spoke to the engineer. The first thing I did is I took those documents, had the front desk copy them. And because the church had used the village's engineering study and the village's site building plan, I thought, well, why? I should be able to do the same thing. So I had them copied and scanned into my permit application. And I got a response from William Diaz, and that's tab number seven. Here's his email to me. He's saying, good morning, Mr. Bittner. I don't have any problem using the same document approved previously. If planning and zoning and structural reviewer agree and approve your submittal, I will approve it. Okay, I'm cool with that. But I didn't know that there was a problem with the engineering study at that point. Okay, then we turn to page eight. A few hours later. William Diaz writes comments in my permit file and rejects those documents with the following notes. He says, building review has been rejected due to the following. The submitted documents were approved under Florida Building Code 2020. The documents and calculation shall be updated to Florida Building Code 2023. Okay, well, you know, a little technicality, but I understand that. I understand it. If the code changes between then and now, you need to update the calculations. So what was my next step? I got to contact the engineer. So that's what I did. Tab 9. I started communications with the engineer to, A, find out how much is this going to cost me to update this to the current code, and, you know, when can you start work for me? The first thing that the engineer wanted to know, he wanted to see my building plan. And he said, are you putting in a six-foot by six-foot by three-inch slab around this sign? I said, no, of course not. Well, that's what's being required here. And he also, by the way, told me it's going to cost you $750 for me to say that. So, next we turn the tab, and I said, you know, Mr. Engineer, I don't think that the village and the community church have a six foot by six foot by three inch slab around their signs. And I went out and took photos, and tab number 10 is the sign in front of Village Hall. There's no six foot by six foot by 10, it's just not there. And number 11? Unless it's cannily hidden under all that grass. Well, it has to be at the surface. Okay. And then here on the community church, you can still see the cardboard form that they used. When they dug the three-foot hole, you stick in a cardboard form, put the sign in, back for it with concrete. You can see it there in this picture. So neither of those two signs... complied with their own engineering study okay fine so time for me to do a little legal research. First thing I did was to find out how the Florida building code is adopted here in the village and take a look at tab 12 this is Florida statute 553.73 on the second page you see subsection 6 This is where it reads, the initial adoption of and any subsequent update or amendment to the Florida Building Code by the Commission is deemed adopted for use statewide without adoptions by local government. So this applies, the Florida Building Code applies to Miami Shores Village whether they like it or not. And that includes all subsequent amendments. Okay, so that's a starter. Then tap 13. And I have included for you, for your review, the entirety of an appendix to the building volume of the Florida Building Code. It's Appendix H entitled Signs. And in it, if you just turn the page to page 2... There is a section called H101.2, Signs Exempt from Permits, and it reads as follows, in pertinent part, the following signs are exempt from the requirements to obtain a permit before erection. Number one, painted, non-illuminated signs. Okay, well, I don't want to stop my legal research there. I want to find out how the Florida Building Code defines a sign. So the definitions follow thereafter. If you just turn the page, you see the definition of a sign. And I'm just going to read this to you because this makes everything crystal clear. Sign. Any letter, figure, character, mark, plane, point, marquee, sign, design, poster, pictorial, picture, stroke, stripe, line, trademark. And this is what is important here. Reading matter. or illuminated service, which shall be constructed, placed, attached, painted, erected, fastened, or manufactured in any manner whatsoever so that the same shall be used for the attraction of the public to any place, subject, person, firm, corporation, et cetera, et cetera, whatsoever which is displayed in any manner outdoors. So it is crystal clear that an historic marker is a sign under the provisions of this appendix to the code. Now, our next question is, well, does it fit under that exemption? The exemption is for painted, non-illuminated signs. This sign is painted, and it also will be non-illuminated. And it's a sign. Therefore, I conclude, as a reasonable person, that an historic marker could fall under this exemption if it is adopted by the village. And the appendices to the building codes are optional material for municipalities to adopt if they want to. They don't have to. Now, in the next tab, I give you that section where it talks about that. under Section A101.2.1, Appendices, provisions in the appendices shall not apply unless specifically adopted. So that means if this exemption were to be applicable here in the Village, the Village would have to actually specifically adopted. Okay, now has any other city or local government in this state adopted these appendices? Well, I did a little research on that. There are a lot of them, and I included three samples for you because it shows how they did it. The first is Jacksonville, and that is tab 15. under Section 321.101, adoption of appendices, they called it. The following appendices are hereby adopted as part of this building code. And they adopted a whole bunch of stuff. They didn't adopt Appendice H of the building volume, but a bunch of other things they did. And this is how they did it. Tab 16 is from Palm Beach County. And they adopted, on the second page of 16, This is how they did it. Under Section 1, and I highlighted it for you, under Section 101.2.1, appendices, provisions in the appendices shall not apply unless specifically adopted. Palm Beach County has adopted this appendix and this appendix and this appendix and this appendix. Turning to 17, the town of Highland Beach, they did adopt appendix H. And how did they do it? If you turn to the second page, You see section 101.2.1, appendices. Provisions in the appendices shall not apply unless specifically adopted. The town of Highland Beach adopts appendices H and K, and they put it except K111.4 because they apparently didn't like that one. of the Florida building code and that's how they did it so copying that I went to our code to see where does our village discuss the building code well that on tab 18 is section 6 dash one But if you read this, this was enacted in 1971, back when the South Florida building code was in effect. And this reads, the document marked, designated, and known as the South Florida building code which is made a part hereof by references hereby adopted as the minimum standard for purposes expressed herein. Well, this is totally out of date. It's 20 years out of date. It should have been updated a long, long time ago. It shouldn't have been me bringing it to the villagers' attention. It should have been done. But now is the great opportunity to make it so all you got to do is strike the word south and you've got a perfectly usable code now in addition we can add a little language and I provided you with a with a sample of what I'm going what I'm encouraging the well I'm hoping that you will recommend to the village council and on page two of it You'll see I am proposing a new section after 6-1 called 6-1.1 appendices and I'm proposing copied these other Local governments provisions in the appendices shall not apply unless specifically adopted because that's what everyone said the following appendices of the Florida building code are hereby adopted as part of the building code of Miami Shores Village and building Florida building code building volume appendix H signs but only section H 101.2 subsection 1 that's the one that talks about painted non illuminated signs and only as it would apply to historic markers now when this goes before the planning and zoning board which I hope it will They're free to look at the entirety of Appendix H and say, you know, we should adopt the whole thing. And that would be great, too. But for purposes of us discussing this, we're only interested in historic markers and how historic markers are impacted by this. So this is the language that I'm proposing that the village pass. Now, finally, tab 20. I'm encouraging you all today to pass a motion that reads as follows, tab 20. The Miami Shores, and I drafted a proposed motion for you. The Miami Shores Village Historic Preservation Board recommends that the village council adopt an ordinance in substantially the form attached, and I've already given you that form, amending section 6.1 of the village code to change references to the superseded South Florida building code to the Florida building code and to add a new section 1-1.1 adopting in part appendix H of the Florida building code building volume 8th edition 2023 to exempt historical markers from the requirement to obtain a permit before erection Now, not only will doing this help me, but it will help the library who is just about to come in and apply for a permit and doesn't realize yet that they're going to have to put a six foot by six foot by three inch slab all the way around this marker. It will also help any future folks who want to do a marker, and I'm hoping that the marker that is placed in front of my house that everyone is going to see is going to say, oh my God, I want one too, in front of all the historic houses. And finally, it will cure whatever happened with the city, excuse me, the village and the church, because Their signs are not in compliance with the Florida Building Code. They're just not. And that needs to be corrected somehow. And this would cure all of it.

Well, I think I understand it. I just have one question. Sure. So you're not only proposing the adoption of Appendix H, but you're also proposing the removal of the word south from the ordinance.

Yes, because you see it there and you say, why is that there?

That was superseded 20 years ago. That impacts other things, too, right?

Well, there's probably other things in the code that could be changed, too, but it's Far be it from me to suggest other things from that. And I picked that location in the code because that's the logical point in the code to, you know, the Florida building code is our code. And then right underneath it, we're adopting these appendices. That's a logical place to put it. I got it.

Mr. Bittner, I have a question. When you talk about this massive concrete slab, I am a little bit confused. Did you find in the Florida building code structure section that a marker or a sign requires that size of structure or you're saying that when you went to the engineer, the engineer that you looked after once you found some information, that engineer was the one who told you that it had to be that size?

the engineer i learned about this from the engineer and he pointed to page two of his analysis that required the structure to i guess in his opinion withstand the wind loads of uh uh and that is how he required the sign to be constructed but he didn't base it uh he didn't show you that the florida building code

SECTION STRUCTURE WAS REQUIRING THAT SPECIFIC SECTION. IT WAS THE ENGINEER. THE CALCULATION CAME UP TO THAT.

THE CALCULATION REQUIRED THAT AND THAT WAS IT.

THAT WAS FOR ORIGINALLY FOR THE PERMIT ON 2323.

The village The villages he prepared he didn't know that his study was used by the church, too But they didn't do it They still got approved exactly so it was like a miss no, you know probably what happened and that may be the part of the history that were missing is that from what you're telling me, and I'm not an expert in structures, but from the little bit of experience that I have, it seems that this is oversized. What you were told is oversized for the use of what was intended, in other words, for the marker. Probably what happened with the church is that after They submitted everything during the shop drawing review because there is always like a shop drawing.

It got reduced and probably it got approved. My understanding is that these markers are standardized.

Yes, the markers don't change.

They're all standardized marker sizes. There's one company that does that.

So probably when the shop drawing came, they showed a much smaller structure that is already approved and tested and that's why they didn't make them comply with that huge

But this is the same size marker.

Yeah, it's the same marker.

I'm talking about the structure. So when you do, when you submit a permit for something that has to do with structure, there's a calculation from the engineer. And then you have to do shop drawings usually for certain things. So the shop drawing actually goes and further define you know, whatever it is that you're going to build. Probably in that shop is when it got revised or something, and it got approved because probably what you were told is a little bit of an oversized calculation. Again, I am not a structural engineer. I don't, I cannot attest to that, but it sounds to me that maybe it was oversized, and that's creating, you know, of course on your end, like why, you know, why is it that we have to go through all this? But on that same thought, Anything that is freestanding requires a structure by the Florida building code. And under the sign, under your highlighted sign, there's something below that says sign structure. And it says any structure that supports or is capable of supporting a sign as defined as this code, a sign structure is permitted to be in a single code and is not required to be an integral part of the building. So you have the sign, but then you have the poll that supports the sign. And I believe that when you do that, you're required to have a structure for it. And that will tie you into requesting a permit, I think.

That's the only thing that I'm you know, just by yeah, I think it's correct But what I understood was that it was the change from the Florida building code 2020 To the new one 2023 which required the six-foot. No, no, no The village and the church yeah

was under the old code, and that required a six-foot slab. Yes.

So it's not just the engineer's drawing, it's actually in the code. It's a requirement in the code. No, no, no, no.

Well, I don't know. I'm saying that the engineer who did the calculations did them under the 2020 code. I see. William Diaz, the building plans examiner, wants me to, naturally, because we have a new updated code, to submit an engineering study analyzing the provisions of the 2023 code. And that's fine. But the thing is, no matter what coat it is, I'm going to need this, in the engineer's view, a six foot by six foot by three inch slab.

Maybe if you consult with a different engineer, you will get a different answer. I think so, because it sounds way...

I went to the same engineer that prepared that.

That's not what they ended up doing. Exactly. It sounds way over-engineered. They do like to over-engineer things.

Their shop drawing references the wind, the engineer's report, but draws a different... This one. Yeah, it's five.

And this is... Yeah, this is what...

They reference the... Yeah, tab number six. It references sea wind load calculations. Exactly, that's why. They're referring to the engineering study. But the engineering study diagram doesn't look like this. There's a six foot by six foot slope.

Right.

Okay, so the whole point is I see an easy way out of this, and that is by the village adopting that portion of Appendix H, and that's what I am recommending to you.

Will that mean that future markers won't require engineering studies?

If the village approves this, not only the library, but...

If this would mean that future markers don't require an engineering study if they follow... If they do exactly what the I don't think that's possible though.

No I think that one thing that needs to be considered is that the village has a Designated person whose job is to interpret the Florida building code and that would be our building official, right? I would suggest that prior to making such a strong, impactful decision, maybe having, let's get his opinion. I did forward the information that Mr. Bittner forwarded to me earlier this week. Ismael Naranjo. And he's assured me that he's looking into it and that once he obviously came to a determination that he would give us his opinion. But I think that's probably the first place to go because that is the person who is the designated appointee of the village that makes that interpretation. Does he agree with this interpretation? Does he have a different interpretation? Those are the things we don't know. Just my...

I mean, you said at the beginning that we wouldn't be able to make a decision today anyway, right? We have to wait for that review.

I think it would be wise to wait. Yeah.

I understand the frustration. Now. A thousand percent. Like this is very frustrating when we just, you know, literally a year ago had to and the library is also going to be going through this, you know, very soon. So hopefully we can, you know, get an answer, you know, from Mr. because it doesn't seem to make any sense.

So we've got to wait. But thank you for laying this out. MR. Oh, sure. MR. Clearly. MS. I thought you needed to be very, very thorough. MR. Very, very clear and really thorough. MS.

Very thorough, like very easy to understand the whole process. The building official. The building official should be reading this.

And the fact that you've laid out and proposed words for the ordinance in case we have to do it.

We can also write him and encourage him to hopefully resolve this quickly.

Now just a question of Mr. Nunez. Depending on what the building official says, let's say he comes back with a favorable opinion. Would you recommend this come back? Could you make a motion subject to the opinion of the building official? That's why the rush to get this done. Can we make a motion subject to the building official's opinion?

Well, I think we have a difference in understanding, too, between us, right? Like, I would say, yeah, we could do that subject to his review, but it sounds like there may be other issues. I don't know.

I just don't know if that's our jurisdiction though. Yeah, that's the only thing I don't know if we are because it has to do with a technicality about wind and Structure so I don't know if we are actually the ones that can I mean I wouldn't I wouldn't know I mean I

no i i i tend to agree also because i'm pretty sure that that language that's being referenced in the packet is not found within chapter 11 which essentially chapter 11 historic preservation is what governs uh the abilities of the board um

One, I think you're going to have to trust us. You're going to have to trust us to shepherd this issue, but I don't think we're going to be able to.

Okay, no problem.

Yeah, I think we can, you know, email.

And you can participate via phone. And I probably can give Ismael a call and find out a little bit more and, you know, give you some. Oh, that would be very helpful.

Yeah. Maybe it's just another engineer.

Yeah, it is a little crazy, that huge slap.

I mean, I don't know why. It would be helpful to understand, though, why obviously that was not necessary in the other permits, right? They ended up doing the three.

And I will say, in my experience, I'm sure Ms. Cojrea also, in the development world, different engineers tend to come up with different takes. It's all mathematics, whatever the math can result in. I don't know if that would be the same in this case, but I have seen it many, many other times.

But that's not where the issue is, right? The issue is they all use the same engineer. and they had a different output. So how did they get the different output?

What I heard was one used an engineer and then the same exact drawings were repurposed. So it's not that the same engineer did the work again. No. It was only done once.

One engineer's report was used twice. And I was trying to use the same report. But what the issue was that the village did not follow its own engineer's report. report. It just did something else.

It did something else, right.

I don't know if that's a good thing to do, to use another engineer's report.

Okay, well, the Miami Shores Community Church built something that the engineer said to do something else.

Especially something that can go flying in a hurricane or like, I don't know.

I mean, there's markers all over the city and the state, so I've I think they're obviously safe without the necessary six feet. But hopefully the building will be able to confirm that because there are quite a few markers around. prior to, you know, one right by the water.

Yeah, we'll make sure and shepherd it through. I promise.

Now, can I ask you all a favor? It was a little expensive. Yes. Thank you so much. Yeah, you can reuse them. Yeah.

Thank you, Warren.

Appreciate it. I would like to talk a little bit about a subject that we had discussed in the last meeting regarding setting up some parameters when we have applicants coming. I had a little bit of discussion with Eddie via email. For example, today's presentation was excellent. They brought all the samples and everything, and it seems that, based on the conversation we're having, we don't have that standard. It's not written anywhere. To bring samples, because the last time they didn't bring samples. Yeah, and not only that, but from what I was reading on the application also, like he brought pictures, he brought the history. He's very thorough. Yeah, and I can tell, he used to be part of that. Always, yeah. He's a lawyer. He has already an interest in it, but through this, most of the people don't or they don't know because that's not what they do or that's their interest. So I think it will be good for us, and I don't know if this is something we can set up motion or I don't know exactly how we do this, but to get this ball rolling with... adding to the process a set of standards that maybe we can discuss in the next meeting and vote on it. Is that how this works? Are you making recommendations?

Are you asking staff to do, staff to enroll?

I can help in the process, and I can, you know, I can do a list, and we can, I mean, I know we cannot discuss it.

Eddie can send them to us. Exactly. I can send it to Eddie. And then we can provide input and then discuss it at the next meeting.

Exactly. So, you know, so that we, these months that we have, we can, like, you know, go back and forth through Eddie. I can start a set of, like, those requirements, discuss them with Eddie, make sure that I'm not, you know, asking for something that is not correct and then he can send it to you guys and you can add to it so that in the next meeting at least we have something to work from. I think that's fine.

My only concern would be making it too onerous for people if they don't have Um, a lot of experience around, so I think we have to be a little careful. I think, I think we can set a minimum of requirements, but let's not make it too difficult for, you know, the average historic homeowner to come in with something they want to do. I think that if they're going to do roofs, you know, bringing a sample of roof. Yes. That would be great to understand.

Yeah, in the past they have, but the last applicant didn't. So it's not really written, so that could be written.

I think that's the only caution I would make is that we need to make sure that it's not a real onerous effort for residents that want to bring in the certificate of appropriateness.

And what else is included in that certificate of abroad? Like what other items? Because all I have heard is the room. Windows. Windows.

Any change they want to make to the facade?

Any change. So planning and zoning?

I mean, other than landscaping or something.

My experience has been that, you know, I have seen them go into planning and zoning, but they have to come first to us. If the house is designated.

Not all items. Not all items have to go to P&Z.

Right. It depends on the scope. Exactly.

Like something like this would only come before this board.

Yes. Because it's a roof, right, and so that gets approved.

That doesn't need to be approved by the board.

We issue a certificate of appropriateness, which the chair would sign. I would send him a copy, and when he goes to submit for his permit, he provides a copy.

But for the building permit, he has to submit a lot more detail than we saw today. He's going to have to provide wind specs and all this other kind of stuff, right? Of course, of course. But this wouldn't go to the Planning and Zoning Board.

No. This particular one. Although it's a change to the facade.

Yes.

It doesn't need to go to planning and zoning. Because the scope is too small, even if it's a change of the facade.

No, no, no, it depends. Like if they're adding.

Oh, no, no, yes. Yeah, if they're adding. That would have to go to planning and zoning. But if you change the roof completely, it's a dramatic change to the facade. But it still doesn't make it to planning and zoning.

Correct.

It goes to the building department.

I think last month we made a minor exception because we were trying to be

flexible with they had been waiting in the system we couldn't meet at the end of last year and I got creative but that is not the norm yeah yeah so I mean I'm fine with coming up with a minimum set of like requirements for them to come in but I would say let's not let's just not make it two owners yeah too much of a burden I mean I think

I think it's typically changing the roof, so examples of the roof, and they typically have always brought them.

Changing windows, they will bring samples.

They don't bring samples. No, I'm sorry, but they'll bring drawings. They bring the brochure. They should bring the drawing and the color. They bring the brochure. I think that's important. Like this. They bring the brochure of the windows.

If it's a more extensive change, it has to go through the Planning and Zoning Board. They usually come to us with the full set of already prepared specs anyway. But they're going to submit to the Planning and Zoning Board, yeah. Come first here. That's the requirement.

They have to come first here.

If it's designated.

Yeah, if it's designated. If it's not, even if it's a significant home.

It only goes to Planning and Zoning.

Okay, and then if, but if they're changing like sconces, things like that, it has not... Changing what? Like sconces, like even if they're historical significant or things like that, that doesn't... I don't think so. No. No, nothing like that. So it's really roof and windows, basically.

We don't have any say on color anymore.

Correct.

We can't approve that or deny it. Yeah. It's basically roofs and windows most of the time. Unless it's a major area. Right. Unless it's an addition. Then they bring all the material.

Which at that point they should bring renderings and everything.

Yeah, they bring everything.

But what we don't have really established is let's say what happened in the last meeting where they decided to change, in my opinion, the home is going to change completely. It's not going to be really The history of it by changing the roof to a metal roof basically worked. It's not there anymore. But there's no like a procedure. There's no like, in other words, any person can come and change completely the roof. It's okay. The materiality of it.

If it's designated, we still have to approve it. Right.

The reality of that is that it was a wooden roof and that's not. Very difficult. That's not.

to reinstall and fix.

Right, that's not a roof that's really a sustainable...

In California, they're outlawed now because of a fire hazard, but I mean, that's a different thing here. Yeah, it's a different... And there are homes that are not necessarily designated, but they are historic in the 1920s that have metal roofs on them.

Correct. And she brought a lot of examples of that.

There's a beautiful Keeneland Elliott house, actually, in the village that is a 1920s Mediterranean with a metal roof. And it actually looks really good because they kept the color appropriate.

Right. And that was the thing because the roof is gray now.

So why don't you do this, Paula? Why don't you like... submit a minimum set of things you want us to consider through EDI, and we'll look at it. And then we can talk about it at the next meeting. Just keep it, you know, a minimum, I think.

Some items are even mentioned here in the appropriate drawings and, yeah.

Yeah, it's just a little bit too, it's too generic, I would say. Okay. And, hi, perfect. That was it. Okay.

Okay, great. I think we had board member comments. I know that Patricia had submitted what we discussed last time for the houses of the month.

and we didn't do our homework I didn't know I had an action item actually six from the 30s and 40s and on my page if you have them 80 print them

He did, we have him.

We're looking at them.

Wonderful, wonderful. Thank you, Eddie. Of course. Okay, so as you see, just like a scrambled numbers, it doesn't have to be in this particular order, but I found two English cottage houses from the 30s that are designated, one Art Deco, and three Southern Colonials. Those six... Are historic designated? I don't know if you want to go that route. I think it's important to respect the houses from the 30s and 40s that have been designated to motivate people to keep doing it. And the rest, I just fill them up with houses that has caught my attention in the village. there's one the number uh seven is beautiful and i focus as you uh notice and you check those houses that i focus on east of us one because we've been doing so much on the west of this one that i don't want them to feel neglected because they're beautiful spectacular houses so i just went

They're not often neglected over there. Yeah. But there are more on the side. That's a rarity. There are more on the side. But anyway, go ahead.

So that's why I selected from east of US 1. For example, number 7, I found there is a Robert Loewy streamlined modern house spectacular on 96th Avenue.

That's a cool one. I love that one.

Yeah, very nice.

Yeah

could be a way to educate the community about that style prairie style from france and frank lloyd wright also 96 and i found out that the architect is george reid that is an amazing architect too so it's just houses that i throw you know like from what we have used already that are mid-century modern and Mediterranean. Just to like start to illustrate people that we have a richness in architectural styles. And finally, I think there's some example of Arteco architecture. Barely in the 1930, because some places says 1921, These are fantastic elementary schools. I'm just proposing to have it designated. I already made some calls at the Miami-Dade County, but that's from another day discussion. So that could be also something with so many people that goes there every day, seeing a sign and start making conversation could be a momentum that could, you know, make us designate the school, too. So those were my 10 options that I just put on the table for discussion. I know that not everyone has the time to do it. Maybe we can just choose maybe the designated one. There are six. And at the next meeting, we choose

Yeah, well, great recommendations. Thank you for fixing it.

Yeah, they're good recommendations. I have a couple of problems. Like the 1967 house, I just can't see. I mean, we're doing 30s and 40s, so I can't see including that one, really.

The prairie one? Okay. Yeah. But why?

Because it's 1967, and we said we'd focus on 1930s and 40s.

So that's what we agreed? Only on that? We had, yeah.

We had talked about it. Specifically because we were going to look at the three dominant styles in those periods, which is Art Deco, Streamline Modern, and Southern Colonial.

Okay.

So this is very different from any of that.

Yeah, of course. So basically... It's a great house. We can leave it for next year. Next year.

Yeah. So like the houses or the elementary school, technically 1929, it is Art Deco, and it's close enough to the 30s that I would say that's great.

Yes.

I have some issues with some of the designated houses, but they're pretty good.

But let's go one by one. I mean, I love number one. Yeah.

Yeah, number one is great. Is everyone in agreement with one? No, number one is great.

Daniel?

Yeah, wasn't John also going to look to designate his house? John Boucher, Mr. Boucher. Yes. He was going to look to designate this year. Yes.

Yes. He submitted it.

John Boucher's house is number six. He submitted it, right?

He's in here. Yeah, he submitted it. I was going to just ask if he was in here. Yeah.

yeah that's number six right here oh he's number six yeah six yeah yeah i would definitely include that one yeah he's already submitted his paper at the end of the six just to give time six months to like have it designated officially right yeah that's great what about number two but number two yes number two is the simpler one but i read the designation The problem I have with it is if you drive by it now the landscaping is really

Well, not only that, but it looks like the features are completely gone. Yes, it was modified, yeah. And that's why just, you know.

How did that happen? How did it get modified?

Exactly, just going back to what we were just mentioning. We need to, I mean, if we're not strict enough, we're going to have this type of situation all over. Exactly. But, you know, I mean, it's like weird.

So I think we'd have to find out if that was really modified.

I would really like to see the original. Yeah, the original plan. The original submission. There's no floor plan.

That house is weird. It looks like they put an 80s window on a.

It's fantastic, though. The architect is fantastic. And by the way, it's the same architect from house number one.

Oh, wow. They're so different.

Very different. That's interesting, yeah. Yeah, interesting point, Patricia.

House number one is like a mixture of like Tudor and Mediterranean revival. Yes.

That's fantastic. That's a beautiful house.

And that house has a metal roof, it looks like.

I think it's a wood. It was originally wood.

But at least if... See, it integrates well, though, so it looks good, I think.

I think we all say no to two. For now, let's say no to two. We're not feeling two.

We'll say yes for one for now?

Yes. No, one is beautiful.

Okay, three...

And next door, there are two houses almost next door that both of them are designated and have fantastic architects, number three and number four. Number three and four. EP3s. And with the reader, imagine the same.

I love Crystal's house. Yeah, beautiful. Both of them are gorgeous. They're both beautiful houses.

I would say yes. Very, very large, very regal, very, yeah. Number five.

Number five is Mr. Finkelstein's house.

Yeah. My only problem with that one, Patrice, is if you've driven by it lately or walked by it, it's really looking dilapidated on the outside. I know he's sick, so I hate to say anything, but the house is not looking good. There is something on Grand Concourse, and it's for sale right now.

No, no, I'm talking about designation, Jeffrey. Oh, right. So that's a great thing to put on the table. Maybe the same month that we make the party, because we haven't done yet that, the official designation, maybe that month. We can put it at the end. We can put it number five or number six. I don't know. I just give them time.

I mean, how do you guys feel about that? Because the house is not looking great.

This house is going to be designated.

Yeah, I know. I know. Okay, whatever.

What we can do is just listen. I propose just to choose number 134 for now. And next month in March, we decide the rest.

Well, I'm okay with putting six in, which is John Baquet's house.

The ones we like are one.

Since it's going to be designated.

Yeah, one, three, four, six.

Seven, because it's very streamlined, modern. I think that would be great to have.

And the elementary school. Granted, the number seven is a beautiful house, but is it looking exactly like this?

yeah it's looking pretty much like that yeah it looks like that yeah it's a very cool house and i'd like to suggest another so wait let's decide which one is on here now so what did we say we want i i suggest to choose three or four for now there is this home there is this home that i saw and it's also on on the east side it's 1291. i don't know i i don't know the history of it but it's a And it's going to... That's 1920s, I think. I think it's a 20s house.

I thought it was Mediterranean.

I think, yeah.

And it looks like they're going to sell it.

That is 104. That's a centennial house.

That's what it looks like. They had it for sale.

They're going to sell it.

And they couldn't sell it. They're going to sell it. And so they're going to list it again. Oh, well, Paula, that house is national designated. Oh, yeah? But it's the 1920s, yeah.

Oh, wait. Because I saw they were going to sell it and it's in a very big lot. I was like, they're going to rip it out. It's a huge lot. That's what I thought. It's going to be ripped out.

It can still be ripped out because it's only national designated and not local. So national designation can get destroyed. Really? Yes. Only local designation are protected. How can we work towards that?

I don't know if it's not locally designated.

That's what Patricia just said. Oh, okay.

1291, Patricia.

It's only nationally. No, no, uh-uh, only national. Yeah, national is not protected. Is there a way we can...

We can encourage them. I owe you the list. So I'm going to email you the full updated national and locally designated houses list.

I saw this one, but I don't remember the address now.

Oh, you do have it. Isn't it pretty?

Doesn't it look like a 1930 or 40? Or is it 1920?

Yeah, it does.

You know, there's a house on Grand Concourse, but you'd say that's for sale for $5 million.

I know, I know. It's...

Yes, and it's in 1947, and it is amazing. I would love to have that house. It's 441 Grand Concourse.

Okay, I'll find out the architect if he's on record.

Okay, I think that house would be great.

All right, so we're just going to choose right now the next. Okay, there's one, two, three, four. There's five that we like. What are the numbers? What are the numbers? Number one. Number three.

Number four.

Number six.

Number seven. What about the elementary school?

Yeah.

Yeah? Let's do the elementary school.

Wait a second. Why not make the same as the six months?

Well, you said we're just doing a few right now, right? You said?

But, you know, he's designated, and I don't think he will feel okay. You know, next door, we just celebrate one and not his that he did. You know, after two or three years, he finally agreed to designate the house. That's number five.

that's number five yeah yeah okay that's fine what do you think seven for the rest of the year and i and i'd like to add the elementary school that's like i guess pretty that's a great art deco example march march march for the rest of the year okay so uh i make a motion to select

seven houses for now and we then choose the remaining three. Number one, number three, four, five, six, seven and ten.

Okay, and then we'll figure out, we'll do others.

Okay, I repeat, for your records, I repeat, we are choosing the story houses of the month starting in the month of March, houses number one, number three, four, five, six, seven, and ten. Those are... seven houses and the remaining three we can we have plenty of time to uh well it should be the next month for for me to have a calendar and post it on on social media but it's okay for now plus we have to send out letters right like we did uh last year yes i can we have to write the blurb letters yes i can send the letters i'm in charge of sending the letters and uh jeffrey you wrote the blurb last time right yeah uh I have their sample. And what about the sign? We using the same sign? The sign is still there. I forgot to pick it up. Yeah, I saw it the other day on my wall.

I know. I forgot to pick it up. It's still out. I'll get it. I'll get it. I know. I'll get it. We didn't have any place to put it.

Right. It's the house of the month for December, January, and February. Yeah, it's out there. I'll get it.

I'll get it. Don't worry.

Jeffrey's going to get it.

I'll get it. This doesn't need a motion, does it?

I was going to ask, what again? Where do we go from here? I'm in new terrain right now. I don't think you need to worry about it.

Yeah. Okay.

Yeah, I don't think he needs to worry about it.

So when Alice left, she left me this very nice kind of handover packet. And I went through it. Houses of the Month was not part of it. So I'm learning with you.

We do have to make a motion.

Now, the one thing that we did was we did have the village publish a blurb in the newsletter for every House of the Month. And I used to coordinate with Elizabeth. Yeah, and she's not here anymore, right? Or is she still there? She's still here.

Oh, I thought she was retiring. She's what? She was out.

She's not retiring? I thought she was retiring.

Okay, good.

So I was coordinating with her. I imagine it would be okay if we continued to do that. Okay, I think that's good.

So I think we do have to pass the motion for the seven. So Patricia just asked for the motion. Does anybody second?

I second, yeah.

All in favor? Aye. All right, so we've approved those. Was it seven or eight? Seven. We approved seven houses.

There are three more remaining for the month of March. We've approved seven. Let's keep looking for houses. Three more, you know, to go.

Yeah, three more to go. And then the next steps are that Jeffrey is going to write the blurb. and uh patricia is gonna get homeowners approval and then you'll coordinate for it to be published yeah i mean sure i mean the blurb is written for last year i will i will make the research for the house uh 441 grand congress okay okay that's great that would be good and the rest of us look for three more houses in the 1930s and 40s all right sounds good our next scheduled meeting is march 19th

March 19th.

March 19th. March 19th. And unless there's any other items.

It's amazing it falls on the same guy.

Well, I just wanted to advise the board that we did submit Mr. Baquet's house to be considered for the February 18th council meeting.

Great.

That agenda is still being organized, put together. That doesn't mean that it's set. You mean March 18th? March. I'm sorry. That's okay. Last night we were here until about 10 o'clock. Yeah, I know. I watched part of it. My Tuesday and Wednesday were kind of running together. But yes, the item was submitted for Mr. Beque's house, and we're expecting it to be in the second meeting in March. Excellent.

Okay, that sounds good. And what is happening with the house we were just talking about, Patricia? That got approved.

I don't know how to answer that.

I'd have to look into it and see. I wonder if it was ordered.

It wasn't in the turnover packet. Oh, wow.

Okay, that would have been something that Alice would have done, yeah, was go through the procurement person to order it.

So it's 565 Grand Concourse. The city council approved that, what, like three months ago, Patricia? Like three or four months ago?

Something like that. It felt like three months ago.

Like three months ago they approved it.

Yeah.

So, yeah, if we could find out the status of the clock. It does take a while. It might be ordered. It takes like six months.

All right, then we're adjourned. Thank you.

Bye, Patricia. Thank you all. All righty. All right. So am I attending any other events?

Do you do an event here?

Yeah, it's in there. It's in there? I don't see it. It's in there, yeah. You have to scroll a lot. Is there a way to search? I'll search. Yeah. I posted it on all the websites, but it's sold out. Oh, wow. I'm sure we can make room for the board. Oh, by the way, so I don't know. Yeah, tell us about it. So there's a, you know, Open House Miami? Uh-huh. It's an event that happens every year, and it's all of Miami-Dade County, and basically...