Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So it goes the other way.

Thank you.

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. I'd like to welcome you to the Fan Commission meeting for the City of Martinsville Tuesday, July 28th at 7 p.m. Meeting is called to order. First up, Ms. Secretary, would you call roll call?

Richard Bastin. Steve Votie.

Jim Burkhardt. Yes. Joe Disney.

Present.

Richard Dernal. Present.

Caleb Forrester.

Present.

Rick Keacock. Here. Ann Miller. Present. Jason Scott.

Here.

Troy Swan. And myself, Marilyn Siderwitz.

We've got seven members present, so we have a quorum. Okay, next up is presentation of minutes dated June the 23rd of 2026. Has everybody had an opportunity to look over the minutes? Do we have any corrections that need to be made?

I will make a motion that we accept the minutes dated June 23rd, 26th as presented.

Rigner and all made a motion that we accept the minutes. Do I hear a second? I'll second. Caleb Forrester seconds. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? Abstain. Abstain. Ann Miller abstains. She wasn't here last night. Okay, we don't have anything for old business, so the first thing on our agenda will be new business. It's docket number PC26018, remodeling historic downtown. The owner is B-O-C-K-F-B-J-L-O-C.

Mr. Chairman, yeah, Mr. Chairman, I'm Dale Coffey. I'm going to step out of here because I have a conflict of interest to this application. All right.

Thank you, sir. Will you please sign in and state your name, sir?

Certainly. My name is Chris Fuller, and I'm here on behalf of DOCK FBJ LLC. I'm located at 6 East Morgan Street here in Martinsville, Indiana. I believe you all have a copy of the packet I submitted there. I'm happy to take any additional questions on that. We have been renovating this building, the first floor and second floor, to modernize it. Much of the second floor is probably stuck in the 40s or 50s, and we've got that moved forward. And this that I'm here today is on the front of the building. I think I provided you all a color photo of that. And on the front there, we've match windows with the original arches, and they will now be the black frame windows, as well as the lower half there. If some of you have driven by, you've probably noticed that there is a brick enclosure on both sides. It's a lighter brick. It's not right around the building. We're taking that out and putting a storefront on it. Kind of our inspiration was looking at the theater you all did next door, or the theater next door the city did. Paint will mostly be the same. I think I've provided a paint sample. If you look at this, the paint that won't be the sign is just right there in the windows will be that paint sample I provided you. All the other paints will be the same. You'll also, although I don't have it shown in this picture, the door going upstairs here will be matching the door we have on the front of the building to keep everything consistent. And I think it's going to be a great addition to downtown. It's going to be a big change for that building, but it's consistent with what the city's been doing. The front currently there is not historical with that grid. We look forward to getting it done. Hope for approval and welcome any questions you all have.

So the paint swatch that we sent around is just the small sections underneath of those windows, right and left of the front door?

Yes, sir. The other paint, the trim colors will be the same as they're currently there. Okay. Yes, sir.

Do we have any questions for Mr. Fuller on this? Well, I would entertain a motion.

I'd like to entertain a motion that we accept docket number PC26018.

Okay, Ann Miller has made a motion that we accept PC26018 as presented. Do I hear a second? I'll second. Mr. Heacock, seconds. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Thank you, Mr. Fuller.

Thank you, all. Have a good evening.

On your way out, could you find Mr. Coffey and...

I'll grab him. Oh, here he comes. There he is. Thank you.

Okay, next up on the agenda, I want to do a little flip here. We're going to go to, because I have a feeling that docket number PC26019 is going to be very involved, so I'm going to go to docket number PC26020, which is a sign in the historic downtown district Landowner is Ron Stanhouse. Applicant is Jocelyn Covey. Is there anyone here on that? You're here? Okay. I didn't want you to sit through. I appreciate that. So if you sign in please and state your name.

My name is Jocelyn Covey and I am here for the Caddye Collective.

What is the... The business, what is the Cat Eye Collective?

So the Cat Eye Collective is a tattoo and beauty collective of booth rent professionals.

So you've got beauticians and art artists?

Yes, we've got a little bit of everything, all our independent businesses. So we support them in their autonomy as business owners rather than being employees, which is really common in the tattoo. beauty industry so i'm just trying to provide a beautiful space for a lot of like-minded people to come together and share their craft with everybody they're going to be lashes too yeah i'm really open-minded to anything i've had a hand in a lot of different facets of the beauty and tattoo industry so if i have a space that fits and benefits a provider i'm open-minded to it

So on your signage, this is all going to be transparent, basically? Yes. It's just going to be the print on top of the glass, so you're going to be able to see through it?

Yes. Yeah, I'm trying to keep that window, all the windows exposed and for people to be able to see in.

Do we have any questions on this?

I was just going to ask, Mr. Strater, do we have approximate dimensions on the building? That section of the building? I have an estimate, but I don't know how close I am.

No, we do not. That's the new space that has just been placed in there on the Sycamore side of Ron's building there.

The measurements that I, they may not be completely accurate, but it should be the ballpark. It's 55 feet in length, just a one story park in the back. I don't know if it's 10 foot or 11 foot wall height, but even at 10 foot, if my math is correct, the total area of the signage is well under the 10% of the service area, even cut in half. So if there's a second tenant there, there's still room for that same amount of signage in the future. OK. Thank you, Rick. No problem.

Joe, I'm going to abstain from any motion on this, just getting ahead of it.

OK.

I know her through my wife, so.

OK. So Jason Scott will abstain on this. Are there any other questions on this permit application on the signage?

I go ahead and make a motion that we pass docket number PC26020.

Kay Ann Miller has made a motion that we accept this. Is there a second?

All second.

Richter and all seconds. All those in favor?

Aye.

Opposed? Jason Scott of SANS. Thank you.

Thank you.

Welcome to downtown.

Glad to have you.

Okay, next up will be document number PC26019. This is a rezone from AG to HUD-R. The address is State Road 252, the owner of Sun Energy Farms, but I believe that this presentation is from maybe Four Star. Do we have someone to speak on this? If you would please sign in and state your name, please.

Good evening. My name is Cheyenne Hoffa. I'm the entitlements manager with Four Star Group. I appreciate you guys hearing our petition today for a rezone from ACT to PUDR for a proposed neighborhood called Maple Hills. I sent along with my application a PowerPoint presentation. I have copies of it here if you guys do not have it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Okay, so I passed out PowerPoint to you all. So we are proposing a residential neighborhood. I know that you indicated that the address is on 252, and I spoke with you guys late last year about the annexation. I know that was a point of contention, so we'll chat on that a little bit later, but I wanna introduce Four Star Group, which is a residential land developer. We're the largest land developer for residential lots in the United States, developing about one out of every 50 lots in the country. We do not build homes, and we sell to almost every publicly traded home builder in the United States. Our largest partner is D.R. Horton Homes, but as you all know, as members of this community, we also sell to Arbor Homes, who's building in our previous community, Hannah Farms, on Artesian. But we're always looking to build beautiful communities that will have lots that are available to a multitude of home builders. At this point, we don't know who the home builder will be. Later on in the presentation, there are some examples from both. D.R. Horton and from Arbor, but whoever would build on these logs would have to follow the requirements of the PUD. So on the second page you'll see the area for which this rezone is for. It includes the sun energy parcel and then a small portion of the faith church parcel to the north which is going to give us access onto state road 44 as we're looking for a rezone tonight which is you know entails the allowance of development for residential on this property we're also working on our engineering plans and working with indot to ensure that we make the proper improvements and etc but we're utilizing that same curb cut that faith church already has so that helps but i've been working with the seymour district to determine what improvements might need to be done at that intersection in the future or as we develop our neighborhood The next page shows our layout, so you'll see that the initial roadway down to 252 that you guys saw when I annexed this property late last year has now been removed. We're seeking to just go to State Road 44, and we worked with HWC, Mayor Causton, and also town staff to make that road a large boulevard for access and safety so that one lane would be blocked for any reason that the emergency vehicles could still get through that additional lane that would be separated by a landscaped boulevard there. which will also include some landscaping, which is codified within the PUD language, as well as that front pond. We're planning to have a fountain in that front pond to help with aesthetics along State Road 44. On page number five, you'll see we're proposing the current site plan has 159 50-foot lots. This will fit a 40-foot home product as well as this property is very beautiful. It's hard to get to as you can tell that we've switched entrances there, but once you get on the site, it has some rolling topography and you can't really see out of the site because it's wooded on all four sides which we plan to retain those woods which is really great in terms of lot premiums for those homes that will all back up to the woods that are on the outer edges of the site in addition to some beautifully wooded locks working with staff and mayor costin we've also upped the brick requirement from hannah farms on these homes so The language in the PUD requires that 50% of the homes will have at least 50% brick on the front facade. Those homes that are going to be wider than 32 feet will have that requirement. The remaining 50% will have that brick wainscot.

Any homes that are narrower than 32 feet

will be required, 50% will be required to have that 360 for Dwayne Scott. The remaining 50% will have that for Dwayne Scott on the front. Working with my home building partners, again, as we don't build the homes, that helps to retain some anti-monotony throughout the streetscape. If you have every home brick or every home not brick, then sometimes as you're driving down the street, it looks like the same home on every side. So that kind of helps give some diversity to that streetscape. There on page six, the first two pages of homes are DR Horton Homes, which is our largest home building partner. Those are some elevations of a 40-foot wide product that they offer in this market. Those range from about 1,200 to 2,600 square feet. And typically the starting house price on those is about $275 in similar markets in this area. Again, we're not the home builder, but just on market research, we're thinking that probably those homes will be at least that base price or a little bit higher depending on where we land with construction costs. On page seven are some 30 foot wide product that Horton offers. These range from 950 square feet to 1900 square feet and start in the mid to low 200s and then Some arbor product which will look familiar because some of these are from Hannah Farms, the plants that they offer from Hannah Farms neighborhood. These are 40 foot product that range from 1200 to 3100 square feet and from the mid 200s to about the almost $400,000 range for the arbor product. And then page nine shows some arbor arrival product, which is 30 foot wide, range from 950 square feet to 2,000. And we've seen the billboards, but they're about starting at 200,000, but a lot of times with options and et cetera, those will go up to almost $300,000. The final page, we have a playground amenity proposed. There's a lot of really great wooded areas around The one picture on the bottom right hand side is from the site. I went out walking the site a few months ago and determined not to have some amenities in the back in the wooded areas. I wasn't sure that'd be safe for people, but it's just a beautiful property that is, you know, going to be really great for some beautiful home sites that are slightly elevated from what we're seeing at Hanna Farms. And then additionally, we will have, like I said, that pond fountain at that front pond on State Road 44. As I indicated, there's the two different home sizes that are shown here. The PUD will allow for a 30-foot wide product on a 50-foot wide lot. The side yard setbacks are five feet, so most of the lots will probably be built a 40-foot product, but the PUD does have allowances for that 30-foot product that is shown that DR Horton and Arbor both offer. And then... some additional landscaping requirements in the Boulevard, but open to answer any questions that you guys may have.

Councilman Coffey, are we allowed to ask about the entrances to, is this something we can discuss? You mean how you access the property? Correct. Sure. Okay. What are going to be the access points to the development?

Yes, so we'll have a boulevard entrance on State Road 44, which is in that existing Faith Church entrance right across the street from the fire department. And again, we've worked with staff. That roadway will have a fairly large right-of-way so that we can fit that boulevard through the middle so that it can retain two kind of two points of access with the boulevard being split in case there'd be a blockage on one side of that boulevard.

So there will not be any access to the property on 252?

There will be no access on 252.

Okay.

Do you know an approximate acreage amount of how much wooded is still left there on the west side of the property that comes up to 252?

On the west side of 252, oh well we plan to not, I'm sure there will be some removal, I don't know the exact acreage but I can definitely get that percentage for you. I don't know the exact acreage but we Trying to stay out of as many trees as possible because with the trees comes some some steep topography as well So not only is it difficult and expensive to remove trees and we want to have that buffering, but it's also Really steep and it just does not Conducive.

Well, I'm happy to see that the trees were there. Yes. I just wondered how many acres is left there that will be would it it's not a concern right now i just thought you might have that number and like miss miller asked about so you're working with the state now on the entrance yep they are aware of our change in plans um and then we are in the middle of

an updated traffic study. We had one conducted when we planned to go onto 252, which now needs to be revised. But I heard some feedback from the CMAR district actually today on that entrance, and they were happy that we were utilizing the existing curb cut, but would need to see the traffic study to give some additional guidance. But we'll follow the guidance of NDOT. You know, as much as you guys are the deciding factor, if we get rezoned, they're gonna be the deciding factor on what improvement we might need to make at that future, or it's a current intersection, but a newer, updated intersection.

And I've seen it here somewhere, but the amount of, this may be it here, the amount of property that you're getting from Faith Church.

Yes, it's about five acres. um that we're getting from faith church so we will retain those trees that are on the west side of the property and we're just kind of going to hug that tree line and move up to 44 so we won't be removing trees along the western property line of the faith church parcel that we're acquiring one question yes sir so on the entrance off of 44

And maybe you can't answer this, but will there be an allowance or an opportunity to widen 44 in a place to allow for turn lanes?

I would say the minimum that the state is probably going to require us to do a turn lane into the neighborhood and then like an A cell, B cell lane on either side. I can't speak to if they're going to require there to be a turn lane. It is, I know, one of their concerns, but it is close to the 69 interchange, of course. It's an existing curb cut, so it's not like we're seeking a new one, but that question I cannot answer, but definitely we're working in our design right now, and so those will definitely be an item that we can discuss as we get into primary cloud.

That's really nothing that we can control because that's all up to the state. Yeah. You're in the state's varsity.

We are, and they will, you know, most likely follow what the traffic study indicates there. But sometimes, you know, they have some additional. I know I've put, we've done end-aught intersections before, and so I've put in a big number just in case they ask us to do a big improvement. But I know in their initial analysis of 44, they were like, we really don't want to see a light here or anything like that. And so that... Just the proximity to the 69 interchange.

More questions?

You mentioned you brought up anti-monotony. So since I've been on the plant commission, this is the first PUD that I've been involved in at the very beginning. I think it would... probably behoove us to include some language. My experience with the current subdivision going on has been good. I think Arbor Homes has enough product in different elevations that I think you can tell certain developers, certain builders take some pride in doing that themselves. I would feel more comfortable if we actually had something in writing in the ordinance.

And I've seen some from different municipality to municipality. It's not always in language. Sometimes it is, but it's mostly kind of an exhibit within the PUD that will have like kind of laid out and that exactly right there is what you came prepared. So that is something that we would be definitely agreeable to adding an exhibit. Of course, I haven't reviewed that in detail, but it's something like that within the PUD to...

I've got about 15 copies here, so I will go ahead and if nobody has objections, I'll pass this around.

No, please do.

Once it gets around there, if Mr. Schrader would like to see one, if Sandy and Mayor Costin would like to see one as well. So for any of my fellow commissioners, if you're not aware, some municipalities, some counties have adopted anti-monopoly standards simply to keep a builder from putting a whole street of identical houses. As I said, my experience with what Four Star has done here has been, I wouldn't anticipate a problem, but it may behoove us to just have it in there.

Yeah, I would have no issue adding this as an exhibit within our PUD. And like you said, for us, we don't build the homes, but we want to make sure that because we don't build the homes that we can provide you guys with every every chance to make sure that whoever is in there has a product that you guys want to see and addresses some of these comments. So definitely would have no issue adding this into the current PUD. I know there'd have to be some language in the PUD that refers then to this as an exhibit, but not at all an issue there.

And actually, I've spent a fair amount of time in Monrovia, which I know is a DR Horton subdivision up there.

it's pretty apparent that they follow something like this with how they lay out the elevation plans so that they i feel like they do a pretty fair job of not creating duplicate and they're even following a pud that's probably from 2001 from us old cp morgan down there so yeah this is fairly standard in a lot of udos and when it's not i have no issue adding this as an attachment into our beauty

Do we have any other questions? So if we accept this as presented, this would be included in it? I would say we would make that as part of the motion. Okay. We would make that as part of the motion that we add this as an exhibit.

I'd like to make a motion then to approve.

I would like to ask if there's anybody here that would like to speak for or against this. Please come on up one at a time. Sign in and then state your name.

My name is Terry Allen. My property, my property butts up against where this new addition will be, woods to woods. They don't have very much woods and we hunt in our woods. So if this goes through, I just want to ask if there's any way that we could have them to put a six or eight foot fence with barbed wire because I don't want kids coming over on my property where we're hunting.

So where is your property located that way?

It is, I believe it would be the west side.

Okay.

And

So are you off of 252?

We are off of 252. Okay. I can show you if you want me to show you. It's probably easier to understand if I show you.

So your property goes all along this property line?

It doesn't go completely across it. It switches hands down towards the end, the bottom end. The majority of it would be ours.

So you're saying up on the north part of the subdivision towards Faith Church, by where the cul-de-sac is, you have property there?

Can I show you? Can I come up there and show you? Sure, sure.

And then I'll explain to the rest of the commission members.

Okay.

So she is...

Her property butts up to where the cul-de-sac is. As you're looking at the subdivision, it's the left side on the north.

Okay, so the subdivision is going to be within the city limits, is that correct?

Yes.

But your property is... We're ag. Agriculture. You're agriculture. We are. Okay. Okay. Sears Zone Agriculture.

Yeah, I think probably most people around there are. I don't know.

Are they? We're in the Concord on Morgantown Road. Is it sitting? No, it's not.

So it's basically going to be surrounded by, and this is my husband, so he can probably explain things better. Robert Allen.

Thank you. Our property cuts up to Faith Church from the south all the way across the backside. Our property runs on the east side. next to the subdivision probably three-fourths of the way down we actually have an entrance off 252. we also have an entrance off 252 lane back to my property as well okay so we are not in city limits so right now that's how we prefer to stay It's because we do things there on our property. So the big thing is, I was a kid. I know what kids do. That's why we want chain link fence with barbed wire to protect that. Do I like what's going on? No. But am I going to stop it? No. It's progress. I understand that. So I just want to make sure that we are protected and covered on our side of it. That's kind of where we're at with this. Sure.

How many acres do you have?

It's just under 30. Yeah, 29.5. Okay. So... And we've actually bought the woods several years back so we would have more woods, more property. Sure. Out in the country. Right. So...

Right.

So you would like to see a...

taller fence on their property line definitely and barbed wire to keep anyone from crossing it from like 252 outlining their property line all the way back

Well, you can speak for yours.

Okay. Okay.

But you can't speak for the other property owners.

Okay, that's fine.

Okay, that's a good point. You got anything else? Okay, all right. Cheyenne, will you make a note of that? Do you see where their property is? So that way you can see what you can do to accommodate them. down lower that's going to be all woods and you said that that was very hilly terrain i want to go ahead and talk about this so come on up here cheyenne yeah it is there's a lot of terrain back there i think

I know we've walked back there, but even met with some other neighbors and walked some of these areas as well. And it is very, very steep terrain out here once you get into the wooded area. That's kind of why we've taken so long to get here for rezoning, trying to get equipment in to do our due diligence work just because it's the topography. I think... What we could agree to would be to put up some no trespassing signs. I don't know that a fence, I just think a fence through there feasibility-wise would be really difficult to get a fence installed along that entire property line without having to take out some trees and then just the topography of that area. We could try to do something where there, you know, every 50, 75 feet in the woods or even outside of the woods. I'm sure the HOA really won't want children to be in the woods at all, just liability wise. Even the ones that are on our property.

Right. And what I want you to do, Cheyenne, is to take that under advisement. Okay. Because what I don't want to see is this homeowner having to have the burden of going back there and have an expense of them having to put something up on their property to keep... And I understand what they're saying. I've got four acres in town, and I've got neighbors, and it's wooded on the back, but I sometimes see kids over on my property. So I understand what they're saying, especially with the new subdivision. So thank you for your comment. Yeah, this is good. I'm glad you brought it up, and we'll have her look at this further and see what she can... do on that whenever they start getting this laid out. But thank you. Do we have someone else that wants to speak on this? You want to come up?

I basically just have a couple of questions. My name's Tom Flatt. I own just a movement.

Would you sign in? Would you sign in, please? And it's Tom, what's the last name? Flatt. Flatt. Did you get that, Tom? Flat.

F-L-A-T-T. No, F-L-E-C-K. F-L-A-T-T. Flat tire or two T's? Two T's. F-L-A-T-T.

Okay, Tom, go ahead.

Yeah, we have a sliver of property that is adjacent to the entrance room off of 44 there. I have a couple of questions. You have a retention pond there, right there at the entrance of 44. Now, the drainage there is, well, where that retention pond, that's about the extent of the drainage off of that section, because that's where the dividing line between watersheds is, right at the top of that retention pond. So I'm wondering here, are you intending on diverting more water along that access road to that retention pond? Is that why that retention pond is even needed there?

Yes, it'll take on the flow from the ground on the missionary church that we're developing a pond. So that pond will take on flow from the access road.

Oh, okay. Yeah, because that drainage off that pond goes down adjacent to 44, and then it all comes across my backyard. So if you increase the flow there, I got more flooding right now. Right now, I only get a flood when we've got too much rain. Okay, well...

so i guess it's designed to hold the capacity of whatever runs off that section yeah so most of the stormwater ordinances require that you don't increase flow from its from the use that you're developing it off of so a lot of times it's mostly farm fields that we're developing upon we're not allowed to increase the amount of discharge from that site than what it is currently so a lot of times when we put in you know as much as you see pavement, houses, all services that will not take on water like a farm field used to. And you think, oh my gosh, they're going to be shedding off a ton more water. Well, we have all these retention ponds that then will make sure that the flow is not higher than it was when it was a field, but then will also release that slower because of the requirements for those outlet structures. So a lot of times you may even see a little bit of an improvement in these flows from that site because it's being released over a much longer period of time than just like if it were a farm field just running off as quickly as possible.

Okay well that'd be good because it might because I think we have an increased flow from when they dredged out that long 44 there so I'll take that as an improvement. I'll be out there every day when it's under construction. I was out there when 69 was built, and I filed three watershed violations while they were building that, so I'll catch you if you're going along. Well, I got around stormwater, so I... All right. Another question I had is this is a pretty tight subdivision. You've got some amenities. You've got a playground. You've got woods. Is there going to be probably an HOA?

So, Mr. Flatt, the way this is supposed to work is you present your comments to the Commission. You can't do a back and forth with the applicant at this stage, so you have your public comments to the Commission, and the Commission may follow up with the applicant as to the questions you've raised, okay? We can't have a dialogue between the applicant and yourself in this particular period of the hearing.

Well, then I ask you guys, is there probably going to be an HOA involved with this to take care of the amenities and maintain the roads and things like that? Is that how these normally go?

Well, sir, with Hanna Farms, this is a four-star development also. Hanna Farms is down on Artesian Avenue, and that's what they've got there. and it's going to be the four stars of the developer here. They're not the builder, but they're the developer of the property. They're putting the roads in, the sidewalks, the curving.

But don't usually, when they sell the property, they indicate whether there's an HOA involved, or does that come later if the owners want it? How's that?

That would be something that's up to the developer. That's nothing for tonight for the Planning Commission to decide. The Planning Commission tonight is deciding whether or not to recommend to the council, city council, to rezone from agricultural to PUDR. And so the issue of a homeowner association, those kind of things are not before the Planning Commission this evening.

But they are good questions.

So thank you. That is a good question. Very good question.

Do you have anything else? No, that's it. Thank you. All right. Thank you, sir. Do we have anybody else that would like to speak on this for or against?

Can I ask something?

Ma'am, would you come up? And this is Mrs. Allen that has already been up here.

I just wanted to add that I believe it was two people from Four Star, two guys that came out to our house, and my husband took them and walked the area. And they're not where we were asking for the fence is not in the steep. It's you don't get into that deep hill area. So the fencing would not be over the, into where the deep.

The rough terrain, yes.

Is.

Yeah, I believe I understood that. Did the other commission members understand that?

Okay, because I know when she was talking about like, no trespassing signs aren't going to do anything for us. And I just don't want to see anybody get hurt one way or the other. Yes. You know.

Thank you, ma'am. You need to state your name and sign it.

I'm Gary Oaks, and I've missed you all over the last six months. Let me give you a little history of this now we've gotten here. In 21, we passed a bond that gave us a million dollars to take water and sewer up to the 44 interchange. We negotiated with the Faith Church to come into the city at that point. With Faith Church being in the city, we were able to work with John Fuel for this property that Four Star proposes to develop. The water and sewer line runs across Allen's property, next to Allen's property, but actually on Faith Church's property. But it does benefit them to have water and sewer availability for any kind of commercial development that may happen at some point there. Our history, the city with Four Star and the Hanna Farms is outstanding. They've done everything that we've asked. They've done everything that we've asked regarding this property off of 44. It was most apparent that it should come off of 252. And as we continued to look at that, that situation was very dangerous. That's the hill and the curve there. Very short sight lines. If you go up to 44, which they recited to accommodate our request, at 44 you have good sidelines both directions and you have emergency services right at your doorstep. So it works out to everyone's advantage, I believe. So our experience with Hanna Farms, they did everything that was asked out there. If you look at the landscaping along the road, it's great. The roads and sewers went in right from the start. You don't have to wait for it like we have on the other subdivisions. The experience there I think guides us in what we might recommend here. And my personal recommendation is that this development proceed. These are bigger lots. This will be a higher price point. We have a price point that's $235,000 to $385,000 in Hanna Farms, a little less than that in the Spina Hammock subdivision. But we want price points around your city. So up in Hills, we've got a couple different developments happening up there. So those price points are a little higher up there. So you have to have that kind of variety to be able to draw people to your city. And we need to develop with that. So our experience, my experience with Four Star has been outstanding. I recommend them again. Thanks.

Thank you, sir. Do we have anybody else here that would like to speak on this? Do we have anybody here that's from one of the other subdivisions that is in the area? Would you like to speak about this? We want to hear public input.

Thank you. My name is Tammy Goodall.

Tammy Goodall.

And we, and I, my husband and I, we live off of Old Morgantown Road, 252. Okay. Okay. Our property is at the end of the street. There's only 10 houses in that little subdivision, Patriot Place.

So then that's right across from the church?

It's off to this. Yeah, across from each Christian church. Okay, so you're on Old Morgantown, right? That little subdivision right there, there's 10 houses there. And our house, we're the last one kind of go down the road on the left. The new subdivision is going to go right up behind us. We have an acre there, and we've got it fenced off, and we have tree lines on that whole subdivision. And you answered our question why we came. We wanted to make sure that our tree lines stayed there. And that's kind of what she said, that the tree lines would stay there. And then we were worried about the emergency entrance being suggested coming down our road. Because it's just, it's a dead end.

Yeah, I don't see anything here for any back road entrance into this subdivision.

Okay, all right. And like I said, again, I think you all answered, asked the right questions that we were looking for. I mean, again, we don't really want it to come. We know it has to be there. I mean, we knew eventually that property was going to get bought out. But if we believe and trust what everybody's saying, This gentleman said it would be a quality subdivision. It won't be, because our homes are anywhere from $400,000 to $600,000 homes that we have there.

Yeah, and this is just my opinion, but I think as the city grows, we're going to see more stuff, maybe not so dense as this, more like what you've got in your subdivision. There's going to be more of that in your area. Just as the city grows there's going to be that demand and there's going to be people that's going to come in. I mean you've got Clercreek just right around the corner. That's nice and that's what I wanted to know is if there was anybody else here from these other subdivisions and any concerns. But I like the tree line that's going to be around this.

Right, right. And I really like to hear that we just don't want the children back there. It's very scary to us. We have grandchildren and we know how to start getting subdivision. It's single family homes, right? I mean, that's what most of them are gonna be.

Do you know what Mr. Fuel was originally gonna put this in as a solar farm?

No kidding.

Am I right?

There you go.

So that's what you could have added.

Now, see, now, see, I was all trying to be good and positive about this, and you go do that. Okay.

So thank you for your. Well, thank you. For coming, your attendance. We appreciate that. We want to see the public here and hear public comment.

All right, thanks. Thank you.

Do we have any other questions from the commission? Mr. Koston, you're here. Would you like to say anything? This is something that's been in the works for a long time. Yes, sir.

Scott Granger.

Some of you know me. Did you get his name?

I did.

We live on Hawthorne Drive, which is, I guess, would be northeast of this development. And had a couple of questions. These may be beyond the scope of your committee, but just wondered, I think I heard earlier that none of this property was previously owned by the Hess family. Is that correct? Not I know of. OK. And then the other thing is it seems like we're getting a lot of high density, maybe low cost or low moderate cost homes in the community. So I was glad to hear that maybe there are plans for maybe some more higher end developments. in the future. Is there a comprehensive plan for Martinsville or Morgan County? Yes, sir. Okay. And that's, I'm sure that's available for inspection? Yes. Yeah, okay.

I think that's on the City of Martinsville website under planning.

Yeah. Okay. Well, I didn't do my homework before I came, but this is the first time that I've been to one of these meetings, and I've been impressed with the way things went. You know, I commend you on what you're doing here.

Well, I'd like to invite you to come back more often.

Okay.

Thank you. Thank you, sir.

I'll make a comment to follow up on. with our comprehensive plan, and I've referenced it many times, and I think my voting record for plan commission businesses has been very pro-housing. It's a need, and I will, kind of in the vein that we're going, the comprehensive plan, there's a key word in there, it's diversity in housing. We've had a lot of petitions and I would like to see some higher end stuff at some point. I think this, I can't make a determination on exactly how I feel about this particular subdivision because it's so early in the process. I mean ideally I would have liked to have seen larger lot sizes, larger homes. But then I'm not in real estate development. If I had the money and was in that, maybe I would make some different decisions. But this is what we're presented with, and it does fit the plan.

Yeah, I think that's one thing that, for those who are in attendance, this administration, I think that Mr. Koston, one of his campaigns was he wanted more housing. He wanted that diversity. He wanted people of all walks. We see that with the habitat builds that are coming. We see that with these subdivisions. And I'm sure that behind the scenes Mayor Costin is talking to other developers weekly on bringing other stuff to town. So I think we got to commend this administration on following through with what he said he was going to do. So with that, I want, yes, Rick.

I've got a couple other questions. Based on the turnout, I'm kind of anticipating the answer to this question, but did all the public notice mailings go out as required? Okay. Did everybody receive a public notice mailing?

Yes.

I know I saw it in the paper, so.

Did the Allens receive a public... Allen family, did you receive a notice? Yes. Okay.

And then, like I said earlier, since this is the first time I've been involved with a PUD from the very outset, I don't know the city's timeline if we ever do a technical advisory committee. On a development of this size, I would honestly love to hear from the chief of police, the fire chief. I think Mr. Oaks answered my question on utilities, so I appreciate that. And probably a representative from the MSD of Martinsville School District. as we're adding houses to a district that within a year we're going to lose two of our three city elementary schools. I don't know that any answers to those concerns or points that those departments might bring up would necessarily change the outcome, but I think they're questions worth asking. You know, we see the, we see what happens on social media and we'll, you know, why didn't anybody think of this? And I want, my hope is that the public sees that usually there's 11 of us here and we try and give good, good consideration to all sides of an issue. So I don't know if the city uses a technical advisory committee at any time.

Mr. Colquitt. We do not. We have not yet that type of an organization set up. We, I mean, the Village Department does take comments internally from fire or police if there's any issues they see, but per se we do not have a technical review committee that is part of the process.

The boulevard entrance came about with discussions with the fire department because we had thought about doing an access road over to the neighborhood to the east and that was not working out as well as i figured those homeowners probably wouldn't want an emergency access over there either so the boulevard entrance and then i've also spoken a few times to susie libs who's on town common council she works for the school corporation and she hasn't expressed any concerns about the students um i don't know that i've asked that question specifically but i have spoken with her about this project during the annexation portion portion and reached out again as we started this reason

Thank you. I think in our procedures, one of the mailings goes to the school district. So whether or not anybody looks at it, I don't know that. But at least, yes, you did your due diligence on that. So thank you.

But Rick, you do bring up a good point, and as we continue, as the city of Martinsville continues to grow, if that's something that we need to look into, then We'll see what we have to do to put that in place.

If I may, I hope Mr. White, a development, a higher end is needed. It's very difficult to do. They'll probably tell you the current price for a 50-foot lot frontage on a street exceeds $75,000. So your price point goes up really fast on a house. You might recall I did with you a couple of houses down here on Victor Drive last year. Those were 285. They were a little higher end than that. But it's expensive to do. And so it's not encouraged to do. The subdivision I live in off of 252 was developed in 2008. And they lost it to the bank because 2008 came along. The numbers are really tough to do. Starter homes are almost impossible to find anymore at this point. You'll see that there's a demand because you look at Hammond Farms. Look how fast those houses are selling. They're selling by square footage. Three stories, two stories, so it's cheap square footage. So that's what that market is right now. It's difficult to penetrate.

Thank you for your insight, Mr. Oaks. Ms. Allen?

Hi. I missed how much the housing range is going to be in that addition. Can you tell me?

I wrote it down here, ma'am. Now, this is just the development. They're just developing the subdivision. And then there'll be different... home builders in there. The DR Horton Homes was in the $275,000 range. And then they just went up from there. So, Cheyenne, am I not correct in that, in the 275 range?

We do a competitive market analysis, and of course we're an aqua builder, but we anticipate average boat's base home price is going to be around 325. But there's, you know, important in-area,

to starting at 275 and then you know our smaller product would probably be starting around the 215 225 mark for the smaller homes there if those were built 225 i'm sorry thank you thank you okay um and then the fire department as far as that addition goes It's city. So unless they have a mutual agreement ready to go with Washington Township. They do. They do. Yeah, it's all mutual aid. Okay. They do have an agreement there. Okay. So I guess.

I've actually just a comment on that. I've actually seen Martinsville dispatched two different fire stations in Washington Township. Fire truck would be sitting down here in Martinsville.

Just on a backup.

They all work together.

It's all mutual aid. So it's going to be very well covered by fire.

Okay. That's all unless you just want to hear me say that I'm opposed to it if there's not a fence there.

Thank you. Do we have anything else from the planning commission members? So a reminder of what we're looking at tonight is rezoning. We're sending a recommendation to city council for zoning change from agricultural to the PUDR, planned unit development residential. And that's what we're voting on tonight.

With the addition of the anti-monotony standard?

Correct. Is that right? So with that said, I would entertain a motion for or against

I'll go ahead and entertain a motion to approve docket PC26019 with the addition of the anti-monotony standard option two, rezoning from AG to residential.

Yes, it's a PUD residential. Okay, PUD. Okay, we have a motion on the floor to send a favorable recommendation.

Second.

Mr. Heacock, seconds. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Thank you Cheyenne for coming in. Thank you to the members of the community for coming in. That's all we have on our agenda tonight. Do we have any comments? Anything we'd like to talk about? We don't have a full membership here tonight.

I suppose I'll just reiterate. I've brought this up a couple of times. I think I think we would have a benefit of holding an executive session at some point in the future, maybe on a month that we don't have any items on the docket, which I keep waiting for, but we seem to do this monthly now, so just throw that out there that next time we have an empty docket, I would still like to meet to maybe discuss some areas of the comprehensive plan and other business.

Sure.

And with my approving this is with the hope that that fence will be put up with barbed wire and chain link fencing.

Well, that's just something for them to. Yes. That's something for them to. They're aware of it. Okay. So as long as they're aware of it, then. As we know, there's many steps to this process. It goes before council, next for the rezoning. So if that's all we have, I'd entertain a motion for adjournment.

I make a motion we adjourn. Second.

All those in favor? Second. All those in favor? Aye. Okay, our next regular session meeting is Tuesday. August the 25th, 26th. It's August already, guys.

August 25th. Thank you. Meeting adjourned.