Planning Board - Regular Meeting

You're so you're so different at these meetings than your meetings. These are the fun meetings for you. Okay, we're ready. Ready? Okay. Welcome everybody. Good evening. I'll call this April 9th meeting of the Burough Hillsdale Land Use Board to order. We'll begin with the open public meeting statement followed by the pledge of allegiance. This meeting is being held in accordance with the open public meetings act. Notes of this meeting was published in two newspapers according to law and the time and place of this meeting have been posted in prominent location in Burl Hall. Please stand for the pledge of

allegiance to the flag of the United States of America to the republic for it stands one nation with liberty and justice for all and we'll start with the board roll callates yes vice chair rearen here secretary Raymond here Mr. Alter here Mr. Freriedman here. Mr. Creed here. Dr. Weinberg here. Mr. Hip here. Council Zi here. Mayor Shinfield here.

Board attorney Mr. Leeman is also present as well as board engineer Mr. Satiel and board planner Mr. Novak. Thanks. And Tanya's under the weather so we're trying to save her voice as much as possible. At this time, I'll open the meeting to the public. This is for any items or issues other than those listed on the agenda below or that may come before the board on another evening. Is there anyone that would like to approach the board on any matters? Seeing none, I'll close the meeting to the public. We'll move on to invoices. Christy Teal, two invoices totaling $1,557.50. Please review. When you're ready, I'll take a motion. Motion to approve. Scott Raymond, second. Dr. Weinberg. Chairman McCates.

Yes. Vice Chair Rean. Yes, Secretary Raymond. Yes, Mr. Alter. Yes, Mr. Freriedman. Yes, Mr. Greet. Yes, Dr. Weinberg. Yes, Council Lead. Yes. Mayor Shinfield. Yes. Motion to pass. Thank you, Tanya. Moving on to our last meeting minutes, March 24th, 2026. Please review. Thank you, Tanya, for them. And when you're ready, I'll take a motion. Motion. Scott Raymond. Second. Second. Mayor Shinfield. I'm only calling the members that were present for the meeting. Chairwoman Gates, yes. Vice Chair Rean, yes. Secretary Raymond, yes. Mr. Alter, yes.

Dr. Weinberg, yes. Mr. Hip, yes. And council Analleti and Mayor Shinfold, you both were not at the entire meeting, so I don't know if you want to recuse yourselves from this. Can we give a partial yes? I think it's yes or no. Probably not. So we'll have to recuse ourselves. Motion pass.

Thank you. So we have two applications this evening. The first is their new applications PZ 1225 block 1507 lot 12 255 St. Nicholas Avenue. Autumn and Brandon Milker single family home at a level. Um welcome It's on. Yeah, you can take it off. You should be able to take it off. Good. I think Yeah, we hear you.

Okay. Uh, good evening, Madam Chairwoman, members of the board, uh, councelor, uh, board professionals, uh, Charles Sarlo, 777 Terrace Avenue, Hasbro Kites, New Jersey. On behalf of the applicant, Autumn Meckler and Brendan Meckler with regard to the property at 255 St. Nicholas Avenue, lot 1507, lot 12. Um, this application be comes before you for a few variances related to uh the addition of a second floor on an existing one family residential dwelling uh at 255 St. Nicholas Avenue. The property is located in the R-4 zone which permits single family residential. Um, and the addition is going to be a second floor addition. uh principally as you're going to hear uh throughout the night with the testimony to add additional living space. Um I have one witness with me um who is a licensed architect. I did not bring a a planner uh because of the variances and after the architect testifies um I'm going to um you know go through the facts go through the law and let the board tie the facts to the law. Um I did submit it. I did submit procedurally. I'd just like to back up. I did submit um prior to the hearing the affidav affligation to the board secretary.

And just so you know, our planner is here for our second um hearing tonight. Okay. Yeah.

Thank you. Um so again, what's what's being proposed here is a second floor addition um over the obviously over the existing um first floor footprint. And what's being proposed is to canlever on the left side and the right side uh by the maximum allowed by the building code of two feet before you run into structural issues. Um your zoning ordinance I want to say it's unique but it's broad in terms of the setbacks and your setbacks actually take into account the eaves as well as the gutters. So this setback that you're going to hear you you know you're going to say wow that's a kind of a it's you know well we're doing a two-foot structural setback you add on another foot for the eve another half feet for the gutter you know it becomes a three and a half ft encroachment and this would be on the left side of the house um there is if you if you're familiar with the house if you've um you know been by it part of the application is a series of photographs I have extra copies of the survey the floor plan, the zoning table, the photographs, um not the photographs, but I have, you know, everything. If anybody does not have it, I certainly have enough copies for for those people. So, um the the existing house has a small enclosed front porch and um again, what's being proposed is the second floor, but the second floor would not exceed over the existing front porch. It would stay within the main structure. Um however the u the the front yard setback requirement in the R4 zone is 30 ft and this um proposed second floor addition I think would be 20 ft. So that is a second variance um that we also need. So we need the sideyard set back on the left side. We need the front we need the front yard. And then the last variance that we need is off in the back right

hand corner there's a shed a sexually shed. It's existing. It's 6 and 1/2 ft off of the principal structure. Your code requires a 10-ft distance between the principal structure and an accessory structure. That's a pre-existing non-conforming condition. However, and that's only a one-story shed. We are putting the second floor on that's going to have that two foot um two foot plus the one and a half three and a half foot encroachment that make shrinks that 6 and 1/2 ft down to three feet. But again, you got the shed as one story and you have the um second floor addition as the second floor. There are a um a number of pre-existing nonconforming deviations and that's and that's principally why we're here. Not because of the exist pre-existing non-conforming deviations, but because this lot is undersized. That's really um driving the variances that we need as it relates to the proposed addition. So, just to quickly run through them, we have a minimum lot area. The R4 zone requires 7,500 square feet. We have 5,075, which is about a 33%, you know, uh, lot size differential in terms of being less. Um, minimum lot width frontage 75 ft. Um, the what's existing is 50 feet. Basically, same thing, 33%, you can see the lot area and the lot width kind of go hand in hand there. And this is probably the most important and and after the architect the architect's going to go all through all the uh dimensions um and then when I come back on and really talk about you know the variances this probably the most important. So your your zoning code requires minimum floor area in this zone for 800 square feet. Um, this existing house which was

built decades ago, 50, 60, 70 years ago, the main structure itself is only 635 square ft. With the enclosed porch and that enclosed porch, its floor area, it could be used as a sitting room. Maybe, you know, a child could play in there, but it's really not a functional room as it exists. But if you if you include that, you get to 750 square feet. So even with that small front porch, the existing house is efficient in terms of the minimum uh floor area. And that's really what's driving this application is to bring this house into conformity with the zoning code um by adding a second floor and bringing the you know the the house you know into conformance with the neighborhood. The um the other we talked about the um sideyard setback. So the left sideyard setback is already deficient. 10 ft is required. Um structure to property line is 9.72 feet and then you would deduct the additional 2 and 1/2 ft for the eve and the um and the gutter. But that's already deficient and that's really the left side is where um we're asking for that variance. Uh we talked about the accessory structure. Um and really that's it. So there's a there's a number of non-conforming uh deviations that are really not going to be affected by this application. There's case law that basically says, you know, flag them. They are existing deviations, but if they're not impacted by the proposed development, there should we shouldn't really be considered new variances. Um so really the variances that we are creating again are the front yard setback, the sideyard setback um and the uh distance between the principal structure and uh the accessory structure. So with that said, I'd like to call my first witness, which is Alfredo Silva, who is a licensed

registered architect with DMR Architects. So before we swear to um I have two zoning tables in my file. I think one that you prepared, Mr. Charlo, dated February 10th, 46 and then one that's um signed and sealed. Which is the more updated one?

The more updated one would be the February um date, February 4th, I think it is. And the only the only update there is um adding the um as was pointed out in in Chris's review letter, the um the g the gutter um encroachment. And in fact, um, we're gonna have another change as as we go through because that sideyard setback, um, counselor that's in in the in the zoning table only accounts for the the gutter. It doesn't account for the eve, right?

Okay. So, we, you know, so, and if this gets approved by the board, we'll certainly, uh, update the zoning table so it's accurate. We'll put it with the survey as was requested in the review letter or a follow-up email. Okay,

please raise your right hand. You swear with the testimony we're about to give the truth about the truth. I do. So, you put your hand down. Please state your name, spell your last name, and give us your business address. Alfredo Silva Marquez. How to spell a l fo s i l v a hyphen m a r q u e s and 777 Terrace Avenue, Hasbro Heights, New Jersey. Um Alfredo, you are a registered architect with DMR Architects. Correct.

Okay. And um uh I'd like to qualify as expert in the field of architecture for the benefit of the board members. Can you uh uh tell them about your academic credentials? Sure. I graduated out of NGIT for the professional program five years uh in 2017. Uh I've been working in three different firms. Now I'm working with EMR for about three and a half years. Uh plenty of experience. I became a licensed architect last year um with the mentorship of my different um peers. Okay. and um your professional experience you've you've uh designed floor plans and other other architectural elements. Can you elaborate on that a little bit?

Yes. Uh from conceptual design to develop design and construction documents. I have done all parts of the the design process as I am a licensed architect and that is required by New Jersey state to do all task involved in that in including zoning analysis and understanding of placing a building on a lot. And did you have the opportunity to the plans that were submitted uh that were um to the board with the application that were signed and sealed by Kurt Villet who's also from GMR architects? Is that correct? Correct. Okay. Did you have the opportunity to review the plans um with Kurt and ask any questions? Correct. Okay. And you feel comfortable testifying as to those plans? Correct.

Okay. And then the last question um uh since you only got your license last year. Okay. Correct. Um this is the first time you are appearing before a zoning board or planning board. That is true. Okay. So um Alfredo has not been um qualified by an expert before other boards. We are hoping that this board accepts accepts him given the the nature of this type of application. Um and he will forever remember tonight. It's nice to see a new face. So welcome. I'm fine accepting your qualifications. Thank you. Thank Thank you. You need any notes or anything? It's okay. I could bring the drawing just to flip through. Yeah.

You have a question.

Just ask Mark. What's the question? Uh I worked years ago. You're fine. You're fine. He's so ethical.

Very good. He doesn't know you. You're okay. Um, okay. Afraid. Uh, you want to go through uh the existing conditions about the lot, you know, the existing structure, and then get into the floor plans and what's being proposed? Sure. Um the existing building as Charles described um the house is about 30 foot by 20 ft given roughly 300 635 ft for a single family home. We're looking to expand that to a second story and increase it by uh 757 ft. This would allow to have a three uh 757 I believe is the number.

Um Yep. Um, this would allow to have three bedrooms in the upper floor, a restroom, a full restroom up in the second floor, and we're continuing the existing stair that goes to the basement to uh reach out to the second floor. Uh, this new addition on the second floor would increase the width by two feet on each side, and we're going to keep a setback of 20 feet at the front of the house. Okay. Um, want to go through the the floor plan? Sure.

Um, from Ten, the floor plans, the first and second floor both together. Um, on the first floor, we're looking to have a formal living room and dining room. Uh, a kitchen on the rear back and another full bathroom. Then you can see the existing stair location which would then become the access to the second floor. Um and as you turn into the second floor we have the widths and the dimensions that are necessary to have an appropriate space. Uh reason why we also increase the width of the second floor. We have the three bedrooms, one primary bedroom and two bedrooms for with uh smaller closets. uh a full bath for the family and that's what we're showing on the second floor.

And Alfredo, was my uh representation to the board when I made my opening statement accurate in that we're looking for a two-foot canoliever on both sides plus a one foot eve plus 6 in of the gutter for the setback? Correct. Okay. And u a natural question would be well why not uh just stay on the existing footprint and go up? Why are we, you know, putting a two foot, you know, um two foot into the setback plus the one and a half ft? Um and you have a any opinion on that?

Um we look at different configurations and this was the most appropriate way to provide three bedrooms and proper access to each one of the spaces. Uh minimal storage for each one of the bedroom, nothing exaggerated. And that was the best configuration for the plan. Okay. So without the without the four feet two feet on each side um you would basically be shrinking that second floor plan and you the bedrooms would in essence become smaller and not as practical to use for a family. Correct. The proportions would be inadequate for Okay. Um I have no further questions at this time.

Okay. We'll turn over to Chris first. Chris, any comments in addition to your report? Well, one question I have is has anybody certified the foundation to support the additional floor on top of the building? This is an old house. Not to my knowledge. That would be done during construction. This is all schematic design.

Okay. The feasibility of the project before you come to the board and not after the fact and I get a phone call that we realize the house is built on stone. So, we have to rip up the whole house and move it. We've had that before, too. So, okay. As long as the applicant understands what the board approves tonight is it, you know, during construction, if this something goes on with this house falls apart, you know, you're back before the board the whole nine yards again. Okay, we understand.

Okay, that's fine. Uh, my report's pretty straightforward. I don't think you're not increasing the impervious coverage by that much. So, we didn't have a problem with uh we see a need for seage etc like that. Comments here. increasing. I'm not sure if you're proposing any new HBAC equipment on the outside of the building. There would be uh necessary upgrades for the HBAC for the second floor. Keep in mind there's setback requirements for that as well. Okay. You just can't slap it on the side of the house, the generator or something like that.

It would all be within I'm sorry, I did write a followup uh about that. So the um side setbacks does not include we would be okay because it's going to be on the right side of the house which is the bigger side setback but impervious coverage there's one condenser there already second one we will be far short of the impervious coverage and we will not interfere with the setback okay and that's all I have that's all I have really okay thanks we're going to turn over to the board for questions just to prepare you we do have some architects on this board so it's usually not the standard questions so I'll start actually with Mr. your head. Don't have any questions. Okay, they're coming though.

I'm not Seth. Mr. Greek, I'm not an architect. I'm just warming them up. I saw a picture um Sorry, I stole your thunder. That's okay. I saw a picture of the back of the house and it looks like there was supposed to be stairs or a deck or something back here. As part of this project, is there any work being done to to address this? No. No. No proposed work. No.

Any work to the PA area? No. Second just structure. All right. That's all the questions I have. Thank you, Mr. Raymond. Thank you. Going with um Seth's comments about the back, it appears that a deck was proposed at one time. Um judging from the pictures I have of the backyard. Yeah. So, is there

these are pictures I took today when I was visiting the site. The reason I asked the pavers look in uh the PA patio looks in a bit of disarray. So it looks like maybe proposed uh decking was um going to be it looks like the the siding has been cut back and a uh a header was put in for a deck um ledger board. Ledger board. Okay. I just can't have you going around saying the wrong things. No, that's him. He's the architect. So, well, we can't have we can't have testimony um from the audience, but if it's relevant, you can come up. We could swear you in. She's actually the applicant.

I know who she is, but we still need to swear her in and have her testify in the so we can hear even before we get to that. We have the photographs that you're referring to. You took those, did I? I did. Okay. So, hand the whole package to Mr. He needs to be able to see it if we're if you're making comments on it.

Yeah. So board members obviously are encouraged to go and visit properties. Um the decision that the board makes has to be based on a record that's before the board. If if a board member has information that other board members don't have that they're basing their decision on, they need to share that with the board so that everybody on the board has the same information. So let's let Mr. Sarlo look at the photographs and then I want to show them to the applicant as well. Then we're going to mark this package into the record as board one and then we'll all have the same information.

You know the importance of those photographs, I'll tell you why, is the applicant took screenshots of his computer looks like of Google Maps. And I don't know if these photographs actually represent what's out there. I mean, they probably do. I don't know when this screen I don't know when this photograph that Google took was done. 2022, 2025, you know, 10 years ago because sometimes these photographs aren't, you know, last week or within the six months. So, I think in the future we're going to change the checklist once again to say you can't do this at either. It's going to be has to be photographs that were taken by the applicant in the last, you know, couple months, which I don't know what this picture could be related. Well, that's not that typical that that happens, but the first time I've seen this application.

Yeah. Okay. I I just want to count the number. Is our checklist in effect currently? The one we revised? Yeah, we voted on it. So, is it would this application be susceptible to that checklist is my question. Oh, I hear. Yeah, because I don't have color photos and the scale of the architecturals is the wrong scale. It probably came in before and I would hope I think it probably the application came in before we vote on the checklist. We'd have to check the That's fine. I'm not trying to slow it down. I'm just

I count 23 of Scott. Scott, you're going to have a side job. Just passing the color printing too, huh? Mine. Any objection? Oh, no objection. I'm just going to pass the board. You got to see them. I want to make sure that you guys see it so you can comment on them. That's okay. Mr. Raymond, raise your right hand. M. You swear from the testimony about his truth. I do. Did you take all those pictures? I did. I did. When did you take this morning? Maybe 11:00. Were you in my backyard? Yes. Well, we we're going to swear you in the door. We heard the dog barking, but

before you comment, we're going to swear you in. So, we'll have this all on the record. I want to wait for the board. Okay, we're going to wait for the board. We're going to wait for the board to look through the 23 photos. We're good. We're just passing the photos around. Next time, M. Randy, you have you have to make enough copies for it. He will. He will, too. I'm going have to get a siphon. I know. I got more today. She can't comment yet. We got to swear in. So about Well, that's that's what it was for.

He's a new grandpa. He's always taking pictures. Ma'am, witness. Can you please raise your right hand? You swear from the testimony to give the truth about yourself. You put your hand down. Okay. Tell us your name. Spell your last name. Um, my full name is Autumn Meckler. My last name is M E C L E R. And your address? 255 St. Nicholas, Hillsdale, New Jersey 07642. Thank you. Welcome.

Is Scott allowed now to ask his question now that they've seen the photos? I want the photos to come back. To come back. Okay.

You saw them. Did you see them? We'll get them to you. I have my opinion. We'll get them to you. And the leazison needs to see them, too. You guys are voting the upstairs bedroom. You're voting on this one. Where else? No, Stark. You're ultimate for this one. Yeah, I'll go home. Swamped right there. I think we may need you for the second. Okay. You want to take a break though and come back? I didn't bring my laptop. Oh, you can and you'll see those after you see those pictures.

I can go. Yeah, me too. He knows my father-in-law. They're watching the kids right now. You know Rich Meckler. You know the Meckler family. Yeah. Yeah. Should you recuse yourself? Yeah, I'll be sure to tell him about this one. system.

Hey, I finally get to stay. It's a whole new world for me. It's a whole new world. There's no D variance going on here. I know. Then I have to leave. But for this one, You're the first mayor that actually had a problem with

Did they make Bob? Did you get him out? Yeah,

that makes sense. But it's it's not

weird stairs. So it's just going to be steps. I think we're good to go. Slide bar. So the question again, oh yeah, you're good. Sorry. Go ahead. So it appears I don't know if there's sliding glass doors uh leading from the house. It looks like a Stephen, what was the name of the not a header, but a

it's it's it looks like a ledger board, but I think it's for they're going to propose it shows only on the rear elevation. It's the only place it shows it. It looks like just a set of of direct opening to the steps that go to the rear yard. If I'm not mistaken, the architect can correct me, but through my experience, I'm right. Correct. There is a sort of set set of stairs. Yeah. It's just they're they're teeing it up to get the stairs a long time.

Yeah. Okay. Um, I don't know if you're needed from this point forward, but was there any seepage pits? Uh, or maybe this is for Chris. Were there any seepage pits? I see a lot of leader pipes coming off of the left side of the house and the right side of the house and the rear of the house. When was there any seepage pits proposed in the application that I no did not see? So, it's not necessary because it's a Yeah, there's no increasing burger that's top top of a motion. Okay. And the just so I understand the three sides, the right side, left side, and rear will be increased by the two and the one and a half feet. Not not the not the rear, not the just the two sides. The front is going to remain the same. Correct.

And the 20 foot existing setback. And there's a covered porch there that's like a threeseason porch. The existing uh setback at the front is 13 13 three uh 35. Correct. Uh, and we're actually putting back the second floor to give that still more space. So that's remaining. You just steming at that count. Correct. Okay. No other further questions. Thank you, Scott. Mr. Rean, you want Mr. Al? Oh, sorry, Mr. Alter. Go ahead. Thank you. He's the birthday boy. Um,

what's the height of the can level from the driveway? Uh, and the front elevation it is noted as 11 ft from the bottom of the extension, right? Um, so do you intend to park cars in the driveway? We don't usually go all the way. Like the driveway is all the way there, but we don't usually go all the way. Right. I see you have the gutter now. Yeah. So that's why is that going to stay or you're moving that? Um, I guess the gutter would stay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So our both of our cars just fit like before the gutter. So Oh, they do. Yeah. Okay. All right. No more.

Okay, Mr. Re. Um, okay. So, we're going um first off, all right, you did not draw all these drawings, correct? Correct. But you fully reviewed them. You're on board of everything that's you see there. Okay. So, with doing a muffin top, basically your candle ring both side, it's Yeah, it's it's technical term, but it's it's legit. Um, that's a real term. No, it's Seinfeld. So, you're doing a two foot canle lever each way with new joys going up there. Um, with that you are bicting a existing masonry flu. I'm sure that is for existing mechanicals in the basement.

Uh, the existing flu I don't have any drawings from the existing. Uh, I do see the new gas uh fireplace. Yeah, but also on the elevation I see that that chimney getting dissected a masonry treatment. Yeah. No, it's getting cut off and getting stuck underneath the canal lever. Correct. My question is is there still mechanicals that need to use that chase? We have not reviewed uh mechanicals or further uh other than the programmatic schematics of it. Okay. Only reason I'm saying that because you have an issue with wherever you vent out with windows. as I'm sure you know that with high efficiency and all that stuff. Um

other than that uh I kind of agree uh with Chris's comment. Just make sure you know once you guys get into the construction documents if it does go that far that there is structural um it is it compromises anything with that with that much load. Uh and then my only other comment is I beg you not to put that second floor bathroom with its plumbing over open air. After this winter you will know why. Okay. Thank you. Um just just to confirm there's no landscaping changes, correct? The application. None. Yes.

Okay. And Miss Mecca, can you speak again to the need for the expansion? So the board's clear why you're asking for this project. Um yes. So right now it's like a twobedroom, like 2.25 I call it. Uh we have two little kids. So right now you have 2.5 bedrooms. Well, I like like it's like one bedroom and like another bedroom and like the room like a small room before you go upstairs. Um, but we have two little kids, so I want it. So, they're going to be used as bedrooms. All three bedrooms. The three bedrooms. Yeah. Okay. For your own family. Okay. Thank you, Dr. Weinberg. No, no questions. Dan,

um, yeah, I I'm glad you mentioned that. That was one of my questions because I don't see existing plans just uh what the layout is currently and how many bedrooms and bathrooms. So um so that was part of my question also along with the fireplace. Um uh the sheds the sheds existing and remaining. It's there. Yeah, it's been there. All the fences are remaining. The fences we've renovated but like they it's the same property line. We got a permit for it. It's not being shaped. Okay. Yeah, it's all the same. Um, no other questions. Okay. Thank you, Mayor Shinfield.

I'm just uh curious. You're going to go out two feet on the side over the driveway. Um, so I technically there it's going to go from 973 to about 773 at a height of 11 ft. Yes. At the height of 11 ft, it will go down two feet. Okay. Um, neighbors are full. They didn't come and testify. I understand that, but I'm always asking, you know, asking Scott's questions about privacy um extending Bushes on on that side. If uh I like my neighbor Dom. He seems nice. He seems good with me.

So, I think he's saying nobody's nobody said anything to you when they received notice or anything. No, we told Dom about it. We told him we were having the hearing and he said, "Good luck." Okay. I don't have any other questions. Okay. Mr. Ki, no questions. Okay. I'm going to open it up to the public. Is there anyone from the public that has a question or a comment about this application? Yes, our attorney has a question. How long have you lived in this? Um, my husband bought it in 2020, I believe, and then his father owned it before. So, we've been there. Yeah. Uh, so like over 10 years, right? Or like close to it.

Do you know how long your in-laws had the house before you? Um, yeah. Maybe like 2015 they bought it, I think. So it was like, yeah, six years. Yeah. Long time or long in my head. How do you know this? This is my dad.

I kind of knew the answers to those questions. That's why I had no clue. So professional. Oh yeah. Interesting. Okay. And Chris, you don't there's no history of this property coming before us for anything. Okay. Okay. Board, any other questions that have come up or professionals? Stephen, I would just ask that you just update, you know, um the survey doesn't really depict what's going on in the plan. I think doesn't show the rear steps going out to the patio. Minor home housekeeping stuff. Nothing outrageous. It's just make sure it reflects. There's nothing worse than the site plans don't match architecturals as everyone would hope they know. That's all. Are these requests or conditions of approval? I

I think it would be a condition for them to get a permit regardless if it got approved. So, they wouldn't be able to have something without a matching B. Okay. So, we don't need to put it in there. Same with the foundation, right, Chris? That would that's not up to the board. Yeah. I'm just confirming. Okay. Any last questions? If not, um I think Are we ready to take a motion? Yeah, I would just uh one condition I would like is that Mr. Slo was at an updated zoning table so I can copy and paste it with my resolution. Yep. Okay. Does anyone ready to make a motion?

I'll take Yeah, I'll make a motion to approve. I think you're doing the right thing for the right reason. You have uh you have the kids, you have a relatively smaller house now, and you're doing something that's a needed a need, not a want. you might want it as well, but it's a needed it's a needed addition because of the children and you have a relatively small first floor and now you're adding the extra bedrooms for the kids. It fits in the neighborhood. Um, as you can see by my 22 pictures. He's a fan. I'm a I'm a fan. So, across the street next door, the houses do have additions. So, for that reason, I um I'd like to make a motion. Motion to approve. Second. Second, Mr. Greet. Vice Chair.

Yes. Secretary Raymond. I'm sorry. Yes. He made the motion. Mr. Halter. Yes. Mr. Freriedman. Yes. Mr. Creed. Yes. Dr. Weinberg. Yes. Council Leon Kleti. Robert, you get to vote. Council. Yes. Paris Shinfield. Yes. Chairwoman Kates. Yes. Motions passed. Thank you. Got your first one, buddy. Congrats. Congratulations. There's that false confidence you need going everywhere else. Yeah. It'll only get easier for you. I love how he told it. You'll become an expert.

Now you can say I've once stood in front of Hillsdale. You said you faced Steven Rear. You succeeded against Steven Rear. Appreciate it. Congratulations. Congratulations. Okay. Thank you for being here. Let me know. I'll if we need you. If it continues, I don't think it will. I'll be watching. Okay. You going home? All right. Thank you, board. We have Okay. Before we move on to our next application, we're going to recuse our our mayor and our council because it's deep might be a little bit heavier. Start charging per pound first. All right, guys. Probably a good idea.

All right. So, mayor and council are accusing themselves and we're going to begin our second application. This is PZO126, Bot 1504, lot 446 Florence Street. So, I don't hope I'm saying your name right. Elona Bow Bow, please correct me. Kim and Kevin, single home family home edition. Toner's still wet.

Come on. Have a look at the uh 17 photo amateur photographers got. That's not his. That's not his. That's the other option. No, no, no, no. This is That's new. Oh, those are new. Oh, no. He went to both places today, buddy. I did. Scott had a lot of time on his hands today. Beautiful sunny day. He took exam. Yes, sir. Put on the record that I do work in Old Japan and Mr. Greyel is the engineer in which I have worked with for soil moving and stuff. So just putting that on the record, but I work with a lot of engineers and that's just the case. I'm sure the applicant has no problem with me being on this.

Okay. Thank you, Mr. All right, council. Why don't you introduce yourself? Thank you. We have more photos to review on board.

All right. Good evening, Madame Chair, members of the board, professionals, and uh the mayor and council leazison left. So, u my name is Fred Gats. I represent uh the applicant Alona Bong and Kim and Kevin Cretz. Uh my offices are at 167 Main Street in Hackinack. Uh this is in reference to 46 Florence Street, Hillsdale, uh block 1504, lot 4. Um actually uh fairly similar uh circumstances. They're actually neighbors from the last application. Uh so same neighborhood. Um same pictures. Uh

no the same. Um the uh the applicant has applied for variance relief from the zoning code with regard to the applicant's proposed construction of a 462 square foot primarily second floor addition to the existing structure. Uh converting the existing 3bedroom two bath structure to a four bedroomedroom three bath structure at 46 Florence Street. Uh we're requesting C1 variance relief of 31.09 09% imperous coverage where 30% is permitted and requesting D4 variance relief of 38% floor area ratio where 35% is permitted. Uh essentially um the lot is flat. Uh it's in the same neighborhood surrounded by other twostory uh homes. It's an arbor zone 7500 square foot uh lot and um this house also has uh been passed down from uh generation to generation and the um the applicant has two daughters who are currently sharing a room so they can have a playroom and they're in need of another bedroom and another bathroom. So, they uh love it here in Hillsdale and they'd like to stay and um they just need to accommodate uh their growing family and expand the second floor. Um at the same time, they've tried to stay as close to the requisite code and by the least intrusive means as is constructively possible, which you will see from the professional testimony. Um, and as you can see from the fairly dimminimous uh relief requests,

um, we believe the applicant is entitled to relief as the strict application of the code would result in peculiar and exceptional practical difficulties to or exceptional and undue hardship upon the applicant. Uh, not granting relief would inhibit the extent to which the property can be used. The proposed use will promote the general welfare of the community and relief can be granted without substantial detriment to the public good and without substantially impairing the intent and purpose of the zone plan and the zoning ordinance. Um, if the board has any preliminary questions, uh, welcome them. Otherwise, I'd like to call my architect. Yes, please call your architect.

All right, please come forward. Raise your right hand to this one. I do. Please state your name by your last name and give us your business. My name is Kevin Brody. I work for Susan Berman architecture at 496 uh North umberland Road in Tene, New Jersey. Are you a registered architect? I'm registered in New York and Connecticut. Susan um is registered in New Jersey. She was not able to appear tonight because it's the last night of Passover. Mine aren't raised, but it's Susan.

I don't have any objections to the way he's testifying architecture. It's like science. Mostly what he's going to testify is actually not architectural expertise. It's facts. What's on the plan? I don't think we've run into this issue. I have not run into this issue board, but that's the general. So you you feel you can comply answer all the questions that you see you see what may be raised correct

I do I I I have a four-year degree in architecture from University of Buffalo um 1989 um I appear before boards in Pamis Tene New Milford Bergenfield Whiteoff um and I'm sure there's a few others okay board how we feel accept this witness yes okay thank You're not sure? Yeah, I'm not sure. What's your concern now? I would have been punted off of in front of a board if I wasn't licensed in that state. Well, I that's why I'm asking legal,

but I mean New York and New Jerseyy's building code is building code. It's international. And so Mark's statement, what he's testifying to is is schematic design. He's not

there's no legal problem with having a planner not licensed in our own state testify before us. So the the the rule of evidence on expert testimony is uh you can provide expert testimony based on knowledge, training and experience. Um there are some areas of law that lensure is critical and required to be admissible. So for example, valuation questions in tax court real estate agents are allowed to testify. you have to be a licensed person, but there's not a rule like that for and also the rules of evidence don't strictly apply in zoning planning or

in my experience. If you're not licensed, you can talk about the plans, but you can't express any payments. You just strictly say yes, the plan shows this plan shows that past that you can't because I've had this happen myself. So, you just can't go beyond that. We're not going to get into like true architecture. this beam will support this way. I I could see it being I mean as long as there's nothing legal ramifications then I guess if there's anything that needs to be validated we could carry the hearing if if I mean if I'm just saying if something comes up that's

I'm sure all he's going to testify to is this is why this room is here. He can be giving testimony as an architectural designer in the state of New Jersey and he's under the umbrella of the firm owner. So that's really what goes on. Okay. And it's not like he's submitting for a permit. It's going to be sealed by that. But as long as there's nothing legal then even with the Dvarian. Yeah. Normally Susan would testify. It's just it's Passover. Last night of Passover tonight. I understand where Passover is here too. So um Okay. Well, Dan, what do you want to say something? So the the licenses in the other states are in good standing. They are. Yeah. I've been licensed in New York for 25 years and Connecticut for 20 years. So

Okay. So we'll proceed this time. Thank you for taking our questions. Thank you. Did you answer? I did. Okay. Mr. Bro, can you walk us through the plans? Sure. So um let me just bring You can pick up the microphone and how you

Okay. So, the um the Cretzes have two daughters and right now they're sharing a bedroom. Cape Cod house, two bedrooms upstairs. There's one bedroom downstairs. It's being used as a study. Um girls are sharing one bedroom. They really want them to have their own bedrooms. They're teenagers now. Um, so the plan is to remove the whole second floor of the Cape Cod as well as the roof over the garage below. Um, we're removing most of the walls on the first floor except for the center bearing wall. Uh, and then on drawing A1 is the foundation plan. We're building out crawl space additions on the front and rear of the basement. And then on the first floor, First floor shows um the outline of the existing house and we'll be adding on to the rear and the front. Um as well as a small mudroom off the back of the garage with um with bedrooms above that. Uh the existing first floor is 867 ft. We're proposing a 420 ft addition on the first floor and uh a small uh entry portico that's uh 4T by 10'6. Um the first floor would have a larger kitchen um a larger living room and uh a renovated study um along with a bathroom and and like I said the mud room in the back. They do plan to add a patio on the rear. There is an existing patio that's going to get demolished. And then uh the second floor, second floor is all new. Uh master

bedroom with a walk-in closet and a master bath on the left side. And then there's a balcony walkway that overlooks the living room below um with a bedroom at the rear. a whole bathroom that would be shared by the three proposed bedrooms. Um they do have um Kevin's mom comes to visit for extended periods sometimes from Florida, so they wanted the extra space for her when she comes up as well. The outside of the house, um Hardy plank stone base on the foundation. Now replacing the garage door with a new garage door. Uh we have a two-story volume on the left side and flanking that is a two-story volume on the right side um connected by a roof in between. And the rear elevation um twotory Hardy plank and asphalt shingle roof. That's side view. Uh on the south side shows the new portico which would be all masonry with uh powder coated aluminum railings and um asphalt roof. And that's uh that's about it.

Get over that to the board. Do you have any other professionals here? Uh yes, we have an engineer. Okay. Um All right. So Chris, we'll start with you for just architecture questions. Probably weren't there, but the discussions with the client in the beginning, did anybody adise the client that the house was going to be going to exceed the F design house and said, "Oh, we're all that." Well, they they they came to us and we designed the floor plan that that they wanted and uh we did tone it down a little bit to to Yes, we knew right away that there was going to be an F issue. And they were told there was an F issue.

Yes. And then we downsized the house a little bit more to try to comply as much as we could. But, you know, they're looking at this also like, you know, they're going to spend a considerable sum of money on this house and uh, you know, they need certain things in it that they need to live as well. So, well, a lot a lot is is is Yes.

So, it isn't that the lot's undersized and I can see well, yes, I can see them being that they are here. lots you know the zoning ordinance is what it is why can't the house can't be sharing at the plans the house is basically demolished the existing block except for a couple walls it's the house difficulty you know shar I think we we did explore it. We would we would lose a bedroom on the second floor which was kind of critical to them that they had the three bedrooms uh I mean the four bedrooms I'm sorry on the second floor. So that was really the main driver of this whole thing.

If if I may my understanding speak into the mic please.

Yeah if I may. And my understanding is that if they were to reduce the uh there would be no feasible way to add a bedroom and a bathroom if they were to reduce to get within the code to reduce 225 ft. They did condense it as much as as constructively possible to be able to accommodate an additional bedroom. Other if they did take 225 square ft over the out uh to get under the F ratio, there would be no constructive way to reasonably make a reasonable size bedroom which would defeat the entire purpose of the application. I'm not going to speak to the interior of the house.

I think these are the types of questions the board's going to ask because obviously you need bedrooms, but it's not literally just bedroom work going on there. There's other considerable changes as well. So, do we have to mark Scott's photos before we ask any more questions? Yeah, I've pre-marked them as board council. Any objection to those photographs? No objection. Mr. Ramy, just to confirm, you took those photographs today. I did. Thank you. Okay, Mr. Group, are you ready? No. Okay. Anybody ready? Mr. Freeman? Yeah.

I I don't see a site plan. Uh can you just make it clear where Single family homes and two family homes are expressly recite plans. I know, but still it's useful. They have a plot. I'm having trouble figuring out where the site Yeah, it's a shows that it shows the dwelling on it. Yeah. We can mark that E1 if you'd like. We have it. Excuse me.

Yeah, Mr. Scrabble's site plan does show the outline of the existing request if you don't mind if we can maybe move that where it's not obstructed. The easel the the one in front. I'm sorry. The one in front of you can put that back where it was. Couldn't see with the easel there. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. So, you can continue if you were answering some. So, yeah, I'm still having trouble figuring out what's new and what's

I think it's probably more clear on my plan because it's um Yeah, let me put this back up. Dan, if you go to the first floor plan architecturals, there's a hard dash line. That's the boundary of the existing footprint. There are Steve, what page is it? It's a 2.0. That's right. A2. There it is. Stop right there. 2.0. Is that what you want?

You want to look at this? So, it looks like standing back.

That's correct. Yeah.

Yeah. So, there's a small protrusion on the left side that we're removing and then adding I think 18 inches on the left side and then get the exact number uh five feet to the rear and roughly uh four feet in the front. Yeah, but it's staggered in the front. So, it's between two and four feet. And is there is there a deck for No. Uh there'll be a stairway in that mud room behind the garage and then that will connect to a grade level patio at the rear. So and the patio is at the same level. The patio is not raised. No, that's a grade level. So it's about four and a half, five feet down below the finished floor.

And so in terms of a hardship, you're not proposing a hardship. Well, property is not a hardship. We'll get to we'll get to planning. I think I mean I'm assuming that's more of a planning topic. Um, yes. The rest of my comments are for the and we can come back to you if uh something comes up. Dr. Weinberg, I have the same question. I didn't see it as a hardship as a as a seed. Well, that this is going to be a planning when we get to planning. I have no questions. Okay. Can you confirm how many trees are being removed?

Zero for sure. Zero. Yeah, there's no I think there's one tree on the front yard that we're not touching. Um there's no trees anywhere else on the property. Okay.

Are we touching those? We can swear you in if you want to comment. That's okay. Yeah, Mr. I think because it's just the just the architect. I'm sorry. I'm belittling myself at the moment. Okay, we'll wait on that. Okay. Sorry, getting a little ahead as Stephen said. Um, so who's talking? Stephen, your turn. Okay. So, um to go on top of what Mr. Satil is saying, um has I mean as this client comes to you and you are I mean in most burrows they would consider this new construction with the amount of demolition that's taking place. Yeah.

Because it's percentage based in a lot of burrows.

Uh not here, but um it's a new construction. Was there any talk of actually studying a new construction plan that would conform opposed because the the cost that they're putting into it is tremendous. I do agree. Um, and they are bringing down to almost first floor deck entirely. I mean, you could say you're leaving a garage wall, but every time someone says they're leaving it, they'll save it and then they tear it down and rebuild it. Um, with that, the layout and the the F, which is in question for 225 ft of overage, uh, you have open spaces, you know, you have a a balcony looking over an open living room that that could easily be taken and the bedroom could be shifted there. There are ways. I I don't I don't really accept an answer of there is no way to do it. It just may not be the way you did it or your firm did it. Um so with that said, was there or is it just the client wanted it this way and that's what we're

No, I don't think it was that. Yeah. So my client plans on building this himself. He is a contractor. He's going to, you know, so and there is considerable cost savings and not having to excavate for a new foundation, keeping the existing foundations in good condition until you know concrete block. This house was constructed in the 50s. Um, they are going to keep a lot of the bearing points intact. We're keeping the bearing center bearing walls intact. So, there is a bit of savings I would say. Uh, the ceiling height of the basement currently. Uh, 7 feet I believe. Let me see. Sorry, it's on there. Yeah, it's roughly seven feet. 72 foot with all crawl space additions. Correct.

Um, okay. All right, those are my only architectural questions. Okay, Ed. Um, first of all, I wouldn't call a 3% difference the minimus, although it's not overwhelming either, but I wouldn't call it the minimus. Um, how do you intend to handle a storm water issue? I think that's engineering. Engineer, we're going to get to engineering for that. Okay. All right. I'll work on Thanks, Ed. Scott. Yes. All right. Can you tell me the square footage of the uh house as it exists? Sure. Now a little bit more.

So the existing first floor is 900 uh 867 square ft and the go back to the demolition plans. Um second floor existing is 625 square ft. And what's that? Do you have a total there? Uh eight. I don't have a total handy, but it's uh 895 plus 625. So 14 15 15 and change. Did you say the first floor is existing at 895 or 867?

Uh the existing first floor is what I say 8.95 on that plan and then this plan to remain is 8.67. I'm sorry. So it's 895 is the existing because we're demolishing the side piece. That's a good point. 8.95 first, 625. So 895 first, 625 section. Roughly 1500, correct? Okay. 1500 square foot as it sits now. The expected square footage or the square footage after the additions and the demolition, yep, is uh 1287 first floor and then uh 1220 second floor. So 20 roughly 2500 square ft.

So you're going from 1500 to 25. Correct. Okay. Um, how many bedrooms are existing in the pro uh in the house now? Uh, there are three bedrooms, one down and two up. One down, two up. And the proposed plan that you presented, I didn't get a chance to count. How many bedrooms would uh how many bath would be um would be in the new proposed addition? Uh, four bedrooms up. I'm sorry. I thought I said bath. Oh, I'm sorry. How many bathrooms? Bathroom. You said one down, two up.

Oh, okay. So, bedrooms right now. Bathrooms. We have one bathroom on the first floor and one bathroom on the second floor. So, two total. So, you have two total. Yes. And the new addition. New addition. We're going to have uh one down and two up. So, three total. So, you're going from two to three. Yes. Correct.

Okay. Um when I look at the uh uh A2.0 you're mentioning the demolition of the first floor, second floor and first floor, second floor, and basement demolition plan that now you said you're going to leave some uh bearing walls for the most part. Is everything going to be stripped down to the the deck the first floor deck except for the center bearing wall. We're going to keep the center bearing wall intact because that is u you know loadbearing onto the basement beam.

And when you said basement demolition plan if you're if you said down to the first floor, how is the basement demolition going to take place? There's no basement demolition. The basement's going to remain. This says basement demolition plan. Basement demolition plan. just has some uh the platforms on the outside of the structure being removed and that's pretty much it. So, does that hold true with the first and second or are they being dem It's the same wording. First floor demolition, second floor demolition, basement demolition. Right. So, the second floor demolition, complete demolition. Yes. And then the first floor demolition pretty much complete demolition, although we're going to leave the garage walls and the center bearing wall intact.

Okay. And talking about the impervious coverage, um, we're waiting in the trees. Yeah. Okay. Talking about the impervious coverage, um, have you tried to resource every possible option from a 31.009 proposed um, to the 30 that's permitted? Have you looked at maybe reducing the size of a patio? Um, have you looked at any possible to alleviate that variance? Is there anything more that you can do to reduce the impervious coverage?

I we eliminate the patio that would reduce it but or make it conform but um they they want a patio in the back right now. So house want the patio. It's got I think a compromise of some sort should be made. If you have an extra bathroom or an extra uh living room I I mean an extra bedroom. I understand the wants, but there's also needs that have to be taken into account as well. How bad you want it and how, you know, if the ordinance is calling for 30%, you're up to 30 31 and change. How can we get to where we need to be? That's that's really a question and a comment at the same time other than I have no other uh no further questions. Okay,

Mr. Great. In the area where the to Scott's point, the area where the patio is depicted at the back of the house, is there anything there? Now, there's a concrete patio. Concrete pavers. Concrete to pavers. Yes. And would you in fact need to eliminate that entire PA patio in order to bring the impervious coverage down under 30%. I believe we would. What's 81? Cut it in half. Pers out of it, not 82. We can talk about that with engineering if Yeah, I think that's probably more a question for Mr. Okay.

And I just want to be clear, you're adding one bedroom and one bathroom upstairs or is there more rooms being added upstairs? The net ad is two bedrooms and one bathroom. Two bedrooms. Right now there's two bedrooms and one bathroom. downstairs. There's two bedrooms and essentially two bedrooms downstairs. I we're calling one a study, but there is a closet there. So, I guess officially that would be consider existing, right?

Oh, yeah. So, I'm just looking at an addendum. It says 462 square feet primarily second floor addition to existing structure converting three-bedroom, two bath structure to a fourbedroom, threebath structure. Uh yeah. So that's that's correct. Is that that's accurate? Yes, that's what you said. Yeah, I don't think that's accurate. What? No, no, there's two closets there, but they're being this is being used as a study. It's not a Yeah, there's an existing study and the study would be relocated, but there is a bedroom on the uh the first floor, correct? They're going to use and there's two bedrooms. They're going to use as a guest room without a closet. So, by code, it doesn't fit the standards of bedroom without a closet.

So, you're adding a bedroom and a bathroom upstairs. two bedrooms upstairs and one bathroom upstairs. And are the size of the rooms changing on on the first floor? Are the sizes of the room changing on the first floor? Yes, they're increasing. Correct. Yeah, right now the kitchen's tiny. Um and uh they want to get the laundry, you know, have a laundry room upstairs. Right now it's in the basement. Um one second. So there's a laundry room in the back. a walk-in pantry and and a larger kitchen. The kitchen is really tiny right now. So So larger kitchen, larger study,

uh larger study, um adding a walk-in pantry, um and a larger living room. So all the rooms are being increased on the first floor. That's correct. Along with the additional bedrooms and bathroom. Just wanted that clear. Yes. No, absolutely. architecture but architectural questions. Yeah, thank you. Thanks, Dave. Great.

All right, hold on one second. Let me give me one second to get my calculator. I apologize. No, I I think maybe you were just doing the two floor areas and not the uh so 1220 257 first and second and then with the portico and the garage. That's where you get the 2851 ft.

302 and 42. 302 + 42 equals uh Yeah, that's 20 + So, yeah, that's correct. Okay, so 2,851 ft is the floor area that's proposed. When you take that to the lot size, that's where you get your 38% at AR. And that's in, you know, that's including the port open portico, right? 40 some odd square feet for the open portico plus the garage. Is that being increase from the 1500 square foot that you mentioned before? Existing was 1,500 and now the new FA uh uh 285 for the first floor area

current which was the 895 plus 625 is roughly 1500. Yes. That's correct. Yeah, we're going up to 2851. Correct. Can I ask, and I apologize, it's probably written down somewhere in here. Uh, what's the current F percentage?

Yeah, we can't we when he comes up, we'll clarify this so he can we can swear. All it says is required. Correct.

Correct.

So, did he answer your question? No. Oh, the plan. No, I was just wondering what the existing F percentage is. Existing F is uh what is the existing? You have it on your thing, right? No, you just require it. Oh, okay. I'll I'll do that right now. Hold on. I thought that was 1520. plus five. So it's 1825

divided by 75.243

24.3%. Yeah, that's correct. I had to do that. I made the calculation for sure. And just one more question. Um, were you able to do an analysis or see how this floor area or floor area ratio compares to some of the other houses in the neighborhood? We did not. No. Okay, that's all I have for now. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. And board. Any other questions for the architect? Okay. Um, I'll open it to the public. Is there any from the public that has questions for the architect on the testimony you heard? Not not the mayor. Seeing none, I'll close the meeting to the public. Would you like to bring up your next witness? Uh, yes. I just have one clarification just because I think the board members might have been under the wrong impression. You're eliminating Well, I'll ask them. It's true that you're eliminating a bedroom on the first floor. Is that correct? That is correct. Well, we're eliminating Yes. one bedroom. adding two on the second floor, but we're eliminating one on the first floor. Correct. Yeah.

Okay. You're not renovating the house. You're raising the entire house and building a new house other than other than foundation. So, you know, when you talk about limiting this, it it's it's not a gut. It's not an interior renovation and dwelling to keep the the house itself. The house is gone. What what the demolition is off, you're basically building a new house. So, I don't know what the comparison about what was there before to what's there. It doesn't make any difference anymore. The old house is gone. You agree, Mr. I I see it all the time. Yeah. Yeah. So, I don't know that you make those comparisons here. It doesn't seem It's not It's not apples to apples if that's what you're correct as my professors would always say.

Is the study does that? Tech technically they both would, right? Because they have closets. So, but it's one's being used as a study and one's being used as a bedroom. So, and it has windows. Well, they none of these because they're all It's an old house from the 1950s, so they're all small double hung. So, none of the none of the windows meet egress requirements on the existing house. There's nothing against them. If it grandfather, yeah, we all know you go to sell the house, you throw that closet in there and

technically it's a four bed. Technically, it's a fourbedroom house as a realtor would list it, right? It's got four closets, but there's nothing against you doing so. So, therefore, it's not affecting the F regardless or the impervious coverage. So, therefore, okay, let's move on to engineering.

Hi, please raise your hand. You swear from testimony about the truth. I do. Please state your name, spell your last name, and give us your business address. Tom Scrabble S as in Sam K R A B as in boy L E excuse me business address 65 Ramapo Valley Road in Mawa.

Uh could you take us through your uh qualifications? Yes. Have a bachelor's in civil engineering 1987 University of Delaware. I've been in the industry ever since. I got my license in New Jersey in 1992. um New York, I think a year or so after that. I've testified before many, many boards in northern New Jersey, southern New York State over the last 35 or so years. Have you appeared before here before? I have. Not often, but yeah, I I believe you have. Okay. Thank you. We We'll accept you.

Thank you. Thank you. Uh Mr. Scrabble, can you take us uh I'm sorry. I see you put the proposed uh dwelling in SEC plans up. Is that Yes. correct? Calling that E1 or All right. So, just for clarity, the plan that is on the easel to say we have in our application date is June 25th, 2025. Yeah, there should be two revisions just above the main signature. I was going to ask you. The second revision is 9:1525. That's the latest. Just want to make sure and you're also familiar with Mr. Satil's letter of January 29th, 2026. Yes.

Can you take us through the project and how you address the issues relevant to Mr. Statiel's uh letter?

Sure. So, the the lot's located on the east side of Forest Street. We're just I guess it's south of St. Nicholas. Um, as you've already heard, it's a 3500 foot lot. Um, proposed significant renovation to the home. Um, as part of that, we're we're changing the the stairs and the walkway in the front. We're removing a concrete patio in the rear. Um, building a PA patio in the rear. Um, all of the the walkway in the front and the driveway will be made to be pavers. Um, we are providing stormwater management for the entire roof. Right now, the the roof leaders just run off onto the lawn. Um so from a stormwater management point stormwater management standpoint uh it will be a significant improvement um because all of the roof will be discharged to the pit. Um one of Mr. Statiel's comments was because it's essentially a rebuild um more than just the roof should be collected. The other impervious areas should be collected as well which which we agree to. That's that's not a problem. Uh we'll revise the the cage fit size to accommodate those additional areas and show the additional piping on on a revised plan should we should we get that far. Um one thing I did want to mention because I don't think it was part of the prior testimony. Um obviously we're asking for an F variance. Um but we do meet all of the the bulk criteria as far as yards front side rear and the building coverage. So, the footprint of the house isn't oversized. Um, because of the way it's it's being designed inside, it's it's slightly over the F, which I only reason I bring it up is it's kind of unique. Normally, when you have an F variance, it's it's common that you would have a building coverage variance as well. In this case, we don't. Um, the other variance we're we're requesting is impervious coverage. We are 82 square

feet over. Um, but as you know, the pavers are taken at 50%. So really the other than the the dwelling, which I I realize that's up for grabs also, but other than the dwelling, if we were to reduce something, um, the driveway is only 18 ft wide, so we want to keep that so we can get two cars in side by side, um, it would really have to be the walkways or the patio. So we would, again, because it's taken at 50%, we wouldn't have to take 82 square feet out. We'd have to take 164. And the main patio in the rear is is I don't think it's even quite 300. Sorry. It's 24. The main patio is 24 by 12. Um, so 288 square feet. So to take 64 square feet out of it, we'd be basically cutting that in half. Um, as far as tree removal, there's no large trees being removed. There's a 20-inch pine in front, a 30-inch in the rear, um, 4in pine on the north side. Those are all staying. There's a relatively large and I guess old mature shrub row along the southerntherly property line um, that will be affected by the construction. Um those were proposed and they're labeled on the drawing to be removed and replaced.

So how many in all trees coming down? These are they're called 6 in pines on the plan and there are 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11. But the intent is to replace all of them on the property. Yes. Where are they going to be replaced? Basically in that same location. We just we're we're changing the grading slightly. um to accommodate the new patio and we have a 11t setback where we're putting a proposed walkway in. So the trees would be disturbed by the construction. So we're showing them to be removed and and

they still have to do a two for one though. They look like they're low top. No, it is a shrub and they're they're cut kind of as a shrub row at the or a hedro at the top. I would guess they're 15ish, but that's approximate. No, right. Unless they're replaced at the same height. Yeah, we can't replace them at the same height. That's that's not practical. So there's a restitution that that will need to be made to the tree fund. Yeah.

Which we would stipulate to these. Are they really trees? I'm just looking Maybe I'm looking at the wrong photos. They look like a hedro to me. But it is a hedro, but they're large. It's very old. And I think I'm looking at I'm really getting one on the the back corner. The white vinyl Scott's pictures. Where are Scott's pictures? Um, it's the one says adjacent property 124 Clinton Aav. Easily get the photographs that we submit. Yeah, I'm just looking at I'm just wondering where Scots are. I mean, they're literally shown as 6 in. So, some are probably a little smaller, some are probably a little bigger, but whatever the replacement requirements are based on what's being upright or spreading taxes or, you know,

we're willing to agree to that. Mark, do you have my pictures? I don't. I don't know. Do you have the pictures that we uh marked? No. The one he took? Are they back on your file? What's in your blue folder? And I I might have said this already. I don't know if I did, but there's the other file. Any of any of the other comments in Mr. Til's letter, we will stipulate to those as well. So, it says screening screening for a generator.

Yeah. What the applicant's proposing there is um like a boxwood hedge around it. That's okay. Okay. So, street curbs and if we're going to show replacements on a revised drawing and the drainage on a revised drawing, we will clarify that. Okay. Do you have a drainage pit in the back as back as well as the front? We're only showing one in the front, but again, if if we're going to pick up these other areas, that could conceivably change. I'd like to have another uh pit in the back if Yeah, we're doing a large we're doing a thousand gallon in a 10 by 10 stone bed.

So, this is like 2500 gallons worth of storage. We could probably get away with two smaller pits and break it up. Okay. Is that better, Chris? Yeah. Yeah. Better as far as Yes. One question on the replacement plan. It shows the sewer going out the back of the house. You have anything where that senator sewer goes? I don't I hope there's no septics in the back of the house. Oh, you're going to find a decommission. I don't know you. I don't know what they did with the sewer. So, in any case, we need to clean out the sewers got to be run out to the front. Just stipulation.

The architecture will actually note that they scope and read. It's on the basement plan. No, the architecture I saw it on the basement plan. It says it says to reroute existing sewer line. We would stipulate we run the sewer to the front. That's fine. Okay. So, board members, any questions for the engineer on anything that hasn't been mentioned? Scott? Yes. Thank you. Uh the plan that uh you submitted says existing PA uh driveway. I'm looking at the plan. And is that asphalt or driveway existing? No, it's it's proposed to be it has to be pavers to meet the coverage numbers we have. So that's what we're proposing. Okay. It is existing asphalt. It is okay.

At least most of it. It says existing. Yeah. There's kind of an area in front of the garage that has papers architectural plan that does say existing paver track. Yeah, I think that's in uh right hand side which should be the south of the property. It says new 36 inch paver walkway. Right now you have uh stepping stones blue stone correct would you be I don't know what the calculations would be but instead of putting pavers there Chris you might answer this better is that going to increase or decrease by having two by it's going to decrease so that's with the current percentage of the walkway no what's the current coverage percentage existing

I don't have that exact number handy. I'm sorry. I know I have it somewhere, but it's not on the drawing. Um I mean the maximum round numbers were add, you know, the addition footprint is about a little over 400 that we're adding. Um and the walkway on the side and the patio. So we're probably adding somewhere about between 550 600 feet, something like that. and the size of the patio that's existing in the back which is cement that's going to be I'm sorry this patio in the back the cement yes that's going to be removed papa

what size is that patio in comparison to your 24 by 12 PA patio yeah it's that's why I asked for my pictures it shows the old patio I'd like to know how how the new patio sizes compared to the old it's not a rectangular shape you can see it's it's the lighter gray line all the existing features are lighter gray. So, and this is is an estimate, but it extends beyond our patio on the north side. It extends beyond our patio on the east side and then we are creating a larger area on the the south. Okay. So, they're probably very similar in size because it's a deficit on the it's basically a swap. Okay. Yeah.

Okay. That's the original survey. Might help you. Oh, thank you. Okay. I don't have any other questions unless this is now again the tree time. Meredith. Well, yeah. Do you have another question about the trees? I do. Have we resolved the fact that we're going to be putting in um what size tree? What type of tree? Uh these are coming down. I guess the root system and stump system stump is going to be removed. Did we discuss how many trees they're going to have to put in 11 at the same height or else it's going to be a two for one. Okay. Not in that area. Yeah. Okay. And the only thing I'll double check again, assuming we're coming back for another meeting, is

the fact that they're all they're all shown as 6 in. I was there tonight and I know some of them are not. So, some of them are probably not covered by the regulation. So, we might not need 22 replacements. We might need 18. But whatever the number is, it is. And we'll we'll show it on the next drawing. Okay. And there was a dog, but that had to be replaced. Do you know where that's going to be replaced too, which is somewhere on property? You're going to be transplanting the dogwood. Oh, that Yes. Yes. I'm sorry. And I'll discuss that with the owner and we'll show a location next time. And providing that if it doesn't make it, you'll make res or replace. Yes. Two to one for the dog if it dies.

I thank you. And I have no other questions. Okay. Thanks. Ed, did you have a question for engineer? Yes. Uh, so I'm correct in assuming there's no deck or shed being added. No. Okay. Um, no, I for one think this is a big improvement in the house and it can only increase the value and make it much more of a home for a grown family. So, good. No question, Stephen.

Uh, just a little housekeeping on your uh zoning legend. The minimum sideyard both you have required 30 I believe it's 22.5 and proposed you have 31.6 six. That is not what you have. Are those percentages? Those are the percentages of the width. Yeah. So, the width is 75 ft. 30% of that is 22.5. Right. So, both of these numbers are percentages, though. So, I'll change them to feet so it's clearer. You know what I mean? You have required and it says 30 30% of 75 is your 20. Yeah. Oh, and you're you have a percentage. I apolog Yeah, I got you now. Okay. Totally. I'll put the feed numbers there as well.

All right. Well, that's leading to my next thing. So, hold up. Um, on the north side, you have the addition of it's like a a foot and a half addition right up to that property line, right up to the setback at 12.5. All right, Chris, there's the overhang found on that to the extent of the house. All right, so that would be variance. The variance for what? The addition, the foundation line is right up to the 12 and a half setback, but it's not including the one foot overhang which the elevations are showing me. So therefore, it encroaches on the combined. Interesting. But it might not because the other side is 11.2. So it might just clean it up. That's basically Yeah. Okay.

Housekeeping. So measure everything to Well, yeah. Because if we don't know the number the variances, we can't vote on anything. So just to clarify for my own knowledge I apologize. So it would be the eve line to so even if it's a six inch eve it counts any there's no minimum yeah no uh no allowable projection into sideyard or

Stephen anything else uh I do not believe so I think everyone's touched on and everything. I mean to to bring it down to the impervious in which we're looking for I mean I understand because we already are generous with the 50% for pavers. Um I think it should definitely be clearly noted that asphalt driveway to be removed and replaced with pavers on this. Uh if it does go that way and proposed walkway just it just says typical. Let's make sure it says PA if it has to be. Yeah. I mean, obviously this has to be clarified and cleaned up before we so we can't vote this evening. Um, I would really urge you to take into consideration the board's concerns because you're hearing them now. Mr. Leeman,

um, Mr. Scream, want you to provide planning testimony also? No. Council, do you have a planner? We do not. Well, we have our planner and we have a planning report. So, we will be um considering planning significantly. Yeah. As you know, you need five members to approve the key areas. Understood. I would strongly suggest that after the cleaned up plan that you bring. Okay. Understood. Doc, anyone down here have any engineering questions?

Just comment that I would like to see you're going from 24% uh FI to 38%. And that does bother me. I mean, I was in K House and I know what it's like. That's where I live to go from 24 to 38. I'm telling you, it concerns me. Thank you. Yeah.

Um I'm just curious. So, uh you're showing the previous coverage truck the proposed dwelling is 1,657 square ft. Um I think the architectural was showing, 1564. There's about 100 square foot difference and you're saying that did not include I was assuming that that was the difference.

Uh yeah's there's something yeah the numbers on my drawing are all you know limit of foundation. So my my assumption was that you know the floor area numbers are calculated a little bit differently and that was the discrepancy but I I can't speak to it more than that. Yeah I would think for uh intensive purposes the bulk table have everything not say C architectural because even on the architecturals the breakdown is not too clear for the general. Yeah I was there's two different values that

the breakdown of which I'm sorry I didn't hear that. Yeah, just have the F breakdown on your all one table. Let's not make people go from page I mean, you know, I'm putting elbows in people and 24 by 36 pages, but just a nice clean thing because it it's a numbers game. They don't lie. What did I say? I said I can't No, just one footprint number and then an existing column required existing and proposed is the the means and method we like to see. Okay. Um, at this time I'm going to open the meeting to the public. Is there anyone from the public that has questions, engineering questions about this application? Now be the time.

Seeing none, I'll close the meeting to the public just because our planners here this evening. Um, I know we're not going to go through all the planning tonight, but um, I want to make sure the points you brought up you feel have been addressed or at least the applicants clear on what questions you had. Yeah, I absolutely and I think uh I I would echo the recommendation of the board for the applicant to get a professional planner for the next hearing. Um this is a D4 F variant. So as the board noted, you need five affirmative votes of the board. So if there are full complement, you still need five. If there's five members here, you need all five. Um a D4 variance differs from a D1 use variance.

I should probably swear, shouldn't I? Do you sound swear from testimony? I do. David Novak, NOVAK, professional planner with Burgess Associates.

Okay, next time stop me quicker. Um, this is a D4 variance. So, it's it differs from a D1 variance wherein we don't need to see whether or not this site is particularly suited for this use, right? Because we know that this site is zoned for residential dwellings. What we need to see is whether or not the site can accommodate the issues associated with exceeding the floor area ratio. So things that we typically would look at would be storm water, things that we look at would be parking and also some of the bulk standard as well. So there is discussion tonight regarding the need for impervious coverage variance. However, the applicant may be coming back to address that as well as whether or not a sideyard setback variance is required for those eaves. So those are some of the problems that we would associate with floor area ratio being exceeded than what's otherwise uh permitted. The other important thing to keep in mind is that we still need to address the negative criteria wherein the applicant needs to demonstrate that there's no substantial detriment to the public good and no substantial impairment to the intent of the zone plan. Your master plan does have pretty specific language regarding how you want residential development to look like. Your 2003 master plan had recommended the adoption of floor area ratio in order to control the bulk of new homes and you did that following the adoption of your 2003 master plan. You recently adopted a 2022 re-examination report which talks about maintaining the land use patterns and characters of the established single family neighborhoods as a priority for the burrow and to maintain the density, scales and characters of existing family zones. So, one of the questions I had earlier was how does this proposed house compare with some of the surrounding area and the other dwellings in the neighborhood. Um, one of the things I would recommend the applicant look at and provide maybe an exhibit or additional testimony is how's this house going to fit into the neighborhood? Um, is it going to be overpowering? Is it going to be larger than everything else

there? um your re-examination report talks about maintaining the character of your single family neighborhoods and maintaining those scales. So that's important information that this board is going to have to consider when it looks at this variance specifically with the negative criteria. So those are just some of the things I would tee up for for the next hearing. So again, I would recommend that the applicant do get a planner, consider those issues. That way we can examine both the positive and the negative criteria with this application with all the information you guys need to make an informed decision. Thank you. That was very helpful. Appreciate it.

Do you like to open it to the public again? All right. So it sounds like we're carrying this application. Well, our next we're booked for a while with significant hearings. So Tanya That's I presume you're adjourning it. Okay. I mean, the next night we really have open is June 23rd. We have big big applications in May. Um, like Broadway applications, you know, like commercial applications.

So, can you check that date of June 23rd? Otherwise, we could put you on 2nd June 11th, but it's going to be a while till we get we would get to you. Chris, do you what's the 24 Brookside place? Is that's a residence, right? I can almost see the numbers coming in front of his face. He's trying to think about it. I know it's not a site plan. I'm trying to remember what uh

I'm just trying to figure out how I know.

Let me No, no, not that cold as that one where they 24. That's not that one. That was Washington and whatever. No. What's the one you're looking for? 24 Brookside. Yeah, I have a 24 booksh 24. I have it right. I have this. It's a variant. Wait, let's see. Oh, I know who that is. That's Zara's. That's um I know what this is. It's a D. It's a D. It's Bruno. So, Bruno. Yeah. It'll take It'll take I would take the 23rd.

Yeah, I would take the 23rd because we have another D on that. I'm the chairman of the zoning board in Washington Township. So, are you man? All right. Okay. So, all right. So, this matter is going to be then adjourned to June 23rd at 7:30. Is that okay? Is that work for your professionals? That's kind of a conflict even 23rd will work. All right. So, you consent to an extension time tonight? Absolutely.

All right. Right. So, this matter is going to be adjourned June 23rd at 7:30 p.m. in this room. There'll be no further notice either in the mail or by publication or posted anywhere else. This is the public's continued uh notice announcement. Thank you. Thank you for Thank you for your time. We appreciate it. Thank you, professional. Thank you for your time. I'm glad I didn't make the joke about being not being undefeated like the last Thank you. Oh, no.

Okay. Okay. Um, thank you so much, board. I'm going to open the meeting one more time to the public to see if anyone has any issues or items for the board. Seeing none, I'll close the meeting to the public. In terms of discussion items, it's been a very busy spring for us because we are yet again celebrating a board birthday at a board meeting. Two in a row. Uh you guys skipped mine and this time it is Mr. Ed Alter and we'll throw in Steven Rear and also celebrate birthday but not at a meeting. I am as old as Mr. Still has been in for practice. And you are in Hilton Head. 45. I know,

Ed. You really deserve a a toast. How many years have you been on our board? 21. Wow. 21 years. Wow. Through. Congratulations. Through how many mayors? Probably six or seven marriages. Mayors. Mayors. Six or seven mayors. And uh you definitely always say you're the heart and mind of the board. And we're so appreciative of you. So, we don't have a big cake for you, but we do have something for you. Who's gonna lead us singing? Oh, we got a happy birthday to you.

Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday, dear. Happy birthday to you. Yay. Very good. Just so you know, I was originally appointed by Yes. Yes. Yes. We're just We're still on the record, so we can't speak yet. All right. Thank you everyone. Our next meeting will be Tuesday, April 28th, right here, bro Council Chambers. Do I have a motion to adjourn? Motion. Thank you. Second. Second. All right. Thank you so much, board. Thank you, everyone. Good night.

Thank you. Yeah. Well, they kind of