City Council - Regular Meeting

catch up after trial and it was sketchy, but we have All right, we'll call the meeting to order. Oh, okay. Do I have the invocation here? Almighty God, send down upon those who hold just who hold office in this city the spirit of wisdom, compassion, and justice. Grant that with steadfast purpose we may faithfully serve our community, seeking the common good, protecting the vulnerable and promoting the well-being and harmony of all who dwell here. Amen. Amen. Pledge.

Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Okay, clerk will note uh standing clerk will note all uh members are present and accounted for. Um for announcements, we have several. Uh first of all, if you're here for the um public hearing on the gas station um appeal, that's been withdrawn. So that's not happening tonight. Um you don't have to worry about that anymore. Um, if you're here from uh, Little League about the um, the fields, there's been no discussions from the city about changing the fees for this. I don't know where the rumor started. Um, and I can't speak for the school district, but we haven't talked about changing those fees at all. Um, and you're of course you're welcome to speak during public comment at the end of the meeting. Um, there's also going to be a uh, a trash pickup day along I90. We've gotten a lot of complaints about that and it's looked pretty bad that there's trash along along the freeway there. that is maintained by ITD by the state, not by the city, but they do have a volunteer program for going out there to pick up trash, and there will be a group doing that on April 11th, and there'll be more details to follow on the city's website for that. Uh, the city is accepting applications for a vacancy on the Parks and Recreation Commission. Those interested in serving can apply online at postfalls.gov. Application deadline is this Thursday, March 19th. Postf Falls Parks and Recreation is hosting a recruitment rally job fair on Wednesday, March 25th from 4:00 to 6:30 at the Black Bay Depot. They are hiring full and part-time seasonal positions. Great opportunities for high school students, college students, teachers, and retirees. Pulsefalls Police Department is hosting Coffee with a Cop on Tuesday, March 31st from 9 to 10:30 a.m. at Starbucks on Beck Road. This is a great opportunity to ask questions, share concerns, or simply get to know the

officers who help keep our community safe. Our newest K9, Uno, will also be there. Enjoy a complimentary cup of coffee, courtesy of the police department. And Postf Falls Rec Parks and Recreation is hosting the annual Easter egg hunt on Saturday, April 4th at Camelan Park. Thousands of eggs, golden ticket prizes, and a visit from the Easter Bunny will make this one of our favorite spring traditions. The egg hunts will have staggering start times based on age starting at 1 p.m. More details on these events can be found at postfalls.gov. Selfie time.

Okay, I think that's all for the announcements. Uh, first item up is Postf Falls Urban Renewal Agency annual report. Well, good evening, city councilors, Mayor Westland. This annual report is required under Idaho code 50-20 of urban renewal law chapter 2006 paragraph 5 sub paragraph C. The purpose is to report annual activities for the preceding calendar year to the city council by March 31st. The financial information required as part of the annual report documentation is available in both the city clerk's office and the agency's office as well as on our website www.ps pfur pfur.com. Postfall is urban renewal agency was created by the city in 1991. We occupy office space in the chamber of commerce building across the drive. We hold commission meetings on the third Thursday of each month in the in these very chambers. We have three specialized sub subcommittees that meet as necessary. We have scheduled workshops as needed and the public is always welcome to attend. The AY's mission statement is to encourage sound economic and community improvement that enhances the overall quality of life in Post Falls by providing and improving infrastructure, attracting jobs, and enhancing citizen safety and health.

Before we cover our active districts, I'd like to provide you with a brief review of our closed districts and their positive impact on the present. This map shows the overall outline of the AY's seven closed urban renewal districts. It provides a clear view of how the city of Post Falls and the urban renewal agency have effectively utilized the program to promote sound economic and community improvement in mostly commercial and industrial areas during the past 35 years of growth. In our closed districts, urban renewal funded improvement costs have totaled $68.4 million. Total district property valuation increase due to development during the term of these districts was $1.08 billion, equating to over 2.64 million in funds to the city of Post Falls, which continues annually as part of the city's expanded property tax base. When the these urban re renewal districts closed, rebates of unexpended funds to the listed task taxing districts totaled over $2.23 million. Additionally, the agent has been proactive to return unobligated funds, increment funds to these taxing entities during the term of an urban renewal districts or during the term of an urban renewal district. In 2009 and 2012, funds totaling $5.5 million in the East Post Falls district were rebated to the taxing entities. And lastly, it's important to note that development and expansion of property tax base continues after an urban renewal district closes, providing for increased tax revenue possibilities into the future for these districts. This variation of the previous chart

shows the change of value for each urban renewal district from its opening base value, a cumulative 135.6 million, to its closing value, to the latest 2025 cumulative value of $2.26 billion. This highlights how urban renewal has significantly expanded postfalls property tax base. Whether the district was created as a deteriorated according to Idaho code title 50 chapter 20 or as a competitively disadvantaged border community area under title 50 chapter 29 or both. Also, let's not forget about the added jobs and economic opportunity from these urban renewal districts for the citizens of Post Falls. Now, moving to our current districts, this map shows the locations and names of our three active districts. It's important to understand that the district proponents build public infrastructure and pay for it upfront. The risk lies solely on them to bring in new businesses and expand the community's property tax base, which results in additional property value and tax increment. District participants in both the downtown and post falls technology districts have completed at their expense approved remediation and public infrastructure projects in accord with district plans. The Post Falls Technology District proponent, Beyond Green Incorporated, has submitted a request for reimbursement of costs associated with the shopping center portion of the district located north and east or northeast of Highway 41 and Prairie Avenue. This request is currently undergoing review by the AY's C consulting engineers. In the downtown district district, there are approved project costs totaling just

over $6.1 million. Reimbursement made during 2025 resulted in a remaining district obligation of approximately $4.3 million. And lastly, there's not any activity to report in the Pleasant View district. These photos show a few of the on-site uh activities in our or urban renewal related activities in the postfalls technology district that were completed during 2025. The agency entered into an owner participation agreement with North Idaho Healthcare Holdings LLC for the construction of public infrastructure related to the Prairie Medical Campus located south of Prairie Avenue and east of Highway 41. Construction of public infrastructure is expected to begin in 2026. In the downtown district, activity consisted of ANA construction and developments completion of project related infrastructure in phase C which is being pointed to by that orange arrow. It sorry it's not clearly showing in this representation. Uh this is a portion of the mill works project area as well as most of the construction of phase F which is where the yellow area arrow is pointing which is the extension of Idaho street. The agency and our consulting engineers engaged in a public or in a review of construction costs for this phase of public improvements during 2025. Participant reimbursements during the year totaled $779,28 and our endofear district obligation currently stands at 4,287,612. Here's

a few pictures of the construction carried out for the extension of Idaho Street, the Idaho Street, Fourth Avenue roundabout, and frontage and transportation improvements associated with the West End portion of the Millworks project between Post and Lincoln Streets. The re review of costs for this phase of improvements is nearing completion. Then continuing in the downtown district, the agency executed its first minor project reimbursement agreement with the Fraternal Order of Eagles and Idaho nonprofit corporation for its project at 209 East 4th Avenue. The agreement was for costs related to city required frontage improvements associated with the 2018 city center parking plan. Tax increment received in 2025 for our three active districts totaled $2,257,000. This slide shows a three-year comparison of tax increment received during the calendar year by each district. The top four rows are closed districts. The increment associated from these closed districts is now received by the taxing districts including the city. The Post Falls technology and downtown districts continue to have tax increment growth around 46% annually as the result of new development expanding the property tax base in each each district. This tax increment will provide for the timely reimbursement of current district obligations as well as future district projects. We're coming to the end, but a few items of note between fiscal years 24 and 25 include increment revenue increased as project development is expanding the tax base in our active districts. Interest revenue increased marginally as district reimbursements from capital our capital

improvements fund were offset by increased tax increment revenue deposits. Cash assets increased as tax increment remittances exceeded desk district expenses. Loan liabilities remained zero as the agency has not taken on any debt after the early payoff of the Greens Ferry overpass in 2021. Proponent obligations decreased as the agency continued reimbursement of approved project costs in the downtown district. Our approved operating budget increased as costs for goods and services continue to rise due to overall inflationary pressures. Actual operating expenses increased due to rising costs for the same reason. These numbers represent the AY's established commitment to conservative fiscal management practices, operating within adopted budget parameters, and preserving liquidity for reimbursement approvals. So, on behalf of the Urban Renewal Commission, I'd like to thank the city staff and administration for their cooperation with the agency throughout the year. I'd also like to thank you and the mayor for your willingness to work in partnership with the commission. And lastly, I'd like to thank you for your recognition of that urban renewal and tax increment financing are effective tools available to the postfalls community for economic development, attracting businesses and job creation when implemented with well-considered district plans, effective coordination between the city, the agency, and our local development community. Thank you.

Questions for Director Johns? Uh, yes. So, director, um I noticed in the calendar 2025 activities, there were a number of requests after the state law uh came through to be able to withdraw fire and ambulance districts. Correct. Um and all of those were denied. I know there's statutory language as far as what the denial can be based on. Do you recall what the what the denial was was based on? was it that denial is based on uh existing contractual obligations we have to district participants in those in those districts

and so um I noticed in the in the presentation there that there was couple of districts that had zero dollars. So if they were to apply today would they potentially be withdrawing from technology and pleasant view?

No. For example, in the Post Falls technology district, the proponent there, the participant has incurred expenses uh in the millions of dollars for improvements to Prairie Avenue, Trade Avenue, Zoros Road, Zoros Prair, Prairie Roundabout, and we have an agreement with them to reimburse those costs when they submit that documentation. They have submitted documentation. We are in the process with our consulting engineers of reviewing that. So we we do have an outstanding obligation forthcoming that we are contractually obligated to consider even though there we show a Z obligation at the present time. It's only a Z approved obligation.

I see. And so the um the ability to pay those upcoming obligations could be jeopardized by the withdrawal of those two agencies from the urban renewal. Certainly. Okay. Thank you. Just best urban county. Thank you so much. You guys do an amazing job. So I really appreciate it. Thank you.

Thank you. Next up, appointment of Planning and Zoning Commissioner Michael Flock. Please come forward. Just want to jump in real quick. Um, I know this was in the memo, but we have got a lot of members of the public here. Um, I just wanted to sort of reiterate the second paragraph from the staff report. Uh, planning and zoning commission members are volunteers. They volunteer their time to review planning applications and recommend on zoning matters. uh they're made uh through state law which requires the appointment to be made without consideration of partisan politics. So just want to make sure we uh have that refresher.

Thank you. All right, let's start with the first question here and um tell us about yourself and why you're interested in serving on planning and zoning.

Background here. Um I'm a a kid who grew up here on in the middle of town on 11th and Lincoln back in the 70s. um left for a little bit of time going through that college era, but I've been a community member here basically for, you know, in a 50-y year range. I've watched it go from gravel roads to uh these wonderful highways and freeways around us and and just the development of this this community. Um I was asked by um a planning and zoning member, uh Bobby Wilham, that it's it's probably time I stepped up and did something a little more public. Um, I've been running uh a building center here uh for the last 32 years, growing its business. I've since changed to help grow a brand new one here in the community as well. Um, so I'm familiar with a lot of the dealings that kind of go on with the um with the zoning. Um, I'm familiar with a lot of the people that are putting in applications. I don't believe there are conflicts with what I have to say and I know there'll probably be questions that come up about that. But when you deal with the public for 30 years, you get to meet a lot of people and you get to shake a lot of hands and and uh have a lot of good conversations. Um I'm a pretty open book. You can ask me any question. I'm pretty honest with people here. I have to deal with the public every day. Not too ashamed of it.

Questions? I'll start. How would you describe the roles and responsibilities of the uh PNZ commission and uh by what state statutes are the authorities and restrictions derived? So, you get a uh the state of Idaho had a local land use ordinance that was passed in the mid70s, you'd say, and what it really did was it gave um the right to protect property owners. What it really gave was the city to the ability to set up um a planning commission, a zoning commission, a uh a uh the the business plan for the city. It allows them to run it, you know, as they see fit too for the community. But it was really started to protect property owners rights, you know, when you really read the definition of it. And that was back in the mid70s 75. I think I was a kid. I wouldn't smart then.

Also, I'd like to I'd like to thank you for answering that with a straight face. If I have to work on one of my favorite holidays, then everybody has to look at me dressed like I wear green pants, man. I I appreciate that answer. I'll pass the torch to anybody else who wants it. Can I ask you a little bit about your professional background? Uh my professional background uh mostly comes from uh retail uh to ask you a question though. Yeah. Okay. Um, what is a building center?

Um, there's different sizes of building centers. A building center is a place where, uh, anybody in your community can come and buy building materials. They can come and get building help. Uh, they can get advice. Um, if they want a set of blueprints, I'll get them hooked up with an engineer to get them a set of blueprints. You're there to help your community and, uh, get somebody through their projects, their way of life. Okay. Um, if you want to cringe, it's a way for people on Pinterest to get by and go in and really see what things cost. Now,

cringe over Pinterest. I'm so sorry for any other millennial women out there, but I don't cringe over Pinterest. It's how I make dinner. Um, do you see that at any time you would be an applicant to any of the um the issues that come forward in planning and zoning? If I can be frank, one of the problems that I have is that some of our planning and zoning um commissioners also act as applicants and that's why they have to recuse themselves. Is that a situation that you feel like you would see yourself in?

No, I don't. I sell materials. I don't want to get involved in the developing side, any of that, the application part of it. I see a lot of these things and the aspects of it, but that's not my direction at all. I don't foresee that. I uh when you watch the meetings and everything and and if you attend one um yeah there are people that that excuse themselves um I had to ask that in the interview to start with. I go I have relationships with some of these people because I sell them stuff. That's not a conflict of interest according to them in the interview. If I really felt it was going to be that way, I'd be more than happy to step aside. I don't have a problem. My question is specifically about you representing an applicant. No, I wouldn't. Okay.

No. And then what one change would you like to make to our comp plan as we review it this year? Um I think I think I don't know if you sat through um that urban 3 uh the latest um

the latest phase of that the video that was out that she put on um the uh the mixed use in the corridor here for the downtown part. uh their comparison with Cordelane, it's not fair with the age of it and the type of background and structure that you have. But if you want to compare it to something that's newer, look at Midtown Cordelane, that Fourth Street corridor. Now, that development is happening and it was no better than what we have. I don't want to say no better. That's not the right way to put it, but it's it wasn't in any better condition than what's going on right here. So, everybody's getting the opportunity to put in some retail with some condos above it or some rentals above it. Um, I'd like to see some more of that. And in the long run, when you understand, uh, what revenue that can help generate and give it more of a a feel where people want to hang out, you know, love the food court and the food truck. How about it? Just a couple more restaurants, too. We all know how tough that is to get a seat at some of these around here on a Friday or Saturday night. So, that's what I'd like to see. A little bit more growth that way. A little more growth up.

Do you feel like there's something in our comp plan that doesn't allow that right now? and you're advocating for that change.

I don't think so. I'd like to see if maybe if we can find a way to help pitch it better. I don't know. That's up to what our community does, you know, to sell itself the city of Post Falls. Um, our comp plan, you know, I'm not a professional on it. I'm not going to lie to you. I'm here to say I'm here to help with the zoning and and help support the ordinances that are there. Um, but as we steer this towards that, um, we can only grow out so far. If we can start growing up sooner in our comp plan rather than out, I think that will help us fill in or have give an idea of these guys that want to put a subdivision in that's 23 houses here, 23 houses there. It allows us to look at those in a different manner also. So, I don't know, maybe it helps out a little bit whether our comp plan is needing there,

that's to be determined. You know, that's why we hire people from across the country to come in and look at it because as a city council and as the city, they don't have time to do the comp plan on their own anymore. It takes professionals to decide what happens. Correct. Can respect you guys for doing that. But planning and zoning is the steering committee for the comp plan. Is that accurate? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Thank you. I got one. Oh, sorry. No, go ahead.

Okay. Thank you. Um, first of all, thank you for being here. Uh, in your application materials, uh, you spoke about how you had many years of experience in dealing with customers and you heard about the concerns of the city of Post Falls and the increasing population and all that, but then you also spoke to uh, one of the issues you just mentioned about how uh, we have enough regulations, but we just need to enforce them. I think that's how you you characterized it. Um, so how do you see yourself, you know, if if you were to be approved for this position, uh, balancing the concerns that you're familiar with about from the community and especially those who are affected by development with the enforcement of these uh these zoning ordinances and and whatnot. Uh so put it another way, how will you how do you envision balancing the private rights of land owners with the concerns that the community may have or the impact on the community at large really because you're talking about zoning? So how are you going to balance that?

Well, we have seven, eight, nine, I think, you know, types of of zoning there. Um, when you talk about from my statement there where we have all the regulations, um, we just need to enforce them. I don't think we have to start going crazy about adding on and adding on more. I think when you put your application in, there's almost 100 different categories to pick from for you to get four to eight of them that fit your thing to that fit the description. Um, we're not going to cause the city any further impact, you know, other than what's right here. Oh, here's what we're going to do to minimize impact to the city. Um, I think if in my background there, I've been a an a basketball official for 35 years. Um, the rule books thick enough. We have plenty of rules. We always say it's a spirit of a letter of the law and spirit of the rule. So, I think that's part of it that you have to look into it. You can look into these things and read them and go, are we stretching it, you know, this far for that one to really eliminate it? This guy's this is this guy's third try to get this through. Can we come to, you know, an agreement here? What can be done and discuss it with the other seven or eight people at the at the meeting? You know, there has to be some feedback back and forth on that. Um, it you don't have to be, you know, stringent rockhard on that stuff for, you know, letter of the law. there are spirit, you know, the spirit of the rule is what allows you to uh not cheat, but to leave it a little more open-minded for people. And I think that's kind of a good part of it. You know, have an open mind when you're there with these things. Don't be predispositioned on it. Um yeah, it's the guy's third time trying to get this through or fourth time even. Um and they're spending a lot of money to do that. Let's, you know, really see where he's going wrong or what's happening here. Let's try to help them out also to guide them to the proper area of it.

Maybe we can get an agreement made a small change or something like that that will get it over the hump. So in that and how do you envision and the other part of my question then was how do you envision taking into consideration the cares of the community? you've been hearing them for over over the years and obviously I think there's a a sometimes a competing interest here between what a person can do

and what people want done. Like how do you envision your role if you were to be in this position balancing those interests? That's a tough one because when you've been here as long as I have and I know some of you people have, um, you know, people like Post Falls the way it used to be, you know, but we can't stay that way. That's just not logical. So, we have to kind of help them embrace, you know, growth. um to get people, you know, to to want to it's just that's a tough question because you're trying to I have to try to read into what someone where they're steering or headed, I think. But I don't know, you just have to be openminded and want to work with them, you know. I think that's the biggest part. You got to show an interest in them in their project and what they want to do. Whether it you know, you're going to pass it through or not, you've got to generally show that you're making an effort with them. And if they haven't made the full effort on their part, then we can, you know, correct it and help them to get to that point to where, you know, it can be a accessible project.

Thank you.

Um, yes sir. First I want to say thank you for stepping up. This is a a position with a lot of work and not a lot of reward uh other than intrinsic. And so thank you for that. And um I'm also um excited about the fact that you have been here a long time. It brings a different perspective. Um some of us that have come more recently also liked the way that it was. Um and certainly everybody that we've spoken to when we knock on doors to run for office. It's the number one issue on everybody's mind is growth. And uh like councelor Mosby said, there will always be that that tension between somebody who wants to do something with their property and everybody else doesn't want it done and feels like we have the right to tell them what to do with it and of course we don't uh within except within very narrow um prescriptions. So thank you for that. I wanted to give you an opportunity because the application is so small. Um I want to give you opportunity to expand on a couple of things that of the answers here. Um first is that you say that you're for expansion and growth if it's regulated in the right ways. What do you think are the right ways? Um it should be um how do I put this? I like Post Falls as a community. I like the way it looks. We're a nicel looking community. We're not a big dirty industry type community. The sawmills are all gone. And there's nothing wrong with the sawmills when they were here. They provided us all a place to start. A lot of my friends and family and and and people throughout the uh that I've known forever here. Um but now it's um it's more of a service type community. It services the people that live here that get on that freeway every day and drive somewhere. Um, every neighborhood that we put up, there are pockets uh that are undeveloped that um as on the on the planning and zoning,

you'll get the chance to to review when someone wants to convert that piece of land. And you'd hope that uh when they put forth their product that they would uh look at the product around it and first try to match it so that things are fluid and congruent throughout that neighborhood. That's kind of uh what I mean. We shouldn't have, you know, three or four different pockets there that look entirely different. There should be something that kind of ties it to it. And and I know if something's 20 years later, you bet. I can tell you what brick when I drive around what year those houses were built by the type of rock on the front of them or you name it. But they should be of similar uh ilk or something that, you know, brings value to the neighborhoods around it. We don't want to see anything get too run down. Um I'm for things like cottage homes, smaller homes like that. Um, I don't think we'll ever see starter homes that aren't $350,000. That's a I mean, I know what building materials cost. You understand what people charge to do it, and we know what a piece of dirt costs around here now. Um, so, uh, they should build something nice in this community for what they're going to get for it. Um, and what they're trying to do, these builders, too. Um, but I'd like to see it to where, you know, when you go from one subdivision to the next through the connector streets, you'd hope they're the same width, that they have sidewalks connecting, things like that. That's important. Um, uh, that, you know, if this one has a bike path, the other one doesn't have a swale where it stops. You know, it's that part of it that makes the community a little bit nicer for a walking or getting around. Um, we do a lot of dog walking and riding bikes and stuff and my kids live here, my grandkids live here. So, um, but that's kind of the part of it, you know, with that statement.

Thank you. And then briefly, you also said that you you feel like as it's evolving, it's heading in a good direction. Um, how so? I like it because um the last

I don't know, you can say five, six, seven, eight years maybe even back even, you know, pre-COVID a little bit things um the community, like I said, I like the way it looks visually. Things are cleaned up, things are better. Um, if I drive around and my wife makes a comment about something, I look at it and I go, "Yeah, maybe, you know, we could do better at that in the city. Make the the fountain on the exit ramp work, you know, make sure it's weeded, make sure it's clean." Things like that. But, um, visually, I mean, people have to come through here. When I go to I travel with my wife, um, when I go places and I see something and you go, there's seven cars in the front of that. Why? What's, you know, what's going on here right now? And there's seven houses in a row like that. um it doesn't fit in to what's on the next two blocks around it. So um it kind of falls in line with what my some of my thoughts on ADUs. I'm not anti-ADU at all. I'm anti the ADU taking up the whole lot and then seven people parking in front of the house in the street because there's no parking for the ADU. Um but um I kind of like when I say it's it's moving in the right direction. I like the businesses that have moved here and that helps when we have the right, you know, comprehensive plan. People want to come here and set up. I think I told the mayor, I said it, it's nice that we see Seltis Way and some of the closing the close connectors around it um being cleaned up for property-wise. Some of those buildings were around when I was a little kid and they were already there. You hate to see things knocked down, but we need to move forward to make this town nicer uh for the people that do live in it. So, um, visually, communitywise, and I like that. This is a great place to be. Super town.

And then, um, you also said that with the amount of time that you spend in retail, you've had a chance to hear the good, the bad, and the uneducated opinions of the increasing population base. What did you mean by that? Um, you'll get an opinion of people that'll just show right up and can't believe that, you know, they can't uh cover 75% of their back lot with a shop. This is a small Idaho town. It's not a small Idaho town anymore. I mean, the last time it was small, I was in high school. You know, there was 5,000 people here instead of 45,000 people. Um, you know, it's it's there's sometimes there's a mentality that it's still a small town in people's minds around here. And so you do have to enlighten them when you're dealing with the community. You can't do that. We can put a smaller shop in for you if you still want that pro, you know, you know, that space on your property. You know, there's a lot of things that we can do, but you know, people that come here that I get to talk to, they're fantastic. You know, when they they come in and they say, "What can we, you know, can you help me out with my project?" This that the other, they're real good. They don't mind dealing with city hall and the plan and permitting process here. Some big projects, it's not the funnest thing in the world, but on small ones and everything, they're pretty fair to the the general public here. And that helps with growth, too. You know, this building does a pretty good job of of moving people along with their projects. So,

okay. Um, last question I ask everybody this question uh and that is what do you feel the proper role of government is? um community guidance I think is the best way for me to put it. You know, you're an elected official. You're elected to to um do the best job you can for our community. Uh you need to put aside your personal interests. You know, if you're in the government and deal with the rules and the statutes as they are. Um, but I think uh, like you say, I'm not for big government. I'm not for small government. There has to be a certain amount to run a place like a business. You'd like to see things run more like a business. Um, be fiscally responsible. Uh, and that's what the comprehensive plans for for, you know, housing and transportation and and um, city projects, things like that. Be on the the fiscally responsible side. you see how much money the the urban renewal district makes in let's handle the money properly you know that's what I my role what I think government should be they should be uh the you know I guess the city managers part of the government manage it for us properly don't make us regret having you as an elected an official

thank you thank you guys the last one uh just real quickly um you kind of touched on a little bit of this but I'd like to hear your full explanation or understanding of the role that you will play in the P&Z and then how that contrasts to what city council does. So the role, you know, in in the in the planning and zoning is is is where the front line before anything ever gets to you guys and we can go through one, two or three reviews of a project um to get it to the state where it has to come to you guys. the money, you know, meets the road when when this planning and zoning passes it on to you folks right here. You're the ones that were elected. You're the ones that get to the say in this. Uh all we are is um a screening and guidance process. We can give you here's, you know, their project, here's our guidance on it. Um you guys can accept it or reject it. That's your own uh choice. Um everybody has personal opinions. you don't like personal opinions getting too involved in projects, you know, when they're presented, you know, again, everything's fairly well structured. Um, I don't, um, want to say that, um, the planning part of it. That's probably the newest thing for me to have to deal with. I'm used to dealing with project plans and stuff like that, but the planning and zoning part of it, the actual planning, hey, that's something I'll have to learn more of. I'm not going to lie anything like that to you guys. Um, but um dealing with zoning and the ordinances and and such, that's all things that um as we go, you know, hit the checklist, make sure things are right. Then it gets forwarded to you guys. And that's where, like I said, your elected officials. You're the ones that get to make the hard decisions. We can only say this gets to you guys and

we approve it. If we disapprove it, it's not going to get to you anyways. So, Mr. Flock, are you prepared to make some final decisions though because planning and zoning does have the ability to absolutely do there's Can I finish my question really fast before you answer it? Great. Thank you so much. Um, they they do have the final say on special use permits and planned unit developments, PUDS. So, have you looked at the qualifications for any of those applications or what you would be evaluating in those circumstances because they are different than zoning?

Yeah, I haven't seen any of the PUB ones to be honest with you. Okay. Um, on making tough decisions, that's not the hardest thing. If you look at all the facts and what's laid out in front of you, you can make a decision whether six guys in a room and six gentlemen and ladies in a room uh make the same decision as you. That's why you have votes. Um, but you do have to make a decision. You bet. There are choices we have to make in that room. Not everything is passed on to city council from PL. I just wanted to make that really clear. Okay. Thank you. Further questions. All right. Thank you. Thank you. See entertain a motion. I would move to confirm the appointment of planning and zoning commissioner Michael Flock.

Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please.

Stick leader. Why am I always a first? Um, I have a little bit of heartburn over this. I know that I feel like perhaps I was slightly listened to. I asked for someone that is not exactly in the business and has more of like a lay person perspective. Um, but also given the feedback from other council members of what we should be looking for when we do these kinds of interviews, um, like it is a job, I I'm not sure that there's like a solid understanding of of planning and zoning. Um, the comp plan is exactly what a planning and zoning person should be an expert on. Um, and there should be a solid understanding that not everything gets passed to city council. And some of those um, PUB and special use permits are what we hear the most about from residents. Like those are decisions that don't come back to council that we don't get to see that have a huge impact on how the city is developed. you seem like a lovely person and I appreciate you putting your name forward. Um, but I think gosh, I think today it's a no. And I'm I'm so sorry. I I I don't think this is the the right appointment.

Pl. Malloy. I Ziggler. I Mosby. Luca. I. Motion passes. Thank you. Um, now we're getting to the the real part of the meeting. Amendments to the agenda. We have none tonight, sir. Uh, declarations of conflict, exparte, contacts, and site visits. Seeing none, please present the consent calendar. Item A is minutes from the March 3rd, 2026 city council meeting. Item B is payables March 4th through March 18th, 2026. Item C is January cash and investments report. And item D is the park furnishing surplus.

I do just have a request when we send things the the surplus is going to um auction if I read that correctly. Right. That's correct. When we send things to auction, could we get like a quarterly report on like what we're getting back from these auctions if at all? Sure, we can send back. In fact, we just had the vehicle one come back to us about a month ago and we can provide that to you. Okay. I would just be curious. Cool. Thank you. Sure. Move to approve the consent calendar as presented. Second. A motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. PL I. Malloy. I. Ziggler. I. Mosby. I. Luca. I. Stig leader. I.

Motion passes. Thank you. Next up is public hearings. The first one again was cancelled. The uh appeal of the gas station pumps was canceled. That's not happening. So, we're on to the second U public hearing on the agenda. Prairie Avenue annexation. And I will open public hearing. I guess just for clarification on that, Mr. Mayor, that by canceled it means permanently withdrawn. It's never coming up. Just so members of the public understand that it's it's over.

So, all right. Good evening, Mayor Westland and City Council. My name is Justin Solder. I'm an associate planner here in the planning division. And the item before you is the Prairie Avenue annexation file number A NNX-25-5. So the property owner is copper basin construction and the applicant is Lake City Lake City Engineering and they are seek they are requesting the city council to approve a request to annex approximately 20 acres with the single family residential R1 zoning as part of an annexation request into the city. Here's the project location. It's uh just north of West Prairie Avenue and it's about a third of a mile um east of the intersection of Greens Fair Road and Prairie Avenue. Um for a little more context, you can also see over there on the right side of the screen there's Highway 41. As you can see, the site does not currently have a zoning designation as it's not in the city. The properties to the north and east are undeveloped and they're within the technology mixed zone and are intended for multifamily uses as well as some commercial along Prairie Avenue. The properties to the west contain single family homes on five a girl lots that were annexed in the city in 2022 with the community commercial mixed and the community commercial services zone designations. and the properties directly to the south across Prairie Avenue are within the community commercial services designation as well. The applicant is requesting a zone designation of R1. And as you can see on the map, there are some single family homes within the R1 and the R2 zone south of Prairie um that are further south of that CCS zone in the red. So that would be everything here in the the yellow in the the darker yellow here.

The site is currently undeveloped. It's over the Rathstrom Prairie Aquifer. Ross Point Water District would serve water and for wastewater it would be city of Post Falls and the city does have capacity and willingness to serve the property uh for the requested zone. Prairie Avenue is a principal arterial and a critical arterial corridor and additional rights of way and easements would need to be provided as part of the annexation and then road widening at the time of development. Now we will get into the zone change review criteria. Number one is the proposed zoning district consistent with the future land use map and focus area contained in the currently adopted postfalls comprehensive plan. The future land use designation of the subject property is transitional which is designated for areas suitable for growth. Timing for growth is undetermined, but guidance can be found in the comprehensive plan in the focus area, which for this one, it's the 41 north focus area. The assigned zone should be compatible with adjacent zones and uses and consistent with the guiding principles found within the focus area and the site is adjacent to properties with land use designation of transitional to the west and south and then business commercial to the north and east. The 41 north focus area states that the highway 41 corridor will rival Seltis in terms of importance as a retail mixeduse residential and services district. So residential development has been predominant in recent years and it's a trend that's likely to continue. Such growth is expected to spur commercial uses adjacent to Highway 41. And as this area of North Prairie grows, land values may pressure development to attract a range of residential developments, offering shared amenities and a different variety of housing types to help enrich the future identity of the focus area. Growth should strategically be located in carefully

designated land uses incorporating trails and interconnected walkable street network. And in this snapshot of the surrounding area, you can see there are generally residential zones to the south of Prairie Avenue in the yellow and then more commercial zone designations to the north of Prairie Avenue. And when you get closer to Highway 41 as well, there's a lot more commercial. The proposed R1 zone may be compatible with properties in the immediate vicinity to the west, which are currently utilized as large lot single family residences. Um, and then also may be consistent or compatible with some of the residences to the south of Prairie Avenue in some of those subdivisions. The request may also be consistent with the focus area which talks about residential uses within proximity to Highway 41 in order to support commercial and medical development along the highway corridor. Um, and as you know that we have the Prairie Medical Campus that's just right there on the southeast corner of Highway 41 and Prairie Avenue which was recently approved. Moving on to the second review criteria which states is the proposed zoning district consistent with the goals and policies contained in the comprehensive plan that are relevant to the area under consideration. The annexation request is consistent with goal one which seeks to grow and sustain a balanced resilient economy for postfalls providing community prosperity and fiscal health. The R1 zone can deliver single family homes which make up the majority of the desired housing product in Post Falls. Annexation of the property would allow future residential development located near commercial and future technological services where residents would be able to live and work and patronize these services contributing to economic diversity in the city. There's several factors that need to be considered when applying a new zone. We've already touched on the fact that the proposed zone designation may be consistent with the future land use map, may be compatible with

surrounding land uses and the goals of the policies of the comprehensive plan. As far as infrastructure, sanitary sewer is located at the Southerntherly property line and would discharge to the Greens Ferry service area, which has the capacity for the requested zone and is in conformance with the city's reclamation water plan. For traffic, Prairie Avenue is classified as a principal arterial roadway and a critical arterial corridor that is currently configured with two eastbound lanes, one westbound lane, and a two-way center turn lane. However, to accommodate the future projected traffic volumes, Prairie Avenue would require widening to a five lane configuration at the time of development. The annexation is also consistent with goal seven of the comp plan, which seeks to plan for and establish types and quantities of land uses and postfall supporting community needs and the long-term sustainability. The R1 zone may help with community needs and long-term sustainability by providing housing, and it's also consistent with policy 15. The annexation of the subject site with the zoning request would help provide land for future housing needs at a low density in an area projected to be incorporated into the city. And then upon subdivision development, roadway and pedestrian improvements would be required and completed, allowing for continuity of roadways and help create further pedestrian connections through sidewalks and trails as encouraged by policy 33. The third and final review criteria. Does the proposed zoning district create a demonstrable adverse impact upon the delivery of services by any political subdivision providing services within the city? There have been no identified demonstrable adverse impacts at this time. Here's a list of all the agencies that were notified of the project and we received these comments back. They were either neutral, would coordinate at the time of development um or had no

facilities within the project site. Review criteria once more for you. And then actually uh John Manley, the planning manager, is going to get up and talk a little bit more about this um area in a little more detail. Good evening, city council members. Um, Sean Manley, planning manager. Yes, what I wanted to do is give a brief history because not everybody may know the history of this. Um, this project site in 2019 was proposed as an R3, a multif family site. It was the AUF annexation. That was denied. And then in 2021, they proposed a residential mix project for the site and that was denied. I believe that's why the the applicant is desiring to come up with a potential zone that may be approved. I think that would what the applicant would desire.

May do you sorry I wasn't here for that. Do you know can you maybe speak to if you know why those higher densities were denied when it seems like it's it's zoned for that everywhere to the west of it.

Yeah. So I believe one of the occasions was denied because the um the unknown timing of the regional park and the lack of trail systems to that park at that time. Um I would conclude though that through development to the west and east um that's how you're going to get the trail system is through development. So um the timing of that I don't think was deemed correct at that time. Um and the other one I think there was some unknowns with highway 41 and the timing of 41 and the implications it may have on that corridor as well as um potentially infrastructure questions I think was another reason for another denial. I can add to that, but Mr. Harrington, stop me if I get over my skis because no, we're only supposed to consider what's presented to us tonight, but are we allowed to consider what previous uh

for the annexation bit being a sort of legislative decision decision? I'm you can kind of speak to your personal uh experience with that, but uh as far as the council's decision, it was the council's decision at the time. That's right. Yeah, but I did bring it up.

Well, well, I I would say he brought it in the record and it's in the PNZ report that says this is the applicant's third annexation request for the property. Previous request for higher intensity zoning were denied by the city council. And as we're attempting to figure out if R1 is appropriate or not, I I'm wondering why R1 would be appropriate when it doesn't appear to be there. And why wasn't it before? Is there something some deficiency in the land or some reason why we would So, I wasn't trying to say no. Ah, yeah.

But one one of the concerns uh in previous attempts is that a couple of the other sites uh adjacent to this one to the north and northeast uh are also the same developer. And the only exit possible from this plot is onto Prairie Avenue. So, when we've been asked to consider X number of units on this plot, when considering traffic, it's not just that number of units, it's also plus the numbers of units that connect to this plot that are all going to dump out on Prairie Avenue at the same time. That was one of the factors that that uh that's helpful. So, decreasing the density then would alleviate that concern potentially. Potentially would it would alleviate some of it. Okay.

Thank you. So ultimately I came up just to kind of discuss the the implications like uh Justin did cite in the staff report that R1 may be compatible but how it becomes maybe compatible is the if this went R1 uh the projects to the west north and east would install a 15oot buffer. That's how in our code how we mitigate potential incompatible uses. So when you stick single family next to industrial or commercial uses, the one causing the impact is the ones that have to provide that buffer. So that would mean that surrounding that, good, bad, or indifferent. You would get a 15oot buffer around that area.

Sorry, who's responsible for that buffer then? In this case, in this case, it wouldn't be the single family subdivision. It would be the developments to the west, north, and east. Okay. Would have to mitigate their impact at the time of site plan review. That's how we deal with that in our zoning ordinance. Thank you, Mr. Manley. Has any ground been broken on the surrounding plots or do we know what will be developed in any of those? At this time,

I believe the lands to the west is waiting for this property to be annexed because they would like to get the access and utilities through this to their project. Um, I can't speak for them. Maybe the applicant knows more about that, but that's what I have heard is that's what some of their reservation is access. There is plans that this access would go from uh this project to the west and go to Greens Fairy as one outlet.

If they had been separate owners or separate developers, then presumably the two what is that CCES and CCM? Is that correct? um to the west would have had to find their own found their own outlets, right? That wasn't through this property site. Yeah. So, they went and developed first. They would provide their access on the Greens Ferry. I think what they're weighing is their um sewer. So, you have sewer right here. Yeah. So, I think that's where they would like their sewer to go to is to that location. And so, until that rideway is dedicated and that sewer is extended, then they can't use that connection.

Do they? Surely everyone involved knew that when those two properties to the west were annexed and zoned. Yes. Um I can't I can only contemplate on they want in the city they got the zone they want. I do know that their intent for the types of uses they were um what changed between the time they applied got annexed to now. You know you do have a 20 acre county pocket. They more than like believe that in time that, you know, it's a matter of time that more than likely it would be considered infill and be annexed eventually. Yeah. It's just like Field was getting at, you know, you have the annexation decision, right? And then ultimately it's the quagmire is zoning.

Sure.

Okay. And I think the from what I understand from the applicant, they would just like to solve the quagmire, you know, whatever that would entail. That's kind of what what I think the open discussion is. I do know that the Prairie Avenue is slotted for some widening in the next five to seven years. So just like um on the east side of town with the Hughes annexation, that rightway had to get purchased. So ultimately between Greens Ferry and Highway 41, it is in the nearer term that that road will get widened. Um, and so it's either going to get through development or the areas that aren't has the rightway dedicated, then you would have to buy that right away prior to doing construction of it. Um that's the gist of most I wanted to bring up as part of this just to kind of give more of a bigger story of the site the implications with zoning and kind of your opportunity to look at this and discuss this

and about quick question about the responsibility of the buffer zone just from my understanding. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but you said that the surrounding properties that are undeveloped would be responsible for that 15 foot buffer zone, but it seems like that this zone designation would create that. So, help me understand why the surrounding property would be responsible that not this one. So it used to be kind of unclear and then we encode defined it as that who the entity causing the impact the non-compatibility would provide it and the reason being is it becomes real awkward to code enforce and police. So if you have a single family subdivision they're dedicating 15 of their land as a buffer. Well two things the you have an HOA having to maintain that long term if it's a tract right as a cost on the HOA. If trees get cut and not maintained, then you're code for then you're code enforcing that versus when you have a private like a multif family project, it's easier for them to include the buffer into their project and it becomes part of the common ground for their site to do the maintenance. Similar with a commercial if a commercial property that's a common site, common ownership, they're maintaining it. It just becomes real awkward when you have a skinny strip of land that is you are people allowed to put their six foot fence and then you end up with this big corridor that's 15 foot wide fenced on both sides full of trees and landscaping and it becomes awkward to maintenance and then who knows what may go on long term between those two six fence two six foot fences versus something that's just open as to as part of and included within a a master plan site.

Okay, thank you. Makes sense. Further questions? All right, I think we're ready for the applicant to speak. Unless you have more to say on yours. Sorry.

Thank you. Evening, Council Mayor. Steve White, Copper Basin Construction. Um, I think, uh, these guys kind of nailed half of what I was going to talk about. John did. Um, kind of pinning down. Third application, multiple zonings, right away for Prairie is is I'm sorry, sir. I can hear you just fine, but I wonder if the mic is picking you up. Probably not. There we go.

Anyway, third time through, and we are just looking for what what zoning works on this. We've kind of made a run at everything. It is a county island. We do own the property. I don't I haven't even seen these slides. Uh we do own the property to the north. Cecil Road will eventually provide outlets for all of this residential and all of this area also to a intersection that is planned to be uh have a traffic light. So, I don't really don't have a whole lot to add to to what planning is on or to what the uh planning department has there, but I would certainly entertain questions and entertain discussion. Well, I think the the annexation is obvious and it u supports everything that we want to see from an annexation standpoint. And I think the can I say heartburn is for me uh is is it's like a thumb of R1 sticking up and you've got the adjacent commercial and I'm my just to get to the point and not belabor it too much. I you're it sounds like and but I don't want to put words in your mouth. You potentially would be open to other zoning.

We've tried R3. We've tried RM and so Yeah, I know. I get that. I totally get that. And that's it's but it's a different world today now. Yeah. Um, and so I'm just I I think that was where where I would I I would go, you know, we're open to any I mean, we clearly obviously develop multi open to residential zones. Like this is this is Prairie and 41 and Greens Fairy. Like why not commercial? Well, I have a whole bunch of commercial on Prairie. There's a whole bunch of commercial all around Prairie. There's probably more of a question of how much commercial can you support anymore? You know, we have

are the two sites that you already own that are zoned commercial but allow for highdensity residential excluded from allowing highdensity residential based on your development agreement. Uh these 44 acres here per the PUD are designated for the multifamily

period in the in the technology zone. So we aren't we're not allowed to do anything different commercially there. What I say is there, you know, we have all the frontage in 41 with two more property. We're trying to get that commercial going. You have commercial on the other side. There's lots of commercial and and commercial is a different animal now than it was 30, 40 years ago with, you know, with Amazon, with online shopping. I, you know, I see commercial quarters struggling. Do you own the two properties to the west? I do not. Okay. I must have misunderstood what Mr. You were saying then we own the property to the north to the north

this here. So from future Cecil Road right away which is annexed these 44 acres tie into that. So having this one annexed whatever the zone is would allow us to sort of plan the development of all those 64 acres together too.

Respectfully I disagree. I think there is an enormous amount of residential being built in Post Falls. not in this picture that we're looking at right now. But um the annexation might have been easy for you, but I without seeing anything else built out in this area, I don't know that I can confidently say that annexing this piece of property at this time with any zone because I don't understand what zone we should give it because none of the surrounding land has been developed in any way to know what this transitional is what it says in our comp plan in our um future land use map should be transitioning from what to what. It hasn't been built out yet. Um, and if I may, putting an exit onto Prairie for highdensity residential through R1. Good night. Could you imagine if the R1 was there first? Like, we would never hear the We would never hear the end of that.

I'm lean I'd lean more towards like an RM residential mixed. Oh my gosh, dare I say it? commercial on the bottom and residential on the top. That seem that would make more sense to me. I think that was the last attempt, right? Yes. So, it sounds like you would be open to it. It seems to make more sense to me based on what's around and that's what led to my question as to why the applicant was denied previously.

Sure. And if those conditions have resolved at all, then you know, I'd like to give you what you want, you know, originally. And uh and make it more compatible with these uses where if we do have technology park development going on to the east and commercial to the west and you have this single family neighborhood sandwiched in the middle, it doesn't make much sense to me. I mean, yes, there's that R1 to the south. And so, I'm not a no. Um, but I wonder if there's a win-win here that that we could do like is does anybody know is that when ITD comes through and widens, is there going to be a a roundabout or a cutout for people to be able to accelerate safely onto Prairie? Anybody know if any of those discussions have happened? Um,

if I may, Mr. Mayor, just for a second, if I can jump in for a second. Um, I think we're starting to get a little bit of ahead of ourselves. We're getting into deliberation. We still have we may have other people who want to testify. Um, and may have additional information for you. Um, so maybe kind of rain it back in a little bit and and let the applicant finish and see who else has to testify. My fault and then we can dive into the deliberation.

No, certainly. Um, we would be open to to the RM transitional. I think you know per our previous application would be fine with us. the R3, the R1. I mean, I do I think it's a great spot for for an R1. No, because it is sandwiched in in a whole bunch of red around it. Uh I think our previous proposal had the commercial in the front, sort of mimicking the property to the west where they wanted to have kind of a backage road or a frontage road for the commercial access with them. We're fine with that. We'll just just want to get moving forward on this project eventually. So, I'll uh reserve any other comments for any other public hearing. All right. Thank you.

All right. Thank you. Have any public comments? We have one uh wishing to speak. Shirley Leonard, want to come up and speak? Is this in favor or in opposition?

Oh, is this for the other hearing? Yeah, it's one that's canceled in Okay. It was about this one here. Developing a gas station. Oh, yes. And that's that's that's right. That was Do you have any comments on on this hearing on this? Yeah, I do. Well, you're you're welcome to speak.

Okay. I think we need more open spaces. I think we need more parks. We don't have any parks in our I live at 2136 East um Boulder Street and Greens Fairy runs right there and that's throughwhere. Then it goes up and go take a pull line. They have gas stations there, but there's no parks other than Suringa, which is several blocks up. The next park is over at Tilmore, and the kids when they get snow or they get something and they want to get their sleds out, they use the swells and the homeowners association areas and it's deteriorating badly. So, we need open space for kids to play. We need more parks and that would be a good spot.

All right. Thank you. Thank you.

All right. There was one comment. Does the applicant wish to rebut or add anything? All right. Then I will close the public hearing and we can go through the annexation question. I guess I'll start since I've been here for the last two, but the uh the real challenge if you can leave this up. Uh so we've got the property in question directly to the north of it and to the norththeast are the three that really we're talking about here. And the conundrum I think for the city and for the developer is that it's it's a large chunk of land that's essentially landlocked. There's no access to it except from Prairie. they don't own the property to the east that's on Prairie, in which case they could, uh, fill out Cecil Road, uh, and get additional access, but even that would be dropping on to Prairie. Uh, they don't own the property to the west, and I a previous map had the name of that road just off to the left in the in the middle of the screen, but because they don't own the property to the west, that road can't come in or they can't make the neighbor put that road in to get access on the Greens Ferry. So whatever we decide tonight, if whatever zone it is, all of it's coming on the prairie. Uh so that's we got to decide if we're comfortable with or not.

And the landlocked, just to be clear, the landlocked piece of land that you're talking about is the parcel directly to the north of the one that is up for annexation. Correct. The problematic piece of property, the the piece of property that's up today opens up the property directly to the north and the property to the northeast also. So that's what the developer is trying and I God bless them. I get it. you know, they want to they want to develop that property, but the the chunk they own has no roads to it except for except for Prairie and they're dependent on other development to get additional roads to it and obviously they can't make the other owners do anything. So, if they're going to do anything that we have to say yes, you can dump all of that onto Prairie all at the same time.

So, that that was my concern last time around. I would say it still remains a concern. Uh the widening of Prairie is sooner on the horizon now than it was last time. So, I I may be slightly less uncomfortable with it uh because that's coming, but uh and without the property directly to the east on Prairie, uh nobody knows what's happening with that or when that would finish out Cecil Road. Uh without any assurances that the road to the west that is unnamed on this map, but would have to go through the properties to the west would come could come in and dump on Greens Fairy. The only certainty at this point is that if we approve it, then everything all 80 something acres is going to dump on the prairie.

What's the answer other than annexing this? I mean, is there I mean, it's it's a tough one. Like, like I said, the last time this came up was what, a couple years ago. So, the prairie widening was 8 to 10 years off. Yeah. Now, it's six to eight years off. So, Uh, how long is it going to take to develop all this out? Who knows? And is the widening of prairie going to fix the issue of everything dumping onto prairie? I doubt it. Um, but Prairie might be more capable of handling it being wider. There's more lanes. Uh, of course, there's the additional complication of the property to the west holding off because sewer is not there because this isn't annexed into the city. So,

we're also if we deny this, then we're holding up that property from development, which kind of stinks. So this is this is a a smorgesborg of of h I don't really know how to deal with. So but all of those properties that annexed in knew that this key property was not in the city and they did it anyway. So I I feel like a little frustration having pressure put on us to annex and zone something without any like idea of what else is being put in there because this one key property was not annexed. But that was a known factor when this development was planned. Does that Yeah. Like so

also too the the other properties may not have been for sale at the time this particular developer bought the other ones. And so um you can buy and not annex.

Yeah, we have seen other properties that annex knowing that they can't build until other things happen. I think that we've we saw that on the east side of town as well with sewer lines needing to go through. I think on the issue of annexation, I do think it makes sense to annex this into the city just because it is technically a pocket that we're we're trying to address getting services to but also having connectivity on Prairie Avenue um effectively from Greens Fairy all the way down to the Highway 41. My recollection of the hangup last time was the traffic flow onto Prairie Avenue um having a higher density designation on that piece of property without the development of the backage road to the properties on the west. Um seems like with the connectivity of the sewer um that is kind of dependent on this property would facilitate development of a sooner development of those properties to the west which could open the opportunity for that backage road to relieve traffic off of Prairie over to Greens Ferry. Um but you know this is one of those properties I appreciate the applicant being uh patient as he is with trying to find something that really fits here. Um, and I think I think R1 actually is quite appropriate here. Um, I like the idea of Host Falls looking toward a kind of a um, local community services around residential areas. So, having a having a small pocket of single family homes near a hub like we have on this corner, I think, is pretty ideal, especially considering the the residential development to the south of Prairie. So, I'm comfortable with the zoning. I like the annexation. What I another point about the the R1 accessation that I like is it does somewhat alleviate the higher traffic flows from higher density development in that parcel that we are so concerned

about. So focusing on the annexation question is it in the best interest of the city? I'm inclined to agree I think it is. Uh I think that this is the exact kind of property that we need to to approve for annexation. it is surrounded by other annex properties. Now incidentally there is an interest or a benefit to those other properties but focusing on this property itself I think it does provide a benefit u I think certainly however it is annexed whether it's for RM or whether it's for R1 I think that where it's located the I think the staff report on this was excellent in in explaining how an R1 designation here would would increase I guess it would increase uh the amount of people who can supply commerce to that corridor. So ultimately I think there's an economic benefit to the city. Now I think there are other benefits to the city as well that have already been well explained especially with the fact that uh how this particular parcel if it becomes part of the city can supply benefit to the northern and northeastern adjacent parcels. I think the law, the public policy favors the productive use of land. And if this annexation allows those other parcels to become productive, uh, then I think that that's going to provide a long-term economic benefit to the city, especially in this area. Um, I think speaking to R1, you know, I'm inclined to agree with councelor Ziggler. I think that R1 does uh it does have a the ability to reduce the concerns about dumping off onto prairie. But more importantly, I think that just reviewing the staff report that and the presentation today, there weren't any concerns expressed from any of the other departments in regard to this particular uh application. And so, uh, I I think

that if we had seen some concerns about that, besides the fact that Prairie needs to be widened, which we all know it needs to be widened for any development, I don't I don't see that as a I think that concern is addressed by that consideration that in order for a development to take place on that parcel, if it's a widened prairie, then I think that would resolve that issue. I think that it on the annexation question, I'm also a yes because it makes a lot of sense uh because it's an island. Even though if any future developers are listening, I'm generally opposed to going higher density north of Prairie, but this one is a is surrounded by city and so it makes a lot of sense to me to annex it. the the zoning question is a little harder for the reasons that others have stated. I think if this was being developed at the same time as the applicant's other property and there could be an exit out to Cecil and developed Cecil Road at the same time, then it the higher density would make more sense to me in this zone. But barring that um if that's not you know if that road wouldn't be developed simultaneously with this development then um then I think R1 would would be appropriate because of the lower density dumping out on the street. I know there are sighteline issues too with Prairie Avenue that that I'm not sure what the sight lines are here. I think it's flat at that area. So, um, so I'd be okay with with the R1 at this point, um, if it's not developed and there was some and Cecil was done and there was a contiguous development, then maybe another zone would make sense in the future, but for right now, I'm comfortable with R1.

Okay. So, we're going to separate the annexation um, and the zoning motions. So, can I ask Mr. Paulus a question? Am I allowed to do that? So, the public proc the the public hearing is closed. Um, so we can if you as long as you limit your questions to what is in the record. How about I'll ask a question and if you feel like it's not appropriate, then you can say no and he won't answer it. Does that sound like a good plan? Sounds like a plan. Okay, great. Mr. Paulus, can I ask you some road questions? Why why don't we go ahead and and reopen the public reopen the public?

Yes, I'm sorry. Okay, great. Um, in our transportation master plan, is there intended to be a road through this property and to the property of the north that potentially lines up with the road that I see to the south of Prairie? So, the road that's south of this property, that's Lind Street. It is our intention that that will run to the north. Okay.

Its alignment once you get past Prairie is speculative because it becomes a local roadway and we do not ma we don't put in our master plan the full alignments of future uh local roadways. We do know that that intersection of Lind Street and Prairie would be restricted long term. That it most likely would end up being a threequarter turn movement so that people would be able to make left turns on and off of Prairie and they would be able to make right turns on and off of Prairie, but they would not be able to go across Prairie on Lynn and they would not be able to make left turns onto Prairie. So only left-hand turns off of Prairie, not left-hand turns on and off of Prairie. Correct.

Okay. Um, and that would only happen once Prairie is because there's not a there's not a center lane right there at Prairie currently, is there? To make a left-hand turn in that section, there is. Yes. Right now.

Yes. The improvements that have occurred on the south side of Prairie over the past six years has allowed for the establishment of two eastbound lanes, a two-way center left turn, and a single westbound lane. We're we're just missing the improvements on the north half of that road to get that last remaining um through lane and the bicycle lanes in place. We actually sacrificed a little bit of the bike lanes in order to be able to fit a two-way left turn pocket in there right now. There is a suicide lane on Prairie in this section right now.

Yes. Oh, I've had to start taking my child to school down this road um and drive it twice a day now sadly and I like can't remember that that exists. Okay. So, um given where Lynwood is then you feel comfortable that there would be a threequarter turn with an anticipated light on Cecil and then already the light on Greens Ferry that would be in compliance with what our master plan is anticipating.

Okay. Um, I think that's most my I mean I am curious if there's a way in this to allow development to be triggered based off of roadway building out so that we don't build out this and only have essentially like a dead-end street which would be Lynwood like down these two pieces of property on and off of Prairie. I don't know if that's really like your purview or if I'm just getting crazy over here. You are

one of the Okay, great. Thanks. one of the areas that depending upon the size of the development that goes in there, um if there's a question as far as a safe access on to Prairie Avenue, city can require with part of the subdivision process, having a traffic study done where we look at the preliminary layout of that subdivision and take a look at that access point and and make a determination from that traffic study. Would traffic on Prairie Avenue be reduced in its capacity to function as a critical arterial and also would the amount of traffic that's coming out create a unsafe condition.

Okay. So we you could and um condition future development in the annexation agreement and just have to get the legal to agree with it. We could put in there as a condition with the annexation that uh a traffic study would be required if no other road connections are con provided to Greens Fairy or Cecil Road. Cecil Road. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Yes. Okay. Yes. So, Rob kind of alluded to the annexation agreement. Mhm.

So with mix zones and with zoning, we can also, you know, bring back an agreement before you guys that look at the coordinated effort at getting to Cecil. I do know with the multifamily that the same property owner owns to the north and east, they do plan on improving portions of Cecil Road to get access to that, which you're not seeing that with this proposal, but there's maybe some conversations we can have with the applicant and embed the appropriate or applicable triggers to alleviate some comfort and maybe you guys could review that prior to, you know, as part of a zoning decision, not necessarily tonight maybe, but you could see that at a following date. So, I just wanted to add that commentary in there regarding the concerns with everything going to Prairie through Lynn Street.

That's good. So, the the we have options with that. We can after the annexation question is is determined, we'll go through the the zoning question and we have the option of either approving the R1 tonight um or if we wanted to go back to a mixed zone, we could do that and those require development agreements which would be a continued hearing. Yeah. And then we could maybe look at more detail with traffic plans and things in the mix zone. So that's an option. Sure, we'll deal with annexation first and then we can get into that.

And Mr. Mayor, once we like if we were to address the annexation, if we were to approve that and we were then to proceed to the voting on the zoning just because if if we were to approve R1, the applicant could come back to us seeking a reason see if he was to go with a mixeduse hearing more or less approval from many of the members on the council here. If you the applicant were to decide, yeah, I want to go for a mixed juice, he could come back to us for a reason, right? We should probably close the public hearing first.

So to quickly, we uh we'd have to ask if there's any other public comment on any of the things that were presented uh by Mr. Paulus or Mr. Manley. Uh after we close the public hearing, then we can go back to deliberations. I can answer that question. Okay. All right. Any any public comment on what was just presented? All right. One thing, can you step up to the microphone here?

Something that's not in the rebuttal. So, you might No, it's not in rebuttal, but it's a clarification. My name is David Leonard and I live on 2136 East War Lane which is by Greens Ferry and uh um so we were just

Green Ferry High School and Pole Line. So um my question is he said I think 20 acres develop property was it 20 acres of property you're going to develop and that results in about 15 acres of develop where you put residences on there the rest of it roads sidewalks rightways and um your R1 zoning is zero to four residences per acre Any Did I get that correct? I believe.

So, that really runs out to about at uh 15 acres. An acre is 43,000 square feet. Four is 10,000 square foot per lot. And you got 15 acres and four four per acre. That's about 60 residences on this whole 20 acres. And what I was looking for is how many people really have to have access to the roads and are going to use the utilities of post falls such as water uh sewage and so on. And that was my question. Um based on an estimate of 60 residential units on these 20 acres, what will be the load on the city of Post Falls? Thank you. Rebuttal from the applicant. Let me get back to that previous map here. So, just for some clarifications, the the 44 acres to the north that we do own is slated for multif family. We are well aware that we cannot build that. One of the reasons the Cecil Road is currently a public rideway, it has been dedicated to you. That was part of the purchase process that we went through was to ensure that we had the ability if none of this other property uh ever developed over here in the technology park that we had access and the ability to build on our own Cecil road because there's no way we're going to dump 800 units of multifamily through an R1 development that we do. I 100% agree. It would be more of a emergency outlet for for either the multif family

or the single family if something happens at the intersection here with Lynn Street or whatever that is. I can't my eyes aren't good enough. Uh then then the uh we we're planning on couple different accesses, but one would be across here to Cecil Road in the future. It gives both the R1 has a secondary access out to Deceal Road in case of something happening in prayer there. So just just for clarification so you guys do know we are well aware that any development that occurs here is going to require a buildout of Cecil Road. It is part of the URD. So it's a reimburseable expense. So it's not like it's something we're not used to doing. We you know we did the URD in Tulmore. So we're well aware of that fact. Just wanted to clarify that. I don't a question for you or or staff. So, do you have the legal ability to build Cecil Road all the way down to Prairie?

Yeah, it's a public rightway. It's already been dedicated. The hold up on all of Cecil Road was basically other developer that will not mention and Ross Point Water District arguing over wells and tower site. We are working with Ross Point for their well and tower site on our 44 acre property. It's a critical piece of infrastructure that that happens and that can only happen now because that right away of Cecil has already occurred. So would you be okay with the development agreement to say that no highdensity housing can go in until Cecil Road to uh Prairie is at least built in concurrently? Yep. Um Okay. Thank you. Okay.

So then this property is not key for development if you have the right of way to build out Cecil. It's not key. This property is not key for us to develop the 44. Yeah, we can move forward on that at any time. Okay. And do you have plans are are those near-term plans now that that has been resolved somewhat or are those long-term plans to develop the 44 acre parcel? We're still a couple years out from even starting to work on that. But and this one that we're debating tonight, you want a near-term development? that one as an R1 or as a as a lower density we would start. Okay. So they would not be concurrent development then.

No. Okay. Thank you. All right. Now we'll close the public hearing. We can return to deliberation. Start with the annexation and then from there Mr. Mo Councelor Mosby if you could kind of repeat your question. Um, I know I had an answer, but uh, the question was if we were to approve the annexation and then to approve the zoning at R1, right, the reason, then a reszone would still be possible if there, having heard the deliberations of council, the applicant were to determine it would likely be a favorable application in the future.

Yeah. So, um once once you make a determination on zoning, they can't come back immediately uh and request a reszone. I think there's a year um waiting time um that they can't come back and request a new zone. Um but that being said, you you do have some options ahead of you um after the annexation. We can make a motion for whatever zone we want, right? And if it passes, then the applicant just has to agree to it. And if they don't agree to it, then it comes back to us. Correct.

That's true. Um, however, I would, um, for the sake of transparency, if you are considering going up to a higher density zone like RM, um, or commercial or any any other of those sort of uh, higher intense uses, I would recommend um, continuing the public hearing so that we can renotice it so that uh, if anybody who would who didn't come out for an R1 zoning may come out for a RM zoning. Um and so allow us to to renotice that and generate a new staff report and bringing that back along with the development agreement um in those mixed use zones. Okay.

All right. Have we sufficiently discussed the annexation question then? You didn't actually read it, but we kind of went through the line anyway, right? Yeah. So, is the annexation of the property in the best interest of the city? I would say yes. Yes. Yes. I would say yes for the reasons I've already given. And I would just call for a vote. All right. Entertain a motion. Do you want me to say my reasoning now or with my vote? Do you care? What do you want, Warren? What do you want me to say it? Okay, great. A motion. Do that then. I move to approve the annexation of this partial presented. Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Malloy. I Ziggler. I Mosby. I

Luca. I stutter as this property is not key for the properties to the north to be developed. I do not think that it is in the best interest of the city at this time because I do not think it is clear in what way it would be for the best interest of the city as none of this other land has been developed. So I would say no I motion passes. Thank you.

All right. So, now that we've completed the legislative uh aspect of the of the decision-making process, we're going into the quasi judicial process. So, uh we're talking about applying uh zoning to this property. Um I think that um there's been some discussion about possibly some other zones. Um we can take that up first. We can take that up following going through the criteria. Let's take it up first if I may. Go ahead.

So, uh, one thing that was never presented in the either two previous attempts is that and may that may not have been the case yet. The Cecil may not have been dedicated, but uh, in this case with the surrounding zoning already in place, I think it makes way more sense to have something like residential mixed against Prairie here. What I would like to see is some sort of development agreement that would say that no high density could be built uh until or or should say no uh occupancy certificate shall be issued until Cecil Road is complete to Prairie with a signalized light.

Uh in that case, I'm I'm happy with a higher density. Uh it's it's the high volume of traffic going in an uncontrolled intersection on Prairie that has always given me heartburn. But that wouldn't that be a development agreement on the other parcels that we're not talking about tonight? Not necessarily. I think there there may be a because we're limiting the I would have to think through that a little bit um in the development agreement because we could um there may be a way to let's see you're getting at uh limiting

can we make this can we make the zoning designation on this one contingent upon a development agreement on the other two parcels because it is all the same development extra layers, right? The development agreement on this one could say that he can't build until Cecil is complete and there's access to Cecil from the north. Yeah. So I I think we we could likely limit the in the development agreement we could limit the high dens higher density residential until such time as there is a alternate connection out of that southern um that southern connection high density residential on what piece of property

on this proposed property. So, if you're you're talking about like RM where you're uh having a development agreement to say what type of housing goes where, um I think you can kind of control the phasing of that uh to where the higher density doesn't happen until the alternate connection out of the back end is made. That's not what you're talking about. We know where she's going and I appreciate that. It's it's the two parcels of high density that they also own to the north and northeast that I'm concerned about. And I don't want I don't want those to go on the prairie. I want those to go out ceiling a signalized uh signalized intersection.

That would be harder to accomplish because that those would be governed by their current PUD and their their current development agreements. So would it would it accomplish it if we said for example uh we're going to zone this property CCM or RM but development agreement will will limit it to an R1 style unless there's a an an outlet to Cecil and a light to handle the additional traffic that it would generate. I don't think so because then you're talking about um you're sort of um you're limiting the ability of of that parcel to develop contingent upon other parcels. And so you you'd kind of be courting a a takings claim there because you're you're utilizing conditions on this parcel to mitigate the impacts of another parcel. So, we have to make it the most restrictive and then have the applicant come back if they want to change it later. So, it's R1. And then if you decided you wanted to change it in a year and develop it concurrently with the other property with an exit to Cecil, then we would entertain that at that time.

But it just R1 is all that's I mean it it could be other it could be other zones. um you just would wouldn't be able to have some of those conditions in the development agreement. I want to make this work for the developer also. Um and obviously this is the first parcel they want to develop. So I don't know how we can maybe get creative because they do own all three parcels.

Uh they've expressed interest in in developing Cecil all the way down to Prairie. uh if if we table this to a the the zoning designation to a future meeting, can can we get creative and help everybody get what they want, which is not a bunch of high density dumping on the prairie in an uncontrolled intersection and they can start developing this current parcel perhaps at a higher density than R1, which I think actually makes more sense uh as well. Can we not connect Lynwood through as part of the development agreement? like Lynwood cannot be connected to the property to the north until the property to the north has access other than Lynwood.

So if you want to entertain a higher density land use, I would recommend continuing the matter and letting us renotice it and working with the applicant and bringing something back. So moved. We can still have discussion. I I think the motion should say something about what zones we would like to entertain. We're going to to move to what what what language do you want in the motion to move to renotice and continue.

So we can again it's a it's a more open process with you you can assign different zones but uh it would be nice to have some guidance for staff to uh prepare a staff report for a a zone but that does not tie you to that zone. But does the zone are you hung up on the zone? Because I feel like we could I mean it doesn't matter to me what zone you pick. I guess like I don't feel like we're hung up on a zone. We're hung up on how any of those people are going to get out. Like it doesn't really matter what zone it is, right? So if could we entertain a motion for whatever zone like we all

be on? I think I mean my two cents are this. I think we're making it way more complicated than it needs to be. I think the current zoning if if it satisfies what we want it to be. The applicant seems to be happy with the current zoning criteria reduces traffic in the short term that will be feeding on to Prairie Avenue. I think our city engineer provided us a mechanism to oversee any traffic volume that might be detrimental in the future. If those northern properties uh are developed before Cecil is, we can we can request a traffic um study before allowing that to happen that would address those concerns. Um so to me, this is the simplest and most uh reasonable way to move forward, allow the applicant to move forward on the development of this property and still address future concerns. I would say we may be over complicating it to a point, but I'm I'm betting that if there was a preferred outcome than, you know, the current developer has the two parcels to the north, and if it's R1, they've got to now build the 15 foot buffers on those parcels, which they would probably rather not do. You've got the other parcel that they do not own directly to the east on prairie that we would then be saddling with a 15 foot buffer if we do an R1 here, which that property owner would probably not be too stoked on that. and uh and considering the density of the surrounding uses anyway, I don't from a city planning standpoint, I'm not sure that R1 is the best option. The only reason it makes a a reasonable option in my head or our head is is the risk of the traffic spilling on the prairie, but we still got the two, you know, 46 acres of of high density that could then spill on the prairie as soon as they start developing it. Their intent is not to develop it right away, but uh you know from a longer term city planning standpoint, if you got residential mix on prairie where this R1 is being developed, you got high density above that and Cecil coming out and all that high density feeds onto Cecil, that makes way more sense than putting an R1

saddling buffers all the way around it on two different three different lots and then eventually Cecil is going to punch through anyway and so what's the point of the R1? Well, if if I can suggest a way out of this, I think what you're looking for is a development agreement, which we could then use to regulate all of this. And if we're doing that, something like the RM zone that requires a development agreement, would make sense. Um, then you could say, let's continue this with the RM zone, that would give staff the opportunity to negotiate with the applicant what the development agreement says. they could look at this in a lot more detail and then bring it back to see if they can make it work in that sort of everybody wins situation.

Yeah, I think everybody wins if it's RM on prairie, but nothing nothing high density gets built until Cecil is ready to go. Yeah, that that seems to me like a win-winwin for everybody, but the staff has to get creative to make that work. And you could always approve it at R1 later as well. So, so what is it between now and the time that we continue it to do we have unzoned property within the city. So when you approve So you've approved the annexation. Um the annexation doesn't necessarily occur until we have a signed uh annexation agreement and ordinance that we bring back. So that's right.

Um okay you've approved it. You need to you need to zone it um so that we can complete that process. But it is it is approved. moves forward. Would they have to go back through planning and zoning if we table the zoning part? I don't want to make the developer go back through that process. No. So, okay. Uh, planning and zoning just makes a a recommendation based on the applicant's request. The way we do the public hearing notice, it's it's

the request is this, but it doesn't tie you to um to making a different determination. Um, the reason why I would like to renotice it is I think it gives people better notice, especially when you're going from a lower density request to a higher density request. I just want to confirm that if we table the zoning aspect of it tonight, they will not have to take whatever zone back through planning and zoning to get to us. And your answer is no, they will not. No, they will not unless you deem it. So, you can always send things back to the planning commission. That's always fun. Let's not say we I think you could go ahead and make that motion.

Well, I would I would move to table this issue and let staff uh explore options for uh development agreements with the assumption that we would proceed forward with a residential mix zone on this plot. Is that English? I think that works. Okay. Second. Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. Malloy. I. Ziggler. I Mosby I Luca I Stigleer I PL I motion passes. Thank you. So we will continue this and

one quick reminder because it's it's continued. It's a live hearing. So that means all of the normal prehering requirements apply. No exparte contacts, no site visits. Um it it's it's just like the hearing hasn't happened yet.

Thank you. And I and I do want to state for the record that as a commissioner also concurrently with the Ross Point Water District, the applicant is as he stated donating land to the district. I don't have any pecuniary benefit from that, but I just want to make that clear. All right. Uh so we're done with public hearings on to returning business. And the first action item here is update to the city proclamation policy. Is there a presentation for this one or do we just do a motion?

Uh there was no presentation planned for this item. Uh we took the comments from council, incorporated them in. Um it's for your review and I would move to approve the update to the city policy. Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. Ziggler, I. Mosby, I. Luca, I. Stig leader I blue I Mallaloy

I motion passes thank you we are on to new business first up personnel policy animals in the workplace exemption this one also doesn't have a presentation plan for it we had a workshop on the personnel policy um we've kind of continued that discussion but there are some items uh smaller items that we need to work through in the personnel policy so um we're just going to start bringing those uh smaller items forward. Um so you'll be seeing these at the upcoming meetings uh just smaller bite-sized chunks. So this one is a update to the animals in the workplace policy. Basically just to provide a pathway to um exemp to an exemption um should the should we determine that one is necessary, we have a option to do that and a process in place for how to how to handle that. is

was there a specific situation in the background of this that drove this? So, yes, there um there are certain departments that have um that have allowed animals in the workplace in the past who don't interact with the public. Um, we have had situations where, uh, we've done a reasonable accommodation for a short period of time to to for somebody to have their dog with them for a short period of time to deal with the loss of a loved one or something like that. So, this is just having building in that process to process those and have an agreement in place. Thank you.

I would move to approve the personel Oh, sorry. No, well, that was my question. I there in this policy there's already an exemption for ADA and the police personally I feel like so for for like working dogs. Yeah. Yeah. Like the exemption has an so this wouldn't apply like those dogs are already allowed to be here I guess is what I'm trying to say.

Yes. Um, I would be more interested in seeing like part of the personnel policy that works to allow um, city employees to work from home for like a couple days a week or an extended amount of time, then personally I'm not interested in having animals in the workplace, especially since it's only dogs um, that are usually part of this. And like I I don't I don't know. I'm not this seems unnecessary to me. the dogs that we need in the workplace are already allowed in the workplace.

So from when I was reading it seemed like it was the exception exemption was already there. It didn't seem like this was building upon it. This was providing more clarity as to the process by which you apply for an exemption, not creating new exemptions.

Not necessarily. it I so pets for reasonable accommodations under the ADA who are service animals or anything like that those are allowed under those provisions. Um, this would be to in those rare cases, um, to be able to sort of work through having a, uh, presence of an animal for an individual circumstance that may not necessarily rise to the level of an ADA service animal or a uh, or a police canine who is a working animal.

And that puts it in the department head's control, but this provides a pathway to make that application. and the department head can determine whether this is that type of scenario. Yes, it would be the department head, the human resources director, and myself. And we'd actually have them sign a waiver of liability and indignification agreement just in case the animal bites somebody or something like that that they would be responsible for that.

We already had that kind of taking place at times. This is just providing a streamlined structure for how that goes about like that. That was already happening, wasn't it? We have done it on an ad hoc basis, but we'd like to clarify that in the policy to have that outlined as as far as how we how we approach those items. Right. So, the policy didn't have like a prohibition on doing it, which I I think is kind of along the lines of what councelor Stigler leader was getting at. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

Well, surely we didn't have a line in the personnel policy that says you're never ever allowed to bring your animal to work. And this is clarifying that because we were breaking the policy. I think the general assumption is that at a place of business in offices, you can't bring your animals unless they are ADA or a service animal or a police dog. This is officially opening up the gates to allow it to happen to which I am not particularly a proponent of. If I may, I know that when I toured the police department, um there was a dog in the records area. And speaking with the people there, I know that it brings a lot of comfort to both crime victims, to the people that work there that deal with really awful things all day long. 911 dispatchers that are hearing horrible things, and uh sometimes petting a dog can be therapeutic, and I would hate to see that removed from the police department. So, um I'm actually concerned that this might be too restrictive. Um but I understand there's also the ability to abuse this. It's already kind of baked into our federal law, too, though. I mean, it's I know you probably would tell us it's very hard to deny somebody if they say that they need their, you know, emotional support goat to come to work with them. It's very difficult to say no, you don't because it's a medical decision. And so, um reasonable accommodation would need to be made. So I think that on the other side we're like if we don't have this policy we we still have the risk that someone's going to come and say they need their goat to come to work with them and you know we have to allow it in this case I think particularly for the police department with the level of stress and things that they deal with. I think I'd want to give them all the support we can and if this helps them and doesn't hurt anything great. It doesn't hurt anybody that doesn't say anything, but gosh, I'm just going to

get so much hate for this. That's fine. Uh I just like only people that love dogs talk about loving dogs, but not everyone appreciates having other people's animals in their workplace. Um and that's that's just that's just what I'm saying. So to some extent if someone needed support or needed to needed that at work, I would be more interested in finding options for people to work from home three days a week or like loosening up that aspect of it if their job allowed that. And I think the police department is a separate issue. Um and they handle animals there all of the time in a very different way. It's a very different culture there than being in like an office building like us at E-Haul. But I am on the opposing side of things all of the time. So float a motion. This is how it always goes.

I would move to approve the personnel policy animals in the workplace exemption. Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. Mosby. I. Luca. I. Stig leader. Hi. I'm sorry. What' you say? No. Pl. Hi. Maloy. Hi, Ziggler. I motion passes. Thank you. Next up, standards for public works construction. My gosh, I have to be Do you want to Can we pause? Can we have a two-minute pause? Oh, yes. Let's Let's call a recess. That's fine. We'll do a fivem minute recess. I support that.

All right, we will resume the meeting

and we are at standards for public works construction engineer. Tonight, the engineering division is asking for your approval for adoption of the standards for public works construction, which would be dated today's date, March the 17th. The last time we updated these standards was in 2019. Historically, the engineering division updates these standards about every 5 to 10 years. Engineering standards help set a general expectation as to what gets constructed and what we end up owning and maintaining for perpetuity after it's constructed. Just looking at the past four years, we've averaged about 366 lots being constructed. That's a mixture of both residential and commercial lots. And the city has averaged 21 site plans a year. What this means is we've seen just from residential subdivisions about $8 million of new in infrastructure constructed each year for our ownership ownership and maintenance. Uh in the past four years that's about $33 million worth of improvements. Breaking it down a little bit more, each year we see typically between 3 to four miles of new roadway, about eight miles of curb and gutter, a little bit less than that of sidewalk, and then there's It varies quite a bit the amount of street lights that go in. We do not own and maintain the street lights, but through our construction improvement process, we do get developers and subdivisions to prepay the first year's operation of those lights. In 2025, we saw about $6 million worth of road improvements in the city. In the utility section, in a typical year, we see about five miles of four to five miles of new gravity sewer and a lot smaller portions of pressure sewer.

Usually, that's put in with city projects and just a very small portion of water man being installed each year. A lot more water main is being done in the East Green Acres Irrigation District and Ross Point Water District. In 2025, we saw just over $1.3 million in water and sewer improvements within uh residential subdivisions. When we develop and update our standard drawings, we utilize a lot of different sources. Um first, we look at national and regional as well as state standards. Some of those, the Idaho standards for public works construction, the current standard on that was updated in 2025. Uh the manual and uniform traffic control devices was up updated in 2023. And then the public rights of way accessibility guidelines were also updated and actually adopted by the federal government in 2023. So we take that stuff into consideration. Some of the stuff we're required to do by those standards. Some of those items are gray areas where we have a little bit of discretion based upon what the local standard is and how we apply those. We also look at manufacturers data. As time goes on, manufacturers change some of the products that they are selling or how they should be utilized and maintained and sometimes will change what product we want to utili utilize based upon maintenance history and what's going to give us a better life expectancy and service to the people. We also take a look at what field practices are out there. We try to adjust based upon areas that we see concern with contractors to make sure that we're getting a good product that's easy to maintain. This is a collaborative process. The improved the standards before you were worked together between the engineering division and the divisions of the public works department. That's water, surface water, sanitation, and streets. Those guys work on the stuff every day. They

give us a good feel for when we're asking for too little or things need to be done just a little bit differently as to what the final product is. The standard notes and drawings fall into five areas: water, sanitary sewer, transportation, and storm water. They cover a lot of the aspects and expectations as to when the contractor builds it, what does the final product look like? How will it work? How does it preserve and protect the health and well-being of the public and our ability to maintain it in an efficient manner? Typical lot. Someone has some hopes and dreams on it. Are they going to subdivide it? They're going to build a business on it to meet someone else's needs. Is there going to be a home on it that a young couple wants to get started with their family or someone wants to retire on? Well, in this case, you need to have a road to serve it. This is actually looking at Cecil Road right now. I found it interesting that that came up for tonight. Well, that's what Cecil Road needs to look like and that tells the contractor a lot of information. Some of the stuff like the compaction of the roadway. If you don't compact a road to the right standard, a 1% below our standard can result in about a 10% reduction in the life expectancy of that roadway. It's important for us to make sure it gets built correctly. Also, we want to make sure there's enough gravel and asphalt on that roadway to handle the expected uh volumes of traffic and the weight limits of those vehicles. That little drawing leads to this. You get curb gutter, you get asphalt that goes in, and there's your final product. Looks nice, but took a little bit to get there. Fire hydrants not always as easy as just, oh, there's a fire hydrant. It works. We got to take into consideration how does the fire department access it and make sure that it'll work appropriately for them. There are elements in the design of that which impact safety of people in case they run

off the road so that it doesn't damage the cars as much and can preserve the safety of drivers. You also have to have items in there that when a hydrant drains, how are you protecting and protecting the users of the water system so that you're not contaminating the water? stuff that's taken into consideration. Simple street sign. What's the correct height? What's the flashing pattern of a rapid flashing beacon? How is that push button on it configured so that meets the standards of the public rights of way accessibility guidelines or the Americans with Disabilities Act. We take that stuff into consideration. Or even something as simple as a driveway. A driveway approach, we do have standards on it. A good constructed driveway can last a home its entire life life. A properly installed driveway approach can result in more cost to the homeowner. We don't want to see that in the public rideway in particular or in business areas where you have the sidewalk next to the curb. How do you bend that sidewalk around so so that you can still provide Americans with disabilities access on that driveway approach? In the end, our design standards provide a uniform expectation of the finished finished improvements. How are they going to look? How are they going to operate? They promote safety for the users. The one thing we want to make sure is that and actually it's a compliment is if someone doesn't worry about when they turn on the water, is it safe to drink? Or what happens to that water when you flush the toilet? That says we're doing a good job with the services we provide. And when they don't have to worry about when I pick up that phone and dial 911, will emergency services be able to get to my house and help me with what I need? That's what we're trying to do through the implementation of these improve these standard drawings. And if we do it correct and we manage what utilities needs for uh maintenance oper and operation and we try to look out for the

long-term cost but be cognizant of that balance between what does it mean on the putting in new homes and businesses as well. We will promote a lower life cycle cost for what we develop. Short and sweet but I do ask for your approval and whether or not you have any questions on the standards for public works construction. Is there a price tag associated with this update? Uh what was that? Is there a price tag associated with this update?

The price tag we have not calculated as to all the changes that we made. How much more expensive or less expensive does it have cost? We haven't done that in the past and haven't looked at that. So no, I mean are are if I understand correctly, you're you're proposing that you develop the guidelines further.

So we've we've updated and so what you're doing is approving for them to be signed and there was a copy of the roughly 78 pages in your packet. So we've gone through and done everything. What would then happen is with this approval, we will then put on the city website. We will contact the engineers and consultants that we normally deal with and some of the developers who normally do work and say these are the changes that have occurred. These are some of the major changes and then as they come in with new projects we will have them update to those standards. The projects that are already in development and review they will be vested under the current standard as it exists right at this second. Thank you.

Mr. Dr. Paul, do you see a substantial increase in the requirements that would be made for single family home like swale, curb, gutter, sidewalk, um, or areas that HOAs maintain? With the updates that we're doing? With the updates, that doesn't really change much in the way of the roads, the swailes. The areas that we h saw the biggest changes were some clarifications in the testing and certification for the water systems, providing a few more notes and details on that. A lot of the other things were just really minor tweaks that that are typical and and occur. Okay, great. Thank you.

I move to approve the standards for public works construction. Second. Motion in a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. Luca I Stigleer I Blue I Mallaloy I Ziggler I Mosby I motion passes. Thank you. Next up is uh but we my agenda is so cit citizen issues and then staff reports. Are we doing them in the in the wrong order? No, that's right. No, we're doing that first. Yep. Citizens issues then. This section of the agenda is reserved for citizens wishing to address the council regarding city related issues that are not on the agenda. Uh, five minutes per person if you'd like to speak. Would anyone like to speak? Yeah,

we race to the podium. Me and my husband came up here in Could you speak in the microphone? You can pull it down a little bit. State your name for the record and you have five minutes on the timer.

My name is Shirley Leonard and I live in 2136 East Warbler Lane, Post Falls. We moved here uh from Cascade, Idaho in 2020. Um we've seen rapid changes and everything and you number one, you guys don't have enough engineers for post walls. Um I'd like to see just make a statement. We need more open space. We need to keep those trails open if at all possible. And you were talking about this annexation that was something to consider that they could put in. But Prairie was there's a I think it there was a pathway ends at the east of us um forget down the road where it just shuts off. It's a signal light. And so we like we like to ride our bikes and we used to be able to go all the way down and ride the our bikes along the quarterlane pathway all the way up to downtown Quarter Lane from Post Falls from our house. We can't do that anymore.

Um highway 41 and 90 is a mess. There's a big traffic accident there. I'm sure you must be aware of it. Horrible. we were coming home. When things like that happen, there's no not a good alternate route

in that area. And it was a real wakeup call because my husband and I have been talking about it since they implemented and and got everything was this is going to happen and it did. Um anyway, what I'm wanting to to the danger of our kids. We have two schools very close by on Greensberry and anything that is built for gas stations or anything like that just really and by high school we got them all clustered right in close together. We don't have enough parks close by but um you were mentioning that they're putting on and putting a park. It's the Corey Sports Park.

Yeah. Going in that area

close by. will help. We need more swells for the kids where they can take their snowboards or little boards and sliders and all that stuff and and play hills that are safe without rocks and other things being in their way where they can jam and fall and hit their head, which we have seen because they like the swell. right next to our house on the corner of Bogey and Back Weight and there's rocks there and they're slumping down and the kids are getting hurt and that swell has sunk because all the water doesn't drain. So, these kids need something to play. They need more room and playgrounds and things like that. like you have to go way over by um east to get to a skate park. Well, that's concrete, but these kids need place to play with their their boards and their and everything else and jump up and down. So playing activities, parks are so important for kids and with two elementaryaries in high school there because the high school kids come to there even and they get hurt, you know, cuz it hits that culbert that is supposed to be a drain that now the dirt has sunk down below and you don't see it because the snow's covering it and their little boards hit that and they go boom, you know. So these are things that are concerned me. And we need sidewalks by our our elementary schools. I don't know if our taxes, government taxes could help that out. Uh they have grants, ask for grants. You know, Boise, they're getting we used to shop down there. We know that they have sidewalks and they have everything. And Post Falls is a family community. It

really is. The people live there. or they go to Celane to work or they go to tri the valley the Spokane Valley to work or they go to the com the commercial areas to work. We also need more real nice restaurants. We only have one that I know of that's really nice and that's by the golf course. Okay, I'm done. Thank you. Anyone else wishing to speak?

Mr. Mayor, counselors, good evening. Thank you for your service. My name is Bill Carlson. I live at 116 South David Court and I am a 38y year resident resident of Post Falls. I'm here uh this evening to uh represent Little League and American Legion baseball. Um and first off, I want to thank the mayor has uh took my call in the past. Uh we met with city staff uh regarding what I'm here to discuss. uh city staff has referred us to you because you have to make these kind of decisions. Um what basically I'm I'm I'm talking about is the uh u $12,000 a year that the little league pays to play on fields that the taxpayers we own. All right? And uh it just it doesn't doesn't make much sense to me. Now, I I will say that the city staff does they mow the lawn. They water the grass, which they would do anyway. It's a park, but other than that, the little league has done a lot of maintenance down there. They report they've repaired scoreboards. Um just uh yesterday, they bought uh I think it was $2,000 worth of fine dirt to to replenish the infields. Um you know, and uh we just we want some relief. We just don't understand why on a city field that the taxpayers own that they pay $12,000. There are board members here at a little league that can offer you documentation over the years. Um, and this just not last year. I mean, this has been going on for for many years. The past administration wouldn't wouldn't discuss it. Um, but uh that's why I'm here. I'm here as a grandfather. I want to know why my uh grandsons got to pay to play. Um, you know, I take any questions you may have and we've got board members here that uh can offer you complete documentation on

that, but I'd like to see the city council do something about it. Um, we're not providing it's not like a program where we're in a gymnasium where there's electricity or an air conditioning or heat or referees. I mean, you don't pay for the umpires. Uh, like I said, the the the only thing the city does is is mow the lawn and waters the field. I see a lot of, you know, and I think a lot of people are shocked that that uh you know, a nonprofit little league would would pay $12,000 a year to use a city field. I mean, you you charge us mighty hour to use the field.

What does that equate to for each participant in a yearly fee that they have to to pay and play? I I Mr. Luke, I don't think I understand your question. I assume that you pass those costs on to to the the players and their families. What does it cost for a player then because of this fee and your other things that you have? It's a little over $100. I think about 100. What is it? Uh 200 $200. We do have one of the board members here can answer a lot of those questions and document that for you. Thank you.

I guess where I sit on this is this is this is new news to me that the fees would be that exorbitant. So, I think it's very well within reason for us to consider this and take a look into the parks and recck budget and see why why this is what it is. I can't give you a definitive answer tonight without having further kind of explanation from the city's standpoint of why those costs are there, but thank you for bringing it to our attention. I was unaware of that the fees were that high,

you know, and we also can uh I said the board members can document go back five, six, 10 years and document the exorbitant fees that they've paid over the years. And of course, and when I say maintaining the fields, the the the fathers and and mothers of these kids are out there raking the fields, preparing the fields, cleaning up the the batters boxes and all that stuff. I mean, there's a lot of They even paid to have the scoreboards fixed. City didn't pay for those. Little League did. How many fields, sir, are you referring to for the $12,000? I'm sorry. How many fields? There's How many fields? All the city fields. How many fields are you using? What is the number that you're paying the $12,000 for? Yeah. Whoever has that number, introduce yourself.

Yep. Thank you. Hi, council. My name is Pansy Baker. So, I'm the vice president of our little league this year. I've been involved in the Little League for several years. Currently, this season, we're using approximately 7 to eight publicity fields. Okay. Um, but that can fluctuate year to year and based off of our attendee numbers. So, right now we have just under 420 registered players for this season. Every season it has gone up and that's of course to be expected with the amount of people moving into our region. So our fees range anywhere from our teballers right around in the 90s up to our older folks. So we go from the age four all the way up to 15 16 both for softball and for baseball.

Is that $200 figure per month or per season for the season? So per player if you break it down. So on average about 12,000 is what we pay the city for usage of the fields and then the players right it varies anywhere from 90ish dollars to 165 just depending on their ages right the older they get more game opportunities umpires there's more costs right associated with those um so if you break it down it's we're paying a lot of money for the usage of the fees in addition to just everything else going up. Has there been a request from the Little League to have any of these um the dirt or the scoreboards or any of these things fixed by the city or has it just been taken on because it's easier for you to organize yourself?

Yeah. No, I know we work with them directly um and ask right, hey, this needs to be fixed, this needs to be fixed and oftent times it's fix it and then send us a bill and maybe we'll take it off of your fees. And have you ever submitted a bill that's been denied? Not that I'm aware of. Um, but I would only know within the last year or so. That might be helpful information to have as we think about this. I guess my other question, sir, to your point about them being publicly owned fields, are the public allowed to use these fields while you're using them? Well, uh, when you're playing a baseball game, no, you wouldn't have a bunch of kids out there that weren't using them. No, I mean, we do go they do go through, uh, and reserve the fields, but they are there are fields for baseball,

right? or baseball park. I'd like to see this like decided equitably. But I do think that it's important to note that while they are publicly owned fields, the fee that you're being charged is allowing you to use them solely and not the public to use them. And I think that's an important distinction. Well, they do have to be reserved. You just can't walk on and and play, but you could if there wasn't anybody on there, right? Well, I think if you go down to any of the ball fields in town here during the summer, you ain't going to find a lot of people out there playing unless it's or they're it's organized. Do we require a fee for everyone that reserves the baseball field? Like even if it's not like a league if they reserve the field. If they reserve the field. Yeah. Okay. And I think one thing to note too, and I'm sorry to interrupt you. No, please.

Um is when you reach out to Celane, Hayden, even Rather, their cities do not charge little league abuse the fields. They don't. They do not charge. We are the only ones postfall city that have to pay to use those fields. It so it must be more than what the reservation fee would normally be. No, they don't pay any fee whatsoever. They don't pay to they reserve those fee those fields and those are during the little league season. Those are those fields for little leaguers. Do you find those fields are the same quality? No, they're better. They're better. They're better. Okay. Y um and then the um the the 90 to 165 per student. Um, do you offer any kind of discount for a family that has multiple players?

Yeah, multiple. And we do a lot of scholarships. So, we do not let money get in the way of children playing, right? Because they're learning the sport, of course, but all the other things they're learning within baseball and softball far exceeds them having to cover the cost to play. Thank you. Y, you know, I also I also think it's important to note that uh we're able to use the school district fields and they don't charge us either. Yep. They charge us, I think. All right. Well, thank you for for bringing this forward. We have a new parks and rec director, Chris Arman, who's over there. If you haven't spoken to him yet, I would encourage you to. And then maybe we can have an update from him at the next meeting about what these what these fees are and and it's probably something worth looking at.

And can you guys hear this? There we go. Pretty quiet. Um, we have an agreement with Little League between the city and Little League. So we can bring the agreement and what the outline of that is. We also have all the documentation on what's been paid for the last several years and so we can bring that also. Okay. Thank you. We'll take a look into all this. Thank you for your attention this matter. Thank you. No, thank you for waiting. We appreciate it. Just picked a heck of a meeting. Yeah, you kids did great. Good job, guys. I know you want to stay up late, but probably not. This wasn't what you had in mind.

Anybody else wishing to speak? My name is Steven Suji. I live at 3604 West Villa. Um, I do want to thank the council mayor for your time. Uh, I want to address the baseball issue, but I uh have a little bit of a different perspective that maybe I could share with you. So when the previous speakers got up, I and forgive me, I sustained a traumatic brain injury four years ago while I was at work. So I have dysphasia, so sometimes communicating is a little tougher. I wouldn't ask for uh special treatment, but possibly if I go over my time because I'm obviously having a hard time communicating, I would appreciate some grace there. Uh first of all, I just want to tell you that uh I'm grateful to be a resident of Post Falls, grateful to be a resident of Idaho. I think we're a great community besides baseball. Uh, both my grand I'm half Japanese. Both my grandfathers served in the US military. Uh, my family was interned here in Idaho cuz we're Japanese American, right? So, I totally believe in America, right? I live in the state where my family was interned, right? That's what America's about. That's what baseball is about. So, I've coached for Little League for about four years, even with a brain injury because I think it's important for

young players to see that adversity can be conquered, if you understand what I mean. So, I'm not as eloquent as I used to be because of the the brain injury, but I want to speak to two things specifically. I know that 122,000 $14,000 divided over 400 kids. I'm not a mathematician, but I think that would come out to like I don't know 30 bucks, $35 per kid. That doesn't sound like much, but it is an economic barrier to some. $35, right? And I want to give you a different perspective. Little League does a great job with scholarships. I've been injured at work. I sustained a a brain injury. I was worked at a in impatient drug treatment center and I just got a brain injury. I couldn't afford to pay for baseball for four years. For four years, even Legion ball, who gets charged to use the fields? I couldn't pay. They found a way. They found a way to float float me until I could pay with these fees. There's no money left for scholarships, right? And so I want to say this. I've coached for four years in post falls. That means I've I've guided probably at least a hundred kids. And I will tell you this, the kids that come from single parent homes that need a good coach, a coach that our only interest is seeing the kids succeed, succeeding, seeing the

kids be something in the community. We have parades. We have opening day where this may be the only opportunity for these children to ever get recognition. And the first ones that are going to be out are those that $30 is an economic barrier because some of those parents, they don't have the resources to say, "Do you have a scholarship? Is there another way to do this? Can I volunteer? Can I coach? Can I help rake the fields?" Me as a coach with a disability has spent many hours laying chalk, raking the field. I have a different perspective. I think the parks department does as good of a job as they can at trying to get things fixed, trying to get things done, but it's baseball. So, I spend a lot of time, too. There's a lot of people that are involved. And I just want to say that even though it comes up to $30 and I know you have a a responsibility of fiscal management and maybe the easiest place to make that cut or or not to adjust anything is like for baseball, but it's America. If it hadn't been for baseball, if it hadn't been for Little League and also our Legion teams, my family wouldn't be the same. And it just won't allow the baseball community to be able to be a community and help each other with these large bills. Thank you for your time.

Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else wishing to speak? Yeah, my name is David Leonard and I spoke a little earlier. Uh the gentleman in a green shirt, uh I guess he is our city engineer. Yes.

Okay. there was a different one when I went to talk to them previously as an engineer that started out building highway with the um Nevada State Highway Department and when they wouldn't give me a promotion I went back to college and got a degree and I came over in Nevada and I came over to Idaho to take my exam and I formally was a civil engineer registered with the state of Idaho and I obtained registrations in other states by reciprocity and I've been involved with everything from building a dirt road to a nuclear power plant. I thought that was a very very good presentation. It followed coherently and completely understandable and it looks like a really good set of rules to conform to. The last engineer I came to talk to for the city, one of my questions to him is rules are fine, but they need enforcement. When I worked with Nevada State Highway Department, whenever we was supervising the highway, we had a testing trailer and we had at least four or five and they took gravel samples, they took compaction tests, they took water tests, flow tests, the whole works. Tremendous expense when I look back on it now. But I wonder how. And I wonder perhaps maybe as city engineer if there's others interested because I've heard complaints within my own subdivision about roads failing within five years of being constructed. And I I wonder how the city of Post Falls enforces the myriad set of rules that apply to the myriad kinds of construction you have here. Paved roads are different than sidewalks. fire hydrants and and the underground piping for that is different than the

piping for the water to the house or the sewers and we have ro rules for every part of that but how do we assure compliance that's what I would really like to see a presentation on I would hope that the many other um city residents would also know how how do we make city of post falls as good as the rules say it should be and that's uh I'm I'm going to pay pay a visit to find out personally but the last visit was there was an engineer and he had two assistants that's only three and when I think back to my previous days we had a trailer of testers and inspectors on 19 miles of state highway we probably had seven people working in that facility plus the cost of the facility outrageous But it we had roads that lasted with truck traffic for 25 years without major potholes and major repairs. So it was designed properly and then the design was assured to be completed because we had a lot of money to spend. Postfall doesn't have that kind of money I'm sure. But I'd like to have a presentation to see how they do that. Maybe I don't need a presentation. Maybe I just need to visit the engineer. Yeah, I think you guys will have a lot of shop to talk about. That should be fun.

All right. Thank you very much for your time. Thank you. Thank you.

My name is Beth Vamm. I'm here about the baseball. Um, excellent question. In all the years that we've been on these fields, we haven't come across other people wanting to be on the field while our kids are on it. We have other people wanting to be there to watch our kids. Smaller kids wanting to interact with our bigger boys who do. Our coaches make an investment. Our parents make an investment. Not just in the kids that are here right now, but in our future. I'm a combat veteran. We lost my husband to PTSD. These coaches are my kids' dads. They step up for everything. He also went out for football. His baseball coaches is guiding him through football. He's struggling with missing his dad. His coaches step in. Investing in our baseball players is investing in our community and investing in our future. Thank you.

Thank you. Hello, council. Um, my name is Nick Bonds and I'm running for the US Senate race this election and I just wanted to give notice. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you. Good luck. Anyone else wishing to speak?

You're probably tired of this topic at this point, but I'm here uh my name is Joel Brown. I'm here on behalf of American Legion baseball. Um, American Legion is kind of extension off of Little League. So, we take the kids as they get older, um, and trying to provide opportunity for these young men to have a competitive experience, um, outside of travel baseball. Um, and if you look at it, um, we're giving them opportunities to do something that they probably couldn't afford otherwise. So, this we're we're typically dealing with not the the wealthy among us. Um, we keep our fees pretty low comparatively. We charge about 1,500 plus a little bit of of uh investment that the kids have to do to do some fundraising. Um, and that compares to maybe five grand plus for a travel team. Um, and that's for year round. So, um, we try to give them, you know, they have nicer uniforms. They're trying to give them a nice experience. We get to see what it looks like as we we go around, um, other communities. Um, and I would just say that um, our facilities are lacking in terms of the size of our city um, compared to others. We go play tournaments in a city like Moses Lake where they have a dozen plus fields and we have one um, and so it's not really competitive. On top of that, the facility that we are competing for to use um, has the agreement with the Catholic Church next door. So, we can't play games on Sundays. So any type of tournament typically has a championship game on Sunday and we cannot do it in Post Falls um unless we use the high school and that field needs some work too. Um so just wanted to um give a little plug out for for American Legion. All the coaches are are volunteering. We're doing it for free. Um just trying to help our kids grow up and become young men that are leaders. Um and then the field that we currently have, we are competing with other um other teams. Um

one of the big things, I know somebody else said it, but we we've actually experienced this. There's men's leagues that play and a lot of the teams that are playing on the fields are from Spokane. So we have com competition going up against them having reserve fields that we cannot get in on um on top of having to pay to play. Um and so that doesn't seem right to me. It seems like we should have dibs over any Spokane team coming over to Post Falls to play. Um, and then I just I just I think we got to continue to plug for more fields every opportunity that we can get because we need and I know that we're we got Tullemore on the docket and I I think people have confused um what's going on next to Origill and what Tullemore is is what the plans are for that. I don't see any plans for an actual uh full-size baseball field in any of that. It's all little league and smaller and uh softball and other things, but no actual baseball fields. Um so I just want to continue to put that bug in people's ears when we're talking about this that we need to look at maybe adding that. So thank you.

Thank you.

All right, guys. Julie Hensley, 1360 East Warm Springs. Good evening. Um, I'm here to speak to encourage everyone that the city of Post Falls to not charge Little League um to use our local baseball fields. Little League is a not a business. It's a not for-p profofit organization and it's run by volunteers. It's run by parents, coaches, and community members who are giving their time so kids in our community have a place to play, learn, and grow. These are not outside groups coming in. These are postfalls families. These are taxpayers. These are the same people who already fund these parks and pay their property taxes. Charging them again to use these fields quite simply is charging the community twice. The same and the city of Post Falls has already shown the understanding of this principle. With the recent changes at Camilan Park a couple years ago, we used to charge residents to use that park. We used to have to pay to park there. And this city council, well, well, I think you're the only one, maybe Lizzy Glover on them, actually said like we need to stop charging our residents. Our residents are already paying for this park. And so, we're able to actually have a park pass there so that way we could actually use those facilities. You know, when you look at other cities and what they're doing, I called the cities today and I said, "Hey, what are you guys doing for little leagues?" And they said, "We don't charge our little leagues." I said, "Why would we do that? They help maintain our fields. They're the ones that are going out there and making sure everything's right. And that's something that, you know, we need to apply to our little league here in the city of Post Falls. I can tell you our parents, we're the ones that are out there helping these fields. We clean up the fields every year. My husband and I, we go bring a quad down to Corbin Park for the last couple of years to clean it up because it is not a playable field. There are pine cones and pine needles and trash everywhere. And we spend hours sitting there doing that field as a Post Falls resident. And it's not for our own glory. It is to help out our kids in our community and to make sure that they

have a nice fields to play on. So big thing I'm going with is the fact that, you know, we don't need to inquire more costs for our local tax payers that are already paying for these fields. So thank you. Thank you. And thank you for the work you put into the fields.

I would like to comment real quick on this. Um I love baseball. We can talk about baseball all night as long as we're here. Um, I have played on all the fields that you've mentioned, having been born and raised here, uh, on 19th and then on 21st, Brett James Memorial Field. I've taken ground balls at the gravel pit at Corbin Park. Um, so I completely understand what you all are talking about. I also raised my son to play uh, through little league and Babe Ruth and high school ball and and um, American Legion. So, um I I really appreciate you all of you, you know, taking the time to come down tonight cuz like I said earlier, this is something that I was completely unaware of. I think I think being reasonable people in the room, you know, maybe there's an expectation or or an acceptance of of of fees that are more reasonable to cover a little bit of the cost that may the city may occur. So, you know, I'm I'm not trying to make any guarantees that we can just wave all the fees, but I I do think it's something that we can definitely address because having been a player um and a coach, uh you know, baseball is is the truly American sport that I think we can embrace. Um I would suggest though even if even if on the outside chance that the that the city can you know take on all the cost the cost um associated with maintaining the fields to not let your players uh grow up without knowing how to operate a landscape break because I think it's one of the coolest thing about our sport is that you know I don't know any other sport where the player learns how to take care of his own playing field uh other than baseball. So um thank you again for all of you coming down here. I know for me, you know, I've definitely heard you. It's something that I will pursue and we'll try to get an answer and at least, you know, help out the burden of the financial cost for the great game of baseball.

Anybody else wishing to speak? Can I make just some I like your hat. Thank you. If I had to come to work on one of my favorite holidays, I figured you'd all have to look at this. All right, we are on to administrative staff reports. The Harmony Place HOA discussion. I'll let it empty. Can't hear you.

Mayor, council, Bob Seal, community development director. Um, so on I believe it was January 6th, uh, one of the residents, uh, and an HOA board member came to the council and brought up an issue with the Harmony Place neighborhood in the HOA. And I'm bringing you back information in order to help look at this closer. So overview of this um the Harmony Place uh Harmony Place Ho or neighborhood was platted in 1995. Starting in June of 23 uh we started receiving uh emails uh regarding HOA concerns and their issues that they were facing. Um, we will also I will also go over the uh currently maintained areas by the HOA and discuss what um they've the request for city assistance. So, this is a copy of the plat. Uh, it's at the corner of Idaho and Polline. um in June of 23, the vice president of the HOA, the then vice president, I don't know if they are today, um reached out to me and indicated that they were currently gathering votes to dissolve the pro the to dissolve the HOA and wanted to know, you know, would their taxes go up, uh who's going to maintain the grass medians, the grass around the perimeter, the common area they have. Um, and I basically uh told them that, you know, this was an HOA issue. Um, at this time, we didn't really have much of an answer for them, uh, except for the fact that they were still required to determine how to maintain their areas. Um, and she noted that they had uh, nearing the majority of the neighborhood was ready to vote on dissolution. Um, but they had not finished that yet. Um, come June of 25, uh, the same board member reached out, uh, said, "Okay,

we've gathered enough votes to dissolve. Now what?" Um, as I noted to them in an email was that dissolving the HOA would be problematic for future maintenance of many of those common areas. Uh, that's shown on the original plat. uh they have the landscape islands in Teton, the drainage easements on Idaho and Pole line as well as the common area that's in the middle of some housing and I'll show you a map of that in a moment. Um I also noted at that time that the city does not routinely take on private HOA maintenance responsibilities. Um following that email correspondence in December of 25, a different board member uh reached out to me to talk about the fact that they had the same they were still looking at the same issues desire to dissolve and what that means. um in conversation with her um I offered to go to the HOA meeting that was being held uh that coming Saturday. Um so I went to their meeting and listen to their issues that they were facing and and um try to discuss with them some of uh some alternatives that they may have for how they maintain their common open spaces. Um but also noted that the city for my opinion, but that's just mine, uh was not prepared to take on any m maintenance responsibilities that they would need to speak with council to have something like that taken into consideration. Um and I also advised them that if they were not to be maintaining those uh common open spaces, that would ultimately fall on the adjoining land owner. Um and so that would be still remains a private issue. um to give you kind of an idea of what we're talking about. The um I've shown on here using the arrows and uh the common area is between is a less just slightly less than an acre and it's surrounded by um houses. It's only accessible by foot paths. Um there's landscape islands in the middle of Teton. And then there is a perimeter

landscaping area that is uh located within a separate tract uh along pole line and Idaho. Uh all those pieces are essentially owned and maintained by the HOA at this time. Um, part of the argument that came up was that the city already maintains a bunch of land uh, landscaped areas near the neighborhood and would it be would the city be able to take on those maintenance areas that they are asking us to take. Um, I wanted to show you this because uh, the green is currently maintained by the parks department. The red is maintained by the public works department. Um that's a linear park that runs through there. It's actually got a gas line in the middle of it. Um but that's how that was established. Um the HOA has ultimately requested that the city take on maintenance responsibilities for the landscape tracks and easements along Pole Line in Idaho. Uh the one on Idaho I believe is 20t wide. Uh the one on pole line is 5t wide. And they're all those are also adjacent to rightway. So there's additional landscaping that takes place in there. Um and then as well as sidewalks. So the sidewalks are responsible are responsible having the snow removed during the winter as well. Um these are just some photographs of the area so you can have a better idea as what we're talking about. You see on the left hand side is the uh common open space um that they currently water and mow um as necessary. Um, and then the Harmony Place uh is just an example of the uh landscaped islands that also serve as swailes. Uh, this is along Idaho Street. You can see the depth of it um from the right from the streets

edge over to the fence is rather substantial. Um, and then on pole line, while the uh actual easement area and tract is not as wide as the other one, it's still a decent size. Um the issue that we face with this is that we're setting a precedent if we were to take on uh the maintenance obligations uh creates an expectation that the city can backfill. Um when HOAs begin to have issues um whether those issues are financial or struggle with maintaining a board which I understand this neighborhood is. They struggle to have uh residents that are willing and able to sit on the board. Um I also understand that the board some board members had received death threats. So, you know, it's not something that obviously is what they want to do, but they're doing it out of an obligation and they're spend a substantial amount of time maintaining that board. But, um, and while I empathize with the neighborhood, um, I still have to step back and say that staff doesn't recommend taking on maintenance obligations, um, as to what could lead into the future. We do have dozens of HOAs throughout the uh, throughout the community. Some of them are small, some of them are large. Um, and they all have certain amounts of maintenance responsibilities that uh help to keep their neighborhood looking nice and um, attractive. Any last thoughts on this? Can I answer any more questions for you?

You've probably addressed this before, but what is our enforcement mechanism of especially along streets and things like that? What is our responsibility enforcement in a situation like this where the HOA basically collapses? So, we would end up looking at it under like the maintenance code that code enforcement um would follow. And that's going to be overgrown grasses um would could potentially be an issue. Um but I believe that's 8 in 12 in. I can't remember how tall it has to get before code enforcement gets involved because it ultimately the land um that is public right of way is essentially the the adjoining homeowner's responsibility. Um and so with these yes it's difficult um because there's no access from their backyard into those tracks area that tracked area. Um what that might entail is um you know putting in a gate in their fence, joining together and paying one person to do it. Um anyways, it that the code enforcement is what it comes down to. Um for most of those issues,

you'd have to enforce it against each individual property owner. Correct. Kind of like how you're responsible for mowing outside out the front of your house. But and then the ones that don't have common area adjoining their homes, they they wouldn't have code enforcement taken against them, right? Um well, as long as you're maintaining your property, there's and the property that abuts yours, uh there shouldn't be a reason to have code enforcement go after you. But as you note, you know, that that's the thing with this neighborhood. Oops, I can just stick with one of these is that yes, it's those homes along the perimeter that are going to be the ones that uh struggle the most. Um if you're on Elias Court and the HOA collapses,

you're fine, right? It's the property owners on Cabinet and Shasta, those those property owners would have to maintain the area behind them and our code enforcement would enforce their little 75 foot, 50 foot section, whatever, right,

against that property owner each individually. Yeah, I mean there are other um uh if the city were building this. So we we built uh we did a road section on Spokane Street um and we didn't anticipate necessar well that's not a good example. There are a couple of HOAs that have failed and the right of way that does abut those HOAs ultimately just uh ends up looking like weeds. Um, and uh, whether there's enforcement involved or not, um, it depends on what it how tall the grass actually ends up getting. And because it's not being watered, it doesn't really get very tall. Um, and so it just kind of, um, looks brown, kind of like um the picture I had of,

but we don't send an assessment, for example, to every house and say, "We're now maintaining this because you have failed to, and you all owe us $150 or whatever, right? We are not we uh don't do maintenance areas of most of those common areas. I can't I don't even know of any that we do necessarily maintain that are HOA properties. Right now, we wouldn't charge them for our maintenance. We would just charge them whatever the the Oh, the fine. Thank you. Whatever the fine is, right?

Most likely. Yes. So the real issue for them if they don't maintain it, it's probably less the code enforcement side and more do they care about how their neighborhood looks and their property values because they could let it fall apart if they decided not to maintain everything and right before it's a code enforcement issue. It's just an eyesore issue and do they want that for their neighborhood or not is kind of the question. Correct.

Yep. There's there's a property over by uh uh I think it's well it's Guy. It's over by Graange and uh trying to think if it's off top of Spokane Street or Chase. It's off of Spokane Street, right? The uh um the old guy property. Um so it's actually near Prairie Falls that um the gentleman on the corner maintains his yard really well. Um but the subdivision that's behind it um they ultimately just stopped irrigation um within their swailes along Spokane and Graange and have just kind of let it die um and the trees have also died in those areas because they just decided they were not going to have an HOA anymore.

Collapse of civilization. So, I feel like we really need to enforce this. Like there there was a development agreement that went in that this HOA agreed to, every property owner agreed to. I mean, my HOA has very small number of houses, but we have long strips like this that we maintain and that means I pay $500 a year, whereas places like the Highlands pay a third of that maybe. And with all their amenities, we have zero amenities. But we maintain the grass. We pick up the dog feces from people that walk through. We maintain the street trees. We do all of that. And it's, you know, 30, 40, $50,000 a year for our small development. And if we're doing that, I feel like everybody else has to live up to their end of the bargain and keep our city looking good and not allowing the the dandelions and everything to take over and affect everybody else's property. So, I would just, you know, I'll be in no on us taking it over or letting them out of their obligations. And I just hope that we use whatever enforcement we have to in order to maintain that that have them uh take up their responsibilities. I doubt that their assessment is anywhere near what mine is and they have a park and they have access to city parks and they have to just cut the grass and water it. So that's my opinion.

Mr. Seal, what happens if they is it quit deed? Is that the term? Like can they like a quick claim? Quit claim. Quit claim. Quit claim. I don't think you can quick claim anything to the city. Yeah. Okay. So, there's no I thought I saw in the packet that they were asking to like deed it over to us, but we would have to accept it, right? There's no way for them to give it to us without that. Okay. Yes. Correct. Thanks. I have other questions about HOAs more in general that I was hoping to talk about, but we can make this decision first. I'm not in favor of taking it over. No. No. It's collapse of civilization.

Exactly. I think we do have some interest. I mean, limited, you know, the city's interest in keeping our I mean, that's a major roadway that it's unfortunate that both sides of that road will look like the center and the left side of that road. Um, but I think you're exactly right with the president that it was sent, but I do think somewhere in our moving forward in our development agreement or something, we need probably more rigorous enforcement mechanisms for situations like this. And we've already addressed this, but

I I would defer to legal on our ability to do that. It is incredibly hard to uh for government to regulate private businesses and so once they you know we can require that they're formed but we can't really do much more uh than making sure that they are formed in the proper way. But what happens after that? Um, you know, they're they're their own association and we don't have we don't have a lot of good tools for that other than breach of contract and suing them and that costs has its own costs of associated with it as well. Well,

well, I think that's kind of what we're talking about here is that that would be the enforcement mechanism. And I think from every plat that I've looked at for a subdivision like this, they always have the CCNR called out as an express condition of approval and it's on the back page of the plat where all the signatures are for all the different agencies that have signed off on it. So I think certainly if built into that agreement with the city in exchange for approval of this subdivision there has to be an agreement an enforcement mechanism whether it's a lean right or what have you that if there's a violation of the CCNRs where they failed to uphold their end of the bargain and perform this maintenance instead of having to go and enforce a fine on every single property maybe there's a mechanism to okay our agreement was with the entity you find the entity generally for the entirety and then that trickles through the entity to all of the members. Now is are they actually going to enforce that? I don't know. But

I think there should be something there's no entity there's no entity. the entity collapses, then I think we need to have if it's legal, we need to be able to go after each individual property owner and say like if if I don't take care of my grass, my HOA will come cut it and send me the bill and then they'll put a lean on my house if I don't pay them. Like why do we as a city not have a similar mechanism? It's like you agreed to this, you breached the contract, we're sending somebody over to cut it, it's, you know, 7,000 this year and you need to pay that.

And if we don't have that mechanism, can we get that mechanism? Is that something we can do? Because otherwise, why does any subdivision that signs an agreement with us have to comply with it? They don't. They could collapse that HOA the next day and everybody can put their boats in skyscrapers and, you know, let the clover grow or whatever they want to do. So, it would just make a farce of our entire process of planning and zoning and council. You said you were going to do these things. If we can't enforce it, then why are we even talking about it? Build whatever you want. I guess the alternative would be then if if I mean I don't know how many times this has happened. It seems like it's become a topic of conversation in the last couple years at least.

But the alternative would then be to require new developments to put in a park up to city standards which would then be ours and we would be responsible to take care of that along with you know deeding the rights of

of these rideways to our maintenance. So it it does meet city standard. Um, but I know, you know, for most small developments like this one, I don't know what our minimum requirement for space is a city in a city park, but that would definitely cut into any kind of, you know, density numbers that they would want to target. But um you know I I agree with with councelor Lipin like there there has to be a way that we can kind of follow through with what I believe is our commitment to the rest of our residents of the town of like we're allowing this development to go in under these certain guidelines that I feel like should be contractual in with an enforcement mechanism.

So that's retrospective what we're going to do about the problem that we already have. I'm curious about what we want to do with it in the future. So, um I agree like we have spent you said this was in 95. Yeah, this was so five years ago we approved this plat. 30. Yeah. Yeah. I got it. I got it. No.

Um we approved this plat. It's built out and so now 30 years. How many HOAs have we approved and been have been built out in the last 30 years? So, we would anticipate that this will continue to be an escalating problem, right? And that we're going to see more of this coming. So, we need to I feel like have a mechanism to figure it out. But every plat to counselor Mosby's point that I have also seen in two years and some change always has an HOA. And some of them, especially the ones where they're advertised as being starter homes or cheaper homes, even involve a private road, which are even more expensive than just these pieces of land that we're talking about. So I'm sort of interested in a council and as a city exploring the idea of not having building requirements to the extent that every development we approve must have an HOA because clearly however we have been doing and enforcing HOAs is something that has a high percentage of getting into this tricky and quite frankly unwinable situation. And this is not right this is not the only HOA that we've heard about. So

seems like if we can place deed restrictions or qualification on sale for creating affordable housing, which we have done, then there should be a mechanism to attach HOA responsibilities to a deed restriction. There is like even in this one there is a a note on the plat that talks about HOA maintaining these common areas. Is it a strongly worded note? Because that's what we need. We need something they follow. They followed the rules until they could not do it anymore. But if the HOA doesn't exist, we're Well, I think that's the thing is if the HOH HOA collapses, there has to be a secondary mechanism that goes to each property owner.

Well, I believe each property owner when they acquire their property subject to the CCNRs, they're entering into a contract and I believe that that would be part and parcel with their agreement with the city because when the city approves the plat subject to the CCNRs, I think it still binds each of the owners individually. I think that's where the problem failure is is it's not a contractual agreement to the city. It's to the HOA. Yeah. We're not a party to the contract. We're not party to the contract. Is am I? Yes. The individual property owners would likely have a cause of action against the entity.

Yeah. So maybe that's a some verbiage that can be added as a as a trigger. require a covenant to the city where they owe an obligation to the city in in exchange for approval. Is that something we can do or not require HOAs that make everything more expensive including affordable houses and and so a lot of the HOAs are created to maintain you know some of these um outside areas outside of a fence line along along a roadway. Um areas that don't have HOAs in the city are the old lot and block area.

Um but the direction that a lot of developers have gone over the past 30 40 years has gone more to that curve linear type of streets um that ultimately have a lot of these uh extra landscaped areas. They also often will have small neighborhood parks. Um, and it is part of the beautifification, right, of a of a development. Um, and so that's been the kind of the direction that they've gone. What we often didn't get under, you know, under these types of developments, we do see more neighborhood parks getting created um than say during an old lot and block type of development process. Um but you know so we have tried to look at some of our you know we could look more further into design criteria what does that look like you know how do we start to discourage um this type of development versus lot and block I don't know if anybody really wants to go to lot and block um talking

you can still have a pretty swale and have trees on the interior of the neighborhood because that's all maintained by the homeowner not by the HOA I'm just I'm just saying we we can't have both things. We can't have all of the beauty and none of the cost. And I think this is a fantastic example of what happens when one side of that runs out. Um I'm a big fan of the lot and block. I I would much rather go back to that and have if the mayor and I agree on something, you should probably know.

I'm all about the lot and block alleys and everything. That's fine if that's what the agreement that they enter into. They didn't enter into they made a promise to the city that we're going to put this sidewalk in. We're going to maintain these. We're going to do these street trees, all these things. And if they don't have to, why do I have to? And the fact is I don't.

This is enlightening. So unless my HOA decides to enforce it against me, what you're saying is is the city is not going to take any action and they're going to come cut my grass or let it grow, one or the other, and maintain the street trees or not, or enforce it against the property owners that are abudding that greenway, which I don't. So you know, and that attitude is going to be for everybody. I did they happen to in your discussion or your meeting, did they happen to mention how much they pay a year in HOA dues?

Yes. I mean, I I heard the fee increase was going it it's nominal in a sense of like in scope of yours, it's probably at least half. Um, they just continued to have again, you know, it was like 25% or so of the property owners weren't paying and hadn't paid. They'd lean some of the properties. Um, but nobody has been really selling in this neighborhood, so they're not receiving any of those leaned property funds. Um, and so it's it's more about the fact that they've got 66 plus percent of the neighborhood that just doesn't want to be part of an HOA. Um, and then you've got board members that they struggle to maintain a board. Um, those that are currently managing the board indicate that there's a lot of work that goes into it. Um, I talked to uh the president of the board last week, I believe, and he indicated that, you know, he spends 20 hour his his note was I spend 20 hours a week working on this. I already have a full-time job. I don't have to do this any I don't have time to do this anymore. Um but there's nobody from my understanding currently willing to step up and take on those roles. So that's the other piece that they're struggling with. So

maybe they don't hire a property manager. They they're doing it well. Yeah, I think that they're handling their stuff primarily on their own, but I don't really know the details. So I know they struggled. That's all. I am not totally happy with the way we have things set up. It's awkward to require HOAs. We have to have them because we're requiring green space in neighborhoods. But when we end up with green space like this, it's not very functional green space and it's not obviously part of anybody's property. And so we're we're going to inevitably end up with situations like this where there's u nobody really wants to maintain it because nobody feels like it's theirs.

Um and I don't know what the way around this is. We do need some green space in neighborhoods. There's no perfect solution to it. I'm I'm sure the um the members of the HOA are probably watching and and not thrilled with the direction of the conversation, but just to to restate it, I they're what they're asking is for the taxpayers to subsidize the maintenance of their neighborhood. And the reason we require HOAs and and green space is because we want to have a beautiful city. And when a new subdivision goes in, you could ask somebody, "Do you you want your taxes to go up to pay for the, you know, the green space and the the grass in that new neighborhood?" The answer is obviously no. Nobody wants to be charged for the new neighborhood going in. So, we want neighborhoods that are self-sufficient and and so we end up in this system and and the neighborhood as as a whole has an obligation to maintain the space. This this does tie into the sort of degradation of society in some ways where if people stop caring about the area around them then it's it's not going to be an easy thing for us to try to find ways to address because there is no perfect solution to this.

No, there isn't. And it is difficult and I feel for them and I feel for they indicated that quail run and singing hills just south of them too struggle to to keep their board and keep paying their dues and and get their stuff maintenanced. So, these are neighborhoods that are starting to hit that 30-year point and people that originally moved in there, maybe they're not the same ones anymore. So, it's it's changed over and the, you know, perception of the neighborhood is is different than it was 30 years ago. Um, but and I I did want to point out one thing on comment you made about private roads. Um, is that we've been in the process of uh working on trying to update our subdivision code um that'll be eventually be coming back to you. But one of the pieces in there was the making it more difficult in order to um uh to actually create a private road.

Yeah. So trying to to discourage that more. If I'm glad that you brought that up because I am curious if staff feels like we need to have um a you'll tell me if I'm wrong policy if that's the right word about um like HOA owned land collectively owned land being and the city asking them ask Mhm.

So sorry. Um HOA is coming and asking the city to take that over in the same vein that we made the private road one a couple of years ago because we kept getting asked I is my understanding for that. Would it be reasonable for us to look at having a policy for that as well so that you don't have to come talk to us every time somebody asks you. I mean the policy was built so that we can bring you the proper information once they request. Um, but I mean, you know, we could do that. Um, I, you know, I think that'd be a fine idea. If you don't like the idea, just tell me no, Mr. Seal. You don't have to. Well, luckily, this is the only one I've had to bring you in seven years. You know,

is there since I think we're going to see a lot more of these, is there a way forward where we can do something like a local improvement district or a special tax assessment where we could in theory take it on and then have them pay for it as an additional fee on their taxes. And maybe it's more expensive than doing it on the private market because now the government's getting involved in it. But if we could charge that neighborhood extra tax and then take that on, that might be a way out of this. If there's a legal way to do it,

certainly something to look into, but I cannot answer that question on the fly right now. Could we ask could we ask staff to look into what enforcement options would be available so that we're not making a mockery of our development agreements? And also, I mean, there there are people there that are paying, and it sounds like over twothirds of them are, and they want their neighborhood to look nice, and that's the agreement that everybody agreed to. And some people can't be adults, and they need to be adults. And so, sometimes adults need supervision. And if we can provide that for a fee, then fine. But, um, but but if that neighborhood degrades, it doesn't just affect that neighborhood. It increases crime. It bleeds over to other neighborhoods. The dandelions blow in everyone else's yards. Like there there's a you're devaluing 66% of the properties on that lot by letting your weeds grow 6 feet tall in your front yard. Like there's there's a lot of considerations. So I would love to hear some options from from staff about what we can do to enforce those agreements and we get creative and okay, you want us to take it on, here's how much it costs and if you don't comply, here's the fine. And Um, I imagine that people will behave after that.

Yeah, maybe if it's not a taxing district, we could have a contract between the property owners and the city if they sign it over and then we do have a contract between the city and them for providing services. And then we could in theory do a lean if they don't pay. Yeah. But then we would have the same problem, wouldn't we? Is that you only can enforce the lean when the property sells and if they stay there 30 years, they don't have to pay it or it's a rental

till they sell. So, I would love to see some sort of a ordinance or a fine or something to where, you know, if your fine's going to be we take care of it and we mark it up whatever the landscape company charges and there you go. And um or it's a $100 a day if you don't comply or whatever, then now there's teeth to it. And I don't I'll just say I don't like HOAs. I don't like being part of one. And that might surprise you with my comments today, but I'm very much about people keeping their promises. And if you promise that and you sign on the dotted line and you sign that big stack of paper to buy that house and you said yes to the CCNRs, then you don't have any excuse. So

I like my HOA. I like my actually helpful at 9:18 at night. Yeah. Anyway, Phantom Ha. Did you get what you needed out of us? Yeah. Okay. Good. All right. Thank you guys. Thank you. Okay. Mayor and council comments. No. Who wants to make the meeting longer? Throw this out there. Maybe I'm the only one, but I left the house at 6:30 this morning. We've been here for four hours and 20 minutes. There any chance we can continue this executive session to another date? I would really like to talk about it tonight for 90 minutes. It doesn't have to be 90 minutes.

Is that what it says? No. I I think we can keep this one a little shorter. I I would like to to deal with it. I'm willing to try if it goes long, we can ask to continue it. Right. I move to enter into executive session pursuant to Idaho code 74-206A. Uh further that no action will be taken during the session of the session will last approximately seven minutes. Just kidding. A reasonable period of time. Second motion and a second. Further discussion. Roll call, please. Stigler leader. I. Pl. I. Malloy. Hi. Ziggler. Hi. Mosby. Hi. Luca. Hi. All right. We enter executive session.

All right. Call the meeting back to order. Um, any other business to come forward? Move to go home. Seeing none, we will adjourn. Thank you everyone.