Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

at 6:30. Like to call to order the planning commission meeting for April 21st, 2025. U roll call, please. Mr. Shipley, here. Mr. Walker. Yes, ma'am. Mr. Hogler, present. Mr. Cohen. Mr. Sheck, present. All right. If you could stand and join us in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. All right, we're going to next our next item is to swear in our returning commissioners who are starting the next terms. So, we want to do them both at the same time, Lyn. Yes, that normally goes really well when we do that, Mr. Bar, as I recall. Let's do that. Gentlemen, hand down Mr. Shipp to state your name everybody. If you would please raise your right hand, gentlemen, you're both returning commissioners and we welcome you back and we appreciate your uh your time and service here. Um, so if you could repeat after me. I state your name. I, Craig Walker, do hereby swear hereby swear that I will support and defend the Constitution that I will support and defend the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America. and the laws of the United States of America. The Constitution and laws of the State of Ohio. The Constitution and Laws of the State of Ohio. the charter ordinances and resolutions the charter ordinances and resolutions of the city of Twinsburg,

Ohio. of the city of Twinsburg, Ohio. And I will faithfully, honestly, and impartially And I will faithfully, honestly, and partially discharge the duties as a member of the planning commission. discharge the duties as a member of the planning commission to the best of my ability, as I shall answer to God. Best of my ability. Congratulations, fellas. Thank you both. And then gets a copy and he doesn't get a copy. For the benefit of our audience that we usually don't have at these meetings, uh, planning commission terms are three years and Mr. Shipley and Mr. Walker have just been Thank you. reappointed to serve another three-year term. Today the 21st. Thanks. The next item on our agenda is election of chairman and vice chairman for 2025. And with the absence of Mr. Cohen, I uh suggest that we maybe move this to our next meeting so that we have all five members present. We can commence with that. We'll second that. All right. Very good. All right. Next item. We're going to move into our work session. We have a concept site plan presentation, the Tiger Legacy Project for the Twins City Schools. Uh they're going to make a presentation tonight and then afterwards we will have a opportunity for public participation. Please understand that this is solely about the proposed site plan. This is a preliminary review. Um they are coming to us as a courtesy to get feedback from the planning commission on their project. Um there's

no mo vote tonight. There's no action by us. This is just merely an advisory um type of action and we appreciate that they came in advance. Uh we've done this several times with other projects that have been impactful to the city. Um it works out well for both parties because it avoids a lot of issues later down the road. So, um, they can kind of tell us what they think they want to do and we can give them feedback and how it impacts the planning and zoning code. So, with that, I'll turn it over to, uh, Katherine Powers, the uh, superintendent for this Twinsburg city schools. Thank you, Mr. Ch. Good evening, planning commissioners. I appreciate the opportunity to be here tonight. Just want to introduce the members of my uh, committee who are here to present. This is my business manager, uh, Matt Strickland, um, who has been with our district for a little over two years now. And our architect is here tonight, Rob Latchford from Cardon Clark Leesco. Those of you who've been around here for a while know that we've had a long-standing relationship with LECO and Leco was um, purchased by Cordon Clark and now it's a bigger organization. We're glad for the resources. Also joining us tonight are number of our board of education members, Mrs. Tina Davis, board vice president, and this is Maria Hamilton, um, one of our board members. We appreciate them being here tonight as well. And then, uh, two of our community partners are here this evening, Mr. Chakmore Hans and his son Anu Pans. And they will be speaking, um, at the end of our presentation this evening as they have a large part in this project as well. So, for those of you who are not familiar, maybe you are, um, the Tiger Legacy Project is not a new concept here in the school district. We have been working at this uh construction proposal since the 201516 school year. At that point, uh we knew we had to do something with the facilities as they continue to age much like our homes age. And it has evolved over the years that we've been working

on this project as many things do. And this evening we want to present to you the concept that is uh now current uh the one that we are hopeful um with the passage hopeful passage of um issue 11 in May. Um and clearly we're here tonight for your feedback. And I thank Mr. Walker for reaching out uh suggesting that a meeting with you where we uh offer our ideas and and um offer a chance for your feedback is really important. I didn't know that. So thank you very much Mr. Walker for suggesting that we come this evening. um and uh present for you. We're not going to take a lot of time. Normally when we present about the Tiger Legacy Project, it's well over an hour. There's a lot to this, but we do want to present to you this evening the concept of renderings uh that are um our our latest version of this plan. As you know, um back in November, uh the Tiger Legacy Project was issue 33 on the November ballot and it failed by 431 votes, which wasn't uh that bad given it was a presidential election, right? and we uh listened to the community through all of the conversations that we had with them. We knew that we would need to make significant changes based on the feedback that was offered to us. And thankfully um through uh that reflection, we came to um a great conclusion uh uh in the project this evening that we're presenting to you. I I want to back this up a little bit and uh remind those members of the community that have been here a while that when we started this project back in 2015 16, we actually had the new school, a replacement of just Dodge and that was to be built behind Twinsburg High School on the site of the current boys practice soccer field. When we introduced that to then Mayor Yates, he was not a fan of that plan uh because of the traffic um congestion, etc. that would potentially happen behind the Twinsburg fitness center. And so he introduced at that

time an idea, a land swap idea to us. And uh we started to contemplate what that potentially could be at that point. It was the property at the corner of 91 in Glenwood. Um at that point, I don't believe the the roundabouts were were quite constructed. So it was a different look to that corner. Um and we actually had some renderings of this new school being built at that corner. And then fast forward 2020 happened. Everything was shuttered because of the pandemic and the only thing we were focused on at that point was keeping everybody safe and in school. So, we got back uh to the drawing board and through this uh latest rendition um after the election failed issue 33, uh we uh resurrected the idea of the land swap and Matt and I visited with Mayor Scapiti who was unaware of the land swap agreement or or the thought at that point and um what we learned is the um roundabout at that corner would be pro uh prohibiting a project of this magnitude. to be built at that uh corner of 91 and Glennwood. I asked Mayor Scapiti if there may be another parcel of land that the city of Twinsburg has that we can consider for this project. And this is how uh this land swap agreement was born. And so this particular plot of land is located between Ravena Road and Chamberlain. And it once was the uh property that was owned by the Twinsburg Board of Education years ago. And uh through the construction of Twinsburg High School, there was a similar swap and that piece of land became the property of the city of Twinsburg. And we have beautiful Twinsburg High School um as the result of that. And so this particular uh project is built on the concept of the new prek through six elementary school being built on this land swap with the city of Twinsburg. And I'm going to ask my colleague Matt to talk a little bit about the particulars with respect to this

building. Thank you, Superintendent Powers. Thank you, um, board. Thank you, residents. Um, so we have, um, really done a lot of work, um, with the Ohio Facilities Construction Commission and the architect, um, in going around and looking at other neighboring school districts to see what is the thinking in modern education when you propose building a new building. And a large school concept um, is in the construction world, what they call this. And as you'll see in your handout in front of you and up on the screen, um if you're watching from home, um I'm going to zoom in just a bit, um to where we can see a little bit better what the concept is. Um there's a lot of things that a large school multi-grade level is and a lot of things that it is not. Um what it is is very separate houses they call them. Um so when you look um in the proposed project um the house furthest to the north would be proposed onestory pre kindergarten through kindergarten house. Um that's we don't want our littlest folks um walking steps. And then on down is a grades one through two house. In the middle are shared common areas like gymnasium, cafeteria, um performance stage area, that sort of concept. And then the next house down is grades three and four. And the next house down is grades five and six. Um, this project proposes to close Willox Primary, Bissell Elementary, and George G. Dodge Intermediate, as you know, which is part of the land swap. Um there are a lot of different efficiency savings in the model and that's one reason that the OFCC which is a branch of our state government um they really they like these concepts because there's a lot of efficiencies that come um when you can consolidate grade levels. Um just to give you a quick thousand foot view of what they offered in their partnership with us. They did a full-on

facility assessment of all of our current buildings. as Superintendent Powers mentioned, that's sort of what helped us evolve from just the concept of replacing Dodge at grades four through six um to a full-on replacement of three older buildings. In addition to that, they did an enrollment projection and that goes out 10 years. And what that does is it's helps uh board of education rightsize the district and not waste money either way. You don't want to build something way too big or something too small. It helps gives you a snapshot of what your enrollment will be. The good news is that in the Twinsburg City School District, we're very static across the next decade and have been in the prior decade and that we don't project a massive loss of students or a massive gain because as you all well know, our district is mostly built out. There's not a lot of areas where there's going to be a lot of residential growth. And what that means to a school district is you're not going to see um some type of rapid influx um or decrease in student count. Um the other three houses would be twostory while that first that prek and kindergarten is one story. Um as you'll see the design concept um we've worked through this uh the original concept on that lot. It was actually flipped um but we went and met with a lot of our um condominium uh neighborhoods that border the property as you can better see there. Um, and we took a lot of their feedback about um, if this comes to fruition, how would you all like to see this uh, laid out? And they unanimously spoke to us and said, could you flip it? Could you put the parking lot um, further away from us and the back side of the building, which would be more playground space um, toward the border of that property. Um, so we feel like uh the mantra for this campaign has been um we heard the community and we have been out at homeowners association meetings, meetings in the street, meetings in the property boundaries. Um, one interesting thing that I would say um, for this

committee tonight is that um, we've heard a lot about moisture mitigation in those surrounding communities and through that feedback and through conversations with the city. Um, we're pretty optimistic that we can actually help with that. Um, because by building codes, we have to mitigate the water that would be on our property and because of the way the property is situated. Um, we're hopeful that there might be some opportunities um to tie in with storm drain and water mitigation and help the folks that bordered this property with some flooding issues they have um due to some construction issues that they had had when those neighborhoods were built. Uh, one of the things that um we have worked through the last several months is the access to the lot. As you know, if you drive down a road, there is not a road that's easily accessing this particular plot of land. And through months of um conversations, negotiations with some uh residents on Ravena Road, we were not able to reach an agreement with uh them to build to purchase their land to um build a road and access uh off of Revena Road, which I think would be desirable. Um but we were not able to to reach that goal. So therefore, uh we looked to Chamberlain and uh thankfully uh we met um Mr. Hans and his son and they own uh large parts of the land and at the end of our presentation we'll ask them to come forward and explain um their plans for for that uh lot. But thanks to that partnership, we are able to now uh build an access drive from Chamberlain Road uh to the site of the new school. Um which I think is um a wonderful partnership between the school district and um a resident here who's been a long-standing resident in our community. Also um you'll notice that the particular rendering has separation of traffic. If you have been

at any of our elementary schools over the past 10, 15 years, you know, arrival and dismissal is very difficult for families. Uh because we have bus traffic and we have car traffic. They're crossing each other. Traffic backs up onto the main roads. with this particular driveway into the school. Um it will have the car and the bus traffic um entering uh through that long drive off of Chamberlain, but then it separates once it gets onto the site of the school where the bus traffic will ring around the back end of the building. the buses will drop the children off um where Matt indicated where the the playrooms are in the back of the school and then uh parent traffic will be um ringing along that uh parking lot area. The other thing about this project is we have been able to increase the number of parking spaces. When we talked about building a new elementary school across the street on the current site of Tiger Stadium, we heard time and again that there was not going to be enough parking for staff and parents and visitors and such. This uh site allowed us to expand our parking, I think Matt told me, by 200 spots, which is quite amazing. Uh so that adds uh parking uh which is much needed for a building of this size. Um the buses will ring the um back end of the building, drop the children off at the back entrances, and you'll notice that the houses have their own particular entrances, so we're keeping the children separated. And then the buses will exit along the um uh driveway that you'll see on the bottom of the uh slide there. Um that that exits out onto Chamberlain Trail and then that goes to Chamberlain Road. So, the bus traffic will be um exiting the property separate from the car traffic. All right. Does anyone have any questions thus far on that?

How many total students would be in the building? We're right at about 2,000 and staggered starting times obviously. So, right now we're working through a lot of different models um with our bus routing software company. Um we will tandem that with traffic survey results to determine what's the least impact to the community. Um right now we we are trying to work it about three different ways. Brexville, Broadview Heights um has that we've been using leaning on them pretty heavily uh because their community is very similar and the building and property are very similar. Um, so we're trying to see what would work best. So, how many cars would you envision to start of the school in a 45 minute time? Again, that's going to be on the traffic study. I can't tell you that exactly. Um, but that's where we think that we will have to stagger it somehow to bring that in, but I will say um that this proposal um at its furthest point brings car bus traffic up to a half mile off the roadway. Um, which right now we don't have anything like that. How many do the schools have now? Uh, as far as car traffic, yeah, just each school. Hundreds. Each school is hundreds. Yeah. So, times three. I wouldn't say times three. Um, I'd say a few hundred probably. Yep. So, I have a couple concerns. um the main driveway area. Um if you come back for a um formal site plan approval, that's going to have to be signalized. Even though it's on Chamberlain Road, um between the schools we have now, essentialized. My other concern is is that their

secondary drive is exiting onto Chamberlain Trail, which is not a fully improved roadway. Um, so concerned about um what the impact's going to be on that roadway and we're going to have to work partner with the city to see how the improvements can be made because that is not a up to standard roadway. Um, you don't even do bus traffic down there now. So, um I mean I understand the circulation model is is probably good, but even then coming out onto Chamberlain Road that is not the most ideal intersection either. So, you're possibly looking at two intersections are going to have to be signalized as well. Um being that this is preliminary, I'm not sure what variances are going to be need to be put in place. Um, so I'm not it's not to scale, so we don't have the setbacks and stuff on whatnot on that, but um, right. And the the public facilities district is fairly um use and sight specific as opposed to having clear established setbacks. Um so it'll it setbacks will be more based on the topography say surface water features the kind of the amount of parking that's needed and as you've already done your homework and input from residents. Um but I I will commend you on uh your collaboration with the uh residents and flipping the design to uh seat them as well. Um, I think your biggest challenge here is going to be storm water. Um, because there's not any area for retention. So, I don't know what the plan is. Do underground retention. Um, above ground retention doesn't look like

it's much of an option. Um, and along that lines, environmentally, that main drive is um actually in a reption zone. So, I'm not sure what issues that's going to that's what challenges that'll have as well. So, just that from my homework looking at it. That's all. Any other comments from the commissioners? I I have sort of a conceptual question about the the efficiencies of a large building and you talked a bit about looking towards Brexville Broadview Heights model and getting students bus and so I mean what all the buses can't come at the same time so you've lost the efficiency of just picking up students based on their geographic where they live And so what what what is the basis for getting the kids bus and staggering them? it will it be from house to house as you've called the school um right so currently our current model um includes um transportation by building right so okay um will cost has its own schedule this and so on and to be honest with you the district is driven no pun intended by the bus routes it is what it is it has been forever here um it would be our desire uh to um um diminish some of those routes so that we potentially may have only uh two entries and two dismissals. All this is under study uh with our routing software. It has to work. Um and if it is going to work, there is potential impact to RBC and Twinsburg High School's um arrival and dismissal times. So this is something that you take very slowly and um steadily with respect to

does this work because it means a potential impact to the entire school district if we're going to change the pickup and delivery time for any building. Uh we actually just did this about five years ago at the beginning of this current strategic plan. When we took a look at that um there was a great interest in us starting the high school students at a later start time because all the research indicated that adolescence do better with a lar a later start time and so when we did that it impacted all the buildings down to Willox. So we don't take this task very lightly. This is a very significant task for the school district to look at. And so we're hopeful that we may be able to collapse one of those um arrivals and dismissals through this. But it is taking us some time to take a look at whether or not we have the capacity based on the number of bus drivers we have, the number of vehicles we have, and what the impact is to the larger picture of the high school and the middle school as well. Thank you. I think they have a couple more slides. Oh, okay. Okay. So, um, in addition to the school, um, this has a a a bigger a broader picture because, um, when, uh, we were in discussions with Mayor Scapiti about the city's interests in the Dodge property as the swap for this parcel of land between Revena and Chamberlain. Um, Mayor Scapiti indicated that he would like the entire campus of Dodge vacated. And so, we have to move the varsity baseball field, we have to move the girls practice soccer field someplace else. And so this project also includes the relocation of several fields, the renovation of others as well. So first piece is to move the ninth grade JV boys baseball field. It is currently located behind Twinsburg High School. So it will now find its home in front of RB Chamberlain Middle School, uh sort of across the street from the bus garage. Um and the reason we have to move that field is because we need to move the

varsity baseball field someplace. So, varsity baseball will find its new home, brand new home behind Twinsburg High School. Um, Matt, you want to go up one slide? There it is. There. Uh, so that's the new baseball field that this particular project does not impact the boys practice soccer field. It will remain where it is. Although, uh, in our meetings with the the athletes at the high school, we've been told that school district needs to do something about irrigation on that practice soccer field. So maybe with the relocation of the boys varsity baseball field, we'll be able to maybe tackle that as well. So uh we will put the varsity field there. Um there's the JB 9th grade field in front of RV Chamberlain Hoon softball field needs to be renovated. There's a thing called Title N. So Title N will tell us that what whatever we do for the boys, we must do for the girls. It's the right thing to do. And so when we are building a new um baseball field for varsity city baseball, Hoon softball field will get a nice upgrade to be in the same standard as the boys baseball field. So Hoon stays where it is, but it will be totally renovated. Um the girls practice soccer field will be relocated from the campus of Dodge across the street behind uh Tiger Stadium. Um we have received um very good remarks from coach John Garber as he's the head coach of our Lady Tiger soccer team. He likes the fact that the girls team will be close to the stadium with the facilities won't be out there by itself across the street and separate from all the activity at Tiger Stadium. Um and then you'll see that Tiger Stadium is also going to get a total refresh of $4.5 million which will give us the new um turf. It is time to replace the turf. It's been 10 years. Um the track has failed us both last spring and this spring. It is time and Matt tells me that it's not just the surface, it's the

ashalt under the surface. So that is going to be a a major project. New um new locker room, new weight room, new concession stands. Um and you know, things such as Wi-Fi. If you've been at our stadium on a Friday night and everybody's on their phones and such, the Wi-Fi at that place is horrible. We have to do something to upgrade the Wi-Fi code. Um Brian Fanton will tell you that there is not a power run underneath the turf. So they've got electrical cords running all over the place which is a trip hazard for our athletes. So we when we're taking up the turf, we want to make sure that the electricity is run the proper way for what we need in our stadium of today. And then the boys practice football field will also get brushed up a little bit in the project. So most of our outdoor facilities will receive um either renovation or relocation through the Tiger Legacy project. Anything else? Any questions on the athletic components? Okay. All right. So, um, one thing that we learned and heard loud and clear in the fall, um, was that, uh, the community did not feel we had a concrete enough plan for what would become Abyssell and Wilcox. When you partner with the OFCC, um there are several different reasons that when you replace a building, when you take it offline, that once the new building opens, the old building you're replacing has to be abated and demolished. Um it's part of their code. It's part of the co-unding. Um so this time around, um we looked at a lot of different options. uh talk to our staff, talk to the community um students and um we want to propose tonight um a plan for Samuel Bissell and for Willox property. Um so Samuel Bissell um in this project would become a nature park, a learning pavilion uh for students, for the community. Um as you can see in the graph in front of you, um there would be a trail um sort

of carved out uh through the woods um that the cross country kids could use, community residents could use. Um, and then there's a lot of ideas there and there a lot of big ideas. But what we're excited about is we have some pretty special staff um at our schools that uh do this sort of thing with grant writing and we can get a lot of grant funding to make a lot of this a reality. Um in addition to uh one feature um that we're excited about is in the uh current site where we propose to build the new school. A lot of um wildlife, a lot of native plant species can be repurposed here. Um when you think about a learning pavilion or any type of amphitheater when you see those words, um we're talking about being able to repurpose wood um from the site. So, we felt like that was a pretty neat opportunity um to uh to try to, you know, give a nod to um to the nature components of it. Um and we foresee again this being an extension of our classrooms and a spot where our kids can uh learn outside of a traditional building. Okay. And then for Willox, um another very cool opportunity, a cool partnership opportunity. Um, and I might add that both of these are are grant-f funded, almost entirely grant funded. So, they're not budget driven by the project, not costing people money. Um, unique or organization that uh partners with um communities and school districts for fitness courts. Um, nearby Beachwood has one of these and it's just exactly what you see. Um, the folks that are doing a class out there, um, that's a pvious material, a lot like a track surface. Um you could do classes, wellness classes, yoga. You can see all the applications there. Um the other side is parkour equipment. Um it is gauged for ages 14 and up. So it would be uh middle school, high school age

students for us. And then we've had a lot of conversation with um the recreation department with the city of Twinsburg about what that might look like um for the community, particularly senior citizens. um could definitely see a lot of use out of a facility like this. Um when this company goes into a community to see are you a good partner before they start to apply grants to it. Um Twinsburg is a hot spot for activity. Um all of your smartwatches, your Apple uh phones, all of that track your activity and um Twinsburg is a busy spot. So uh we're really a prime candidate to partner on something like this. A lot of grant dollars available. So, um, what we would propose is once Willox comes down, something like this would be, um, built and a mixed school and community use. So, um, you know, really it's an entire multi-generational offering um, as part of our project. And in both cases, the board of education will um, continue to own the property, take care of the property. It would still um, come underneath the district's liability insurance, those kinds of things. We've received those kinds of questions, too. So, it's still owned by the board um but it would be given a community purpose. And at this point, we'd like to invite um Mr. Hans and um Anuk forward to talk a little bit about the driveway, the partnership with um the school district um and their plans for for their lot as well. Good evening, council, and uh thank you guys for the time today. So, we are the owners of a lot on the east side of Chamberlain Road, which is directly bordering the proposed school site. Um, prior to learning of the school district's plans, we did have our own plans to develop that area, which

included some single family housing. We have worked with the board of education and the school district to revise our plan and develop a new plan that would accommodate both our proposed development as well as the development of the new school. So the revised plan that would have the school district take ownership of a 2.6 acre strip of land that runs along the south side of our property line and it connects the proposed school site to Chamberlain Road. This would allow us to continue development on our P parcel while also making way for the school district to develop their land. Um, a couple things about this strip here. So, we have already conducted a wetland and flood zone assessment. As you can see from the image shown, the proposed roadway will cut through the area of lowest ent environmental impact. And then on top of that, our own development plans will not interfere with any of these wetland areas at all. In conclusion, we do stand in full support of issue 11 and the school's proposed Tiger Legacy project. Um, we have already signed an agreement that would trade ownership of the 2.6 acre strip of land to provide access to the school. And then beyond this, we are willing to help with anything related to this project as long as it doesn't hinder our own development plans. So, a couple of things here. This could include the potential to cut through the front of our property to extend a third extended merge lane on Chamberlain or it could also include using some of the vacant land to ease some of the environmental concerns for a retention pond. Any questions? Everybody good? Awesome. Is it clear where this is in relation to the school building site? North of the

main entrance where the cars and buses will go. Yeah. Yes. This is the main that the road access I haven't seen your development or what you have planned so I guess you can't really comment on No, I mean I think it's affect what you want. Zon residential right now. Yeah, it is zoned residential. Mhm. Um It's going to Yeah, there'll be some challenges seating on the floor, right? I mean, with this layout, you could deed restrict the wetland features and not impact them as was noted. Um but the the roadway and this was also indicated on the school site plan crosses the creek at the south boundary. I mean there's already an existing drive crossing and an existing house. Correct. Yes. Yes. Yeah. It's a similar land with the Bissell and Willox properties. Any use issues there that you see? Um no. I mean, it activates those sites maybe almost more so for the um not the nature center site, but the recreation site, but maybe in a good way. Um yeah, the only comment I have on on the repurposing of the Wil Cox and and the Bissell properties is I noticed on the presentation for the Bissell property mentioned portaotti. Um I would say that we we need to have regular restroom facilities at both sites if they're going to be public facility use. All right. Thank you. Thank you guys.

Thank you. Now I've got my questions. Mrs. Powers, I'm surprised you don't have a pot back here. Always had a great working relationship with these. I appreciate you coming out. I don't want to take credit. It was the chairman who mentioned it some time ago. And you know, whether people agree or disagree with this, you all have gotten out there, put yourselves out there for engagement, public comment. I really appreciate that. Um, and the two things I'll mention are not surprises. I talked to Mr. Franklin about it. You know, I've got a little bit of a development background myself. So, first on the on the wetlands and the flood plane issue, I don't know if this is better set for you or the architect. I don't know if the architect's handling the environmental compliance. Have you all reached out to OEPA or core Buffalo district for preliminary thoughts about this? Not directly yet. Have you done an initial assessment just on your own? Just kind of gut checked it. We've looked at all the mapping some county maps located. We will have a survey done first thing to show where they are exactly. This is a concept for the building. So obviously it's adjusted as we map out those specific gener right do you and I I'm not holding you to anything. Do you anticipate any wetland buyback mitigation anything like that? Okay. Um second point and I know I talked to both you all about this about the fitness course. So, Beachwood actually paid I think net 200,000 for it. And I'm not I'm not saying anything in public that I haven't said in

private. And I'm glad we got two board members here because ultimately this is your all's resolution, your decision that you are that you are proposing to the residents. Um yeah, the cost of the city for Beachwood Fitness Park is $26,000. They did get a grant. Hope hopefully you can find grants to make it a net cost of zero to the district because you know we've had emergency levies, operational levies. I do worry about you getting into business of running a park. We do have a parks district. I'm not saying I'm against it, but you know making making projections based off of grants that can be dubious. And I know with new administration, you all are dealing with funding issues on a se on a primary and a secondary and a tertiary level. Those are the those don't really relate specifically to the planning issues, but it's just something I see with the whole fitness courts idea. And I've told you and I know you all do your diligence, there are some places that really like fitness courts. There are some places that have not liked the idea of working with fitness courts. I would say overall reading the articles on it, there's more favor than not favored. My big concern is just there's going to be the grant, but how much skin are they going to want from you all? Thanks, Mr. Hler. Good. Thank you, Mr. Shipley. I just had one more. So, you're going to own the the areas where we tear down the old schools. You said you're going to own that. Um, where's the land swap then? I guess I'm not following the land swap with the city. Yeah, sure. So, um, the land swap would be the city of Twinsburg would be the owners of the entirety of the Dodge campus. So, the school would be demolished once our new school is built and we're able to transition the students into the new building. Uh, that building will come down and the city of Twinsburg will will do what they wish with it. Um, they would like ownership of the current baseball field and the girls practice

soccer field sooner than later. And so as soon as the construction or renovation of the fields occurs, we'll get the girls practice um soccer field and the boys varsity field off that campus moved across the street. And in turn for that um the board of education would receive the property the um acreage between Revena and Chamberlain Road. Um and um Mr. Hans mentioned um the 2.6 6 acres of land from their property. In exchange for the board securing that as as their property, the board of education would then be swapping the current uh location of where the board of education office is at the corner of Ravena and Glennwood. Uh that would become the property of the Hans family in exchange for the 2.6 acreage uh that would be constructed into the new driveway. Okay. I missed I missed that part. the the two smaller schools is what you're keeping in your right and you know um when we were uh on the ballot in November the residents spoke loud and clear like you have to have a plan because there was a concern that the board was going to sell the land to a developer and then we lose control over what happens what's going to move in there and so we took that to heart and had lots of internal conversations conversations with the board what can we do with those properties that would be able to be giving back to the community in a good way And one of the things that we struggle with are with our kids today. They're on those screens too much. We need to get them outside enjoying outdoor education. Um and that's how this idea was born. As Matt indicated, Cindy Kurt is a huge environmentalist. She belongs to a number of commissions here with the city of Twinsburg. Um we're relying heavily on her and her um experience with outdoor education and um and and that's how that idea was born. Okay. Thank you. You're welcome. So, I guess I'll round it out.

Um, so I touched on a couple things earlier. Um, the addition of residential lots on that main drive, um, with the school traffic, I think, is going to make signal signalization a priority. And plus, I think you're going to have to have turning lanes. That's going to have to be a totally improved intersection. Um, there's going to be a lot of traffic. Plus, when you throw in the extracurriculars that go on at the schools in the evenings, conferences, open houses, holiday parties, um you're going to you're although it's not a main thoroughfare, Chamberlain Road still does see a decent amount of traffic. So, I think that's going to definitely have to be uh something that's going to be considered is uh intersection improvements and upgrades. And and I always come back to my predecessors on planning commission years and years before me um who approved the Darl Road plaza with no turning lanes. Um just unbelievable. Yes, I would um anticipate planning commission hiring a traffic consultant to analyze the traffic consultants um study provided by the schools. So study study. Yeah, I think we're going to have to have a third party just to kind of sanitize everything. Um the site has a lot of challenges, I think. Um but I think your biggest challenge is going to be wetlands and uh storm water. Um you got a lot of impervious surface there that's needs to be treated. Um and just an aside because I was around for all the land swaps since I've been here for ever. Um yes, that was original uh board of education property. The city owned the property over here and

um Jim Carbeck, former mayor, organized that land swap and his legacy to the city is preservation of green space. Um, and he's a he was a very humble man, but we can thank him for the 900 acres on on Liberty Road and Liberty Park cuz that was going to be developments and you'd be building more school buildings if it wasn't for that. So his intention was this wasn't this this site has challenges and uh he thought it was perfect opportunity to preserve the green space but if it uh can lend itself to the other two park areas being born but um as my colleague Mr. Walker said, "I think you don't want to be in the park business." But that's that's very challenging and I thank him for u extending the invitation for you folks to come out and get some feedback from us. Um I was expecting more back in my day, but you really secured from that. I'm impressed. I'm trying to I'm trying to live in the moment. I I will note though because I know we have public participation coming up. So we do have like some Lake Plat residents here and I don't know if they have question. I don't know if you mind if public asked questions about the project during public participation. We could do we could do a two-way forum. I mean um I but I want it to be totally focused on what it the planning and zoning. Um not the function, not the reasons, not the purpose. This is obviously you want to build something on this property. So it doesn't matter what it is. um it's about building on this property and how it impacts the areas around it. Um it's not about the function or the purpose. So um want to make that clear to the public that's going to be um focus of the participation is just the how it impacts our planning and zoning

regulations and uh from that nature. So if you're open to being questioned um sorry to put you on the spot. Not a problem. Hill two birds of one stone for you if I could. Thanks. So with that, we'll uh Mr. Bar, do you have anything? Nothing. Okay. Um Lynn, anything else? Nothing else. All right. We'll open it up to the public. Uh again, this is mainly um related to the site development as it imp as it uh focuses on our planning and zoning. So anybody from the public wish to speak, please come up. State your name, address. Karen Pard. I live in Lake Plata. When they do the traffic study, are they going to do the traffic study going through our homeowners association? There's two to 300 cars that are going to be coming off of the parking lot, so on like that. Mainly cutting through our subdevelopment. I can see it happening. Are they going to take that traffic study out that far? I mean, because it's a really good cut through between Shephard Road and Chamberlain Road, and we've got Children's, we've got a tot right there. We've got all of that going on. And so, they have to take into consideration 300 cars coming through that subdevelopment. So, Lynn, collect, correct me if I'm wrong. I believe the traffic studs of the area, not just that specific area. Um, but I will say that uh if you notice most of the subdivisions that were built later in um time here in the city are not direct cutthroughs. So in other words, there's not a street that goes straight through like East Idlewood. Oh, I understand

that cuts through now from Shepard to the reason deter people from taking that shortcut because it's not a direct straight route throughout right through. But Lynn, do you have anything to add? We we can take that into consideration. Good point. Yeah. I mean, you're going to have children through there. You're gonna have everything else and and that's going to be a lot. Um the other one she mentioned that the board of education building is coming down the the one on Revena Road. Or did I miss here? So, thank you for the question. So, the board's property at the corner of Revena and cross is part of the up with Hans family. So, we'll take ownership of the 2.6 acres to build the driveway into the new school site and the Hans family will take ownership of the board of education property there. So, where's the board of education going to be? Um, we are relocating to the lower L pod of the Twinsburg High School building. When the OFCC did the study, what they were able to identify is that there is ample space at Twinsburg High School to be able to move the board property there. Actually, they even said that there was ample space to move the entirety of RB Chamberlain into the high school building, which I can't imagine, but that was what they said. They based their numbers on square footage only. So, they're not talking about programmatic needs and such like that. But there's enough uh property available or enough space available in the high school to be able to move the board of education offices um up to this building across the street. Currently, um, we already are, uh, separated in the sense that Mr. Strickland's business department is at RB Chamberlain, our people services department is at Twinsburg High School, and the rest of, uh, the staff is, um, down street at the board of education property and moving us all to the lower pod um, L pod of the high school. We're finally going to be all in one space. It'll add efficiencies to our organization. Thank you.

And thank you, ma'am. I live right by that tot lot. Lynn, is the board of educ board of education offices still commercial or did that get reszoned to public? I think it's public facilities district. So that is still public facilities. So even with that land swap, there would be a need to go to the ballot to change the zoning on it. Hi, I'm Patty Stoddard Dare. I live in Lake Pa as well, so I'm familiar with the area. And my question is I I can't understand when I'm looking at the maps is is the entrance before like towards the board of education side of Chamberlain. It's before the underpass and then is the exit on the other side of the underpass? My the reason why I'm asking the question is I'm trying it seems like what you said like they're going to have to widen the road, but there's the big huge pillars that are holding up the highway that don't allow it. I can't imagine that it would allow for that part of the road to be widened. There's some sight issues with at the Chamberlain trail um egress onto uh Chamberlain. So yeah. Um so he pulled it back up on the graph there. Um the one off of Chamberlain Trail that connects to Chamberlain Road that is on the other side of the highway and then further up to the north on Chamberlain would be the primary driveway. Um, so they both are past the highway if you're thinking of it that way. Closest to um the board of education office. So, yeah, north of it. Do is that better visual for you there? Yeah. Okay. That's why we need a laser pointer. Um, Peter Gentles with Lake Plowed. Just one question with the school going in. Are you going to um put in full sidewalks all along Chamberlain? I'm assuming you want to have non-motorized access to the school beyond just car traffic. I mean, with all the kids,

bikes being able to walk to the facility because right now there's no uh sidewalk uh access on Chamberlain. So, I can I can tell you my quest since I've been on a planning commission, any lots that are improved, any lots that are redeveloped get sidewalks. So, um, the access area on the main drive would would require sidewalks. The roadway going into the school would require sidewalks. And I've been criticized in the past by other applicants, but well, there's no other sidewalks in the area. I said, well, if we don't start now, we never get them. So, and then it comes back to the city to put those in. So, we require any new development areas, any property that's being redeveloped to have sidewalks. That's the daycare on 91 across from CVS has sidewalks and they argued, "Well, there's no sidewalks there." Yeah, but you're going to put them in because we have to start someplace because how would you put in sidewalks where as she mentioned the pillars holding up the for the uh freeway? I mean, obviously you have to go around them. I mean, well, that's that's going to be in addition to this project because that'll they have to work with ODOT, but we can work on getting grant funding to extend sidewalks down Chamberlain Road. Um, and I think we probably stand a pretty good chance if the school went in there to get some grant money to continue sidewalks, but the site development areas, um, I for one, and I can't speak for my colleagues, will will be pushing for sidewalks on any site development. I mean, they probably need to be between the peers and the abutments. Yeah. Anyone else? Papa Shedley Stone Creek Lane. Real quick question for Max Strickland. Uh

reversing the uh rendering. You said reversing it was unanimous by the condo associations. That's not true. Why did you say it? I'm on Stoke Creek Lane. We are opposed to this development. Um the only thing I'll say to that is the um residents that we've met with that border um the back side of the property. Um the first two meetings that we had um we heard that over and over. Um the building was totally flipped and everyone that we talked to um did say that they would prefer uh the layout this way. Um but I'll circle back to what our architect said. Um it is still fluid um until you've broken ground. Um for example, Superintendent Powers and I are at a homeowners association right over there uh Wednesday night. So we look forward to even more feedback. Um I think the only thing I'd leave on that is that uh we very much have tried to engage the community and be responsive even at these early stages in the project. So So understand this is a preliminary plan that they are presenting and I can tell you through my experience and I'm sure um Mr. Strickland and the architect will agree to that once you start doing more in-depth um work with the site as far as soil samples and uh as Mr. Walker mentioned uh the the core is definitely going to be involved with this um for sure and they're going to dictate what c what can and can't be disturbed. Um it will tweak a little bit, things will get moved. Um we will be very diligent on photometrics as far as uh intrusions into um the neighboring properties and then as far as sir uh your questions you know anything that's going to be outside of the code will require a variance which will go to the board of zoning

appeals which is another body uh where you definitely have the right to voice your opinions to that. So I think and I know not speaking for the architect but I think this he's trying to maximize the design at this point and then they will pull things in as as need be as as as the site develops. Sorry I didn't mean to speak after Steve Sunzac I'm in Twins Township. Um, when you're talking about traffic study, if you look at the geography of the district, you're going to have a significant maybe 90% of the traffic is going to be coming south on Chamberlain. So, the intersections at Glenwood and Revena and Revena at Chamberlain are going to be significantly impacted, especially left turns off of Revena onto Chamberlain. Yep. Yeah, I think uh we're going to have to look at the overall signalization and uh updating that, ma'am. My question really goes along with that. Concerns with I'm a Lake Platter resident as well. Concerns with the traffic on on Chamberlain as well as being able to put adequate traffic lights in front of the schools with if you think if you were like leaving Lake Platter or coming from 82 driving towards Revena, would you be a like where would you be putting a traffic light in that situation to not be blocked by the freeway being able to get into the school? So, I just wanted to add that additional concern. Yep. I think the the whole ingress and egress uh intersection areas are going to need to be uh evaluated. The one thing that I'll add with that uh with the traffic study um we've partnered with TMS engineers and we um they are doing some quality control and finalizing that data. Um it's nearly complete and at that time it'll be shared with our board of

education and then of course the city um for us to look over uh those results. So, I look forward to Mr. Schwire's uh summary. You know, there's a little old Ford um Focus or something sitting right on on Chamberlain going in. I thought, well, that's the traffic state. I know there's for sale sign keeping there. I keep thinking it's the traffic counter. It's not. Somebody buy that car so I can be less confused. Members of the board, Councilman Bar School Board. Um, Don Simon 96 51 Chamberlain Trail. So, I'm one of the ones on that Chamberlain Trail. Um, I've been a resident at that location for 34 years. Been a resident in the city for 48. Um, obviously I have a lot of concerns. Um, it might be just me, but I think there's others that have concerns. Um, all the homes that are on that street are on wells, so obviously that's a big concern for us. Nobody can guarantee if there will be an impact, but that is a concern. Everybody except for one are on septic systems. People don't believe that there are people on wells in the city, but that is all wells. Um there's three streams that flow through that property. That drawing shows one. Um I've been there for a long time. I'm you know, they'll do their surveys and they'll show it, but they're not shown on that. There's three lot of water. Um it's very wet and does flow through there. doesn't mean it can't be built, but there is a lot of water that flows through that property. Um, one of the big concerns is we're talking three schools, so obviously that's going to be a lot of traffic. I've lived with the freeway in front of me. I knew that when I moved there that the freeway was there. I have the noise. Noise is probably worse now because of that wall. So now the impact of three schools of busing, car traffic is going to be a big hinder. Um, so it's a concern. School values are always good

for homes with the grading of schools, but not for traffic. If you read up, the traffic could impact my home value. So, that's that's a big concern. Um, the road, the city knows about the road. I've been there for 34 years. It's at time is 16 to 17t wide. Um, the garbage truck backs down that street. So, if we try to put buses on it, I don't know what's going to have to be done, but we know it's not the city specs and the city's aware of that. that road was put in, all those lots went right through the freeway and then when the freeway came in, it cut off the access and that's why they built those roads. So, yeah, they're not to city spokes. Um, and then just with the water that flows through it, um, it shows on the Summit County GIS on the environmental viewer. Um, and you have an ordinance for repairarians and wetlands. And I just hope that's that's reviewed in detail um, and followed, you know, if the project does move forward. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else? Yes, ma'am. Patty Depra for Lake Plat as well. My main concern or question would be this is coming to vote in two weeks. How are we going to cover all these contingencies, dotting all your eyes, crossing all your tees before it goes to vote? Because if it becomes if it does pass but none of these contingencies work, what happens? All these planning like we we still have to worry about the roads and the traffic lights and sidewalks and all those the traffic patterns. What is going to happen if none of this can be approved through the planning commission? So under understand they are in a difficult position. Um and I think that's why they're with before us tonight is trying to get some initial feedback. Um they can't really can't

move forward until they have funding. So you know their their focus is on getting funding and not speaking out of turn for you. Um so that issue is going to move forward and you know it's up to the voters they want to approve the funding or not. If the funding is approved, then they can move forward with more detailed designs. Uh we can start reviewing some of these issues that are going to be uh relative to that project and getting more definitive um plans in place. But right now everything's is is kind of in limbo because they don't have the funds to move forward with environmental studies, uh, groundwater studies, um, soil studies, and, uh, things of that nature because they just don't have the funds right now. Am I correct? The only other thing I'll add to that is, um, we've been asked a lot like um, what soil warings have you done and stuff like that. Um, at this stage when you're doing a land swap, we don't own that land. The city doesn't own our land at Dodge. Um, but we both have been combing through all of the state and federal documentation that exists for the properties to determine before we ever got to this stage, does the county and state, does the Army Corps of Engineers say that this build, this lot is buildable? Um, the answer is yes. um we can't go in and do what's needed to be done um for the soil borings and that until we own the land because you do have to clear a certain acreage of woods to be able to do that adequately. We can't come in and clear city property. We don't own it yet just like they can't do that at Dodge. So, you rely on the county and federal records that exist to tell you is this even worth pursuing. And we did all of that leg work and the architect did on the front end of the project. Um and then um just as you spoke um when the funding comes available then you really jump in and you start to develop it. You engage the

community on um we I am proud to say sidewalks are included on anything you see that's ours but of course we know um that we would partner with the city on what other developments need to be made and those are accounted for heavily in our budget for the development of that property. Does that help? Maybe. I hope so. Thank you. Yeah, understand it's it's still a pretty fluid situation right now. Um they're basing their uh assumptions right now on historical data. Um and like Mr. Trixen said, they can't get any more definitive data because they don't really own the property. So, um it's it's all kind of conceptual right now. Anyone else? Just to point out, it's not unusual instructional schools. Yep. In this process, you don't have all plans at the vote. Yep. It's not unusual for any project at this point. No, it's it's a huge undertaking and it requires substantial funding and until you secure that funding, things can't get firmed up. Um but you know at least you're coming to us in advance um getting some feedback um and everybody's talking about it. So that's that's a good thing. Anyone else wishing to speak before we close the public participation? Anybody from the panel? All right, we're going to close that portion of our meeting out and we'll move into um our new business. uh begins with the lot split consolidate. If anybody wants to leave, you really don't want to sit through this. Feel free. You're not going to hurt our feelings. Thanks everybody for coming. Thank you for coming out. Thank you all.

All right. Uh item number one's lot consolidation 9385 Shepard Road, permanent parcel number 64-01251. Um, oh gosh, Derek Bis, thank you. Thank you. Um, please uh let us know what you're looking for us from tonight and feel free to present. Okay. Yep. We're uh again Tom Fetto and Derek Bergus and the uh property is 9385 Shepard Road and we're looking to split that property into four 1acre lots and uh back in November November 15th we had a meeting with at city hall with the our attorney with the mayor law director Matt Bastana city planner Lynn and city engineer Amy Moore concern turning this lot and splitting splitting it into uh four 1acre lots. And you could see in the application package the lot configuration, the four lots, two in front, two in back. So there's a 11 by7 map and then a regular size map just for your review if you want to write anything on it. And uh as a result of the meeting we had on November 15th, we collectively decided to utilize the private rightway and access easement as a method to get to the back locks, the back two locks, you know, and again you can look at the MA survey map and you could see the the private rightway access easement. It's a 30 foot wide strip of land that opens up to a 75 foot wide front lot line. when when that uh when it reaches the back lot, when it reaches the back

property line, that's when it opens up to that front lot line. And there's one rightway for the uh parcel A back lot, and there's a second right away on the south end to the uh for the parcel D lot. And you can see that on the survey also. So in this this private rightaway access easement will automatically transfer with the appropriate legal documents and we included a example of the legal document which was provided by our our attorney or law firm and uh it can be also be found in the application package. And uh so this access, you know, easement is is legally binding and it will be tied to the land. It's not tied to the individual owners. And our attorney referenced it as a it runs with the land. So it sticks with the land. You know, when someone sells it, it goes, you know, with with the land. And uh so you know our our uh this is in replacement of a uh flag lot which is a typical uh scenario u but this allows uh us to you know come through with this and we don't need any uh um changes or variances with this going through this and that's why we all kind of came to this conclusion and if the uh front lot or if the uh back lot sells first, then we'll assign uh that private rightway, Derek and I will assign it to the buyer of that back lot. Or if the front lot sells first, then we'll have that buyer of that lot, they'll assign that right away to us and then we'll assign it to the back lot owner when we when we find one.

So, you guys any questions on that? I I feel compelled to remind the commissioners. Is this the same exact lot that you approved a year ago? I mean, instead of it being a flag lot, the access is still easement. Other than that, it's essentially identical. Isn't it functionally still flag pole lot? Yes. I mean, I I get the whole running with that in practice. Yeah. It's still functionally a flag pole lot. Exactly. Instead of the back lots actually owning the access way, it's an ement. It's an easement. Correct. Which they'll have a right of access to the right of access, but it's still functional. Absolutely. Like I just I draw a line on the dotted line. So same thing. Okay. Excuse me. Okay. Sorry. No, I just I just said basically functionally it's still it functions like a flag pole lot. Yeah, that it it does. Can you explain why we're going the easement route? I like what's the justification for switching from the flag to the easement approach? No. No variances are required going that route. Did you have trouble getting variances last time or BZBA did not didn't make it through? We had four variances that were required for the flag pole lots. for the flag pole lots because I'd much rather not pay taxes on an easement that I on a driveway that I don't use, right? I mean, you pay on the acreage, right? So, yeah. So, basically, the front lot owners are still technically own the property when they're get granting an easement for access. Correct. Which I think is less cleaner than flag lots. I agree. So, and everybody will be obviously aware of that. I mean, yeah, they they need to be. My question, and this is my ward, so these are lake plat people.

To me, the big money question is what about the storm water mitigation, which is a big issue. And the second question, okay, cuz BCA mentioned it. I think the chairman of the BCA mentioned it was access to fire protection and I believe she mentioned something about firet trucks and accessibility. You may, this is your job by day, so maybe you can answer. Those are the two things I think I'm interested in. I'm pretty sure the residents will ask about, too. Yeah, a standard driveway is not going to support the weight of the truck. Um, it it it will get back there. I mean, if it's a fully improved driveway, which I'm sure we're going to require to be concrete or asphalt pavement, it can't be gravel. Um, but it probably will be damaged in the in the course of it. So, then there's a whole bunch of issues go with that. So, Uh yeah I to me it's just the same thing just in a different package and I'm not I won't support it. So but any my colleagues anybody anybody else just just the storm water question. Okay regarding the storm water management we met with our professional engineer Mr. James Titmas and submitted a storm water management plan. It was reviewed by um city engineers Amy and Patrick um who provided feedback on how how to improve it. So our professional engineer um was compelled to meet with them in person where they configured a storm water management plan that was acceptable with the city and so we provided a um a detailed storm water management plan if you guys would like to review it further. So yeah, um a lot of effort has been put in to um considering what options would be available for managing storm water at this location and materials have been submitted and approved by the city engineer.

Um it's more or less um some hypothetical um ways of managing storm water, but Ohio Revised Code requires us to approve a minor lot split such as this. It's on an existing roadway. Um it meets our code standards. Um it's in compliance in every way. It can access sanitary sewer and other utilities. Um the review of storm water management will come once a building permit is sought. We cannot per Ohio revised code deny the lot split right on the grounds of the storm water management plan. At this point they've done their due diligence. It's been approved by the engineer and if you would choose to um not approve this, you would have to have grounds other than the storm water management, right? And I know that was a discussion we had when we voted this last year. My last question is, have you talked to the neighbors about this? One thing that I didn't mention, I'm sorry to interrupt. Um, the applicant had suggested in the meeting with the law director and the mayor that they would install a storm basin at the rear of the four acres. However, engineering division said, "Nope, we don't want it. We don't need it. It's not going to do anything to resolve the current issues. That's not where the water is coming from." So clearly uh Mrs. Muter has mentioned uh yes you can this is meets the code and

everything. Um I'm just cautionary. be careful what you wish for because um you might sell the back lot and you might not sell the front lot because somebody doesn't want to pay taxes on somebody else's driveway and deal with the traffic and stuff. So, um that's my understood and then you know you guys had came to us before for some preliminary input and you could do three lots with no no issues whatsoever. So, um, you're you're rolling the dice, I guess. Anything else? All right. No, sir. All right. We'll get back to you in the regular meeting. Um, thank you. Item number two, lotslit consolidation, 3231 Symmetric Drive. Brian Simich. By the sounds of it, this should be a pretty easy one. Um, basically I'm taking a two acres, uh, combining them back together, respplitting them out to one acre and one acre off of Symmet Drive up off of Liberty. This one is a redo as well. So, um, some of you were commissioners at the time that this was split previously, um, with the barn on the vacant lot. Yep. Right. And this reverses that and puts that accessory structure on the lot with the house. With the house. Just undoing over. Exactly. All right. All right. Any questions from anybody? I'm sure. All right. We'll get back to you in a regular meeting. Uh item number up. Item number three, planning and zoning code amendment. Lynn. Okay. So, this one is um relative to our new code. Um, language was

included to um cause an attached garage be set back not less than 3 ft from the nearest front building wall of the principal building. And so the concern um was well does that make a lot of homes in Twinsburg non-compliant relative to that? So, um, part of this requested action is to clarify beyond a reasonable doubt that a dwelling built prior to 2025 shall not be considered a non-conforming building solely for a failure to comply with the provisions of that setback. But in looking upon it, um it also seemed prudent to to maybe create a little bit more flexibility with that requirement. And the suggested language is um an attached front loading garage shall be flush with or set back from the principal building front wall. That um allows for a side loading garage to be placed in front of the principal um elevation but creates um a flush um front loading grudge configuration or a setback. I you know were essentially built out in Twinsburg in terms of single family homes. This isn't um earthshattering in terms of a design requirement, but we do have some properties in town that um would maybe lend themselves to some cluster homes or town homes where side lots are shorter, maybe front setbacks are shorter. And I'm I'm thinking specifically of we have a resoning request on the ballot for May at um on East Road in Chamberlain. Yep. Um that one would like to go to cluster

homes. I think in terms of housing products where each home has the garage really as a prominent feature. We'd like to not see that. And this proposal I think supports ARB in terms of reviewing those types of designs. So theoretically, if they still want that recess entrance way, all they do is bump out the front wall to match the garage. Exactly. Create out there. Okay. Um, this I think got added to the code at the very last minute when we shifted from the project manager that we had been working with throughout the year and the principal Sean Sudter came on board at the end of our project. For some reason, he added that. I'm just thinking that was a pet peeve. Everybody has their thing and that was added and I don't think it's bad. Um but it is pretty um inflexible and maybe not necessary in our community. So this this ratches it down just a hair and also clarifies that we're not creating um non-conformities with existing homes. Anybody have any questions? Uh, Miss Muter, if I may, just a quick question. Um, I do uh appreciate the intent of the legislation, especially the non-conforming use issue. A question I have, and unfortunately our resident architect, Mr. Cohen, is absent this evening. Yeah. Um, there are a lot of modern floor plans as somebody who's in a lot of new homes as part of my profession that incorporate bonus room space or additional space above a garage. So, in that case, were we to take like a gable and bring a deeper garage out and have finished space

above? Is is that then a nonconforming use if there's like dwelling space above the garage as opposed to it just being unfinished space? Because I mean theoretically one could argue that that's living space, right? It it just the way it's written as the revision just says an attached front loading garage. It doesn't really um clarify in terms of usable space above the garage. Fair enough. Just a question. I Mr. I think it be I think it'd be okay because the unless they're going to overhang that living space from the front wall in the garage, which typically I don't think they would do. Well, I think his question is that that that living space isn't probably considered a principal building front wall. So, you probably have to keep that garage even with the rest of the house. Sure. I think I was just asking more from a devil's advocate standpoint of so let's say front wall and and this is purely hypothetical I'm not moving but I want to build a house and I want a 32 foot deep attached garage so I can park my skiboat back there um is the workaround well I'll just finish the upstairs and put a home theater in or a pool table and a you know a man cave I and again I'm not an architect and this isn't ARB. Um I just I don't know. I just thought it was worthy of mention is a definition of the principal building front wall I think. Right. So it's above my pay grade Mr. Sh. So here I'll defer Mark. I'd probably say no. It's not a principal front building wall. Just something for discussion or consideration. That's a good good discussion. Well, what I would like us

to do this evening is if we want to continue a conversation about that. Um, if we if we could recommend adoption of the nonconforming clarification here and move that onto council, that'd be great. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I wasn't trying to hold up No, the legislative process. I had sent an extremely lengthy email to um the ARB chair and to Mark Cohen regarding this and I may have added more confusion than clarity. So we could revisit this for sure. So you're just saying yeah the 11201 11201 part. Yeah. Okay. I I feel um um that's pretty cut and dry. Yeah. That that we could advance that just for clarity sake because what's going to happen is if somebody falls into a category of they haven't met that setback, but they'd like to put a sun room on the back of the house. I don't I don't want there to have to be a question that that that has created a nonconformance for that home and then we have to jump through another hoop to have them be able to do their project. Yeah. Okay. So, we'll recommend 1128.01 and hold. Yeah. The 1109.01. All right. Anybody good with that? Okay, next item. Zoning map amendment. Reszoning request 9392 Ravena Road. Doyle

Stman. I'm Doyle Stman. Um 9550 Liberty Road here in Twinsburg. Um the I purchased two lots. One is Blue Top. You probably aware of Blue Top Motel um in town. It's been kind of a shady joint for a long time. Thank you for tearing it down. You're welcome. Zero tore it down. Tore it down. It's like, you know what? I I have the I have the building next door to it, Compass Computer Group. Um, and I had to look at that constantly all the time and deal with the things that were going on over there. Um, so the choice came to buy it, just to buy them out and get rid of it. So, that's what we're working on. In order to use the property that I need to do, I need to have it changed to the zoning from C2, what it is right now, to I1. Um, it is bordered on next door to a I1 and across the street is an I1. Compass, which is the other property that I own, is a C2. So, um I kind of like um I I mean I don't see any reason not to move it to 911, but that would be obviously uh up for the voters and yourselves and things like that. So, that's what we're here for tonight to try to improve the community. We It is not a residential uh location at all. It is strictly uh commercial type buildings in that area. I'm Robert Dennis from Max Smith Group. I'll be Doyle civil engineer from now till it's open for business. Um he's working with Rexton Construction who's a industry leader in self storage and they're still very early in the process of determining the unit mix he's going to have and how many each side of the building where the doors are going to

be. So we haven't really gotten into the technical layout of the project, but he does know that he needs the eight buildings shown to get to the yield to make the project profitable. So it's a makes sense. Self storage is not a allowable use in the C2 zone. It's only it's a conditional use and I want is a lot of hurdles to clear you. No, it's a reasonable request. Um I think you know I hope the voters understand it. Um the fact that you took down that ice order is I'd vote for it. Um and I don't think it's going to be impact. Um I think the area is not challenging to develop and uh I think you know definitely be a improvement from what was there uh prior. So it does have some technical challenges. Storm water will be a bear on this one. Some ideas on how to get that done, but we need the unit types to know where all the roof trains are going to really advance that design. Yeah. You got the run off to Tinker Creek, so deal with that. Yeah. And this particular lot that we have does cross Takers Creek, so we do have wetlands and things. So there I can only use about half of the of the actual acreage. Okay. We have talked with Lyn quite a bit about you, like you said, will the voters buy into it and that and how we educate? It's going to be a grassroots campaign to, you know, to get the community knowledgeable about what this votes about. Very good. Um, Mr. Bogler, anything? No, sir. Great. Uh, no. I assume we're going to require sidewalks when we develop this, unfortunately. Yes, I will. Yeah, Mr. Walker. No, sir. Right. So, what if should they get their um reasonzoning supported by the voters and they would come back for a conditional use permit for the for the storage use and for a site plan, right? There's also discussion of the phase development

starting right off with phase one development on the current I1 lot and then maybe potentially having easements as needed for temporary fill or fire department access. Okay. Okay. On the lot while it's still a zone C2. Mr. Bur, anything? Um, yes actually. So, Mr. Doyle, you you current is compass currently on the the parcel that is I1 C2. We are on C2. So you're on the C2 parcel. Yes. But you currently own the parcel immediately. What would that be? To the east of that or southeast? To the east, southeast. Yes. Okay. And then is that um I'm just trying to get my bearings again. I know where your facility is located. Is that that uh Crash Champions Car? Um Advanced Auto. Yeah, it's Advanced. Okay. Is there? That's a I mean the aerials kind of don't do that site any favors as far as um Oh, they're in the process of changing. That's absolute auto. They are in process of cleaning up the rear yard. Perfect. Perfect. Perfect. No, I'm a big fan of putting this in the voters's hands, but it sounds like it would be a great addition to the community. So, I wish you the best of luck with it. Thank you. All right. Uh if there's nothing else, uh we'll get back to you in your regular meeting. And item number five, final site plan, self-s serve storage. Brandon Klein, guys construction storage night tonight. Planning. So, good evening. I'm Tom Flynn. I uh one of the owners of Turner Dev Development. This is uh Brandon Klein's not here with us. This is Renee from GIC. We're seeking final site plan approval for a climate control self storage unit. It's better than we just spoke about. We're in the self-s storage business. We built about five or six of them, but we build climate control

indoor. Almost looks like a boutique hotel car dealership type where you're all the majority of our units are inside. 75% of our units are inside and climate controlled. So, you really wouldn't know it was a climate controlled. We don't like to be actually associated with the typical drive up storage. We like to have a more class A product. We had shared some renderings uh with Lynn to show you what our final product would look like. I think was well received. So, we're here to seek uh final site plan approval. All right. Um yeah, this definitely different markets and storage and that these are this is very marketable. Um and uh your your renderings look great. Um we've had good luck with them. We've actually built about five or six in greater Cleveland. Yeah. Um I'm good with it and it meets the code. It's in the it's properly zoned and everything. So um Mr. Coler, anything? No, sir. Mr. Shipley. Yeah, it's mainly just on I guess the uh um the vegetation and trees and stuff on uh I guess Old Mill Road because there's there's are there are houses across the street from that, right? Or Yes, there's houses to the south. So, you're going to build a a grass mound that's I don't know five six feet tall or something and then correct. Basically, what you see here with all the trees, they're going to be on top of Okay. Yeah. Tall. So, you would you really wouldn't see our buildings. Yeah. Looks like a welldesigned. Okay. So, even the mound is almost the height of it. No, because didn't at the

conditional use permit hearing um one of mill residents. Yes. asked. Um, yeah. And you had committed at that time to and your lighting study shows zero influence outside your footprint and all that. So, okay. They're all on the They're all Wallpack lights. They're all down. They're all They're all shielded. They're I I don't even know the distance from the building to Old Mount. What is What is our distance here? We did make a commercial grade driveway around the project for fire access. Nice. Oh wow. Okay. I think that that's my main concern. I guess traffic should be fine on 91. We actually hope to have no traffic. Just as point of reference, we're almost like a funeral home. If we get more than four customers a day, we'd be shocked. We are slow lease up. Uh the market uh rates on these things are you lease up usually about 3 to 4% a month and you're in about two years you lease up to around 90% but it's just a slow lease up. It's our average customer is a suburban housewife who's looking to to declutter her house in her garage. You know, quite frankly, how we got into it, we're in the development business, but as you might all know, Northeast Ohio was a pretty much a a bedroom, World War II bedroom community where majority of houses didn't have basements. Even when people build today two-car garages, there's still not enough room. Some people build uh put showers above the garages these days. True story. I used to buy shower doors from them. Now, are the smaller buildings are each unit access from the exterior? From the exterior. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And what we did with those, we actually we do a

little bit different market. The average storage facility will have an 8ft door. We make ours 10 because we believe there's a demand for people with jet skis, landscape contractors, and we make them a little wider so they're not uh hitting the sides of the walls as they enter. Okay. Mr. Walker. Mhm. If you had wanted to look at one, we just finished one on Cochran Road in Solen. Uh same thing. We took a building and we have a it's a drive-thru. You You wouldn't notice it was a self-s storage facility. No, you would. Mr. Bar, anything? I think it's a great location. I like the access off of Daro. I think that's good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Best of luck. Great. Okay. Very good. Well, we'll get back to your regular meeting. Thanks. Thank you. All right. That concludes the work session for new business. move to our regular meeting. Um, we don't have the minutes for January 27th, so we're going to pass that one over. Uh, public participation, anyone wishing to speak on any of the items that are on the agenda tonight. Go right ahead. Hi, my name is Patty Stoddard Dare and I'm a resident of Lake Plat and my lot is adjacent to the proposed lot split on Shepard Road. Um, I have been communicating with my neighbors in Lake Platada ever since we heard about the first um, zoning variance request and um, through that process, we had I think I think it was seven different letters from different property owners and also our HOA who had sent um, information pleading with the city um, not to request or not to approve the variance. Um, and at that time at the BZA meeting, um, they also heard and saw pictures of what was happening in our property. I did submit some before this meeting. I'm not sure if you all received them. I heard um that there wasn't going to be consideration of the water on our

property. That's the first time I've heard that and I'm not sure that I embrace that. I would like an opportunity for us to be able to get an attorney to give us some advice on that as well. Um, am I allowed to share some of the photos? I don't know if you shared them that the ones that I sent previously. Sure. So, these were if I if it's okay to come up here. Okay. So, these are some photos that were taken on April 2nd. Um, and I'll just show you I'll go through some of them. And where is that? This is the property. So the right property on April. So this is also this is the water that's coming through the property. Yeah. And this is my backyard. So, we already have swale background that the city um mandated that the previous property owner install. And so what happens is that from where this lot comes, the water comes down, it hits the the property owners I just talked about goes to my backyard, but then it goes all the way down Shepherd Road and it goes it actually impacts the property owners around the curb on Bridget and then it also goes to the other side of Shepard and we've all had like very significant um water intrusion on our property. So here you can see the water coming out of the woods and then it goes down. And then here you can see I have a huge drain this big already in my backyard and my neighbors already have substantial drains and they are as well. And this is with the drains. And so here you can see that the water travels down just down the neighborhood wiping out the landscape and then it goes to

the houses who are down on the other side here. Um So, this is an ongoing really super serious concern for us uh and for us as property owners. The thought of having the vegetation removed from that space and the the thought of having to have an imperous driveway um that would be directly behind our properties where we're already having tremendous water intrusion is a serious concern for us. So, um my request obviously is that that you wouldn't approve this. Um, but if that can't be done, then I would request that that the property owners have time for us to get legal representation so that we can um have consultation on what grounds we might be able to discuss um our concerns um with the planning commission. Great. And I also want to say that a lot of people from Lake Platter were here and they left because they didn't realize that they were going to have a chance to speak. So I know that engineering division has met with Lake Platter residents and has offered solutions to the current problem. Engineering division has has Amy Moore not met with Andrew Drive residents? Um, I met with Amy Moore and um, also my neighbor met with Amy Moore. I'm trying to think of who and I Yeah. So, I think there was three neighbors that met with Amy Moore. Her suggestion was that we pull together and pay thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars to put in a um, a storm sewer in the yard because Shephard Road doesn't have storm sewer and Chamberlain is my understanding also doesn't have a storm sewer. So like we don't have anything to connect into and the property owners have already um actually had great

expense to our own properties already to try to mitigate the water and try to put in some drains. Um so it wasn't anything that we could afford um in terms of a solution um because the in the infrastructure is just not really there for us to connect to is my understanding. That is accurate. There are no um public easements. There are no there are no city easements. It's all on private land. So from that perspective, it's a private property owner issue. Um and I think um solutions would involve somebody dedicating an easement on their private property and that is a tough cell and I I can sympathize with you folks. Um, but understand what we're doing here is a lot split and as Miss Muter uh pointed out it's legal and we really have no basis to deny it. Now given that once it's granted then there'll be development it'll come back to planning for um you know site site plan approval which these issues can be addressed then but right now we can't address those because this is just for splitting the lots. My concern is that like the once they split the lot and say that this is where the driveway is going to be and that you've already stated that the driveway would need to be made out of cement that is it's taking away the vegetation that's absorbing some of the water and that it's going to be an on-ramp for because this all goes downhill towards our property. So I'm not sure about the easement that you're talking about. Um what we heard is it was like numbers in like the 20 $30,000 to try to you know connect and they suggested well maybe you can ask Lake Plat that they can put something in. Um what we're asking is that things aren't made worse for us because if

things get worse it's going to flood the interior of my house and I I I have a a furnished basement and and most of my neighbors do as well. And so I mean this is going to be a devastating loss of our property value if that happens. We can't, as you can see, absorb any more water. What we've been told by the city engineer is that they have to the property owners are the of the Shepherd Road property that they have to show um the how much like the rate of water. So you have to say that the rate of water coming onto the property is going to be like it's going to hit a specific threshold, you know, like within a certain boundary. But they don't have to say anything about the amount of water. And so, you know, if you're filling a a swimming pool in my backyard unintentionally, it doesn't matter how fast the water's coming, I'm still underwater. There's there's no place for this water to go. It's already saturated. Do I need to clarify that? Okay. So, a house on a lot doesn't create more rainfall. The rain hitting the imperous surfaces creates a higher rate of runoff. So the task at hand through city regulations is to maintain the same rate of runoff as pre-development runoff. So for it to not be worse than it is now, not coming faster than it is coming now off of that site. But what engineering division is saying is the problem on Lake Platted U home sites is not from this location. It's from north of this location. They have the the property owner has said we'll put in a basin if that's what it takes. We'll put in a basin. And engineering said no, there's no point in putting a basin in at the rear of that. That's not where the problem lies.

Can we share the picture show coming right out of that property? Because I don't want to challenge the city engineer at this point. We did meet with her. She we could pay for ourselves and there's property owners willing to do something and she's saying no. She's saying it will not solve the problem that you're having. That is not the problem. And if I may speak because I am our law is directly involved in this. Could you just call the microphone to get on the record? I'm sorry. Patty Dep Prey and um my my husband and I property backs up to this proposed driveway. Um the water in April was the worst we've ever had where now it's filling up our window wells for our basement where and we've had we had extensive landscaping done in the back and with that extensive landscaping we put in one two three four drains and um it still doesn't hold all the water that comes gushing down. And so now my husband has to go out there with a pale and take out the water from our window wells. And that's not even with the property being developed yet. This is what's currently going on. And so it is a major concern because it has gotten worse over the years. So that's just I mean come on out in a really downpour and you'll see this water that's just gushing. It becomes it becomes almost like a a real river water slide or slip and slide. That's how much water is coming down. Even to the extent that even in our front yard, we've had to build up dirt underneath the grass again because all that water just gushes the dirt down and um we've had to raise the sidewalk on

the front and also add more dirt. So, it's it's a major problem. Thank you. And Charles Mcluffy. I'm also from Lake Plata. I live up on the top end of Lake Plat above and adjacent to where they want to put the uh three lots, four lots, whatever it is. The a water problem need goes beyond that in as much as water comes from Macedonia. There's a large sewer pipe that comes across Sheepard Road from the Macedonia side that drains behind my property and all the way down into the property adjacent to that also, which is uh owned by um U Palowski family um which is now vacant. But that water runs over Shephard Road and onto th those two parcels and behind my parcel and runs down in the back which adds to that uh situation and putting any type of driveway whatever would only exacerbate that. So, I just wanted to make I made this clear in the last when when they had the the uh zoning meeting where they went wanted to break the the properties up. I brought this up and all I heard was an O and nothing no one ever came out to look at that situation either where the drain comes through on Shepard Road. So there there's there's additional problems that would that that already there's a problem that already

exists that that creates that problem that that we're not that no one's looked at and that would just increase the that flow of water too coming across Shepard Road. Everything runs down from Shepard Road. Thank you. All I do, Mr. Chairman, is um I I live in Lake B as well. I live on the top lot. I'm not in the area of impact here, but I've heard from a lot of my neighbors and this is my ward too. I I will just offer I don't see anything wrong with holding this until the next meeting. I wouldn't wouldn't mind talking with Mr. with a with our legal counsel, but uh I do want to say for the record, I know I saw a lot of my neighbors out in the audience this evening before uh before the end of the school presentation. And I know there's there's a lot of concern. I I think those who have spoke here are in the most directly impacted area. I don't know if it's all of them. And I understand what our legal standards are and what we can vote on, but I know there's a lot of concern from my neighbors just to northeast Northwest. Any objections to holding? Are we okay? And and why are we postponing it? To get legal counsel? Yeah, I would like to ask him some questions. Okay, Mr. Park, anything? It's I mean, it's ultimately up to the commission. It's up to the commission. The applicant has met with the um city's attorney and the applicant's attorney has met with our law director and this is the solution that was approved by the law director and the engineer. I understand. Can we get these are outside of those questions? I understand. Can we get

something in writing from the law director for guidance then? Yeah, it sounds like Mr. Walker has some specific questions. Yeah. So, it sounds like that there was a meeting between attorneys u that were representing the the people who own Shepard Road and the city, but the attorney that wasn't present was someone that was representing our interests and so we want to have an opportunity to have our interests represented. Very well. Okay. So, we're going to hold it. I agree. Yeah. I don't know. We would we would not want to put something that would make the situation worse for I mean hopefully there's an opportunity to improve your situation. That's what I'm looking for. What that might be. I suppose I'd only caution the planning commission if if everything is in compliance. I mean, I don't know the legal ramifications of tableabling this as opposed to acting on it this evening. Yeah, I don't know if there's a time frame that we're I know if we were um in a township scenario, we would have seven days to approve this and then we would run a file if all conditions were met, but I don't know how that translates to a municipal scenario. What's our next scheduled meeting? It's a monthly month out. Yeah. As long as you have I don't think that that time frame applies to us. Okay. Uh I I would I'm supporting Mr. Walker's motion. So, uh I'll second it. Have a motion to to table till the next meeting. Second byly.

Okay. I'm going to do a roll call on that one. Sure. So, a motion to postpone um the the Shephard Road lot split till the next meeting. Um Mr. Walker, yes. Mr. Shipley, yes. Mr. Hogler, yes. Mr. Sheck, yes. So, we'll take that up next meeting. We'll get a couple things cleared up so we're all on board. I'll try to get that one and organize a meeting with their attorneys to try to get all parties together to talk about it. That's that I mean that's fine. I I definitely and I just have a question. It has more to do with voting procedure has to Okay. Thank you for bringing that up. All right. Uh that moves us to item number four. Lot split consolidation 3231 Simmit drive with the applicant come back up. Anything else you'd like to add? Uh, no. That's pretty straightforward. Anything from the city? All right. Based on that, uh, I make the motion upon reliance on representations made by the applicant and their representatives along with the submitted application for a lot split and consolidation of permanent parcels 64-09682 and 64-9683. Date stamp received April 1st, 2025 and revised survey map stamped received April 14, 2025. I move that planning commission approve the requested action. Do I have a second? Second. Going to say that was Craig Shipley. What's it? I think Mr. Shipley seconded that.

Give it to Mr. Sheck. Yes. Mr. Shipley. Yes. Mr. Walker. Yes, ma'am. Mr. Hogler. Yes. All right. We're good. Passes 40. All right. uh brings us to item number five, planning and zoning code amendment. Um I think I only need one. Yeah, we're going to make a I'll make a motion that move the planning commission recommend to city council approval of the zoning code amendments presented by the city planner related to section 10120.01 not performing buildings and structures. Um and we're going to hold the other part. So just uh we're going to do 11201. Do I have a second? Second. Roll call. Okay. Mr. Sheck. Yes. Mr. Hogler? Yes. Mr. Shipley? Yes. Mr. Walker? Yes. All right. That passes 40. Uh zoning map amendments. Uh resoning request 9392 Revena Road. Um make the following. Is there anything else on that? I made the following motion upon reliance on representations made by the applicant and their representatives along with the submitted application for resoning from EVC self-s storage LLC date stamped April 1st and April 2nd, 2025. I move that planning commission recommend to city council approval the requested map amendment for permanent parcel 64-000096 from C2 community commercial zone to the I1 intensive commercial and light industrial zone. Do I have a second? I'll second. Roll call, please. Mr. Sheck, yes. Mr. Shipley, yes. Mr. Walker, yes. Mr.

Hogler? Yes. All right. And item number seven's final site plan self-s serve storage permanent parcel 640967 1. I make the following motion. Upon reliance of representations made by the applicant and their representatives along with the submitted site plan, landscape plan and other substantial materials for self-s serge storage facility at permanent parcel 64-09 671. Date stamp received April 1st, 2025 and revised April 16th, 2025. I move for final site plan approval with the following conditions. Condition one, approval of the SWP3 by Summit County Soil and Water. Condition number two, final engineering approval by the city Twinsburg city engineering department. Uh condition number three, final approval by Twinsburg Fire Department. Condition number four, dedication to rightaway along Old Road that is noted on the site plan. Do I have a second? Second. Second by Mr. Hogler. Roll call, please. Mr. Sheck? Yes. Mr. Hogler? Yes. Mr. Walker? Yes, ma'am. Mr. Shipley. Yes. All right. 40 on that one. All right. That brings us to communications. Public service. Oh, nope. Thank you. communications and miscellaneous. Lyn, anything on the horizon other than we have to revisit the lot split? Yeah. Um, no, there nothing that I'm nothing that's in the pipeline right now. Um, I have a a list of other zoning code amendments that I plan to bring forward for you to think about. And so the one that we've postponed with the garage,

I'll just I'll just add it to the list. Okay. Um I have a question. The trailer storage uh lend lease on 91 by the clinic property. I see dirt moving around. Yeah. It's been a long time coming, hasn't it, sir? Yeah. Is that still valid or do they have to come back? Now it's still valid. I I saw that as well that they started importing soil last fall and then stopped for the winter and now there was for them to level that site. I think they said it was going to cost a million dollars to get it level. Yeah, there's a lot of dirt in there. So, um yeah, and uh I I was so ecstatic. I think it was in February and I went down a random road and I was like, "Oh, the blue top's gone. So, uh, anything from the Mr. Hogler? Anything? No, sir. Mr. Shipman? No, sir. Nope. Mr. Walker? No, sir. Mr. Bar? Uh, nothing from the city. Thank you. All right. Very good. Uh, we just need a motion to excuse Mr. Cohen for this evening. So, moved by Mr. Walker. I'll second. Second by Mr. Shipley. Roll call. Um, Mr. Walker. Yes, ma'am. Mr. Shipley. Yes. Mr. Hogar. Yes. Mr. Sheck. Yes. I think he did this to me on purpose. Yeah, I know, right? We got a good one. We haven't had a two-hour meeting in a long time. We are adjourned. Lyn, just for the when is