Planning and Zoning Board - Regular Meeting

I'd to call the Planning and Zoning Meeting for Wednesday, October 8, to order. Before we get started, I'd like to respectfully request that all electronic devices be set to audible, non notification and or airport mode. Airplane mode. Whatever that thing that flies is. Close enough. So we don't have any interruptions. Please, Board members also. Okay. Call to order. Roll call, please.

Mr. Kennedy? Mr. Andrew Kovich?

Here.

Mr. Hatcher?

Here.

Mr. Duane?

Here.

Mr. Fisher?

Here.

Mr. McGinnis?

Here.

Mr. Emma Futano?

Okay. At this time, there are no old business, new business. The first item is RZ2503, request for rezoning from one I-one Light Industrial to mixed use, planned use development for a property located at 2945 West Park Avenue. Staff report, please.

Thank you, Chairman. City staff didn't send out public notice with this aerial map within 500 feet of the subject property. The request before you is a rezoning from I1 light industrial to mixed use planned unit development. This is a MUPUD. As you can see from the land use code within the future land use of industrial, a compatible zoning district is as it is currently zoned I one light industrial, I two heavy industrial I PUD which is an industrial planned unit development agreement or in this case mixed use planned unit development agreement.

The intent of the purpose of the zoning request is to facilitate a mixed use project that aims to activate the St. Johns River To Sea Trail. The proposed development is going to be built across two phases. The first phase seeks to build a multipurpose exercise and coffee shop with enclosed pickleball ball courts. The second phase has the option of adding additional commercial business space or overnight short term rental cottages.

On the screen above, you can see the conceptual master plan for the proposed development. The proposed rezoning provides a feathering of intensity in development, provides a transitional recreational commercial development along the trail against the backdrop of industrial development. City staff believe the requested rezoning in the proposed development agreement is more in line with the intensities and densities just north of the site. We recently brought in Hunter Davis on the agriculture site for the blueberry farm to north of this subject property. The proposed front landscape buffer is 15 feet in width.

It does encompass quite a bit. It's one canopy tree for every 50 linear feet, one understory tree for every 30 linear feet, 40 shrubs for every 100 linear feet, and one binding plant for every 30 linear feet in addition to the windscreen protection for the enclosed pickleball courts. City staff have negotiated with the applicant to place the buildings closer to West Park Avenue and away from the trail system. Bringing the buildings closer to West Park Avenue will help slow down speeds at this intersection in the future. Part of this MUPUD agreement is the city's commitment to activate the trail system by putting signs up along the river to sea and also working on towards a improved bike lane.

And the reason that city staff to the trail is during the comprehensive plan workshop. The public really liked the idea of activating the trail system. And this is kind of this applicant approach staff. And this is a unique opportunity where the code gives us that flexibility to kind of create a really mixed use recreational component to the trail that doesn't exist today. With that, staff is recommending send a favorable recommendation to City Council for RZ2503.

Thank you very much. Open the public hearing of the applicant. You're the applicant, sir?

Excuse me?

You're the applicant?

Yes.

Okay. Please state your name and address for the record and then proceed.

Yes. David Godoxen. My address is 1901 Wismore Court, New Smyrna, 32168. This property is 2945 West Park Avenue for the rezone, Hedgewater.

Is there anything you wanted to add other than what?

No. We spent some good time corresponding with the city. Ryan He's been great. My wife and I, who are the primary, this is not a big business endeavor. This is more of a community, do something for, hopefully, for school kids and maybe some elderly people and more community based get togethers than we have currently today. Finally, a place to play in town that is out of the weather a little bit, which would be nice.

Okay. Thank you. Public comments. Are there any public comments at this time? Please come to the microphone and state your name and address for the record.

Mary Forrester, 1937 Edgewater Canal Road. I live about almost a quarter mile north of this property, and what scares me about it is school traffic. Edgewater Canal, my road, and Tatum are connector roads from Edgewater to the middle school, to the high school, and to Daytona State College. In the mornings and in the afternoons on school days, it's a very dangerous intersection. The traffic can be backed up on Massey, which is the road that will be north of this right on the other side of the trail.

Two to three cars, it can be backed up all the way to Edgewater Canal Road, which is the first street left, and I can sit two or three cars back waiting for school traffic at Park Avenue because you also have the business traffic that is going from all of the businesses on Park Avenue. The renderings that I looked at showed an entrance right on Air Park Road. That's already congested. It is very congested. That's a very dangerous intersection.

It became more dangerous after the extension of the airport and they put in the big curve on Park Avenue. It's very difficult to see beyond that, especially when the trees are if the trees haven't been trimmed, you have to really, really look. So you have kids on bicycles, kids on e bikes. You have parents and students all driving that intersection in the mornings and in the afternoons. And in my personal opinion, this is a great thing, but it needs to be at not such a busy cross street.

We've had I don't know how many accidents at Air Park and Park Avenue just in the last year. So easy to get in an accident there, but my concern is the safety of the people going back and forth to school, especially with an entrance and exit on Park Avenue. It's a disaster waiting to happen during school days. And that's all I have to say.

Thank you. Thank you. Are there any other public comments at this time? David, can you come to the mic? Are there any board comments or questions? It looks like there's also an entrance on Park, Correct.

Yes. So, city staff had the applicant line up their entrance with what is already across the street because that's where the traffic would align

And

so that's where staff made them have an entrance. On Park Avenue there there is going to be a protected bike lane. We did ask and the applicant is giving a 50 by 50 corner cut to the city for intersection improvements in the future. They're also adding that protected bike lane on Air Park to that intersection on the north side. So the intent here eventually is to run down Air Park that protected bike lane because we will have running through Mango.

We'll have a trail running up that way connecting Park. We also have an eight foot sidewalk going from 30th And Silver Palm all the way up. And then this would kind of make that connection where you have three routes throughout the city to go northbound into our industrial areas.

So the 50 by 50 will basically be a line of sight.

Yes. Essentially that's on this corner here.

Okay. We increase it. Any other Board comments?

Yes. So I have a couple. I mean, I understand they had a tax classification for timber and that's typically for a bona fide timber harvesting. It kind of looks backwards. The land was harvested. Now they want to rezone. And, it seems like it shouldn't have been that way. It kind of circumvents the land development code and the tree preservation to me. But that being said, I just think it's a great plan, but I have concerns over a thirty year PUD for that. Right?

And so how does the harvesting of timber trigger the two year on the thirty, you know, the first two years to, I don't know, turn a shovel, put in a a whatever. Is this already to that point? I mean, this could be accomplished with a a a much shorter PUD. And you just said a few minutes ago, I overheard Dennis. It's a tight room. But PUD, anything goes, right? And so you're opening the door for thirty years.

Correct. But the agreement is for that period. If he does not do something within that two year period, the agreement expires. So it holds kind of their feet to the fire, say, if you want to build this, we expect you to go build it. Typically, staff have always held that thirty year agreement because that's typically how PEDs are written. So we just kept that consistent.

It just seems excessive to me, my opinion. So when a two year commencement requirement would start when it's not started yet just because the land's been cleared?

No. So it starts as soon as they start actually doing stuff on-site, whether that's they apply for a site plan and then they actually get out there and start doing silt fencing.

Well, starts when this document gets signed, right, in two years. Correct.

And then that carries through if they sell the property before they do anything with it.

David, is this going to be public accessible or is it a private?

No, it'll be public accessible. Okay. It'll probably have some kind of a membership and just a drop in rate. But it will be our goal is to have it be not very open,

I guess.

So maybe we'll have some after school programs.

But covered for weather.

Covered for weather. We'll be on the sides, which is why we have the windscreens And on the sides, then we'll have the one small, comparatively small building for like the clubhouse where we'll have AC in there. And then we want to have

a small coffee shop there. Good.

Okay. Thank you. I appreciate that.

My question is that the business side of it, I don't have a problem with. What I'm concerned with is the water retention and make sure because I know that area floods very easily to the north of there. And I'm concerned to make sure that the water is maintained on property as best as possible. And I'm also concerned of making it a PUD with the cottages because once you make it a PUD, now you open it up, you can do anything you want to do as far as residential, hotels, you know, where if you just stay with the industrial side of it, you can have your restaurants, you can have your pickleball courts. That's my concern is if we make it a PUD, it opens it up for anything.

Not correct. I mean, within the PUD itself, it has listed things. And it says specifically on the cottages, they can't be they're short term rentals. They're not for the purpose of overnight, long term stay, anything of that nature. And it doesn't allow residential uses. So he couldn't just throw up a single family home or a bunch of townhomes. He can only do it under the premise of that business of operating.

We'd have to come back for approval if we want to do something different.

But to Jim's point, there is nothing about water retention or storm water other than what you've got in the one hundred year. We use that a lot.

Mean, that is the city standard is the one hundred year twenty four hour storm requiring more. Obviously, it just requires way more land to take up even more to go to the 500 or 1,000. And at a certain point, there's a point where if we go to a one thousand year storm, it has to take up 70 of the properties that take. I don't know. We just have to be mindful of those things.

We have had discussions on that. And Ryan made those same points. He said we really want you to keep your drainage on. It would be ideal if you had a wet pond, which is why we have it in our initial plan. We still have to go to civil engineering, but we've had those discussions already. So we are I think we're on the same page, though I understand that maybe means different things because you've seen different actors in the past. We, at this point, have had pretty good discussions between the city and ourselves and the civil engineer already towards that.

Yes. I mean realize this is only step one of this. He starts to come back with a site plan and then we can ask for more if we would like at that time. So this is literally just saying, okay, go to the next step.

I think it's important too that this is staff's attempt at we can't really rezone things. I'm asking it's applicant driven. And so this is staff's attempt to start doing some of the things from the comp plan workshops. And this was kind of a big one that the public in general I know I didn't have the greatest turnout. But the vast majority of those who did attend and who were consistent in their attendance liked that idea. So that's why staff have brought this project when this person approached us. Okay.

Any other comments for the board and for the public? All right. I close the public hearing and I'm looking for a motion on this item.

I'll make a motion to send a favorable recommendation for RZ2503. I'll second.

Okay. Thank you. Roll call, please.

A motion again, please.

Motion to send a favorable recommendation for RZ2503. Do we have a second?

Roll call, please.

Mr. Andrew Kovic?

Yes.

Mr. Hatcher?

Yes.

Mr. Duane?

Yes.

Mr. Fisher? No. Mr. McGinnis?

No. Next item on the agenda is SD2405, request preliminary plat for construction plan approval for Deering Park Center single family Phase one located South Of Indian River Boulevard within Dearing Park Center. Staff report, please.

Thank you, Chairman. City staff did send out public notice. This is the location of SD 2405, preliminary plat for single family within Deering Park Center located just West of I-ninety 5 and South Of Indian River Boulevard. This is the proposed subdivision layout. The applicant is proposing ninety four fifty foot wide lots, eighty two fifty five foot wide lots, and seventy four sixty foot wide lots.

The PUD agreement requires that only 25% of the lots within Deering Park Center are permitted to be 50 feet in width. Within the first phase, 50 foot wide lots are 24.7%. This subdivision layout of the lots and both the minimum lot size and lot width all meet the code requirements and in the case of lot depth exceed the code requirements. The minimum code requirements for lot depth is 115. The applicant is providing 120.

This is kind of illustrated here on the layout of the lots broke down. So on 55 foot lots that's 21.5% of this subdivision and then 19.4%. The maximum impervious surface is 70%. The maximum building coverage is 70%. The applicant has provided a maximum building coverage that you can see in the development summary on the left hand side that has the maximum building coverage at 5% for 60 foot wide lots, 60.6% for 55 foot wide lots, and 53.3% for 50 foot wide lots.

These all meet the land development code and the PUD agreement. The typical roadway within Deering Park is a 60 foot right of way with a 12 foot green space as well as 10 foot drive aisles, two foot Miami curbs on both sides, and six foot sidewalks. The land development code calls for four foot sidewalks. The PUD had established that it would follow the land development code. The developer has provided greater than four foot sidewalks within the subdivision, thus meeting the intent of the Land Development Code and the mixed use plan unit development agreement.

Tree and landscaping. The applicant has provided the landscaping arborist reports and tree surveys. The applicant is requesting to remove two historic trees that were identified to be dying. These are identified as tree 106 and tree 115. This does have to go to council for approval for the removal of any historic regardless if it is diseased or dying. The applicant has provided images and an arborist report demonstrating that these two trees should be removed due to their failure. That is likely. All other landscaping plans do meet the land development code and the planned unit development agreement. Storm water for the site. So the city of we just kind of touched on it within Article five.

K, L, and M are kind of the bigger, beefier sections of the land development code within Article five for storm water. So in this case, the one hundred year, twenty four hour, point one inch for positive outflow of public conveyance. So you can see here this is the North Fox Culvert heading to Little Cow Creek. So in the twenty five year, you can see that there's a substantial reduction between pre and post conditions. And then in the one hundred year there's an even more substantial reduction.

The code requires 90% reduction so that is being met. And they're retaining the one hundred year the twenty four hour event. On the left hand side is all the pipes and storm water for this subdivision. Again, this is one master storm water system but for this specific subdivision they have provided the storm water analysis for these ponds. Compensating storage.

So one of the other big things is that this site is encompassed encumbered by flood zone A which is sheet flow flooding. Deering Park is required as part of that development agreement and Deering Park Center to provide compensating storage on a cup for cup basis for any fill placed in the hundred year flood zone. This has been provided and you can see here in the table the compensating storage of the fill in the Flood Zone 88.32 acre feet and the compensating storage provided is well above the minimum cup for cup that would have been 88.32 acre feet. With that, city staff are recommending approval for Dearing Park Center SD 2405. The applicant has met all the requirements of the land development code and the planned unit development agreement for Dearing Park Center.

Thank you, Ryan.

Mr. Chairman, may I interrupt? I would like to make a motion for a continuance of this recommendation phase of SD 2405 until the stormwater master plan is returned to the city for review. Decisions of this scale should demonstrate conformity and feasibility with the city's forthcoming stormwater management strategy by Jones Edmond and Associates. Size and scope here is enormous.

Construction plans submitted state name of receiving waters is Headwaters, specifically the Turnbull Hammock Conservation Area, which is situated East Of I-ninety 5 and West Of US-one, which is basically all of Florida's shores. I get it. One hundred year store standards, DEP, St. John's River standards, cup to cup, Is dotted, Ts crossed. But the fact of the matter is our past reliance on their effectiveness has left us in our current predicament in searching for solutions. This is going to get done. No doubt about it. I know. But it must be done right and it would be a disservice to cut the corner right here. I don't believe this board One

second, Aaron. Is this appropriate at this point, what he's trying to do?

I don't think so because it's not the role of this board to table things down the road, the role of this Board is to send a recommendation either favorable or unfavorable to That's the City what I thought. So I don't

think it is appropriate. Okay. So at this point, I'm just going to cease your comments. And at this point, the applicant I'm opening up to public comments. And the applicant, I believe, is that the microphone?

Yes. And I'll be glad to address your concerns in a minute. The problem is, of course, there are certain legal standards that the planning board has to follow. And it's in your code as to what you have to do. And, to be honest with you, tabling is not one of your options. So we can talk

It wasn't tabling. I was trying to.

Continuing his table. Continuing. It's not the

same thing.

Right. Same thing. Yeah.

You have

to The bottom and we can talk about this in a while, but the bottom line is you have, you know, basically three options. You can recommend approval. You can recommend approval with conditions, or you can recommend denial. And that's it. But we can talk about that. First, I want to have Sean Stephan, who's the applicant, to come up and talk about the project itself. And then I'll talk about the various standards.

Please state your name and address for the record.

Sean Steffen, 3450 Old Dawson Ranch Road, 32132.

Thank you.

So in addition to Dearing Park Center, this is one phase of construction of a larger development. And then we thought it would be important to share additional information from a high level and kind of work down to this phase of construction. So that's what we've prepared for you tonight. Gering Park Center is obviously in the Edgewater portion of this project as part of a very large piece of land. It's 70,000 acres.

Within it, we've gone to great lengths to preserve lot of the property. So currently, 46,000 acres is set aside for conservation in perpetuity. In order for that to be accomplished, we wanted to take into consideration wildlife corridors, hydrology ecosystems. And we also want to connect with the corridors on the outer boundaries of the property. So the areas you see in dark green are all the areas that is part of the 46,000 acres that would be set aside in permanent conservation.

Next slide, please. So in Edgewater, we have multiple portions of this project in Edgewater, so starting with Dearing Park Center. 185 acres will be in conservation. And Darien Park North Darien Park Center is basically the portion of the property on the South Side Of Indian River Boulevard on that site plan. Darien Park North is basically the portion of the property on the North Side Of Indian River Boulevard.

And so in Darien Park North, approximately 3,700 acres will be in conservation easements. To the west, have Farmton Eastern Gateway. 100 acres of that will be in conservation. And it will also include the Edgewater Wetland Park and a wildlife corridor bike trail, which will connect through the property north up to 44. Together, this is Dearing Park.

So the piece that we have in front of you tonight is circled in red. This is the Dearing Park Center single family portion. In Dearing Park Center, we've commenced construction on our Welcome Center located at the end of Indian River Boulevard, basically the current termination of the existing roadway. And we've also commenced construction on the extension of Indian River Boulevard, Williamson Road, and then the roadway leading south into this portion of development. We call that Lily Hammock.

So this property will sit at the end of an existing roadway that we are currently construction. So Deering Park Center also have a wide range of homes and eventually some commercial options. As Ryan illustrated in the site plan he provided to you earlier, there's two fifty homes in this neighborhood surrounded by preserves, lakes. And we went to great lengths to preserve a lot

of the oak

trees. We've actually modified our site plan many times to do that. That was part of our ARPRIST report. And then just to illustrate the commitment that our team has to this project and the quality of development, one of the executives from the Deering family will also be residing in this portion of the community. So this slide here, we just want to illustrate some of the roadways.

I know Ryan shared one of the cross sections in the staff report. We've had this labeled as Indian River Boulevard. This is just example of the interconnection of roadways. So starting with Indian River Boulevard, we'll be making landscaping improvements on the existing roadway. And as we extend Indian River Boulevard West, this is just to illustrate the tree canopy that we'll have in the medians, along the sidewalks, multiuse trail throughout the community.

This is our monument, which will sit at the end of the existing Indian River Boulevard. And as you look at the bottom, this kind of pans from left to right across the entire intersection. So on the left, that would be your left hand turn going towards this portion of the community, the Dearing Park Monument. And then as you work your way to the right on the bottom of that screen, that would be looking forward on the extension of Indian River Boulevard. This is just a rendering of the welcome center that's currently under construction.

Move through some of these. So Okamik amenity, this is located in Deering Park Center. This is actually one of two amenities that we currently have planned and will be under construction as part of our first phase of development. This sits immediately to the northern property boundary of the Deering Park Center single family phase. This will include resort style pool, clubhouse, cabana, dog parks, and also interconnected trail systems so the residents can enjoy all the amenities but also get to them either pedestrian or via bikes.

So another illustration in the Okamiq amenity. One of the reasons we've named it Okamiq amenity is we've preserved an Okamiq. So what you see here is a rendering of one of the age appropriate several age appropriate playgrounds on that amenity. So that oak hammock we currently have in place, and we'll be incorporating basically a kids' park within it. So one of the things that we just want to share with you that we've shared multiple times is just that we're incorporating native landscaping and Florida friendly plant material throughout the community.

One of the reasons for this and I'm going to focus on the goals to the big four to the right is just less water usage on native plants, healthy soils, less demand on fertilization, and also to promote healthy ecosystems, which is really from top down, whether that's pollinators and things like that. But it was very important to our community to have those standards throughout the community. So just an example of some of the streetscapes and trees we'll use throughout community are roadways, parks, and things like that, and also residential lots. And then I'm going to turn it over to Glenn.

Thanks. And again, for the record, my name is Glenn Storch, 420 South Nova Road, Daytona Beach, Florida. So

one of the

things I get to discuss is the standards for review of a plat. This review is not of a zoning. This is not a review of a comp plan or an annexation. This is a review of a plat. And the plats have very specific standards that have been created by law. And that's why, like I say, when you're looking at the idea of potentially tabling it, in actuality ends up being a pocket moratorium. And that's not permitted under the terms of what we're talking about. I can ask for a continuance. That's true. But if you, in fact, do that, then it creates a potential problem.

So let's start with what I have to show in order to get an approval for a preliminary plan. The first thing is and pardon me for the folks who have already seen this but it must be consistent with the Edgewater Conference of Plan. You have to look at that. Your staff report indicates that this plat has been reviewed, and it is consistent with the Conference of Plan. This is a mixed use comprehensive plan that specifically permits this subdivision, the size subdivision, the size lots, this type of residential use in this mixed use designation.

So the next one. Then it has to be consistent with the zoning. Go down from the comp plan to the zoning. And in this case, we have a Deering Park Center MPUD. That was a PUD that we all approved years ago. That was in fact it's a contract between the landowner and the city. And it's a large contract. It's got probably thirty, forty pages of requirements that we have to meet. And so the staff has to look at that and say, everything in that PUD, everything that we've agreed to, has been met by this plat. And the staff has indicated that, yes, indeed, we've done that.

And we, of course, we have our engineer here to also testify, if necessary, that we have met every single criteria of of the Dearing Park MPUD with this plan. Next. Then the third thing is it has to be consistent with the land development code. So you have a you have a comprehensive plan, you have a zoning, and then you have the overall Edgewater Land Development Code. So every single piece of that land development code that's not specifically provided in the PUD, we also have to meet that criteria.

And as the city staff has indicated, as the evidence has shown in this case, we have met every single criteria, every single part of land development code for this preliminary plan. Next, please. I should point out that per the staff report and this is stormwater is always an issue. And so we try to make sure that we understand that. In this particular case, the applicants provided the stormwater report. We've done all the permitting. We've done the permitting with St. John's. We've done the permitting of the city. We have those permits.

We are in the process now of putting the stormwater ponds in. Literally, as you indicated, in Durbin Park Center, 155 acres of stormwater lakes are going in there right now because that's what they were permitted for. And we have demonstrated in that model that we meet the criteria for a one hundred year storm event. And this results in a significant decrease in runoff right now from the natural grade. We will reduce the runoff on this site because of all this stormwater management system that we have put in place and the 155 acres of lakes.

When Dearingport North is in place as well, you'll see that the entire amount is nearly 400 acres of lakes system to hold storm water. Go back to second. The staff specifically found that it's met the requirements of the MPUD agreement and, more importantly, the City Of Edgewater's land development code. Thank you. Then I always believe it has to be consistent with the state statutes as well, because actually, platting is a state statutory requirement.

The state has all the standards as far as how the plat should be. And in fact, if you know, the state recently took away the rights for the city commission to have to review the Platts in the future because there were issues, because they weren't following the law, I suspect, as much as anything else. And so now, the state legislature has found, that unless the applicant requests an extension of time that's what we were talking about just now, the continuance unless the applicant requests that extension of time, the administrative authority shall approve, approve with conditions, or or deny the plan within the statutory time frame. Next, please. If the plan is denied, recommended denial in this case, written notice must identify all areas of noncompliance and include specific citations for the requirement as to how the plan fails to meet those requirements.

And the governing body may not or require the applicant to follow a written extension of time. My mother always said it never hurts to ask, but it says, I guess you can't force them to do this. Next, please.

The

report, the plat itself, everything that has been provided, all the seven reviews that have taken place by the staff on this site, literally the nine months of reviews of this property. Because this plat was submitted in February '5. Yeah.

Or December.

Or December '4. Okay. So it's been more than nine months. So that much time has been put into looking at this and making sure that everything meets every requirement of the law. And it does. So in this particular case, the Edgewater Conference and Plan mixed use designation is consistent. The MPUD is consistent. The Land Development Code is consistent. Statutory requirements under 177 is consistent. And that's why, like I say, after reviewing it for so long, there is no evidentiary basis for denial.

Next, please. This is what I wanted to get to to commissioner Fisher's point. This actually says what your job duties are. So your LDC 20 one-sixteen thousand three hundred five says, the planning board shall review the preliminary plat, the required exhibits, development plan, and the review comments to determine the conformity with the comprehensive plan and the land development regulations. And that's, of course, based on evidences provided.

Secondly, the denial of the preliminary plat is is only permissible if reference to specific articles which the preliminary plat does not comply are addressed. And I have not heard of any articles that we have not met. Next, please. Upon the completion and review of the public hearing, the planning board shall recommend one of the following actions at the public hearing. Again, this is in your code.

One, the approval of the preliminary plat. Two, the conditional plat approval subject to any necessary modifications, which will be noted on the preliminary plat or attached to it in writing and then forwarded to the city council. And three, the denial of preliminary plat. Such denial should be accompanied by reasons for such actions and they have to be legal reasons, obviously or reference to the specific articles, which the preliminary plat does not comply. Again, there is no provision at this time that would allow the board to table this matter. Next, please. So I think this is probably the end. All entitlements have been granted for this site. We have all the permits for the site. All stormwater management permits by St.

John's and Edgewater have been granted. The stormwater study is not going to affect the stormwater management plan whatsoever because the permits have already been granted. But it is my belief that because they've already been granted, this storm water, you've already been vested. And I guess I need to go into this. The city is issued a finding that the project is fully vested.

Next, please. So what happened during the moratorium was there was a profession that said, if you have met all criteria, if you have provided for significant investment in your project. If you have permits, if you are doing these things, you will be vested. Your entire project will be vested entirely. So in this particular case, I literally provided seven, eight boxes of materials showing just that, showing every criteria that has been met, showing the amount the affidavits showing the amount of money that we have spent project based on the permits that we have received.

This thing is in progress as of right now. And so we have received a letter based on the law, based on the moratorium, that this project is fully vested. Next, please. These are a few of the case law that typically most people would look at. This is Broward County versus Norco Realty.

This is a 1978 case. All persons similarly situated should be able to obtain Platte approval upon meeting uniform standards. What that means is if you have laws and you meet every one of those laws and you check every one of those boxes, which we have done in this case, then you're entitled to your Platt. Because otherwise, as the case said, otherwise, the official approval of a Platt application would depend upon the whim or caprice of the public body involved. Again, it would be bad faith.

There'd be a number of it's arbitrary and capricious. There's lawsuits, etcetera. When the statue let me go back just a second. When the statutes and ordinance have been complied with in making a plat of a subdivision, the active approval by, in this case, the village board, has been held to be ministerial. And what that means is if we check the boxes, if we've met every requirement, if we've met the comp plan zoning and the land development code, then your job is ministerial.

You really don't have a choice as to whether or not to grant a plan or not because it's ministerial. It meets all the requirements. Next, please. This is GBV Intern Limited versus Broward County, 1998. All persons similarly situated should be able to obtain plat approval upon meeting uniform standards.

We just talked about that. In this case, the county land development regulations contain specific requirements for plat approval, just like Edgewater does. The record before the commission established the developers complied with all these requirements so that the approval was a ministerial function. And again, it's one of the reasons why they have the legislature has removed this requirement that it goes to the county council because it is a ministerial function. Next, please.

This is the city of Bank of Miami versus City of Coral Springs. I thought this was interesting. They attempted to add additional conditions to the plat condition that would have actually delayed the ability to actually use the plat. And again, this court said, it is elementary that once a party complies with all legal requirements for platting, there is no discretion in government authority to refuse approval of the plat. Thus, why the public policy requires municipal controls such development, the authority of a town to deny the landowner the right to develop his property by refusing to approve the plat development is by statute made to rest.

Refusing to approve the plat of such statute is by statute made to rest upon specific standards of a statute or implementing ordinance. Thereafter, the approval disapproval of the Plat on the basis of controlling standards becomes, again, an administrative act. So that's I think that's for you. What's the next one? That's the conclusion. So that's bottom line. And that's why, again, Platts typically do not take hearings. Platts do not take lawyers. Typically, you have an engineer coming up answering any questions that staff may have. But these are different times.

So we do want to make sure that everyone understands the law. We do want to understand that that want everyone to understand that we have literally spent almost a year making certain that everything is done, that every piece of evidence presented to you so far has indicated that everything has been complied with, comp plan, zoning, land development code, and your planning ordinance. So there's nothing else I can do but say, please recommend recommend this this to to the the city city commission. Commission. Thank Thank you. You. And obviously, we're available for any questions because I have my whole team here.

Thank you, Clint. Public comments. Are there any public comments? If you come to the microphone, please state your name and address clearly and then proceed with your you have three minutes with which to state your case. And is the timer on?

Agnes Witter, 223 Flagler Avenue. I recently read an article about FEMA. The group that recommends the changes that they should consider taking as information comes in about the changes in our weather and especially in the flood situations that we're witnessing now. They've recommended that they change to a five hundred year plan. The 100 is no longer considered satisfactory.

And so what I would like to ask Mr. Storch and the group group is seeing as how Edgewater did experience Ian, and that was considered a five hundred year by FEMA, We're going to expect more of that. Are they and their lakes, are they capable of handling that kind of water? It may not come all the time, but it will come at some point in time. So in that, if that were to happen, then that extra water, will your lakes handle it?

Or is that going to come over the other side of 95 and into the back end of Florida Shores? And we already know that Florida Shores is a target for flooding, so I'd like to hear what you've got say about that.

Thank you. Do you want to address that now, gentlemen? Okay. Any other public comments at this time? Okay. Seeing no other

And

point.

The

who's had flooding end issues. I've been flooded three times now. Ian was the worst. We actually had six foot of water coming at us, and we had to escape during the hurricane itself with our dogs. So I understand what you're doing. I'm in an area that's in the middle of the woods. There's no development for eight to 10 miles away from where I am, but it just happened. So bottom line is we recognize that we have to plan better. And we have. So if you look at what this plan is, like I say, we're already reducing the amount of runoff from the natural land right now.

On top of that, we have the one hundred year floodplain, I mean, the one hundred year standard that we do have. We didn't have to do that at the time. We went ahead and designed for it just because we wanted to design for a higher standard. On top of that, we also designed for Florida Outstanding Waters, if I understand correctly. Is that right? So that also provides an additional layer of protection and storm water. And yes, 400 acres of lakes in that system, I suspect, will help enormously on this particular site. There's no guarantees. There never is. I recognize there's climate change.

And from our standpoint, when we're looking at marketing this project it's not even a project. It's a community. When we look at marketing this community, we want people to feel safe. We want them to make sure that this is the very best possible scenarios that we can have. We're already looking at adding some other things.

But at this point, we meet or vastly exceed every single standard. And again, we'll certainly look at the stormwater plan when it comes in or the study when it comes in. We'd never say that we'll never do anything because if we can find solutions and help find solutions, we've done that. We're very lucky that our clients are someone I shouldn't say someone. They're a family that cares. And for instance, there was the wetland park that we're doing.

That

wetland park has nothing to do with us. It has to do with the fact that the city is dumping up to a million gallons of reclaimed water into the Mosquito Lagoon every day during rainy season. And reclaimed water has nutrient levels. So we worked with the city and the state to find a solution to take that out of the Mosquito Lagoon. One of the major problems right now with climate change is that you have increases in the levels of water for the ocean.

So whereas before, had a simple system like in Florida shores, you had a simple system of ditches and canals that then went into the Mesquite Lagoon. That can't necessarily be relied upon anymore because sometimes you'll have that water higher than it's trying to go into. At the same time, we've got to find some way to start maintaining the systems that we have. For Dering Park Center and Dering Park North, I have a massive system of a tax entity, the Dering Park Stewardship District, that is going to be able perpetually pay for all maintenance of our stormwater systems because of the fact that it's over 63,000 acres and I can tax myself. That's important.

But the problem is in places like Florida shores, you don't have that. And you don't have anyone who is basically requiring that the ditches be cleaned, that someone not be allowed to cover their ditches with grass. I mean, your system is not functioning there. And so you've got to find some way of maintaining those systems. And again, I don't know if you know this, but during the last storms, we came in to help.

We did anything we could. We brought in three days of workers, three days of equipment. We had the people who are working on our site do the same thing. We're your friends and neighbors. So if there's ever a chance that we can help you solve that problem, and especially solve the Florida shores problem, problem, which can be helped with just simple maintenance, then I'd love to be a

part of that. Thank you. Okay. At this point, I'm closing comments and I'm looking for a motion for this item. I'm sorry, Board comments.

I've got a few. UD is not in here and I know it's a book. Chances are, probably made the motion to approve it. Yes, know. Know.

Because none of them will do it.

They all look at me.

Don't wait now.

Yes. That's true. You will.

So I approve.

All your renderings, it's big, huge mature trees. And I know my big thing, and it was on '44 or April is this conservation overlay. Or does that definition mean they can't touch it or they just have to try not to touch it?

So the wetlands within Gering Park, part of that is they put in 3,700 acres in the north of the conservation. On the south side, they put in a couple of 100 acres in conservation. Then they have preserved wetlands within the site. They've allowed to mitigate them based on the preservation. Right. They offset. Right.

Okay. Well, my question is, with this conservation

going in to I

I so the common open space will be platted indefinitely. So they can't just come back in and sneak it in. They'd have to go through a complete replat. And that would have to come back. And that decision

And it's more than that. I've to tell you, I've been drafting conservation easements for a while. And my whole goal in conservation easements is when we put these things on here, they are absolutely permanent. That means, no, you can't come and build on them. Because the conservation easements sometimes I think most of the times in Enduring Park, we've had two and three beneficiaries. So you'd have to get everyone to approve whatever you're doing. But our goal when we're designing these things and putting those conservation easements in place is that's it forever. That's perpetual. And that's the important thing. I know I've heard.

I've seen stuff on social media. Oh, they're just going to take that 46,000 acres and build on it. No. That 46,000 acres, most of that has three different beneficiaries on it, sometimes four, to make sure that nothing can ever be touched on that site.

So the biggest one comes from probably last year, the subdivision behind my house. Mr. Posey was up here for that one. I can't remember what the name of the subdivision is, but there was a preservation area that was like 112 acres. They weren't going to leave alone. They were going to take it down and make it a dry creek bed, but it was technically preservation. When I hear the words conservation preservation, what I mean is don't touch it. Leave it alone.

Our case, well, now, I will tell you some of the conservation we are allowed to do agriculture on. We're allowed to continue our silvicultural operation where you cut and plant trees, some of that area. We're allowed to do hunting on it. So there is a different use on some of this stuff. There's no hunting in this one because it's too small. It's 100. And I'm pretty sure that everything on this site will be untouched entirely. I'm talking about the bigger 46,000 acres. But those trees in those areas that we're preserving and when I say preserving, I mean conservation easement. There's a difference between preservation

on the

thing and the conservation easement. Those trees in the conservation easement on this one are going to be untouched because there are amenities. People are buying because they areas. They want to be in the areas that has all this nice vegetation. That's one of the reasons we're also doing. So yes, they will not be touched.

Okay.

I appreciate

you saying it on the record.

I am saying it on the record.

It's a big one for me.

And I have a record right here, right.

And I mean, where I'm at on Balko Road, I heard all of this and then they mowed down 20 acres in four days and clear cut it after all of this. So that's why I'm asking these questions. Now my next question

is Before I forget, I offered all, by the way, to also provide a conservation easement to the city of Edgewater. They did not want it as one of the beneficiaries. So if you ever want, if the city of Edgewater ever wants a conservation easement over this thing so they'd have total control over this, let me know.

You want more on your plate, Ryan? So let's talk about the elevation of the roads. And I know it's probably cart way after the horse at this point. But so again, subdivision across from my street, the elevation for the finished road is four feet above what the natural grade was. And then Volco Road, the county made you required you to come in and expand the road 46 feet onto my property.

So guess where all that water goes? Right into my wetland. And right now, the wetland is up probably a foot higher than seasonal norm over the last five years. And I'd say that road has been there about one years point now. So it's what my concern is and I saw the cutaways and we saw the widths, but I never saw anything about benchmark heights.

And what we historically see with these subdivisions is they have the main road and then they have their artery road that goes into it. So they build that up about a foot or 12 inches, 18 inches and then they build all the pads and 12 inches higher than that. So next thing you know, your perimeter is three feet higher than everybody else around you. So your sheet flow can't go through, it goes around. Which is why we keep talking about what we're So talking my question is how high like can we put something in place that doesn't allow them to make their artery road any higher than 442, so that now all the house pads are technically only 12 inches higher than 442?

Chris, so That's what I was bringing. I'm going to have

You said we can make concessions.

I'm going to bring yeah, I'm to bring the engineering. The bottom line is the advantage here we have is this don't forget, this is basically part of a 6,000, 7,000 acre piece. And so we're able to design the entire thing together to make sure it all works at the same point. But as far as having the issue you're having, that ain't going to happen. But let's talk about because again, our goal is to make this the very best subdivision we possibly can. But as far as the actual road heights, Chris, why you talk to us?

I just didn't see any benchmark elevation. So I'm like, well, I got nothing.

Just state your name and address. Thank you.

Chris Worshaw, England Tims Miller, 1411 Edgewater Drive, Suite 200, Orlando, Florida 32804. The elevations of the roads and the elevation of site is actually all within the preliminary plat application and the engineering drawings. So I don't think it's shown in the staff report, but all that information is provided in the report to include the centerline profiles of all the roads. So just to be clear, all that stuff is presented in the plans that have been submitted to the city. Ryan, correct me if I'm wrong here, but the city and the city's engineering standards actually dictate a minimum separation of the roadway to what is analyzed as the seasonal high ground water for that.

So what we are doing is we are putting that roadway at the bare minimum separation from the groundwater required by code. So that, on this site, equates to, I think, in areas it's as low as a foot above existing grade and then upwards of three feet in some of the low lying areas. Ground moves, right? So it's to be an average. Yeah.

The

you know, when you come in and build I'm gonna go on a little bit of a rant here. But when you come in and build, like, 04:42 right to the middle of town, right, they're doing the same thing, meeting that minimum separation. So it creates a damming effect. I think as you guys all see that, right, 442 is a dam. Right. What we've done in our storm water analysis that has been presented to the city is we've analyzed exterior to our property what our system is doing to those areas. So we are extending 442, minimizing that fill on that road as much as we can. And so it's actually four forty two stops where it stops now. Actually, little bit closer to that and becomes a New River Boulevard, which is a city road. Interchangeable, but that's a city road at that point.

Our site is going to essentially mimic that same elevation because we're working with the same groundwater conditions all throughout. So we're extending that roadway. That roadway, as Sean had mentioned, is currently under construction. Our site is not going up from there. It's kind of mimicking that same elevation of that roadway that's being designed. That's being carried all throughout this one. Then as subsequent applications come in, it'll all be fill is expensive. We're trying to minimize as much as possible. So we've got an opportunity on this site where we've got some pretty favorable groundwater conditions. And so that's allowing us to lower the site down to to the bare minimum we can get it.

Yes. And I saw the elevation marks for the crowns of your road. Just didn't know that it doesn't reference the full 42 elevation.

Yes, correct. I mean all of that's going to be at the bare minimum elevation that needs to be per city code. Williamson per county code and anything we're touching here at four forty two

per FDOT standards. Okay. And then my last one I wrote down, because again, we're Tree City USA. So let's stop clear cutting everything and then planting the shrub. So when they went the tree, I know it's in the PUD, but I don't have it. No, no, didn't feel like going through No, the

please. So

the same question about the roadway, what the groundwater conditions that we've got out there, what it's allowing us to do is look at the entire site and say, what can we save? Because we're not doing five feet of fill and then creating these bowls. We're going to have that a little bit because we are filling some, like I just mentioned. But in the areas that we've got these, especially on this plat application, you can see it, there's a If you look on the northern piece, there's a pond in the middle. We've been able to preserve a large string of trees directly adjacent to that.

And these are pretty spectacular oaks. I was just driving out there today and the oaks with the water next to it, it's really spectacular. But those trees Can you go to a map with the color on it, by any chance? So they're grayed out, but on the plan north of that pond and that northern piece, there's a significant oak chemical. Even on the south side, that's why that pond's got kind of a weird shape to it, because we're slicing it in between the trees, maintaining the required setback from the trees to keep the trees healthy.

But all those peoples in their backyard are going have this massive oak havoc behind it. And then that continues all the way down into the southern piece of the property where we've identified the best trees on here and said, let's relot this around. Mean, was a painstaking process. We worked with Ryan and staffed. I from our I wish I could show the picture our original application to where we are now to kind of get to a point where the tree preservation became a major part of the overall kind of process we've been going through over the last

eighteen months. So on top of that, and this you talked about little bitty trees.

Yeah. Yeah. I want to talk about the new trees.

Exactly. I figured as much because we have basically brought in practically every tree guy in the area. Talk about

So in the staff report, it talks about what the minimum tree size

Your name and address,

Steffen, 3450 Old Dawson Ranch Road, Edgewater, Florida, 32132.

Thank you.

So in your staff report, it talks about the tree caliper requirement per lot. So there's four trees, a two inch caliper. That's the requirement for an individual lot minimum. So our architectural guidelines for the community, it doesn't sound like much, but we have bumped that up a two inch caliper to a three inch caliper as part of the requirements within the community. That's one thing we've done. In addition to the trees that in the satellite picture, Ryan, if you could go back to that that Chris was talking about, just illustrates one

more.

I think he talks about decompensating storage. Yeah, that one. So can see basically the light areas are the pastures as they currently sit. And you can see from the overlay of the site plan that we're basically developing within the existing pasture and staying away the conservation areas, all the conservation areas around the perimeter. And then within some of that, there's kind of that, I guess, light bluish color.

So we're basically developing within the footprint of the existing pastures with a few exceptions. The area that we're talking about as far as Deering Park Center single family is the area to the east with kind of the C shaped pond there. And as Chris illustrated, the OKAMX I mean, our arborist report for all of Deering Park Center was over 600 trees. And for this particular section of those 600 trees, if I had to guess, there's probably about 100 to 150 that were part of that arborist report. And to Ryan's point and to Chris's point, we've one of the reasons why this nineteen months to get through this process was we have modified our site plan to incorporate in the heritage tree requirement, which is 36 inches in caliper or more.

So of the trees that we've requested approval of removal are two of those historic trees that are over 36 inches. One was damaged during Milton. One of the pictures illustrates it's basically dead and laying on its side. The other one is damaged and won't make it, regardless of what we do. So those are two of the trees that we've asked out of many in that arborist report.

In addition to that, we did illustrate in our cross section the rendering of the trees maturity, to your point. I can't commit to the caliper that we would install right now as far as our roadways, but there are significant trees. There's honestly thousands of trees across the site. I think we have, in each section, I do have a report that has how many trees that we will plant. So two fifty times four is 1,000.

And then in addition to that, in the landscape approval plans, you have 1,000 trees just on the laps themselves. In addition to that, the roadways, the common areas I don't have the number in front of me for just this portion of the community. But on the roadways, I don't have a specific we're building a beautiful community. In order for us to market that community, I need to plant larger than three inches Caliper trees on my roadways.

Right. Well, and that's I mean, when I look at your entire plan, I mean, it's going to do it a dis disservice if it doesn't look like a mature subdivision from day one. I mean if it doesn't look mature at day one, then miss the market.

Yes. I mean just to give an example. So Urban Forestry is Volusia County as a nursery for trees. They've been on our site. They actually did the tree trimming in our oak hammock. We had to raise up the canopy really for safety when we do our park. So when we're building a park within an oak hammock, I can't have deadfall, damage from storms, things like that. So we've already done that work, which Chris was talking about today. We're encouraged to use local vendors for the construction of the properties. We've already started urban forestry as a Volusia County nursery. So we'll be utilizing them in their nursery for these trees.

I was going say that urban forestry actually has the ability to plant.

Correct. So to your point, any River Boulevard alone will be about a half a mile extension of roadway. And yes, we would be a disservice to the project to put two inch caliper trees down that roadway as So a our landscape plans alone for Indian River Boulevard, Lily Hammock are in the millions of dollars. And the biggest portion of that budget is our trees.

I remember when Indian River Boulevard was two lanes with grass down

the middle and by now,

it would have little Christmas trees in the middle. Little Christmas like trees.

Know. Any other Board comments? Seeing no other Board comments, seeing no I'm closing the public hearing, and I'm looking for a motion on this item. Passing the baton. No, you're not. I'm passing the baton.

Get that thing away from me.

No, understand. I'm giving it to you because I'm going to make the motion. I can't do it. If I don't have that in front of me, I do.

You can pass the gavel and make a

motion, right? That's why I'm doing it.

Does that mean I can just adjourn? No. So on

SD2405, I make a motion to send a favorable recommendation to city council to approve this item as written. I'll cite that. I'm going take this back. Okay. Roll call, please. I'm just trying to do procedure. Roll call, please.

Mr. Andrew Kovich? Yes. Mr. Hatcher?

Yes, but I'm going to hold you to the grindstone on trees.

Mister Dwayne?

Yes.

Mister Fisher? No. Mister McGinnis?

No. I would have to ask mister Fisher this is a quasi judicial hearing. I'd have to ask for mister Fisher and mister McGinnis to tell, in public what the basis for denial is. What what

error Because because the plan shows says that that the water receiving waters will be the Bay Hammock, the Turnbull Hammock.

No. I'm asking what specific land development code, zoning, or comp plan does, issue have we failed to meet?

So why do I have to vote if you're going to tell me that I can't?

Aaron, can you explain to this gentleman what Mr. Storch did earlier? And if everything is met with the standards that the state or the city requires, it's an administrative Right.

It really is an administrative proceeding. There's not discretion involved in the planning process. So if a flat does not meet certain standards, then those should be identified for the applicant so that they could correct any discrepancies between the comp plan, the zoning, MUPUD agreement or the land development.

So this the vote of this Board, three to two, doesn't carry a recommendation to counsel? What is the purpose of

It does, but they still, I think, are entitled to know the reason behind the no vote.

They're asking to substantiate it. I got what It's they're like when counsel denied the final plat, it was an administrative decision and it was approved. Everything was according to the letter of the law, And they did it anyway against Mr. Wolf's recommendation to approve.

And otherwise, it's an arbitrary or capricious vote. So based on the law, you have to show what your basis is for denial. All. I mean, you have it if you have it a a basis, just explain it.

I don't have a legal basis that you've done anything wrong or that you don't meet. What my issue is is that the city has paid over $1,000,000 for a stormwater study. I know you've dotted your i's, crossed your t's. I I heard. I was listening. And I believe I'm not trying to stop anything. I just believe that the city should have the ability to review the stormwater study and make sure that it's cohesive with the development that's going on.

And understand that. It's

And then you tell me that I can't I could ask questions, but it doesn't matter. You've got all the answers. This is I have to go with the flow? Mean, I I don't understand.

It's simply a matter of following the law. I'm a big believer in following the law. So I'm just trying circumvent the law. Yeah. So at this point, the question is, if you are going to, as the law says, put statute and your ordinance, if you are voting to deny, you have to explain the specific provision that you're basing it on. What you just told me was you're not basing it on any specific provision. You just would rather we see that we wait till the staff.

Yeah. I guess, unfortunately, my feeble brain can't find it in 90,000 pages of planning. It's great. It's here. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with the plan. I it the the eight page 87, I think it's on, it states construction plan, the construction plans that were submitted, name of receiving waters, terminal hammock headwaters. The specifically, the fact that that lies in between US 1 And 95, that affects Florida shores. And then that's where the Mister Storch, for

the purpose of the hearing, I'm gonna ask you to take a seat so we can continue with the hearing.

All right. But that from a quasi judicial standpoint, I am making an objection for failing to do that because I don't believe this is a that's an arbitrary and capricious vote.

So the votes have been taken and it's been recorded, is that it?

Yes. Three to two to send a favorable recommendation Okay. To the city council for

Thank you, sir. Okay. Next item on the agenda, CU2501, request for conditional use permit to allow for manufacturing general within a B2 neighborhood business zoning district to establish a custom woodworking shop for crafting cabinets, tables and similar items for the property at 2421 Drive. Staff report, please.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The request before you is for a conditional use permit for the property at 2421 Guava Drive. City staff did send out public notice within 500 feet of the subject property with this aerial image showing the subject property. The applicant is currently undergoing the construction of a site plan for a warehousing building at 2421 Guava Drive.

The requested action is to allow a conditional use permit for manufacturing within B2 neighborhood business. The applicant is also requesting an extension of one year if approved for the conditional use permit to receive that certificate of occupancy on the building to allow for the transfer to the new owner who is putting the building under contract ahead of time. And he's asking for this conditional use permit to operate his business in that location. So the applicant is requesting the conditional use permit. The property is currently vacant.

However, it does have a development order and is beginning the construction process. A conditional use permit is required to operate a manufacturing business within B2 neighborhood business zoning district. The property does have a future land use designation of commercial. And it is B2 neighborhood business where we typically have a lot of warehouses and that sort of business within there in Guava and Hibiscus. Staff have reviewed the three sections within section 20 one-nine 204 for conditional use permits and found that the request is in compliance with the current requirements.

Staff have reviewed the current site plan and the adjacent land uses and found that it would be compatible with the other uses around it. Staff have no comments or objections from other departments and are recommending approval of the conditional use permit. The fire department did note that should this business occur in here that over 2,500 square feet would require sprinkling for the building. Permit addition would need to be to the current permit.

Was that something that would need to be added at the end?

No. As long as you granted the conditional permit, it still would be required Okay. Because it's Thank you.

You. Thank you, Ryan.

Okay. I open up the public hearing at this point. Is the applicant here? Would you please come to the mic and state your name and address, sir, and anything that you'd like us to hear?

No, sir. My name is Brian Smith. Reside at 843 South Cooper Street, New Smyrna Beach. And this sole intention of this warehouse is for my personal woodworking. I've been a woodworking junkie all my life, and I've outgrown every garage I've ever

Board. I that's

question.

I'll make the approval make a motion for approval for CU2501. Second. Do a I

second? I'll second. Thank you. Roll call, please.

Mr. Andrew Kovic?

Yes.

Mr. Hatcher?

Yes.

Mr. Duane?

Yes.

Mr. Fisher?

Yes.

Mr. McGinnis?

Yes.

Next item on the agenda, VA2512, request for variances for Article III and Article V to allow for front yard accessory structure carports size 22 feet by 22 feet for the property at 3,015 Queen Palm Drive. Staff report, please.

Thank you. City staff sent out public notice within 500 feet of the subject Included in that public notice was this aerial image of the subject property at 3015 Queen Palm Drive. The applicant is requesting the variances to build a carport on the existing property to protect their cars. The requested actions are from Article III Section 20 one-three 602 to allow a front yard accessory structure carport detached three feet from the primary structure. So that first variance is to allow an accessory structure in the front yard.

The second is from Article III, Section 20 one-three 602 ms to allow the accessory structure carport to be metal in lieu of the architectural design standards when it's over three fifty square feet Article five, table V1, to allow a 9.3 foot side yard setback in lieu of the required 10 foot side yard setback and then lastly, Article five, table V1, to allow a maximum build coverage of 32.8% due to the pool screen room and detached shed currently on the property. City staff did review the application against Article nine, Section twenty one one hundred point zero four and found that the applicant could not meet all six of the criteria of the land development code within this section. City staff are willing to go into depth on those questions should the board require them. Code did respond to city staff comments and found that it was incompatible with the surrounding neighborhood, that no hardship had been truly demonstrated, and potential quarter We of

We quarter of turn

the the

turn

over We would just like to protect our cars. We don't have a garage. The people who built the home closed in that place, they made it a bedroom. There's no the other option would be for me

to open it back up to

a garage. So that's why we want to just do a carport. And it's a 10 foot variance. The carport will sit 20 feet, four inches from the street. So it would be a 10 foot variance. Know you want I think it's 40 and you all require 30, so I'm at 20 with the carport in place on my driveway.

Thank you. You. Public comments. Are there any public comments on this item? Board comments? Are there board. I think I

a a 20 foot variance, question. Right? Is that's it 30 feet or 40 feet from the front? 30. 30. So 19.77. So no, that was, yeah, that was all I just making sure I'm reading that right because it's kind of typed in there a little funny. Making sure I am indeed reading that right.

Is it really offset to the right, though? It doesn't look like it's centered over the driveway. And wouldn't that increase the Ma'am, will you come

up for the board? That way.

The carport is if you're facing the house, the carport is on this edge of the driveway and we extended it over past that so it would be over the entire driveway. Because the driveway was a carport is a little bit bigger. There is a wing on there now. So it is totally on concrete.

But it's centered over the driveway?

It is lined up with the left edge of the driveway. It's not centered over the driveway because there is small lamp that's in the middle of the between the driveway and the sidewalk. There's a little lamp there, and I can't center the driveway over that.

Is this to build one or is this thing already sitting there?

It's to build a

I just want to yeah, this is the that's kind of what the airport is going look like.

Well, no, I know. The only reason I was questioning is because you're using words like it's sitting there now. No, I'm like in the future, it's going to be there. That's why I

was like, wait a minute. After the fact?

All right. So So it can't be moved to the left.

Yes, it's nine feet from the property line on the right side. It's nine feet, three inches.

And then I see you've got like it looks like there's like a little tick of a line to the right of the driveway. What is that going to be? Some type of an asphalt millings? Or are you going to expand the driveway over with concrete? I mean, the other thing here is if you've got a carport that's sitting three or four feet off the driveway, inherently, you're going to drive off the side of the driveway, right?

Actually, the wing here is a concrete. It's all concrete. Concrete.

The

wing is already there. It's a concrete wing. So the carport would be on top of all concrete and then mounted into the concrete for our storms that we the the

get

time

of

nine'three is to the edge of

the time carport. Right Yes. The picture of the car blocks out the driveway. Yeah.

I mean, and Google Earth blocked it out too, so. It's my opinion, it's a big structure to put in front of a house, truthfully. In all honesty. And I understand your hardship with garages no longer a garage. But putting something like this forward towards the road, it's something that I just I don't particularly care for the looks of it and it's not something we usually do. I

think, in fact, one was denied not too long ago.

That's just my opinion. Okay. Thank you very much. I So appreciate at this point, are there any other Board comments? I just need a motion for

I'll

make a motion to approve VA2512.

What's the motion?

I'm sorry, a motion to approve VA2512, the variance in the front yard accessory structure.

There is no second. So at this point, it Yes,

there should then be a motion to deny the variance request.

I'll make a motion to deny VA 2,512 variance to front yard accessory structure. Second.

Roll call, please. Now a yes is denial, right? Yes. Correct. Okay. I just want to make sure we've been through this before.

I know.

I know. But every time it happens, it's I just want to make Mr.

Andrew Kovic?

Yes.

Mr. Hatcher?

Yes.

Mr. Duane? Yes. Mr. Fisher?

Yes.

Mr. McGinnis?

Yes.

Thank you.

The variance is denied.

Yes, variance

is denied.

Thank you. Next item on the agenda is VA 2,513, request for variance from Article five to allow for 10 foot landscape buffer in lieu of a 15 foot required to accommodate a larger structure and parking area for the property of 191.

Thank you, Chairman. The applicant is requesting a variance from Article five to allow for a 10 foot landscape buffer width in lieu of the 15 foot wide landscape buffer width. City staff did send out public notice within 500 feet of the subject property with the aerial image attached in the public notice. We did not receive any comments from any of the surrounding property owners. So per Article five, table B3, the side yard landscape buffer is required to be 15 feet in width.

The applicant is requiring for a 10 foot width. This is the proposed site plan for the I-one Industrial Lot. City staff did review the application against Article nine, Section 20 one-100.04, non administrative variance of the city of Edgewater's Land Development Code, and found that the applicant could not meet all six of the criteria. City staff do not recommend approval for VA two thousand five hundred thirteen.

Okay. Thank you, Ryan. Okay. Is the applicant here? Please come to the microphone and state your name and address and tell us your story.

Rebecca Caudle, Zev Cohen and Associates, 300 Interchange Boulevard, Suite C, Ormond Beach, Florida 32174. I am representing the current owner and the developer of the property. We are requesting this variance just to reduce the landscape buffer only on the north and south sides by five feet to accommodate a building that is wide enough to accommodate the parking of an RV and to accommodate a parking lot with a turning radius that could also accommodate a large vehicle. As of now, there is an existing drainage structure on the east side in the rear yard that is used for conveyance. This will not count towards the future development stormwater management area.

So an additional 15% of the site will be dedicated to stormwater. So this reduces the building envelope further. We are not proposing any changes to the front yard or the landscape buffer there. And I'm available for any questions, as is the developer.

Okay. Let's see what the public has to say if they have any questions. At this point, are there any comments from the public on this item?

Agnes Witter, 223 Flagler Avenue. I'm just wondering if this is a site plan for construction or if this is just covering the downsizing of what they need to do. If it is construction and there's going to be a pond down the area and it sits right in front of the ditch that my ditch in my neighborhood needs to empty our rainwater out of, and it's gonna cause a problem. I live on Adele Street at Flagler Avenue, and I have a ditch that runs through my yard from east to west, It comes underneath Flagler Avenue, runs down the rest through Adele. Outfall is onto the city property, at the edge of the city property.

And then the ditch that runs behind this property is where our water goes to our rainwater to run out into the canal that takes it to the river. And we flood every time there's a storm. And this is going to impact us because you're going to have cement covering an area that was open. So this is going to displace water. That's going to go into the ditch and it's going to infect all the houses on my street.

So I'd like to know if this is going to be a construction site or is this just for some greenery?

Thank you. Want to address that? Brian, do you want to handle that?

Yeah. So the variance before us today is a request in the reduction in the width of the landscape buffer yard. It's not a reduction in the number of plantings. It's just a reduction in the width. The intent behind it is, yes, Ms.

Whittaker, to eventually apply for a site plan that staff would review for the code requirements of the city's land development code. This is on straight this is straight zone I1. So they would be following the I1 zoning district. Their request here right now is they under the I1 zoning district, when city staff updated the landscape buffers throughout the city, we made them much denser and we made them a little bit wider. Part of that though was the intent of trying to reduce building setbacks from adjacent residential and balancing both aesthetics, security and the such.

So that is what the request is right now.

Right. Can you address the young ladies'

Yes, can. My name is Chris Rollins. My address is 123 Via Capri, New Smyrna Beach, 32169. I am the applicant. I'm actually trying to purchase this property to develop it.

And what I'm asking for is consideration on an industrial zone property that the landscaping requirements should not be the constricting requirement on an industrial property from side to side. Building setbacks under the city code are 10 feet for industrial properties. The landscaping setback is 15 feet. So that adds an additional burden onto this piece of property. As to the drainage and that canal, that canal actually sits on this property.

And the city enjoys conveyance of water through this property and there is currently no recorded easement that allows the city to use this property or to rely on the conveyance of that water. I'm not planning to change that. I am planning to add another pond onto the property to hold all of the water that is required by this development before it drains into my ditch that then runs through the city system. I think it's at least for me, I would be adding potentially some woodshop space, But it does restrict on a 125 foot wide lot. You don't think that 10 feet of additional landscape buffer means a whole lot.

That's almost 10%

of the width of

the property. It does affect especially when it is an industrial zone property with industrial on both sides.

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Are there any other public comments on this project? Seeing no other public comments, are there any board comments on this project?

So what's the intent, the purpose of the building? Are you going to is it for your personal use or are you going to rent out RV space?

It is, first and foremost, is for my personal use so that I've got some place for all of my stuff. But I do intend to lease other spaces for light industrial uses, potential storage for other folks that have big toys that they want to get out of the weather in the corrosive environment.

Well, toward the area where this building is proposed because I saw the four sales sign and you're very inside, by the way. Thank you. At one point, I didn't see it the first time through, but I saw it. I commend you because right now, it's doing nothing for the city. And you're coming in with a proposal to build something to contribute to the tax base of the city and to make it a better looking area.

And I believe what you described as far as your water retention makes sense. And I hope that the young lady doing. Positive approach.

The only other and going back off

of what he said. So the building setback is 10 feet, but somehow we have a landscape buffer of 15 feet?

Yes. When I in the landscape buffer So

we planted a tree in the It

was very quick job.

Got you. That

was when we did the local code update.

I hate to see a commercial project go down because of a tree or something or a plant. Walls are not enough space for the tree.

So if you put some just green space on the inside of the warehouse, you're golden. You got it.

Perfect. I'll do it.

You're good

to go.

Would like to clarify, there will still be a 10 foot landscape buffer on either side.

We're not

asking to eliminate it. No, I understand that. Understand that. Very good. Thank you. Any other board comments?

I just have one quick question. According to the picture that, are those large trees or are they any kind of historic or conservative trees?

They are not.

Because I physically haven't been by there yet.

No, there's two trees on that lot and they are not specimen trees.

Okay. Thank you. They're not.

I drive past it every day. It will be

a nice addition to the area. Yes. Okay. At this point, closing the public comments and the Board comments. I need a motion for this item.

Motion to approve VA 2513.

Second. I'll second. I'll

second. Who

is the second?

Patrick. The woodworking thing, I chose. Roll call, please.

Mr. Andrew Kovic?

Yes.

Mr. Hatcher?

Yes.

Mr. Duane? Yes. Mr. Fisher? Yes. Mr. McGinnis?

Yes. Next item on the agenda, VA2514, request for variance from Article five and Good luck, sir. Five and seven to demolish and replace the concurrent nonconforming structure within the grandfathered setbacks, but with modification to continue the nonconforming front yard east corner setback for the property of 125 Rio Vista Drive. Staff report, please.

Thank you, Chairman. City staff did send out public notice within 500 feet of the subject property and placed the public notice placard on the subject property. The proposed use is to demolish the current nonconforming structure and replace it with a new, brand new home, approximately 2,000 square feet. There are a number of variances to go through this. And I'm going to kind of take my time because this one's a little bit more complicated than our typical variances.

So the requested actions before us today and this is kind of the current survey and the layout of the House. The Article V, Table V1, is to allow a nonconforming structure to be built on a nonconforming parcel. Since this parcel is zoned R3, it requires a 75 by 115 square foot lot. Article V, Table V1, to allow a north side of the parcel setback of 22.2 feet in lieu of the 30 feet requirement. Article five table B1 to allow an east side front porch, size six feet by eight inches, to be placed property line and front side of the house in lieu of the 30 foot requirement.

Article seven, Section 2,171.02 is to allow for expansion of a demolished non conforming structure, thereby encroaching further into the non conformity. And then Article VII, Section 2,171.04 to allow for a non conforming site dimensions and requirements. And lastly, Article VII, Section 2,171.04 gs to allow for the reconstruction of the structure after it has been demolished. If you recall in the non conforming section, the grandfather section of it, if you destroy something, you lose it forever. So part of this variance is that request that she's asking for these variances even after the structure is gone.

So in a certain way, I guess we could have just written as the variances I thought for the purpose of clarity for the variance, it's important that we note that this structure is allowed to be if the board does approve it, it is allowed to be destroyed. It is allowed to be at these setbacks that were once grandfathered or are still grandfathered. Okay. So the applicant is requesting this variance to demolish a previously grandfathered nonconforming structure and to replace the structure with a modified setback to continue from the east side of the property to the west side of the current primary structure. This will enable the applicant to place a better centered new home on the lot.

This is kind of what the applicant is intending to do. City staff did review against Article nine Section non administrative variance of the City of Edgewater's Land Development Code. After reviewing Article nine, Section 21.100, city staff found that the applicant could not meet all six of the criteria. Staff will note that code enforcement does recommend approval of the variance. However, city staff in planning and zoning do not recommend the approval for variance VA 2514 because the applicant could not meet all six of the criteria within Article

important I that's point. That's and address and your case. Yes.

Kathy Hoffman. I live at 211 Knob Hill Circle in Longwood. But I bought this property. The house was built in 1946. So I thought from the get go that both of the houses together only have about 1,000 square feet of living area together.

So they're separated on the property. I think one was used by the previous owner as a rental property. So the front little house just has about 500 square feet. And then there's the garage. What we want to be able to do is replace that eventually with a more symmetrical structure, something really nice on that property.

I don't want a huge house. I don't intend to encroach on this setback. I don't really want to. Probably the garage would be setback anyway. But this site plan was to maximize, you know, try to maximize the area so that we could have some elbow room to plan a beautiful home there.

So that's what I'm trying to do is just to have something symmetrical. Right now, if we built according to the way the buildings are built, it would jut back and it could not be built. You'd have corners that are not 90 degrees, right? And so that's not what we want to do. That's why we're really doing that, asking for the variance.

So you're just taking three structures and making one big one, right, basically?

I don't really especially want to fill in that whole area, but I'm not interested in a rental property and a separate property. So it will probably be all one piece, but maybe a garage at the very back. And the garage, I don't want a real short driveway, so the garage is going to be set back. I just don't want it to I want it to have some symmetry to it from the front of the house. The house next door looks very pretty on the property. I want this one too, too. And so that's what I'm looking for.

Very good. Thank you. I appreciate

it. Are

there any comments in the audience for this project? Okay. Please, sir, would you come to the microphone, state your name and address? And Kathy, if you just kind of have a seat in the front if you have any questions. Yes, sir.

So Darren Del Rosario, 116 Naranga Drive. I would be most affected by the building there. So what I needed to find out is, was it going to be a two story house? The property was never a rental. The person that was there had her son living in one house, and she was in the other.

So it was never a rental that was being used. So I'm trying to find talking about raising the elevation of the land itself because we've never flooded. My family's owned the house next door since 1976 when my grandfather bought it new. So I just I'm need to find out how close it's going to be to our property, if it's going to be where it is right now, and that if it's two stories. Because my property or the house we have is nine fifty square feet. So this is going to be double the size of my house. So what I worry about is two story house or too close to my property going the other way. That rainwater would affect the flooding in the house at all.

Brian, you want to handle that one?

Or you want to

Yeah.

So the land development code allows in almost all our residential districts up to 26 feet in height. So by right, they would be allowed to build up to two stories if they wanted to build a two story house. That's not something that I can tell them they can't do that.

That's the only

thing they have. Just as you would have the right to demolish the house and build a two story house. As far as the applicant is not requesting building or impervious. So regardless with the lot size that they have, they still will have to meet those requirements on-site for the proposed development because they're not asking for variances from those waivers. So 30 max building coverage. So it likely could be a two story house because of that 30%. But that constraint in and of itself is a pretty good provision for protecting you from overdevelopment of the site that could have negative impacts on runoff adjacent to you.

Okay. So that's basically what I'm worried about. So I don't know if she's going be able to tell me if it's a two story house or not, or if it's just going to be Yeah.

The staff don't have plans yet, this is kind of the first step for her to really, if she can even legally demo it and then rebuild the house, right?

Okay.

That's kind

of rebuild the house in the non conforming footprint that it is today.

Right. And I understand the way it was designed. That's my question. Thank you. Thank

you, sir. Any other comments from the audience? Any other public comments? Board comments?

How many square feet is this lot? I'm not doing the pi r squared for this radius, so somebody needs to tell me. 44,400 square feet times 0.22.

Yeah, think it's zero point I have it as 0.2.

So roughly couple a of

floor. To

So the actual the sketch that you currently have drawn there is 3,589. So the sketch is significantly big. It can't be that big.

Okay.

I think the point of the sketch was to show you where those setbacks are in relation to sides and front end. Got you. So if it's going to

be small, it could be setbacks could be I was going to say it.

Yes. Mean, could be

bigger. But chances are, if she stated she was going to move the garage further back, it's probably going to be pushing that 10.

Well, but I mean, one of the variances though is the front port. But the reality is she's not able to get that close to the street anyway. I mean, not to stay in the 2,664. I mean, that's there's a 900 square foot difference between this blue box and what she can actually build right now.

Miss, can you come to the mic just so that everyone else

Okay. Can

You see the front corner of the blue box? That's the existing house right there, the front corner. And what I'm asking is to keep the setback the same all the way along the sidewalk so it's perpendicular to the sidewalk.

Okay.

Okay, rather than jut in. And then if we built something else, then the angles would be wrong. We can extend a little bit further to the inside of the lot and still keep the 10 foot setback from our neighbor's property line. So what I'm really asking is just to keep that perpendicular to the sidewalk. As far as the house plan goes, I'm not going to fill in that whole space, but I want to be square to it.

I don't want to have odd angles on a new house. I'm not going to fill in that whole I don't want a big house like that. But I do want to be able to build a symmetrical structure. That's all I'm asking.

I just did the math. So if she held the the 17 foot corner, which would be the south northeast corner, kept a 37 foot depth, that's going to put her at 72 foot overall house and right now she's got 95, 97 foot there. So I mean you're talking 25 feet less. So that rear that this what would be the west setback at 10 almost becomes, yeah. Sure. Right.

Provide for the neighbor.

Well, that's kind of what I was that's where I was going with is if we gave her the 17 feet, I mean, we can't really I mean, foot side setback is 10 foot side setback. Based on the 30%, she's going to be about 30 feet from that property line on the west ish as long as she holds to the 17 feet

the east. Sorry.

Doing a lot of math and site plans.

Well, mine is more geometry. Mean, look at that and I see what's there now. And I just see everything's kind of

wacky I built an addition on a house two doors away from me. You're preaching to the choir.

Uh-huh. Yeah. I assure you that I don't want to fill up the lot. We just have I spent a fortune trying to get the brush cleared from that lot, we just got it finished yesterday. So it's just I love it. I love the little town. Want to have a nice place here. So I'm just asking to be able to build it right. That's all I'm doing.

Are there any other Board comments? Ryan, would we add? What you're talking about is If

you wanted to push it, you

That's wouldn't make what I'm saying.

So that's what I was going to say. So in the motion, could I, in theory, say that Well, right now, what does it have to be?

Well, that would pull it away from that.

Well, it would be the side setback, wouldn't it?

Yes.

West setback. Well, so that's what I was going to say is if I made part of the motion to where she has to hold corner, the northeast corner at its current point, that pretty much sets the tone for the rest of Everything is She's got to stay inside of 2664 square feet. Yes. Okay. That's I was trying to figure out the easiest way to make it clean. So ma'am, what I'm referring to is basically where that current corner is sitting, that northeast corner is sitting on the current house, which is what you retain you wanted to hold.

Upper right. Upper right.

Yes. So what I'm basically what I'm saying is if you held your new home to that same corner, it's going to give you more space on the west side of the house. Because you're only allowed to build 30% of that property. And by square footage, you'd either have to make it really skinny or if you hold 37 foot of depth, you can only build 72 feet of length.

Yes. I lost you.

I know. Because that's the total square footage I could use?

Yes. You're allowed up to 2,664 square feet.

My main concern is staying parallel to the sidewalk.

Right. Okay.

Okay. And having a rectangular rather than what is that rhomsoid or something else? Rhombus? Yes. So I don't want a rhombus. I want rectangular. And so that's what I'm asking.

Okay. All right. Any other board comments? Thanks, Chris. All right. So I'd like to have a motion for this item.

You think it out, Chris? Let me think it out.

Just as a suggestion, I would just say as written and then whatever you wanted to hold to. That way, you don't have to read Okay.

Already on that page. Okay. Figured that. Make a motion to approve variance VA2514 as written with the conditions that the northeast corner of the new structure be at the same location of the northeast corner of the existing structure. That front porch be no nearer than 17.4 feet, I think that is, to the property line. Okay. That will help. That sets her basically a starting Very good.

And that's going to let me stay?

Yes. Thank

you so much. All

right. Roll call, please.

Mr. Andrew Kovich?

Yes.

Mr. Hatcher?

Yes.

Mr. Duane?

Yes.

Mr. Fisher?

Yes.

Mr. McGinnis?

Yes.

Only thing you're showing the audience, and I meant to bring this up before. Sorry. That's right. So do you have a timeline on when you're because you know that this is only good for twenty four months. Yes, the two years. Okay. I just it didn't sound like you had any house plans or anything like that. So I was like, I don't know if she knows how long it's going to take. That's all. I just wanted to make sure you did know that it's two years.

Okay. The next item on the agenda is VA twenty five sixteen, request for variance from Article five to allow a reduced planting requirement for the property at 1824 Hibiscus Drive. Staff report, please.

Thank you, Chairman. City staff did send out public notice within 500 feet of the subject with this aerial map attached. The staff also put out the yellow postcard or Placard. Placard thank you, snipe sign showing the public notice. The applicant is requesting from Article five table V three and V 4 to allow for a six foot high fence with six shade trees with a minimum height of 12 feet and 67 native shrubs with a minimum height of 24 feet.

A Class B landscape buffer is required at the rear, and a Class A landscape buffer is required on either side of the property. A Class B landscape buffer has a minimum width of 20 feet with five canopy trees per 100 linear feet, 10 understory trees per 100 linear feet, and the placement of 60 struts per 100 linear feet, as well as a six foot high fence. The applicant is requesting their own landscape buffer for the subject property. This is the proposed landscape buffer with the proposed addition to the subject current building. It's about a 1,300 square foot addition on here.

City staff did review the application against Article nine, Section 21.100.04, non administrative variance of the City of Edgewater's Land Development Code, and found that the applicant could not meet all six criteria. City staff will be happy to go over any of the six criteria. I will note that fire and code enforcement both recommended approval, citing that an addition of landscaping would be an improvement. That does not recommend approval for VA256. Okay.

I'll open up the public hearing. Is the applicant in the audience? Please come to the microphone and state your name and address and tell us your story.

Hunter is actually the applicant, but I'm Danny. I'm representing the

pool. Okay.

So, 1225

Volcker Road, Edgewater, Florida. Hi, neighbor. I had a quick question, Ryan, because I wasn't sure. Somebody told me, which is irrelevant, we're still gonna do landscape and all that. Somebody told me that the new code that was written was for like big developers from Indian River to US 1 and then from like Guava Drive all the way down for that new code. Is that correct or incorrect?

No. I mean, it covers everything.

All the shores?

Everyone. Like even on your proposed parking. I'm going add something on here right now. On the proposed parking, he would need a variance on the parking requirement. He's proposing on street parking in the addition. And the code now requires against any parking space in the city a 10 foot landscape. And that was added to provide, again, more protection. But again, the code was meant to be tough, and it was meant to be dense. If it's dense, it's expensive. So it just requires more planning.

But does this go does it affect this project?

Yeah. He's asking for a variance from the landscape.

Okay. Well, and then the parking part comes in because he doesn't have there's no way he's gonna meet the parking without having because on street he probably needs what? Eight spaces?

I think was it

Might have been more than that.

10? Nine or 10,

Ryan? Yeah.

It was kind of like a mix up and we were all like, crap, how did this happen? Let's work together and fix it.

What did the Jeffs say?

They they we all said, crap, let's figure out what we got to do, So you we're trying to, you know We want to meet like code and all that. Basically, what I was telling Ryan, when we had all that concrete in the back, we got over 1,300 square feet of concrete. I don't know like the exact measurements, but I'm like, at least we're giving some of the like impervious back or what, you know, giving some credit back to the city, taking a lesser amount. Because if I just rebuilt on that concrete slab, it would look trashy. You know, it would be out of place.

We're just adding to the back of the building and just taking what we already have, put it in the back of the building. And that's why I was kind of like, you know, I don't mind doing landscape, making it look good, meeting some sort of codes. But then I was like, it's kind of excessive with two forty two foot tall shrubs. And my argument I know everybody needs me to code. My argument is I already have the concrete there and I'm giving some back and making it better. So really I feel I could say, hey, I shouldn't have to do any landscape or any improvements, but I want to and I want to you know what I mean? Get back and do something. Know?

Let me just step back so that give the board some edification. So Mr. Danny Shields has the ability he has a pad already on-site, had a site plan for the site in the past, he can reissue a building for his area that was once there. Part of this, too, is the site is rather non conforming. And even when we didn't update the landscape buffers beforehand, the site really didn't have really the width to accommodate that based on the existing conditions. So it's one of those things, too, that the city staff have to recommend denial.

Right.

The only way that staff can change anything from when the code is, is if we do a PUB agreement. However, that process is expensive and extremely lengthy. That's why Mr. Shilms has come from the various.

The pad is already there, but the building portion of it is not? Correct.

Okay.

Yeah. Like there was already a nasty building and for safety reasons, we just took it down real quick. But we already had like this huge concrete just already there and I'm like, it looks trashy. I don't want to rebuild there and have people walking over there. So we just want to take that, put it at the back of the building, which we got the Okay on that or whatever. And we're actually going to give square footage back to the city with what we are if this is our square, we're going to give them some more and let them have that. Because it'll take sidewalks and stuff out and other things, and then it'll just be right against the back and it'll look clean, not all weird. Two buildings on one property is kind of silly, I think.

You're not physically giving property back to the city. You're just converting it from pervious to emperor.

Yes, sir. Yep.

My

question was how do you deal with the parking? I mean, do you put parking?

He has to conform the city city is in the process of creating an on street parking detail that he would then have to build the city standard because it would be in our right of way and then it would be given to the city. So he would have the ability to build that, but it would be public parking. It's on street public parking in the building. Now the intent would be the patrons there would use it. But obviously, if Circle K is blowing up for some reason,

people could

Yeah. They can use it.

It's y'all's.

We don't own it. It's y'all's. We understand that.

So the pad that's there now that had something on it but you tore that down, so the pad's still there, right?

Yes.