City Council - Regular Meeting

Welcome, everyone. You have made it to Tuesday, September 15th. Thank you for joining us. Meeting is now called to order. Melody, let's do roll call.

Council Member Brandon Whedon. Present. Council Member Angela Jefferson. Present. Council Member Joan Cathy. Present. Council Member Eileen Swarthout. Present. Council Member Megan Sullivan.

Present.

Council Member Peter Agave.

Present.

Council Member Kelly Von Holtz.

And Council Member Von Holtz is excused.

And Mayor Lieta Dahlhoff.

And I am still here. Please join us in the Pledge of Salute. Pledge of Salute. Thank you everyone. We are on to special items. Our first proclamation for this evening is a week without driving October 1st to the 8th, 2026. And we have council member Whedon who's going to read that proclamation.

Whereas the Week Without Driving was established in 2021 in Washington State by Disability Mobility Initiative of Disability Rights Washington. So those who have the option to drive can learn firsthand about barriers and challenges that non-drivers face. and whereas mobility is a fundamental part of health, safety, and community connection, and whereas non-drivers, including aging adults, youth, students, low-income individuals, people with physical, mental, intellectual, or developmental disabilities, and people who prefer not to drive, and whereas a third of people residing in Washington State do not have a driver's license, And whereas the US Bureau of Labor Statistics estimates the cost of owning a car is approximately 82 cents per mile with the average household spending of more than 12,000 a year in 2024. And whereas improvements in walking and bike paths in Tumwater improves mobility for residents who cannot or do not drive to get around to visit family and friends. and take care of everyday tasks, and whereas transportation represents the second largest greenhouse gas emissions source in Thurston County, which we must reduce to meet our city, region, and state greenhouse gas emissions reduction goals, and whereas going a week without driving provides an opportunity to gain live experience to understand how we can meet the needs of all Tumwater residents. Now, therefore, Lieta Dalhoff, Mayor of the City of Tumwater, does hereby proclaim October 1st through the 8th, 2026, a week without driving, and encourages all people in the City of Tumwater to participate in the week without driving. Signed in the City of Tumwater, Washington, and recognized on the 15th day of September in the year 2026.

Thank you, Council Member Whedon. We have some special guests from People First of Washington to accept the proclamation and say some words.

Hello, I'm Ivanova Smith, president of the Thurston County People First Chapter, and we're a chapter of people with intellectual and developmental disabilities. This proclamation is so important to us because many of our members cannot drive. and rely on public transit, rely on our crosswalks, rely on other ways of transportation that's not driving. And so it's really important that we make that accessible for all people, that we make it safe for people to not be able to drive. One thing we have done, and I encourage people to check out, is we made some YouTube videos of spreading awareness about crosswalk safety. for many of our non-driver members who use a lot of crosswalks and walk a lot of places. We really want to try to advocate crosswalk safety. And now I want to give a chance for some of my members to come up and say a couple of words. Alan, would you like to come up?

OK.

I'm Alan. I'm Sergeant of Arms with our chapter. And we did a safety thing about crossing the crosswalk with our vests on to have cars stop. Because one time we were coming back from home with my friend, and we almost got hit by a car.

Can you go to the microphone? People online can hear you.

If you guys know where Grocery Island, Dollar Tree on the west side is, that crosswalk, we were almost halfway. Then this woman just come up quickly and was like, Like, I don't have to stop for you and stuff. And plus, I want to say is, if you guys can get your counterparts in Olympia, city council and mayor, to try to contact our safety officer. He's not here right now, but he's probably on his way and stuff. Yeah, I just want to see if you guys can get your counterparts in Olympia, city council and mayor, to give them a call and stuff, too, because we need to talk to them, too, and stuff. It's like, yeah. It's like my advisor, my chapter president says, like, just any time when you are at home or after this, go on YouTube and stuff and look it up. I love that. Our safety videos.

And thank you for that feedback.

I'm Mark. I'm the treasurer for the chapter, and I'm the region's sixth rep on the state board.

Mark, one, you're a rock star. Two, we have a three cities and county meeting coming up this Friday. And our city administrator just wrote that down for an agenda item to tell Mayor Payne.

Thank you.

So thank you, Mark. Sir, can we move the mic? We should have a hand free.

Oh, maybe it can go low enough for me. This is good, I think. Can you hear me? Yeah, we can. My name is Emily Rogers. I have lived actually in Lacey for 20 years. 20 years now, weirdly. I can't believe it's been that long. But I would just say that if you could encourage the mayor of Lacey as well. Okay. We're trying to just educate everyone and help folks to understand that Getting around by alternate means other than driving a car is something that many, many people, even if you don't do it today, you might do it in your future or someone you love might not be able to drive. And so to make it more accessible and available to everyone is a really good thing. thing to think about and plan for so that everyone feels welcome to get out in the community and participate in everyday life. It's a it's a big piece of what makes cities successful and that you want to live there. So thank you very much. We appreciate your support and we continue to do work on particularly on crosswalks. So thank you so much.

Thank you, Emily, for coming. So Administrator Simmons, we also have a message for Mayor Ryder.

We are happy to deliver those messages on Friday at noon.

Tomar is actually hosting that meeting, so they're coming here. So thank you. Are you open to any comments from council? You want to open it up to council?

uh council member swarthout um i've recognized like we all went on a walk last november october yeah in the dark right she's shaking her head we did i was part of our comp plan and we were uh you guys you were so generous to uh share your time that uh to come with us and so it was very eye-opening it it really was and i i learned a lot from um from your team here that that came along so we had uh community development joined us and then also the sustainability person and you guys pointed out the things that we really do need to look for. So I appreciate that. Thank you.

Any other council members, council member Jefferson.

Yes. Thank you for showing up today and representing your community. I appreciate that. And focusing on crosswalks, because there's a lot of accidents that happen in crosswalks. So I see you're wearing that bright orange vest, and that helps with visibility at day and night. And I also saw that you had a whole bunch of vests in the back of a car when I pulled up. Okay, for when you guys go up. Okay. Thank you, thank you for that education, educating the public. I appreciate you for showing up.

So for those online who can't hear our great guests, they're talking about a flyer that we can print and post and also YouTube videos. And so I'm also looking at our communications director, Jason, who already wrote it down, already gave a thumbs up. And by the time you leave it, probably already be posted. Yeah.

Yeah. Thank you.

Administrator Simmons, we have a joint meeting with the school district on October 8th. Let's add that. Flyers, YouTube videos, we're on it. Yeah. Yeah. All right, so Jason also, thoughts, connections with news outlet medias, maybe our communications director. Yeah. All right, Jason. Jason's got it down. Jason's got it. Jason knows everybody.

Thanks.

Thank you so much. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Any, also, Council Member Agabi.

So, thank you for coming. For the many runabout in town, has that made traffic pattern more easier or difficulty for you guys?

So for those online, the response was sometimes it's difficult to know where to cross. Administrator Simmons, can we make a note for that for Brandon Hicks with transportation?

Thank you.

Because we've talked about that with visual aids, lights, physical barriers, objects, and that has been an ongoing discussion. So that is great feedback and the timing is perfect. Not where you wanted to go. Great feedback.

Emily, you were going to say something? If it's darker or if it's getting dark, it's really hard to see where the walking path is.

so lights would help so double asterisks administrator simmons for brandon hicks it's great feedback emily thank you Right. Thank you, Emily. Thank you, Ivanova. Council Member Cathy, did you want to add anything before we take a group photo with our special guests? No. Are you all open if we come down and take a photo with you of where you're at? So we'll just, we can go to them. So we don't, yeah, we'll go to you. So stay, we're going to come down.

Proud.

Thank you so much.

Thank you again for coming. While our guests transition out, we'll have our next proclamation peeps come in. we're going to move on to fire prevention week the week of october 4th through the 10th as we stare at firefighters coming into the room welcome don't be shy don't hang out in the corner as you all walk in councilmember sullivan will be reading the proclamation

Whereas the city of Tumwater is committed to ensuring the safety and security of all those living in and visiting our city, and whereas many of the devices in our daily lives, phones, tablets, tools, toys, e-bikes, and scooters, to name a few, run on rechargeable lithium ion batteries, which store high amounts of energy in a small space, And whereas if batteries are damaged or charged incorrectly, they can overheat, start a fire, or even explode. And whereas the National Fire Protection Association reports an increase in battery-related fires, underscoring the need for public education on the safe use of lithium-ion batteries. And whereas properly charging devices can significantly reduce the risk of fires and associated hazards. Use the cord and charge the charger that came with your device or one approved by the manufacturer. Using the wrong charger can damage the battery and increase the risk of fire. And whereas, charge devices on a table, desk, or other hard, flat surface. Do not charge them on beds, couches, or under pillows. Devices and chargers can produce heat during normal charging. Soft surfaces can trap heat and block airflow, which can cause the battery to overheat. Whereas, unplug your device when it is fully charged. Do not leave it plugged in longer than needed. Leaving a device plugged in too long can increase heat and stress on the battery. And whereas the 2026 Fire Prevention Week theme, Charge into Fire Safety, Safe Charging is a Superpower, serves to focus on lithium-ion batteries to better educate the public about how to buy, charge, and dispose of them safely. Now, therefore, Lieta Dahlhoff, Mayor of the City of Tumwater, does hereby proclaim the week of October 4, 2026, to October 10, 2026, Fire Prevention Week and urges residents and businesses in Tumwater to heed these messages and support the efforts of Tumwater Fire Department and other emergency services to keep us safe from fires in times of medical emergencies.

Thank you, Council Member Sullivan. We have Chief Hurley. What would you like to share with us? Does everyone also want to speak?

Yeah, they've all got their speeches ready.

Fantastic, fantastic.

Well, thank you, Mayor and Councilmembers. I think the proclamation really spelled out the points we're trying to make this week, or this coming Fire Prevention Week. And really, we really have events throughout the entire month. And we'll have some social media as well to emphasize these points. So I just want to take a couple minutes here tonight, really, to talk about Fire Prevention Week in general and how it all started. It's the longest-running public health and safety observance in the U.S., was established to commemorate the Great Chicago Fire, which began on October 8, 1871. The fire killed over 250 people, left 100,000 homeless, and destroyed over 17,000 structures. On the 40th anniversary, the Fire Marshals Association decided to mark that date with public education rather than festivities. In 1920, President Wilson issued the first proclamation for Fire Prevention Day. And then in 1922, the National Fire Protection Association began sponsoring the public observance and expanded it to a full week. So thank you again for us. Historically, in October, we get calls from the schools. We have schools we've gone to every year, classrooms we go to every year, and try to get out and educate our youth on fire prevention and fire safety. So with that, thank you very much.

Thank you, Chief. Any comments, questions, compliments from Council?

Council Member Sullivan. Thank you for keeping our community safe.

You're welcome. I learned something new. I didn't know about the danger of batteries. I won't leave my cell phone plugged in at night next to my head, my pillow. That's what I was chuckling about.

Good to know. That's the recommendation.

Anyone else have life lessons that we just learned? You are today years old when you learned. No, do you want me to make this more uncomfortable? Just wait a little bit longer? Okay. Are you open to doing a photo op?

Yes, they are.

Wow, just like, no, just thank you, chief. If you could all just awkwardly come and stand up here, we're going to take a photo. okay well i've been told all right Why is it that everyone leaves after the proclamation? I don't wanna stay for the rest of the meeting. Melody, we are on to public comment.

okay at this time we will receive public comments you may comment on items relating to city business not scheduled for public hearing when i call your name please come up to the podium speak into the microphone and state your name and contact information for the record each individual will be limited to one three minute period to make their remarks regardless of the number of topics they wish to address Speakers may not comment upon, promote, advocate for, oppose, or speak against a pending initiative, ballot measure, or candidate. All comments shall be directed towards the council as a whole, not to individual council members, and not to members of the audience. Please refrain from disruptive behavior such as booing, hissing, audible comments, cheering, or clapping. And this evening, we have one person in chambers and one online. Would you like to start with in chambers first? So I have a Christine Fergoa. I'm not, Fergus. Oh, I've missed the S, I apologize.

Good evening. My name is Christine Fergus. I am here representing my union UFCW Local 367. We are the United Food and Commercial Workers. I have worked as a cashier in this county in this community as well as been an active union member for the past decade. I am currently serving as a vice president on our executive board, which brings me here tonight. I have given you all a copy, which is the resolution of support from our union local, which in support of the Home Energy Score, which states, UFCW Local 367 resolution supporting local government adoption of Home Energy Score Ordinance. whereas climate change is the greatest threat to all humanity. And urgent action is necessary to protect people from its unavoidable consequences and to prevent even more catastrophic damage by drastically reducing our greenhouse gas emissions. And whereas working people are often on the front lines of climate-related crises and disasters, including vector-borne diseases, extreme weather, energy outages, supply chain disruptions leading to price increases, and food insecurity. And whereas next to the recent dramatic increases in home prices, energy costs are one of the most significant financial stressors for working and low-income people. And whereas UFCW Local 367 represents working people and is committed to improving the economic security, health, and quality of life of workers and their families throughout our communities. And whereas it is essential that regional climate action, as outlined in the Thurston Climate Mitigation Plan, be founded on principles of environmental justice, and this includes affordable energy bills. And whereas home energy efforts, energy efficiency disclosure, help ensure that new homebuyers selecting an energy-efficient home with affordable energy costs and whereas sustainable and climate staff members of Olympia, Tumwater, Lacey and Thurston County have drafted a model resident energy performance rating and disclosure ordinance for consideration by their respective elected bodies and whereas This ordinance represents a significant first step toward reducing costs for working people and reducing greenhouse gas emissions in Thurston County. And whereas the Olympia City Council and the Thurston Board of County Commissioners has adopted this ordinance. Now, therefore, it be resolved that the UFCW Local 367 supports the model residential energy performance rating and disclosure ordinance currently under consideration by the cities of Lacey and Tumwater. And we urge the city councils of Lacey and Tumwater to adopt this ordinance as soon as possible. Signed, Michael Hines, UFCW Local 367 President.

Thank you, Christine.

Thank you. I appreciate your time and your attention.

And now we'll go to online. And we have an Andra Weddington, which you have now been allowed to speak.

Okay, did I just get the right button? Yes. Okay, thank you. My name is Andra Weddington. I'm a member of Olympia Friends Meeting, and I'm here as a representative of the meeting with a letter, which I emailed to the mayor and council. You should have received a copy of that, and I would like to read that letter. Two City Council members of Tumwater from Olympia Friends meeting dated 11 September 2026, subject Residential Energy Performance Rating and Disclosure Ordinance, the Home Energy Score Ordinance. As Quakers, our testimonies or spiritual principles include community and stewardship. These testimonies call us to work to improve the material living conditions of everyone in our community while protecting the earth as the source of all giving resources needed for the survival and thriving of humankind. As a measure that will help homebuyers reduce energy costs while encouraging the reduction of harmful emissions that are destroying life-sustaining conditions around the world, The Olympia Friends meeting strongly supports the residential energy performance rating and disclosure ordinance and urges you to adopt it. Home energy efficiency assessments equip home buyers with information so that they may make more informed choices. An energy efficient home, whether new construction or a home that's been improved, reduces costs for working people and reduces the greenhouse gas emissions generated in Thurston County. Home energy assessments advance equity with costs for the assessment borne by the seller. Subsidies and exemptions are available for sellers with low income and during forced sales. Finally, it creates a more informed homeowner, providing information to support home improvements that increase energy efficiency, lower greenhouse gas emissions, and reduce costs. Climate change poses the greatest threat to our community and to all of humanity. Urgent action is necessary to protect people from its unavoidable consequences and to drastically reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Home energy use is one of the most significant sources of emissions in Thurston County. For these reasons, the Thurston Climate Mitigation Collaborative identified a home energy score ordinance as an important regional initiative. The Thurston County Commissioners and the Olympia City Council voted to adopt this ordinance earlier this year. Adopting the ordinance across the region will provide consistency and predictability for the home buying process throughout the county while creating a model for other regions to follow. We respectfully urge you to adopt this ordinance as soon as possible. Signed, Olympia Friends Meeting.

Andrew, that was perfect timing. That was amazing. Thank you.

And that's all for public comment.

Anyone else in the audience want to talk about something that is not on the agenda? I looked at you all awkwardly enough. I think that's a no. We're going to move on to consent calendar. Are there any items that council would like pulled? If not, I would entertain a motion. But let me know if you want to make a motion so I can unmute your mic.

So moved.

Second.

Really got to work on that. That flow is just awful. We have a motion from Council Member Swarthouse, second from Council Member Breeden. It's been a long weekend. It's only Tuesday. Any discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Thank you so much. In this consent calendar... You all approved three sets of meeting minutes, ratified $2.7 million in payments, updated the city's debt policy to align with state law, and you also accepted an $80,000 grant for the Tumwater Olympia FD Cares Program. We canceled the October 6th council meeting because we're having a joint meeting with the school board on October 8th, and you all just appointed Paul Strickland to the Historic Preservation Commission, who happens to be here tonight, and would like... To take the mic for a minute. Paul, please join us.

Good evening, and thank you, council members, and thank you, Mayor Dahlhoff. Real honor to be appointed to the Tumwater Historical Preservation Commission. If I may, I'd like to read the commission's mission into the record here this evening. The Commission advises the City Council on Tumwater history and historical preservation under Tumwater Municipal Code Chapter 2.62. Its charge is to identify, evaluate, and protect the city's historical resources, to make preservation economically viable through tax incentives, and to build public awareness of local heritage. Core duties, to maintain the historical inventory of the Tumwater Register of Historical Places, review nominations, issue certificates of appropriateness for changes to registered properties, serve as the local review board for special property tax valuation, forward nominations to the state and national registers, and run public education and interpretation. So that's the commission's mission. Personally, I am honored to be appointed to the commission because of my personal history as a fifth generation Washingtonian, and I'm proud and honored to be here in Tumwater, which is a historical city in our state. I'm also proud to serve on the commission with colleagues of my father, who worked at OSPI and as the supervisor of the state social studies curriculum and international education. And Dave McCandrey happens to be someone who worked with my father and did work with Washington State Historical Society, as well as professors of mine at the University of Puget Sound. As such, I'm very proud and honored to be appointed to this commission and will serve the community to the best of my abilities.

Thank you. Thank you, Paul. Full disclosure, I also went to the University of Peter Santa. Paul's one of my best friends. Go Loggers. Thank you so much. Welcome, Paul. And thank you for choosing Tumwater. No pressure. We are on to a public hearing. When I open the public hearing, we will now conduct a public hearing on R2026-014, Timberland Regional Library District Levy Lid Lift. There is a sign-in sheet available on the table next to the door for those individuals wishing to give testimony. Staff will make a presentation and answer any questions from the council. Following the staff report, I will open the hearing for public testimony. Administrator Simmons, would you like to speak from where you're at?

Thank you, Mayor Dahlhoff. As you shared, voters will consider a levy lid lift to support the library district this fall in a matter of weeks. And tonight we have guests from the library to share a little bit about what's being proposed to voters. I'd like to welcome Mary Beth Harrington, a Thurston County trustee, regional manager Anthony Rogers, and interim executive director Andrea Heisel. So thank you all for being here. And they're going to share some information about what's being proposed.

thank you everybody thank you Council and mayor for having us tonight um may I have the power thank you and if you could just that there you go is that better okay um so my name is Andrea Heisel I'm the interim executive director for Timberland Regional Library and I wanted to preface this with a few updates about Tom water specifically and then go into our our levy information So as you can see, Tumwater Library's activity for 2025, we had 538,000 total checkouts. I also want to preface this with the fact that the building for Tumwater was actually closed for renovation during much of 2025, so that's still a really impressive amount of checkouts. We had 311 programs and over 5,784 people in attendance. A good amount of computer usage happening in that branch as well with over 10,000 sessions. And we have 31,124 residents that hold a library card. Tumwater is also one of seven libraries in the Thurston County area. I also want to just talk briefly about our summer library program, which just wrapped up for 2026. And the really wonderful news is Tumwater just saw a 36% increase in summer library program sign-ups and a 26% increase in completion of those activities, and they turned that in. So that's really great news. Okay, thank you. So I also want to talk briefly about a few changes that have happened since January of 2026. The big changes are that we have all new leadership at the top. We have recruitment for the new regular executive director in progress now. And we have looked at various ways to help us through this particular time in our financial what's happening with finances. So we've done some furloughs for nonrepresented staff for two days a month for four months. And we have some projected savings of $222,715. We also have a new policy that's financial transparency and that allows us to show projections of where we're going to be in the next four years. And you're going to see an example of that later on. But it helps us better plan for the future. And we also have, because of various other things we were able to do, cutting back the collections, we did have involuntary and voluntary layoffs. We have saved $3.6 million estimated. Finally, we have worked on accountability from the top down. And so we have new evaluation process in place for the board will be evaluating itself. The executive director will have a much more robust evaluation process, as well as staff and the branches, all the leadership up and down the organization. The board's also moved to hybrid meetings, much like this meeting today. So people can join us online or in person whenever we're meeting. And then all of our remodel projects and service changes are going to be done with more collaborative work moving forward. So those are kind of the key highlights from 2025 and the beginning of 2026. So now I'm going to talk to you specifically about our levy lift initiative. TRL is funded primarily through property taxes. You can see it's 96% as of this year, and that is our main source of revenue. Over the years, our timber revenue, as many places have experienced, have been so variable, and it's decreasing more and more. And then the other small portion of our revenues are miscellaneous fees and gifts, donations, work from our Friends of the Library groups. Our last levy attempt was in 2009, and that failed. But we have actually gone 25 years without a restoration of our full levy rate. So in 2001, we were at 50 cents, and that has declined steadily since then. And you can see an illustration right here of what that looks like. So we're at the lowest levy rate we've ever had. This chart right here is part of our financial transparency reports that you can now find on our website very easily under funding. But it illustrates that we have a revenue. Red dot is our 30% beginning fund balance policy. And you can see that we are out of compliance with that policy as of January of 2026. When we looked at all of our finances early this summer and started having conversations with our board about how we're going to manage this time period and the fact that we've gone 25 years without a restoration of that levy rate, we presented the board with a couple of different levy rate options. We looked at... and landed on the single-year levy lid lift, which as of July 2026 is a two-year permanent levy lid lift. So for the first two years, it'll be at that increased rate, and then it starts slowly declining again over time. I'm sharing this with you too to illustrate the fact that this is actually the new norm for library systems all over our state. So either coming back for a restoration of a levy rate or to renew the rate that they were at is the new norm. and what you can expect to see in set time periods from us moving forward. So this projection sheet here, again, is part of our July board retreat where we talked about levy. You can see that in 2027, we are still ending the year in the black. But by 2028, without a levy lift, we are starting to run a negative balance at the end of the year. um so our board decided to adopt the 35 cent levy lid lift rate that represents a 13 cent increase from where we are currently and on average for the average thurston county um homeowner excuse me i'm gonna grab that piece of paper right here so i tell you the right number we are looking at um $4.92 a month, and that's based on the median assessed home value here in Thurston County. It also equates to $59 a year increase. Using that $0.35 levy rate, we will be able to recover our beginning fund balance within the next year, should it pass. We will also be focusing our levy money towards bringing back some staffing so that we can increase open hours. Some of you may have noticed in some of our library branches, we've had to draw down those open hours because we don't have enough staff to keep those buildings staffed sustainably. So we're going to be focusing on open hours and staffing. That's our primary focus, as well as bringing back the collection spending so you have a reduced wait time for all those popular titles that everyone loves. And then finally, the facilities ongoing maintenance that we need to do to keep our buildings up to shape. And I just shared with you those two numbers in terms of what that might mean for the average assessed value. And also currently, that is 2.28% of property taxes for Thurston County is how much the library rate makes up. So for more information on our website, you can go to trl.org slash levy and see all those facts yet again and more. And I invite you to do that.

Are there any other information in the staff report? Your mic's on.

No, Mayor. Now would be time for council questions and then following that public hearing.

Perfect. We had Councilmember Jefferson. We'll go to Councilmember Swarthout.

Two questions. OK. Do you work with the schools, partner with the schools for the summer reading program?

We do. Our staff typically go out and do presentations that last month before they're out of school to really hype up summer library program. This year, that was greatly hampered by the fact that we needed all our staff in our buildings more to help keep them open.

Okay. And my last question is, can you tell me a little bit more about your background and your experience? Just, you know, where do you come from?

Okay. Oh, sorry. We're talking about the presentation on the levy. I'm wondering if that is germane to the topic at hand.

Okay. Carry on.

I'm done. Council Member Swithout. Thank you, Mayor. Let's see. So I was curious on, is this levy treated like a school bond levy? Do you have to have a super majority to pass it? What's the threshold?

That's a great question. It's a simple majority for the whole entire five-county district. So the 50 plus one.

So a simple majority. Okay. And then what happens if it only passes like in Thurston County? If the other counties don't pass it, would it still be enforced then?

If it's that simple majority, yes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Council Member Shortout.

Council Member Agave. I like your presentation, but in looking at what you gave, your information, you said or stated in your presentation that in the second year, the increase is multiplied by 101%. And is there a reason why it's 101% as a multiplier?

Oh, because it's a two-year permanent levy. So we are allowed to do, get that up above that 1% for two years in a row, and then it starts going back down over time.

But if you start at 101%, what was in the first year? What was the percentage in the first year?

We are at, that's a great question. I mean, we're capped at 1%. So we're only getting that 22 cents per year. per $1,000 of assessed value.

Thank you.

Yes.

Thank you, Council Member Agave. Any other Council Member? We have time, so we want to go back to Council Member Jefferson's question. Do you want to ask it one more time, Council Member Jefferson?

No, I just wanted a brief intro of you to the community, your background.

Okay, great. My name's Andrea Heisel, as I said. I've been a librarian and a library staff member for 26 years, but I've had various roles. And I'm not native of West Washington State. I'm actually from North Carolina, came here from Georgia, started my background in academic libraries, but have transitioned over to public libraries. And nine years ago this last week, has started working for Timberland. I was hired at Timberland as a collection manager, so in charge of all the materials that circulate and coming up with strategies around how we get things to people's hands without barriers. So worked on lots of big projects like reducing fines and fees and increasing the amount of things people can check out and all kinds of good stuff like that.

Well, just thank you for stepping up during this challenging time. And I appreciate, thank you for your service.

Thank you. Thank you for the question, Council Member Jefferson. Council Member Whedon, is it germane to the hearing?

You've mentioned the fines and fees. Can you elaborate on that? I've read some things online and heard some things where they're like, well, why aren't they going back to these and whatnot? Yeah. I know the answers, but can you, for everybody out there in the public that's questioning or might not fully understand exactly the reasons why in which we've, the Timberland Regional Library, I guess, has stepped away from the fines and fees.

Right. Do you have a, I'll allow it, but that's not really germane to the levy at hand in the public hearing, right? We're doing a hearing to then do public testimony on a levy. I'll allow it. but the questions have to be related to the staff report and the levy.

Okay.

Go ahead. Go ahead and answer.

So in, I want to say 2018, we actually did a small pilot of removing fines specifically for children's books because we didn't want to have that barrier for families where I think probably many of us as parents have gone through this. you can't find that book your child checked out, and then all of a sudden you have a big fine on your account, and now you don't necessarily want to show your face back at the library without being able to return that book, and you don't want to have to pay that expensive fine for replacing that book. We did that short trial. It was very successful. We saw an increase in checkouts for kids. We have an amazing group of people. Staff actually crafted and did all the legwork on the research for how much time it took for staff to do that work to have people pay fines in the branch. And what we found, it was like a net negative because we were paying people to process much more fines and fees rather than actually bringing people into our buildings to use those things. And so our board actually voted to go fine free, I believe, in 2019, if I'm remembering correctly. But it was definitely a group effort of staff and administration making that case. So it's been really well received.

Thank you. Thank you, Council Member Whedon. Any additional questions regarding the public hearing we are currently in regarding the levy LIDD? If not, we will go to public testimony. Council Member Cathy.

I'm nervous about saying anything. I hope this fits in with the levy. All I want to say is that a community without a library suffers. Everyone does. In the statistics across the land are for people to try to save their libraries, increase their libraries, coordinate with the schools, all of that kind of thing. So I'm all for supporting the levy. It matters to us as a city and to the projects and the things that we want to do to have a library.

Well said, Councilmember Cathy. Last chance for council to do a comment or a question regarding the public hearing we are in regarding the levy lid lift. Seeing none, we're going to go to public testimony.

OK, and we have no one online. And when I got the board, we had no one. We could ask for anybody else that may want to speak to it. Let's ask. Would anyone like to speak to the public hearing that didn't sign up on the board? I think we're good.

Any further public comment? Any further public comment? Any further public comment? Public hearing is now closed. So you've heard the report. The public testimony and the hearing is closed. So now it's time for council to deliberate on what you'd like to do or not do. Who would like to start? Council Member Swathout.

Would it be appropriate to make a motion? I'd like to make a motion to adopt resolution number R-2026-014 in support of the Timberland Regional Library Livy-Lidliff proposition.

Second. Second. We have a motion from Council Member Swarthout, a second from Council Member Cathy. Any discussion? I saw Council Member Sullivan had her hand up.

I was going to second the motion.

We have a third from Council Member Sullivan. Any further discussion? Council Member Agape.

Well, I have been a beneficiary of the library. When I finished my graduate study in 1996, I swore that I wouldn't be going to the library but having kids. Two weeks ago, I was at the library. My daughter was checking out the book. She's a freshman at Dunwater High School. And I had to return the book, I think, two weeks later. So for me and my household, I have been a big beneficiary of that library, so it is in my best interest that the library stay open. So on that note, I all support for the level eight.

Well said, Council Member Mugabe. Any other Council Member? Council Member Jefferson.

Yes. I've looked at the pluses and the minuses, looking at what the community has to say, I'm in strong endorsement and a yes for this because the library is the hub for the community. I've lived in Central America, Belize, where the library is a small building and the books are so used and the kids just pass it from one kid to another. And it's, it's heartbreaking because they don't have the funding to invest in those libraries. So we are so lucky here, you know, in Tamorda, in Lacey, in Olympia that we can fund our library. So our community has a place to go to. So this is important for me.

So glad to vote. Yes.

Thank you, Council Member Jeffery, for sharing that perspective. Council Member Whedon, do you have anything to add before the vote?

I'd just like to say thank you for coming today, demonstrating what it would look like to, without this levy, Little Lift. Libraries play such a vital role in educating our public and letting them understand what is not only going on here locally, but throughout the world, and how critical it is to educate, especially our children. At a time right now where the federal government is cutting education, I am a big endorsement for this lively lid lift, and you have my full support.

Thank you, Council Member Whedon. Anything else before I call the vote? Council Member Sullivan, Swarthout.

I'd like to say thank you to the staff and the board for this. You guys have been through a lot, and so I appreciate and just want to recognize that sometimes it's interesting serving on boards, and so... So I really, really appreciate your bravery and taking this forward. I love the library. When's the last time anybody's been in the Tumwater Library? You've got to go over. It's absolutely beautiful with the new kids part and everything. So thank you.

All right, we have a motion from Council Member Swarthout and a second from Council Member Cathy to adopt R2026-014, the Timberland Regional Library District Levy Lid Lift. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, same sign. Motion passes unanimously. Thank you so much. If you want to exit right now, we won't judge you. We'll give you some time to casually stroll out. Congratulations. Thank you for all that you do. I was like, excuse me, Sir Finance. I don't think so. We are now transitioning to council considerations. And we have Sir Finance here with us tonight. Sir Finance, what do you need from council?

Thank you, Honorable Mayor Dalhoff. Good evening, council members. Tonight, we are asking for approval of an ordinance, and it's the delegation of authority to issue bonds. With us online are a couple members of our bond financing team. I'll introduce them very briefly before we get started. We have Deanna Gregory from Pacifica Law Group. She's a partner with the law firm specializing in debt financing and municipal law. waving there to us. We also have Scott Bauer of Northwest Municipal Advisors, and he is our municipal advisor for this bond sale. So they both have many, many years of experience in the industry. They're very highly respected and make a great addition to our internal financing team. Okay, so briefly for those here in chambers and watching online, We have some large capital projects and purchases that the council is considering, including a new used building for a new city hall, fire station to remodel, and two properties for our habitat conservation plan. Issuing debt for these very large purchases is a good way to go. It's in a way similar to purchasing and financing a home. You know, most of us can't go Dish out $500,000 in cash for a house. It's similar for the city. We don't have the cash to go and make these purchases. However, we can afford to finance them over a period of years. It helps spread the cost out over time and helps us manage our cash flow. Instead of going to a bank, municipal bonds are a very good financing tool for local governments. We get low interest rates, flexibility, and some predictability, because when the bond issuance closes, we're going to know exactly what we're going to be paying for the next 15, 20, 30 years, whatever term we decide. So this ordinance authorizes staff to work with bond council and our municipal advisor, as well as an underwriter, to prepare the financing. The numbers in the ordinance are not to exceed parameters, they're very high level estimates the bond market changes daily rates rates go up it'd be nice if they come down but things change out in the market and very important note that last bullet even if you if you approve this ordinance tonight that's not the end of your work council still has to approve individual projects so there's still still some some check-ins and some additional approvals needed and that That is the presentation, and we can take any questions that you may have.

Council? Council Member Swartzel?

Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? Council Member Swartzel? I guess is the question, what kind of bonds would be issued?

These will be municipal bonds. We basically go to, well, our advisors, our underwriters, we go to the market, and there's investors out there waiting for opportunities to purchase these kind of bonds. They're a very safe investment. One of the safest investments someone can make. And Yeah, so we can definitely have more education and more details about this.

I appreciate that answer, just the safety part of it. So I appreciate that. Thank you.

If there are no additional questions, I would entertain a motion. Council Member Sullivan.

I move we adopt ordinance number 02026-006, delegation of authority to issue bonds. And yes, and there.

Got a motion from Council Member Sullivan and a second from Council Member Jefferson. Any discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, same sign. Motion passes. Thank you so much.

Thank you.

More to come. We are moving on to interlocal agreement with cities of Lacey, Olympia, and Thurston County for Franz Anderson Road Permanent Housing Project Second Amendment.

Good evening, council members. My name is Sharon Lumban-Tobing. I'm the deputy community development director. And you have before you the interlocal agreement second amendment. Tumwater is a party to the ILA and a first amendment with our regional partners, Lacey, Tumwater, and Thurston County, to develop 70 units of permanent supportive housing at 527 Franz Anderson Road in Olympia. The second amendment establishes our financial commitments. We identified $275,000 in general funds back in 2020-23 that has not yet been paid. So this is not an additional fund. It's just carrying that forward. Some of the terms of the ILA are outlined in your staff report. It's a revised unit mix. Lehigh, the nonprofit service provider, was not able to pencil out the 70 units at or below 50%. And so they needed to do a split, 35 units at or below 30% and 35 units at or below 50%. There are some other terms and conditions here for the occupancy, affordability, and long-term use. All three city jurisdictions councils are reviewing this tonight, and it's going to Thurston County at the end of the month. If any jurisdiction does not sign this, then we would go back to negotiate. This is critical that we have 70 new units of permanent supportive housing. We need a lot more than that. But this is well towards ensuring that that could happen. Happy to answer any questions that you might have.

Council Member Swithout. Thank you. So when I was looking through, so we're looking at obligating $275,000, correct? Okay. I have my budget book now. Thank you, Sir Finance. And so I was looking through the budget. And so on non-departmental expenditures, I wanted to... It shouldn't be...

These pages aren't numbered, so I can't tell you what... Council Member Swarthout, this amount is allocated in this finance budget, not that budget.

Right, but in this budget, it says 225. It's allocated at 225, and so that's what I'm questioning, is I highlight it. This is, if I'm looking at the right thing, because it's talk about social service programs, Franz Anderson commitment, HTAT, yeah, from last budget was fulfilled, but it says 225. And so I was just curious if I missed, if it was in another spot where the extra 50 was going, or that I just didn't see it in there. So that's my question.

Excellent question. Yeah. Yeah.

For those online, especially Councilmember Cathy, Sir Finance in the back said he is going to look into that. Councilmember Cathy, are you speaking? If you are, you're muted.

I was just thanking you for interpreting that. It's very difficult to hear. People aren't pulling the mic right down to their mouths. So thank you.

I'm happy to circle back with you, Council Member Campbell.

Yes, you're circling back. And I'm appreciating it. I'm not dizzy about it tonight.

And thank you, Council Member Swarthout, for noting that. I can already see certain fragments in the back typing. Any other questions? If not, I would entertain a motion. Your mics are hot.

I guess I have a question. If the dollar amount's not correct in the, as compared to the budget, or do we have to be concerned about that?

Well, that's the 2728 budget. This is coming out of this biennium budget that's already been allotted. So that 225 is not this 275. Okay, got it.

Okay.

Thank you.

I got you. You got me. I got you. For those who don't know, Council Member Swarthout is our budget guru. Council Member Sullivan.

Could you restate what it is we're actually voting on?

Authorize the mayor to sign the interlocal agreement with cities of Lacey, Olympia, and Thurston County for Franz Anderson Road Permanent Housing Project.

This is what we committed originally.

In 2023, that is correct, an interlocal agreement for $275,000 in general funds.

Have we been following how some other cities are feeling about this at this point? I mean, are we still committed to the same thing or have we made any other and had any other conversations about this whole project?

The mayors have talked about it in our mayor's forum. I talked to Mayor Payne this evening before council. Their council is moving forward, right? But I can't speak for another council of how they're voting, but for Tumwater and what we're presenting to you all is... These funds have been allocated since 2023. It's not coming out of our 27-28 biennium budget. These funds have already been allocated. This is not a fight I want to pick with any jurisdiction. Whether there's issues with contracts with contractors, that is future discussion. But for sure, some council members on Lacey and myself and Olympia want to move forward with getting those 70 units built. And there will be ongoing discussions Mayor Payne talked tonight about having a meeting with the mayors and Lehigh. And that has not happened, right, before it's been staffed, but we'll be requesting a meeting of the mayors with Lehigh to figure out next steps. But this project needs to go forward, if that makes sense. Council Member Cathy.

Oh, yeah. Well, I mean...

We're picking up what I'm throwing down.

We've been talking about this type of thing for years in Lehigh and so forth. Did you talk to anybody from Lacey? Their amount of putting in is $3 million. Correct. Are they close to not doing that?

What I heard is it's split, so I don't know how that vote will go tonight.

And what if they pull out?

If they do not vote on it, then it goes back to the county.

And we would renegotiate. The jurisdictions would renegotiate. Right.

It goes back to the drawing board. But the deadline is the end of this month.

You mean the whole project goes back to the drawing board?

The Second Amendment.

The Second Amendment. Oh, the Second Amendment. The change in the AMI. Well, it's gotten complicated, but... It's super complicated. Yeah, and it's sad.

waste this kind of time and whatever while people need housing is. Anyway, thank you for clarifying that and that there's discussion among other jurisdictions that are involved in this project.

Yeah, the discussion's not over, right? The focus is getting this housing complete. Next steps are next steps regarding who manages that. Council Member Sullivan.

I would like to make a motion to authorize the mayor to sign the interlocal agreement with the cities of Lacey, Olympia, and Thurston County for Franz Anderson Road Permanent Supportive Housing Project amendment. An amendment, right? That's not worded as an amendment here.

We get a motion from Council Member Sullivan and a second from Council Member Cathy to authorize the mayor to sign the interlocal agreement with the cities of Lacey, Olympia, and Thurston County for the Franz Anderson Road Permanent Housing Project. Any further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, same sign. Motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

And more to come with that. We're going to talk about this at the three cities and the county meeting on Friday. So we'll do an update to council after that. We are now on to the mayor city administrators report.

Administrator Simmons, what's good?

Thank you, Mayor. I just wanted to remind you all, you received an electronic version of the proposed 27-28 biennial budget. For those of you that are here tonight, there are printed hard copies in your mailbox. If you haven't received them, be sure to swing by and check your mailbox on your way out. Council Member Cathy, I would be happy to drop yours off if you would like. Just let me, shoot me a text. Circle back with Council Member Cathy. Circle back, and I would be happy to.

Okay. Kind of heavy, isn't it?

It's not too bad.

I'll circle back.

All right. Thank you so much. We're going to go into council member reports. So we're going to circle back to council member Kathy, since she's right here. Council member Kathy, would you like to start with your council report?

Well, I, I only had, uh, one meeting solid waste advisory council did not meet. And, um, I had, what's the other meeting I go to? ORCA, Olympia, Clean Air. There's just so much discussion as you even watch the evening news now about air and about water and about all of the things that have to do with our environmental issues. needs and hopes and destruction. It comes down to us. I feel like we're doing quite a good job in the air in the five districts that we're working in. I don't know. You get discouraged talking about some of the things that are going on nowadays and that keep being pulled or destroyed or, you know, who cares about the birds and then who killed who and whatever. It's weird to go to a meeting that is about clean air and an air agency that was founded many, many decades back and to hear that it's not that important anymore. And so we've been, we've been having some robust discussions and we're getting ready for fall burning and having all of our, our jurisdictions up and down, uh, from Port Angeles town down here to Thurston County to just kind of renew and look again and put this in the perspective of this is crucial to people's living. So we've had some robust discussions. Going to be having a change of some people on the board and chair and so forth for for next after the end of the year. We're thinking about that too. So nothing specific that I can say that other than all of the burning stuff that becomes big at this time of year, people want to burn their leaves. So that's basically my report. We need to do everything we can to keep the air and the waters clean.

That's a great report. Thank you, Council Member Cathy. We're going to start with Council Member Whedon. What's good?

Earlier today, I had the BCB. We were presented with the 2026 Annual Budget Report. Experience Olympia and Beyond is also going to be holding their annual meeting on September 30th, and the theme is going to be Mission Tourism Possible. Last week, Paul Simmons and I went ahead and got a little... tour of Wolf Haven International. I hadn't been there in years and it is a completely different experience than I had as a kid. So it was cool to hear firsthand the updates that have been made and learn more about their program and how they are now focusing more on animal care and the environment than what was previously done years ago as I was a kid. And I think that's about it. Oh, we have a Toyota Falls Fest coming up on the 26th. Then I'm hopeful that I'm going to be able to make that.

Thank you, Council Member Reed. And we're going to switch over to Council Member Swarthout. Oh, thank you, Mayor.

So on September 9th, I had the opportunity to go to Lott. That was a great meeting. And guess what we talked about? We don't talk about air. We talk about water.

I'm just saying. I'm glad. I don't want you tripsing over into my air space.

It was really a great meeting, and I really appreciated the opportunity. They feed you before you go, so very happy meeting, so that was pretty cool. But what we discussed was the next legislative priorities, and then heard from the contract lobbyists about the upcoming session. We passed a resolution of support for the Deschutes Estuary Restoration Project. We continued policy update discussions. We authorized staff to release the proposed 2027-28 Budget and Capital Improvements Plan for public review. And we approved two construction bid awards for infrastructure projects at the Budd Inlet Treatment Plant. So that was a lot. And then I had an all-day retreat on September 10th with the Thurston Regional Planning Council. And then I just want to put in a plug for TAC. So there's a Tumwater Area Chamber of Commerce is doing a run this weekend, 20 bucks. So it's 5K. You can even walk. Just want to put a plug in.

Thank you, Council Member Swirthow. Council Member Jefferson, what have you been up to?

Yes, I had one short meeting, budget and finance. And then on Thursday, September 17th, we have the Public Works Committee meeting. It's going to be short, looks like. And we're going to discuss Station T2 remodel update.

Perfect. Thank you, Council Member Jefferson. Great work.

Council Member Sullivan. Thank you, Mayor. I have just a couple of things to report on. Since last report, we had public health and safety early in the month. Last week, my seatmate, Council Member Swarthout and City Administrator Simmons and our Assistant Administrator Kelly Adams had the privilege of being welcomed to visit this Coxon Island Nation tribal leadership, their chair, vice chair, and members of their council and some of their enterprise members. leadership from their business enterprises to build connection, build rapport. And for me as a new council member to build some more history and context about our working relations. And it was an honor. So I just wanted to say shout out to Squawks and Allen Nation for hosting us and for that great conversation. And a number of my other reports are, my committee assignments are still coming later this month. I did have a meeting with some community members who wanted to share their thoughts about home energy. I know that's a hot topic, and I continue to say yes to meetings from folks who want to meet and talk about various topics. So that's my update.

Great update, Council Marcella. Council Member Gaby, bring us home.

So, on September 9th, I had a very, very long meeting with the TPB.

And you're going to recreate it for us.

Well, unfortunately, I had to leave 20 minutes towards the end because I had a CDC technical review with the state of Washington. So, I said, bye. Bye, Nara. But... The meeting on the night was very, very, very full of information and very long. It was a good one. So we have a presentation about our TIP, which is the Regional Transportation Program, which is a four-year, which is updated annually, and that provides a regional review of funded, secure, and planned transportation projects based on the local transportation improvement program. And that was a very fulsome discussion. And then we had a final review recommendation that Dave will be working on before the holidays. And the TRPC public participation plan details the agency's policies and procedures for conducting community engagement. And staff presented the finalized version of the 2026 update of the PPP for TPP Second Review. A recommendation will come to Council, I believe, before Christmas. And then, this dove well with our resolution that we gave to the people with the pink orange face. So, we have a discussion from staff, TPP staff, regarding a transportation plan, and this, according to the presentation, this is to document that people with disability barriers, especially people age 65 and older and people with disability and people with low income, that's too negatively. But anyhow, So the presentation is due to the difficulties that they face as they go about their daily chores within the city. And I believe, because this was a draft consultation plan or discussion, that there's going to be an action down the road, but I don't know when. So that is that. I was supposed to attend the, what was that? No, the other one. Yeah, so that was yesterday. It was a long day, so I was still cooped up with my CDC review. I didn't get up work until 9.30, so I didn't make it.

We can have staff ask for an update.

Yes.

Can we do that? Administrator Simmons? Yeah, we'll get an update. Thank you.

Yes, thank you. So that's my report.

Thank you. Great work, everybody.

Mayor, could I ask a question?

You can ask anything you want.

Oh, wow.

I mean, I take that back. I take that back. I take it back.

Okay. Something relevant. I would like to know, and I don't know if we've set this or we're waiting to see or what, when are we going to bring forth again the home energy discussion and or possible vote

Great question, Council Member Cathy. Administrator Simmons.

It will be discussed by the Equity Commission at a special virtual meeting on Thursday at 6 p.m. Following that, do we have a date, Assistant City Administrator Adams, yet on when it will come back to Council or is it pending the results?

October, November? One moment, Council Member Cathy. Well, Assistant City Administrator Kelly Adams comes to the podium.

Good evening, Council Member Kathy, thank you for that question. Good evening, Council and Mayor. So on Thursday evening, the Equity Commission is going to discuss the recommendation this Thursday, this Thursday. And so at that time, we'll be able to give you an indication of if they're ready to give you a recommendation or if their recommendation is that they need more time. So if they come away with a recommendation on Thursday, we can schedule something for October. If they need more time, we can schedule something for November. What we didn't want to do was get ahead of the process.

I'm really disappointed that we're, this isn't a very good word to use, but I'm going to use it, dragging this out. You know, why are we giving it to another commission to go through meetings and this and that until it gets back to council? Council made a pretty strong statement for it when we did vote. I just don't understand this. And there are so many people in the community talking about it and they want it one way or the other.

Why are we waiting so long?

I don't understand how this issue has has done this when part of what we put into our environmental structure for what we believed in and how we wanted to move forward has this very kind of stuff in it. I call it stuff. It's the regulations that move us toward our environmental goals. What's happened is I guess, I don't know.

I'm going to jump in. That's not for staff. I'm not going to put that on staff. I'm going to jump in. So at that meeting, when it was presented, council voted to have it sent to the equity commission, equity commission, along with council and the commissioners of the equity commission had 70 questions. And that's what that meeting is on Thursday to go over the answers to the 70 questions. And then, so you have the option, right? With the commissions and Council Member Cathy, you taught me this a long time ago, right? We have these commissions that do the work, but it's ultimately council's decision, right? So whatever happens on Thursday, council can make an action or not take an action, right? But council voted to have this go to the Equity Commission and 70 questions were posed. They are taking the time on Thursday to go over those questions. The goal is for them to have their recommendation and then it comes to council, right? But we're not going to prescribe them what they will or will not do. And that doesn't hold you back from doing what you want to do either, right? So we let them meet. They go over the 70 questions. The goal is for it to come back to council. If they want more time but council doesn't like that, you want it sooner, then you get it sooner, right? And that's at the expense of that relationship with the Equity Commission.

Well, we talked about this long before there was an Equity Commission.

Well, so, Councilman, I know exactly what you're talking about. Here's the challenge. Council asked for this to be presented last May, and it was never presented. So it was only presented to council this year. And we have two new council members who are also trying to catch up with all of this. So you, the guru of all this, have known about this and pushing this for years. It has only been presented to council this year. You've had two meetings on it, a work session and a council meeting, and then council decided to send it to the Equity Commission. If you want it sooner, then you can make a motion with your teammates and get it sooner. I'm not stopping you.

Oh, no, I'm not thinking that you are. I just think that we have created a longer road than we started out with.

Well, it's valid because you've been working on this for years, right? And then remembering that it's only been presented to council this year.

When this came to council for a vote, wasn't it, was it a tie vote or was it by one vote?

It was majority vote to send it to Equity Commission for them to review and send their recommendations back to council. Are you willing to hear what the Equity Commission has to say on Thursday and see where they're at and then council can decide what you want to do?

Well, I think we should keep it moving. I mean, I'm not against having an equity commission or having them look at this, but you start saying, you know, October, November, it just seems like we're taking- Valid.

Yeah, I get it. I can see the optics with that. The goal is for it to come back to council in October, right? But we're also not going to bind equity commission, right? And also council can decide what they want to do. So you want to hear what happens on Thursday and then council can decide if you want to bring it earlier?

Sure. Sounds good. Well, I mean, I don't know how some of my colleagues feel about this, but I think that, you know, we're...

I'll open it up. Council Member Cathy, we have time. I'm going to open your mics. Who wants to go first and share your thoughts with Council Member Cathy? Council Member Jefferson, go ahead.

Yes, Council Member Cathy. From my perspective, I wanted to hear from all sides. I heard a lot from the real estate professionals, but I haven't heard a lot from some of those fixed income seniors who are in older homes. So I just wanted to hear from everyone in the community to make a decision based on that.

Your mics are open. Who would like to go next? Council Member Agave.

So the information that we were given, plus available literature, there is a, in biology we use the word, the causation. So it crosses over. So in order for us to get it right, we have to have as much information as possible to arrive at the decision. What we're doing is just part of the deliberation. There is no hurry. If you want to vote right now, I say let's vote, but we don't have all of the information.

Being one of the two new members, I've really appreciated the amount of time that we've taken on this. I know for the rest of the council that's been here way longer than I have, and I appreciate that, all the energy that you've put into it, Kathy. It's still something new for me. As I start researching and learning more and having conversations, I just had conversations earlier, actually last week, with members of the Thirsting Climate, and The intent behind the home energy score is amazing. Again, I have concerns about the full impact that this could cause on our low-income families, our seniors and everything. So I would like to see the process continue so that the Equity Commission can answer those questions that were submitted. I also understand your optics and that you're like you're frustrated that it's feels to you like it's taking forever to get to a vote. I'm still new. So I would like to get a little bit more information, give it a little bit more time. So that's where I'm at.

8 to the 1.

Thank you. A lot of thoughts about this. This is something that is deeply important to a lot of folks for a lot of similar reasons and a lot of different reasons. I think what I will choose to speak to here tonight is that we did see this as an opportunity for Equity Commission, which is a new body, to have something meaningful right out the gate that was tangible and that they could wrap their arms around. And it's significant. So I appreciate the effort that they put in. I was unable to make the meeting that already happened, but I did watch it back at the mayor's recommendation. Thank you, mayor. And I will watch back what the discussion is from this next one. And I am curious to see where they take this. And I do want them to be able to take their time. I also hear that, like, we are in a climate emergency. And that is very real. And we're seeing those impacts in our everyday lives. So I think... What I will say that feels very important is that we not try to get this perfect because that I think is a mirage there's not a perfect like No matter which way you go. It's not going to be perfect And no matter how we decide to move as a majority when we do move on this issue There will be some unintended consequence, and I'm I'm pro taking the time to do it well and also I think that we need to give ourselves and each other grace that it will not be perfect. And that I look forward to the opportunity when we all do get to vote.

Thank you. I really appreciate what you had to say. And then for Councilmember Cathy, we're kind of like the old timers on the board. And so, you know, Council, so, and that's the thing that we have to be respectful and let everyone else catch up with us. And so that was the decision that we made just to be able to provide more information. So everyone had an opportunity to feel comfortable before we move forward with this. And so not only for Council, but staff as well. So, so We'll take a pause and have the opportunity to review the questions and get back to us.

So great questions, Council Member Cathy. Valid concerns. We're not stopping anything. And Council is leading, right? This is your branch of government. This is what you do. So the Equity Commission meets on Thursday. We'll give you all an update. And then Council... can make a decision, right? You want to move it up? You want to keep October? If they want more time, right? Take the information you get from the Equity Commission. You all decide. My job and staff job are to take what you're doing, what you're passing, and implement it. So I'm really glad you brought that up, Council Member Cathy. Pardon? I'm really glad you brought, I'm glad you circled back on that topic.

Yeah, well, it's, frustrating because I don't know how many conversations you can have about what the facts are. Right.

Equity commissions had one meeting. They have another meeting where they determine their recommendation and then it goes to council. So they've had one meeting. Understood. Documented.

appreciated and assistant city minister adams would like to say something i'd like to make a clarification and thank you to the city attorney karen patrick so we are due our recommendation is due in 90 days and so it will there will be a recommendation in october i don't know what that recommendation will be so they may ask for more time they haven't indicated either way but no matter what right so no matter what you will get a report back in october if not sooner okay councilmember sellin thank you to our amazing staff thank you i appreciate everyone participating in this discussion um

as the mayor knows, we've gotten hung up on things like this before, and, and relevances passed, or we've taken a beating, like, you know, some of the things that are being said now about, you have an environmental, you know, path to follow, this does fit, this doesn't fit, you know, I mean, we have to, we have to make decisions sometimes, and just make them, and Now there's the conversation of, well, so you just passed it on to another committee because you as counsel couldn't get your whatever's together to make a decision. You didn't want to make a decision. You know how to talk. Right.

I would love for you to anyone who keeps saying that to you, give them my information. I'd be happy to talk to them. Anyone who pushes back like that and talks to you like that, I'd be happy to talk to them and say you are following the process. You had questions arise. You're doing your due diligence, and that's what you do as counsel.

Okay, I wrote that all down.

You just say, call Lieta. I'm happy to talk to them.

And they'll say, no, I'm not calling Lieta. It's bad enough talking to you.

Why would they say no? I don't understand why they would say no. Thank you, Council Member Cathy, as always, for keeping us moving forward. Any other business? I'm not going to look at any of you, so you don't have any new business. Meeting adjourned 837. Thank you so much.