Planning Commission - Special Meeting

I'd like to call to order the October 22nd planning commission workshop meeting. Excuse me. Um, first item on the agenda is approve is approval of the agenda. Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Five to all against five to nothing approved. Um item next item is items up for discussion and decision. The um first item is the draft request for proposal for the impact fee study. Is Dennis going to join us?

He is not. I just got off the phone with him and he said we can have the discussion. If you have questions that Allison or I can't answer, we will be happy to take them down and get a response back to you tomorrow.

Okay. So, kind of as a background to this, as we discussed at the last workshop, this is a the RFP request for the proposal to have the um to find a consultant to do the countywide impact study. The areas that they have lifted out and drafted out are the things that they're asking for the consultant to to look at to prepare during the study. This once approved by you will be sent out to bid and then once the bid um time period has expired, you will get those proposals and we'll do a a a voting to choose which consultant will proceed with the study.

So, is everyone reviewed it and do they have questions? Um, I'm going to give you my hard copy because I have a large number of typographic mra gram grammatical and and just making it look better comments. So, I will give you that at the at the at the end of this so that you can give that to Dennis tomorrow. But so anybody have any questions about the content? Yep. Yep. Go ahead.

Um okay. I guess I I was thinking we were having some type of presentation or something. So I um we'll just jump right in. Um I think overall I'm excited that we're looking at impact fees um especially, you know, as growth is moving further into the county. Um getting into the specifics though of the RFP under number 2A um update needs assessments and capital improvement analysis where it's talking specifically about um the improvement needs across eligible services and categories. I just had the question of why are we calling out some services but not all? Why are we not leaving that broad because it it's leading that we only want to look at those specific services? you would like to answer.

Through an impact study, you're only allowed to request certain services which are fire, EMS, parks and wrecks, storm water, um not storm water, um utilities like sewer and stuff. Um if if you recall in the presentation, Mr. Marstall did say that they were leaving fire off of this one specifically because they were looking at another funding source for that. Okay. And that school is doing their own. Okay. I didn't realize that. Okay. So, that would Yeah, the school already has theirs. It's it's incorporated in ours, but they have to approve and adopt their own schedule and they're a little bit ahead of us because they already have their consultant

looking at it and and they're also looking at the entire county and that would be in addition to what's already approved. Yeah, it would be similar to the way the the impact study is currently. Okay. Um for the panhandle, it has a school fee in it. it has a a fire the EMS parks and Rex and the sheriff um and the school. So it would be the same layout, the same format. It's just that they have to adopt their own and he's chosen to emit fire from this specific study.

Okay. So under public safety though under A, it's specifically talking about sheriff, EMS, and parks, park and recck. So those are the only three things we're wanting to include. Okay. Um so then my next question moving on to 4C. Um we're talking about the CIP and other um ordinances. Do we need to call out the UDO or is that just all-encompassing of everything? And that so that's understood. Okay. Um a few other questions. So, um, we when we had our original talk about this last month, um, there was a time frame listed where, you know, we wanted to get this back in a few months and then have a few months to look at it, but there was no time frame within this document. So, I think something should be added so consultants um, know our expectations of the time frame. And then also there was no due date of when we wanted the RFP back in our hands for them.

I'll double check on that one. I believe um what Mr. Mosall had said in the previous presentation is this once you approve it will go out to bid. There's a statutory period that a bid a government bid has to be out, right?

Um so it'll it'll stay open that long. Then once that closes we will do the evaluation and the time frame would be in the contract negotiation once they cho chose the um consultant because it varies because that you can't give them a time frame. They usually take the information and adjust it based on the the time that they need to reconcile the data and prove that. So I I believe and I will to go back and listen and double check with him, but I think that will be in the negotiation of the contract what time frame needs to be gone. So

okay, I have a question based on that. May I ask it was said that they're looking at another source for uh fire. May I ask what kind of source? He did not specify in his presentation. And I do know there's some other taxing opportunities that you can do specifically with fire like consolidated fire or some things like that. Um but he did not go into detail. Um if you want those details I can ask him to provide that.

I would like to know that just because I would want to know why you would prefer taxing residents instead of taxing people who are going to make money from developments. Any more comments or questions? Um, so how will this process work? Because, um, I would want to see all these changes that I've got before we vote on this. So, so where do we go from here?

Yeah, I I expressed that to Mr. Marshall when I called him. So basically what he said was it's okay if we moved it um I can take these I can take your draft to him. I can take the questions and get those answers and then it will just be moved over to the regular October agenda. So since that is a discussion and an um action item, you will have to do your motions to table and move it to that agenda if you're not going to vote today. Go ahead. Okay. Um, then I'll make a motion to table this um until our October public meeting

and I'll second it. I do have a question. Between now and the October meeting, are we still able to um as we're continuing to review it, am I still able to send those comments and questions over? Um, you can. I would respectfully request to have those done within the next seven days so that if it is something that I have to get some from somewhere else that we can get the answers and get it incorporated in the document so that we have time to prepare that completed document for your review.

Um I do have um one more question. So, um, I've read a lot of of RFPs in my life, and I I remember them saying that they had to recreate this one from scratch. It seems a little lean. I was expecting it to be bigger and more in depth. So, did they I mean, did we not have copies of the the last one of these that we sent out? It is my understanding that no one could find the last one, but I don't know. I we personally don't have it because the the planning department and development services wasn't on that end of it. Y

and we don't we were told we don't have it. We're making a new one and that's all the information that I have from that. I guess a question on that though. Wouldn't um that have been part of the same public process? So, wouldn't there that be in the minutes and the findings? Okay. I I wasn't here, but I will I will double check to see if I can find any more information.

Okay. Okay. All right. So, we have a motion to um defer voting on the um RFP for the um impact um fee study for the county. Um, do we have any more discussion about it? So, um, can we do we have to do a roll call vote or we have can we do a hand vote? So, how many in favor for the motion to defer this to the October full meeting? Any against? So, that is six to none that we are going to defer this. All right. The next item on the agenda is the uh amendments to our rules and procedures. Right, Mr. Chair. Um, I will highlight those two. There were two specific changes that we did to um the adopted rules and procedures. One was to clarify the role of the appointed secretary. That is item section.2. I left that in a highlighted area. Um and then the other one was in section five the voting where we added a sentence saying abstension may be allowed during the approval of meeting minutes if the member was absent at the meeting to which the minutes being voted on apply. Those are the only changes that were made. And to clarify the um absention was a requested change by one of your members.

Correct. We have any questions? I would just like I think it's common sense what I'm going to say, but to me it's common sense. You don't vote on something being approved if you weren't there if you haven't watched the meeting and so forth. To me, it's common sense. We talked about it during the right dura and um the attorney said that you Miss Keratin, I'm sorry. Can you please speak into your microphone? Thank you.

Um during our workshop with the attorney on last week, she did uh comment that it is okay for someone who is not who has not um been in attendance to vote on a particular um issue. I I agree with you. I've never heard that before, but that was what we were told. I would like it just if I was in a meeting and someone said I wasn't here but I'm voting yes. I would think are you kidding me? So with all due respect uh to the attorney it is okay to vote. I still think that um it just doesn't look

Yes, ma'am. I spoke with her um about this before I made the change just to make sure it is okay and um typically with a lot of rules it's the approval of minutes is not that you were there. It's just to allow them into there. So it is typically okay for it to happen but because this board has to have your own rules and procedures. It's equally okay for you to make that amendment. So there's not one way that's better. It's just what you guys prefer and if that at your request we made that amendment and it as long as it's adopted, it'll be fine. Thank you. I just like our body to look smarter than the rest. All right. Do we have any more comments? I mean, those were the only two things that were changed.

Yep. So, um can I get a motion to um accept our new rules and procedures um as amended in this document? So, moved. May I ask one question? I'm so sorry. Um, in our procedures though, we are able to ask questions directly to staff to get clarification. Am I am I correct on that?

At at what point or do you have do you have the section that you have that pulled up? I don't have these memorized. So, when I'm looking at the clarification of um um and section two procedure, I want to make sure that we don't always have to go through the secretary or or we can go directly through the secretary and this is not being um funneled through our chairman or vice chairman to get answers that we need for section two specifically that change any

so so that change specifically allows it just clarifies who acts as a secretary um down in section three um section five the secretary that gives their rules but that is um that is a a procedural preference of the chair typically

may I offer some additional clarity That statement is the introduction of the item when you read the title off on the agenda onto the record. That's that action. It doesn't mean that the chairperson or the secretary gives the documentation or the report. It means that they read it into the agenda um as an introduction to it. If Miss Richards looked at me and said, "Miss Harden, what's next on the agenda?" then she has punted to me to read the item into the record and in the rules of procedure it is up to the chairperson or the secretary to do that. Um again y'all can change that if you'd like but that is mostly that is that is just for the title of the item and then that's what it's called the background and then the staff member would give the application or the information directly to the planning commission. You can absolutely uh ask questions of the staff member. Um the procedural notes about the chairperson has to recognize someone for speaking. It's just a procedural to make sure people aren't talking all over themselves.

Does that help? Thank you. Welcome. Put your hands up, Jason. No. Sorry.

Yoki. Did you mean during the discussion or did you mean to open the item? Um well either because I I just want to make sure that I understand what we are actually agreeing to because um previously I was told that every single thing had to go through the chairman or the vice through the chairman. So I just need to make sure that that's not what we're saying in this document because I I don't agree with that. Just making sure if I may provide a little assistance. Um the item going through the chairperson to be put on the agenda is a typical uh matter of procedure and that is not something that means that the chairperson can say no we're not going to listen to this. It's on the agenda. It has to be addressed in some way shape or form. Um as far as communications going through the chairperson that's also a procedural thing and that you get recognized before you say but that doesn't mean that the chairperson is going to tell you what you can and can't say. the chairperson does the regulation of discussion and if things get out of hand then the chairperson has the right to say we're going to stop this discussion. That's what the role of the chairperson is. It's not about taking your voice away or pushing it through a funnel. It's about making sure that procedure and and um polite discourse can happen during the meeting. Um but as far as this goes that in the matters brought before the commission for public hearing the secretary chairman shall present the background information from the review sheet that is the the introduction to the item for the agenda. Someone has to read the item into the agenda for the record. And under this uh example or this model ordinance, it is the chairperson or the secretary. And um I know that we have talked about it before and Miss Williams was very helpful in getting Mr. Delo here during u Miss Merke's uh session as well. Um

and Mr. Delo said that he would have the ability to come back for procedural um a full procedural training and we're looking forward to having him back. Well, that would make sense. So, I appreciate that clarification, but um that that wasn't how it was presented to me, so I do appreciate. I got you. Well, I'm here to help clarify. Any other questions? All right. So, um, once again, do I have a motion to accept our, um, I can't stand this glasses on, glasses off thing. Our rules and procedures as amended in this thing. So, I think so moved. So, moved. Do I have a second?

Second.

Um, all in favor, show of hands. That is 640 against. Next item on the agenda is meeting dates for 2026. You have in your packet the list of dates that was sent to me by the administration. Um you can ignore page two of that which has the board of zoning appeals. We're only concerned with planning commission dates. Um Lauren went by last year's calendar in which we um did not do a work session in January. It is up to you whether you want to do cancel the January work session since it would fall on Thursday the 1st or choose an alternate date. And the same for July. This past year in July we did not hold a workshop but that is at your discretion. this year it would fall on Thursday the 2nd. And then the other date highlighted is September 3rd. We have previously had to either um cancel or move the September workshop date because of Labor Day, but this year Labor Day falls early, so it doesn't really interfere. Um it's on Labor Day is on the 7th, so it's this year September doesn't really interfere with it. We have questions.

Any questions or comments? Anybody? Um, should we move our January session to the 8th and then that still is 12 days before our regular meeting? Is that long? Is 12 days long enough? Long enough. We would have to before we could officially adopt those with the alternate dates, we would have to check to make sure that the room is available and there are no other conflicts. But we could use that. that we could put that down as an alternate date if you choose to have the meeting. Could we put it down as an alternate date and then if we just don't have enough to discuss cancel that one?

No. I mean that's if they're scheduled they're scheduled for a reason. If there's nothing then it's not a if there's not enough if it's anything. So essentially if you didn't have a workshop you wouldn't have enough for a meeting. So, um, on the rare miracle that that would happen, we could take that as it goes, but you can't just decide to schedule it and then just say we might cancel. So, is there a way to see if the room is available then on the 8th or is that something that can't happen, right?

I can't I can't do it right now because Lauren is the keeper of the calendars and since it's after 5, she's no longer here. Um, is there is there any is there any body that typically meets on the second Thursday? We have over 20 boards and commissions. I can't promise and I'd really not feel comfortable saying yes or no without checking. Sure.

So, do we have to vote on this this meeting? You don't have to. if you would like me to if you would like to set your alternate dates, we could table this to the main agenda as well and then I could have those answers for you if you'd like. So, I'm I'm with uh Commissioner Lou. I'm I'm leaning towards having the January workshop because there's just so much so much stuff and there's still things coming up and I know there's technically the the moratorum, but I still think there's a lot of things that are in process that it might be needed. The same with July.

Yeah. I was going to say I'm um I said it's for I'm good with I I can make all of these dates. So, may I add something that I just discovered? Yes. I actually have access to look at the calendar for the room. Okay, I found it. Um right now, as of right now, there's no one in that room for that Thursday. If you would like to go ahead and schedule the Thursday and we find out otherwise, we can bring the calendar back to you in two weeks and you can amend it. Can you do the same thing for July really quickly? Thank you.

Well, actually, no, we should already have it for July the 2nd and and September the 3rd because that's the normal date. We've just it's normally the the the July one. It's so close to the 4th. that'll be, you know, so it's just going to be a a personal choice. How many people are going to be on vacation and gone for, for instance, the the offices will be closed on the Friday after that. So, I'm all for keeping it on on July 2nd if there's special snacks. I was going to say we cancel that one, but

if it's since the moratorum could be in effect, we might have a lighter work schedule when it comes to summer, but then all the ones that have been in the pike for several years could still come up. And this past July, we did not have a work show either. And that's right. Yes, ma'am. And we would like to clarify that the published notice for the moratorium is not countywide. It's just for a certain part of the county. So, you're still going to be working. Wait, what?

The moratorum doesn't the moratorum doesn't include the entire county. There's just parts of it. So we do anticipate if there's certain areas that have a moratorum that other areas will get a little busier. So we do not anticipate it being lighter for you. Yes sir. Say something. Oh I thought you almost wanted to say something a second ago. My apologum is it's like district one mostly and the panhandle. So

Oh and all of district four. I didn't know that. I stand corrected. So, what does anybody want to do? Okay. So, I make a motion to amend the schedule for from the January 1st workshop to January 8th and then cancel the July workshop alto together. That's all reasonable to everyone. Let's look at it. I'll second that. I gotta look at the calendar.

You're saying January? January the 8th. Just move it back a week. Okay. That seems to work for everyone. That's at what time? Same time. Same bat time. same bat channel just a different day. Gotcha.

All right. So, we have um motion to um take this um meeting schedule. We're going to move the January 1st workshop to January the 8th. We're going to cancel the July 2nd workshop, but we will have the workshop on September the 3. Is that correct? All right. Um, show of hands to accept the calendar as amended. Six to none. We are accepting this calendar as amended. All right. Now, let's get to the meat. So, first item um on the agenda um DA 20242259 the haven at North Corner um um also known as the duly track. Um this is a request for a resoning that has an associated development agreement. The request for resoning is to MDR with a cluster subdivision overlay, hence the requirement for the development agreement. I I will send the staff proposed edits to you guys with um I wasn't quite done with them because I had to get a clarification on something. I will send those in the next couple days so that you can review those prior to. Um, it's very similar to the requested changes that I made in the Arbor Meadows development agreement. I also know that council has also created an ad hoc committee to review this development agreement as well. Um, I will have to check with administration to see what

their schedule is and if we um if we just go ahead and do our um do our thing when we're supposed to and send it up and they'll mesh those together. Um the the preliminary plat and everything is included in your packet. The request is a standard request there. They have some donations of land added in that development agreement and I believe you guys had spoken um some of you had attended the meeting and heard some of the developers information as well. Yes,

if you guys have any specific questions or anything that I need to provide at the presentation, I'd be happy to do so. Um, so this is now put I know there's a total of this is actually three different developments in this same area. Is that all three of them will now be under a development agreement? The other two did pull back and they are preparing a development agreement. Um, we had discussions of how they wanted to memorialize their voluntary donations and the attorney said that that would be the the best way to do so. So they're they've pulled off they are anticipated being heard in November.

Okay. Does anyone else have any questions? All right. Miss Kuritan, you've got that look on your face. I see that question brewing.

Yeah. Um, I think I'm just trying to wrap my head around like so many pieces moving and they're not moving. Um, parallel. They just seem to be moving. I don't know. Um, I don't know how to formulate my my thoughts at the moment, but yes. Do you mean because of all that this project entails or because there's a subcommittee to review the DA and we're having to make a recommendation concurrently?

Yes, I'm concurrent and trying to figure out if yes, the second one. The second part I agree that's a little strange.

Um that is council's right. the the UDO lays out the procedures for a development agreement and they have like an intermediary step between it going to council that they can add a or create an ad hoc committee, hire a consultant or give someone else authority to negotiate or do nothing. Um, I think there's one more that I'm missing, but there's several items that they have the option to do one, all or none of those options. So, at the last council meeting, they did that and they chose the ad hoc committee as one of those options. Um, we still have some, you know, some deadlines. So, it's still going forward with the planning commission for their reading. I don't know how those things will be married together. um because this is the first one that they've had done this way in a while and it is officially my first one working with development agreements and those kind of things. So I honestly do not know the answer but I will be happy to get that in as much detail as possible and present that to you um at our meeting.

Yeah, I'm not questioning their right to do that. I'm just thinking okay wouldn't that be great information for us to also know so that as we um make our make our judgments or decisions or pull our thoughts together to have that information as well. That's Yeah. So, we're not working against each other, I guess. You know,

everything's Everybody's working together. Any other questions or comments? Um, refresh my memory. This is the one that is going to be on individual septic permits and not on county. No, this one is over situated close to the Rosland community and they're tapping on to those lines that were put into that development. Okay. So, that's changed then then since is it or am I or am I getting my projects confused?

I wrote down from the neighborhood meeting that they would be on septic. So, so it's the mayor. Yeah. Uh, I will verify that cuz my projects are running together in my brain right now. But I will verify that for you.

Can I Can I ask the consultant? Can he can can I mean I'm asking can he comment if I Well, actually in the development agreement it says portable water sewage treatment and disposable would be all supplied to the property by the Lancaster County Water and Sewer District. Okay. Okay. Excellent. Thank you. Because when we had the community meeting, uh John Hardy very specifically said it was going to be on septic and that just like did not that gave me the willies. So maybe he maybe John misspoke, but Yeah. Okay. Okay. Excellent. Good to hear.

Yeah. I was that was not setting well with me. That's a lot of septic and I I didn't know how that was going to work. So all that makes me much better. Thank you so much. Okay. Any other comments or concerns or questions?

Um, I mean, I think it's important while we're talking about this project to note they did have a neighborhood meeting back in August. August. Um, I think it was great that they had that to get, you know, adjacent property owners aware, you know, that they were having the meeting. I think that um it was a hot meeting as far as you know folks uh were you know were not excited in the positive about it that I um observed. Uh but

it was still great that they had the meeting. Any other concerns or comments? So, I was just going to clarify that that did kind of cover ex um items A and B since they were married together. Yes,

I was just that going. Oh, yeah. These are some of these that go together because they're doing that um the reasonzoning along with the development agreement. So, yes. So yes, that covers items um uh DA 2024 2259, the Haven at North Corner, which was the uh development agreement, and the next item RZ 2024 2259, the Haven at North Corner, the the reszoning of the four parcels. Wait, can I ask? Yes. Sorry, back on that one before we move on. Um, yeah.

Since they're working in conjunction with the other project to the south of this one and they're all donating land, what happens if hypothetically one project is approved but not the other and they all work together with that land donation? So, it's just a strange um situation. So, I'm just thinking out loud. I I agree and that is something that I have asked them and they're all very optimistic because it's kind of like they're the three musketeers. They're going in all together. Um they they said that it would be very difficult and the commercial would not be justified if the other two developments weren't approved, but that doesn't mean that they won't go forward individually.

Okay. Oh, sorry. I'm sorry that didn't even answer your question. For purposes of the the land donations, that would just be something that would have to come out in the wash. Um, if if say for instance, you approve the dually tracked and not the the maritish property and they're trying to share the school, there may not be enough donation for a school because schools require certain amount of acreage, right? So, that could cause be problematic in the future if they all if it's not one approved as the other. It just seems very risky. I think it's strategical. Oh, absolutely. Thank you, Miss Lou. Glad you were able to make it here safe.

Um I'm Miss Lou. I'm sorry, Miss Henson. Sorry. Um, so, um, just to catch you up, we're on, um, items, uh, 4A and 4B, talking about the, uh, uh, the development agreement, um, and the reasoning for the LAR track at, uh, the Haven at North Corner. Thank you. Do you have any questions before we before we move on? I know you just got here. I don't want to like rush you. I will listen and catch up and then go from there. I apologize for being late, guys.

That's okay. She was doing something really good. She is going to be a new precinct judge here in Lancaster County and we need precinct judges. So, I told her that was a good excused absence. My invitation must have gotten lost in the mail. I don't know. I have another friend that's a precinct judge. It's not an easy job. It was very stressful. All right. So, do we have any more things or do we want to move on?

Okay, let's move on to item C RZ 20251 1834 Hurley. And thank you again for the um uh table of contents so I can find the sheets. It's whoever's been doing that. Yes, that is all Jennifer. Thank you, Jennifer. It is awesome. Ships and numbered pages winning. Yes.

So, so like your agenda says, this is a a reasonzoning of 24.1 acres from LDR to uh rural residential located off of uh 200 off Great Falls Highway. Did I need to cover? Oh, okay. It's It's a family land. They're just looking to No, I was just trying to figure out one of their families put their house on it and use it agriculturally.

Okay. This is like really close to my house. Oh, really? Yeah. Does anybody have any questions? It's unusual to see somebody to go, I guess, down a reasonzoning. Normally, they want to go up. They don't normally want to go down. For sure. For sure. So, yeah. From from LDR to rural residential, but it's uh they they want to use it agriculturally and and they have a family member that would like to to put a house. And so, you know, listen, It's not contiguous. It's got one little piece.

No, it's a it's a it's a different little It's an untraditional shape. It is, but they felt combin they they own several pieces right there. And so they felt that their application would be a little stronger if they did all of them and had a little bit more acreage than just the the one or two pieces. Anybody have any questions or concerns? That was easy. It's an easy one. All right. Thank you. I will get out of the way.

Next item on the agenda, RZ 20251864 space savers bracket. Okay. In this particular case, the applicant is proposing to reszone one acre from the parent track at 2339 Charlotte Highway. and it currently have a uh it has a resident on it and he wants to reszone from general business to LDR because he's modifying the parent property by adding two storage units and the ordinance says that um you can't have a residence on general business on general business t track. So he wants to uh reszone to LDR.

Oh, okay. Because it has a it has occupants in it. And I have a layout here if you guys wants wants to see it. It's in the packet. It's in the packet. So, do you have any question? Oh, got one. Oh, okay. Oh, it's over here. Got it. No, we we do have it. Thank you, Jennifer. I forgot we had those extra ones over there. Mine come out like that, too, when I first tried to print it.

So, you guys have you have any questions? So there um okay because right now it's I guess it's the back car back half of that track is currently just all RV and boat parking but they're planning on putting some more buildings in there. Put in two more storage units. Okay. Richardson, would you repeat what you just said, please? What did you [Laughter] What did you say? That's a good question. It's gone. It would have been good.

So, if you look if you look at the map, this area here is currently RV and boat parking. It's just gravel and stuff like that. They're looking at adding some more buildings. So, they're separating out this house buildings because it's general. Okay. Yeah. They'll be adding buildings building building C and building E. Yep. Those are those are those are the two additions. Yes. Going from business to residential. Yeah. But just just this little track right here where the little track. Yeah. just up top

is he's asking for a reszone reszoning there to LDR because it's currently zoned general business and there's a house on it now there's a house on it now that he rents out people I think people are living in it it's it's a rental property I'm confused it's it's own general business right now but there is a residence on it it's an existing residence I think it was there before the storage place went in and then they changed it to general. Okay, got it. Yep. So, it's just to match the use with the zoning.

It is. It's to make that one residential lot a conforming lot. So, they're going to pull that off, make it residential so that the house there that is occupied is conforming to the UDO. And then they want to build the other um storage units. So, because the house is a non-conforming use on that parcel, they can't get permits to build because they're there. So, they're breaking that one off, making it residential the way it's supposed to be, and then they're going to have the other parcel that'll stay general business. Thank you. Yes. Got it. Any more questions? Feel like we were the dog chasing our tail on that one, but we got

that. I'm flipping like 19 pages and trying to keep them in order because I want to look and I Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. You have a question. I heard somebody say something. All right. Next item on the agenda, RZ 2025 2080. Um, Circle S Ranch Blackman Farm.

So, for the easiest way to explain this, if you could pull your packet into page 82. Okay. So there there was a farm there in the past and it there were some some poultry barns there located as you can see them on that page there. It's a little long white rose there. Um the the family um the owner of the property passed and the some of the people who used the services of that facility bought the prop property. They didn't buy the entire farm. They they parceled out approximately 60 acres and that's the part of the farm that the the Circle S ranch owns. The outlined in blue parcel like the blue outlined is what they're requesting to reszone. They own that parcel and the one immediately to the left of it that has the two barns. So the the blue parcel that we're asking to reszone and the parcel that has the two barns on the left are owned by the same gentleman. He's requesting the parcel to that the subject parcel the outlined one be reszoned to AR to fit and so that he can combine the properties to make one combined parcel for his farm. I didn't know Circle S Ranch owned property out there.

Well, it's not showing up officially on the um the maps yet on the property report, but I have the deed. So, they did it in I think May of this year, so it's new.

No, I was just sorry, just an off-hand comment. One of the first projects I did when I moved back to the Charlotte area was I built their silos out in um Richburg. Well, they actually, it's an interesting story and kind of almost irrelevant, but they bought it because they used the the products from this farm and when the family um passed, the the buildings were not upkept and they were falling down. So, they're they bought it to upfit it, update it, and continue to be able to use what they get from that area. So, and it's helping the family through that, too. So, it's a really nice story. That is a nice story. It is a nice story. So, any questions?

Oh, no. We're back to chickens. Sorry. I couldn't resist.

I know. I saw it. That's on her calendar. Is that a calendar?

Yeah. She's got a chicken. Chicken. All right. Next item on the agenda. SD 20241350 Riverside single family. All right. Good evening, members of the commission. Uh this uh development, you've heard this one before. It was on the August plan commission agenda. The uh applicant developers resubmitted the uh same preliminary proposal uh same exact plan to be purred by the the planning commission again. So they're they're coming back for this byite development. Exactly the same. Made no changes. The what we have in our evolved work portal is exactly the same site plan as what you all saw a couple of months ago.

They didn't take any of our recommendations. No, ma'am. Okay. So, I'm looking at the TRC for is this the first time I'm seeing where the schools didn't approve something south of five has not approved based on the other projects in the area and the schools will be at student capacity. I can cross reference and see if they did it for anything else. I mean, it's just interesting, right, to see and and concerning. Um,

most of the time we do see it above five. That is correct. So, I'll see you.

So, this is actually reminding me of our our previous item with the impact fees. If the schools are not a part of it, I don't know. It's just concerning. and the SCOT because that's why we turned it down before was the especially with this second entrance being up there at the top of the hill and on a curve and everything like that. So on the on the TRC SC DOT said um the proposed access location shall not be considered approved until sight of distance and spacing requirements are met. So does that mean there are the entrances too close together or

we have had instances before where a plan goes forward gets approved by the planning commission and then six months after that std comes back to us and says hey what was approved on the preliminary plan actually doesn't meet our standards now so that has to be revised and sometimes that could be considered a minor modification of the plan and does not have to go back before the planning commission depending on the the um overall scope of How much that the entrance need to be changed? Yeah. Well, because this is the one we asked them to add the turning lane. Turning lane's the buffer up front. Correct. Right. Because we were worried about that. Yes. And still are. Yeah. Absolutely. Those concerns have not gone away.

She goes swimmingly. So, I need Allison or April to to to to chime in. Um um just because it's my first time. So we we've turned it down once and they're resubmitting with the exact same plan. So is it is it like we're starting over from scratch? Okay. basically because it's a new application um that they carried forward. Their um their statements are that it is a byright development and they've met all the requirements and they're submitting it as a byright development that has met all the requirements.

Madam Chair, yes. Perhaps someone at the staff. Has there been any fire department additions in that area that nobody up here knows about? It's a rhetorical question. I know there hasn't. That's important to think about.

That was my main concern last time is that emergency services has to go around their arm and past the elbow after they get around their elbow and back past their arm just to get to the volunteer station. and probably take an hour to get a fire truck down there. Yet the fire marshall approved it.

It says it's in the Van Wick Fire District. So, is are they their own fire district? I can check on our map to you. I'm I'm just reading it off of the TRC. It says the project is located with the Vanwick Fire District. So, they have a their own separate fire district outside of Lancaster counties. Okay. Did not know that they have a nice fire building. They have a nice I beg you pardon. Um it is a county agency. It serves the Vanwick area. Okay.

Um there's three in the panhandle that I'm aware of off the top of my head and Indian Land and Pleasant Valley merged last year or the year before. And then Vanwick uh is the next one down before you get to the rest of them. I was just I was just maybe I didn't ask my question well. I didn't know because when Banwick incorporated, do they also pull out and have their own separate? So they're still part of the county system. Okay, that's I didn't ask my question. Well, sorry.

Got a question. So go. Thank you. this. So, nothing's been changed. That's that's what we just talked about just a second. Nothing's been changed even though we asked about the turning lane and um he said that he would he would do one um the curve still and so nothing has been changed on here at all. That is They didn't bring anything else up. They exact same site plan.

Oh, this is the one with that fancy um thing in the front. He was talking about the big fancy monument at the entrance, but it's the curves. It's the road.

Could either Allison or April please um because you'll do a better job than I am, define what a buy development is and make sure everybody understands what they mean by that. By development um is also um sometimes in some jurisdictions labeled as formbbased development. It's basically that a property owner has certain rights to their property and that if there are certain requirements on all of those requirements are met that they have a right to build on that property.

I understood that I uh I think that's you know the first vote in. I was actually one of the ones that said yes. Um it is beautiful land. It would make a beautiful homestead, but if there's safety concerns for the people that are moving in there, that's still a safety concern that I have. Um and there's not any modifications being done by the developer to change that. I understand that it may not be in the UDO, but um you know, we were I personally was hoping that they would come back with um a little something a little stronger.

It's still part of the county process that it's coming before us and they have to listen to what our recommendations are. So,

does where where do things fall when by right hits safety? What trumps what? the requirements in there and that are presented um that's that's why the fire marshall that's why sod that's why those expert people are included on the TRC so if they've reviewed it and they say that it meets the requirements of say so DOT for their regulations as well as our UDO that's them saying that it it's met the requirements And it would be improper for them to be contacted saying, "How can you approve this

or get clarification?" That's a nicer way of saying it. Well, yeah. I mean, if our concerns could be forwarded to fire and say, "We see that you approve this, but here's our concern." Or is that meddling? Matthew, is this the project that you asked for those or is it a different project? Could be the same project. So, you've already you went and asked above you as the fire marshall and you asked DOT for that, right? Can we provide those emails in the packet, please? Sure.

And I just want to be clear on can I the the the two entrances. Um, one we know is going to be the main entrance, one's just going to be an entrance, but this, you know, the houses, um, they are bigger lots. Um, and they're bigger, you know, they're bigger yards and everything, but it's the two entrance ways. I know we had uh, one development that just came up and they could they were only approved for one entrance. So, how far how far apart distanced are these two entrances and you said that they were subject to change. Am I correct about that, Miss Williams? Is it possible or would that be you?

It is possible that SCOT at a later date could be six months from now could come down and say that, hey, what was approved that the planning commission actually does not meet our current standards. So, uh, they have to adjust them and it can be that can be a minor modification. It doesn't have to necessarily come back to the planning commission. So, what would make it cross a threshold of being a a major change and having to come back before us should it get to that point? That's typically a conversation I have with April and with Allison. If there's a a vast change on the site plan, then have a conversation with them and then we would bring it back to you all. Oh,

okay. Yeah, I was going to if it's a road changing or an entrance changing, that's going to be significant enough to bring back for a review. Good to know.

What are the legal ramifications if we vote this down and it is my right to build? Almost every development has an appellet process. So they there there is a next step that they could file. Thank you. What would be more time consuming to change it or to appeal it?

I mean that's kind of the statement. Um it's not necessarily always time consuming. It's cost prohibited sometimes to make massive changes that they feel that aren't required. Um, that's just their right as a property owner that has rights to their property. Um, I I think that's kind of the stance that they're taking from what I understand with conversations. Um, that that's their right. That's their option. You have to do I mean there are guidelines and I've tried to explain clearly, but at the end of the day, you have to make the decision. Um, however, just know that there are repercussions for some decisions if you make them. When you say repercussions, is that the same as appellet process or

they can file a lawsuit? That's what I was hearing at the last, you know, because knowing the buy right procedure. Um, Mr. Matthew, if possible, could you assimilate what emergency services are available and some approximate time constraints around what those responses would be? Sure. I can email the fire marshall and ask him. Thank you, sir. Welcome.

It's a good request, Jason. I'm sorry to belabor this, but if they didn't go um a lawsuit route, what is the appellet process that as it pertains to us? That is the appellet process. [Music] But we would not necessarily have to defend it. We could just cave, right? I'm sorry. Can you repeat that?

We wouldn't have to defend it if we could just approve it then. Correct. Yes, ma'am.

We wouldn't be losing anything. So, so just to clarify, and I'm not sure if I'm understanding you right, but um if if they chose the the the um appeal process or file suit, it it's not necessarily that you always have to pay. It's a the the judge would look at it and determine if based on the code, based on the state laws, based on all of those requirements, did you did you make the appropriate decision? It would be mostly either you aired in your decision and it should have been approved and they can they can approve it. They can say that you may have aired in your decision and send it back to you to redo. Um or they could see that you you were justified in your decision and say that you know your your decision stands. Um but it's not just paying to make them go away. It it would be they would be able to. However, there are options if it goes that far. Um, they could they could sue the county for other things like damages and the lost time that you know changes in costs that you caused the delay and those things. So, so it could it could become very costly for the county to do so.

The judge would say safety was the main concern and our decision. uh they would look at the UDO, the state law, and see if it was following those requirements. Um getting into specifics um with the site layout on I think it's 107 that that tight uh I think it should have been rounded out to be a smooth curve where they have that kind of bulb sticking out. Is that something that seems it's unsightly. Sorry. What are you

on page? Um I know we talked about it before, but I thought they revised that. This one right here. Oh, that right there. Yeah. Why is that still? Oh, right there. Yeah, I'm sorry.

On the on the large uh print, it's showing the updated where TE's in, but the blowup is still showing the um before it was revised. And that was my question of if it was actually revised or if they resubmitted. Are you talking about ground lots 44 through 47? Yes. Uh yeah, the one that has the kind of the more the culde-sac uh that is the revised version. Okay. This hard car that they gave us, this is the new revised version. Okay. So the blowup on page 107 is still showing the old one. Oh,

and that's probably how they submitted it, but I'm just It's good that they've fixed it because I before Yeah. Okay. Thanks for clarifying. No big deal. I'm happy to see that at least that. Y'all wonder what you were talking about. Thank you. Right here. Last time it came down and it was like it was a corner with a weird little half culde-sac. Now they've got a full culde-sac. for before it was a weird shape and now they've got actually a little culde-sac to make it flow better. Oh, I see. 44 to 47. Okay. Yes.

But Matthew, my my question though, we don't the county doesn't allow those, right? It's not So, in talking with public works, they are allowed in certain instances, but in this case, they were trying to have a kind of a full intersection at one of those awkward u elbows. And so that's where the county's concern came from. And so that's why they ended up revising it to more of a traditional culde-sac meeting the block length requirements and meeting the connectivity requirements. Okay. Thank you.

Um I understand this is just preliminary site plan, but what I don't see here and I have seen in many other places any of the kickouts on the road for uh the the fire department parking areas. I think they're really kind of referred to. Um, it's really just a retraction of the curb back out four or five feet and something like that. Usually they're near fire hydrants. I've seen it in a lot of other neighborhoods u especially up around Harrisburg and uh uh 160 area. And then also I have a question because I can't remember and it's not being apparent. Is there any maybe Miss Williams or Miss Harden can answer this a little better. The is there any restriction from public rightway where a road would be on where and pardon me while I stumble this out where your center line would project vehicles motion into private property. Does that make sense? All right. And and it might be easier if I just go ahead and hold this up and say to everybody that when you're coming down uh where'd it go? Coming down Riverside here that as you come over and this is a hill, right?

All right. So, when you come over that hill, you miss that turn and there's nothing to keep you from driving straight through one of these yards and into one of these houses. And so my question becomes, you know, whether it's a burm or screening or something. Yeah. buffer stuff that it's going to be something more significant than, you know, a little fence. That's, you know, my I don't own a vehicle that's not capable of making that leap. Um, and while it may not be an actual thing in writing, I'm just curious because I can't recall if I've ever seen it in any road design situation,

which comes back to site triangle type question, but the way that you worded it, it's not per se in the code that way. Um but there are requirements for um for curve uh radius and there are um requirements for um the way that the roads intersect but there's not a requirement based on hill at this time other than the speed limit. Other than speed limits and um that it remind me it's Riverside County or state. I think it's state. Okay. If it's state, then the DOT would definitely have an impact on where it could be located, what the speed is in that area.

Pardon? It's the incoming outgoing angles and the curvature. Yeah. Yeah. Excuse me. DOT had to approve those entrances. So, by them being involved, it would be a state road. Yep. going fishing, you know, throwing out. Thank you. I just looked at it, you know, they just look at a scale versus looking at the physical road. I know because

and for the same purpose like we would ask fire marshall if he was really sure that fire services or police or whoever could get down there. Is there an opportunity to request a review by DOT again under the guise of a specific issue? Yes. Thank you, Commissioner.

Would you like us to make that an action item? Uh, I think it deserves it. I agree. I mean, considering they didn't look at any of our recommendations with the the buffer and looking at redesigning some of these things or even the addition of the turn lanes to make those turns safer, I think that asking them to look at it again would be very helpful. Thank you, Jason. And the belligerent no at Miss Williams at the last meeting was very unsettling. Any other questions or comments?

Oh, sorry. I didn't mean to do that. All right. Um, next item on the agenda is NRN 20252188 October group submitt. And thank you, Matthew. Hello again, commissioners. Um, we have a group submitt from Sandra at E911 addressing regarding names for two neighborhoods. Um, the list is attached um in your packet attached to the application. Um, back in March of 2024, we approved names for the Sands at Kershaw. We had a whole list of lanes. Two of those names the developer now wants to retract and replace them with the names Buckhead Trail and Brie Court. And then um Riverside Single Family had already had some road name approvals, but they want to add three addition they didn't get all of their names in. So they've got three additional names to add to the road names um on their plat. That's Croad Lane, Mountain Side Road, and Karp Lane. here for questions.

That's the one we were just talking about. Yes. Yes. We had already processed the the request for the names previously. They're adding some still stand that being from Louisiana, there's no such thing as a crawad, [Laughter] [Music] crawfish, mudbug. But in this part of the country, they're called crawads. Yep. I didn't say I was right. I just said that's what it is.

Okay, that finishes everything. So, next I'm assuming Miss Allison's going to come talk about this giant notebook and our pretty little flash drive that we have waiting for us.

I thought that was just a door prize. Um, thank you very much. Um, I'm happy to announce that the UDIO consultants delivered the uh document on time. Um, as as promised. Um, we received them on September 30th. Um, they gave us two different versions. The version you have in print is the one that has the tra the tracking on the changes. Um the way they've tracked changes that are proposed, they've put um footnotes throughout the document. Yes.

So there's footnotes rather than lines and scratching out and stuff like that. Um this document is 770 some pages. The document without it, a clean document without the notes and everything. It ranges in the 590ome range. Both versions are on your flash drive. And not only are they both on the flash drive, they're both available in Adobe PDF and Word document. So if you want to start making changes and things um in the word document that because this is a public review document, there will be opportunities for change until we get to the final review. Um you can go ahead and start making notes in your own versions um for bringing for next time we come back on these items. Um I want to publicly thank um Miss Tinklerberg, Miss Richards, and Mr. Cavalier. They have done a lot of work on as the subcommittee, your subcommittee on this. They had many uh evenings going through minutia uh with me on things that I couldn't have of couldn't have even begun to start to do on my own. So I greatly appreciate the heavy lifting that they did. Um I s also appreciate the stakeholder groups and the staff for doing a good bit of the reviewing as well. We've had many many hours of people sitting down talking about details like what is a street.

Um and believe it or not we still don't know. We still are out to to pastor on that one until we get uh some kind of agreement uh before the final review.

Uh I wanted to mention or talk to you a little bit about the process that we go from here. So for the first thing is um first the next meeting we are having is a uh the UDO will be presented at a cow meeting with the council on the 15th to give them the overview of that as well. Um, I don't expect any of us to have read through that by the 15th, but I'm going to do my darnest and um and go ahead and start marking the places where either I find that we haven't got things or things have changed since the time that we turned comments on in um excuse me in if you'll remember module one, which is the the zoning districts and the the um dimensional requirements for um residential units was done in public went to the public in 2023. three um just prior to when I got here 2022 the end of or beginning of 2023 January. Um so it's been a couple years. We've learned things since that um document was put into place as the the recommendations from the public review on that. Um so it's worth going back over again. It's also worth going back through the document and double-checking all of the cross references and make sure that they all match. Um we have done a lot of uh code enforcement uh in the last couple of months where I've uh staff and I have found lots of places where the code says one thing one place and kind of says another thing another place. So we're trying to make sure that all of those are are identified as we go. Um in addition we are going to have kind of like a road show where we are going to bring a public meeting to each region of the the county the same way we did with the comprehensive plan. We'll have a meeting in um in the Indianland area. We'll have a meeting in Lancaster and we'll have a meeting in the Kershaw area. Um if you don't mind when we do schedule those, if you uh the area that you live near, if you don't mind um

planning to show up, you don't have to make a presentation. It's just about having you there to listen to the the community and bring the community's words back um with the way you understand it coming from your community. um it makes a better representation for um the document in the end. If if like Miss Richards knows about the area near Edge Edgewater and and Kataba Ridge, um you're going to bring that local knowledge in with the knowledge that comes from your neighbors in that one. Um I am still making sure that I've got the ability to get the dates in such a way that they don't conflict with holidays. Um getting closer and closer to having to put that in. So before I finalize any of them, I wanted to ask if in the next in this month and the next month other than the holidays, if anyone has any big days that they are not able to make a meeting, I want to make note of that and try and make sure that the meeting that we schedule in that time doesn't connect with your um doesn't conflict with your schedule.

I'll start. Miss Harden, I will be out of town December 11th through the 16th. Okay. I'm I'm going for ending ending these road shows in November. Um so if you say December 11th through the 16th. Yeah. Okay. Just in case it comes up. It may go that far. So thank you very much. And then it looks like the 20th and the 21st and the 22nd. Um I think I'm going to be out of town too.

I promise you I will not have a meeting the week of December 22nd. And I promise you I pretty much would would be in trouble with everybody I know if I tried to make a staff meeting on the 19 a big meeting on the 19th or after. Um if we do resume if we are not finished by the end of December, we will resume in January. Um I don't I can tell you I don't want to have a meeting anytime after the 19th at all. They start September 30th, right? Or they started Pardon? Have they already started for for has what already started? I thought I saw um a notification that the this road show had already started.

Oh, no. That there may be some other things going on like Civic 101 or something like that. Um and there's there may be other departments having meetings. Um but for us, this will have its own press release. The marketing department um reached out to me. We're going to talk about when to notify and how to notify and make the make everything match and and that kind of thing. Yes, Miss Williams. The ones that are already being posted and advertised are for the transportation tax. Um administration is traveling around doing that educational series right now. Thank you. Thank you. That's completely forgot about that. I'm in my own world. No,

I'm trying to catch I'm trying to follow. October the 15th is when they're you're doing it to that's the council has a cow meeting that day. We're going to go through um a bunch of the hot topic issues um on that day and and get their temperature on those. I'm sorry. They have a what meeting? Cow meeting committee of the whole CO. Oh, I thought it was an agricultural meeting. Okay. Not heard that term. Thank you. I'm sorry. I was distracted. Is that October 15th you said?

Yes, sir. October 15th. That's the um third Wednesday of October. The cow meetings are typically the Wednesday after the first meeting of the month with the council. So typically they're on the second Wednesday, but this month the month or in October it starts on Wednesday the 1st. So it's on the 3. Not that you needed to know that. I'm just explaining how I know where I'm doing.

And they would be here. Well, the ones that we have here because we will be discussing the UDO from here until it's done. Um that will be here will be in this location, but the ones that we have out in the group um targeting the Dell web library and the Kershaw Library and then either here or at the um historic courthouse depending upon availability of the day. Eric, yes, the Dell web library there. Um, can we when we're planning the one for there, we've had meetings in the past where we only had access to one of their rooms when they have the access to open it. I think we'll definitely need the full space to make sure that we can have I agree. Um,

that might limit our days because I know a lot of things meet there regular. I downloaded their calendars last week and have started looking at it, but they the November calendar wasn't as available. So, I'm trying to make sure that I don't have it that we pick a day that doesn't have any activities in those rooms so that we can open it up. Thank you for that. Okay. So, just to be clear that we're starting the first meeting that that we need to be at on October the 15th. Nope, that's not correct.

No, October 15th is a workshop um or is a cow meeting with the council here in this building. You're welcome to attend, but that's not a required meeting for you at all. Um when I put the calendar together, we're going to also talk about or it'll be on your agenda for review in two weeks at the October meeting that um we'll have the dates set when we have the the meetings out in the county. We'll also have a discussion about how much time it's going to take the count you to go through this document as well. Um it may be such a more than likely will be such that you will we will need to have additional meetings scheduled. Whether we have them here in person or whether we do them virtually will depend upon if we are making decisions at those meetings um in part. Um, so there's still some clearing up to do on the future dates, but I needed to make sure I didn't accidentally schedule a meeting during someone's doctor's appointment or some other family event.

Um, okay. So, I'm going to be out of town October 23rd, 24th, and 31st. 23rd. 24th and 31st. Thank you. Um, I have It's a wedding. if it's possible for them to not be on a Thursday. I My son has football games. I'm actually missing one right now. So, I don't want to miss anymore. We will make our most flexibility as possible. Because if you have a son at football, I'm guessing there's others in Indian land that also have sons at football.

All right. Funny because I typically skip the October meeting because that's my birthday and two days before my birthday is my anniversary. But this year I told my husband like, "Hey, I need you to back up a little bit. A lot going on." Gotcha.

All right. Thank you for the input. Um we'll have a a longer discussion about the dates and the future time frames at your next meeting. and the um the consultants. Um I had hoped to get them here on the 15th. They will not be here at the 15th. Um but they I'm meeting with them this Friday to discuss with the next time that they will be in the area and when they can come. So that's part of the work on this calendar is making sure I can get them down here more than once a month to help push this process along. Um the UDO is part of the driver for the moratorum. Um the moratorum wording is that the moratorum is proposed because we have a UDO coming and it gives nine months for this review time. Um I don't want to have to take the whole nine months but we will go at the pace that the planning commission and the public dictate. If the public has a lot of things to say we may have to listen more than once. Um, and there may be, you know, opportunities to look at a at the what we proposed for a change and then look at it again. I do want it to be a good process. I do want it to be a good document. Um, uh, but I don't want it to to be a become an extended project. Um, I have been involved with a UDO process that was supposed to be a two-year process, turned out to be seven. Um, and I really don't want to do that. I really, really, really don't want to do that. I would really like to be able to retire after this is done. Not immediately, but you know, at some point after this is done. Don't don't make me go out to 2030.

I have a quick question and I don't want it to turn into a whole separate um conversation, but you mentioned the moratorum and it's reflective of having time to wrap up the UDO because the UDO is affecting the entire county. Remind me why we're we limited the moratorum only for the northern part and not everywhere. That was a council choice. Okay.

Um staff didn't project any of the that information. That was a council choice. If I were to guess, which is I'm not putting myself in council's head or words or anything like that, but we have the most projects and the most petitions coming from that area. And so the development pressure is heavier there. Um, and this would allow for us to get it get the new UDO in place in a in a time frame that would affect that um that development pressure. There are in the ordinance that is proposed there are statements about um population explosion growth that come from that came from our comprehensive plan. It talks about the 476% increase in population in the panhandle um since the last uh since the last census or since the 2000 census. It talks about the um outcry from the public because we've heard many times at council meetings people coming up saying we need a moratorium. We need to hold on to development in Indian land. we've talked about in that ordinance that um this is something that is in response to not just concerns from the council and staff but also from the public. So this is um and it is a 9-month uh moratorium proposal. Um they did discuss 12 and six but came down on nine. Um and hopefully well not hopefully my goal is to make sure that this UDO is complete. um before the moratorum ends.

I guess my thought process in asking that is most of the residential things though that have been coming across our table are actually south of five because while I'm thankful to hear that it's coming to Indianland, it's seems a little bit after the thought a little too late but still very helpful. Okay. Is the moratorum um on text amendments only for that area of the county and not the whole county? I I I need to clarify with our county attorney before I tell you yes or no. I know that in my mind it is for all the county. However, I need to verify before I give you a final answer.

That's what common sense would be. But then again, well, we've we've done that before. We have slowed down text amendments before, but um we have some that have been development um centered and based on deadlines that have come through since then. We've had I have four or five of them in my file that are just hanging out waiting. They're like, "Oh, we have time to wait." So, those did not come to you. Um and I'm sorry again to go off on the threat. Do you know when the the date of the final reading is the third reading

of the um moratorum? Yeah. So another thing that is uh in the moratorum ordinance language um that is proposed is the opportunity to invoke the pending or ordinance doctrine. So, the pending ordinance doctrine is a doctrine in South Carolina that allows for ordinances to be enacted on first reading rather than waiting for third. And it is specifically for times when a community wants to make a change in something and they want to prevent uh something from something from coming in and sliding in at the last minute. I didn't know about that, but yeah,

exactly. Um the county council and since I've been here has used it for the asphalt plant proposals um uh to hold off on any further applications for that until they could get the ordinance the way they wanted it to. And they used it one other time I was looking at um do you remember the last time they used it before that?

I think in your email it was an amusement. Oh yeah, the um indoor amusements in the um business park. Um we talked about uh the ability for um uh kid-friendly amusements, indoor amusements was actually an allowed use in light industrial zones and there was a concern about that. So put the pending ordinance option on that and removed that. Okay. Thank you. I didn't know about that. Thank you. Option.

Sure. But if if they don't do it and and I cannot tell you how things will go because I do not stand here to represent the council. Um but I do know that as of right now the ordinance is on the agenda for the 13th. The legal ad went out in the newspaper on Saturday. It included the ordinance uh title and the legal description of the area bound by this mor proposed to be bound by the moratorum. Um it also included a map that showed the area highlighted on the map in which the or the moratorum would be approved if it is approved. And then the language for the ordinance uh will be available for them to make a a vote on the 13th. And they have the same with every ordinance they have three choices uh approve, deny or four choices. Approve, deny, amend, or don't pick it up. Um, so they can approve it with or without the pending ordinance doctrine. They can decide to continue it if they want and make other changes. They can um they can they can make all kinds of choices on that. So I can't stand here and represent that this will happen.

Thanks for letting me know what the options are. Oh, sure. Sure. Um, if they don't invoke the pending ordinance doctrine on the 13th, then the third reading would be on November 10th. Miss Harden. Yes sir. In the event that they do adopt it on the 13th, how does that apply to our current agenda? What that means is that anything that has already received an application from staff by the the date of or the time of the adoption on the 13th will be pro processed unless the council makes it a different date. the council may choose if they'd like to say we're not going to process anything that was

um that was uh applied for since some time frame. Um but typically when they act they act on the date that they have the first one and uh which case anything that comes in after that that is in the moratorum area um would be told I'm sorry we have a moratorum um we're not allowed to take the application for subdivision in this area. um you need to wait until the moratorum is over. So current applications would be

current applications for residential subdivisions and for residential multif family developments. Um in the UDO we have such uh examples as cottage cottage courts, apartment buildings, garden apartments, town homes, duplexes, triplexes, forplexes. All of those would be restricted in this area from applying. Uh but if you have an existing development agreement or an existing master plan that has been approved, then you would be able to continue forward. And an example of that would be um in the exchange where the Lowe's grocery stores be has just recently gone in. Um there are town homes proposed behind that building. Um those town homes will be allowed to continue. Um, there are plenty of neighborhoods in Indian land that are not finished. Sugar Creek, for one, has not been built out. Sugar Creek will not be prevented from pulling permits because they have a plat approval and they have the ability to go forward with that. So, it's not about stopping um people that have the the right currently to build. It's about holding off on new stuff until we can get the new rules in. But

this won't apply to resoning requests. It's just It will also apply to resoning requests. Thank you, mayor.

We have had a lot of conversation. I have a whole notebook. I wish I brought it with me that um Jennifer put together with help from Kirsten and others that as all the applications that we have in the development services division from building, from storm water, from zoning and planning and we have gone through one by one and listed what we think the answer is on this for the moratorum. Is this going to be a able to be reviewed or not? And it's all in a chart. I've passed it off to the county administrator for his input if he's got any questions about that. But we are trying to be as proactive about being about knowing upfront what you would and would not be allowed to apply for in that um in that time frame and in that area.

Thank you so much. You're welcome. Madam Chairman, can I make a comment? I am just so excited that Commissioner Lou is back. I have I'm just um I'm tender, but I'm just grateful to see her back and smiling. So, yes. Thank you. Um, and I also wanted to thank everybody because I feel like we've done this group has done a lot of work already this year and I know we have a lot more to do, but I feel like everybody's been digging in and that's that is exciting. So,

thank you. Yes. All right. Are we done? Anybody have anything else to say? Then make motion to adjurnn. I second it. You're adjourned. When the streaming goes off, can I share a story?