City Council - Regular Meeting

The only thing that I can't actually put an edge upon

Let us bring the city of Spartanburg City Council meeting to order.

As I was just silencing my digital device, would you all mind looking at yours to make sure it is silent? And we're gonna stand for a moment of silence and we'll be led by the Pledge of Allegiance by Troop Two. We were not here, of course, on last week, but all of us at some point remember what went on at 9-11. So just in your thoughts in this moment of silence, just continue to keep everyone affected. Just keep America in their thoughts and your prayers. Amen. I'm going to ask Troop 2 to come forward and lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance, please. Come on up. Troop 2, before you lead us in the pledge, if I could, to my left, just give us your name and your grade, please.

My name is Jacqueline. I'm in ninth grade. My name is James Anderson from . My name is . My name is . My name is . My name is . My name is . My name is .

My name is . My name is . My name is . My name is . My name is .

Thank you, Troop 2.

If you don't mind, lead us in the pledge.

To the flag of the United States of America, and to

Thank you, guys. Thank you for that. We do appreciate you all coming, but to the troop leaders there, it's a pretty lengthy agenda. And if you guys want to be excused, just feel at any point. I know they have their homework tonight. So, where are we item 3 approve of the minutes for the August 24th, 2026 city council meeting 2nd, all in favor any that oppose us have it item for approval of the agenda for the September 14th, 2026 city council meeting. So, move 2nd, all in favor any that oppose us have it. We have public comments and the way this will work. is that I'm gonna call you up and you just repeat your name. You don't have to give us your address. We have that information here handy. And after you give us your name, you will have two minutes to state whatever you come to talk to us about this evening. All right, and we have Jonah Otwell. Otwell. Okay, thank you. John LaBlanche. John LaBlanche. Donovan Lyons.

Thank you, Mary, appreciate you for having me and allow me to speak. I know I've got 2 minutes here, so I'll try to make this short brief. 1st of all, I wanted to thank your city managers, city manager, city clerk, Christie for being responsive. I worked in city government for 32 years. I know it's we're not always the best to get back to folks. Absolutely love the fact that she called me back and very responsive. Also, your fire Marshall back there. Uh, Mr smart William smart has been outstanding. So, coming from city government, I appreciate the responsiveness to I didn't tell him who I was or anything. The responsiveness to just someone calling their office. So outstanding. I appreciate it very much. It means a lot. I do live in Oxford, Mississippi, the home of the University of Mississippi. So I come from a college town quote unquote. Spent 32 years in law enforcement, so I live 3 states away and I drove here for 2 minutes to be here to speak. To speak for 2 minutes, so I drove all the way here. My daughter is a student athlete converse university plays volleyball there. She decided to make this place or home a couple of years ago because she fell in love with Spartanburg. She even thinking about staying here. The reason I'm up here speaking today is because she has moved into a location here in Spartanburg, Riverwood apartment homes. In less than sanitary conditions, which is forced her out of her home for the last 2 or 3 weeks. We have mean, sir, although we've had to reach out to family for help, but she has not been able to stay there because of the conditions of this department. I can't imagine people without means what they would do if their family member or loved 1 was staying there and was unable to pay for this. Um, and that being said, I've tried to reach out to this company and I've dealt with local management here, but what I found it out is Morgan properties who owns these properties has over 100,000 units nationwide. including hundreds and hundreds of properties and many of those here in Spartanburg. All I'm asking you and the council is to consider and keep doing your public oversight of these out-of-state companies that have no vested interest in the citizens of Spartanburg. My vested interest is here. You guys are my voice. Okay, you guys, this gentleman William smart, he's my voice here. So, I know my time's up, but I appreciate it driving all the way up.

Go ahead and finish your comments.

I just, I appreciate you guys doing that. You guys are my voice because I can't be here. She's 21. I get it. She's an adult. She's a full time student athlete. She's trying to live her life and not live in unsanitary conditions. So, thank you all for having me for these last couple of minutes again. Thanks to you guys. I was a policeman for 32 years. I take back everything I said about firefighters. All right? So you guys do more than just eat and sleep in the firehouse, all right?

Awesome.

Thanks, guys.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Be safe when you head back home. Also, we have Ms. Beverly Benson.

Hello. My minute hasn't started yet. The other people who weren't here yet, can I have their time? I just want to thank you. I've petitioned the mayor to let me come and speak in reference to poetry and how poetry, the spoken word, how it affects everything. And if you say it in a different way, perhaps people think a different way. Perhaps they respond a different way. Thank you, Christy. Thank you, Mayor. Thank all of you for this opportunity to come before you. It feels a little odd, and that's why I'm turning kind of odd, because as having spoken before, it's kind of hard to speak with my back to the audience. You are my main audience, but they too are, so it just feels a little odd for my back to be to you. We've spoken a little bit about how in these settings, it sometimes gets contentious, sometimes gets a little loud, sometimes it gets a little rude. My thought though is, where does it say that soft words turneth away wrath? Is it near the same place where two agreed should walk along the same path? What would be the ultimate outcome if two who did not see eye to eye could at least agree where it is written that God created the sky? It is not unusual for folks to bicker and squabble, never seeming to agree who was wrong. But time has shown us that there is more shine in our sparkle city when we all try a little harder to get along. conviction on the left compassion on the right compromise in the middle it may be there that we can see what some one wise has already said we are not as different as we are alike underneath every skin Blood runs red. Where is it written that there is a time for everything under the sun? Could this be the time and the place we give honor and respect to everyone and anyone who dares to speak and use their voice to explain, make an appeal or defend their choice? Where is it written that we can all agree that different is an acceptable space to be and sometimes that's you? Sometimes that's me. And where is it written that your brother looks exactly like him and exactly like me? Different thoughts, different wants, different needs, all expressed within the same hallowed spaces. Multi-levels of wealth and education all are due the same weight of respect, no matter their status or station. Where is it written that the mightiest and tiniest of all weapons can be as a two-edged sword, weighing about three ounces, laying about three inches, the tongue, the weapon of verbal disruption. It is also the source of healing words, words smooth as butter, dissolving argumentative eruption. He rules the room. with wisdom and grace, not the one spewing powerful pounding curses covered in anger with a despair all over his face. Where is it written that true strength, power, and purpose is projected when everyone is recognized and respected? Where is it written that when words are of wisdom from hearts of understanding, Then the result is peacefully, powerfully, positively, purposefully outstanding. I ask you, where is it written?

Ms. Benson, thank you for that. Where is it written? Thank you. That ends our public comments. Item 6, we have a proclamation declaring September the 17th through September the 23rd, 2026 as Constitution Week in the City of Spartanburg. And we have

It's great to be here and have you doing this. Thank you all for coming.

As Ms. Benson just mentioned, having my back to the audience here, but just so they know what we are presenting in the proclamation today is whereas September the 17th, 2026 marked the 239th anniversary of the drafting of the Constitution of the United States of America by the Constitutional Convention. And whereas at the Constitutional Convention our founding fathers, in order to secure the blessing of liberty for themselves and their prosperity, did ordain and establish a Constitution for the United States of America, Whereas the signing provided an historic opportunity for all Americans to learn about and remember the achievement of our founders in the reflection on the rights and privileges of citizens, as well as the attendance responsibility. And whereas the independence guaranteed to American people by the Constitution should be celebrated within ceremonies, and activities during the Constitution Week, September the 17th through the 23rd, as designated by the proclamation of the President of the United States of America, in accordance with Public Law 915. Now, therefore, I, Jerome Rice, Jr., by the virtue and authority vested in me as the mayor of the city of Spartanburg, and on behalf of my fellow city council members, do hereby proclaim the week of September the 17th through September the 23rd, 26th as Constitution Week and in the city of Spartanburg and urge all of our citizens to pay special attention during the week to our federal constitution and advantages of the American citizens. So thank you all on behalf of the city of Spartanburg for what you do and we will have our picture. Yes, ma'am.

Thank you.

Item seven, we have a special recognition of a retiring personnel from the city of Spartanburg in the light blue and orange or peach shirt. Come on down, Mr. Cleveland. I used to think I was a fairly sharp dresser until I met Mark. No, man, Mark. I mean, it does come with, you know. You're a good guy. I'm not going to get too much into it, but Mr. Mark Cleveland has been a fixture. of Spartanburg's team since 2004. He originally joined the city as the project manager and was then tasked to lead our parking operations. He developed our parking program and contributed to its success and smooth operation for the majority of his time with the city. Because of his exceptional customer service skill, Mark finished his career in the city manager's office as a customer service manager. He was tasked with supporting and training our customer service focus position to his high standard and truly, truly high standard. Apart from his official role, Mark has also served as a coordinator with various municipalities and elected officials. On behalf of the city and city council, he is responsible for hosting and coordinating numerous events, parades and celebration. Mark's hard work and dedication has been a boom for the city and our partners. But what makes him stands out more than anything is the great love and care that he generously shares with everyone. From strangers to colleagues and partner, Mark is steadfast in showing us all the meaning of care. He has been a wonderful diplomat and representative of the city of Spartanburg, truly representing our best. He will be greatly missed, and we are so thankful for the impact that he's had on all of our lives. So, Mr. Cleveland, we do hereby give. the City of Spartanburg Outstanding Service Award Special Recognition to Mark Cleveland for his dedication and commitment to the City of Spartanburg, 8-2-2004 to September the 3rd, 2026. Congratulations. I have a speech ready, but then the Boy Scouts showed up, so I can't say it.

Mark, this is not for you. Mayor gave you this. This is for us. So like the mayor said, Mark, you're one of the kindest people anyone's ever met. And you've changed the city. I think we're all a little bit kinder because of the example you set. And for those who don't know, appreciate you. Mark did that by coming in and being sweet and talking to people. The angriest people you can ever experience would come in, calling this man a friend. He taught us the meaning of kindness. And he would do that with staff alike, and sometimes it was just coming in and checking on you. Sometimes it was bringing you stuff that Aunt Carolyn made that made us all a little bit fatter, but it was worth every bite. Sometimes it was just little bits of candy and those little bits of candy or just indications of the kindness that you were trying to show everybody So since you're robbing us of that We were having this in the city for the rest of time This is the mark Cleveland kindness jar Dennis thought this was a square drawer. There was five dollars in here and I kept the $5. But we're going to put candy in here so we can remember you always and let other people see from your example. We love you and we're going to miss you.

To our city manager, Chris Story. Mitch Kennedy, and Kevin Limehouse. To all of you council people, I've had several groups of councilmen. Ms. Leslie, I didn't get to work with you much, but thank you for taking a part and sharing with the group. Megan, you my honey bun. You my honey bun. Erica, you the love of my life, girl. Ms. Little John, She's our fashion statement. She gives me my colors. If you wanna know where I get all these different colors from, Ruth Lil Jon. Jamie Fulmer, his dad, Dr. Fulmer, I always salute him, recognizing your father and give him our love and appreciation. And Miss Sally, I had to drive her in the Christmas parade. And I tell you, that was a drive. She say, turn the radio on, ain't no Christmas music. I want to holler at the people at the window. I said, well, go ahead. I wrote my window up and we had a fun time. Ms. Sally, thank you. And I don't know who will be your driver this year, but I think you might want to get on the float with the mayor because you're not going to walk. But to all of the city employees, I'm not going to call departments, but for every single one of you, I love and appreciate what you've done for me. At my lowest time in my life of 2007, when I lost my mom, 77 days later, I lost my brother. But God has been good. Every department in this city came by and visited me during that dark hour. I'll never forget you. Kevin, for that kindness jar. I bought a bag of candy yesterday. I said, what the hell am I doing? But I'm going to bring it by there and let you fill up the jar and continue to give everybody some love. But to the city of Spartanburg, thank you so much for everything you've done. Mitch, I love you, boy. You know I do. Me and Mitch butt heads, but he always come out the winner. Thank you all so much for everything. God bless you and God bless the city of Spartanburg.

Mr. Cleveland.

Mr. Mayor, Mark has been a giant in our city for 20 plus years, as he pointed out.

And I think It would be appropriate for the scouts that are here that are learning about civil service and civic service to look at Mark Cleveland because he is the perfect example of what a civic servant should be. And so if you ever have questions about what that is, call Mark Cleveland. He's got time on his hands now.

Grid item eight, we have the Airport Microgrid Resilience Project. Information only. Mr. Terry Connington. Good afternoon.

Council members, tough act to follow. So I'll go ahead and do my best here. So I'm pleased to announce we've actually on the threshold of building a resilience system at the airport. And basically what this is, it provides a battery and solar panel, critical locations around the airport. So when the power goes out, we'll have the power to do that. It's been a long time coming. we've actually had a company working with us for a while now engineering it so basically what's going to happen is when the power goes out we'll still have a terminal functioning the runway lights will be on we'll be able to provide power to people that need it at the airport and we'll power up the weather system we'll power up the fuel farm and power up the hangar doors which is very cool and medtrans the local helicopter helicopter companies moving into the airport soon and having them having the ability to fuel their aircraft 24 7 is going to be very very cool So, next year, the airport is going to be 100 years old last next year and October the 12th, Charles Lindbergh arrived here and we're actually the 1st commercial airport in the state and the 1st airport in the state to have this system as well. So, thank you. Any questions any questions?

Yes, please.

Thanks, Terry, for being here 100 years. That's quite the accomplishment. In reading the memo that came along with the agenda, I just had a question. It said that the company that won the RFP, Sun Energy Solution, It says these sodium ion batteries are the first ever installed in the United States by this manufacturer. Does that mean that they have installed this product somewhere else overseas, or this is the first time that they've ever done it?

This is the first time these batteries have been used in the United States. They're sodium batteries. They're far much safer than lithium, and that's the reason we're going with them. They've got a company branch over here. They've got some batteries, I believe, at Tucky and also down in Columbia. But this is the first time we're using these batteries for this particular purpose.

Okay. So we're on the front end of innovation here for this.

Yep. And I'm hoping also other airports around the state will use this as well. So really, really are the leading people doing that. Because it helps the fact that if you've got solar panels, you can have energy. And it will also save electricity costs to the terminals too. So it has a benefit all around for that. All right.

Yes, thank you for coming. Um, so I, I know we've, we've heard about the airport, um, over the last several months, several times, and I know their, um, expansion and growth of our city growth of our community. Um, is this. Is this system, is this microgrid, where are we in terms of, is it, you know, for what's currently on the airport property and in operations, would it use 75% of this microgrid? Is it 100%? Is there a plan for the future and future growth of the airport need?

Yeah, it's going to provide 100% ability to use the airport. A couple of years ago at Hurricane Florence, FEMA used it as a staging area. And they came into the airport because of the space and electricity and power to do that. During Hurricane Elaine, same type of thing. If you've got power and electricity there, you can provide the services to the local public. And so right now, this system will provide 100% power to the airport.

Okay. And so the airport would be able to grow in the future, 10, 20, 30 years, it would meet the needs?

Yeah. It wouldn't confine us by any means. It just provides electricity for us when the power goes out.

Okay. And to build off the comment of Southern Tree Solution, are you working with the location in Kentucky, knowing new technology? We are definitely an innovative city and forward thinking, but what is the plan to kind of support this being the first US location and the usage of what it's being applied for?

So what's going to happen? What's the system going to be in there? We've become visited by other companies and other people from other states to come look at this system and see how it works. We're excited about that because it really puts us on the map. And this company, Sun, also works with Club down in Columbia, the metro airport. And they put systems in there for their TSA systems around the area. So there are other airports besides us.

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Mayor, to put a finer point on that question a little bit, I think it's great that we're trailblazers, but I want to make sure that the technology works. Are we confident that it'll be reliable and something that will work for us to meet our needs?

Yes, so we've actually had a lot of discussions around that. So we get the grant money from the state. I had to go into a Q and a section and they are the same type of questions and this company and the batteries and the systems is a proven record that they work. Some are really, really small. Some are rather big. We've got a mixture of units there to do this.

And you mentioned the grant money. So we seed with $75,000 from our airport enterprise fund, and that's a special purpose fund inside that we hold. And then the rest of that, the rest of the $500,000 is either state or federal grants. Is that right?

That's correct. Yeah. And MedTrans is also putting in some money as well because they find it's an important system to have. They need to have fuel for the emergency helicopters. So it was invested in the two.

That's great leverage. How does the airport enterprise fund populate, Chris?

It's the fund from which we do the regular routine operations at the airport and some of the capital at the airport. is fed by revenue generated at the airport, and then its expenditures are dedicated to things like this and airport operations. So it recycles the resources generated from fuel sale margins and other transactional fees into the airport to help grow it over time.

What's the current balance of the fund? That's about $480,000. So this $75,000 represents a fraction of what the fund actually had.

Chair, just one other quick, and I know you mentioned that we're the first to use this, but we're the first by this manufacturer.

There are other folks that have similar. So there are other fended batteries in the country that use it, but we're the first ones using it for this particular practice. For this particular practice. As far as a solar panel driving this type of thing, equipment.

Okay. Not just the first of this manufacturer, but this particular function here. Okay. Any other questions? Thank you, sir. Thank you. have item nine authorization to extend the contract regarding the micro transit mr kevin limehouse assistant city manager and mr dennis locke will double team this financial director members of council this uh is uh something that y'all have already approved uh but given uh that we want to make sure we cross all the t's and all the i's with anything related to

federal or state regulations, we are seeking your permission to extend the pilot for an additional six months for micro transit. When y'all approved this before, we used language that y'all gave us the blessing to do so, but we just wanted to make sure that, again, we were doing everything by the book, so we're coming back and asking your permission. Uh, we're doing this to allow us to collect more data to strategize more on how we can do this. I know many of y'all may be asking them people in the audience as well. When is this going city wide? This allows us for, uh, for us to figure out how best to do that. And we just need a little bit more time. Dennis and I, I cannot tell you how much time we spend trying to make sure that we get this right. And, uh, we realize how important it is to people. So we're, we're really all in on this, but we need a little bit more time to get it there. Uh, but certainly happy to answer any questions that you may have. Any questions? Microchip? Yes. Kevin. Yes, ma'am.

So far, the feedback that I've heard from the public is it's going really well. Yes, ma'am. But my question in expanding or extending the pilot program, are we going to be looking at any other new locations to kind of tap into and test? Or are we going to stay the same route while we...

Yes, ma'am. So immediately we'll stay the same, but our intent is to go citywide and see where the data takes us from there and what we can and can't do. And if y'all recall 1 of our major thresholds for success was wait time. Right? And so we're, you know, this allows us to. hard press the system right to see what we can do uh when you know when we expand when we shift you know resources shift drivers and that you know keeping that wait time is really a big metric for us along other things so yes ma'am uh that that's the intent but it's just it's a stress test uh things that we're doing for it yes kevin i remember that wait time was 11 minutes yes sir if we can get it shorter that would be even better yes sir on average yes sir good there yes sir

Kevin, thanks.

Sure.

At the end of this pilot, will you be able to tell us what our cost per ride has been? I know for the public, it's... Yes, ma'am. Are the first four rides still free?

Yes, ma'am.

So the first four rides are free, and then it's $2 after that. So to the public, it's incredibly...

Yes, ma'am.

...cheap. Yes, ma'am. And obviously, the more riders and users, the less our costs...

Correct.

But is that something that you'll be prepared to share with us in six months? Yes, ma'am.

I believe so. Without going nerdy, because you have a long agenda, the short version is, yes, ma'am, but sometimes it's a little bit of comparing apples to oranges with fixed route and microtransit. And so in that translation, sometimes there's a little bit of jumbledness. But for all intents and purposes, yes, ma'am, that's our intent.

And since you brought up the fixed route, are we planning to use the data from the micro transit at all to think about altering any routes for the fixed transit?

That's what we want to do is we want to come up with an appropriate strategy on how potentially those could play together and see what we can do. Our chief goal is sustainable, reliable, efficient rides for our citizens. And so data helps us so much with that. And that's why we want to take the time to get some more with this. Yes, ma'am. That's from Rogers. Yes, ma'am.

Kevin, is there any change to the existing bus routes for this extended six-month period of time? So we're just extending the current circumstance of our buses and our microtransit.

Yes, ma'am.

That's the ask.

Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am.

Yes, Kevin.

Yes, ma'am.

I see the transit quite often on the south side of town and going past my house a lot. So I am glad to see that it is in use.

Oh, yes, ma'am, very much so. My kids are tired of me pointing it out. I get excited every time I see it. So, yes, ma'am, thank you.

I'm going to take my free rides. All right. Yes, ma'am.

Kevin, in this six-month pilot, is there any plan? I know when we talk about data and we talk about usage, it was pointed out to me earlier today that if I wanted to take microtransit to the city council meeting, I could not take it home. Yes, ma'am. Is there a test or period of time where you would be looking at that extended hours that I know we've talked about? Data is data. you know, but is there any, are you going to play with any other parts of the current setup?

Agendas. Yeah. Potentially. The hard thing with this is even if we test something, if we put it out there, it's hard to pull back, right? So if data tells us for whatever reason, hey, it's not worth it to do it past 6 p.m., or you don't have as many riders, or it's cost prohibitive, or any number of scenarios... if we put that out there and then you know pull it back that's hard even if we say it's for a pilot so so you know we're going to consider that and see what we can do but it's we take very seriously um our promises to our neighbors to make sure that we don't over under or over promise and then have to pull back yes ma'am

I would wonder if there is a city event in the next six months that the communications team could support preparing citizens for the use of microtransit to get to and from, to test that extended period of time.

Thankfully, the city is not short of any events coming up soon, so we'll have plenty of opportunities. That's a great idea. I hear the International Festival just whispering in my ear.

Mr. Mayor, Kevin, I wholeheartedly endorse Leslie's idea because I think that's a way to get user acceptance and get people focused on it. What's the cost associated with the extension of the pilot?

Uh, it's, uh, it's matching the, the price that we had before, I think, for 6 months is just under 200 K, thereabouts. Um, yeah, and that comes from our allocation that no, sir, it comes from some, uh, different grant funding that we had available.

And so the mayor talked about wait times. I think we want to watch that closely. I think if we're way under our wait time target, it might suggest that the system can take a little bit more stress and we can expand quicker and sooner. I really I've been a long proponent for making sure that we see this implemented citywide as fast as we can. So I appreciate all the work that you're doing to get us to that point and hopefully it'll get there sooner rather than later.

Well, Chris has a very long leg and he's kicking me with it here and I won't say too much other than to that point and to set a playing field for everybody. Our current wait time is about 14 minutes on average. so it's gone up based on things we've done it actually peaked higher than that and we were able to bring it down based on some stuff so yes sir so we're if y'all recall when we originally pitched this 20 minutes was you know what we wanted anything under that we considered a major win we're continuing to have the wait times going up because ridership has gone up it's been a a variety of factors um some of which has been ridership going up some of it we had a lull where we had uh uh two drivers Uh, leave unexpectedly 1 went out of country and 1 moved and so there was a little bit of a gap fill there. So there's, you know, the great thing about the data is it helps us, you know, see these various factors and how they play into. Yes, Kevin. Yes, ma'am.

How many transportation buses do we have now?

Buses or the microtransit? Microtransit. The microtransit vehicles, we have three. Two are on the road and one is a spare. And we've used that, you know, to Council Member Fulmer's point, there was a situation where Ed searched them out and that played with some data as well.

So when you do the expansion, will you think of adding more?

That's what we're going to stress test. So if we expand, we'll see what we can do with what we have and see if there's a need for more, what kind of vehicles we can get, and what we can get out of them. Yes, ma'am.

Okay, 1 more question you may have already answered. So, when you do the expansion is just going to go to the edge of the city. Correct? Yes, ma'am. Nowhere else.

Yes, ma'am.

So based on, I think it was Councilwoman Rogers. Stating the after hours and still want to see what's going to happen with the students who wants to come downtown. So, kind of put that on top of the agenda.

Yes, ma'am. We've got some stretch goals for students' workforce and locations outside the city as possible. So I'm not telling y'all we'll be there tomorrow, but I promise y'all they're on the radar.

Thank you for everything.

Yes, ma'am, of course.

As you can hear, the excitement about microtransit, you know, let's continue. I mean, and you're not the only one that points it out every time you see it riding up and down the road. I have a young lady beside me, not as quite as young as your daughter, but I always point it out to her as well. Awesome. That's great.

Well, thank you all very much for your consideration. Thank you. And support.

Oh, yes, we do need a motion. Do I hear motion?

Okay. Mr. Moat mayor. I make a motion that we extend the micro transit contract.

2nd, all in favor. Any of that opposed? Thank you. I just have it. Mr. item 10. we have a ward of this for the dock and park perimeter trail construction. Miss Kim brown. Recreation and special event director.

Thank you. Mary and counsel. I'm filling this evening for Jay squires. our public works director who is traveling on business. So the request before you this evening is for the award of bid for the perimeter trail around Duncan Park, which includes a segment of elevated boardwalk. Just wanted to share with you just some of the engagement that went on before we got to this point. As you may remember, the Duncan Park perimeter trail was included in the original redesign Back in, I think, 2022, 2024, and there have been a number of phases of Duncan Park redevelopment done since then pal has been such a great partner with us. 1st of all, spearheading our grant process. We're getting some land and water conservation funds, but they also help us with engagement with the community. And these are just some of the numbers that we found. That came out of some of that engagement a lot of it had to do with safety of traffic calming Protecting what's there and making sure that there's a good bit of connectivity So I wanted to make sure that information got to you all And wanted to see if you had any questions about any of the engagement that we've had since we first started working at Duncan Park questions

It's not a question, but I've sat in many of those meetings and I mean, I've really appreciated the level of engagement that the city team and pal have undertaken into this project. And I think it shows in the excitement that the respondents to the surveys have shown. And I think many of those have come from the neighborhood. And so. I think it's exciting to see the neighborhood, the Duncan Park area, get more and more excited about the improvements that are being made along the lake and with the trail system.

Awesome. 166 respondents. That's pretty good. So with those.

I will also note when pal did give a presentation to us and the Duncan Park Trail was actually the out of all the trails that had the most opportunity for more usage. And I think this is great. This is a great focus to get more feet, more activity and obviously protection of the natural element and safety. It's great.

Do I hear a motion? Mr. Mayor, I make a motion that we approve.

Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Any that oppose? Ayes have it. Thank you, Ms. Brown.

I will also say, Mr. Mayor, that after their last engagement meeting at C.C. Woodson, I rode around the park to look at some of the specific areas of where the work was being proposed. It was really great to see the trail that was active. It was great to see the water ecology station, people there, people at the lake on the kayaks. And also, I was blown away by the tennis courts and the pickleball courts. They were max capacity with about 40 to 50 people down there playing. And that's not to mention the folks that were playing on the revitalized baseball fields and things like that. So it's really great to see.

As this council meeting continue to extend out, we will have miles with the mayor at Duncan Park this Saturday. So, again, get a get a closer look at what's happening on those courts as well. Item 11 is resolution certifying the. Real property as the abandoned building site pursuant to the South Carolina Abandoned Building Revitalization Act, Title 12, Chapter 67, Section 12-67-100 of South Carolina Code of Law in 1976 amended regarding the property located at 2199 Southport Road. Mr. Chris Story will be the presenter, city manager.

Good evening, Mr. Mayor and council members. I've got a number of items here in rows, so we'll go at your pace as always. This first one is relatively straightforward, I believe. 2199 Southport Road is a shopping center that was developed. It's on the northwest corner of the intersection between 295 and Union Street or Cedar Springs Road. It for a long time was home to a Bilo grocery store and then Bilo closed a number of their stores in the market and it has since been vacant. This is one of our vacant boxes. The South Carolina Abandoned Buildings Revitalization Act enables those who make investments within properties that have been vacant for quite some time to receive some credits against some state taxes and fees. Uh, we've been working with an area of business that would be relocating into the city that would convert this particular space to an office use. Um, and we think that'd be a great outcome. It meets with the spirit and intent and the letter of the, um, South Carolina abandoned buildings act and, um, by. Certifying it is eligible for this, uh, program. We increase the likelihood of the transaction and the business move occurring, which would strengthen our tax base without any, um, consequence adverse to the approval of the credits. So recommend your approval.

Any questions and Mr story, would this be a redevelopment for a single user?

Yes, the single user going into the big to the big box. Now, there's some other retail spaces in the center that have existing leases and or existing availability and that would not change. This is the grocery box.

And so would that create an opportunity for new jobs into the city?

Yes, this is a growing local company that would occupy the box that would be converted into office, and I think in effect it would be very positive for the center because right now you've got dormant activity, a dormant portion of the center which would get new life, which we think would generate some positive traffic for the rest of the center.

Will there be any potential additional action by council required for this possible relocation?

No, sir, I don't anticipate any. Any other questions?

Mr. Mayor, I make a motion that we certify the site to be eligible for the abandoned building tax credits.

Second. All in favor? Aye. Any that opposed? I just have it the resolution resolution for property for eligibility of the South Carolina credits per the state's credit per South Carolina textile communities revitalization act. Mr story.

This is another utilization of a state program that is designed to provide incentives for reinvestment in certain areas. In this case, it's properties that are adjacent to former textile facilities. This was included in a in a development agreement several years ago, but it has reached the point where we need to act to fulfill our prior promise to certify these properties for eligibility for these state credits. It's two of the project core parcels that Are in the downtown area, and it fully qualifies with the program. Uh, this particular action has no, uh, has been contemplated since the beginning of the project and has no adverse consequence to the city. And it's positive in in that it furthers the aims of the broader downtown development. Certainly welcome any questions that you would have any questions. Do I hear a motion?

Make a motion we approve, uh. Item B, resolution certifying for eligibility for textile communities.

Second.

All in favor? Aye. Any that oppose? Ayes have it. Item C, resolution approving the reissuance of the Spartanburg housing of its multifamily housing revenue note Stokely Terrace apartment project pursuant to section 147F Mr. Story, again, as amended.

Mr. Mayor, Spartanburg Housing, which is our partner of the city that you have known most of your lives as Spartanburg Housing Authority, has found that it can strengthen its capacity to fulfill its local mission by performing a financial facilitation role for affordable housing developments in other South Carolina communities. This practice is consistent with their HUD authorization and guidance and serves to strengthen Spartanburg Housing by generating some administrative revenue for Spartanburg Housing. While there's no financial connection between the City of Spartanburg and these activities, the due diligence provisions and applicable law require an approval action by the host local government, that is you all in this case, when Spartanburg Housing engages in this particular function. The attached resolution is one of those actions that relates to an affordable housing development in Anderson, South Carolina. There's no financial exposure of any kind to the city of Spartanburg or to Spartanburg housing for that matter. This action simply ensures that there's a transparent public process, which is required by the state law. Recommend your approval and welcome any questions that you would have.

Any questions? And I know one that we always ask again, Chris, that we have no financial obligations whatsoever with this.

Yes, sir. The purpose of this approval is simply to know that to create a record of this being transparently and openly undertaken. It helps Spartanburg Housing generate a little bit of administrative revenue and helps some folks in Anderson County have better housing.

Chris, is there I mean, not that I would advocate for Greenville, but is there a reason why the Greenville Housing Authority is not tasked to do?

How are we selected and why are we the chosen one? I don't know the answer to the Greenville question specifically, but it relates to the professional capacity of Ms. Evans and her team at Spartanburg Housing. They are credentialed and certified to facilitate these types of bond transactions.

And we've done that before, right?

Yes. This is not our first. It is admittedly sort of an odd thing that involves a project outside of our jurisdiction, but it's not the first time.

Mr. Mayor, I make a motion we approve the resolution. Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Any that oppose? Ayes have it. D, resolution of enter into a development agreement with the Kennedy Street owner, LP, to develop Kennedy Street parking garage access land with affordable multi-family apartments for rent. And Mr. Story.

This is a project that we've discussed in council meetings over the past, I think it may be four years, because the project has, it has been a strategic objective for, Staff to bring forward affordable development in the downtown area as our downtown grows and changes. We want to make sure that all aspects of our population can find a home in downtown. If that is their, their, their aim. So we have been supporting the application of this particular site by virtue of an agreement. We've done a number of years ago for low income housing tax credits for 48 family development on property. That is essentially surplus property of the cities. That is just on the eastern edge of the Kennedy street parking garage. It is property that all we have done since the Kennedy street parking garage was built is mow the grass. Um, and this, this project, and you all have have seen it, uh, evolve over time. It was recently approved in final form by the city's design review board. It's attractively designed development. We're excited about it. This authorization of the development agreement would address certain expectations and conditions of that and establish the local fee in lieu of tax that the development would pay, which would at the outset be about $50,000 a year. over time to about 100,000 dollars a year. The developers would make available 48 units at rents tied to 30% of the tenant's household income, which is the HUD standard for affordability. and the tenant profile is such that the maximum amount of income could be that which was equal to or below 80% of the area median income. It'll actually be a mix of incomes, some of which much lower around 50 or 60, but the agreement max would be 80% of AMI. We are real pleased with with how this project has evolved. We're grateful for the persistence of the developers who competed and competed again and competed and eventually won latex credits. It'll strengthen the downtown and it'll be a nice aesthetic enhancement to the Kennedy street corridor. Um. And so we're pleased to see it reached this point. And the fact that it can at the same time boost our revenue base for us in the schools and others is a positive as well. Certainly welcome any questions you have and recommend your approval question. Yes.

Chris, I'm so excited. As you mentioned, this has been about a four or five year process. For those that are kind of new to how the LIHTC applications go, can you kind of explain how robust the competition is? But I'm super excited with this being in close proximity to the Meeting Street School and allowing families to be very close by and targeting another income level that is really difficult to get assistance with as far as funding. We talk very often about affordable housing, affordable housing, affordable housing, but something has to subsidize These costs and construction costs, you know, have increased exponentially, materials, etc. Everything is going up. So I'm excited to finally see this project move forward. But can you kind of give just a little bit of a background on how that works? And if you do know, I know this had been approved, but the DRB approved. What is do we know that the breakdown of the units?

I have at one point in time. I know that being a compact apartment development, I think there are ones and twos and not many threes in the deal, but I will get you that 100% of the units are affordable and subject to this agreement. There is no market rate component to this. To the deal, but I will get you the specifics on the unit mix and break down. I'm sorry. I didn't have the, um. Lotte allocation process is pretty rigorous. It involves. I mean, the demand for in the need for affordable housing across South Carolina way exceeds the supply of, um, low income housing tax credits and and those tax credits are the key ingredients and making these financially viable because, as you pointed out. the bricks and sticks and countertops and toilets and all the things that go in the apartments are, you know, there's not much variability on cost there, but the income profile and the rent restrictions create a gap that has to be filled. And the primary way of doing that is with low-income housing tax credits. There are Our best case scenario is in any given years to get one of these approved through the state process, one deal, and maybe a senior one. And we've been successful at that. Pretty successful, but not always because we're competing against, uh, applications from across the state. Um, they score of there's a, it's a rigorous matrix of variables that, um, go into the scoring of it and it's, uh, and then, uh, South Carolina housing staff, uh, does the developer supplies what they think the scoring is and then South Carolina housing staff verifies or not. So they have to grade themselves. These students might. They have an opportunity to grade themselves at time time. And, um, in this case, this was the top, uh, scoring, uh, project in Spartanburg county and therefore the 1 that's advancing this year. Um, and we're just, uh. lot of factors go into that but for us while we have suggested conveying the the property and and supporting the project in this way is because we think with the additional housing that is coming to our downtown keeping that balance is really important strategically and so we're going to try to follow on this one with some other successful applications in the next several years

Chris I echo Erica's excitement this has been a long time coming and she said accurately we talked about affordable housing all the time so bear with me and my train of thought and my questions compound question here as I was reviewing the development agreement Maybe this has been in all of the other ones, but it struck me, and I didn't remember seeing it in some of the other ones, but the Section E, the performance data, where it says that the city shall keep and protect the data related to limited, including but not limited to rent rolls and financial performance data related to such units, income criteria, etc., that we will keep it in a confidential manner exempting it from FOIA. Is that a common thing that is in development agreements or is that something that was specifically asked for by the developer in this particular case?

We had no discussion about that clause. I think it presumably was was drafted initially by their attorneys, but it wasn't a significant point of discussion. Obviously, there's nothing we could have in an agreement that. That trumps state law and so state law would ultimately determine what is eligible. It's it's if there is personal identifying information that's exempt from for you. And if there's certain types of competitive information that. But we would have to sort that out when we got to that point. But there's nothing that this development could do that would somehow, I mean, that this agreement would do that would somehow alter the application of state law as it related to what documents in our possession are or are not public.

Well, so that piece right there, then kind of led me down a path that wouldn't be as relevant to this project because it is 100% below AMI. But when we think about other projects that we've done, Boxcar, Fitzgerald, Mary H. Wright, the Town Homes Off Country Club, where we've set the standard that if you're going to receive a philo from us, you're going to have to include at least 10% of your units as affordable so then seeing this we are going to protect your data it's going to be confidential i was then thinking well you know what if our post and courier friends wanted to do an article everyone likes to talk about government transparency right now you know are those developers actually following through on what we've said they need to do but if we're held to this confidential manner and can't report out on any anything related to such units then that puts us in a in a bind again i think this project is different since a hundred percent of the units are related but my broader question and i understand that's not about this but sometimes this space is the only time we have to ask these questions, is what sort of checking do we do behind the other projects that we voted on and are built and look beautiful and we celebrate to ensure that they are following through? I know Erica and I have heard, I don't know if Erica remembers, but I've heard from different developers that it's hard to find those people to apply, which maybe that begs the question of can we work with them to do a better job to help people understand what 80% of AMI is, which is a term that no regular person has any clue of what it means. But we also, if someone who owns an apartment complex believes that, they're not going to hold 10 units for the rest of their life waiting on someone to come and rent them. They're going to rent them at market rate. And so, again, what is our recourse? How are we going behind and checking to make sure that they actually are following through on rent?

On we have agreed to do, we received different types of information from the, we have, we have done a number of these projects that include the, that carve out and set aside. Um, but, um. They're coming online at different stages and operated by different management groups. Um, and we have, um, uh, get different types of information based on the, the management, but we have had in our interactions today. Nothing that would indicate. To what you spoke to that they're failing or unable to get that number of qualifying tenants. They all anybody that's leased an apartment recently knows that everybody goes to income verification, you know, and so income verification gives them insight into the tenant profile. And so they have that data. Now, that is that's. What allows them to confirm eligibility or not? I will ask we've our team will try to. look at how we can streamline and make it uniform so that there is uh something i can share with with you all in the public that that sums up how we're performing on that but we've got no caution flags or red flags or you know we had some early concern from a couple of folks but once they got into the process and really went through it and realized that there are a whole lot of working men and women in this community who are, as the math would dictate, below 80% of the AMI because it's, it is, so they have, we have not found it to be an operational issue. But I'll talk with the team and have you more thorough answers.

So just to make sure I understand what you're saying, you don't have a concern because you have received information back from the projects that verify this? Correct. Okay. Well, then back to my original question, if we are going to report back out, and maybe I'm not understanding the totality of... keeping this information confidential or what information would be kept confidential. But it gives me a little bit of a pause to say that we can't share any thing out based on the rent roll. Obviously not financial information related to the tenant in 30A, but if someone wanted to know, are they actually following through, because the only way this project's work is with taxpayer money from the state and locally. Are we able to publicly say that, or does this bind us to saying, I can't say anything?

Let me draw an important distinction. This is this this project we're talking about tonight is a lot of tech project, which has means that there's HUD involvement and state housing involvement and all sorts of protocols and rules. I think to your the substance of your question relates to those that are locally done only that there's no other. HUD reporting involved in and that kind of thing. And in that case, I'll have to look at the specific letter of those agreements to see if they have any, but it's, you know, the only thing that would be not, You know, just off the top of my head, the only thing that I think would be exempt from FOIA would be things that that they could argue were a competitive issue for them or privacy issue for the tenant. Understood that, but but, you know, redacting names and identifying information and showing us the, the. you know, the income levels and the roster, you know, that they have the number of, the appropriate number of tenants and the appropriate number of units, I don't have any issue assembling that.

But your point is they're having to report to the federal government and state government, people that have a lot more teeth than we might.

Right. There's a whole lot of money at risk on a LIHTC deal associated with Anything that could compromise the credits on a lot of tech deal understood, but you've raised an important substantive point for our other ones.

Yeah, I'd be very interested because we've never seen any of that information coming back. And so I would really like to.

I just want to note, in our dealings with Norris Ridge and Robert Smalls, Hannah, we had to sign non-disclosures as regards to tenant information. Oh, yeah.

So this is the same. Absolutely. I mean, no, I'm saying just can we publicly verify that Boxcar is renting to 10% of their You know, 10% of their units are actually going to the people that they said it would.

Yes, understood.

Yeah.

We'll close that. Yeah.

Okay. Thank you. That's my only question.

Um, I'm excited about this project as well. I mean, I think, um, you know, for reasons mentioned, but also the proximity to the community college campus downtown. which I think will be a great opportunity to link students at the college to some additional housing opportunities. Chris, I just want to make sure I'm clear. The city's contribution to this project is the land, the sliver of land on the corner of Converse and Kennedy. Yes, sir. That land owned by the city currently is not generating any revenue. No. The revenue that will be generated from day one under this agreement, I guess upon completion from day one, is $50,000 more than it was previously generated. And then over the 20-year life of that project, it will generate another up to $100,000 a year, $93,000 a year, I think is what it said. Yes, sir. So that money will compound over time and we'll be generating a lot more money than we ever had from that property previously.

Yes, sir.

And there's been no contribution by the taxpayers or anything to make other than the piece of property.

That's right, and they have several layers of advantaged financing associated with it, but all of that is loans and other structured programs.

And it's safe to say this project would not have happened without the LIHTC funding or any of the other incentive programs, including our gift of the land and then the incentives over the 20-year period.

Absolutely, yes, sir.

And then after the 20 year period, it will be a full contributor to our tax roll as any other project in downtown or anywhere else in the city.

It would be, it may not be much different than that 90, you know, but it'll be whatever the vanilla is right at that time, which will be based on, you know. Tax rates and the income, the, the financial status at that time.

So, in addition to increasing our tax base, we've also taken a positive step toward addressing our affordable housing. Desires yes, sir.

Any others do I hear a motion?

May I make a motion? We approve resolution D. 2nd.

All in favor? Aye. Any that oppose? Ayes have it. Item E, resolution authorizing development of agreement with Regenesis Community Development Corporation for development of single family homes in Forest Park neighborhood. Mr. Story.

Yes, Mr mayor beginning with planning and community engagement work in 2008, the city has partnered with community development corporation to bring new single family homes to the forest park neighborhood in the South side of the city. 17 homes have been built over those years and sold the families at or below area, median income at prices affordable to that income range. fulfilling the original intent for a mixed income neighborhood. Regenesis is now prepared to enter a new phase, which is expected to include a much more rapid build out of the remaining lots with market rate homes. The attached agreement will allow that work to begin and proceed immediately. We believe the result will be positive for the neighborhood and the community by bringing new housing into the south side, new product and new offerings. We've been working with Regenesis for years, and we're excited about seeing it reach this point and excited about welcoming some 23 potential new home sites and new families to the south side. Welcome any questions that you may have.

Any questions? Mr. Mayor, Chris, so 23 lots over what period of time? 30 months?

Yeah, and that's to, so effectively it could be as long as 42 months total build-out.

Right, and so as I read it, I think we give them a lot and then they start the, and then we kind of, it's sort of a stair-step approach.

Yes, but that can be in bundles and groups. Okay. So we'll be able to go as fast as they'd like to go. So this will move pretty quickly, I guess is my point. Yes, sir, that's our aim.

Do you know when the work is going to start? You know, when would the first home start?

I don't know an exact date, but we've met with Regenesis CDC and their builder partner, who's a credible, experienced group. And so we believe it'll move quickly. So we're pleased with where we are.

I am glad to see that this is taking place and I know that Mr. Mitchell Bush is probably excited about it too because it has been a long time coming.

sure Chris there's a rich history I know to this project it was way before my time and maybe before some other people's times here you when you were reading off the memo and you've alluded to this before that the City Council at that time the goal was the original intent intent was for a mixed-income neighborhood correct and so those original 17 homes that were built over 18 years i'm sure it wasn't one a year but we can just let's just say those were all affordable homes or income restricted or that's correct yes okay and were there already homes that existed in this neighborhood well or those were the new homes

it depends on how you define this specific there was a we worked with Regenesis which was SHD at the time to to plan a neighborhood and there was a number a good bit of work infrastructure work other things the former Piedmont Street area which deep challenges was so In my mind, the broader Forest Park neighborhood, which has existed well before any of this, it depends on how you define boundaries. But for the lots that were subject to our understandings in the past and currently, that ratio you described of about 17 affordable and an additional 20 coming at our market rate is consistent with the balance that everybody intended throughout.

So when it says fulfilling the original intent of a mixed income neighborhood for 18 years, it was not mixed income. It was... Lower income houses.

The new houses that were built, yes, were all subject to that program. But again, that... But you're saying within the broader... That one street over, there's existing houses, and one street on the other. Okay, okay.

So then, I know I've asked this question before, but how long would those houses, say the first house, the one that was built 18 years ago, how long does that house stay... income restricted some the deed on the land is it 20 years is it till it sells i don't know the answer to that what i'm getting at is is it actually a mixed income neighborhood anymore these 17 years later or have all of those homes the deeds have transferred over they've all been sold how many of those original homes are actually still owned by people who

received the affordable home discount right I don't know the answer to that again and I don't know that they you know our intent one of the reasons why we pursue homeownership programs of all kinds is what it can have is the impact it can have on families for a lifetime in a generation right right so we hope that they are well above the threshold now that would be our aim but I don't have that information in terms of knowing what their current status is or anything of that nature

But I'm not sure if the original intent was for a mixed income neighborhood. Maybe the current intent is not because none of the new homes that we're discussing now will be, they'll all be market rate.

That's correct.

Correct.

Yes.

And we own all of the lots that we're turning over to one by one, like Jamie just said.

Uh, that's correct there there's city on lots and what we're attempting to do, uh, here with this is, um, have. To honor the spirit of the original understanding that predates, you know, uh. you know this existed for quite some time to have a single-family neighborhood there that included homeownership opportunities and things of that nature and but have a simple as possible clear understanding for the remaining phase So I guess the question is, it's a little bit of an eye of the beholder, whether you, if you just, if you certainly just look at these 20 lots, what you see is a market rate single family development, right? But if you look at the whole history of the Forest Park build out, going back to the shared effort, what you see, what you conclude is a mixed income single family development.

so it depends on the lens you want to apply to it but from our perspective this is this is in keeping with the original vision as best we understand it so were there discussions about any of these 23 lots being us requiring any sort of income for any of these homes being affordable or we believe we've already

achieved that over the last 17 years right our understanding is that we have you know in partnership with regenesis fulfilled the original intent and that it is supported by the the community and the intention of regenesis to uh to for these to be um not contractually restricted now If there were opportunities programs, and, you know, like, if if we had something similar to the ARPA dollars again, or that kind of thing, there's nothing that would preclude. There there being a. Home ownership that was under some type of other affordability program, but this action wouldn't require that.

So phase one was affordable.

Correct.

To get us to this point. I mean, there's obviously been a lot of, you know, there's been a delay and, you know, you had COVID, you've had construction costs, you have all of all these other factors. But now we are moving into phase two, which would then be mixed. Mixed as in we have the affordable piece.

Mm-hmm.

Now this second phase would be market rate. Is that how?

Yes, ma'am. That's how we would describe it.

What was the city's financial commitment as part of the original 2013 development agreement?

At that point, we had done and were doing a good bit of expenditures that were related to infrastructure. And, you know, I think some of you might recall this whole area is – what we now know as Lawrence Johnson sort of overlaps what I first knew as Piedmont Street. Which had some housing on it and fell into pretty deep disrepair and there was a, there was, it was a grave concern for South side leaders. And so I haven't totaled up the whole history of city investment in the area, but it's pretty extensive amount of investment in the area to to get to part of the aim of. In my opinion, at least, going back through and looking at what I could, part of the aim for having market rate housing in the area was to strengthen strengthen the south side and offer a new product that hadn't been really available, hadn't been much new construction of a market rate nature in that area.

But outside the contribution of the lots, there's no additional financial commitment being made by the city?

Correct.

Okay, so that was all part of the original infrastructure that was done. Yeah, that's done. So that's already been spent and developed.

I just wanted to ask some historical context. So we're looking at this project, but all of this happened with HOPE VI, the Phillips-Gance HOPE VI. The city's involvement with acquisition was the city supporting the Housing Authority. We acquired land, moved people, transitioned, and the development agreement came years later. But you got to look at the bigger picture. You got to include College Park and look at the housing investment there from an affordability standpoint. You've got to look at the existing streets, High Street, Lincoln Drive. So this is, when you say Forest Park, it's not just these units. It's the broader neighborhood. So Martin is not here. I don't see him.

I already looked for him.

But he has some data regarding the affordability of the area. So when we say Forest Park, we're not just talking about these units. It is a broader, and it goes back to the city's investment in Spartanburg housing investments in the Hope 6 project. CC Woodson was a part of that. We wouldn't have a CC Woodson, a new CC Woodson if it wasn't for that grant. All of this came out of that grant process. So to compare apples to apples, you gotta look at the north side. The market rate development that has happened on the north side. I mean, they're looking at a mixed income community, not just a couple streets, but looking at the broader neighborhood. Good.

No other questions? Do I hear a motion? Hold on one second.

I mean, I understand all of that, but also that's all in the past. This is 17. I mean, how long that's... But we have new people moving in, new families, people looking for new housing now. And so I guess I'm a little uncomfortable doing such a large housing project with there being no affordable part when we said, oh, we did that 18 years ago.

And you... my time with community redevelopment like this, you also have older housing stock, you have older family members who are moving out, who are transitioning, who there are homes there that will soon be on the market three years from now, five years from now. And I'll just be honest, when I was looking to buy a home in the city, I couldn't find a home in the city. I live on the east side of town. I couldn't live on the south side.

So wouldn't you want to afford new people?

I can afford more than that. And I want to see people who look like me that can afford it to buy a home on the south side.

Yes.

I can pay more than that. And I want people who can pay more than that to buy on the south side. That's just my personal opinion.

So, I mean, I understand your point, but it's still... it still is affordable in market. Was there, I think the argument then needs to be, was there a timeline in which all of this entire project had to be done so that it was all done together with affordable and market? And I don't think there was.

There was not an original timeline. That's one of the reasons why Mr. Mitchell and I have worked to try to make this as simple and as clear as it could be so it lays that out.

And I think it just really fulfills the agreement, the contract agreement, even though it was, as Councilwoman Smith mentioned, 18 years ago, but we're still fulfilling the contractual agreement between Regenesis and the

And just 1 more point along those lines that I would would make is that we've come a long way as an organization and as a community about our housing development efforts over this time, um, uh, as well. So, um, you know, we've. This, I don't think it's possible to separate this from its history.

I am glad to see that we have made as much progress as we have made in order to get to this point. Because it has been a long time coming. A long time coming. And should there be any more concerns, I'm going to make a motion. Go ahead and make your motion. motion that we approve a resolution authorizing a development agreement with Regenesis Community Development Corporation for development of single-family homes in the Forest Park neighborhood. Do I hear a second?

Second.

All in favor?

Aye.

Do I hear any that oppose? Ayes have it. Thank you. Item 12, ordinance authorizing the intergovernmental agreement with the Spartanburg County concerning the joint use of the government facility. Mr. Storey, still standing.

Yes, sir. This item is, we've been working with our colleagues at the county to establish an agreement for how we will live and work together under one roof soon. As you all know, we celebrated with the topping out last week. The Joint Government Center is coming right along, although I will have to say it's going to look like it slows down because the They're going to be working just as fast and with more people every day, but the fastest part is the framing that's going up now. And so you won't see as much obvious drive-by change coming in the future. Next phase of work, but the joint government center is moving along and we think it's important not just from the for today, but for the long period of years that we expect to share this facility with our friends at the county that there be a. A clear, um, agreement that spells out how we'll share cost and how we'll navigate those kind of things. Um, just as a reminder, uh, this, uh, facility will have portions that are clearly the counties and portions that are clearly ours. It will also have spaces that we will share, um, like, 2, 2 council chambers of, you know, 1, larger than the other, um, that, uh, and a number of shared conference. Room facilities, there's a very large meeting room on the on the ground floor. There's a couple of other spaces that are shared. And then it'll share some other things that would be primarily employee facing, employee break rooms, things of that nature. So all of that requires some management cooperation, it'll require some maintenance costs, things like that. And so this agreement is just to lay those out as best we can anticipate all of those questions that might arise. And so we're still working through. There's a few minor language things we're working through that are different in their versions than ours, but we're real close to final and close enough that we feel like we can recommend a first reading approval to you all. And I know you've had an opportunity to look through it, and I certainly welcome any questions that you might have about it.

Chris, just one thing just right off the top. It just came up in some conversation. There's no way that the city is foregoing and giving up city responsibilities to the county and we're all becoming just one Spartanburg County. No, sir.

We are very much going to remain our own entities. In fact, a lot of this agreement Is because of the fact that we recognize that we will be distinct entities with distinct priorities and distinct views on things and that kind of thing. Okay.

Councilman Brown Chris, maybe I didn't this is a very long. Ordinance, and maybe I skimmed over it. It's quite a long name for the Spartanburg County Joint Government Facility. Where is it going to be part of this agreement, or who gets to name this facility, and what is the name of this facility?

That's actually a question I had, so let me ask my question. Yes. on page 24 it says naming a facility or spaces within the facility yeah i didn't know how this math mathed so the naming of the facility or spaces shall follow the procedures as set forth in section 10-4 then a name however a name for the facility or any jointly occupied space must be approved by two thirds majority of both the county council and the city council. So if we wanna name our conference room on the city's floor, we can decide that. If the county wants to name theirs, but if we wanna name it the Chris Story Lobby, then two thirds majority of both the county council and city council. So I know I'm nitpicking this, but how do you get two-thirds majority of seven people? Is it just you need five votes? And should it say that instead?

I will be candid with you. It was Cole and I thinking that that was extremely unlikely to ever happen and trying to draft the highest bar we could because we saw that that is a potential dynamic that could be divisive, right?

I agree.

So we wanted to be quite high bar there. So we didn't do the math, but we know that there's been some precedence.

But the space itself, when you're walking to the entrance. to walk in, what is the outside, will it say? It's the Joint Government Center.

Yes, and it says...

The Spartanburg Joint Government Center, but it's not named after anyone.

The entry features the word Spartanburg, and the... what do they call it, that thing? The entry feature, the architectural feature, the entries, Hartberg on it. And there are, we are referring to it currently as the Joint Government Center. And that's what we went with on the topping out and that kind of thing.

Okay. I missed the topping out. I was out of town. But I just wanted to make sure it wasn't, you know,

By the way, I vote no on Megan's proposed lobby name.

Two-thirds majority. I'm serious, though. Is that five out of seven votes? Is that two-thirds a majority?

I would think that's what it would have to be.

So is that understood? I am not a math person. Is that commonly understood and I just don't get it? Or should it say that? Because the number of councils, districts could change in the future.

I think that was part of the logic, was to set a supermajority high bar, and then who knows what's going to— Instead of just five, instead of a number, keep it two-thirds.

If Eric is on vacation again and misses the vote.

If you're on the fence, that's half a vote. Yeah. So, Chris, I noticed in there that each party will have an associated allocated costs that they will bear. What is the breakdown of the percentage breakdown of those allocated costs?

We are I don't know if we haven't yet a number based on square footage. Yes, it'd be based on square footage where we will have. a portion of the first floor and all of the third floor. They'll have all of the fourth and the fifth.

We share the common areas equally?

The common will be, you apply that ratio to the common areas. Okay. That's what I was trying to get to. So it wouldn't be 50-50 on the common areas because they're a larger force than we are and that kind of thing. I just wanted to make sure.

And that will be in the final agreement? That'll be included in the

Yeah, I think the architects...

There'll be an appendix.

In our last meeting, the architects were proposing the square footage. We're going back through and getting the square footage.

Okay.

Because there are some things that could change over time. There's some storage in the basement that could change over time. There's the ability to... It could evolve. Well, thank you for your work on this.

I mean, it's a very thoughtful agreement. It was hard to think of things that we hadn't thought of.

Maybe the 2 thirds, but Kevin and Kevin did a good bit of the grinding on it to 2 other questions.

There was only 1 section where I noticed technology. I could have mentioned it. I mean, missed it. It says both the city and county will be responsible individually for routine replacement and upgrade of technology. common technology will be scheduled. I took that more to mean like our computers, but we know our friends at the county have had challenges when it's come to hacks. We have not. So can you talk briefly about that firewall and how if our technology systems are going to be separate?

Our data won't be linked. I think the reference to shared technology is things like video boards and the infrastructure in the shared spaces. But our databases are distinct. um you know they are in businesses that we are not in thankfully that's one of the efficiencies of it that put them on the radar of some of these bad actors that we're not on their radar as much presumably you know But our data systems are separate. There's separate server rooms in the building. There's so much fiber in the building that we're equipped for the long, long, long run for that. And so our firewalling, our management practices of our databases and that kind of thing will remain fully distinct, but we will share some technological tools.

And is our comms team involved in talking with the architects around like specifically around this room, like we know that we have not been able to do some of the things that we were able to do at our old space because of the limitations, but are they involved in saying what we need in order to achieve our

Yes, it'll be whole new systems that are that are now. I know it feels like we're deep into this project, but there's some of the furniture and fixtures and equipment that we're just now working through because of the timing that we're on. Um, but, uh, the. Uh, both chambers will be fully equipped with brand new state of the art systems, including ability to broadcast and all that kind of stuff. Not broadcast stream. Yes.

My last question from the document was. Neither the county nor the city may hold news conferences, media interviews. That was the main thing. Photo shoots or the like where the likeness of the building or its identifiable spaces, plaza grounds will be visible. So if I were to leave this meeting and Fox News wanted to interview any of us, we could not have the building behind us.

You as an individual, yes.

Was not clear.

No, I mean, okay. Well, what we're aiming at.

Who is the city and county then when it says that? Employees?

officially sponsored and conducted activities both both organizations will have in this in the space rooms that are intended with you know logo backdrops and that kind of thing where you can shoot video and um and have that there it is intended to prevent a branding that That communicates to the public, it is predominantly 1 organization or the other. That's what that's hedging against is is that the, um. Now, obviously, if it's in the public realm and somebody shoots video, we can't prevent that, right?

But if we wanted to hold our swearing-in ceremony in the plaza, probably not likely given January, but if we wanted to have it in the plaza, we couldn't do it according to this agreement?

No, you couldn't use it for a non public purpose in any way. And, you know, we can talk with with them more about the language, but no, it's very much intended that there will be events that take place in the plaza. and that kind of thing that are associated with the governments. And so obviously the location would be able to be inferred. It's the iconography of the entrances that they don't, you know, we're trying to guard against those being perceived as just county or just city. I don't know if I'm explaining that at all.

We wouldn't see Christopher do an interview with YFF4 in front of the building as official city spokesperson.

That's correct. He would use his media space to do that. Use the media room, that room that's dedicated for that. Yeah, it would be city branded.

I would maybe recommend making that a little tighter.

And clearer.

Yeah, because like I was thinking about, we were at the topping off, you know, across the street at the library.

People were interviewed.

Obviously, it's not complete, but. This tells me I can't do that. I'd have to tell the news camera, oh, no, turn around and let's get the planetarium behind us. Right, I understand. That's silly.

Yes.

So that one just rubbed me as...

The intent is just so that there's not, like, we don't put a banner on the thing out front that is city-specific. Right. Or the county doing the same thing. Right. That's what you're trying to get to, right?

That's right. That the image of the building is associated with both and not one or the other. and that you know that the that the facility is uh treated and managed as a place where people with all views and all interests and business with either government can can go has the county voted on this yet i think they've had you know the one of you know they've they've they're they're mid-process They have not finalized any action and we haven't either.

So we're seeing the version that they will likely pass on their third reading.

That's that's right. Assuming you advance it, uh, tonight and, uh, we've got a few language discrepancies to work out, but nothing that I would flag for you as a substantive. Okay. And then you, you guys have raised some things we can clarify where I make a motion.

We approve 2nd all in favor. All right. You got a pose. I just have it. We have staff updates.

I wanted to report briefly, Mr. Mayor, that we are wrapping up. As you might recall, in the wake of Hurricane Helene, we successfully applied for some disaster assistance funds that allowed us to have a disaster assistance program that could address some of the needs on private properties under certain conditions. uh conditions and situations and i just wanted to report that we're wrapping that up this month because we're exhausted exhausting our resources there we have uh helped 82 families um and the overwhelming majority of that assistance has been uh with tree removal and private property and roof repairs as you might imagine given the nature of helene but so that's 82 residential properties that have received benefit from that We're ramping up positively for another round of lead hazard reduction and healthy homes grants. We've received word that $1.5 million is headed to our community for that based on our success of the prior program. So we're switching gears on that by the same team that supports that work and that work's continuing.

Is David still with us to lead that work? Yes.

And so we encourage folks to be aware of that. Also wanted to highlight one unique and fun community event, the Hampton Heights Sports Fest. Yeah, yeah. Not this coming Sunday, but the Sunday after it. And I'm going to give you my take on it as having attended it. It's a really cool, unique Sunday afternoon offering in one of our great neighborhoods, the Hampton Heights Historic District. There are a number of... Homes that literally open up their front yards and their front porches to be venues for live music. There's a great diverse lineup of acts. i see things ranging from blues to cuban jazz to i guess i'd call him more country um and anything in between and so that will be not this sunday but next sunday uh the 27th from 12 30 to 5 30 on west hampton avenue in spartanburg um in hampton heights neighborhood we're grateful for hampton heights neighborhood association and all the many sponsors for opening up that that event to all of us, and I'll have this here if anybody wants to get a snap of it.

You can bring your own chair.

You can, or you can just bring your dancing shoes, too. Is Baker Maltz be performing? No, we need a write-in campaign. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you. And welcome any questions, Mr. Maynard. Y'all have heard enough of me, though. I'm happy to sit down. Good.

City Council updates. Councilman Rogers.

Thank you Mr. Mayor. I am going to keep it brief because we have had a long meeting, but thank you to everyone who is still here. Um, it is important for us to ask questions. It's important for us to, you know, actually be difficult sometimes in in just making sure that we are following through. We're thinking long term. We are, we are. considering every group that could be affected or involved and really be a part of constructing how our community continues to move forward and I know that is a long process so thank you for sticking with us and being here thank you mr. mayor thank you those words Leslie one quick plug upon intended for Kevin

I spent all day, actually, three different times today circling downtown to look for an electric plug-in. We have five working plugins in all of downtown. And we talk about climate resiliency. We talk about how we care about it. That means we also need to accommodate the individuals who choose to make that stretch for their family. The two in this parking lot do not work. One in the library one, it's like someone pulled the cord out of the gas tank. And three times I circled around to our four different parking garages. Thank goodness we don't have to pay to enter the garage and leave immediately. But as we are looking to build the new parking garages, I think we definitely need to think forward in the future and about that population of our drivers, because it can be frustrating to five. We have five. unless you drive a Tesla and want to go to Burger King on the west side.

May I just add, I just saw an advertisement, I believe it was Duke Power to not quote me, but it was advertising having charging stations at your business and getting some sort of financial incentive to provide a charging station at your business.

I work right next to One Spartanburg. I call on Alan Smith to install some in the One Spartanburg parking lot. That'd be great. my car my son drives a nissan leap yes i thought you were talking about them and he didn't have enough miles to get to dormant and back so i had to drive it and try to plug it in wow yes uh mr mayor i don't thank you all for being here it's quite thank you for sticking around it's been like a late night um

Excited to see the construction along Pine Street, over in the Beaumont, the new apartments that'll be popping up over there. I do want to kind of circle back. I have mentioned before in the past, I know there were concerns, you know, the community was in favor of this development, but there have been concerns about North Liberty and that becoming a, you know, a cut through with traffic. And so I did want to just put another bug in the ear. I mentioned that I would mention that at this meeting about, you know, potential traffic calming measures along North Liberty. I anticipate that that will be Um, a cut through area, um, and I'd like to see something maybe come sooner before the project is complete rather than later when it becomes an issue. Um, but that's all I've got. Sorry. I hate to miss the mayor's walk this Saturday. I will be out of town in my 1st golf tournament, taking our brother and my little brother in law to his 1st PGA golf tournament on Saturday. So.

Councilwoman.

Thank you, Mary. I want to say thank you to each and every one of you for being here tonight and staying as long as you have to listen to the resolutions and how we voted on them. Please do not forget that next month starts our early voting for elected official runs. And we have a lot of people running for different offices. So tell everybody you know to get out and vote because we really need that. Other than that, I enjoyed talking off. It was great.

Councilman Farmer. Yes, sir, Mr. Mayor. Lots to report on, but in the interest of time, I'll just mention two things. One, this weekend, as you pointed out, miles with the mayor in Duncan Park. I encourage everybody to come out and walk around the park. For those of you who haven't seen some of the improvements going on in that neighborhood, it's a great opportunity. And then to Chris's point about the Hampton Heights Porch Fest, it's a great event, and anybody that attends will definitely have a good time. So I encourage everybody to come out and participate.

Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem.

Yes, I want to thank Hampton Heights and Forest Park. Excuse me, not Hampton Heights, Liberty Heights and Forest Park for doing their front porch roll calls. One was done on August the 26th and the other one was done on September the 9th. And it was a great turnout for both of those. I want to mention all of us that turned out for Michael Knuckles home going service. It was really very touching to me to see so many people to turn out, especially from this city. You've got people from the city that turned out to show their respect for a homeless person. Very, very touching, very touching. And so, and then Fred Burgess, I don't know if you all know him that stays, you know, got directly across the street from Mount Moriah that sit on his porch every day because you're waving and yelling. I was surprised to find out that he had died. passed and he had been gone for a couple of days before anybody knew it. So I ask everyone, if you know of a senior staying by themselves, check on them, please. Thank you.

Okay.

Excuse me. I'm sorry. I just asked that you check on people, especially seniors living by themselves and make sure that they are okay. Um, and that I, I want to offer my respects got to Tracy, uh, look at Kitty Tracy on the passing of her brother. Um, and, um, Mothers, I want to stress this as well. Be careful who you bring into your home. I realize that you may want a boyfriend or you may want somebody to come into your home, but if you have children, especially small children that cannot speak English, for themselves or take up for themselves. Be careful who you bring into your home. I remember my father died when I was only 13 years old, I was the oldest of four children. My mother refused to bring another man in over her children. And so I advise you, have your boyfriends, but if you're going to have them in your home, you make sure that you are there, because then you are keeping your eyes on things that are taking place. And I won't go any further on that. And that's it. Thank you. Thank you for that. Yes, ma'am.

I'm sorry. I do have an announcement. Sure. And it's Ballet Under the Stars by Ballet Spartanburg, which will be held at the Fifth Third Park. It's a free event, and it's September 20th, which is Sunday. And it starts at 5. And for those who don't get a chance to see ballet, that's an opportunity for you. So come join me because I'm going to be there.

Mm-hmm. Good. Thank you for that. I do want to thank Troop 2 for coming and leading us in the pledge this evening, as well as I do see Commissioner of Public Works, Dr. Amici, in the audience. Thank you for coming. and uh being a part of our uh council meeting this evening ruth i knew uh freddie frog as well that's what they called her freddie frog so i'm i'm sad to hear this passing as well and uh miles with the mayor which has been uh mentioned we will start again at eight o'clock duncan park at the pickleball courts we do plan on playing a little bit of pickleball uh sally so come on out and join us All right, do I hear a motion?

May I make a motion to move into executive session?

Second. All in favor? Aye. All right, let's go.