City Council - Regular Meeting

get started. Okay. Go ahead and do a roll call. Present. Alman Hazelton right here. Joe here. Camper present. Lester here. Michael Neely here. Thomas Young present. All right. Item three, public comment. Is there anyone here to speak? All right, takes us to item four. Thank you, Mr.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um, yeah, I'd like to get we got a slideshow that should be in your packets that will uh will kind of progress through and that'll take us from item four on the agenda really all the way all the way to item 11. Um, so I will kickstart our parking and work session if I can here. Let's see if I can get the We need the need the mouse. [clears throat]

It's one of those surprises though. Can't start a meeting without a little technical difficulty.

There we go. Uh first slide really wanted to show the existing financial status of of the uh parking operation. And um this slide um I'll I'll be pretty brief here. uh our fi our our finance director provided uh most of this information and really at what we're what we're looking at is um to begin with we right now we have an unrestricted parking fund balance uh as of as of October 31st of 24 so going going back to that point of $4.2 two million dollars once [snorts] uh and I do want to say these numbers uh most of them are unawituded so you want to make sure that that that was there is some auditing that has to do so these numbers aren't totally finalized but uh gives us a good feel for where we're at. So, uh, progressing through, um, uh, funds that are obligated, uh, of of the fund balance, we're really at, uh, an unrestricted the very bottom number there, it says unrestricted one one a little over $1 million. So um in um in that number we we have u to get us from approximately 4 million to 1 million we uh we have 3 million that is going to uh the the parking garage with the conference center um project. So that's that's wrapped wrapped up in there. And then uh of course we have uh the garage demo and um an improvement to our parking office at

Wallway uh this year kind of wrapped up into that number. So um again we've got an unrestricted um about $1 million. Is there any questions on this? I'll try to answer but honestly um our finance director it comes from her and there's detailed questions we can we can get those get those through her at some point.

Any questions? Um, also on at the very bottom of this slide under unrestricted, it it talks about estimated operating costs, uh, 2027 and we're really around a million dollars to $1.3 million is what we're projecting. And operating costs and that that is cost that is uh, you know, there's no capital costs that are that are involved in that number. That's that's uh paying our operator and uh keeping the lights on at our buildings and uh operational cost that turn it over to John. Just in general, we have 19 parking lots and 965 on street parking spaces in the parking system. Um and we have done a maintenance uh analysis on those lots. We are anticipating over the next 20 years that each of those lots uh will require one overlay. Um that is generally the lifespan average. Uh many of these lots have gone many years without an overlay already. Uh we also have a the existing street parking garage. [snorts] In 2023, we placed a membrane on the top and did some major repairs to it. During that time, the engineer uh told us that we are beyond the the term of the concrete being able to get salt on it. So, because of that, we have to start installing every 5 years, five, seven years, a new membrane on the top deck. That we did that in 2023. So starting in 28, we have to look at it and we're looking at over uh five

of those over the next 20 years at um about $400,000 a piece as that that parking garage was built in the 80s. [clears throat] So it's pretty old. Uh looks pretty good actually for its age and we want to keep it that way. Uh that all all of that work annualizes out to about $260,000 a year. In addition, a new parking garage is estimated cost the neighborhood of $20 million and the debt service on that $20 million would be $95,000 a month uh with interest over 30 years and 4%. Uh the actual spreadsheet itself that governs this is in the back of the packet. Um and so you can see the spreadsheet if you at your leisure. Um, any questions on the parking lots and all street parking?

Yes. If I could just make a comment, mayor, uh, on on the uh, annual cost of 260 plus around uh, 95,000 per month if we wanted a garage. Yes. So, you're saying that it would take about 1.2 million to to pay for a parking garage. Plus, we need to be setting aside roughly $260,000 a year to cover all of the maintenance that's required. Yes. In our parking lots. Yes. Okay. Council

Le just on on the uh uh debt service on the garage after we done how how much of that will be covered by the revenue anticipate from from the garage. Uh we will get to that. It appears that it will be about equal. So [snorts] a follow up on that question. So, just looking backwards, how much did we set aside every year to do maintenance in our parking fund?

Not very much, Brian. Not enough. So, um I I believe this past year was was uh we were at 75,000 is this year's budget. And I would I would say that's probably on the high number looking back in previous years. So with the parking fund exceeding $5 million, why was maintenance not factored? Why was maintenance not factored?

We didn't spend much on maintenance, but we had a five surplus. Why Why didn't we utilize that? I mean I council I wish I could answer that, you know, I started in March. I can't really speak for previous years. So I understand. And then on the membrane that we uh for the Jefferson Street parking garage, I know we voted on that last year and I don't recall because it probably would influence my vote. I don't recall any staff report that that would be a five to sevenyear replacement um for $400,000. But I just want to make that comment. like

you you wouldn't want to do the project if you knew it would have to be maintained. So, if a member's half a million dollars on a parking lot that's deteriorating, it probably would have influenced some considerations there. I'd say this the the parking lot we're talking about obviously is not the one that we're that we're demoing, [snorts] you know,

right? So, uh, making sure that what we have trying to trying to make sure that it's maintained. I think I'm speaking, you know, on something that I wasn't out here for, but I would I would think that they're they're trying to maintain a a parking garage and and in good order versus the parking garage that that we're just now demoing. Maybe maybe some continual maintenance on that garage would have made it last long. Appreciate Council L.

Thank you, M. where I totally a agree and see the the need and the value and return on investment [clears throat] in fact from from from doing our maintenance because I think it's evident that we may not have put near what what's needed in the past. So if we're going to build it, we got to maintain it. If we have one, we need to maintain it to get the longest life out of them possible. Um the cost is too prohibitive not to maintain them. It might be um since it was brought up and it it will be a future question if I get a chance Aaron if I can ask you a question. So if they if you said it would influence your vote. So if you didn't do the maintenance, would you want to demo the build demo the garage? I mean it sounds like either you do maintenance or you just let it fall apart. So I'm just curious. So, you know, when it comes back 40 years,

yeah, I think we'd probably have to get on the staff record. We'll be here all night, but I'll answer your question. I mean, that's not a very big lot. If you look at 400,000 divided by that number of parking spots, that's quite a expensive fix per spot. Um, I mean, I totally agree that maintaining our infrastructure is important. I ran on that, but but uh but I think that would be a consideration. I just don't recall having to replace that every 5 to 7 years is that was primarily my colleague. We can check on that. But the way I remember that project was we had to shore up panels falling off the building plus the membrane.

Yes. For 400,000. Yes. The membrane itself was not 400,000. It was the majority of it. It was. Yes. Okay. Um I I can get you the exact numbers for all this. Let's do that because I I know there was a few things we had to do in that 400,000. And please recall that uh when I say 400,000, I mean engineering fees and all project fees, not just the construction of it. Thinking, but I'm not I'm not totally sure that it's going to be 400,000 every 5 to seven years.

Yeah, we I mean we could dive into that. I just I can communicate that uh um looking at permits that have have recently come in since I've been here. There there uh is a uh another local garage not controlled by the city that that has a membrane that they're that they are going to to do the same thing. They're replacing the membrane that that they have on it. And uh so uh I know that maintaining a a garage like this is not not something that that that others aren't doing too. Sure.

So really right now, I mean, just before we flip the next slide, I mean, if we were at one 1 million to 1.3 million to operate and then uh to maintain without a garage, we're two where 260 uh to maintain and uh build a garage. We're at at [clears throat] 1.4. we're we're now at a at a cost of 1 point, you know, somewhere between 1.3 or or 2.4 depending upon if we've got a garage or not. So, uh just wanted to just wanted to um communicate that. Next slide. In addition to the uh to what we own on the ground, we also have a large inventory for our parking meters. Um right now the parker meters that we have are limited in the total we can assemble uh wholly to about 31 because there are housings and the um the mechanicals are no longer made for our meters. to find them, we will have to go to eBay and be at the mercy of finding um finding them somewhere else on the secondary market. So we are I I spoke to Natash Faulner with PCI this morning and uh at the rate that we are going through our uh our existing stores, we have the ability for about two more years with our meters before we have to start cannibalizing our meters or find a new source of meters. um the software that programs our meters. Um every time we change hours or we the number of hours uh a

meter can take or we change the uh uh cost per hour, we have to program them all. And the software that we have for that and the reader that we have for that are end of life. And uh we have had difficulty contacting the manufacturer of the software and the programmer. Um, and we're not sure what happens when we lose the ability to program our well, if we lose the ability to program, we we cannot use these and change our rates while using these meters. So, an existing double meter cost about $1,125 to set and a single meter is about $724 to set. Um, and that would be using our own staff to do all the work. [clears throat] And that includes um, uh, pole mounts, uh, the meter vaults, all of those things. And, uh, while while the doubles, we have 965 of these, we believe, uh, when you when you go buy new ones, they're going to be more expensive than that. So if we if we have to replace our old meters and we choose new meters when that time comes, it that cost will be approximately $1 million.

Can you could you explain the difference between a new meter and old meter? Uh the new meters have more technology on them. Uh typically they will allow you to pay with a credit card their network so they all know each other and what they're doing. Do you you want to jump in a little more? Yeah.

And apologies at the start I should have introduced our our uh friends with PCI Mike Bandy and and Brian Kern. So they're here to uh there's a few [snorts] more slides coming up that they will handle. So, and uh [clears throat] good evening. Um what John said is accurate. So, the new meters, most of the new meters that are out there are all uh credit card enabled. They have a cell card inside of them. So, they are worked. Um there's number of different types of reporting options and softwares that come with these new types of meters. Um so, the current meters are out there in the field. These are I'm not sure how what decade they came from, but uh it's hard to find uh meters like this uh out there on the open market to to replace.

Councilman Camper and then Councilman Toms. Um what's the co So if we replace all of them, it' be a million dollars. What's the cost of the box? That would do like a whole block. Uh those are or more even 10 10 to 11,000 uh kiosk. Okay. And then how many double meters are in a block? More than 10 to 11. Yeah, it it really depends on the block phase. So uh some of some of the blocks can have uh up upwards of 18. Um

so it' be cheaper to put one of those in than to replace. We could I mean we typically I think what we we tell our clients is you can put one in and you can take away about 10 individual metered stalls. Yeah. Uh it depends on the location. We have parking lots with meters as well. So if you have an area where all the meters are sort of in a in one centralized area, you can probably get away with doing one kiosk for multiple uh with more than 10 meter stalls.

Okay. A couple other considerations, too, is, you know, if you do have a busier parking lot, you don't want lines of people waiting to pay to to go about their business. So, there's a few things to consider on that, but yes, they're multi-pace machines. We can program them to do more than 10. Thank you. Um, so you could replace meters as old ones die. It's not like you have to spend a million dollars and replace them all right at the same time.

Yes. I I I would say that would probably be what what we would want to do. We've we've we already have on the the plan for 2026 uh to install 15 of the kiosks throughout the city. And I think what we'll do is go through and figure out what areas make the most sense, what where are the high high volume areas, and we will take those out. And then as meters do die, we'll have that inventory that we can use to replace anything that dies temporarily keeping us going until we can upgrade the system. So you're thinking about putting in the kiosk and and removing meters. Yes. Is that what Okay.

Yes. Yeah. Exactly. The the idea is we would we would be able to go through it. The other thing it sort of helps us, there's a number of different benefits to it, but on top of having the mobile pay option, so when customers are coming downtown to park, uh, they can either pay with the with with their mobile app, which last time I think we talked about this, it was somewhere between on the high end, it was 75% of our users are using the mobile app to pay, depending on the rate of the meter. So those that were at the dollar an hour meters, 75% were using the mobile pay. the remainder of the 30% are using the single space meters. So, we want to find the areas that we're going to have the most success with those kiosks and the most use out of them um and put it on a map and sort of make that determination on the most logical places to put these for the public.

And it is still planned that the kiosk will take coinage. That's correct. Coinage and credit card. Great. Thanks. Now the existing existing meters that we do have they require a u a device with a software to change their programming. Is that correct? Like if you change if if rates are changed. That's that's correct. Yeah. Everything is done via software connectivity. Is that is that programming or is that software supported right now? It's yeah it's it's the name of the company is flowird is the word we're going to be using and the the existing

oh that the existing software right now is not supported by anything the the company has been uh bought out. They're not doing any type of support. So, uh, should we want to make any types of changes to the rates or anything like that, um, we will not have any success having somebody program our, um, device that changes rates or, uh, the timing of those meters. So, right now, I think it's 8 to five. If we wanted to go beyond that, we wouldn't be able to change it. Is there a pretty good stock? uh here we have uh I I want to say it was somewhere around 30 mechanisms that we'd be able to use.

So So we have less than 1% of backups for the thous going that might work if we don't have a software issue. Right. Right. So if we have a software issue and none of them work or we can't reprogram them then we can't phase them in. Right. Right. Okay,

the kiosk and all that. Uh, how wide of a zone can you make that cover? Are they generally designed for a block or I mean what is the reach of it? So, if we decided to make red zone, green, color coordinate them and all that stuff for these kiosk. U, we could program them however we wanted to do that. So, um, generally speaking, depending on the length of the block, we might put two, one on the first third and then another on the the last part of the block to on one block face and then another couple on the opposite side of the block. [clears throat] But, generally speaking, I think what we would do is start out by looking at where we want to put them, how many meters there are. If there, let's just say for talking purposes, there's there's 10 meters on this block. That would be where we would suggest, okay, let's put one right dead center, middle of the block. So, anybody that parks anywhere on that block, if they don't want to use the mobile pay, they can walk up halfway up the block to pay the kiosk. that's get [clears throat] to a a a point like when we go to Cincinnati, they have the kiosk either in the beginning of a parking lot or in the middle of a block like you said that covers, but I didn't know what the range was cuz we're generally within a block of where that kiosk was too. So I didn't know how wide of a thing of a area that would cover or is that designated from Madison to Jefferson? You know, however that is that you know what I'm saying on something like

Oh, I I I think I follow you. So you're saying if I park in at one block, can I can I and I forget to pay for some reason? I can find another kiosk a block away. Can I use that other kiosk to pay or surely that thing will come up on your phone. Hey, you got 10 minutes left. Do you want to? Yeah. Well, an additional charge. That would be on the mobile pay option. Yeah, you could do it that way. But if we're doing pay by plate, so somebody can go up to one of those machines and plug their license plate in, they'll they'll be all set. They don't have to go back and put anything on their windshield or any receipt because uh we track everything via license plate. So, our enforcement officers will know not to issue any citations. Thank you. All right. Oh,

I'm sorry. Council, thank you. Um, is there a guaranteed lifespan for the kiosks? Like, how often, you know, we've had these meters for a really long time. How long should we anticipate to have a kiosk? Well, I mean, I don't I don't know the exact lifespan of these, but in our cities, we recommend for our people to do some general preventative maintenance to extend the lifespan. And then we would make the recommendation at some point if we see that there's some reason that we need to start phasing them out or upgrading, we would do that. But I don't know a general

Yeah, the manufacturer will tell you seven years, but because of the maintenance that our teams do, we usually can get those 10 to 12 years, but you want to try to upgrade those whenever you can. Okay. And then um so if we wanted to space out the kiosk, there's also people can still pay by their phone and they would not have to visit the kiosk, right? That's correct. So you could theoretically do more of the pay by phone or encouraging people to pay by phone and less of the kiosk.

Uh that's that's correct. We actually were just having this conversation internally, but yeah, we have some cities that are sort of removing their kiosk in some areas and just going to a mobile pay in certain parts of their cities where it makes the most sense. Okay. And the last question, you said the name of the software was Flowird? Yes. Okay. And is that something that is [snorts] contracted through you or is that contracted through the city or how does that like if for some reason in the future the city and PCI parted ways would we have continuity of that service?

Uh yeah it is it is contracted through through PCI uh but the city of Jefferson is paying for them. So if if BCI were to go, the machines stay. Thank you, Councilman Peter. Just a quick one to make sure we're all on board. I'm guessing [laughter] the single double meters, they're 70 years as well or roughly. Those are usually a little bit longer. They'll tell you 10 to 12 years. Okay. Neil,

the cost for the single and double meters that are represented on the screen are those coin and card. The ones on the screen are uh the ones we have. So they were coin only. Coin only. So that represents coin only costs. Okay. Correct. That that is their existing. We are depreciating them out.

Gotcha. Okay. So, has the city ever [clears throat] done a formal request to seek a programmer to write programming for our existing infrastructure? Because that seems like the hiccup to keeping that, you know, those things have lasted a long time. Have we ever saw 2026 sought somebody to take a look at that and see if we could ask some because I bet it's basic programming. I just don't know the mechanics of the meter. Not to my not to my knowledge. Okay.

Yeah, Councilman, we did that in our finance software two decades ago and it was awful. We had one guy that could write reprogram. Uh he retired and then we had to no buy new software.

I would Yeah. Yeah. Not in house certainly that probably would be feasible but but looking nationally for for somebody who could write programming to keep and use the infrastructure we have. All right. All right. So, um, just to recap kind of where we're at costwise operating and maintenance without a garage, you know, we're we're on the low end, 1.3, probably the R somewhere in the range 1.3 to 1.7. With a garage, you're looking at 2.5 to 2.8. and uh that that factors in a a little bit of the the meter discussion that we're talking about here, but on a on a 20-year note, you know, meters is, you know, 75 grand a year, something like that. So, it's not a not not a great expense. So, anyways, keep that in mind as we move forward. We're going to move forward to kind of the displacement plan and I'll turn it over to PCI to uh to

Okay, so this is the uh displacement plan update. We have been tracking the open stalls by area. If everybody remembers that we had area 1, two, and three, everybody that we put on the street, 99% of them signed up for area one. Uh we've been tracking every block face there, and we have a utilization there in front of you to show the total occupancy of the area. And it the highest occupancy we have here is Tuesday. Looks like February, I'm sorry, Wednesday, January 21st at 10:00 a.m. uh 58% 59% was occupied. So, there's still a lot of breathing room in these areas. I know there were some concerns from some of the local businesses that were in that area, uh especially along Capitol. Um at at this time, the displacement plan seems to be not affecting uh any of the normal business operations that are in the area. So, I uh I think everything's been running pretty smoothly at this point.

Any questions on this slide? Moving on to fines and compliance update. Mike.

Yeah. So, uh we did a quick uh we were just sort of getting a quick comparison of how our ticket writing was going this year versus last year. uh we are on par with what the city was writing uh per officer per day for uh comparison between January 2026 versus January of 2025. Um the noticeable difference here is we did have uh more enforcement days in 2026 and two officers. Uh I think the biggest difference here is that PCI we're responsible for just following the uh enforcing the municipal code. We're not called away for any type of snow removal. I know we had some snow events last year in 2025. Uh we have we have that contracted out so we don't have to worry about taking our team off the streets and doing any of that. So um but on on the comparison if you're comparing uh the officer per day, per enforcement day, we're right around the 25.5 to 26 uh per citations per officer.

Any questions? So, so there were a lot more tickets written though. It looks like it's per day. I mean, you've got two officers, a lot more days. Well, yeah. And I think last year we only had the one snow event I think in January here, 8 inches of snow or so. Uh, again, our people didn't have to worry about having to clean the streets or around the parking lots. Last year there was another snow event and my understanding is all the parking team was used to help clean up everything in the city.

That's real quick. Is that the the tickets since they're about the same per day per officer? Is that in a general one location or is that spread out through It's spread out through the entire all the enforcement area that we do. So I it's this isn't broken down by any specific geographic region. I was just wanted to see if you could pinpoint where 15 [snorts] of the 26 a day are. If you do if you do that, you know, if we're having problem with one area of the the downtown area or wherever it is,

we haven't looked into that. We do have the technological capabilities to to we we geographically pinpoint where we're writing citations. So we have that ability to to look into that. We just haven't looked into that yet. That would be interesting to see.

All right, progressing to the uh item number eight on the agenda, proposed rate structure. Um we'll go into that session here. Mike, take it away. All right. Um I did a Google search of what I did in 1930s Jefferson City. I'm not sure if this is accurate image or not. So that was the best I could find. We go to the next slide. Uh there was an interesting document that came up uh last month, month and a half ago. It was a historic Jefferson City document. It was a couple hundred pages, but on page 83 of this document, they had a blurb about parking. And parking has been a hot topic here since 1940, 1938 really. Uh, so I just I say this because I thought it was interesting that there was a street car that that was used back in the 1930s. It was discontinued as automobiles started to take over the downtown. There was a lot of things in this, so I just put it down in the bullet points I thought we'd all care about. Uh, there was two-hour no parking restrictions that were implemented and abandoned after a strong backlash and all fines were refunded. I believe that was all along High Street. So at one point it was you could park on high street as long as you wanted and then that was late 30s and then 1940s 1940 is when Jefferson City installed the first parking meter. Uh and this is all relevant to later in the slide. So I just wanted to bring that up. So 1940 to control and manage the the parking in the downtown area the city installed the first feebased parking meter. And you go to the next slide here. Back in 1940, the the rate was 5 cents an hour. And if we fast forward to what a nickel is in 2026 versus 1940, we haven't really been keeping up with the inflation since 19 1940. So that graph just shows probably if if we did

stay in line where we would be approximately with this and it would be between a$110 and a$120 per hour. still cheap. And uh uh so we're going to go into I think we have a question from council problems. Sure. What is our current rate? We have three rates right now. Uh I believe it's somewhere around 60% of all of our meters are 35 cents an hour. And then we have another smaller percentage that's at 75 cents. And then uh a group that are a dollar an hour.

Thank you. cost. So what what's our cost then for these meters that are our costs have got to be relatively breaking even or lose money in today's if you're if you just said 35 cents did I hear that

35 cents an hour. So yeah and interestingly so if you're using the app whether it be Ubio or Passport however you're paying by your phone uh the convenience fee to use that app is 35 cents as well. So the the parking rate is 35 cents. The convenience fee is 35 cents. So the customer is paying uh.7 cents for uh parking with taking those rates per hour. Yes.

You said the convenience fee is also per hour. the the the convenience fee is not per hour, but the 35 cents is uh the rate is per hour. Okay. Council, you have more comments on this slide. I mean, I have a comment to make on the slide, but make sure Oh, the last slide. This slide here. Oh, yeah. I haven't even got to that, but yeah, go ahead.

So, yeah. So, the slide that was just up, um, what that represents is some changes. Uh, I believe most notably for me on Madison Street, it would propose a cost where now it's no cost to our parking, right? Uh, no. Are you talking about this map here that's up?

Yeah. Um, let me get into this really quick first and then I I guess I can answer that part. Um, so the the one thing that we noticed as we were going through the city, there was a lot of different rates and it seems like a lot of different agreements that were made for different businesses like, hey, it would be nice if I had a 90-minute spot in front of my business or hey, I got a 4-hour spot in front of my business. um we see that there's a much more benefit if we treat everything equally and the city defines zones of this area is going to be two hour, this is going to be three, this is four. So the proposal we're starting with right now is having the red and the blue up there on screen being 2 hours maximum parking and then everything in green does not have a maximum. And I know there was there might be some concerns on the 2-hour. I've heard a little bit of uh scurrying about that when it came up in conversation about a month ago. Um and we can certainly talk about that. Uh but this was really an idea to get some consistency into the parking system with with having four or five different time zones throughout the the city. It's a little confusing similar to how the rates were for the the parking fines were. In addition to that, we're proposing having a premium zone with a different rate. Generally in that area, there is a hodgepodge of rates between 3575 and a dollar. Uh that is a hot spot. It's been a known hot topic of conversation as we're talking about rate structures here. And we're proposing doing a premium zone in this area of $2 per hour with a two-hour maximum. the blue area which is what we're calling sort of the core area. We're proposing that we go from the again it's a hodge podge. There is some I think there's might be one block a dollar an

hour meters. A lot of them are 35 cents. We're proposing that we bring everything up to $1 with a 2hour max. And the same thing with the green area having everything go up to $1 with a two with a with a with no time limit max. So you could park there all day at the dollar an hour and and we're we're doing a phased approach on this as well. So we're proposing that for year one. Whatever year one looks like whenever this decided that we want to do some version of this uh year two the blue area would then jump from a dollar to a $150 where it would sort of normalize and then we would start doing a normal 3% increase to keep up with the economy and inflation. And uh I forgot to I didn't get to what I promised I was going to get to. At this time I we we're not we haven't used high street or the side streets where we do have the free parking in the numbers and the revenue projections. I will say it is a little unusual to have a managed paid parking program where your busiest most high active street is free. It's not really there's no curb management. There's there's just a time limit and we're we're not but we're monetizing everywhere around it. [snorts] It is a little unusual I think when you look at any city in the country. Um, so I did put a little note on the bottom if that was something we did want to entertain and we want to implement monetization on High Street as well as the side streets on Madison that are free, there would be an additional conservative estimate of $200,000 annually based on existing trends and the volumes I was able to pull from the software that was provided to that. So, I probably went into a lot there and

I talked over myself a couple times. So, let me know if there's any questions to that. Council Thomas, do we have any history or anything that tells us how long people are currently parking in the red zone and the and the red zone is only for dropping passengers off do not stop. Sorry, airplane moving.

We we have uh we have a limited data. Uh we I think there was a there was a couple uh parking studies that the city has provided us and there's some information in there I can't bring up off the top of my head. U aside from that uh the city has immediate access to just the passport paid transactions that occurred in that area. Uh but we wouldn't have any uh information on any transactional uh volume data related to the coins. So, uh, unfortunately I don't have a good answer to you, but there is a parking study that's out there that, uh, might be able to answer that. Yeah. [snorts] I'm just curious if, you know, if people are staying there routinely for three and four hours, then we're going to limit them to two. Um, if that's going to be an issue.

Well,

or or maybe most people are only there for an hour anyway. And well, the the other thing is as we're going to go through the slide, I think we'll we'll we'll start you'll start seeing our logic behind it. But in our experience, having a two-hour maximum or something less than the 10 hours that's currently in some of those areas uh in in the core or the the busiest part of your city is sort of counterintuitive to what we're trying to do. We want to get everybody to move out a little bit. We have a lot of open stalls along Mccardi and the green areas. That's why we have nos. We want to push people out there. And if anybody does have business to do downtown, uh not long term, we want people to come come find a spot downtown, uh park in front of the cap, do their business, get out, leave, keep a space open for another person to come in. That's the entire goal of this. And we want to spread everybody out and get everybody to utilize all of the assets.

Thank you very much. Councilman Mele and Councilwoman Joe.

Um the the streets on this map that are currently no cost that would become cost um have longstanding businesses on them that have had some they have the same business operations for decades. And you know, whether it be a florist or a very established restaurant, you know, when you have to go orders or picking up flowers or something like that, um I hesitate on something like this because I think about the competition of those small businesses having, you know, unlimited parking and free parking and those types of things. And you know, you know, my goal is is to create an environment in order for them for them to thrive and be successful. And and I'm not saying that this doesn't do that, but but that's my hesitancy on on turning something that's existed for many years as no cost. And I get what you're saying that it's hard to find a city where there's, you know, free parking, right? But we are a small community. I mean, we're defined under 50K as a small community and we're we're surrounded by farming communities and um our largest workforce is state employees. We have a low income here and so for those reasons I think it's appropriate.

Yeah. And I knew uh talking about High Street that's why there's no additional slides or anything. There's just a little note on the bottom if that's something we even want to entertain. So, um, at at this time, I think what we're really just proposing is the existing, and I apologize, my map, I'm sure, is not 100%. I'm not the best graphic design artist, but uh, the idea right now is whatever we have existing on the street right now, this is what's being proposed, the red, the green, and the and the blue zone. And and we're proposing that the time limits change, and we're proposing that those rates change. uh anything that's currently not being monetized probably might merit another discussion that we're probably not going to figure out here is my thoughts.

So if if we went back in time a couple months to when our fine schedule was I'm assuming in the free area was it $6 too? Yes. If somebody parked in the free Yeah. So, if if our our uh staff was busy shoveling snow or doing other projects or had a problem, uh we only get by there once or twice a day, so somebody could park on our most desired parking for less than $12 a day if we only got by once or twice a day to write them a ticket. Right. [snorts] And and I would say it's that's

that's what we we heard a lot of that in the downtown business association meeting that [snorts] retailers were seeing people staying there all the time.

Yeah, we we did hear that there was a couple vocal business owners that brought that up and they thought that the fine should be $100 and we you know we of course laughed about it because I'm sure that wouldn't have gone over well had we seriously suggested something like that. Uh but but typically what we see when we implement some type of paid parking program in a city, the businesses actually see more foot traffic because there is the more there's a possibility that you're going to get different vehicles parking in front of your business. And that's the whole goal. We want turnover. We don't want anybody to sit there in front of somebody's business for hours on end and the business doesn't get to see any benefit of the park of the traffic on the street.

Well, yeah. And I I think I I see that and we we mentioned a florist here. Um I just happened to do business with that florist today and it was it was surprising to me at 7:30 a.m. there was no on street parking available on that block. My assumption is it's long-term parkers that work in the governor's office, hotel building, uh Jefferson building, other other office buildings. But even before the day starts, some of these best parking spots are full. And I go by the retail businesses and there's nobody in them.

Yeah. And and I think that sort of speaks to a lot of the different cities when there's parking changes. uh it for some it hits a nerve with a lot of different people and it's a very sensitive topic and that's why at the beginning of the slideshow there was that little history from 1930s 1940s where changes were attempted and then there was backlash. We we backed up gave everybody their money back and we said okay we'll do what you want. And now you know fast forward to today we we sort of have a little bit of cleanup work to do. We have garages with that had deferred maintenance that is coming down. We have meters with deferred maintenance that need to be replaced. So, we're sort of in a spot where we really need to figure out how are we going to manage this for the long term. And it sounds like we we we have the people in the room that can make that change now. And we probably want to figure out what can we do right now. Not not what's best for next year, two years, three years, but what what is this going to operation going to look like in in seven to 10 years from now.

Thank you. That's one. Joe, um I wanted to clarify that the fee structure, is it a 1 hour minimum or people can still pay for like 15 minutes, 20 minutes at a time? We'll be able to set that up however is that we we want to do that. I think we're going to recommend that we we do have 30 minutes, but we can do it however we sort of land on as long as it makes sense with the the transactional fees that the city pays and as long as the software works. Yes. When we make the changes, right? As long as it's still working. Exactly. Yes. Councilman Camp here, then Councilman Mowers.

Um, so I I really like how we got everything to be either 2 hours or unlimited. We don't have 90 minutes. We don't have, you know, there was so many different You never knew. Um, a thought, and I'm sure you've thought of this, what about making everything a $150 so nobody I mean, you know, if you're parking somewhere, it's $150 an hour. Just a thought. I mean, because that, you know, the blue and the green would cover the difference of the red. Well, we I'm trying to make it, you know. Yeah, I get it. We We did think city hates change. I thought we saw that.

You know, I think this is great cuz if we don't do anything, then we might as well just say we have free parking because we It sounds like our meters are going to be gone in a year possibly, you know, so we might as well just do free parking. Yeah.

And then, you know, the city's just going to keep going downhill. uh that is definitely on the table. There's a number of different ways we could probably structure these rates, but uh ultimately what we want to do is sort of make the the green area a little more attractive with the longer time limits and and uh maybe we can keep that under the $150, but there's a there's a number of things we could do differently, but I think what we wanted to do was highlight that around the capital that seems to be something that we want to make sure has a a premium rate. Uh everything else on the side um I think is is open for some type of discussion and after we talked about it for the last 30 45 days this is sort of where we landed on that made the most sense.

No that's fine. I just I just want to say I like how we're getting rid of all these different times and I just think make it easy for people. Mr. Crane. Yeah. And and on that point, I think it's important to know that while we're proposing these rates, um we've got to make a decision when we look at these rates if we want to try to afford a parking garage. Uh because these this is how we pay for a parking garage with the revenue from the parking system. And I think you're going to get to some slides here in a moment in a minute that shows how challenging it is to build a parking garage that we all think we want

that [clears throat] we don't want to pay for.

Well, I think also to add to that discussions with the state as we look at a lot of projects that we're working on, one of the commitments that at least I have made to them is we're trying to push parking away from the capital area. So we keep it available and I think the premium moves people up that are price sensitive away from the capital. So we keep it open for people that are coming in there. Now what we do off session don't like it going back and forth and changing rates but part of our commitment was we understand you have problems around the Trimman building capital Jefferson building. If you want to park there let's make it a premium. So I I kind of like the model you've you've set up.

Thank you. Um just getting back to the having the the rate structure where it's easily you know look at $2 or $1 and all that the the the part that you have highlighted red is right in front of the post office. [snorts] So I mean that's something and then also have the discussions with this if if like the downtown business association of have they been included with uh aspects about this and kind of getting the feedback on what they're seeing uh and getting any feedback before we go through this whole thing because we approved this tonight and there's going to be inundated with uh either emails, calls about we don't listen or whatever it is. um about how we're trying to do this for the city when we're actually trying to simplify things to make it easier for people to to uh know where the the premium is and all that stuff to bring it up into the 21st century instead of whatever it was you said 35 cents and all that because I guarantee I can go anywhere outside of your city and at the minimum it's going to cost me seven bucks most likely 15 bucks to to park, but we, you know, I've heard from a couple people that they don't even like to pay $2. So, I mean, it just I I would like to have the downtown business association all on board with a bunch of stuff and getting their feedback and then see how this might incorporate what they think and all that before we vote on any just uh, you know, rate increase right now. [snorts]

Nothing's up for a vote tonight. This is a work session. Mr. Yeah, on that point, we've got u public works and planning meeting to go through. We've been meeting regularly with downtown association. PCI has been willing to come and present any time. We have members that serve uh with them uh that are employees here. So, we're we're working with downtown association quite a bit. I was also and maybe Mr. Bremer or Mr. Fitch map [snorts] shows the area in front of the post office is in that no fee zone, isn't it? There it is. It's close right by close, but it's

Well, I mean that that red line just needs to be moved up to whatever that side street is. Yeah. Washington. Yes. It's got Arison all the way down to what is it? Jefferson Street. I I I think as Mandy said, the graphics aren't I think the intention was that that section would remain Yes. as it is now. Yes. To Councilman. It's it's a it's that block is currently a no fee block. So it would it would we weren't proposing to change those. That was it's just a pixel. No problem. Yeah. Um I

I think it stops at that side street. So I think you intended for it to be the way it currently is.

I think yeah again it was never when I was doing that you I take these bars and I and I I stretch it along. I'm using a tool called Snag It. It's like the snippet tool you guys use. Um so the intention on this map was just sort of give you a visual of the areas where the premium the core and the no maxes. uh everything that's existing right now, any any type of handicap stall, any type of free parking, uh we're not I'm not talking about changing any of that right now. The post office spaces, uh if I'm just talking about what is currently being monetized, what is currently on the street right now that we're collecting money for, if they're in that zone, that's what the rate would be.

And looking at the parking map, uh that that block is a 90minute uh no fee zone. Yeah, I was just just going to comment further um on Jeff's comments. Yeah, we we uh are definitely communicating with Business Association and those those those conversations will obviously continue as Brian noted and uh I know Gus is is here today and and Molly serves on that board and um any conversations on High Street and and the downtown uh of course we'll involve them. I doubt we'll have everybody 100% on board with everything. That's difficult to do, but we definitely want to make sure that that that and we will make sure that communication happens.

We're on Mayor Point for clarification. I just you may be the one that comments on downtown. I I think he does a very We've already gotten through public comments. So, no, no. I'm just going to tell him that who's ever if he does the commenting on it, they do a very good job of explaining exactly what is going on. So kudos if that's you. Uh but you see the comments that come after your post sometimes. So um that's what that's what I was getting at. Okay, Councilman Thomas,

I just want to roll back for a minute to the you don't have to roll the slide, but the 1930s, 1940s to today. Um the last career I had that I retired from was in food service and I dealt with hundreds of restaurants that were still selling a hamburger for $3 because they were afraid to change the price for the last 10 years. And when it finally gets to the point where they're losing money on every burger they sell and all of a sudden the burgers $7.99 or you know whatever it needs to be to maintain profit margin. And I like where we're going here to to start bringing things back up to reality because burger price goes up practically daily these days, but even back then, cost of labor, everything. And we're no different. The cost of the city to run parking, it goes up annually if if not more often. So, while this may seem like a leap, um, it's just catching up to reality. So, I just wanted to make that statement. Thank you.

All right. Okay. So, on this slide, this just sort of breaks out the timeline of how we had it set up. Um, what if this were to be approved, if these rates were to go into effect, we're proposing that everything would go up to a dollar an hour and the red zone that was on the premium map would be the two. On the second year, that blue area would jump up to a $1.50. The premium would still be at the two. The green would still be at the dollar. And then there would just be a 3% increase on years three, four, and five. Councilman Campy,

just a quick question. Is that a 3% on all three groups or just the core and premium? What about that dollar green? Uh, good catch. That was supposed to be on everything. Okay.

All right. Uh, and here's just a a quick visual of what the revenue would look like. uh given the numbers that we just discussed um that would be what assuming the same volumes and everything is the is the same uh year one you'd see 120% increase and so on and so forth. So if you start at 559 uh total revenue the blue is what uh actual revenues that I had on the spreadsheets that I was looking at when we were doing the displacement plan and everything like that. So using that as the baseline, uh the blue is showing 2024 to 2025 numbers and then the orange would show here's what year one would look like, year 2, three, four, five, so on and so forth. So the same thing on the permits uh was looked at. Uh the permits was a little bit of a trickier conversation I think because the you can see the current rate on the left you see all the parking lots we have. So lot 1 568 all the way down to lot 31 and then you see the current rates there. We have 35 69 60 46 28 46. So, we had a N95. We had a number of different rates that we thought would be again for consistency sake, let's let's have like a premium area, which is sort of what we did. You'll see this on the next slide of here's here's the [snorts] most desired area if you want to be a monthly parker right here. That'll be the $150. That's sort of where that's where lot one is. Uh that's where the Madison garage is located. Um, we're proposing that that one jumps up to 150.

Did you say Madison? Where the Madison garage was. And on the next map, you'll see the uh the the box. There it is. So, $150 we're proposing. This is what it looks like here. So, got it.

We're saying anything in that area would be $150 for a monthly parking permit. There was a couple cleanups that we did. for example, lots 11 and 12 and sort of in the middle of the map that are in the $80 box. They're right across the street from each other, but they're $15 apart, I think. Can you go back to the previous slide? Uh, yeah. 11 and 12. 11 is 69, 12 is 46. They're right across the street from each other, and they're for some reason they're different rates and and not even close. So, uh, we're proposing to stabilize those to be the same. They're they're it makes sense geographically to have them be the same. Uh but we're trying to simplify it where we have a $20 rate, a 40, a 60, uh an 80. There's a couple caveats to this. So there's lot 31 across the freeway. Uh I've never seen that lot busy. There's two parkers or I there's there's a handful of parkers there, but it's not really heavily utilized. Uh but we're proposed to have that just uh go up a little bit just to cover the cost of the permitting software and our enforcement and everything like that. Um in lot 24 uh we're [clears throat] proposing that we reduce the rate [snorts] at lot 24. Uh it's currently at 20. Yeah, lot 24 right behind this building is lot 24. Uh you got that front half where the where the visitors park and then you got the back half that's a big dirt gravel lot with that van and uh church bus I think

drug for youth council council for youth bus. Yeah. So uh we're proposing to reduce the rates there because we it's not a utilized area. I know there's going to be a little bit of work going on there [snorts] in in the coming future, but uh at some point I think we should consider lowering the rates there [clears throat] and seeing if we can get some people that maybe are at the $150 area or maybe even in the $40 area and see if they're willing to take uh pay 50% less and and park uh right behind us over here. Uh this this map here shows the

can I stop the council millia question. I'm sorry just on that slide before we get past it.

Does uh does PCI have an idea or staff have an idea right now about maybe how many permits would be issued for those areas? Would would we issue one permit per spot available, three permits per spot available? I mean, is there an idea of what the right number is to because those those parking permit areas still contain spots that can be utilized by a paying customer who doesn't have a permit. So, I just wondered if you had thought of a balance in what that pro preliminarily looks like.

Yes. Conceptually, uh I think how we envision the city to look. Right now you have lots that have these spaces are metered and they're for daily parkers and then the rest that don't have meters are for your monthly customers. Uh usually what we do in our other cities is we don't distinguish from different parker type. Whatever's opened can be used by a monthly or a transient. When we do it that way, we're able to actually do a utilization study and determine what the oversell rate is for a parking lot or a parking garage. Uh, generally speaking, on average, I would say a lot of the parking garages I do utilization studies on in u Omaha might be somewhere around two to two and a half uh of a of a oversell rates, which means for every one stall that I have in the garage, I could probably fit two monthly parkers because they're not all showing up at the same day. I got a lot of people maybe that work for a bank, they got six weeks of vacation a year. Uh, they're part- timerrs, there's night and weekend workers, that type of thing. So that's how we do the utilization studies to determine how many monthlies we can actually fit into a location.

So it sounds like maybe two per spot then generally speaking, but each location could could fluctuate. Uh a smaller location that's in a high highly used area like lot eight, I wouldn't suggest that one to be that high. I would say probably 1.25. But I'm just talking, you know, I don't have any actual numbers on utilization study there right now. Okay.

Uh okay. And then the based on the the recommendations we're making for the permits of of consolidating and moving [clears throat] the the 40 60 80 and $150 uh permitting. uh based on the current annual revenues that uh I had, I uh used the total number of actual monthlies that we have and plugged in what those revenue projections would look like year-over-year. And then this is the same thing uh with meter and permit revenue uh combined. I should note that uh parking fines are not included, hooding fees are not included. So,

Mr. B. So, based on the meter permit revenue and the um cost of the debt [snorts] service for a garage under our current rate structure, we we can't build a garage, can we? We couldn't pay for it. Well, I don't think the enterprise account would be able to to pay for it. What do cities do when the enterprise account can't afford something that they need to do? I would assume the general fund would have to supplement that. The taxpayer would have to pay for the enterprise uh fund couldn't handle. Thank you.

Think I think this is a good point. Maybe I'm wrong. Um, can you just kind of recap for me? And I don't know if this is a Mr. Brimmer or or you um but of these total sums here, I know that we're paying you a flat rate pay paying PCI a flat rate until parking exceeds 1 million and then you get a a bonus commission what you know whatever it may be. Can you with with this graph in mind and these dollars, can you kind of highlight how that would work?

So, I can try to handle that. Um, yes, 15% of anything uh over a million dollars u in in revenue. Obviously, that that does not include uh revenue that's that's generated off of uh fine citations. That's that's excluded. Um, so, um, so really take take these numbers, subtract a million dollars, multiply that by by 15%, and that that would be, uh, the payment to PCI. Does that cover it, Mike? That's correct. Thank you very much.

All right. And [clears throat] I guess I would I would uh going back to the beginning um without a garage what it would take us uh to pay for operations and the maintenance and John detailed on the low end we're looking at about $1.3 million. [sighs] Okay. So, uh, moving on to the Conference Center hotel, the the new parking garage, uh, PCI was asked to put together some numbers on what we can expect that garage to look like in terms of revenue and volumes and those types of things. Um, we don't have to get into the weeds on it, but the the key operating metrics that we used uh is listed there on the left just to give you an idea of how we came up with our annual uh, volumes. Um, there's a couple key details I'll use here when we get into the revenue, but um, before I get into that, let's talk about the rates that were at the Madison garage. Uh, the Madison garage was 75 cents for the first two hours. Uh, and then a dollar max and then a dollar an hour with a maximum of $8.50. And then it was free parking after five o'clock uh, and before 8. And I believe on the weekends as well. Um, for this garage, we put together a revenue projection as well as some rate suggestions. So, similar to what you saw on the previous slide, we're recommending that this garage have monthly uh monthly permit of $150. Actually, I think we probably just go to the next slide to talk about it. Brian,

real quick, do you know what utilization we were using when we talked about parking and you can get two cars for one spot. That Do you know previous to you all what our utilization was? Were we one to one, one to two, or did we not even have that? Uh, well, we we we had uh we we sort of came up with what an oversell rate could be, but in terms of the general parkers that were in the garage, we weren't close to filling the garage with monthly parkers. We came in, it was 229 monthly parkers that we were asked to displace. And was that the 1.43 43 number that I remember we were that's it. We felt comfortable about selling 1.43 in the garage.

That's right. Yeah, it was 55% utilization at that time and that's why we were saying we only needed to find 140 spaces in the displacement.

Thank you. So, uh, based on, uh, what we were using the, uh, information I had from the displacement plan, the 229 monthly parkers. I just wanted to make sure I was able to sort of point back to the logic on where we got some of these numbers. So, that's the monthly rate annual 412,000. That's based on 229 monthly parkers at $150. Assuming everybody comes back. Could be more, could be less, but it was a general idea. I'm assuming if we can get sort of the on street system working with the rest of the area, we can sort of get more uh traffic to go through that garage. The transient is a direct comparison with what I was able to get from the Madison garage for the 20 for year 2024. Um my understanding back then is there was tickets that were being pulled. Um, and I used the numbers of tickets that were pulled, not collected, because it wasn't 24/7, and used that as my volume. I think I'm boring everybody with how I got to it, but I'll make this quick. Uh, I was able to get an average ticket price or an average stay duration of stay for each person of of 4.5 hours. Um, we're suggesting that in the new garage we have rates of first hour free and then a $1.50 per hour thereafter with a max of $12. The the first hour free, I think, is good for the businesses. You can every business that's in that area can direct everybody to Madison garage or the the new garage, I'm sorry. And everybody would there's no need for a validation. you get your first hour free and as long as they're out within that hour, there's no pay that the customer doesn't have to make anything. Um, so we think that

would might be a good uh something that we can provide to the community uh as we're making all these changes for the parking uh community uh in the parking system. uh the valley and hotel. These numbers were based on assumed hotel occupancies of 70 70%. And then of course we broke that down to what we assumed would self would come up and drive versus what would uh use the the valet. So we'd have a hotel stay with in-n-out privileges. We have valet that are using a premium service. um when we came up with those numbers and then the hotel conference and and staff, the restaurant staff, that is uh still something that probably needs to be discussed a little further. Uh that whole category might need to be moved over to monthly. Maybe it goes away because there's off-site parking. I think there's there's a little more to talk about there, but generally speaking, I I think that's sort of where we're we're at right now with the assumption we can make at this time for the garage of 1.3 million. Um the this slide here. Is there any questions? I ask that. I didn't see any.

Okay. I just got these numbers a couple weeks ago actually. So 2025 actuals is what I got from somebody. U I'm I'm I got it from Natasha. Uh and I know we have some audited and unodudited numbers floating around there. Uh but just to something I could point back to I used those numbers and threw it on the graph here. So I had put my 2026 and 27 projections on there and uh to show assuming that the garage was going to be online January of 2028 and uh we didn't have any revenues coming in 26 and 27 from that garage by year 2028 we would see 2.8 million based on what we just talked about. Obviously there's some assumptions being made here. the parking fines, for instance, I flatlined to 139,000 all the way across. Um maybe it'll stay the same, maybe it'll go up, maybe it'll go down with more compliance. Um but some assumptions had to be made on it.

Councilman Thompson, new new kid in town here, [clears throat] state parking garage and housing authority. What what are those and why are we

why are they so there was some there was some u interesting ways that some of the revenue sources were being labeled on the city's finance side. I I think I'm speaking for other people's behalfs right now but I think there was the way it was labeled the state parking garage or the state workers that were parking in the Madison garage. Uh why they're on a separate line item I might have to do with a contract or or something on the back end I'm not privy to. Housing authority is u same thing. there was a uh there's some a deal or agreement with the housing authority in the city uh to do some enforcement around some of their properties and I believe that's the uh the fee that is charged to the housing authority for that service.

Okay. So those those amounts are people that were parking in our existing Madison Street garage that happened to be employment at state or correct. Okay. I was just confused that we why we were getting income from the state parking garage because I know they would not love that. That was my camper. So with the 2020 projections and with the new rates, it shows that we can maintain and run a parking garage and all our parking lots without going in hole. It's right at it.

Right. Right. Right. It's right at it. I mean, it's So, but that's that's year one. And then we're we're going to be increasing, which we've never done before, which is we probably still have that 1930 or 1940 meter sitting out there somewhere. Um, you are you are correct. Looking looking at the operating expenses. So, people want a parking garage. They have to understand it might cost them $3 to go, you know, to go downtown and eat. and you might put three $3 bills in there instead of three quarters. Okay, counc.

And just from your hotel garage projections, I answers my question. The debt service is like 1.1 to 1.2 and so it covers that but just barely and a little bit more maybe. And if I could that projection is an assumption not tied to the hotel conference center project. It is a cost estimate based on a per space number. 500 times by 40,000 as just a rule of thumb that 40,000 per space is generally

close to what parking garage costs per space. It's considered a programmatic cost. Yeah.

All right. Uh that's just that's the final slide I think on this uh just a quick uh summary of all the revenue discussions that we had in the growth rate. So uh if there's no other questions on the rates, we'll move down to item nine on your agenda which is uh codery. Right. I wanted to to just just uh put this as a line item to make sure everybody's aware, I think you all are, that there's going to be a pretty comprehensive code rewrite um and involved. Uh we will we'll more than likely have to hire uh some outside help to rewrite our codes to make sure that uh all these changes all these changes uh occur. And

what are you talking about, man? Why don't we need outside counsel? I believe we have a quandry. Service for free. Nathan, are are you are you good to rewrite the code on it then? We're good. I'm good. Awesome. Awesome. Yeah. You're record. [laughter]

All right. But yeah, um you know, from from how we interact with the courts to fines to rates to procedures, um we can use our our outside counsel to help us out and and knock it out. So, I just want to make sure that the top the slide you just had up had this little tiny white window with a chart in it, which I blew up because that's what I do. Um, and at the at the bottom left of it, it talks about, you know, the process of going through to pay pay your parking fine. And it says, and I get that this is a draft. Um, but it says pay at uh Park JC Mo office. Will we also maintain the ability for people to pay at the window here? Can they do that now? Well, f first I' I'd like to acknowledge John. John has John has put a lot of time and effort

on these flow on the flowcharts which will help obviously uh with with the code rewrites and he's been he's been interacting uh not only with Nathan but uh the court system and everybody else to uh to to try to make sure what's in this what's in the flowchart how things operate uh are ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch ch charted out accurately. And uh I think we're probably to um I don't know. I'll throw a 90% at it. John, you could throw uh what how you feel about where we're at on it, but we we're getting closer uh to having everything uh kind of in detail on paper uh so that code uh rewrite can happen and it will greatly help in that endeavor.

Well, and so my question is will people be able to pay here at city hall or do they have to go to the office? Is it I mean are we thinking about that? Looking for a definitive answer. city hall. Uh they are currently housed in city hall while we finish up Wallway. At the time in the future that this will be implemented fully, they people will pay at Wallway. But when they go to pay at Wall, there will be a computer on the desk to pay it. It will be an in-person deal, but it will still be useing systems that they possess. There is a way to pay uh your fines for example with a check or money order. There's PO box. So that's available as well. Um and uh we would I would not anticipate having a at the window here. We we would not handle cash for PCI's operation um because it it introduces a lot of uh accounting problems and some uncertainties of who's handling cash. Is the cash going the right place?

All of those things. So, it's it's it really needs to go to through the PCI accounting system at all times. Kind of the kind of things that keep your spare up at night. [snorts] And then um the other piece that that appeared to be missing here and again I know it's just a draft and everything's still in conversation but I didn't see where after appeal to the city prosecuting attorney is there at any point someone can get in front of a judge. There are multiple pages to this. Okay. This is merely the first page. Right. And like I said it's a little window there I guess. All right. Okay.

There's there's multiple pages. There's three pages to this flowchart. We haven't done the flowchart for bagging yet. I anticipate doing that next week. We're supposed to do it last week, but things have happened. Um, so we're we're moving along trying to get all of our processes uh fully started out like this. Thank you very much. I know you don't have anything else to do. Okay.

Any other questions on the slide? Uh, next on the list, payment system update. Um, so Mike, are you going to take this one over?

Oh, yes. Um, yeah. So, the we talked a lot about the existing meters and uh we're planning on implementing 15 kiosks throughout the city this year. Uh there has been some discussion about the nature of Ubio being web- based versus uh Passport's appbased platform. Um Passport is still on. Passport is still working and it will continue to work throughout the rest of the year and we'll continue to partner with Passport. So there will be two payment options that the public can use for payment on the street. Passport as well as Zubio. And and I would just add that that was because of some comments that we had received from customers and PCI did a great job of exploring if that was an option. People seem to like at least in the short term the app. So thank you for looking into that.

Yeah, no problem. And uh we did ask Ubio said they were in development on doing the similar prepaid option as Passport offers. uh not done yet, but uh they said it is in development. I just wanted to add that if anybody wants to pay early in now because they want to pay before they get to work, they can use the passport app to do that right now.

Mayor's taking up [laughter] any any other questions on this slide? else.

Um, other items, uh, I think we've talked talked uh about High Street and making sure that we're engaged uh, not only with the downtown association, but um, you all and and any kind of further thoughts on High Street and and anything downtown really. Um I have funerals on on the list and at the very bottom um we've got our current current code um kind of listed here at the at the very bottom which you know if there is we obviously have several numerous churches up in up in the area. what happens um when when there is [snorts] a funeral. Um obviously um you know not a good situation for for uh families, very unexpected cases, but but uh um we want to make sure that we're trying to trying to accommodate those. And so, um, you know, my policy right now is is five five free meter bags to take make sure that we're trying to take care of the the uh funeral director and and the the direct family involved and uh you know, if that number needs to go up or down, I guess, you know, we can we can discuss that. But uh that was the number that we felt, you know, was a was a good accommodation uh for those situations. Um, and then, uh, presently too, we have a food pantry that that happens, uh, pretty well, you know, every week on Tuesdays um, on on High Street or on Capitol, I should say, uh, at the 300 block. And, you know, that there there there is no code um, in in my opinion that that

covers that. and and we've hired PCI to enforce our code. So, right now, the way our code reads is that food pantry um food pantry would need to pay for the meter bagging. So, um unless there is legislative action by you guys to change the change that code for whatever reason, that that is our current policy. Uh so, I wanted to put that down on paper. I know we've we've had interactions with with the uh churches up there and and I know that this is a concern of theirs. Question.

Um so first of all on the funerals uh I guess it's been communicated what policy is to all the churches. We we will make sure to communicate that to them. Um I know that when we had discussions with them, we we noted that funerals was an exception written into our code. So they they know that the number of spaces, we will make sure that we we directly communicate that.

Okay. And and then with respect to uh like the pantry, uh the current language uh doesn't doesn't extend to that being like an incendiary circumstance. And and I guess my other question is is it talks about wave. Does that mean uh you have leeway to to modify what the amount would be to be a lesser amount? First I would so the code as written on the at the bottom says funerals or extenduating circumstances. extenduating circumstances um you know as extenuating you know defining that does not to me say it's a regular event that's scheduled you know to me an extenduating circumstance is something that that's unscheduled um so you know it if it's up to me to interpret everything that that gets into kind of some murky waters there so I mean I would think that that if you would like to to make sure that that uh food pantry is accepted then then u then maybe that should be proposed and then then the whole council take that item as a legislative action that that that would be my preference.

Okay. Yeah, I would I would think they need to to have uh some definition or and some some process to determine uh those type of exceptions. And as as we noted earlier in the code rewrite, you know, that's something that Nathan could help us with, right? you know, if there's there's a code rewrite that uh that needs to happen, we have the council um I'll let him know. [laughter] Okay, we'll work on something.

Council, thank you. Just so I'm clear, so funerals, five spots, if that's the number, anyone else attending would pay wherever they're parking, right? Correct. or or get additional bags and pay for if somebody wants to bag the block, they could bag the block. Okay. But we would we would provide five bags for free and the remaining bags would need to be paid for. And if the funeral's on Saturday, it'd be the same. Just 247 operations or not? 8 to 5. 8 to 5 Monday through Friday.

Monday through Friday. So, right. and and that you know five is a number that that we thought was uh you know a good number that you know that's that's why we have it listed on here so we can talk about it and uh we're making correct that number it's difficult very good thank you so yeah I wanted clarification on that because I know on high street by the church is there those are dope meters I mean, we're talking five bags is is [snorts] for five meter, which is, you know, five parking spaces. 10 spaces. Is that what you're speaking? Five five parking spaces.

Five spaces. Yes. Each bag goes on one one of the two heads. So, it's one bag per space. Okay. If it's a double meter, you only bag the space you need. So, when we do contractors, contractor needs one space. You can still beat a double meter. Yeah, they just don't. But one of the one of the heads is bagged off. Okay. So, so that would be two and a half bags. Okay. Two and a half meters. Two and a half double-headed meters. Five spaces. Okay. That Yeah, that I don't know. I don't know if you churches about that. I don't recall any of the

funeral funeral homes having more than five cars. Now, as you indicated, guests at the funeral maybe. Well, they're longer, too. Hers are longer. They probably take up two more spaces by themselves. Again, we're open to we're open to a suggestion. I would I would, you know, again, what what is fair, what is what is right. I mean, we we we thought, you know, five was a good number. If five is not a good number, then now's the time to speak and and I mean, there's obviously other opportunities as well, but

just yeah, I just uh just so it's clear and it's communicated in and gotten in communication with the churches. And yeah, again, we've talked with the churches uh in one-on-one situations and and uh and u you know as a group as a conference there there's no problem in talking with the churches. The specific number hasn't been presented to the churches or the um funeral directors yet because we wanted you to see it first and then get your feelings and then reach out and discuss. No point to communicate five if if we're we don't feel comfortable in that number and that that number gets, you know, gets modified in some way. So,

right. And we are not currently enforcing this. Right now, the funeral directors are still putting their bags on. So, this is when we do the rewrite of the code is the enforcement. And just so do you know how many bags they're usually putting on now? No. lot of dead people [laughter]

right present presently they are bagging themselves which is not which is which is not how our code reads right so we're we've asked uh you know PCI to enforce our code we want to make sure that that uh everybody's on the same page reading the same thing here

um so we've talked about the bagging It sounds like some people may want to I I would like like if you have a issue with the um let's say food pantry like let's discuss a little bit tonight instead of just all of a sudden we get an email the night before the meeting and then nobody knows which is what's been happening lately. Um, but like the food pantry, yes, they bag the whole block. Then all the cars park up on Capitol, even past the bagging. They do have parking behind. Um, they do rent out their parking or, yeah, rent it out to other businesses, so they're making money on some of their parking. Um, it's a great thing, but there's also several other churches that do great things that don't bag. There's also several non forprofits uptown that do great things and don't ask for free bags. I mean, at some point, if we give everything, you know, if we do this, what happens if every church downtown and every nonforprofit says, "Well, if you're going to do it for them, we do a food pantry as well. We just don't ask for it back. But now we want to." I just want you to think about I know this is very important to those churches and and to some [clears throat] of the council, but I want you to look at the whole thing. There's there's so many nonprofits that do great work downtown, so many churches that do great stuff downtown. We can't just look at one and say, "Well, we want you cuz you've always done it. We want to continue it. Some of the other ones might find different ways." Or they might go out and put quarters in it. We don't know. They're paying for all their parking. You know, nobody knows. Just I want it to be thought instead of just making a rash decision. Let's let's really think about it. comes from hospital

since bagging appears to be uh reactive to you know it's pantry it's a funeral don't know how big the funeral's going to be don't know what the appropriate coverage is perhaps it should be a an application process a permitting process um we're looking for an exception we want to bag this many meters for this event coming up here is probably the best way to make exceptions like that instead of, you know, have a blanket policy that may not be one sizefits all.

Yeah, I would just like to say our our code does address that. Um, we just haven't been following it for a really long time. That's what we're here to try to do is follow our That would be nice. Thank you, Councilman. No,

just talk about the food, the food pantry and Uh I observed that uh those spaces in front of the church there and right next to the pantry uh a lot of the individuals are are disabled and and what I what I've seen is just loading and then moving out of there and not being there very long. Uh and so I know I know there's parking they have in back, but most of that wouldn't work very well for them for a pantry. uh unless they totally relocated it, which I don't think they probably they could. But but anyway, I I just think uh you know, there needs to be uh [snorts] just a a process to go through uh with it. And uh and because [snorts] I guess like food pantry, it is to me a a service to the community. uh uh maybe it's a little bit different consideration than than the regular bagging but whatever we decide it it needs to be a process that that uh uh is applied to any organization that's similar is doing similar work and then council food.

Um, I have a question about the food pantry, but I also um want to talk about residential parking, but I don't want to take up too much time. So, because that's been a concern to constituents in order to and how that's being addressed, how enforcement's going. But on the food pantries, I guess my only question I understand all the comments made tonight. So my question is until this body rewrites code [clears throat] and makes a determination what it wants to do, what is our policy going to be

right now? The food pantry has has been bagging that block. Correct, John? just like they have in the past, which is not how our code reads. So, we've we have not modified modified any actions uh as of yet. We want to make sure that we're um you know, doing the right steps and communicating properly before we before we

so that continues as is until we get the code. And I would say too, I think, you know, looking at utilization on that block, I mean, I drive it frequently and maybe it's just and you guys have been keeping track of it, but util utilization on that block. I'm not sure there is a is a grand problem there just because when I drive it, and I want to be sensitive because I'm not up there as much as the church folks are and everything that to see it, but it it there seems to be plenty of of spots at least on the on the north side. Um but uh uh you know Mike you I don't know if you have utilization numbers. I think your your uh your graphs do have that but we can obviously monitor that.

No and that's all fine. I just want to know what we were going to do until this body figures out what it wants to do. So thank you. And then when we get to residential parking if we can just briefly to kind of clear that up because I haven't had any communication with you know individually with PCI. So I want to make sure I am able to effectively communicate with the people of work to what what our policy is head who's implementing enforcement in these areas and that kind of thing.

Camper. Um so just to make it clear that right now the code shows that we are allowing them to bag and not follow the code is what so really you don't the code wouldn't have to change if we wanted to not bag it. It would just stay the same. If we wouldn't if we didn't want to allow them to bag without paying the code would not need to be changed. We would have to adhere to the code and and we follow the code that that's in there now. Yeah. Okay.

So, are they providing are they doing, if I follow this right, they got their own bags or some sort of thing they do themselves? Did they get permission from the city to do that? I don't know. [snorts]

Well, yeah. I'd say a sit down discussion with them. Um would be it would go a uh further to say um you know, we you have bags. We'd like to have a discussion with you about what the code says and all that and we're here to listen and work out a deal. But I did not know they were just bagging it themselves. All right, back to you.

All right, moving uh moving down the list here. Frequently asked questions. We do have uh on on PCR PCI's uh park JCMO website. Uh frequently asked questions on there, I believe. Uh John, did you slide? They they may they may have not made your packet, but if you uh want to take a look at those and we can obviously get those out to you as well. Um, and with that, I mean, I think under under this would be a good time to talk about that residential situation.

So, I guess primarily just pretty brief for me, you know, who I get the concern from the constituent. I email to the city that gums up email. Three people are on the email. They don't necessarily need to be. You know what I mean? Like it it just seems inefficient. So like who's doing enforcement in the residential zones in war I those areas look like you know close to the bridge or up near St. Mary's Boulevard right off Missouri Boulevard. Um because we have vehicles that is a problem. I'm sure it's existed since day one, but you know, folks camp out and I think the last time that a constituent directed that concern to me, I sent it and we had PD out there addressing the issue. So, will will that be PD until until PCI takes over or has PCI taken over? Correct me if I'm wrong, John. I think we had this conversation. I'm not exactly sure about the area, but there was a we had a couple complaints that came in from [snorts] residents about what you're talking about. And we ended up sorry [clears throat] um we have infrequent patrol patrols that go out there. uh meaning that we go out there when it makes the most sense or when we know we're going to the typical time those people are going to be parking there. Uh we have talked to our enforcement officers, maybe go out there, park your vehicle temporarily, over lunch, what have you. Um but beyond that, I don't have any uh real granular data on on the enforcement of that area you're talking about.

Um I'm sure at some point he's got to look at these areas. Uh there's a lot of them in the city and I don't know that they necessarily make sense. um when you've got a 2hour parking off the boulevard in a res I guess it's to uh keep folks from not camping in those areas but I don't know John maybe it's more than two hours but I was thinking it was like depends on those side streets off of

it depends on location and it's not necessarily the whole street either the u the park JC Mo site has the map of all the parking um for the whole city it's not just the downtown area. So when there's a you can actually go and look uh for a location outside of four. Um but I know for reference the street by the a building downtown that's being or on Missouri Boulevard that's being renovated. There is a part of that street that is regulated so the businesses that are down at the end of the street get their can have their customers come and visit. Um there have been calls on that portion. Um it it's a very there's a lot of residential areas around town that have restrictions and it is and as Mike Bandandy said it is difficult to get to them all on a very regular basis while you're also trying to keep the downtown um controlled.

Right. Yeah. they're going to be doing. So, I mean that that may be a different I would say that's a good conversation at a later date um to get to rationalize what our residential uh department situation is because it is extensive and it is the rules are are kind of Byzantine on Is there a phone? I'm just trying to figure out how to call the uh parking if you call the parking phone number. Okay. 634. So directly we call the parking phone number on the park website and connect with enforcement that might pay a visit when Yes. And they will reply and they will respond a legitimate issue

and we do get those calls. Uh and like you said it was demand driven. We do get those phone calls about what you're talking about. I'm not familiar with those areas. U and we'll respond accordingly. Uh so maybe it's a matter of just getting our number out there or communicating that a little better to some of those other areas that we might need to better look out for. Yeah, if we have some sort of you know message or graphic whether it's PCI or the city, there's neighborhood groups all over social media and that message can be re related to those neighborhood groups and get to those individuals that type thing. So I think that'd be great.

Come here. Uh I also had a question for the residential parking areas. There had been some questions within my ward that I think you all had been discussing about residents who had historically got hanging tags from the city wanting to know if it was possible to get hanging tags again rather than having to register to people online. Has there been a resolution to that? Uh currently we're we're using the the way we enforce right now for residential is license plate driven. So camera goes by, reads a license plate, determines whether or not it's an active valid residential pass. So we want to be able to do hang tags with that system right now.

Okay.

I do want to Sorry, Mr. Mayor. I do want to actually vouch and say the responsiveness of their residential parking once they're notified they are very on it. There was a vehicle that had been hanging out on my street on Locust for quite a while and my neighbors called it in and within 3 days it was gone. So it was tagged and was towed off. So very good response rate Mr. Yes. Last on the list is as is just a comment of total review of locations and program for each location. You know, this [clears throat] is really noting that that you know, we have a a hodgepodge kind of everywhere. I think Mike has done a great job of of uh saying, "Hey, we need to take a look at each location like what's what's proposed. uh they're willing to uh adapt if if it if it makes sense to do something different in the future. Um I know currently uh you know looking at the at the displacement plan that we went over and who who all um accepted uh from the Madison Street garage displace you know a permit on the street. they're looking at at at further potential permit options and and so this is just really a placeholder to say that that they are they are hired to make sure that that we're being as efficient and parking is being as utilized as much as possible and it's not just a one-time look at you know it's not just okay we're going to propose this and uh and that's the way it's going to be for the next 10 years. Obviously, when changes happen, that would have to come through through uh this body if if [clears throat] uh if it's if it's uh you know, needs a code rewrite or whatnot. But but that will be that will be happening probably more fre frequent

than it has happened in in the past several years. Um and with that, um I think I think that concludes our slides. Yes. Any questions? Council like Thank you, Peter. Um, I'm going to go back to I was going to I didn't I thought of this after you went past the slide and I didn't want to digress, but at this point, so going off some projections and you talked about needing to do upgrades anywhere from 7 to 12 years if we convert to the new u rate structure. Yeah. not just rate structure but the kiosks the the meters you know if we transition to the new ones

and you said they needed to be updated or new every seven years some of them were 7 to 12 I think that's what the manufacturer says but sometimes we can make those things last a lot longer just like you have with your meters okay every city is different I mean we've got some cities to where they only last for 5 years because of the ocean the sand and everything and we have other ones where we've been able to look long for 15 years. But in a lot of our cities, just so you know, a lot of these kiosks are being taken away because people are using their phones. We're getting 85 to 90% payment from the phones.

That's an important point to make. My only thought was is that that if there's a a an ongoing expense whether it be u software related or equipment related I don't I don't want to assume this that's why I'm asking the question but any of your projections of cost or you projected 3% increases on the revenue side but the costs haven't been project those types of costs are not projected fair. Well, a portion

a portion of the cost have been. So, like in our 645, we've got those software fees built into that each year. So, some of it is so as you buy more. Yes, that will have to be added in. Got council on on the uh projections as far as expenses for maintenance goes. I think everything that John did was in today's dollars. Is that correct, John? So, yes, everything's in FY26, so they will have to be inflated as we move forward, just like we're inflating our um revenues, right? Absolutely. Okay. Thank you,

Yes. Thank you. I just had one quick question about the um and maybe I missed it about the bags and different conversations with the funeral home, the pantry and you said that um there could be conversation to make determination at a later date. Is that going to come up? Is so and when would you say that will happen? I I would I would say right now what I what I show you on paper, that's that's where we're at as staff-wise and and staff is willing to be directed as needed. You know, we we want to make sure that that um we're trying to make sure that we're living by what the code or beginning to live by by what our code says in this in this instance. Um right now, our code uh gives leeway for for funerals and extenduating circumstances. The way I read that is is kind of how I detailed funerals. I don't see food pantry as extendinguating circ because it's scheduled. I don't you know if I if I extingu circumstance is something that that to me that pops up

and uh and something that that reoccurs every week. Now if if uh you know this legislative body would like to you know modifi modify what what is in code we'd be perfectly happy to enforce what was what was but we wanted to communicate where we're at and then that way we can do a proper job with the with with the funeral home churches and say this is where we're at. One one of our one good extenduating circumstance that has occurred recently was the funeral for former Governor Bond. So I was contacted by the uh Capitol police. They have obviously they have security deta details. They have family. They have all kinds of things that have to occur because of the funeral. So under that extenduating circumstance, we blocked off all the parking in front of St. Peter's Church on Broadway and that was bagged by us and it was assigned to different staff. We also did some uh bagging down on uh Jefferson Street as well to uh provide for quick exit for certain people that needed to get in and out. Um so to us that's an ext that is definitely kind of both a funeral and an extenduating circumstance because we're coordinating with law enforcement needs um and that kind of situation. I believe other extingu excuse me extenduating circumstances in the past have been things like disasters such as a tornado uh flooding those type of things. We we do we will bag things as needed for those. So I think that's kind of where the the director's leeway has been in the past. Um and I just want to point that out that we we do do those things.

Yes. And I totally understand that. But I know you said that there were going to be conversation. Yes. With those people um those businesses down there. So that's why I was wondering once you have a conversation then we can come back and discuss. Right. We've had two. So we've had at least two already. Um different people have been different times to visit the churches. We have not discussed it with the uh funeral directors yet. We wanted you to see it first and we were planning on having those conversations with them now that we've uh presented to you the the staff recommendation. Thank you. And that's what I want to hear. Thank you so much,

Dr. Joe. Yes. So, something that has been brought up some is the uh the 395 processing fee. Um, would we be able to get an outline of how that's broken down? Because typically whenever you pay a processing fee, it's like 3% and that's quite a bit more than 3%. So, don't have to do that right now, but if that's something that we could get so we can better understand why that is more than, you know, your standard processing fee. Uh yeah, the the 395 I think we have two different fees out there. Uh the one you're referring to is on the citations.

Yes. Yeah. So the that processing fee that is charged covers the the cost that we owe to the vendor for use of their software as well as any uh credit card fees associated with that. So, in uh I guess is there a uh aside from that, is there a different type of breakdown that you're thinking we should put out there or the verbiage you think that might need to be changed on it?

Um I'm not sure. It's It just seems like, you know, that's 15.8%. So, I guess that's, you know, 3% is a credit card, then you have a little over 12% left. That would be a software fee. I mean, based on the the 50% of if your ticket was $25. Oh, okay. I gotcha.

And that is only if they want to pay online. If they want to just come in and pay it, they don't have to pay the 3.95. That is just the fee that the company that we go through charges. We can ask for a breakdown. I just don't know if we get that for you, but we can ask. Okay, Councilman Thomas.

So, I want to thank you all for doing this and I know this hasn't been any work at all. Um, so I really appreciate that. What's the timeline? Where where do we need to be focusing? Um, and this might be for Mr. Crane and the mayor as much as anybody. [snorts] Where where do we see this proceeding on with, you know, code changes, rate approvals and all that? Where we have a rough idea of where we are timewise. Mr. Cran,

thank you. I I would say um from a rate perspective, it's going to be over the next few months, especially if we're talking about the conference center and the parking garage. Um, so I think we're going to continue those discussions over the next few months. As far as um, some of these other things, what we're really what we've used and we told the public works of planning committee is we're using a section of the code that allows us to make modifications on a short-term basis. I think the max time is one year. So, we really want to be able to monitor the [clears throat] system, uh, get a better understanding of utilization and some of the opportunities that we might have for some of the recommendations they've talked about and try to get something in place over the next 6 months. Uh, because we're we're going to be bumping up against that one-year timeline. And hopefully that gives them a good, you know, six months, 10 months of data to determine what the long-term strategy is. Thank you.

Thanks. Just real real fast here. One consideration or two considerations that just came to mind I wanted to voice at this meeting to kind of marinate on would be in bigger communities that have the um uh zones with the kiosk. A lot of times we'll offer a 15-minute pickup that's free. um something to chew on. And then on a food pantry, totally understand the arguments that there's other organizations downtown besides maybe a church that do good deeds. I get it. Um so maybe a a code revision that is durable for that type of thing would look at, you know, an NPO versus a food pantry. you know, we look broadly at, you know, nonprofits and those types of things and what maybe reduced rate would look like for them. Um, because, you know, council would determine that, you know, they're providing a service to the city and that type of thing. So, just a consideration there. All right. Well, appreciate the discussion. I think we're at the bottom of the agenda, Mr. confirmed. Is that accurate?

Yes, we are. Mr. Mayor, Councilwoman Young, did you have any motions in mind? Yes, sir. I would like to move that this meeting be adjourned and we go into close session. Second, and I jumped over Clark. I know. I was waiting. No, I was waiting. You let me? I did. The chair will entertain a motion to adjurnn the public session in pursuant to section 61021 of the revised statutes of Missouri. Go into close session to discuss the following attorney client privilege subsection one. We have a motion by councilwoman Young and seconded by council.

Thank you. We'll do a roll call on that. Hi Allan Helton. I Joe I Camper I Lester Hi Michael. Hi Millie. Hi Thomas. Hi Young. Hi. We'rejourn. We'll go into close session. We'll meet across the hall.