Planning & Zoning Commission - Regular Meeting

Yes, sir. Yes. Yes, ma'am. Madam Chair, uh Debbie Cox is absent. Commissioner Art Warren here. Commissioner Mary Lowry here. Commissioner Tracy Quick here. And Commissioner Justin Oabetto is online. Justin, can you hear us?

For the record, Justin is muted, but he is online. We do have a quorum, Madam Chair. Very good. All right. So, the first order of business is a consideration to approve the August 14th, 2025 meeting minutes. Does anyone have any questions or concerns? No. Okay. Do I have a motion? Motion to approve the minutes as written. And a second. Second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor say I. I. I. Any oppose? Say nay. Motion passes. Now, do we have Justin? Are we sure he can hear us?

Justin, can you please um answer the the commission? Before we move forward, Justin, can you hear us? He was there earlier. Yeah. Yeah, he spoke up. Hello. I can imagine him on the other end trying to get stuff to work.

Justin, can you hear us? Yeah, we do need to make sure that he can vote though. Yeah, he's our quorum, so we got to do it. It's not meeting three out of five though, right? We do have a quorum with the three city. I I'll I'll continue to So, you want to move forward since we have quorum with We do have a quorum. Yes.

Okay. Very good. So then we're going to move on to item B, presentation and discussion of parking lot paving standards and alternatives and possible initiation of a text amendment. Dana, thank you so much Madame Chair, commissioners. Pleasure to have this item before you this evening. Um if you recall this was agendaized I think for your October 2nd meeting. Um both items on today's this evening's agenda were uh listed for that October 2nd and due to circumstances you're all familiar with uh we continued or uh moved to this meeting. So that said um just want to make sure you're aware yet nothing has changed in that report. Um I've cleaned it up and updated the dates and things like that. Uh but for the purposes of discussing these this text amendment, uh I know you've seen presentations in the past uh from staff covering uh this particular topic of paving standards for parking lots uh in the city. Um I think back on June 12th, the commission directed staff uh to prepare a text amendment after discussion stem from another uh case before you. Uh on the 30th, uh staff provided a presentation um kind of outlining the various different paving surfaces and locations and purposes and and appropriateness of those different types of surfacing materials and so forth. Um and now we are bringing you uh the language uh that is included uh that staff is proposing for to address this topic in our zoning code. Um this information was uh has been available to public right now in the process. You're simply directing staff this evening on and discussing this text any changes you might want to see questions

you have of staff uh so forth. Um and then ultimately depending on your direction, uh it would then go into that formal text amendment process where we advertise a citizen review meeting prior to uh zoning ordinance coming back before you in a public hearing which is also required. Uh that next step after that citizen review is a public hearing before the planning and zoning commission uh where you would make a recommendation on that an ordinance the text amendment to the city council who's the ultimate decision authority or uh ordinances within the city. So that's the big picture. Uh that said, I just have the text before you uh in your packets as well uh on uh on the screen here online. Uh so we just took the whole p uh for the most part the parking the current parking design standards from our zoning ordinance which you have in form and then show a red underline for added text, red struck uh language for struck text and kind of reorganizing things. So, this is, like I mentioned, already all existing in your code. And then I'll just scroll down. We've got separate uh parking or driveway standards for single family and manufactured homes, duplexes, things like that. Uh but commercial uses are where we really get into more detailed engineered type of uh design standards for surfacing. up. Uh there you see our first in uh inclusion um and identifying for new construction, restoration, uh renovation or restoration of existing parking lots. Uh prospective applicant shall request a PDM, a pre a preliminary development meeting. That's bring them in. We sit down and talk what is their goal? Are they making any changes or what and and then kind of outline that process for them. We do that for every uh development application for the most part. Single family on up or any proposed change of use in the city. So that's just one of those kind of first

uh steps. No approvals given through that process is strictlyformational. Uh so anyway, we want to make sure people are aware uh to do that. We do not have that process adopted in the zoning code yet, but uh we will at some point, but we do want to identify that that's requirement. Um then surfacing we get jump right in. Uh we struck uh the gross weight of the vehicles of one and a half tons. That's that's in a lot of different aspects of our code. I think it's a little antiquated uh to identify this number of axles and things like that. Um when you're getting into heavy equipment, that's a kind of a different application. But either way, uh depending on what the proposal is that we would see, uh the city engineer takes, uh reviews and asks those questions. Maybe a traffic impact analysis, something like that's required. So we can identify what type of vehicles is this for a uh construction yard, right? Where they might have a lot of heavy equipment, semis, stuff like that, rock haulers, things like that. So anyway, we just struck that and I won't spend that much time on any other component of this uh proposed tax amendment. Um so that said, hopefully you've all had a chance to look at it. We really get into the meat. Um on item two, just the one because this paving is applicable to every commercial property or use and potential redevelopment of a site. Um we just wanted to make sure that the language is written to just not be specific to one type of use or something like that in general. So that's why we've struck the kind of some of the fundamental um 3 in of asphalt over 8 inch aggregate base and so forth where we have that uh contained otherwise and that's ultimately up to the city engineer. Uh we do we'll touch on that uh shortly in terms of those specifics. But when we're

looking at a variety of different surface types, there's a variety of different applications, right? And engineering and design standards that we need. Is it in the flood plane? All that fun stuff. Um, so that's something that that city engineer and the design engineer has to take into account when they're looking at uh resurfacing or creating a new parking lot, designing a new parking lot. So that's it. Um, item number two, all parking lot services, commercial zones, and you can take a look at that, but we're really identifying trip demand, the tra the, you know, that establishes the use um consistent use, the heavy vehicles, things like that. uh ADA access, water runoff, all those things I just mentioned. So, we're just kind of making sure that that's clear in our code that those are things that engineers, design engineers and our city engineer look at when look at when considering applications um to repave or pave new parking lots. And then we just kind of really outline that, expand an outline. Um, I would say item three, prior to issuance of any public works permit construction, maybe the first couple sentences there probably belong here, but it gets into a lot of application type of information and and um and disclaimers that are probably more appropriate generally to any civil engineered reviewed plans that we receive. So those standard type of items we think should probably go into a into our design standards manual uh create a design standards manual and then have that type of language in there. It's not really a zoning code specific thing. We're getting into applica detailed application permit issuance type of language that doesn't necessarily belong here. And that's one of the recommendations you'll see. Uh

Dana, yes. Can we pause and just check in with Justin because I feel like I just heard him. Justin did here. Listen along. Okay. Okay. I had to restart a few times, but I could hear everything after the first minute or so. Thank you, Mary. Thank you.

And then just looking at the bottom of that paragraph, registered professional engineer stamp site grading plan, professional engineer stamp drainage study, all that that is contained elsewhere too in our zoning code. So we want to, you know, we might not necessarily need to explain that. So depending on how uh commission wishes to move forward this evening, we'll take that extra look and really start to drill in um to what would be appropriate here or appropriate in a engineer uh globe engineering standards and design manual. Um that's it. So we just kind of renumbered a few other little inclusions and then at the very end of the uh draft language we I do identify so through the process working with staff city engineer and um public works you know a lot like our presentation I think previously at the last meeting uh kind of outlined well these different surfaces asphalt versus concrete versus de you know compacted granite versus pavers and you know all the various different options. Um that type of level of detail could go into a design standards manual and says hey if you're going to design any of these here's some codes nationally recognized engineering standards that should be looked at and applied. Um uh and that's where that kind of specific detail is outlined. Again you can see it it's very detailed. So obviously that's in our zoning. That would probably be the single largest section of our zoning code in paving and like I said it's very engineer based um and not as much zoning related. So that's it. So ultimately uh staff recommends planning and zoning commission obviously have this discussion tonight and then ultimately uh direct staff to move forward preparing the the text amendment document for publication and public hearings. Uh at the same time we'll work with our engineering public works

department to develop that uh city of globe engineering uh design standards manual. Um and that is common in many other communities just like a zoning code. Right now our our engineering standards are kind of throughout this town the town code or the city code sorry uh where grading and drainage is a different section. sanitation and sanitation and water service is a different section. Well, each of those different components, grading and drainage is a different section as well. It's under the building code section. Um, they all have standard details of how things are uh how they cut slope and all these different things. Well, including curbs, ADA aprons, stuff like that. um are for the most part the city's adopted the MAG un uniform uh roadway standards and details which Maropa associated governments publishes every couple years renewed you know updated design standards well cities tend to adopt those and that's what we did uh the city adopted that some time ago so anyway you pick and things you might modify certain components of that and that's where we have that uh that contained within a design standards manager just kind of consolidate all of the that engineering criteria in one location. So a engineer is designing a project, they can go pull the standards manager and say what is that dumpster detail supposed to be or what's the minimum standard that they're going to accept for the ADA rate apron design and stuff like that. So sorry about all the detailed engineering stuff. Um but that's the idea bigger picture expand our language in our current code as proposed and then let's get that design standards manual so it can details can live separately in someplace else that engineering public works can enforce that said staff's recommending like I

said the discussion and direction move forward with the text amendment anybody have any questions concerns comments I have a question um first of all thank you for putting this work into it really appreciate the research that went into it um and the time that went into it. Um the recommendation that this commission would make is it to amend the code and to ask the city to include this language in the engineering and design standards manual or are we just making a recommendation to amend the code and then the city is going to independently update the standards? So you have the draft right now before you that would amend the code. Okay.

And this is the language. So what you're doing is saying staff, yeah, we like that. Make these tweaks and then move forward with the text amendment and then it comes back to you formally in the public hearing process, but that you're making a recommendation ultimately to city council on the specific wordbyword language that's in the zoning that you would like in the zoning ordinance. That make sense? Yes. But the standards is a different book, right? Correct.

Wouldn't the code and I thought maybe I misunderstood too. I thought we were kind of simplifying the code to say rather than detailing all of this in the zoning code now, we're just going to put little references to this other engineering manual and then that manual needs to be updated from time to time. Did I misunderstand that? Correct. So, we've got the foundation of what we've found we what our paving surfaces need to address in our zoning ordinance. Now, the detail depending on what you choose in terms of surfaces and how you design that that's in a design standards manual and that's kind of outside of uh zoning world. Yes.

In a way that's it is a city council adopted code, but yeah, exactly. That's more founded in in contemporary adopted engineering standards. Yeah. Like I said, MAG is the leader of this is how you should be doing. So we're we're taking a lot of that detail out of the code and putting references to this other manual in there. Just to be clear, I want to make Yeah, we didn't have a lot of detail in in the beginning. You can see what's being struck here. It has to be this type of asphalt like that's coming out of the code now. That's correct. I'm sorry. Yes. Correct. Exactly. That specific three inches of asphalt over 8 inches of compacted DG. Yeah. Exactly. Because as that changes and it depends on the application too. Yeah.

So you shouldn't have that as a basis. It should be up to the when you see the manual say oh this is their standard that would be that is we mirrored our current code mirrored uh acceptable standard you know really for most municipalities that's a certain detail that they use for for surfacing. Um yeah we just don't need it to be that specific in the zoning. And then so is this who is responsible then for maintaining that standards manual? So, city council ultimately adopted MAG standard details that we our engineers use, our engineering department, public works use. And that's kind of that it's in like I mentioned other areas of the city code.

Okay. That aren't the zoning you're in uh respon planning and zoning commissions responsible uh the for the most part the zoning ordinance, subdivision code, zoning map, all that zoning related stuff. and it gets into some other little things because we look at curbs and details on parking lots when we see a site plan. Okay, that comes before you to prove. So, but yeah, there is a different um world that that exists in and and we can talk about how that goes about, but we wouldn't need to do a formal adoption of as long as we're not compromising what is clearly adopted by city council as to what our engineering standards are.

And that's what I wanted to be clear. If I if I can just interact there. Uh we have been always uh using MAG standards and uh MAG standards also are evolving uh depending on you know new uh materials uh new uh construction processes and uh so we're trying to keep our code to where uh we can refer to uh documents that can be uh modified and and uh still be uh you know included in our code. Uh and that is why uh we are proposing to uh you know work on a manual that uh uh is going to try to accommodate all these changes uh throughout our time. But uh code is still be referring to to the manual where uh things are going to be updated and and uh still are going to be uh enforced by our code.

Thank you. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. My my main concern was just that we're being clear that it's not like it's going to be up to the individual engineer that that particular person or business works with to make up the rules as they go. like this is still a reference to a standard that has to be adopted and any changes to that have to be approved. So, it's still a fair and consistent reference material. That's what I wanted to make sure of. Right. These are minimum standards. Yes.

We also need to uh sorry uh I want to say that uh uh you know there is a lot of new materials out there and uh there are even better than gravel or chip seal or even asphalt that are are being produced. Uh and that's why we want to leave one last chance uh for you know the applicant to submit uh new proposals, new materials and and we're just going to you know uh review them and if they work uh and probably they're more expensive than normal you know paving materials but if that's what they want to do Um, I can tell you there are there are uh plenty of of of uh better processes to to uh build a parking lot that will last longer than any of the you know uh materials that we're using um right now.

Okay. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Got anything? I do on the MAG uniform standard and and Dana you probably explained this very carefully but I want to make sure I understand it. The MAG standard is subject to revision from time to time. So as that document evolves with as the engineer just spoke uh there are different products, materials, processes that become available and the MAG standard probably reflects those as appropriate. My question is does the MAG standard when it changes does it automatically change our standard to to be current with the current MAG standard? Well, because we use MA standards, uh when MA standards make uh changes, uh we adopt them uh as ours, you know, unless we have uh issues, we could uh just, you know, not take it all or take part of it or or none of it. You know, we we can decide that, but Normally we just go with max standards because uh they're a big uh agency and and they uh make more research that we're not capable of doing and uh when they put out new specs uh is because they have done uh very thorough research. So, but specifically when they make

changes, and I'm just looking up our standards right now, it just says the our current ordinance um city code in um section nine, which is regulating permitting work in public rights of way. Um they just reference uh mag association of governments and as amended by the city engineer. So that is assuming whatever the current adopted MA whatever the current MAG standards are um that would apply. Um yeah unlike sometimes they would say like when we do building codes and things like that and fire code um the 2018 MAG standards or that's not a

it's not a building but that's the idea. What we keep it open

what happens is that uh our uh topography and you know the way our roads are laid out. Sometimes uh we cannot really comply with max standards. It's just because the width of the road is is not what they are estimating is because uh you know the ADA compliance is not uh you know something that we can comply with just because uh the road is so keep or you know different different reasons why we can uh deviate a little bit from next standard. It's not that uh we're not applying but it's because uh it doesn't apply to our topography and that's why you always mention that uh it is according to global uh policies and match standards. So that way we can kind of accommodate uh you know something that cannot be fully compliant with MAC but uh you know we can work with the applicant to where is fair to be built you know it's impossible to comply with mu uh standards we we try to do it as as much as we can But sometimes we need to deviate because of the reason that I just told you

topography the age. So it's up to Luis to look at that. Okay. What are you know how how best can we show compliance after he reviews the design engineers proposal? No, no, no. Just just to clarify, you know, that uh we always mention uh M standards, but uh sometimes uh it's just impossible to comply with it. You have something else? That answers my question. Did it answer your question? You're you're satisfied.

But then what does kick that in? If it's if the MAG if the MAG standards are updated, is that just something that it comes up and you go it's been updated and we update? I mean, I know we're not going to be responsible for it, but

the way I'm seeing this language, yeah, it's just whatever is current, you know, we'll have that manual. It'll probably come down to uh when we decide to go through and make it. There's not a heck of a lot, you know. Uh and there the the fundamentals are there. They haven't changed in decades. Um but anyway, uh they we would have the ability to go back and revisit and evaluate what's working, what's not or what new, you know, what doesn't mag address that. We've got this hillside situation that we really need to start to have uh you know, more detailed standards to address certain situations, narrow roadways, things like that that we

these would be like on these would be standards that would be at some association online that they would be pulling from though, right? So as as we as we enter into different situations, we would go to those standards and they would automatically p be published uh by some other entity that's updating them. Right. It's just our engineers that are accessing them, but our engineers aren't setting those standards. Correct. And ultimately we consolidate the most frequent use ones that the guy coming in that wants to do something on his lot. Here, take this to your engineer. This is what we use. And there that's very customary. Yeah. some standard level of detail, right? Some standard level of standard. Exactly.

And I'm sorry, I just have one more. I just want to clarify. So, because I see two different directions here. So, I just want to make sure that when we're ready to make a recommendation, you're asking for two different directions. One is to direct to finalize and publish the proposed text amendment to our code language. The second is direction to prepare that standards manual. Correct. Okay. Excellent. Are those two separate motions or or what is that?

No, no, no, no, no. They they are really tied together because uh we don't want to include all those uh specific details on different uh surface treatments in our code. Right. We understand. So what we're doing is we're tying our code to the uh manual. So it is it is they're tied you know they they work together.

I would say you wouldn't need to direct staff that again getting out into that engineering standard you um we have the draft language and with the explanation that we need to have a design standards manual prepared. So I think if you say we like the direction and the language proposed here, please move forward with uh or preparing text and that's it. Okay, great. Awesome. Anybody Justin, you got anything for us? Oh, we lose him again.

Sorry. There we go. Question. I do not love this methodology. This is this is what I end up using typically when I'm working out of town. So most most entities across use those design service manuals to help guide us along without having every last thing of code. So, I love this. I think it's perfect. Makes it much easier on everybody. Well, that sounds like a a definitely someone that was ready to make a motion. Yeah. Yeah. I would make a motion to approve as outlined by staff. Very good. Do I have a second? I second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor say I. I. I. I.

Anyone opposed. The eyes have it. Motion approved. Thanks, Justin. Okay. Now we are ready to move on to presentation and discussion of the home occupation zoning code and possible initiative of text amendment. Dana.

Thank you so much, Madame Chair. commissioners sharing same format and very similar prelude there like we've discussed this we've brought a few presentations before you in the past did some pure community review and analyzed in uh reports for you um now we've got the summary and the language for a home occupation amendment to our zoning ordinance you're all aware in one of those presentations the last presentation We provide the city's current ordinance, which is basically our zoning ordinance, a definition for home occupation. I'd be happy to revisit that um on your wish, but uh obviously it was lacking a bit. It was a definitely antiquated. It's probably 30 years old for adopted from the county um and and didn't really address a lot of the home occupation activities that we see today. So very limiting. Uh as a zoning administrator, I've had to be very liberal in its application. Just understanding I' I've worked in several communities and had to deal with the home occupation. It can be a sensitive thing. Um so become very familiar with activities, business activities out of homes and stuff like that and just what you're trying to avoid and what you're you know what's very acceptable. So that said, uh we have that draft before you which you've also seen. This draft was published uh to the public uh for public for comment and we did receive three responses and that is included in exhibit B in your staff reports if you want to take a look at those two letters and maybe just a general statement from one of our one of your citizens. Um that said uh again we just have the text shown here. I'll increase the size so everybody can see it. I'd be happy to kind of go through line by line or just ask you to

direct me on whatever topics you'd like to discuss. Well, as I mentioned before the meeting even started, the only thing that I've ever heard anyone that's they're concerned about is the daycare. So, and so I don't want to see, you know, and reading through this I'm saying that there's, you know, the I'm sure the county health department is involved. the state of Arizona is already involved. I don't want to overburden them with yet more garbage that they got to go through in order to do something we really seriously need here in the community.

Correct. So again did peer review familiar. We do know when we're talking about strictly daycare and this is not classes and things like that. This is a child daycare children under 12 that's regulated by the state. Um dees um and I'll get to that in a second. What we're what you'll see well dees requirement is basically five or more children five to 10 children in a home requires dees licensing and separate level of approvals and everything. and that when you look at other communities um provisions for child care, they'll reflect that threshold. A five and up is you got to get a use permit possibly. And that's what we're proposing actually here. That's the safest way. And what you can do in that scenario is uh so less than five, you're good. We don't even have it as a home occupation in here. We don't even address it. Uh, and that's less than five excluding your own children. So, up to four unrelated kids to being dropped off at your house for whatever period. We're not even uh that it's a home that can be a homebased business or home uh occupation and they can get a business license for, but we don't have any requirements for for them. Um, but we know more than four children and up to 10, you want to cap it at 10 in a single family home environment because that's becomes that's basically uh 10 extra trips per day dropping off kids if it's only a one cycle versus like a half morning and afternoon sessions or something like that where you got possibly more traffic. So, uh, as you know, that's one thing that we that home occupations are are are codes are designed to do is really maintain the character of that residential neighborhood, limit the amount of traffic because we know commercial uses, business uses can

demand more traffic than a single family home. So, that's the whole goal is to make it fit within that neighborhood. uh with the ability to get a use permit for more than five, you can start to look at and we can implement distance separations and things like that through that use permit process. For instance, like um we have a code for group homes for elderly uh care in group homes. Very similar the the state uses very similar language in regulating the number of beds and things like that. Now obviously it's a very different use but uh how they're treated but the idea is it's in a neighborhood setting and how do we protect that neighborhood setting and they so statute actually has a 1,200 foot uh minimum distance between different care homes because they don't want a conglomeration on one street because then you'll quickly change the character. There can be detrimental effects to that particular block or neighborhood when there's a concentration of any one type of

business activity like that. So, and believe it or not, it has happened where people will start to consume houses in an area for that purpose. We saw it down in Maricopa became very popular today. Uh, so giving those separate so through a use permit process for five or more or five to 10, we can look at distance separations and stuff like that and then also make sure they're meeting all that criteria. there's uh this dees has a amount of criteria they're required to provide uh outdoor space outdoor activities things like that uh and other security and care um criteria and be happy to look at that. I would definitely I'll I think have that manual available to you with text amendment should this move forward just so you're aware of what somebody wants to do with daycare of five or more kids this is what the requirement is but it's definitely background checks things like that so for that reason in the daycare section five here uh uh the daycare of more than four children so less than four or less you're all good uh four or more than four but less than 10 requires an approved cup and uh proof of licensing from the state. Uh child daycare of no more than four children under the age of 12 excluding any dependents of the

Yeah.

Looks like I might need to fix that langage. Can I ask? Yeah, please. That was one thing I was going to ask is that second sentence if that could be cleaned up because I think what you're trying intending to say is if you have you know no more than four children under the age of 12 excluding dependents then it's not considered a home occ that's all. Yeah, exactly. But I think allowed by writer. I'll just double check what that should say. Yeah, it's basically saying it's not regulated.

Can I ask another Go for it. Um, so to Tracy's point about not adding more governmental oversight to uh home occupations, are we adding I mean apart from the fact that if someone has a daycare uh that has between four and no, I'm sorry, five and 10 children um that requires a conditional use permit. That's all we're saying. We're not putting any more regulations on that. Correct. The rest of that would be up to the regulations that are already set by the state. Correct. Correct.

Okay. Yeah. You see exactly the extent. Uh what do Oh, yeah. You see the full extent unless there's something else in this code that also applies, but no signage, you know, things like that. Okay. So, that applies to all home based businesses.

Okay. So, no signage. And then like the total trips per day, the math around 24 trips per day, which by the way, that 24 trips per day is specific to instructional classes, not daycare. So, when I go later in the code, and I I might be missing this, but when I go later, it um if I look at part I, so if you go down to part I, that's where it says traffic and parking. It says the home occupation shall not generate more than five additional trips unless otherwise specified. I can tell you that if they even have five student or if they even have five kids in the daycare, then they're going to have 10 trips in a day, right? Drop off and pick up

trip is round. Okay. But even even still, I think if we're if we're stipulating like in part six, instructional classes get 24 trips per day. Should we increase the the number of trips that daycare gets? I'm just nervous about daycare being limited by part I that says five trips per day. Well, we don't even regulate less than four or four or less right now. And it says unless otherwise. Okay. Okay. So, hypothetically, let's say somebody has a daycare with 10 kids. They have the max and so they have 10 kids that are they've gotten a use permit at that point and you've been aware of the trips per day.

Perfect. So, so, so the CUP covers the the number of trips. Oh, that's where stipulated. So, it doesn't matter that this part I says five because the cup would have a different number for that business. Exactly. We look at Sorry about that. It's late. limitations on roads access. Is it off a collector? All good stuff like that. So they would get the number that they need for the the business that they have. Perfect. Specifically on that. Okay. Good. Then that's not a limiting factor. That's good.

Art, do you have anything? Good job. I'm still a little little confused and I'm slow. So, you're in good company, sir.

Humor me. I'm a little nervous about this because traffic in a neighborhood can be a very sensitive issue. And I I just want to make sure that even if uh you had a limit of four with extenduating circum circumstances, the traffic can still be more than eight round trips a day, four round trips. And depending on the location of the home and the uh whether it's a one-way street, you name some of the variables. Uh, so I don't need to rename them that it can be um a sensitive issue to neighbors. So I just want to make sure that we've I understand if we go above four, five and on, we're in a cup, right,

situation, but even four can be Yeah, but we're not regulating four. So that would be the cut. That would be the neighborhood having to complain about it and maybe bringing it to attention, but if we're not regulating it, that would be none of their business with how much traffic there is. Um, yeah. So, we're not You're not Are you referencing home dayare? Yeah. And I apologize, maybe I didn't

because I'm going to say with the CUP, the neighbors are going to have the opportunity to come and speak out against it if they don't want it in their neighborhood. traffic reviews it and looks at the intersection the number of incidents at intersections serving that particular neighborhood. You know that you got to take all that into account

and my understanding of some of the existing ones they they all they're in a neighborhood that supports them. So I mean we're we're right now we're I I don't even know if there's new people trying to do daycare but the ones that are existing are in neighborhoods where the people support them because we need them so bad. Yeah. So I I'm very comfortable. So right now, you know, the average trips per day for single family is 8 to 10 single family home. So with those four additional should be now when like in the instructional classes we'll allow, you know, we recognize, okay, they could be doing yoga or something like that and having people come and go. Uh so 20 trips per day. felt we saw that I think in other city situations um would be appropriate to allow that with these separational things. So now we know three houses in a row aren't going to have classes or something like that where now that one intersection to get back to that houseway back there uh you know isn't receiving some astronomical increase in traffic or something like that. So I think there's there's measures in place for number six instructional classes um not exceeding five students but um to to look at that

and it can't for the most part for the margins obviously we can't regulate daily who's accessing what house and stuff like that. Usually if it's something that's brought to our attention because there's a problem then it's something we can measure. Excuse. So, so there are some guard rails that we can that the homeowners can use to um assail any u what they consider a deviation to that.

Right. Like I said, we'll once we get I've had to get involved in that in the past. If there's complaints of too much traffic, then we monitor it and you know, let's see what you know what the traffic situation is on a regular basis. Like I said, if it's the level of being complained about you, it's pretty evident usually by the time we start keeping an eye on it, investigating. Okay, that answers my question. Mary, you said you had one more. Yeah, I have two more. Two more. Okay.

Sorry. Um, so, uh, number one, uh, I want to go over to, uh, you know, we, in part B, it lists, it lists permitted uses and it lists a bunch of different types of businesses that people could use as home occupations. Part C goes into prohibited. What if a type of occupation that comes up later on is on neither list? How will that be handled? I'm not for trying to put everything in one or two one of these lists. What I would recommend is that we have some sort of language in here that covers the process for how we would handle a new business that comes about that's not already listed. Does that make sense?

It does. So in the each section well overall in the zoning ordinance it's zoning administrator shall consider uh there's language standard language in the code. I think it's it's also included in our permitted uses sections in each zoning district that we have our list of allowed uses and it says similar to and that's up to the zoning administrator to look at it and make a determination. Is this similar to any of these type of uses? Um, yeah. So, I go through that process when I look at these codes or develop this and I just ask let's talk about throw one out is the only really way to do it. Um, but if you have a thought or an example, other than that, I'm pretty comfortable. We've got the margins here and then most everything falls within it.

Then the only suggestion I would make is you have that clause in in part B for permitted uses. I see it there in part B 10 where it says similar uses to above. You need some sort of clause in part C. And my only argument against saying similar is somebody could come up with something totally different that that we either want in this town or don't want in this town. Let's say somebody comes up with um you know, I mean, there's all sorts of things out there that uh people may or may not want going on in their neighborhood. And if it's not similar or dissimilar to things in this list, now we're in a sticky situation. So, I would just open up that language under both lists. Does that make sense?

Absolutely. The second thing um has to do with part D where it says maximum floor area allowed. A home occupation shall not occupy more than one quarter of the total floor area in the principal building. Is that from an industry best practice or a standard? What is that from? That is um you'd be hardressed to find a home occupation municipal code that doesn't have a that area. Okay. One quarter. And I think that's what are we I think that's more liberal than what our current ordinance says as well. Great. I'll pull that up. Well, yeah, quarter is a very typical. Okay, that's it. Thank you. Cool. Justin, do you have anything to add?

Um, let's see. So, going down into the the additional notes that you outlined down below that I think are just based off of the two emails that you attached as well. Um, there's a few things in there that I go back and forth on and maybe just figure we should probably just address as we're all together for a few moments. There's a number of things like animal care, health and wellness, creative services. Most of those I feel like they already kind of fit into most of those categories of correct.

That's how I see it. is animal care. I figured that falls under something under probably instructional classes. It almost is daycare. I think that was the only one that I was maybe a little concerned on cuz it had pickup drop off type of elements to it. Yeah. Like dog room. Exactly. Um Okay. Kenneling, overnight kenneling. You know, my experience that's all for some reason the veterinary even in commercial uses that sometimes requires a use permit just because I think historically kenneling has been used bothered neighbors apparently can be noisy. Yes.

Um dog walking. You can go walk people's dogs, right? Usually they wouldn't just be walking a dog. That's staying at their house. Well, you can have a dog stay at your house and you can walk it if you're right. And then Yeah.

Yeah. So So I think those are all good. I just want to check and kind of make sure as I was rolling through all those that you felt those were covered in those categories already. Um I think the only other one that I saw was the notes but I'm not seeing it as a issue currently in which you're we have outlined here is uh the discussion of uh using accessory structures we allow that it appears in this current draft text amendment. Uh the only one that I understand here might be something we might want to look at is the use of some of the outdoor spaces such as landscaping, gardening, and backyard nurseries type of elements, which almost feels like it should be tagged in as part of the food handling or somewhere in there or maybe it's its own thing. Um but that one is a little unique as we do say within the the confines of the the principal building accessories, structures. Um, I've got to think I think I know of at least two that exist in town already that are probably doing their own thing, more of a hobby, but is that something we should be addressing as well?

Um, so the area obviously it's a lot also best practices you it's hard you'll be hard for us to find a community that allows outdoor home occupations. That's where you get into trouble. like what are you doing outside that's not going to annoy your neighbor as a business, you know, 8 to five or whatever it is. So, that's why you'll always see that like it needs to be combined. So, that said, obviously hobbies are hobbies. Um, if you've got a a nursery and you've got up to five people showing up at your house to buy a plant or something like that, I don't think we'd ever uh I don't think that would come across our

desk. Um, but the consequence, we allow it. You could potentially have some serious potentially have that real fast. Uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Trips per day to a residence and and it's going to be hard to turn that off. And then this one has nothing to do with our current text amendment. I just it joged my brain and I couldn't find anything on it, so I figured I'd put it in front of you. Is do we have anything in our code on beekeeping currently? I know most municipalities do and it was brought one of those emails.

I know. Yes, you don't want those on less than an acre. I don't I'll have to take a look. Yeah, that's and that's very common. I sense the county animal control probably has a regulation. I'll look into that for you. Yeah, not something I wanted to add in here. I just figured that's something if we're going through text amendments, you might as well look at that one, too. No, but I think everything else on here makes sense to me. Thank you for your time, the presentation.

Thanks, Justin. I have one one comment on the the very last of the letters, the collection of equitable taxation as this hurts our commercial districts and diminishes the tax base. Do um like the does a daycare do they pay PPP taxes? Like if it's a daycare that's I don't know what this I don't know uh what not that they're competing with anybody, so that's maybe not a good example, but Uh, it's income, but I don't know how that's taxed. And I sense that it might not be taxed, but uh, I'm just curious.

All right. If there if no one has anything else, we have someone that would like to get out and say their piece. Sylvia Geyser. Hello. Thank you for listening to me. I was just a little confused on your ratios. I am a DS daycare provider and I've been licensed since 1995. Um, my license I'm sorry. I just want to go back. I just want to go back to the taxes. Who's speaking? They need to pause. Excuse me. And you know you have number.

Sorry. That's okay. Thank you. I'm used to it. I can interrupt it all day. Um, like I said, I've been licensed since 1995. Um, my license allows me to have six children, 24 hours a day, seven days a week. You mentioned five. I just wanted

Yeah, I'm sorry. Hang on. We've moved on. Please wait.

No espec good. Um and you did mention um a different ratio than what my license holds and you also mentioned the times that children or parents are allowed to drop off and pick up. Now, right now, since I do hold my 247 and like you mentioned, child care is very much needed as well as preschool in our area. So, I have two preschool classes, an AM and a PM class. Currently, I have 11 children. How does that affect me? And if I choose to get evening kids, I can do that. And if I choose to get graveyard kids, I can do that according to my license. I have done that in the past and I'm not doing that currently, but I can if I were to get a call from CPS or DES. There's only three DS childcare providers in our area and as you mentioned, it's it's needed.

Yeah. Um, with what you're proposing, are other providers going to be mandated to get a license of some of some type or if state requires it? And and now you've brought up two things. Is it daycare or is it uh She has both classes. You have both. Well, see, I'm a child care provider, but I'm also an educator. So, my children in my care are not going to sit there and watch TV, right? I'm going to teach them. And so, even though they come to me as child care, they're getting preschool for free.

If you um So, it sounds like you're probably grandfathered right now. Um because you've been operating, you have business license with the city, with the state. Yeah. Not with the city. Um okay. Uh so you'd have to outline that. Um we're doing education and providing classes as well. You know, that's two things. Okay. So what if I what if I just said I'm just providing child care and these are the crafts that I do every day.

Right. And if that child care Exactly. What do we know? Right. What would you mean? It's the it's the heads in you know the butts and seats or the heads and your location is the item. So if item number five um so and so you have six this language in my first class I have six and my second class I have five. Five. Okay. I don't have any graveyard or evening kids at the moment but I can take them according to my license if I choose to. Got it. I'm old and I'm tired

and they're all under 12. Um, yeah, they're all under 12, but my license also will allow me to build the state of Arizona up until a child is 13. And the food program also allows me to um get reimbursed for a child up until their 13th birthday. Got it. Got it. Got it. Well, and this is only trying to address I think the dees language is addressing child care in a home up to the age of 12. So, I don't know if they classify 13 and up differently. I bar code's not specifying that. I would say you've already got your dees license. I would suggest you get a a city business license at your earliest convenience.

Um, and the fact that you've been operating uh should just continue as grandfathered um until you make a change or something like that. You would need to make sure you're in compliance with whatever code gets adopted. Okay. So, as of now, the home occupation code wouldn't allow you to. Our current code doesn't allow what you do. And how are you mandating other providers in the area that haven't gotten any type of license to be mandated like I'm going to be licensed? Wait for people to turn them in or they come in on their own and and and apply for a business license. So the person like me who's doing everything by the book is going to be mandated, but everybody else that isn't will

not anybody that comes and asks us for a business license to operate an activity out of their home, okay? we'll get the same code applies to everybody. You're just saying, you know, if somebody wants to not tell us something, obviously that's not uncommon. So, if I'm doing child care, I don't have to file for that. But if I'm educating children in my care under my child care license, I have to file for that. Uh, if you're if you're taking care of more than five children, like I said, I'm thinking you're grandfathered. We'd have to look into details. You've got your dees license. You're you've got child care of six kids and you're doing your thing. Mhm.

Uh once you change that and want to increase or something like that, we would say you need to come in and get that use permit. And we look at the trips per day, all of these details that you're discussing, uh where the property is, its access, and to make sure that there's not going to be a traffic impact to to the surrounding area. And it's a hearing, it's a process. Planning and zoning commission actually is the decision authority on use permits. Okay. So, that's where that would go. See, and right now if I wanted to have more than six children or children or above the five, my ratio would be I think it would be one to 10 or 2 to 10, but I'd have to go with the group home license um through DES or DHS.

Um but what the part that I'm still confused on is the limited times of day per my house that can go any times explained in this I don't believe. Yeah, I don't see any time at all. I saw something about five limited times or trips per day. Trips per day. So, if I have different parents coming throughout my day, according to my license, I can have 18 kids during the day, morning, AM, PM, as long as I don't go over my six. Four for comp.

Yeah. So, just be aware. uh trips per day is one of our critical things that we look at to make sure we're not disrupting the neighborhood or causing an unsafe traffic situation in a neighborhood, right? And I and and none of my parents block I live in a culde-sac. Nobody ever blocks anybody's driveways. Everybody can come and go. Um well, I think it would come down to your neighbors complaining about it. So you're in a neighborhood that that's not happening. So you're it wouldn't seem to me like it, you know, unless some crusty old person moves into a house all of a sudden that and starts to come and complain. I can't imagine anyone giving you any grief over it. And you've been doing it since 95 in the same place. Yeah.

Yeah. I would say you're probably fairly safe. 2000. But I mean I I try to be as legit as I could be. I mean I've I've gotten my education. I'm with First Things First. I'm a fivestar program. um since 2012. I'm nationally accredited. Like I said, I've I've held my DS license since 1995. I'm here for the children and our community and to teach children, not only just to be a good child care provider, but also to send them off to kindergarten ready

ready. And you know, I mean, I don't I don't know how that would differentiate me having to get something else other than my license for child care if I want to teach those children in my care.

So, we're trying to take the lightest, most delicate touch possible, I think, in this scenario. So, I think if you're um like you mentioned, you've been operating. I would get a business license though to do with the city because that's where we look at it's legal non-conforming use. They've been doing it for x amount of time now. You know, we can look into the details, but as of now, I don't see any reason why if this ordinance is adopted, you need to change what you're doing. And I'm being told you're legal non-conforming, but um you know, you can always look deeper,

but uh if you can operate within this confine if you do change or decide to increase more than six then we would ask for a use permit I' I've been asked to go group home no different deal and a group home that's separate in our section you can look at it it mirrors the statute yeah I DS has been wanting to go group home since I started and no for kids okay so uh that's a different because it's so needed and and I'm great at what I do. You're right. Is when you start to get into and our code separates out if it's for um our group homes. I thought it was for the elderly. The way the dees writes that, but anyway,

it's for child care, too. You just need um another body um another body so that you can have more. They have other regulations. Yeah. And and they do limit. I mean, I don't have babies in my child care, but they don't stay the night either. Excuse me. Group homes are typically for where people reside. It depends. It depends on what you want to work. And so a typical group home would probably go 9 to5. Um I've always held a uh 247 license because you know not everybody works 9 to5 and so just until recent I um quit doing the graveyard only because the mother lost her child care.

If you could shoot me an email though I'd be happy to dig into that. the the group home and learn more about that, too. Yeah. Yeah. I just felt like I don't want to be breaking anybody's rules since I am a rule follower, and I try to get into as many programs that are going to benefit my families and my children. Um, and so, yeah, it's a lot of work. All the organizations that I'm in, they're all a lot of work, but if it's for our community and our children, then I'm going to plug into them. And so when I start hearing, you can only have so many kids coming to your house. I get kind of scared because I don't want to have to lose any of my families and anything that I provide for them.

Said, "Yeah, please reach out." So the process is this will this text will then be written and published in a newspaper and advertised for a citizen review meeting. And I'd love to have more conversation on that with you prior to all that going going on. as paying taxes. I pay a lot of taxes. Pay a lot of them. Nothing's free. Thank you very much. Thank you. All right. Uh we have Alexandria White.

Thank you for allowing me to speak. I also provide child care. I am a private child care provider who's been doing child care since like 2012. So the way that my business operates is I have full-time kids throughout the day. Towards the end of the day, there is a transition period where kids get off the bus. Their parents can't pick them up right away. So I act as liaison in between for those children. But what I'm hearing is is now if I do that, I'll be in violation of the code as it's written, which isn't really fair to those parents who have no way of being home for their children until after 5:00 or 5:30 or 6:00. Like I still have one of my daycare kids with me right now, you know, and so that part I'm a little unclear or nervous about. Well, I'm not sure the bus dropping them off would even count as as as traffic. I mean, the bus

I'm more worried about the ratio portion of it because I choose to stay um an inhome provider, which I still want to stay an inhome provider. Um I don't want a license through the state only because um my husband worked in law enforcement through the drug and task uh violence task task force. So there will be some families who do call me who I have to respectfully decline. If I'm sanctioned through the state, I cannot respectfully decline. I have to consider them just as I would consider everyone else, which is an implication to me, my home, and my family. So that's why I've chosen for the last 13 years to do it the way that I do it. Um, and as far as uh neighborhoods and you know the traffic in your area, I mean, we're two h there's one house in between hers and mine, but we live in a giant culde-sac, right? So, she does what she does. I do what I do, but our traffic never impedes anyone's driveway. It never gets in anyone's way at all whatsoever. Um, and so I'm curious, in the event that it were to exceed that amount, would we be able to ask our neighbors in good faith to write a letter to the city stating they don't have a problem with our pickup and drop off so that if we ever go over the provided um in and out of our driveway, it won't become an issue.

Madam Chair, yes. So, two points there real quick. The ratio part, we don't have a ratio. Like people I think that's a dees requirement. Well, you're kind of setting a ratio when you say four or below. So, that's a ratio. Yeah, exactly. And that that's because that's the that mirrors the dees requirements. And it sounds like they the ES says, "Hey, if you're taking care of five to 10 children in your home unre, you know, not your children in addition to your children, then you need to go through this licensing process and that's not us,

right? So I would less which is why I'm asking you because I think I would fall under you because I don't fall through dees. If you came for if this was adopted, you came in and asked for a business license to have five kids under your care during the day, we would say you would have to get a use permit and apply for a conditional use permit, which will require that you also get DS license because we can't ignore the state's requirements for

and in the event that I have four or less, I will still uh need to hold a city business license as well. Um, we're not addressing that. We're just talking about four or more. It's I'll leave that to uh Tony's the business license guru. Um, but I'll leave that up to our business license group. So, what they require seem to be what I'm reading is four or less. You It's

right. I just I just want to clarify before because I don't want to come in here feeling a certain way and it be completely misaligned. You know what I mean? Um, as far as taxes go, I've had my transaction privilege tax since the first day I started. I pay taxes yearly plus my income tax that I claim as a schedule C business. So, I know a lot of businesses don't do that. Um, but th So for those of us that do, I'm not understanding if I'm four or less and I still do that if the business license would still apply to me or in lie of the business license, the fact that I do pay, you know, my taxes for county, state, whatever it may be. Are those interchangeable or will they be mandated together?

So, we're getting way outside of I think you know taxes and licensing. I'd be happy to speak with you on offline and then put you in touch with our My apologies. They mentioned it and he spoke about it, so I thought it was table questions, but I know you won't customarily see that in a zoning ordinance. Correct. Yeah, good questions. Yes, great questions. Let's touch base as we develop this and make sure you get the information.

And I just had one other question. you had said that the actual parking and time frame doesn't apply, but I read both of the suggested um documents from the prior conversation you had as well, and it did state on there that it was residential as well for deliveries and drop offs and pickups. So, do we fall under a residential drop off and pickup that's limited to a certain time to 10 p.m. or do we not fall under that? Even though the way it's written, it comes off that way.

No time restrictions in the code uh with when you're five trips per day outside of your typical family. No, I'm saying the prior code that you discussed where you were talking about deliveries and drop offs and stuff like that. It stated in there and I read it line by line, but one of the things it stated was for residential drop offs. We're residential. We're getting things dropped off, you know, kids all the time. and it said between the business hours of I think 6:00 am to 10 pm. So my question is as we're operating a business are we also going to fall under the residential guideline for 10 p.m.

This is all the guideline we're talking about today and I don't see that language in here we can when we chat online you can tell me where if you saw a prior presentation or something like that. No no no you spoke about it earlier in the same meeting. Okay. Did I have time frames? I don't recall anything. So no this is the tax. I don't see anything specifying times like I think you mentioned UPS and FedEx and stuff like that day. We're not going to put limitations on times traffic and parking, right? Parking for residential, but does that incorporate our All of this is residential, right?

If you're not Yeah, you wouldn't need this if you're not in residential, right? It' be a commercial use or something like that. So then the 10pm won't apply to that. Correct. There's no 10p. I now I think you might be talking about noise maybe in a like a different city code. It said parking. It was in the city code, but it talked about parking. Go ahead. It's in one of the letters that was written and sent in. Oh, amendment as was somebody's recommendation. Oh, okay. So, at this time then, yeah, sorry about that. Yes, we received comment from the public and I kind of itemized summarize and itemize what

Oh, here it is. Reasonable business hours from 6 to 10, but yeah, that's that's a suggestion from a member of the public. It's not the code. The code has no time constraints or even anything about times in it. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Sorry for that confusion. No, that's fine. And then I appreciate your time. That's all I had to ask. Thank you. Did we want to circle back to the lease or do we want to not? No, he went back. No, we did not. No, I just brought that up because of the I was curious because of this last the third letter. That was it. And no, we don't need to circle back to Luis on that. At least I don't think so.

All right. Do we have anything else? I have a question about number of trips. So, if in part B permitted uses number six, instructional classes, if we're willing to stipulate 24 total daily trips for that use only, why can't we just make that the generic maximum for all uses?

Uh, it's just incredibly intense. You don't have a lot of people doing classes like that. I think you'll be it'll be unlikely to have somebody to have that many trips per day doing yoga classes or whatever classes they might be doing. Um but if you have food handling, processing, packaging, 20 trips per day, that's going to be a lot of little trucks or something going up to a house. And uh clearly so I I just I keep going back to the day. You got 10 kids. You got and and we're talking round trip. But you get to control that by use permit.

I know. But then why wouldn't we? I guess I'm I don't know why we're putting like these guys like why does this one get 24 and all the others get five? That's what I'm trying to understand. that. So, let's talk about the other business such as plumbers, electricians, contractors. That's strictly a home occupation, uh, home office. They're not people aren't bringing their plumbing. They're not allowed to bring their plumbing, their electrical, and their things like that to the residents to drop off to get fixed. Yeah.

So, if you say they're allowed to do 20 of those, I think they're going to assume they're allowed to have people drop off their their stuff. uh that class a class is where you have the the interaction with the public and the trips. That's the only besides child care. That's the only those are the only two uses home homebased businesses or home occupations that allow somebody to show up at your house to get for you to serve. So those I'm looking at it also it it limits it to five students at one time. So, it wouldn't be like all 24. You You wouldn't have all 24 people show up all at once. There you go. All right. So, because you don't have the parking for that, yeah, that's what I was thinking. Where the heck would you put 24?

We don't want you to have the parking for that because now you just lost your yard and neighbors might not be happy. You changed the character. So, it limits the 24 by limiting how many people you can have per class. That's fine. I just I was curious like why put why have 24? Like why does that one get 24? It seems like that wouldn't even Why would you even have 24 in there then? Does that make sense? Say 24 or 20. Six is 24. 24 total day. I'm just I'm wondering why that one gets

five five at a time, but you can have up to 24. So that doesn't even the m the clause about 24 should just come out. It's It says, "In no event shall an instructional class generate more than 24 total daily trips to the residence." Why would if if we say that that's a max for that use, why wouldn't we say that's a max for all uses? I just don't know why that's being tagged to that use. That's all. Uh potentially Go ahead. No, please.

I was we potentially removed that four trips on the instructional classes. Um, and then when we go down into our traffic uh and parking and I where it says shall not generate more than five additional trips. Currently, the language you added in there was unless specified in this code. Would we say unless specified within the agreed initial use permit? There's no use permit for the instructional classes that this is that's this is a carveout of

if you removed the number what's it say they've got five halfhour event uh classes of people of five all day that you you can't take that back you'll have to rely on your PD for public safety enforcement though we permitted them to do it right we don't have a stop gap at that with what we have listed here at their peritted uses. If somebody wanted to like the professional office, if they wanted to have additional trips for a day, we could they would come in and they would submit for a conditional use permit for additional trips, parking, etc. Whatever I mean. Correct.

I'm sorry, one more time. Sure. So let's say just looking at number one the the kind of most blanket term the professional offices remote online teleping service whatever that might be. So let's say they needed to have more than five trips per day. They could potentially come in and submit for a conditional use permit that would allow for additional trips. Correct. No. That's strictly daycare as the use permit. No.

Okay. And with that mentality, yeah, then anyway, one way to address that is say, yeah, if you want more than any of these any of the maximum or the maximum standards allowed, you can appeal to this, you know, or apply for a conditional use permit to allow these. And I just don't you don't see that that Yeah. Not great. Okay. Most uses don't home occupations people really don't have a lot of people there. Where you would really be concerned is sales and you're not allowed to sell stuff. Any code you'll see will allow you to sell to customers on site.

Our current code doesn't. Um that's that's where you get the trips. Other than that, you know, delivery trucks usually don't you know, they don't deliver that often. So you don't really see that much of an impact from a traffic-wise situation except for when people need to go to the location for the service and that's classes. But can do hair but they're not going to have five seats. They can't do they can't have more employees. So that's inherently controlled by how much they can achieve in a day, you know, patrons that they can and I haven't been aware of any issues coming from that type of use.

I think they for you guys. I'm good. I'm good. Good. All right. You're good. Okay. I'm good. Do I have a motion for us to move forward on this? Let me get back to the page. I'll make a motion to adopt the recommendations by staff, including the additional modifications to section B5. That's a motion. Are we motioning to adopt or it says publish and propose to uh to accept and move forward with the

So that motion was solid. Great. Second. What did you see? I've got a motion in a second. All those in favor say I. I. I. I. Any opposed? Motion passes for us to move forward with it. All right, Shellyley. Do we have any I know we have future agenda items. Do have we set our meeting dates? Yes. Our next meeting is December 3rd. Did the meeting invite already go out for that? Yes. Perfect. Thank you. Yeah, we did. Let's see a legal ad today's

Yes. P reason and then um as well. I think we'll probably schedule a few other things on that agenda. I don't have development applications, but maybe text them related things. Um, you know, it's tough with the holiday right before that get crunched. Uh, but you will have another zoning case. Um, in probably July. Okay. Very good. All right. Anybody has have anything else to add? Do I have a motion to adjurnn? Motion to adjurnn. Second.

Got a motion and a second to adjurnn. All those in favor say I. Opposed? Nate, did he