Road and Public Safety Committee - Regular Meeting

Okay. So, I guess I'm calling the meeting to order. Um, six. Sure. We wanted to take a vote on the minutes of the last meeting. Would you like to say I or nay? I I Any nays? And so, it's passed. Um, we have Martin Plank and Kevin Hallowing, right? Yes. From Ultimate here. Oh, is that somebody door? Um they are going to present their their wares. And then what was your last name? Howard K L O R K. You want to introduce yourself? Sure. So I consult Hold on one sec. I think they're they're going to have you introduced at the beginning of your presentation. They've got a couple of things to do on their agenda quick before that. Right. Do we you have No, we were going to have them go first in the No, you have public comment on your agenda. You have other things you have to follow through on your agenda. Okay. I don't have it in front of me. I thought I thought ultimately we had changed it. The one I saw online is posted. Oh, the survey. We're doing the survey. Oh, the fo i a. It's kind of a de facto item. Whether someone actually falls in or not is not that common. Well, wait. Do you have it? Have you did you start your meeting? Yes. Yes. No, we we haven't. You're on. Yeah. You're just not You have We're just not on. It's online. Okay. But you don't have the Who's got the clicker? He's got the clicker. Oh, you do. So, I don't know. I am. I'm just letting you know that we try to get it on. So, they're filming you, just so you know. Okay. You don't know if it's going to happen

or not when you search for that, but it might film it as well. Is it going? Is it actually going? Yeah, it's recording. All right, great. You're recording. Yeah. Can you get that? Have you been able to get that hooked up? Oh, I can help you do that. Okay, great. Okay. We've been trying for a half an hour to get that. Uh in the meantime, Greg, if you wanted to do the fo i a. Uh is is can we tell if there's anybody online? Martha, I will. Um there is not anyone online. Okay. Um but if you don't have someone dial in, you're going to lose this connection anyways, just so you know. Okay. So, I'm going to get you hooked up. Um, now so do we need when we plug in the u connection when I plug in the HDMI my computer just it's not I don't know it's a bad connection it won't it won't cast on there for some reason. Okay. You might want to see if it's going to go. Okay. It's Yeah, you can try to I'll get it. I'll get it. Mine is can be tricky too sometimes. Yeah. Sorry, the technology. Oh, it's definitely the problem to move these guys up front. So, I know, but Martha seems to feel like this is this is what this is. So, FYI would be down here after these guys. Well, you want to try and tell Martha that because she doesn't seem to feel that's the way the agenda is. I I'm I was just looking online and saw your public comment was up at the top. Okay. Yeah. So, we did we we called the order. We we Okay. Okay. But we don't have any public comments that want to say something. Okay. Just as a

we we're still working on some kinks here. Um I would abstain on the minutes vote because I wasn't meeting. No, just do not apologize. I'm sorry. I don't agree. Okay. Do you wanted to say something public comment? Yeah, I do. Okay. I just wanted to share this with all of you and I'm going to send this around just so that you can see it. I'll send them both ways so that it'll meet in the middle. Um, and I'm sorry to be in a rush, but my son is getting married in two, three days, and I have the first guests are arriving on the train at 8:00. So, I have grocery shopping to do. Yeah, you got to go. I got to go. Um, and I'm out of the office for the next three days. So, I just wanted to send this around. This is um if you've seen the speed cameras on the road that the police department have put up. These are those speed signs that blink and when you're going. But this is the data from um October I mean sorry April 28th until uh May 6th. And this is the one that was on McCertie road. Um, and you can see the data that they had 5,000 cars pass by it in that amount of time. And the highest the the highest number of cars that went through were 1,800. And they were between the 31 and 35 mph zone. And that is a 25 mile zone. The Sorry, the entire way. What? The entire length of Mccertie is 25. Yes. 35 to what? This is right over by the golf course. Yeah. Thank you. What was the speed you said? 35. Can I see it right here? It's 31 to 35. There were 1,800 cars that passed, but it's a 25

mile hour. Martha, can I can I just clarify Fritz's question? So, on these uh the data collected by these signs, it'll be what the speed limit is at the location where the sign is. So, I mean, streets could conceivably have like u shore road speed limits that go up and down, but where you're doing it this we Oh, mccertie in that place is all I realize mccertie is all the way. Yeah. Right. Okay. So, and I and they have two more cameras to put up. Um I'm not sure if they're up yet, but there as of last week there were two installed that have the solar powered and one that had the battery powered. The battery powered one does not collect data. That was an older one that we had. But the two that are up, newer ones do collect the data. And um that is all filtered through a software program. The one on Sill Lane um is attached to a 30 mph sign when it should be 25. It should not be 30. That's the only sign that's different than all of Sill Lane. So, that's the one we wanted to correct and then the speed sign ended up on that one. Okay. So, if somebody would like to send me an email on that, then I'll forward that to Matt Weber. Um, and why that sign is up, I do not know. Um, I'll have that was part of our protocol of swapping out signage. Yeah. Right. So, I'll check on that. And, um, but Dominic provides this to me. Dominic Salari provides this to me so that I can kind of just see what's happening in town and they can as well and then they can make their recommendations as to where to put some you know speed trap not speed traps but to parole patrol a little bit heavier in those areas and they have been and they've been pulling

people over and they've been making a difference and I can tell you coming down Mccertie in the morning um people are not happy with me because I'm driving and getting that thumbs up sign and people behind me are like, "Oh, why did I get behind her today?" When they're pulling people over, are they being ticketed or warned if they have been warned before and it is noted in their data system, then they would ticket and they have ticketed. I don't have the exact number of tickets, but I know that they're doing it. Um, and I know that you're hearing a presentation tonight. Um, was this Did you That was at the end of this. Oh, sorry. I picked it off off my desk. Thanks. Um, and so I know that you're doing a presentation tonight and I know that we've had a presentations from some other groups. I do want to say that Alman, if you came into town to do um a traffic survey, I would assume that you would be letting me know where things are that you're putting up. Oh, yes. Um so, just like we were talking about, I have a speed study going on currently. Uh one of the locations is at my daughter's high school. I even let her know. So, um, absolutely, we would let you know because for certain reasons, you know, people are out there putting up things and you want to make sure the community knows and, um, and you don't want to, you know, you don't want radar, you would get accurate results, too. So, I just want everyone to know that Matt Weber was very concerned that um another company had gone and done a survey without notifying us because um when you're patrolling or or getting data, you are supposed to let the town know. So, as much as I appreciate the fact that they did a survey, uh without us

knowing, that's kind of jump. They should have let us know that they were doing that just to make the rules clear. Um, so if anyone has any questions for me, I'd love to answer them now before I disappear and then Amanda and I I'm very upset our com our thing is canled in June. It is. Yeah. They sent me a notice. They didn't have enough people sign up. Okay. Well, it would have been lovely. I like I signed up and they never acknowledged my Oh, they did. They sent me a thing saying you're nice that they did it to you. the town. The town. Okay. So, it's canceled. I got a thing. I'll send it to They're going to reschedule. Okay. But, um, do you have Does anyone here have any questions? Have a wonderful time. Go. Congratulations. I think it's fabulous. I've waited 13 minutes. Can I ask just a quick question? Are you going to be in the office between now and son's wedding or not? No, but you know how to reach me by cell phone. You can text me. Okay. Thank you. Text I will answer on Wednesday and Thursday. forget Friday. Congratulations, Martha. Okay, go for it. Oh, see already. Okay. Well, I was going to hurry for her, but I'll still hurry. Um, so, uh, hope sorry if you can't if y'all want to sit close, you can pull up a chair. Uh, this will be informal. I'll try to get through everything. It's a very high level overview of uh, what we had spoken about. Um, it's automated speed enforcement. It's becoming very popular in Connecticut. A lot of jurisdictions are um starting the process. So, uh I'll go through everything. Um if you have any questions, maybe just save them till the end. You're going to have lots of questions probably. Um but if we get through then then it'll go a little bit quicker. So, and I apologize if you cannot see. I'm going to wear my glasses so I can. So, uh so our company name is Ultimate. By the way, my name is Marty.

Uh I'm the VP of sales. It's a very, you know, inflated title. I'm just, you know, the sales guy. And then chief, I'll let you introduce yourself. Hi, I'm Kevin Howerin. Uh, I'm consultant for Alam Chief, two-time retired police chief, I guess. Spent 35 years in law enforcement. Uh, retired from Brford and then I worked for five years in North Brford. Okay. And so, yeah, I I live in Virginia. Uh, but I have been in Connecticut a lot since probably last summer. A lot. So, and I love it because I was coming up here a lot during the winter time. Um, and I She promised me to get me a meeting and it's beautiful today. So, I appreciate a good move. I won't talk too much about us as a company. I'll try to keep it more about speed enforcement and try to help um answer any questions you have. So, uh, ultimate, we're based in Atlanta, Maryland. Uh it's about three or four miles from the commander's current stadium. Uh so I work from home. I never go to the office if I don't have to because traffic is terrible on 95. Uh but our mission is is really to make the roads in and around community safer for everyone, not just kids walking to school, but it's also the parents that are dropping off their kids and uh the school buses that are driving around. So, Ultimate does uh speed enforcement. We do uh red light enforcement and we do uh stop arm enforcement on school buses. Okay. Uh the problem uh there is an epidemic of speeding ever since kind of the COVID lockdown got lifted. Uh I see it a lot in Connecticut driving myself. I see it in Virginia. Um but the problem is is you know the highway safety board put out you know if someone gets hit by a car going 30 miles an hour their chance of survival is is about 50%. And most of your school zones are probably 25 miles an hour. So if someone's going

10 over the speed limit they're going 35 miles an hour gets very dangerous and it gets dangerous for the people dropping off kids at school too. Uh so everything we do we're USA owned and operated. We build all our systems in house. Um we don't outsource to any companies overseas or anything like that. So um it's kind of like building a custom house versus, you know, I have the cookie cutter house. I like it, but you know, so just think about it that way. So right now we have uh over 73 jurisdictions that we're enforcing in. Um that's across 10 states. We've issued over 8 million citations. Uh in Virginia last year um we submit a report every jurisdiction we have and we had 266 266,000 citations that we issued last year. Um so we have a lot of experience with um standing up programs and getting them off on the right foot. uh over 600 cameras that includes all enforcement and over 345 years of of law enforcement experience that backs us including Kevin. Uh we are the fastest growing uh traffic uh safety enforcement in in the country. We're the fastest growing company. Um so in Connecticut, I'll I'll break it down. There's a lot more to this law, but these are the basics. So, if you put a camera and a radar in a school zone that has issues, um, one of the things that's required by law is you have to have two signs to notify the public that photo enforcement is going to take place uh, in that school zone. And that's both. So, if you have two cameras, that's four signs. So, it's it's I like that law. I think it's good. It gives ample opportunity for people to slow down uh, before they approach that school zone. uh you cannot issue a ticket unless it's 10 miles an hour or over the posted speed limit. So you guys

were talking about 2535. So if it's 25, we you can only issue a ticket to someone that's driving 35 or higher. Okay. Sorry, could you say that again? How many miles an hour over the speed limit? So the threshold is 10. Yes, ma'am. The law does not allow us to issue a ticket for anything under 10. Can I interrupt you? I'm sorry. Absolutely. So, we weren't able to figure out how to get this up on the screen. No. And I will send this to you. Okay. Yeah, I will send this to everybody. I can send it to you. I said whatever is on here. You just keep internal. Yeah, I will definitely send this to you and then you can call me and ask me any questions that you have. So, yeah, I apologize. Um, so the fines are $50 for the first fine, 75 for any thereafter. Um, you can't charge more than 50 for the first violation. You can't charge more than 75 if somebody gets two or three. Uh, this is a civil penalty. So, there is no insurance impact. It's not going to affect points on your license, which is huge. Uh, with insurance this these days, the prices, you definitely don't want to get a ticket uh because your insurance is going to go up. So, this You were stopped by a cop, would it affect your license? Oh, yeah. It will affect Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Well, it'll affect your license. It'll affect your insurance. Yeah. So, I don't understand the difference like, you know, it's a civil penalty. Yeah. Yeah. So, this this was um created by the state legislature in 2023 to allow municipalities to install uh speed cameras, but it has to be done through town ordinance. Okay. So, the state has removed themselves uh from the process. Um and doing that it becomes an administrative violation basically. So it's it's done through town ordinance. Okay. Kevin, can I ask you a question? As I recall, there used to be

was there once a statutory speed limit where where 60 or 70 or something like that above whatever is posted that if you go above that the fines would uh increase. So, u yeah, 85 miles an hour of car is considered reckless driving. It becomes a misdemeanor offense which requires a court appearance. And would would that play how does that factor if someone goes ridiculous speed on one of the So, the state the state um has a what they call schedule of fines. Um so depending upon how many miles an hour or the speed limit you're going depends um dictates what your fine will be. Um, this is just a straight help. If you're going over, if the speed limit's 25, if you're going 36, first offense, it's $50. Any subsequent offense at $75. So, so speed doesn't and and unfortunately not an officer, they're not going to allow municipalities to administratively um uh follow up on the reckless driving charge of because that's a misdemeanor offense. Okay. You're you're lucky to get a ticket from our camera versus getting pulled over. For sure. But all that information does go to the police department. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. So, if somebody if they see somebody go through 25, 60 miles an hour or something multiple times, they would just be able to internally say, "Hey, maybe we should keep an eye on this car." But there would be nothing to do in terms of, you know, uh, a fine. Correct. I mean, it would just give them information. Correct. Yeah. I mean, there there's definitely uh data from a speeding standpoint. And but like you said, if it's it stinks because if someone's going 50 and a 25 or a 35 and a 25, it's still 50 bucks. Still the

same unfortunately. But um there are um you know in an ordinance though you know you can if someone gets a certain amount of tickets like five tickets you know you can definitely you know there's things that we can look at doing to make sure that they get the message to slow down. Yeah. So like this one person who went between 61 and 65 in a 25 mile an hour. Yeah. So we did we did a speed study and I'll talk about speed studies. Um we did a speed study in Connecticut. on a town on the shore and they have a school zone with yellow flashing lights and um we we clock people going 55 and a 25 at times which is super dangerous. And then it gets worse. Even when the yellow flashing times aren't there, there's still people coming and going from school. Um we we clocked some very high speeds. It was it was pretty bad. So it's it's concerning. So hopefully that answer your question. Um any revenue from the program must be utilized for traffic related expenses. So you can use any revenue that the town makes and put it towards projects that you have. Um you do like Kevin said uh you have to pass a local ordinance. Um then you conduct a public hearing and then you submit any locations that you would like to enforce. We we do it with you. Um you can submit those locations to Department of Transportation for approval. They have up to 60 days to approve it. What would the public hearing cover then? It would it would it would cover the locations. So, you would just want the public to know that you are looking at having speed cameras. You would have the data around where you're thinking about putting those cameras. If you have a speeding issue, crash data, um if you've had any injuries in that school zone or nearby school, this before or after you put in your So this is be public hearing would be recommendations before you put in your

cameras. A thousand%. Yes, ma'am. And so if the cameras moved, you would need a public hearing every time you move them. You're not going to move the camera. Yeah. No. But yet, in theory, yes. If you if you wanted to move the camera or add another location, Yeah. You're going to have to submit that paperwork. Yeah. Or you could suggest them all upfront by saying we want these x number of streets covered and then you you're it's a one ask. Correct. Yes, ma'am. Perfect. Yeah. But but it's got to go through DOT approval. It it does. It still has to go through DOT approval. And if I'm not quite sure if they will allow you to throw a blanket over the town line like every street. Yeah. Now you know that we ever would do them. Yeah. They they want to see they want to see justification. Um hence the speed studies that the free speed studies have ultimately do right to show your problem to justify the reason for putting the speed camera in the location that you put. So that's a perfect segue. So speed studies, we do no cost speed studies. We do them for five days. Um, I've probably done them in 10 different towns and in every single town, um, they give me the locations they want to do them. I let everybody know we're going to do them so they don't run radar. The the community is aware of it. But from those speed studies, you can get a lot of data on where your issues are. Most time police knows where the issues are already. It this just confirms it. Um, so with that speed study data, um, that's where you can start to decide where you would want to put the cameras. Yep. 100%. In fact, I think I think the speed studies we'll probably look at doing next month versus right now. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's what Marco wanted to capture the summer people. So, okay. I guess I'm a little confused on the order of things.

Um the public hearing and selecting the locations comes after you do a speed study which will put in speed cameras. So that's you're talking about putting in speed cameras. So I didn't do a good job explaining. So there's no perfect order, but an ordinance is required and a public hearing is required before you submit your that's part of the paperwork that you have to submit to DOT. our speed studies. Some jurisdictions do their own speed studies. They have their own data. We just offer the free speed study to help um the jurisdiction decide if there is a speeding issue along with, you know, you already know if there's, you know, been fatalities, traffic accidents, that type of things, complaints from the community, too. Follow up on on Andrea's question. Would you do the speed study prior to the ordinance being proposed? So, that's your justification for the ordinance? 100%. Yep. Yep. So, anecdotally, you know where all your speeding are. Yeah. So, to to get that data before you submit it to a referendum or whatever public hearing that you have, um you would want to have that data to justify um approval of the town ordinance uh to locate speed cameras at location X, Y, and Z. So over those five days, if we have say 10 streets that we're liking to include, even though it may not all be applied, then you could hit all those 10 streets in those five days, for example. Correct. You don't ne Yeah, you don't have to. Let's say that, you know, even if all 10 streets had, you know, huge speeding issues, right? You could still like to your point you you could submit the data to do and once it gets approved you don't have to

necessarily enforce at every single location. Do you do you have a limit because I sent you a list and you sort of whittleled it down and that's fair. I mean you don't want to hit every single street. Is there a limit that you sort of self-impose? I think what we try to do is make sure that um it's a school zone or a nearby school zone, right? Because you you can justify doing like a state highway as long as it's near a school if it's nearby, which what if it's I mean or a high accident rate. Yep. That's well uh so uh where I live I am in front of a beach where the kids go a sort of after school every day and there's issues including like the only death in our town um was right in front of my house. So um but it's not a school zone technically. You know that's okay because of the of that fatality. Uh I I would definitely think about doing at least a speed study there to look at the data. Another quick question. Sorry to keep interrupting your You are not interrupting. No, no, no. One of the I live in a community that's off a state route, shore road, and that's a route that gets a lot of traffic in the summer. People going to the beach communities. It also gets a lot of traffic bouncing off 95 when there's a backup and people try to go around the highway. Um, are the state roads basically left to the town or does DOT ever put up cameras or do anything like that on its own? I'll I can answer that or you want to you answer it, Kevin. You want to answer it? So will the state put a speed camera on? But are they doing that in any locations or or are the state roots within communities the community's responsibility? The answer is state has relocated um through state law which was

passed in 2023 to to hand over responsibility to municipalities. Yeah. Um they don't want any part of it because if it goes through the state, you're going to have to go through the state infractions bureau. um it's not an administrative uh infraction and that means that they're going to be overwhelmed with tickets coming in possibly people contesting the tickets and administrative hearings through the state of Connecticut and it'll be just too overwhelming for the state of Connecticut. So in other words, it's a municipal responsibility. Correct. Correct. and and how do you weigh uh accident experience with the speeds when you're when you're doing a justification for cameras for the state? For example, I I'll give you a concrete example. Andrea lives by an intersection that has a fairly high accident frequency. Uh the DOT for whatever reason is reluctant to even put a light there. There's also an where I believe it's still the case where you have two different speed limits in each direction. One direction is is 35 and the other direction is 40. So how do you deal with something like that? So we would enforce we would enforce based off the speed limit on you know you have a birectional road with we would just you know if this if this lane is 35 then we're going to enforce 10 over if the other one's I guess 45. I I we have not seen that probably yet. I find it I find it really incomprehensible because the the the direction with the poor sight line has the higher speed limit. Of course it does. You know, the big thing for us would be if you do a speed study there is just to make sure that we accurately reflect, you know, because we're just used to both lanes or if it's four lanes, just that speed limit is usually the same. So, I would highly recommend doing a speed study at that location. Yep. Yes. Well, and it's you.

So, you know, it's But yeah, I mean, if you know, we will do speed studies because you know where your issues are. I don't, right? Um, and sometimes, usually, especially the police department, they they're spot on on how many and sometimes they're shocked at how much speeding there is because, you know, the cameras catch everybody. They do. And uh you know it it's it's you know it's safer for police. They're not pulling somebody over on a busy highway and um that interaction that's tough you know. Um but yeah that's we'll do the speeds. You just got to let me know where to do them. That's all. Okay. So I um have another question unless we should wait. What's it about once we Oh, I'll wait. You sure? Okay. You're going to still have lots of questions. So okay. Uh so this is an example of um this is a work zone. This is a school zone um in Suffach, Virginia. Suffach is kind of the gateway to get to the Outer Banks or Virginia Beach. Kind of like your comment about people getting off a 95. They go through Suffach to get to the beach. They avoid the tunnels that we have. Um and they have a few work zones that are very dangerous. They're almost more dangerous than school zones because you have a lot of equipment moving, a lot of workers right there on the side of the road. So, um, we do, uh, school zones, we do work zones, red light, and stop arms. My point to this slide is, um, the mayor said when we first did a speed study, there were over 30,000 violations. Over 30,000. Um, after we did a public information campaign, we did a 30-day warning period in that work zone. The first month, we cut it down in half to 12,000. And then you can just see the numbers go down, which is incredible. That work zone um completed

a few weeks ago and now is turned into a school zone, believe it or not. So, um, we we anticipate and any other vendor would anticipate we we when you get a speed study, we think we'll get a 90% reduction on that number, which is huge. Yeah. Yep. Um, and this I mean I can give you stats all day. So, this is a smaller elementary school. Um, I forget the original number, but you can see 839 and it just started going down. Yep. they now have 11 schools that are active and we're enforcing and that's just if you think about the school zones in Virginia we can only we really only enforce during yellow flashing light times so maybe 45 minutes in the morning 45 minutes in the afternoon you know in Connecticut you can enforce all day long because your speed limits most of the time except for your places you know the same all day long no matter what so but I just want to give that as an example of um I'll do this one too this This is Harrisonburg. Um if you're familiar with JMU, it's a pretty Yeah, we have a work zone that it's about a mile long that connects the campus and it is they had huge numbers too. Um this is the director of public works just talking about our technology, how it greatly reduced speeding in that work zone. I have a lot of friends or kids go to school there and they know what I do and they're like, "Yeah, everybody gets right there and it's just everybody's creeping." So, uh so these are speed warning signs. These are examples. We provide these to the jurisdiction. Um, and just so you know, I don't want to forget, this is 100% violator funded. You will never pay a dime for the program, just to be clear. Even if there are zero violations, we get it down 100%. You'll never pay a dime, just to be clear. Um, and we have a contract that says that. But we also provide the signs. So, this is an example of a sign that says speed up speed photo enforcement. Um, so

that's just examples of what we do and what they look like. I kind of install them. We would install them for you. We would get the approval. So what part of the paperwork is we would tell DOT where those signs are going to go based off of where the cameras go. We do that all for you. We do the power. We do everything. Yep. Okay. Got lots of questions right now. I can tell. Uh I I won't get in technology too much, but you know, you have the opportunity. We can use lidar or radar, doesn't matter. Uh we have solar, diesel, portables, everything you can think of. Um the pole, it's just one pole. You don't even know it's really there. It's a little box with a camera, radar, everything. So, uh this is just an example of a school bus camera, and then a red light camera. Yep. And and the red light camera doesn't tie into your actual red light. So, which is really good. We don't really have So, those are the people going through a red light. Absolutely. Yeah, we've done a lot of red light studies in Connecticut, too. Um the most dangerous obviously are the violations that are straight throughs um and then lefts, you know, right on red. You know, you get a lot of violations that way, but it's, you know, we could we have under five traffic lights. There you go. Yeah. Um I'll talk about community enhancement. The biggest thing, excuse me, about a program is once you sign a contract, you get approval, you're starting the process. The biggest thing that you can do is have a public information campaign. We assist with that. This is letting the community know that the cameras are coming, why the data behind it. We help with all of it. Um, and so this is just examples of, you know, videos. chief. Some chiefs like to get on or or whoever the mayor, they like to get on TV and and get it out there on on media, social media, um print. Let me show you. Um yeah, we have a lot of programs that have um are very successful because of

our teaming up with them and their marketing department on on the public information piece because you definitely want to let your community know they're coming. And you will have people that say, you know, certain things, but you know, the camera it just captures the back of the plate and who's speeding and they get a ticket. That's it. You said back of the plate and who's speeding or just back of the plate? No, no, no. Sorry. Now, who's speeding? Like that individual that's driving that car. We don't It doesn't care. All it captures is the plate. Yep. Yep. I'm sorry that I uh I almost messed that one up. Yeah. We don't We don't even capture like you we we won't do front. We always just capture the plate. So, um if you're driving the speed limit, you know, your plate's not going to show up. So, uh just really quick. So, we capture we capture the violation, that person speeding, whatever that threshold is. uh we process the data, so the the car, the make, the model, all that information, and then we get the uh registered owner. Once we have that, we check to make sure it's a good citation. We send it to the police queue. Uh we have a back office. To your point, um I think you had maybe mentioned this. Uh it has to be approved by a sworn law enforcement officer. So, law enforcement approves the citation ultimately. Now, we do have some SRO's that do it at the school we're enforcing at. You have light duty. You know, you have some folks that are on maternity leave. Uh, and then you have some captain sergeants that they want to control it and do it themselves. So, it's really up to you. But once we approve it, we send it into the queue. Police reviews. It takes maybe 15 seconds to approve a citation. It's quick. Once they approve it, it comes back to us. We do all the mailings and we mail that citation out. Once they pay, we close it out. Um, at the end of 30 days, whatever our fee is, we take it. Whatever's left over, we send that

revenue to the jurisdiction and then we purge the data. Yep. Which is 30 days. Um, I can kind of show you this. I don't This is why I don't want to, but this is kind of what when someone logs in that is authorized, it's very secure. Um, they'll have every camera listed, how many events are in it. So, they'll go in every day, maybe every two days, and approve those citations. Yep. I'll show you this. Um, so this is when they go to approve it. This is what it looks like. The person that's speeding can also see this, too. They'll be able to go online and look at it themselves and see their own violation. So, it shows that they were speeding 11 and over. It shows date and time, plate number, registered owner. Nice thing about Connecticut, there is no transfer liability. The registered owner is responsible for the ticket. Um, and then you'll see four pictures. Two will show the vehicle moving. There's also a video. So, yep. And you can hover over and blow up the plate. Is that cool? You like it? Can you see it? Okay, I'm going to go back down. Um, also a cool thing is we, you know, when when someone goes to pay a citation or look at their citation, we customize it so it' be your town. Um, you know, the big thing is sometimes somebody can get a ticket and they think it's fraud or they have questions. They can go right on the site. It'll have your logo. We customize everything. The appeals process, I won't go too far into this. This is going to be brand new, but it is like Kevin said, um it is a local there is, you know, you're going to appoint someone to do the hearings. We support you with that. Um but the violation occurs and then they either pay or they can appeal. I will tell you, uh in other states, um there is a big court process, but we have less than 1% that even contest the ticket. So, that's a good thing. Um so, it won't overwhelm the court system. Uh

but you will have to appoint a hearing officer. Uh for anybody that wants to um contest it, there's only six reasons that you can contest it. Um I I'll send this to you. I mean, there like there I I just don't see many that uh like the one is the traffic signal wasn't working. You know, that's a red light. Um there was an emergency vehicle coming through and somebody had to maybe do something. So, uh so that's that's kind of what happens with the process. Um, if a hearing officer has to be appointed by the town, is the town responsible for paying that person? No. No. It's it's a it's a current employee. It would be someone that you guys appoint. Like, does that make sense? Not not necessarily. So, you could you could the town could elect to have a citizen Yeah. be the hearing officer. Be the hearing officer. Um, and that I believe would be up to your town charter whether or not that person would be reimbursed. Um, I know from my previous lifetime we had hearing officers for the u we had a town harness for the uh motorcycles, the dirt bikes and uh that person did not get paid. It was a it was voluntary position. So I I think it would be determined upon by your town whether or not they get paid. Okay. Yeah. But that would be the town's responsibility if it were determined that that person was going to be paid for. So it's not like this person goes to the New London court. Oh, no. You come right in this room and the people come in and they could appeal the appeal the the ticket fine and um that person will have access to everything that the videos and the license plates uh everything else. And there there are not to interrupt you, but there are a couple ways that um the transfer of the the liability for

the the ticket. There's there's two exceptions. One is is if your car is stolen and you have proof that your car was stolen, i.e. a police report or if you stole the car prior to right the violation. Yep. You just Yeah. Yeah. That's all. But great question. And one last question while we're on this side here. The the hearing officer's decision is final. There's no appeal to that. That's it. Correct. Yep. Um yeah, that's that's the step four is kind of you make the decision and it's it's moving on. So um why didn't I have real quick? Hold on. I wanted to show you this. Um, so I can give you an example. One of the one of the six reasons too is calibration. And just so you know, um, this is an example of what a citation I know it's small, but that's what a citation looks like. When you have a hearing officer, we we provide a autogenerated statement. So it gives the person's name, you read it out, and then they can give the reasons why they're contesting the ticket. Um the other piece too is we self-calibrate all our systems every single day. So when they come in and question calibration we'll have calibration day before day of day after the citation. Okay. But we also per law Connecticut law we have our annual calibration certificate too. So that's that's pretty much it when it comes to the hearing part of it. So that's it. And what's the financial breakdown per citation? Um, so so the $50 so what we do is we we we charge a fixed camera cost, right?

Um, at the end of let's say that that camera cost I'm please don't use this number, but I'll just I don't I don't I'm afraid if if I say too high then you'll never talk to me. If I say too low then you'll expect it. But uh let's say the camera cost is $1,000 for a camera at the end of the month. um at at the end of the month, let's say you have a hundred paid citations, we're not compensated on anything that's paid. We just take our fixed cost and then once we take that $1,000, anything left over from a revenue standpoint comes back to the town. So to be used for specific, right? So So you pay for that camera per month from the citations. Correct. 100% violator funded. Um and and that's another nice thing about the speed studies too is it kind of gives you an idea of and that's why in our contract though we have cost neutrality. So even if like I said if you had one violation it doesn't we would just carry that balance over so you're always protected. Oh, I'm sorry. Uh, so when you showed that the speeds dropping dramatically in a school zone, for example, the signed cost, I I assume it's like this. At what point does it become not economical for you to have the sign? So, so we we will we've never walked away from a program. We continue to enforce as long as you want us to enforce. We have a program that has one school. It has about five violations a week. It's very small and um but and they have two police officers but that that camera has been live now for three and a half years. So um most programs though that we see even after we see a 90% reduction there is a revenue component because you know you don't you don't know how many people are going to get more than one ticket right because that second ticket is going to be $25 more. Um, but if you had, you

know, a hundred tickets that were paid, that's $5,000, right? So, um, and you know, if it's a 100 tickets paid, we take our thousand, that would be 4,000 as an example. So, my questions are all sort of tied into that. Okay. Um, so do you leave the cameras up until we tell you not to, and when we we've seen the 90% drop, we say good job. But then would when people realize there are no cameras, would it just start to escalate again? Absolutely. A great question. Um, in some programs we'll see even a 50% reduction is really good, right? And and it depends on um some towns are very transient, right? Like you mentioned the beach. So you may have uh people that come during the summer that normally don't come. So that makes it challenging for us to get to that 90% sometimes because the the folks that live around are going to they're going to know and they're going to stop. Um but no, once we get to the 90%, we get to 95% in some instances. No, we would keep enforcing 100%. It would be your call. Um you know, our agreement has, you know, whether it's a three or four or fiveyear agreement. You know, we want every jurisdiction to go through that entire term and then extend because to your point, people know that they're gone. But you haven't done a study yet to see like after it's gone how much it goes back up. Oh. Oh, we can do we can do studies. Well, no, we wouldn't. I'm saying you haven't done that yet. No, because people Yeah, we haven't done that. Yeah, we'll get there. Do you have stats on recidivism once you get one ticket? know they're sort of regular offenders or that's not a big issue. Um Oh, no. It's a big issue. It depends on the town, right? So, we have some really big programs and it's, you know, you you have there's a few outliers that get a

ton, but um we work with the local police department to say, "Hey, this this individual," and that's also people that may not pay, too. Like they there's a conversation that probably needs to be had in that situation. But yeah, uh we can pull any data that you want as far as um what we see a lot what people don't realize is you reduce the the speeding but it's it's really the actual speed that people drive around town after the cameras go up. You will see the average speed limit like people driving goes down. Yeah. You'll see a calming effect. Exciting. Do people Connecticut is uh very um it's it's it's different like in Virginia it's you know it's it's it's dense. There's a lot of traffic and people are in a hurry and it's smaller roads. I mean it's it's definitely there are a lot of speeding issues here and I've seen speed study numbers and I'm just I even like look to make sure I'm adding everything in my Excel and it's right and it's it's bad. It's bad. What happens when they don't pay the ticket with the citation? Yeah, great question. So, um there are, you know, you can put an ordinance, you can do a scoff law. It's up to the jurisdiction how you want to handle those. Um we also do what we call collections. Um we we can send, you know, a second third notice to encourage people to pay. Yep. Yay. There's definitely steps that you can take. Um, you know, it's it's really up to the jurisdiction though. You know, I don't One last question in that regard. You talked about transient population in the summer. The interstate is a major throughway and you get a lot of out of state people on the highway and coming off. How do you deal with an out ofstate violator? Yeah, that's a great question. So, we we we go through the normal

checks and balances we would for an instate, right? So, if I was coming through Connecticut and I was speeding, the only thing I would say it takes us um don't quote me on this, but it takes us only about 48 hours to get the registered owner and turn that ticket around. When it's an out ofstate plate, it might take a little bit longer. That's all. Um but but we're going to treat them the same way. Yeah, we deal with that a lot. Yes, ma'am. Uh so have you had it dealings with um or what have your experience been with like people who object to this for example or have restrictions like a historical society where there's a limitation of signs in a historic downtown or police and fire departments that may or just objections from the public um before a program starts you mean? Oh 100%. Um, it's different in Connecticut because you're start Connecticut's new, right? It's a new state. What I've seen in my past though is in the beginning, you have some people that support it and then some people that feel like, like you said, too many signs. Um, it's an overreach of government. You're spying on me, whatever, you know. But once the programs go live, what we find is most people are happy that they have it, especially the people in the communities we serve, um, the kids that are going to school. But you will have a small group of people that will never be happy with campus being in, right? But if there I guess it's just more of a town issue or between the commissions and individuals. If you have a historical society that has regulations like no signs, no lights, no blah blah, you know, that's that that is something. Virginia has old towns and roads. So Williams, we have we have a program right beside Williamsburg and and it's um but we've been live

there for almost an entire school year and it's worked really well. It's really Do you have restrictions for signage? Yes. Yeah. On this very road, they don't they don't like it. It's It's unclear I think, but I'm not sure as to whether how much is formally restricted and how much is preferred not to have it. Yeah. I mean, I'm not state that requires signage um for for the cameras. Does it require flashing light signage? because that was the main concern I think of the historic yes it doesn't you don't have to have flashing yellow I think that's a discussion that the committee can certainly have the historic district I mean historic um venue shouldn't trump public safety particular when you have schools but particularly if we don't have to have flashing lights if it's just the two signs prior to I mean the bottom line too is that there's going to be an ordinance passed to allow That could I I'm not something I would recommend, but it could be it could also limit the um jurisdiction of the historical commission for traffic safety measures. Maybe that's a question to consult town council. Yeah. The other to your point though, it's really good. Um one thing I didn't mention and I wouldn't think about is you know on that system when it captures someone um we don't use like a white flash too. that can be we feel like that's a distraction itself. Um some systems use a white flash and it's it can you know that always is bad if it's near a neighborhood. You know there's always that person but we use like what's called infrared uh IR illuminators and they it it's that enables us like in Connecticut like before daylight savings time you're going to capture people speeding and it's still dark outside. So

that enables us to capture those plates too uh when it's still dark and not have the white flash. So that's always helpful in this scenario. So I think we're gonna wrap you up for now. You're available to answer questions, right? I'm here. I'm here in Connecticut. Yeah, that is Yeah, thank you so much. I just one quick question. Do you have contracts at any existing Connecticut towns now? Um I will tell you this is public but we are in contract negotiation. So we've been um the intent to award which you know yeah the answer is yes but we just have to put ink to paper is what I would say. Um I would tell you we were first in Virginia first in Florida to go live. Um yeah we have I don't know how many programs in Virginia Florida a lot though. And we're in Maryland we're in uh Georgia. A lot of lot of programs. So, but in Connecticut it it is it's pretty new, but it's starting to pick off. So, you you would have a couple of letters of recommendation you could forward to us. I Which state do you want to call? Yeah. And I honestly in Connecticut, too, I could um connect you with some folks that are working with us. Fantastic. That's great. Great news. And we did Oh, the the Council of Governments. I don't know if um I I don't know if you're able to purchase off that. I would think you are. Yeah. The for vendors list. So it's like a the bid no bid list for just region we were just they were just awarded at least one of the preferred vendors for the cap region. So a lot of times town although it's 100% no cost to the towns a lot of towns are opting to go to RFP for this this process to um show transparency with the process that's going on but yeah Capri and Prague Council of Governments when you send us the the PowerPoint

presentation of what that is can you send us a little information about that 100% you'll be the first to fits that. So, uh that was a competitive RFP. Um every vendor could uh bid on it and they chose three vendors were one of them. Right. So, and just one quick thing before before I leave, if you don't mind, um being the the traffic safety committees that said we are um I don't know if you're familiar with it, but the state of Connecticut has the crash data repository. It's done through Yukon. Um, you could go up onto that website and you could stick an old line and see where where your issues are and what are the most likely places that you would think that might qualify for Cameron and somebody said they live on Shore Drive Shore Road 156. Um, I did a quick and it's quite busy. So, so I would say this when I leave, you know, just amongst yourselves, figure out where's the most important places to do a speed study. Let's get them scheduled. I can give you the data. That's really important. So, great. Okay. Thank you so much. Sorry. Am I sticking around? Do you want me to sit here? Okay. You can go or you can stay. It's up to you. You guys need me to stay? No. You sure? You sure? I um Whatever you want. You You're good to go. Okay. Thank you. I will send the the presentation in the in the PDF um and then please reach out to me if you have questions. Okay, cool. Thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you. We want to run through the fo. So I I Yeah, I I And may I um apologize? Sophie graciously offered to take the minutes for the rest of the time. I had an unexpected um event pulls me away.

You're allowed. I wanted to mention to you one one other Thank you so much. Quick aside, you could just exception to your thing. My wife got a citation the city of San Francisco about a year ago. Thank you. And and it had her plate on a a box truck. Yeah. misuse of misuse of that that would be probably qualifying that would be up to your appeals. So thank you again. Appreciate it. Thank you. Enjoy the no rain while we still have go out downstairs or do we have to walk all the way around? You can go out downstairs and you can exit that way. Yeah. Thank you everybody. Appreciate it. So as far as FOYI goes, the one thing I would mention is is I I would suspect many of the people from the committee have not come from work with other government agencies or were experienced with a government agency. And and one of the one of the peculiarities of working for a government is the public has an affirmative right to know what government's doing on its behalf. And that's the FOI uh thing. And and it it I'm not an expert on FOI, but the one thing that I've been cautioned about and I hear about a lot is conducting business via email. You can actually there's a lot of back and forth and yeah, hey, we agree with that. Let's do this. You've actually conducted a meeting via email. Uh the other issue is that um whatever you say via email is technically a part of the public record. So, you've

mentioned this before, Amanda, and I would strongly suggest that if anybody sends a email to the group that we CC the town account because I would much rather have somebody um basically look for the town account for the information than to frankly look at my personal email account. Definitely. Uh and and the other thing you could look through what this attorney said. The other thing too is is I think it's if someone says to the group, I think what Matt said is great. I really like this, like that. Just send it to Amanda and let that go and let's not all discuss it among ourselves to it's almost impossible not to do that, but to refrain from that as much as possible, I think will be helpful. We should be doing here anyway, right? Yeah. you should be would that those conversations should take place here or uh I know I think it's it's because you you come from a the corporate environment you want the whole team to know you don't want to repeat yourself so it's it's a habit to say hey let's just share information with everybody but that's not we want to convey some things to you send you the email blow up the road in public safety option for example for you to share your thoughts on this presentation with the whole team is then when other people start going back and forth and you're saying, "Well, I like this. I like this company. Let's go with this company." And someone says, "Yeah, that's the company I want." That's when you start to get into an area that's a little bit tricky. But we could register our thoughts and just not reply to each other. That That's the best way to do it. So, we could register your thoughts. Oh, yeah. Yeah. To the whole group, but let's not have a chat about it. Can't reply. You pretend it never happened. Yeah. No, you don't pretend. It's it's it's fine for one person to express their opinion for the whole group. It's when you start getting into the back and forth that it becomes more of a meeting

than than single communication. I don't think we've done a lot of group I really don't feel like that's been a I mean my experience with our group is a lot of people don't reply to emails. That's just I don't usually I don't usually email anybody really. I don't So and and then of course there are the people who just don't show up. I was nervous at all replying. That wasn't I didn't know. My wife does. She does. Everybody, but I don't I never have really. I know. I don't I'm not on social media. I've never been on social media, but I think it's a good habit to, you know, not not have a chitchat across email. That's great. Um, is that good? Yeah, that's so then we have uh the website. Oh, the survey. Sorry, we're doing a survey. I had three topics on there, all of which relate to the public profile of this committee. Yeah. But in having a quick conversation with Sophie before this meeting, I think it's it might be best, Amanda, if you and I speak with Martha and just I I want to find out exactly what the holdup is. Well, if she's got concerns what they are and make sure that we abide by that. Did you ever Sophie, did you ever find out why the stuff that we did was taken down like within an hour or whatever? Katie just emailed me to say that Martha needed to go through it all to okay it which is why it was all removed and that's the last that I heard. And what had you put up? Sorry. Nothing. Put up nothing. We So I had sent out to all of you guys like a proposition for how the website would be organized and Greg was the only person who redlined it. So I just used his red lines. Okay. And the way that the town has it set up, which I don't understand why it is done this way, is Amanda and I had to stand behind Katie's desk as she input everything for about an hour. Yeah. And we literally just told her what we wanted and in what place and what it was going to look like and she did it all and then it was up

for about an hour and then it got taken down and it's not there anymore. Um, so yeah, I guess but it was should ask Martha what her concerns. I think a more general a more general comment would be that I I think it's really important if we're going to address a safety problem in this town that the public know that someone is looking at this and kind of get people behind it. I don't want, you know, Halls Road is a great example where people thought that committee was kind of doing their own little thing. Exactly. You know, I I think the the more support we get, the earlier we can get it will help getting an ordinance passed, whatever, because eventually it's got an ordinance has to go to a town meeting and people have to vote on it. I I will mention that the mention in Martha's newsletter, I think, was actually read by at least a couple of people because there were two different comments in the like the just the the general email sent to us going, "Why aren't you taking care of this?" So there's there's someone read that this could what this committee does and what this committee recommends and when it gets to the board of select persons what are they going to do? I mean it could be that they Martha wants to do it as part of this is what I recommend as as suggested to me by the committee if if they want to have that level of of public engagement. I think that's how she wants it. Yes, that's her prerogative. But I'd like to know that so we know which way we're do we're going. When I asked her because was it and I forget who said can you please ask? Um she said your adviserss. Yeah. So you know we're not making any decisions. We're advising her to please do this. But but my response to that would be we're an advisory committee. But on the other hand, when the committee was initially established, I was told that there'd be people from various neighborhoods around the town. You'd survey people in your

neighborhood and bring what the people in your community think needs to be done to the group that we discuss it. Uh and and I think it's still important that one of the things that should go into a recommendation to the board is what do the people in the town think? what you know if if people don't think there's a speeding problem in this town that's the client I think they do which gets to the survey hopefully I think that survey is going to be a good idea my wife and I said it'd be a good idea because there's people in my neighborhood that and like on rolling road my customers don't walk on rolling road anymore because people flying down the road so I have to go down to the D and walk down there but now you can't walk down there because they got that all jacked up so they have no place to walk and it wouldn't be great if we promoted Like that's why we're doing this, right? So we could have more walking and more safe. Yeah. You know, walking your dog, walking your kids, come in here. I was going down bronze lane and there's a lady and two little kids and they're like these little carts and she's pushing down the road and the volume cart was going fast cuz the one in the back was going fast. So she was pushing them and I'm thinking if somebody comes up that hill they're going to hit her and I was so nervous and it's on my own road. I'm so scared. I mean and they shouldn't be doing 50 miles an hour on my road. That's show. You know it should be done really constructively. you know, the there there's there's a lot of data that there's a speeding problem and and an accident problem nationwide, certainly Connecticut wide, you could say Old Line wants to look to see what its problem is. You know, we'd love to have you give us your suggestions, you know, and and I could it could be done in a in a positive way without really I think getting into any bad you've been sending articles about other towns. You can cite those as examples of this is a a problem and other towns are addressing it and blah blah blah. We may not get hits from the the summer people, but the people that live here all the time, all of us that live here all the time, those I'm

sure we get and I know people and you know down here too. I'm sure they they would think they'd be right on top, you know, they do the survey because you see people doing 45 miles an hour down the street sometimes. this doesn't make any sense to me, but I think it's a very nice idea. I I know, you know, I I I I really had to smile when I was listening to Martha talk about going down Mercury road. So So I I always have been a pokey driver, particularly compared to my wife who's got a much hairier foot than I am. Since I've been on this committee, I think myself, it would not look good for you to get a speed. Exactly. So I follow the the the the speed limits on Shore Road. I try to go 5 miles an hour at most over the speed of my new copy. He's he's good. I've seen him three times already. Once on air, twice in front of my office pulling people over. So, yeah. But not going five miles an hour. No, he got one kid going. He had one of those little super cars that goes right in front of my office. Got him and pulled him right over there. Then I saw him where I saw him. We were going to Big W. He was down here hiding in a little turnoff on there. So, he's around, man. I'm glad. I like it. So I So I don't really I would defer those additional agenda items till we've had a chance to talk to Martha. Okay. One thing I' I'd like to ask again. Sorry I missed a couple of meetings. I'm just catching up. Just missed one. How was it that we found the two companies that had presented to us and are there they got to it's three companies altogether and uh just so we're all aware but I think that we've dismissed them. the first company that presented to us um name is completely okay. They were expensive. They were but they they came back afterwards and said, "No, no, now we have a free version. Now we have a free version." All right. They said they were going to Yeah. So, but I think Mar like I didn't respond to that and Martha

didn't respond to that email that she sent to both of us and I was like, "Yeah, I think your time has passed." Um but I I am very interested in the people. I know you didn't get to see Andre present, but the people who have seen both like did you have a preference? Um, did you feel like one was more You were very enthusiastic about Andre second. What was the name? Blue Line. Blue Line. Yes. He was from our town. He lives in our town. He thought us out, right? He I all I know I was I was encouraged to wait. No, he came to me through the email through the road in public safety I think. But every time I mentioned him, everybody like all the selectmen had already knew all about him. So he's obviously been very present in everybody's sphere. Uh and then he presented and he did the safety uh the the speed uh surveys without asking which you know it it was great to have the information but that is sort of trespassing. Um, did you make a comment in one of your emails, Amanda, that he didn't represent a company? And I I took it back. I I hope I made that aware because I feel bad about it. I didn't He He initially in his email response of like, "How do you want to be introduced?" Basically was, "Oh, I'm just a resident." And then and that's what I saw. And then I there was like this like, "But if you have to list something, there's blue." Like so but he was but his initial thing was like oh I'm just a resident you know I'm not here to I wrote to you I I spoke to the guy in Washington Connecticut and I believe he said he did the work there. Okay. And they never heard of him. Oh, that's Well, and and I'll also say he sent he sent an uh an email with an

attachment of an article that was supposedly about how great a job they did. It never worked. He's never sent me the article on the side, you know, like that that this website just does not exist as far as I can tell. And I wrote back to the guy saying, let me ask this again. Are you telling me you you did not work with a company called Blue Line? And he said we did not. Yeah, I think that Washington Connecticut was Traffic Logics. Yeah, that's they said that they did Washington Middletown Marlboro Beacon Falls. That's the first company. The one who $2,000 per Blue Line said he did Greenwich and Washington Blue Line. He seemed like a nice guy. He's I I think he's very sincere and I think that he's very eager and um I feel terribly that I didn't catch that but I'm from Blueline because it really colored how I saw him. Um I still think it was sort of you know not nefarious but you know a little a little sneaky to sort of say no no I'm just a I'm just Do you have if he may be marketing directly to the select people? I I think he's getting up in their grill. I definitely think that I know he had talked to Martha individually before he presented to us. Um, but I mean I thought he was, you know, I it did seem it was like he was presenting this pie in the sky. We're going to do everything for you. It's not going to cost you a scent and whatever. So, it seemed between the two. I don't know how that would look. It It seemed very too good to be true, but they're sort of presenting the same thing. Um, I I liked these guys. Um, I don't know. I It feels like they're more professional somehow, but I don't I don't know how you guys feel. I felt

good about them. Yeah, I like we don't have to pay for the the the tickets, you know, all the things. It's um, you know, a violator funded. I like that. But what does the camera cost a month? You know what I mean? It doesn't cost us anything. So, even that that charge that he said something about $1,000 a month, what he was just using. But I think that's how they justify having a camera. They're going to earn out their thousand and then maybe a little more or whatever. That is a different economic model though and that's not a subtlety um as opposed to a um split from dollar one. And I'm not advocating for either one, but I picked up on that right away because I think um let's say you take 20 tickets and you know we could end up not getting paid um fairly quickly. You know, in other words, that thousand thousand, you know, but that I guess when when we had the last meeting and that was sort of brought up with with Andre. Yeah. He said that for a $50 ticket, they take 1750, right? And then it's a split from as opposed to acrewing like you're in the hole for a,000. I'm not saying it's good or bad. It's just it's a different I don't think that's ever in the hole. I think that because he basically sorry maybe not in the whole but we would not generate revenue if unless there's at least $1,000 but also do we care about generating that's my point that's what I brought up with Martha like are we in this to make money because I didn't think we were in this to make money I thought we were in it to you know have a speed reduction to change the I think the town is always happy to make money but we don't we don't actually really care about generating money we obviously didn't want to pay the first group 2 per camera per month. That was crazy. 2500. Yeah. If we're not paying anything, it doesn't really matter if we make sense or if we make Yeah. Although I would say that that we it should be revenue neutral.

The the the safety impact is the key criteria. But if there were the the ability to generate some revenue and pay for the traffic enhancements like putting in the speed humps or whatever or even getting the the person paid who's doing the you know Yeah. No, I I but I think that with both of them, I think the town is getting money like from pretty much from I mean, we can also ask these people to be a little bit more specific about what the cost would be per month for their cameras that they would want to recoup before the town got I mean, I was just surprised that they didn't have like an across the board price for that. It seems like they were determining it based on something else. So, we can't make a decision until they give us. It feels like with both of these companies, towns our size are not generating revenue for them. They're just trying to accumulate a bunch of towns that they can go to the New Haven, the big places where they would actually generate a lot of revenue. So, we may be in a advantageous situation if we're one of the earlier towns to do it, right? They they could be willing to give us a good deal and use us as a as a selling point for we've reduced their other distinction I noticed and I'm sure you all had others was he um tonight I I think presented the state law um in a way that differed from my understanding from Andre in in that it was very focused on school zones. And it's not lost on me when I spoke to the officer in Greenwich for some time, they were only applying them at school zones. I thought it was a voluntary decision on their part. So now whether Andre was being completely transparent or not, I

think he led us to believe that we could have them everywhere and it was independent of school zones. I mean, school zones are obviously important, but that's another distinction I picked up on, you know, for following. I I didn't hear that they were saying they wouldn't have it, but maybe the DOT, whoever has to okay having these cameras, maybe they're more focused on having school zones and other high traffic or whatever. It's a shame that we couldn't see it on the big screen, but I wanted to go back and and read the law a little because it's a whole different ballgame if it's exclusively on around school zones. Yeah, it doesn't help a lot of us. Perhaps I'm wrong. Yeah, I think I I didn't hear that it was exclusive, but somehow they're concentrating there or they like it there or it's an easier one to justify. That's what I thought. Maybe they sort of heard it too. Yeah. May May I make a suggestion? So, I this this committee is juggling a lot of different balls. And one of the things I'll try to do is kind of put together a an outline of all the different things we've dealt with and where we're at with it. But maybe one thing to do would be to have a little subgroup that can analyze these three people and come back and say, "We like this. We have questions about this, about that. Would you be willing to work on that?" Maybe Sophie and does someone else want to volunteer? Maybe three of us. Happy to. Okay, great. There you go. So, and we can come back in the June meeting. And so, we're done with looking at companies. Amanda, I think we are. Okay. I think we are. I mean, I haven't had anybody else come to us. Hurry up. We got to go. Question. I don't think I I would just say so

lame. Who was responsible for putting a booster for that? No idea. And we have police I think was the police who did it. And we have to contact Martha to get permission. No, we have to write to Martha to say that with an incorrect speed limit. Yeah. Okay. Well, we're calling it to a close. Yes. We're saying hi for whatever. So you guys next motion door five need to make sure we retired too. Yeah. Yeah, it doesn't. Yeah, it's still