Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

New York.

Nice. Yeah. 07:00. We ready. It is, 07:00, and, this is the planning commission meeting for Tuesday, 12/16/2025.

Let me, have a roll call, please.

Commissioner Hall. Here. Commissioner Eschke. Here. Commissioner Walsh. Here. Commissioner Anderson.

Here.

Commissioner High. Here.

Hey, Sean.

Hi, guys.

Alright. Let's see. Next, we have a public comment, section as public's opportunity to comment about any item on the agenda, including items before final action. Public, we would like to I'll, keep it to three minutes, and, please state your name and city, please.

Good evening. Randall Friedman from Camus. I talked to this about council yesterday, but I wanna, since you're hearing as well the more detail of the downtown plan, go I'll go through a couple of things. And, I mean, I don't know if you remember from algebra, the a if a equals b, b equals b, then a equals c. But we gotta have something like that in the model toxics control act. It starts off by having a definition, very specific definition of what an industrial property is. The mill needs it to the letter. The next thing it says, okay. You've got an industrial property. You gotta clean it up.

What is the signal you look for? There's one thing in the under the growth management act. It's the zoning. And if it is heavy industry, the model talks it's gonna write is very clear. It is an industrial cleanup.

Now what happens let's say the c part of it. The c part of it is if it's an industrial cleanup, we are required to accept an institutional control on the deed that will keep it industrial. And there, we will have 660 acres behind a fence because it's mandatory restriction of public access with an industrial cleanup, and it can sit there. Now I've asked the council for probably about a year to engage a land use attorney to just answer this simple question. There has been nothing.

I understand Robert mentioned it yesterday, but, frankly, he's not an attorney. Our city attorney, if you look on the Washington State Bar, is not listed as an expertise in environmental or land use. So we have a very specific point of law that is everything for our future and this cleanup. I don't understand why no one is interested in answering this question. Now why is this important?

The property owner, Coke Industries, is very litigious. So I could just see them several years from now coming to ecology and saying, the law is very clear. It's industrial zoned. We're keeping industrial. In fact, their plan says we won't even plan it until we, the mill, will start, and we're not gonna start.

How can ecology how can you require anything but an industrial cleanup? And if you do, we'll see you in court because the law is clear. So we're giving the mill a backdoor lawsuit, making it easy. It's clear, and yet I hope you as the planning commission will be curious and maybe seek an answer to that before we have a plan that writes it off. Now the other thing I just wanted to say is you're gonna hear about the wonderful public involvement process. What you won't hear is how selective it has been. There is a survey that was done. The mill was off the table. It wasn't in the survey. 17% of the respondents said to hell with it and brought up the mill and said we're gonna talk about it.

You don't hear about that in your plan. You won't hear about the outpouring of interest this community has in the mill. It should you are the last stop before the council, and I hope you take your job seriously. Thank you.

Thank you, Randall.

Oh, and this is something, this is the Camus Earth Day Society. We submitted comments to Clark County about the Nevin property. It has a discussion about why deficiency in the in this plan is the lack of consideration of the mill. And the of that, going immediately to greenfield development when we have a huge brownfield that's ready for development. Thank you.

Thank you.

Good evening, Tyler Sanders. Have. A lot of noise here. Good evening, planning commission and and Alan. Here to just reiterate some comments I gave to the council last night.

Obviously, this has been a really big year for, Canvas for for planning in Canvas with, some new laws from Washington on various topics as well as the our comprehensive plan update process. One of the most consequential topics has been this this question of missing middle housing in campus, especially relating to ADUs. I've I've described ADUs as one of those rare, like, win win win policies. It's it's a win for for those who need affordable housing. It's it's a win for the city because it allows infill development, bringing in new revenue without new infrastructure burden.

It's a win for for property owners, allowing them to develop their property more how they see fit. And so, I'm I was I'm I'm really encouraged by the new ADU policy that was passed last night with the the batch of municipal code ordinances. I know originally in in in the in in the ordinance that was originally planned, there weren't these considerations for utilities, and I and and others brought that up. And I I just wanted to thank you all for for listening to that, for for all the work that was put into tweaking the policy and and really making something that works better that regard. Our our policy now has provisions for ADUs being able to share utilities with the main unit or or with each other given everything's right sized.

And it's like it's it's a little thing, but it's a really big thing. It's it's gonna remove tens of thousands of dollars potentially from the cost of developing ADUs. It's gonna simplify the process. It's gonna keep the city's infrastructure more intact. And and so it's it's really great to see that you all listen to that and and made a better ADU policy for Canvas. I obviously, there's there's more work to do in the coming year in regards to ADUs and and many more issues, but I'm I'm encouraged by the progress that we've made this year on all these things. And beyond that, I I just thank you all and and wish you happy holidays. Thanks.

Thanks, Alex.

Good evening. And staff. Thanks, Rick Marshall, Camus Washington. So just wanted to thank staff consultants and the planning commission for, you know, some very nice work on the draft downtown plan. I read through the whole thing multiple times.

I've got a bunch of minor suggestions and edits that I'm hoping to maybe spend some time with staff to to improve it a little bit. But I like the overall approach and the recommended strategies. And and, you know, we've been doing pretty good with with downtown. I don't know if you realize the increase in property values in in the last ten years, but, basically, you know, from when Claire Flats went in to when Livingston went in, we were looking at, yeah, five times increase in land value. So good job, everybody.

I mean, we've been doing a good job. You know? And my overall suggestion with the plan is really, you know, to keep expanding the walkable areas, make things as safe as possible for for both pedestrians and bikers, you know, and and really increase the connectivity to surrounding neighborhoods. That's gonna help both with getting in walking traffic and and with parking. Some things I really liked, you know, I like the note on the topography, but, you know, that that can be a real challenge, but also an opportunity because it provides reviews and and just a more interesting layout.

I think the six goals that are listed are really good. Really, the focus on better utilization of Mill Ditch and and Lewis Block Park is real important. You know? And and I'd vote for the city hall with parking under. I just think land is probably too valuable in downtown for surface parking anymore.

You know, we've been working with volunteers on both Mill Ditch and the Ouachuca River, Lackamas Creek Greenway for close to a decade now. So I know those areas really, really well, and I could spend a lot of time. But let me just offer up a few suggestions if you guys haven't been to either of those areas because I think they're important. One, check out, you know, the city steps. You'd be surprised how many people have not walked our beloved city steps, and I'd like to see that maybe, show up a little bit more prominently in the plan.

And then there's actually a little Mill Ditch connector trail that neighbors have built off of 7th Avenue. So just a little bit east of where of Birch so between Birch and Dallas on 7th that connects up to the corner of Mill Ditch and 7th Avenue. Real fun little entry to that green space. And then, know, we have oh, and if you're real brave, there's the Cedar right of way. You can scamper up actually from 6th Avenue, on city property up to 7th, which is kinda fun.

And then, you know, we have multiple Washoe River overlooks, which I think a lot of people don't realize. Get down to Kramer Lane behind Well 13. There's actually a real nice overlook. There's a couple of nice benches that the neighbors have put in. Great place to just hang out. And then the 2nd Avenue overlook, which is just East of Garfield, that's not very developed, but I think it has tremendous potential. And, yeah, I'd love to share more about some of these areas if if I get a chance. So thank you.

Thanks, man.

Like, online, I didn't hear you.

Good evening, planning commission. This is Robert Maum, the planning manager with the city.

Good evening, mister.

I just wanted to clarify something for the record.

Speaking.

Mister Friedman had indicated that I said something last night at council about the mill and zoning.

Barely Hey, Robert. Can can you hold off for a second? We need to raise the volume.

Okay.

How about that?

Say that again, bitch.

How about now?

Yeah. Let's see. Can you restart?

Okay. Yeah. I just wanted to clarify something for the record. Mister Friedman claimed that I made some sort of statement last night regarding zoning for industrial properties. I did not. I did have a presentation with the city council during workshop for a summary plan in North Shore, which he did not stay for. So, I just wanna make sure that it's clear for the record what he's saying is false about me and, to just keep that for the record. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Robert. Alright. I'm

sorry. It was Alan who said it, so he's right.

Oh, okay. Well, Robert, Alan, whatever.

Alright. Not seeing any other public. We will close the public comment. Alright. Next on the agenda, we have the approval of the minutes for November. I'll take a motion and a second when you're ready.

I make motion to approve November 18, '2 thousand twenty five planning commission meeting minutes as stated.

Second. Alright. So we had a motion to approve from commissioner Eschke and a second from commissioner Walsh. May I have a roll call vote, please?

Commissioner Hall?

Yes.

Commissioner Eschke? Yes. Commissioner Walsh? Yes. Commissioner Anderson? Yes. Commissioner Hai?

Yes.

Alright. The motion passes. Next on the the agenda, we have one meeting item tonight. Looks like it's our Downtown Camas twenty twenty twenty forty five update. And just to be clear, this is just a review of the draft tonight. There's we're we're not forwarding anything on we're not making a a recommendation to counsel. It's just a little shot for for the update. And the presenter is Alan Peters.

Alright. Thank you, chair and planning commission. Thank you for joining us this December evening. Wanna wrap up the year with the the last event and topic of what is the third community summit for the comprehensive plan update where we've been focusing on one element at a time. We're in the middle of a three week window where we're looking to receive feedback, on the downtown sub area plan draft.

And so we have a survey online in Engage Canvas. This is an opportunity for the public to hear more about the plan, and also for the planning commission to provide some feedback. So while you won't be taking any formal action, we are looking for input, and, that input will be considered as we work on the next draft of the plan, which we intend to release February or March time frame. And our anticipation is that that next draft is the version that will be taken to the planning commission for a formal recommendation and to council next year. Know, obviously, having been through that adoption process yourselves on on you know, whether it's comprehensive plans, sub area plans, or code updates, you know, there is still a public process even at that stage where, you know, there is some feedback, some fine tuning, some edits, and things like that.

So this is very much a working document today. And as we move forward in the calendar, we're gonna get closer and closer to, I think, that that final doc. So with that, we'll we'll jump in. Wanted to talk first about what a subarea plan is. And it's basically you know, one way I I think of it is is it's a comprehensive plan for a particular smaller area of a city.

You know, the the districts that you might do a sub area plan can be very small or very large. This is a smaller footprint generally for a sub area plan. It covers, you know, one specific existing downtown neighborhood. And the focus here, I think, is on redevelopment as opposed to, for example, the North Shore suburb plan, which you all were part of, you know, three years ago or so, was for a larger greenfield development part of the city. But the idea here is that we can provide a more detailed vision, more detailed sets of policies, strategies, and location actions.

And so, you know, as you look through the plan, you know, you'll see detailed drawings, renderings, concepts related to land use, open space, that type of thing. And it also provides the opportunity for for the public to provide that, you know, very detailed kinda ground level feedback on what is or isn't missing. And so, you know, I I think we wish we could address our entire city at this level of detail, but we were fortunate that we have this opportunity to look at downtown this way. This is the intent is for this to be adopted concurrent with our comprehensive plan. And so, certainly, while we're focusing on downtown, we wanna make sure the planning commission and the community at large is is looking at this comprehensively because this is contributing to the next twenty years of growth in Canvas.

And in fact, as we'll, you know, learn later in the presentation, downtown is considered, you know, one of the most important parts of one of your vision. So the draft plan again, it's actually been out for several months. It was released in July 2025. We did a rollout of this plan and the comprehensive plan in Canvas days. It was really important for us to be able to launch it at that time, and so we released what we had ready, in July.

And so I think both plans are are pretty early drafts in a way. The downtown plan, I think, is more developed, in some ways. There's also, as you'll see, a couple chapters that are missing, and they're just waiting on on more information, from the larger comprehensive plan process, particularly from the county, with respect to things like infrastructure and transportation planning. We need to know what the overall growth alternatives are so we can start doing that modeling ourselves. We're waiting for RTC to do some transportation modeling.

But what we were able to put together was a plan that was informed by public input that we received throughout the process, particularly the first couple of community summits as well as community conversations, our vision survey. And then we actually have two advisory committees that have set eyes on this plan, the community advisory committee for our campus twenty forty five. Then we have a downtown specific downtown advisory committee for, our downtown campus twenty forty five, and that group consists of, a smaller subset of the CAC members as well as members of the Downtown Campus Association. So, you know, they definitely have been onboarded partners as part of this planning process. But we've heard a lot, during, you know, during our visioning, during, you know, all the engagement processes.

Whether it was downtown focused or citywide, we did hear a lot about downtown. It's certainly something that the community cherishes. There's definitely, I think, a recognition that this is an area that, is special, charming, warrants preservation, but also, an area where people, I think, do have a desire for for more growth. And, when people think about density and and additional housing and development, a lot of times, I think their focus is on downtown as being the appropriate place for that. But, again, still wanting to preserve that core.

We've heard some comments today about, production safety or or connections, and I think that's an important thing we're trying to address here. Open spaces, development of Civic Hub. And, definitely, we've we've heard a lot about the mill, and I think, you know, that's something we expect to hear much more about in this final stage of the community summit. And, you know, some of the feedback I think we have heard is, that the things that the plan does talk about, you know, it talks about, well, it it is an ambitious plan. It is visionary.

And I think, you know, you know, that's something that maybe we can talk we can extend towards the mill talking a little bit more about, you know, our our long range vision for what that could be while, again, focusing on the areas outside of the mill. So with that, I'll hop into what the organization and the plan is. It's separated into to eight different chapters, provides a high level introduction as well as background information on existing conditions, and then goes into an overall framework that includes land use concepts, parks concepts, open space concepts, transportation, infrastructure, and then implementation. Those last three, again, are still under development. So the introductory chapter talks about why we're planning for downtown now and how did we get here, and I think explains a little bit why why we're not meeting this as a redevelopment plan for the mill.

Part of the plan explains the history of the mill. There's a couple of pages that talk about, you know, its significance to Downtown Canvas. The fact that they have reduced operations but yet continue to operate. Since the draft plan was released, the mill has announced what they're calling their revitalization project, which, you know, is an interesting title because, you know, it both includes, you know, investment significant investment back into the mill, which I think shows, you know, a commitment to continued operations while also includes demolition of buildings, which is very much gonna change the landscape and, you know, create a perception at least that, you know, there is an opportunity for redevelopment in the near term. With that said, you know, the the plan is very clear that city, is committed to achieving an unrestricted cleanup level, which would allow the city at the appropriate time, whatever that might be, to come in and then perhaps do a more detailed sub area plan for that property where, you know, our options aren't limited to one use or another.

We can truly develop whatever plan is appropriate. But our intent, I think, is is focused on the the areas of downtown that we think are accessible, developable in a twenty year time frame, while also doing what we can to support the unrestricted cleanup and and build the neighborhood around the mill that itself is gonna place pressure on ecology to determine that it would I'm gonna shrink it clean up. So the existing conditions chapter then kinda talks about what we have today. There's some interesting market data about vacancy rates, visitation. I think what you'll see in there, the couple pages that talk about that is downtown has been doing very well.

Vacancy tends to be very low. Yeah. I feel like we've seen maybe a little bit of slowing in the past year or so where, you know, it's taken a little bit longer or some spaces to fill. We have a brand new mixed use building on 6th in Dallas. We have some ground level, space that has not yet been filled, but there has been interest.

You know, I think some of what you see with new construction buildings anywhere is they have higher lease rates. There's higher startup costs. And so and and also that location is just a block or two north of the ideal place where people wanna be, which is 4th Avenue. But we're hopeful that, you know, with that housing coming in, that'll present an opportunity to bring some more businesses. And they may be different businesses than what we're used to seeing here, but I think it's great that they'll provide an opportunity to expand our commercial footprint downtown.

But in any case, the existing conditions talks a lot about, you know, what's on the ground, the topography, the topographic constraints. Zoning, I wanna show this map on here because that red area is what we call the downtown commercial zone. And I think when people think of downtown or at least when when my staff thinks of downtown, we're we're often looking at the downtown commercial zone. Early on in this process, we we we're asking people, what is downtown? You know?

Where do you live? Do you live downtown? And and I think everyone's perception of what downtown is is varies. But this plan, I think, does expand the footprint and designates a specific area that we feel is downtown beyond that core. And I think that relates to this figure on the right, which shows the connectivity and basically rates it between poor and excellent.

And the only areas we have excellent connectivity really is within that downtown core. But as you leave that core, the connectivity gets pretty poor. Right? And and and what's unfortunate is the connectivity to the surrounding residential areas and neighborhoods around downtown isn't isn't great. But these are folks, I think, who would say they live downtown. Right? And so we want to make them feel more a part of it and have that better connectivity. And seeing how poor the conditions are today, I think, is a good motivator to to improve that and, again, through through land use, but also through transportation open space network to do a better job of that. So

Alan, do you wanna give us our question at the end, or as you speak, we ask questions?

I'd say feel free to ask questions as as we go.

So

Yes. Sorry. Thank you. For the connectivity, I was looking at it, and I was wondering when we say excellent versus fair or poor, what are the benchmark for determining that? Is it safety, accessibility, available sidewalk, trail. What does that make it excellent versus good? Or

Yeah. So, typically, we're using, I think, objective criteria, what the infrastructure looks like. I I can't say for sure what our consultant team did in in ranking this, whether it was it it wasn't based on any survey data. Right? But I again, I'm assuming it's based on on the infrastructure as well as, you know, the it's usually a combination of, you know, what the pedestrian or bicycle infrastructure is relative to, like, traffic counts and the nature of the the vehicular traffic.

And so you can see that 6th Avenue, for example, doesn't have bike infrastructure as a sidewalk that's right up against the curb and has four lanes of traffic. Right? That is not ideal connectivity. Whereas, within the downtown core, you have slower speeds, better and wider sidewalks. But even third Avenue is is is pretty good here.

I think as you cross 3rd Avenue, it maybe doesn't feel like it's good. But, again, I guess the short answer is I don't know exactly what went into, but those are some of the factors. So so the framework talks a little bit about the engagement process, what opportunities and constraints we have for the future of downtown Canvas. One of the things that is neat is it provides a day in the life snapshot for a resident. In this case, this is Canvas resident, Craig.

It talks about, I think, a Saturday where he's meeting up with a friend and and shows the various things and modes that you can get around downtown and do. I think that is one of the things that people do enjoy about downtown is is you can do more than one thing. Right? And and you can get in your car from the other side of town and get here, but you're able to navigate, by foot. And I think that's something that people enjoy, whether you're a resident or a visitor or employee.

And so, you know, part of the purpose of including that information is, you know, we're thinking about who who is using this. Certainly, our staff is using it and implementing what will eventually be our new zoning code for downtown. But we also think this is sort of an invitation for the development community to build the the the neighborhood and district we wanna see and also for visitors to understand, you know, what downtown is meant to be for them. But the most important part of, I think, the framework is the vision statement, which I won't read the entirety of it, but it basically is that char that our downtown is charming, vibrant, and walkable in the city's living room. I mentioned earlier the importance of this relative to the the overall plan.

The our, campus 2045 vision statement, talks about our community, our environment, our neighborhoods, and our downtown. And so these were, I think, sort of the foremost important things we've heard about early on in the process. And, you know, it wasn't intended necessarily that, you know, we'd have the same vision statement for downtown as the overall city, but it is a part of, I think, one of those four pillars of their overall campus vision statement. Again, reiterating the importance that this district has. The land use concept, this is where it starts to get more detailed.

This chapter talks about what, the future of downtown might look like, through new development, redevelopment. I'd say also preservation of what we have in value, including various types of residential and commercial and mixed use, and how we're able to do all that while reinforcing the importance of the 4th Avenue core. And so what we're proposing is to create four new downtown design land use designations, which would result in four new downtown zones. You'll see also, though, that we have included a portion of the mill. And, again, while, you know, the intent of the plan isn't to, you know, provide a a redevelopment plan for the mill, I think it does acknowledge that it is part of our downtown.

And so there's there's parts of the planet talk about, again, connectivity, transportation, infrastructure, even some of the design components, open space that do have implications to mill property. There's also mill properties that are going to be rezoned as part of this plan. For example, property East Of Division or Adams Street, is owned by Georgia Pacific. But in any case, you know, we're taking a couple existing zones and creating four. So I think the at the core of it all is what we're calling the historic Community Street Core, which is a a 10 block area between Adams And Franklin 3rd And 5th that is intended to still provide for mixed use redevelopment opportunities, but at a smaller scale preserving, again, that charm of of what people value along 4th Avenue.

But then surrounding that, we're proposing a couple mid rise and low rise zones where we do see a lot of redevelopment happening, particularly housing, but with ground level retail. There's also opportunity for people if they wanted to build, you know, multistory office buildings, that type of thing. And then moving east into the Aberceen Terrace neighborhood, that is a low density residential zone. We're bringing that into downtown, still maintaining it as a low density residential zone, but utilizing the changes that's adopted by council with middle housing and accessory dwelling units. I think this is a neighborhood that may very well see some more redevelopment with the addition of that kinda gentle density due to, you know, there's larger lot sizes there.

There may be some room for additional housing, and I think there's definitely demand for housing in that neighborhood. And to, you know, repeating what one of our commenters made earlier, you know, you've seen the property values where there are opportunities for owner occupancy near downtown. They've gone up tremendously over the past decade and in this neighborhood in particular. And so understanding that there is going to be demand for housing at lower densities as well, We are suggesting to bring this into the downtown plan. You'll see, kinda uniquely to this area, design guidelines that will affect what redevelopment looks like in this neighborhood to maintain what is very much a a single family residential type area.

Well, again, we're gonna get middle housing and and ADUs as

well.

So diving a little bit more into, you know, those five land use designations. You'll see here some of the key features of the historic Main Street core. One big change that we want to do is ensure that on ground levels, we have active retail storefronts. So that means prioritizing retail uses that bring in foot traffic where there's interest behind the glass windows on the ground level. And so that's kind of focusing on on on on shops, retail as opposed to office or institutional uses, that type of thing.

I wanna make sure that we're also maintaining historic character. And then, you know, before I move to the next few slides here, heavy industrial. So, you know, this is basically within the downtown area. It's the Canvas paper mill that that's all that's there. The zone today is it looks a lot like a mixed use zone.

In fact, if you compare it to our mixed use zones, it's very similar with the exception of residential. That's the one thing it's it's missing. So it allows industrial uses, obviously, but also allows commercial uses, recreational uses, educational uses. You could build a retail bakery in their parks, schools, that type of thing. And so we do think that the existing zoning itself does make a strong argument to, qualify for an unrestricted cleanup level.

While it is named heavy industrial, there's language in the the RCW and WAC that I think, provides you know, I think, in fact, requires ecology to to dive deep into the zoning code, into the use tables, and see the uses that are allowed there. What is missing, I think, that would make a stronger case for unrestricted cleanup is residential. And so the plan supports adding residential development to the heavy industrial zone. There's a number of ways that could be accomplished. Don't know exactly what the final version of the code might look like, but the intent would be that, at least within the footprint of the sub area, that residential would be added as, an allowable use in that heavy industrial zone.

And and I think we're very clear on why we're doing that. Our intent is to, achieve that that cleanup level.

That's a question. If you go back to the two slides, I think it is, to the that one there. As you're going up Garfield from Safeway and you get about halfway up on the right, it you so as you're going up, it's mixed use. And then there's makes sense because you're on either you know, on that main row on Garfield was kind of a heavier use road. And then it switches to the yell to the downtown residential. So they're kinda continuing you on both sides of our field

Right.

Being that little bit heavier. I don't know if that was purposeful. Or

Yeah. So I'll say this was actually drawn sort of independently of the existing zoning, but it that line matches what the existing zone is. And, really, what it does is follow the existing development pattern. We heard a strong desire to sort of respect that neighborhood as it is. But on the East Side Of Garfield, for those couple blocks North of 3rd, you have a church, you have a funeral home, you have some, you know, higher density buildings.

But it's also, you know, on a state highway, if there's a signal there. Right? So I think it makes sense to have opportunity for more intensive development on both sides.

So maybe it's a little bit of a compromise of grabbing a little bit on the East Side Of Garfield of the Yeah. Intensity, but not going too crazy.

Yeah. And then, again, it it happens to match what the zoning is. Got you. Alrighty.

Okay. Good question. Good

question. Yeah. Upper left hand corner of the mixed use, there's a number one that trapezoidal shape kind of against the heavy industrial, which on another map is added to a a new open space. So it is that north

Oh. Yeah. We're division. Most portion of the gray box.

Yeah. That's that's actually a footprint of a building that looks like the number one.

Really?

I was but now that I was ordering I was looking for a one, and then, like, and then I saw it.

That that building looks like a number one. That area is gonna it's a potential open space. What is what is that building now? I'm trying to

So that is that is part of the mill property. I I don't know the history of that specific building, but you're talking about property East Of Division Street.

That's right.

Yeah. Yeah. And that's, you know, one of those spots where there is actually some open space already. It's privately owned. But, you know, I think, again, we've we we have placed some vision on Mill Property as providing a gateway, providing an open space opportunity connection to the Millditch within that area.

Right. So that that level of, like, vision from Mill Property is, like, the seem like it's going in the right direction. Like, there's not nothing utilized currently for these demolition plan as part of the revitalization plan. Is that is this one of the sites where this gonna happen? Is that somewhere else? And is should there be

I don't oh, no. This that site is not included on any plans that we've seen. It's definitely not within the phase That's now. And and think the difference and and why we felt appropriate to to look at that is just because it's outside of the the heavy industrial zone. Today. It's part of the downtown commercial zone. But, you know, I think it's clear, you know, you can't imagine, you know, crossing sort of the arbitrary line of division or the zoning boundary and seeing how that might extend further west.

Yeah. Appreciate it. Thank you. So

then just wanna dive in a little bit more deep into the the different landings designations and and talk about how this might translate into implementation. So the historic Main Street core, again, primarily covers, 4th Avenue. This figure on the left shows, sort of a cross section of what that streetscape might look like. This shows two story buildings with a third story that is stepped back. So on that left side of the screen, you can see there's a little bit of a third story peeking through.

As we're working on zoning code and specific design guidelines, right now, we're looking at allowing a maximum of four stories, with that fourth story being set back 20 feet. The idea there is when you're standing on the ground level, you might only be able to see three stories, but there would be some additional capacity for a fourth story. Contemplating possibly that that step back area that could be an outdoor patio or rooftop patio type of thing being utilized. Right now, I think the tallest building we have on 3rd is the Canis Hotel at three stories. So but, you know, this is one of those things, you know, we're looking for feedback whether it's from you all tonight or through the public process on where are we at with these these height limitations.

I'll point out that there is no height limitation within the downtown commercial zone today. So where it might seem like we're allowing a lot of height, that's actually scaling it back from from the current condition. Yeah. These are photos of what development looks like downtown today. I think there there's no new images here. The intent is really about preservation. We're not prohibiting people from from doing redevelopment, making improvements, or even tearing down buildings. But I think there's the idea is that the zoning restructured in such a way that it really incentivizing. It incentivizes keeping what's there. But we do see an opportunity for streetscape improvements and sort of extending that 4th Avenue feeling elsewhere.

This image on the right side shows a potential improvement to to Dallas Street, which is contemplated as a linear park, include wider sidewalks, wider planting strips, narrower street cross travel lanes. We'll get more into that later. The next downtown district is the downtown mixed use mid rise zone. So you can see here this cross section shows a maximum of eight stories, which is, you know, is quite tall. That's, you know, about as tall as I think would make sense in this market.

We haven't seen anything like that anywhere in Canvas. But, you know, as you look up the hillside or even lower where there's views potentially of the Columbia River, Roshuga River, it would seem like, you know, a a developer might want to take advantage of that by by going higher. So if there is an openness to eight stories, you know, we feel like that would have to be outside of that main core. And so these images here show one downtown building, our project at Clara Flats, but the other images are representative of the type of architecture or or building design and scale that we might expect to see in that mid rise zone. Now there's a picture of a of a of a grocery store, so a more urban Safeway.

I think, you know, there's a possibility given the size of that property for redevelopment. The future has been redeveloped a few times already to maintain that, you know, grocery amenity, but also provide some additional density, maybe parking structure. So that's the type of use that, you know, would still be allowed, but the design guidelines would contemplate a a more urban form. And this streetscape image is of 5th Avenue and Bird Street showing how we would make similar improvements to to 5th Avenue, providing traffic calming, some more bicycle facilities, better crosswalks, and trees, again, sort of emulating what we have on 4th without, you know, doing a carbon copy of it. And you can see on the left side of your screen where you do have lower building heights, two, three stories, and on the right side, higher buildings.

And that's sort of what that would look like. And then the downtown mixed use low rise zone, this is primarily located South of 3rd Avenue. This would be up to four story buildings, and I think, you know, these are all example images showing a lot of middle housing, row house type development, two to three, four story range. That image here of 2nd Avenue and Evertree, I think, shows a neighborhood in transition. I think this is what we would expect to see is a mix of density, a mix of development types, a lot of retention of existing single family that might be refurbished or improved, maybe include additional middle housing, but where you might also see some redevelopment, row houses, that type of thing.

And so I think the intent is that this is still primarily a residential area, but it is a mixed use zone. We would expect to see more of sort of those cottage industries, you know, occupying existing homes, perhaps some live work units, that type of thing. But this would feel more like an extension of downtown than it does today while still remaining primarily residential. And, again, I think those height limitations is is what would maintain that residential.

Can you go back to the I think it's one slide, maybe the downtown mixed use mid rise? Yeah. Where can you give me an idea of where downtown that would I don't know if you have to go back to a few slides, but where does that would that these midrises Yeah. So Targeted.

It encircles the downtown core. Right? So North Of 5th, South Of 3rd. So all that that gray All that, yeah, that, yeah, kinda gray OB color.

So in in the slides we have in our packet, it talks about, like, typically ranging three to five stories. You mentioned eight stories?

Yes. So that is what we're currently looking at with the, the zoning code. And that says that in is that was that in the draft plan? Or That's I don't think we'll

catch on page 50 well, there's two different page numbers here. There's a 52 and a 46. Okay. There's no mention of of, you know, like, what and maybe it wasn't intended to be here, but, know, eight stores. Okay. That definitely catches my attention. You know, eight stories is getting, you know, to dwarf around downtown. I mean, I get it. We have to think about densities in the long run, but definitely that weren't feel to me like that warrants some thought of would we want and not that everybody's gonna go

and build

a story building through that through every gray block. But if you imagine that that was Yeah. That that's a lot of shadow. Anyway, that's just my

Yeah. No. You're you're yeah. I I found that, and that is that's an area of, you know, inconsistency with, you know, the draft from six months ago and where our code is currently being developed. I will say we've consistently heard feedback around around the eight story idea. Okay. And, you know, I I think there's a desire to sort of be open minded and say, hey. Well, if that comes in the right place, that might make sense. But now is when I wanna, you know, patch that for sure. Most construction we would see expect to see would be the five over one construction style.

Anything above that does sort of start to get cost prohibitive. That's just talking about construction costs. The major factor that the plan doesn't really go a lot into, but that will impact height is parking. So the higher you go, the more parking that's gonna be required based on whether it's unit count or commercial use, that type of thing. And so, you know, construction costs and the parking requirement, those right now is worth that.

Right? So the question is if someone could pull it off, would we want them to? And if not, then we we ought to, you know, figure out what that that comfort level is. So the plan I think those images, I think that's that's a very good comment because they demonstrate buildings that are sort of in that four to five story range rather than than higher than that. Right?

Well, first of all, I wanna say lots of great information and graphics during the report. I I was really appreciated and impressed by all information, graphics, parts. It was great. So one thing I was hoping to get the information was the street cross sections for each, like, dental core versus the surrounding. That, you said that it's, under work? Because that really answer a lot of other question I have. Are we providing wider sidewalk than what we have today that allows for furniture? So

Yeah.

Outdoor dining. And, we have such

Okay. Yeah. I can I can touch on that a little bit when we get to those those chapters? I I don't have a lot to talk about relative to that, but, you know, they'll give me something to talk about. We talked about mid rise zone. And then downtown residential here. So this is the Evergreen Terrace neighborhood. Typically, just single family residential where we have a 35 foot height limit throughout campus. And you can see here, redevelopment would still maintain a single family residential type appearance. There's nothing that would prohibit more modern drawings or anything like that.

I think where we do see improvements perhaps would be with the streetscape. So this is an area where we do have very wide streets, not always great sidewalks, but or even, you know, street trees. And so there is an opportunity to, convert, you know, that that wide pavement into a more pedestrian friendly corridor with, wider sidewalks, park ships, more street trees. Street trees obviously provide a lot of aesthetic benefit, environmental benefit, shade. It also would reduce, you know, storm water needs, right, by reducing some of that pavement.

And so that is one of the ways that we could, you know, aesthetically improve the infrastructure there. I think a key component to the success of that is getting down into the details of of how do you get across Garfield Street, to this neighborhood.

Yeah. One other

thing I wanna add, I don't have enough information to share, but when it comes to mid rise or high rise, the type of trees we can plant, needs to be checked. Not all trees can handle their lots of shade because those rice midrites cause a lot of shades. So that may come with some tree selection that can

Yeah.

Good. To consider.

Oh, absolutely. Good comment. And I think one that, you know, could be addressed case by case, right, when we have a building that does come in, making sure that we have the right tree types and also that we're not compromising whatever is existing already. So I'm gonna move on to the open space network. And this is, I think, a a really exciting improvement that is proposed to the plan. I think our downtown, you know, it it it's obviously a beautiful downtown. It's a great place to gather. It is very unique in a sense that there isn't really a proper downtown park. Right? Not even a pocket park.

I don't know the history of why why that never occurred here, but we've done very well with what we have. And in fact, it's it's created, you know, the need for, you know, the street festivals that we do have. And so, you know, that maybe has been a benefit, but I do think as more people come down as those events grow, there's clearly been identified a shortage of of open space and connections to the open spaces that we do have. And I think some have been underutilized, and so this presents an opportunity to improve those connections, better utilize the spaces we do have, and add some new space. And so there is a plan here for a connected network of open space.

And and really what it does, you know, one way of looking at it is it connects downtown to the parks that are close by. Crown Park, obviously, is the place that people sort of identify best with downtown. It's a bit of a steep climb to get there, although it's, you know, not that far away. And then Louis Block Park is very close by. We don't think of that often as a downtown park, and part of that is just because of the poor connection across 3rd Avenue.

And so in order to utilize those spaces better, make them feel more like a part of downtown and as our downtown parks, We're proposing to improve connections to them. The the kind of central feature of of those improvements is what we're calling the Dallas Street Linear Park, which would extend from 2nd Avenue basically up to the Mill Ditch, is providing some improvements that streetscape. And it's not just wider sidewalks. It's actually creating more kind of small park spaces and activities along that corridor, providing some, you know, signage entry monuments. But you can see there's areas where you might have a wider park strip with a meandering sidewalk that might have park benches, maybe some sculptures.

I could even see some small play structures or, you know, educational items that might be appealing to kids who, you know, might need a break as they're climbing up that hill on Dallas. Right? But this is a street that that's right through our downtown. We'll continue to have additional traffic on it, but there's an opportunity to to make it safer and to build a better, stronger connection to our downtown parks, Crown Park, and we Block Park. Another important feature of the plan, and and this is one I think that we've gotten the most positive reception to is the idea of a downtown Civic Plaza, which would occupy the space we're sitting in right now.

This would, you know, I I think achieve two things. First, it would create a better defined Festival Street on 4th Avenue between Dallas and Franklin. The intent would be to still keep it open to vehicular traffic as it is today. Generally, there's lower traffic counts on this part of the road, but build build it out so that when it is closed, it can be closed more quickly, more easily, and more easily converted into a festival street. And so you can achieve that through different pavement materials, through different lighting, through maybe having a a curbless street cross section, having, you know, bollards that are in place that can be easily pulled out or placed in.

So that's something that, you know, makes a lot of sense for for farmers markets, for example, for those weekly events where it's a lot of effort to to set up and break down. The second thing is that it actually would create additional open space, you know, about a half acre open space here, in front of City Hall, which, you know, it could be a a plaza that's paved. It could be a a lawn area. We've heard a lot of interest on, hey. This would be a place to have a Christmas tree that's permanently there, and would be maybe more appropriate appropriately sized for the attendance we get at that, you know, hometown holidays event.

So I think there's a lot of excitement around what that could be and what that could create, and, the plan pushes us in that direction. The other thing it does, and this is where,

you know,

we get into implementation and timing and and, you know, budget is, this requires, rebuilding city hall. Right? And, you know, I think the only plan that that does make sense is to have a city hall with underground parking that allows you to recapture some open space downtown and really create your first downtown park space. The fire station, really, I think, is phase one of this project. It does provide an edge, to that plaza.

And I think once that's created, you know, it'll be the right time to start having that conversation about how do we implement this and and make this this plan happen. Definitely, I think we wanna build some momentum momentum towards that, if not achieve it within, you know, that twenty year time frame.

Question. Yeah. Maybe maybe three three questions. That's all related. Right? The pocket park downtown sounds fantastic. Underground parking makes a ton of sense. The connectivity issue, I think that two slides ago, we were looking at improving 6th Street by or those wide streets going down to our East. Yes. If we you shrunk the 6th Street Boulevard down to a more moderate sized street, you have another linear park essentially.

Because, right, it it's untrained. It's it's flat. It's wide. There's tons of room, and it would be a lot easier than walking up Dallas, which I think is a fantastic idea. So you get, like, basically, two perpendicular route. And the comment earlier about the city steps not being included, they're just adjacent to Dallas Street. Mhmm. Those to go up because they're a little less of a push. You get on, and you're at the top. So it'd be cool to add that into the plane because they're already there unless there's a concern about their maintenance or something that I'm unaware of. But there's, like, a free connection on sixth, which we're

Yeah.

Already discussing. So that should be added to this adding in the city steps if they can be.

Yeah.

No. Yeah. And that's and that's and and and, no, that's a great comment. And, you know, all this is the kind of stuff we are we're looking for, whether it's from you or from the public. And I think, you know, you can think further than that, the connection to the cemetery, you know, connection to, the Lackamas Creek Trailhead without having to cross third, for example.

Right? And so there's there's, yeah, definitely a lot of opportunities within this plan. So here, I wanna address, you know, Matt's questions. So there's three other chapters. Transportation is going to talk about, you know, effects on the transportation network as well as improvements to it, infrastructure, which, you know, obviously, we're talking about water and sewer, but also transportation infrastructure as well as other public amenities and infrastructure.

Then implementation, this is where we get into the detail of so how are we gonna act on this? And I I don't think this plan is going to show you, you know, what the cross section of 5th Avenue is gonna look like specifically, what the cross ings along 3rd or Garfield or Dallas are gonna look like. Specifically, it's a conceptual planned implementation is going to be where we would say, k. We're going to come up with a project to revitalize Northeast 5th Avenue, and there will be a budget to design and construct that. It may be that there is a plan to just do intersection improvements and specific connections or to build upon some of the work that we've done already with downtown's trees.

And so that's where again, based on what we're hearing now, that's gonna be one of the final things we do is put together some implementation actions. And I think that's something we'll bring back to this group and want some feedback from the public on helping prioritize that, but that's going to lead to future capital projects. It also will help us, though, have actions that as new buildings come in and they're rebuilding, you know, our infrastructure that they can start to implement piecemeal parts of that plan. So, I know, you know, there's a lot of people that are very hungry for that detail. You know, the DCA folks that are working with us, you know, wanna see that as well.

We need to make sure that the plan is well flushed out before we start, you know, spending effort on that. But, yeah, I think some of that detail is is gonna be future projects.

Makes sense. What I suggest is, we're under existing condition section chapter. We add couple more graphics showing existing water sewer storm system. At least this give us good perspective Yeah. Of where we have heavy utility versus no utility. That that helps. Yeah. Or even other private providers like gas or. You know, it becomes very expensive when there are lots of utility under ground versus not that many. So it makes a difference for planning. Yeah. At least I suggest adding that to existing.

No. That's a good point. I you know, my assumption is some of that would go into the infrastructure section, but I think bringing it to the forefront is also important. And, you know, as we've worked on this fire station project, you know, we're realizing, you know, the the implications of the aging infrastructure and overhead power lines and things like that. And, you know, I think, obviously, there's desire to to underground some of that.

The cost is absolutely tremendous to do that, and it's something that just we found out it's not gonna be feasible to be done for individual projects. That's that's a bigger investment and, you know, something that we definitely need to contemplate as we think about, you know, the the Dallas Street Linear Park and that type of thing. How do overhead power lines perhaps impact that or doing something that on 5th? So I'm

not

gonna go into all the goals or all the policies, but we do have six goals that are developed specific to the downtown plan. The first one is architecture and design. The intent of this goal is to retain downtown's historic character and expand its charm. And so we're working to do this by creating an objective zoning standards and design guidelines. Those will benefit, obviously, the historic Main Street core, but, other parts of downtown.

We also recognize that some of the aesthetic improvements are gonna be the responsibility of the city within right of way, whether it's landscaping or lighting treatments, that type of thing. Downtown housing, the purpose of this goal is to incentivize a range of housing options that welcome more people to live downtown. And what we're really trying to achieve is a range of housing types, and we have a range downtown, and I think people enjoy that range. We also wanna make sure that there's both rental and ownership options within the downtown area. We know that there's a lot of people that wanna rent here, that wanna buy here, and there's not a lot of buying options.

I think the middle housing and ADU laws will provide some more opportunity. We also wanna make sure that, you know, if folks wanna build townhomes or condos that that is supported through the plan. There's also, again, like I mentioned, gonna be some design standards that apply to downtown housing, whether it's, you know, in Evergreen Terrace or down which are they called? Urban amenities provide the right mix of development services and open spaces that support ways for people to live, work, and play downtown. So one of the ways we do that is through improvements to, you know, the city amenities, public amenities, urban spaces, which include, you know, the the new plaza, streetscape improvements, pocket parks, that type of thing, requiring ground floor uses to be active ground floor uses.

That's something that we're fine tuning through the development of the zoning code. This is, you know, zeroing in on what is know, what are those active ground floor uses that we wanna make sure we're achieving, you know, on those primary street frontages like 4th Avenue, Birch, Cedar, and so forth. There's also a goal in or a policy in here to create a parklet program, and this is one topic that, you know, we've had a lot of interest in, and we've seen, you know, opinions for or against the idea of a parklet program. Had a little bit of a conversation with counsel about that last night. You know, I think one question is, is is this an appropriate goal or not?

And if so, you know, what does a program look like? So we're meeting with our parking advisory committee next month to talk about what a program could be, what the various ranges might look like with in a program. So a program could be, you know, we're going all in on Parklets. You can do it year round, sort of like what you see in Portland. Maybe it's something that's seasonal just in the summer months, or maybe it is just what we've been doing for the past three years, which is, you know, there are limited pop up events.

If someone wants to do it for a weekend or one evening or something, we have a system based to allow you to to do that. And so I think that's, you know, that's what we mean by program. It it could be, you know, anywhere on the high, medium, or low part of the spectrum. But that desire for Parkland is related, I think, to the interest in in spending time outdoors, having outdoor dining, which, we recognize can be achieved in in in many different ways. So Parklands are one way to do it.

We've also have outdoor dining, in our current sidewalk patios that are, on public property but privately owned and maintained. So you think of, you know, Cafe Piccolo or, gosh, backpacker, pizza, Cameo's, caps and caps, they all have that. We also have public spaces like that new, seating area in front of canvas antiques. You know, there's benches that people sit on and eat at. And so there's a number of ways to achieve that.

You could also have, like, what, Grains of Raft provides, which is a privately owned patio. And so, Parkwoods don't have to be the only solution or even part of the solution. And so, again, that's something that I think we're gonna try to fine tune, between now and adoption, while also thinking about how we implement a long term program for not just Parklands, but, you know, how do we use that sidewalk space, and are we using it appropriately? We definitely wanna, you know, allow businesses to have that flexibility to have that outdoor drying, but we also need to preserve, you know, accessibility and and open and safe sidewalks.

Make a comment on

that? Sure.

I think this is a really important area. I area to explore more if we're work working toward a more pedestrian friendly downtown area, less cars and parking and more places to sit and be and walk is the only way to achieve it. Park lists seem like a great idea. More real dining outside slows traffic down, keeps cars away, gives businesses more income. Just altogether seems like a win win win, except you can't park right in front of the business you wanna go.

Right.

So as problems go, I guess, that seems like one small loss for a lot of gain.

Yeah. I'd 'd advocate for that.

And I think, you know, we we've heard again, we've heard both sides. We've heard that argument. We were just concerned. So, hey. It's it's parking. Right? And I think, you know, we'd wanna make sure that no matter what we do, we're setting reasonable expectations and also limitations on on how extensive a program can go. And, you know, I think we wouldn't want every single parking space to be occupied by a private use today. And it may not be dining in all cases. Right?

And so how can we set parameters that are fair, equitable, but also, you know, do a lot of the businesses that wanna do it to do it? And so that's something we'll be looking into, and it it I'm not sure where we're headed, but we're having that conversation right now. Economic development. This goal talks about encouraging development and redevelopment to expand opportunities downtown for retail, office, and residential. This talks about, you know, providing code procedures and use allowances to support development and increase flexibility, partnerships with the DCA, the Chamber of Commerce,

and other

organizations providing, you know, the infrastructure improvements that'll make downtown a more attractive place to be. It also talks about actively participating with ecology in that, you know, process. So I think that's one additional place that we again, we do we do talk about the mill. Civic Life. Expand on civic life and services downtown through strategic use of city owned property and vibrant community events.

So this really just talks about maintaining the ability to have those events. I think one of the things we see is there's just a need there's a demand for downtown event space. You know, we we're having to turn down permits or, you know, limit the scope of permits for events downtown because we we can't have our street closed all the time. Right? But people still wanna be here.

And so, you know, can we provide more spaces, better spaces? And, one of the ways I think that we can do that is through developing that civic hub. But the first policy in this section is an important one, and this is already in our existing planning documents, but something that, you know, we've we've heard a little bit about over the past few years as we think about our needs for a future city hall. Ensuring that city hall remains downtown, I think that is an important part of what makes, you know, downtown special and accessible and brings people here. And so we wanna ensure that city hall and primary services like the library fire police stay downtown or close to it.

And then multimodal connectivity, create a safe and connected transportation network that makes downtown walkable, bikeable. You know, we've talked about this a lot. It's very important to the success of downtown is keeping it safe, making it more safe, and and, you know, expanding the areas that where people feel safe. I think there's a lot of comfort when you're on 4th, but that very quickly changes as you're trying to get across 5th or 3rd even. Right?

So we wanna make sure that that feeling of safety and pedestrian comfort, expands and allows more people to to walk here and and bike here. So, that's that's a quick rundown of of the plan. I think you covered most of it. We do wanna come back next year and talk more about the transportation infrastructure and implementation sections. I think that's where there's gonna have to be some more feedback on some of the policy choices and and projects that we wanna target there.

But, next steps is we're gonna wrap up community summit number three at the end of next week. So, again, we're in the middle of the three week window to get feedback on the downtown plan. We have a survey on there where, people can learn high level information about the plan and respond to specific questions about some implementation strategies, goals, policies, that type of thing, there's also an opportunity for people to provide open ended feedback. So as as generic or as detailed as folks wanna be, we're looking for feedback on the plan, and our hope is to take all that feedback from this three week window as well as the past couple of months and come up with new drafts of plans that will be complete, that will feel a little bit more polished, you know, February, March time frame of next year, hopefully. That'll also allow us to get past the county's process where they should be, selecting a preferred land use alternative in February.

And so, that will allow, us to do get more modeling of infrastructure and transportation needs before then. So, again, thank you. I'm open to any last comments.

Yeah. Can we just go back real quick to Civic Life? A couple Yeah. Because I love the Civic Hub concept, this idea of more green space here and creating the Civic Plaza and supporting community events and adding that flexibility and creating opportunities for more sure. All that language, it's great.

But my mind kinda goes to so if down the road we are building a new city hall, so that would be a big investment in the community. It could also be another opportunity to get creative. I mean, there's all kinds of ways that you can approach a city hall building with office spaces on the top floors and then other more flexible uses on the ground floors. And you can imagine things like, you know, some shared some some community spaces, some spaces that maybe during the day are where you have your pre app conferences, but during the night, it can serve as an ex just another space. I know those are always in demand demand in all of our community spaces where people can gather or have events.

And that feels congruent with what's being said here, but it's not explicit. I'm, like Yeah. More to it. But this also might be an opportunity to plant a seed of thinking about when we do get there and we're building a new city hall, let's make sure we take full advantage of that. And and that can be pretty exciting when you're thinking about this whole, you know, civic hub across from the library and the most squeeze the most stuff. Yeah.

Yeah. No. Great comment and feedback. The the plaza or city hall, it's not yet a project. Right? And it it is still conceptual at this phase. But, you know, as I said at the very beginning, you know, this provides us an opportunity to give it a little more detail at a comprehensive planning level or a conceptual planning level than you'd see in a citywide plan. You know, I think, you know, we we've thought about some of those things already. Right? We don't have a lot of meeting space in this community whatsoever.

It is very difficult to find meeting space even for us wanting to do public meetings, but we've heard it from other groups. You know, ECA just, you know, had their, awards banquet, last week and had a hard time finding a space to have that event. So I think we envision that definitely more meeting space that's not just for us, but available for the community. We also looked at other models like, you know, could you do a mixed use building? Could you do a private public partnership where, you know, there there is some commercial space that provide some some revenue, but also helps fund a building up front?

And so I I think there's an opportunity here to, without getting too specific on a project, to talk about evaluating alternatives to to move up the timeline to make it more feasible, more reasonable, and build a package that, you know, would be supported by the community. You know, this is it would be their building and their plaza certainly. And so, definitely wanna make sure they're part of the process, but I think there is there is a way to, be more specific here. Appreciate that.

Yeah. Why did we look at two scenarios? Sounds like, we all like I mean, is a great idea to have and we need it. But the report suggests scenario two, which has a lot of, surface parking and fiber storage sitting home. That have a, some advantage to that?

So the the way that, so those are presented as trying to remember the terminology there. But, basically, they're they're case studies on development feasibility. So we also looked at private projects and what might be feasible, and that was intended to help us, you know, build that land use concept and see what, you know, what the development community could support. Obviously, you know, a surface parking lot is going to be less expensive. Right?

But I think seeing them side by side shows, you know, how much you lose by saving on that upfront cost. Right? You're committed to surface parking. You're committed to not having that plaza. And so it's presenting the yeah. We've considered alternatives. Right? Both of those, I think, are are are valid and and ought to be included. But, you know, the ambition is to do the right project. Just a matter of of how and when we we achieve that.

Thank you.

Thank you, Alan. Reason for making Thank you. Let's see. Next, we have miscellaneous updates.

Sure. So just a couple. Tyler mentioned earlier, council adopted an ordinance, yesterday evening, '25, o two '5, which, adopts, the annual code updates, but specifically the ADU and middle housing policies, from the state. So very happy to say that that went through as recommended by the planning commission. It's taken a lot of work over the past couple of years to put that together in the planning commission.

Think it's really been an important and central part of moving that conversation forward. You know, I think as, you know, we learned about 11/10 and 1337 back in 2023, There was a little bit of surprise and, you know, certainty about how we were gonna respond to that. But I think the planning commission helped bring the community on board and and council on board, and so there was, you know, unanimous support of where we've headed. I think we've also had a lot of support from from people in public comments and the development community addressing the need of those changes. And so I'm happy to say that we've that.

It'll go into effect by deadline of December 31. Met with some colleagues earlier today in in Clark County. Not all of them have been able to do that, but unfortunate that we have here through your help. So that's an exciting thing that we're moving forward. There's also improvements to permit cross processing across the board. So some changes to permit timelines as well that you all were able to weigh in on. Secondly, did wanna thank Mazda for her service on the planning commission. Mazda has been a commissioner for the past five years. Only gotten to work with you for for three of those, but we're moving on to city council. So it'll be so part of the organization will be able to to work with you. So I wanna thank you for that.

My pleasure. Siren here along with others. It's a great team here. Now I'm gonna miss this team, but we'll be checking. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

And then last night, counsel approved the mayor's appointments. So Joe Keller, who is a longtime campus resident and currently serves on the parking advisory committee, I think he served on that committee for five years, will be joining the planning commission of twenty twenty six. Not sure yet if we have a meeting in January, but we'll let you know as soon as

we Okay. If if we do have a meeting in January, it'd be on Wednesday, the twenty first since Monday is the holiday.

Oh, yeah.

Sounds about right. We can get shifted. Try. Yeah.

Actually, it'll be on the twentieth, that Tuesday.

It'll still be on a Tuesday? Yes. Okay.

Gotcha.

Alright. Well, with that, it is, 08:22, and we will close the meeting. Thank you.