Zoning Board of Appeals - Regular Meeting

Anybody present that would like to speak on any of these matters, you're welcome to do so. When we get to that, I would speak loudly. you've uh put your name uh your address and and what agenda item or address that you're speaking on and we'll move those who are here in person off the agenda. What uh what address are you

at? Okay. So, we've got here uh we've got uh 37 Madison, we've got 28 Maine, 18 and a half south, and 26. All right, go. I will just call start. We'll go with number two.

Number two. Change that. And right there. So that would be you. Chris Anderson want to come up there.

Yeah. if you want to come up and you're tell welcome everybody to the uh July 28th 25 meeting of the city of Portland's own board of appeals to start delay but we are going to call read to order here at 957 uh first item on the agenda is uh we're going to change things around the second item on our agenda is number one that is 37 Madison Street and area variance. Chris Anderson seeks variances to extend the driveway toward north property line, increase parking capacity from two to three vehicles. We have here anything else you need to talk about with it. Uh and boy has documents and everything like that as well. No, I think I'm well set. I mean, it's be improvement to the the property that's non-compliant right now. County recommended to resurface the whole the remainder of the driveway which defined if you county has reviewed and sent attached letters or attached to this one if I can find that exact one that I can bear with me a the county's recommendations. Uh, we got the pack inside of this packet. the the

county stuff. The county packet should be in this packet. I have a copy to make your county letter.

Yeah, we'll add it here. Oh, that's really bad. And you've you've reviewed the letter and you're aware that specifically uh address several recommendations pretty specific recommendations considered in um and and I'll go over those real quickly that u uh benefit of the applicant. This group shall take into consideration benefit the uh we do that with everybody. So that's not we're going

into any further the city determined uh existing family residence qualifies as a legal noninforming establishment for the adoption of current solving information. You had had it for a long time.

No, I bought it a year and a half year and a half. Prior owner had it for quite a while. Quite a while. Okay, that's something we see quite a bit. Then number three, the applicant considering the existing driveway addition the proposed expansion. Uh and then lastly, the city determine whe the proposed expansion is manifestally arranged or designed for such use. Um I think that's kind of self explained itself for us. The main question to determine is conformity of this resonance. So I think we got everything we need to hear from you. We're going to discuss with Roy ourselves here some of the diagnosforming

y use. Yeah. So I mean I don't see it as a huge expansion. Yeah. I do see it as a way to prevent parking on the lawn. Also to prevent I in lie of it being a so he's creating more parking. He's actually making it more conforming. Even though it's even though that there's a bunch of area variances y that that required to do this. Yeah. I I still think I mean it's a it's been a two family forever and by adding adding one parking spot to prevent to prevent from not only prevent people from parking on the lawn blocking the sidewalk and from uh stacking.

Yep. So I think based on all that one vehicle I think it and and the fact that he's fixing the other driveway too which is kind of a mess. Yeah, I think it's I think it's better for the neighborhood in Milwaukee parking area. It was not uh as as well fixed up as it should be. So I think that's something that could be avoided by fix and and most of the nonconformities that are pre-existing nonformities. It's not

the nonconformities. I mean there's a couple there that are being created by the work. Yeah. But the majority of are all pre-existing non conformities that we just fixed because we can't. Yeah. Okay. All right. Anybody else on board here any questions about what I think? Looks good. Pretty straightforward. No frequent questions. All right. All right. I'm going to make a motion to close the public hearing motion and uh and then a second. A second. Second's been made. All in favor signify by saying I.

I. Uh the following test could you be considered by the zoning board appeals to determine whether the variance determine the variance weighing the granting or denial of the area or what whether an undesirable change produced in the character of the neighborhood or a detriment to nearby properties will be created by the branding of the area. looking at the areas and photos knowing the area I would I would have to go with no on that what are the benefits sought by the applicant can be achieved by some feasible for the applicant to pursue other than an area acquisition history and uh prior ownership well nonconformities this is his best method to try to bring at least a lot of that property client so Um I I again I would say no to that one and u whe the requested area variance is substantial here in Hawaii.

So if you look at it I mean in this case given given the lot size you guys can do it if you want to. No I should look at it based on the use and the number of variances he's going to need to pull this off. Yeah. Um I don't define substantial. You know what I'm saying? So just think about that. Yeah. But, you know, especially the specific requirements that, you know, we're going to that I'm thinking that I'm going to incorporate into any uh, you know, we've got four pretty well identified, two of which I think are definitely almost word for word. So requires some of these things put into into a grant of of area.

Just want you to look at the list before you make that decision whether that's

No, I got a lot going on there. So good. I'm going to say yes on that one. I think based on some of the things that are being proposed to be multiple plural usually there's been some degree uh whether the proposed variance will have an adverse effect or impact the physical environmental conditions the neighborhood district again I think no that and uh whether the difficulty was self created which consideration shall be relevant to the decision of the board but shall not necessarily including granting of the area. Uh I think yes this is a self issue not withstanding the purchase of the property nonconformity uh but is in order to approve it often times property owners face these situations. So Oh yeah. So Andy, we have no no yes, no yes. I have questions. I'm proposing use some of this language. Uh that I'm less concerned about number one that recommendation. I don't know whether to we do that every time. Anyways, we have one of our questions, one of our standard questions really addressed at first. uh recommendation of the county stad um and the city determine whether existing use family residence qualifies for I think that's that's something that we

that's pre-existing for um I think we can forget about you don't really need to press that and then it's going to stay that way uh so also keep in mind that that use in that area is typical for that area. Yes, it is an R1, but really if you look at it's more of an R3 multiuse residential area.

It's been so evolved to that evolved whatever you want to call it to that point. Uh but I do want to point out require that in granting various that we u uh want to require repairing the existing driveway and proposed expansion and we do that by by the date that specified we should we've been giving as much as the now we're in yes I think that's renewal

yeah paid everything I think that's a good good way to look at it just pointed out that given period yeah and curve Yeah. Yeah. All right. And then I don't manifest the range for design for say she's driving the driver. So uh I'll propose that uh we grant the variances as identified application. Yeah. Just want to make sure that that side exit there. Yeah,

that leaves some entrance that the vehicles don't park right up against it to prevent people getting out in case. So, but they leave ample room there too. Yep. For the aggressive people.

Yeah. So, that's two. Yeah, there's two entrances there. there wanted that. All right, I'll specifically add go back and let me move that the uh application for variances are granted on 37 Madison subject to uh the applicant being required to repair the existing driveway. Uh at the same time that the expansion is approved and that all access points be uh um be u free from any any parking any vehicles to block any traffic from out of that that area. I think that's motion made second by Jake and then all in favor by saying I

I motion carries.

All right, just be clear on that. So subject to the applicant preparing this drawing assistant drive in addition to the proposed expansion. Uh and then let me add to September 30, 2026. That's two two seasons. I think he was and how you want to word the uh part about the not blocking the access uh It shall take uh

should leave a minimum of 36 in from the front of the vehicle to the uchess. Okay, that that's that's more specific than I would get, but I think that's that's good. He can handle that 36 in from

that minimum of 36 in. Just need a clear path to the north public access structure.

Oh, it does. Yeah, among the existing driveway addition post expansion don't add in there will cause adequate curve cut. All right. I think we're going to go. Chris, please stop in sometime tomorrow. Thank you. Welcome to Washington.

What would Main Street see here? Yeah. So, let's go to 28 Maine. All right. Next agenda item. We're moving to agenda three now two. That's 28 Main Street. An area variance. Chris Berkeley seeks a variance to install facade sign and seating the allowable square footage business called Sundown Sundown downtown clubhouse. You have any anybody to speak on that?

Chris is here and tell us anything you need to at all. Uh so originally we went through the historical and architectural review committee last year and uh deal with planning review for the facade received approval with tenative uh plans for the signage. Once we finalized our logo um earlier this year, we went back in front of the architectural and historical review committee at the most recent meeting received unanimous approval. The signage is designed um very much inspired by the previous signage of the building from Swollen's office outfitters. It's actually slightly smaller than the footprint uh that the Mullen sign took up, but it's essentially the same headline of Sund Dog where the Mullen sign was and then Office Outfitters was in smaller font below that. That's where we had uh the lettering for downtown clubhouse.

Okay. Um primarily it I'm happy to answer. It's not in a window that No, it's there's no windows on the upper second story of the building. Um and there wasn't previously. We basically just uprooted the previous design of the MS building. Just trying to stay in the spirit of that. So there's no windows in the front. Just on the first floor. There never were on the second floor. Yeah. On the Orchard Street side. There are windows on the second floor. There was never any windows on. So there's just mine went to be somewhere else. Oh, okay. Where she escaped the restroom or the apartment upstairs? Yes, there are. way here. So, don't pay any attention.

I don't know if everybody's looked at it. Uh, this is something that was part of many different building and what have you be. I was a little surprised that it was considered historic. It's but it's it's within the district. So everything's everything's for the historic district design guidelines are applicable even if they even if the building's not

right thanks for your info provided go from there so as I stated earlier it's it's a pretty simple thing the a total square foot is assigned exceeds the linear square footage in the front of the building. Yeah. The wall the wall sign portion and essential business says says the total square foot the sign cannot exceed the linear square foot. Okay.

And which it does. So that's why it's requested. From what I feel, it doesn't seem like it's substantial issue. Uh we do a lot of these downtown. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that as you change from a from a what was it a stationary or auto supply outfit now something kind of differently you're going to find those truthfully it's more important that I got the historical committee lesson. I agree.

Yeah. And I think they I think they look at not not to pick on the building or anything. They look at the same way that I was thinking that it's it's but it's facade is less concerning. So uh than it would be safe or the community restaurant building or something has more architectural signatures plus you know bar you know all different architecture styles down there. Has anybody else had any questions on board before I close the public hearing? Hearing none. Look for a motion to close the public hearing. Motion made by J. I'll second. All in favor signify by saying I public hearings close. with questions. The following test be considered by the board of appeals to determine its grant weighing the granting or denial of the area bearings request. Number one, whether undesirable change will be produced character of neighborhood or to nearby properties will be created by the granting of the area variance. uh if that's the historical commission is the goal but whether the benefits sought by the uh can be achieved by some kind of feasible for the to other than an area variance no requested area variance is substantial thinking no on that one I was shooting them off here because of of it seems like We're all in agreement whether the proposed variance will have an adverse effect or impact on the physical environmental conditions in the neighborhood or district GB. No, I really don't think so. I don't think we're going to see the tasteful designs in some of our buildings down there. Whether the alleged difficulty was self

creating this consideration shall decision of the board that shall not necessarily include the granting of the area variance and I think that's a yes. So u entertain a motion. So just yes on the final. Yes for those entertain a motion on granting area variance uh as as described in the application. And uh and we have a second and uh from Jake and all in favor signify by saying none. I

I that motion is and uh good. All right.

So you Chris, I can I can give this to you right now. There's no concert. Uh, next on the agenda, I'll stand there and just say it's approved. There's no additions or moving to number four. I'll take that. Congratulations.

Yep. Thanks for coming in. Uh Andy, are we down now to Let's go to eight. South. Uh agenda item number three 8 and a half south a variance experiences for the purpose of subdividing property two lots and an 8 and a half to 10 and a half style badge. You had probably here uh I want to say you were here two years ago maybe. Approximately three years ago. And what did we table it or?

No, not enough for this. It was for another 34 was for big project. Yeah.

Okay. Okay. That was right. I saw I saw salt. It was on South. Sorry about that. I I for some reason I couldn't find it in any of my documents and I wanted to stop the first time but it uh but it was so good. So tell us what you need. Looking for a a line division of a three building one lot one parcel property trying to sell the property to the same gentleman who bought the other properties on South Avenue. his lender. They're not going to do commercial. So, he wants to separate the uh room in house from the other two buildings.

And he'll get a loan for that. And then he'll pay out of his pocket for the uh commercial. Same buyer for both. Same same buyer for the sub but subdivided because it's not quantity. That's correct. Required subdivided. Yeah. Okay. The problem is there's some varianes that have looked at. All right. Um, so is it my turn? Yeah. Yes. Um, this so what you're essentially doing right now, anything you do has to be contingent of what the planning commission does because

the planning commission has to split the lots before you guys grant it grant the varian. So whatever you do is contingent on the plank division decision. Whatever decision you make, I want to tell you Mr. Benedy's fault, but the new owner has not done anything with with that other property that was supposed to be Yeah. Okay. I just wanted to check is he only bought it on June 6, the guy. Okay. Um All right. All right. Right. Right. Um that's good to know that. So you did the subdivision. Yeah.

Of 34, that thing over there. That very large subdivision. And he just purchased the property on six when he didn't say it took two years to the day for that deal to go through. So why didn't you do the work? What? Why didn't you do the work that that was required? Because it because he said he was going to do the work. All right. So Okay. Again, up to you. No, it is anyway. So, that work on the other property was was not completed in the time frame that you're getting specifically, you know. So, does that mean but it was under but again if you look back on what you ordered it was that the new owner do the work. Yeah.

So, maybe whatever. So, different property gave all the paperwork that you gave me. I informed them that's what's expected. Yeah, sometimes you know the best thing. So, this will be this will be out of plan information. Okay. We'll deal with we'll deal with it. Um the the county planning did note the nonconformity of the rooming house. Yeah. Because it is an R2. So, you're talking a little little different situation than we were 37 Madison. Yeah. Yeah. All right. um that they wanted you to look at that situation. Okay.

And the parking and and and and what the subdivision will do to the lack of parking. So that line might need to be changed. Yeah. And that's that was one of the big things they were that they were concerned about because it he needs he needs if you look at the parking requirements for uh rooming house, you're supposed to have one parking space per room. Like the building is 11, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I'd like to point out in the 15 years that we had the lumen house, it's not the type of uh rental that people rent that can also afford a car is what I'm saying. Yeah. I can't remember. There might have been some, but I can't remember any any tenants having their own car. Right. So well that's all we hear that actually we've heard it's kind of a unique thing about

plus plus like I said the same gentleman is going to own the two properties on the left and he's going to he already owns the three properties on the right one of them which is a pretty much a lot an empty lot that has plenty of parking spaces if he needs to

use that. And that makes me a little more understanding or concerned about what Roy pointed out that he hasn't done any work. He owns that not only required from you but others um been six weeks. I guess it's just purchased. But so the other thing I will point out also is the county not only said that about the parking stuff in the same breath they said the city needs more properties like this that cater to a certain clientele. Y that need you know that what they call transitional housing. Yeah. Yeah. So transient transient

it was transitional it wasn't it was um you know that so you have 11 rooms of a transitional housing that the city drastically needs more of y so they they were concerned about it being non-performing but they're also concerned about it not being there anymore. Yeah. So just keep that

not being available. But uh yeah, I'm thinking extended period of time again allowing for this applicant and then sub other other owners subject to that to that ruling. uh if we again extended the time for construction to be carried on on other I I should be penalized because what the other no I I agree but I think he he you know he's he's only legally acquired it as of June one it wasn't anybody approached him and said you know this is required

well I again the planning commission has has more of an oversight since it's a subdivision Um, but I think that u it's it's something that I have to believe was communicated back when we had u your original your your previous allocation here. And I I would say others who do this that one of the best ways to do that is to purchasing some of the sale documents. That way when you have an agreement of sale, I mean that I don't think you could ever get back into business. I'll remember that.

Remember that trying to retire two years to find a buyer and and I couldn't find anybody local. No, it's hard to continue with this like and and you know going to be at least another four months to finish this deal if everything goes smooth, right? Yeah. Okay. I'll still have one one more person wants to speak. Yes. Yes, certainly. If that's all you have, then uh we'll get another another person to speak on on the issue.

I'm not here to to shop this or anything. Whatever happens have I live at 10 South Avenue. I recently took the property own from my parents and um I know that when he subdivides it, it's going to have to have property lines drawn again. Well, between 8 and 1/2 and 10, which is my house, there's a drive which is a shared driveway. I mean, granted, I don't use it because I have my own driveway, but it is a shared driveway between my property and that property. Okay. So, I just want to make sure when all of this happens that somebody's not going to try to No, that has to that has to be cut through. I mean, I don't use the driveway and I'm nice enough. I let the neighbors use it, whatever. But I just don't want to be cut out when it's part of my property. Yeah. you you uh I pay taxes on it though.

I prefer not aware of that. I I've looked at the property. Yes. I actually have the I found it because I keep everything, but I actually have where it says that it's a shared one because it used to be Bardi properties, but when my parents bought it, that's what they called the next store. So it shares a driveway with So yeah, my house has a driveway, but then there's a driveway between my driveway and 8 and a half. Oh, this 10 and 8 and 1/2. Well, 10 and a half is out back. So that's how they get to 10 and a half is using that driveway. This is right on this is right at your feet. So

correct. There's no way that you subject. Yes. Correct. That's what I just wanted to come here to make sure that I wasn't, you know, he I subdivided whatever you want. I don't really It doesn't matter to me. I just want to make sure that people are aware, whoever is buying it is aware that a driveway is shared and like and sometimes not nice enough is now yours. It's diffused. Yes. I took over in November. So my parents So I am Heather and my husband is Arnold. Sure. And Jimmy and Daddy were my parents are ours and you are

No, actually the subdivision that's rooms now used to be a bar and my parents used to know the gentleman that owned the bar. Okay. Uh Tommy Bardi. Oh, I thought you said you. No, not my parents. It should have but in in any case this well this is a driveway and what you have is you have the owner of the land is encumbered by allowing access. So if you I I have actually access my neighbor's plan to buy to buy that building on my property the easement is in my favor is my neighbor. Mhm.

This is a similar situation like that. So u you would have every right but again this is this is the how you enjoy having properties but it's all right. It's it's the burden of this. So even if he sells the property um the owner the owner the purchaser has properties that enjoys this easement has to be aware of this this language because this is recorded this is recorded 25 years ago. Yes. And so April 11, 2000. Yeah. That's what I verified.

So, uh, that's on the record for until such time as as somebody requires it from you, right? No, I understand. I just wanted to make sure that I the subdivision whatever clean up South. Um, but I just wanted to make it aware that, you know, that is part of the

I would just to be, you know, I'm not going to give advice because I don't like this, but I would make a point of finding out when the maybe approaching or sending something to the the acquiring interest, the owner, the guy who's going to buy the property and say, "By the way, in my deed, um, it's granted that you have a right away to use, but it's not doesn't it doesn't grant you the opportunity to to block it or to permit other uses of the should

and I've never had any trouble, but like when I got this, I'm like, Okay, I need to go address this just to make sure that it's there that people know that. No, I can't conceive of a reason why you'd want to do that. Just there's a house in the back.

Yeah. And that's the only way they can get basically get to the bathroom in the I just think that, you know, you know, again, I'm just a guy up the street telling you what you should do because you have this easement, you should make sure that that any documents that convey property to the new owner uh reference even just even if they just say there's a reference by reference there's an ement granted in April, 2000, that's all it has to say. Okay? And if it does that, then any subsequent owner uh has to abide by that just like I have. When I sell my property and the neighbor sells his property, he can't all of a sudden park cars out because I I can't get in the I don't own the land.

Yeah. I haven't I have that right to use it. So that's good. And it's good that you're bringing it up and you're on the record hear it. So if they ever came down, they say, "Hey, I came to the Portland hearing board and presented this and they set up." But by and large, it's not your point. Are you Thank you.

I hope I hope he does get it sold and I hope that they do. CL Yeah. Do you ever stop down by the property? Yes. You see a white car or a gray truck? I move to close the public hearing for 8 and 12 South Avenue. All in favor?

Roy, isn't it typical for So the lots to allow So this is a weird situation, right? Because the lots have to to to allow the sub the lots that's like number one or two in this in the minor subdivision subdivision. The lots have to be ready to build or they can't allow. However, you guys can't do an error on two lots unless the two lots exist. So, it's kind of a weird thing.

Yeah. I think I would require us to vote around something to have a layout like it has to has to include something like that as a professional draw. That's fine with me. outline of where the potential parking would be. And I say that even that the new owner can see exactly what you guys want and see where this driveway exists. Absolutely. Had she not brought that up, I don't know. I would have seen that. That's a little concerning. But the county I'm sure would take that on that. But Yep.

Good. All right. Yeah. So I'm kind of single too. Yeah. I think that's the that's the way that Yeah. That's where Yeah. We we've run into this an awful lot. You can come back up with us. We encounter this fair amount where we u We have to because we have another commission that's going to look at us, right? Planning commission does nothing but have

large roles of designs and everything especially a subdivision and that would be something subdivision uh particularly what she just brought up which is something that any kind of deep search or whatever would show would would produce that but show on the survey map. Well, it should should

because it's it doesn't have it doesn't necessarily have to be exactly where it doesn't have to be surveyed exactly pins or whatever, but the access does have noted on on because she had, you know, her her it's it's in it's a it's a it's a burden on her property, but nonetheless, it has to be addressed. It can't be something that automatically manurs is the word thinking of to a subdivided home. So I assume that 10 and a half used to be part of the lot to something.

Yeah. Yeah. Very likely was in many cases those halves that were done were done and not allowed to subdivide but then later on they did. So u u it's just it's so what we're going to Google on is uh we're going to kind of indefinitely table which gives you kind of extended period of time to desire or to a period of time to produce some kind of design for us about what he tends to do and and when we look at it that would be from like

engineer engineer design survey or sketch plan even if it's a sketch That's something we've had those come before preliminary and we don't guarantee the public planning commission. So maybe you can have a meeting maybe Andy can set up a meeting with the planning commission and you guys a sketch plan meeting. Yeah. To run over exactly what you guys want so he's not chasing down. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. That that sketch even if even if just one of us comes to it with something.

Yeah. So a sketch plan conference has to consist of a minimum of uh the chair and so officer and and any one in addition

it's welcome but the applicant or somebody yeah I I can do that. So, so what they're going to want is a a 10,000 foot view of both the new properties professionally drawn out, especially with eight. They're going to want to see where the where your thoughts are for the potential part. All right. Um then that does I I see your point. It doesn't necessarily have to be 11. We can get around that with with variances. One of the variances already are the minimum parking variance. We we can get around that, but we're going to need a better p they're going to need a better picture of what the plans are to provide that than me drawing a line.

And one of the ways that I've seen this happen too is with if with if with if with if in leases and you say in lease that we're leasing in this room, but we're not leasing with with a you know it doesn't include a parking spot. That's something advice for for getting around that required lease. We've had we've seen that happen here. So, if he wants to create a lease of the tenant and lease a parking space on four uh South Avenue, he can do that.

Yeah. On four. Yes. Because you can have an parking in in a residential neighborhood as long as long as they're as long as it's the same owner and it's and it's a budding problem. Yeah. So when what when can I get something you know in written up that I can show this gentleman what's required? We'll have uh our our minutes are produced within a couple of weeks. You have you have in a week right? will be producing, you know, back commission. Is that Do you have someone in mind that you go to get your drugs?

Say again. Do you have someone in mind that you would go to to get these drawings or you just think about No, I'm not going to pay. Yeah. I mean, for the most part, any professional drawing, I have no idea. Any professional that do drawing? No, you go to them. Hey, I want to subdivide this. I have to get approval from the CPA. They're going to know what to draw, what's to produce. So it's pretty much a conversation with whoever's drawn and in this case it doesn't have to be an engineer can be an architect. be session mayor anybody with access to

can I mean I think my assumption is the planning condition is going on those details on on the financing issue with with them requiring almost never heard of that requiring a subdivision in order to buy both the properties yeah it's the second time it's happened with the same guys they happened with the wind on the on the road too. Slender is a lending operation out of Florida. Okay. So maybe is just a real estate just investment. Yeah. Okay.

Yeah. And that's something that would be certainly the uh flesh with with clinic people. But you're saying that I will have something specific outline discuss with you. Yeah. And again what we what we have to permit something term our role. We just have to make sure that these solutariances there are things that we can then look at. Some of the variances are pretty like I think you've heard us beat these before. Yeah. They're not sign they're not what we call significant

or or substantial I think is the word that that I'm using often. Um so that aren't u uh those are kinds of things that we can look at as a group and say that have made exceptions to if if we see it at the bigger picture. Basically you're saying this is all contingent on these plans being drawn up. Yeah. Because I think the other the other part of the city's organization here the planning commission can't have to in order to grant subdivisions amongst us all. That that's something that has to be seen. And they're gonna look at this next week. Yeah, that is next on the agenda for next week.

Yeah, it can stay on the agenda for next week, but it'll be their now their decision will be contingent on the next time you guys meet. So, but they're going to look at it anyway. They're gonna have to look at it anyway. So, mine be April to next month. That's up to you guys. I'm just But then again, that's up to them, too. I'm just So, Mike,

so here's and I think you're already explaining to him that's a pretty big deal. I mean, you're just a it's I mean, it seems like I mean, I know it seems like it's all on paper, but in terms of variances, subdivisions. I mean, you've got one that's a non-conforming use. However, that non well, you got two that are non non-conforming use. Actually, both of the properties are non-conforming uses. One being the Ring House of R2, the other one being a two family and a one family on one lot, which is also a non-conform. In fact, it's restricted. Um what else can you do with those? Um

like again I but the county did recognize that the type of housing the transient housing is much needed. So I don't think we want to, you know, get rid of it or don't allow this to move forward, but I think we really need to watch moving forward how we fix this

and we want to avoid a future issue with the finance here too. I mean thinking I I can see it's smart for them to say to subdivide it even though they're requiring both because if one of one of them becomes something that is not allowed then they haven't lost the investment that they made in both of them for for whatever reason or if one of them one of the new acquired properties somehow becomes a a nuisance. Yeah. Then then got an issue and the owner can keep tenants in there or something like that. I can see that being something that they want to avoid. So, um it's complicated, but uh the first thing that has to be done is is everybody who sits on any of these boards, whether it's zoning, has to be looking at the same sketch, even if it even if that's basically status, just something that sketches down exactly what's going to happen.

So, are any of you guys available? I'm I'm available Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. This week? Yeah. Uh yeah, Friday Friday till you know you know what Friday I'm here all day. So yeah, why do you I'm not here tomorrow. Come in Wednesday. Sit down, talk to me. I'll run you through a list of what these guys want. Okay. And then hopefully you can get it drawn up. I mean again, anybody with a cat doesn't need to be stamped. What? Anybody with a CAD does not got to be stamped, but you're going to want I mean so we have a overview of the whole property, right? What what what they need? What the planning planning commission is going to need is specifically what the two new self-divided properties are going to look like and the measurements.

Yeah. Along with the parking and so on and so forth. Okay. Okay. Yes. Let me know because I should write down here at your office. So come in Wednesday. I'll give you a list of what they're going to need unless you you got it right now in which case you can come in on or not. You understand what I'm talking about? Why don't Okay, come in tomorrow and I'll see you online. Not tomorrow, right? All right. So, the goal is to get this passed, right? But it has to be done, right? Because it is such a big there's a lot of moving parts. Okay. Right. I'm not speaking

very much. No, it's uh and we can't also because we have to involve the planning commission. That's not a that's not a corporate thing. That's a state thing. That's that's New York State saying have to go through all this. So it's something that we see even though we as Roy mentioned it's something we want we actually want to see these kinds of of living on on a more on a regulated basis but for this purpose we have to go through we have to look at consistent manner with all the other departments. All right. Um, what time is good around? On Wednesday here, I'll just All right.

Hop in. If I'm not here, Dave will call me. I be right back. Okay. Okay. I'll do it. Again, understand I want to get through this with a lot of moving parts so we can work through it. Okay. I hear you. All right. All right. Thanks for coming with that.

Just for purpose of the M. So, we're going to table it. You know, the request of site plans for the proposed development be submitted for a sketch of plan conference. That's the way to put it prior to further action. Further action. There we go. Thanks. All in favor? Second. Second. All in favor of saying I

I scroll down 26 and 28 L street variances for construction 25 parking area one vehicle English sign street sign believe the last meeting you guys denied it but tabled it because you didn't like the parking arrangement. of the two vehicles on that side

is now limited it to one vehicle and it's coming back for okay I think that's a better look I'll pass these guys I don't know you might not I was looking specifically he's looking to actually extend this sound and all so he's going to need the same area it's just one

but it's just according to a sketch like that And I was the best is really a well done in terms of what we're looking at. The green street side for behind. Is are you gonna then move that fence back when it's existing?

No, you wanted it kept there. Kept there. So, but the paving is going to only go to that point. It's going to be off the road. Yeah, it's be right. Okay. Off the sidewalk beets. All right. I think it's going to be large as the curb cut. I think that's the option. You guys want make the curb cut a little bigger? Yep. In order to make two entrances cuz Oh, no. Not two entrances. Oh, that's Yeah, two two It splits. Well, yeah, but it's only going to be one car now. So, we just But you still want to make it big enough. So, you got one car pulling in still. Yes. And then one car pulling off. So, there's still two cars parked there,

but they're not they're going to be able to pull out without moving. So, so they won't be they won't be stacked and they won't I guess your other concern was is that one could back out in the other one. Yeah. And it won't happen this time because the one that's parked Okay. The one that's parked east, east, west, west, east, if you will, being pulled up more so that this car can come up. Yep. So you have one, two, three. That's two. Two. Two. You guys were concerned about the three stacking problem. That's because I now see

and that's why I wanted to my second part. I have two parts. want one there alongside the house. Let me just show you real quick. When I get done with this, there'll be a fence by the I remove the fence. There was a fence going all the way around it. Remove that. When this is done, there'll be a fence. My fence will come back along. Oh, there will be another fence. Yeah. Okay. All right. So, yeah. And then this the green space on Elm Street stays the same. Yep. And then over here the city just put in a nice big driveway with

Yeah. See that? So you'll be pulling in here and then this is what I was talking about earlier where this Jeep is. Yeah. Is I'm going to black top that that black top here. Black top there. Two part. Yep. And the guy out back I don't know whether he's got a stack. They only have one vehicle. Right. Right. That's the that was the access off of L. Right. This is not me. Sorry. Gotcha. You'll have the fence up to prevent people.

Exactly. So you'll leave that zing fence that's there and then you'll add another stretch fence. Yeah, I'm not changing. There's a black rod fence that goes that fence there. I'm just going to put it back in. Okay. Oh, you're going to move that back from where? Well, I removed this was all green space here where the truck is right now. It still is green space. There was a fence that went all the way down to here. Yes.

I removed that. And then once this is all blacked out, I'm going to put the fence back in. So it'll be black. All right. Does anybody have any questions at all? How big? How big? How far 129 far was the curb cut intended to be or is that

that's a pretty adequate curve that the city put in because it is two two different buildings that share the same Oh yeah. Did you did they just do it? They did a So was that the meeting I want to say? driver.

They need to That's up to you guys. But yeah, just asking right here. If there's no cracks here, this is driveway. So does that please pay the driver? Me. Yeah, you're paying it yourself. No. Oh. Oh, I build a contract. Contract do it. So do this. Cut that.

Yes. I mean it was first choice. First choice. didn't hit my curve cut and he cut out the curve. Well, that's actually how far is what is there like considerations for

I would put you got to put I would say I think I mean flush flush the I mean, I don't think it's going to be that much bigger because the other car is going to pull up and you're going to pull it out. But I still think you need to add to that so that they can come. And by the way, here's a picture of that fence. Yeah. Which which will come out now while they're paving that, but it's going to go back in. It's going to be around the front, too. So that they cannot Yeah. They can't pull through or pull out this way. They're back out. And I would recommend that you have your tenants back into that space.

Oh. Just tell them to back in because it'll be a lot easier for them. That way they're not back into the people walking on the sidewalk or the other vehicle. Gotcha. Gotcha. Cuz on the other side of the house side of the house over here, see this driveway? I paved that years ago. So people pull in and back out there. That's I'm still so I see I see your still yeah this

this is going to have two propos anything you can be more so you suggest that people I was just get back into vocal but yeah I think a lot I think they kind of do sometimes not all the time but Okay.

Because it's still I mean it's proven fact that most most accidents happen when you're acting up your vehicle. That makes sense. I just want to get from I think you I think Well, yeah. No, you're absolutely correct. I agree. I agree. So yeah, I'll say thanks very

anybody else questions for Mr. Stewart. We got one more photo here. Oh, we got one more. Yeah. Is he still okay? You want these back? I don't have so agreeing to do and I can contract. Yeah. Right. Again, I mentioned this the last time. This house was built when we were building cars. Yeah. No, that's what we were.

You gota be creative. Find that out. It's the cherry buildings too. Talking about that earlier. Something that everybody's tear down. Now they're finding out that they can actually have. They're actually pretty well built. I mean, if I again, if you look at the the other houses in that neighborhood and look at this particular house, I mean, it's immaculate. Everything's good. So,

it's a good corner. heard some good really takes care of his propert. Anything else for Mr. Stewart? I'm going to entertain a motion to close the public hearing. All motion made second. All in favor say I. I wish pass questions following test will be considered by the zoning board that deals determing or denial of the area variance request. Number one, whether an undesirable change will be produced character neighborhood or a detriment to nearby property will be created by the granting the area variance. I think all consensus whether the benefit is by some feasible applicant to pursue other area think we're doing things requested area substantial I think when we spoke with Mr. Steuart last at the last meeting uh we thought that was substantial and I think he's modified what he wants to do to achieve basically the same same results. So I would say no on that one. uh whether the proposed variance will have an adverse effect or impact on the physical environmental conditions or district. No pointed out and I agree it's a really well corner location difficult so created which condition which consideration shall be relevant to the decision of the board but shall not necessarily include branding the area I think yes things that come up when you're in the business of

having rental properties like this So I'll move to a motion to uh the requested variances with the condition of uh curb cut expanded 35 ft. 35 you said 3 to five

35 with a concrete apron padding. So uh span the curve cut by three divine ft at one of the congregation approaching street sign offered there. Second has been made by J. All in favor by saying I carries. So let's go back up four. Let's go back up to looking at this one. It's pretty pretty it's a ground pool. I didn't see anything like they were not very accepting of it. And Jesus against page 19 that I don't think that they're asking for as long as they put that in there. I don't believe think that needs to

happen. uh and uh attend street and vote for a second. Okay, second has been made. All in favor say I.

I can't close. I look unless we have any other questions to go over anything. The following pass will be considered by the zoning sales. to determine whether the benefit by the applicant could be achieved by some feasible for the applicant Area variance. Which one did we

We're on number one now. Seven Pendleton variances requested for the installation of holes sideyard variances and things like that. Am I right about that? It's just sideyard and Oh, so there's a a few actually. Um, yeah, there's a page.

So, I guess I should have that. I knew there was all one page. So, so there was right here. in the right one. No, they're okay. I'm sorry. You guys are rolling. Seven pounds. Okay, I got Yes, there's one spr

which is difficult.

Yeah questions. Yeah, that's what I'm at now. So, so that was the only late at night. Okay. So, okay. I think I'm Yeah, it's already written no for time. So, present variance is substantial. No. So number four, whether the pool's variance will have an adverse effect or impact on the physical environmental conditions and neighbors of the district and I read something about how it be dangerous. I guess that's something

has to be alleged in South consideration shall decision award that shall not necessarily completely grant the early variance or penalty. plans as second made. All in favor by the same motion carries. So

1562. Yes. People know this is the way to park. Oh. We're doing 156. Uh we're at Talin Street the the buildings. This is what is it?

Yes. So this is not a sign. Oh, they're doing a rebrand. Oh. So they have one sign there. Pull sign is not fine, but it's pre-existing. So yeah. So what is it? So 323 max front yard parcel has three front yards. Yeah. Great. Because it's a corner, right? Interesting. Yeah. So it has front yards on on water on Fins and on Broadway. Yeah. Broadway Fins. Yeah. And street

water water street clean water. So the max front yard is uh 30 ft 31 foot in water. That's 134 ft on the Broadway. The max is 20 ft. Yeah.

Uh the max building footprint is is 5K. The building 51K. The minimum parking is 20. So the should say maximum. So I mean the maximum parking is 23 they have 51 30 uh 38 84A123 it's all about front yard parking maximum parking in the front yard. Yeah.

And then 395 it doesn't have a 10ft buffer between the doesn't have a 10ft buffer between four Broadway and seven water. Okay. All of which are pre-existing non pre-existing non-conformance. Okay. Okay. All right. Uh because they are putting up I stand corrected. Yes, they are re they're putting up the same drive-thru structures that they added. This is the same rebrand that they did over at Clinton. So

yeah. Yeah. Now they just call it Duncan or something like that. Same. Okay. So all this is same thing. Okay. And they're all existing back and for that just need to be fixed that should have been fixed the last time. All right. Is there concern that that they that there is I think I want to say there's vegetated street there's grass between sidewalk and street isn't it? Yeah, that's that's Yeah, that's and that but it's not enough. And so

no, you're not talking about So what So you're not talking about that? So between a commercially zoned property and a residentially zone property, you need a 10-ft buffer strip. Yeah. There's not a designated 10 foot buffer strip. Yeah. Between that property and and for Broadway and seven. Right. Right. Okay. All right. Okay. All right. But that's been like that since they had it as as the little gas station. And truth I don't know when that was the last when that was re

done the I mean I was actually here when it was redone the last time. I was not the zoning officer at that time. Yeah. Truthfully I was surprised the stuff wasn't already fixed. All right. So, the rebrand is nothing but a new change with the No, this is all pre stuff. Okay. All right. And as was the as was the one down in Clinton. Same same exact. I don't you guys have any question for Roy or anything like that. How did you receive these documents for the drawings? Did you get hard copies? You just scan them.

I have both. I have electronic copies and hard copy. Like these scan ones like nothingual as far as just being pixelated. So it's maybe if we can get like what do you I'm confused. What do you I mean basically okay so all these drawings that provided from for like what's going on here they just can't read anything assuming it's all so it's just if it was like a high quality so so again I understand what you're saying these are these are the documents that I get I scan put back and just scan the package and I I have electronic cops

yeah so that's what I was saying if that's when it was a scann It wouldn't be all I don't know. I mean, I could do that, but it's the problem is you're you're talking a very large file. How are you guys? I mean, basically, some of these sets of plans take up a whole whole thumb drive. You can't really email. Yeah, maybe just like the the one page set, that's like site plan or something that has the information on it. That might Okay. in the future. The tight information is hard.

It's very cold. That's me. Just came up that you did. I was like, "Oh, no."

That was in the beginning. Okay. And the lady from the courts was just saying that frozen one of these. We need one of these. pages have list of all variances.

Yes, it's the same way I always do. It's right there. Nothing they are doing. Yeah. And been any of it. It's just Yeah, this is all pre-existing stuff. And have you had any issues with have the police had any problems or anything that

Yeah, it's really not that's a that's a planning mission thing, but I don't believe they have. Yeah. I don't I don't think that it's not. Yeah, man. I I go there all the time to get gas and never really It seems like it people even even with I think the worst issue we have with them in the winter time is not having to walk shovel. Yeah. Yeah. That's a that's something that occurs a lot of places. But that's uh Yeah. For for being in business and even though They got a lot of sidewalk too.

Yeah, they got almost a full two sides. Sidewalk got three sides.

Those those sidewalks get a lot of use. Well, truth be kind of these people should be here with a joint for you.

Yeah. Yeah. That's so that's what they I want to say they came the other way after you know after they you know I'm I'm opening it until they come here with with some kind of a sketch and explain any questions but it's up to you guys I just honestly honestly none of the work they're doing is is not conformed this is all pre-existing stuff that should have been fixed when this building was Yeah. When when the building and actually nothing to do with their work at all. It's the property as a whole. So So when this when this thing was redone Yeah.

when it was like an express mark when they changed it over to Speedway. Yeah. So all of this stuff should have been done then. Yeah. Exactly. So and it wasn't. Speedway which I don't think it's part of Dun which Duncan was part of some other some other whatever. And so, yeah, before they were, you know, Yeah, I agree with you. It's strange that that wasn't something that came up. I mean, there's just Yeah, that's proper location. Plus, it also has

it's a gas station. And again, this is really nothing to do with you guys. It's a gas station in a neighborhood business, which requires a special use permit, which it did not have either. has a gas station right across the street from too and in another neighborhood district too. And it's a and I don't know why none of this was and I I don't I'm just saying that's a lot like this with a lot of things that I do. I'm playing catchup on trying to fix things that were done in the past. So yeah, just trying to fix this.

I don't I mean I'm sitting here thinking that I wish they would have suic attorney I'm sorry I forgot his name Randall Lewis Randle Lewis is this something if we if we grant this kind of blanket kind of variances is this something are we exposing anything for guy the sitco station across the street or something like that again if they do something across the street I will fix that problem too but right now there's He starts static. I can't make him do it. Well, I could probably make them spec. Yeah, that's right.

Until something changes. Yeah. All right. They're doing very small changes the building and changing the dump signs and everything else. Yeah. Yeah. Little facade changes like that. It's not really increasing the nonconformity, but I still have the ability to get things fixed while we're there. Right. Right. Okay. I have nothing. Okay. All right. Uh I wonder is there anything here that we should like say maximum building for instance they they're exceeding it by 100 square feet. I know it seems like overkill, but

say that here's what you don't want to have is happen. Say some kind of accessory structure that you buy on clothes just that that's not part of the total public. That's an accessory structure. That's a little different by by definition if they add. So I was having this conversation with Kyle last week. Just because you're granting a variance like this. Yeah. if if they want to add on to that building. Yeah. They're they're they're in they're they're going inside of an already approved variance. Therefore, they have to come back that. Okay. All right. All right. I'm done with it's just like the So,

so any anything that that you've already approved if they try to get more Yeah. in that particular variance, they have to come back. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I'm seeing the I'm old enough to remember when Dunk Donuts only made donuts. Now they make breakfast and lunch and this that and the other Kingston or whatever it is too. So it's kind of time to make the donuts. Time to make the donut.

Yeah. All right. All right. Any other questions for guys? Uh and I think I will uh I will move to grant the area variance for CNY food service groups u according to the documents presented and acknowledging the question I got to close the public hearing. Sorry. Move to close the public hearing. This will made looking for a second. I'll second that. Second and uh by saying the following test will be considered by the board of appeals to determine whether the variance waiting granting or denial of the varian request. Number one, whether undesirable change care or a detriment to nearby properties will be created by the brand. Number two, whether the benefit sought by the achieve some feasible for the pursuit other than another one. I'm going to say no. Uh it's all know well it's a area that is two gas stations and a lot of lot of commercial areas. uh although between it and sitco uh with the existence of them this being neighborhood is something to be concerned about for expansion purposes. Number two, yeah I think no on that too the uh the variances and we can literally kick down the road again. So again no whether the requested area variance is substantial no a sign and then existing pre-existing situations and uh whether the proposed variance will have an adverse effect or

impact on the physical environmental conditions to the district. didn't know because I do believe that they uh um are have been around for a long time there uh and this change is not going to make much of a difference whether they alleged difficulty with self creative consideration to the decision of the board but shall not necessarily include granting the area yes so we have four no yes and and a Motion to the application application. Motion has been made to approve the application by 156 as submitted. Package second been made. All in favor signify by saying I. pre I think our last item is 95 port area various type price it's various parking area auto sales business oh yeah

so most of these are pre-existing thing except for the parking. Yeah. And the parking is what brought this to our attention. Yeah. Has anyone seen this place? Is he the guy? Yeah. I I pass by it all the time. I told him um for one of a better term. And so let me preface this by saying Mr. McBride is willing to do anything. I mean, he was very cooperative and and he's willing to do anything that we asked him to do to clean up the property. He's he he admittedly has outgrown the parson. Yes. Um it's a mess

to say the least. But with that saying, he recognizes that and he's willing to work with us to fix it. Okay. Too many cars to become blind to these things. Daily operations are tax. I won't do that again. Are the cars still there? Yes. That was as of June 19. So building height. Wow. We don't see that that often. You see that a lot actually. Yeah. Is there another floor above it or something where

No, the there is no. So the build So the minimum building height in a GB2 is 22 feet. Yeah. Wow. This is just a single garage. Yeah. It's that higher than that. Wow. Granted, the same thing across the street. It has to cover whenever we're doing the signs in the parking in that area. It's just it's a I'm through things fixed.

Yeah. That's a that's a main to do with the work he wants. Again, it was a complaint that came in about junk vehicles and parking. Um, parking needs to be determined according to our local code. Any type of parking needs to be determined by uh by planning commission. And and this this is actually an odd odd one because he he so it's a vehicle it's a he he has two two bays to repair vehicles plus he he's a he he sells vehicles. Yeah. So he's requesting parking for both of those uses. Yeah. Is this is this right where the county's uh right next to it?

What is that? Right next right there. So there's going to be more bunch more traffic going out there theoretically. Yeah. But it's so it their entrance is maybe 10 ft downtown and I think the school buses and what have come in and out of there a lot to the back entrance to the high school. And uh what is his use on to consider? So there's automobiles the auto so there's auto sales. Yeah. Just he does have vehicles side.

So there's motor vehicles uh service shop and then there's motor vehicle sales which are both allowed in GB2. What is it for parking? Oh,

so if you go to the max parking is 200% uh so Anyway, so if you go to the so um garage is three per service bay or repair station.

Yeah. So you got two bays which is six, right? Six. Um so read So it doesn't say motor vehicle sales in the table. that. So I've said it before, I said it again. Our zoning laws are written. Yeah. Yeah. We don't have one for like a sales. So we don't have we don't have one for sales. So I use retail store sales and service. So allows the right two spots. So that's crazy for the it's not. So he proposed 12 for that. So eight spots are allowed maximum. That's 200%. Okay. All right.

Um 20 requested and he wants 10 for sales, nine mixed and two for staff. So you'd like 22 actually. Yeah, that's what I count your two if each one of these squares, whatever you want to call them.

Thank you. But so that drawing is not by any means of skill. Okay. I thought I think you should have numbers right but that bad. So I did all the junks. Yeah, you did. Oh no. Well for I not I count 20. So maybe it is 20. I came with 22 but two staff. So okay. Yeah two staff 10 retail and eight. Okay.

So that is 12. Yeah. would would be something wrong with it. Is there a way if we said yeah we can give you a variance but at the end of the year I want to see some of these things that are usually correct done or there so there is a question though I did this it's not scale but this is kind of what he posed

yeah I used that sketch there you gave you a Oh, there you go. Okay, I see where it is. RS Mad I got really. How many cars are on the lot now? More than 20. So 20 would be cut back then. 20 would be cutting it back. However, I would I honestly if you guys wanted to want to look at that, too. I'm going to have to find a commission really pull pull that in like for junk vehicles. Yeah, he's got a bunch of those there now.

Yeah, I think that what they regard is and a lot of places where you have auto sales or auto repairs is whether vehicle stays there for for an x number of days stays in one spot and I think that's the determination. So vehicles unlicensed unregistered yeah they're technically but as long as they're up for sale I don't have an issue with it. I think the the biggest problem is this miscellaneous parking. Yeah, I think you have one row. I mean, right now there's like two two rows sometimes three rows of vehicles. Yeah. I would think that the Port Was Street is this main view of

I think reasonable to say if you look at if you look at the drawing here and again it's horri it's it's it's not at the scale. that possibly not even possible feasible you know because I didn't you know I didn't measure it

so actually 10 there's a car One, two, three, four, five, six. So you're not you're not fitting eight, right? Yeah. You're not fit. So again,

I didn't like come up with a eight foot, you know. So this should So a parking space should be minimum 8 ft wide. Well, I do. But I don't think he should park any here because I agree with you. There's going to be more more parking. I just think and this needs to be handicapped. That that is an extra spot. So, I wonder if the if the way to look at this is is have him agree to areas where he won't park. Is that possible? No, I think you need I think with a case like this, you need to limit

these need to be lined. This is where you park them. Period. And that's plenty. So, I think what you guys don't my suggestion is that you don't grant 20 because like he said, I that's a I don't think you can put 20 on that lot. Okay. Yeah. Especially you got to have two. You gota I mean did I count 20 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20. So there's 21 there. Yeah. I would say 16 is reasonable. Yeah.

That that was the original number that I came up with. Yeah. All right. So, wait. How many did we say? Six. 200% of that. Six.

Yeah. Max. Yeah. Let's just make sure we're not I want I just want to So, grass have three per bay. So 200 have six. So 200% of six is that's 18 alone.

We have 200% of six. That's the garage. Let's see. So, even though this says 110%, me and Andy just looked up they changed that roll back in 2022. The the max parking is now 200% now% I don't per service for anything used to be 110% now it's 200. Okay. For and that's only I say.

Yeah. So my I guess my I don't I think if you guys grant that max parking don't think planning commission is going to allow I can agree again that's what they'll look at is specifically the numbers I mean as far is there like a site plan review for them as far as that actual plan yes they have a site that go next week site so they've So they're going to approve this layout. So

so all all year for us. Yeah. And I think I think 20's too much. I think now that I look at that I mean just drive past the place now. I drive by I'll drive by tomorrow morning. But that being said, he he he's been great. He he greeted us. He's he he's overgrown the space. He's willing to work with whatever we we we want to work on. In fact, he even says he wants to make the place look good because it doesn't look good when people come to look at his vehicles that they can't walk between the vehicles to look at. They are very together.

Well, why don't we take what you said you recommend 16, right? And there are two bays in the garage again. I think so. There are two bays in the garage which count. Yeah, they do count. Yes. So 18 18 total. I'm fine with that. Yeah, it seems Yeah, that seems fair. Yeah, look at And then with moving forward, I'll make sure the planning commission tells them no, you know, no on the license on registered vehicles that aren't for sale. Yeah, maybe. And there's junk in one corner screen that off and you know just plenty of commission. Yeah. You can purchase right now.

But again this is have to go through this again. I mean there's no green space on entire property. No there it's all front yard park. Yeah. What's this this neighbor to the west? Are they having any issues with anything at all? the one that had they got they got noticed they had an issue that bigger. Yeah. And then there's probably Well, also keep in mind that one of the variants you're giving them is that 195 which is the buffer strip. Yeah. Yeah. Because that there are two residentially zoned properties. Yeah.

Yeah. I think I think there might be two residentially zone properties right next to that. And there is zero. There's no maximum front yard block coverage of 383 which is your parking and then 384 that is which is your front yard is it a but that's so that's your front yard and maximum 65% front yard 45 single that's that's the 10 offers right the neighbor properties.

Yeah. All right. But not dissimilar to any of those commercial properties. Well, I guess that the problem is is that's the last commercial property before they changed to Yeah. R4 and I think that I think the surrounding properties are R4. All right. Maybe an R14 W. You know, there's auto sales across the street. The guy has button around there. He's got different situation with with with buttons, but again, he hasn't really done anything to trigger this.

He might be coming to sight plan because he's trying to do something else, but we'll see that that's down the road. But I did I did double to make sure when I was doing this because he's not I mean we got one at Clinton Avenue now that's that's been existing for a while but he's he's parking all over the place. So I got to rail that in. I've got one on North Main now that had vehicles for sale that can't sell. I mean it's just we're trying to as I'm going I'm trying to reel these in. They should have been done a long time ago but I'm I'm I'm gradually getting to this. So, so the gentleman across the street at Riverbank Auto has a site plan

has been approved for those number of vehicles he has he has and now it's logical then that Mr. McBride now has to comply with all this, right? All right. Yeah, I agree. It would be nice to see have that. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot I mean, right now, and again, he agrees it it it's a mess. Yeah. I mean, it's purely like life safety of just having lots lot of traffic going on there. And Alderman Michaels will be very happy and his constituents because he gets a number of complaints from his constituents about that corner problem. Yes. Yes. Okay. All righty. Um this go into site

and rightfully so. Is there more is there going to be more of a developed site plan from from that or is it I don't know. I really honest to God think in this case your best should he have one? Absolutely. I just you walk a fine line with some of these people trying to trying to get them to comply and you can push them over that compliance cliff to screw you. I'm not going to do it. You see what I'm saying? Yeah. No, I do. Yeah. just just uh

I don't disagree with what you're saying, Kyle, but I think in this case I got them right at that compliance cliff. You don't want to shove them as you want. Yeah, it'll just it'll just keep trying to get away with what they're Well, in the same token, you have to be consistent because you have asked for that in the past. So, I just I I I think we could get a drawing out of him, but I also think he's I could ask for it, sure, but it it's a big ass cons I should have probably asked for that and I you know what, knowing that that's what you guys want.

I will ask for that in these situations in the future. Really, this is my fault. No, I I should have asked for better drawing. Yeah, I in the climate commission might, you know, just but the the fact of the matter is we're trying to change a problem and by limiting those vehicles is what we're trying to do and cleaning up, you know, having them lined, having where you can park is ultimately what we're trying to do. Yeah. Well, can we partially ran something on this? We'll say and we say yes, we will go and you want to go buy that. Well, that's speculous. And then Okay. the the parking design. Parking design

is the planning. You're not granting him a variance for parking. No, we're gr we're looking 10. You're granting him variances for the number of vehicles. Yeah. And the front yard parking, which there's no way you get around because that's all there is there is front yard parking. Yeah. Yeah. And the 60 uh the 40 45% of the front yard can't be can't be has to be green space which again it's all pre-existing doesn't really belong for a slight property like this I guess but yeah I I agree with all right number I guess yeah numbers

I I think you should limit that absolutely I think 20's too much or whatever the number 18 say 18 with two in the garage that's perfectly fine two in the garage column Yes, the code does say the two in the ground just like the overhang at a gas station. Okay. The overhang at the gas station counts as those whatever spot you whatever. So if you have two pumps on both sides that's four parking spaces. So it does it does say that in in the in the in the footnotes that that inside whatever whatever room you have inside counts as money.

So I like the seven. did I don't think that go 18 I think it's 18 including the two inside shall include the 18 two two inside beta so to clarify 16 no more than 16 external and two allowed in area and so here it'll cover two birds with one stone you say 18 like that unless you come with uh a site plan. A site plan that can prove you can have more. I'm sure they can prove you can have it. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Realistically more, you know, with the measurements and everything else. I think that's fair. Right.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's that's that's an improvement what he was probably planning to do. So, I agree. All right. Anybody want to try a motion? No. will to give it a shot. Have I public hear questions? So looking motion that only you know just broadly granting variances for 10 10 different or 10 different variances but um if we grant them and then result of that is the car is is is sticking to the limited number of cars and then I That's right. Okay, I will move to grand variances as described for 95 provided subject to limit of no more than 18 automobiles license registration or or suitability for sale on the property at any given purish must be inside of the structure. Um and u and then that incorporated into a into a site plan is would suffice for us.

Awesome. So again, you said Swift. Yep. It's a total of 18. Total of 18 with two being in the base, 16 being exum of 18 vehicles. Yeah. with no more than 16 of

two being the beds two or a drawing showing feasibility where the other what we say four four get it to expand upon that number yeah pop but but set of max no more than 20 total sketch show where we get from 18 to 20. If he needs sight plan for that. So if he wants more than the 18, he must provide a site plan

detailed enough. determined and and then that we want to require spaces be identified on site as well that the that the proper parking measurements be adhere to the drive

lines um so parking all right what's the last part about oh that all f identified outside with markings I target again and all that stuff. Second made all in favor motion carries minutes any second minutes. Yeah. I So, okay. Paul was here last. I guess that's still

changes index to approve the absent and I'll see if I say all right I guess you can um minutes have been approved. And any move for second on David