Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

business different.

But uh we'll go ahead and get started since it is after uh six. So we'll call it the meeting to order and uh I have to go through all the instructions. We thank you for your attendance and participation. The purpose of the public hearing is to gather information from the public to help the commission formulate recommendations. In order to ensure a fair and orderly meeting where everyone can participate, the commission requests that you act respectfully to everyone in attendance and follow the hearing procedures. The chairperson will call the public hearing item. The planning department will present the staff recommendation. Commissioners may then ask questions of staff. The applicant or representatives may make a presentation and commissioners may ask questions of the applicant. The chairperson will open the public hearing and the chairperson will call for public comments from persons in support of the items followed by persons in opposition to the item. The applicant will have the chance for rebuttal comments. The chairperson will close the public hearing. Commissioners may ask questions and discuss and then take action. Speakers must speak from the podium and state their name and address for the record. The chairperson reserves the right to establish a time limit for all speakers to ensure that everyone can speak. The designation of a spokesperson for groups sharing a common point of view is encouraged. All comments and questions will be directed to the chair from the podium and not to the applicant, staff or to the audience. When the hearing is closed, additional public comments are not permitted.

Next item is roll call. Dan Brian here. Myron Langer here. Chad Ghart here. Janette Johnson present. Rosa Kabasos. Terry Robinson here with five members present. There is a quorum. Thank you. Um communications from the public to the staff.

We did receive one letter um regarding um case CU2502 and that was one letter on behalf of four neighbors um in opposition of the conditional use permit. I'd also note for the record uh Julie just to ensure Rosa is here. Yep. For the roll call. And also that the letter was distributed to the planning commission. Yes. Prior to the meeting. All right. Um have there been any exparte communications by members of the commission?

Any conflicts of interest? Anyone would like to declare? All right. Then we'll call the first item of uh business. Silver Lake Commercial and Industrial Park subdivision number two, preliminary and final flat phases.

All right. Thank you. Um my name is Henne Perez. I'm the planning and zoning administrator. Our first item is case number P2502, Rodney J. Robinson Trust. Um the requested action is a preliminary and final plat approval of the Silver Lake commercial and industrial park subdivision number two proposing to incorporate an existing parcel as lot one and to establish a legal build site for a new development on lot two. It's located on Northwest US um 24 highway and 9939 Northwest US 24 highway. Lot one is about 1.14 acres and lot two is 1.85 acres. So here we have the general location map. Um and you'll see it as uh this the blue star lot one. Uh there's an existing business window design and remodeling. It also contains two commercial buildings and it's uh zoned light industrial in lot 2. Uh it's currently vacant previously used for agriculture. Um recently reszoned to a light industrial back in May. Um proposed improvements will include a warehouse and manufacturing buildings, RV parking area, and future storage unit development. Here we have the preliminary plat and then the final plat. Staff recommends approval of the preliminary and final plat of Silverlade commercial and industrial park subdivision number two subject to the following conditions. One, submission of a category A drainage report for lot 2 to public works in the Kansas Department of Transportation for review and

approval. Any requirements of the drainage report must be met prior to development. Number two, a final plaid of the sub subject property shall be approved and recorded prior prior to development. Number three, an entrance permit from K dot must be obtained or if not available an eress ingress egress easement with the parcel to the west will be considered upon consideration of the building permits. That concludes this item.

Thank you. Do the commissioners have any questions of staff? Seeing none, um, does the applicant have anything to say? Make a presentation.

Good evening, Joshua with SPB Engineering. Um, there's not much more to add. I just wanted to say that we acknowledge the conditions um of the storm water management report and the access um from KOT. We've applied for the access permit and last week and we haven't seen any indication that they would deny that at this point. So looks good. Any questions? Is this within the city limits at Lake? It's outside the city. Just outside.

Have you had any conversations with the governing body of city at this point? Uh not formally. I think uh Mr. Robertson has reached out to them just informally. What's What's the plans for the describe plan use as kind of a manufacturing material storage parking lot storage?

Right. Yes. So the first phase is an additional manufacturing storage building which is roughly the same size as the one on lot one. It'll just be in approximately that same location on lot two with a gravel storage yard over most of the site. So they'll be using both of those buildings to wheel materials back and forth and assemble items and drop off materials and storage there. And then over on the west side of the site, the future may be storage unit buildings or some RV parking just to make full use of the site.

What type of manufacturing are they doing? uh windows and doors and they do a lot of remodeling and construction projects for kitchen. Anyone else? We'll now open the public hearing. Anyone want to speak in support of the item? And anyone want to speak against the not then um we will close the public hearing and commissioners you have any questions any discussion ready to make a motion

I make a motion to approve based on staff recommendations Second. It's been moved and seconded. So, you want to take the role? Chad Ghart? Yes. Myin Langwitter? Yes. Terry Robinson? Yes. Rosa Kasos? Yes. Dan Bryan? Yes. Janette Johnson? Yes.

With a unanimous vote in favor, the planning commission recommends approval of the call for the second application. All right. Um the second item is case number CU2502, Turkey Farm Property LLC, a request for a conditional use permit to allow the use of the property as a quilting retreat. It's located at 4621 Southwest Gage Boulevard in Mission Township. It's 9.5 acres. And here you'll see the blue um star. That's the general location of the site. The applicant plans to demolish an existing house and construct a purpose-built retrieve facility. The new structure will have five to six bedrooms, five bathrooms, and a full kitchen and a large open space designated for sewing tables and group quilting activities. I do want to note that um there were additional accessory buildings on the site that were demolished by the previous owners. So, uh the new owners would only be demolishing the current structure, which is the house that's currently there. Overnight retreats will host up to 10 quilters at a time for three to four sessions. Day sessions um stays are scheduled for either Sunday through Wednesday or Thursday through Sunday. Check-in and checkout will be informal but coordinated with by a group organizer. On days without overnight retreats, the facility may host single day quilting sessions known as sue days. SO days. These run from 10:00 a.m. to 400 p.m. and provide a casual gathering space for local quilters to work and socialize.

Here we have uh the proposed site plan of where they would be um constructing their new building. Here's the vicinity map. And here is the map um of property owners within 1,000 ft from the site. 25 letters were sent out to property owners located with 1,000 um feet of the site in Shauny County and 200 feet in the within the city of Topeka. One letter was received on behalf of four neighbors expressing their opposition. Staff recommends approval subject to the following condition. Um, one, all activities conducted under the conditional use permit shall occur by pre-arranged lease, contract, or agreement. The facility shall not be open to the general public without such arrangements. Overnight stays must be directly associated with a scheduled rental of the facility. Two, the facility will be required to meet all applicable regulations of the state fire marshall and or local fire jurisdictions at the time of building permit application. Three, the use of the facility is limited to quilting retreats including the scheduled so days. The site shall not be used for other types of events or gathering without first obtaining an amendment to the conditional use permit. And then there was also an amendment to um our conditions which is to have them submit a category A drainage report to public works for review and approval. And that concludes this item. Are there any questions of the staff for the staff?

You all noted the additional requirement for the recommendation. All right. Then um if there are no questions from the commissioners, we'll open the public hearing or ask the applicant if they wanted to I'm sorry, I skipped over. Does the applicant want to make a presentation?

You're the applicant. Okay. Why don't you come up to the podium and state your name and and if you have questions that you saw? So if there's questions, we're happy to answer them, but the commissioners have questions of the applicant.

Is this a friends and family thing or is this a business It will be a business. So, um, quilting retreats are just just that. There's a group of women that get together. There's normally 10 to 12 women. Um, they'll stay the night. They sit, they sew. Once they're inside, they're inside. It's a very quiet time. So, there will be no noise, no additional things in the neighborhood. a welcome addition. It's been a sore site for a long time. Um that little corner there has not been used for anything. So look forward to it. Didn't see on the site map. Is there anything notated for parking and that type of thing? What's your intent for that around the new building site?

Yes, they'll just park right outside the front. just it's not it'll be a stick building, but the parking will just be right out in front. Um, and where we're going to build is up on the hill. So, really, unless you're looking for it, you're not even going to see that we're there. Yeah. I drove by the site today. This is a rendering of what you intend to build. Well, yeah, there's been modifications to the building, but yes. something similar. Yes. Is the parking lot paid for gravel

right now? It'll just be probably gravel right out along the front and that front edge will be concrete along the front of the building so they can wheel their sewing mach and all those things. Just you'll just level that smooth that area. It'll just be green space grass area down there. Yeah, it'll probably stay for a while. I mean, we're not looking just to go in and tear it down right away. So, um it it maybe we find we have a use for that. Maybe it can be an office. Maybe it can just stay.

Um and if not, we'll just level it. We've had it looked at the the structural it's all good structure wise. Um, if they were going to use that as part of this, it would be need to be included in the condition. Correct. Yeah. I would I would recommend if you have any desire to use that property or that house for anything that you reach out to the planning department to find out what you are allowed to use it for. Um, if you end up using it in conjunction with this, then we may have to do an amendment to the conditional use permit to allow for that. Um, right now the only thing that the house would be able to be used for would be residential use. Okay.

Yeah. Maybe we find that we just go ahead and right now I would ask you to come up to the mic. We're recording and live streaming so we may not be able to hear you if you're not at the microphone.

We had a a contractor who plans to build our building and he walked through it and walked out of me says, "You can't tear this down." The stud walls are straight. The rafters are are solid. It's on a concrete foundation. Uh floor joists are all solid. The roof line is straight. So, I kind of threw a curve because I I'd already gotten a bid to to demolish the building, but he it is a sound structure, but there's the plumbing's been torn out. I mean, it's uninhabitable as is. And so, that's not a priority, you know, as far as remodeling, but but it is still a sound structure and we haven't invested we didn't plan on invest investing money remoding that but I I don't know anything about that stuff. I walked with ceilings upstairs what he calls what he says that's not a priority our priority is getting

yeah to answer your question Chad the um the use of this property the zoning remains residential rural So, as a whole, it is still, you know, to be able to be used as a single family residence. It can stay,

right? It can stay. Correct. It is not being required to be demolished. Um, our understanding was that it was going to be, but we we have no objection to it staying um as long as the the building is far enough away. And we go through that procedure when we do the building permit to make sure that it meets proper setbacks. A conditional use permit is kind of like a a little overlay on the property. The only thing that this would be allowed to be used for with the building would be for that quilters's retreat. Um, and that's on top of the already usable status as an RR property.

Didn't read these city utilities out there. The house and water.

The city water is located right across the street, but it was determined in communications with the city that it's far enough away that there's no need at this point um for them to connect. Um obviously, you can see city limits are right there. We ensured that the city didn't have intent to annex at this point or to require us to plat and none of those were um issues for the city.

One more. Um on the SO days, so you're limited to 10 quotes to a time for your retreats, but on the SO days, I don't know how popular those are. I mean, is that going to be at that same 10% cap or could there potentially be 20 people? No. Only potential there could be So days because the table space will still be the same.

Almost always they come in groups usually. from Ohio, Missouri, Illinois. Can you clarify? Um, in your business model that was presented with the application, you indicated that it would be for small groups of up to 10 quilters, but you've mentioned today several times 12. So,

we we can do 10. when we got to looking at the space and and what we planned square footage wise, that's when it's figured out that we could probably hold 10. So, okay. Well, whatever you put in your business plan is what is going to be required under the conditional use permit. So, if you're asking to modify that to 12, then we would need to know that now so that the planning commissioners can make that consideration. So, is that an amendment that could be made and then if we stick with 10, we do correct 12. John.

Okay. So then commissioners on the application um they included as a part of that um a sheet of paper that has their description and on the back of it well on the back of ours because we did them double-sided it says quilt retreat business model and it says for up to 10 people. I would have you each notate that that would be up for 12 um for up to 12 quilters. Any other questions from the commissioners?

Thank you very much. And we will now open the public hearing. So we will call first for public comments from persons in support of the item. There's anyone here in support? If not, then anyone that's Yes. My name is Carol.

If you're going to speak, please come up to the podium. Yep. My name is Carol and I live2 neighbor sounds like worried about maintenance. Anyone else a proponent? If not, then we'll call for persons in opposition to the item. Anyone care to speak? My name is Terry and I sent a letter and I hope you all had in front of you. Um, there's a whole laundry list of things that we kind of brought up your attention on what you should take into consideration when making this decision for property owners that sit directly across from there. You've lived there for quite some time. In fact, I've lived there for 15 years. Um, Of all the items, one of the biggest items is the actual water runoff. I don't know if you noticed or not, but last year during this time right here in this corner, a new and all that water now from that entire track runs under that road into the city's property. We have been dealing

with water runoff from that for quite some time. Um, we have a storm water runoff uh d the city has in there. The city has easements through every one of those lots. And in fact, what's ironic is you would think all the water would run to the north, but the way it's designed that the city had designed it, all the runoff behind the properties runs directly to the south. And so it runs out right about here to that area. And so all that water comes through our properties. And Don here, Don Hoover, and so is Dan Hutchkins. Don is in the county if you notice that or not and that's 46. So he's still on a septic and lateral system. So all that water is coming through that lateral field and frankly about 15 years ago about several of those houses back there were flooded and so the kitty city had to go back and scrape it back out. So one of our concerns is when you have land that is not developed, it is permeable. That means that water absorbs into that soil and you tend to have less runoff. But when you start developing property, then you start increasing the permeability of that property and that water has to go somewhere and the only place that water can go is across the river. And so with all that in consideration and also our laundry list, we're They have any questions?

Sure. So on their their application um the question was explain what effect the development have on the character of the neighborhood and they said that um previously under previous ownership allowed multiple people moving outside the house in various forms of trailers and allowing racing of motorcycles. They did not race motorcycles. Can I finish my question? Yeah, go right ahead. I apologize. So, um and it says the the property was littered with many vehicles in disrepair, general garbage and trash. So, is that this what they put on their applic?

I think to a degree it is. Um, I don't know if you all remember, but the Wilson turkey farms that was up on that hill for a long time and there was some kind of an arrangement so that I believe the children could live there for a certain period. I don't know the details of that, but the daughter, I believe, and the son were living there and then they had some friends there. The daughter's son had a motorcycle. There was not a motocross track. He would have a motorcycle and he would ride his motorcycle. Don't disagree with that. There were several people living in that. Don't disagree with that at all. It wasn't kept up at the best. In fact, I think the lady brought up a good comment. It wasn't kept up at all and it needed something to be done with it. And somebody did go in there and clean that up. But from our perspective, you have to look at it from trying to maintain the integrity of what it was designed for, and that's R1. And it's not some semicommercial type of a structure that should go in there, but it should be something residential or quai agriculture. That answers your question.

Again, my my question is, you know, this this seems like to me that if the condition of the property now is a significant improvement, did did you or your neighbors ever complain about the property before? And if I mean it seems like it seems like this is is a dramatic improvement on what was there before.

Well, considering the sheriff's department was over there quite a bit, I don't think it was necessary to complain that much, but that doesn't answer your question. I know. But no, none of us complained about it because, you know, that was there before we all moved there. All right. I think the only thing that was uh and I can speak from personal knowledge on this, but they would shoot guns over there and those rounds would go in my pool. Oh jeez. And I still have them. Seems a little disingenuous that you would be complaining about other things. I mean that this this seems like such an improvement. I just can't

Well, I think you're exactly right. It's an improvement, but it's not improvement for R approval for something else. And I don't disagree with you by no means. It was an eyesore by all means, but this is not the same thing. I think if you also got to look at it from the perspective that nobody can even answer to this day is how much additional runoff is going to come off that hill from this development. Can you point out which is your property? I live southwest. Okay, thank you. 4620.

I get your concerns about development, but we're talking about 9 and a half acres of basically open farm ground and we're talking minimal footprint structures on there. I mean, it seems to me, I mean, that the amount of additional runoff would be negligible at best. It sounds like you have a ongoing water problem,

but I'm not sure. I mean, do you think that that would have a significant impact on that? I think with this amendment that they're proposing, I think that will help give us a better understanding. But I also think you have to understand from our perspective when we come in here. I didn't know where that structure was going to go. I didn't know where was going to be and I didn't know where that park was. I learned that right now. Okay. And so knowing that does that change your mind?

You know, I think you from where it is right now. It's a vast improve. We all know that. But we also know when you come over, you'll see that driveway.

Any other questions?

Any question for you? Yeah. They could build this 60 by 60. exactly like it's designed correct on this piece of property exactly the way it's owned and just not operate a quilting retreat out of it. Um yes, based on the acreage it would be allowed to have an accessory building that would be 60 by 60. The maximum size that we allow at 10 acres I believe is 6,000 square ft. And so this would be sure that you're calling an accessory. Mhm. If there's a house, if they demo the house, then they can

not call an accessory building and build a dwelling dwelling just like this. Right. Correct. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Is there any other person that would like to speak? to build that and hold private quilting retreats for 12 people. Correct. Correct.

Does the applicant have anything additional? You do have a chance at rebuttal if you'd like. [Laughter] No. And what while I get the concern about the water, you know, that water issue is a city issue. Um I mean, we're not going to add to that issue um from where it's located clear back in the back of that corner there. So, I would just ask that we consider that when you guys are considering whether you're going to approve that or not. really they won't even know we're there. So,

thank you.

We will now close the public hearing and the commissioners may ask any questions or discuss as you like. I think it is important that we add the um water drainage report to this. So, as a side note on that, um, after receiving the letter today, we, as you all know, every time we do these cases, we send them out for review from all sorts of entities, whether it be fire districts, uh, public works, environmental health, um, in this case, City of Topeka. um you we send them out for review and comment and public works did not have an issue with it and did not ask us to include the drainage report which is why it was not added on to begin with. Um typically if they have a concern about it they ask us to include that. Now they're looking at the change in impervious area just like Mr. S was indicating when there's a large change in impervious area then it is a concern. However, since this property did have a house and several buildings on it previously, the way that he weighed that is that we weren't really changing uh the impervious area because you're taking off some buildings and adding another one. And so that kind of weighs against one another. However, after today, I had sent him the letter and said, you know, can you review this and give us a input? and he also notated that if that water issue is an issue, then what the the current owners are not doing is needing to correct a current issue. We just want to make sure that they're not enhancing that issue. And so he said, why don't we go ahead and ask for that drainage report so that we can see, you know, if this would modify things at all. Um those drainage reports, whether or not it would have been asked for here, we require them with commercial buildings regardless. And while this is not going to be a

commercial property and this is a conditional use permit, which is just a, you know, if if they would terminate the quilters retreat, someone else can't come in and just use it for whatever they want. It would be in essence an accessory building at that point. Um, but it it would require based on the building permit for them to re respond with a drainage report anyway. So regardless of whether we do it now or as a part of the building permit, they're going to have to do that drainage report and it's, you know, something that we require of all commercial style buildings. Um, I also had talked to Miss Perez about adding a condition on here that insinuates that they need to follow their business plan because that we didn't include that as one of the conditions at the get-go. And so I want to make sure that we include that as a condition. So I would ask that we amend it to a number five that states that they follow it their business plan. And I would notate that that would be amended to to state the 12 quilters or seers. Isn't that basically what number three says except without the actual number that you're limited to just this what's in the business plan you're talking

we so actually if you instead of adding a number five we could yes we could just say number three the use of the facility is limited um I would like to state specifically though that it is based on the business plan that they submitted um as amended today so just add uh based on the business plan submitted according to the business plan.

So maybe a answer to the issue if there's going to be extra water coming off the property, which is at this point debatable because they could, like I say, they could do an accessory building. Could we require them to uh and on the as there's a looks like there's a draw going from north to south in there that they could build a BM to direct the water from that. No, I would not ask that you do that. Um I would ask that we just follow whatever the drainage report signifies.

Yeah. because then the county engineer will review it and we'll give them recommendations or requirements based on that drainage report. I don't want to add something that we don't know for certain is going to be good. It could be that we add something that is a totally unnecessary or b could cause other issues. And so those reports are done by engineers and then it's submitted to our county engineer who reviews it and then makes specific requirements. So whatever we approve today will be subject to correct if anything they may say that nothing needs to be done.

Is there any other discussion? Are the commissioners ready to make a decision? I'll make a motion to approve based on the call it four conditions now and also with a note to add to condition three that they will operate the submitted business I'll thank you if there's no further question or discussion then we'll take the role Myron Lightweather, yes. Dan Brian, yes.

Janette Johnson, yes. Chad Ghart, yes. Rosa Kavasos, yes. Terry Robinson, yes. With a unanimous vote in favor, the planning commission recommends approval of the item and it will be heard by the board of county commissioners on Monday, August 11th. And notate that those are now Monday meetings. I like to say this to everybody because they used to be Thursday meetings and now they're Monday meetings. So Monday mornings at 9:00 in front of the board of county commissioners.

Yes, you can still go ahead and do No, I was thinking I was up but you go ahead and call the public comment. All right. Is there any public comment on non-aggenda planning and zoning items? uh then we will have a discussion of planning related issues at this time. Uh first we need to um review the proposed budget. So that's that's me. Yeah, you all are free to leave unless you would like to hear about the budget.

Oh, come on. Why don't you go ahead and stand up here, sir? Yeah, absolutely.

I'm very confused at how long it has t to get a building on two acres of ground. How much delay there has been on me getting approval on this building to get it built. I started on this project last June or excuse me last November I diligently get an engineer to get started I don't know every time I turn around seems like another meeting and I'm being told now I need to go on I guess I'm confused approval process I mean this is acres of farm warehouse next to a piece of commercials on the property. That's all it is. There's no water. There's no sewer. It's a warehouse. And I have already put my building once. I had to cancel the order $10,000 price $10,000 inte And I'm just wondering my excavator 90 120 days now. I'm trying to see if there's any way that you guys could hold a special meeting or something. I was figuring tonight since I started paying taxes this community just property on my building not my homes not my rental houses not my personal vehicle but maybe that doesn't matter it does to me because my money goes into this county I'm very concerned about and I don't know if you all are aware of

this but there is in general talk amongst engineers and everybody in this town that approval process has slowed way down here and I can personally see it. I can drive around this county and see nothing going on. I'm not blaming. I'm just saying for me personally I've witnessed it. I've delayed things. I was told last time I was here previous not by you guys by my engineer July 15th drop dead two days ago I get told I had to call my excavator again. I'm just ask you guys any way you can hold a special meeting. Maybe I'm talking to the wrong group of people. I don't think I am, but

So, actually, sir, if I can respond to that. Um, we all of this is the preamble to your building permit. Um, we haven't received an application for the building permit yet, but we wouldn't be able to grant that based on zoning and subdivision rules, which is what you're going through right now. Um, I would check with your engineer about your next meeting date because that meeting date is with the board of county commissioners to approve the final plat which is what was considered here today and um that will not be on the 20th for sure because that's a Wednesday and we don't have meetings on Wednesdays. Um, so it depends on when the engineer at this point gets the item to the county surveyor because she has to review it and sign off on it and she has a statutory time frame that she has to review and sign off on that as well as the mapping department. Um, and then we have to take it from once we get that back from your engineer. Then we have the ability to set it for a board of county commission meeting. So, we actually don't even know when that will be until we get the documentation back from them.

He he has steps that he has to follow and that will include at this point now he needs to get it to the county surveyor to do her sign off and review. Well, but sir there those steps have not changed ever. This is the steps that that have to be taken in any situation for a plan. Can you please uh contact us tomorrow and I can send you a copy of the steps that have to be taken in the time frame and we can talk about it a little bit more.

Talk about it. My point is this commission and that commission you two can surely get in a room together and say we have a concern that has paid lots of money to keep people employed in this building and all around this county and we have some kind of special meeting. you get them in this room with you guys and you all talk about it and I'll be glad to get my engineer to get whatever you need. He claims he's got everything he possibly have done. He's waiting on that group, this group. I don't really care. I just know what he's doing to me. It's a detriment to my business. I can't even move things around. My parents sold their lumber yard. They were allowing me to park out there. The new guy is not allowing that. We have been in a rock and a hard spot for a long time. I'm just asking could you all get together and talk about

No sir there's statutory requirements that we have in terms of deadlines but to answer your question in that degree we haven't delayed anything at all we set meetings as soon as we get things submitted to our office uh based on our timelines which are are certain timelines that occur on a regular basis there's been no delay on our end if those delays have occurred I would speak with your engineers because maybe those delays are not coming from us. Okay. Okay. That's not what he's saying. I'm sure we've not we've not pushed anything off one time. So, what would the normal process be for something as simple as this?

It's not simple because you you have not only reszoned your property, but now you've platted your property. That could have all been done at one time had all of that documentation been submitted by the proper deadline and it could have been heard at one meeting um instead of it being at two. But that's not the way that it was submitted to our office and we have specific deadlines. But typically with a a resoning case, I I would say 90 to 120 days. Um with a plat case, it can also be at least 90 days, but I have seen much longer than that depending on how quickly um consultants and engineers get stuff submitted to the departments that have to sign off on things before a plaque can be recorded.

Okay. Okay. So, three to four months is which is what I would probably expect. This started last November. Not with you, right? Correct. Yeah. We didn't get anything until January or February. So, what I'm hearing maybe you didn't get in a timely fing I'll handle the meeting and I was told the meeting was over at 700 and I' been sitt. I'm sorry about that. Please contact me tomorrow and we'll get you some um information. Okay. Yep. Thank you. All right. Now, on to the budget.

Our favorite topic, budget. Okay. So, tonight, uh this presentation is one that I gave to the board of county commissioners a couple of weeks ago, uh at my budget hearing. Um, there is a bylaw that requires you all to see my budget and to sign off on it. In essence, this is a presentation to tell you what it is that's already been presented to the board of county commissioners. Um, you can ask questions. Um, if you have concerns, I can address those. Ultimately, you are doing uh you're acknowledging receipt. Uh, you can approve it or deny it, but it is considered by the board of county commissioners regardless. They approved it.

Uh they have not approved it because we are just getting started with uh those proposals and cuts. Yep.

Um okay. So organizational structure. For those of you that don't know, we actually have five people that work in our office. Um myself and then Harim is the planning and zoning administrator. Jolie at the end over there is one of two planning and development coordinators. Um Courtney Palmer is the other one. Um, and then we've hired recently a planning specialist and his name is Adam. We have a planning intern position that's vacant, but I actually did not even ask to uh fund that this year because I don't think that it'll be necessary to have that uh sixth part-time position. Um, the budget overview, what you see is from 2025, what was approved was 491,169. um personnel services make up over 98% of our budget. And so that's the five staff members that get paid out of our office. Um that's in essence what my entire budget is made out of. We also have some contractual services with vendors such as shredding um water. We have uh other random leases. We pay for training um our papers and supplies. So those fall under the contractual services, leases and supplies and they make up just a tiny less than 2% of the budget. Um in 2026 or yes for 2026 the proposed budget is 537,202. What you should understand is again most of that comes from personnel services and there was close to a $50,000 increase in that this year based on the fact that we have full five full-time employees this year. whereas last year I did not have a full staff and where they budget things is at step one of a range for a position and if we hire people we don't always necessarily hire them at step one and then they also um granted

raises as of July and so that carries over through July of next year and so that's why that has increased um changes in the budget again I notating that MSA1 is the category February of salaries and benefits and that went up 46,000. Um that takes into account a savings of 15,600 for that intermittent position that I left unfunded. So actually if I would have left it funded it would have been an additional 15,000. Um I did increase MSA2 $740 um based on some contracts that have gone up. MSA3 is a decrease of $100. I was moving some money around from mile uh from gasoline to mileage. We used to have a planning car, but we no longer do. And so I use that money to pay mileage now versus um gasoline for a car. Um MSA4 is an increase of $720. And that was an increase in countywide copier expenses and water contracts that we have in the various departments. Uh planning commission activity. We like to do a little overview of what it is that you've done over the last few years. And what you can see is um the cases for 2025 show eight cases as a whole. And that actually didn't include a couple of cases that we had submitted after this was created. I apologize. So that number is eight on here, but it's actually more like 10, if not 11 now. And then that will continue to acrue. I anticipate that we'll probably hit at least the 13 cases that we had last year because we seem to be doing at least one or two a month. Uh board of zoning appeals activity. Uh we haven't had any variances or exceptions until next month. We will have one. So you will see that number change on here. Uh typically it's not as

usual for us to have those board of zoning appeal activities. This is uh what you don't see is that what our office spends mo a majority of our time doing is building permits. Um we issue a lot of building permits every year. Um it looks like so far to well as of when this was printed in for 2025 we had 240 building permits. But if you see historically we do over five or 600 every year um in total and that is on track to to meet that same goal as of this point for the end of this year. Um the fees collected what you can see is we have collected over $93,000 worth um in those building permit fees. Uh we we do not keep any fees that we collect. Those go to the general fund and then the general fund pays our budget. So we do not keep those fees in our own office to use for offset of our budgetary expenses. Revenue generated by type. Um you can see the the differences based on planning commission zoning zoning appeals permits. Uh we also issue the fireworks stands and so every year we um get revenue of about 12,000 for those. typical is anywhere from 150 to 200,000 a year. Um the strategic plan for the planning department um my priorities and goals for the department uh have changed a little bit because my my primary goal over the last several years was getting fully staffed and we've met that goal uh which I'm very proud of. Uh so the next step is our online building permit portal which actually is going to be um opened on August 1st. We're not going to release that to the public for a couple of months though. We're going to use it internally. Uh we will continue to take

all of our applications by paper and we on the back end will enter those into the system so that they start to acrue within the system. However, we need to do a lot of testing on it to work out all the kinks before we release it to the public. So, within a couple of months, I anticipate we will open that up um to the public and everybody that comes in to apply for any sort of permit, whether it be conditional use permit or building permit, will do so online. Similar to the city of Tobas or uh something similar. Yeah.

Not the same one, but something similar. Uh we are my one of my goals is to finalize the solar energy conversion systems uh regulations. Then the next steps of things that I'm going to be doing are building permit procedures. You probably will not hear those because that's something that the the board of county commissioners considers and approves, but that just helps us navigate the procedures that we take for issuing building permits. Um we will start bringing topics of zoning regulations up to you guys to talk about and consider so that we can make some modifications to our zoning regulations. And I would like to do some updates to the plat regulations. One of the things that as Mr. Robertson was mentioning, the city has a minor and a major plat process where anything that doesn't include the dedication of a new road and is like four or five lots or less. They allow them to do it as a minor plat that actually gets reviewed and approved by the planning department without going to the planning commission. And we don't have that process. So even though Mr. Robertson only was doing one lot or two lots or you hear plats here frequently mo most frequently with only one or two lots, we can't do that internally. We have to bring them to you. And I would like to consider an a process where we can do that as an administrative process so that it would save time. It would eliminate quite a few steps. Um, we will continue to look at and review the comprehensive plan and then training for staff. I've tried to encourage staff to to jump on board with any continuing education or training in topics that are of importance and we've been doing a lot of work on document management and record cleanup because we have a lot of really old documents in our office and we save everything. So, we're getting those scanned in and then

destroying all of the the papers. Okay. So, do you guys have any questions about the budget? So, for clarification, we have a budget of $537,22 and we're expecting revenue of

uh anywhere from 150 to 200,000. And that's for the whole department, not just the planning commission. The planning commission is just a small portion of everything that the planning department does. And so yes, the planning department's overall budget proposal is 537,000 and then the revenue that comes in is about I would say 160 is pretty typical. So So the difference is made up by the county taxpayer.

Yep. Yeah. And one of the things that I talked with the commission about this year is we haven't raised um fees. And Terry, you may have, you know, a lot of opinion about this. We haven't raised fees uh ever for the planning department when it comes to not only what we charge for conditional use permits and plat, but for our building permits. There's a misconception that when the building code went into play that building permits uh the costs were increased, but they were not. The resolution approving those costs has not changed since 201 I believe if not actually sooner. It may be sooner than that.

I should know this but are building permits in Shauny County based on the value of the the value of well so

it the way that our this is where it differs the way that the resolution reads is that it is based on the valuation. And so when someone comes in and tells us the value of what it is that they're building, um, they should tell us the total value. And what we had been telling people is that meant the cost of materials and not to include labor. That's actually not how it's supposed to be. You're supposed to include the total cost of what it cost you to build. And that can be a contractual like you know if you work out with a contractor how much is it going to cost me? It would include material labor you know all of the expenses except for things like having to go get permits. Um so we have been in my opinion undercharging people for 15 years. Um and so what I expressed to the commissioners is that I'm not asking to increase fees. I'm asking to enforce the actual fee schedule as it is written um which will increase fees and we'll probably make some people upset but um our office is not like I said it's supported by the general fund and so the taxpayer is paying to support the office and the work we do versus the people who utilize our services in particular. And so if we increase the costs a little bit, the people who are using our services help support our office more so than the general taxpayer.

So as a recently retired builder, I'm more in favor of raising fees than you were. No, I I I just want I just want to make this concern. I I I just in in a time when everybody's looking at budgets and Uh I took a everybody took a big hit again on property tax. I think we need to really be looking at all of our fees and yeah,

you know, applications for for in every category uh so that it doesn't hit just one part hard like like building permit fees. But obviously they are going to need to be raised because I don't I have a a problem with not that uh the county taxpayers pay some of the load, but I am having a problem with the amount of the load that the county taxpayers are making. So, I I would even encourage the the board of commissioners to even allow us to re allow you to restructure all the fees in all the areas to to so that we're at we're at least

we got to be at least at 50%.

Right. So I will say that when I have compared our fees for conditional use permits and resoning and plat etc. we are well above what most counties are already charging and I'm quite surpris and you know it may be I don't know why it may be that they had the foresight of the amount of work that goes into each of these cases. Um, but we we charge $650 to $700, I believe, for each conditional use permit that appears in front of you. Um, some places only charge a hundred or $200. And so, I don't think that by increasing those fees, and we see five to 10 a year, I don't think that that's where the bulk of the issue is. We spend a lot of man-hour doing building permits. A lot. And we have five full-time employees who all day long spend a lot of time answering questions about a lot of stuff, including building permits. And the fees that we're charging do not even come close to covering the workload that we are doing every day.

How about the fees for the fireworks? Is that how does that relate to the time?

We charge No, we charge $500 for one permit per year. every year they have to pay a $500 fee. Um, it's actually a lot less of a process because 20 out of the 24 of those applicants have applied year after year after year and nothing changes. So, it's really just a reconsideration of it's not new site plans, it's not new parcels that have to be checked out. It's all very similar every year. So, I would ask for a motion to approve the proposed budget to be heard and considered by the board of county commissioners.

So, just like second. Thank you. All right, we'll call the role. Janette Johnson, yes. Terry Robinson, no. Rosa Kasos, yes. Dan Brian, yes. Myron Liner, yes. Chad Ghart, yes.

With a vote of 5 to1, the budget is approved. Move on to our solar energy work session. Okay. So, I'm opening up the draft that you all have a copy of. I incorporated all of the changes that were discussed at last month's meeting. Um, we can I really have no specific presentation to give you tonight. This really is incorporating everything that was discussed last time. The only thing that I would point out is that I stated on number seven that battery storage systems as anertinent facility to um a solar energy conversion system project is prohibited. Um I debated how to approach that topic. Um and it could have gone one of two ways. first being the way that I did it, which is to say that they're prohibited. The second would be to engage a full set of battery storage regulations. Um, I elected to do it the way that I did. Uh, one, because I really feel strongly that what we're focusing here is on the solar energy, not the battery storage. And battery storage because they can be considered anertinent facility to a solar farm is one thing but a battery storage facility can also be a completely independent facility. And I felt as though if we allowed battery storage as a part of solar but then as a whole we didn't necessarily want battery storage for the the county those are conflicting. Um and we haven't considered whether or

not we want battery storage in the the county. And so my proposal would be that we put it in here as though it's prohibited at this time and then one of the next steps would be to discuss whether or not battery storage is suitable for Shauny County. And if we end up approving any sort of battery storage um regulations or modifications to our zoning regulations, then we could come back and make a minor amendment here to which we could allow battery storage based on other regulations within Shaunie County. Um so that the question then is what exactly does the battery storage mean to a solar project? Um, solar projects can tap directly into a transmission line or a substation and don't need to have battery storage. There would be no need to store it because it's tapping directly in and going directly to the grid and it's losing velocity, if you will, within that battery storage versus going straight into the grid. Um, the only time battery storage would really be a benefit is if there's ever a solar farm that's not tapping directly into the transmission lines or the grid. I do see I do think that there would be circumstances where battery storage may be the only choice. It would really narrowly narrowly tailor what kind of solar project would occur if we say battery is not allowed. But again, I think that we have to make a decision one way or the other. And if not, then what I would do if you want me to say, you know, I'm going to go back and craft some battery storage regulations. Instead of moving this forward and, you know, trying to schedule some public hearings and start having hearings on the solar farms, I will go back to my office and start drafting another set of regulations in regards to battery

systems. Um, I think that they have to go hand in hand, but they're coordinating. They're not necessarily based solely on one another. They can work together, but you can do it without. And so that is why I left it as a prohibited line on here. Other than that, I have no specific presentation. If you have questions, concerns about what you've seen, um, if you're ready to move on to do public hearings, we can start creating our publications and make a meeting specifically for solar and decide where that's going to be and I'll start getting all that prepared.

So, your thoughts are that I want to make sure that somewhere not related to solar, people may want to use battery storage for other purposes in the county.

Um, battery storage is can be they can be independent systems. Um, they do not have to be attached to a solar farm or a wind farm. Typically, I do believe a battery storage system, if it's independent, would be located near a transmission line or a substation because just the same, you have to be getting that energy from somewhere to get it there to store it. And then once it needs to be used, they would transfer it off to wherever it is that it needs to go. You do not have to have a battery storage system to have a solar farm, though.

I think for the most part, you captured all of the things that we agreed to and the format is is good. I guess the battery storage is the only question. It's hard when we only talk about it once a month because, you know, I have to make an executive decision about how to move forward not knowing what you may think. Um, and in this case, I decided that, you know, based on kind of the history of the conversations that maybe battery is not something that everybody really is super excited about. Not to say that we're not going to end up needing to have some level, but I felt like moving the solar forward without Yeah, actually we're working on this and I think we're to a point where we can get public comments for sure. Uh I I think it's going to be interesting now with the lack of federal funds subsidizing solar energy. It's going to be I think the chances of us actually encountering one special use permit is going to be pretty pretty minimal. Now

think it's down since that bill was signed a public hearing. See what we're saying after that. Does that need to be a motion? Um, it doesn't have to be. I think that if you guys are comfortable, you're not technically voting on anything. You're just telling me that you're confident and comfortable where we're at, that you don't want me to make specific changes. Um, we would just go ahead and move it forward and then you would officially consider it at a public hearing.

We I forget how it went with the wind when we did that. Did we vote on it? We voted on it. public hearing over the station. We heard public comment you voted on it that night. Yeah, that was correct. And we had been discussing it for several months in that case. Um but we didn't have anything ahead of that. That was the big public, right? Is that where you think bigger arena for

I don't really know. I mean, I I think it's better to be safe than sorry and just go ahead and host it at Great Overland. I mean, we know we know the setup. We know how it worked. um we'll we'll publish it in the paper. We'll have our communications director send out some news releases and if we get invited to talk at you know WIBBW or KS&T or wherever um you know anybody can absolutely get up and you know present on that as well. I'll make announcements at BCC meetings so that it gets out there and we'll send um notification to everybody who had requested notification as a part of the original bannon moratorum discussions that we had. So we've got a list of several hundred people that we'll send it to as a part of that. Do you send out what our proposed

regulations will be so that they know?

We would put it on our website. I would I have not yet published these on the website because they were a work in progress. Once we know that we're ready to move forward, then I will put it on the website and we'll start all that publication and then we will do an official public hearing notification and that would take it to the planning commission in front of you and then based on those conversations, public comments, if you wanted to make changes, you can make proposed changes that night. You can make a motion to have a second meeting so that you can work on them some more and then hold more public comment. Um or you vote on it that night and then it goes to the board of county commissioners and we have another public hearing in front of them.

I'm in agreement. I think we're ready to hear from the public. Kyle, do you want them to make a motion and or no? No. Okay. Okay. All right. I'll just say by consensus the commission is asking you to move forward in that direction. Okay. Otherwise, we're sit around here around the same.

Yeah. Yeah. I think that you guys have talked about it. You've had your opinions and now it's time to hear from the public. What I probably will do to start off with is I want to send it out to some entities, get some input. We'll put it out there, invite comment. Um, and we'll start sorting out because we do have a meeting in August, but we are definitely not going to be able to do it at the August meeting. So, I anticipate more like September um is when we would do a meeting on this.

Why not August? um timing for publication. You have to public we would want to publish the notice far enough in advance and while not statuto well it may be actually statutoily required to do it the 21 days ahead. So we would be really tight on timing any further business if not we'll stand adjourned. Thank you. Thank you. Is there much on next month?