County Council - Regular Meeting

May 18th meeting of the county council order to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Any any changes to the agenda? Changes or additions to the agenda? Somebody said we the Purdue extension would come off. Is that right? So, we're pulling that one off. is being no longer there. Commissioner's issue. Hey, you forgot the minutes. Yeah, I forgot to put the minutes on there. So, I will make an addition that we will approve minutes on the agenda. I'll second it or whatever. All right. Is that

a motion to accept the agenda? with the addition of minutes. Second. I What are you looking for? A motion. Oh, I move we add the agenda the minute or the minutes to the agenda. And remove the Purdue extension. And remove Purdue extension. Do you have a second? I'll second. All right. All in favor?

I I Okay, hold unfinished business. We have Kevin Al from CVC for an appropriation of 131,500. Anybody have any questions? We discussed this at length in our work session last time.

Is Julie on? Yeah. Okay. Do you have anything to add to this, Julie? She has to unmute.

There we go. Can you hear me? Yes. Yeah. Okay. What did you What did you want me to add to? Uh, we are approving the CBC appropriation for 131,500. Did you have any have anything to say about that or anything pertinent? I don't we did see from Susan Beavers the appropriation form. I don't know if you got a copy of that. I do not have a copy. I have I have a copy of what was submitted. Yeah. You happen to have Susan something this afternoon or she did sign that or is Susan on by chance?

She is on. Okay. No, this this appropriation she sent. Do you want me to send it to you?

Do we not have a Did we get a paper copy that? I believe I don't know if we did or not. Let me just go through this real fast. Okay. Everything I had was in our packet that I gave you, so I don't think I have it. Okay. I do have an agreement for Susan, but that's about it. Okay. Who's the appropriation for? It's for the CBC. Oh, you already approved that the last meeting. You just have to actually agree with it. Yeah, we have to Well, we we agreed to approve it tonight. We just have to officially approve it.

Okay. and we do not have the printed version of it. Can we go ahead and approve it tonight and then sign it at our work session? I'm sending it to her. Susan, if you're on um We don't have that printed copy apparently. Do we need to sign? Are you talking about this? Yeah. Here it is. It's on it way to you. Here you go. Okay, there we go. Got it. Never mind. It got printed off. Can I get a copy of that, too? Okay, Jim. I just sent it to you. Thank you, Jim.

So, there two are two line items on there that uh Julia will have to assign a line item for because under the CBC budget, there wasn't anything for software. So, she'll have to assign a line item for that. Um, and then the other thing was the marketing that I did not know whether they were doing that through the CVB. I did not think that was the case by the explanation that Kevin had at the last meeting. I thought they were doing that separately and so that would need alignment item number as well. Placer AI, I think that's what you're talking about or mountain bike.

Mountain bike. Yeah. And I responded to your email Susan. So this is Kevin. So that's under the CVB. Which one? Both or both? Both are under the CVB. Both mountain biking and placer AI 46,500 or 56,500 are under CVB. CBV.

Does that change your So it it does change that just a little bit. um right because I want to make sure that that gets into the that CBB um contract is in a actually 50,000 series when you look at the line item number um so those two things would get added into that 50,000 um which is um apologize let me pull that up real fast I did not realize that Julie was gone. That would be why she didn't um respond to an email today. So, didn't know that she was out. So, hopefully she's having a good time. Um

and that conference. Oh. Oh, well, sorry. That's not maybe not a good time, but um yeah. So, Susan, while you're thinking about that, I see Darren looking at the advertisement. Does that change the advertisement for those two items or should Are we clear on that? It does not. Okay. No, that is totally clear. And so in your income tax fund, that 1127 um all 131500 then would go into that 50,000 line and there would not be anything in the 30,000 line if that makes sense. So you can approve it

right as everything coming out of the other 50, 131,500. Um and then we'll just correct down below that little breakdown for Julie. Um, that's what that is down below. So, okay. So, I'll go to the 50750 line. Okay. So, for the ordinance that you have as written, we at um we approve zero on the 30,000 line and then we approve 1315 on the 50,000 line. Correct. Okay.

Thank you. Okay. So, uh, council bill number six, which includes the CBC appropriation of 1315 and also an advertised amount for the clerk of 7,200 for uh, election board salaries and pay. Can you turn the mic on here for a minute? Yeah. Give me the mic. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Chair, I got a question. Okay.

All right. Uh, help me understand this if you will based on the 2026 uh adopted budget line item. A line item. line item is 1103. It's for the election board members. We appropriated 12,800 hours and now all of a sudden today I find out that we are requesting I think it's a 56% increase above and beyond the 12,800 for another $7,200. Can you help me understand that?

No. Okay. Do you have Do you have Pita's pro request that I sent out? Maybe she has something on there that would explain it. Yeah. Well, I'm having a difficult time with it. If if what I if what my assumption is accurate, it says election board members. I believe there's three election board members. True. Are are there three election board members? Yes. Yes.

Okay. So, we allocated $12,800. So, if you want to take that, divide it by three, and now all of a sudden, we're coming back and say, "Oh, no, no, no. We need a 56% increase. Another $7,200. That's $19,000. I I Why? Maybe she needs to come to our next meeting and explain it." Yeah. Well, I'm not going to approve it. So, I've said I've said my piece. Thank you very much. Julie, do you have anything on that? The only thing I had on it is what I sent to you guys already. A request. That's all I know about.

Did we see that? Yeah. Let's Susan, since this is part of council bill number six, can we can we table that portion of it, do we have to write another ordinance for our next meeting for it and zero this out?

Yeah, I I would suggest yes, since it's been advertised for now, the the notice to taxpayers is the advertisement that we're going to have a public hearing on this. So, if you want to continue the public hearing for this until the next meeting, you can do that and you can announce it in this meeting right now. The additional appropriation that you have before you, if you do not intend to appropriate anything in that line item, you can put zero to the outside. Julie should not have to advertise it again to the notice as a notice to taxpayers because you're announcing right now that you're continuing the public hearing on that appropriation for your next regular meeting in June. Okay. Uh, do we need to do that at our regular meeting or can we do that at our uh, Thursday work session regular?

I I would do it at your Monday night regular meeting. Okay. Anybody have any any objection to that? No, I think we need an explanation. Okay.

So, what motion do we need on that consation? Right. So, um what you can do is you can move to approve it. If the inclination of the entire council is to not appropriate that money in the general fund at this meeting, you can move to appropriate zero in that and that $131,500 in the inkeepers tax fund. And that can be your motion for tonight with a second. And I want to make a motion that we zero out the $7,200. I'll second. Right. We have a motion in a second to approve. Approve nothing. Zero. Zero it out. Still approve the 131.

Yeah. Yeah. Make a motion to that effect. I'm going to make a motion. I'm going to make a motion that we um approve zero dollars in this 10,000 personal service uh line item on this ordinance that I've got in front of me under the general fund for the election board for the election board and and and approve the 1315 for CBC. Are you just making that motion for I'm making this separate motion specifically for the election board. Okay. Do we have a second on that? I'll second.

I have a motion, a second to zero out the $7,200 for the election board until our next regular Monday meeting. Motion a second. All in favor? I. All opposed. Jim. Huh? Oh, I thought you said roll call. Roll call. Roll call. Start with me. I'm sorry. I can go somewhere else. Jim. Uh, yes. Patrick, yes. Scott, yes. Judy, yes. Darren, yes. Gary, yes. Joel, yes. Thank you.

Okay. Now I'm looking for a motion to approve the 131,500 for the CBC. Additional appropriation for the CBC. I'll make a motion to approve 131,500 for CBC. Have a second.

I'll second. Uh discussion. Yeah. Um I was uh Brian and Kevin earlier about

how I pulled up her appropriation and that says the IC3-65.6-6 states that the county election board are to be paid an annual salary of not less than 5,000. Please see attached. And I've also got an email, this is Jim Kemp. I've also got an email from uh Susan Beavers that was sent out this afternoon at 2:05 p.m. IC3659 compensation of members and secretary. Um the clerk is requesting an additional for election board pay. Can we we have a motion and a second?

Well, but Julie just interrupted and took us right back to this the We have a motion, a second for the for the CBC appropriation. We need to finish that.

All right. So, we need and then you'll come back. Okay, that's fine. Good. Well, we were discussion. So, the this the pickball courts uh expense came up several months ago. I think it was actually supposed to be approved last year and it's been delayed quite a bit. Um but we've talked about in our inkeepers tax meetings um you know with capital expenses that will require ongoing maintenance on public property and could possibly be borne by taxpayers that we come up with a plan for providing those maintenance expenses rather than shouldering those with taxpayers. So, this one is a little different than, you know, because it came through much before those conversations. But I do want to as a a committee, the inkeepers tax committee, you know, we've talked about identifying I see Mark Shields here. Identifying operating and maintenance expenses that are tourism related in the current county's budget, which include parks and recreation, Salt Creek Trail, uh Covered Bridge, Pioneer Village, the county fairgrounds. I'm missing one.

Okay. But so I think we need to the overlook is a prime example and I can and I can fill you in on what the CVB and parks and recck board has been working on if you'd like me to in regards to that.

Well, and so I think it's it's not just that one, right? And it's not these aren't all about new expenses. These are actually about pre-existing tourism related expenses within the county's budget that have been borne by taxpayers. and the the idea that that our our group has talked about and and all agreed to which is offsetting those expenses that have been borne by taxpayers for many years that are tourism related with some of those inkeepers tax dollars in the hopes that some of those funds could be applied to critical county needs such as public safety etc. And so I think we need to get back to that conversation. And you know, we've had several requests for capital. You know, pump tracks, pickle ball courts, these are all really great things. So we need maintenance plans for those things when they come before council to to to guarantee future ongoing maintenance funds, whether whether it's with the folks operating the facilities for private gain or whatever, or coming out of the inkeepers tax. But then we also need and especially before we continue to expand with capital projects out of the inkeepers tax on county properties uh we need to address the pre-existing expenses that taxpayers have been paying for tourism related things and and get that taken care of before we continue to add to it. And and so and so that was kind of my just cue to the council that we've got to come back to that and to the committee so that we just do what we kind of said we were going to do and address those issues however that may look. Any other comments?

Ryan, you had something you wanted to add?

Yeah. Okay. Uh Brian Tadlock, chairman of the CBB. So in our discussions with uh the parks and rec board in particular with the Bean Blossom overlook with this particular structure, it was kind of put up and we needed a roof, but a lot of um our discussions have evolved to the point where we're ready to execute cuteus so that the CDB can do sunset dinners, sunrise breakfast, plain air events. These are the types of things that we can do in order to utilize these great county assets to generate revenue and give back to the county. So whether that be in a non-reverting maintenance fund so that these things don't continue to consume a ton of general fund expenses, then that is our intent with these items. Sustainability is the key discussion and it had it has really never left uh the top of- mind conversations that we've had with parks and wreck in particular um you know with these discussions. Same thing with the pump track as we move forward or even with the initial discussions that we've had with the pickle ball club as well. That's a key thing uh between Danny Keys and and his group and the CVB as well. And one of the big reasons why we wanted to go from six courts to eight courts is because that makes us tournament legal in order to have tournaments to offset these to offset these expenses. Um because regardless of the pump track which has seen a huge amount of use in and of itself, it is a county asset which means the county has to pay the expenses on it and we need to utilize those things in order to help generate revenue. It would be fantastic at some point to be able to say that the parks and recck budget is completely covered by revenue generation at these great

facilities and therefore it comes off your roles completely. So I mean that's that's all I wanted to say and a point to the pickle ball courts going from six to eight. We have six courts. We basically just have a recreational pickle ball court set out there and no other way of of monetizing it. We go from six to eight and we are tournament legal. We can we can establish tournaments, have tournaments and welcome all the benefit that that brings. Correct. While still having it for um the locals to use um anytime that they want.

Yep. Thank you. All right, we have a motion and a second on the appropriation of 131,500 for the CBC. All in favor? I opposed. I'm going to abstain. Okay, roll call. Yeah. Patrick, no. Scott, yes. Joel, yes. Darren, yes. Gary, yes. Judy, yes.

All right, that is approved. Jim, abstain.

Um, before we get into Um, anybody have before we get into the salary events update? Um, solid waste has a couple of appropriations. We want to take care of those first. Sure.

Right. Um, Brown County Council resolution whereas Brown County Solid Waste has received monies from Gov Deals auction for the sale of four old mobile plastic bins be a resolved by the Brown County Council of Brown County Indiana that the following additional sum of money be hereby appropriated to the general fund. Then into the fund listed below for the purposes specified above subject to the law governing the same uh fund name repairs and maintenance amount approved by the fiscal body $50 and that is from the sale of they had some old couple of old plastic bins that needed to get rid of and put them on gum deals and they sold them for $50. So, we just need to appropriate that money back into their their budget.

The second one, Brown County Council additional appropriation. Whereas Brown County solid waste was awarded Brown County Community Foundation grant. We have additional income that was not predicted or appropriated in our 2026 budget. Therefore, be it resolved by the Brown County Council, Brown County, Indiana, that the following additional sums of money are hereby appropriated into the general fund, then into fund listed below for the purposes specified above subject to the laws governing repairs and maintenance amount appropriated $2,500. And we have to appropriate that because it was a grant from the community foundation to help them cover repairs to the west wall that has been damaged and the longer it waits the worse it's going to get. It's kind of a it's a maintenance it's a repair issue and also issue. Anybody have any questions? Got a motion to approve.

I'll move to approve it. Motion. Do we have a second? Second. Second. All in favor? I. Jim, yes. Patrick, yes. Scott, yes. Joel, yes. Darren, yes. Gary, yes. Judy,

yes. Brown can clerk on new business. That is going to be old business at our next meeting. Okay. Salary or update and discussion. Do you have anything, Julie? Okay. Wait, can wait a minute. Okay, hold on. Let's go back. Finish. Yes. Okay. I'm going to read this into the record. So, we got it on YouTube TV

and it's documented. This is an email again from Susan Beavers on Monday, May 18, 2026 at 2:05 p.m. It was sent out to all council members. Julie Ree was CCed on it. It states the clerk is requesting an additional for election board pay. However, she cites a statute that is limited to Porter County. Only Porter County is required to pay the election board members not less than $5,000. Brown County would fall under a different statute. She then quotes Indiana Code 3-6-5-9 compensation for members and secretary section 9. Each county fiscal body shall determine in the manner provided by law the compensation of number one the appointed members of the county election board and two the circuit court clerk for the clerk's services as secretary of the county election board. So that should clear up that issue. Thank you.

Thank you. Any other discussion on that? Okay, Julie. Yes. Salary ordinance amendment. Yes. Do you have anything to add on that?

I do not. I sent out what I've so far what I have. I have more to come but for right now that that basically is the only thing that would be affected would be the um base pay the base the we already pay already we already pay the stipens we already pay the longevity so the only thing that would really be affected would be the base pay

Jim there was a There was information that you had requested that's really sent out to you. Have you been able to look at?

Uh, no. I was out of the office all last week and I've not had an opportunity to go through those two Excel spreadsheets that she said or the PDFs rather. So, you know, furthermore, I think it would be wise for at the next special session meeting that for us to put that on the agenda and discuss that thoroughly considering the fact that we agreed that we've got to use the 2026 salary ordinance. First, we've got to understand what's in it. And then secondly, we've got to use that going forward to determine the salary ordinance for 2027 because I'm assuming that we all were on the same table, same page with regards that we really need to run hard to work on the salary ordinance for 2027 first before we start moving into the budget hearings because considering the fact that labor cost is, you know, your single largest expense of the county budget.

Yes. And in our budget process for 2027, the first stepping stone we have is the amendment to the 2026 salary ordinance which we have has been presented to us. And we really cannot go any further with this year's budget or next year's salary ordinance until we get this one approved and taken care of. Um, anybody have any discussion?

Well, you all can do what you want. I'm not going to vote to approve the salary ordinance, okay? Because I do not have the information that I need to where I've got a clear understanding of what's in that salary ordinance and I will not vote on something as large as an $8 million worth of labor cost, not understanding what's in it. You know, I've said this this we've had several meetings and I've verbalized this for the last several weeks on in. So, you the rest of you can do what you want. So they don't let me hold you up on it.

Well, the amendments in the salary have been discussed for months. We went over line by line all the changes that have been made as an amendment to the salary ordinance and it was agreed to be understood by all and accepted by all and ready to move forward with it. And then it didn't move forward. Judy, I know you had a question about it. Have you been able to look over any of your concerns?

I have briefly looked at it. Yes. Um, I still think that we probably still need to have discussions with this, but on what you guys did with those which I hope that we can clear up here in the next week or two with Lorie since she had responded back to us in a couple of days. That's my question. Yes.

So outstanding issues to keep it from moving forward are what? Swiss and anything else? Curious. Did you have any Let's clarify them so we can identify them and move it forward. Well, Mr. Good.

Could you stand up right now and do a presentation on 180 employees in the Brown County government with 26 different departments and tell me which employees and which departments are currently being paid 2025 pay grades as opposed to how many employees through what departments are now being paid under the new factory evaluation system and how much of an increase that they've they've they've uh they've experienced. Can you speak to that specifically? And do you can would you testify that you know that? That's not what I asked to ask.

I'm just asking a question. Can you do you know actually know what's in it? I mean what you're doing is you're asking you know 2025 2025 was under the old pay grade system. Correct. Correct.

Okay. Furthermore, in 2025, while we were working on the 26 budget, we all agreed that we would hold the 2026 uh payroll at the 2025 level. Matter of fact, you sent out an email to every department, right? Asking every department to go in and leave the compensation under personal services at 2025 with no cost of living, no cola adjustments. And then at the last minute, you all decided at a meeting in Seymour with Rei that you were going to go in and change and bump specific employees within the county. All right. And I have yet to see a one or two page report that specifically shows each position within each whatever departments they're in, which I have no idea of. How much of an increase did you give these select employees? I've never gotten a copy of that.

It was I have no I Darren I I have a copy of it that was emailed to all of us. Then then show it to me now. I want to see it. What I don't understand is why I've never gotten that one or two. It should be a one or a twopage report. Was it 10 employees? Was it I don't even know how many employees you guys How many employees was it? It was this one that Julie has spent weeks together for you. What is it you don't understand about my question?

I keep asking the same question, but you continue to deflect. There's no deflecting what it I don't need an Excel spreadsheet with 180 employees and then I've got to spend three hours, four hours trying to go through that massive report to simply determine how many employees Darren, you were there. How many employees of the 180 employees in the 26 departments did you increase their pay based on the factory evaluation system and how much did you increase that pay above and beyond the 2025 pay grade levels? That's been Can you tell me the employ how many can you answer that question?

Who needs to bend over backward to give you that information when the information is here because it's a rational objective question. It's been given to you. You can't answer the question. The truth is you know you want me to summarize all of this in my own words I can't how many employees it's written in a document that's why we have the document so it can be how many employees of the 180 and the 26 departments did you all increase what it appears to me is you don't want that information

this information is right out you don't want the employees to know what positions were increased above and beyond 2025 And you know, and we talk about an open door law, and the problem I've got with the open door law is what isn't brought up. If the audience, what the audience ought to be listening for is what isn't being asked. All right? And what I've never seen, this is a simple question. It's a simple request. Of the 180 employees, how many employees with what departments did you increase their compensation? 15, 10, 100? How many did you increase? I cannot summarize it for you because it's seven pages that I can't I gota go through you go through the pages and find it.

I can go through the pages and look at it. Have you done that? No, I'm not going to do that. I didn't have anything. Julie spent weeks compiling that for you because you specifically asked. You're deflecting. You're gaslighting. You are deflecting and you won't address my question. You won't address my You are deflecting and you are gaslighting me right now. I'm not going to tolerate Jim. It's okay, Jim. Um, and there just I mean, let's just bring it back down here. Um, do you understand? So, well, and that's what I want to get to. That's what I I and I think there was there were and and and Judy and I had talked about this before. There were a few positions that were changed at some point. That was a two-page document that was given to Jim two months ago. No.

Okay. So, hold on, hold on, hold on. So, there were a few positions and I think that's what I think it's those few positions that were changed after we looked at the uh salary ordinance that were changed that I think Judy and I had questions about. We just want to know how it happened. Did it follow the WHIS, you know, fees system? And Jim, I think that's what you're referring to. Is that am I you're hearing me right? Okay. All right. because I I think those are how many time how many times do I have to ask this question? Is my question so difficult to understand? Am I not asking it the correct way? I'ming what I think I heard. Can let me May I state it one more time? Just for the record.

Just for the record. You have approximately 20. You get 26 departments. Matter of fact, the largest department in the county is the law enforcement center, which is the sheriff deputies, the jail, and the dispatch. There are approximately on any given day 180 employees. How many employees were kept at the 20 25 pay grades and did not receive any cola? Number one. Number two. So there's more than one question. Okay. So your first one is

I'm giving you context. Specifically speaking of the sheriff's department, the sheriff's department didn't get a raise because the sheriff didn't get a raise. And since they are the ones that decided they wanted to go by those by the state's stuff, that's not the county's problem. Okay, so question, right? Question one is how many employees stayed at the 2025 rate with no colo, right? What employees did you guys give raises to? And then second, how many who are they? How many in what departments? Secondly, how many employees did get raised, right? Who did and who didn't? Who did? Yeah. Who are the employees?

I think that's what that spreadsheet was. I I looked at that spreadsheet. I think that's Did I get I would think that you you know, first of all, you got a person we pay full-time do payroll. Number one. Number two, you know, you all worked on that. I mean, did you give it to half the employees? You give it to 20% of the employees, you know. So, can I please can I throw this out, please? math was out. I'm not trying to be argumentative,

but we went down there, we worked on it, decided that we couldn't do the $800 and some thousand dollars. Thought we could do a third. We brought that back to county council. We didn't arbitrarily make any decision, Jim. Let me finish. We did not vote. We could not vote. We did not make an arbitrarily decision. It was brought back to county council that this was what we had worked on and then we it went from there. So please do not blame us as like voting that we voted it in. We did not vote anything in the day that we went down there. It was an idea and we brought that forward.

So who made the decision? Because let me give you another example. Let me let's talk about something else while we're on this subject and bring up the salary ordinance. Okay, the commissioners have a commissioner's administrative assistant. So, you have the commissioner's assistant and then the commissioner's assistant has an assistant. Correct. Yes, I do. Do you know that was not funded in the budget, but somehow it got slid in on the salary ordinance. Slid in on the salary ordinance. Yeah. $66,000 total cost is what that job cost. I had nothing to do with that. Well, okay. Who made the decision to do that? Not me.

All right. And when I sit here and and and and you know and I hear nothing but deflection and get gaslighted when I ask a very simple question which is how many employees of the 180 received increases in compensation for 26 who are they? The question would do that

as you mentioned about saying holding the 26 to 25 without cola. If you have that information, it would seem that the changes we have discussed and they are in discussion for months to to increase to step into the new system and we still have things such as understanding the fees factor evaluation system to confirm that um that information if you compare those two what the current presentation is for the 2026 versus the old 2025 you would get an idea of what is increased. Why can't you produce a report? We didn't do a report. You got

Why can't Why can't you simply answer the question who what positions within what departments received increases in compensation for 2026? And I think if you put those two documents next to each other, obviously you all don't want to address that question for whatever reason. I'm not sure quite why. But I tell you what, I don't. It's a simple question. All right. But clearly nobody wants to address that question. And it it's it's Jim, I think I think I hear what you're saying, but I do hear what you're saying. I think Julie

gave the council a spreadsheet based on what she heard you asked for. And I I looked at it and it sounded like what it sounded looked like what you asked for, at least the last spreadsheet. But I do see some other questions here that wouldn't be answered by that spreadsheet. and and maybe they hadn't been answered. I thought they were the few new positions.

Well, I'm still yet to see how the changes the ones that that were changed beyond the evaluation of onethird the change the job description changes that were reviewed and that kind of thing. I have yet to see those and get the answer from on those because we've not had a meeting with them. Those are the ones that I have a major question of. Those changes were made. We as council haven't seen them and we haven't figured out exactly how they did that. Meaning I had nothing to do with that. Those changes that were made and given a salary or whatever. I had nothing to do with that. So my question has been I want to see how that would compare with what would do and that's what I am still waiting on. That's my

Okay. So, that's what you need. What else do we need? That's a That's a reasonable request. Correct. We had the issue and I think that both of you were making that request. Yeah, we did. And I just heard Jim ask for it again. I've not voted on the salary. That was question five. Question four was who made the decisions? We did when we approved the FES system and the original salary ordinance for 2026. Yes. But I think he's I think you're he's Well, maybe I misunderstood the question. I think he was saying before we were asked to approve it who changed salary grades and yeah I'm not sure that matters as long as it's accurate. I'm not sure that that happened. What you there's two completely different subjects. Yeah,

what Jim was asking who approved all of the salary increases

and that was those went those were increased because of the fees system and the new paygrade system that did away with the old clunky arbitrary system that we have. We now have a new system that is that is guided by job descriptions, the job position, what the job does. And that's why we wanted to get that uh system implemented. That system sets the pay the pay grid for us to implement the system with an average compensation comparable to surrounding counties. That target was 850,000. We do not have the money to do that. So what we did is a partial increase for people who were below that line without while leaving the people above that line in place. They did not get an increase of any of any kind because they are above the line of the fees system. We brought everybody below that line up to the total of $270,000 which would have been the equivalent of a 3% across the board cola increase. So that's how to summarize that without going through this entire thing and pulling out people's names and saying this is what they made last year and this is what they made this year for as Jim points out 181 people which I'm not going to do because it is in a document that can be read for anybody who has a question about it. So,

as a as a Hold on, hold on. As a courtesy to Judy and Scott, I would I I would, my personal opinion like to hear a motion to table this until we can talk to Whis and get their questions clarified. And any questions for Jim that that may clarify? Well, we do have a date now that they can meet with us. My question still stands of what do we need to resolve it? It's just an open question. We need the FS understanding from WHIS, right? Anything else? What can we do so we can

What I'm hearing from Judy what I'm hearing from Judy and Scott is they want to to hear from Whis that the the the page and a half of changes that we made which what how many how many changes was that J Julie do you know off hand? She's muted.

And we did go through those at work. Some of the ones we went through at the work session that that that Julie sat with everybody who had questions on it and showed them exactly who was adjusted after meeting with the department head because well like like one instance the baiff was way underpaid. He was categorized the same as uh security guard at the front. So he had since he overseas there was a descriptor that was left out of his his uh

um his job description that led it led him to be classified as as security. parks and there were cut the one there was a parks and wreck uh position that was going to be way overpaid because of the supervisor that was put into it. Correct. There were some small changes. You have the court baith. Yeah. You also have the the court system because they made two chief deputies for the judge and she only has one. Um, I'm just going off the top of my head here, but I mean that's that's the type of things that were changed.

Yeah, it was about a It was about a dozen. I have a list. I brought the list to you. You we went over it multiple times. I know. Um Scott Scott and Judy are simply just waiting for um I guess an approval or an okay. I'll just say don't wait on me because I know how I'm going to vote. you're not gonna like it and this is not going to change that. So don't wait on me. So I I would like to speak unless there only certain people that can speak.

No, but here's my we beat this. I don't know what more Julie can do concerning this. And so if we if we talk about it then what's going to be the next item the next time? I looked over that sheet. I'm satisfied whether Jim is or he isn't. Jim's not the boss. There's seven of us. We all make up our own mind. We all have the right to do that. I make a motion we vote on this tonight. Second. All right, we have a motion and a second that we vote on it tonight. Well, my only question is maybe to Susan. We didn't advertise it as a vote. I see it's discussion and update. So, I mean I I don't know if that is a problem. Susan,

not a problem. It does not have to be advertised. Is there a chance I might be able to Yes. Go ahead.

Pam Gold taxpayer. Um, as a taxpayer, I am um I am uh very pleased with the amount of diligence that has gone into this and the changes that you're trying to make, understanding that this transition is messy. Um, sounds like you have collected a tremendous amount of data and you're simply lacking the summarizing to make proper data analysis. Is there anyone on the payroll that understands AI and chat GPT and those kinds of tools that can run through that data and spit out a summary in split-second fashion? I think it could be a marvelous tool um for you guys to have access to or to have somebody on the payroll that knows how to do that so that you can get quick information without having to be uh do redundant work um that would take hours for a human being to do that AI can do in a fraction of the amount of time. question.

My name is Sher Mitchell. Jim Kemp, I agree with you 100%. And yes, that tasted like vinegar. But yeah, I'd like to see that, too. Um, I have a question. I I think um I understand that some of our employees are getting overpaid and some of them are getting underpaid. How are you going to fix that? that is happening through the through the further implementation of the fees system. As I said, what we had was we had in the old structure we had pay grade seven, pay grade 8, pay grade 9, pay grade 12 and there was always discussion of well this person does this, this person does this, this person does this. So there were always changes based on what somebody did. What we did with the fees system simplified all that. This is the job. This is what the job is. And then we categorized, we classified each job based on what they did within the same system basically the state of Indiana does and several government agencies in their in their payroll system. In doing that and through the through WIS's um study, we found comparable pay grades of surrounding counties, the counties that were competing with for the labor pool and counties of similar size. And we did a pay grade a pay a salary study on that to see where we compared. We got a a list. I've got it with me. It's been everybody has seen it. Everybody got a copy of it. Wis handed everybody a copy of it and it showed some people that were more underpaid based on that guidance

than some other people. And then we have some people in the county who are above that. The people who are above that line did not get an increase last year and they're not going to get an increase this year until the full implementation of the fees system that brings the the people who are under compensated for what they do up to adequate compensation and then that catches up to everybody. It is a multi-year process.

I'm sorry, Darren. Let me let me ask the question again. I understand that the salary ordinance that you're working off of right now. Some people are underpaid and some people are overpaid. Just as you talked about the gentleman in the clerks in the in the courtroom. Okay. He's being underpaid, right? So, how are you going I mean, are you going to write them all big fat checks the people that you overpaid? Are you going to take a check? How are you going to do that? Julie, that would be a question for you to answer. Thank you.

There she comes. How are you? Okay. Refer run that question by me one more time. If people are being overpaid or underpaid, how do we rectified in the future as we go through this transition of into a new system? Are we going to have to pay people more? Are we going to have to take take uh pay from people? You you can't take pay away from people, number one. So the people that are that are being that are above the the scale that we have now cannot be they cannot have any money taken away from them because they are being they are being basically compensated for what they do. Well, let me let me everyone

let me let me go specifically to the question. I think you're answering a different question that was asked. The question is we have in that page and a half those dozen dozen and a half people that we corrected for some of those in the salary ordinance amendment we reduced their initial salary. We we reduced the increase in their salary. We didn't actually reduce their salary below the static level. What we did is we reduced the increase down to a reasonable increase. I think the question is, are we paying those people the large increase and are we going to have to take money back from them to get them back down to where they should be?

Is that the question? Yes. Currently, yes. that I mean if you're going if we're going by that first by the first um salary ordinance I do believe that it that it it had the increases on it. I will have to check that when I get back but okay to make to see for sure. So there there there's a handful of employees who salary adjustments will have to be made for once we get the salary ordinance amendment passed and that cannot happen until

Sherry wants to call me on Friday. I will let her know because I can I can go through it and tell you tell her how will you do it for sure question. Well, I mean let's say it's $1,000. You can't just take that out of somebody's check. They won't be able to make rent or not. So, would you take it out over 10 months? Would you take it out over 12 months? No,

they're still going to be increased, Sherry. They're not going to We're not taking them back down to the actual pay they were. We increased them for a reason, but we're not going to uh according to some of the department heads, their job did not their job description did not warrant the $5,000 to $6,000 pay raise that they received. Okay. Well, the question is, are they getting that extra 5,000 currently? I I will have to check that in the salary ordinance. Okay. That we passed the current one you have. Okay.

So, with that being the potential case, the sooner we do this, the less hardship this is going to cause. Well, that was the whole point of it. But, you know, which was why we tried to get this done three months ago, six months ago. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Just be gentle when you have to do I hope I Yeah, be very gentle. Yes, I that will be taken into consideration. Thank you.

Okay, we do have a motion and a second on the table. Any further discussion? Okay, we have a motion to approve the salary ordinance amendment as has been given to us for the past many weeks and a second. So, all in favor? I I All opposed. I Judy, no. Joel, yes. Gary, yes. Darren, yes.

Scott, no. Patrick, yes. Jen, no. Okay, Julie, we finally got the salary ordinance amendment passed.

Are you there? Yes. Thank you. You're welcome. Now, as we go into the budget, as we go into this budget process, if we all have the these concerns that we have, can we get them addressed and taken care of as we go through this? Uh we're going to be this is going to require a lot of diligence, a lot of intention, and a lot of paying attention to numbers so we don't run into this again.

Well, and I think we're also going to be hearing from list so that will give us some sort of Yeah. help I hope. And I still I was going to give you some time for you to get there, but I still But I still want to get you the clarification on this. And anybody else have any other comments about the budget process or timeline going forward? So what's on our agenda for the special session on budget? I assume we're focusing on budget now. Uh, yes,

Jim. I will try to get that try and get what you specifically just asked me for done for you. That would be that would be much appreciated, Julie. Thank you. You're welcome. Regarding budget, I think we've discussed the fact of having additional work sessions if it comes to it. Is that not true? Yes.

Okay. So, put it in play if we need it. right now we haven't uh July July 1st is the deadline for getting our forms form ones back as discussed um if we do not get form ones uh to us by July 1st what we're going to do is default to last year's budget for those departments and work from there as we go into the budget hearings for each department So, at our next meeting, now that we've got our 2026 salary ordinance, we can start with that. Yes. And and just dig into that at our next work session.

Yeah. And start and then we'll hear from Whis. Is are they She said that they could come the 9th or the 10th, I believe. I can look back at my email. Maybe they could come to our work session. I don't think I don't think she gave us three dates. 9th, 10th, and the 15th. when our work session be I thought we had the special session scheduled and we agreed in the email. Nobody objected for I believe July the 9th. It was Thursday, July the 9th because we talked about having it on July the 2nd, but clearly that's the 4th of July weekend. So I believe we agreed on July the 9th, which is a Thursday. I'm talking June. You are correct, Jim.

But yeah, we're talking July 9th. Right. But our special session for June is simply the first Thursday of the fourth. It's the fourth. The fourth, right? But I kept here on the night. Are you talking about in June? They're coming in June. Yes. Those are three dates that they gave us. So they could come in June. So that's second week in June.

The 9th. So what we can do is if we is there any desire to change our Thursday June 4th work session meeting to Tuesday June 9th so that we can have tentatively in hopes of getting Lori from WIS here. That's a pretty it's a pretty core piece of our budget and if she's helping us talk through midpoints and salary impacts be a great way to get started seems like on a good basic questions out I agree push push for that it's awesome okay Julie what's that I said she's pretty awesome Lori is so

yeah she'll be great so who's going to coordinate she'll be great she can use nth there's 11th was an option was that 9th 10th and the 15th okay 9th So 9th or 10th everybody will catch that would be best for me. That's Tuesday or when we'll shoot for the Tuesday. Yeah. And then if anything changes from there and you'll get a hold up for Darren. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. As of right now though tenatively we are looking at a June 9th and that be 9 to noon. Is that our typical work session? That's what I'm shooting for unless there's some

circumstance that dictates otherwise but that's what and she has she has stated that she is best best with daytime meetings. So good good next. Okay, I have a question please. Are you going to hold budget hearings like we used to have them over the two or three days? Do you have dates by any chance? Uh the was July 9th, wasn't it? No way. That was June. June uh 28th 29th 28th end of July July 20 28th 29th and 30th 28 29 30 Yes. Um are you going to have those big old fat binders? Yeah,

I would like mine. I've already asked Julie for it, but just so you know because I plan on attending budget hearings and it makes life a lot easier if I can flip pages when you all do.

Okay, that's it. That would be up to Julie. Okay. If uh we have had were there any further discussions on that? Okay. We've had discussions about the coroner's vehicle. I noticed coroner is here today. I had him on the agenda last time and he we we couldn't coordinate. Anybody have objection to having him speak to the corner's vehicle tonight? Right. Turn your mic on. I think it's Yeah,

I think Eric's been adjusting it because it was too much at one point. Tall people, there's short people. We got to adjust. Good job. Uh, in regard to the Can everybody hear me? Yep. Okay. In regard to the corners, for the record, go ahead and state who you are. Oh, Mike Moore, Brown County Corner. Thank you. Uh, in regard to the corners, payroll, um, there was money that was supposed to be put in the budget. It's been cut a couple years

now. Um, but there was a possible solution brought up that the sheriff's department would have a vehicle that would be taken out of service and transferred to the coroner's office for use. The only thing I'm sorry, I'm on duty.

Go ahead. Um, the only problem with that is the vehicles they have to take out of service are basically worn out to begin with. Second of all, they're not designed for the use that the coroner's office needs. um a explorer is not of sufficient size and manufacturer for hauling bodies that can be up to 3 400 lb and there's not enough room in an Explorer. So, it's not a doable solution. And again, most of the vehicles that are coming out of service the sheriff's department are there's a reason why they're coming out of service. They're not serviceable and they need to be gotten rid of normally. So, I'm just throwing that out because it's not a logical solution for a replacement corner vehicle.

Okay. I'm going to respectfully disagree and I'm going to push back on everything that you just said. Um, I don't have the documentation with me, but I do have it in the file at my office. I reached out and I have an email from the the woman that heads up the Indiana Corners Association. Um, and then what she told me is that the counties of the 92 counties, they are purchasing um the the Chevrolet I've got it all. Matter of fact, I typed this up and emailed it to you guys. um the Suburbans, the Dodge Durango, and Ford Explorers.

I'm not aware of any Ford Explorers that are being Yeah, that's what she said. That's what she That's what she said in the email. This is the lady that's the executive director for the Indiana Corners Association and I have an email actually. I talked to her on the phone. Number two, you know, the the challenge that I have with the coroner's office is I spoke with the health department. You all are averaging on average two to perhaps three recoveries per month. Okay? Now, if you have two recoveries, let's just say you have 36 recoveries per year, you know, the mileage that you're going to drive, let me ask you this. Does the corner have access to this vehicle 24 by7 as their own personal vehicle?

No. Okay. So the only the only the only use for this vehicle is to do go out on a recovery. Correct. Yes. Okay. So if you have three a month, 36 recoveries, we actually average more than that. Well, then give me the documentation to show it to me because I talked last month I had five.

Okay. I'm talking about the last three years on average, not one single month. So, I had a conversation with the health department, okay? And they did some research and they gave me the information that I'm quoting to you because what I'm trying to what I did is I backed into how many miles is this vehicle actually going to be driven every year because what I know for a fact that automobiles, whether it's a new, used, I don't care really what it is, if an automobile sets indefinitely and isn't driven much, it's not good for the vehicle. Number one. Number two, we don't as a county, you know, for us right now to go out and spend 50 grand, 60 grand, 70 grand, thousand dollars for a brand new vehicle for the corner's office to set and only be used two to three, maybe at the most five times a month. Considering the fact that you could drive from one end of the county to the other end of the county, you know, and what is that 100 mile? It's not even 100 miles. So, you know, that vehicle is probably going to be driven four to 5,000 miles per year. So, what I did is I reached out to Brad Stocksdale because I think it makes far more sense to pull a vehicle that's in service. He's got a 2017 Ford Explorer that has from the front seats to the back that's 7 feet in length. All right.

No, they're not. Okay. Well, you can I can get a tape measure and I guess we'll go over and measure it off and just see exactly what it is. All right. The possible corner. What I want is I want a fact pattern. And what I'm trying to avoid is we don't need to go out and spend $70,000 for for a vehicle for the sheriff's department and then turn right around and buy another vehicle. $70,000 that's going to sit around and we're not going to drive much. It doesn't make much sense. We spend an enormous amount of money every year on automobiles in this county. So, I'm trying to reduce the cost. Hopefully, you can appreciate that. I can. Okay. Because right now, what are you currently driving right now to take care of recoveries?

A 2010 van. That is something you can put in. What type of van is it? It's a caravan. Dodge. So, you had a Dodge Caravan. Dodge Caravan. Okay. How many miles on the Dodge Caravan? Over 100. Well, right at 100. Okay. And why are we looking to replace it if it runs good? It is got some issues. What issues? They can't I mean we can't We have one vehicle. If it's out of service getting repaired, we don't have a vehicle. There's no way to haul a body recovery.

So, you're saying you need two vehicles? I would like to keep the old one as a backup. So, why don't you keep the old one and then we'll transfer this 2017 Ford Explorer, make the modifications to it that need to be modified so that you could carry a corpse within that vehicle. Again, an Explorer is not designed for carrying a body. Would you want to have a COVID body sitting right next to you in the same compartment? Okay. Don't you put them in a body bag? Yes. Could you build a platform in between the seats and the back?

Then you cut out Is that foot of space? Is that Is that what you currently have a divider between the front seats and the caravan? Yes. The Dodge Caravan. Okay. Was that installed? Because I don't think they come from the factory that way. It was installed. Yes. Okay. So, why couldn't we take that same approach with the 2017 Ford Explorer? Because then you have 4 foot of usable space in an Explorer. What? Four foot? Why you coming up at four foot? The back and the back seat. It takes part of the space out of the vehicle if you install a divider. How thick is the divider?

It's not how thick it is, it's how it has to be installed. Have you seen the divider from the front to the back? Well, first of all, I've never looked at the caravan that you have. I I don't I'm talking about the Explorer that the the county has for transporting the persons that are in jail and it has a divider in it and you it takes a lot of space out of the second seat. We could remove the divider out of the Ford Explorer that's currently in there to free up the space. But you need the divider in there. You need the divider for a corpse. We don't. Yeah, you do. Wait a minute. I thought let's I'm getting confused. And And who are you, please?

My name's Dave Friendrenmeer. I'm currently running for county. All right. So, you're going to be the hopefully the replacement come January 1 of 2027. I take it. I mean, I I But you're not running, correct? Okay. For the sake for the sake of something, let me summarize what I think I'm hearing from both of you. There is a divider in the Ford Explorer right now. No, there's not in the one that I've heard is the possibility because it's the one that the jail commander has right now and it has no divider. Problem I see once you put the divider in it, you're not going to be able to lay the back seat down because of the room the divider takes up. Can we take the back seat out and modify that to just make make a level?

I still think you're very short. It's still not going to give you enough space. If we put the divider right behind the front seats, you got the four four foot cargo area behind the back seats and then you got what three two and a half to three feet of area for the back seats. So that sounds like we're speculating. Why don't we spec this out and discuss it? That was going to be that's that's the that's the suggestion I was leading up to instead of arguing. I mean, we're we're looking right now. The van we have now is bigger than the Explorer and you're still at the back tailgate when you put a body in there. Yeah. And there's Right. But you already testified that you're looking to have two vehicles, correct?

So if we if we could take this vehicle, this 2017 Ford Explorer, modify it to where it suits your needs, right? At minimal cost. Right. At minimal cost.

All right. That gives you the two vehicles so you can continue to use the caravan. Now, the idea is is because, you know, this is then the sheriff's, you know, Brad and I, what we discussed is that we we work on a process that we buy a vehicle for the sheriff's department that's going to ultimately serve the purpose as a corner's vehicle. We then take that vehicle out of service, you know, not at 140,000 miles, but take it out of service probably, you know, say it's 70,000 miles and then we transfer that in and then we then keep doing the same thing to try to reduce the cost.

And that sounds like a great plan. I just don't know that the Explorer has the room to do that. Okay. The only thing I know is I went online. I went online and researched the 2017 four-door Ford Explorer and it stated that if you take the back seats and put them down from the tailgate to the front seats, there are there is seven ft. But will that with that seat laid down? Do you have enough instruction structural integrity to put a 3 400B body on?

But okay, but hang on a second. We can always find there's got to be someone out there that we can go in have them for, you know, a couple thousand two or three thousand dollars at the most to make the modifications to the 2017 Explorer because the other thing that's going to have to be added to that Explorer is you're going to have to have tie downs because you roll the end into the back. Correct. Doing research on this. I propose that he, Brad, and you two get together to find some facts and come back and talk talk to us about it rather than speculate here for the rest of the evening.

The only I mean just one suggestion I have and this is from 23 years on the fire department dealing with used vehicles and buying new ones. It is much more expensive usually to upfit an older vehicle than to have one built the way you needed the go. But to Jim's point, and I I agree with this point a little more delicately, but I agree with this point that the the new vehicle needs to be bought for the sheriff's department and not the coroner's office because of just the utility of it. You know, the sheriff's office needs the new vehicle. corner's office for, you know, five, six thousand miles a year does not need a brand new 70,000 vehicle,

still needs to be capable of doing the job, right? And I agree with that, too. So, I mean, we need it, it'll make it to where when you're in the front of it, you're not dealing with anything coming out. You body bag him, but you still you got somebody that's been decaying for a week or two weeks, you're not keeping that out of the front seat with you without a divider. I don't I don't want to be driving a corner's vehicle and have to hit a hard stop at a red light because somebody pulls out in front of you and end up with a front seat passenger that you didn't intend. Body bags aren't as sealed as people think they are. No. They they leak. I move we table this until we get the hard facts.

Well, and I want you guys all to know that we've talked about this. There's emails that went out that sent out to all the commissioners, sent out to the entire council body. Brad Stocksdale was in here and I think Brad has gone ahead and gone ahead and ordered this vehicle with the intent of taking this 2017 and transferring it over to the corner's office. I found your email. Yeah. So it and nobody none of the council members responded. We you know so um you know the reality is is Brad's already or you know he's ordered a vehicle. You know, we approved basically approved the the 50 grand for So what you're saying the the sheriff's department made the decision for the corners? No, the council no sheriff sheriff sheriff's department

county council made the decision number one. And number two, you have to remember that everybody's brother comes out of the woodwork and everybody wants all brand new cars. Everybody wants more money, more money, more money. And we've only got a finite amount of money. So we can't continue to go out here and just continue. And I understand that. When when has something ever been bought specifically for the corner's office? We just spent First of all, my understanding is is the history on this corner's office is we had a funeral home that donated their services for years. We had an individual that that used worked in the funeral home. I think they used the hearse. I don't know what they did. But Brown County, I can tell you what they did.

That Brown County, Let me finish my statement, please. Brown County spent very little money, but in the last four or five years, we've had to build a new money building. We've had to buy you additional. Did you get the stuff that you needed to get last year? We had to put in a a a a generator to keep the coolers you put in there for this year. You needed to buy more, a freezer, I think, or something. So, we've had to put quite a bit of money in the last three or four years, have we not? You you had to do something that should have been part of the office a long time ago. You just didn't have to because Earl took care of everything. Took it out of his That's right. That's right. Earl actually bought vehicles out of his own pocket, right?

And that should that shouldn't be the way it should be. But that's the way it was. Yeah. But that's the way it should be going.

I understand that the way it was, right? So, and you know, so and actually if you've got hard numbers, you know, I would really like to know over the last five years, how many recoveries have you actually had to perform, you know, on a five-year average and so we can use those average so we can back calculate how many miles you're going to actually be driving every year. And that's the reason I called the health department to find out because nobody knows. And so I got a hold of a certain person and they did a little bit of research and they were a able to give me the last two years because I wanted to back into it and find out how many miles are we going to actually drive. Is it 3,000 4,000 5,000? Because the other thing is do we go out and spend 60? You know if you know it's going to cost a minimum probably $55,000 just for a base vehicle. Number one. All right. And then number two, you're going to have to make some modifications even to a new vehicle to make sure you guys that vehicle's equipped the way you need to have it equipped.

That's that and that's the only concern. It's not necessarily saying we have to have a new vehicle, but whatever we get needs to be able to do the job we need.

All right. Well, how about we do this? Let's put our heads together. I'll meet you guys any day, anytime that you want. We'll go over here, look at this 2017. Let's calculate what needs to be done to it. that's back into it and let's see if we can't negotiate a win-win to get and keep in mind this is temporary. All right. So, if you can hang on to the van, if we keep that thing running, right? Then you got a four-wheel drive vehicle in case we get into really bad, you know, inclement weather. And then we can work with this Brad and then, you know, down the road who the new sheriff is so that they perhaps the council can allocate the money to get a vehicle that would suit the corner's office a little better than what they're currently buying, right? And I don't know if that and you know and so I don't you know because all I know all I'm going by is this woman that's the executive director for the Indiana Corners Association. I called her because I thought well she ought to know what the other rest of the counties are doing.

I just know I've never seen a vehicle used like that in other counties I've and most of the other counties that don't transport their own bodies do use Durango and Explorers and things like that but they don't transport. It's just an investigating vehicle and they hire people to transport.

And I, as a county council member, represent the taxpayers. I'm not a politician. You know, I'm just here to try to hang on to the money that we got coming into the county. Trying to hang on and fight for every dime that we get so we can keep some of the money and so it doesn't just continue to roll right back out the door. And what a and it's like for example on this issue I don't as a county council member have a complete inventory of all the vehicles that the commissioners own. I don't have a complete inventory that shows me the inservice date, the year, make, model, mileage. I don't even know if we do inspections on all of the county vehicles. Does the county own a 100 vehicles? Do we own 200? I don't how many vehicles do this Brown County Commissioner's Office own? What I do know is there's a lot of money that goes out the door every year for new vehicles and trucks are as you all know the vehicles are I mean an entrylevel car is minimum $25,000 and if you guys know as well as I do you look at a truck I mean you're 60 70,000 for a 3/4tonon four-wheel drive pickup truck.

So the four of you do due diligence support to us and we'll we all agree that Gary thank you. So, if you I'll reach out to you. I'll reach out to you and look, can we do that? Agree to do that. And I'll get a hold of Brad and let's set up a date. Get down and get this and we need to do it quick and get it over with so we can move on to the next. Okay. I have one other question for you and hopefully it'll be a quick one. Uh, you had an issue with a cooler that was turning into a freezer. Has that been taken care of? I believe so, but there's an issue about where I'm coming up with the money to pay for the repairs on that because there was no line item in my budget for that. Okay. How much How much are you looking at on that?

I think $2,500 approximately. Okay. That's less than I recall was being Okay. So, I think uh the first bill was like a little over 2,000 and then there was a couple of subsequent bills after that. Well, when they came back to try and figure out what it why it wasn't fixing it. So, okay. So, it was able to be repaired. It didn't have to be replaced. It did not have to be replaced. Okay. Cuz I think that's what we were talking about earlier at one time was replacing it. So, so that that is satisfied.

It's working now and I hope that it continues to work properly. Uh, but that was the only thing that in the future if we continues to have because I'd had no room at the end where everything was filled. I have a oneperson cooler and a threeperson cooler and I have had those all four filled at one time. Okay. Are there any other issues that you're facing or looking at? Well, with the generator being installed, that's that's helped out a lot because I was really worried that at some point we would have a power outage, which Nashville's known for. Yeah. That you know, but now that's not an issue now. So,

yeah, I remember an ice storm where I was without power for exactly 72 hours and that would not be ideal for you. Yeah, it's especially in the middle of the summer. Yeah. Okay. Oh, just is that is that all are all is that are you good otherwise? I believe other than um the question of what we're going to do about a vehicle is the only other issue on that. I mean you're you're talking about things that are kind of just the cost of doing business. We've got people are going to continue to die whether we have a running vehicle or not. If a van goes down that's 16 years old over a 100,000 miles on it.

You know that's a problem. We can't just And so you know I hope we just kind of find a good solution there. That's not Scott. I just drove a 2002 Ford Explorer that I bought in in in 2004 with 132,000 miles on it up to Lafayette and back. That vehicle runs fine. Yeah, it's got some rust on it, but if you maintain the vehicles, the key is the maintenance. Okay. Yes. Can we not go off on that tangent, please? Please. Like 17 years old, 240,000. Works great. How old your oldest one? Okay. Anybody have any more questions for my Thank you very much. Thank you.

Thank you. We Sorry.

Um Pam text. Um I appreciate your your due diligence trying to hold the expenses in check. Um and I do thank Mike for his service and congratulations Dave. He'll do a fine job. Um, while you're investigating, Mike alluded to something that I don't don't think I've heard you talk about, and that is having the coroner outfitted with a vehicle that can go anywhere and then hiring the carry. other count other counties apparently function that way that they hire out or contract with a service that has the equipment and the capability of tackling that portion of their job. So while you're trying to save money, that's an option that I think you should spend some time exploring. Thank you.

I had a little highlight on that. Most of the time the people that do that um what happens is they pay the ambulance service to haul that body to the mor and you know that's that generates a bill they're going to charge us to transport that body well in our county with two ambulances. Do we take a do we take a truck out of service for an hour to transport a body and get it unloaded at the morg? Yes. How much how much would that run be? That I don't know. I don't know the billing rates on that, but I know, you know, we Bloomington runs eight or 10 trucks. They used to do it and their corner doesn't even do it anymore, right? They do their own transports now. They don't pay IU to transport them.

But in most counties where the corner does not transport him, it's the ambulance service that does that transport. It doesn't have to be. I don't know of any C companies that specifically do that that would be on call at our will to come pick up a body and haul it to the board. I just haven't heard of that. In a larger county, I could see where that would be more accessible. And and I agree, we can't afford to take an ambulance out of service here. That's an ongoing issue for me personally as well as representing the taxpayers because we have a shortage of medical care in this county anyway as far as emergency services go. So I don't I would never consider that uh until we improved the emergency services completely in this county

and the Johnson County hires theirs to be transported. However, their services out of Marian County and I believe they're located on the northern side of Marian County. It's a service that they charge for. Um, but are we going to want a family to have to wait on somebody coming from the north side of Indianapolis? No. And tie up an officer and a coroner for two hours to get somebody picked up. I'm, you know, it's just a question. Yeah, these are these are all points to be considered. So, and balanced.

Anybody else have anything else? Jim Motj. Second. All in favor? Baby Jim