Art in Public Places Committee (Through Sept 2021) - Regular Meeting

Also, everything's closed. I think for council, they felt like it was a safe way to test the concept.

And I get it. But it's just funny because I was like, if this doesn't work.

Well, go check it out.

This doesn't work. This isn't what we wanted.

And so if you're downtown looking for something to do, you can always go hit the new Dave and Buster's.

i know i haven't been there go win some tickets and yeah trade them in for i don't know no it just i just do they have adult versions of like the toys that like at chucky cheese you get the tickets and you can have you been to dave and buster's i have not been to dave and buster's never been to a dave and buster's i'm assuming they have something they've got to have something yeah because a lot of people are i mean it's usually pretty busy in there i think

The running fence, except for the running fence itself.

Yeah, no, that's cool. I know which piece you're talking about. Having someone like that around.

City of Arcadia did it. We're thinking about having a meeting. This is it. This is all we are today.

Yeah, no, glad to do it. Glad you're here. Yeah.

We have a forum now, right? Yes. Okay.

I am happy to call this meeting of the Art and Public Places Committee to order.

Yeah.

Interesting. 38. 338? Yep. Okay. Great. Very good. Let's do... All right.

Chair Nathanson? Present. Present. Vice Chair Kiefer.

Present.

Committee Member Puentes.

Present.

And Committee Member Peters.

Present.

Let the record reflect that all committee members are present with the exceptions of Committee Member Trejo-Vasquez and King.

Okay, thank you. Are there any modifications to the agenda today?

No modifications, Chair.

Okay. There are no members of the public present, so there are no public comments. We're moving on to approval of the minutes of the last meeting, which was on, hold on a second, August 3rd, 2026. Any additions or corrections? Did everybody get a chance to read them? Okay, no additions or corrections. And so the minutes are approved as submitted. Okay, we are up to scheduled items, number seven. Okay. It's 2027 through 29, Temporary Art Walk, Call for Art Review. Meredith?

Yes, thank you. Let me share my screen here. If you recall, the last meeting I brought forward, the public art... proposal, draft, project proposal to you for the next temporary art walk that would span two years, 2027 to 2029, as the current exhibit is coming down, I believe it's September of 2027. And the feedback I received was that for the call for art, as we look at inspired by, and we were speaking about art history, we really wanted to ensure that we're not just speaking about Western artists, that we really look at more cultural and diverse selections that could be inspired by. So attached to this, and in front of you, you'll see the draft call for art. This would be posted through the platform of CAFE that we utilize for our, call for art platform. If you've had a chance to read it, I don't need to read through all of it. Or if you'd like me to, I'm more than happy to. And here you'll see the theme and speaking more about the inspiration that can come from a wide range of sources, including Mexican and Latin American, Indigenous, African folk, and other cultural and artistic traditions from around the world. And so really trying to highlight that theme other than just westernized art that people may already be aware of. And then again, the eligibility, the artist stipend, artwork locations, etc., So with that, I'll turn it over to you, Chair. Again, I'm more than happy to read through this if you'd like me to go through each section.

I don't know that we have to read through each section fully, but if you could just share on the screen, kind of scroll through it, because I didn't print it out, and that looks like Lauren didn't either.

I didn't print out the attachments.

I did read it.

I just didn't write it.

I have it here.

I reviewed it. Okay, we all reviewed it, so that's good.

And then after the discussion today, I'll make whatever edits you deem necessary, and then ideally I'd like to open this in October for the calls. So here we have the theme inspired by, celebrates the many people, places, cultures, traditions, histories, and creative movements that shape artistic expression. Artists are encouraged to submit works inspired by the artistic traditions, techniques, stories, and visual languages that have influenced their practice. So again, we're looking at more of that creative influence and diversity, just not your typical, this was inspired by Monet's water lilies, et cetera, right? As I'm sure there's still some beautiful pieces out there.

So we want to exclude Western art.

Correct. Yes. We just want to make sure that this is expanded so that we can really diversify our collection here in the community. So we're opening this up to up to 10 temporary public artworks. This year we only had eight. So it doesn't mean that we have to reach 10 again because it's Selecting the location with the artwork, we don't wanna just select and then pop art where you're just putting in, it doesn't actually fit. So we could do up to 10 is what we've budgeted for artworks between downtown and railroad square. And I'm looking to utilize most of the locations that we have from last year, but I'd also like to open this up in the meetings moving forward to alternative locations that we could also select for the art walk. So whether honoring a cultural tradition, drawing inspiration from an artist or community, re-imagining a historic art form, exploring ancestral influences, or bringing traditional techniques into contemporary expression, selected artwork should invite visitors to discover these stories and inspirations behind the art. So I think that will also give us a really good opportunity through a public art map that they could go to the QR code and learn more about the artist and that inspiration. The program goals will be foster civic excitement, encourage creativity, make art education accessible, transform public spaces, and inspire curiosity and learning. The eligibility is anyone 18 years of age or older, artist or an artist team, and this is for already completed artworks. The artist will receive $5,000 stipend, $3,000 on install, and $2,000 on de-install. And then the artwork locations and installation, um, the artists won't be selecting the location. I mean, that will end up being up to, um, at the end it would be city staff, but also with your input, um, and the selection panels input on that. They can submit, um, up to six artworks, um, with maximum of three images, each showing different views, 18 images total. And then they can also submit videos and they will be submitting the artwork list description. theme statement inspired by their installation plan. So that's when we start to look at their dimensions, weight, safety, et cetera, and their artist resume. The selection process, we'll be looking for two members of Art and Public Places Committee, one city staff member, and then two members of the arts community. And I would be bringing this back to October and November meeting to select for the selection panel when we have a better timeline on how that will work. The evaluations will be on artistic merit and quality, the connection to the theme, creativity and innovation, suitability for the outdoor public setting, the feasibility of the installation, public safety, and then the contribution to diversity and impact of the exhibit. And then this is the estimated project timeline. Ideally, we're publishing this call beginning October with the deadline mid-December. Um, the selection process will sometimes take two to three months. Um, and if we could notify the artists, I would say by April, if not may, um, sometimes some artists contracts can take a little while and then we're looking at a September install or October install. I think September is the D install of the current ones. So that's the draft call. And again, it's a draft. So I'd love your input and feedback on this. And ideally, we could get this live in October.

Great. Thank you. It looks good. And the floor is open for comments and questions.

I just have a thought. I really like this. I'm excited about it. For the third paragraph on the first page, the inspiration may come. I kind of wanted to also add, if possible, Asian, just so it kind of opens the door and welcomes more. And if it's a possibility that if we do receive some kind of historical, like if it was either Chinese or Japanese, that we could actually find a place in the area that was, you know, and then have that place there with the little bit of history context in that to support that area. Love that idea.

Thank you. I think that's a really good idea, especially in Santa Rosa, because there's such a very active Chinese, Japanese, and other Asian culture. communities here. Okay. Any other suggestions, comments, questions? I think you did a great job, by the way, revising it, updating it, and taking our feedback. So really appreciate that.

I was just going to say, how is this sent out? via email, is it posted? Like how is the link?

So we use our call for art platform. And so that's what will be posted. We'll be doing social media posts. I do have the marketing budget that we do every year. So I plan on utilizing some of that because this is to US-based artists. So we'll be doing some online ads and marketing. And then I also have a pretty large email list to send out to our, not only local newsletter that we'll do, but then we also have other public art artists on that list that we could send out too. and then please forward along in your friend groups, et cetera. Again, I'll be open for a little over two months. We could always extend it if we don't feel that we've received enough, but I believe the previous year received in at least over a hundred submissions and it was pretty tough selection. We have very good submissions. So I'm excited to see what we get.

Does everybody follow the arts and culture social media? Okay. Great. Just sharing those posts is really helpful. Also, I know the Museum of Santa Rosa has routinely shared those kinds of announcements, something that I wanted to see happen. So if you're, Lauren, maybe at LVC, you guys can do that.

Yeah, I'll talk to them about that. And then Are we Creative Sonoma?

We'll post it on their website, and we post it on the California Arts Council website. Santa Rosa Urban Arts Partnership can forward information as well.

Yeah, so as long as the news is spread far and wide, hopefully we'll get some good response.

So at our next meeting, what I can do is share with you a link for the posts, etc., where we've advertised it, and then we could also just get more feedback on where else we could place it.

And remind me regarding how far we're extending this call for artists. For US-based artists. US-based artists. US.

US, sorry. We did that last year. We ended up getting, I believe, the farthest was, I want to say it was Minnesota, but I know we've got wheels go around, it was Denver. So we did have quite a few apply on the East Coast.

Did they have to pay for transportation to get here?

Yeah. Yeah. So we know it automatically, you know.

It just goes to this limit. But some are also, you know, in comparison, we have such a growing and great arts program that coming out here is a really great resume builder for someone as well. Yeah.

And Sonoma County has just an amazing number of public artists who are doing public works in sculpture and murals, but especially the sculpture community.

And we had two Santa Rosa artists in the last one. And again, those are all blind scoring, so you don't know where they're from. So I think that speaks to what we have here.

So talk about scoring. Are we looking to get two volunteers from this committee to be on the selection committee today? Or are we going to do that later?

I don't have that on the agenda today. It was a discussion item on the call. That would be our next meeting. I'll do a motion to select two to be on the selection panel. We'd be looking to do that probably in January to March. And that would be virtual meetings.

So everybody is aware a month from now, we'll invite you to from our committee. We'll do that selection committee. Any other questions, comments, suggestions? Okay, great. Excellent report. I think the call for art looks really good. And so thank you, Meredith. Okay.

Do we need to do any kind of motion for the suggested change? Okay. I will add that in. Okay. Great.

Okay. So that was a call for art review. Now we're up to 7.1, which is temporary art while funding. So and then the Project plan, I guess. Okay, so Meredith, do you want to go over that for us, please?

I have 7.2 as Adrian Lippman's public art proposal.

Oh, I had 7.1 as a temporary recommendation to approve funding.

We're not doing, that was my mistake on the script. There's no motion. I thought there was going to be a motion on this one. So 7.1 was just the discussion. Oh, got it, got it. Okay.

yeah because it says recommended action online i don't know i'm just i put on my glasses we are up to 7.2 a litman public car proposal okay yes thank you chair

Adrian, artist Adrian Lippman gave a public comment at the last meeting, I believe. And I did let him know I would bring this forward. So he submitted a public art proposal for his artwork, Dynamic Directions. And the location proposed is on 4th and College. His artist statement is that this is a visual symbol of life complexity in an urban environment where everything is moving in various dynamic directions. You'll see the photo here. It's seven feet high, six feet in width, and six feet in diameter, and it's brushed aluminum. And I've included in this as well sort of the location here at Forth and College. that he is proposing, and this on a map just so we can sort of see in respects to downtown corridor. He is letting us know that it would be a donation and temporary. I spoke with him about the need to pour a concrete pad for this location and do a plaque, so there would be costs involved. I did want to bring it to you as a discussion item in consideration for Adrian, which... And I can communicate with him afterwards. On this artwork here, if we like this location, if it's something we'd want to also think about maybe for the art walk or open it up to other artwork. And we received this proposal, I believe, about two or three months ago through our public art proposal form that is on our website. So with that, I'd like just to open it up for discussion today. And then... And let me know if you have any questions that you'd want me to bring back to Adrian.

Great. Okay, thank you. I'm curious if he has indicated what kind of paint or finish will be for the colored ends on that brushed aluminum structure.

Yeah, I'm not sure, but I could ask him.

I would hope they're powder coated or something of that nature, you know, so they're appropriate for outdoor placement and they won't chip away or fade. That being said, okay, any questions, comments, responses to the offer? Yeah.

So I like the location. And the reason why I like the location, because many years ago, we did have something there. We had another person come in and propose. And we had that work up there and it was these lights and it was really cool, but it was for just a short time. And then when it was gone, that place was empty and it's that corner has high traffic and there was nothing there. And so to have it empty for so many years, again, it's just a sad space right now. And so when he has this proposal, once I put it there, we have no other options. Other thing that I've known of that is suggested to be put there. I'm glad he chose that spot because that spot is a spot that I've seen art there and it has done well. And for my perspective, and so it'd be really nice to see art there once again. And then plus, since it's a little different to know that the rocks that they do have there, it's a deterrent. It's, you know, it's a hostile architecture rocks there. I think that art piece would make it a lot more softer and it would make it a not more inviting place than the hostile rock architecture they have right now. So, yes.

OK, thank you for those comments. I'd like to pose the question, do we think this particular artwork is effective in this particular location? I agree, the location needs a work of art. Is this the piece for that location?

His description of it, I think, does fit pretty well for that area. really doesn't, the way it's pointing, the way it goes in directions, because this is on its, all it's by itself is a little corner that is pushing out there and it's telling the traffic to go that way, this way, in every way.

I feel like it's sort of like a modern interpretation of the scarecrow in Wizard of Oz.

I kind of like it.

I think if we had put out a call for art for that location, who knows what we would get. But I feel like that, because of what you just said, Lisa, I agree that thematically, the concept of the work and what it symbolizes, I think would probably... it would probably be pretty competitive if we were comparing it to other entries.

The only thing I was going to say, if you go back to the other, I don't think that's to scale, right? I just want to make sure. Because it looks a little small compared to the space.

It does look a little small.

But it says it's seven feet high. So I think that that's not to scale on that. So it would be much larger. I think it would feel larger in that.

We'd have to go. I'd have to go measure the space.

And I may be wrong. I haven't looked at the space exactly. But I do think that makes it look a bit smaller than it is. I agree.

Okay.

You bring up the question of scale, and I think that's a really important question because seven feet tall and six feet wide will not appear that large in that outdoor space. It may not be large enough to really have the impact that we ultimately might like for that space. I mean, it's just slightly larger than... You know, like if you're a six foot man with your arms out, you know, that's basically, you know, it's a little larger than that scale.

But if there's a six foot something man with his arms out standing right there, you're going to see that person.

Well, imagine Victor Webinyama standing there with his arms out. That's about the scale, right?

So we can go, I can go measure. I do need to take a look at that. What? basis with need and the costs associated. Another option is we are opening the call for the art walk. And if this, I know it's far from downtown, however, so it's not as much walkable, but if this is a location that were to be considered and this went into applied and went into the, the two year 2027 to 2029 is sort of a gateway into downtown. So we do have a couple options.

One, One thing that comes to mind, though, if we decided to fold it into the art walk, my guess is that he's offering that artwork now, that it's available. And so do we want to wait over a year to... I think you brought up a good point. That's... It's an empty site that has been begging for a work of sculpture for quite a while.

And there's only, you know...

hostile landscape right in there at this moment have those have those rocks been added or they were because there was an encampment that kept starting on there so they added those rocks afterwards okay so it's not like they're part of it's not part of the natural landscape where it'd be difficult to move them or relocate the rocks if we need to

With the pouring of a concrete pad and forklift and all of that, the labor, we wouldn't be able to, already being September, probably spring, summer, with the other projects we have lined up to install something here. Okay.

All right. So we're still looking at a fairly long timeline.

Do you know if those rocks were installed by the city or by a private property owner?

That's a good question. I'm not sure.

It's right next to the restaurant. It's a city park. But I believe we have a maintenance contract with a third party to maintain it because I reached out to them already. But I'm not sure regarding the rocks on who placed those.

And you said it's temporary. I just want to make sure. I mean, you said it would be a temporary like loan.

Yeah. How long, how long of loan are we proposing?

We haven't discussed that yet.

I want to bring it forward to you as a discussion first. To do a pad approximately.

Depending on the size, it could be a couple of thousand dollars with labor. Um, because this is seven feet tall and six feet wide. Um, The base still looks pretty small, actually, with the footing. So I would have to get those exact measurements here.

And get the weight also. If it's aluminum, it's not going to be all that heavy.

Yeah, I don't believe.

You may not need a major crane for it.

Not for his sculpture, but for the pad. So he did note to me that no pad was necessary for it. It was a lighter weight, and I just don't have that in front of me, the weight, but I would like all of our artworks to go with that consistency of those concrete pads that we have, just for professionalism, etc. I think it really does add a lot to our collection as we go this route with a plaque, etc.

And I also think if you add a pad there, then... when this loan terminates, you will have a location where we can install another piece. And actually what I'd love to do is plan ahead and let's say his loan is for two years. After a year, we should be looking at, okay, are we doing call for art, commissioning a piece? What are we doing to replace it when the time comes?

Thank you. So I will be in contact with the artist and get some more of the specifics back. And then I would imagine this would be on the October, November agenda as more of an emotion.

Okay. Great. All right. Thank you. Okay. We are up to item 7.3, Ruth Ozawa. history of Sonoma County panels. And we do have a recommended action. Is this accurate, Jack?

Yes.

Adopt the motion expressing support for staff to explore alternative options for temporary display of the Ruth Asawa panels and to engage the community and public in discussions concerning their final placement.

Excuse me.

Meredith, will you please present? Excuse me, I've had this off for a number of months.

Thank you, Chair. So today I will be providing some background on the history of Sonoma County panels that I believe you all know. But I think it's really good for us to review the full history of this as they've been in our public art history for about 40 years now from Santa Rosa. And so really this is looking at how we want to be thoughtful about their longevity and sustainability in our collection. So before we get into the project itself, I think it's important to review who Ruth Asawa was and recognize her significance in the county in California and as an artist. Her story is pretty remarkable. As a teenager, her and her family were incarcerated during World War II. She later attended Black Mountain College, studying with artists such as Joseph Albers and Buckminster Fuller before settling in San Francisco. She became deeply connected to the Bay Area, not just for her artwork, but through her advocacy and commitment to arts education. So when we're talking about these panels, we're talking about the importance of Santa Rosa history, but also work by one of the most significant California artists in the 20th century. This project began in the 1980s. Ruth became involved in 1984 and was ultimately contracted in 1985 by the city to create these panels. One of the things that makes this special is that they weren't created in isolation. Asawa, she worked with the students from Burbank Elementary School and many other community members to create these. And they were installed in 1987 and remained at Courthouse Square until the reunification project in 2016. Apologies, I can't see the bottom of my slide here. So these, what happened was when we removed them in 2016, We found that they were deteriorating and the conservators documented significant deterioration with water damage, standing cracking, service loss, and other structural issues. And that's what we're now looking at when we're looking at their final placement as well.

Missed.

There we go. It's jumping on me. And so these are some photos from the install in 1987 from the newspaper. So as you can see here, just the pure size of these panels. I mean, this was, again, in the concrete which she had originally created these in. And when we de-installed these, we found that there was significant cracks, et cetera. And Ruth's original vision was to do these in bronze. And this was the de-install in 2016. So you can see the sea life panel on the left-hand side there. And then one of the eight by three panels over there on the right. In 2017, we had the reunification ceremony for Courthouse Square. And again, the conservator's recommendation was due to the deteriorating material that these panels were to be recast in bronze. We did receive a letter of support from that from Ruth Asawa's family to move forward for that for sustainability in an outdoor setting. On August 2nd in 2021, APPC approved the casting of the art panels in bronze. And then on November 9th, the council approved an allocation of 300,000 from PG&E Settlement Fund to put towards Artworks Foundry to cast these in bronze. The scanning was completed in 2023, and the new estimates were received in 2025 that had an increase in material costs. As you can imagine, the cost of bronze, et cetera, does fluctuate and tends to go up. And on April 7th, 2025, APPC approved $75,000 to Artworks Foundry from the Public Arts Fund for the solid panel projects. As we moved forward, again, the cost was increasing. We, council approved a contract for Artworks Foundry for 406,900 for the bronze casting of the panels. And The family granted approval to proceed with the 3D printing casting of these panels. Our team visited the foundry in October, which was really exciting to see these in person. I'm very excited for you to see them as well, just to see the process, et cetera, and the detail to these. And I saw his family also reached out to us with a letter of support to explore alternative displays. So as we've been looking at this, you know, the original display was for a fountain, which is still in our master plan. But there have been concerns over the longevity and sustainability with that. And so they did reach out to us with our support on exploring other options. As of May this year, six panels have been completed and now we are looking at moving them up here for temporary display and that's what we'll be discussing some options today. We also received a letter this June from the Downtown Action Organization that they would like to pursue a feasibility study for permanent placement in the community for this community asset as an economic driver for downtown Santa Rosa. We brought that letter to the Economic Development Subcommittee and They would like APPC's involvement as well, which is why today we're also looking at a motion to start to move this project forward more in the community with community surveys and looking also at our master plan. So today we're seeking some options for temporary display of the panels and also looking at while we explore the final placements. Here are some photos of them being poured in bronze and then completed in bronze. So you'll see on the left-hand side, we're with the artwork's foundry owner, Cam Beats, and with two of Ruth Asawa's children, Vivian and Henry. The middle photo has part of the panel process and then a panel detail on the right-hand side. And these are the overall panel sizes. They haven't been, these are still estimates. They haven't specifically each been weight, but they're around 450 to 550 pounds each for the three by eight panels. And then depending on the mounting hardware, when these go on the permanent location, et cetera, that could add another 50 to a hundred pounds on that. And you'll see the size of the sea life panels are quite large too. While exploring temporary placement and permanent, we've also been researching how other cities are displaying bronze panels. You'll see on the left-hand side, this is actually by Ruth Asawa, and it's on a concrete base. And this is in San Jose. The middle bronze is in El Paso, and that's more of a freestanding in concrete. And then on the right-hand side is a wall-mounted bronze panel. So as we're looking at temporary considerations for these panels, um, we want to look at placement and then we also want to look at, um, whether it's weather, weatherproof is very important, um, clean and professional, um, a rubber at the base to protect it from, to protect bronze, um, from water, et cetera, or scratching, um, the potential to build these bases in house. And of course, um, In consideration of the location, we would want the base to match and be approachable by community, have information about this project, Ruth Asawa, et cetera. So as we've been brainstorming as a team, some potential locations, and that's where we would really love to start to get your feedback. I think it's really key that this is accessible to the community, that it's in the community. We have obviously there's City Hall, Finley Community Center, Courthouse Square. And here you can see with the red square, just sort of the size of the eight by three panel. So six of the, and I'm saying eight by three, but they're just a little under eight feet. Um, you can see the size of that panel in comparison to wheels go round. So what it would look like on those are two, three by three bases. Um, so what that size of the panel would look like, and then that's in front of the council chambers at city hall. Um, we have the welcome center, different city parks and museum library, et cetera. So, um, today I would love your feedback and start that discussion of, of where we would like to see these, um, temporary displayed in the community. And the recommendation for today is to adopt a motion expressing support for staff to explore alternative options for temporary display of the Ruth Asawa panels and to engage the community in public discussions, public ed discussions concerning their final placement.

Great. Thank you very much. We will open the floor for comments and questions. And actually, I think we want questions initially. And then we will ask for a motion to move forward with this. And then we can open it up for comments and recommendations and such. So questions. Yes, Laura.

Are you thinking they will be kept together on display or separated?

That's a great discussion item. Potentially, we could place them in various locations throughout the city just to diversify the access from community members, or it could all be on display together. There are six large panels and potentially they could go, we could do two back to back. Again, all of this would have to be approved through a solid family as well, once we figure out that temporary location.

So there are nine original panels. Is there a plan and timeline for the last three?

Yes, we need to do a contract amendment to do the sea life panels. Those are quite large. And so right now we're working on that. I would really like to get those done by, I would say, beginning of next year, maybe spring, because that will take some time. And then we could look at that temporary placement as well and moving those up here.

And so permanent installation and the proposed fountain, can't happen until all nine panels are completed? Is that true or?

It depends on the permanent location that we end up finding for it. If we move forward with the fountain, which is in the master plan, then that would work with that timeline and we would place it on that. If we end up finding an alternative option or the community would like to see them all somewhere else besides the fountain, then that would be a discussion of placing them on there.

OK, so I guess what I'm unclear about is, are all nine panels supposed to be connected or around this fountain? Is that the original concept?

Correct, yes. And the concept, speaking with Ruth's family, is that they would want the permanent placement to be in the same layout as Ruth has originally intended. We wouldn't want to permanently display them all separately. So there's the two. There's a temporary placement that could we potentially display them separately? Maybe, and we would need to discuss with the family. Permanent placement, we would like them all in the same format as we originally intended. Got it. Great, thanks.

My question is, we had some, what was proposed too, is that some ideas for the stage? And how would that incorporate, would that do all six panels plus the nine or just the six? They would be nine panels, correct.

And with that discussion, that still needs to move forward on different avenues in regards to the stage. So the permanent placement is really up to a master plan update. So that's more of a larger discussion.

What would be that next step for a master plan revision?

I'm going to turn it over to Scott Adair, Chief Economic Development Officer.

Hi, everyone. There was originally a master plan that was adopted for Courthouse Square for the design and placement of infrastructure in that public space. And that went through a community public comment process and period, and went through formal adoption at city council. We're still investigating and determining whether or not a potential revision or alternative placement to or for these panels would require the master planning process to be revisited in its entirety. But we do know that at a minimum, just as a best practice, we should engage the public and the community before even really starting to go down that road. The feedback that we've received as staff Tells us that there's been an evolution in thinking toward fountains in general and an evolution toward best and highest use of the downtown and courthouse square and whether or not Some constituents and residents and business owners think that perhaps there could be another way to meet the original intent of Ruth and display those panels in an alternative fashion, which would be dual purpose. We've met with the family and have discussed this, knowing that it's just throwing things at the wall right now to see what sticks. And they seem really receptive to the idea. So what staff is hoping for here is to be able to go out and engage the community and begin asking through surveys, polling, door-to-door visits. There are a number of ways that we could get the word out just to ask. Is it time now and is it okay to pivot and consider something else for how we want to envision the placement of these panels, whether that's a stage or an amphitheater or maybe we're sticking with the fountain? If the overwhelming response from the community is no, we want the fountain, we want to stick with the fountain, we already have a master plan that approves that. And there may not be much more planning effort on behalf of the city other than just to move the project forward. If there seems to be a lot of support for reviewing alternatives, depending on whether that's just strong support for one type of alternative only or strong support to reopen it and replant it and redo designs and do community feedback on those multitude of designs, that could change the direction as to how we go and make recommendations to city council. So that... i hope is sort of a non-answer answer but that's sort of where we're trying to get with it we're trying to not infuse our own opinions and perspectives in this and literally let this be guided by the community and and what the community wants so when reach you do reach out to the community are you going to give them examples and ideas um

So they can see what is possible to, you know, rather than just they have their own ideas that may be not even be possible.

Yeah, our discussion has been through polling and community surveying to present here's a multitude of ideas that the family is supportive of.

Okay, yeah.

And if necessary, maybe have an open house with some visioning boards and people could come and see how it could look. And this is me infusing a little bit of my own perspective here. We've seen when times are bad and that you have financial constraints as an organization, Fountains don't always end up getting maintained or cleaned. We have a couple fountains in Santa Rosa that are not operable. So we're also thinking about what long-term value looks like for the placement of these pieces. And I think the family feels the same way. And so I think we will be very clear in that to the community. Like, just a reminder, if you walk in the fountain... This is what long-term water usage looks like for that, what long-term maintenance looks like for that. Just sort of revisiting to make sure everyone is clear and comfortable with how we proceed and how we move forward. Okay.

Thank you, Scott.

Yeah.

Okay, at this point, I would entertain a motion expressing support for staff to explore alternative options for temporary display of the Ruth Asawa panels and to engage the community and public in discussions concerning their final placement. Second. I did not make the motion, but if you would like to make the motion, you can say so moved.

So moved.

Well done. Is there a second?

I second.

It has been moved and seconded.

There we go.

And you can read the motion up there on the screen. So the floor is now open for discussion, comments, suggestions. Who wants to go first?

I would request that the APPC is notified of planning meetings with the Economic subcommittee when this item might be coming up so that we can be part of that conversation. Yeah, good.

Thank you. Good suggestion. I just want to share that I know that the condition of the original panels was significantly compromised and Several years ago, I was part of a conversation about what it would take to scan and sort of recreate what the original design was in order to make those bronze panels accurate to the original design. And so I'm I'm actually really pleased that it was successfully accomplished because I think it was a challenge. And so I'm excited to see them publicly displayed. I'm of a mind that because they were originally in Courthouse Square and they're intended for Courthouse Square, that that's the right location. But I also understand because it's temporary, they're There is an opportunity to put them somewhere else. And I just think that Courthouse Square is the town square there. They're ultimately going to be there that I think I think it would enhance Courthouse Square. And so I'd be in favor of that particular placement.

Yeah, I'm not opposed to them being elsewhere, but I do think the intent of the artist was to have them there. And I also think it would just be really nice to have them back. Those of us that grew up here remember that fountain very well and very fondly and would be excited to see them again.

I think this is a unique opportunity to do it right. And so thank you guys for taking the time to prepare this history for us. And it really gets me excited again last time or last year when I went to see the Ruth Asawa exhibit at the SF MoMA, it stoked that excitement. And so I think this is really a well, I'm glad this conversation is happening. I really believe in us doing the storytelling to, again, convey the significance of Ruth Asawa's impact on this area. And I am open to hearing ideas about how else to place them instead of a fountain, if the stage, how that would come together. But it would, again, I would like this committee to be informed of any of that traction in other bodies. And for this to be a real opportunity, when you say engaging the community, I think there should be also some education on our part. And so thank you for putting, again, those history points together. I think having that with some sort of poll would actually give a bit more context. Yeah.

Can I add to that?

Yeah, please do.

No, no, please do. I was really relieved, truthfully, to see that you were asking to meet with the public again and know that people have very strong opinions about this and that there was a lot of work done previously to the master plan. It made me very anxious to think about changing that and going against what people... I know time changes things, but people put a lot of time and energy and a lot of thought into... where we're at now with that master plan. And it would just really bum me out to feel like we were ignoring that. So I'm just really happy to hear that we're going to re-engage people again. And so we can honor the thought and the time and the energy that people put into it to get us to this point. I don't want to take that lightly. So. Anyway, and not to say that we can't change things and there's no time now, but I just think that that's really super important because people have feelings.

I agree. I'm glad that the SF MoMA exhibition was mentioned. I think it's really significant to acknowledge that Ruth Asawa, although known by many here because she had public artwork on display for so long and others in certain parts of the Bay Area community. But overall, she was a very important and influential artist who was underrepresented, under recognized for decades. And so I think SF MoMA's major retrospective helps to correct of that history and adds to public recognition and knowledge of her importance as an artist and educator. And I feel really fortunate that Santa Rosa has had a relationship with Ruth and her artwork and continues the relationship with the family. So honoring that legacy, I think is incredibly important. And I would encourage the public engagement in this process to be framed in those terms, that here were the artists and the city's original intent. And this is where we're at now. But I think most people, to your point, Lauren, I think most people would like to see the bronze panels go back into the same configuration with the fountain that basically the original artwork format and intent were. But I think Scott brought up a really important point that fountains can be a challenge, especially in economically challenging times. I think it's gonna be a matter of seeing what the public feels in terms of priorities and the importance of, I guess, respecting the original intent and integrity of the project.

Yeah. Well, we need to definitely bring that up of what Scott brought up too, when people want to talk about having it as a fountain once again and stuff, because anyone who has deep feelings of it being a fountain and within this area of Santa Rosa also realize fountains within Santa Rosa that weren't running forever and what it looked like. I mean, if you recall Juilliard Park and the water feature there that wasn't working forever, it really pulled down you know, the atmosphere, this, the area of Julia Park, it was just like horrible. It was sad and depressing with just having a little green puddle on the bottom forever. And it was always dirty and gross. And so it wasn't maintained at all. And once you think of that, and when Scott did say that, because I have place in my heart that wanted the fountain. But when you did say that, all I could think of was Juilliard Park and the fountain there and being like, oh, no way. We will never, ever let that happen to that. I never want to see that bronze, beautiful Rufusawa, you know, piece of art in that sad condition.

Well, and how that fountain in Juilliard Park was enhanced by a mural, a painting of a mandala on the ground to enhance that space. I think that was... also a neat opportunity to reclaim okay well this is what it was this is how to create a beautiful experience again so I in thinking about a different opportunity if we were to talk about a stage I would want to again have a conversation about how each of the panels is viewable yeah when that stage is just going to say that.

Yeah, in years. I'm not trying to go down a route that's stressing me out. I want to make sure that, again, it's accessible.

And those would be conversations in the future if we go that route, of course, involving the family. They did make known that they would like the panels in the same format. And, of course, there's... visible and accessible by the community. We do have to think about the usage of Courthouse Square. We've now had it for almost 10 years, and about 50% of the events there do have stages. The last thing we want is a stage being placed in front of a fountain as well. So there's a lot of different considerations that we're thinking about. But those would be further conversations that we would, of course, bring forward as we go.

Also a question, when Scott mentioned the best and highest use in courthouse square, did the downtown action organization or the economic subcommittee have statements about any other possibilities other than a stage, or was that kind of the only one loaded that with real seriousness?

That's the only, um, option that has been presented to us. Um, Do you recall any other option for permanent placement?

And we can have that discussion as part of the outreach and engagement. Some of the discussion around the fountain is not just concerning maintenance and water evaporation, but the fact that the fountain would take up square footage in the square. So anything interior to the panels is not usable. I think the idea of a stage was just to elevate so that then the top is usable, whether it's a platform for concerts or whatever it might be. But we would work with the community to come up with, if you're receptive to that alternative idea, what would be appealing to you, what would not be appealing to you. If the community overwhelmingly supports and wants the fountain back, then we would work with the businesses on, is there a way with the loss of that square footage to do something else? So then how do you get, how could we address both issues? So that would all be in the engagement work that would have to happen. And that's why we're really not at a point yet to look at what, a revision or an addition of the master planning effort looks like because we don't have the intel yet to even decide how or if that needs to move forward. So that's what this would all be about, asking those questions exactly.

And one more question. Meredith, do you know the height of the panels? How tall are they?

They're three feet.

Three feet tall for the six that have been poured and I believe a little over five feet for sea life. I could go back to that.

Yeah, I would just want to know that the panel dimensions before we have right there on that slide. Well, thank you.

Yeah, five feet tall for the sea life panels.

What I recall is the plumbing's already been set up for the fountain in the square. And so the location is You know, when people are thinking of different locations, it's not a different location. There's a location there, and it's already been set up, correct? And so it needs to stay in that area.

So the infrastructure exists. Yes. So that's an important consideration. One thing occurs to me because Courthouse Square is the main town square, and it's really important to the downtown businesses that that be... that collectively for the community, that's a well-maintained area that I would find it very surprising if a fountain fell into disrepair because of what that square means to the entire community and especially the downtown business association.

There was a fountain not even a block away by the brewery That one wasn't working for a while, too. And that wasn't looking pretty for a while. And that's not that far. So when you said when times are tough.

I guess I'm just thinking because it's the main town square. It's a centerpiece for the city. And I just imagine that the city would really have to be in dire straits to let that be able to fall into disrepair. Because, yeah. Yeah. And the hotel and all the businesses and everything, I just don't think they'd stand for it. But that's just me speculating.

So what do you need from us today? Again, I apologize.

So we have a motion. Yeah, so we have a motion on the table.

Got it.

And clearly there's going to be this discussion. This will continue the process towards... the decision of where the temporary placement of these panels will be. So we're not deciding on the exact location and placement today, but we're basically putting a process in motion.

For both the final and temporary. And being that it's part of our permanent art collection, that approval would come to you. So just be mindful that no decisions would be made without bringing it back to you as we're looking at exploring this.

This is for both the temporary and the...

And yes, in the final placement, it's a motion for us to move forward to start to engage the community in these discussions.

And I think the other part of our decision making will be how the panels are actually displayed. Are they on a platform? Are they in a frame? You know, like, you know, what does it look like?

Yeah. The examples.

Exactly. Yes.

So we would help choose that or?

Once we start exploring the temporary placement, I would bring forward of what that would look like and where. We have to look at costs, et cetera.

I imagine there's going to be some comparison. I was like, okay, if we construct a base, that's going to be this cost. If we have a frame fabricated, it'll be that. So that's all part of the process, right?

So for today's discussion, is it relevant for us to discuss temporary locations? Okay.

Yes. So if there's any, from what I wrote down, it was at Courthouse Square was for the temporary panels that you would like to see because that's its home. But if there's any other locations that you think we could explore, not saying that it's going to be there, but if there's something you had in mind that we're not thinking of here as a team. Could you go back to the slide that had the...

Thank you. Okay. And City Hall is not to scale, right?

Yeah. But, yeah.

That's about eight feet across. I mean, maybe I need to move it over a bit, but I had measured.

Okay. One location I don't see up there, but maybe the Welcome Center is at Railroad Square. Is that the way? Okay. Yeah, I was thinking.

And these were just a brainstorm of not saying that we're moving forward with them, but these are some city locations that are open to discussion if necessary.

I support the discussion around the Welcome Center. Currently, we don't have anything that is really an icon when you step off the smart train. And it would be really nice to have something that's a bit more location specific and telling the story of Santa Rosa. With this being the Welcome Center, I've often heard a joke that it isn't very welcoming. So for us to make movement to be more welcoming would be,

something i would actively support i was going to say it's interesting to consider maybe taking those six panels and dividing them between two locations let's say the welcome center and courthouse square or something like that so there's more of a presence in the downtown region but um There's pros and cons, you know, I'm just thinking it through. And I don't think we have to make that decision today. We're just voting on moving the process forward. There will be a time in the not too distant future where we're going to have to vote on that very decision. Yeah. Okay.

The only thing I wanted to add to that, while I do think courthouse square is the best place for them generally, I also could see the side of things where, since that's where they're going to end up permanently, it might be nice to have them where for a minute just to increase this is the but on the other hand make it to courthouse square but you can make it to the finley community center then like they have that opportunity to see them where it's hard you know anyway no i can i can understand if that makes sense for monetarily and design with you with the courthouse square i'd like to see them all but if we did

decide to put one, I would like to put one, not necessarily three, but just one elsewhere just for a peak and maybe one somewhere else, but as a, you know, a little peak of what's going to happen in Courthouse Square.

Something occurs to me, Meredith, you said something about the panels could be displayed back to back. And so that suggests to me, maybe there's three locations where they would live. So you would place them back to back so people could have, you know, walk around them.

And then have sort of a plaque or verbiage to say that these will be in Courthouse Square.

Yeah, so just imagining maybe there's two panels in Courthouse Square, two at the Welcome Center and two at Finley Center or something like that.

How much would that even cost?

I'm thinking of transportation, which is the other reason I'm like, maybe they should just go to courthouse.

Well, anyway, I don't think we need to go down this rabbit hole. I actually think we've... A lot of good ideas or good topics for discussion in the minutes for the next meeting we have about it and for Meredith and her team to work off of. Meanwhile, if there is no other comments or questions, I think we should wrap this discussion up and go for a vote. Okay, with that being said, the motion is no longer on the screen. So, Jack, if you would. The motion was read aloud, so we are good. Okay, so the motion, I think everybody understands what that was, and it's been moved and seconded. And so, yeah, Jack, if you would call for a vote, please.

Absolutely. Chair Nathanson? Aye. Vice Chair Keefer. Aye. Committee Member Puentes. Aye. And Committee Member Peters. Aye. Let the record reflect, the motion passes unanimously.

Great, thank you all. Good discussion.

Thank you.

Okay, we're up to number eight, department reports.

Yes, thank you. We have some exciting department reports today. So we have Intersecting Infinity has been installed at Fire Station 5. And that was through artists post shoeing for the burning the 2017 fires. So I apologize. I didn't get slides in here for this today, but we are still finaling it, but it has been installed. And then I will be doing a plaque. So at the next meeting, I plan to have some, some photos of that for you. It has been updated on our website. So you can see photos. I haven't, um, been able to get photos of it lit up at night because there is lights in it. So I plan on doing that soon.

Will there be a dedication ceremony?

They did a fire station ceremony already. I am working with the artist on a schedule because I would like to have him come up here. He lives in Berkeley for a meet the artist, I think would be really nice.

Keep us posted.

The monarchs have been installed at Howarth Park. That was installed on the Friday before Labor Day weekend. And there's been a lot of talk on social media about it, which I think has been really exciting. I ran a quick ad prior to the install, but other than that, it's all just been word of mouth. And so I think that really shows the the power of public art and art in parks and getting art out in the community. I know a lot of times we focus on downtown and railroad square, which is great, but getting art to where the community is and accessible. We had over 59,000 views of the post and that was over 40,000 viewers. So unique viewers of that post and that was all organic. So that was not paid. That's great. And reading the comments is really encouraging. So I'd encourage you to go take a look. We will be doing a Meet the Artist. We haven't secured the date yet, but I will be sending that out to you. I envision that being sometime in October. And that is up until October 31st.

My wife and I went over on Saturday afternoon and walked the trail. It was great.

Yeah, it's really neat. The National Arts Program is right around the corner a bit. So that will be opening up in November for community members to apply. And so that will be at our next meeting. I'll have those exact dates for you. And I plan on doing an arts newsletter in the next coming weeks with the Call for Art Open, the Monarchs, the Fire Station Five, the National Arts Program. We have a lot going on. So if you haven't yet, you can sign up for our newsletter on our website, srcity.org arts. I also wanted to note that there is a project page for the Ruth Asawa project as well. So some images of the panels are there. Her history that I went over within the slide was provided by the family and that's on that page as well. So we've been really working our team on keeping those pages up to date with projects. So take a look, you can sign up for our newsletter. Our social media links are there as well. Thank you.

Great. Thank you very much. Okay. We are up to number nine committee reports. Any reports from committee members? I'd like to just mention A week ago Saturday, I went to the opening of the new Dia de los Muertos exhibition at the Museum of Sonoma County, and also took another look at the Christo exhibition. So I highly recommend visiting the museum for those two projects. And personally, I'll mention that at the end of this month, my contract with the Richmond Arts Center will be completed. the art center has hired a new executive director. So in the final week of this month, I will pass the baton and then I will be more available during the week. Um, I'm really glad these meetings take place on Mondays because otherwise I'm, I've been in the East Bay almost every day. And, um, Yeah, so Meredith, if you need me to, you know.

I'll put you to work.

Yeah, give me something to, that's, and I apologize, oh yeah, we didn't talk about the utility box project, but... I just didn't have a chance to do any measurement. Is there, are there boxes left to be measured?

I'll email the ad hoc, the update.

Okay, yeah, please do that. Yeah, because I feel remiss in that I have not had a chance to do that, but I have a tape measure and I have a car, so I can help.

We can do an update at the next meeting on that as well.

Okay, any other announcements, comments?

Yes, I do have an announcement. So it is open. Santa Rosa Open Studios had their first weekend this past weekend and our second weekend is next weekend. So you still have a couple more days to go check out all of the artist studios. You can check out the project or the entire map of City of Santa Rosa with all of the artists studio locations on that map on the website. Santa Rosa Open Studios. Look for that on Instagram. and Facebook as well, if you want more info.

Yeah. Thanks for announcing that. I was over in the, uh, uh, sofa district yesterday.

So I went out to the Fulton crossing yesterday and that's a really great space to see, um, open studios is really neat opportunity for them too with them being open on the weekends uh brings in a lot of people because they have I want to say seven artists in that displaying artwork in that same space so if you're looking for a bang for your buck kind of space uh Fulton Crossings and The Barracks are good studios to check out.

I always find the open studios here in Santa Rosa and also art trails to be really challenging because people are so spread out. So, you know, I think that's a good point when there's multiple artists in one location. I was director of San Francisco Open Studios years ago, and we had over 700 artists. So that was just impossible. So I kind of like these smaller open studio programs because they're definitely more manageable. Okay. Any other announcements or comments? Great. The next regular meeting of this committee is scheduled for Monday, October 5th. I hope you all have it clear on your calendar so we can have a quorum. And with that, the meeting is adjourned at 10 of 5. Thank you. 4.51 PM.