Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Oh, okay.

Okay. Now I can talk. See, I can, these guys have puppets drink. I can only talk when I'm allowed to talk. We're going to do roll call. Go ahead, Jerry, lead us.

Chris Dietz. Here. Josh First. Here. Mary Gayski.

Here.

John Kirshner.

Here.

Gary Lenker. Brian Pomeroy. Joe Robinson. Lisa Schaefer and Bob Spanler. Okay, we have four.

We have our quorum. Okay, we're going to go right to six, old business number two.

And we're going to do the officers first.

Oh, you want me to do officers first? Yeah, I told you I'm on puppet street. Jerry, tell me what I'm supposed to do. We have to elect an officer.

Right, because the meeting has to be recorded by somebody.

All right, well, is there anybody... mary your past john your past president so who we have chris chris do you have are you an officer yet is chris and all he's not involved i i am not chris would you mind if we elected you secretary does that mean that i have to keep notes

No, Jerry does all the work. The role of secretary, I'll give a quick overview. Technically, you're to be the official reviewer and the seer of the minutes and the actions of the committee. However, on a practical standpoint, uh our office myself either or alexa corber who also assists we'll write up the minutes and we'll send them to you in advance for you to review and make any comments and then once you do that then we make it available right before the meeting for everyone to see uh also you are responsible so we have to get your signature because uh as being the uh for official plans and our reviews, we need to put your name on the plans as being part of the review process. So that would fail of us getting a copy of your signature if you're comfortable with that. And we make a stamp of it because we do allow for a stamping of your signature on those plans.

Chris, I'd just like to say I was secretary for a long time. It must have been five or six years in a row. uh simply because it gave me power over jerry not many other opportunities to tell jerry what to say so when you control the minutes chris you control what actually comes out of this organization there's a lot more power to it than you think so i hope that you would accept my nominating you uh to be secretary do i hear a second person or second thank you john anyone opposed All in favor, say aye.

Aye. Well, thank you all.

Thank you for stepping up. We appreciate it. Nice to have a secretary. Excellent. Okay, now.

Gary Lenker is now on.

And is there anybody else?

Yes. Did you want to mention about Taryn?

Oh, yes. Taryn has... stepped out of the commission and we now have Lisa Schaefer in Taryn's place on our commission. Lisa could not be here today because she has not yet incorporated our schedule into her schedule, but she knows that she's on the board and she'll be joining us in the future. So thank you to Taryn for serving and welcome aboard Lisa. i worked with lisa in the lower faxton township planning commission for a number of years so i'm she she knows what she's doing she knows what she's doing so she'll be a valuable member excellent thank you for saying that appreciate it okay meeting minutes has anyone had a chance to read the minutes if not i'm giving you five seconds okay i'm i move to approve the minutes thank you very much mary we have a second Person or seconds? Thank you, John. Anyone opposed to approving the minutes? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Thank you very much. Minutes are approved. Okay, now we go to six, old business. Number two, Millersburg Borough. We've got Chase. He's a civil engineer sitting here to my right. He's here to discuss the Mid-Penn Bank Facilities Building Land Development. Chase, the floor is yours.

Thank you very much, Josh. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Chase Mader. As Josh said, I'm with Williams Site Civil here to represent the Mid-Penn Bank project up in Millersburg. The project consists of both a subdivision and a land development aspect. There will be three existing lots that will be consolidated into one parcel that's approximately just over a third of an acre. It is in the borough's old town zoning district in which a facilities building is permitted. We are proposing a 3,808 square foot facilities building with a drive-through. The drive-through is there because it will temporarily act as the bank facility for a time and then ultimately become a maintenance facility for Mid-Penn Bank and their other regional bank locations. So at this point, we are here to answer any questions that you may have. Jerry, what were the staff comments on this?

Well, just kind of history on it. This is a Dauphin County planning approval. Millersburg is part of it, of the six municipalities that have left that responsibility to us. One of the things that we have been working with The borough is on the engineer review. Millersburg has agreed that their engineer will be part of the review. And also they've been working with talking with the borough about their concern. Tanner Stroup is our planner, who is the LPA representative. He has completed his review and put it together. Tanner, if you want to go over briefly that and the major highlights, if you want to do that real quick.

Yeah, absolutely. yeah i mean there's not really any any major comments on this plan uh you know just kind of going through you know because of it being a preliminary final plan they need to request a waiver for preliminary plan requirements uh since there is no access onto state road they don't need to worry about hops that there is a comment on here just ensuring that they've uh talk with the borough all access is fine on the borough borough and streets since the borough engineer is going to be reviewing the plan a note a their review block needs to be added a typical certification notarization prior to approval the land surveyors required to certify the plan and then three kind of things here and there's been some preliminary discussions with the folks at Williams Site Civil. One of the, the first one here is about requiring PADEP sewage facilities planning original module where exemption is required. Essentially with that, you know, we I think in the letter it was stated that due to the low amount of volume and also the fact that there are existing on-site laterals, there is no need for the planning module.

Yes. I've reached out to the Millersburg authority. We have, as you said, we have evidence of an existing service, so we got a letter from them. We'll be able to provide that to you.

Okay. And that's essentially all we really wanted is essentially, you know, because I mean, the way DEP spells it out, you have to either have the original module or proof of exemption or such. But, you know, with the existing the facilities that are still there, we basically decided that a letter from the sewer authority would suffice with what's already existing.

Second was stormwater.

Our ordinance requires a stormwater management plan with, let's see here, Provisions in our ordinance state that the requirements of our stormwater provisions can be waived in favor of a direct discharge report if deemed necessary by the borough engineer. So I know there was some discussion. I'm not sure if the borough engineer, what the outcomes of those discussions that you've had with them regarding that direct discharge report.

We spoke with the township engineer last week at a quick meeting, and he is on board with just confirming that the discharge report, as long as we're not increasing flows or presenting any erosion issues downstream, then we'll be fine. And at this point, we don't see any concern right now.

Jerry, I guess I'll ask this question of you. Since the way it's worded in our ordinance, it says about a waiver for that.

Right, so we would need another waiver for that and then confirmation from the borough that they're accepting that as part of their review.

So our waiver request will be from township requirements?

Well, no, it'd be from that requirement, which gives the township the option of allowing it. So we will actually, everything, if we do it, in the way the origins is stated, what goes through them. If you get past that gate, then we would decide whether or not. So go ahead. Yeah.

And then, and just to kind of reference it in reference to that in, in, uh, Millersburg's, uh, comment letter. They basically stated they have no comments on the plan. However, the borrower would like to see a discharge report deal detailing how stormwater will be handled and how it will affect infrastructure downstream. So they concur with allowing that waiver.

Thank you very much, Chad.

And then there's a little bit more. Our ordinance requires a final erosion sediment control plan. ENS was provided in the plan submission. Our ordinance requires a submission to the conservation district because it's over 5,000 square feet of earth disturbance. We have received a letter stating that it was submitted to the conservation district for their review. Has there been any word back from them? Okay. Monuments and markers need to be set in accordance. There is a general note that needs to be corrected that states Derry townships. That's just a general correction. And then take into account any comments from the borough. There really weren't any. and then just general outweigh the reports. So nothing major, just some, mostly the stormwater.

I think the summation where we stand is we're still waiting on some more things. There's still coordination that's going on, particularly getting the report done, reviewed, and getting it okayed by the borough that they're accepting the information and it's okay, and they're engineered review of it. We have 90 days from February 2nd or to from these matters, most everything can be done, if not certainly done in the next few years. No, no, I think as you mentioned, Josh, the main concern whenever Tanner was talking to them and is not giving a whole, carte blanche okay on the stormwater because it's a concern but having at least this being a reasonable option of the middle ground to make sure that everything is acceptable so so with that our recommendation is for let's not make any action tonight let's just wait until we get all the information in at that point if there's any concerns we can raise it with work it out so uh i guess the the action we're taking is to let things continue

and wait for all of the paperwork and the additional information to come in. Things need to be dotted.

I's need to be dotted, T's need to be crossed. Okay.

Is there an action for us on this? No, there is not. Okay. Thank you very much, Chase, Tanner.

Mr. Chairman, I have a question just for clarification. I'm somewhat hesitant to ask it for fear that I have missed something in recent years, but the engineer for the bank referred to uh uh old town zoning district in millersburg borough when did millersburg borough adopt zoning oh miller perk had zoning for has that been 10 years now i want to say like 2014-ish oh was that in conjunction with upper paxton did they do that together with upper paxton is that when that was no okay it was not together we we attempted that but it did not work out okay Thank you for the clarification.

Gary, they have kind of a hybrid form-based zone that we actually wrote, and I think it was Leah and I, a long time ago, wrote that in conjunction. Yeah, it's when I first started at Tri-County, so it would have been in 2014 or 2015.

No wonder I forgot that.

Yeah, right.

Okay, we go back. Chase, anything else you want to say or do?

Yes, we would actually like to discuss another aspect of the project. As of right now, we're just looking for, you know, for the facilities building in the northern portions. In the future, we plan on coming back to discuss a main branch building. Right now, there's very large hodgepodge of buildings that's constructed just south of this maintenance building. Ultimately, the goal of the bank is to demo that and construct a new branch building. And at this point, I'm actually going to open the door for Doug, but there's a question about HOPs and access onto Union Street to the south. So, Doug, if you would like to give some input here.

Can everyone hear him?

Oh, yeah.

Okay. Yeah, I'm Doug Gossick. I'm also with William Sites Civil. As Chase said, this is really the first step in a two-step process for Mid-Penn Bank. We're going to construct the facilities building. Ultimately, the use is, as Chase said, to house a few maintenance folks that will take care of the regional facilities. But temporarily, it'll be used to serve customers from a banking purpose. That's needed while they demolish the existing structure and construct a new one. That plan for the demo and reconstruction of the bank will be forthcoming here within the next month or two. We wanted to get through this step first since it is a critical first step in the process for the facilities building. That said, we're hoping, I know there's been some dialogue with respect to the bank and specifically its existing access onto Union Street, which is a state road. They have three existing driveways on the Union Street. Unfortunately, there's only one that is permitted, and that's the most recent one that was constructed near the intersection with Ray Street. It serves a parking lot that's on the bank's property, but it's primarily used by the municipality and folks in the downtown area. But the other two driveways that really serve the bank itself, they predate the whole PennDOT permitting process. And our concern was we are not, as part of the bank project, proposing to modify those driveways. We're maintaining the same dimensions, same traffic patterns. And in fact, as part of this redevelopment of the bank building, the square footage of the bank will be reduced by 70%, 75%. So a lot less traffic in those driveways, theoretically. Our concern was that if we have to go through and try to read or permit those existing driveways, it's gonna delay the project by 10 to 14 months. So we just threw it out there that can we request a waiver that the county ordinance requires that if you have driveways onto a state road, you must provide copies of the HOP. in this case understanding their existing driveways and we are proposing no modifications and the project will actually result in a decrease in traffic pressure on those points we would be making our application here in a few months requesting a waiver from that requirement to provide HOPs for those existing driveways. So again, just trying to feel you folks out today to see if there's anyone adamantly opposed to considering that waiver, because frankly, if you are, we have to hit a reset on our schedule for this overall project. So I'm sorry for the length of that explanation, but that's, you know, we'd like to see if there's anyone who's adamantly opposed to that request that will be forthcoming as part of our next plan.

I would not be opposed to that. Being familiar with this site, knowing the history of that building, those buildings being originally from Millersburg, I mean, that's just common sense. To have you go through that, I think, is absurd, quite candidly.

Agreed.

Well, thank you. We really appreciate that feedback. It gives us a greater sense of comfort moving forward that we're not too far off in our projected schedule here.

Thank you very much, Chase and Doug. Thanks so much for being here. Appreciate it.

Thank you very much, especially for bringing us up. I appreciate that. Absolutely.

Is there precedent with PennDOT for grandfathered driveways like that, that there's not a requirement?

If that's the question.

My experience, Chris, is yes and no.

Okay.

Yes and no. It's been my experience.

Sounds good.

Thank you.

Treasurer's report.

See you, Chase. Thanks. Treasurer's report.

Jerry, would you like to give us... Yeah, just... it's a very light month uh there's only a few uh applications put forward and it's again it's money coming in uh to dauphin county as tri county is providing the staff it's the transfer of the funds over to tri county as collected by the county for the reviews okay do we have a motion to approve the payment of expenses so move thank you gary we have a second second

Chris, thank you very much. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Any opposition? I didn't think so. Okay. Passes. All right. Now we move on to reports. Jerry? Well... Any officers have anything to report? Chris, don't you dare. Okay. Got a smile, that's good. All right, no report of officers, communications staff reports.

Yeah, we have a couple items. First one is to note that we received an official notification from the Harrisburg School District on the closure of the Marshall Academy and Roland Middle Schools. Under the Pennsylvania Municipality's planning code, whenever the district intends to redo a school, either property or closing, that they have to provide us with a copy of such There is no action that is needed by us on this. However, there is a public hearing on March 31st at 6 p.m. in the boardroom of the administration building of the Harrisburg School District on 1010 North 7th Street. So more information will be provided there. We do have copies of their information as they provide it. Again, we do not have to take any action. We're just being notified. A second notification is that the 2025 annual report from Tri-County and of which Dauphin County Planning Commission as a component of it has been published and it is available for review online. I suggest you take a look at it to get to see what all the things that we're up to, which you all know what that is, but it gives kind of a listing of the activities with the REP program, the CAP program, which is the two water quality programs that are involved with, gives a summary of all the LPA, projects or timeways and also with the development trends that have been happening within the county, I will say that we have had a steady flow of new plans. and again 55 of all big plans have been occurring within our community service area which is uh which is again positive which is a goal of the of the comprehensive plan uh of which 62 of those plans big plans have been within it so again the idea is to try and discourage leapfrog development and that is occurring so within the county maybe not 100 but it is uh the trend of the majority of the larger plans are occurring within the community service area that is for areas where there's water and sewer um other kind of things again there's just a breakdown of all the bullet items of all the things that we have done um and there's a commission so again if you want to take a look at it it is it is up there for review. As Josh mentioned, we had the new Planning Commission member put into place. We have provided her with additional information about the roles in the Planning Commission. If there's anybody who wants to provide additional information to them, certainly that's welcome. Also too, we'll be sending next month a listing of all the addresses so if you would take a look at that next month we'll make sure your information is correct and then uh we'll make that as our official directory of the planning commission members so as of next year we have two members who are of terms expire at the end of the year and that's uh mr first and mr spandler so everybody else is how many years a couple years yeah so next year is when is one up in december december december okay yes you miss his family all right everybody else is beyond that and that'll be on that information we'll send out next month so all right where are we programmed progress reports i'll take that one um in in february we've

you know variety of things it was a hats meeting month so we went through our normal mpo uh hats meeting processes uh call a couple things to attention here uh tri-county applied for and in december we we uh got notified that we have additional we received a supplemental safety planning grant from the federal safe streets and roads for all uh program uh that's the same program that funded our sober ride home program uh so this is a a little bit more supplemental money to do some site specific work or additional planning and safety analysis at five locations across the region that are identified in the safety plan uh in um in dolphin county those two locations are louder milk road and 743 in dairy township and uh walnut street and 28th street i think in pembroke borough but that that one will probably be expanded a little bit into more of a post 83 uh improvements long-term transportation traffic strategy so we're excited to get we're kind of getting started on those um other staff is working on what's called a human service transportation plan uh it's a plan that looks specifically at the challenges faced by the elderly and disabled communities particularly as it relates to transit access so both fixed route transit and paratransit so rebecca and karen from our office have been doing a lot of great work on that study been doing a ton of outreach and meetings and they did ride-alongs a few weeks ago where they were out on the road with people talking to people while they're on their trips also talking to the drivers and getting as many perspectives as possible uh this year we're also updating the tip so the transportation Improvement Program that's the four-year construction schedule of federally funded transportation improvements uh that's going through the processes right now we'll be going to air quality conformity here in the next few weeks uh that is anticipated for adoption in june and then that'll take effect october 1st is the first day of the of the next fiscal year last thing i'll call attention to is our regional growth management plan uh we are updating that right now uh over the last last few months of 2025, we had a visual preference survey out where I kind of just asked people's opinions on a variety of pictures showing different kinds of development, kind of scales, intensities and types. So we got a lot of great input. I think we had right around 100 responses, which is, you know, for our outreach efforts, that's a that's a good that's a good number. And we got some great

Were all those people planners?

No.

No, I mean it's- We all are planners. We all aspire to be planners. Planners.

Yeah. No, we got a lot of great input from that. So we're moving forward with that. That also outreach is doing some stakeholder outreach here and having a couple stakeholder meetings in the next few weeks. So Jerry, do you have anything from a county specific perspective?

The only thing I think is the, As the rep, we don't have an update on the rep report here.

There's a little blurb about it.

Yes, what we're doing is still moving forward to getting all the agreements signed with the municipalities and with the county, and we should hopefully get that all done in the next month and start doing our data collection with R2 on their contract.

Outstanding. Thank you.

Contract to R2 today.

Wow, did you really? All right, great. Thank you. I'm telling you, I keep tooting your guys' horn on this. that subject was a train wreck in your county or to lancaster just a lot of counties had problems with this issue called a rain tax a lot of political resistance to it and i don't think it was handled very well this is the only county i know of where this this regulation really is what it is it's an unfunded federal mandate was handled in a way that you know it uh it persuaded me So, you know, hats off to you guys.

I will bring up one other hot ticket. We took part of a tour of data centers in Loudoun County. Oh yeah, how'd that go? It was very good. It was very informative. In attendance was Commissioner Hartwig, but also there was state reps and a state senator and also members of our economic development community. So it was very well received. very informative and uh you know these things are coming and these things uh um you know it's good to have as much information as we have and so uh i thank the commissioners for inviting me on that and uh you know it's helping us we're going to have a review of the plan coming or that's here in a few minutes it just seems like everybody wants to have four or ten well it depends on who you are yeah but it just seems to me like everybody seems who wants one

has like a place to put it. But I don't think a lot of the sites that I've seen really lend themselves to it. You got to have really a major source of power.

A lot of power. Yeah, I mean, we can get into long discussions on the thing, but kind of in summary, you need three main things. You need power. Power has to be available, it has to be able to get to your site, and the people need to be able to show that they can get it to you, so whoever your energy provider. is that's the case there the concern with power is that everybody is draining as a type of thing so if you're even interested in building power on your own site you're bidding against the utility companies who are also equipment. So that's one of the things. Two is water. Water is used to cool. A lot of the systems are self-contained cooling systems, so it just recirculates within very little evaporation. However, the initial draw is tremendous. So whatever happens in terms of commitment. It's not a local drain. It's not a slow, it's going to be a one-time boom, bang type of thing. So that's also the type of problem that everyone has. The other exciting consideration is they do have to have access to the internet. They have to have ability to get their information in and out in a quick manner. Data does go down after distance. So you may have power in Northern Dauphin, you may have water in Northern Dauphin, but you don't have the internet connectivity. So those are the three things that they're really looking for. The other thing they're looking for is a commitment from governments to not necessarily slow them down. This is a fast moving type of thing, places that have by right on a state level, if they're tax free, that gives them another big advantage to no sales tax on equipment. That's in Virginia right now, but they're reconsidering it. So there is also that Pennsylvania does also have provisions where there's no tax on data center buying and purchasing type of thing. So those are the things that I miss out. Those are the things that are looking at if I'm sitting there as being Joe and Jerry developer looking for data centers. That's what I'm looking for.

That's very helpful. Thank you, Jerry. I didn't know any of that except for the power. Appreciate it. Any questions for Jerry? Okay, let's move along. We have done program progress reports, LPA report.

LPA report, 30 hours. A number of those meetings, night meetings, uh middle paxton millersburg has you know that was with tanner uh susquehanna has some general meetings with uh some developments that they're looking at so uh i've nothing outside outside outside of what we've been normally doing uh however that data center trip is also on there so i have one correction i'm sorry chris i'm going to step on your toes secretary

Loudoun County is L-O-U-D-O-U-N. You have it spelled L-O-U-D-E-N. Oh, yeah.

You're not a bad person, Jerry. It just proves I'm not perfect.

You're not Southern is what you're not. All right. Thank you. Any questions for Jerry on the LPA report? OK, we move on to committees. Committees, anything committees.

well i i do have a uh question and some comments on committees i can wait till go ahead so uh and i'm sorry i didn't reach out to the staff sooner i was actually it uh about a week ago attended the national association of home builders winter meeting and international builder show in orlando and uh It brought to mind because there is a lot of discussion. The term is resonating that housing is having its moment in this country. And I think we can concur with that. Our governor Shapiro released his housing action plan about a month ago, and there are two major pieces of legislation in Congress. One that passed the U S Senate called the road to housing act and one that passed in the U S house. Housing for the 21st Century Act. And both of these major pieces of legislation provide production incentives to communities and counties that increase their affordable housing. And that is by zoning incentives and other things. So I know that we have had a committee that has dealt with an array of these topics. I think initially it was called affordable housing committee I think we then kind of changed that to housing affordability and then maybe even workforce housing but there are major benefits to communities and counties that meet these standards in the both of these pieces of legislation primarily increasing CDBG funds so I'm I'm just asking the question it seems to me if these if these bills get put together and approved which it sounds like there's a very positive chance of that i would think that we're going to be asked to get involved or weigh in on some of these ideas with zoning incentives so maybe it's appropriate that we at some point in time in the next month or so get that particular committee together or have at least discussions about preparing for that does that make any sense

gary i hear gary i hereby uh appoint you to be committee chair for affordable housing pull together whoever you want on it and then you'll have your first committee meeting at the next uh dauphin county planning commission is that work for you yeah i i certainly need the staff's uh full input and support on that and i can chat with them afterward but uh

Great. Thank you. Thank you.

There's already a committee. Isn't there already some? There's a formal organized group. Yes.

Well, then we just took it over or we are deferring to whatever people want.

Can Jerry, can staff help me on what we have been calling this committee most recently?

We'll look up the records and get it all back to you and we'll have something prepared for the next meeting. Sounds great. Thank you. Thank you,

Thanks, Gary. Thank you, Mary, for pointing that out. Okay. Old business. Number six, old business. Subdivision land development matters. Number one, approvals. Williams Township.

Yeah. This one is actually go ahead and take action on. This one's ready to roll. There is a David and Jolene Smith and Williams Township. in essence is moving a lot line between a couple of pieces of the property that they own under their own... They own both lots, so they're moving it between the two of them. It's officially a lot add-on plan and those in our ordinance are reviewed under a very relaxed standard compared to a plan that is creating a new lot. Therefore, this plan meets all those requirements except for a couple of small items that there is a title block that it has the to be put on that Williams Township has reviewed it because under our ordinance, they are given the opportunity to review and they have and have no comments. And also the title block for Dauphin County says that we reviewed it as opposed to being approving it. And therefore that should be changed if it's an approval. So in essence, we believe that it's ready to roll. And with those two changes, it can be approved and move forward.

Okay, excellent. Any questions for Jerry? All right. Do we have a motion to approve staff comments and actions on this? Jolene and David Smith. Sorry, it's a good song. Motion to approve. Thank you very much. Second? Anyone get a second?

Who was the second? Second, Gary.

Thank you very much. Anyone opposed? All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Passes. We've already done number two, Millersburg Borough. We now move into new business. Number seven, subdivision land development matters. One, reviewing comments. We have four action plans and four plans, and we're supposed to ratify your staff comments. Go ahead, Jerry.

Not much here. I mean, the Lower Sotera has an extended stay of a 4,700 unit and a couple, one or two lot subdivisions.

Any questions for Jerry or Andrew? All right, I'd like the motion from someone please to ratify the staff comments.

Motion moves.

Thank you, John, do we have a second? Thank you, Bob. Mary, we'll get you next time. Thank you. Anyone opposed? All those in favor, please say aye.

Aye.

Passes. All right. 7B, zoning amendments. Jerry.

Okay. South Hanover. South Hanover has been talking about their changes to their zoning ordinance to talk about data centers. They're one of many communities that have been talking about doing such. They've been reviewing different ordinances that are out there. They've been also reviewing where in their township may be making sense. In essence, the communities are kind of deciding, let me back up in terms of not just this one, but a lot of the communities are concerned in that if there is a not a definition of what a data center is under regular type of development in terms of zoning interpretations if you don't define then it can go anywhere so therefore a lot of these communities are deciding that they want a local control over this because as of this point it is a local control matter there has been some house or yes senate state senate uh legislation that Mr. Rothman has put forward to take that control away. Not sure where it's going to go. But anyway, the responsibility is falling on the local municipalities and a lot of them are struggling what to do. So South Hanover, I think, is our maybe first, if not second, municipality that has come along and put together some regulations on it. In essence, they're looking at it being they're creating a data center overlay district so they're not creating a zoning district per se but they're allowing it in within their resident one uh the residential cluster portion and their industrial park district where that shows in if you're familiar with south hanover township it's the area around the quarry So that is their main industrial area. And then they've had an extension of the northern area as well to allow that data center to occur. There's the water. Well, there's the water. Yes. Most of these municipalities are looking at their industrial districts to put these things in, because if you take a very broad approach to these things, these are industrial kind of complexes, they're industrial type of uses, therefore they're going there. But because of those concerns that we've talked about before, the data, the energy and everything else, everybody's, and from a local standpoint, it's the noise. As we talked about, these things use a lot of energy. It's not to run the machines, it's to keep the machines cool. because a lot of computers in a lot of space get a lot of hot going so they've got to keep those things anywhere from 65 degrees to 72 degrees and they have to regulate humidity to be almost perfect at all times because they've got advanced equipment so so a lot of the energy is for running that and the water and the energy or to keep the place cool so if you got a lot of air conditioners running got a lot of emergency generators running, that creates a lot of noise. So a lot of the things that these ordinances, including the South Hanover one, is talking about the noise, talking about the vision, talking about what they look like, and talking about some of the other things that are concerned in most of the ordinances. We have reviewed the the ordinance. We're generally supportive of the ordinance. However, the letter was in your packet, of which we do have some things that we think that should be put into play a little bit more considered. But again, these are more refinements than they are saying don't do it. One of the things is where they have it, their district, make sure that they have enough space for it. Are they being within that small area excluding within, are they making it not possible to build because they selected such a small area to build on? If you don't kind of... if you have you can't out zone a property by putting it in as only allowing it a place it can't be built right so the question is with that quarry and with the area and everything else are they excluding it because one of the other provisions that they have is that they're requiring such a large setback because of the noise they want the people to be away from the noise because noise is one of the best deterrents of noise is distance so therefore unless somebody waved at it we have an option for people to wave out maybe someone likes it maybe somebody does but maybe they make their own one yeah well and noise is relative is it background noise or is it loud boom noise right those kind of things So anyway, they have a large area in their ordinance. They have also large setback requirements. So those are the things that we require them to take a look at. They also require a minimum 300-foot buffer yard for existing residential uses should they also be looking at residential zone areas because they can get to mine future things. They also have some lighting standards that we think that we want to make sure that they're not in conflict with other provisions of the ordinances. Also, they have some environmental requirements and emergency management requirements that we want to make sure that doesn't fly in the face of state regulations that would supersede any local regulations. so in essence we're in favor of it however we want to just make sure that they take into those couple uh factors to make sure that they are not getting themselves into further trouble by being totally exclusionary interesting thank you okay so we need to take action by approving uh our staff recommendations uh do we have a motion mary did you want to make the motion

mary's still there yeah she left i'm sorry she left yeah i was looking is it just me and john are we like the quarry form of two no no you're good all right who else who would like to make the motion hey bob spandler i'll make that emotion thank you bob second please second i'll second it brian palmer away thank you very much brian anyone opposed Hearing none, do we have unanimous all in favor? Say aye.

Aye.

Everybody's in favor? Passes. Thank you very much. Okay. We have an official map for Lower Paxton Township.

I'll take that one. So Lower Paxton Township developed an active transportation plan over last summer and into the fall, and then they adopted it in January. This is essentially a an implementation tool of that. And official maps, while they're certainly not a new concept, they are pretty underutilized. They're a very good tool specifically for things like trail connections or multimodal type improvements. They can also be used to kind of earmark kind of provide the townships with a right of first refusal for things like parkland or other other types of public improvements so again lower paxton's is primarily looking at uh uh bicycle and pedestrian improvements uh kind of get enabling them to have some teeth behind places where they want sidewalks trails bike paths that sort of thing so um you know there's a there's a little bit of cleanup that that that I uh noticed in my review nothing major um I know they don't go to uh their hearing isn't until April so we because we just got this like two weeks ago so I turned this around pretty quick their planning Commission meeting is Wednesday night so I'll be able to talk to them about it there uh but yeah I'm I'm just happy they've developed and are doing an official map. It's great. I wish more municipalities would do the same.

Yeah, you'd probably get even more feedback from people if they could visualize things. All right, thank you very much. All right, so we're going to take a motion from someone to approve staff recommendations on the Lower Paxton Township official map. Do we have a motion?

This is Chris. I'll make that motion.

Thank you, Chris. Do we have a second, please?

You have Bob Spandler. I'll second it.

Thank you, Bob. All right. Anyone opposed?

Before, I just had one comment there, Josh.

Yeah, go ahead. Sorry.

I think Andrew was too kind in his review. I don't know if anybody looked at that map, but it is really hard to read. It's a pretty poor effort at putting forth an exhibit to show an official map.

Well, and John, it was tough to read, and that was one of my comments, I think.

Well, I know you were pretty kind. You just said, I probably, I get older, I'm probably more blunt, but there are things on that map that don't even have a key or in the legend to show what they're for.

Yeah, they also had an interactive web-based map that showed it as well. So, yeah. one of my comments discussion points at the meeting is going to be what exactly is getting codified as part of the as as part of the uh of the official map but i but i i agree john that it would the the the map they provided was not as as tight as it should have been every map needs a legend key all right thank you john yeah all right so we have two motions i think

And we hear no opposition, just General Grousing, and that's okay. Any opposition? None. Hearing none, do we have a vote in support of Andrew's corrective comments on Lower Paxton's mediocre township map? That goes in the minutes, Chris. All in favor say aye.

Does Grousing go in the minutes? Grousing?

Yes. It's part of the motion. It's part of the motion. that's a good one i gotta support that thank you very much i appreciate that all right all in favor say aye please all right thanks passes you have your marching orders andrew all right we get to d intergovernmental reviews jerry uh do you want to do your first one sure the the first one is um is a uh

Part of a safety project in Lower Paxton Township has been pursuing for a while. It has to do with the intersection of Haux and that whole area of Haux Road.

That is a crazy place.

So they're trying to piece by piece make that intersection a little more normal. They already had some funding to build a sidewalk from Jonestown Road to the the township building there so this is yet just another piece that they're going after uh pendon multimodal fund uh dollars for it so all right thank you we're going to do these together in one motion harrisburg city uh cameron street veterans housing i'll just read what they said it's a

Housing and Workforce Hub is a mixed-use redevelopment project located at 1317 to 1321 North Cameron Street in Harrisburg. The project includes a veteran-focused housing component, a workforce training center, a small business cafe market that will serve both the residents and the surrounding community. The PA sites request support for site readiness work including grading utilities floodplain elevation compliance and pre-development engineering and who is that applicant it is profit from experience inc llc thank you they're going from dc they're going for dced and it's a Um, strategic investment to enhance sites program, PA sites.

Interesting. Well, anyone that's ever been stuck on Cameron street, you know, you can get out of your car, walk into a cafe, get a coffee and walk back 10 minutes later and the traffic won't move. So it'd be good to have a cafe there. Maybe you can pick up a skill or two. Okay. Yes. All right. Um, We are going to take a motion on approving the concurrence of the staff and the commission. We have a motion. Thank you, John. Second, please.

Second.

Thank you, Chris. Hearing any opposition, anyone opposing this? Hearing none. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Thank you very much. Motion passes. The commission supports Lower Paxton Township and the city in their endeavors. Okay, we now move on to seven additional items. Dawson-Kinney Comprehensive Plan.

Yes, we're still, like Andrew said, about the Regional Growth Management Plan. We're kind of piggybacking on a lot of the things that they're doing for their outreach. We still have our survey is still up and running. We just put in to have a booth at the County Wetlands Festival. So throughout the remaining portion of the summer, we will be doing outreach and starting to gather stuff. We're also looking at dates that we'll be meeting with local officials to, again, discuss this in cooperation with the Regional Growth Management Plan. We have not heard yet back of whether or not we were going to be funded either through the gaming grant or the state maps grant, which would give us a whole lot more ability to do more. So we're kind of just moving along at a measured pace, because if we do get more money, then we can do a lot more, be more robust if we have to. Be careful about how much we spend, then we'll be careful about how much we spend.

Okay. Thank you very much. Any questions for Jerry about the comprehensive plan?

and his update and if you haven't done the survey take a look at it online and and please take the survey all right take the survey it's a quick 10 10 question survey which uh asked for generally uh general perceptions on planning. There will be a second one later on, which we are going to have it as more of an interaction of where we are and whether or not we're going the wrong final steps type of thing.

Okay, thank you, Jerry. Any questions for Jerry? Hearing none, we go into adjournment. Can we have a motion for adjournment, please?

So moved.

Thank you very much. It passes. And our next meeting is Monday, April 6th, 4 o'clock. Thank you all for being here. Jerry has something to say.

Chris, don't step off yet.

Okay. Sounds good.

Thank you, everybody. Thanks so much.

Good night, everybody. Have a good afternoon, evening.

Thank you.