City Council - Regular Meeting

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Is last name or is Are you sure? Yes. Few more minutes. Just let me know when you're ready. Okay.

Good morning everyone. We're going to call this meeting to order. It is Wednesday, March 25th. It's 9:00 a.m. in the Lashley community room and we will do roll call. Janine, Greg, Julia, Janice, Locker,

and then we'll have the invocation followed by the pledge of allegiance. Heavenly Father, we call you Father because we are your children. We lift up every man and woman serving in our military today. Protect them wherever they are stationed on land, at sea, or in the air. Be their shield. Be their covering. We also pray for their families that your Holy Spirit would give them peace. Father, we thank you for the city of Pontagora and all our all of our employees whose hard work and determination make this city such a great place to work, play, and live in. Father, bless them. Father, thank you for the officials that are open to prayer at our city council meeting. We thank you, Father, for the decisions they make every day, which are not easy and not always popular. We pray that you give them wisdom. We pray for all who are in this chamber this morning. We pray that you keep them and may your Holy Spirit bless each and every one of them. It's in the name of our Lord and Savior we pray.

Amen. Amen. To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. And because um it actually is our Vietnam Veterans Recognition and also National Medal of Honor today. Today is National Medal of Honor. I'd like all of our veterans in the room to please stand and recognize.

Thank you everyone for your sacrifices and welcome home. Do we have any announcements to make? We do. Mayor,

yes. Uh, Swift One has implemented a modified phase 3 watering restriction going in place on April 3rd. What this means is that the watering schedule um if your address ends in zero one or one, you should only water on Monday, two or three on Wednesday, four or five on two or three on Tuesday, four or five on Wednesday, six or seven on Thursday, eight or nine on Friday. There's no watering on Saturday, no watering on Sunday. You can only water from 12:01 a.m. to 4:00 a.m. or 8:00 pm to 11:59 on your day. This includes uh residents on city water and people with private wells. There are hand watering um opportunities if you have new lawns and all of this is listed on the city website already, but I do want to mention that it's bigger than just watering. Also, restaurants know you'll have to request if you want to be served water. restaurants can no longer automatically just bring you water. Um, so we're doing some messaging with our chamber of commerce and with our business tax receipts so that that businesses are aware of this. Um, it also requires us to take a look at high usage accounts and check to see if those um accounts are are uh doing excessive irrigation or trying to get to the bottom of why the the um high water bills are occurring or why the usage is occurring. So this is very serious. We will be messaging this of course on social media. Uh we will be including it in newspaper columns and it also this this order now our ordinance already required us to find people for um violating the irrigation orders. This this now from swift mud um also requires that we find people and not give warnings. So um we have to follow their directive and we need to make the public aware of it. So, this you're getting the

first announcement here. It's already on our website and you'll see it other places as well. And I'd appreciate it if uh you could share the information with your neighbors and make sure that they're taking a look at our website so they understand the rules as well. It's a very serious situation. So, um we're all in this together and water. There's rules on pressure washing, too. Um you can do it if you're going to be painting your house, but you can't pressure wash for aesthetic purposes. So, if you're just trying to remove some gunk and grime, that's not allowed at this point in time either. So, I encourage you to take a look at our website to get all of the information.

Thank you. Anybody else have any announcements? Okay, just quickly so I don't forget, especially with it being an important time for our veterans actually having Vietnam on March 29th uh on Sunday. And I know we'll talk about this Vietnam Wall um National Veterans Vietnam Veterans Day at 10:00 a.m. at the wall. And then on Friday, this Friday, we have the Veterans Resource Fair um March 27th. And I've got the information up here if you need it. Okay. Our next meeting is actually going to be on April 7th. It's a joint meeting with the Historic Preservation Advisory Board, 5:00 p.m. right here in Lashley Cleaning Room. And then the next day will be April 8th, our regular city council meeting 99 here again. And lastly, community room. Anybody have anything about the agenda?

I think we discussed um rearranging uh putting six I after six. Yes. Okay.

Yes. Perfect. Next, we're going to be doing three proclamations. St. Vincent to Paul with Janice. Vietnam Veterans Day appation. I will do that and tribute Woods economic development day with Janine. So from St. Whereas poverty poverty in Charlotte County continues and has been compounded by rising rent, food, and utility costs as well as unsettled hurricane insurance reimbursements with many more of our neighbors finding themselves in dire distress and in need of assistance. And whereas the Society of St. Vincent Depal in Charlotte County's mission is to assist those in need by responding to community and individual needs through programs such as disaster relief services, food pantries, housing programs, utility support, thrift stores and other programs and services. And whereas the society partners with local churches and charities including Harry Chafin Food Bank to stock food pantries and feeds several thousand people each month helping to alleviate hunger in the community as well as participating in seasonal programs for snacks, school supplies, and holiday assistance. Whereas each year the four conferences of St. Vincent Depal and Charlotte County hold a walk for the poor to raise funs and increase awareness of the less fortunate among us with every p penny raised benefiting our our neighbors in Charlotte County. Now therefore, the city council of the city of Pontagora,

Florida does hereby proclaim March 28th, 2026 as St. Vincent Paul Day and encourages all city of Pontagora and Charlotte County residents to participate in the 17th annual Walk for the Poor, make a donation and use their talents by volunteering with the society to support its mission passed and duly adopted this 25th day of March 2026. Thank you so much.

Did you want to say anything? I guess she said it all, but this is our biggest fundraiser of the year. Without this, we would have to cut back on what we do. But we do a lot. We we help people remodel their houses and food, clothing, rent money, electric, water. We even we give them money to drive to the local doctors. So, we do do a lot and we thank everybody and please show up Saturday. We got hot dogs, hamburgers, uh water. We can't have any odd liquor because we don't have a license. But anyway, thank you and please show up. It'll be a nice morning. Thank you again. Thank you. Can I get my Vietnam catchment? I come find

sir. Your name for the record. Your name. Peter Couturo. Did I say that correctly? Okay. Thank you, sir. Sir. Okay. Now, my Vietnam veteran, do you want to come on up, please? I'll be

Thank you so much for coming today. It's really truly an honor and privilege to give this proclamation. Whereas, as we honor the enduring legacy of the Vietnam War, we reflect the solemn reverence upon the valor of a generation that served with honor, paying tribute to the more than three million men and women who bravely left their families to serve a world away from everything they knew and everyone they loved. Whereas we remember those who courageously served during more than a decade of combat over air, land, and sea. And we pledge that their sacrifices in the name of freedom, often made in the face of extraordinary and unprecedented danger, will never be forgotten by a grateful nation. Whereas through the presence of the Vietnam Mall of Southwest Florida, dedicated on November 5th, 2016, the citizens of Point, Charlotte County, and the state of Florida are daily reminded of the more than 58,000 patriots who sacrificed all they had and all they would ever know. And whereas in the reflection of the wall, we see the military family members and veterans who carry a pain that may never fade. and we seek to offer them peace in knowing their loved ones endured in the hearts of all Americans who remain forever grateful for their service. And whereas the formal Department of Defense 50th anniversary commemoration program concluded on November 11th, 2025. However, the mission of gratitude continues, ensuring that this generation of proud Americans is forever honored for seeing our country through one of the most challenging chapters. And whereas, let us strive to live up to the example by showing our Vietnam veterans, their families, and all who have served from November 1st, 1955 to May 15th, 1975 the fullest respect and support. And remember, it is never too late to say welcome home. So, welcome home to

the men and women who answered the call of duty. Now therefore, the city council of the city of Point of Florida does hereby proclaim March 29th, 2026 as Vietnam Veterans Appreciation Day throughout the city and urges residents to reflect at the Vietnam Mall of Southwest Florida to reach out to a veteran you know in the community and to demonstrate their gratitude through active support of our local veterans organizations and service chapters. Pass and duly adopted this 25th day of March, 2026. Thank you. Thank you, Mayor L. and and thank you for my fellow veterans who show up today. Um, I'm not going to say very much. I just like tell you all that we have a great event coming up Sunday at the wall. Uh, we're going to honor today and we're also going to honor uh uh a groundbreaking ceremony for the helicopter that we're going to be trying to put there. So, if you have some time, we start at 10:00 on Sunday and I'm hoping to see the same faces I see here there.

Thank you. Thank

need Get in the middle of this.

Let me go back. Next up uh is the Treywoods Economic Development Appreciation and I would like to see Miss Anna Pwood and Mr. Wilbert Smith come on down. Whereas in 2005, in the aftermath of the devastation caused by Hurricane Charlie, the city of Ponttoorta sought to partner with local entities to foster recovery, economic development, and the creation of affordable housing. And whereas the Trade View Woods Economic Development Corporation under the steadfast leadership of President Anna Cowwood stepped forward to bridge the gap for lowincome residents, securing a 20-year loan through Hurricane Charlie recovery funds and the Community Redevelopment Agency CRA. And whereas despite early skepticism regarding the long-term viability of the venture, Trey Woods proved its critics wrong through disciplined management, community spirit, and unwavering commitment to its mission. And whereas the corporation demonstrated extraordinary resilience during the 2008 economic downfall, successfully completing an aplex townhouse building that provided much needed stability and highquality housing for puntabor residents during a period of national financial uncertainty. And

whereas Trey Woods Economic Development Corporation stands today as the only original entity from its funding cohort to reach this 20-year milestone, fulfilling every obligation, serving as a beacon of the public private partnership model envisioned by the city council two decades ago. And whereas the successful retirement of this mortgage represents more than just a financial transaction, it represents two decades of providing lowincome affordable housing and proves the adage that together we achieve much. Now therefore, the city council of the city of Pontaorta, Florida does hereby recognize and commend Tradeview Woods Economic Development Corporation for 20 years of dedication or dedicated service to our community for their perseverance through adversity and for their successful final payment to the city of Pontagora. We celebrate this achievement as a victory for affordable housing and a shining example of the strength of our citizens passed and duly adopted this 25th day of March 2026.

Thank you so much. For the record, Anna Carwood, president of Tur Woods Economic Development Corporation, accompanied by Wilbert Smith, our building attendant. Good morning to the council and all of you hearing my voice today. I stand to present our first our final land mortgage payment credit to the city to the city of Corona and to say thank you for this proclamation in recognition of it. I gladly accept in memory of my deceased but always remembered business partners in order of demise Sonia Millina Rosco Hill and Isaac Thomas better known as Elder Thomas or brother Don still among the land of the living to see this day come to fruition of our Mr. Joe Reese and I of five reflections in 2005 when we came before council to request $360,000 of the city's proposed CRA and Hurricane Charlie recovery passrough funds. We were told by a council member who looked at our financials. He stated from the desk that our business would not last one year. I'm happy to report that we are the only original payback funded recipients. Here we are. We did it. Thank you. We will never forget from whence we came. Thanks to God's continued blessings and the motivational and collaborative support of so many including then city manager Howard Kunic, the community development and finance staff and the then councilwoman

Marilyn Smith Mooney, then Councilman John Murphy, and our many vendors and community and its leaders who we storms with us. We thank you for believing in us and for being our angels throughout the 20 years. Thank you for not counting us out. Can we act today on that?

Okay. Now we have public input. The first one is actually anybody who wants to be nominated for a board or committee. Okay. So those wishing to introduce themselves as nominees for a board or committee may do so at this time. Those who choose to speak must state their name for the record. So, this is for a board or committee.

My name is Pete Johnson. I'm currently a member of the code enforcement board and I was appointed a couple years ago to fill up a spot on it and I'm coming up for uh I would like to continue with that for another term on the board. Um I involved in community involvement. I've gone through the um citizens academy last year uh with some of you. So just wanted that I'm interested in doing this. Thank you. Anybody else?

One last time for board committee. Okay, we're going to move on now with public input. Anybody wishing to address the council on any matter must state their name for the record. Each person will be allowed to speak for up to a maximum of three minutes. Please be kind. We're just trying to do the best here.

Hello, my name is Kay Abs. I'm the government leaison for the Pontagora Isle Civic Association and I would like to invite you all to our 2026 candidate meet and greet in the spring. It'll be Thursday, April 9th from 6 till 8:00 p.m. at the Civic Association. All are welcome. I would like to thank uh Council Member Don for confirming, Vice Mayor Hulk for confirming and regrettably um thank you for council member Julian who has a prior engagement. He's doing his own town hall. So thank you. I have these flyers and also April 15th is the giving challenge and a lot of nonprofits in the community are getting double their money. So there's a little code on the back for that and there many other I have to consider. Thank you.

Thank you.

Morning. Three short things. First, uh, regarding Medal of Honor Day, for those that haven't taken the opportunity, I invite you to come by the military heritage museum and visit our Hall of Heroes. learn a little bit more about the history of the medal and some of the uh recipients of it. It's a it's a great visit and well worth your time. Second, uh reviewing a couple items. Uh first on the U one cent sales tax going through them. One item that sort of stood out that I couldn't figure out. I vaguely heard it before is $3.5 million for a waterfront sport center. And it's just kind of a Okay, where did this come from? I remember it written way back when, but I haven't heard it recently. Uh, next the budget. So, I've been coming to city council now since about 2012. I remember how many years the council first used the budget to uh the reserves to balance the budget and finally spent years getting the reserves back to where they should be to the national standard. So, when I looked at the five spin plan and saw how quickly uh our reserves the negative and carried all the way out through the budget. This is just uh unsustainable as a town. You know, Good morning. I'm John. I just want a

clarification for Quasi judicial CP01- 206 and also quasi judicial Z1 2006. Um it says that there's no public hearing. Is that correct? So there's no public input. Judicial has public. It will have public input. It's a second reading.

So will there be public input? Okay. Okay. All right. So 35 seconds of my time have already eroded. Um we had contacted three of the council members um who one just specifically told us to talk to the city attorney. Um the mayor basically said thank you for your input and our council member that represents us. We had no response from them. Okay. Uh my wife and I own 2920 Magdalena Drive which is one of the four parcels that are part of the zoning changes of which I just stated. M these are the facts. Mr. Morgan submitted plans for three develop three duplexes on lots zone for single family homes causing this issue. Mr. Morgan always blamed the city never taking responsibility. The city is three permits for duplexes in air. Certain council members and Mr. Morgan are trying to force the zoning change on us to solve the problems of Mr. Morgan that Mr. Morgan created and and it also included the city. If this zoning is approved, the county will raise our certified just values on its tax rule, forcing us to pay higher property taxes. Single family homeowner, Mr. Derek Hunter, who is also not in favor of this zoning change, will now face the possibility of having multif family units on both side of his home. The city council did not consider the planning commission's recommendations of not approving the zoning change. No city employee or elected official ever reached out to us to ask our opinion prior to mail notification about these three meetings. Mr. Morgan has not maintained these three lines. I would encourage you to take these

facts into consideration in your decision because it is a lasting decision that affects property owners. And as a sidebar, um I would like to uh to note that we did email all council members and two of them, thank you very much for for corresponding with with us. We appreciate it. The other three, you you you pushed your responsibilities on to the city manager who gave us incorrect information and shame on you. This is something that should have never got this for. The mayor has always been in favor of the developer saying it was the city's fault. Ma'am, it's not the city's fault. It is his fault. He brought all of this onto shame on you. Bill Page for the record. Um, in recent years, the city of Clint recommended that changes made police officers retirement. During these presentations in the state that the cost of the changes would be minimal, something in the order of $30,000 a year. The most recent annual report Foster and Foster the city's actuary consult GSB disclosure information dated September 30th, 2025 presents in different pictures. I'd like to point out some of these things that need to be explained during the presentation today or by foster. Here are just a few of the examples of what needs further research or explanation. Page 13 of the report shows ization of changes of assumptions. It indicates recent changes are costing the plan $830 something,000 indicates that's

advertised over four years to be fair, but that's a far difference than $30,000. I've heard people stating that the differences in the performance was as a result of the performance of the plan. The plan has a targeted internal rate of return of 7%. Which is actually kind of high, but I know it's higher than what the general employees plan. However, the actual performance was 13%. Almost double. So, there was a performance of um this this information can be found on pages 16 and 17. The reason that this is so important is that we will have years where the internal rate of return is below the target which means there'll be additional contriage 15 shows the change in wages between 2024 and 2025 is $972,000. or a 29% increase. More detailed explanation is necessary than simply saving overtime. On page five, it shows that there was a change in active numbers in the plan. There was an increase of one,000 with the exception of uh 2022 which was a co. plan is investments that significantly exceeded the target which is a that's on page 14 without that past favorability that's being advertised we pay for on page 16 the inflation rate from investment advisor is 2 and a half% which is very close to what

are assumptions inflation assumptions in the city like the 2025 wage increases why so much Good morning. My name is Dirk Country. I live at 29. My home is in the middle of this thing. If you if you pass that, I'm not going to live there. They're up and down the street. empty condos sitting half and there's no reasoning I'd like to thank the two council members who did get back

I'm Bonnie um I am John's wife on the property to these duplexes. After the last meeting, uh, I decided to look online to see if I could find any articles. What I did find was a YouTube and article. They pretty much both at the beginning. Not once in this builder. We are all here because it started not with the city. The city did not say to him. He went in with his information. I don't I mean it is his responsibility or his staff his staff um responsible and the city should take responsibility I question why you feel like you feel that you should take responsibility also you have sovereign in the community. So responsibility just falls back on also, you know, it's unfortunate. It's an unfortunate situation, but we're now being drawn into it and asked to allow for the res. Uh the article also mentioned that the city at the time said he needed to convince the joining property owners have concealed

it. It says to agree a woman says pay me 250 and we opposed. So he says to agree I would think this woman who wanted not I don't know received any information from the other two property owners but I really would like for it to be understood that half at least 50% of the property owners are understood we did my husband We emailed to each of the three that voted against it and we basically got very respons I I believe that is your responsibility Cindy O'Hara PGI In order for me to access the home that I have lived in for almost three decades, I have to go up and access every day, multiple times a day. It's a cut through. It's not that busy. There's times where it might be a little bit more busy. It's multi. So, I'd like to see these partially constructive projects done. However, if somebody were changing my zoning and it was definitely going to result in increased taxes, which I don't know if that's the case or not, but if it is the case, they have every right to be annoyed and angry. I'm asking our city attorney, can't you do some kind of a ordinance or law where if the city changes your the zoning of

your home that the person that's living in that home gets to enjoying the the prior zoning taxes get the even though the zoning would be changed, they would have they would have an exception where they would be taxed according to the zoning that they purchased. Could something like that be done?

Okay. But I think that's something we need to look into because they should not have to have their taxes increased because of errors all over the place. I mean, we've had some sloppy city council. So, you this council shouldn't have to taken all the hits for what the previous council did. You know, I look at Palmer's basketball court. How the heck did he get approved from a basketball court in PGI that's created all this? So, it's been four councils that have done this. Now, they're stuck cleaning up. So um I want to be a subject on the uh sports court. I just want to tell you my wife to be here, but she has her 101y old dad who was World War II and pre down. Now, the other thing is DMV,

but y'all don't have to worry. I sold his 20 but I already started, you know, impression that I got is that actually 24 minutes to 54 minutes. So, you know, January, but the rest of the year rules. People come out there. Now, this house I couldn't find anything. So I mean I was call

me out there. Next thing is you know I know I know you passed this had Anybody else? Anybody else? State your name.

I love hearing about I have been in multiple counties in this state that we don't have enough waterership even I sat in this room and I heard someone say,

"We don't have a problem with water. And I thought to myself, these guys must not be aware of what's happen. You know, for so long and I do this all on my own.

All my spend all my time. You have to research a lot of documents database. It takes a lot of time. Lot of I want you to know, but unfortunately myself and other environ could not have foreseen what is right on the horizon. It's here AI data centers

yesterday. I want you all to understand the beginning water, air and land is what They are the most valuable commodities in the world besides human life and God. We have a problem. I want you to know 10 years. Our river is dying.

Both of our rivers in our harbor are dying. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else wishing to speak? Want to speak? Anybody else?

My name is Chris. I live on 524 West Virginia Street. to support as was told it's been said we're going to move forward. Thank you, sir.

Anyone else wishing to speak this morning?

Okay, next we're going to go to the public hearing agenda. First one is quasi judicial. Okay. Next we're going to go to the public quasi judicial request by Kurt Davis property owners rights pursuant to chapter 27 rights determination code to allow the applicants to develop property in accordance with designation in place property. Good morning council zoning official for the

swear the testimony presenting testimony or evidence here agendabody testimony Anybody else? We've got four standing testimony.

Good morning, council. Rachel Barry, zoning official for the record. The item before you today is an application for vested rights 2025 located at 302 and 308. The applicant purchased the properties in April of 202 of purchase. The property was located within the traditional overlay within the residential edge zoning district which allowed a single family home of the property. The chang city does not section 2-3. for reasonable reliance and public.

Can you hear? I'm sorry. I don't I cannot hear her and I'm sitting by her. So, there's something wrong with the microphone. Is it better if I hold on to it?

Okay. U so listed in chapter 27 section 2-3b there are four approval criteria substantial good faith investment reasonable reliance governmental entity action impact and a public interest consideration. The application was heard before the development review committee on January 23rd, 2026 and the planning commission on February 23rd, 2026 who both uh voted to recommend approval of the request. Staff also recommends approval with some recommended conditions which are included in the staff report and are listed on the screen here. Happy to answer any questions you may have and the applicant presentation for you as well. Do you have any questions? I don't know if this is the appropriate time to bring it up, but even just like Sullivan Street Craft Fair, we made them do four separate permits for four different ones. I don't think three and two and 308 are one of rights. And I'm not sure why this didn't come through as two separate rights. That's how we typically handle all of the public hearing items. For instance, similar example is the Magina applically describes all the properties included applic It's my understanding that when the properties were purchased, we had to buy

both of them because there was an unpermitted building on the property and it straddled both properties and that's since been torn down. So, it was purchased as a I think he had to do it. I'm not sure that you didn't have to purchase the property.

You want to go next?

My name is Good morning. My name is Kurt. I currently live at 301 Goldstein. I have purchased 302 and 308 Goldstein. I provided city. I provided city council, city attorney, and city manager um some pamphlets. I just want to quickly go over why I was so diligent, why I asked so many questions. This is Rachel Barry as I was proceeding through this. It took four months for us to make this decision. After numerous, numerous complications asking her some of the same questions over and over and over again. I tipped lightly trepidation because of past experiences I had had. misdirection that I had dealt with on building my previous home. So, the very first page that I'll go over with you folks is what I went through on the house at 301 Gold. I went through the process. I was directed to talk to a lady named Kathy. I believe she was the building manager. Don't quite know exactly what her exact title was. Upon meeting her, she immediately formed me to two other gentlemen. One's name was Mitchell. I do not know his last name. The other gentleman was named David Mccardi. I gave them my plans. They went through the process of inspecting them. They picked back uh they said the front of my house had to be I couldn't have a spot that was more than 30 foot long. So they made me make a change. So I sent it back for reddrafting. I got it done. No problem. I turn it back in ready to go. They kicked it back again. They said that I had have three garage doors that I had three individual garage doors. I couldn't have a double garage door and a single garage door. Something about the historical district. Okay. So I send it

back again for reddrafting. I come back a third time, give it to them. Then they say, "Well, we want you to do board and uh they actually drew on some PDFs of what they wanted expected because it was on a high visible street." At this point, I'm like, "Have you guys fileed my whole process by a month and a half time? I thought it was a little inconsistent with the previous time I had built with a gentleman named John Smith and Randy Cole. Everybody called him Smitty. It was an effortless transition. It was an easy, simple thing. It was a joy to do. So they finally said, "Let us review the whole file. We'll get back to you." So a few days later, I get the file back. That was the last change they want. Mitchell actually drew on the PDF exactly how he wanted the board and I gave it to Audrey, my architect. We got it done. So moving on to the house. We get going. Everything's running pretty smooth. months. So then I have to meet a landscaping gentleman named Frank. And by the way, the reason I'm telling this story everybody is this will all come full circle on the trepidation and the concerns I had when I was talking to Rachel Barry over and over and over again about these property on Goldstein. So I'm dealing with a gentleman named Frank. Frank is the landscape guy. He gives me a book, tells me how many shrubs I got to have based on the how far how long my uh street front is. uh uh species uh natural species etc. So I do everything I have to submit a plan that shows where my sprinkler heads are going to be in the landscape and the whole So I permit it submit it. I get approved from Frank. I'm going to do a retaining wall along my house with block. I order the block from Lowe's. It gets delivered to pallets thousands of pounds shrink wrapped the whole nine yards. I got my slag sand delivered from but wells. I got eight yards of still in the area. Everything's ready to go. I get called by a gentleman named

Nick. I do not know Nick's last name. He works for the city. Told me I cannot do that. I said, "What are you talking about? I've already got the approval." He said, "No, it violates some code." And he had a very, very specific rule. He said that it is going to be considered a permanent structure to the home, permanent attachment to the home. So therefore, because it would be permanent, I'm now going to violate my 10 foot back to the sidewalk. I'm like, "This can't be true. permanent thing. So, we go down the whole road. I said, "Well, how's everybody else doing?" I drive around. I'm a real estate agent. I see this happening in all kinds of new house constructions. I see people doing rellandscaping and they're not going to be off the the um their seven and a half foot set back on the side or their front yard or everything. So, he said, "Well, maybe they get a variance." So, I said, "How do you get a variance?" You have to go to city hall. I don't remember if this is years ago. Was it a Tuesday or Thursday, the first of the month? you go and you present and then they can give you the variance. I said, "Okay, fantastic." So I went to city hall. They said, "Yep, you got to come here too. They start the nine o'clock." Fantastic. So I go there three weeks later. Now I'm being delayed another three weeks. I go there. They say, "Well, you're not on the docket." I said, "What do?" They said, "Well, you're supposed to be on the docket. You're supposed to submit based on a time." I'm like, "Well, why didn't anybody tell me that?" So I'm a little frustrated. I said, "Well, can I talk to somebody, a supervisor?" They said, "You want to talk to Kathy?" said, "That would be great." So Kathy was busy. So a gentleman named Barry came out and Barry still works for the city. Barry said, "What can I help you with?" I said, "My landscaping plan has been denied." And and so he looked briefly, what are you looking to do? And I told him, he goes, "Well, Kurt, you can only go up to 24 in on that retaining wall." I said, "I know that. That's what Frank told me in the first place. I'm okay with that." He says, "And what are you here getting the variance for?" I said, "I don't want to be here getting a variance, but a gentleman named Nick called me and vetoed the whole project and I got all this stuff sitting out of my pocket, thousands of pounds on my front." He goes, "Nick is wrong. I don't know where he comes up with this stuff. Go ahead and proceed." I said, "What do

I do if somebody stops by?" He goes, "You just tell him to talk to Barry." He goes, "Nick is wrong. Frank is right." Okay. So, we proceed on it. So, uh, I eventually get through my whole process. Brian next door said, who's building the bill at the same place said, "Hey, can we put seashell between the two houses? I think we looking at the code. They said, "I have no idea." So, let's go talk to Frank again. So, we go up there. Frank says, "Yes, you can do that." Well, Nick's desk was right next to Frank. And it was right over there by Sherwin Williams. They had a temporary office over there for a little while. So, um Frank goes, "Yes, you can do it. Let me check and see what code regulations are to it." So, Nick chimes in and says, "No, you can't do that." And he reads a very, very official reason why. He read it right from his computer. And Frank goes, I know you're wrong. We've done it in a couple places here already. So Nick, no. And so I think they should talk to Lisa's name. So they directed a lady named Lisa. So Nick's office go by the way Nick district. So we had that landscaping and we have countdal

forward. The house was being finished. Um, four inspectors come out one day for the whole day. Got to be there all day long. One of the guys shows up very well. Oh my god. this way. I said, "Fantastic." Comes back by two garage door. had another couple weeks just people were on the exact same question. when my neighbor and I didn't see her for probably month. So I saw her one day she had I think volunteers 10 people out and they were taking everything out of the house. So I asked her what are you going to do? I don't know. I don't have insurance.

I said, "Well, if you want to sell the house, I will buy the house." I told her I'd give her $200,000 for the house. I have to check the city. What I wanted to do that I wanted a couple times I don't know exactbody else turn I asked her question, she gave me great information. I don't want to be my concern. So, I'm still thinking about I don't see I don't have shares in I really need to sell this property and I'm broke and I'm wearing out my back this house all the I said, "But I wanted to know because I'm coming in. When I built my house, I had a 60% rule on how much of the property can be a home." She says, "You don't have to worry about

the house." She says, "You don't have to worry about that. You can go 90% of that lot. That lot, multifamily, and res. everything. Not only was I going to do a drive through garage can bought it. So, we're going to move forward. So I move forward. We're going to buy the property. Then I find out that the two have a building in the middle 5050 in the middle. Miss Rachel looked it up on a GIS thing or whatever online. I mean right in the middle of the thing, never inspected. It violated everything. Went right up the line in the back. So now I can't get clear title. You can't property I don't have the money to buy can't do it so she asked me to list the property we list the property it is nobody buy our market here I'm a real so She's upset. We list the house. It's We're getting no reply. We're getting no phone calls. We're getting nothing. Nobody's interested in buying this property. So, I went, she asked me, "We already dropped the price once. We're about to drop it again. She was going to sell for 300,000." I said, "Sher, let me let me talk to somebody." I called David, a

friend of mine. I said, "Danda, I borrow money from you because if I got a home equity, I'd have to pay a penalty to get out of it. I paid it off. I'd also have to pay the fees to do it and the interest rate. So I said I will match if I pay you 6% would you lend me the money? She said I would absolutely lend you the money. So she lent me the money to buy out Mrs. Sh. I had to buy both. The primary reason for buying both is so that and I talked to Rachel about this that I'm going to tear down by 25 structure whatever you want to call it. So she meat is what it's called. I filled it out. I got approved. As you start looking for this, you'll see that I got that approval on May 8th of 2025. So then I file for a permit. I get a letter from the city that I'm in for building for a while. So he says he says, "Okay, I'm sorry about the oversight." Uh, and I put that in your thing, his email to all of a sudden he said, "You can go in can your

So he must have done something. So I got it right away. Now I can sell that other individual clear title to get rid of it so I can pay back the engineering study in the house. Rachel told me I had to get in the house. I went and got literally never opened it. I went in to give it to Rachel and that's when I found out about this thing called LVR. And I said, "What's an LDR?" I don't even know what that means. She told me the bad news that all of a sudden everything I bought the property was completely the rug was pulled out. That is completely unfair. So, she knows I'm so upset. I'm not upset at first. Um, and I'm like, "This is so unfair." She goes, "We're working on it right now. A lot of us disag the city not to do it. We've got a change in management staff. Everybody's changed. So she goes, "We're going to try to do a thing called six months later. I'm still waiting. Just so you know, I gave you a copy of the check that I couldn't sell that property. I also gave you the listing to show that it was first days. a 27. Nobody's interested in buying a commercial property on that 22 years a new house. We want to invest $500,000 to build a nice house. We're being just literally shut down. So, we get we get through that process. I do my best to write the And then I find out that the best are

going to run with the land. What's the moving target? So then my next payment to April another 46 So I am trying to get this thing. I had a lifelong friend that was in my wedding. I was at his wedding right now which is like to try to make another payment. I've already lost $6,000 and I'm pay all my time and effort and I paid $1,500 to be here today. I can't $100 to get my vested rights back home, I tell you. This lady I'm going to tell you when I'm in her office even kept interrupting us five or six times to ask questions of her because she is probably the most intelligent person in the room and I'm not cutting anybody down but everybody comes to her for guidance and direction and she's not even thinking what is going in my I did all my due diligence. I wasn't too this and this. I started the process

with her and then it totally changed after ma'am. That is why I had to buy the second lot. I never wanted money. I never wanted to. I couldn't get. So then the house right now is penny. Why is it penny? because it said what can I do because I don't have a contract and they can't open a file in privacy or whatever contract I can open up a file we can do all your title searches your title commitments and all the research I've been through a I am losing money,000. We have everybody This is very important. I've been waiting months and months and months. Three more minutes. So, in any event, so we had to write a contract. I talked to then I get the email from her. Oh, we can't do it on So that's why I had to write that contract that's why it was wondering why

I put the contract in terms of the land which is exactly what Mrs. time and time again. The last thing is making those commercial nightmares. It's just difficult. They got to park all the way down. There's no parking. How are you going to put all those new commercial and where are they going to park? Where are the people? The only reason why it's not Friday is closed on Friday. So all those little commercial Somebody was talking earlier. I want to add to it. I between when I bought my house, the taxes on those two $2,000. I built the bill $15,000 annually every single year. We want to bring invenue. My friend Larry wants to build. We want to bring in revenue and we're told no taxre

since I lived here in 2008. I'veenved not seen single small business downtown. This is why I'm building my retirement home. So we have it okay if I just ask one question and it's just Rachel. Um, would you vouch that what I'm saying, not word, but everything I've presented today with all of the time you and I together that is accurate, it is integity and I can confirm that we have met and had those conversations, but I can't converize There's some discussion. Is it time to discuss this?

So, we're gonna open this public. My name is Sher. father's ice in my yard. They lot house that house full of You try to lift it or move it out the middle. My parents have seen many hurricane up by And I sold this Kurt because he was going to build a home. My mother was in her

And I don't mean I mean you guys want I One house, two houses. something I would not Anybody else speak on this? My name is aunt and my grandmother street all our lives.

I agree with her. I agree with her. He deserves his property to be able to do what he needs to do. He has a lot of stuff from him. I just I just want to say I am here for him. I want to support this. Anybody else? So if I'm understanding completely correct, we've heard heard about Magale City and I I really thought our country was about citizens, the people. I did not think our country is about corporations and greed.

This is really a shame. I don't I don't know what the legal issues are here. But I can tell you one thing. This was any one of us or our family members going through this. We would not appreciate what's happened. very nice comments about this and when I heard the list of people that you said are no longer here anymore and again all these meetings that I've been to before any of you were ever elected on this board or even worked here in this city It's it's a shame. And uh somehow we we have to start putting the people first and probably more than just the people. The children and our elderly. The children and the elderly are the most important assets and issue in our state, the country, the world besides air, land, and water and Jesus and God. So, I don't know what what to really say, but th this needs special attention. This needs to go above and beyond what normally do. Nobody should be going through this situation. And again, we have numerous houses for sale in the city, numerous houses for sale in Charlotte County,

numerous houses for rent. Thank you. Anybody else? Public hearing. We have a motion, a second to close public hearing. All in favor? Motion carries discussion.

This is why we passed a vested rights opportunity so that we could work with people who have started things and they're caught in the middle of different regulations. And so um I'm sorry to hear all that you've been through, but um I think this is the kind of situation that we need to resolve and that's why we have that kind of stage. So I just want to make sure I'm clear. So when was in the process of buying the property, it was under the 2024 LDRs. That is correct. The the TPG, right? So it was listed as residential at that time.

It was residential edge which allowed mixeduse buildings. It allowed single family. It allowed commercial. And so there was a wide range of uses that were allowed. And then when it was repealed by this council, it went back which then zoned it home. Correct. Hence the problem. Correct. Okay. Anybody else? I have a couple of questions. So, no site plan, no plans for this property. There's no, you know, let's move forward with this.

We have not received a a survey or official floor plan for a home. I'm I'm not at all against um you know building a home there just because exactly for what they said. I mean that's always been there. My concern is that has been commercial for a long time zone commercial. They've allowed all kinds of offices on Goldstein. So my concern is if we change it, are these people who are already in as offices, is there going to be an issue there with them and their resale? This is there shouldn't be. So the zoning itself is not changing. It'll stay city center. Um if this application is approved, then there would just be additional um rights or development um that pertains to the specific property, but it wouldn't change the zoning designation. Everybody. So, are you done?

I I think I'm done yet. Thank you. So, I I have several questions. It sounded like this house has been in the family for quite a long time and now it has termites, which actually old homes do. I used to live in an old home. That happens. You have to maintain your home in order for it to stay properly properly, you know, maintained. Also, I I know if you did due diligence, but this house was national historic on the national historic um contributing structure. It is on there. It is on the national historic contributing structure. So I

But okay, you can't talk from there. I'm sorry. Yes. So I I just have to bring up my concerns. Um so I'm looking looking at number one and he said he had to buy it. He didn't have to buy it in order for him to do what he wanted to do. He had to buy both properties because of a shed. So, he didn't have to buy the first property in the first place. He did it because he wanted to. That's a huge difference of having to and wanting to. Um, that was my my question on that. One of the big things as well besides it being on the historic designation it went through. I understand they had 18 months. You changed it to 9 months. I understand that as well. Um, the thing that we have to look at is we have to look at legalities of the definition of vested rights. Okay. We have to look at and and and I'm sorry, Mr. H, you are a realtor, so I understand that you have to understand a little bit more. I looked up on the MLS and stuff like that. You know, it was purchased you you put it on the listing price for 225 in January of 2025. Um, it decreased, which is normal, you know, at to 1999 and then you sold it on four you decreased on 226. Less than a month later you decreased it. Then it went pending on March 17th and sold on 42 for $130,000. So and you listed it, you bought you sold it and you bought it.

Yes. So this was all you. So you had the opportunity to walk away from this because if you knew that there were issues and it sounded like you knew there were going to be issues from the beginning, but you still went through and bought it. You had the right to do it, but you also had the right not to do it. You didn't have to buy this property. I was provided a path of exactly how I was going to handle the issues with all my consultation with Rachel. Can I finish, please? So, what you were saying is that you had it on the market for a long time. I'm sorry. from January 27th to selling it on April 2nd is actually a pretty short amount of time to have it on the market, which is which is what is standing here.

So, it it didn't it wasn't out in the public. It wasn't out there to be to be sold as a house. It was only on the market for a couple of months and and we have a lot of houses on the market out here. We have a lot of them. I haven't asked you a question, sir. I'm sorry. So, I'm looking at timelines and like you said 308, you know, you were trying to get vested rights for 308, but you're selling it in 9 days. It's pending to be sold in 9 days under condition that the vested rights go through. It's the only way somebody will buy it.

So, when we look at vested rights, we look at trying to look at it as how much substantial and you can't purchasing the property does not consider that you have vested rights. We've all made um purchased property and taken a loss on it. You know, we've all done that. That's that's kind of like, oh crap, I did that. I'm sorry. But yeah, we all do take losses and stuff. So, not because people changed the rules on you. Please stop. I I understand that. But you still had vested rights to do this. So, we have to look at and legally we have to look at substantial investments here. And I know that you paid $900 for the tear down of the shed. Um, and

$900 is completely incorrect. Okay. Okay. For the engineering report, excuse me, for the tearing down of the shed. Then we look at um you said you paid 130,000. I paid 300,000 for both properties, right? But I understand that, sir. Greg, can I finish this, please? Yes. Just letting you know I'm ready to call it when you're done.

Okay. Thank you. Okay. We have to scope of work, you know, like you said, were there were there plans drawn up? Were there per was there permitting? Was anything done? Because if you knew that you were going to do this, and you're saying you knew this quite a while ago, I would have had some plans there. I would have had these things. But you've always So people buy vacant lot. No, I'm going to defend myself. I have every right to defend myself. You do. When people buy vacant properties, they all have a plan already. You can't even get a plan till you buy the property. How How am I supposed to have a plan on something that I haven't even purchased yet? And when I purchased it, then all the rules changed underneath my feet. I bought it as a residential single family residence. That's what I bought it for. I understand that.

And everything got changed. I didn't want that change. You guys imposed that change on me and now you're acting like I'm a criminal. This is completely

sir. I am not saying you are a criminal at all. I feel for you. I understand it. I'm just trying to produce things that I see here. Okay? That's all I'm trying to do. Okay? I'm trying to look at everything here. No, I it's not on my side. I'm trying to produce facts here. It doesn't mean that I might not vote for him. Okay. I'm trying to do all the right things bringing everything out. The biggest concern is that we if we this does seem like a special circumstance. That's something that you've actually planned. You you haven't done all the things according to our criteria though. Okay. The criteria of what we have and that's what we have to look at. If you brought this to a judge, you'd be looking at the same thing. Criteria. We serve as a judge on this. This is how we have to look at it. whether it's right or whether it's wrong. We have to look at how the vested rights process works. Okay? So, it's not that I'm saying no. I'm not saying that this is bad. I'm not accusing you of anything. I'm trying to go through the proper process. Okay? I think you're what you did on your house over there looks fine. I'm sorry that you went through all the issues. Okay? I'm trying to do my job here to do what's right as well. Okay? So, I'm looking at scope of work. I'm looking at it. I think that we should have looked to seeing if it was a historic contributing structure. Whether it falls down or not, it's something that was on the national registry. I don't know if we Rachel have to go ahead and notify national that we are taking down a home or not. I don't know if that's something that we have to do because it wasn't it is it has been for quite a long time on the National Historic Registry.

Um if or when a demolition permit is pulled, we would notify the state. Okay. So, we just we have to wait until it's actually pulled before we notify them. Correct. Okay. Thank you. My concern is if we don't follow our rules of what we do, we might be opening a can of worms for any other person who says, "Well, you gave this vested right to this person. I want this vested right." That's my biggest concern. I think I think the world of what you try to do. I know that you're a good realtor. I know that there's a lot of great things that people really like about you. Nothing to do with that. I'm not saying anything else, Greg.

Yes, we we approved chapter 27 and the criteria that are in it. The DRC, the planning commission, the city staff have all evaluated this and unanimously approved the vested rights. We're just looking at four criteria, right? and and all those other professionals have already determined that he does have vested rights. 14 out of 14.

Excuse me, Jimmy. Janine pulled for the record. So, this is where, you know, I'm I'm I'm very much adamant that Richard Groso or somebody of that stature would look at our land development regulations. These are the kinds of issues that we're going to run into with this change. Um, my thing is just like yours, Mayor Lux, I'm concerned we're giving these out too easily. Um, he does not he does not have an inordinate burden or an inordinately burdened property. Um, just because there aren't there are no plans, there was no, hey, this is approved, we're ready to go. Oops, we changed the zoning. We we can't we can't do that to you. This is something that was in the process of doing and I understand what you're talking about. I'm going through building a house right now and you can ask Rachel, she sent it back several times and I've had to fix it and it's held me up. But that is the process of development. Um, unfortunately, it's not easy and I'm sorry that we changed the zoning. I live in downtown. I think what you've built is beautiful. If you are really going to make this your home and you're building a home on it, it doesn't sound like you are. It sounds like you're you're you're selling it to someone else who says they're going to build a home. Am I proper? Am I right about that? No, no, that's completely incorrect. I am building on 302 Goldstein for myself.

Okay, that was all I originally was talking to her about. I wanted to make sure what I could do, why I wasn't violating and everything I found out was actually even more beneficial. It made me want to buy it more. Then it all fell apart because of that illegal property that was never permitted or inspected. So then I backed out the whole thing. We listed it. She's the one who then, Miss Sheriff said, Kurt, I need somebody to buy this from me. I am desperate. we were about to drop. I talked to you personally. I I remember the whole story. Um,

you know, I'm I'm not at all um I'm not at all opposed to you building something there. I I'm just concerned that that this city and it has nothing to do with you, but we are giving these out too easily. We changed the land development regulations. You have to have an investment in the in the actual development that you are doing in the process of doing. So, it's completely different from, well, I purchased the property and now I should have it. I'm just concerned that we're getting them out too easily. Again, I'm not against a single family home there. I think it would look beautiful. So, Mrs. Paul, I'm in the pro I was in the process. She's guiding me through the process. We're we're in discussion right now, please. Sir, I

I just want to ask him, did you have plans submitted? No, I haven't. Okay, that's all I needed to know. That's all we need to know.

So, yes, going with of what vest it is. I think one thing that resonates with me and correct me if I'm wrong on this, the per the property was purchased in April of 2025. The LDRs were then changed in July. So to me, I don't know that anybody that to me, regardless of the conversation before, it doesn't really matter. you purchased a property and your research said it could have residential on it in April and three or four months later we changed it. That I think to me is a defining factor

because you wouldn't have ch um plans. You wouldn't have a chance to have plans. You could have just bought it as anybody else and said, "Oh, I'm going to buy a piece of residential property." It's the timing for me. It's April, May, June, July. Then it was changed on you. So to me, going back to are we giving this out to, you know, without plans, if that wasn't the case, I wouldn't be able to approve this, but because of that timing, to me, that allows for it to be able to be changed. I swear to God,

that concerns me here is I understand exactly what you're saying. I would go along with that thought here, but I see that 302 Goldstein Street was put on the market of December 13th, 2025 to sell. So it was just on the market to that just got taken off a couple weeks ago, right? But my impression I think was because 302, yeah, not 308. 308 is pending. 308 will be they were both 30. We're talking to each other. I know, but you're giving misleading information. 302. Ma'am, does anybody 302 302 Gold was on the market on December 13, 2025? It was on the market for 78 days and taken off just before this meeting.

That's correct. It is factual on here. I'm sorry. It is factual. It doesn't stay. But you're manipulating by not telling the entire story, ma'am. I'm going to keep fighting here. That is true. But then I the vested rights thing came up immediately when it got changed. I don't want commercial property. I'm not going to build. So I put it up for sale. Then all of a sudden we can do vested rights. We have this new process that we're working on. So, I took it off the market because I still want to build a house there. You just took it off the market a few weeks ago. I know. But when was your vested rights? When did you apply? I don't know. I Why did you apply?

Even this morning, I asked about vested This has been such a moving target. All the rules keep changing. Just this morning, I asked Rachel. I said, "Rachel, do the vested rights run with the land or is it going to be a two-year maximum?" Two-year maximum.

You're right. It So, Mr. Leavist just showed me that you did the vested rights after you put it on the market. Okay. Okay. You know, I know that was there's another part of this that's also and let me tell you, this is just really confusing because it sounds like you want to buy it, you don't want to buy it, you want to buy it, you don't want to buy it. You you decided to buy it, then you bought you had to buy the property next to it because of a shed. You had the shed taken down. So, you kind of had to do these things, but you knew you're going to sell the other half to your buddy. So, that's why you bought it anyhow instead of just having your buddy buy it or you jointly buying it with your buddy and then you could have kind of brought it together. There's My buddy never came. You're misleading people again. Larry never got involved till about two months ago. Till about two months ago when he came down here and visited me. He was never part of this. You got to start telling the exact truth.

So you listed that one on the market on 1213 as well. You listed both the properties. That one's been listed. If you look on the days on market for like 259 days, then I had to change the parameters of the of the verbal 308. Look at the days on market. The CD1. You said you just had to buy 308 because of 302 because I did. I did. I immediately put it up for sale because I never wanted that property. I had to go through the process of tearing down the building to get the property. Mrs. Lux, you should listen to what I'm saying because you are misrepresenting these people the truth. I know the truth inside out, upside down, and backwards. I've lived it and you're trying to to I'm not trying to. I'm looking at the MLS and everything.

And I provided that to you so you can see the track record. you can see the story of what has happened here. I have 100% honesty and integrity here. I have done the right thing. Please, if you're going to convey a message, know exactly what that message is in all the due diligence in all the

sales history from public record. 717 2012 warranty deed for Edna Ppple. Next sales history was 4425 warranty deed with you. That's all I can see on here. So, this is what I'm trying to look at. So, you bought the property in on in April. So, it wasn't that you owned it before that that you couldn't sell it. You bought the prop. You brought the property in April. That's what I'm trying to say. I I understand what you're saying. And I understand that you had 302 listed, not 308, but you had 302 listed and you had it listed as having the house being torn down. But

I was selling it because I was So the house itself, I listed the vacant lot. If you look at it, the combined days on market, it's called CDOM on an MLS report. You're going to notice a smaller number in the middle and a bigger number at the bottom because it was listed for sale almost immediately after I bought it. I was just trying to get rid of the building so I could sell it and get the money back because I never wanted the property. That way I could pay back the land. But the CDOM wasn't you having owning the property for 259 days. It was just you listing it. Is that correct? No. No. I bought it on April 2nd of last year. Right.

And I And then I went through the process with her, started the process with a certificate of appropriateness and the permit to tear it down and I listed it for sale. I never wanted it. I couldn't afford it. That's why I had to borrow the money. You are misconstring the entire message and you're telling people the wrong thing. You need to listen to me. I know the story inside, upside down, and backwards. And the person who knows that story the second best is Mrs. Rachel. I never wanted to buy that property. I had to buy that property because the whole titles on both properties were totally messed up because of the illegal structure that was never permitted. Matter of fact, she's the one who looked it up for me in her office. She said it looks like you have to buy 302. What's that? Did you have to buy 302?

I wanted to buy 302 for residential and that's what I bought it for. And I bought it for residential. I paid for it as residential. You changed it on me. I didn't change it. You changed it. You said you can't build there anymore. You're stuck with the property that nobody's going to want to buy. That corridor, nobody has built one single thing since Hurricane Charlie. That whole corridor has 100% futility. Nobody has done anything on that corridor. Nobody. If you want the story, I will tell you a story, but you limit me to 20 minutes and then you're going to make a decision or you're going to convey a message to people that's inaccurate completely based on your two minutes of of research. That's unfair to me, Miss Lux. That's unfair to me. I've done the right thing every single time. I drove her nuts with questions before I ever bought it. Matter of fact, you had your 20 Please. I know. I'm going to say one one last thing. I'm going to say it. I even asked her, I was so worried about when I went through the building process last time, I said to her, I said, "Are you going to be here because I want you to be here until my house is finished?" And she said, quote unquote, she said, "Kurt, I got a raise to come here and I just bought a new car. I can't afford to leave cuz I was so afraid of this stuff happening and now it's happening."

Okay. You're not going to beat me when I'm telling the truth. Excuse me. Point of order. That's enough. Ma'am, that is enough. If you have $300,000 your compassion, we understand exactly what you're saying. Please, sir, it looks like we're moving into your favor. So, please just take a deep breath. Okay. I'm emotional because this has been going on. We understand that, sir.

I will say Janine Pulk, for the record, like I said, I live in downtown. I represent District One. I don't like giving these out like candy. And I feel like we have done that. Okay. We are giving them out if somebody says, "Hey, I bought this." That's not the law. Wait a minute. Let me finish. That is not what the law says. Not at all. Not even close. My thing is we're not going to get development with commercial. He's right. He's right. We're going to get development with a single family home. I say we approve it. I just not giving them. Yeah, we are. We are. Look at the law. That's why you want to make a motion.

I'll make a motion to approve 3A. I second it. Hey, we have a motion before you vote. Yes. Where I need to make things clear with you guys. 302 and 30 and 308. If I understand correctly, 302 Mr. H wants to keep for himself. 308 is being purchased by a third party. The vested rights application has both properties. But the property appraisers office have them separate. Correct.

So if you're going to vote, however you vote, you're going to have to vote on each property separately because they're not joined together. And this was my question in the first place that a vested rights should be brought together on two separate properties, not on one. because this is something completely different than us looking at LDRs and comprehensive plan. And the reason why they would have to be separate is because they're one's being kept, one's being sold. And the way chapter uh 27 reads, investing rights runs with the land. So, you're going to have to vote separately on each individual property.

Can I just ask a question? Did I mean did that what can I say? Should that have been together? I mean, I understand it was together because of the purchase, but in the future, should that have been or should we since we're voting on two separate it? I mean, just just moving forward, it should it should be two separate applications. Just so we know for had had they been joined and no fault to Mr. H. This is just the way it's an odd o it's an odd situation, but they're both owned by him and I'm sorry, I don't remember your business partner's name. Uh but they're both owned by the same two people. So I understand why staff did it conjoiningly. Um but in a situation like this, they should be separate

unless they're joined together. And I think the concern is this is quasi judicial. This should have been done correctly. And it's scary to me that we're approving this like this just just for legality concerns. I'm a little concerned about it. But

and and that and that's my biggest concern too. Not that we want you to have a home there because you're right that will bring revenue into our city and everything. We have to look at this is what we do here affects everything we do in the future. So if we don't get something and try to do it, what makes you think that somebody is going to come after and say we did this here, we should allow it. We're like, yeah, now we have to because we allowed this to happen. That's my biggest concern that's here. The other thing that I think that we need to do is Can you hear me? It sounded like you're going in and out. It sounds I feel like mine is going There you go. So my biggest concern that that I have like I said with the going in and and out of this you know is that when we look at our vested rights if it runs with the land we better say you know it runs with the land because there's been significant development on it. There has been engineering there has been permitting. There has been all these things not just because somebody bought it and they're selling it because they have to sell it. it should be going that it's because it is a vested right. This is kind of a real anomaly here. He's saying he has to sell it because he he can't afford it and he's going to sell it to a friend. That's where I have the big concern. Not to his fault because he didn't know. He didn't know he should have two separate ones. You know, it seems like he keeps on getting stuck in a pickle here with everything that we're doing.

And I think to your point for the record looking at um Yes. If if this Let's put it this way. If this land had been owned for a year. I would not approve this um because there's been nothing significant done. I think the caveat in this very odd situation is the time of the price purchase in April, repealed in July. I think for me that's where I'm okay with approving it. So

I think my other concern my other concern with this is because it was on the National Historic Registry and I think as realtors when you're selling property you should understand and look at these things that's on national. It's not just a city. national and now this is a historic home that's going to be torn down probably rightly so maybe it can't be kept together but could it could it have been moved could something have happened to it could it have been maintained you know we don't know that but that was my biggest concern and that's when I started looking at things is because it was or still is on the national historic registry I was directed to get an engineering study would you like to go we don't need to go into more detail no we're we're making decisions right now we're talking need amend need to do for the two properties.

Yes. The two properties. I'm trying to remember who made the motion. Greg made the motion. I second. I want to restate what I moved earlier is uh that I recommend or move to approve vested rights for both 308 and 302. I think you have to make them separate. Yeah. So, let's make them separate them separate. I move to approve vested rights for 308. 308. Second. Okay, we have a motion and a second for 308. I wish you would have done 302 first. All in favor? I. I. I move to approve vested rights for 302. Second.

We have a motion and a second on 302. All in favor? I I Okay, motion carries. Mr. H see you got upset for nothing here but we have to do the go we have to do the proper go build we have to do the proper process you understand that you know we have to do it so we are really happy that you're building another home there we hope it's going to be a beautiful forever home for you mayor 10 minutes please yes we're going to take a 10-minute

should ask my mind. No, no, no.

This next one is legislative and it's the second reading. Give me one second. Moving on to item 4 A legislative ZA-3-2026 proposed amendment chapter 26 articles 3.4 and 3.5 to allow for the possible expansion of general single family and general multifamily districts and require multifamily structures in the GM district to comply with article seven with exception with exemptions and this is the second reading I just have one question for the attorney I spoke with you last night about this being a citywide impact and Are we going about this the right way in terms of procedurally?

Yes. Because it's a citywide impact. It's legislative in nature. Whereas like 4 and 4 C is specific. That's why those are quasi judicial. This one is amending the code citywide. So it affects everybody. So that's why this would be okay. Carl Ben for the um staff doesn't have any presentation. We would just like to bring forward a presentation from the first reading. If you have any questions, we are more than happy to address. Does anybody have any questions?

Discussion. We get a motion. I move to approve 4 A. A second. A second. We have a motion and a second to approve 4 A. All in favor? I oppose. Motion carries. B is quasite judicial

CP-01-2026 an ordinance of the city council of Pagora Florida amending the comprehensive plan future land use map to reflect the change in the current designation from low density residential LDR to high density residential HDR for acres of land situated in the state of Florida, county of Charlotte, lying in section 13, township 41, range 22 and being further described and incorporated herein providing for findings providing for conflict providing for severability and providing an effective date and this is the second reading because this is quasi judicial if there's anyone presenting you need to be Sorry about that.

Anybody have any questions for this program?

Yes. So again, um just making sure. So basically 4 B and 4 C are almost going hand in hand. So basically this will be my comments for both. We have a situation here where we had a gentleman that um made a mistake. Yes, the city was involved but at the end of the day it's a buyer beware situation. And now we have two people that have come through for that zero to do with this issue. Zero. I mean they just bought the property and they just hanging out. No problem. I don't know and I'm not comfortable with allowing us to change if there if there is people that are not on board. This gentleman over here that made the mistake, it falls on him and he's had two years and he could have brought these structures down and redone them um to what it is zoned. And I just feel that you know whether it's one person or two people, it all goes together and these people made zero mistakes and this gentleman So I am I cannot support this.

Anybody else want to say anything? I think the anybody who owns that piece of property has the right to build what they want on it. So if the person bought the property to have a single family home, they can still build a single family home on it. And I think one of the single family homes is existing already. I just wanted to make that clear. They don't have to build.

No, Janine, for the record, I I just would like to say that, you know, I live in the historic district and they changed it from 10 dwelling units an acre to 25 dwelling units an acre. So, I know how you feel. It happens. And, you know, I don't have a leg to stand on. Um, We were threatened with a lawsuit uh before the last meeting and I'm sorry I just don't discuss things with people who threaten us with a lawsuit. I'm worried that I might say something that could later come back to kick me and so um I tread lightly on that. Do we have a motion? Motion to approve 4 B. We have a second.

Second that. We have a motion. A second to approve 4 B. All in favor? I I sorry I oppos. Okay, so it carries three to two oppos.

Sir, you're out of line, please. Sir, you're out of line, please. Sir, you're out of line, please. You're terrible.

Please vote C-012026. An ordinance of the city of Panagora, Florida, amending the city of Pagora district map for seven parcels consisting of approximately 1.87 plus or minus acres identified by the County Property Appraisers as parcels 412 213 258001 412 213 258002 412 213 258003 412 213 2584213 258 5 412 213258006 and 412 21325 8007 and being more particularly described below from general single family-3.5 GS-3.5 to general multifamily GM10 providing for findings prov providing for conflict, providing for severability, and providing an effective date. And this is the second reading.

Again, I just want to go on the record to say that yes, you can build, you can still build, but their taxes have been affected. And unlike if there's a general change to our comp or you know, LDRs or whatnot, this was only changed because of one man's mistake. these other people had nothing to do with it and we're changing everything because of one man's mistake that could rectify it by bringing down those buildings or those foundations and starting over. Anybody else want to say anything? I move to approve 4C. Second.

We have a motion and a second to approve 4C. All in favor? I oppose. I I motion carries opposite. Next is a consent agenda. Anybody want to pull anything? We have a motion. Move to approve the consent agenda.

Second. We have a motion and a second to approve. All in favor? I opposed. Motion carries. Next on the agenda, sorry our morning is taking so long, but it's home owners against landfill order, also known as halo. Good morning, council members, city staff, and all council meeting attendees. I'm Kim Kitkco. I'm speaking for Halo, Home Owners Against Landfill Odors. This group consists of residents from multiple communities in both Lee and Charlotte counties. Halo is working to unify the city of Puna Gorta, Charlotte County, the District 76 state representatives office and all affected neighborhoods and developments in support for the FD and the strongest possible consent order to end the odors from the SLD landfill off of Highway 41 and Ziml Road. Today, I'd like to share with you some information about the impact this landfill has on our community. I'd also like to share a few facts about SLD. Um, and I want to assure you that the odors can indeed be mitigated and controlled. I also want to talk to you about the very powerful tools the city has to help get this done. Did you know that SLD odors can reach over 12,000 residents in both Lee and

Charlotte County. 12,000 residents. And that the new fire light development off road will add thousands more new residents. Many of these residents eat, shop, and play in Puna Gorda. But it's not just the residents that live around the dump that are affected, is it? It's not. It's every vehicle that passes the landfill on Highway 41. 35 to 50,000 vehicles with 50,000 to 100,000 passengers travel this stretch daily. This includes commuters, families, visitors, tourists, local businesses, and emergency services. The SLD landfill is really the entrance, really is the entrance, right? If you're coming up from the south and you're coming up 41, the SLD landfill is really the entrance to the county and then the city of Puna Gorda. And that rotten egg smell creates a negative perception for the area which affects the community's reputation and economics. But hey, we need landfills. We have to have landfills, right? We need them. Um, we just need them to be good neighbors. And this has been a challenge for SLD almost since the beginning. This landfill was started 20 years ago. They've changed ownership a few times, but they were acquired by Waste Connections in 2016. Who is Waste Connections? Waste Connections is the third largest waste management company in North America. They operate in 46 states and six Canadian provinces. They made almost 9.5 billion in revenue last year. They are huge. So, you would think, right, here we come. You would think that with that money and experience they would know how to eliminate the odors, right? Well, certainly they know how to eliminate them. They're just not doing it here

because for over a decade, this landfill has been in violation of a 2016 consent decree and state laws which specify that the odors can't extend beyond their property lines. Uh it's the problems are pretty well documented here. There have been over 3,000 complaints in the last 10 years that have gone into the FD. But somehow SLD continues to break the law and thumb their nose, pun intended, at all of us because they never received a notice of violation or a fine. Let's talk about those complaints for just a minute and see if I can get a show of hands here from the audience. Audience participation. How many of you have ever filed an odor complaint with the FD? Oh. Oh, we've got a couple. Okay, that's pretty representative. Another question. How many people know how to file a complaint? A couple people. Okay, good, good, good. I appreciate that participation because we're going to talk about that complaint system. See this number of 3,000 odor complaints? If you don't know how to file one of these babies, whip out your phone right now, get your camera. Here we go. Wh There's the QR code. Just download that QR code and you can place your complaint. But let me warn you, the system is antiquated. It's hard to find and it's hard to use. There's also no call in option. But really one of the biggest problems here is that no one knows about it. Perfect example from this room who knew about it. So of the 12,000 residents that we said live around the landfill right now, only

about 2,200 know about the complaint system and none of the drivers or passengers know about it. So that means less than 4% of the people that could be affected by these odors every day even know the odor complaint system exists. If they had known that, my math's not great, but if they had known that, and you extrapolate that, you would have gotten 84,000 complaints over the last 10 years to that phone line. So, uh, much bigger number than what's up there. Uh, let's talk about the violations for a second. Oops. I did it, didn't I? I touched the wrong button. Hang on. Sorry. So, let's talk about the violations. What constitute a viol what constitutes a violation? If you break the law or if you're breaking the consent decree. Those are two really good documents to take a look at. We looked at them very closely and just in over the last 10 months using those documents and publicly available records through the FD website, we found 16 violations. Uh, and hang on a second. 16 violations. And again, my math's not great, but if you extrapolate that 16 violations over 10 months and assume they were doing this for the last 10 years, which we know they have, that would be an exposure of tens of millions of dollars. So the penalties with those violations should have been almost four million. Over 10 years, that would be tens of million. So what we're saying is any odor complaints that have been put in, they were very minimal and under representative of the

problem. There have been no documented notices of violations or fines. This is the reality of what should have happened. Yikes. Yikes. Okay, but the problem's going to get worse. Wait, I got to give you the bad news before the good news. Okay, if you look at this slide on the left, uh SLD actually down at the bottom, SLD currently uses or has used approximately 84 acres of land. The largest part of this is in phases two and three which consists of 65 acres that are now closed. Now look at the left hand side of that slide. It shows a picture that you can see. It's a rendering of nice green grassy closed sections of landfill. This nice dirt and grass coverage is like putting the lid on your trash can. It's the exact same thing. When a section of landfill is closed, it should be covered with dirt or similar material and sealed and vegetated. If you can see the trash, it's not covered and the lid is left open on the dump trash so that you can smell it. The new consent order gives SLD a year to close the lid on these closed areas. Best practices are 30 to 90 days. And considering they've been negotiating and dragging this consent order out for nearly 10 months, they should be closed. But that's not what it looks like up there. It looks more like the right hand picture. These are phases four and five. These are considered their active phases. That's 19 acres of active uh landfill. The new consent order says that SLD can have an open working phase of 90,000 square feet. That's 2.1 acres that has to be covered at the end of each week. Best practices are to have a small working out area about 10,000 square feet, enough space for the trucks to dump and turn around and it should be covered at the end of

each day, not the end of each week. Why would you leave the lid off of your trash can all week? Good question, huh? And why would you have nine trash cans spread out over multiple acres when all you need is one? So my point here, people keep asking me, can this be fixed? Yeah, these are basic operating practices. So absolutely it can be fixed and we need to do it because um if SLD can't control the odors in the 84 acres they have now, we're going to be in big trouble when they open phases 6 through 11. That's another 59 acres to come. And wait for it, they own another 457 acres. We don't know what they're going to do with the rest of that, but I'm just terrified of the 59 acres they're going to open. Okay, I have to say it again, these problems um can be fixed. I'll emphasize that the technology, operating practices, and oversight mechanisms exist to get this fixed. Many many landfills operate in neighborhoods all around North America and you can't smell them. So, how do we get this fixed? Well, the FD is trying to get SLD to sign the first new consent order in 10 years. This is a great start. First one in 10 years. The 2016 consent order was obviously pretty weak and not enforced. The new one is better, but the FT needs our help to take the consent order to the next level and include best practices, measurable and enforcable parameters, and third party oversight. So, here's a list of just some of the things that we amateurs have found that would uh be serious concerns with this new consent order. Remember, I said that their past violations should probably in the tens of millions. Well, this new

consent order lets them off the hook with a 30 30,000 fine, a little over $30,000. Does that feel right? Uh we want stronger penalties for the future. We talked about the amount of time it takes to close. They should close those acreages that are finished. They should close them in 90 days. That dumping footprint should be 10,000 square feet. There's no automatic odor enforcement triggers. The H2S monitoring, that's what you smell, the rotten eggs, right? We want that monitored. We want it monitored all of the time, constantly. H2S, we also want an alert trigger at 100 parts per billion. I'm sorry, that's what the new consent order says. We want it at 10. You can smell H2S at around 4 to seven or eight parts per billion. Why would the trigger be 100? It needs to be 10. There's no independent oversight in this new consent decree. Do you guys trust the fox to watch the hen house anymore? Hasn't worked for 10 years. I don't think it's going to work now. No real time public transparency. Did you guys know about these issues? I mean, you knew it stunk, but did did you have any idea what the situation was? You should you should have a dashboard that tells you exactly what that H2S is along 40 constantly. Other cities have it. You guys deserve it. There is also no call in reporting system. Do we really want people on 40 trying to find the link on their phone to call in a complaint? So these are just a few of the things that we can help get changed. So the mechanism for those changes uh for giving this input is called a petition for administrative hearing. Interested parties like Halo, like the city, like individuals and communities will have 21 days to respond and give input on the consent order once it is signed. The more petitions, the more voices, the more pressure. And here's

where we need and asked for the city's help. I believe you've already drafted a letter to the FD in support of a strong and enforcable consent order. I believe I saw that in the agenda packet. The Charlotte County commissioners have also drafted a letter and it is a powerful force when both the city and the county are aligned behind this message and send those letters this week. Then to send an even stronger message to SLD, Halo seeks the city of Puntaort's consideration to file a petition for administrative hearing. Having the city aligned with organizations, communities, and other affected parties is also extremely powerful. In addition, the city may actually be the best positioned with the most leverage against this dump. Um, you have the ability to suspend, not review or not renew or even revoke contracts with SLD or contracts with companies that use the SLD landfill until the stronger consent order is signed and implemented. What about taxation? I am not a finance person, so I'm not sure. But is there a chance for a nuisance tax to help uh with the budgeting? Um I would hope maybe that's a possibility. But uh the last thing that we know you can help us with is helping us get the word out about the odor reporting system. This is critical for enforcement going forward. We have to report the odors or the landfill says there aren't any. So we have to report those. Thank you so much. support. I'm going to invite Michael Brown and Jeff Wiggle. They are part of Halo and they were going to come up and uh answer any questions that council members may have.

My question is what would prevent us from that? I don't know. Thank you. And we have legal counsel that's already drafted a couple of them. So, you know, we're happy to share that any help that they can give to us in providing documentation so I can ad. You got it. Any other questions? Thank you all so much. Appreciate it. Thank you.

So, we do need a motion for approval to send a letter. I move to approve sending the letter. Second. We have a motion, a second to approve the letter. All in favor? I motion carries. Thank you.

Next on the agenda, we We are moving to long range plant. Good morning, Kristen Simeone, finance director. Um, so we're starting off our budget season and we're going to start with our longrange financial plan and also talk about the property tax reform bills that have been up in Tallahassee. So, we first provide you with our fiscal forecast and these fiscal forecasts were our original fiscal year 26 budget. we will be updating them as part of our process of budgeting. Um we'll include the updates to beginning reserves and any reserves. Um so on the general fund I did put in there currently our estimate for the increase is about $2 million from fiscal year 25 and that's after the reappropriations and PO rollovers. um that's from additional revenue that we received or expenses that were not um spent um like positions that were open or um just under spending on some of our line items and operating costs. So again um this particular proforma as we talked about during last budget season that um by fiscal year 29 especially we would have to talk about what other things we could do to um get that difference between revenues and expenditures um down to um fund the full fiveyear plan.

So this is just a graphical representation. So you do see that we um have um shortfalls and we're using reserves the first three years and then we have shortfalls in 29 and 20 in and 2030 on the city lease property fund. Um, again, we just bring back the information. Um, as far as this was the CRA fund and we had the Herald Court Center as well as the non-EP departmental area which is a few other leases like the ground lease here at the marina um and a bank lease that we have um and the expected expenditures. This was before we um are now using some of that um center leases for our fire department. So, these revenues will look a little bit different once we um update the proforma with those changes.

Do you know about how much of a change it's been affected? Um not offhand, I'm sorry, but again, we won't be receiving common area maintenance fees for those because now that'll just be absorbed by the city as well. Um so that will just add to the portion the public portion of the building that we already have to fund as well. But it looks like we still have a pretty healthy reserve. Yeah, we'll probably okay for a couple years, but then again, um once we get to that point, it won't necessarily be self-sufficient anymore because again, the city will be using that property versus leasing it out.

So again, this is the graphical representation. um had a little bit of surplus mainly in the non-dep departmental area and we have our utilities operating maintenance and um repair fund proforma. So this is the operating side and we did have the new debt service on there for the various projects that are required. We are working on that and we did receive some grants. So this will look a little bit different um as we move forward and we bring that back as well. But this fund is supported by user rates and we have the rate increases in there that were proposed by the rate consultants at 12% through fiscal year 29 and 5% in 2030. So again, we have use of reserves in some years, a little bit of um surplus um in 2028 and 2023. On the sanitation fund, um again, this is using twice a week pickups for our refues and yard waste and once a week for recycling. Our recycling is outsourced, but we did have um a contract in place now for three years with no increase. Um but after that they may increase again. Um so we will keep an eye on that. And then we have the capital needs for replacing obviously the sanitation packers. So those are built into the plan. This plan does include an increase needed every single year to continue funding the operation and being able to purchase those packers. So with those increases in place um you do see the use of reserves um in some years some years there's a little bit of surplus. We have the PGI canal maintenance fund proforma

and you see the assessment rates that are in the proforma for fiscal year 26 it was 1350. This particular um assessment district did increase the estimates $150 per year to again continue to increase the amount of seaw wall that is completed each year including the extra costs that come with that um each year the inflation causes price increases. So um we do have that we are still working with FEMA on these projects. We have brought to you before some of the issues we're having, but we do continue to work with them and um we will be asking for an alternate project as well as maybe hazard mitigation on some of the areas where they only um were giving us a rip wrap as a repair. So hopefully we can maybe get some hazard mitigation to help cover the replacement of the seaw walls. But again, we will continue to work with them um and the state who is in support of our projects. So again on this one you see use of reserves. Um we do have a shortfall in um 29 2030 which does use up some of those reserves but again we would take care of that by either increasing or reducing the the wall program a little bit. On page 12, it talks about city will be receiving 500,000 state funding um towards the district. Are you like distributing that 500,000 where most of it goes to PGI because it's a larger area?

Yes, because we're going to just do the we're just going to use the percentage of seaw wall replacement that was between the two the two districts and use that percentage.

So BSI canal maintenance fund perform again has very similar situation to PGI as far as repairs from the hurricane. Um, however, this particular fund has a couple projects in it. So, it had the um large access lock removal project which we have some debt service on through an internal um loan and then um they did approve the projects for um starting to accumulate funds for the actual uh purchase of land um for staging. So that is included in this particular perform as well and again we have to use reserves um but it's planned for reserves last park arena fund. Um again this this fund is in trouble we've talked about it we are not collecting revenue because of the damage from the storms. So, we will need a subsidy or find other revenue sources to help us put this um marina back together and and start accumulating funds. Um if it's even if it's an internal loan that then gets paid back over time or if we do a bond or or debt service that might be some options also to look at so that once it is that the marina fund can then pay back those bonds. see the shortfalls and um we continue to work on reducing that. The building fund pro for the building fund is doing very well. Um they have permit fees and special assessments. We are going to look at the various fees and talk about possibly changing some. However, they are doing well. So, we have to be careful about that. We do bring this to the board um every year

because if we have a reserve that's more than the permits that we are um taking in each year. We have to get approval to continue to keep those levels. And we have shown and we show it every year in our it was also in the long range plan that how sometimes when we do go to through an economic decline and we don't have a lot of building going on and we go down to very minimal staff but we're not taking in revenues, we can eat up those reserves very quickly. We do want to make sure we have enough reserves for like again we have a healthy reserves and we continue to monitor their staffing as well. 6ent gas tax fund. Um again this is by the local option gas tax and these are for like the repairs of the streets and and things like that. Um like the rideways um sidewalks um and then we have our gas taxes we'll talk about in just a second which is the actual paving program in that. So the local option gas taxes you can see there and again this fund can have changes for effects on the tax based on the the dollar of the gallon. So as gallons you as usually the price goes up people try to conserve and use less gas. So then we see less tax from that. So we are very cognizant the only did not see that right after CO because again a lot of people I think were um stir crazy from being at home and getting out. So um but we do have to be cognizant of that in the future that as gas prices rise we might see a decrease in tax. Other revenue sources are the um revenues we we receive from the state to help with the lighting maintenance and um other maintenance programs that we do on the

the state highway. So again, this one does have a little bit of a um negative balance in 29 and 2030. So we continue to work with that fund and um the division for right away to try and resolve that. Here's the additional 5 cent gas tax fund perform for four months. So again, we have our tax. The general fund does subsidize this particular program and they do 709,000 per year um from Adalorum over to this fund and then you have a little bit of revenues for um interest in a paving program of approximately a little over a million dollars per year. That's the funds themselves. You have any questions there?

When are those gas taxes for renewal? So, they they look at those every five years um for the whether we're going to do an interlocal agreement with the county or if we're using a population based um and is a county one right now or is it just city? So, one is with a uh count. So they both are these taxes are both county and city, right? But this is our city portion. Um one of them is by interlocal agreement and the other one is by um the state statutes. So even if we buy gas like in Charlotte County, we still benefit from it. Yes.

It's just a percentage. It's not Yeah, it's a percentage of the whole county. Sorry if I misunderstood the question. Okay. I think that was so every year we look at the strategic plan. Oh, I'm sorry.

Um I still don't understand how we can be spending 400 over $400,000 on a marina that's dysfunctional. We What is the cost? I know it's the marina contract. I don't understand why that is so high and I don't understand why the expenses are so high. We're not really using water or electricity because we plugging in noting. So what is the cost? I would like someone an independent someone to go through this and what is the problem here because it is costing us a lot of money. I mean again we're staffing 24 you know seven days a week from morning till um that so they have I think to do what we'd be better shut down the marina

and if that's what you would like if that's the direction to go we could do that. I just want some efficiency and we have a a contractor that seems to be charging us a lot of money. I think it's 20,000 a month. Um, and I' I've asked this question many times and I feel like we need some independent uh eyes on this because it doesn't make sense to me.

Well, we could certainly one of two things. We can put it out to bid again, but we saw what happened the last time and it comes in considerably higher than the solution that we have in place right now. Um, we can at bringing marina operations internal which Ron is working on getting those cost figures together to bring to council or we're still exploring that third option which would be to lease out the marina or some sort of public private partnership. Um we understand that re we need to start getting revenue from the marina. So that is why Ron has filed and Brian have worked on that temporary use permit so that we can open up more of the slips to get more revenue in this doesn't make a lot of sense to increase our rates because we don't have a full service marina at this time. So, the idea is to start to get revenue back in the marina by leasing out those additional slips, by getting the moring balls back in action. Um, all of this takes time though. We have we're working on the permitting to be able to do the dredging. That'll that's one step in the process. Um, it it isn't going to be a money maker in the short term. It is it is likely that we're going to have to subsidize this while get it up and running.

My main concern is with the management company who we fired about a year and a half ago. I think we could do better if we had a very good dock manager and someone to drive the pump out. There's just not that much to do here. And I know you say landscaping, okay, hire the landscaping up. I just we're getting like and you and I have talked offline and we're we're getting those costs together so that council can make a decision if if that's what you'd like to do is take take that programming back in house and not have a management contract. We are looking at that.

Yeah. As long as it's the right person or people who know what they're doing. We can't just shuffle someone around within the city who doesn't understand marinas and you know someone who can understand how to oversee the building. I don't know. There's just so many questions and it's a lot of money and we have to save, you know, here and there and this is one spot we should target for efficiency.

Yeah. And I don't think it's about 20,000 a month anymore. I mean, I think it is lower. I think it's in the 13 to $15,000 range. I mean, it's still expensive. I'm not going to say it's not. Um, but we do look at those costs every single month. And, you know, you have a lot of operating costs. I mean, there is still electric going on out there. We do have boats that come in, you know, throughout the day and um 170,000 in expenses and 233,000 for the marina contract. When are we going to hear about that public private partnership?

I followed back up with them last Friday. I'm awaiting a return call or email. Um but I am continuing to converse with them. We're working through the process. I know that we're all working on I know you're working on it, but it's just It's frustrating to see money just going out the door and no revenue coming in. And it could have been and should have been dealt with after Ian. We lost a lot of money since Ian. That's all.

Okay. So, our next section is just on the strategic plan, a little bit of an update. So, again, we're doing that process simultaneously as we build our budget. It sets the overall goals for the city. We are going to have the heart of the harbor conversation tomorrow night at the plort library from 4 to 6 pm. So, please come out, bring your ideas, kind of have conversation about what you want to see in the budget and the strategic plan for the city. Um, the city manager does challenge all the departments and divisions to forecast their needs to meet the goals and objectives of long-term plan. Again, it's developing those understanding of the operating impacts from each capital improvement project that they is proposed, the staffing needs of each department, ongoing maintenance costs, equipment needs. So again, um we'll be focusing on this time on capital improvement program and 1% sales tax project planning. So we kind of want to go over the budget issues that we already are kind of starting out with and that we kind of know have to be addressed or continue to be reviewed as we move through the budget process. So, some of these are general fund and some of these are also citywide. So, we tried to put those together. Um, so and these are things that are not currently in our budget or our performas. So, we'll be working on that as we move through. So, there are a lot of legislative proposals that get brought up at during the state session. There are currently eight current proposals related Um, and we're going to have a little bit of discussion about that towards the end and we'll talk about the impacts of each of those eight proposals. Um, restricting decreases to public safety budgets is also part of some of that um, reform and so that could affect other services that the city has. So can't cut public safety. Where are we going to cut? It's going to be parks, rideway, things like that.

Increasing payout caps for injuries could give us a possible liability cost. Restricting raising new revenues or business tax changes could also affect some of the revenues that we see. But again, we keep trying to look for some ideas, but if we're not allowed to do some of those things, you know, that might cover some other um operating budgets, nonpersonnel. Um the city manager has directed our department to um budget 10% um in operating than fiscal year 26. So that's just the operating non-personnel side. We still also have hurricane recovery that we're dealing with. So we have demands for recovery projects in addition to existing projects and workloads. Um we talked about the various permanent work projects how they're funded. So for Ian it's 90% from FEMA, 5% from state, 5% to the city. On Helen it's currently 75% 12 and a half% from the state and 12 and a half% the city. And again, we still have to prepare for any upcoming hurricane season. You have economic conditions that we continue to monitor. We look at forecast and we look at local conditions because again, sometimes what's happening in other parts of the country we might lag on or be ahead of. So we we try to make sure we're following what's going on locally as well as throughout the US. We use our performers to help us see how those changes are affecting um the future years so that we can hopefully get ahead of those items and work on um addressing them as quickly as possible. We have inflation. It's slowed to 2.7% for 2025, but that is still above the annual federal target of 2%. Um we continue to look for grants to

supplement increased project costs. So again, we've been doing very well in that area and finding We review projects for timing based on cost increases. So council may want to review some of the projects that are in the the queue or that are in our fiveyear plans and say, "Hey, we want to push these out a few years, you know." Um, and again, it'll come down to wants versus needs and needs being priority, public safety being priority, things like that. And again, we continue to look for alternative funding sources. So a lot of our projects you see are not just necessarily from general fund revenues. They're from impact fees. They're from other funding sources. Wherever you can um pull money, attraction, retention of employees is also a big factor for our city. Again, um so we have a compensation and benefit study that's underway. It compares areas in our local area as well as other life-siz municipalities. And again, trying to remain competitive with local job market pool in our performer. We do the health insurance rate at a projection of 6%. Last year that increase was three and a half%. So that was great. We had a little bit of savings there. There's no indication yet of what is upcoming for this coming year. The pensions increase for fiscal year 27. So the police pension increase is 71.8%. Buyer pension increase 78.6%. The general employee um pension increased 4 2% which was under the 5% assuming rate or increase there. Um

do you have a a amount with these increases? So it's a between the two um police and fire it's approximately just a little over 1.3 million just for 27. just for 227. Yes, that's the increased amount over what was in the performer. And when you do these when the pension does it, it doesn't include overtime.

So what the pension does is assumes the the total increase of salaries or pensionable wages, right? So they are using they were generally using about 6% for both of the funds and over the last years and I wrote them down this morning. Um, so for the police pension, they saw a 21.68% increase in 23, 7.26% increase in 24, and a 27.32% in pensionable wages in 25. And in fire, um, 23 was 4.96% um, pensionable wage increase, 24 was 11.2% increase, and 25 5% in fiscal year 25. Now, a big part of some of these increases in pensionable wages is um first of all, we had the $10,000 increases to all of the that staff and that occurred the last quarter of 24. So 24 only had a quarter of that 10,000, but that full impact was in 25. um as well as we had the fire bargaining unit also completed their negotiations and had increases in fiscal year 25. You have position increases as well. So you have um from 23 to 25 police had seven position increases in fire it was three positions from 23 to 25 but one other position that was a general employee position became a fire pension position. So, um they really have four position increases there. The other thing is we have um overtime is pensionable up to 300 hours. That includes and for fire that does not include their scheduled overtime. So all

their scheduled overtime is pensionable. It's only unscheduled overtime up to 300 hours is pensionable and then it becomes non-pensionable. However, had storms and storm pay is pensionable. So, and under the current ordinances. So, they had a lot of storm pay because we had two storms in 25 right there. Um, so it was affected 25 the most with some of those increases.

And you're saying that the extra 700,000 what is it? 700,000 in related storm. So not all of it just some of it.

So the other part of it is coming from they had both funds or both pension plans had an experience study done in fiscal year 25 and it was presented in June to both boards who approved it moving forward with those new experience based on what they see. So it affected their what they should use for their assumptions. So the assumptions for um personnel increases I think were increased. Um the mortality rates were changed. The assumption of what the earnings will be were decreased a little bit because again um both those plans were a little higher compared to what the state would like to see and they are asking to go down. They didn't go down a lot, but they went down a little bit because I think they were over 7% and fire might still be over 7%. In theirs,

what they expected to make from the pension? Yes. And didn't we make something like 23 or 25% and then 13% I mean we been doing well with our

we've been doing well but the actuary spreads that over four years. So that in any year that percent is spread so the actuarial rate was actually lower than 13%. And that that is in the in the the pension paperwork, but they also do that on the um not just on the revenue side, but they have like um when they had a bad year, they spread that over four years as well. So those are things that have to get made up as well. Another thing they changed was the assumptions on the assumptions was how long they'll amortize things. So they used to use year amortization, they're now using 15 years. So when they have this change using a 15-year amortization, that means an increase because you have five less years to amortize those assumptions over. So about half of the increases that the police and fire pension were seeing were specifically related to the experience study changes.

Can you explain what you mean when you say experience study? So they hire the actuary to go over um all the years and say, "Well, okay, here was your assumptions for each year and what actually happened each year and are you coming close? And if you're not coming close, what should you maybe make those changes to to get closer?" So, just for clarification for everybody, I think that the way this is is even if the market goes bad, the city is has to guarantee a 7%. Is that correct?

Or the city has to guarantee a certain I think it was perfect for police of a 7%. I can't remember like if I was more than that and again that's their assumption. We don't guarantee it but obviously if we don't make that assumption that affects our next required contribution. So we may have to make we might have to pay more if we don't make the assumption. If we do better in a different area it might help us. sometimes they're offset. It just depends because again there's so many factors that go into the pension. It's the age of the employees. It's um some of the other assumptions that were changing um that I saw in their experience study was um the age of which people might be retiring. So if if people are retiring um earlier, say after 20 years instead of 25 years or whatever, um they would lower that assumption. That means you're making more payments for the life of that employee. So that affects the the the required contribution as well. There's a lot of factors.

Can you remind me how much the employee contributes versus how much the city I mean is it almost double something like that the city contributes? So the city contributes whatever the actuary calls for the required contribution for the year for the employee it's 6%. I'm sorry. There are 8% on the police and fire. It's 6% on the general employees in tier 2.

I read in the pensions that employee contributes something like 800 a month and then contributes this. So this the um employee contributes 8% of all their pensionable wages. So any of that overtime that we talked about on that they're paying 8% on into their into the pension. We also do get some funds for police and fire from the state insurance program. Um we have limits of how much is can be used towards our the city's costs. And then on the police side, anything over that limit is split 5050. And on the fire, I think all the rest goes to the um the employees in the plan. when they go over

see sorry I'm looking at the summary here you know 1024 um and I'm just looking at the summary and it says 831,000 it went up to 1.4 a little over 1.4 million. So it was increase of almost $600,000 and that was from 24 to 25,

you know. So that that's a huge increase. Yeah. You're saying, you know, they and and when I looked at it, about half of those were related to the assumption changes or the experience changes because on another page, you'll see it. It'll say October 25, October 1, 2025, and it'll say it's a 15-year annualization. So you can see what that dollar amount added to the um the required contribution. So, and it's all negotiated and what the city actually contributes. I I think when you say negotiated, um does that negotiated the pension plans are also negotiated or is that just

Well, the pension plan can be negotiated as part of union bargaining. Um, but it's it's not like the pension board is doing that, right? So, the pension board can also make changes as well. So, one of the things they've been asked to look at, I know on the police side is they're looking they want to do full cost of living adjustments. Um, I I did let them know in the past several years that, you know, council has not wanted to approve that at this time. And with some of the cost increases that we just saw, it might not be the time, but they did table it and they're going to talk about it again. Um, and again, the attorney for the board says it's up to the board what they want to bring to council, but it then council can make a decision. So, if they want to move forward with requesting a cola, they certainly can um based on the attorney's recommendation. But again some some bargaining can you know with bargaining pension can be included. I know we we've talked about I'm not even sure that the status I know that you've worked super hard a lot of your staff on the FEMA stuff because that's just absorbed a lot of staff time and everything and I know that we've had a procurement for some place a FEMA contractor hopefully to help alleviate some of this. Are we

I just got I just got a whole list of questions that I just have not had a chance to answer. Um I have to go through and find um I mean it was like a whole list of questions and so we have to respond to that and provided to everyone. So, we are extending it a little bit.

I'm not sure if I talked about the health insurance rates, it was only 3.5, but you always every year just assume 6%.

Yes, we currently do 6% because over the years, some years it's 10%, some, you know, some years it's been a little lower. 6% has been about the average. So that's why we use the 6% over the long-term proforma but every year we update it based on what we actually see. So I want you okay staffing needs so departments and divisions have increased workloads as you all know. Um the current fiveyear planning of staffing through fiscal year 2030 um was in our strategic plan. However, for fiscal year 27, those positions will still be reviewed again. So, even though they were included in the proforma based on the city manager's discussion with the department, um we will still look at those again and the city manager will make decisions about what she wants to bring forward during um this road. Public safety bargaining unit contracts. Again, we are still in negotiations for the police officers. Um fire staffing standards, we have applied for the safer again for quite a few years now, going on probably four or five years now without success. But we have been increasing anywhere from one to three firefighters per year when able. Um again, we will review that again during the budget process. I know they are requesting another two this year. Um and then another two in 2028. And again, when they do get those, they want to move over to that um what they call a jump vehicle that they could use for um a smaller vehicle to for the medical emergencies instead of having a typical fire engine information technology. So again, we're focused on improving city operations, providing efficiencies, and improving productivity. So those are where we really try to focus our uh IT dollars on. Rising costs do continue in this

area due to security enhancements that are required and needed um storage capacity needs. So again as we move away from paper there's more storage that's you know on the um IT side cloud technology and accessibility improvements and again we need to balance those costs with the security and operational efficiencies while analyzing that in the decision making process. Um we talked about this a couple times throughout um the last year or two um the contributions. So we have the Charlotte Harbor Environmental Center at 20,000. We have Coastal Heartland National Estuary Partnership at 5,000 and United Way at 27,500. For fiscal year 26, we have not provided the um Charlotte Harbor Environmental Center or United Way yet because again that will be a council decision. Um we did put it in the budget but it's up to decide if they want to move forward with those contributions. Um, we do have uncertainty of federal funding programs and directives from the federal administration. Again, we unknown recent changes. We don't know how that's going to affect the states and local government. Um, there might be possible new required terms for federal grants and contracts that might increase costs of those types of programs. Other funding programs may be reduced. We did see that in one particular program that was Um, but again, we continue to monitor those as we move forward. We kind of talked about PGI already. We talked about Hurricane Ian um and the the challenges we're seeing there. Um, proposed rate assessment changes will be reviewed and presented during the budget process. Same thing with DSI. They did have one project that's not approved at this time. So, when we do look at the perform

that below the line. Um that was the Lwood railing project. City lease property fund. We kind of talked about that too. Um the fire department will be using two of those units. So maintenance will not be fully covered with normal lease revenues. So those will have to be covered by the general fund since the general fund is using those units. on the utilities side get more um they do have some legislative proposals also um the reduction of the third charge to properties outside the city limits so that estimates increased because of course our rates have increased so that estimates about 1.3 to$ 1.4 million reduction in revenue. That 25% of charge outside city limit. Um you all know about the shifting the responsibility of the utilities area outside city limit to county that has unown impact the city and county and we're hoping maybe that won't go away. Um we're working very hard for that for the water quality subject to sewer. So again, we have our grant for the design for the first priority area. We had moved um after construction out to fiscal year 28 in the five-year plan. However, to actually do that particular construction, we would need some grants. We had always estimated 25% grants would be needed. Um obviously costs have gone up and we need more than that. Is that something we can do joint with the county because I think the septic sewer that we're talking about and this is Charlotte County property but you know real close to us. Is there any way we try to consider, you know, staffing for some sort of joint.

Um, we had brought it to the Charlotte County and asked them to help partner in that particular project. At the time, they were not willing they were willing to help us do the assessments that would be needed on the tax roles um and support the project, but they weren't they weren't interested at the time in helping with some of the cost. and we did bring up to them that we felt like well they are county residents and they were using some of their funds for um other grant funds or other funds that they had out of not out of the utility to help with some of the paving and things like that. So we said, "Well, could you help with that?" And at that time they were um they had not wanted to partner. We could always bring it back up but I'm just letting you know we did at the county and presented them information. So the city is going to take on responsibility for the county which not get it sounds like it would be nice to have a joint. Um so as part of that subject of sewer um once the design is done we do have to develop a full schedule of community meetings because again we would have to assess the properties. We would do this as obviously loans and then trying to find grants also, but the part that's the loan would need the assessments to pay back financing and uh user rates. So again, we just had a rate efficiency study and we implemented that for the increased capital improvement plan. We did receive our preliminary approvals for hurricane related SRF funding which total 45 million 50% loan forgiveness 0 %

interest for the remaining 50%. Um we have our bond council financial advisor and we just discussed options and we actually just did a bid process. Um received three bids for interimm financing for that difference to get this one project going. Um so we'll be evaluating those three bids and that'll be coming back to council as well. Um and then we would at that and again this is short-term financing. we would still then look to longer term financing whether it's a full bond issue um when some of these other projects are coming on so we would add to that and again we continue to see opportunity

I don't mean to go back to the subject of have we have we discussed with the residents if that's something that they would want and I think that we just had a study that came back and I don't that the Charlotte Park area was really causing any issues which I was really shocked at but unless I looked at it wrong that was what they stated and we asked them to test the water in Charlotte there was no there were no issues

so have we discussed with the res there there was a community meeting held where the residents were made aware of the project um I don't know exactly what what the sentiment was. I had mixed reactions that were called into my office after that meeting. Um, some people were very excited about it. Really, people want just wanted to know when to plan for it. So, if they were thinking about putting in a new septic system and they could wait, they were thinking about that, you know, whether or not they were going to make that investment. So, I think what's going to be really important if we do as we move forward with this project is that communication and letting the residents know exactly when are going to occur. Now, obviously, this has not been the highest priority for the city at this point because we've been dealing with the hurricanes and dealing with our utility expansion, things like that. But this is will have to be a lot of public dialogue as we move forward.

I I agree and that's where I'm looking at finances talking about staff and this we're trying to do it. Is it something that we just say the county of it? there aren't truly any issues in that area. Do we just pass it back to the county or and it's just a question I have no idea and I don't know who could pass it fully back to the county because it is our service area and not their service area. Um it's just whether you you want a sewer system out there. So right now um a lot of those residents just have water with our utility and not sewer.

I don't think tax should have to be the county sector.

And and that's why in this particular project they wouldn't be because the way um we had a consultant look at this and of course it's been a few years now so obviously the the numbers have probably changed a little bit but you would need the assessments. We estimated the grants and then when they would come when that project was done, they'd be paying for their sewer costs, right? And that would also help fund the portion of the project that would need to be done that was like for the um transmission lines. So it wouldn't it was meant not to cost the city taxpayers or the city rateayers any money. it was that particular area would be funding the project.

I think I remember something like 20,000 per per house. Yeah, at the time that's what we were using. It was up to 32 the last time. I think we can put that for a while. Yeah. So, yeah, a little bit of history. We got that grant from the state and that's the money we're going to use. You know, I even said at that time, I'm not willing to spend one dime of the city money. facilitate this and I was hoping that you know if somebody wants to push the issue that it needs to be done it either needs to be pushed by the county or the state you know the state can come in and pay for it if that's what we want but to me we get that we had the money so we're using it for that but it's way over

yeah and that's for the design and and we always anticipated going back to the state for some construction funds but their priorities may change as well and they may not be funding that as much in our area right now as they are in some other areas So again on the marina fund we kind of talked about this you know we've had our lost revenues again we working with FEMA on both Ian and um Paulina Milton we have options for management being explored whether it's from the in-house vendor or public private partnership other things that we're working on is to review and update the rates obviously at the point we can reopen but also still putting in boat parking and our boat ramp fees. So that that is something that has been brought up and we will um be exploring that as part of some of our revenue for the building fund. They're again focusing on technology specifically digital submissions and digital review of plans. Um another thing is trying to update the application types on the website so they can be able to take more payments online. Um the bid process start for that new software. Um, and they must be compatible with the city's current ERP system or any future ERP system that we might being. And I know that bid did come in, but there's they had a lot of input on that one. So, they they're reviewing all those submissions on the sanitation fund. Um, again, they have an industrial study, a standard study to review. Um, they had those funsed school year 25. They are carrying those funds over to try and get that moving. They'll look at the routes, rate for services, current practices, future needs, um, and provide any suggestions for improvement.

Um, we could also explore again going, you know, we're doing twice per week. Do we go to once per week? Um, do we want to do a survey to see what, you know, you all want to see? Again, that's council direction to us. If you want to see any of those, you just let us know and we will explore.

Didn't we do a study not too too long ago and it was one of those trips to the dump scenario and it kind of washed itself out.

Right. So that was that one was specifically like um our finance department did that and it's been quite a few years now. We would have to do it again. But basically, we figured out how many how many um tons could be held in a garbage truck, how much they pick up. We used the data that we had from all the pickups and disposals and figured out how much you could actually hold. So again, you couldn't save like say 50% just by going to one once per week because basically it just means you have more you still have more trips because you can't do the whole route, you know, because you're picking up all of that garbage from a whole week instead of half a week now in one trip. So you you that truck can do less of say an area. So you have more trips that they still have to make to continue. Obviously we spread over more time like maybe you probably to go to five days a week. um instead of the two um they do four days a week right now for those. But we could look at it if you want. We could do that inhouse if you'd like or we could you know again as part of the industrial um standard study also look at it then.

Did you look at like wear and tear and how much gas you and so you pulled all that stuff? Yeah, we had a full spreadsheet on it and I believe the number of employees like that you would need like you know how many you can save by switching over and again it's not it's just not full you know the nonseason time there's less garbage out there so you know the trucks are going by a lot faster so there isn't as much pulled in but you said you incorporated that into your study yes so the other option when we talked about it is like once per week the last time we did it was just once per week for the whole year we could look at something like maybe just during the summer months do the once per week

again though that's the hottest time of the or the year, right? So, yes, you have fewer maybe residents that are here, but they may want it moved a little quicker.

I know. I think and I don't recall where I saw it with like the the cost I think it was earlier the cost of sanitation funds with, you know, outsourcing it versus in although I personally love our sanitation department. They're such great people and they do such great services, but I know up there pretty high with how much we pay for sanitation versus a lot of other areas. Yeah. And there's a lot of areas that do do the once a week and we're we're still under there, you know, and they outsource or you know, but we do look at that every year. We do survey that population too. We need to look at population as well. Well, it's the cost per unit, right?

So, we are looking at cost per unit. So that would take into their population because you're saying how much is it per res I I I love our sanitation department and we we do um we have a very high level of service in that area capital projects. So again we had a committee form for 1% sales tax extension and recommendations are brought to council. You'll be talking about that again a little bit later today. We have downtown drainage um the study to determine the possible solutions and associated costs. So again, we don't know what those solutions are going to be, what the cost associated with them. You know, there might be multiple solutions. You may have to do it in phases, things like that. Infrastructure maintenance. So again, we have a development of additional annual funding plans to accumulate funds for larger rehabilitation or replacement projects for aging infrastructure. So, in some of our funds, we have already started doing that. We have a capital improvement um line that we fund. We use the five-year and try and come up with an annual amount so it's a little more steady over the years. Sometimes we can get some big piece of equipment that's needed and might have a little spike, but again, we're trying to have a fiveyear plan in place for these replacements and plan ahead for that. Um, another thing we do sometimes is we say, "Hey, we're giving um for like Carol Court Center maintenance or Lashley Park maintenance. We have $70,000 a year that we expect to pay annually for maintenance. Now, some years it might be 10,000 we spent so we carry over the 60,000 because we might have a larger project later on or you know especially as you get to end of life and have to replace the whole thing. So those are some things we've been doing. Um, again, we could probably do a little more, but again, that puts

more that you have to set aside now for future improvements.

I know I asked about it um a while ago, you know, that I think probably last year is I agree. We need to have some sort of maintenance program, but I think instead of just setting aside money for a big project, I would like to see us section off our whole city into areas, make sure that that area gets fixed in the next area so it doesn't hurt quite as much as now. the cost more because we waited so many years. Is there any way we can figure out taking sections and dividing our city up into little sections and doing that project right there and then the next year so it's a continuous so let's say we're doing it for 20 years with all these sections and when it comes back to after 20 years goes back to the first one make sure it's maintained it's updated so we always keep the funds rolling instead of having just big project that

yeah um I guess it depends on which type of infrastructure it is right so like When you're talking like that, I kind of think of roads, right? I'm thinking piping.

Oh, piping. Okay. And the piping, if it's if it's specifically utilities piping, that's in the utilities fund. But again, um we would have to look to Tom and his department to to look at that. However, there may be certain areas that are developed quicker than others, right? That may that infrastructure might be being used more than something that might last a little longer because it was put in, but that area didn't really grow as quickly as it was. You know, so just like paving too, I think of paving, there's going to be some roads that are just more heavily used. So their paving is going to be need to do sooner rather than later or more often than say some other areas that don't have that are not as heavily traveled, right? So I I I the departments can definitely look at that and we can try and um see how we could um section things off a little bit better. But um we have uh a user group that's coming together around infrastructure maintenance and GIS that I think that if we integrate some of the financing concepts in with that infrastructure maintenance map that is getting developed and tracked um we can have a really nice product for you in the future and something that our residents can also see how our infrastructure is being maintained and improved over time as well

like

and I know both public works and um utilities have been working really hard to try and map with GIS all the assets and the infrastructure of the city. And the last thing on capital projects again um related to growth management a little bit is we know we're facing higher cost for capital facilities increased service demands limitations that like the legislature is putting on strengthening our growth plans. um you know that that also limits us on on some of the things that we can do and it makes it uncertain on some of the grow property tax reform. Any questions before? So we kind of just want to give you what is property tax and it's an adorum tax meaning that it's an amount owed is a percentage of the assessed value of the real estate. The property taxes are the main source of revenue for most local governments in the US. They are used to fund a variety of things including public safety departments, road construction repairs, schools and other local services that benefit the community. Like what is the millage rate? So, a mill rate is the amount of tax per $1,000 of taxable assessed property value, and it's calculated by dividing the millage rate by a,000 and multiplying that product by the taxable assessed value of the property, which again, that can account for any exemptions that are on the property. So, here's an example. You had a millage rate of 3.900. That means you pay $3.90 for every $1,000 of your property's taxable assessment value. We did want you to see how you would compare locally with some of these other um municipalities in our area. Some have um a debt rate as well or fire service

rate. Also, some of these communities, they might have assessments for their fire districts or they might outsource um using like sheriff's department. Um so anyway, we wanted you to be aware of that. So here's the current mill rates that um a resident of the city might see and so 36.4% of their mill is Charlotte County.2% is a west coast inland navigation. 23.3% of the dollar would be uh city of Pana, 1.2% is environmentally sensitive land, 37.8% is the Charlotte County School Board and 1.1% is the Southwest Florida management district. So out of every dollar that of the full payment of the um mill rate on a person's tax bill, 23 % is what is coming to the city of comfort. So does the mill rate cover it all? So this is based on our 2026 original budget. It excludes any bargaining impacts for police. So this is the original budget. And then also out of police operating, we subtracted out the grant revenues that we get from the Charlotte County School Board for public works um drainage program that are But you can see that just the paving program, the police, fire and public works operating is more than the adamorum rate. If we were to bring to say, hey, Agalorum is covering all four of these items. So again, we have other funding sources

that we pull and we use and um to fund everything within our city. So ongoing statewide focus on property tax relief. There's been multiple proposals filed this this session. Voters will decide for multiple options on the 2026 ballot. So that was originally the governor is trying to get that down to just one um item on the ballot. All proposals prohibited a reduction of law enforcement funding and exempted the school taxes. Um There's no implementing bills with these. So the framework would be set after voter decisions. So again, that leaves a lot of uncertainty of how we would make up those differences. So again, though the governor dismissed the concept of multiple ballot options, um he does want the proposal to benefit full-time residents. He was not interested in proposal for residents age 65 and over only. He wanted to help newer homeowners as well. Um not yet a plan on the property taxes but would introduce one ready and he did indicate he would call a special session if necessary. These are the eight proposals. So so far I I kind of hear the contenders are HB203 which is the phase out of elimination of non-school property taxes for homesteads. Um, so that one would be 100,000 per year. So that would give you a little bit of planning because you would have a reduction over 10 years. Um, then the other ones I think are 21 and 215 if I'm remembering correctly that were kind of still um up there.

Did you want me to go over each one of these or Um, we did want to show you the impacts. So for HB201 obviously is the most one. That's if they took all the homestead properties right away. HB 203. This is the calculation for the first year. So again, um, it would be a decline like you would have more. would keep going up until you got to the full 9 million, but you have it over 10 years and the amount would be less each year of how much that decrease would be because some people in the first year might get to that cap and they might already fall off. It's at the higher level homes. So, so um in the first year we would so fiscal year 28 would be the first year we might expect something and it's HB203 you would be looking probably at approximately $2.6 million reduction based on 2026 rate. So what's next for us? So council members um you know have to actively engage in educating our legislators on our impacts of the house proposals and I think you've already been doing that and you've been going to Tallahass keeping a breast of um all the options coming up workshops to evaluate level service impacts should the proposals pass. So we're going to need input from our community about what what they want to still see in the city and what level of service it is. You know if if staffing levels have to decrease. You might have to wait for something to happen for three or four days, which normally occurred within a day or two now, you know. So, things like that. Um, educating residents on the impact and potential service level reductions. Um, we would also engage with other

municipalities to help brainstorm and discuss ideas for offsetting revenue reductions. I mean, everyone's going to be in the same boat. We're all going to be looking for for things and, you know, someone might think of something that we haven't thought of. So, we want to, you know, continue to make sure we're keeping those lines of communication open with other municipalities. I did put some versus facts that were on the um Florida League of Cities website. Um, you know, eliminating property taxes will lower costs for everyday Flidians is kind of a myth. It won't necessarily be a tax cut. It'll be a tax shift because again things are still going to have to get paid or services still have to happen. Um and so what does that mean? You know, so wealthy land owners and out of state property owners would benefit most while working families might pay more, whether that be through higher sales taxes or hidden fees. Scrapping property taxes won't impact essential services. We know that's not going to be true. we know we're going to have to make cuts and what is that going to look like? So, it could be services like public safety, parks, clean water, depend on stable local funding. So, eliminating property taxes threatens those things that make Florida great places to live. This plan gives communities more control over their future. Well, it really kind of does the opposite because now you don't have that revenue source and um it centralizes the power of Tal Tallahassee, giving special interests more say while everyday residents Um this presentation is online. You can click the link and get some more um information. There's video clips. Um there's some tool kits just to help maybe facilitate discussion for residents to even go find some more information on this would really be great.

That's all I have today. So any question very thorough presentation that's all you have any good news but we are working on our budget so we'll be coming back. Thank you for also recommending 10% reduction. I think that was one huge step forward to helping us you know try to maintain that going into our reserves.

And keep in mind it isn't going to be necessarily across the board, but at least uh every department, every division is making an effort to cut to cut their operating costs by 10%. There will be items that you'll see that will come back that will have to increase simply because the cost of that item increases for instance um say gas. If gas prices are higher, there's there's nothing we can actually do to cut the gas prices by 10%. So, um, yeah, we're really challenging the directors to work hard. Um, I do want to say thank you to Teresa Carla as well in finance. She has been working with all of our admin staff to really help us through this budgeting process and making sure that everyone is formatting all their information correctly and is getting the instructions that have been passed down um down to every level of the organization. So,

she did a great job. She um put together a presentation for them and work with them individually as well as setting up time to go see them, you know. So, we really appreciate all the work she's doing on that. What are you doing on the software to make things easier for you and finance as well instead of going here to here to here to try to patch things together?

Well, currently we have to use our ERP system. will be looking at um other ERP systems, but again that's usually a process and there is through um FGFOA a resource we could use where you bring someone in again if they help you but they um look at all your systems and what you have and they can help make recommendations and and things like that. So we'll be looking at that but again there's a cost to that as well but it makes it more efficient. That's and especially for you with FEMA and you know all the hurricanes that we have it would be much easier for you.

And we talked to Brad about that before he retired and he said Central Square also had some newer technology that maybe we instead of doing a whole new ERP system maybe we could piggy back off some of their new technology that they're um having. It would still be a process to switch over but it might be a little less painful or a little less costly. We don't know yet. Thank you. Thank you.

Okay. Okay, we need to take a 10 minute break. Sorry.

I came back. Okay, we're gonna go ahead and get ready again. This next one is a resolution of the city of Ponttoa approving and ratifying an agreement between the city and Southwest Florida chapter of Florida Police Benev benevolent association effective October 1st, 2025 through September 30th, 2026 authorizing the city manager to execute the agreement on behalf of the city and providing an effective date.

Good afternoon, council. Jeff Payne, HR manager, coming back to you with a of this proposal, right? And before I get into the details of the proposal, I just wanted to say that city utilizes a negotiating team, management staff to represent the city's interest, right? And that's headed up by members of different departments that all represent different points of view, right? It starts with our city manager, Melissa Riker, who is there to give us over the city overall. She knows the details of all the different divisions, the different union contracts, etc. So, she helps us get that overall perspective. She knows where the city wants to go, right? Then we have our finance director who's also on the negotiating team. We depend on Kristen Simeone to give us the cost of the proposal, tell us what the city can and canot a to do and what the city might have to do in order to pay for an agreement. Then we have our police chief and then the management staff that she wants to bring um and what they do is they help us understand the operational needs of the department where we stand in comparison to our neighbors. She knows what all those different organizations whether they're sheriffs or police or whatever are doing at this time. And then part of that negotiating team as well. And I I look out for the city as far as labor needs, legal issues, liabilities, etc. I don't think I left anybody out of the team, but if I did, I apologize. Right? So, we do have all these different

people come together, and so we try to keep all these different things in mind. Uh, so this agreement that we're bringing today has already been ratified by Police benevolent association which I hope you don't mind if I refer to as the PDA as a whole year. Uh so the dates on it are October 1, 2025 to September 30, 2026 and we were going to increase the range which means the minimum and maximum for the police officer position is 8%. So the starting pay then for all newification the maximum that any officer could make in a fiscal year as well. Now existing staff would go up 10%. However, part of that 10% would be the annual merit that they would get out of their performance evaluation. So that really cut down that 10% to like a 6% instead. And of course, they have to get a minimum performance rating that meets expectations on the annual evaluation in order to get that increase. Um, and those increases would be passed out on their annual review date. Wouldn't all happen at the same time, right? Some of those would be backdated to October 1st of last year. Although realiz that their review dates in the history like that have already received partial increase on that date. So they wouldn't be getting 10%us what they already

increases. Yes. I thought I maybe I'm wrong because I didn't look this up and it was a while ago, but I thought that um the increase with the last negotiations was like 2 and 12% for the sworn officers

and% Okay. Um we had previously talked about um longevity pay and that was cut out of this proposal. Uh there was also discussion of a traffic homicide investigation position which was cut out of this proposal. We did increase the detective incentive from 50 cents an hour to a dollar an hour. So those detectives would get an additional$1.

So that's that's $1 an hour. So their salary actually increases by that much more. Well, it's not part of their salary, right? So then when you get increases, it doesn't get compounded, right? So we can explain it if we want to go into detail, but it's what we call in our system addition. So it's outside when they get raises and things. So it's

Yes, it does get onto their an hour. Um there were a couple other wording proposals um that were denied and we'll go into the details of those and then also three personal days per fiscal year are in this proposal for all the officers. These three days are to be treated as vacation days, right? They have to be approved in advance. Can't just call in before the start of the taking a personal day, right? Supervisor has to know in advance and approve it and say it's okay to take that day and then they don't use those three days. This is a use it or lose it situation. So cannot carry it over into the next year and accumulate personal days forever. It's three days a year and they have to be used in that year. So that is the details of this agreement. Uh there were some questions about what the Charlotte County Sheriff has done. Like to thank the police department for sending that contract. Right. So they're giving a cost of living a cola increase of 3% and then a merit increase on top of that 1%. And then they also added longevity 3% for every year of service, not to exceed 25 years of service. You have to be there at least two years in order to get. So instead of putting it all into a merit increase, they broke it up into several different buckets. As far as take home vehicles go, yeah, our officers are allowed to have take

home vehicles. went back through previous contracts as far as 2013. And in the 2013 agreement, they were allowed to take home vehicles within 25 miles as determined by MQ. So for at least 13 years, they've been able to take those vehicles home. As you look through the more recent agreements, right, you can see that HR has gotten involved and we've added in wording about dimminimous personal usage of that vehicle to and from work and stuff like that. Right? So, it's really for official use. It's not for running errands and those kind of things.

When did it go up to 35 miles? Uh, let's see. In 2013, it was at 25. 2016 it was at 25. So, was somewhere between 2016 and 2020. I don't have the exact on

I have some questions for you. So just because it wasn't made clear this money will I mean we're we're prepared for 4% raise right we have that yes okay 4% was budgeted 4% and then the extra 6% is coming from reserves from the reserves okay and how will we be replenishing those those monies is the big question.

So, they'd be coming Well, they'd be coming from the reserves. Um, but we did let you know that we did already have $2 million increase from leftover funds from like savings that you know the departments didn't spend or some additional revenue. Um, longterm you would have to like um obviously the legislature is not cutting public safety. So, if you needed to increase your adorum or revenue sources. Again, we'll be looking at all of that to try and fund any of this for the long term. And again, in our perform, we did include the the additional positions of the five-year staffing. So, some of that might come from cutting some of that staffing, you know, that was projected over the five years. I don't I don't know. It will be determined by, you know, talks with the city manager, with city council, and the community. But once we approve this, we will not be able to cut their salaries. It's very hard to go back, right? Yes.

Um they did do this as a one-year term instead of a three-year agreement. Um because we're not able to agree term. What will it add to the cost of the pension more or less? Because it's not just the wages, it's the pension increases,

right? So, the pension would increase based on that. You know, obviously pensual wages will go up an additional 6% over what we've normally done, right? So, if we've been normally doing 4%, but again, it depends if we have storms or not. If we don't have storms, that might help keep those estimates down. Um, but we don't know some of thatvious butvious obvious any wages, pensionable wages would affect the pension. Um, if we're going to continue negotiations, maybe we look at some of that those items as well of what's considered pensionable.

Well, this is only the beginning because there's going to be fire. I know we just did whatund we did include. Yeah. So, we included the estimate based on um if you ratified this particular one at 10% that they would also get the same type of increase. So, we included that estimate. It's almost $91,000 per year um for lieutenants and captains. Um it was on the page that looked like this.

It was attached to the agenda item. I don't know which one it was on there. Sorry. number three of the exhibits. Well, I I understand that we're not supposed to use reserves for normal operating costs and then when we have a hurricane, if we have a hurricane, those reserves will be diminished substantially. We're using reserves on a lot of things, right? To make up our whole budget, we're using reserves.

Well, and if we look back over the last few years, you'll see that even though we project that we're going to use reserves, we don't always use those reserves. Sometimes we're adding to the reserves again because of either additional revenue or department's turning back funds. But when and and I just listened to the county's presentation on their um budget information from March 17th and they do the same thing. They budget 100% of their personnel expenses, but a lot of times you might have vacancies throughout the year. It turns some of those funds back. So, um So, I hate this. It's really, you know, you know, I even had to write it down because I've been in such turmoil over this whole thing. And and you know, it's one of the things and I think we all agree we love our police officer, our fire department. We love all of our staff. You guys do go above and beyond, you know, for for all of us. And the thing that is really tough is we're looking at a financial insecurity. We don't know if we're going to We don't know if there's going to be a tax cut. We don't know these things. And and I tried to look at it internally and I was like, you know, it's kind of like a child who wants to have that Mustang Shelby convertible and you want to give them everything that they have, but does the pocketbook actually allow it? You know, like your your budget might only be a Pinto or something like that, but you want to give them that Shelby convertible. And this is where I'm just having this turmoil. You know, I don't want us to all of a sudden we're going to give this and also we're finding out that we can't balance our budget and and I don't want us taking away I don't want us you know losing our police. I and I I look at it and it's really a difficult difficult decision. And I know when you came to us when it was the $10,000 increase for every sworn officer, we

weren't negotiating at that time because we needed to do it. But now all of a sudden we're we're asking for a higher increase and we were saying because we needed to keep staff here and it it's like okay so we're looking at starting salaries for everybody. That's what we've always compared, you know, all our notes to. But then it's the starting salary and every, you know, police officer gets in merit increase every single year, you know, at least 4%. And so there always is going to be the divide. And for me, it was like, okay, if we're concerned about new hire, maybe that's where we should increase it. But to jump up that extra percentage for staff, and I'd like to have it, too. Trust me, I would love to have a bigger salary. But is it right for us at the budget with our budget with uncertainty at this time? Is it appropriate for us balancing the checkbook to say yes to everybody else who wants a 10% increase which is actually only a 6% increase? And I know that sounds horrible and it's not. I don't not that I don't love you guys and this is why I have such turmoil. I don't want to lose you guys. I want to give you everything that you're asking for, but I don't know how we're going to do it when we look at the long run. And that's scares me and I just had to get it out there.

I just did simple math and the police add up to the 19 million tax that we collect 19 million that's what we collect and it's police and fire now on old old pay scale old situation. So we're already dipping into funds that we don't have and it's only going to get worse. I don't think anybody has any doubt about that have less money. So, I I don't know what happens when we run out of money. I I don't want to raise taxes. I don't think that's right. Maybe it needs to be up for public discussion. How much do you value police? How much do you are you willing to have a raise in taxes? I mean, how do we make this decision um when there really isn't the money there? And that's obvious because we're already using reserves to I mean, sure, it doesn't sound like that much, but it is actually a lot more than it's at least 500,000. I think when uh just with the you know the um pension and all that calculated so I don't know I don't I don't have to

for the record and my concern is you know I feel like we have this brick wall in front of us right now we we know what's we know what's coming up there will be something on the ballot that you know phases out school property taxes on homesteads. And you know, we have an over 65 community. Many of those people live on a fixed income. And I'm going to tell you right now, they're going to vote yes on this. I don't care how much you educate them on what will happen, what the repercussions will be if this is passed by the voters. I think people are still going to say, "Hey, this is hitting me in the wallet. I'm good with voting yes on this." And and that is a concern of ours. Um I I think we need to get out and really educate people and make them understand. But this legislation also includes a provision freezing law enforcement budgets at the higher of the budgets either between 2025 and 2026 or 2026 and 2027 fiscal years. And it's forcing local governments to maintain that police funding. So, we're going to be, you know, our feet will be held to the fire. If you're going to pull it up this much, then you better be ready. to maintain that because we can't cut police officers. We can't cut our fire. We we can't even I don't even believe you can cut a a truck or a car or anything like that. So, um you know, I'm just concerned and it's all about the legislation. I I listened a little bit to the to the county, too. They're very concerned that um it'll just take a couple years before we we all don't we don't have the money to keep going. So, I don't know what the the intention is of the legislature other than they want people to come to Florida and they want people to stay here. The the taxes have been raised, but also the flood insurance, all that. So, they're hoping

that this will draw more people in. Well, then there's a whole valuation of our houses has gone down about 20%. We're not seeing that yet in our revenue, but we will. I believe we'll be seeing less revenue.

I'm ready to move to approve this. Um I move to approve 6B. We have a motion on the floor for approval. All in favor? I oppose. I motion carries not I'd love to have it come back when we know more about our legislative on what we're going to do and how we're going to do it. I think if we had more definite amounts it would be so much better for us.

Chief Pam Smith Police Department. Um it's very disappointing. I know you guys have the dilemma of the But I'm telling you right now, we are now currently Fort Myers just ratified their contract. We are now the second lowest paid. All All these officers have been asking is to be equivalent. They just want to be able to feed their families and do the same. They're doing the same job that every other department is doing, but now they're one of the lowest paid in this region. And I'm just disappointed. I guess it would help if we could find cuts somewhere, but nobody can come up with cuts and I think I don't know if the police department is being asked to cut 10% the way the rest of the departments are. Are they?

Yeah,

chief. You know, one of the biggest things that I would love to see is is like when we were comparing, even though it still had population differences and everything like that, when we brought together to bring $10,000 by looking at everybody, I never saw that exact same like take that exact piece of paper to show where the increases happened, how much they were getting, and it would help us visualize it. I still don't know how we're going to pay for it, but it would help us visualize that. Well, that was a PowerPoint that we tried to present to you guys in that uh shade meeting um showed where the comparisons were. The other issue is um what happened back in when you gave that raise was because we had lost all those officers and we were down staffing. they were working multiple multiple shifts of overtime. Fatigued officers create dangerous situations. So, you will pay later if you know if you don't pay now. Um don't want to figure something out.

I I get that. I'm just saying that if this happens, we have 20 officers that are under five years. They are not vested. There is nothing keeping them here and they will go somewhere else. I can promise you that and we will be in this situation where we'll definitely have to cut services as well. So again, if we have and this is where I was saying that earlier is if we want to best our lower paying police officers to try to get them to stay, you know, why are we looking at such a huge increase for everybody who's already here compression if you don't but they're still getting 4% every year that the new person So the new guy comes in and gets more than the guy that's been here a year.

No, no, no. I'm saying the same pay grade because you're talking about pay rates. If they're all at a 35 pay grade and the person who comes in, if it's 35 and now we've increased it, that's the area that we need to concentrate on, not with everybody else going out. We need to take a look at statistics. Exactly. How is that going to affect it? Do we have how many people in that lowest pay grade? Five, six. They're in the same pay grade, but they're at different levels. Sorry. Oh, we have to look it.

Yeah. So, we do not have the officers broken up into separate corporal position. Right. So, they're all in the same range. So if you raise the bottom and you don't raise all the existing corresponding amount then you will have new hires coming here. So how many police officers here

six less than a year. So those are the ones that we need to concentrate on. Those are the ones we don't want to lose. So they should I don't want to lose any of them. You're saying that these nonvested I'm sorry these nonvested ones are the ones that you're afraid of losing because they have been here for five years. There's 20 that are under five years. So those are the ones that are not vested that have you the ones that are here two years you some of them are uh contractually obligated to be here for two years right um but whether they went through the academy and I think now we've instituted ones that have already been certified also have to be long. However the law only applies to How how long is a probationary period for a year? A total of a year.

So they get the one base pay and then when they graduate with a probationary period, then it automatically begins. So it bumps up right away. So that's actually good. And then if they've been here a year, they actually have another 4%. So if we start calculating, there still is a difference. Maybe not as much, but it's even like in any place like when you go to, you know, a restaurant, you know, just minimum w if they have everybody increase, you know, by a percentage, too. I don't think a restaurant would work if they had to do that.

I I know I you guys are said we love you, but we have to. It's It's a different category, but again, we look at the benefits that you're getting on the pension plan. We're just looking at the budget right now. We We love you guys. We just have to figure out how we can do it. And if you can help us figure out how we can fund this, that would be awesome. I I do have

I I really appreciate this. I would love One other item that can help fund this is the red light um speed cameras or the speed cameras that we talked about for the school zone. Sorry, not red light cameras, but the speed zone. So, because again, if that was generating approximately 400,000 per year, that would actually fund this particular as well. But I think we're going to have issues with that with hiring magistrate and things like that. So you really have to get the Yeah. So when you hire the magistrate, they you assess the fees to the person that's making the appeal. That's a very good point. That's a very very good point.

Can we get public input on this? Because if we have to raise taxes, I want the public to have. Is there a way to just I mean I know they'll all text text an email and they'll they'll let us know what they think. And I I actually want to hear where the public's at on this taxes and it seems like that might be especially with what's going on with the state. So, it's not something I want to do. But if people really want that the police and they want to pay for the police, then then they have to realize what what it's going to cost. How do you get that mass? It's hard, you know. Sorry again. Yeah. So just um just a thought or you know discussion here. So if we would say the you know the speed zone cameras is funding it in the short term rather than reserves. Um that would you know that would cover that. It's only a one-year agreement. You can't go backward, but you could say, you know, when you're discussing the next years, what would the next year percentage be? You know, if you had to possibly, you know, and again, we'll probably looking at all of it, but um you know, what would the next year percentage be a lower percent? Are you stay with the 4%, you know,

so those are cameras haven't started yet and this is being retroactive back to October. So, it doesn't doesn't work. But again, the departments did turn back funds. So those funds are coming from savings from a prior year. Police department or other department um all departments. So I I could I could get you what the police department was. And the biggest concern is now we have other departments who saved money, you know, turning it back. And aren't they going to be looking for a raise as well because we have to look at the budget comparable. So now we've just taken the money that we've, you know, that they worked hard at putting it back and now it's going to the police instead of maybe going to them who could use the increase in pay. We we just have to look at everything, you know, and that's the thing. But I just wanted I just wanted to,

you know, point that out with the with the speed camera um the speed cameras generating some revenue that might help towards your discussion. The speed cameras are good. you know, we've had so much turmoil with a lot of areas that have been pulling out to you here, you know, from speed cameras. I hope that that's not a fact. I hope we've got everything squared away. I know I've had a lot of emails sent to me about them, too. And I hate to rely on something that we might have issues with, but again, I love the fact that she said the magistrate's going to, you know, pay for fees for the people who try to get out of their ticket.

Um, Jeff, do you know the sheriff's pay with this Do you know what they are getting starting? Uh, I don't have they were at 625.

I heard they pay they get paid less than ours, but I don't know if that's true. Charlotte County,99 start.

I think the other is the the FRS versus the pension plan because that's huge for us too. That's another chunk of change that we're looking at. You know, the the county and most of them all have an FRS plan where we pay a lot more out of the city's budget to cover a pension plan. And maybe that's to look at as well. Is our city, you know, FRS, which actually would save us some money, which would save the city money if we can increase pay, you know, I mean, are there ways that we can do something? We have to figure out how we do things. And I'm just throwing it out there. I don't even know if that's feasible or not.

Of course, Dodto County just in negotiations currently, right? So, if we don't take some action, then we will be at the bottom. I think that would be good to look at the pension plan and see if we can make wiser choices there so that we can pay the officers more because I think it's an expensive If we can get some analysis of that helpful rather the officers directly and they'll still get a good pension I'm sure I mean just what I've heard about FRS

well so FRS has a program specifically for public safety right it's not like the general plan so it does provide betterenefitseneral employee So don't know the details of that research. So maybe what I'm hearing at least Debbie and I are saying is that we figure out a way to pay for this that's not into reserves if there's some by saving on a pension plan or doing something because we do not want to have to cut the police. There's another option out there nobody wants and that's no and that's not what we want. So we have to work with what we've got. So by by turning it down today, right, it does allow us to look at some other issues, right? Then we have to get them to reopen negotiations in order to change any information. Can't just do that unilaterally. This is horrible. This is coverage. Trust me, this is we have to figure out how we can how we can possibly keep our police officers pay and well.

Okay. The next one is resolution of the city council of the city of Pontagora authorizing the city manager to enter into local agency program agreement. Department of Transportation for design services improvements to Cooper Street from Airport Road and East Marion Avenue providing sidewalks, bicycles, bicycle facilities, decorative street lights, street trees, providing for conflicts and providing

brick grants coordinator urban design. Um this is a typical lap agreement uh local agency program agreement with FDOT. We've entered into a few of them um over the last couple years. Um this will be the uh the first of two this spring uh for FDOT programs. This is funded right now at the tune of 308,000 for design at Cooper Street. It's been on uh FDOT's uh program for many years and uh there is um 2.911 million allocated for construction on the back end.

That's awesome. So, um just asking for you to enter into um agreement with the uh for the resolution and then enter into the actual agreement uh for the contract to move forward with a couple questions. Somebody asked me, is it one side of Cooper County, one side city? Is that affected? And is the county involved in it? And of course, second question is, are we on the hook for any two questions? So the the second one that's most important is no. I don't believe we're on the hook for any money right now. The 308,000 is set up for a design. Design is fairly straightforward with this project as far as I understand. Um and I don't think we're going to be on the hook for

I think the concern was if if we were and the county was involved obviously would make sure Carl's got some answers on whether or not the county is involved. I think part of Cooper or part of Cooper is but I'll let I'll let him for the record the portion that we're talking about is all within the city right I personally think it's about time we do something on the east side of 41 so I'm really thrilled about this move to approve 6

we have a motion and second to approve all in favor I oppose motion carries thank Next one is award of amendment Corollo Engineers of Sarasota to provide professional services for the mechanical integrity test and renewal of the operating permit for the reverse osmosis water treatment plant deep injection well.

Good afternoon and he procurement. This is an authorization on the master agreement for public water supply to Corollo engineers. Staff requested a proposal based on the hourly rates for the master agreement to provide planning contractor and field oversight in order to perform the mechanical integrity test on the wells. This is required every 5 years prior to renewing the permit. The consultant will also assist in renewing the underground injection control permit which expires in April of 2027. The total cost of the authorization is 100,28 $289.50. It will be completed over the next 12 months. Staff is recommending approval of this award to Coro Engineers.

Any questions? Motion to approve 60D.

Second. We have a motion. A second to approve. All in favor? Oppos? Motion carries. Talk to us about the next award for certainly. The next one is again an authorization on the master agreement for public water supply to Corollo Engineers of Sarasota. Staff requested a proposal based on the hourly rates on the master agreement and this is for assistance with preparing the application for funding and planning documentation required with the application for the supplemental appropriations for hurricane and Milton which The SHM program through FD total funding is 35,139,169. 50% will be provided as principal forgiveness and 50% will be at 0% loan. The cost of the authorization is $109,730 and a time frame to complete is over the next nine months. Staff is recommending the amendment to pro engineers. Any questions?

Move to approve 6. Second. We have a motion, a second to approve. All in favor? I oppos. Thank you. Okay. City.

Good afternoon, council. City Clerk Sarah Walch. For the record, at the January 29th city council meeting, discussion of the use of funds to purchase tickets for city council members to attend community events was requested. Section two of the city council travel policy available in exhibit 1 details sourcing of funds and authorization for their use for community events. The current policy states for it defines allocation of funds as funding shall be included annually in the city council's travel budget for costs associated with attending local community events. It says for authority to incur travel expenses, all expenditures will be pursuant to authorized annual budget allocations. Each member of the city council may approve his or her expenses but shall not exceed the authorized annual budgeted amount. Members who exceed the budgeted amount may request additional funds such requests to to be approved by city council. Funds from the city council's travel account may be used to attend events when the council members representing the city of Punaorta in an official capacity. Expending city funds to make donations to any business, organization, group, or individuals prohibited. Submission of receipts for attending community events are required to obtain reimbursement. Alternatively, the city clerk's office can assist by making advanced reservations using a city credit card. So, some advantages of the current policy include individual autonomy by allowing each member to approve their own expenses within their budget. The policy minimizes administrative red tape. It empowers council members to decide which events are most relevant to their specific constitu constituents or areas of focus. Another is clear prohibitions. The explicit ban on using travel funds for donations is a strong safeguard. This helps protect the city from potential violations of the Florida Constitution's prohibition against the credit for private purposes. Another advantage is the flexible logistics. It provides two paths for payment, reimbursement, or advanced reservation and accommodates different personal preferences and ensures that

out-ofpocket costs aren't a barrier to participation. Another advantage is the budgetary cap linking expenditures to an authorized annual budget ensures fiscal predictability and prevents openended spending. Some potential disadvantages and risks include uh the vague definition of official capacity. The policy allows funds to be used when a member is representing the city in an official capacity, but it doesn't define what that means. Without specific criteria, like being a featured speaker, presenting a proclamation, or an event being hosted by a partner agency, this is open to broad interpretation. Another disadvantage is the self-approval perception. While efficient self approval of expenses lacks an independent check, in a community that values transparency, this could lead to public perception issues. If a council member's event choices appear more social than functional or professional, there's also the fundraiser gray area. Many community events are fundamentally fundraisers like gala dinners or charity auctions. While the policy prohibits direct donations, it doesn't clarify if purchasing a high-cost ticket to a fundraiser is considered a donation or a legitimate travel expense. This could be a point of contention for auditors. There's also um equity of opportunity. If one member exhausts their budget early and requests more funds, it may create friction or the appearance of favoritism if the council had to vote on an increase for one and didn't grant it for another. And then the final um identified potential disadvantage is documentation gaps. Requiring only a receipt for reimbursement doesn't necessarily document the public purpose served by the event. It doesn't require the member to show how their attendance specifically benefited benefited the city or what official business was conducted. Some points that could be considered for today's discussion are one, should city council establish a list of pre-approved types of events like chamber of commerce events or homers association events? Two, should there be a dollar limit on individual ticket prices for community events? would adding a requirement for a brief

report during city council meetings after attending an event enhance transparency regarding the official capacity requirement. And now I am here to take notes.

Maybe we can make it really simple. Either a we can agree on like standing stuff like League of Cities or the Chamber, but anything else has to be brought forward to us. I'd like to go to ABC and then we all as a group decide if that's appropriate or not. Pretty simple. I mean, just try to make it. I think you know events you know like you said you go to these events and you're paying $200 a ticket and you're probably going to think I think anything Um I don't know how much like going to the county and things are great going to lunches. I'm not sure how much connection you're really doing as representing the city for the lunch pay for that. I don't I don't know if that's something that we should be having out of lunch. That's kind of way too much. But I don't know if that's really looking at you know I know some of it was like it's up to 30 miles away. I think that you know when you get an overnight stay or something like that should be overseers you know so I think that I drive all the time

I don't ask for reimbursements we're eating event when you go to events. It's crazy. You're paying $30 for a hamburger that you could, you know, so that one Yeah. bring it forward like, "Hey, I'd like to attend like just like we do in DC, you know, "Hey, I'd like to attend this." And then we can talk as a board and say, "Yeah, great. Whatever." You know, go from there. And if you want to do standing, whether it be whether it be cities um that's fine but if it's on a case by case basis we just have to plan a little more ahead

I would note um the discussion intention for today was more of community events Florida League of I don't think they've ever held a community event down here I'm in agreement with everything that that you both brought up um there was also something in there that you said about requirement for city council member kind of a short synopsis. There's not really one currently that was a potential proposal if that would be beneficial. I like that idea. I just feel like, you know, sometimes we go and do something and then we come back and we forget to do the follow through which is to tell the public this is what you paid me to do and I went and did it.

Yeah. Instead of going looking at a site website, you know, that's important, right? I do that routinely for the legislative committees that I've been on and I never charge for meals for any of the trips

and but local stuff around here we pay our own way. I've used city funding for education and and I've taken level one and two. I'm going to be taking level three and then that's the end of it. And uh but I will on legislative committee which occurs up in Orlando. But yeah, this is just about paying for stuff here locally. That's all.

Yeah. And I think again, if you're exhausting, if you've exhausted your amount of money, then you've exhausted your amount of money because it's unfair if all of a sudden something comes up and like, hey, we want to go. Well, yeah, the money went to somebody else and then we don't have it. You know, again, I think it needs to stay with us with that amount that we are. And if we're not using it, then it goes back to the funds again. This saves our city money and it starts with us. So I think we're saying we don't really need to change anything except maybe report back when go somewhere. Is that what you're saying? I think that's the way it's been, right? We have our own funds and once it's exhausted it doesn't it doesn't transfer like mine doesn't transfer to

but a council member is currently allowed to uh request use of additional funds in the current travel policy. Um I don't know you know everything would be subject to council's approval. I don't think anyone is probably planning on doing that for local community events which was the intended focus of the discussion today. Well it has in here and stuff like that so I wasn't the entire travel policy. Sorry, we're just uh focusing on section two right now. So, we agree then we agree. We're all in agreement. Is that right? And that agreement is for specifically Just want to make sure I've got pay out of your own pocket unless it's for local community events. Um do we want to define any kind of boundary on what we're considering local?

No. I I think like like Greg said, Tim and I drive, you know, to Fort Myers and we're not like requesting gas room or for eating lunch or anything like that. We do it on our own pocket and I think that's really the right thing to do. Even though we're representing the city in a way, it it's still, you know, something that we just do. Okay. I think the biggest thing was like these $200 tickets and having the city pay for it and stuff. I think that's I don't even know. Has anybody done that? I know I haven't. I have not. I can't recall anyone purchasing tickets.

So, I do want to note uh with travel policy for the tickets, the funding for things like registrations actually comes out of the separate budget item. It's the registrations account. So, u those things don't actually come out of the travel account even though they're authorized pursuant to the travel policy. Thank you. Thank you.

Alicia. Awesome. Next, we're going to talk about AI governance policy. Okay, Alicia Oats, interim IT manager. Um, we are introducing our first draft at an AI policy. Um, this is essentially going to be just a a guardrails conversation. It's happening whether we like it or not. AI is part of our reality. Um, it is being integrated into the tools. We're using it in our personal lives and we're just wanting to clarify our is with AI stuff, but um so our our intent is to look for ways for um rounding up information, making it readily available, um sifting out the noise so people can quickly and efficiently make those decisions. It's not the intention of having AI make the decisions for the staff. It's just to make it uh easier for them to make informed decisions. And another area that we're looking at is for um cleaning up the repetitive tasks. It's great for automation, but again, we're not looking at it as a mechanism to replace the employees. So, just some examples uh would be drafting summaries, um identifying trends. Uh one thing that I heard at a recent conference uh One area is improving response times and that's any field workers public safety

and non and um this will allow us to focus on staff and residents instead of a lot of the mundane tasks. So as I said this technology is mainstream at this point and we are already hearing um solicitations about how it's being integrated with our tools with upgrades that are up and coming. So we need to make sure that we're ahead of the curveball and we've set the expectations with the employees. So, some areas that um we are wanting to reassure the community that are on the radar is making sure that we're transparent on how we use it. That we are accountable with our use of it that again it's human oversight and it's not something where we're just going to take it and run with it to cut corners. Um we need to maintain fairness and equity. Uh security is should have been first because our ultimate um push as we talk about AI with staff uh safety and again this is all maintained by the human oversight. So um one of the things that we need to determine how we're going to um move forward is how to note when AI is used. So you will that will be part of the conversations um making sure that we come up with a standard on how that and the different levels of abuse of AI. But again, the recurring theme is the city employee is always ultimately responsible and the data needs to stay protected. So let's see operational efficiency um customer service support data anal analysis and asset management. Those are some areas that we're already having

conversations and interest on. So just a little bit ago we were talking about um the the work orders and asset management management. That's blue city and that's something that our GIS manager is wanting to move forward. PowerBI is something that is a part of our um 365 upgrade. Um so we are going to see this um moving forward. Okay. And the way that we control the way that this is used in the city is by putting together a governance committee and that will be made up of representatives of leadership. city manager's office, legal, HR, IT, and then department heads as appropriate and the the practice and the intent is that the tools are brought to them or if it's an upgrade to a tool, if it's something that is an exposure to the city, it's brought so there's awareness and then we discuss this is the plan, this is what's happening and the expectation on, you know, are we going to turn all these features on? Do we want to explore these tools? I've had qu few directors come to me with interest in tools and it's like you know if we did this we could eliminate this whole section. So there is a lot of interest in their choing at the bit and they're building their budgets right now. So um we just need to set the rules and then um another big part of that is going to be for the governance committee is the ongoing monitoring it. Obviously one of our big goals is to track all of this maintain the security and safety and then track usage and um basically all over the law. So as we as we identify issues which a lot of the issues we don't know because we haven't really stepped into a lot of as we start to identify this. We can bring this back to the committee and then we can say this is what we're

seeing, this is our trend, how does the city want to proceed? You know, is this something we need to pump the brakes a little bit? Do we need to create additional rules? Uh but this is again this is a starting point for our conversation. And the last section um on this policy talks about public records. So again, this is all public it is susceptible to public records request. Uh it gets reviewed and redacted. All of the Florida laws still apply and the city clerk is ultimately responsible. So as we move forward and we have those guidelines, we then need to move forward and educate the staff. Uh and in the um the draft that was attached, there's four sections. So, we started with a public summary, which the intent was for that to be on the website, just a a quick one page where you can see what the city's expectations are just to give the guards. And then you've got the actual policy which has all of the elements that are necessary. And this is based on best practices. We do a lot of work with Gartner um and obviously they're pulling trends with other municipalities and people in non-government. So, um we have them to make sure that we're not missing gaps. Um, and then the next section is a quick employee reference and that's just a quick you do this and you don't do that. Um, so for those employees that are using technology and they're just using the basic word outlook and you know they've got co-pilot now or they're getting a report, this will give them just a quick reference to say well what am I allowed to do with that? What are the expectations if someone asks for something? And then the last section is just clarification on the public records. So, um I know I went really fast. This has been

a long day. Did you have any questions? Cost there. That's my question. Okay. So, this is just the policy. Uh this is not an obligation to use any tool. So I heard that there are additional steps that come up next once we have an approved version to review.

Yes, we will adopt a formal policy. Um right now it's your opportunity to provide any feedback to that policy as far as costs. Um there's staff time involved at this point which there is anytime we implement any new type of technology. There we go. I personally think having AI is actually great because it actually might expedite like writing a scope. You know, it's kind of like the writer's blank. You know, they know how to do it and what to do, but to actually get that first thing started. So, I think with AI, they could say, "Hey, you know, we've got this project." And then also hopefully it'll become like a template for them and they just have to tweak it into whatever. Of course, you're still going to have to review it. Like you said, you still need humans in there, but hopefully that might expedite us with scope being written which means it goes faster through procurement. We can have more you know definitive things that we're looking for. So it actually might help us move things a lot faster and stay instead of saying that we're always slow as molasses. So I think this is fantastic idea.

I I'm glad to see us moving forward on this. I did receive a couple of comments that um it needs more teeth. What exactly they meant, I'm not exactly sure. see if I can get more detail.

So, I think a lot of the teeth are going to come as we start looking at specific tools and we start to see how employees use them. We have a few employees that we've noticed are using it and you know, we're cautiously grooming them to be careful what you put in there. You cannot put, you know, public information, you know, personal information in there. Um, so the teeth will come. This is intended just to be a first It's our future. Good job. Thank you.

Awesome. Kayak services discussion.

I'm the one who keeps bringing this up. Do you have some comments because you guys did a survey and all that. I don't have comments. I was just going to kind of give you guys a brief history of how we got to where we are and then ask for direction.

So, for the record, Carl Benge, uh, in July and August of 2025, staff was directed to look at the idea of a kayak kiosk rental primarily brought on by a vendor who ran a kayak who wanted to donate to the city. August 20 August 20th, 2026, staff presented the idea before city council along with the procurement procedure necessary to move forward. After staff's presentation, city council discussed that the services they would like to include in the scope of work. This included accessibility needs, self-running system were a way for the vendor to recoup the fees. It included a dock or a kayak launch of some sort and included in including the permitting and environmental fees as part of that scope of work. Um, this scope of work was drafted by urban design and during that meeting staff was also directed to reach out to Charlotte County and ask how they ran their services. Staff was able to reach out to SH County resource manager and get some information on the item. They provided staff with Florida statutes 327.54 which states safety regulations and penalties for rental companies. The Florida statute outlined what is required for those who provide those services and operate and how they can operate within the law. They also mentioned that the people that approached us also approached them. They had their legal look at their donation and their legal their donation their donation would not uh meet this the statuto requirements. So um with that in an effort uh to see how much interest was in the city uh urban design did a survey. It was um I think it was 11 questions. We only had 77 respondents unfortunately. And so December 3rd we came and uh we presented these findings to you. Um it was determined then that this wasn't a high priority and so we're coming for you now and seeing what direction. I think we gave up on the idea of the accessible dock because we don't have

the funds for it and it was going to be donated but that's no longer the case but if we could have have provided I don't know about the legalities and the rest of it but if we could provide a pad a location for a self-service kayak rental whatever that is. So it's the self service that we're running into the problem that's well this the Florida statutes require that certain safety uh instructions are given before and it strictly states that the person g the person giving the instructional needs to sign off. So if it's on a phone app and you have to sign to and you have to read the instructions that doesn't work.

So according to Charlotte County, they took it to the legal and they said that it wouldn't pass the statuto requirements staff's reading of the of the statutes. It strictly says the person who is giving it. It doesn't say so it has to It's kind of what it's insinuating. Yes. So, a private place like this little rental here, they kind of have a couple that they could do it. It seems that a man station would uh satisfy the statuto requirements. The ones that and if it's a private business, then there's probably still some of that.

Well, there's requirements. Yes. And then we can as a city can can uh put restrictions on, too. But there are requirements. That answers your question. Yeah. I mean, I think at this point it's it's not up to the city to we can't do it without a bunch of I'm sorry to say legalities and hiccups and stuff like that. I say we just we're done with that. Um what also though since we're talking about this is maybe if there is an owner or somebody that wants to approach the city and do a public private you know agreement or however that would be but I think that's really at this point it's either business comes to us and That's it. But I think from a cityrun perspective, there's too much.

We would highly recommend anybody who's interested to reach out to procurement first so we don't run into the same kind of situation. Not me. Don't reach out to me. Reach out to procurements. But yeah, anything else? That's great. Thank you. Anybody want to go through the long range finish? Sorry, trying to be funny in our long day here. Next is local options sales tax.

Boyd Lawrence, planning director. This is a item coming back to you that was presented March 11th. It was the uh the scoring and rating of the projects that this committee went through over the last seven meetings since July first meeting and wrapped up in February. Gave more detail the last meeting as far as the top five projects and um this is the whole the entire list in its entirety. Now there are some some factors to consider which I think in the last cycle there was a tier one and a tier two list of projects. Tier one would be your top primary project that funded with through the estimates of 4 million a year. Um you can consider tier two projects if there's residual funding on those projects. And another the thing that I found out I went to the county's meeting last month and they still have one more meeting to refine their project tomorrow afternoon. But they're going to go not only with a six-year program, but they're going to propose an eight or 10 year sales tax cycle. So when referendum So they're looking just something to consider.

You need to pick your projects and how much money you're going to put towards the funding. because it is in my area. I have no idea how Royal Complete Street got such a high rating. To me, it's very low or should be. So, I just don't see that that's a priority compared to everything else on this list. Did we already necessarily could you could leave it on there because then

sales. And just another word of advice going into this. So if there are priorities change over time, so it may be six years from now and another city council is looking at these projects. If you have some money allocated into the project, then it makes it a lot easier to reallocate additional dollars back into it. that you can't add a sales tax project on later in the game. So, seriously consider things that you think are important and at least put some sales tax funding towards them. Would it be easier just for us to kind of go down the list instead of bouncing around? I mean, I know which is fine, but also before I before anybody answers that, didn't we just look at complete street airport road US 41 cooper with the and We have more funding. Is that a different project or is this the same project?

This one is airport road specifically. But I thought it was Oh, the other one was Cooper Street Airport. This is US 41. There's a different section.

And I should point out the two of the projects at the top, downtown flooding and the Lashley Marina improvements. These were entered later in the process. There isn't quite project those are master plan stage an assessment of the marina as well but they were still deemed to be important projects in the uh reverse osmosis plant we brought utilities projects to the committee at the last meeting there was a long list of about 10 projects but they were interested in looking at the primary or priority and that was one that the utilities director appointed. So that's how we came to the refining those projects.

So the idea put a bit of money towards a number of them in hopes that we receive money. Yeah. And in fact the reverse osmosis plant is already getting some funding. This proposed for sales tax to fill that gap and we're looking at an average of 4.5 mil per year, right? Is that correct? Yeah. So, it's kind of, you know, we should know number that we have that we're trying to look at so that we don't go over we are under we bring in another smaller project.

Kristen, finance director. Yes. So, currently we're getting about 4.5. If you know sales start going down because of you know gas prices going up and people conserving you know again it's percentage of sales. So if um we might see a little dip there, would it last the whole six years? You know, there's no determining, but we've been getting approximately a little over 4.5 million per year the last few years. But that's based on our population versus the county population. And if population increases and we don't, then our percentage is going to be small.

And that that also will affect it because that does um get looked at every year. Department of

I think we all agree downtown flooding is a huge like number one for all of us that's again if our design plan was actually do any construction so to me I almost think that that's where we have to like focus most of our money on is our downtown flooding so we can actually you know execute what we find you know, needs to be done because I think with all the other plans, they've done like little tiny things, but the citiz 1.8 million for the first part, let's say it's 1.8 again. Well, this is only, you know, 3.2. That's the second part. That doesn't even talk about grants for us to execute what we're doing. and grants aren't always going to be 100%. So, this is where I'm saying that we really have to look at this as like our highest priority in my personal opinion.

And Janine, for the record, because it is my my district, um, you know, the downtown flooding has a lot to do with our businesses and that's the heart of our city. So, we do I feel like we need to make this a top priority. So, how much would you suggest we allocate to, you know, it depends on how much it's going to cost? So, I think for me, I think we we should like pick which ones that we want to so we see how many we think are really important and then maybe try to allocate funds towards it. I mean, what do you think might be easier that way?

Um, I know I've said lastly Marina improvement projects. I was hoping that we could do a loan or something like that. So even if it's in the 1% it's alone because once they generate revenue it can't go back to the general fund. So I I've said that a few times that you know if we give it that should really be alone. So we can lend from this. No we would from the city funds right. We lend from the city funds. So how many are we choosing? I I think we just top five.

I think you're we're supposed to look I don't I personally also think historic district infrastructure is huge. we need to start improving our east side and they also have a lot of the issues. And and the thing that we also have to remember is these are just numbers like for the preliminary of this. It doesn't mean that it's actually the cost. It could cost seven, you know, 8 million. So these are just like the start of it. What would that district infrastructure? What are some examples of that? That's in the one area defined like on the east side kind of is it kind of like by the the coffee shop over there by the railroad tracks and back into that area.

So we lighting paving sidewalks and helping with flooding that's in that area. Yeah. So I mean if you just go the first six to me looking at that that's pretty priority I think and everything else is kind of not not important but some idea should be a long not I mean I don't think that's so either then take that out top five or add the channel and didn't we get

Yeah, Richard. Yeah. So, the the dredging at the boat club, I think we got a grant for that.

I personally think that we can probably uh get a grant and I'm sure Richard can tell me I know we've had a grant for living shoreline extension. you know, living in Shorland, we've had grants. So, that's another one I'd like to see if we can get grants for that one. Um, I personally, again, I'm thinking that, you know, if we're looking at, you know, improvements for our residents with the 1% because this is what it is for public purpose, that again on the east side, Traview Park improvements, you know, the veteran shade structures, the the Harborwalk, Lashley Park, marriage point, and the interpretation markers. People love that. Tourists love that kind of stuff. So, they're smaller, like you say, smaller hanging items on here. They're not as big. I kind of like to have those as maybe something that we can look at, but then we can table them or or do it if we need more money to go for another project. We can revisit those and say, "Hey, we can't do this right now. Let's move that money into another project that's more important."

We do like tier one and tier two. Tier one could be the first six, whatever you want to do. And then some of the in a tier two and say that's our next top or do tier one and do first next can we concentrate just on the the top ones like you're saying let's just concentrate today and just agree upon that at this point and again we don't know how much money it is but I think those are our top priorities and once we can get more funding we're coming up against we have to let Charlotte County know what our projects are going to be and what the dollar amounts are going to be

so do these top ones do a dollar launch or you think we should put more I think we should do a tier one and a tier two. So if we do the first tier one, that would be minus. So first

and then tier two again, you know, we've got the traffic signal may never come. You know, that's an thing that might not happen. I think we're really looking at um I said I don't know the water sports activities are got in there but

that's kind of so I was talking about you know the at the end of it with the tribute park improvements harbor walks park those marriage point historic district interpretation could be part of the interpretation markers. Sure.

I mean, I guess you just go by what's on here for now. Yeah.

Yeah. fencing. Is that already covered? I think that's already. Okay. It is. It wasn't a project put forth, but the pickle ball court, all of the sports courts eventually are going to need to be completely redone.

Pages. I'm good with that. So, well, we sorry. We also want to make sure that we keep the ADA improvements citywide in there as well as a tier one. Yep. Throw that in tier one. Someone had a suggestion for the Home Depot area to have a flashing light or something or reduce the speed limit right before that. We need to do increase the safety but we don't see lower section I think that again has to

the other thing personally you know again with our environment and everything that's going on I would like to keep living shoreline extension also sh street and tribute area I'd like to keep that going because if it's oysters and everything like that and it cleanses for our environment. I personally would like to either keep that on tier one or two.

I don't know if anybody else has any input on that one. So just put that in tier two. Is that puts that are listed there? I think what we'll do is to get we'll get the numbers together. Make sure everything adds up properly. I'll send that to all of you in an email. Um let me know then individually if you have issues with with anything. Um we do have Do you know the exact date we have to have it to the county? It would need to be April whether we

potentially I'd like to have it wrapped up before then. So if you can communicate back to me um feedback once we put the numbers in front of you that would be great and then um we'll adjust it from there and get it sent to the county. Can I add another one? I'm really sorry to tier two at least Ponto Park improvements. I think that's been something that's kind of gotten kicked down the road and I know that at some point it's very expensive but I really think that's another area that we have a lot of people going to. So I'd love to see that in tier two as well. Can I ask a follow question on that? Somebody asked me this the other day. I don't have an answer for it. Once wildlife moves out, I know some of it is.

Do we have any plans for that? I mean, has that discussion even that discussion really has taken place? Part of the building is on city property, part of building is not. So we'll have some decisions to make. Are they expected to remove every I'm going to have to take a look at the least that is on my list of things to think to us, but if the bill is not on our property, then it's a little difficult to do. which to me according to the GIS it's not on our property. So

project updates. Are we good? I'm sorry.

Project updates. So um as of So this is this is interesting and this is kind of speaks to how things take so long. So we put in the wreck. We're moving forward with getting the letters um onto Herald Court. Well, steps of course in that is uh the actual design of the letters. So now we're back um communicating with our vendor. They're getting us a a rough draft of what the letters will look like. We have to approve that. All of those little steps in there take time. You know, it's back and forth between vendors. So I know it seems like it takes forever to do anything, but it's all those little steps that add up. If you've uh been over by the pickle ball and tennis court, you'll see that that underway. The plants and trees that will be placed around there have been selected. They're um going to be meeting with the nursery very soon here. So, that's exciting. Um as was mentioned earlier, that permit software, we had a lot of responses. The evaluation and selection committee is uh being scheduled to rank those proposals. The procurement study, the evaluation and selection meeting is um being established this week. FEMA grant manager Kristen alluded to that we've got quite a few questions that are questions that can pretty much just be answered by Kristen. So her being one person she's she's working hard to get to those questions and get that answered so we can get that contractor on board. Um city hall chambers the purchase order notice proceed has been issued so you'll start to see construction on that very soon. Um Mr. Evers is going to have the front portion of the building the um the stom panels taken down during construction um just because it is a 1% sales tax project funds that are going into that I think it presents a lot better to the public having that seeing that historic building so watch for that

in coming weeks um foc drainage we are moving forward with the construction checklist just needs to be added to that um that was one that I did get some feedback from residents of course over our brief downpour flooding a couple weeks ago they know the people that are living over there really really are anxious for that project to start as we all are. So um we're excited to move that forward. Uh the engineering library that bid closed with 27 responses which is fantastic. That is going to help us in so many ways. Um the Tiki Point which is the um living shoreline project that's currently out to bid. The pedestrian crosswalk improvement design that had only one response. So the devel reviewing the scope of work on that to get that moving forward. Um, and then the fantastic news of the day, uh, Rick Lemon has just been on a roll lately and doing great things for our city. He submitted, uh, a FEMA grant for a watershed master plan. It's a $300,000 grant, $225,000 federal share. We have a $75,000 local share. This was just recently awarded by FEMA. This will help take us from a class class in insurance ratings. So, we should see our our insurance rates for our residents go down as a result of that. Um, he also worked really hard on a T-Mobile grant for playground equipment out at Ponds Park. Those results will come in in May. Um, we announced some of the other, uh, MAC grants at the last meeting. So, um, we have been having great success with with grants and thank you to Kristen and the finance staff. It's never just one department that puts the effort into these things. It's it's totally a group effort and they've done a great job on that. So, unless you have any questions, that's all they have project.

Do we get to see what the interior or chambers is going to look like at any time soon? Kind of excited. As soon as it's done. Can't wait to move in.

Sarah, boards and committees. Good afternoon. Again, under boards and committees for announcement of vacancies, we have one alternate on the board of zoning appeals. On the building board, we have one regular seat open. On the Burnt Store isles Canal Advisory Committee, we have one regular and one alternate seat open. And then on the utility advisory board, we have one regular and one alternate seat open. Under nominations, we have one regular position on the code enforcement board. Mr. Keith Johnson's term expires May 17th, 2026, and he has expressed an interest in continuing to serve and is eligible to do so. The appointment will be for a three-year term expiring May 18th, 2029. At this time, staff recommends going ahead and reappointing him by motion. Okay. They have vote to nominate and in appoint

nominate and appoint Mr. Johnson. Okay. All in favor? I oppose. Motion carries. You want to stay up there?

If you don't mind. Uh, first under clerk reports, I'd like to invite everybody to join the city clerk's office here in Ashley community room for our just desserts and discourse event on Saturday, April 18th from 12:00 a.m. to 12 from 10 12 10:00 a.m. to 12:00 p.m. I am so sorry. This will be a fun, family-friendly event sharing public speaking tips and desserts provided by First Baptist Church. We look forward to uh tasting their treats. They also provided them for our fall and Everything they had provided was a hit. So very grateful to them for providing desserts again. Then on Friday, April 24th from 6:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. in Lashley Park, we will hold Picture Perfect Projects and Popcorn. This free event will feature crafts and a movie, and we hope to see everyone there as well. Next, I wanted to share some concerns about the watering restriction citations. Recently, our team members, particularly those tasked with issuing and enforcing citations, have been subjected to a significant increase in argumentative and disrespectful behavior. While we understand that receiving a citation can be a source of frustration, I must emphasize that our staff is simply carrying out the policies and ordinances established to protect our community's shared resources, water being one of the most vital of those. To our residents, our staff members are your neighbors. They are professionals dedicated to serving the city and they deserve a workplace free from hostility. We ask that you extend to them the same courtesy, patience, and care that you expect when seeking assistance from your city government. Disagreement with the policy is a right, but directing personal vitual towards the staff implementing it is not acceptable. To the city council, I respectfully request your support in reinforcing this message. As the leaders of our community, your voices carry immense weight. I ask that when you engage with your constituents, you help us relay the

importance of civil discourse and mutual respect. Our goal is to have a safe and productive environment for everyone who lives, works, and plays in Gorda. We appreciate your cooperation in helping us foster a culture of kindness and professionalism. Thank you. Thank you.

Okay, we have the HPAB joint board meeting coming up on April 7th. At that meeting, we will presentation on becoming a certified local government. That's kind of the main topic of that meeting. Should give us um something to seriously think about. If there's anything else that you would like us to add, if you could just let Ashley know or if you know right now, um please do because she's going to publish that agenda pretty quick here. Um we have a public meeting coming up on April 2nd at 5:00 pm at the Lashley Community Room regarding improvements to Nature Park. Rick will be leading discussion about the city's application for a recreational trails program grant for a potential of $450,000 to fund new trails, a new fishing pier, two new observation decks, and a pedest pedestrian bridge in the nature park. Please mark your calendars for that. Tomorrow night, part of the harbor conversation from 4 to 6 at the library. Um, we encourage people to come out, help us shape our budget and strategic plan, get questions answered from department heads. Should be a really good time to have some nice conversations with our neighbors. Uh see the city secured the ability to withdraw an additional 2.2 million gallons a day from Shell Creek to supply the Peace River Maninnesota regional supply authority. So what that means is we can withdraw more from the Shell Creek. That allows us then um we have that interconnect with the water supply authority. We can share water back and forth at an additional now 2.2 million gallons per day. So that was huge. Um, congratulations to our utilities team for getting that done. I too had a note to please be civil when paying the fines. Um, it isn't every day that Sarah makes a plea like she does and you can really tell that it's affecting her staff. So, I too echo that message. Please people be be respectful when you come and you visit our staff. Um, I understand that you don't want to be

paying fines. Nobody does. Our water restrictions are really important and they are being mandated by the regional water authority that we um have those regulations in place. I did want to ask you all the dusk to dawn sports courts lighting issue. Um our last direction with staff was to be working on an ordinance for that. I would suggest that we just address that as a part of the land development regulations as we have those discussions that lighting would be a piece of the land. Is that okay with everyone?

Okay. I'm trying to make sure I caught everything that I wrote now. And then um just a bit on the police celebration night last night. Um personally, my husband was in law enforcement and I think I had become immune to um just the the awesome responsibility that law enforcement officers have. And sitting in that room, you know, because friends of my husbands and mine, they were saving lives every day. And that's just kind of what people I I realized last night sitting in that room and listening to the stories of lives that were saved by our police officers exactly how important that truly is. And I know today we were tasked with getting that PBA agreement done. It is so important that now me and my staff we're going to go back and we're going to figure out a way. We've got to figure out a way to fund these police officers. They do so much for our community. They're important. Um I I can't thank them enough for all that they do. And I can't thank our chief enough for what she the values she instills in her officers and the support that she gives them. I know as city staff, it is my responsibility to help support them as well. So, we will be trying to come up with some ways that we can make this work and get this funded for our staff. That's awesome. Thank you.

Dr. I echo your on the PBA contract. Um I have worked with law enforcement throughout the state and both with them and opposed to them and we've got some of the Dr. speeding ticket money or whatever it may be. a different project somewhere else or whatever it may be, but we got to get them funded. We got some of the best around. Um secondly, um Dallas is still doing a wonderful job managing the legal department. There have been outside of some of the lawsuits that have come through that the insurance companies are running and carrying in the federal courts. No new lawsuits come through and whatever legal matters that were brought to my attention are being handled and have been Uh, yes. I echo about the police. It's a shame we couldn't get that done. Um, I've already actually talked to Lisa. I talked to her in a break. Um, got to get better microphones. I've been getting people that, you know, are saying that it was echoing and microphones and uh, so I think she's already so not a slight against them. She's already working towards it is what she told me for a solution. So maybe we don't have these Hopefully, we'll be happy.

That's it. J, uh, I think I asked this question before, but I see the golf course watering huge amounts of water onto it, onto their grass. I don't know what the restrictions are on the golf course, but I just wanted to check. They have their own permit through Swift, so we don't have regulatory authority over them, but um, I do understand that there are additional there are there I actually read them yesterday. There are additional restrictions for golf courses during this uh when we move into phase three on April 3rd. Great. Yes. I uh received a complaint about Are you done? Okay. Sorry.

About the bike event that took place this last weekend. There were people walking down the sidewalk on Marian that were forced off of the sidewalk. And the bikers apologized, but they said they were told to be on the sidewalk. And in a city where we have pathways. It doesn't make any sense. Um, but she asked that we at least somehow consider that for events going forward. Bicycles are allowed on the sidewalks in the city,

but it not to force pedestrians off, but I I will have a talk with Betsy to make sure that that's expressed in next year's event that you know, safety of pedestrians as well. That's it. Couple of things. I I think we need to change her to the name. You know, I I drive by there and that's actually what I read as a teacher. The light trail northbound

esplan will be completed by mid to late April. That's the light at Tamiami northbound and rea. I spoke with the gentleman who represents um EPOT and he that I can assure you within the next six weeks that will be done. So there you go. Watch for it to turn on. Um there will be an MO board or a metropolitan planning organization meeting on Monday, March 30th, 2026 at 2 o'clock. You can catch it on the Charlotte County um you know web page. Um it'll be at the Charlotte County Administrative Center, room 119. I will be there. It's always interesting. They talk about bicycling. They talk about walking. We talk about everything and anything mobile um safety. So join us if you can. Good. Okay. Um I'm really glad that you know a lot of stuff got um discussed this morning and I know that we're going to be looking a little bit closer at our vested rights to make sure that we're very detailed to make sure that everybody has the opportunity to do that. Um, my other thing that I I feel really bad about the police officers and I hope, you know, thank you to our hardworking staff to try to make sure that we can give our police officers the pay that they deserve. That's that's our our biggest thing is we want to make sure that we we have them and I'm so sorry that you know, we just want to do a little bit more detail. Um, the other thing which I I can't is it true we're going to be saying happy Easter before our next council meeting. And you know, a lot of people I think are going to be going home. So, safe travels for all of you going home. And one last thing I want to say is save the date. Uh June 14th, it is Flag Day. Uh the American Legion is hosting something similar to um uh Quintagorta Taste, right? How am I saying that? Rotary

taste and play. Why was I having mindb blank? Rotary has been so amazing in helping us with a lot of stuff. They even have given us a grant towards doing this. But the the best thing about it is we were trying to figure out a way to have our local businesses have some more revenue. So June 14th having something similar to the taste of Pentaga along with being on 14th celebrating 250 years by the American Legion honoring our heroes that they're recognized helping our local businesses during a very slow season. Uh it's going to be kid-friendly because it's going to be similar to the great fantastic taste of dea but we're doing one little extra thing at the end of the evening and that is we're going to have a drone show. So just Keep your eyes out for the save the date on this. Of course, everybody's looking for sponsors and vendors and all that kind of stuff, but I just wanted to to put it out there. There's some fantastic Don't forget about this weekend thanking our Vietnam veterans and then Sunday at the at the wall. And for all you veterans, you know, reach out at Mission Barbecue. You can't go wrong with that. So, that's all I have to say. On to public comments.

Still Tim Richie. Um, you know, it's amazing. I'm not even on Next Door. I don't even have the app on my telephone. So, I want to bring something up right now. And, and I don't want to have to talk about this anymore. Now, my mother was charged not only one time, but two times a significant amount of money for water usage that was never used. Now, if any city council member is going to mention my name or my mother's name on next door, they better be reassured I'll be talking about them in this chamber. Now, a city council member on this dis definitely made a post on next door and please don't make me do a freedom of information act or even take it another step forward and send our city attorney a letter because he hasn't received that letter from me yet. But I want you to know, I don't want you telling one more person ever that what Tim Richie says is false. You made a post saying, "I looked into or I had staff look into Mrs. Richie's uh water bill and she definitely used this water." I am not kidding around here. you don't want me to send a letter to the city attorney. And he knows exactly what type of letter I'm talking about. Now, on another issue, I want you to know I've told a few of my friends in our community, and I mean this. I don't care what college degree you hold. I want you to know if your intellectual level is not up to my intellectual

level, you will no longer be getting the respect I've given all of you for years. I work very hard for your kids, your grandkids, your your great great grandkids, and I don't want to have one more person in the government or the state of Florida ever try to make it out that Tim Richie is ignorant or stupid. I have educated so many of you. I have told you about this water problem. The living the shore living thing. Bologoney. That water's toxic. Number one on that list. That reverse osmosis. Get that done. The water coming down Shell Creek is terrible. And I'm not kidding about these comments about my mother and me on Next Door. I don't want to hear it. We had real problems with the former mayor and the former city manager and the former city attorney. They were all gone for a reason. Thank you.

Hi, good afternoon. My name is Glenn Ridda. I am the employee development coordinator for the police department. For the record, I am clocked out and on my own time. uh watching the meeting at the office and I felt u a great need to come down here to address council. You have a management team uh that twice has negotiated with PBA the union twice in good faith have negotiated a contract twice and brought it before council twice it's been shot down um today um mayor I was a little bit disturbed that you compared our police officers to spoiled children who wanted a convertible but all we could afford is a pino. I assure you our children our officers are not children. Uh they do a fantastic job. I have the honor of working side by side with every one of them. Every officer that comes through the door as a new hire comes through my office first. Every officer who leaves the police department leaves through my door last. Since I've been here since 2020, we've had 15 officers leave. It's about 30% of our police department we had to replace. 30% attrition rate is extremely high. And we had a conversation, I think, Alicia was talking about AI today. And AI tells me that that type of uh turnover creates unsustainable recruitment, training, operational challenges commonly linked to burnout, morale issues, and high stress environments. Um, I assure you that's what will happen. We will be put in a cycle where we're not going to be able to replace. We are fully staffed for the first time since what I'm told, 2011. 15 years we've gotten here. you're not going to

stay here. Changing the pension as it was suggested. Maybe changing pension to the state retirement FSA or whatever we call it, I'm sorry, is not an option. That pension is what these people earned. This is what most of them are staying here for. Okay. Um that would just make things huge, which is terrible. That's what I'm afraid of. And I don't live in the city of Pangora. Uh I can't afford it. I work here. Um city I'm not saying this will happen. I'm afraid it will happen that services will start to deteriorate because staffing will be shrinking. We will have to shrink back to the lowest common denominator of services for police. I'm not in charge of the police department. I'm just in charge of training the people of this police department. They deserve what they negotiated for. I would urge you to really reconsider this contract as quickly as possible, please. Thank you. Thank you. For the record, I'm really sorry. It mine was saying the love for a child that it was a love for our police.

Cindy O'Hara, regarding the police contract, you guys need a board of finance. I'm telling you, when I lived in Connecticut, we had the board of selectmen who were elected and then we had a board of finance. Select like the mayor. You need a board of finance. This is ridiculous that you're putting all that kind of time. You need people just focus on that kind of thing. Um, and then, uh, second, you know, there's all this talk about consideration and respect, and I'm hearing it from the council over and over again. I heard it from the clerk today. You know, you want people to be respectful. Well, give them respect. Your agendas are embarrassing. They're ridiculous. They're all over the place. Resolutions here, resolutions here, an hour here, an hour and a half here, two hours with this person. I mean, why don't you do your your your typical city council agenda items first? Have the respect for the the residents. get knock that out instead of making us wait here for three hours and then you knock everything out and put tell everybody that's you know that you know it's going to be controversial and it's going to be blah blah blah and all this long spiel of this and that and fighting and wars. Uh put that like tell them to come in at 11 or 12 o'clock. That will start the the the resolution stuff and the proclamations. All these people and we're stuck here for 45 minutes doing while you do your proclamations. I mean, have a little respect for the people that want to come in and see the regular city things and then put all your resolution stuff that you know is going to be drugged out. If people have that kind of time, great. Let them show up at 11 or 12:00 and sit here till 2 or 3. I have to be in Cape Coral to pick up my grandson and I should have left at 2:35. So, I'm out of here. Otherwise, he's

going to be standing at the bus stop wondering where his grandmother is. Okay. When you start out, my name is K. Uh, when you start out with saying, maybe I shouldn't say anything, maybe you shouldn't, but I do want to. We love the police. Um, we really love you. We love the city manager's office. We love the clerk's office. You We love the fire department. We all think you're doing a wonderful job. Um, For me, it's scary that a lot of people are going to be voting this fall to eliminate property taxes. Um, I think a lot of them are going to hear, "Oh, I" and they're not going to realize that's cutting the money that the city will have to pay each and every one of you precious employees of this city. And I don't think we want to do that. But it's kind of scary to think if I have a degree in accounting. If our funds are going to be cut, you know, who do we cut?

K, did you need to say anything? You're good. I think that was for the last one. Okay. Okay. Anybody else want to say

K? Did you That wasn't for you. So, I'm glad you didn't make a snap decision and just shut it down. And hopefully you guys can work on it because I think it's really important that we find the money to pay you guys. Maybe not in the rainy day fund because we might need that when when a big source of our revenue is going to get cut. So, I I hope you all can go back to the drawing board because this is really important. Um, what else I was gonna say? Um, okay, that's it. Sorry.

Thank you. Anybody else have anything to say? If not, meeting adjourned.